LPRC - CrimeScience Episode 52 – The History of Loss Prevention Magazine ft. Jack Trlica (Loss Prevention Magazine)

Episode Date: May 19, 2020

In this new episode, Jack Trlica, Managing Editor of Loss Prevention Magazine, joins our host Dr. Read Hayes to discuss his background, the history and evolution of Loss Prevention Magazine, organized... retail crime, the magazine’s digital platform, distribution, COVID-19 resources, and much more. The post CrimeScience Episode 52 – The History of Loss Prevention Magazine ft. Jack Trlica (Loss Prevention Magazine) appeared first on Loss Prevention Research Council.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Hi, everyone. Welcome to Crime Science. In this podcast, we aim to explore the science of crime and the practical application of the science for loss prevention and asset protection practitioners, as well as other professionals. Co-host Dr. Reid Hayes of the Loss Prevention Research Council and Tom Meehan of ControlTech discuss a wide range of topics with industry experts, thought leaders, solution providers, and many more. We would like to thank Bosch for making this episode possible. Use Bosch Camera's onboard intelligent video analytics to quickly locate important recorded incidents or events. Bosch's forensic search saves you time and money by searching through hours or days of video within minutes to find and collect video evidence. Learn more about intelligent video analytics from Bosch in zones one through four of LPRC's zones of influence by visiting Bosch online at boschsecurity.com. Welcome everybody to another episode of Crime Science, the podcast. And I'm honored to be
Starting point is 00:00:50 joined today by Jack Trulisio. He and I do go way back and Jack is the, and you're going to have to correct me here, Jack, if I'm wrong, but the publisher, I just remember longtime editor of LP Magazine, Loss Prevention Magazine. So welcome today, Jack, and I look forward to you and I talking about the magazine and all things LP. Thanks for having me. It's going to be interesting. I'm happy to talk to you. Sounds good. So, all right. So right before we started recording, you and I talked about, you know, how you became engaged in the LP loss prevention world. What did that look like? I mean, how, what did you do before that to set yourself up? And then I know you went to Pinkerton, but how did that all unfold? Well, it's interesting because I have a, my career background is all in advertising and marketing communications.
Starting point is 00:01:48 And I was working in the early 90s. I was working in Charlotte at an advertising agency. And I was recruited by Pinkerton Services Group to come into their organization to start to manage their awareness programs for retailers. At the time Pinkerton had what they called alert line, an anonymous tip line that they you know they provided that service to a lot of retailers and then they were wanting awareness programs to instruct their associates about how to use the hotline. So I decided to do that. And so I joined Pinkerton in 1991, I believe it was. And I set up a creative department, hired designers, writers, those kinds of folks.
Starting point is 00:02:42 And part of my role was like a product marketing person. I was to market the Pinkerton Awareness Services to retailers. And so I thought, well, what we should do, since I'm an advertising guy, we should advertise in whatever magazine services, you know, this segment of the industry. And of course, I found out at the time there was no loss prevention magazine. So that was a kind of an interesting tidbit that I kind of put in the back of my mind. So when I joined Pinkerton, this was my very first introduction to loss prevention. And quite frankly, it took me a while to kind of figure out what in the heck LP guys and gals did, you know. I was, I guess I was a bit of a Boy Scout. I thought, well, you know, who steals stuff
Starting point is 00:03:34 from retailers, you know. So I was, I was pretty new to this whole industry. Our clients, my first clients were Home Depot, Family Dollar, Saks, Belk, Talbots. And so I got to know LP professionals in a very intimate way, providing their services, our services to those retailers. So that's how I entered and became a part of this industry. And I think it was sometime in the mid-90s, Reid, that we shared a stage probably at NRF or one of the other industry events where we were both talking about awareness programs because you were involved in awareness back in that day, right? and awareness back in that day, right? You know, I was. We had a – I was a Ross Stores district and then regional and so forth LP manager. And it was during that time that Ross decided – or my boss at Ross Stores,
