Marketing Happy Hour - From Culture to Conversions: Maximizing Tentpole Moments | David Pangilinan of Paramount Advertising

Episode Date: August 28, 2025

In this final episode of our POSSIBLE series, we sit down with David Pangilinan, Senior Manager of Audience Impact and Intelligence at Paramount Advertising, to explore how brands can win big by leveraging tentpole moments. From live events and major film releases to cultural shifts that dominate the headlines, Paramount has perfected the art of turning high-profile moments into powerful opportunities for advertisers. David breaks down common mistakes brands make, strategies for staying authentic, and the four pillars for success he shared at POSSIBLE—our favorite presentation of the entire conference. If you want actionable insights on how to turn cultural relevance into measurable ROI, this conversation is one you won’t want to miss.Key Takeaways:// What tentpole marketing really means today—and how the definition is evolving in an always-on, digital-first landscape.// How to authentically connect with audiences during cultural and industry moments without forcing the brand fit.// The four proven strategies for tentpole success that Paramount uses to deliver impact at scale.// Mistakes brands should avoid when trying to insert themselves into cultural conversations.// How to measure ROI when investing in tentpole-related campaigns.// Where audience expectations are heading in 2025 and beyond, and what marketers need to pay attention to now.Connect with David: LinkedIn____Say hi! DM me on Instagram and let us know what content you want to hear on the show - I can't wait to hear from you! Please also consider rating the show and leaving a review, as that helps us tremendously as we move forward in this Marketing Happy Hour journey and create more content for all of you. ⁠Join our FREE Open Jobs group on LinkedIn: ⁠Join now⁠Get the latest from MHH, straight to your inbox: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join our email list!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Follow MHH on Social: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ | ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LinkedIn⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ |⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TikTok⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ | ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Facebook⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

Today we are continuing our possible series, last episode of the possible series, and we're joined by David Pangellian, senior manager of audience impact and intelligence at Paramount advertising. David, welcome to the show. Thanks for being here. Gosh, thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. Absolutely.

This was, I kid you not. Like, I feel like this was one of our last sessions that we attended. And we ended the conference on the bank because we walked out and we're like, That was amazing. Not even just the content, but again, we told you off record. It was so well presented and just so fun. We really enjoyed hearing what you all had to say. So thank you for sharing that. Of course. Yeah. That was a big goal of ours too, is that whenever, especially at Paramount, when we're talking about a bunch of numbers and strategies, it's like how can you bring it to life and how can you really engage with people who are listening? And a lot of it

is theory, but when you show how it can be put into practice, I feel like it's much more engaging. Absolutely. For sure, and everything felt so relevant and timely. Just kudos to you and the team. It was an excellent presentation and excited to chat more about it today. Yeah, let's get into it.

I love it. Well, first, David, we have to ask you, what's been in your glass lately? What are you enjoying? Oh, man, okay, I feel like, so I used to create these like a year ago, so I feel like I'm not hopping onto the trend, but I do love myself a Hugo Spritz, but with like very little St. Germain,

like elder flour liqueur in it, I love it. I love the essence of it. I love my bubbles, so like pour more prosceco, you know, pour a little bit, a little bit of that club soda, but I love a Hugo Spritz. It's so nice, not too sweet, you know, yeah. Big pants, one of our favorites. Yeah.

I have to ask you too, in New York, what's your favorite? it place to get a Hugo Spritz or even just have a drink in general. Oh my gosh. Okay, if we're going the Italian route, there, I grew up in the West Village in New York City, so you have to go to this place called Bar Pissolino. Okay, yes. Very good.

Yep. Go, oh, yes, you've been, you've been, yes. Go there during the off, during the off times, so like, you know, like you can actually get a seat outside, but it's, it's so delicious, it's so fun. And another place, it's my favorite spot just for, like, date drink. or like catching up with someone it's um it's called palma and it's on cornelia street yes it's across from taylor swift's old house but it is it is um i grew i grew yeah right like taylor swift's if you know if you know yeah but um it's it's delicious i love the place it looks like you're like in italy

the way that they've created um um the setting with it inside with like huge flowers and they're real and it's it's beautiful it's beautiful yes okay amazing and you're you said West Village and I was like bracing myself because one of my favorite spots in the West Village is Dante, which I know is kind of like right there. So yes, yes, yes. I wonder. Oh, yeah. Say to that. But no, the ones that you shared are also fantastic. You know, I was about to go to Dante tonight. Like Dante was on the list because I'm going to happy hour, but then I'm in Times Square. And my friend was like, let's just do something in Times Square. And I'm like, yeah. Okay. Have you been to the alderman yet? To where? The alderman? No.

