LPRC - CrimeScience – The Weekly Review – Episode 216 Ft. James Stark

Episode Date: August 28, 2025

In this episode of the LPRC CrimeScience Podcast, Dr. Cory Lowe talks with James Stark of Axis Communications about his career journey from retail and law enforcement to leading roles at Neiman Marcus and Pier One. They explore how loss prevention is evolving to balance customer experience with security, the role of visual sensors and business intelligence in retail, and leadership lessons learned along the way.

Hi everyone and welcome to crime science. In this podcast, we explore the science of crime and the practical application of this science for loss prevention and asset protection practitioners as well as other professionals. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening everyone. My name is Corey Lowe. I'm the director of research here at the LPRC and I am joined by James Stark. James, it is fantastic having you on the podcast today. Thank you, Corey. I appreciate you having me.

Looking forward to the conversation. And it's even better to have you listed as an LPRC research fellow as of impact of this year. It's something that you've been due for quite some time because of your engagement and involvement at the LPRC. I think I spent some time highlighting how involved you've been in the LPRC over the years at kickoff this year. but you are what makes communities like the LPRC possible. Your commitment, your engagement, I could not thank you enough for that. But today everyone's going to get to hear a little bit about your background in this industry and the indelible mark that you've made.

So let's just start where it all started. How did you get into this industry? Well, you know, probably like a lot of folks out there, you know, had aspirations of moving into law enforcement. A little unknown story is I grew up in. retail. So, as you know, and I've shared, you know, I'm adopted. And my adopted parents owned a Christian bookstore in Bel Air, Texas. And so that was my introductory to retail, you know, waking up at four in the morning, going to open the store with mom and then coming in late and

working with dad closing the store. But I swore then I'd never work in retail again. Worked that well for you, didn't it? It did. It did. I kind of went the other way there. But, you know, going to school, you know, I did a little bit of, you know, executive protection and some physical security work, got my license with the state of Texas. And then, you know, I was working with some sheriff's deputies. And they said, hey, you know, we want you to go apply for this job. There's a guy that just retired from HPD. And then another guy that was actually, I believe Robert Blackwood, who Reed Hayes knows, was a member of the Florida law enforcement community. and they had retired and they were heading up the loss prevention unit at O'Shawn Hypermarket,

a French grocer, or what I would call the early days of the Walmarts that we see today. And so in Southwest Houston, that was my first loss prevention job, making $5 an hour. Yeah, so, and it was a war zone. So no better way to cut your teeth than down there in Southwest Houston, right? So, but then from there, you know, I went on. I did some, I went to work for a private investigator that we did corporate loss prevention for the grocery industry. So folks like Krobert, Tom Thumb, Garlands, who was a local grocery, would hire us. We'd do shoplift detail, internal investigations, those types of things. And then I was recruited by Foley's department stores. And so that started my journey into big box retail. Spent a couple of years there. I was on the shoplifting teams around Houston based out of Memorial City Mall there. And then I was recruited by Neiman Marcus, where I spent the better part of 20 years of my career, moving up through the ranks. Started in Houston Galleria.

My first LP manager role was in Bell Harbor, Florida, and then moved back, spent some time in operations. And then ultimately landed in Neiman Marcus Direct, which was our dot com. And so I spent 10 years in the Neiman Market. stores and 10 years on the other side of the fence in supply chain and distribution, where I ultimately became director of corporate investigations and technology. After that, you know, then I accepted a role as the leader for Pier 1 imports, so Vice President, Laws Prevention and Risk Management there. And so through COVID, you know, we were a casualty of COVID, and that threw me into the solution provider realms. You know, not a lot of calls coming in for senior asset protection

and loss prevention leaders during that time in retail. So made the pivot. And here I am today with access communications, been with them for three years and leading the retail segment for the Americas and loving every minute of it. Yes, sir. So, yeah, that's been a pretty amazing transition. And I can't use one of those people out there in the solution side today. That's just an invaluable resource to the industry.

