Lovett or Leave It - Look on Trump's works, ye Mighty, and despair!

Episode Date: May 14, 2026

The president makes waves with his Reflecting Pool reno, the U.S. treads water on the Iran peace process, and Trump’s crypto golden calf is more than a little fishy. This week, rock legend Melissa Etheridge lets the lesbian good times roll. Speaking of roll, Bosco brings the magic while we rank the sexy monsters of Magic: The Gathering. And to close us out, Lovett serves up a piping hot round of Second Thoughts.

This episode is presented by Planned Parenthood Federation of America. Plan Parenthood Health Centers are the nation's leading provider of sexual and reproductive health care, including cancer screenings, wellness exams, STI testing, and treatments, birth control, abortion, and more. Today and every day, Planned Parenthood is committed to providing access to the care information and resources people need to make their own decisions about their bodies and their futures. But the Trump administration and Congress are trying to take away that freedom. They defunded Planned Parenthood Health Centers in an effort to cut off affordable medical care for

millions, especially low-income Americans who rely on Medicaid. In an ongoing affordability crisis, stripping people of high-quality affordable health care is yet another cruelty inflicted by this out-of-touch administration. Planned Parenthood has never and will never stop fighting for everyone's fundamental right to quality health care, regardless of who you are or where you live, no matter what, they need supporters like you in this fight. Donate at planparenthood.org slash defend. That's planparenthood.org slash defend. I sold my car on Carvana last night. That's cool.

No, you don't understand. It went perfectly. Real offer, down to the penny. They're picking it up tomorrow. Nothing went wrong. So, what's the problem? That is the problem. Nothing in my life goes a smoothie.

I'm waiting for the catch. Maybe there's no catch. That's exactly what a catch would want me to think. Wow, you need to relax. I need to knock on wood. Do we have wood? Is this table wood? I think it's lamated.

Okay, yeah, that's good. That's close enough. Car selling without a catch. Sell your car today on... Carvana. Pick up fees may apply. I'm from Hollywood. I'm John Lovett. An underdog you root against. We've got a great show for you tonight. But first, let's get into it. What a week. On Tuesday, President Trump was, get this, honest, when asked if Americans' economic struggles were a factor in negotiations with Iran.

Not even a little bit. The only thing that matters when I'm talking about Iran, they can't have a nuclear weapon. I don't think about American financial situation. I don't think about anybody. I don't think about American's financial situation. I don't think about anybody. This is awesome. Not only is this damning admission going to run in ad after ad all across America from now until the midterms. It also sounds like Trump is having genuine breakthroughs in therapy. But hey, to be fair, who has time to think about American's financial situation in the middle of so many decorating products?

Last week, Trump addressed a crowd of supporters by phone at the unveiling of a 22-foot golden statue of himself at his own Miami golf course. Look at that fucking thing. Whispered the Antifa General to his two dozen soldiers inside of the statue, Don't strike until you see the whites of their golf balls. The $450,000 statue nicknamed Don Colossus, was funded by a group of crypto investors, of course. More like Sam Bankman Frieda Callow, am I right?

The ceremony was led by Pastor Mark Burns, reportedly Trump's informal spiritual advisor. Trump's formal spiritual advisor is, of course, Benjamin Netanyahu, said the pastor of the giant golden statue, let me be clear, this is not a golden calf. Burns continued, this statue is a celebration of life. It is a symbol of resilience, freedom, patriotism, strength and the willpower to keep fighting for the future of America.

But most importantly, a symbol of Donald Trump, said Donald Trump. Speaking of blasphemies that would make Moses shit his robe, Trump proudly announced that the reflecting pool on the National Mall will be painted American flag blue. Are you hearing about this for the first time? Yes. He's drained the reflecting pool, and they are painting it what he's calling American flag blue. it is currently a kind of slate gray

because it makes it kind of inky and reflective so that one can reflect as the water reflects in the fucking reflecting pool. But don't worry. If you're stressed about gas prices, we have amazing news. We're painting the reflecting pool

American flag blue. Worried that your boss keeps asking you and Claude the same questions and then comparing the answers to see who's better? Don't worry. We're painting the reflecting pool, American flag blue. Did your doctor delay treatment for an ectopic pregnancy in order to consult with the hospital's lawyers risking permanent infertility? Well, hang tight, little lady. We're painting the reflecting pool, American flag blue. Did your cousin just get back from around the world

cruise and now has what sounds eerily like a rat's cough? Well, fear not, because we're painting the reflecting pool, American black, fucking blue. A week earlier, Trump posted this AI-generated image of himself floating shirtless in the updated reflecting pool with all of his pals. Oh, but when I print out an AI image of my coworkers shirtless and post it by the coffee machine, it's an HR violation. Sorry, Hallie, for giving you perfect knockers. Can't make a joke anymore. To paint the pool, Trump reportedly awarded a $6.9 million no-bid government contract to a firm that worked on the swimming pool at his Virginia club. said Trump to reporters, I have a guy who's unbelievable

at doing swimming pools. That's his quote. Trump doesn't swim personally, of course, as he's never gone 14 days without having active diarrhea, but still, it's a beautiful facility. It doesn't mean this contractor is right for the job. The Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool is massive. How massive?

