Mad, Sad and Bad with Paloma Faith - Ellie Simmonds: My Birth Mum Gave Me Up - But I’m Not Angry

Episode Date: March 17, 2026

Ellie is one of Britain’s most decorated Paralympians and the youngest person ever to receive an OBE, making history both in and out of the pool. 🏊 You might also have seen her amazing documentaries, like Ellie Simmonds: Finding My Secret Family (A BAFTA winner by the way…), or ice-cold moves on Strictly Come Dancing. She is simply one of the kindest, warmest people I’ve met. After watching her documentary I became completely fascinated by her story and just knew I had to get her on the podcast. In this episode we talk about everything from team pranks and embarrassing moments with Barack Obama, to disability in the care system, online hate, regrets, and the incredible friends and family that keep her grounded. She really is amazing and I can’t wait to see what she does next!—Find us on: Instagram / TikTok / YouTube—Credits:Producer: Emilia GillAssistant Producer: Alex ReedVideo: Josh Bennett, Jake Ji and Harry SawkinsSound: Joe Richardson & Rafi Amsili GeovannettiOriginal music: BUTCH PIXYSocial Media: Laura CoughlanExec Producer for JamPot: Ewan Newbigging-ListerExec Producers for Idle Industries: Dave Granger & Will Macdonald Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Paloma Faith and this is my show. Each week I welcome someone fantastic into my home to talk about what makes them mad, sad and bad. Roll recording. Thank you so much. Thank you for coming. Oh, thank you. Thank you for having me. You're such a legend. Oh, no, you are too.

Literally. I'm not a ch-in. You can't get your coat? Oh, yeah. To you, she's a Paralympic swimmer with 25 gold medals. to her name, including five Paralympic goals as well as an impressive 10 world records. She also made history at just 14 years old as the youngest person ever to receive an MBA. Outside of the swimming pool, Ellie has just as many achievements.

She's an ambassador for Water Aid, Dwarf Sports Association in UK and the Scout Association, using her platform to make real change. And if that still hasn't wowed you, she went on to make. award-winning documentaries picking up a BAFTA for a deeply moving film, Finding My Secret Family, where she explored her adoption and searched for her birth mother. These days, she's just as loved on our screens as she is in the water, appearing on Strictly Come Dancing and Celebrity Baker. But to me, she's a woman who I was deeply moved by watching the documentary,

finding my secret family. I was in bits, brought to tears by her story, and just became obsessed with her. I had to get her on because she's so, so wonderful and kindness is rare in this world. And this is the amazing Ellie Simmons, OBE now. Thank you so much for Lowe. I love that. That was so nice. So lovely to chat with you as well.

You too. Thanks for coming. I'm so glad. Do you know what? I loved you in St Trinians. St Trinians. I loved you in that when I was a kid. Oh, thank you.

Yeah. I was 27 pretending I was 14. I bet that was quite fun, wasn't there? We always want to be a bit younger, don't we? Starting with mad, there is nothing mad at, in my opinion, than being 14 years old and being awarded an MBA. That is quite a madness. Yeah.

Do you ever take the dot of what you've done and just think, or are you, and just sort of think, wow, that's even beyond what I thought. Like, because you come across as somebody who's always been quite ambitious. Oh, very. But, like, has it exceeded what you even expected? Oh, hugely. I never would have thought, like, and I don't know about yourself, but I'm always thinking about the next challenge, the next thing.

Like, I'm never, I forget sometimes to sit, to stop and like take, in things that I've done in the past. So, like, when you mentioned all those things that I've done, sometimes it doesn't feel real. It doesn't feel like it's me. Like, never in my wildest dreams. when you're a kid that I would think I'd be like here chatting to you today or I've done like got a baffa or done some things in the pool and achieve what I've achieved.

Like I never would have thought of that. Like so it is crazy actually. It's very mad that what I've done, like I don't feel like it's me. Yeah, I always say to people that I feel like a lottery winner. Yeah. Like I sort of think it could have happened to anyone. Why did it happen to me sort of thing? Yeah.