Not only do you know the business side, the retail business side, but you also know technology backwards and forward. So I definitely lead on you a lot. I want to actually talk about your role at Axis. So what do you do in that role today? So the way I see my role within Axis is I'm a consultant and an industry advisor, right? So for our sales teams, I go in and I consult with them about what's going on in the industry, what are the trends, what's happening. I act as a liaison on to the field. And then industry associations actually, Corey, are a large part of what

I do. Working with the community, working with you folks at the loss prevention research council, LPF, LPM, clear, you know, just around the horn and anywhere we can plug in to help support the community. And for me,

you know, it's rewarding because, you know, when you work for a singular retailer, right? And most of, most of us do and all do when we're on the practitioner's side, we're solving our organization's problems. When I work with industry associations and get connected in through that, I get to help a lot of people with a lot of problems and really have open conversations. And for me, you know, that's what excites me is I get to work on a lot of different problems and in a lot of

different scenarios and really try to apply technology. And not, just technology, but even my experience, first, and Linda, you know, first a listening ear, an understanding ear, right? And then also any kind of guidance or mentorship, I can supply with that as well. Not that I'm, you know, an elder statesman or anything, but, you know, 30 years in the business, I've seen a thing or two. Yeah, most definitely. I think that's one of the things I like most about loss prevention asset protection as well as the problems that we get to solve. You know, my background is in criminology. And that's one thing. But when you start adding the business layer onto it and the operational layer onto it, it makes the problems much

more complex because now you're solving for a red and green guest. And so most of the time we're talking about how can we prevent loss, prevent crime and protect people and all of that. But we're also going to be focused on how can these technologies help businesses run better. How do you think about that problem, the problem of needing to balance what we call the red guest needs and the green guest needs? That's a great question. So what I would say is, you know, as we say, everybody's green until they're red, right? But then, you know, it's sometimes difficult from a customer experience and an associate experience perspective to not have the red guests bleed over into the green guests and or associate experience. right and how do we help how do we look there's no way to control it you know those are

uncontrollable situations there there's there's a saying that I've started kind of socializing you know we prepare we prepare we prepare we prepare but are we ever really ready for what's going to happen yeah don't know that we are I think we need to kind of back up a little bit because people are listening they're probably thinking red people and green people or what planet What planet have James and Corey going to? So just to back up and explain to the listeners real quick. Within the OPRC, if you've been around this for any amount of time, you'll hear us talk about red guests and green guests.

And it's just a way we think about place users. The green guest being that person who's there for some kind of legitimate purpose, they're there to shop, vend, work, manage, those legitimate purposes. And the red guest is the person who's there with malintent or criminal intent to kill, steal, destroy, defraud, you know, those kinds of things. And so LP is interesting because you have to think about both of those groups. It's not just preventing crime, but it's also enabling the green guests to do the things that they want to do. So, sorry, I thought we might need to back up to that a little bit because people probably think we've gone crazy.

We've broached into Area 51. Yes, yes, exactly. So, no, it's an interesting profession because of those complex problems. But I think the reason I bring that up is because I think camera systems have a lot of applications beyond the traditional use cases. People think that's historically been owned by law of prevention, but that's, you know, in the future, it's probably going to be a fraction of the total value proposition of camera systems. probably even today, the security value proposition is just a small part of it.

Where do you see the other opportunities for cameras in business today? Yeah, so, Corey, I think first we've got to really look at it not just being a camera anymore. Yeah. It's a sensor. You know, it's an IOT device, right? It sits on the network. It provides intelligent data, you know, whether it be visual or through metadata. So we really have to start looking and referencing these things as visual sensors, right?

And so we're providing visual context around what's happening in your world. You know, we can look at reports and we can look at data all day long, but contextually, do we bring dimension to that data? The answer is no, but the way you do that is you incorporate vision data with that, right? So I think that by and large, and I agree 100% with you, as we move more and more into the business intelligence realms of retail and what we're doing, you know, I believe, you know, and I work with people in the industry, some of the large data folks, you know, the way they categorize it, loss prevention, asset protection is a bucket within the business intelligence flow, right? So you'll have supply chain. You'll have, you know, task management, labor management. You'll have, you know, shelf checking and stocking and things of that nature.