Starting point is 00:04:41 the Vice President Dave Whitney, decided, hey, we're going to – that we've got our chairman and our president are partners in an organization that has other startup retailers going on, Egghead Software and Workplace. And I'm trying to remember, there's another chain or two. They need LP help. I'd like to nominate you, Reed, to do this on the side. You know what? So that's how that started. Um, you know, and so he said, Oh, and, uh, here's the deal. You're going to retain your current position and your shrinkage not only should not go up, but it needs to continue to go, you know, go down or keep doing a good job. So that was, that's what was going on there, Jack, that we were a division, believe it or not, of Ross stores. And, uh, so we started doing training and awareness, including touchscreen IBM, doing this
Starting point is 00:05:27 interactive store detective training video and all these things. So you and I end up on a panel. It sounds like back then it was either NRMA or maybe it had become the National Retail Federation. I'm not sure. Yeah, I'm not really sure. But I know at the time I was hired the the major awareness vendor in our industry was the network in Atlanta and I guess they kind of started the whole awareness programs that were based on cartoon kinds of characters you know for posters and whatever because we did this we did something similar we had a Captain Impact that was a character, and we actually did comic books for Home Depot and Family Dollar with Captain Impact coming to the rescue and this, that, and the other.
Starting point is 00:06:14 I'm sure that some of our listeners probably would even remember some of these characters that we did. But I hope that I kind of took awareness to the next level because I came at it from a marketing perspective and started doing, you know, sort of target focus groups with our retail associates to try to understand, you know, how they received things and wanted to learn and this, that, and the other. So it was a very interesting time for me. And I stayed in that role for about, probably about seven or eight years. And then I was moved into a corporate marketing role for Pinkerton and was in that role probably until, well, I guess it was 2000, about 2001, Securitas had bought Pinkerton, and Securitas didn't have a real high regard for marketing, so my role was eliminated in January 2001.
Starting point is 00:07:28 opportunity. And the idea that I put in the back of my brain back in the early 90s about a magazine for loss prevention kind of resurfaced. And I kind of put together a business plan. And about that time, Jim Lee, who I had met when I was at Pinkerton, and he had a company called Contact that was an awareness provider. And he contacted me to see if I was interested in joining up to do awareness programs and we started talking about different things and I brought up the idea of the magazine and you know after two or three meetings he got excited about it and I think April 1st as I recall 2001 is when we decided to move forward with the magazine. That's how the magazine came to fruition. That's so interesting, and that really ties together some threads for me.
Starting point is 00:08:19 I was trying to remember, and I had little bits right, but not the whole thing. And I, of course, got to know Jim Lee first when he was the head of LP for Marshalls. And he and Bob McClee, of course, was his number two there. And I actually was dispatched by Ross to go in there and see if they would buy into that store detective video training program. And so Jim is particularly skilled at delegation. And so, you know, Bob and I had, you know, a series of meetings. And, you know, that's where I really got to know, know Bob, and what a gentleman and what a neat guy and what a capable leader. But so anyway, that's, so had the little bits right, I guess.
Starting point is 00:09:10 Yeah. So you're you guys, you start getting the magazine. You decide to found it. What's that look like? You're you know, you've got a business plan. You've got a business partner. Now, how do you guys get the magazine rolling? Well, that was pretty interesting. Pretty interesting. The great thing about Jim Lee and at the time, Walter Palmer was in partnership with Jim in contact. And so, you know, it was a great marriage because I brought the marketing, advertising, publishing role. And Jim and Walter were, you know, brought their industry contacts and their industry knowledge. So it was a great partnership to begin with. So like I said, on April 1st, we made the, I can remember sitting in a hotel conference room and we made the decision to go forward. Between mid, April 1st, where NRF was going to be in Vancouver, we put together from zero to finished
Starting point is 00:10:09 a fully published printed prototype. So we contacted people to write articles for us. We even had advertisements in it just to make, to give it a look of a finished magazine. And so we went to NRF with about, I think we printed 500 or 1,000 copies of it and distributed it to the attendees and just kind of tried to get input from the industry as to what they thought about it. So it's interesting. I've got that initial magazine in front of me, and we had some pretty interesting articles.