Well, it's roughly 60 times the size of the pool at Trump National in Virginia. I'm not guessing, by the way, at a crucial moment today when Hallie, Sarah, and I were working in silence, working on this very show, I was secretly in Google Earth measuring the pools. Nevertheless, a White House spokesperson told the New York Times that, quote, this project is now being completed at Trump Speed to ensure the iconic landmark is totally restored ahead of the 250th celebrations.

They got the name Trump Speed from the bottle of loose pills in the top drawer of the resolute desk. But then on Tuesday, the New York Times published a report titled, reflecting pool repairs appear uneven and behind schedule? Uneven and behind schedule. What is this? Every pilot script I ever wrote? The project would have been done by now, but Trump kept getting in the way,

gazing longingly at the beautiful creature reflected back at him in the water's surface, trying to grope it. The project that Trump initially claimed would cost just $1.8 million has now ballooned to $13.1 million. Cool. amazing, said a colon cancer researcher whose funding got canceled last year via an email sent by a Doge

staffer with the subject line, smell you later. A preservation group is also suing the administration claiming that the dark gray acromatic basin was not incidental to the design, it was the design, and that the new coloration will cause the pool to resemble a large swimming pool rather than the reflective civic landscape it was designed to be. Even worse, Trump wants to add a sign that says, welcome to the Lincoln Memorial reflecting Ool, notice there's no pee in it. Let's keep it that way. Trump also posted an image of himself on the $100 bill. I actually think it's fitting you'll be able to use one to buy a gallon of gas. But who among us hasn't focused on petty grievances

and home improvement projects to avoid facing the raging chaos and unsalvageable failures in our lives before loveless marriages result in divorce. They often produce perfectly organized hall closets. Something to think about. In a bracing piece for the Atlantic, Robert Kagan, a longtime neocon and advocate for U.S. military interventions, wrote, quote, It's hard to think of a time when the United States suffered a total defeat in a conflict,

a setback so decisive that the strategic loss could be neither repaired nor ignored. Responded America, challenge fucking accepted. Don't you dare question our capacity to ignore a point? to ignore a problem. Gas is $6 a gallon, wildfire season less from September to July, and GMC just announced a 6,000-pound pickup truck with a six-foot-high grill called the kid catcher. We can't ignore a problem. Trump ripped up the Obama-era Iran deal, the JCPOA, claiming it was the worst deal ever made. He then launched a war that upended the global economy and greatly improved Iran's strategic position. And so Trump cannot accept a deal that offers Iran

better terms, and Iran cannot accept a deal that offers worse terms. But don't worry, Pete Hegseth has a plan, not to resolve the conflict or reopen the Strait of Hormuz or explain how additional bombing would improve our circumstances. No, NBC News reported on Tuesday that the Pentagon is considering renaming the Iran war if the ceasefire collapses from Operation Epic Fury to Operation Sledgehammer. They renamed it what? said a terrified Iranian general, reopened the Strait of Ormuz. This is just like when I changed my rap name in high school from algebra to Dr. Quadratic. Suffice it to say it did not change the reality on the ground. But Operation Sledgehammer is a nice little pit stop on our path to the war's final name, Trump's Vietnam.

All right, we have got a great show for you tonight. And we will be right back with Melissa Athridge. Hey, don't go anywhere. Love It or Leave It, coming up. Love it or Leave It is brought you by Tommy John. What do I love about Tommy John? They're the most comfortable. Tommy John underwear is soft and durable.

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We'll be gracing our stage in just a moment. But first, if you are a friend of the pod, thank you. If you're not, now is an even better time to join in addition to even more Ponsave America content like the Only Friends Podcasts and OpenTabs newsletter. You get an ad-free breaking news feed and you're supporting independent media that you can trust. Now you'll also get CrookedCon perks. They include dibs on pre-sale seats for our live podcast.

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the one and only, Melissa Etheridge. Thank you for me. We're a hugger. That's all right. And thank you for being here. Hey. Hello. So nice to have you.

Yeah, it's a guy. It's got a sink to it. This is a sink state. That's an old couch. I bought that. I bought that at a store. Oh. I just went to a store and I bought an old couch on.

It's lovely. It's lovely. It's got a nice vintage store in Los Angeles. I went looking for a couch for this very, very stage. Any quarters in there? There was no money in there. There was no money in there. So I would say that you have been

one of America's preeminent lesbians for a generation. Wow. Thank you. You got your start in lesbian bars, and the lesbian bars is an endangered species. What happened to the lesbian bar? You know, we like to drink until we're about 30, and then we kind of stop, because we don't like waking up like that anymore.