So, you know, all of those are components of the data. And you can read a report, but once you incorporate the visual reference and now you're seeing what's happening or you're being told by the camera, hey, this is what I see is happening. That brings contextual, you know, it gives you that. context behind what's really happening in the data? Yes. And it's going to play an increasingly important role in real-time crime centers and everything else as well. So in addition to all of the operational use cases and understanding the context in which people are, you know, doing things within a store environment, there's

also greater ability to, you know, make connections with law enforcement too. With all of said, you know, when you were in your roles in retail, you know, you had to use all of that business intelligence. How were you during your career leveraging business intelligence as an LP executive? So are you speaking within the LP organization, or are you talking at the larger retail level for the organization? I think both. I think it's helpful for everyone thinking in terms of both of those things. All right.

Yeah. So foundationally, you know, it's when you start, and I'm going to go back, you know, when you start intertwining your exception-based reporting with your case management, with your e-commerce data, and then you bring in your video management platforms, you know, I think foundationally, as an asset protection loss prevention professional, we all understand and know those and we work with them. every day, day in and day out, right? I'll tell you where I broke ground really the first

time, Corey, with getting people to adapt to using video by, you know, at large scale within an organization was when I, we actually opened up and really set up a hierarchy within our organization for certain executives. So, for example, maybe our field folks, you know, looking, logging in and looking at the store layouts when they changed, or our visual departments when they wanted to log in and just look and see, did, did they set that upright? Are we visually in standards? You know, you're looking at those things. So as you socialize and you warm those people up, then they start to ask questions, well, what else can you help me? Right. And so you create that grassroots groundswell and very subtly, very non-induced.

your face, just say, hey, how can I help you? Have you thought about using video to solve this business problem? Exactly. I love that approach. I mean, it's essentially going to an executive and saying, tell me all the ways that your employees use their eyes. Now, let's figure out what we can do with cameras in the business. Because a camera can do every single one of those in terms of information gathering and then, you know, with AI today, it's incredible. And I'll give you one more along those lines, Corey, it's also being an active listener in executive meetings. You know, you have to be present.

You have to be paying attention. And then it's, you know, you hear something go, hey, I can help solve that. And then you go to that executive and say, hey, can we have a conversation about this? I think I can help you because everybody's looking for help. So it seems like a huge part of your job today is, you know, helping to do problem analysis and then helping retailers to solve those problems that they have. Can you tell us a little bit about, you know, just being an active listener and how that's helped you throughout your career?

Sure. So, you know, people will tell you what they need and tell you what their problems are. It's up to you if you're actually listening to what they're saying, right? And so, and I think it goes back, you know, it's like being a little kid and your parents, and it's like the Charlie Brown thing, want, want, want, want, want, want, you know, you have to be engaged and you have to be active, because you never know when you're going to get that little nugget that sparks you, and you're able to take off and use that as a launch pad for an initiative to move something along,

to get great ideas. So, you know, I just think I can't speak enough about, really listening to what people are saying and trying to understand the situation. And also being engaged in the conversation, though, I mean, asking questions, you know, it's active listening, but also being actively engaged, you know, in the conversation. Most definitely. I think that's one of the things that the LPRC does very well. We do the research day in and day out, but we also facilitate conversations between retailers and solution providers and law enforcement and other industry partners. And I think that's one of the greatest benefits of the LPRC to a lot of people is just

on the solution side at least is understanding what some of the problems are that are going on today. How do you use research that we're doing at the LPRC to inform what you're doing within access day? And before your time in access, how are you using, how are you leaning on research? search in your everyday activities. Yeah, so, you know, I think before, you know, it was, the LPRC was evolving and we were involving with it, right?

So I remember when my first LPRC and we were in a room, I wouldn't even say a third the size of what we're in today, right? And so it was a lot more intimate of a community and just learning and listening to what things. It was really the first time I had been exposed broadly to a science approach to what we do, right? We would go to the NRF. We would go to RELA. We would sit in these sessions. They would talk about different things and breakouts. But, you know, listening to statistics and, you know, applied science and doing these types of things, it was new. It was different, right? So now we're in a much different place than we were then. I mean, you know, I know we talk about on, on our calls,

you know, with the advisory boards, you know, about, you know, even today, the offender interviews and stuff, you know, those were fascinating back then, but now it's like, okay, and I remember redoing his studies on how PVMs impacted a, you know, a person, you know, a bad actor in the store. So I think those types of things, just hearing how those things back then applied. But now it's like that on steroids. Yes. You know what I mean? We have so many solutions out there. And the work that you guys are doing, you know, corraling that, doing the lab, showing the applications, showing the practical uses. And really, you collect use cases because what happens is, is one person may see your study and think one way.