So I relate to that feeling because it's like disassociation. It's quite hard to actually sit and acknowledge what's how you've turned things around. Yeah, and I don't know about you, but sometimes I look back and I think, actually, was that me? Like I look at, like, when I go to the gym now, I think he used to push my body to its limits every single day. And when I was in the water, I was like, how did I cope with all that pressure? How did I cope with going, being on the road all the time, you know, going to so many different countries, jumping in and out of the pool every single day? Like it's so nice now not to be smelling of plurine, have nicer skin, you know, like, I don't know how I used to.

Were the trainers really hard on you? Like my coach, Billy, who was my coach from like when I was 12 till when I retired when I was 26, he was lovely. He was amazing. He was like my second dad. Like this Welsh dude, big personality, such a joy, such a motivation. But we did have a time where there was an individual on the team that was a, the nicest and was very controlling and he had this aura about him and you didn't know where you were where you stood with him and he that authority and I think when people have got power they can be

controlling can't they they can use it against you and especially like going into Rio 2016 it was like we couldn't stand up for ourselves we couldn't we knew our body to its best like we knew what we needed to do in training and to be the best athlete that we could be yet we didn't have that choice. We didn't have that ownership of our own self and our own bodies and being an athlete. He was yet a super super, super and controlling individual. And it's crazy.

It still happens now in the water, you know. And I think again, when there's money, when there's pressure, when there's pressure from getting gold medals, people don't know how to cope with it and they can turn it into a bad way. What do you respond better to, do you think? Like brutality or encouragement? Encouragement.

Me too, because I actually went to dance college, which is a physical training as well. And there's some teachers in that, probably similar to swimming, where some of them would be like, you're really doing well, I've seen your progress, and then you get better and better. And some who were just like, that's just not good enough. And then you get worse. Yeah, like, I don't know, when you get told that that's not good enough, like, yeah, sometimes it can be motivational. But actually, you're like, I'm very much, I need someone to be telling I'm all right and go to give me a bit of more confidence. So when someone's saying, oh, it's not good, you actually then take it in herself, don't you think, actually, oh my God, I'm awful. I'm not good at all.

You've got all those inner voices. Oh, yeah. Do you think they're still there? Oh, very much. So sometimes, like, with the work that I do now, because I knew I was good at swimming. Like, the medals could prove it. I was competing and I was training for times and for medals. Whereas now, with the work that we do, I do, it's, you're hoping to get in the next.

job from other people and it's out of your control and sometimes you think am I good at this? Like I'm learning every single day like I was training all the time for swimming but actually this work like being in front of the TV or doing talks or sponsorship stuff. You're learning every single day and you're like you've got nothing to grasp to tell you that actually you're good at it unless you get told you're doing a job again. There's nothing actually to give you feedback really is there? No, especially not if you try and avoid looking at online. There's horrible people on there, aren't there?

Yeah, there is. Yeah. Doing this podcast has shown me that there's like some brilliant types of madness and there's some not so brilliant types of madness. Like some people have experienced where they've gone to the edge or, you know, they're up in the night or they're tormenting themselves or whatever. And then there's also like the brilliant, a bit wild side. Like even when I was on the team, we used to, I used to be with some of my girlfriends. We used to be the mad ones where we used to do like all the initiations and like we go into people's rooms.

And like one time we had like a stale dead fish underneath our bed. Like we used to do like funny things like that. Or we used to like a tradition, the initiation. Yeah. And also you used to probably go a bit too far. You know, like when we like cling film every part of their like apartment or their room or like put all their clothes. So hide all their clothes. from them so they didn't have a duvet or anything.

Those poor people. I know. What if they were insecure? They're like, oh my God. I know. But like that's the thing. Like with the team, they become like family. And like you're so exhausted.

You're pushing your bodies to its limits every single day. And you're on the road all the time. Like I'm sure you were the same. When you're on your road like performing on tours and stuff, like you become so close with everyone, don't you? And we did it. So, like, yes, it was a laugh, but it was just to keep us all entertained and go inside and just, I just love a laugh, you know, and I love messing around. Do you think that's your escape from actual madness is laughing?