So it kind of, once online dating came, because the bar used to be the center of the community, you didn't meet any gay people or assume they were gay unless you went to a bar and saw them. It was like the only place. There was no internet. There was nothing you had to find the bar. And now you can find lesbians. And now you can find us everywhere. Good Lord, we're just everywhere.

You're everywhere. I forgot. I was thinking about our conversation that you were part of the Ellen coming out episode in 1997. Yeah. And I'm curious what the vibe was like on that set. Like, what was it like when you're shooting this thing, it's months before it's going to come out?

It must have felt like you're part of something. Yeah. I have been friends with Ellen for years, met her when she was, you know, before any television shows or anything. And it was a pleasure to. watch her career and her decisions, you know, that led to that. We went out to dinner one night and she goes, okay, I'm going to do it. And I'm like, what are you going to do? She's, I'm going to come out. And I'm like, no, she goes, my character on the show is going to come out. And we're going to

call it the puppy episode. So nobody, it was called, it was secret. It was called the puppy episode. No one was to talk about it. No one was to say anything. And then, it was it. And And each of us, man, she had Oprah on. She had, there were so many people in that episode that they just created this massive thing that you couldn't look away. You couldn't, you had to pay attention to it. And when it was aired, there was just, they were crowds gathered just to watch this historic thing. So cool. Hey, are all famous lesbians either friends or enemies?

Yes. Really? No. You have ones that you just think are fine? Yes, the ones I haven't met. Oh, so Wait. Wait.

So are you either friends or enemies with all the famous lesbians you know? Do you have any enemy lesbians? Are there enemies? I don't spend time with enemy, I mean, I don't spend time thinking about enemies. There's those that I don't really see much anymore.

How about that? Because I think of lesbians, and I'll tell you, I'm a gay person, and just as my experience of lesbians, which is like, you know, lesbians to me are the, like, when someone says, like, my dog is really sweet, but give her a minute to warm up. You know what I'm saying? That's my general experience.

About lesbians? We're very sweet. No, we're just, well, same with gay men. Most of you, you're just all yummy inside, and, you know, you just want to be loved and liked and a little sarcasm in there, too. Yeah, I don't agree. No, okay.

All right. So maybe so. So when you came out in 1993, that's four years before Ellen comes out. Were you, was it, did it feel like you were telling people an open secret? Were you surprised how people were surprised by it? What was it like to do it in that moment? Back then, in the early 90s, it was, don't ask, don't tell. Seriously, across everything.

They really just, it was like, okay, you exist, but don't tell anybody. and we won't ask you. So the press never asked me. And I was discovered in a lesbian bar. I used to, I'd said to myself, if anyone asked me, I'm going to be truthful. But I went through three albums, and it wasn't until the very end of the third album

that Barry Walters from The Advocate actually was like, were you going to do something? I said, I think I am. Yeah, I'm going to come out. So nobody, it was. It was a don't ask, don't tell. So I needed to step up and say, hey, you know, I'm gay. Did, were any of your fans surprised?

Like, what was the fan reaction? Because as much as it's an inside secret among, like, people that, you know, cover music and Yeah. Like, you got, you were, you're traveling in the country and parts of the country where people weren't talking about. Yeah. Yeah. I had a very, I had an underground.

I obviously had a lesbian following, even from the first album. But I also had a very strong male following of guys that just like rock and roll music and loved it. And for the first few years before I came out, I had a big following of that. And then I think when I came out, I think I broke a few hearts. I do, you know, just a few fans. But now they actually, they come out and see me now. And they, it's like they have permission. It's like, okay, she's gay, but I can still like her music sort of thing. Yeah. It's like the evil I moved to trans and now being lesbian. Yeah. Oh, it's mild, yes, compared to. It's a mild case.

Yeah. The mild case. Now, you won an Oscar for your song, I Need to Wake Up, for Al Gore is an inconvenient truth. Given that we never did, in fact, wake up, do you think you should give the Oscar back? No, I think waking up looks different to everybody, and I think that I think we're more awake than we know.

Oh. Yeah. How do you know when you're more awake than you know because you're asleep? You know what I mean? How would I know if I'm awake, if I don't think I'm awake? You would feel.

It. Yes. You would actually feel. It would feel different than the fear that you wake up with every day. I do wake up afraid every day. Yeah. And like kind of little nauseous? Yeah. Yeah. Well. So you told a story about how Taylor Swift discovered the guitar in part because they were listening to you play the guitar. And Taylor came and told you about that, right? Yes. It was one of, it's something that I use. forever with my children because they're like, well, you know, who are you, mom? What, you know, you're not Taylor Swift and, you know, and, I mean, years ago,

now that they're older, they respect my career and everything. But back then, they just, they never heard me. They didn't know what I did. And so Taylor came up to me early in her career. It was probably 10, at least 10 years ago, if not more. We were both being honored for something. She had only put a couple albums out, and we were backstage. And she came over to me, and you know, she's just one of the nicest people on her.

