Love Lives - #12 How to know you've found 'the one' and which attachment style are you?

Episode Date: December 8, 2017

This week on Millennial Love, we're joined by dating and relationships psychologist, Madeleine Mason. Did you know there are three main attachment styles? Madeleine explains what they are and we work out which category we fall into. We also discuss how we develop our attachment style and what we can do about them. As a relationship expert who got engaged after four months of dating by using her own techniques, Madeleine is in prime position to talk about how you find 'the one', if such a concept exists - we quiz her on her secrets.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/millenniallove. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. Hello and welcome to Millennial Love, the Independent Lifestyle Desk's weekly podcast on love, dating and relationships. Hosted by me, Rachel Hosey, Assistant Lifestyle Editor. And me, Olivia Petter, Lifestyle Writer. Each week, we'll be discussing the core dating issues affecting millennials today. There are endless podcasts out there on love and relationships, but we felt that nobody was speaking directly to our generation, where people ghost, zombie and breadcrumb one another quicker than you can say Tinder. Today we are thrilled to welcome dating and relationship psychologist Madeline Mason. Hello. Hi, thank you for having me.

And so the things we're going to be talking about today are super interesting and we can't wait to pick Madeline's brains about them. The attachment styles that different people have, firstly, and then we're going to move on to how do you know you found the one now the most interesting thing about attachment styles is I think not many people know about this and I only discovered this a few months ago when I met Madeline and we had a discussion about what all sorts of interesting things related to dating and relationships but one of the most interesting things I took from our chat was about these different attachment styles and now Olivia you didn't know about this either. I never heard of

it before but it's really interesting because I do think that one person obviously fits into one of the three. So can you explain what they are? Yeah of course so attachment styles are basically the way that you relate to somebody who's special to you. Originally, it came from how children were attached, as it were, to their mum or their significant caregiver. Exactly. And scientists or psychologists sort of looked at this and thought, hang on a second, this actually happens in adulthood as well, that we have a need for a secure base, as it were.

We'll have a special person in our life and it typically is in a romantic context and so what they found is that most people have what they call a secure attachment and then different psychologists call the other attachment styles for different things but for simplicity I'm going to call one for anxious attachment style and the other for avoidant attachment styles overall So overall, there are three. There are four, but the fourth one only accounts for a very small percentage of the population, which is a mix of anxious and avoidant. So what does that mean? Well, if you imagine two dimensions, one is how we relate to other people,

whether we can depend on them or not. So people who struggle with depending on other people's whether we can depend on them or not so people who struggle with depending on other people find themselves quite independent and they don't like opening up and being vulnerable to other people does that also you think manifests itself in the type of person who thinks I want to do all these jobs at work because I can't trust anyone else to do them I think there might be an overlap in terms of how you might work as well. So let's say the dependent axes, if you like, will typically look like people you'd call commitment phobes.

So they're the ones who typically ghost you or breadcrumb and do those sorts of things because any time anything becomes a bit close, so you have to depend on something, you open up and become vulnerable, they sort of run away. becomes a bit close, so you have to depend on something, you open up and become vulnerable, they sort of run away. So if you're high on that axis, as in you're high on, or low rather, if you're low on dependability, I can't depend on other people,

you're gonna be more commitment-phobe, or avoidant in your attachment style. On the other axis, it's what we call, if you're low on that, you've got an anxious attachment style and that's about whether I can trust whether the relationship is there tomorrow and if you have an anxious attachment style you'll be hyper vigilant to any signs that look like rejection. So you're a bit paranoid? Quite yeah and in extreme cases very paranoid so you'll get almost like a panic attack because your date hasn't texted you back after three minutes or an hour and you get sort of slightly worried that,

oh my God, he doesn't like me anymore, she doesn't like me anymore. Is that person also likely to be quite jealous in relationships? Yeah, can be. Yeah, absolutely. And so anxious and avoidant, kind of like opposites then? Yeah. Right, okay. That's really interesting. And the third one is secure. So the secure is happy to depend on other people