Starting point is 00:10:54 I mean, the lead article was written by King Rogers on organized retail theft at the time. That was before we, I think you actually changed it to Organized Retail Crime. So that was our cover article from King Rogers. And Jim interviewed David Myers from Montgomery Ward who was the executive interviewer in that premier issue. Actually at this point in time, it was just what we called a preview issue. We had an article on Lowe's Internet-based LP audit. Walter wrote an article on how to develop ROI on your different technologies and whatever. And then we had an article from Steve Wilvey on pre-employment screening. Those were our major feature articles. But what's interesting too, Reed, we contacted some people who we wanted to
Starting point is 00:12:03 contribute on an ongoing basis. And so in that very first issue, we had an article from WZ. And they're still, they've been in every issue ever since. Bob DiLenardo did industry news from that very first, until he retired three or four years ago. Dick Hollinger wrote an article on workplace dishonesty, and he contributed columns for, I don't know, quite a number of years. We had a woman named Mimi Welsh who wrote an ongoing column on women in LP. And then we had, this was interesting, and it was very well received. It was one of our most popular columns. We had, it was called LP and the Law. It was written by Norman
Starting point is 00:12:52 Spain out of Eastern Kentucky University. And he just kind of talked about the different legal aspects of LP. And he did that for a number of years. So that was our prototype that we called our preview and when we came away from Vancouver, the reception was so great that we said well looks like this is going to work and so between June and, we refined that preview prototype and turned it into our premier issue that we published in September 2001. And that was our very first issue. And starting in January 2002, we've been publishing bimonthly ever since. That is fantastic. A lot of names that I remember so well from Norman, Spain.
Starting point is 00:13:49 And, you know, the irony, but that NRF that you're talking about there in Vancouver, I mean, to me, in my mind, that just doesn't seem that long ago. I can remember sitting out there with Ed Sanchez from the Home Depot and meeting. Well, he was at Target at that time, actually. And us sitting out there and having a meeting and the beautiful scenery and all. I just can't believe it was that long ago. Yeah, it does. Well, that was 19 years ago.
Starting point is 00:14:30 years ago um and and one one little uh one little comment i remember from that vancouver event um i remember being at a networking event and talking to people about uh about the magazine and and it was paul jones and quite frankly i think i don't know where he was at the time he was probably at uh sunglass hut or someplace like that. I think it was Sunglass Hut, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So I remember sitting there talking to him, and he said, he looked at me, he said, well, how in the world are you going to find enough stuff to write about for this industry? You know, and I thought, well, there's all sorts of topics.
Starting point is 00:15:02 But, you know, it made me start thinking. But now that I look back at it after 19 years of content development, we've never had a hard time coming up with something to write about. Well, yes and no. I can remember, you're right, but those earlier planning meetings, the editorial meetings, there were times when it seemed like it was pulling teeth, not necessarily good content, but to get people to write the content up. That seemed to be the challenge. You guys would go around the room, and really some guys, they were in, some of the people and others were like, I got an idea, but I don't know if I can write an article. It was interesting. You're right about that. And, you know, one of the things, I mean, we were a very small organization, still a very small organization, and we didn't,
Starting point is 00:15:52 it's not like we had a, you know, a room full of writers to develop content. So we had to depend on people to write for us. So, you know, that, you know, that first article I was mentioning about Lowe's Audit, that was written by Claude Verville. And he will be the first to tell you he's not a good writer. And my line has always been, look, just put your thoughts on paper. You may not be a good writer, but I'm a great editor. So I can polish it up and it'll be and uh so we we did depend and we got a lot of contributions from people in the industry and we still do today not nearly as much as we did uh we do have a couple of writers on staff now that do a lot of our content but we still are always looking for contributions from the industry.