And she just came over and I said, oh, I'm a big fan. My daughter's even a bigger fan. You know, can we take a picture? And she said, you know, my parents took me to see you when I was 11 years old. And that's why I learned to play the guitar. And so I will tell that to my kids' friends. Anybody under the age of 30, I will tell that to. When did your kids go from not appreciating you as a musician to appreciating you as a musician?

When did that happen? Well, it kind of happens right around. It's not that they didn't appreciate it. They just didn't care. It, you know, it doesn't, children are very, you know, which is a good thing. They're very self-minded. And this is long as, you know, there's food on the table and everything was going fine. And it was until I think the girls, they started listening to me before the boys.

The boys just still don't have anything to do with me. They're just like, you go do what you want. I respect it. Thank you very much. much for it, but they're just not fans of me, you know. I know, that's okay. They were, they were, they were actually

not, they were actually a little impressed that I was coming on your shows. Wow. So there you go. You know what? Maybe you're smarter than I thought. Okay, see, yeah. So you have an album outrise, right? Yes, yes. What are your, what is the energy like at your tour shows? And I was, and listen, I, I, I've been to Brandy Carlisle shows, and I

had this idea that, that on some level, the kind of biker lesbians at your shows might be menacing to the theater lesbians at the Brandy Carlisle shows, but you might unite to take on the Gen Z. Bygirls at Boy Genius or Moona. Yes. Yes. Yes.

No, I've got... We lovingly called them the Donnas because in every group, in every, like, meet and greet group I've ever had, in every group of at least five lesbians of Etheridge fans, One of them is named Donna. So it's just, it's a fact.

And so we call them the Donnas. And they are, they will save the world, actually. They are some of the, Melissa Etheridge fans are some of the deeply kindest people I've ever met. It's true. See, there they are. But they could take the brand name. They could. They would absolutely.

If anyone, if I was in danger, they would, it would be blood, yes. Yeah, no, I feel very safe. Yes. Yes, yes, you sure, yes. You know, flat tires, you know, ruffians. I think you're just safe. Yeah. You know, anything like that.

Which I think brings us to our game. There's no wrong way to be gay, except for however Tim Cook is currently doing it. But, Melissa, it's time for a game. We're calling, like the way I Subaru. Ah, I love it, I love it. I am going to read off a lesbian stereotype. You confirm whether it's true or false. Are you ready?

I'm so ready. Do lesbians love Subaru's, true or false? Is that a true or false stereotype? Well, I need to tell you why we love Subaru's. Oh, please. I want to know. Okay. Back in 1990s, early 90s, there were barely any out people.

And the only couple that were out, the lesbians, were the sports, was Billy Jean King and Martina and Avertolova. And I know we've got lots of issues now in that. But the truth was they were out, and they were mentors to me. Now, no one would touch an out lesbian to do an ad. Subaru, who was kind of floundering in the what is a Subaru world, said, you know what?

We are going to go for the lesbian community. And when they put Martina in an ad for Subaru, and they paid her money, we said, yes, we will buy a superiors. We will show you that making that decision economically was a plus. And we started buying suboros and we have not stopped because they supported us back in like 1991, 92. It was very, very big back then. That's cool. Can I admit something to you?

Yes. So I'm engaged to a trans person who for the first part of their life was basically a lesbian. and now they're a trans person marrying me, and I'm very confident in our relationship. However, we already have season tickets to Angel City, the women's soccer team. And so I've really drawn the line at getting... I really don't want us to ever get a Subaru

because I'm afraid it's catcher. They'll get behind the Subaru and they'll remember who they once were. Oh, for them. Oh, I thought you were going to become a lesbian. No. Okay, no. Oh, I don't think it's...

Right. No, no, I see what you're saying. Yeah. I'm more worried that... I'm less worried about me becoming a lesbian and more than reverting. No. I don't know why I think the Subaru would be the thing to do it, but I do feel like we have season tickets to the women's soccer team. We're driving on your way.

What am I? Playing with fire over there. You're on your way, yes. It's dangerous. Look out. Are you? The next thing we know they got a carabiner on their way is, you know, it's scary. It's scary.

Next lesbian stereotype, e-hauling. This is when basically two women start dating and very quickly they're renting a U-Haul to move in together. Yeah, yeah, it's true. I can't deny it, yes. We loved to make homes. We love to, we have transformed cities across the world. We find something that's broken down and, you know, it looks horrible. Oh, we can fix it up. Then, you know, this is like the second date, you know, but you're going to fix that apartment up. Bring all this stuff, make a home out of it. It's just, we really like to do that, yeah. Wow. I know. One interesting culture. Yeah. We get guilty with sex. We have sex with someone.

