Love Lives - Grace Beverley on the weirdness of dating in the public eye

Episode Date: July 3, 2020

Support Millennial Love with a donation today: https://supporter.acast.com/millennialloveFollow the show on Instagram at @millennial_loveThis week, we are joined by fitness entrepreneur Grace Beverley.At just 23, Grace has made the unlikely transition from influencer to wildly successful CEO and now runs three fitness companies, including the sustainable activewear brand Tala.She joined me on the show to talk about how on earth she balances her business ventures alongside a dating life, why the myth of “having it all” is so damaging for women, and why she'd be cautious about sharing a relationship on social media.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/millenniallove. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Twas the season of chaos and all through the house, not one person was stressing. Holla differently this year with DoorDash. Don't want to holla do the most? Holla don't. More festive, less frantic. Get deals for every occasion with DoorDash. Hello and welcome to Millennial Love, a podcast from The Independent on everything to do with love, sexuality, identity and more. This week I was very excited to be joined by fitness entrepreneur Grace Beverley. Grace is a bit of a multi-hyphenate as the phrase goes these days. At just 23 she is the CEO of three fitness companies including the sustainable activewear brand Tala. She started out as a fitness influencer and has since grown her empire to encompass a whole range of interesting things beyond social media. She joined me on the show to talk about how she balances her business

ventures alongside a dating life and why the myth of having it all is so damaging for women. Enjoy the show. Hi Grace. Hey. How are you doing? Good thank you. Just getting through lockdown. Yes how are you finding lockdown? I have found it very kind of up and down. There have been times where I'm like this is great I'm going to treat it kind of like exam season. This would have been the first year anyway that I didn't have kind of full-on exams for my entire life so I was kind of like you know what it's fine it's just the same as I'm always used to um and then there have been times where I'm like okay I'm really done with this now um but I've been very lucky um I just moved into my kind of dream house right before lockdown so

it's given me a lot of time to sort out the house and everything which probably would have dragged on for so long if not so I've been very very lucky oh that is so lucky do you have a garden as well yes we do so well we actually were meant to move in the week after lockdown and then um we just upped and moved we threw everything into bin bags and I called every removal company on TripAdvisor and said can you be here in two hours um and because essentially the issue was that I have a dog and we were living in a high-rise apartment with no garden and we were meant to move the next week anyway it was a 10-month renovation um and then I was like oh I cannot be locked down in a in the high-rise flat with a dog when the plan to get the dog had always been about the garden

and so literally just threw everything into bags and moved within kind of from 2 p.m we were in by like 8 p.m um god that's a bit of a crazy one yeah and are you living are you living with friends yeah so I have two of my friends living here with me. Yeah, which has been lovely. Makes such a difference, I think. So you're only 23, right? Yeah. And you've bought this house yourself? Yes. So let's talk a bit about how you did that, because that's pretty incredible. So you run a few businesses, don't you? Would you start us off by talking about those?

Yeah, for sure. So I started my first business about three and a half years ago now technically it might be four I started selling products before I would probably call it a business but then it kind of got into what it is now or at least the foundation of what it is now about kind of three years ago four years three and I need to look at the timelines um about kind of 2016 um and so that was in my first year of uni um and that has developed into what is called shreddy now which is a business that has a fitness app um and also has an arm of kind of equipment and everything you'd need to build kind of an affordable ethical home gym which we love um and so that that was kind of my first ever foray into business and that started off as digital products and then went into um physical products and it was all based on kind of

like a gap in the market and areas where as someone in the fitness industry I was saying you know hey why hasn't someone done this or why hasn't someone marketed these to these people or whatever it might be um and so that's been amazing that's kind of drastically changed over the past few years um and then my other business so so BND also comes under Shreddy if that helps to explain anything it's all a bit confusing and it's all going to be made less confusing soon um but essentially it's bands isn't it it's it's like yeah yeah so it's um so it's a it's the subsidiary of shreddy but it's a yeah everything from uh resistance bands to lifting belts to dumbbells to kind of any any gym equipment really um but looking a lot cuter than they

usually do um and uh then my other business is Tala which is a sustainable style is what we call it um because it kind of started as activewear and then we just realized how much of a gap there was in the market um not just business-wise but also kind of ethically and sustainably for sustainable fashion that didn't cost 100 pounds for kind of a pair of leggings or whatever it might be so we developed that from what was originally activewear to kind of being way more than that and that's been such a passion project for me as well not just in terms of the sustainability but in terms of like the designs the fashion aspect all of that um so so yeah and so that's kind of about a year and a few months old now um but I've been working on that for a year prior to launch so it's kind of it's kind of felt like

