Marketing Happy Hour - How Social Media is Redefining PR and Brand Credibility | Casey Madsen of VaynerX

Starting point is 00:00:00 57% of people said that local news was their most trusted source. I thought that was really interesting because we know it's like social first and all these emerging platforms, but people are still seeing their local news as that source of truth. And I think it's like that credibility that has just been built up over time. Welcome to Marketing Happy Hour, a weekly podcast helping marketing professionals build better strategies and hit career goals. I'm Cassie, consultant and your host through these unfiltered combos with your peers. Grab your favorite drink and get ready for practical insights to support your journey in marketing.

Starting point is 00:00:38 Today, Ali and I are very excited to be joined by Casey Madsen of Vayner X. Casey, welcome to the show. So excited to have you. Thank you. So excited to be chatting with you both. Of course. You've been around behind the scenes of some episodes. So excited to finally have you on the mic today, joining us for a conversation.

Starting point is 00:00:59 conversation. We've absolutely loved getting to know your team. We were out with you guys at possible back in April and got to have lunch with you. And Rachel in New York as well and just love the collaboration that we've sparked here and stoked to dive into this report that we have today. But first, Casey, have to ask you, what has been in your glass lately? I love it. So I'm at the office today. So I just have my like giant water bottle. But you know, it's fall. So I've really been. loving apple cider and my trick is to mix a little sparkling water to make it like a little apple cider spritz like a little fun dinner drink oh i love that that's so fun i'm definitely doing that this week yeah can we do that tonight cast wait low key no casey alie and i are going to carve pumpkins tonight like we're recording this right before they're Halloween and so we may have to do that thank you yeah it's a perfect dream for carving pumpkins oh my gosh i can't wait to try that. Well, again, I would love for you, before we kind of dive in here, Casey, tell us a little

Starting point is 00:02:05 bit about this report, first and foremost, that you guys have put together, and then would love to know for you personally, is there a specific data point or finding that you found the most surprising or interesting? Yeah, sure. So at Vayner X, we started offering PR for our clients last year, and you may know at Vayner, our philosophy is really rooted in social at the center, finding that underpriced attention, meeting people where they are. And so we translate that to our philosophy with PR as well. So really building our PR strategies around a social at the center philosophy too. Because we know, well, we had a hypothesis, right, that people were getting their news on social first. And so we wanted to collect the data to really get behind that hypothesis and

Starting point is 00:02:53 really sort of supercharge and inform the work that we're doing. So we tapped our partners at Muckrack and at Ipsos to survey consumers, and we really found that our hypothesis was right, so I think we'll dig into that a little bit later, but a good majority of people. It's young adults, but it's like really a range of adults. The majority are getting their news on social first, and so really we're seeing more and more brands understanding that and leaning into it more, but we think it's just so important, especially in PR, and in brand building to ensure that you're incorporating that into strategies. And so it's funny being like so deeply ingrained in it every day. I was really thinking about what was the most surprising. And I feel like nothing honestly

Starting point is 00:03:37 was like too, too surprising for somebody who's like in this doing the work every day. But one thing I thought that was super interesting is 57% of people said that local news was their most trusted source. And to me, I thought that was really interesting because like we know it's like social first and all these emerging platforms and social first voices but people are still seeing their local news as sort of like you know that source of truth and i think it's like that credibility that has just been built up over time right especially even as like millennials and gen z sort of like moves into their adulthood where they might be paying attention to the news more we grew up turning on the local news at six o'clock you know we grew up even on facebook seeing our local stations at

Starting point is 00:04:26 as like something that we trust. So I thought that was really interesting and even validated by our work with our client removery, who has local studios all over the states and then globally as well. But any time that we would get a local press hit, it would drive really strong anecdotal impact of like driving people in the door of their studios.