And another person is going to think a different way. Why? Because their environments are different. different, right? And so that from a solution provider perspective, you know, we have to be aware of that and have to listen for that. And then the other side of that, too, Corey, is, you know, being available to you folks. And what are you, what cases are you trying to prove? How can we support you in your research? Why don't we try it like this a little more than that? And this is, these are things that we're hearing in the industry as well. So, you know, then we're able to collectively put together, you know, information and data and solutions with confidence and with backing, right?

So that's how I use the science today. I think those conversations are helpful because of all the reason you said that everyone's kind of context and perspective is a bit different. Even the LPRC uses things a little bit differently than, say, the retailers do. For example, we've got projects going on right now where we're using cameras primarily as data collection, right? So we've got the covert camera unit on the east side of Gainesville that is just there to generate data around foot traffic and automobile traffic. So we can understand what happens to those once we start deploying different technologies. It's a kind of a big challenge for us because our challenge.

is if we if we introduce a camera into an environment, we want to understand what impact that has. But I'm not going to understand what impact that has completely because that camera is going to is going to influence our ability to collect data and all that. So I have to go beyond that and get a second sensor to be able to actually capture data around what those different technologies do. That's just one example of how we use cameras to click data. And that's one of the many use cases of cameras. But, you know, moving forward, you know, you're heavily involved in the LPRC Innovate Program, the advisory panel, the Research and Innovation Committee, really helping us to think about where we're going as an organization. What developments in technology are you most excited about today?

Yeah, you know, I don't know if it's about developments as much as I see people adapting and really categorizing technology into the zones. Yeah. You know, I think that is really sinking in. And that's, I believe retailers, because they are so familiar with the zones of influence, and they can say, okay, this problem exists in this zone. And we've now put technology wrapped around it. So now they can be a little bit more targeted with their search instead of going,

oh, I don't know, or what should I be doing? I think it's how, look, there's so much innovation happening right now. I think one of the big things, and I was just talking about this with another outlet, is the sandbox. And I know you and I have had conversation around this and the importance of being an open source technology. And I'm hearing more and more from retailers is, you know, we need a single paint of glass. And so what that's going to force is solution providers to play well in the sandbox together and figure out ways to work together in probably ways that we haven't traditionally done. I'm fortunate enough that I work with a work for a company that that's in their DNA, right?

Partners, open architecture, those types of things, innovation. We clearly understand where we start and stop. You know, I can tell you, yeah, with confidence, I know I can do this X, Y, Z at a base level, but if you really want to go after it, then we have a strategic partner that's a software provider. That, oh, by the way, they've written a software API that sits on our camera, so now you don't have to worry about another appliance in your environment or something like that, right? Or I have an integrated solution partner that uses our technology in their application, and then we go to market on it.

So I think those are the types of things that probably appeal more in today's asset protection environment. The silos are coming down. Closed architecture is not, you know, you may be roped into it because of legacy decisions. And it's a fight to sometimes to get out from under that. But you know in order to succeed in order to take full advantage of some of these other technologies and other software platforms that you're going to have to make a decision and draw a line in the sand at some point.

Yeah, you and I have had many conversations on open versus closed architectures and systems and integrations. You know, it's mind-boggling sometimes to me to see solution providers who are actively impeding their clients. to build intelligence. And I could go into that in long long as well. Actually, I will. You know, if we're going to build criminal intelligence,

if we're going to create an intelligence packet about an offense or an incident or whatever, I've got all these different pieces of data that I've got to bring together and build into actionable intelligence. I hear people talk about gathering intelligence

and that denotes a, you know, a passive kind of process. process where I'm just going out there and picking berries as opposed to I'm putting sensors in specific places so that I can build the intelligence I need to conduct these investigations or to be more aware of things going on in a store so that I can protect my employees or my customers. It's always struck me as odd that people would say, you know, intelligence gathering. when it's that active process. But that requires that you be able to take that data from disparate sensors, bring it together and make something useful out of it.