Oh, yeah, very much. So I think if I didn't laugh, I'd probably go crazy. How? Oh, I don't know. Did you suffer from insomnia? I do, yeah, especially when I used to race and when I've got a lot of work on. Yeah, I just, and that's what I listen to, like, podcasts. and your podcast comes into my ear at the night.

So normally, 2 o'clock in the morning. I'm sorry, I keep you up. No, it's lovely. It really helps me. So, yeah, keep talking, you know, because I'll be listening to you at 2am in the morning. But yeah, I think just I'm a overthinker. I'm a warrior, and I overanalyze and overthink absolutely everything.

Why do you think that is that you do that? I think it's because you care so much. Probably, yeah. And I'm a naturally, my personality is I'm a warrior as well. What kind of things do you think are your like go-to subjects to worry about most at night? Worrying about, yeah, what people think of me, what work. Yeah, those types of things actually. So you need validation. Oh, very much so.

Yeah. But I think for 15 years of my life, I was getting valid. it is most of the time like with medals and my achievements. She was so successful. And then it's like an addiction. Yeah. Like you want to,

I want to be good at something. Like I want to know what I'm good at. And like I want to hit that high. Like it's as soon as you finish a race, all that training, all that hard work for that moment. It is a high.

Like you get a, it's like a drug. It's like you get an addiction. It's like euphoric feeling. Like you're the best in the world. All that training was for that moment. moment and then all of a sudden that goes and yeah I am very much yeah look for something to be good at and that validation back yeah do you think you're like competitive more with yourself

than other people oh very competitive with myself yeah because you're like I want to uh I want to be the best whereas what other people are doing is not you don't look at them and go I want to beat that person well I did it's fun actually I'm a bit of both I'm very competitive with myself but like growing up when I was a kid I used to have like my rivals I used to call them my enemies on like a board and like I used to use them as like a hit list

like I wanted to target yeah so I used to like once I'd beat them I used to scratch them off like so yeah maybe that's what I mean it's like it's fascinating to me as somebody who's not done anything that competitive

are you competitive? Not really but then everyone always says, well, you are because you wouldn't be successful if you weren't. But I am competitive, but it's usually like within myself. When did you realise you were good at singing? Like, when did you find your talent? I think I still have. I'm not. I'm okay.

All right. You're more than I think. Days on and days off. But I just like, I like, I think for me it's always been more about being on a stage than it has about what was doing on the stage. Yeah. I just loved it. Do you know, like how I say, like, when I used to swim at a Paralympics, I used to get

this incredible feeling when a race went well. Do you get that when you, after you perform on the stage? Yeah. It's like you just feel. When everyone stands up and claps or they're singing your song to you or whatever, you're just like, this is, there's nothing better. Yeah. But like you say it's so addictive.

It is. And I think as humans, we like that, though, don't we, some of us? We love, like, performing in front of people. We love, like, my swimming was, I was performing in front of 7,500 people in the crowd, in the pools. And it's exactly the same as we like doing that some of us do, don't we? Yeah, but you push yourself so much of a limit, don't you? That, like, so there is a madness in what you're willing to sacrifice of yourself for what you're passionate about. Like, you know, have you had burnout?

Oh, yeah, yeah, I have. Not when I was an athlete because we were very structured and we were like we had a plan so we knew that we were going to get a break. But I think we've since retiring and since doing the work like TV stuff, the Olympics, the Paralympics, documentaries when you're filming quite regularly, all that. There was a time like even like 2024, I had, I was away all summer with the Olympics, the Paralympics and I was doing so much of the work with. it with sponsors, companies and TV, and we're filming the documentary, just wrapping that up as well. And I remember coming back from the Paralympics in September,

and oh, it's exhausted. And you know when you just want to cry all the time, and like you try and sleep, but you can't sleep because you're just... Overtired. Overtired. And then, like, you're, like, you're analysing yourself and, like,

actually, am I good at it? And then you're doubting yourself. And then you've got, like, that... feeling in your head. Yeah, I was, I've never been so exhausted and so mentally drained as well. Yeah. And I was like, I just went and spoke to people and had a person to chat to because I used to have that all the time when I was an athlete, had like a physiologist. Yeah. They helped me process things mentally. But when you retire, you have that massive team. But then when you retire, you're on your own, like you put out there on your own. So you have to like make sure you're okay and

stuff but yeah that was the time where I just needed some help. Have you met any people that you thought it was quite mad to me? Oh yeah, oh my gosh, really embarrassing. There's many moments on TV that I've done silly stuff. But there was a moment where last year got the amazing opportunity to meet Barack Obama, which was incredible. He was the former United States of America like, wow, this is going to be amazing. So you want to wear your nicest outfit, don't you?