Starting point is 00:16:47 Yeah, those are good insights. And you mentioned King, and he had that article on ORT. And I believe you're correct, Jack, that what happened was somehow King and myself, I don't know if we were asked or it was our idea or what to do a joint column in the magazine. And we were trying to figure was our idea or what to do a joint column in the magazine. And we were trying to figure out what to call it. And we started talking about ORC with you. And I can remember you at first saying, I don't know, Reed. I mean, everybody says ORT right now.
Starting point is 00:17:19 And you had your marketing hat on and you're probably thinking, I don't know, guys. Make your case. And what happened was I had a little grant from, ironically, Paul at, he was there for a cup of coffee at Relift, if you'll remember. And Paul called me up and said, look, I can get you a grant if you'll go do research on this organized retail theft and put together a white paper for us and something that our members can use, but also we can use because we need to go to Congress and then some of the states. that our members can use, but also we can use because we need to go to Congress and then some of the states. And so I went around and spent all that time with the FBI and, you know, Florida Department of Law Enforcement and Target and other ORT investigators at the time. And when it came back and wrote it up, I said, wow, this goes way beyond just theft. The dynamics are incredible, you know, counterfeiting and human trafficking, we call it now, right? There was all kind of things, passport counterfeiting and just amazing amount of fraud as well as the theft and compromising law enforcement officers.
Starting point is 00:18:13 It was kind of scary. So we came back and we kind of told you that. And you're like, okay, that sounds good. Let's call ORC. Let's call it crime. It's not just theft. So, but what's it, how's it, let's go forward's crime it's not just that so um but what's it how's it let's go forward now or start moving through time you've got to establish you've got writers you you had some
Starting point is 00:18:32 regular people in there um how did you start to evolve the magazine clearly you want digital in europe and so on talk a little bit about that jack if you if you would. Okay. Well, you know, we had this idea and we started and we just kind of flew by the seat of our pants. And as we got further into the industry and talking to different people and getting input, you mentioned our editorial board meetings that we have on an annual basis and the input they gave us and that kind of thing. that we have on an annual basis and the input they gave us and that kind of thing, we just started looking for new opportunities for content. And I was looking back and you started the evidence-based LP column back in 2005. So that's been going on for quite a while now. So that's been going on for quite a while now. And that was partly, I think, due to my participation with the LPRC and my backing of the research that the LPRC has been doing.
Starting point is 00:19:33 And I just wanted to give the LPRC a voice in the magazine on an ongoing basis. And then another thing that happened along the way, the magazine was partly, if not totally, responsible for the development of loss prevention certification. We announced that in 2006, and that organization came together. I didn't, I wasn't participating in that myself. Jim was big into it and still is actually. But then, so in like 2010, the certification was developing and announced in the magazine so that was another way the magazine was was helping the industry because our mission was to inform and educate LP professionals and so it's all kind of made a lot of sense you mentioned Europe we partnered with a UK group called Oris Media, who had been running events and networking kinds of things for retailers in the UK. And in 2013, we launched a Europe magazine out of the UK, which is still publishing today
Starting point is 00:21:09 on a quarterly basis. And I'm still involved in the actual production and design and that kind of thing of the magazine. It's actually done here, but printed and distributed out of London. So, but on the digital side, you know, we started off as a print magazine. I think, you know, even very early on, we probably had a sort of a rudimentary website that just where we put up some of our content, but it was nothing like it is today. Of course, websites back in the early 2000s were tremendously different than they are today. So 2015, we decided to up our game on the digital platform, and we launched a new one where we were doing digital newsletters, which we are still doing today, doing today and a much more robust website that was more optimized for mobile media and that kind of thing and then we also just last year sort of
Starting point is 00:22:17 upgraded one more time to a fully optimized platform sort of our digital volume two. And that's kind of where we are today. We still are doing these digital newsletters every day. We have a much more robust digital platform, much more content that we put up on a daily basis on our website. that we put up on a daily basis on our website. And it's been real well received. We have over 15,000 subscribers, digital subscribers. And, you know, it's interesting. There's been all this talk about publishing, you know, printing becoming a dinosaur and nobody reads print anymore.