I've been doing both of them for really quite a long time um and but they're sort of unrecognizable from when I began at the beginning of uni lockdown must have been pretty good for you I imagine right with all the people doing home workouts and stuff now so what's been funny is that for some parts of the business it's been amazing and for some it's been really awful which I'm very lucky in the way that you know they've been able to balance each other out so like at the beginning of lockdown, Tala, for example, was down, down 46%, which you do not want at all. And then, you know, people started to online shop more and people started to, you know,

see our stuff. And I think a lot of the time it's harder to, when online shopping is so focused around fast fashion, it's harder to kind of infiltrate that area and people being able to see our stuff as well um has been amazing during this time and be able to see kind of sustainable alternatives to that you know we don't want you to look at our clothing and go oh that's definitely sustainable because it looks like i'd wear it to do yoga um but kind of you know we want our clothes and everything to be so nice that you'd never even know that there was kind of, that they were made out of plastic bottles or whatever it might be. So certain aspects, yeah. And we've been really trying to give people resources and help and,

you know, show our business and what we've always done, what's always been our bread and butter, for example, at Shreddy, working out at home and all of that, but also not capitalise on a global pandemic, which has been a fine line and so we've really tried to what's been really important for us during this time has literally just been listening to the customer and just saying hey we're thinking about this what do you think um how does this make you feel what do you want to see from us um and it's been kind of probably the first time where i've actually felt as out of my depth as everyone else because usually the way I feel is kind of that I'm sitting with a lot of people who've been doing things way longer than I have and I kind of feel

quite out of my depth and with this no one had any idea what to do so I kind of felt like great I'm finally finally on 11 playing field here. You're a very busy person you run all these businesses I suspect you have very little time to see your friends let alone your family let alone to date so could you start off by just telling me a bit about how you divide your time in that way and whether you do actually have time for dating at all yeah so I'm very particular about my time because I've learned that I can't not be so I'm I'm very rigid now my new year's resolution this year was to take weekends um and that has been kind of life-changing for me and my I'm one of those people that for example yesterday I started on a project that

probably should have taken me a week and I got inspired on it so kind of cancelled everything and did not look up until kind of deep into the night time and then I'm just so drained and burnt out and it's such a bad habit and you know inspiration is great and all of that but what you need to be able to do is you need to be able to take that you need to be able to kind of bottle it and come back to it when it's also a good time and you know and I'm really learning that along the way um but I am someone who often puts work first and often kind of feels like I have to especially as I'm in a position that's so kind of fortunate to be in so I often feel like you know I have to work as hard as physically possible to justify you know the amazing benefits I get out of it um so but now I'm I'm really making a conscious

effort to do things like take weekends to see my friends to not the first few months I was working in London kind of self-employed I was just not seeing anyone because I'd get to the evening and I'd be so drained because I hadn't done anything in a normal time scale I was just work work work don't even look up don't eat don't just absolutely go at it but it was so unhealthy for me and obviously it hugely affects your mental health um so now I'm I'm very clear on it I stop work kind of no later than obviously there are other times where this won't be the case but never later than seven really um and I really really try I just know things that I can do to bring myself back to life

like go on a quick walk and then and try not to cancel whatever plans I've got um but yeah of course it's been completely different in lockdown I mean I've not only moved to the area but also we haven't even been able to kind of leave the house so um it's definitely been kind of a changed experience um but for me it's kind of it's how my normal life often is so that been kind of a changed experience. But for me, it's kind of, it's how my normal life often is. So that was kind of the weird part about it was kind of being like, hey guys, this is what I do the whole time. Which isn't, and it kind of made me recognize how much of a bad thing it was because a lot of people were essentially saying, you know,

this has had this effect on me, this has had this effect. And I was kind of like, yeah, it's probably why I shouldn't live as if I'm in lockdown for my entire life um but no I'm I'm very I go out and I go for dinner with friends weekends I really I try and do everything I try and do something on Friday something on Saturday try and do something in the day um because it is important for me to try and live as much of a normal 20s as well. And I think what is kind of the point if I'm working so hard the whole time that I can never enjoy it. So this year has been the year of making a conscious effort to put work second, which has been so weird for me and never been a thing that I've done.

