Mad, Sad and Bad with Paloma Faith - Jamali Maddix: A Lack Of Hope Has Created Angry Men

Episode Date: March 30, 2026

When I first met Jamali I wasn’t sure if he liked me or not… so I thought I’d get him on the podcast to find out 🤣Jamali Maddix is one of the sharpest minds in comedy, saying what we’re all thinking, whether we’re ready to hear it or not. You might’ve seen him on Never Mind The Buzzcocks, QI or 8 Out of 10 Cats, but he’s not just funny… he’s seriously thought-provoking too. From his documentaries like Follow The Leader to appearing on Jimmy Carr’s Am I The A**hole?, Jamali has this way of diving into uncomfortable topics and making them make sense.We get into EVERYTHING in this one… from generational trauma to anger, grief and why it’s okay to not always have the answers. It’s deep, it’s funny, it’s a bit chaotic… basically exactly how I like it.We also talk about whether men can actually be trusted in relationships (👀), if animals cry, and why sometimes anger might not be such a bad thing after all.—Find us on: Instagram / TikTok / YouTube—Credits:Producer: Emilia GillEdit Producer: Kat MilsomAssistant Producer: Alex ReedVideo: Josh Bennett, Jake Ji and Harry SawkinsSound: Rafi Amsili GeovannettiOriginal music: BUTCH PIXYSocial Media: Laura CoughlanExec Producer for JamPot: Ewan Newbigging-ListerExec Producers for Idle Industries: Dave Granger & Will Macdonald Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Paloma Faith and this is my show. Each week I welcome someone fantastic into my home to talk about what makes them mad, sad and bad. Roll recording. Jamali, it's cold. Lovely to see you again. Local boy. How you doing?

Nice to see you. Thanks for having me. Thanks for coming. I appreciate it. I'm sorry. Lovely house. To you, Jamali Maddox is a British comedian, writer and presenter with a razor-shund. heartbrain and a talent for saying what we're all thinking. Let's see. You might have seen him on the

telly on shows like Never Mind the Buzzcock, QI, an eight out of ten cats. He's also the face of several documentaries. Yes, he can be serious too. Like Follow the Leader, where he spent time with community figures on the fringes of the mainstream. Most recently, he was on Jimmy Carr's Am I the A-Hull where they presided over a parade of potential assholes. But to me, he's someone I did Never mind the Buzzcocks with. I really wanted him to like me, and I sensed he might not have, or maybe he was a bit indifferent. It's Jamali Maddox.

Do you hate me? No, why did you feel that? Is that the vibe I give off? Well, you've got this cool vibe where you're like, I'm not really bothered by anyone. I don't know why people think that. I'm used to people either really hating me or loving me, and indifference isn't something I've had to deal with in my life. No, I liked you a lot.

I thought he was great. Thanks. It was nice time out of you. I was happy that you was on my team. Was I? Yeah, yeah. I can't remember. I'd just say it wasn't, yeah, all you was thinking about is if I liked you or not, he didn't even.

It was distracting the whole time. I was just like, please love me. Please. Yeah, you wasn't. My father never loved me enough, so I just looked to men for validation. Yeah, it was me, you and no. That is a dream team. Yeah.

It's a dream team. Solid. So you're a Buddhist? I was. Well. Stabbled. This is the thing, yeah. You know, have you ever said anything in like an interview?

And then it just becomes what everyone is. And so I sort of said one time passing me like, oh, I used to go Bethnal Green Buddhist Center. Yeah. And it was just to sit down in quiet. And then everyone now. Yeah. Yeah.

And then now it's, I'm a Buddhist. So anything. So you're not a Buddhist. No. What is the most Buddhist thing you've ever done? Meditate, I guess. Well, I haven't reincarnated yet. You don't know that.

Oh, I have. Oh, actually, yeah, that's a good point. If you've come from something, what would it be? In the previous life? Is it that you had to have done something good? If you do something good, then you get a good life. I've not said I'm something very shit before. Yeah, because animals are superior, aren't they?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, Mad. This is my, you know, my podcast, Mad, Sad, Bad. We're going to start with Mad. So my first bit is, you just can't get enough of racist. I love it. You love them? I'm in it.