But I didn't realize that, like, with my body changing, I've put a bit of weight on. Typical. So I was, the buttons kept popping over. Hello. Hello, Barrett. Yeah, pop. It was so amazing. So, like, he came into the room.

And because I was just worrying about this top, my hands were super. sweaty. So he came over to me and shook my hands. But he must have thought like, she has wet. She's been out the pool. She just got out the pool. Literally, I was like sweating. She lives in it. Sweating so much. But then I was just sitting there and like preparing for like to chat to him. But I kept like feeling like my papa's going worse and worse more down and down. I'm thinking, I've never flashed like Barack Obama. but I'm blushing him right now and I just kept having to like

Did he, was he well-mannered? Or did he think he saw? I think I tried to hide it as much as I could. But like I was like typical of all things. It's quite cute though I love it because I did, I had the symbol of where I didn't have my shoes on. I met Will and Kate

and I was meant to put my shoes on but I'd change to somebody else so I didn't see that it was my turn next. And then I was like, oh God, sorry, I've got bare feet. Were you embarrassed or was it? Did you laugh at out? There's actually a picture of us laughing that went sort of viral and it was partly me saying,

God, I'm really sorry I haven't even put my shoes. Oh, that's lovely. But they didn't mind. Yeah, well, I hope Barack didn't mind maybe me. Maybe that was, maybe liked it. You know. Next time I know I'll not to put that jump suit, back in the cupboards and never wear it again.

That's the thought now. Moving on to Sad, your documentary, which I can't stop thinking about since I've seen it, where you found your birth mother in that, which was really moving and really emotional, not just the moment that you met her, but also everything leading up to it. And I just feel like that must have been really like life-changing for you. It was hugely life-changing. It was, yeah, it was emotional, tough, sad, all that type of stuff. It was, yeah, like, it was funny because growing up, like, I always knew I was adopted.

I have to say quickly as well, just I was really moved by your adoptive mother. like, you know, everything. I know that you wanted to keep her out and her privacy is sacred and everything. But like just every, like all the stuff she instilled in you and the family that she provided you all with, you and your siblings, and like, what an amazing woman.

And I just found her really moving. And then the fact that she was like giving you that freedom to just go and explore your origin story. Oh yeah. My parents have been so supportive. And like I think you need that, don't you? And for them to know that it was okay for me to go and find out more information. Because they are my parents.

Like, nothing's ever going to change that. Yeah. But like, growing up, you've got all these questions. Like, you know when you go to a doctor's and they say, have we got any medical history? I could never like answer that because I didn't know. Like I don't know my medical history. I don't know my past. And then also, like, I used to love the story of Tracy Beaker growing up.

It's like a TV shoot show on CBBC. And she's like in the dumping ground, which is like she's in care. She's in foster. And like she has visions of like what her birth mom's going to be like and like look like. And like, yeah, all these thoughts and feelings. And I was like that growing up. Like I just always wanted to know what my birth mom was like, like what my family were like, all this like you envision them to be like something different you know you have a picture of what

they're going to be like all that um but so after my um swimming career i decided oh i'm ready to like find out more because during that time i didn't want to really find out more about my life because it's quite i was quite selfish when you're an athlete because you just focus on yourself yeah like you didn't want any distractions at all and when i decided to retire I thought, you know what? There's this whole chapter I don't know about myself. So we went on this journey. And also we wanted to highlight disability in the care system as well.