and is happy for people to depend on them, but is also trusting that you're not going to disappear tomorrow, that has an assumption that this relationship is going somewhere. So it's not too worried about, let's say, the text isn't, oh, I'm sure he'll text back later or she'll text back tomorrow or something. He's not too bothered about uh those signs that might others that might look into it so the secure person is essentially someone who's going to have healthy relationships and not struggle too much yeah i mean a bit idealistic isn't it that sounds nice

so people the idea is that the people who are so it's very it's very boxy right so you're we're talking about scales here some people people might be more secure than others. Others might be more avoidant than others, etc. But on the whole, you might find you have a tendency to one or the other. So on the whole, somebody who's in a secure relationship, all those friends of yours who seem to just meet one or two people and then they've settled down. And is it those people as well who seem to jump from relationship to relationship? Do you think that can come into that because they just are really happy in a relationship and want to be in a relationship? Yeah, exactly. However, if the jumping though, it could be an avoidant

as well. So an avoidant person would as soon as a relationship becomes too intimate or close, they will jump ship. So again, on the scale of degrees of, let's say, let's call it an avoidant or commitment phobia, that might kick out once the engagement has been set up. Or it might be that weekend away. I guess it manifests itself in different ways. Yes, exactly. Yeah. See, it's so interesting.

When I learned about this, it was like something clicked in my head. And I was suddenly like, oh, oh my god I am an avoidant like it made so much sense to me about like loads of like issues I've had and you know my dating history and my dating past and I I was just really like yeah avoidant that's what I am yeah what do you think you are I'm definitely an avoidant as well it's it's annoying because I'd love to be like oh no I'm the really you know idealistic secure I'm I'm perfectly an avoidant as well. It's annoying because I'd love to be like, oh no, I'm the really, you know, idealistic, secure, I'm perfectly comfortable and confident, but I think absolutely avoidant.

I don't think I'm anxious. I feel like that's a bit more extreme than what I experience. I think probably everyone has a little, I definitely have a little bit of that, you know, sometimes I'll be like, oh, why hasn't he texted me back? Yeah, because it's a bit of insecurity, which is sort of inevitable, but I don't think if I were to classify myself

in one of the three, I think I'd probably be more avoidant than anxious. Yeah, because I definitely like when it starts getting serious or someone might actually seem to like me or something, then I freak out and push them away. And I'm like, why? Why am I doing this?

So speaking of which, why do people fall into these? What makes someone avoidant or anxious or secure? So there's two ways. The original way, if you will, is how you grew up. So what kind of parenting? So always down to the parents. Well, it can be.

It can be circumstance as well. So let's say if you had a parent who had to work a lot and they simply weren't around, well, then you didn't have anybody you could rely on, so you had to rely on yourself. So you might have built up sort of that's where you can't depend upon others. I have to depend upon myself. So it's not necessarily bad parenting.

It could just be circumstance. And also in adulthood, it could also be, again, circumstance. So you might have grown up in a secure family, say, secure family say but have dated some people who have somehow either been avoidant or anxious in their attachment style and somehow has kind of spread that over to you as when you've become anxious or you've become avoidant as a result what's that Philip Larkin poem I won't say the word because it's a naughty word but it's like they f you up your mom and dad very true in this situation yeah i actually um i was i had this a chat a while ago which probably most single people have with their parents where they're just like but but why are you single which is another whole other topic that pressure from parents but um i then said to my mom i was like well mom i'm

an avoidant you see and she was like what and so i explained it to her and she was like but why and i was like it's your fault such a rubbish question to ask someone I mean particularly a parent but what so why are you single what's someone gonna say to that I mean you had a definitive answer but how how many people are gonna understand what that means when you say oh well it's because I'm avoidant they'll be like oh yeah of course yeah yeah exactly most people be like excuse me I don't know you just made that up Does it make sense for you? Yeah, definitely. I think, I mean, I come from a broken home and I'm an only child. So I guess the whole parental thing makes sense for me being an avoidant.