You just love racist. I just scour Facebook looking for it. Yeah, you just like, you went to a fucking far right white power festival. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Why? I was making the show at the time where it was sort of like, the first series was mostly focused on like far right. And then second series we kind of tried to drift off from it and do other stories.

But that one, I was in Ukraine and I was sort of meeting the guys. This is when like the war with Russia was sort of, It was sort of, they were shooting stuff at each other, but it wasn't proper kicking off. And I was with this guy, the guys called the Avon Battalion. And they were, like, a lot of them were also, like, a fascist. And I ended up at this white power music festival. And it was in the middle of forest. It was fucking, like, middle of nowhere.

And all I remember, like, the most vivid memory I had from it was there was guys with these, like, knives. Everyone had, like, a big knife on them. And I saw this fight happen. and one guy stabbed another guy in the head. Were they both white supremacists? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They were both white supremacists. One stabbed the other guy.

Oh, music fans. And one stabbed, or one stabbed a guy in the head. And then over the town away, all you heard was, can everyone please put away their knives? And there was a guy then. And he wasn't fighting, but he was just in the corner, like doing this with his knife. And then when it said, can you put your knives away? The guy went, oh.

What just followed the rules? I had to sheave his knife. And the most, the most thing. that stood out most though like the thing that really stuck in my head it wasn't even the people stabbing each other in the head or doing the sig how and that it was uh it was there was a guy who was working the food stand who looked like this really he looked like he was like he was like arab but he was the most furious i was there really yeah yeah yeah like i was trying to take over his spot he's like there's one spot for one guy and that's me um but yeah it was and he was

just he was the whole time he was just staring he was fucking furious the whole time. But yeah, that was the one. That's like the one time where I was like, yeah, this is fucking, that's mad.

But you've seen so much with that. Like, where do you think racism comes from? Is it scapegoating? Yeah. I think it's a lot. I think it's... Like,

who can we blame for our own in the rage? Yeah, I think there's a lot of things. I think it's that. The large part of it's that. I think poverty pays a large part into it. Because it's normally the people who are selling you the product of racism.

have money and they're selling it to people who don't have money. How much were tickets to that festival? They weren't cheap. So that ruins your argument. I got a media, and I've got a media pass. But it's, I'm not saying all of them,

but I'm saying like a lot of time is people, it's sort of what you're seeing now with the rise of the far right is, it's rich people trying to tell poor people that poor people are making them poor. Yeah, because why haven't people work locked onto the fact that reform, you know, our far right party, they all went to private school. Yeah.

Like literally all of them. Well, it's the thing is it's that it's trying to sell people that it's not the establishment. You know what I mean? It's sort of like the Trump thing is the whole idea is that he's just anti-establishment. He's a part of the same of, you know, establishment. So, yeah, so in terms of where racism comes from, it's, you know, I saw you sort of see the same things occurring where it's sort of just

you know people long in for something and it's sort of the same with like conspiracy theory when I sort of met conspiracy theories theorists extreme ones is they kind of they like there's a sort of enjoyment they get where they go everyone else is the sheeple but I actually know

like I'm the smart one What kind of mad conspiracy theories did you hear? Well racial ones I heard a guy where he had a different theory about evolution of where the different races evolved from and he thinks white people evolve from dolphins for some reason and there was that one there was a guy I met in Tennessee. What on dolphins did he think are nice animals?

No, it wasn't a niceness of the animal. He wasn't a white supremacy. He was, he was a white supremacy. But he was sort of his head. If you look at the head shape of the white man, it looks more like a dolphin. And the more he spoke, I go, fuck, they kind of look like dolphin. And like, yeah. And then there was, I sort of, I met this guy in Tennessee, I think it was, where he thought he, so they were part of a cult where basically his dad, they were the Moonies and they claimed that he was Jesus.

So he was, he thinks his dad was the second coming of Jesus, which is also quite a mad thing to believe, you know. Do you think you might be? The second coming of Jesus, no. I'm 34 now. It would have come out by now. How would you know, though? I would have done a miracle by now. If it comes out of fucking 40, I'm busy.

I've got, I've got 40-year-old shit to do. A couple of miracles under your bell. Yeah, but I've got time to be there. You're not done any miracles? No, I've never done a miracle. Yeah, I haven't either. No. So probably not us.