Starting point is 00:23:03 But we still have over 15,000 print subscribers as well. So I don't think magazines, printed magazines are going to go away anytime soon. You know, one thing that's always been comforting too, I can remember years ago, twice had the privilege to go down, excuse me australia um and going into some of the retailers you know colesmeyer and or bunnings and uh there they've got lp magazine or lost venture magazine at the time on their desk or you know on a table and you know the same thing in europe and elsewhere south africa i can remember so it's just really comforting and neat and exciting to see the magazine. And like you say, what's, what does that look like? I know you've got the Europe
Starting point is 00:23:49 magazine that comes out quarterly out of the UK, but what's your distribution globally of the magazine? Well, it, um, it's not as much as it was early on. We, uh, the magazine is distributed free our sole revenues come from our advertisers and initially and and the decision was made in part by our editorial board because if we had charged a subscription to receive the print magazine then it would probably have restricted our audience to executives or mid to upper executives who could expense that. So probably the store associate NLP would not have spent whatever a subscription would have cost to get the print magazine. So we made a strategic decision in the very beginning to make it a free publication. And so that's what we've done. and that's what we still are doing.
Starting point is 00:24:47 And in the beginning, we started getting requests from outside the United States and Canada. And so we were shipping the magazines free to Europe and South Africa and Australia and all that kind of thing. to Europe and South Africa and Australia and all that kind of thing. And we did that for a number of years until we kind of did an expense, looking at our expenses, and we were seeing how much it was costing us to ship magazines around the world. So after that, we decided that was sort of what spurred us to get a much more robust digital website so that people outside North America could read the magazine but read it digitally. But we still have people who pay $99 a year to get the magazine, the print magazine, sent to them in India and Japan and South Africa, Australia. So we still have some print subscribers outside of North America,
Starting point is 00:25:47 but not nearly as much as we did at first when we were giving it away and sending it out on our own time. So that's fantastic. But I can imagine, like you said, the digital is the way to go. First of all, people still want to read. They want content. But it's tough, and it sounds like pretty expensive to send that many physical magazines out. You're already sending 15,000, but with, I imagine with international postage rates
Starting point is 00:26:12 being what they are. One question I had, by the way, on your editorial content, how do you all deciding now? And I know you're like a conference in so many ways in that you've got, you know, people that have been in roles for 20, 30 or more years, and you've got people that are brand new, and then those that are transitioning in between. How do you all try and work out that content? Well, there's a couple of ways we do it. As you mentioned, we have an annual editorial board meeting, which, you know, back in the day started off with about 20 people sitting around a table somewhere talking about the magazine and what we should be writing about and this, that, and the other. And it's evolved now to where our annual event has become almost like a mini LP conference. I think we had a roughly 180 people at our last annual meeting which was in Hilton Head Island. And we do get comments from our discussions at the editorial board meetings, and we take notes about the topics that people are discussing.
Starting point is 00:27:29 We also send out – we communicate with our editorial board throughout the year on different topics, asking them sometimes, for example, if we're writing an article on facial recognition, for example, we might send out an email to our editorial board and say, hey, we're doing this article. Would you be willing to participate and answer some questions and blah, blah, blah? So that's another thing that we do. We also do an annual readership survey where we do a SurveyMonkey-type solicitation to our readership and ask them the same thing. And so we get a lot of content suggestions from our readers.
Starting point is 00:28:15 So we take all these suggestions. You know, we also just observe what's going on in the industry, and we try to come up with, you know, sort of the major themes of what we're going to write about in the six print issues. And the content, as you probably know, it's not all just, you know, LP, interviewing, technology, that kind of thing. We also have content related to management skills and professional development and things like that. is influence the LP and now the AP professionals to be well-rounded business people, not just LP specific guys and gals out there just looking at theft. I mean, they have, because as you know, this industry has evolved to the point where today's LP professional is probably looks way different than it did back in the 90s and early 2000s. And thus, that's why so many organizations are going to asset protection and, you know, profit protection and all that kind of stuff.