Oh, woe is me. But you're a middle child. You've got like brothers and sisters, don't you? Well, yes. And my family is still very, like my parents are together. I have a very wholesome family. I've been very lucky growing up so you know it's there's no like an obvious thing like that for me however the only thing I can think of that has made me the way I am and I don't know um if this is right or not is the fact that I say I'm the middle child I don't know

that's very much woe is me I'm the middle child my parents never paid me attention yeah exactly so maybe you felt that you've had to rely more on yourself than than the others have had to for some reason yeah well I have actually always been very independent um and I guess that does somehow link to the avoidant thing can do yeah so then if someone is okay how does someone become anxious then is that linked to parenting as well yeah so for example um the theory is that if your parent has parents or your primary caregiver um has been absent for periods of time, either psychologically absent or physically absent, then you develop the avoidant attachment style. If your parent is ambiguous, so sometimes available and sometimes not available, then you'll develop the anxious.

So in that's more me, maybe I'm the really rare fourth kind. It's a bit of both because because my parents are sometimes absent, not maybe yeah I like to think I'm special that's interesting but then so can people um you know if people have these issues either they're anxious or they're avoided and that's causing them problems when it comes to their love lives and relationships is it something that people can can they change? Will their attachment style change or do they have to actively work on it to change it? Both. So let's say that there is evidence to suggest that if you're on either of the avoidant and the anxious and you team up with a secure attachment styled person, I don't know how you would call it,

but then there is evidence to suggest that that can mitigate whichever whichever other style right um and the other option is of course to work on it so that's what i do a lot with my date coaching clients is is work through the anxieties or work through the sort of the overwhelm and whatever sort of because at the end of the day there's some blind spots in there you kind of notice hang on a second I keep leaving a relationship I keep meeting the wrong type of person or whatever and it kind of work comes down to sometimes the the attachment style so I work on that but it's those two scenarios that can change it it's so so interesting so you like ideally if Olivia and I believe we are avoidant slash avoidant anxious yeah then we what would be good

for us would to be with someone who's secure yeah that's what I was gonna say because surely it would make sense it would be good for us to be with someone that's secure but why on earth would a secure person want some anxious mess or someone who's gonna like ditch them because they can't deal with commitment yeah well it's again we're talking about scales here. So how avoidant are you? Like how terrifying is the idea of settling down with someone, for example? It's not like too... Rachel took a deep breath. Yeah. And you could have somebody who's extremely secure. So they're not bothered at all. So another way of looking at avoidant, example is that it's space it's

this illusion of not being bound to somebody and having to depend on them and in fact two avoidance can actually date as long as there's no pressure if they both give each other space if they both give each other space however the problems arrive when something like a baby comes along right and all of a sudden you do need and rely need to rely on one another for help and support. And then that becomes overwhelming, it becomes really scary, it becomes difficult. And then you need to work through that. It's weird, because as an avoidant slash anxious person, self diagnosed. I think that if I was with someone who was secure, it would almost freak me out a bit. Because it'd be

like, Why aren't you freaking out about anything? Why aren't you worrying about? You'd need that, though, you would need that you'd need someone because I'd be like, why aren't you freaking out about anything? Why aren't you worrying about these? You'd need that though. You would need that. You'd need someone to be sensible. Yeah. Yeah, I guess so. But you almost want someone that identifies with what you're going through a little bit.

You know what I mean? I guess like the worst combo must be anxious and avoidant dating, right? So that makes it difficult. Yeah. It's all about, I suppose, how one engages with the romantic partner. So what is the point of dating? What is the point of having a relationship? It's to somehow feel like you belong somewhere. but basically what it means is that we need to belong to something, someone, something bigger than us. And we get some kind of psychological, I don't know if it's fulfillment or some sort of spiritual something.

There's some kind of energy there that kind of gets fueled. But it's not because we don't want it to happen. It's because it's scary. Yeah. So it's not because it's just an inability. So basically another way of looking at it is that we all have to survive childhood in one way, shape or form, whether it's being mollycoddled or whether it's being bullied or abandoned outright. We have to survive childhood and we build up resources and resilience in different ways and strategies to get through that. Except when we get to adulthood, they sometimes no longer serve us.