Yeah. Because when we were going on this journey, I never envisioned that I would find my birth mom. It was always a hope, but I met so many people along the journey that had never actually been able to meet their parents because, again, either passed away or didn't want to because it's a lot for them as well.

People feeling ashamed and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah. Of what they've done, maybe. Yeah, giving up their child, because it's a big thing, isn't it? Like, what would you say to someone that was looking at adopting, but saying that they wouldn't adopt a child with disabilities? You know what? A child is a child.

You'll love it no matter what. And a disabled child, there's so many children out there with a disability in the care system, looking for a home. And all they want is love and care and a family. 100%. Like, and I just think it's the most amazing thing to adopt and to adopt a child with a disability. Because when we were speaking to social workers,

we saw the database. Say there's like a thousand people. Wait. Yeah, waiting for a family. That number goes, who are happy to have a disabled child, goes from like, say, a thousand to eight, which is crazy. Yeah, because even now, like, we're getting more aware.

of differences. We're talking about being different in society. We're very much opening up to lots of differences and I think that's incredible. So yet still people when they have this choice I was quite taken by some of the like really archaic ideas that when they were reading out what your birth mother had thought about people or what she'd been told about people with a conroplasia. Like there was some really old-fashioned. things like being in the circus or something like it was there was one bit where they said they might be evil yeah very much what a strange word to use from like a psychological perspective anyway like haven't we moved on from black and white thinking like that no everyone's

both evil and good in equal measure like yeah but it's crazy like even that was 30 years ago that's the thought people have long ago how did you have the strength to hear all those things in the that your mum had said at the time, like, the way with such humility you addressed it and you still wanted to give her an opportunity to meet you and have that conversation, like, where, what is it, what was it within you that had that strength? I think the support system around you makes a big difference. I think being comfortable in your own skin, but knowing that like, no matter what I've still got my mom and dad. I've still got everyone around me that supports me and loves me for who I

am. But also, I think it's fair on my birth mum's side, that not being angry towards her, not being anything, listening to her, because we all make decisions for our own reasons and for some, it might be what we perceive as wrong, but actually, at that time, it's the decision they make. It's no point in being angry and also the awareness that there's what more could be done. So I thought if I go in like balls going like angry, angry, angry, then actually it doesn't give a two-send doors. Yeah, and it might give it doesn't really give two-sided views. Yeah.

Yeah. I think you're strong and brave to do that. What was the last thing that made you cry? Oh. Yeah. It makes me a bit sad now actually. Yeah, I think my auntie has just been diagnosed with MND, which is motor neuron disease. It's like when you, your muscles like waste away.

It's like what Rob Burroughs had, and Lewis Moody has just announced that he's got it. And I'm so close with my auntie. She's, I don't know if I can say it, but she's my favourite auntie. You can. I just had. But yeah, we used to like, she's. She used to travel a lot and like, we used to travel to hers in Wales, used to see her all the time. Like, and yeah, she's just been diagnosed with it.

And then seeing her at Christmas time, it's she's just, yeah, got worse to see someone. Deuteriorate. At such a rapid rate. And like, all the diseases or stuff, there's cures, whereas M&D there's no cure whatsoever. But there's medication and bits to help the longevity. But actually, it's sad to see someone that you love, go down that. Have their freedoms taken away? Yeah, because for her it's gone to work.

There's so many different types. That's what we're learning. I think there's four types, actually. And she's got the one that gets her throat. So she started doing voice banking. So now she has like an app on the phone, which is amazing. Technology is so good. So they can make it so eventually she'll have her voice on the computer to speak.

Yeah, so it sounds like her. So like we were playing Uno just before Christmas and like she's got Uno in there. So she goes, Uno. I'm like, amazing. You know. Something that stood out for me quite big when I was watching the documentary was that you said that if you hadn't got in swimming, your mum thought you'd end up in prison. Yeah.

Why? Because I... What kind of a baddie are you? What are we dealing with? You've been doing like fraud credit cards. Yeah, literally. I put this picture that I'm a good person, but actually I'm so naughty. But we all watch shows where we love the criminals most.