So, yeah, that sounds that sounds like a much, much healthier approach to things, to be honest, I guess. sounds that sounds like a much a much healthier approach to things to be honest I guess but the thing about lockdown is that and we've been talking about this on the show a lot is that obviously if you're gonna you know not only when you're going on dates and seeing and seeing new partners and stuff but also seeing friends the rules are very different you know you have to stay socially distancing you have to you have to keep at least well now one meter away from away from people yeah have you been have you been dabbling in keep at least well now one meter away from away from people yeah have you been have you been dabbling in that at all in like the virtual dating or in going on social distancing dates yeah so I think what's been weird for me is that I my life has changed so much over

the past few years but actually until this year I was in a kind of very long-term relationship um and so I've kind of not only moved to London out of uni and out of all these different things but I've also kind of moved out of that and been like oh I'm actually now a single young professional how on earth does that work how do you like how do you meet people like I work for myself so I'm I'm not gonna meet someone at the office and if I do then I definitely shouldn't be dating them so so that's not gonna work um but then also kind of just yeah trying to work out how on earth it even works has been such a big thing for me I mean I feel like the whole of lockdown it's been I've been talking to so many friends about this and just trying to navigate it and I think what's been what I realized is so weird as well as I've never

kind of when I have I've kind of had one year single in my adult life um and that was at uni so it was completely different so it was kind of and that I was kind of like 18 so just a completely different and also I didn't really have like a social media platform so it wasn't like your or I did but it wasn't it wasn't as big as it is now and I didn't get kind of the press and all of that and so being able to navigate that as well has been really weird because it's like it's it's a whole different ball game like meeting people for one but then also when you meet people I mean I think especially as you kind of saying as a as a woman who has like who is kind of successful or you know all of these different things they absolutely play a part um and it's been such a weird space to navigate I

think maybe one day I'll write a book on it or something because yeah it's been so insane well it's a very rare position to be in particularly as someone at your age and I think also it's so rare to be like newly single from having been in all these relationships in lockdown yeah to be like your first sort of like single single experience um have you been using dating apps at all I kind of so the weird thing is for me is that at the beginning I was like okay cool I'll I'll try these things or and then I I had one time where my so the only times I've used dating apps have been when my friends have been like come on like it'll be fun like even if you never talk to anyone, like just like we're, we're in lockdown kind of all the time. And then I actually had the most hilarious conversation with someone,

which was someone, someone messaged me and goes, is this someone pretending to be Grace? And I replied saying, yeah, as obviously as a joke. And he goes like, I'm actually, I'm going to find the conversation. Show me, show show me that's what I was gonna ask you because surely people because you're very recognizable if he ever realizes that this was actually him poor guy will be like why the hell did I say that because obviously didn't realize that it was actually me but I found it so funny and I'm more of like a yeah I end up being more of a kind of I just don't I don't think that works for me I think I'm very off the vibe of a person I'm very kind of you know how I don't know I think I could find someone really attractive in photos

and absolutely not in person and then I could find someone absolutely not in photos and then really attractive in person so I just don't think I'm good at operating it but um so this was is this the fake grace account again and I say yes he goes what's your goal and I go to catfish all the men are you aware how weird that is and I go yes and he goes right there's more to life than this try going outside and i go no he goes freak and he goes that's so mean and he goes good and then i don't know if i can swear yes you can swear you can swear okay so he goes good fucking weirdo and then that matched me oh my god the poor guy has no idea i was sitting on my sofa screaming with laughter oh my god that poor guy but that's so funny that like you don't only have people recognizing you

because that's what i was going to ask do people recognize you from apps not only do people recognize you people recognize you and think you're fake well I I had way back when kind of like however many years ago I I can't remember what dating app it was on but I like set up a profile like it got deleted because because I was reported so much for being a fake person because also like I don't so people knew that I was in a long-term relationship so I was in a relationship with someone from like 15 to to uni so to like 18 19 and then broke up for uni and then from second year of uni to January so kind of like a like five six years whatever it might be and so people kind of knew that and so whenever they see me obviously on things and it's either it's fake or I'm cheating so which would be very loud um and so people have people really really enjoy um the reporting process and so there

was this one time where I'd set one up and I was deleted and I was like huh and then I then that happened this time so I think I think I've realized the dating app world isn't for me that's so funny you know I want to ask you because do you think because you're you're obviously like I would say that you're known in the public eye right but it's not the same as being like a traditional celebrity yeah so do you think there's a difference in the way that your fans and followers kind of feel more comfortable to approach you or to to interact with you on something like a dating app than they would with like a more conventional celebrity so to speak yeah well I actually like I have no idea how celebrities date like I I genuinely because yeah I get press and I'm on social media

and like my social media following is obviously kind of high but it's incomparable to someone who's on primetime tv the whole time or always in tabloids or whatever it might be and I just have no idea how they do it because I cannot navigate it I find it so hard and I just I'm kind of more like you know I've I've dated people and not refused to tell them like my job but they've genuinely had no idea for the whole time that we've kind of been on a few dates um and that's been so much nicer for me but then I've kind of found that when it's not like that I'm like because you never really know then it's really hard to navigate you know whether someone's with you to be able to use this like a trump card to their friends to be like hey look good night I'm seeing or whatever it might be or whatever