Where is that? Oh, I highly, highly recommend. We're getting a little off track, but it's absolutely, like, we could talk about New York for hours. The Alderman is excellent. It's in Times Square, and you think it's very, like, kind of hidden. They have a coffee bar, and then there's a small restaurant in the back. It's excellent.

Highly, highly, highly recommend. Oh, okay, okay. Writing it on my list. Maybe we'll go there after happy archings. Yeah. Yes, absolutely. Amazing. Well, David, can you share, too?

If you don't mind just a little bit about your career journey, how did you land at Paramount advertising. Yeah, this actually works so well because I just did a panel today in front of high school students. So I'm like, ooh, I got it all in my repertoire. Yeah, they like, they came in to like, talk to Paramount Advertising today about our career paths and so I was, I was like, this is so cute. Yeah, so I started off at NBC as a sports booker. If you can even believe that, wow. Yeah, went to the Olympics in Rio in 2016. And then I worked there as a booker, and then I realized that I didn't really like the idea of working around sports. Like, it was very interesting.

It's very cool. It's just not for me. It's not a passion of mine. It's not something that I'm very, like, well versed in. And so I heard through one of my friends who was part of the page program at NBC about a job at what was then called Viacom. And so it was called Scratch, and it was more like of a think tank. creative agency within Viacom. So it operated independently, but it was still, you know, like it's serviced like all the networks and stuff. And then we got absorbed by what is now called

Paramount Brand Studio, which is our creative in-house marketing agency and studio. So a lot of like that integrated marketing, the White Glove Service integrations within shows and all that, they're kind of housed in Paramount Brand Studio, which we call PBS, which took me a while to kind of like wrap my head around because I was like public broadcasting yeah um and then um with during the pandemic we then merged a lot that within paramount brand studio we were the cultural intelligence team which kind of suited it was much more suited to the ad sales and research and insights division within paramount advertising so then annette while i stayed on the team we then moved into ad sales research and insights um and lydia daily now heads it who she used to head our

And now she has the entire division of audience impact and intelligence, which is under the umbrella of Paramount advertising. And I've been here ever since, I'm coming around nine years at Paramount. Yeah. So I love it. It's great. It's so dynamic. I think our team is really interesting. The cultural intelligence team specifically is just, we like to, I mean, we're trying to demilitarize our terms at work, but we're kind of like a swap team of strategists.

But yeah, it's been great. Thank you so much for sharing. I think one of the areas that you mentioned specifically at Possible, but also in your presentation, is really focusing on these tent pull moments for the brand. And so really curious to hear from you how you define a tent pull moment at Paramount advertising given the sort of ever-evolving, ever-changing marketing landscape. How has that definition grown? Yeah, that's a question that we get every time we present how to have a moment.

So I'd say that the tent pole, the traditional definition of a tent pole was anything that was like a marquee event that was televised or talked about, right? We're talking even at Paramount, it's the Grammys, it's the Tony Awards, it's the VMAs. That's what a lot of people consider to be a tent pole, Coachella. And what now, especially within culture, because everything can have such a viral moment, anything can kind of dominate the cultural conversation. Anything can really be a tent pool. Anything from like a creator having their own moment on Twitch or on our any type of streaming service. But that's what we consider tent poles. Anything that's like legendary IP, like RuPaul's Drag Race, you know, Yellowstone, things that kind of, I wouldn't want to say like disrupts, but more so kind of like take over a cultural conversation because of just how popular it is.