Yeah, you need an aggregator. Exactly. And if I'm a solution provider A and I say, okay, well, I'm not going to work with them as part of my business strategy, and the client's saying, well, we kind of need you to do that because it's the only way that we're going to be able to build the intelligence we need, that's problematic. Right. And I'm saying, unfortunately, way too much of that today, unfortunately.

Well, I think, Corey, quite honestly, it's been in our industry for years. It's been in our industry since, you know, since I was an investigator in the field 30 years ago, right? I think now more than ever, the in-consumer, the practitioners, you know, there was always a struggle to become, you know, the education line drew at whatever, you know, level you're dealing with, if it's at the install level, the integration level, or the manufacturer level, you know, how far you push that or how far you care to. But I think in today's times, the immediacy of information at our fingertips, whether it be through chat GPT or Jim and I or Brock or whatever you want to use, it's much simpler and much more streamlined. So we now have a much more educated consumer that is asking some tougher questions and bigger demands. And so, and I think there are.

able to tell the story now more than ever of why they need it and how they need it and oh by the way you know if you're not going to help me in this situation then i'm going to have to look for another solution because my organization is demanding that i i find a solution and fix this or at least get us on the path right there's definitely um it takes some out of the box thinking sometimes. Definitely. You've got many, many, you know, at this point, decades of experience under your belt. And, you know, one of the things that I've been, we've been focusing on more at the LPRC are things like operational excellence and leadership.

And how do you actually make things happen within an organization? And so all these podcast interviews that I've been doing with, you know, people like yourself, leaders in the industry, things like that is i'm trying to get some of the key principles that they live by as leaders so if you could you know identify a couple of the principles that you've always brought to the table in terms of your your leadership what would those be what do you think those those principles are that have contributed to your success oh man um you know i i think about all the mentors i've had over the years and things that I liked about them and things that I didn't like about their style. And then I take what I think would work for me and the things that I liked and I kind of

formed my own style. You know, I'm all about empowering people, you know, to make decisions. And one of the key things that I learned early on from one of my mentors was, you know, know, make a decision. If it's the wrong decision, we'll talk about it later. If it's the right decision, you did a great job. If you didn't make a decision, you still made a decision. You were just, you know, you were, you were inactive in the process, right? Which is what you don't want to be, right? You want to be active in the role. You want to be front and center, you know, there's a lot of things, you know, the calm within the storm, the, you know, six P's. I could go

on and on and on about things that I've learned, be prepared in meetings. always have something to say, you know, but I think it's, you know, building that sense of awareness and education and accountability, you know, if I make you aware, then I have a responsibility to educate you. Once I educate you, now I have a responsibility to hold you accountable to what you've learned so that you continue on your path. So, you know, those are all things. I mean, I could go down the list of my mentors, but it's really just, it's a conglomerate of all of them. Yeah. It's funny that you go back to mentorship because that's something that I hear so, so regularly in my conversations with leaders who have had successful careers, is they had good mentors. They sought after mentorship. Yes. I guess there's an element of knowing their limits and knowing that they needed to grow and seeking out mentorship.

So I just find that interesting and fascinating that. I continue to see that. Well, James, I appreciate you joining us today. I thank you for your wisdom, your insights, and your mentorship. We get to spend a lot of time together with everything you do with the LPRC, and I'm incredibly grateful for that. But thank you very much for the time with us today. Thank you, Corey. I appreciate it. It's great chatting with you, man.

Yes, sir. All right. Thanks for listening to the Crime Science Podcast, presented by the Loss Prevention Research Council. If you enjoyed today's episode, you can find more crime science episodes and valuable information at LPRsearch.org. The content provided in the Crime Science podcast is for informational purposes only and is not a substitute for legal, financial, or other advice. Views expressed by guests of the Crime Science podcast are those of the authors and do not reflect the opinions or positions of the Lost Prevention Research Council.