it might be and so that's been definitely something where I've kind of just been like well I'm just not gonna like I'm just not gonna go near people then and I much prefer like traditional ways of like meeting people whether it's at like a pub or you know um a night out or whatever or through friends or whatever it might be but I think also that people find you a lot less approachable if they know what you do and so I think it's really hard to navigate that whole thing and I don't I have definitely not cracked it and so I'm kind of more like I just sit here and I'm like approach me if you will yeah it must do you reckon do you reckon it's probably do you reckon it's probably easier to date people if they don't know what you do I think so but also then I don't know how because it's such a specific new job and people have such

kind of they have such preconceptions about especially like influencers and all of that it's very I think the type of people that I usually date are not necessarily the types of people who would kind of be in the industry or famous or whatever it might be which also often means that they find it hard to understand the kind of social media sides of things and all of that and I think for me that's such a big thing for me I'm never going to be with someone who doesn't understand my job or thinks my job's stupid or whatever it might be and now my job isn't you know my job isn't being an influencer it's having these businesses and all of that but if they belittle kind of that side of the of my job or the fact that you know I do do press or I do do tv or any of these things then that's

never going to work for me um and so I think that's that's quite difficult is the yeah it's great that someone doesn't know but then if they don't know then they also can't like support that or if they didn't know at the beginning then fine that's great it's much more likely that they'll like you for you um but it's much more difficult to kind of get that understanding you add people have to be really open-minded um and I'm sure there are kind of loads of jobs like that but it's I'm I'm not the type of person who's going to convince someone that my job is legitimate or whatever you know if you if you if you think I'm great and think you know you can see I work hard then cool

um and whatever comes with that then cool but if not then like I'm not going to sit here and try and persuade you to take me seriously um so yeah that's definitely been something for me too it's kind of a yeah two different sides do you think do you think that people are also probably quite intimidated not just because of the social media element and because you have all these followers but also just as a really successful woman you know do you think that that intimidates some people that you go on dates with I think that I don't know if it's necessarily like I think a lot of people think that it doesn't but it definitely it's come out in other ways so it's actually usually the people who are most

vocal about how much they like it and they like that you know I'm a successful woman or whatever it might be or kind of have my own thing all of that those are usually the people who that are then most kind of insecure about it or most you know I think there is usually some sort of power structure and I'm not saying that's just created by success but there are these power structures between like men and women and the way society sees it and so often I feel like often when you know if I if I actively like someone and I'm dating them they'll assume that I have kind of these hundreds of like men like knocking at my door like hello like please and I think that often

throws a bit of a spanner in the works and then I I think that a lot of the time I've definitely had it before where they're kind of like oh well I'm not even gonna try and or not like not make the effort you know if we've been dating before but kind of they very much assume that that's not an option especially if they're not in like the public eye or whatever it might be um and so I think there are definitely points like that when those kind of more low-key people that I really usually do kind of go for are like yeah like I won't even bother or are quite or kind of do not understand the aspect that you know might be that I'm not really interested like I don't I don't care about DMs and people and I don't care about like how famous you are or how much like money you have that's not what drives me especially in a relationship um so so yeah there are kind of like all of these

different all of these different elements that come together in this whole like dating tornado um it's really fascinating particularly the instagram thing as well because and this is something i i'm writing about at the moment for my book is sliding into people's dms because that's got such an association with like you know there's a real intent to sliding into someone's dms isn't there oh absolutely and obviously when you've got as many instagram followers as you do i suspect you get quite a lot of people sliding into your dms with intent yeah i mean i feel like that's part of the part of the job um is that like and obviously as someone who's spent the majority of my adult life and especially my adult like my time with a following in a relationship like it's so been not like as in it's more something you like laugh

about you're kind of like hey so you slid into my dm today and then you'll like laugh about it together and you have to be with someone who's really confident in themselves and also kind of just like reassured by your like by the fact that you know I want to be with them but I think that a lot of the time that's really really hard to find and I think even if people say they are reassured they're kind of what I found is that people who it's then not worked out in its depth with it's definitely been because they think they're reassured about that stuff but they're kind of constantly either having like backups or assuming that it's not going to work or whatever because they assume that's what I'm doing and all of that so I that's definitely tough too because it's kind of like

if I'm if I'm dating you and I say that I'm enjoying spending time with you I'm not lying like I'm actively not lying I don't have the time for that um but I think a lot of people because of the position I'm in assume that that's not the case and so often don't put the effort in when they probably would elsewhere in terms of that because they're like oh why bother do you think in an ideal world you would be with someone who you would then bring in to your social media and sort of you know film videos with them and put posts of them on Instagram or if you're film or if you're dating someone who like you said is, is, you know, what you go for, someone who's a bit more low key and wouldn't want to be a part of that. Is that possible with what you do?