And so when we talk about how to have a moment and within the study, it's really learning how to harness something that's already taking. shape within the cultural conversation, and that's what we consider to be attended. I love that. That's super helpful, too. And I think of too, like this week when we're recording, not to timestamp this too much, but like Taylor Swift is releasing a new album, like things like that. So there are some, to your point, like really obvious moments, but also other moments that feel maybe a little bit smaller, but they do impact culture in a way. So a good way to look at it. And especially within how to have a moment too, right? Like the main goal of it is to teach brands, big and small budgets, huge, and not so huge,

that there's an opportunity through those four strategies that I know we're going to go into later where you can actually tap into the conversation and one that aligns with your brand, but also just feels right for your brand to be able to take part in. Yeah, absolutely. Well, we loved hearing about some of these examples at the conference, but if you don't mind,

can you share just an example of a campaign of yours that leveraged one of those big cultural moments and how did it resonate with audiences and what did that look like for you all? Yeah, I mean, my favorite example to talk about, which is like bridging fandoms, and we're going to bring it back to sports, was the Gladiator 2 movie, the NFL, Megan the Stallion, and the VMAs, where we created over 200 assets from like, I think, eight different countries and creating that one powerful commercial, that kind of like took over the airwaves.

Everyone was talking about it. When you take sports, music, a legendary piece of IP, like Gladiator 2, and of course, Megan the Stallion, alongside the VMAs, you're bridging all of these fandoms together, right? So the point of that piece of creative with Pepsi was that you're doing intergenerational fandoms, too. People who are watching this piece of creative may never have heard of Megan the Stallion. If you're older, if you're younger, you may have never never. seeing gladiated the first gladiator movie which was 20 years ago right so we really want to highlight

that piece at paramount especially when we're talking about 10 pull strategies because it harnessed so many fandoms and it paid off with over 22 billion organic impressions within the first week so it was just it just shows the power of fandoms and how fandoms can kind of dictate the cultural conversation too and I mean also when you throw in the NFL you know I mean you got like everything happening. It was timed so well, you know, like Megan Missalien was in the piece. She also hosted the VMAs, the NFL players. It aired during the first day of NFL game day. So it was just, it was so beautifully planned that it's just, it's so impressive. And also, if you remember the original Pepsi commercial, right, with like Britney Spear, like it was

just like recreating of that moment too. So there was just so many moving pieces. Like a nostalgia play for it, right? Like at the same at the same moment. Yeah. Oh, that's amazing. So with something like that, or even just using that as a specific example, how are you measuring success? I mean, I'm sure there's so many different layers of touchpoints and places where consumers are talking about these different integrations. But how do you guys look at something like that and say, okay, this is successful and here's why? Yeah, that's such a good question too. And I have to give it up to our data strategy and analytics team and our performance and impact team where they do a bunch of, you know, after the ad has been shown like the like what's the lift like what happens there and with our

social listening team like really understanding like what were the impressions um what was the purchase consideration that happened and so those teams just measure everything like that like and it's it's so amazing to me right because as a person in cultural intelligence i just told you about what was trending you know like i just told you about what's cool and so to be able to see how creative teams put that idea together and then see that impact whether it's social views you know, whether it's like, likeability about the brand has changed, purchasing intent. There's even an example that we have of like the Grammys this year with Lady Gaga and MasterCard, where they air Lady Gaga's abracadabra music video.

And after that, there was 52% consideration in opening up a MasterCard credit card. It's just like, excuse me? I just watched a music video and a piece of creative. And now you're like, I should open a master card. crazy yeah so it's so many benchmarks wow wow wow wow and as we talk about sort of how to have a moment what are some of the things that you are seeing that brands are having challenges with as they're trying to back themselves into these moments and how do you think they can help overcome those yeah i feel like a lot of brands are trying to capture lightning in a bottle

too often and sometimes you know you can um that's why there's that saying right but I feel like a lot of brands have to understand how they specifically align to a piece of culture, which is why we have the four strategies because you're also like needing to understand like what consumers are saying. And, you know, like one thing like with Mountain Dew that we had, right, like in our example, was that they listened to what the cultural conversation was happening about how both the VPs, like during the VP debate, love Diet Mountain Dew. So they played within that space because, you know, consumers were seeing that. like they were typing it on reddit they're typing it on twitter they're like oh my gosh like they both share a similarity that they both have diet mountain do and i'm like that's so random