We're like, oh, all right, that's it. We're going to be with him forever. So that's an interesting point you raised. So I have found when I was in my youth, I always felt like because the expectation that men have a masculine relationship to sex, there's a kind of like the sexual dynamic in like gay bars as you can have basically kind of emotion-free sex.

sex, sex without love. Like, there's no commitment involved and everybody could just have fun and shake hands and go home, or whatever people do, I don't know. I wasn't really part of it. But I feel like there are men you have a feminine relationship to sex

in that they have the emotional connection and they want something more like a relationship before they have a sexual relationship, but it's a little less... Now, it's when men date women, that's obvious who will tend to have which role, but in gay world it's less true. In the same way that they're,

the gay land that there are men who are like, I don't want to have easy sex. That doesn't work for me. How often are there lesbians that are like, where are the bitches that just want to fucking go home? You know, I haven't been in the single world in a long, long, long time, but I have witnessed it. And I think that there are some pretty fierce young women out there that are doing the, I'm going out tonight and whoever and whatever. I think that's not as rare as it was when I was in the dating pool, which was a long time ago. Carabiners, why do lesbian feed them? I have no idea. That I don't understand.

So strange. Why do you, why does, why is, why is we, why is wanting to go down on your friend, meaning more keys? It doesn't make any sense. We, we, we don't like purses. So it's like, how are we going to carry our stuff, our keys and stuff, you know, and the Swiss Army knife and the things we need. Right.

You know, so I think that's where that comes from, but I don't personally have one. Sorry, I can't help you with that one. Hairy armpits. Yeah, well, that I got, yeah. Yes, sir. There is no reason to shave your armpits. I just do not get it.

Yeah, I don't. It's not because it's not for you. No. The man. Yeah. Or it's for someone else. It certainly went for me. Yeah.

It's annoying. It gets you get, anyway, we won't go into that. We don't need to go into it. We don't need to get into that. No, I don't, yeah. So I remember that, but I do remember the first time when I was a child in the 60s where I saw a woman with hairy armpits. And I was like, you know, just because I hadn't seen it. But then I was interested.

Was that the moment you realized that you? I think so. Yeah, I think so. I was like, shocking. Oh, look at her. She has hairy legs. What does this mean? Next stereotype, if you need a lesbian in a hurry, you can find one at Home Depot.

Ah, probably, yeah. Like I said, we like to fix things. We like to make homes. And we love to, I mean, if there's something broken in the house, oh, if you've got a lesbian, forget it. It's, we'll fix it in a minute. That's so cool. It is. You're the first one I've met, and so far I'm into it.

I'm kidding. And final stereotype, fans of Melissa Etheridge. Ah, that's true. Yeah. Yes, what? Yes, lesbians like my music. I don't know what else to say. There's nothing else to say that. There's no. There it is. Yeah. You know what a lesbian army is called, right? What's the lesbian army called? It's a militia Etheridge. It's a perfect place to leave it. We will be right back with the one in Army Boston. Let's average.

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And we're back. Please welcome to the sage. It's a bird. It's a plane. It's the diva herself. It's Bosco. Hi. Love it. Lovely. Thank you. Beautiful. Beautiful. It's my job. Thank you. It's quite a far away down for me. Hi. Hello. Welcome to the show. You look stunning. Thank you. It's my job and God given talent. Thank you. And those are the two things you, you know.

Absolutely. Effort and talent. After that, it's just luck. You know. And money. Absolutely. Having rich parents. Which is highly recommended, but not always available. The marvelous misgender.

So true. It's about your alter ego's plan to turn everyone trans. Mm-hmm. That's your new stage show. How would one turn someone trans? Okay. So here's the thing. I have a ray gun that does it for me.

It's delightful. And the thing is, when you turn trans, you just, like, if I were to trans-genderify you right now, you would not be a trans woman. You'd be a trans man. And you'd be able to check your DMs and you'd find a lot of rude girls in them. And I promise that's a great thing. Say hi to Safira for me. Yeah, I think it's really, really fun to call out what the media is currently saying about trans people and saying that they're right. They should be worried and they should stop us if that's an opposite. No, such an important point that people are afraid to make. This is the turning everyone trans is the goal. Oh, absolutely. That is the plan. Oh, world domination, turning everyone trans.

Yeah, now we haven't really cracked the exact formula yet, but we got scientists working on it. We sure have, and we're going to crack a few eggs along the way. Pete Buttigieg goes down a very long elevator to the basement where there's a meeting of the secret cabal. Yeah, and then he finds them the non-binary advisor that stole the luggage. Yes. And they put on lipstick for each time. The non-binary Biden advisor who stole the luggage was for a time our favorite villain. What an incredible.