Literally I love those criminal documentaries. Why did your mum think you'd end up in prison? Because I was always like had to do something. something like I always had to be on the go and I was lucky that swimming channeled like my social side and being on the go all the time like I never when I was a kid and even now really like I'm getting better at sitting on the sofa watching TV I'd stop in but growing up I always used to have to be like outside on the cordy sat playing with friends you know I loved it being in the summer because I could stay out till like late at night and because it was light outside and she thinks that like

if I hadn't channeled my ambition, my drive, my personality, my go, go, go, my, like, determination into swimming, I'd probably be in, like, persuaded into other naughty things. Have you ever done, have you ever accidentally made someone cry or upset someone without meaning to? Not that I'm aware of. I have one time done the worst thing. Oh, what? Do you know when you think someone's pregnant? Yeah, that was what I did when I was a kid one time.

Like Paris Hilton. When she went to Venezuela, I think it was and she kissed someone's tummy and they weren't pregnant. And there's pictures of it all over the internet. Gee. Did she do that? Yeah. Oh my gosh. Do you have any regrets?

Do you have like a one big regret or anything? Yeah, I regret. I don't have many but I regret like going into Rio in 2016 there was that individual on the team who was not nice and yeah like

was horrible actually were meant to be a trainer yeah he was a coach and he was so horrible to so many of the athletes awful awful what kind of thing was he doing I didn't he used to just

make people do stuff which they just couldn't do maybe because of their disability. The words that he used to say, he used to swear at the time, he would just tell people they were overweight. You know, I used to, yeah,

you would get obsessed with our weight and what we would look like and would be really like, oh, she can't have that, she wouldn't let us go home, would be controlled, yeah, like we'd check on what time people were on WhatsApp,

all that type of stuff. And I wish, looking back, I stood up for my team, mates more, that's one thing that I wish. But at the time when you've got someone who's so controlling and you don't think about it, you're just... You're silent. Yeah, whereas now, if ever that happens again, I would, even my two pennies. Good.

Yeah, I would just stick up to my teammates more and support them. Like, I did support them. We supported each other, but speak to people higher off and say, this is not supposed to happen. Have people said bad things to you about who you are or your disability? Have you ever heard people say things that you're like, I can't even believe that's being said to me? Mockery, you know, against like my type of disability to what is perceived in shows and films, like the comparison. But you know what?

There's normally that one comment and 10 amazing ones. So you just try not to focus on it, even though, like you say, you sometimes see it and you think, oh gosh. But then at the end of the day, like... I also find it really irritating when people go for such obvious thing. Like, yes, I'm aware. It's like when you're... It's like, I'm aware that I'm not as tall as everyone else. I've lived with it my entire life, you absolute numb nut.

Literally. Do you think I didn't notice? Thanks for bringing it to my attention. I think so many benefits you get cheaper shoes. You get like, you get some lots of benefits from being a bit smaller. You probably pay an adult price for your trainers. Your fucking skin and I'm still at the restaurant. Leading on, because this is optimistic now, to glad, what's the gladdest thing in your life?

What makes you the most glad? Oh, probably my friends, my family, my loved ones. The opportunities that I get to travel. and see the world. I think that makes me really, really happy, you know. And, like, living in London, like, just seeing so many different people for more walks of life and just, yeah, like, seeing different cultures and travelling the world and, yeah, opening your eyes to so many different things. But definitely, like, I've just moved home and I've, like, got this new home now, which I love,

and making that my home and the loved ones, definitely. It's wonderful. Well, thank you so much, Eddie. It's a dream to meet you. And I just wish that the whole world was full of people with your heart and soul. Oh, that's so lovely of you to say. Thank you. Thank you.

You too. You too, thank you. Okay, thank you so. You're everything I wish for and more. I love chatting to you. You're amazing. There's your bag. Don't forget.

Yeah, don't forget that. Otherwise I'll come and let myself into your house. Yeah, you're more than welcome to do that. Safe travel. Thank you, Pallema. Bye. Bye. Oh my god.

I love her. Well, wasn't that great? All of the links of everything we mentioned in the show can be found in the episode description. Oh, and while you're there, why not subscribe and follow the show too? See you all next time. Later's potatoes.