you know like um and so i feel like a lot of brands need to understand like their ethos because consumers are so savvy now right like there's literally subreddits talking about brands that have underperformed or missed the mark because they're trying to connect with consumers that first of all may have never even heard of your brand before or also you're trying to meet creative that falls really, really short, right? And like left and right, now what's happening in the advertising world and if a brand messes up, oh my gosh, I can like come up into our social media feeds. You know, there's like so many accounts dedicated to breaking it apart. So I feel like brands really need to understand what's happening within the consumer cultural conversation

and also be able to maybe, you know what, I don't need to be part of that moment. You know, maybe Labibuos are having a moment right now. Maybe I don't need to come up with my own type of Lubbu. Sure. Yeah, it's like it's an art and a science to be. Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. Well, kind of along those lines too, like how are you balancing some of that brand authenticity in your messaging so the content doesn't feel force? Because I know that's a big thing as marketers. We feel like this has gone away over the years. However, for a while, it's like we have to jump on every trend. We have to be a part of every moment. We have to do everything in order to get ahead as a brand, but that authenticity comes into play of making sure it's aligned with who

you are. So how are you kind of balancing that with the messaging and making sure it does make sense when it goes out to consumers? Yeah, at Paramount, we do a really great job of just trying to understand which of pieces of RIP match with your target demo, right? And so when we think about the how to have a moment for tent pool strategies, just like one, is it extending the entertainment, like are you are you going to be in there to allow fans to have more of an understanding of like of the piece of creative that's out there like are you attaching something on are you writing the the coattails of something that it's an easier way in or are you as a brand with our another strategies to are you bridging fandoms together does your brand have a fandom can you connect

that fandom to something that's happening right now right um or the third one is to create culture to own like are is there a way that you can like you know something like like like Wendy's did a really great job with the crabby patty meal, right? Like Wendy's was just like the crabby patty meal from Sponge Jop's Quir Pants, super iconic. Like, why don't we take that and own that piece of culture while also understanding that it's fans first, right? And so, oh my gosh, they're like hours. I've had hours of people waiting in drive-thrues just to try the party patty. And then finally, like the last strategy is like, can you keep the conversation going?

Like, how are you able to kind of like empower fans and these fandoms that they're in? that align with your brand, like the MasterCard and the Lady Gaga example, you know, like we asked Lady Gaga to be like, encourage your fans to try to do the abracadabber dance. And it just like generated such a huge millions of views and millions of submissions of videos for people to kind of like take part in it. And I want to say that the silver lining within all of this is that you're understanding your consumer first, right? Like understanding your brand and how those consumers align. And really finding your place there, which is why we have those strategies with a bunch of of case studies that you know when we take it out to our clients and our and our agency partners

they can kind of like we use a litmus test of like okay maybe this will work you know yeah for sure for sure and i know you just kind of gave us a little bit of an overview of those four strategies would you mind just kind of breaking those out one more time just in in order there that would be super helpful particularly because you know we were obviously lucky enough to see the the presentation but i think particularly for for listeners that'll be really helpful just as they're creating their own strategies as well to, you know, to model off of this. Yeah, of course. So we put all of these strategies together, one to really help brands both big and small with budgets that are big or small to find a way to be able to take part within

a tent pole, like a tent pole moment. And so our first temple strategy is to extend the entertainment. And that really means consumers are so savvy of like what kind of ads are intrusive or additive when they're watching something, right? And like an example that we use in our deck is the VMAs partnering with MasterCard and SISA. And so instead of of MasterCard actually creating a very random and separate ad, they dedicate an entire commercial pod, a three-minute commercial pod for Siza's latest single, which is Saturn. And so if that's what we mean by extending the entertainment, right, it's kind of seamless. Like, you're going from watching the Grammys and being like, oh, okay, like, this is such a great show.

And then you got Trevor Noah, who is hosting it, being like, and we'll, and we're about to debut Sizz's latest single, and we'll be right back. Which means, like, oh, this is an ad, and then you watch it, and it's her entire music video. Right. But then at the end, MasterCard, you know, like, has, like, a little call out with Siza about how she's helping the reforestation efforts of MasterCard. So it's just really, like, having that seamless additive extension of all. already what people are watching. So there's that. The second 10-pull strategy is bridging fandoms.