Melissa Etheridge, you know about this? No. This is the best story of all time. The non-binary representative of the Biden administration was stealing luggage from the airport, opening it, and then wearing the outfits in public events. And part is there like Nigerian, like, beautiful fabrics that a one. white person should not be touching and or wearing. It is

one of the craziest stories. Wow. Well, look, and it's, you know what? Queer people can be villains. It's so true. And that's part of it. Yeah. Think about how many suitcases you would have to steal from LAX to get one that has beautiful custom gowns. That fit you.

That fit you. That is so gaggy. I honestly, I think non-binary people should steal more. I think that they did nothing wrong and they should continue. I don't know where they are at this point, but I do think they're like the Rachel Dolesol of non-binary people. And I really think they should be allowed to run for office again. Sure, can't do worse than some of the other Democrats we've had out there.

Now, there's nudity in the show. Hopefully. But your inspiration was also Batman, like the Adam West Batman. Oh, yeah, famously filled with nudity. And Pee Wee's Playhouse. Also filled with nudity. How did you get everything in there? The nudity, the Batman, the Pee-We-Herman.

I think my favorite thing about creating is pulling from so many different sources that an alchemy happens and you're like, this feels familiar, but I've never seen anything like this. So that's what I'm trying to do with all of these references. Do you ever when Batman is running around with a bomb on the beach, and he has to, on the boardwalk, and he has to run and find a place to throw the bomb, but he can't find a place to throw the bomb because everywhere he looks as like a nun or children-hild children hanging, and then he finally finds a place to throw the bomb and it explodes right at the perfect time. Remember that?

I don't. However, that's the best bit I've ever heard. I do. He looks pretty silly. It looks pretty silly. I like that that's like Pepperidge Farm remembers, but Melissa Etheridge. I remember. I remember. Now, you also host Spell Slayers, a YouTube show about magic gathering. I have in my home a box of magic cards that I believe has not been touched since 1999.

So there may be valuable cards in there. I believe it. I believe it. No, it is such an old card game. Well, not old, but like it's been around longer than almost any other card game, other than like playing cards. It came out, I believe, 1992, 93, so 30 plus years. And it is such a lovely, lovely pastime of mine that I've decided to monetize and turn into business to torture myself. You do the show with Irene the Alien, fellow drag queen. I do. Yeah, it's not my fault. Have you ever played Magic the Gathering? I bought the game for my son once, and then he always told me he wanted to learn it because he heard it was good, but he never did. So I still have a box in my toy chest. Will you play Magic the Gathering with me, Melissa? Sure.

I'd love to. Oh, it would be an absolute delight. It's my favorite game. Wow, cool. It's also a really interesting game because I find out, like, crew people whenever I go on tour also play Magic the Gathering. So I bully them into playing with me. And then they have to lose, otherwise they get fired. You just got to make sure you have the right balance of mana of resources and defensive and offensive creatures.

And then think about what kind of deck you want. Do you want a fire and ice deck? Do you want to kind of be think about that. You want a black and white deck. A lot of different ways you can go. I think that it hasn't changed since I last played. Oh, no, it's great. But now they've added neopronounds.

So now there's a z-zer type tax. Wow. Magic the Gathering went woke. Oh, yeah. Stayed woke. Been woke. Been woke. That's great. Found woke. And there are characters now in Magic the Gathering that are considered to be queer characters, right? Absolutely. By me in particular. Is it wishful thinking or is it canon?

It is canon. It's canonical. There are queer characters within Magic Gathering the universe. This is going to shock you. A lot of trans women play and create Magic the Gathering. So we do try to insert ourselves wherever possible. We're just laughing. Not too much. How can we strengthen the bond between trans women and lesbians? How do we build that bridge? Oh, I think that bridge is built already.

Yes, with our tools, yes, with our tool belt. With our carabiners come by. Yes, yes. For sure. I think there's an entire, the transbeian sect of trans is very, very powerful. You can find them on Reddit. I don't know. I feel like lesbians and trans women are natural porn allies. Absolutely. There's some, you'll find some, you know, conflict in social media.

A little bit social, but generally, I mean, back when... Conflict on the internet, great-ridden, two backwaters, basically. Exactly. But we, historically, we very much, I mean, it was lesbians in the trans community at Stonewall that started it all there. It was a couple hot white guys. It was like, no, no. The red was hot white guys is the chufeterm. Yeah, that's really, yeah, really beautiful. I saw the film, and that's what I remember from the film.

Yeah, no, no, no. There were, like, bringing those guys, like, food to eat. No, no, no, see. They were getting the coffee. Yeah, coffee, that kind of thing. No. No. No. No. No, no. No, no.

No, no. I'm sorry, but the gay rights movement has been led by, no. specifically a subset of handsome, rich white man. That's the movement. I'm, I'm crazy. Yes, you are. This is it right here.