And that's when the problems come. So another way of looking at how our attachment styles are formed is just one way of surviving childhood most parents mean mean well for their children but again circumstance and you know stress of life and work and what have you kind of interfere with with well well intent well moment intentions kind of makes me terrified to be a parent make sure i bring my kid up to be secure so much pressure to give them all my issues but anyway i don't know i think it's super super interesting and i actually think when you know or

maybe not know but if you have an idea and you think about what attachment style you are i think that can help a lot yeah and you can work on it so you know that okay for example if you are an avoidant if you have an avoidant attachment style you're then better able to locate what it is that that anxiety is about what is that overwhelm so the moment you feel I guess it's trapped and suffocating I think that's what the most avoidants will feel just before they ditch a partner or ghost or whatever is this sort of claustrophobic feeling. Now, if you know that it's not because of the other person encroaching on your space, but rather a reaction to something that's from your past, then you're better able to work through it.

Super interesting. We have lots to work on, don't we? Oh, so much, Rachel. Right. Well, that's good to know. Let's on to dating disaster of the week shall we yeah okay so this is one that we got emailed thank you so much for sending it in um okay here we go so guy promised me dinner at the most exclusive restaurant in town made a huge sing and dance about it i think she means made a huge song and dance about it yes okay uh ended up covering my eyes as we walked towards the restaurant he unfolded his hands we had arrived at Zizi's I mean I love Aziz's as much as the next person but don't make it out it's exclusive what's worse is he sat me down and told me he goes to a gambling anonymous group

three times a week what was he addicted to fruit Oh, and to top it all off, as we walked back to the car park, he had lost his parking ticket. The fine was £25. I looked at him and he said, I've just used the last of my wages on our exclusive meal. Would you mind paying? Let's just say we never had our first date snog. And when I texted him to say I wouldn't be seeing him again, I got a text back saying, we can still chat and stuff though, right? Oh, wow.

I mean, wow. Do you think he really thought Zizzy's was exclusive? You have to wonder. I mean, I really like Zizzy. I like it too. But I would never go to the point where I'm covering up my date's eyes to be like, look where I've taken you. Ta-da! Yeah, that's weird. of the most popular italian chains in the country yeah and like one is the most of like there are so many i how would you not oh i don't know that's strange but

i also just think that it's like there are so many weird things in that that it's almost like there's not like one massive thing that makes that oh my god that was a disaster there are so many little things that you're just like questionable like the gambling anonymous thing and then the fruit machines and that that happened to me not gambling anonymous but a guy i went on a date with was about 40 minutes late and then i was sitting there waiting i was like that's so late i would have left i know so late i was about to leave and then he arrived and he's like oh sorry i'm really late i was at my gambling addiction meeting. And I was like, oh, dear Lord. Was that a first date?

Yes, this was a first date. There was not a second date. But it was just the whole thing was so awkward. And obviously then we just started the date by talking about his gambling addiction. Wow, that is a lot. I'm like, that's not the way to woo a lover. No.

What do you think of this story? Well, like you say, there's a lot of wrong there's a lot of things going wrong there um there's some assumptions about what a good date might look like that could do with a bit of tweaking i think yeah i think you need some work this guy oh well we live and learn and every bad day is a good story exactly a good story for this podcast hashtag content twas the season of chaos and all through the house not one person was stressing holla differently this year with doordash don't want to holla do the most holla don't

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with jesse crookshank is not available on facebook it's out now wherever you get your podcasts a cast helps creators launch grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere a cast.com um well that was fun and so the next topic we want to talk about is super interesting given madeline is here. Now a bit of background. Madeline is obviously a relationships coach, dating love expert. And what is most brilliant, I love, I just love that this has happened, is she is currently engaged and she got engaged to her fiancé four months after they started dating, which I just love.