Because obviously so much of what you do is so personable. And I suppose probably your followers, if you are in a relationship, maybe they expect to, they're like, they deserve that information into life yeah well I think definitely before when I did kind of YouTube and stuff then for sure but I mean I haven't done that for a long time now and I guess my job has gone from influencer to you know founder of these brands um and I share a lot less of my life purposefully as well not because of an accessibility thing but just because I realized that a it wasn't what I was made for like I I very much stumbled into the job I never wanted to kind of put myself out there in that way

it was just the right thing at the right time and it got me amazing things and I'm so grateful for it but I was never someone who wanted to kind of put that much out there and so for me it just got to a point where I was like I don't want people's opinions on my everyday life I wasn't put on this you know I want to be able to share as much as I want to share but then if it creates this kind of ability for people to give you their opinions on your personal life and all of these things then that is not for me that's not I kind of wasn't put on this earth for other people's entertainment and I think that was like a really big thing for me to realize was that like anyone else can change a job at any time they can kind of say hey you know what I'm going to go in a different direction

and I think when you're in the public are you can't necessarily do that because you owe certain things to some people and kind of I think I owe people a lot of gratitude and no matter how hard I work I will still owe a huge amount of gratitude and kind of appreciation but I don't owe anyone my kind of happiness and my mental health and my livelihood in that way. And so that's when I kind of started changing from the types of social media I did and just shifted to kind of being like, you know what? Actually, I'm just going to post as any other person posts on social media, probably a bit more, just sharing a bit more about my working life. But I don't do videos. I kind of post photos of my life rather than being like, hey guys, today I did this. And so I feel like with the relationship, you know, my past relationship, I posted a photo kind of once or twice, sometimes on my story, but was never in a video.

Never any kind of anything of that. And I think that was definitely the right thing to do. anything of that and I think that was definitely the right thing to do um because I've had a social media relationship before and it is just a it's all lies like you're never gonna put an argument on social media and then you know if we needed to film like a video then of course we're gonna snap out of it and it I just kind of like looked back and I was like god that was all it wasn't even intentionally kind of fabricating anything it was just like that is not representative of how I felt at that moment and I think it creates this I mean even as a kind of moral responsibility of an influencer it creates this completely incorrect idea of like what a relationship was and like the picture of that relationship was just completely inaccurate um and I think you even kind of convince yourself of that to the

point where you know the relationship probably ends a lot later than it should because you're kind of a it's part of your job but you're also convinced that that's part of um the relationship itself whereas then my past relationship I kind of kept that completely I was like it's not a secret but it's private and I think that's the important thing. I'm not keeping anyone a secret, but I am keeping my private life private. And I do that the same with like, I often get comments, but like I got comments in lockdown being like, I can't believe you're not social distancing. And it's been like, these are my housemates, but I don't show them. So you don't know. And so I think that's, I've changed the whole way I share on social media. And it's kind of the

blessing about being kind of in the public eye on social media but not necessarily in tabloids and things like that is that I can choose what I put out there um and whilst that can be dangerous in terms of like highlight reels and stuff it's important in terms of private life and mental health and all of that so I don't think I'd ever have a relationship I don't think anyone will be kind of publicly on my channels unless that's what they do too um and then I still don't think that I'd create this kind of joint identity which is really easy to do because also people want to see it um or definitely not until I was kind of fully settled down um which isn't going to be anytime soon. Breaking news happens anywhere, anytime.

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Twas the season of chaos and all through the house, not one person was stressing. Holla differently this year with DoorDash. Don't want to holla do the most? Holla don't. More festive, less frantic. Get deals for every occasion with DoorDash. When you have that many followers, you absolutely have to set boundaries

on what you share about your personal life because like you said, otherwise you just open yourself up to scrutiny and obviously that's going to take a toll on something as you know vulnerable as a relationship between two people which is always gonna you know how can you read comments like criticizing you about your partner and not being like oh you always interrupt when they say this and it's like imagine if someone came up to you and your boyfriend it was like you need to stop like it's like there should never be an outside I don't think there was one piece of it kind of looking back I'm then like well maybe it was