Andy Cohen threw the first brick at Stonehouse. You were saying just doesn't feel true to me. No, I'm sorry. I think I was there. I wasn't a Stonewall. I wasn't alive, though. I think we've always kind of been like the most vocal of like the gay subtypes. Well, trans people in general, not take it just to trans women,

but like trans people in general and like lesbians have kind of. I've always been the ones shouting from the rooftops, whether people wanted to hear it or not. That's right. That was nice. Thank you. Thank you. We'll be right back.

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but does its monsters. Let's discuss in a little game we're calling Magic the Gathering. Oh, I love that. I love that. That has quite a bit better ring than Fagget the Gathering. Yes, Bagot the Gather.

Oh, that's good, too. That was just sitting right there on the table. I'm allowed to say that. Yes, yes, really. Yes. And there's nothing wrong with that. I know. I'm trying my best.

Bosco, Melissa, I will show you a monster from Magic to Gathering. You will tell us where you think they are on the Kinsey scale. Zero is exclusively heterosexual. Six is exclusively homosexual. First up, we have Tarmagoyeuf. To help you decide, we also have quotes from this character. What doesn't grow dies and what dies grows the Termagoyf. I know the head is crazy.

I feel where does non-binary fall on the Kinsey scale? I find no sexuality at all in that. No, but I do see a septum piercing. So we can say, there's no eyebrows. You know, listen, we can do a three-dimensional plot. We can now leave the X, Y, axis. We can talk about how sexual they are. We could talk about what their gender identity is.

There's no rules in this game. You can do whatever we want. So we're saying asexual, non-biased. Binary? That seems to be where we know. Who is making oat lattes for me in the morning? This is me when I need an oat latte. Yeah. Don't copy me before I've had my tarmagoif.

There you go. There you go. Mean anything. Next up, we have, so we're going to say, asexual, non-binary, just for the ruling there. Next up, we have Amnath, the Locus of Creation. Landfall wherever a land enters the battlefield under your control You gain four life if this is the first time

This ability has resolved this turn. Very sexy. Wow, you need a bunch of different kinds of Mana to do this. You do, but a complicated creature. I believe Omnath has bangers Because it looks like the two fingers are shorter than the others Which I think is going to put her

pretty high up on the Kinsey scale. Yeah, no, for sure. It's very rainbow. What do you think? You really just passed me that. I have no idea what you're talking about. Okay, that's fine. Okay, that's fine. I can't wait for you to go home and Google what bangers are. I'm like, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, I'm so I've been.

So what are you thinking? We're thinking of four, we're thinking a five? Oh, I'm going six. Six. Just straight, just gay as, gay as it can be. Look at her. Yeah. Look at her.

Bangers, bangers. Okay. Should I, can I? No, I don't know. I don't know. Should I. Maybe whispered him to my Sethridge what it is. Okay, absolutely.

I'm going to whisper with this mic right here. So bangers are when lesbians have shorter fingernails on their index and portrait Oh For fingering purposes Of course, thank you very much You're so welcome We didn't have a name for that We just, it was just the way you figured out if someone was gay

You'd look at their hands, but go ahead Love you the way I do So like No fingernails, perhaps a lesbian One long fingernail, maybe a coke problem That was right Exactly Right for sure

And so they're okay Yeah. Next up, the hermit druid. You seek the company of plans to ensure that your wits will go to seed. Okay, wait. Look at this. Look at this, hermit druid. Oh.

Wait. I don't know. You don't know? I don't know. Okay. So, I do believe we're giving straight, however, we're giving chaser, which I don't know where that falls on the Kinsey scale. Right.

It was not a zero for sure. No. No. I'd say three or something. Yeah. Like, yeah, let's say three. A self-hating three. A self-hating three.

I love that. In my DMs, but not willing to go out in public. Right, right. Yeah, that's, I think. And it's, you know, and it's sad, honestly, for the hermit druid, because it's like, there's a happy world out there for you, but you just brace who you are, right? But then you think it's a druid, and so maybe there's a kind of stoicism to the whole enterprise.

Oh, yeah. I would say, like, I would find him at Burning Man. He would come to my window. And I do believe. that you know what they missed the first one they got the second okay okay okay got it got it perfect perfect we had to hit it one more yeah yeah yeah absolutely I'm giving chaser vibes so like interested in women but also interested in women we're calling it a self-hating three next up the Golgari Grave troll

oh look at that queen That very cryptkeeper. Cindy, this is bones. Okay. Yeah. How gay is this the Golgari Gravetrol? I mean, look at that, look at that waist. Look at the kind of snatched.

We are kind of snatched. Look at the cage. You're kind of snatched. Okay, got it. Skirt. We do have the skirt. Midriff showing. Kind of looks like the older women, when I used to play the bars in Long Beach,

that would sit at the end of the bar and complain that I was singing too loud. Wow. Kind of. Got a very skinny, angry, skeletal bar dwellers. But gay. But gay.