Do you believe in generational trauma? If a whole race of people has abused for that long, that it's inevitable that the trauma's carried. The feeling, you mean? Yeah. Yes. I mean, I think that I don't know too much about. about it. So I don't know in terms of

you're born with that feeling because feelings are genetically passed through. I can't say it's untrue or truth. I don't know. But I feel that one thing's certain that, you know, because I remember there's always this thing of people talk about like, it's over

now. You know that idea? So get over, it's over now. And you kind of go, well, it was just my grandparents' generation when they came here was no blacks, no dogs, no Irish on pub doors. And that's not that long ago. That's not that long ago. Yeah.

It's sort of like, because when was the date it ended then? Yeah, but also it hasn't ended because you're, you're, and I'm sure it was probably somebody who's never experienced or had to experience racism that told you it was over now. Because your day, your lived experience shouldn't be minimized. Like, I'm sure in your life you've experienced racism. Otherwise, you wouldn't be so fascinated by it. Yeah, yeah. And I was, yeah.

I mean, it's even like, you know, the idea, you know, like when you say, the idea of I'm a British comedian. There's a lot of people. If you look at the comment section, they're going to disagree. What's the most shocking thing that a racist ever said to you?

Do you know what? It sounds bad, but you kind of get desensitized, especially when I did that show, I got so desensitized to hearing mad shit that we would get like a new sound guy would come on or a new camera guy would come on and he would be in the car

and we'd be wrapping up for the day. And he'd be like, what the fire? I was fucking insane. And you just be like, oh, stand. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like we didn't even. That's terrible, isn't it? And that's how, when you look back in history, how it spread so much and how it was such a big thing.

Because it was like literally just embedded in culture. It sounds like, you know, that scene you're talking about with the knives and stuff. To me, it just translates as like quite a lot of angry men. Yeah. Do you have empathy for angry men? Do you understand why men are angry? Well, this is, I think, I mean, some level of empathy. I try to be empathetic person.

And I'm not saying it's right. But there was this idea that a lot of people got promised where they went school, they might have gone to uni, they get a job for life, you know, they'll get a job at the council, or a train station or something, it would be like a good job with a good pension. They could buy a house, they could go on a couple of holidays a year, and they could live like a normal good life. that's kind of gone and that's kind of eroded.

And this sort of thing that they were promised and this sort of thing that they thought they had and their parents' generation had and their grandparents' generation had completely gone. And I think that that breeds anger, you know, because it's like I'm 34 and a lot of my friends I grew up with still live at home with their parents. And it's like, yeah, my house is nice, but it's not like, fuck it, yeah, no. It's not got a helicopter pad on the room. No.

I don't have a vote. And that's what you thought would happen if you went on 10. Listen, I thought I'll be jumping into coins like Scrooge McDuck. Do you know what I'm saying, man? That's what I thought my life was going to be. Like, you know what I'm saying? But it's still the same shit. I still got a fucking, you know, I'm still like fucking cancel taxes come.

Do you know what I mean? And that's, you know, and it's sort of like that upper working class, a lower middle class or whatever the class system lands on it. It's kind of like a bit fucked. And I can understand when there's a lack of hope or when there's a void of hope, I think anger fills that whole for people. Are you ever angry? Yeah, of course.

Of course. I think I used to be more angry. I think I was an angry kid growing up. Because I think I, you know, I think I had that thing where I felt a lack of hope. So I filled it with anger because that's an easier and emotion to muster up. And it's easy to express where other emotions are harder to express, you know. Than to go, I expected this and I just, I'm disheartened that I never got in. I just, I sort of was in that position when I was in my teenage years and shit, where I genuinely

didn't think I was ever going to have a life that was worth living. Like it was just, it was it, you know, I sort of, I flunked out of school. Were you bunking off as that? Well, no, yeah, I was doing that, but I was sort of, I had a, I got like, severe dyslexia and dyspraxia. So I was just, I just shit at school. You know what I mean? So I felt, I felt angry about that. But, you know, and then luckily I sort of fell in something that I'm good at doing. You're brilliant. I feel, you know. Yeah, I mean, I've been stealing the living for a bit. As long as you've got a little bit of talent and a lot of hustle, you're fun.