useful because it made us realize things that we wouldn't necessarily have realized and then I was like actually no I don't think that was one useful bit of input from an outside party because you know for anyone whose opinion that should matter I'll be able to contact them directly or they'll be able to contact me directly so other than that it's kind of just people weighing in on something that I would then kind of be like oh am I too like this in my relationship am I too like this whatever and actually it just for me and it might be completely different from other people and I know people who are very you know relationships online that are completely the same um in real life but those people are actually quite few and far between I'd say and then that's why people are so shocked when like celebrity couples break up and it's like no one who's close to these people are shocked

yeah um you know all of these different aspects and I think the blessing the biggest blessing was that my last breakup no one knew and no one would ever have known and you know actually like this is probably the first time I've even talked about it kind of on online just because it's not anyone's business and that's you know it's a good months after a breakup and so that's like that's what's important is that you know I've had the time to go through my breakup be able to do that personally have no one weigh in tell me they were right I was right anyone was wrong this person's now doing whatever the only one thing that just gets slightly annoying which has definitely been busy helped me lockdown is that if people know

who your boyfriend is um then if they're seen with someone i've had multiple times where people have been like hey just to let you know i think your boyfriend might be cheating on you because i just saw him with this person i'm like well thanks we broke up oh my god that is so intense that's unbelievable thanks to my 20 000 eyes no one could get away with cheating on you ever at least i had a friend who um whose boyfriend had an identical twin um and sent a video of him on and was like i really hate to break it to you but i think your boyfriend's cheating he just kissed this girl and she goes thanks love for I was like to be fair like I my ex for example was was once working and he was talking to one of his colleagues and someone came up to him and was like I hope you're keeping this savory I know

you're Grace Beverly's boyfriend and he was like this is my colleague. Oh my God. I think that's the thing is that with people feel a lot more, I feel like if you saw a celebrity in that situation, you're never going to go up to them and be like, Hey, by the way, I hope you're keeping it. Like just going to watch and be like, Oh my God, I saw this person with this person or whatever it might be. And so we definitely like, as in there are definitely kind of those types of things where you're like god I really didn't expect to be

to be told when my ex was on a date but god it's so bizarre god it's so interesting um I want to finish by asking about this kind of idea of having it all because obviously yeah that includes you know it includes a really successful career which you have it includes like you know a thriving love life which I'm sure you do have regardless of whether you're in a relationship or not but it includes an active social life you know all these different components so if someone's looking at you from the outside they would probably say yeah you probably have it all what would you say if someone said that to you do you think that's a compliment because I think that's something that only gets said to women doesn't women yeah

well I think it's like this what is it this 90s kind of rhetoric of like oh you can have it all as a woman and it's very based on like family relationships all of that and that yeah you're right that having it all is never inclusive of relationships when it's a man in fact it's often kind of different it's like oh the bachelor who has everything and you know it's women are never seen as complete until they're in a relationship and I think that part of that kind of societal construct is definitely like it definitely comes into everyone's personal lives I think when I've had troubles in like my love life I've definitely and kind of people have been like oh my god you know you're so great and all of this and I'm kind of thinking like oh well I've

got all of this but this is wrong um and I think love life is one of those things that actually always weighs a bit heavier even when you're like I there is nothing wrong with being single as in I actually really I think being single is so important and that's from someone who should like has not been single for you know that long and has not spent that much of my adult life single and I think that the times that I've grown the most as a person I've definitely been single you don't face rejection like you do in dating anywhere else in your life as in you just don't have that kind of you don't get that kind of growth because you don't have that you know oh I wonder if they're ghosting me or if they've just been you know or if they're

just working today or whatever it might be and I think those things are such important kind of life lessons to go through that often we're just like I find it myself as well like I have had times where I'm so much happier to kind of jump into a relationship where I know I should be staying single and it's just because we are women we as women are taught that that is what makes us whole and we have have this kind of this whole social life and love life and someone who loves us unconditionally and all of this and actually that would just be the worst thing for me right now and but yet you know there'll always be those times where you and your friends are kind of like watching a rom-com and you're like oh god wouldn't that be so nice and then I kind of like I'm like

the only reason I think that is because I'm told I have to right now I absolutely do not want to be in a relationship and yet over and over and over again it's like you're constant you constantly kind of think you are or you give someone more more time of day than you should even when there are red flags and all of these things and I think it's all based on the fact that we are kind of constantly told that you are better and worth more if you're in a relationship um and so for me I think I want to make clear as well that that is part of like the rhetoric in my head as well and I think it is as part of any successful woman I think even people like Rihanna who is like undoubtedly one of like the most successful like kind of women out there and she's it's kind of

like who's she dating is she dating like god that's so tough that she's got all of these things and she's found perfection in all parts of her life apart from who she's dating and it's like fuck off like leave her alone it doesn't matter who she's dating it doesn't matter whether she's dating it doesn't matter whether she's being rejected or she's got 100 men seeing her down the street like none of that is relevant to her worth and the way but the way we talk about women is it's always relevant it's the same with people like jennifer aniston has always been like how is she so beautiful but doesn't have a boyfriend and like i'm like there are constantly people in my DMs being like, I just don't understand how you don't have a boyfriend. And it's like, I do.