And we want to know how. That just never happens these days. Well, I guess I just took my own medicine, really, is how I kind of summed it up. I, for about a year, a couple of years ago, I got divorced and fannied about a bit, I suppose, and then decided actually I was not really doing myself any service or favors, and I did want to settle down and I employed all my little strategies that

I normally coach people and it took me about a year I'd say before I met Chris or just under rather so I went on a dating app and I did about three cycles of dating if that makes sense so you sort of dated three guys for a bit do you mean so you would be number third the third cycle so let's say I started to download the app in January and I and our first date was on the 13th of December so almost a year ago yeah so the January so so dating cycle is what I'd call it is kind of where you meet some people you decide on one person go on a few dates them, and then it either happens or doesn't. So let's call that one dating cycle.

So I had two of those, and then Chris was in the third cycle. Wow. That's a very useful way to think of it, in a dating cycle. Yeah, I like that. I'm just in my dating cycle. It's my second one this year. Yeah, nice. I don't know what number I'm on for this year.

Menstrual cycle, then the this year. Yeah, nice. I don't know what number I'm on for this year. Menstrual cycle, dating cycle. What a month. Anyway, so he was your third dating cycle. Yeah. And when you met him, had you got like an extra jolt of excitement? Did you think there was any sign that was like, he's going to be, I have a really good feeling about him? Or did he just seem as good as the other two?

Well, it happens that actually when we first chatted, I was on a second date when he asked me to meet for coffee. Hilarious. Dilemma, because, you know, he was actually really nice. I liked him, and I thought, but I've already said yes to the second date. Were you physically on the second date? No, no, I was going to go on the second date. You know physically on the second date? No, no, I was gonna go on the second date when you know you chat with several people you can't sort of... No, no,

you've got to keep your options open. Well, it's I guess it's kind of a process you message a few people for example and then it just gets who comes back first and how the conversation starts, right? So you will end up chatting with a few people and then somebody will invite out for a coffee for example but you still have a conversation with somebody else who's kind of perhaps deciding maybe they've gone on a coffee with somebody else and then it's that dynamic I suppose so I'm set to go on a second or maybe even a third date with this other guy and when Chris said should we go for coffee so I had this dilemma and I said well I'm really sorry but I'm going on a third date with this other guy and um when chris said she would go for coffee so i had this

dilemma and i said well i'm really sorry but i'm i'm going on a third date with someone um who seems nice and i don't think it would be fair if i met up fair for anyone if i met up with you because i clearly like chris but i'd already sort of going on this side it's very good of you so chris he wrote back and said you you know, thank you for telling me. And, you know, anyway, this guy turned out to be a bit of a floozy quite quickly. Can I just say, I love that word. Floozy. Yeah.

Yeah, that's good. Continue. So I said to this guy, listen, this is not, this is not working out. No, this is, you know, we know, I think we've got different values, what have you. So that was the end of that cycle? So that was, well, it was the end of that. No, this is still, because I'm not dating anyone yet.

So this is the beginning of the third cycle. I wasn't actually dating this guy. I'd just been on a couple of dates. It's not quite. Had it become a cycle yet? We're only sort of exclusive ish or starting to date that's when the end of a cycle might might happen so after a couple of weeks of deliberation I thought well Chris was really hot yeah you got a message um you got a message him right what have

you got to lose so groveling sent a groveling message saying, well, that coffee, was it still available? And it was. Well done. So, yeah, he gave me a second chance, luckily. So then you dated for a few months. And then how, how, how did he propose to you or did you propose to him? He proposed to me in Bologna. We were in Italy.

Were you expecting this? Not really, no. I think we had talked about the idea of marriage. We talked about the idea of family. But not more than that. So I think we were on a holiday in Italy and being quite a romantic space and by a fountain, lovely hot weather.

He just sort of stopped me and then asked how do you been planning it or was it spontaneous well a bit of both I think he was he wanted to plan it with the ring and everything but on the other hand the moment seemed so right so he was kind of deliberating whether I should wait because you know you can never predict when you know it's going to feel right to do something like that. And I think if it's spontaneous, it feels more authentic than if you plan this grand sort of gesture. We should definitely discuss proposals on another episode. Because that's happening to both of us very soon.