Yeah, yeah. I'm bad with the hustle, though. Really? Yeah, I'm not good at the hustle. You know, that hustle? I'd rather be at home. You wouldn't just bowl up to someone and be like, hi, my name's Jamarley. No. No. It's not even that I'm bad at starting conversation. But I'm not, man. I can't do that. Hey, hey, man. Can we connect? We should collab.

I don't. Collab on what? Like I'm that guy. Like what are we collabing on? What makes you most angry? Do you know what? I guess it's just day-to-day minutia. Someone trying to jump in on the line or, you know, those things, the day-to-day.

Would you call someone out for that? Oh, fuck yeah. Excuse me? I'm cool with calls in the scene. Oh, really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not that person who's going to like, no, brother. I've been waiting in this fucking line, brother.

I want to jump in too, but I don't. You know what I mean? Because the thing is that the reason I get angry at them is because I go, I want to do the same thing. But society won't run if I did as well. I want to do the same. Because I don't want to be in a line at the fucking bank all day. See what I'm getting mad right now.

I'm sorry. I don't mean to bring this energy to your house. The people who jump the line in the way that they think you haven't noticed. They're slowly drifted in front of you. Jarring, isn't it? Should we bring hire in my friend's here? And she quite likes being Aggie as well. All right.

This is my friend Aya who's appeared on the series before She's an artist and local legend She's actually really famous in Hackney Like every parent in Hackney knows her Oh sick But yeah she's quite Aggie, aren't you sometimes All the time There's a lot to be Aggie for

I feel Yeah Talk about the state of the world and all of that stuff But actually I was When I was recently in Palestine I was there recently And I was very enraged all the time And I was always told to just, I'd be a bit with diplomatic.

I had to get your point across, you've got to be calmer. And I met this amazing activist who's at the forefront of real social change. And she said to me, rage is the only thing that will get you, that will see us through. Rage is the only thing. And I think actually it's okay to lean into our rage. I think we're always told to calm down and be diplomatic. But actually, I think that's, I think that's just what the West wants us to be. We're okay, it's okay to be angry because there's a lot to be angry for and I lean into it.

Because of what's happening in the world with, you know, the vice contextualise, like there's Sudan, Congo, Palestine, ice, reform in this country. Trump's on a mish. Like, it's insane. Everything's crumbling. Do you feel like there's more tension in, like, the street or the, like, society? I don't know. People, there's obviously a cost of living crisis so people don't go out as much. It feels like the bars and stuff are more quiet.

And it's that thing of, yeah, people always felt ways about race and all these things and they've always been homophobic and all these feelings have, these aren't new feelings. This isn't like, these ideas have just been created. But I think there was sort of a social understanding and it was sort of, even they knew it was rude to say it in public. But now everyone's open. Because they feel cathartic. It feels, it feels, they feel so emboldened.

And they feel like, oh, finally I can say the thing I want to say. You know what I mean? And it's like, I think once you open that box, it's hard to pull it down because, you know, they, they feel these feelings so viscerally. Yeah. That when they start expressing it, you know, they just, it feels good for them. And it's like, finally I can say all these horrible, horrible things I've been wanted to say. If you ever, you ever, like, not like someone and then you just fucking let them have it one time. Do you know what I'm saying?

And you just fucking let them. And every thing, you know, and you did this fucking thing. And another thing. another thing that's not even related to this thing. Yeah. You know what I mean? But like, you know, and it's... We've reached a tipping point for sure.

But I think that the hopeful one in me, but I just, I feel that when you reach a tipping point in the face of adversity, people do come together in a different way. Communities. Communities, but also historically, I just feel like I've been friends with everyone and anyone. But now I'm only friends with people who are allied fundamentally with my views on really important things, like race, like. diversity like Palestine like whatever and I just feel actually I've just cut out all the

filtered a bit you know again it's that thing of it's definitely what I kind of enjoyed at the time of making the docs back in the day about the race stuff is I kind of wanted people to I want to hear what you actually think the conversation you know I think the conversation is important yeah and it's just so we know yeah I want to know and I kind of don't like people who lie about what they are. Like, I find that, I find that, I find them creepy. What you mean, we lie? It's a bit weird like a snake in the grass there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, why, why are you lying about who you are? Thanks, Ia. Thank you. We're going to have you back later. Do you think animals can cry? No, no. But they can feel sad. I don't know if it's the same emotion as sad, like, as human

sad. I watched this documentary once, I'm going to tell you about it. Please do. Where these scientists, in quotation marks, lived with, it was in the 60s. It's a black and white documentary. They were all doing LSD. Yeah. They were living with dolphins.

Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. Humans and dolphins could cohabit. There's a theme here. It's a dolphin theme on this episode. And this woman, long story short, was wanking off this dolphin every single day. Yeah, yeah, yeah. During this experiment.

And then when they shut it down, The dolphin died of a broken heart. Because he was getting just japped off every day. He missed the orgasms. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he missed his human companion. The dolphins just, they're like, what the fuck? If you think about it, in Animal Kingdom,

we're looking at dolphins maybe getting to fuck twice a year. I like that these scientists, they've done a long walk. That's a long walk, in it. That was like a lot of justification just because they wanted to beat off a dolphin. Do you think? They had to pretend. We're doing science and wearing lab coats. And yeah, science.

This dolphin died, and I reckon... It died from not getting jacked off. Well, it died from a broken heart. It was in love with her. I think, okay. So it must have felt sad, me. Yeah, but it's, I mean, they say dolphins are probably one of the smarter animals. That meant to a chimp-like, I won't go to a zoo because I can look at a zebra.

Like, I don't care about a zebra. Like, a zebra doesn't know. Doesn't move you. No, the zebra doesn't know it shouldn't be there. You don't fancy the zebra. I don't fancy the zebra. I don't fancy. dolphin now we're fucking talking you fucking killer whales them killer whales then we're rocking and

rolling but i like i'll see like a gorilla or a chit and i can't it's meant to be sad this section yeah but i'm saying it looks like it shouldn't it looks like it knows it shouldn't be there do you know where the other animals don't like a giraffe doesn't know it shouldn't be there yes yes but the gorilla looks like they do experience sadness probably some level but not i don't think it's the same experience we have it might be i don't know i haven't I think they have lost. Yeah. Like if a dog's owner dies, they mourn, don't they?

Yeah, but is it, how long do they mourn? Is it, do they mourn until someone else feeds them? Probably. Do I mean? Until someone else strokes in, it goes, ah, fuck that, fucking. Who? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So tell me about your sad thing.

One of the real sad moments, I lost my friend though that long ago. Sorry to hear that. No, that's all right. And, yeah, and that was, that was, that was. was a real sad moment and it's even she was one of those friends where when she passed there was definitely a loneliness that exists

and I know I'm not going to find another friend like that do you know I mean no and it was like a real you know it was a it was one of the friends I could really be completely honest with you know because I think you know being completely yourself and being completely honest is you you sort of is something sparing who I am but thank quite sparingly sometimes and you sort of, you know, you have to keep something for yourself.

But for her it was just like a real, like, complete, you know, she knew exactly who I was, you know. And that was a real sad moment. And accepted you? Yeah, of course. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. How did she die? She had pancreatic cancer. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And how long as you? Was it an old school friend? No, I had known her since I was 26 and she passed away. So about 10 years. Yeah, about 10 years. And we had stopped speaking for a long time too. Why? We fell out over something stupid.

Oh. And but we became friends again. And I remember I saw her the day before she passed. And I'm happy I did. You know what I mean? And yeah. And I sort of went in there with the intention to make her laugh. And I think that's one.

And I remember she telling me that that was one thing she appreciated. If I didn't go in there and go, oh, yeah. Yeah, melancholy. You know what I mean? like she was walking really slow and I said fuck me it's the white Usain boat fucking running and you know and just taking the piss out of her making her laugh and you know what I'm saying and treating her like a human

and normal and not just treating her like this because she wasn't a sick person she she knows she was one she and it's sort of like sometimes when people describe people it's bare jarring because they sort of go like you know they walked into the room and they were perfect no one was no no one is you know we're flawed

and we're all this but she was one of those people that liked life and loved life and deserved to live it. And really lived it. You know, really and really didn't just sit around and, you know, really took life and, you know, and, you know, and experienced it. And yeah, man. So that was a real, that was a real sad moment, I think. Do you think you ever recover from losing someone?