So weird. You're a failed person otherwise. It's not like someone comes to my door with a dowry and like buys me out because they've like offered me like three cows. Like it's not how it works. And I think that's how it's like, it often comes across. And it's like, it comes across like that way in our own heads as well because it's like this power structure is very much that the men don't want the relationship so if they agree to a relationship it's because they really

like someone which automatically makes the woman that much more worthy and it's like where has this why is that still here why are we still talking like that and I think one of the biggest things about me being single now has me been has been me working that out and essentially kind of being like do I like this person because I genuinely like them and I think our lives would fit well together and we have a great time and all of these different things which every box for me would have to be ticked to be in a relationship at the moment or even kind of an ongoing dating situation um or is it just because they clearly like me back and they're great in one two three four five ways but you know I'm just turning a blind eye to all of these things and I think there's I'm in such a kind of transitional stage in my life at the moment

that no relationship would fit with that and if it did it would kind of become probably quite codependent and I don't want to be codependent ever so a lot of my kind of journey with dating in this position has been about me I'm teaching myself that having it all like I you know I'm so lucky in so many different ways and I think that what like why does why would dating even come into that and why is that part of my like worth and how I'm seen and how like valuable I am to the world because you know like I'm in a relationship or not like the choice is never seen as the woman's and I think that that is kind of so important to talk about and definitely something that's made me kind of prolong relationships in the past or get into

relationships too soon or stay dating someone that I'd never actually get into relationship for a long time just to have that there and I think that's something that we probably all unlearn at some point during our lives and I think the more we talk about other women like that the more it's gonna have that impact on ourselves too yeah absolutely I think it can definitely lead people to stay in toxic relationships for longer than they should because it's almost like the longer you stay in a bad relationship and the longer you kind of subscribe to those narratives that you were talking about you kind of get this fear of being single again because it's like oh well no one will ever love me again yeah if I dump this person like I'm so lucky to have this person I think one thing for me as

well has been that I'm so busy that I often you often kind of drift towards like this idea of like monogamy even if it's just going on dates with the same person um and because it's like I don't have the effort all the time to reach outside of that and so I think that that's been a big thing for me too has been kind of like establishing now that I am kind of dating properly has been establishing like okay do I actually want to go on another date with this person because I want to spend more time with them I want to get them to know them better like what do I see as the end goal in this do I you know or is it just because I'm like great this person likes me I think they're great let's like let's go on another date cool so many reasons for that but I think it's often as well because it's like you don't want to not have some sort of

option you want it to be your choice and you want to constantly be seeing that it's your choice that you're you know seeing anyone or not seeing anyone or there's an option or whatever it might be um and I think that's been such a big thing for me to kind of unlearn and just be like you know what like I yeah it's so tough to navigate and I think if something is going if something is right and if something should genuinely be taken further it will be made very clear um and I think that is always the case it is like nothing that is meant for you like will ever pass you and I think that is like such a big thing to live by and dating as well because I think especially people probably think too that at to live by in dating as well because I think especially

people probably think too that at this stage or you know with this kind of social media following or whatever it might be like it becomes a lot easier and I think it's kind of become an absolute minefield in terms of working that out and not that it I mean I can't compare because I've never been 23 without the platform and dating. But I think either way, dating is an absolute minefield and unlearning your own kind of traumas and preconceptions of relationships is so important before you can start to kind of take that further, you know, with someone else. It is time for our lessons in love segment. you know, with someone else. It is time for our lessons in love segment. So this is the part of the show where I ask every guest to share something that they've learned from their previous relationship experiences. It can be as personal or as general as you like. So Grace, what is your lesson in love for the listeners? I think that mine's kind of like an

un-lesson. And I think it does come from kind of what I was just saying in terms of unlearning things and I think in every relationship whether it's a relationship a situationship a marriage a kind of you know just sleeping with someone situation whatever it is it you will have things that you've picked up from that in terms of kind of preconceptions of how people show their love or what you want from a relationship or what you should expect from a relationship that you'll pick up from those situations and I think the most important thing is to work out who you are without all of those things and what your opinions are on things kind of what's your love language how do you like