Starting point is 00:29:40 But I mean, our LP executives are now responsible for much more than theft and safety crisis management and compliance issues and all sorts of things you know so many some of some of the SVPs and executive executives out there you know they they, they're handling facilities. Now Shannon Hunter just got promoted to managing sustainability. So it's such a wide range of things that LPAP professionals are managing these days, it's causing us to look for more and more areas to focus our content on. Yeah, you all have really done a great job over the years of doing that. It seemed like playing and providing good contact at different strata, and then,
Starting point is 00:30:44 as you said, the different areas of responsibility, and those continue to change, do more with less. And, you know, we had a call this morning or record a podcast, a crime science podcast with Fred Becker from Bloomingdale's. And he was a top executive at Toys R Us under Chris Gillen. And he was a top executive at Toys R Us under Chris Gillen. And during Chris's time at Toys R Us, he was not only the VP of asset protection, but they gave him VP of customer service and call centers. And so they say, hey, this guy can handle things. He's a good leader. We're going to give him this very important but completely different thing.
Starting point is 00:31:23 And it's like you said with Shannon Hunter. That's really a neat thing. And it's like you said, with Shannon Hunter, that's really a neat thing. And you and I both know that, you know, Marvin Ellison is certainly serving in a different role now at Lowe's than he was when he was at Target or earlier on his career at the Home Depot and AP. And so, you know, that's neat how you all have done that. Well, and we're just going to continue to do that. I mean, that's the requirement. And, you know, that's neat how you all have done that. Well, and we're just going to continue to do that. I mean, that's the requirement. And now, you know, bringing it up to today and this COVID outbreak, we're like everybody else. We're probably busier today than we've ever been because, you know, we're trying to keep up with all the content that's being put out um you know we when uh about i don't know i guess it seems like forever ago but it was probably only a month ago we started uh doing special
Starting point is 00:32:27 doing special newsletters in the afternoons specifically on the pandemic. And because there is so much content out there coming from so many sources, we were trying to look specifically for just the content that was useful and specific to the LPAP industry. So we were looking through all the content that was coming out from various sources, and we weren't repeating the things that you would get from your afternoon local news or Wall Street Journal or whatever that whatever source of information that you get stuff from so we started doing these three times a week afternoon emails specific to to the COVID crisis and we did that for about three weeks and then we started worrying a bit about filling up people's inboxes because we we have a daily newsletter that goes out uh midday and then here we were sending afternoon emails out
Starting point is 00:33:33 and we were just we were worried because we you know we talked to people who are in the trenches and they are just so inundated i I mean, some of these LP executives are, I mean, they're working 60, 70, 80 hours a week right now. So we didn't want to be a burden by sending out too much stuff. So what we did instead is we created a COVID information page on our website and we're doing daily updates on that. And so, and pushing out that content in our daily newsletter so that people are still getting the information, they're just getting it in a different way. And then there's a, hopefully people are bookmarking our COVID page and they're coming back to it to see what the updates are. And so that that's kind of what how we transition over the last four to six weeks
Starting point is 00:34:28 and then we've also been doing some things like we've we've done some sort of social virtual cocktail hours you know two or three times where we were just trying to provide a venue for people to uh network with each other uh and kind of in an informal way and just kind of not really talk about COVID or whatever, just to kind of get a sense of how people are doing now that people are having to stay at home and homeschooling and all those kinds of things. So those have been kind of interesting. And then a couple of weeks ago, we started a series of weekly webinars. The first one that we did was on how to handle layoffs and furloughs if you were somebody who was hit by some of the store closings.