I think when we say recover, we want to be completely dissolved from any feeling of that feeling. And I don't think that's true. and that's okay. Do I mean? And I think we, like, you know, we think if it's not back to 100%,

then it's still broken. And I don't think, I think it just, it changes you. You know what I mean? And I don't know if it's like, you get over it, but I don't think you,

you also let it, uh, define you forever and it's just something that's happened and it's, it's a changing moment in your life and it changes your trajectory. So I don't think it's sort of that thing of, you know, oh yeah, that's,

you know, it's, it's, it's, fucked forever now. You know what I'm just sadded forever. That's insane. Like that's an insane.

Like I'm not, you know, every day. I'm never going to get over. Yeah. Like I'm never going to live a life again because my friend died. Like that's insane and that's not what she wanted. Do you think that's possible though?

Like if you have, you know, there's certain people in your life you could lose and then you'd be like, I'm never going to, I don't know how I'd ever get over it. No. No. And not in like in a horrible way.

Not in like a way. Like, it would fuck me up and I'd be horrified and it would change my life. But I don't, I can only want for myself what I would want for other people sometimes. And what I'd want for other people is, if someone felt that way about me, don't. Go live your life still. Like, I don't want you. Yeah. You know what I mean?

Be sad for a bit. Like, I'm fucking dead. Don't, don't just be calm with it. You know what I'm saying? Like, I want a bit of fucking morning. Move on. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You better cry at my funeral, brother.

But, like, at the same time, like, you know, go, I want you to live life. Go out there. Yeah, I want you to exist. Start again. And enjoy yourself. And, you know, because it's like, just because I'm gone, it doesn't mean you're not, you can't exist anymore.

So I don't, you know, there's like if I lost my, you know, if I lost my mom or my father, because it would be, it would hurt a lot. And I think it would change me forever. But to say that I'm never going to live again, I wouldn't want that for myself. Are you the type of person who likes a hug or do you want to be left alone? I wouldn't be left alone, I think. Really? Yeah.

Oh, so you will go to the corner and just... Yeah, I want to be like black and white French movie smoking a cigarette, just mysterious. Yeah, I want to be mysterious. Don't touch me. Yeah, yeah, I want to be looking out and it's raining mysteriously. Brooding. Brooding. That's the vibe for me now.

2006, Jamali's just on a brooding. Are you comfortable to cry? I don't cry a lot, but it's not like I'm uncomfortable with it. It's just not my first go-to. What's your first go-to? I think for a long time it was distraction. I sort of would distract myself where I would throw myself into work. You know, I remember one time I was really feeling bad, so I booked a tour.

Just take your mind off of them. Well, I booked a tour in Asia because I was feeling shit. You're like keep busy. Yeah, and then I've fucking got measles. So it made you feel like people were. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, nearly killed me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, all my lungs hemorrhaged and shit. Oh, God.

Yeah, and I was in like Bangkok Hospital. It was fucking rough. But anyway, but yeah, I would do that. And I thought I stopped doing that now, I think, as I got older, and I kind of, I tried to process. And I tried to, yeah, but like crying, like, you know, actually tears from my eyes. I don't do much now. You're stoic? Yeah.

That's new, 2006, Stoic. Do you think you're a nice person when other people are sad? I try to be. Were you like, come here. Do you want a hug? Yeah, I mean, if that's what they, yeah, yeah, I can't have a problem with that. I think it's, I think it's good to be comforting someone if they're feeling sad. I'll give you a hug.

But I don't necessarily like it where men particularly try and solve the thing. Like I'd rather they didn't go, well, you know, you knew that this person was dying or, you know, we all knew and you did your best or whatever. Like, you just don't say anything. A hug's good. If you don't like that, I won't come. Why, you were solving. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm a solver. Oh, come on.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're like, I don't need that because I have an intelligent mind. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what you're saying, but right now I'm experiencing my. feelings. Yeah, no, I'll probably do that, yeah. Bad. Yes.

Now, I know you've got your own agenda of what you want to talk about in bad, but I want to ask you a couple of questions. Is there such a thing as a man who doesn't cheat? Yeah, of course. Really? You're looking at one right now. Lala. No, I don't cheat on one.

I'm old man now. No more? Yeah, I've cheated before, probably, yeah. What's so great about cheating? Why does it feel so good when you're doing it in terrible afterwards? I think when, like, again, you're talking. talking about like when I'm 17, 18, and the cheating is like I kissed a girl at a club when I was drunk. Like that level of, I've never like had an affair or, you know what I'm saying?