to be showed love how do you like to show love and learn those it doesn't necessarily you know you don't need to break up with the boyfriend to do this but learn those without anyone else's input and then you can kind of work out who you should be dating who you shouldn't be dating all of these things and I think my like where I've kind of been in relationships too long but it hasn't even necessarily been like a toxic relationship it's essentially because you know you get very comfortable in a lot of various situations and actually the right the right thing isn't always right in front of you but that is the easiest thing or that is kind of what you think should be right and I think the what I need to do most importantly is unlearn you know aspects of relationships that I didn't like that I now expect that everyone will do so for example like one of

the things I hate the most is flakiness I hate when people cancel on plans without and like this is not today I mean I'm a busy person so I understand if things get too much or something comes up or whatever it might be but the way you cancel on plans is so important if you're really apologetic and if you're like hey I'm so sorry this came up my bad cool absolutely fine do it the whole time but if it's you know to try and make yourself not sound too interested and just being like oh I can't do tonight anymore or whatever it might be absolutely not okay and I think because I that's one of the things that I've learned that is one of my values that I will absolutely not

step aside from and yet I think in past relationships because I've been I've like say I've been with someone who's who can be flaky or you know who you don't even want to get your hopes up the or you are doing something on that day you're kind of like oh are we even because I know they're going to cancel um and you kind of realize that that's the norm in a relationship and it's like no that can be one of your non-negotiables and you can have so many non-negotiables and you should have. And I think that I really like nice people and I love seeing the good in people. And so I think I can instantly make excuses

for people so easily. And I'm just like, you know what? Just because I've been in a relationship with someone before who I don't even get my hopes up about plans because I know that they're gonna be canceled or they're gonna be too busy or whatever it might be. All that should have taught me is that I don't want to be in that situation again rather than teaching me that that's what relationships can be like and that's just something you have to put up

with um and so both you and the other person or whatever will have those things to unlearn after every relationship or situationship or whatever and so being able to confront those things and take it back to kind of like a blank canvas of who you are and what you want and what your non-negotiables are I find is so important because I you know I had my last relationship was so lovely it was so amazing and you know it was an incredible person and yet there were so many things that I've spent I've now realized over the past you know seven months and kind of when I've started dating and all of that that I'm like whoa because I had a really healthy relationship I thought that there weren't any of these things and I'm like there are so many and you just need to learn to kind of be like no I don't like that I don't like that that's

something I put up with but actually would never be how I went into a relationship next time. And kind of getting acquainted with those, I'm holding red flags to be red flags. Yeah. And you have to, you have to identify that stuff early on and call it out. Otherwise you set a precedent that then, you know, it affects your entire relationship with that person and how it unfolds.

If you don't set out your boundaries and set out, I'm not okay with this. I'm not okay with faking this or whatever. You you know you don't just drop out of a date like I actually say it quite early on now I'm just like I'm just like oh like either like because you know if it's someone that fine there's not or it's because they're disinterested or whatever then fine I'm not going to put the effort into disciplining someone like they're my child when I'm not you know I'm not trying to raise a son here um then I would you know I won't do that but if I if it's someone who I genuinely want to see again and I think they do and it was an honest mistake or whatever

then I'll just be like just to let you know that is one of my absolute pet peeves um like it's completely cool let's rearrange but you know like just to let you know and then that's all you need to do and I think that's we as women are taught to be so agreeable and so kind of like work around people understand that people are busy all of these different things but actually you can be agreeable and also have standards and have boundaries and I think that especially you know my last relationship started when I was like 15 so like I'm not gonna you know when you're 15 you're like oh my god a boy likes me like I'm not gonna tell them that I don't like this or I think it's rude when they do this or I actually you know I like it whatever it

might be from time to time I'm not gonna start those kind of conversations whereas now as an adult it's so important to and I think that's one of the big things I've learned has been like okay like there are lots of things here that you have to kind of just look at and be like nope not how I do a relationship fine if that's you know if you're a flaky person then we're just not gonna work yeah so things like that have been really really important for me to kind of just be like what do I like and what do I dislike even like write them down and never go back on them like you can have leeway and be an understanding person without being walked all over and getting yourself into another relationship

with someone who doesn't care enough to change things that you know they should be changing um and I think yeah I think it's very very important that's it for today thank you so much for listening if you're a new listener to this show you can subscribe on apple podcasts spotify acast or anywhere else you can comment and leave us a rating too so that more people can find us keep up with everything to do with the show on instagram just search millenn Love. See you soon. Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you.

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