Yes, it's very likely. Very, very incoming. It's in the immediate future for me, I'm sure. But then were you, was it an immediate yes? Of course, absolutely. Oh, that's so sweet. Yeah. Wow. but then were you were you was it an immediate yes of course absolutely yeah wow so there was were you never a bit like this is way too soon or um no the funny thing is that you you can actually there's this app that you can you can download all your whatsapp chats and i've created all our first whatsapp chats in a book up until our first kiss. Oh, that is so sweet. If you're

to read it, it's pretty mundane stuff. I have to say it's quite cute. It's kind of like, what are you doing today or Christmas shopping? But it kind of illustrates the beginning of a relationship, sort of getting to know one another. But it's for me, one of the things that I kind of advocate is to look for somebody who has the same values as yourself so if you understand what is important to you in a relationship so um I sort of tongue and cheek say I look for KFC which is kind funny and caring rather than the actual fast food so but it's kind of memorable and for me uh Chris embodies all of those things and more but um I think to the degree that you can you can connect on those values then you're more likely to to something happens and also if you're

willing to settle down and want to put the work in a relationship and you're both open now Chris is really good at communication and is is happy to share when he's you know upset about something or whether he's frustrated and is happy to share when he's upset about something or whether he's frustrated about something but essentially also when he's happy about something and how much he means to me and vice versa. So that is just really important and it just I guess speeds things up. My dad also died in that time and he was really supportive and I think those sorts of experiences will help people bond together quicker. Yeah so much more. those sorts of experiences will help people bond together quicker. Yeah, so much more.

I think what I'm learning more and more from everyone I talk to who's like a sort of relationship expert is that what's most essential is working out what's important to you so you can then be with someone else. Yeah, definitely. Which makes a lot of sense, but rather than sorting... It's so funny because that sort of goes exactly against what dating apps promote. It's like the idea of selling yourself

the best version of yourself possible to as many people. But why would you want to be universally attractive to everyone? Because, you know, there's so few people that are going to sort of meet the specific requirements that you're looking for. One thing especially I find that people, certainly girls, struggle to say that they want a relationship for fear of coming across as desperate and needy. The interesting thing though is if you follow the idea through is that who are the people

that would see you as desperate and needy? They're the people who wouldn't want to date you in the first place. So you want to to what we'd call in recruitment self-select so you the more clear that you can be about what it is that you're looking for in terms of what kind of relationship would I like what are my values what am I interested in you will attract somebody else who looking for the same oh you know that's what I want yeah I will then go for it you almost want to do it by more of a process of elimination sort you want to ostracise all the people that aren't right for you. Correct. Well, as you've established, there are too many.

I mean, this is what my mum can't understand. She's like, there are so many men in London. Too many men. That is a song. Yeah. That's the thing though. So yeah, self-selecting, I guess, helps. Yeah, it does.

But also you'd need to be happy with the guy that you choose or the girl that you choose because there's another phenomenon that seems to be creeping in is this fear of missing out or maybe the next person is more interesting or better so there is an element of another thing I'd say is that make sure that who you meet glue together god it is so hard you know god damn it i mean yeah seriously there are just so many things you've got to get right meet so many people but yeah finding the one well you did it in four months so it's possible that's very impressive so what is your top tip then for like, you know, not messing around and making sure that, you know, I'm not saying, I don't want to be like, how to snag a man in four months? Because I'm not necessarily saying that, like, I don't think everyone wants to get engaged in four months.