Like had another family and all that shit. But I didn't have the capacity to be in a relationship in the first place. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Well, that's really young. Yeah. But that's what I's the only experience I can talk about. But have you ever like had a girlfriend and just pretended you two were cheating together to spice things up?

No, no, no, no. No, because I think my girlfriend would still, my girlfriend, we would do that. Would it plant the scene? girlfriend be upset being like, you like that too much or that was, you were too good at that. But no, like, this is so wrong. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I can't. I don't do with, I don't have the admin skills.

It's just too much. It's too much admon. Do you know what? Someone said to me, which is brilliant, actually, is like, it's best not to lie because then you don't have to remember the lie. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because most people who lie forget what they actually said and that's how they get caught. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

So it's just way easier to be honest. And people can clock, like you said, they were all asked you the same question, three weeks later and that you thought you got away with it but then they'll ask you again there'll be a lot of men watching this saying he's lying when you said there's no such thing as there's such a thing as a man who doesn't cheat there was men who don't cheat i know i did a friend of mine who he married to his wife you know got three three lovely kids and i remember talking to him and he says to me and he said to me you know one of the great things about not cheating and being completely loyal to his wife is

he goes, I'll leave my phone everywhere. There's no block on my phone. Let's leave everywhere. Because there's nothing to hide. And it's not, you know, and it's like, and I sort of know some friends who cheat on their partner or have cheated on their partner or would be cheating. And it's the abject, they've got no every time where everything gets. Where's my phone? You know what I mean? It's like, that looks like a castle. Yeah, it is. Are you in a relationship now?

I have a partner, yeah. You'd never cheat. I don't cheat now. Do you think she would? Do I think she would? No. Have you ever been cheated on? Never been.

Not that I know of. If they cheated on me, they fucking, they were good. Would it upset you? Would it upset you? Do you know what? It's funny you ask me this year. As I get older, the less it would upset me. Like, I wouldn't be happy.

I'm not going to be like fucking sick. But like, I'm going to like, but like a little part of me is like, once you get over the initial feeling of it, yeah. I think a little part of me would be happy because I finally know what type of person you are and I know what this relationship meant you, which was not much, so I'm happy.

Yeah. So I'm kind of happy that you did. They've done your favour because you haven't spent the rest of your life with this weird day. I didn't waste time. So it's like, yeah, man. And it's like you're not, you're not, you're not held captive. If you want to go, go.

Like, it's fine. Like, you know, breakups happen. You're not hostage. No. Just do your thing Just go What was it your I said something though

It's just to come over My mum once said that men are as loyal as their options What do you think about that Yeah some men You know what I mean Like it's just I think you gravitate towards people Who kind of have your ideals Right

Yeah Or you know there is some kind of And it's just the people that I kind of associate with or no, they don't get into relationships if they don't want it. Do you know what? And I tried to,

oh, I tried to hang out with people who were sort of mature, I guess. But, you know. Once I sat on an airplane with this guy who was a heart surgeon for eight hours, we didn't know each other, we were both flying alone.

And he said something amazing to me. He said that the reason why he would never cheat on his wife was because he loved her more than he loved himself. And that he felt like he respected her more than he respected his own desires. And he said, I'm not going to lie. Obviously, I've occasionally, like, thought that person's attractive, hot, whatever.

But what stopped me going there or staying in the hotel bar in the evening or whatever would always be that I just think my wife's better than me. Yeah. Do you think your girlfriend's better than you? No. Oh, I think, I don't know about best. think she's inferior. Yeah. Is she batting?

Yeah. Was this not a misogynistic? If it's not a red pill. Yeah. I mean, if that's how he feels, I guess. Yeah. I mean, but it's like one of the things of you, if you're going to be in a relationship, especially if you're married with kids.

Like, I get the kind of, you know, you know, people were sort of this sort of situation ship and then they, you know, still vetting their options. Like, I can understand that. But when you got like fucking wife and the kids and you're out here at a hotel bar cheating, but I've like, come on, man. A little curveball, right? Yeah. There is a misconception that people who cheat are in unhappy relationships.