And that is really understanding, right? You guys were just talking about it before. There's so many different things happening within culture, right? Like rapid response, rapid response. Something's always trending, something's always so viral. And so when you're thinking about how niche fandoms have become, how can you as a brand bridge the interests of these fandoms together? The example that we have in our deck is the NFL

Game Day, Gladiator 2, the Megan the Stallion kind of connection where you're bridging fandoms to highlight a moment so many different moments that are happening. The first NFL kickoff game, Megan the Stallion hosting the VMAs, Pepsi just

become always known for highlighting like music and artists and spotlighting artists and then also Gladiator 2. So it's like being able to harness that. Not that's a really big example but it's really understanding that there are so many communities that exists out there and then trying to find ways of their connections.

For sure. And I think particularly with that strategy, as someone who's in the partner space, particularly on the partner marketing side, sometimes we hesitate to kind of cross-pollinate some of these partners. And there is an opportunity to do that when it makes sense in a brand moment or in a cultural moment where you can kind of bring all of your partners together and create something really beautiful. So I love that example because I do think that brands have kind of shied away from doing that in the past because there's, you know, red tape or whatever other reason. That was a big risk and I feel like it paid off for the brand based on the results that you shared. Yeah, it's just so fascinating to me because like if we were to sit here and we're

thinking like Megan the Stallion and the NFL. Yeah, right. And then like Gladiator too, we're like what? But shout out to those creative teams that like kind of had put all of that together to like really understand the the moment that it was happening but that's just one great example and and I'm sure that there are other examples of brands like doing like very like unhinged very like fandoms coming together I think there was like the I think we have an update example of like baby baby Bell cow saying RIP to Duolingo because do a logo by the way yeah so that that's like an example of like understanding what the conversation is but maybe that's more of keeping the conversation

going. And then the third strategy that we have is create culture to own. So, you know, this is really more of like, what are some centerpieces within IP that exists? And like, how can you tap into it as a brand? And a more updated example is for any Yellowstone watchers out there when Beth Dutton proposed to Rip Wheeler with a six pack of Coors, that was a really great integration. And how Coors really kind of took that piece of culture to own is that they made limited edition six packs with wedding bands so you could recreate the moment with yourself or your loved one and i'm like honestly i live i was like okay like this this is definitely owning a piece of culture um but yeah it was just you know those teams like they were able to generate so much buzz

around that and then being able to take it out from the show and then giving a retail presence so it's like kind of hitting culture in all different ways having a retail presence and having like those bands that you can buy and like the six pack and like the collectibles that's just like talking about culture from all sides and then our fourth and final strategies to keep the conversation going now this is more about like really really listening and honing in on what's happening within culture and what are people talking about and how can you add to it and so here it's all about like encouraging consumers like take part into something with the MasterCard and abracadabra dance contest and competition like encouraging people to not to extend the conversation

and to keep the conversation going well after Lady Gaga's music video aired and so that's our four strategies and yeah I feel like it's it's been super helpful with our case studies to showcase too yeah absolutely thank you for sharing that and I'm just kind of curious as a quick side tangent, you know, obviously you guys have tools and stuff to kind of measure what's happening in the marketplace and things that consumers are talking about. But how are you personally just kind of staying fresh on what's happening? I know as marketers, we always talk about being consumers first and being on the platforms and listening as to what's going on, but what does that kind of look like for you and how are you just kind of staying on top of that

in order to provide that creative and insights to the team as well? Yeah, that's a really great question and I feel like I'm showing my age now because I talk to just young people I talk to young people. No, we actually have a, we have a weekly meeting on our team and it's called the Insights Playbook where we come together and we just talk for 45 minutes about what we're seeing in culture on our social media feeds, headlines that have made us to go, huh. And we go in there and we talk and it's like people from different levels. of people in there and we're just chimp-chatting because I think the issue right like when you're looking at something within culture of like how to be able to tap into it or like is this going to go viral or is this actually is this just on my feed you have to check your bias there like we especially as algorithms get smarter and AI becomes more personal like you're like in this bubble you're on your social media bubble like you're you're hyper-targeted for things now right

like advanced advertising is here and nothing's a coincidence so it's It's being able to speak with other people, like, have you heard about this, you know, or like, or how can we connect something? Like, you're talking about Lubbubu's. I'm talking about line culture. Is this collectible culture? Is this, you know, the lipstick effect because of a potential recession that's about to happen? So it's really being able to sit with people and, like, chat with them about what you're seeing.