But clearly you knew what you were doing and you weren't faffing around with a relationship. Clearly you knew what you were doing and you weren't faffing around with a relationship. Top tip would be if it's a relationship that you want, if it's a long-term relationship that you want, then invest in that idea. I don't know if that's even helpful, but what I mean is that once you've decided on someone then then give it a chance yeah invest your time invest your time in it until it you know and because I go back to the maybe go back to the example for for originally when Chris asked me for a coffee like if if I had not if I'd not said no to him and not given the first guy I don't know if I'd give him a chance,

but I certainly gave it sort of, well, I have to make sure, I have to run this out to make sure that it isn't something. Because otherwise, if I'm all of a sudden between two people that I quite like, I won't be able to find out who I'm truly connected with if I'm almost dividing my attention between more than one person. Yeah. That's great. I like that's great I like that and I

think that's something millennials should definitely take on board because everyone's like seeing casually too many people and very stressful anyway that was great so now we're going to move on to bumble bio of the week and um I'm not gonna I'm just gonna say that Olivia and I disagree on this which is so rare for us to disagree on something um anyway this is a guy called Tom because of course they're all called Tom that's true it's the second Tom I mean I'm pretty sure like 70% of boys in their 20s are called Tom anyway okay so also Sam and Alex anyway so, so this guy goes, I love to laugh. My passions are shopping and being gorgeous. Shoe emoji, bikini emoji, crown emoji.

If you're not six foot seven, don't talk to me. I don't do hookups. I never text first. Travel is my life. Skiing emoji, surfing emoji, rowing emoji. I love kittens and cuddles. Lion emoji, hearts with eyes emoji emoji i have a real passion for talking let's say rubbish um okay so my thoughts on this is like he's completely taking the piss

out of girls on dating apps and i'd like i think it's quite rude but you disagree i see yeah i disagree because i think it's funny because i hate it when I see guys with their dating bios where it's just a series of emojis or like weird, like one word being like music, travel, red wine. Everyone likes those things. No, I completely agree with that. But I think he's specifically mocking women. Yeah, I guess so, obviously, because he's looking for a woman.

But I think men, because men and women both do that. I mean, I see plenty of boys on apps that do that. I don't know. I don't know. I just, I think it's quite funny. It's different. It made me laugh. I don't think it's the best bio.

I don't like it. I don't like it. I can tell. If you're not six foot seven, don't talk to me. Like, I think he's being really judgy about what women put in their bios. My bio doesn't even look like this. It's a bit arrogant and a bit pretentious what do you think well it sounds like somebody who's not too serious about dating exactly which is what i like take it don't take it too seriously because it's not

serious you're on a dating app have fun well be silly depends if you're serious about finding someone that's true that's true how serious can you be very serious so on my dating app i was quite serious really there you go i always see i just i always assume that people on there aren't serious if you don't want something serious don't be serious yeah and like that's fine but like maybe you're not sure what you want and to avoidant okay exactly case in point so keep it vague but i guess when you do work it out you want to make it clear and i think that makes total sense yeah it's scary to do that it's very scary yeah once you've decided that this is what i want then you ask for it in a way that's that seems approachable and not sort of fatal attraction uh bunny boiling style but as authentic and

ordinary as possible if humor for example so humor is really important to me if you can put something funny in there demonstrate your humor but the the more and there's also like the more effort somebody puts in a profile well the more likely they're going to be serious so you there's proxies about stuff you know if somebody's going well, the more likely they're going to be serious. So there's proxies about stuff. If somebody is going to take the piss or they are going to come across in a piss taking way. It can also be, I mean, there are these outside sort of people like to use humor in a sort of a self-deprecating way because it's too scary to ask for something serious. So that's what we have to navigate as well. something serious um so it's so that's what we have to navigate as well there's like well how much of it is serious and how much of it is just a front if that makes sense i'm so guilty of that

well we all know what we need to work on um yeah so we've got time for today thank you so much madeline for having me it was really fun honestly it's been great to have you on and hear all your wisdom please subscribe rate and review us on iTunes to the listeners that actually is really important

because it does help other people discover the podcast which is super and if you have a dating disaster story we would love to hear it so please do either

write it in an iTunes review or send it to us privately via email at millennial.love at independent.co.uk you can also tweet us at rachel underscore hosie or at oliviapetta1 and don't worry all the stories will be kept anonymous

thank you so much bye A-Cast powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend. I'm Jessie Kirkshank, and on my podcast, Phone a Friend, I break down the biggest stories in pop culture. But when I have questions, I get to phone a friend. I phone my old friend, Dan Levy. You will not die hosting the Hills after show.

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