Starting point is 00:35:29 closings so we we brought in a panelist of people who were from that recruiting and mentoring area to talk about their perspective on the situation last week we we brought in a business recovery expert to talk about how to prepare your stores for reopening because that's a and that was kind of interesting because there's some, you know, sometimes when there's a hurricane or flooding or whatever, you might have a store closed for a few days or a week, but very seldom has anyone had any experience with closing a store for four, six, eight weeks and then coming back to reopen it. for four, six, eight weeks, and then coming back to reopen it. And some of the issues that you could have with mold and air conditioning
Starting point is 00:36:12 and all sorts of things. So that was kind of interesting. This week we're doing the webinars on some of the changes and some of the challenges and the solutions that people have been dealing with on the supply chain. So we're going to continue having these webinars and all the content from the webinars were also, if you don't go on the live webinar, you can listen to the recorded webinar and also we're creating podcasts off the audio and then also we're taking the transcripts from the webinars and turning those into articles as well. So there's a lot of channels that we're moving content through so that if you're someone that likes to listen to podcasts, you can get it. If you're somebody
Starting point is 00:36:58 that wants to read, you can find it either in print or digital. So that's kind of where we are today. That's exactly what we wanted to hear and what the listener needs to hear, Jack, is, you know, it's really, particularly for me, of course, because I in part lived it, but it brings back so many great memories. But hearing about, you know, your career, how you moved, the genesis of the magazine, the evolution of the magazine. But then here we are in the middle of a pandemic, a global one, therefore a pandemic, and all the different ways that the magazine and the team is working to support the APLP leaders and all their crews. And you and I have talked about, we've had these cluster calls that are somewhat similar to yours, where we're trying to help them and us understand what they're going through, they're adapting adjusting and what they need going forward
Starting point is 00:37:49 particularly on the their exit strategies which i i found that what you were describing has got to be beyond useful for them to have these recovery experts in there talking about that even though there's some uncharted territory here to be sure, but there's got to be a lot of lessons learned from these people. That's what they specialize in. That's fantastic. Anything else, Jack, that our listeners need to know? No, I think we covered pretty much everything. You know, we're just, like I said, we're continuing to evolve as a publication, trying to match the evolution that's going on in our industry. And we appreciate all the advertisers who make our content,
Starting point is 00:38:34 make it possible for us to publish our content. And we certainly appreciate all the readers who have been reading our magazine for almost 20 years now. I can't tell you how many times someone, I see somebody at an NRF or a RELA show or something like that, and they say, you know what? I've got every one of the print magazines in my office. And, you know, you made that comment earlier about seeing our magazine on executives' desks.
Starting point is 00:39:05 And a lot of our advertisers are advertisers because they've gone into people's offices to pitch their products and services, and they see our magazine sitting on the desk or on the coffee table, and they go, dang, we need to be advertising in that magazine. So we've had a lot of supporters in the industry to get us to where we are today. And we're going to just keep on trying to do our best to keep up with the industry. That's good. And I even saw some data the other day about magazines making a comeback. Hopefully it's a long-term one, but how people are finding they have a little more time to read and the value of something that's been curated like that in addition to the almost live feed at least daily feed and weekly feed of other things that we get but to have something that's a little more
Starting point is 00:39:55 reflective a little more in-depth views and things like that is much appreciated that's lp magazine all the above really that you guys put together. So I want to thank you on behalf of our team and Kevin Tran, our producer, and our listeners, Jack. And obviously to you and yours, stay safe and sound and have a great rest of the week. And we shall be back in touch. Thank you very much. I appreciate the opportunity to be on and look forward to continuing our relationship with the LPRC. Absolutely. We value that. And thank you to all our listeners out there. Everybody stay safe. From Gainesville, Florida, signing off for
Starting point is 00:40:35 Crime Science, the podcast. Thanks for listening to the Crime Science podcast presented by the Loss Prevention Research Council and sponsored by Bosch Security. If you enjoyed today's episode, you can find more crime science episodes and valuable information at lpresearch.org. Thank you.

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