I think, one, it's fun for 45 minutes to break up your work day and be able to talk to people. But then, too, you're also checking to make sure that, like, your for you page isn't just because, you know, like you liked one picture of Pedro Pascal so like now your entire where you page is Pedro Pascal it's fantastic four it's all the other two movies he's about to be in you know it's it's like i'm like okay like picture Pascal's not having a moment right or is he like yeah it's it's it's also great to to not um to burst your bubble not be in an echo chamber and kind of encourage moving away from group think right because um yeah it's just it's just a great conversation that we have. I think as we kind of come into the last half of this conversation,

particularly around audience expectations, things are obviously changing so rapidly in the second half of this year. And I feel like a lot of the trends we heard about at Possible are already kind of at their tail end, which is crazy to think about. It's only been five months. How do you see audience expectations shifting, particularly around that sort of branded content through the end of this year? I personally think they're just they're going to want something more seamless. I think I believe it was sling TV that just said people who have like streaming fatigue can pay $5 to get like all like all cable like access for like a day or something. But I think especially when we're thinking about extending the entertainment, consumers are just getting smarter about like,

oh, I know this is a this is an ad versus like being important. impressed, right, of being like, oh my gosh, that was like such a seamless integration. And I think that's honestly, like, especially for me, like when I feel like, since we all work in like marketing and advertising, like we can kind of spot it more. But I feel like that the audience expectation is do you understand what what this show is about and how does your brand show up in that show, whether it's an integration or it's an actual commercial pod that that happens? And I feel like that's what it's going to honestly be like. It's going to be, we're talking about hyper-personalization, and it's very scary to talk about it, but having ads that are more catered to what the consumer is expecting and ties to IP. I've seen it, like, it's actually kind of wild, especially with how, you know, like how MasterCard

just gave an entire commercial pod for a whole music video. I'm like, so is that what advertising is going to turn into where it's like, oh my gosh, I know you want, you'd rather watch Siza sing Saturn. Rather than talk about reforestation efforts for whole three minutes. So I think that's where it's going to honestly go. I think they're much more savvy. They're going to expect to see brands that they know and understand are part of that conversation. But yeah, I think it's just going to be more seamless integrations.

Yeah, for sure. And then in terms of other trends you're seeing outside of that, are there trends that brands should be paying attention to coming from, you know, having a pulse on culture? I'm curious if there's any trends that are kind of catching your attention right now. Yeah, I mean, we've developed this one micro trend and shout out to Nicole in our team. She's like the trend queen. But underlying with the fact that people are obsessed with Lubu's, which is now, they're obsessed with moomins now, if you've heard of this. They're like, they're like, they're like, I think they're like, I don't want to say that they're Swedish.

I don't want to get it wrong, but it's a hippopotamus character. And people are like, oh, yeah, they are going. train but we're behind on that yeah and and they're obsessed and it's it's so interesting now that you know if we talk about a possible recession that what is it about collectible culture and i've i've had brands ask me like is like a like blind buying is like what what's that saying about customers and i think brands should really kind of inspect into like what that what that means because if we're talking about the lipstick effect about buying things that aren't super expensive but give small joys What does that mean for consumers as a whole?

Like are we just like really sad and like we just want to constantly buy small things? Like do you want to go on Amazon and buy like a $12 trinket and like come home be like, oh, I forgot I bought that to help push us into happiness? So that's like a really big thing as well. I think also in New York line culture is something that's had a huge resurgence. Before people were like waiting in line for a cronet and then people were like, I'm not waiting eight hours for a rainbow, uh, a rainbow bagel.

So is it this idea, right? When we're connecting it back with collectible culture, is there something there about exclusivity? Do you want that Hello Kitty rice cooker on Amazon? And why, as Gabby Windy from her podcast has said. She was just like, do I need that? I don't even cook rice, but it's just that it's exclusive. And so I feel like there's something there for brands to adopt

into their strategy of understanding the consumer of like they want something quick they want something fast they want something exclusive and you know when we're talking about like consumer goods it's just like that's something that's so low-hanging fruit you go into a Starbucks they've always had city mugs you know like you go to a Starbucks and you want to buy that mug because I went to New York City they have a Times Square one you know and it's like what is that saying about consumers and this collectible culture what is the new Beanie Baby? I'd like to know Yeah. It's so true.