Some people cheat and they're in very happy relationships. And I just think sometimes it's a reflection on themselves emotionally and it's not a reflection on the relationship. Does that make sense? Yeah, I understand. Right. And the other thing is I feel strongly, because I've experienced it, that sometimes infidelity can be the maker of a relationship. So you find out you or your partner are cheating and it comes out and then shit hits the fan and actually there comes a point where it's make or break and you've got nothing

to fight for but then you come together and you actually do we want to be together because couples can go for years without asking themselves do we actually want to be together and actually when something crumbles and the foundation breaks then you start to rebuild it on an even keel. So I feel like it can be the making of a relationship. So I'm smiling, not because I think it's a very interesting point you're making, but it's just I like the idea of a guy be like, listen, I cheat because I'm trying to fix things with you. I fucked her because I love you.

That's why I fucked her, babe. That's like Eddie Murphy when it's sitting wrong. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I fucked up. Yeah, yeah. I made love to you. Yeah, yeah. I just, you know what, man, yeah.

As I get older, yeah, I think I always thought relationships was a very prescripted thing. This is what a relationship is. This is what it is. And if that's how you guys rock and if that's what works for you guys, or you know that what works for you guys is, is that you both kind of know what each other's doing. But the happy family and you're happy together and you've got a nice mortgage. And that works for you guys.

And fucking rock on, man. Like it's, you know what I mean? Or it's that. Swingers parties. Yeah, whatever the fuck is. If that's what they're into. I think that, yeah, there's a lot of judgment. And I think that it's very binary how people.

look at infidelity. I'm not defending it and I think being transparent is really important but also I think that there's so much inner turmoil in the person that's cheating

it's, you know that's something for them as well to have to deal with it's... I hear what you mean about judgment because look

any of the day man your situation with your partner or your man your woman whatever it is you do it's your guys's business

so if you guys after these big things come out and then you come out better like it's their business and I think it is kind of that thing of, you know, I try not to be judgmental or in other people's situation. Because again, it's kind of, it's not, it doesn't, it doesn't change the

taste of my cereals. Why am I getting involved in their shit, you know? Thanks, I asked. Do you think you've got a clear conscience in your life? Like, not just about cheating, but just in life. Yeah. Do you think you've been a good person? I think, do you know what? I think I've, no, but I don't think no one has. I think we all have flaws. I think I've been a human. Do you know what I mean? And there's nothing egregious. I don't think I've done anything fucking, like I haven't done a war crime.

You know, like, you know, but. You got any regrets? Have you got? Yeah, I've got a lot regrets. Go on, tell me one. Even just little things of if I, you know, I'm feeling frustrated or I'm feeling this and I'm kind of a bit snappy with someone or I'm not as kind as I could be. A little part of me goes, oh man, I could have been a bit more, you know, I could have been a bit more

kind to that person. I could have been a bit more, you know, patient or I don't know. You're human. Yeah. And I'm, you know, I'm flawed. I try to be honest about my flaws and I try to be, you know, like I can be fucking grumpy. I can be all these things. I can be, you know, I can, yeah, I can be rude.

I can be all those things. I try, I try to be a good person. I try to, you know, I try to apologize. if I feel like I've generally done something wrong. That's a skill, I think. Yeah, I try to. I try to. I've tried to.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right the second, what are you glad about? Well, I'm glad that, you know, like I've, I feel like I'm, I feel like I'm taking bigger steps to progress in life, which is sometimes hard to do and sometimes daunting, but I'm sort of taking those steps. Being brave? Yeah, I think that's good. I'm glad about that.

I'm glad that I'm doing something. I enjoy, you know, because I think you can kind of, you can take that for granted a lot. Because even though I like, you know, I like doing comedy and I like, you know, talking shit and doing all that, it is a job. And you can, you can kind of forget that actually is something you enjoy doing. So I try, you know, I'm glad I'll get to do something I like to do and not something I hate doing. Like, I don't hate Mondays. I'm glad about that, you know. I'm glad I got a family, you know. So, yeah, I'm glad about a few things.

Thanks so much. Uplifting. Yeah. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Thank you so much. So nice to send you back on the road. Look off yourself.

You too. You too. Bye. I love that. Decent chat. Well, wasn't that great? All of the links of everything we mentioned in the show can be found in the episode description. Oh, and while you're there, why not subscribe and follow the show too?

See you all next time. Later's potatoes!