But gay. And mad about it. That's at the six. Five or six. What do you think? Yeah, I'm going to go six. Six. Yeah, let's give her six.

And let's do one more. Next up, we have the mimiplasm. The mimoplasm. there's the mimiplasm, legendary creature. It seems to have the power of ooze. The power of ooze, the mimiplasm. I do want to say that I've met a barista that's non-binary named ooze. So I do think that I think we're back on.

Wow, I think you are. Wow. Wow, okay. Absolutely. I think that the second O is capitalized instead of the first one that I'm. No, I think that... Nope, shut it down. Second O capitalized.

I think so. Second OECD capitalized. Come on. Power to the people. Come on. Is that why they... Is that why the lesbians threw the brick?

Exactly. They're trying to hit ooze. So just to wrap it up, we've had a... We have another non-binary, but I think hypersexual. I think there's a deeply sexual... Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

One of their hands has a tongue. What do they call that move? I'm out. I'm gone. All right. And that's... Wow. Magic the Gathering.

When we come back, it's time for second thoughts. Yeah, you just kind of fill in the blanks. And that's what I do with my toes. I only paint the first three. You only paint the first three... We're back. You only paint your first three toes.

I sure do. I sure do. A, because I'm lazy. B, because it's messy. And C, I don't like people touching my feet, so I don't like getting pedicures. Oh. And, you...

Yeah, it's kind of like when you are able to read every single word, the first and the last letter are the same, but all the letters are the same within it. It's all like jumbled. If I paint three toes, everybody just assumes the rest of them are painted. Wow. But you know. But I know, and that's my secret.

Now it's time for second thoughts. Tell us. I know. Basically, I have a list here of proposed second thoughts by the producers of this show for things I perhaps should regret having said or done. And I'm going to walk you through them now. And then also I'd like to know what regrets and second thoughts you have about this evening. First up, think about it.

Give it a good think. First up, from the monologue, the joke, Sam Bankman Frieda Kalo, you guys hated that. You just hated that. I've never had a, I've never had a pun, basically fly the plane that is this show into a mountain. the way that that, it was a different energy in the room after I said that, and I do regret it, I do regret it, I do regret it. Oh, I also at some point referred to my respected co-workers, knockers.

I did refer to her knockers, and while we did discuss the joke beforehand, it still felt weird to say it. I said to Melissa Etheridge, and I quote, my experience with lesbians, that's how I started a sentence. I said, Melissa Etheridge, let me tell you about my experience with lesbians. Melissa, oh, also, Melissa praised her fans, and I did not even occur to me to talk about the fans of this show. It did not even occur to me to suggest, oh, we have great fans here at Love It or Leave It.

I don't think they could fix a goddamn thing. I get this, I feel like in this group, even just look at this group of people who've attended, which I think is a mix of fans and people that are here. I'm not sure we're getting the tire changed. Oh, you know what? Thank you. I didn't want to, I didn't want to, like, suggest it, but there was a competence coming off of you that I felt safe.

So that's good. So that's at least two of us that you and Melissa Etheridge can do it. All right. Get it done. Oh, for Bosco, I dress like this next to you. How I dress for this show. I have a regret about it. Oh, another regret.

I did not invite myself to the Bosco, Melissa, Etheridge, Magic, Gathering game. I just let it happen, and it was just going to transpire without me. Well, there you go. Still not invited. No, I was not. Sorry. Just for the job you want. Yep.

Melissa, what's a regret you have about tonight? Or any second thoughts you might have? I really don't have any regrets, but no, I think. I don't know What do you think about our dynamic? You and me? Yeah. Oh, I think we need to have like a dinner.

Yeah, I think we need to... I don't know. I just think we need to talk. Cool. Yeah. That was such an interesting energy to it. I'm excited. It was portentious.

Bosco. Yes. What do you have a second thought about? Anything you regret saying or doing tonight? Any regrets that I have? regrets? Maybe just subjecting the audience to the raw sexual tension me and Melissa have in this moment. I was looking at her lovely, this is really impressive. The ink you've got. Yeah, see it's just she's very pretty. I'm sorry. Very pretty.

No, and I know that's kind of overwhelming and like maybe like jealousy inducing to the audience here and I'm really sorry to do that tall. Look at them. They're riddened by jealousy. They're overwhelmed by it. The green cloud of jealousy looms on the stage between us. Isn't that right? Betwixt. Betwixt, yes. And that's our show.

Thank you so much. There are 173 days until the midterm. We all will see you back on Friday with Caitlin Riley and Sam Hewen. Until then, have a great night. Love it or Leave It is a Cricket Media production. Our show is produced by Kendra James, Bill McGrath, Kelsey Gante, and me, John Lovett. Our production team includes Hallie Kiefer, Sarah Lazarus, David Tolls, Claudia Shang, Jay Banks, Gavin Purcell, and Matt DeGroote, and our staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.