I actually, we're based in Orlando, and Seoul de Janeiro, the beauty brand, did a pop-up at Disney Springs, and they actually had a vending machine. And so they had people queue in the line and actually pick a product from the vending machine. And so the whole experience was like coming up to the vending machine, picking your product, getting it delivered, opening it. And it was just a mini of either, you know, the bum-bum cream or the spray. But, like, I'm talking Q was four hours to get back in line. Like, it was crazy. But again, like a moment for them, right? They just popped up for one weekend.

They had this opportunity for people to get free product. And it worked. Yeah. Yeah. And it's interesting to me because you can just go into a Sephora and you can go by, like, a mini. Right. And then you don't even have to wait. Yeah, like, you don't even have to wait.

But it's really interesting now because it's curious. I feel like also people are like wanting to go out and like meet people and like understand like what's happening. I see Instagram accounts like dedicated to being like to lines like New York like, like I forget what the account is called, but it's like this girl just like looks at lines in New York and she just stands in it and she just makes friends with people who are in the line. And she's like, I don't even don't want this. But like I just want to talk to you about why you're standing in this line. But yeah, it's it's really interesting because I want to investigate it more, you know, of like why. like what is this exclusivity that people need you know I mean we used to think about like off white and supreme with the drops right and I feel like it's like 3.0 now

where people are like I want a luboo but then I also want to go to the tattoos parlor to give like my liboooo a tattoo and I'm like what is I want my lobooboo to have a lobooboo and I'm like what happening it's it's just everything it's also that I mean we've already kind of talked about it it's that social element too like People are so clued in like what is this person going to unbox like let me it's the anticipation and the buildup and then actually sharing what they're unboxing and then talking about it in the comments. It's this whole extension of this small simple story and product. Like it's so wild. Yeah. Yeah. And I also I forget who said it. So I want to say that's not my saying. But it was, oh, it was actually at possible. I think it was Zayyad. He's a good friend of Paramount. But he said something along the lines of. like comments are culture like comments are content now like so it's less about like what's your Instagram picture it's more about like what are people saying when you're scrolling down that's the first thing I do I'm like what's the pinned comment how many likes is it getting

and what are people saying are people roasting this person you know I'm like I want to know and it's more of like you know that Cardi B gift of her like at the basketball game like eating popcorn with her sunglasses on I'm like I'm eating this up and I want to see what people are talking about Because more often than not, some of those comments are like pointing to something else in culture. And I'm like an investigative journalist. You know, I'm like, I'm over here, like, being like, what is she talking about? What do you mean? So it's really just like, what's the conversation and like what are people like, yeah, it's, I'm eating a dead horse now at this point.

No, it's so true. It's so true, though, because like half the time, like I'll send her something and I'm like, first comment. Like, read the first comment. Like, it's more about commentary than it is the post itself because it's so funny in the way that people. are curating these conversations around a piece of content. It's just, it's wild. It's so fast. Yeah. The first thing I do now is like, I like click share on Instagram and I click a bunch of my friends who'll get it. I'm like, I don't even say anything. I just say comments. Yeah. Yes, literally same. Yeah. We're doing that back and forth all day. Yes. Absolutely. Oh my gosh.

So funny. I, we could talk about this all day. This has been absolutely fantastic. David. Thank you so much. We have to know, like, as we round out, of course, where can we stay in touch with you? Follow you. You have an amazing Instagram account, by the way. So please plug that. Yeah, where can we connect with you online? Yeah, you can connect with me on my LinkedIn at David Pendillion, but you can also follow my food review adventures and my love for the outdoors, even though I hate bugs. On Instagram, it's at David is here now. And then on TikTok, it's the NYC Food diaries so amazing amazing David thank you so much we very much appreciate you and just love

everything you and the team are doing so keep it up hopefully we see each other again soon at a conference yes yes absolutely absolutely thank you so much you of course thank you guys