Starting point is 00:04:50 Like pretty much every time we would land a local story, we would hear from the studio like someone would come in and say, I saw the story. I decided to book my appointment, you know, so I think like, and with PR, that anecdotal impact is like, we love to hear and see that. So that was like awesome for us. But I think a key learning there for Combs folks and brand leaders is like don't shy away from a local or regional strategy in addition to your national or more broader communications work. Yeah, I think that's a huge takeaway point. Just hearing you speak about it as well. And one of the, one of the stats that I think

Starting point is 00:05:26 stood out to us, particularly, is that 85% of young adults get their news from social, but only 5% actually completely trust what they're consuming. And so there's an interesting kind of mix there where you're like, how do I activate these local partners to get, you know, our messaging out in a bigger and more impactful way? What do you think this means for brands that are really trying to build that credibility in a space that's dominated by the algorithms and the short form content all at all. Yeah, so we see it that integration is more important than ever in terms of merging owned and earned, right? So it's like we know that those credibility pillars, those earned stories are still holding weight for consumers, but we just need to get it in front of them

Starting point is 00:06:11 on social. So yeah, we really see it as like strategies should be comprehensive. You should be working like cross-functionally with your social teams as well to ensure that it's working in tandem together. Yeah, absolutely. So, I mean, diving into that just a little bit more. So how should, if you were to take this finding and tell teams out there, marketing teams, how to develop a content strategy around this finding and how they should be approaching this from a consumer standpoint, what would you say to that? Just kind of, again, blending and rethinking, earned media with that social storytelling and that overlap there. We really see it as a two-way street in terms of like tapping these new social channels for to drive your comm strategy so the first

Starting point is 00:06:59 way is thinking of social as your new sort of like news desk or press secretary right it's like it's a big place of inspiration for topics for you so that could be trending conversations cultural conversations it could be pain points that people are talking about with your product or brand and then that's that's you know a direct insight into what people are thinking and then you can use that to really enter those conversations whether that inspires like larger campaigns whether it inspires simple like commentary pitches or commentary type of stories that you can go to journalists with to ensure that you're you know joining those conversations and getting your brand narratives included um we also see it on the back end too where you want to make sure that the social first component is embedded in your strategy from

Starting point is 00:07:48 the beginning, right? So, I mean, I think about it through a PR lens, but it's always like what is the, maybe what's the visual component of this story? How can we go to, we call them like modern PR targets. So that's like social first accounts or substack accounts or maybe journalists that are publishing their own content on social now. Like how can we target them and what's making this unique and right for their platforms? And then it's at the end as well. So, you know, it's great when you secure that story, but it needs to get in front of the audience on social. So we encourage our clients to then go ahead and post any, you know, earn coverage that they love that they're excited about on their social channels in platform native ways, right? So we want it to, maybe it looks like what it looks like when the news is posting headlines.

Starting point is 00:08:37 We do a lot of green screens that you'll see, these quote cards, like things like that, but to really make sure that you're getting it in front of your audience in a digestible way. And I have another, like, really good example with our client Removerry. They've been, you know, one of my biggest projects over the last year, but it was really, really interesting. There was this insight popping off on social. It was about, and Removery is a tattoo removal company. So it was about people were removing their tattoos before their weddings.

Starting point is 00:09:05 It was a huge conversation, like brides, you know, were removing their tattoos. So our team was able to flag that insight. Removary made organic content around it. It was like a simple video. It was like POV, you're a 2025 bride over a video of a tattoo removal. It ended up going viral, like super viral and billions of views. And it resulted in additional press coverage around it from big publications, Newsweek, New York Post,

Starting point is 00:09:33 who now have writers that are writing about internet trends, viral conversations and things like that. So that was a huge win. And then we were able to amplify those stories again on their own channels to make sure we're hitting those credibility markers in front of their audience again. So it's not just coming from them. We're getting that third party validation and we're getting it in front of their audience. That's incredible. I'm curious because you obviously have lots of clients that you're working with day in and day out for things like this. What are some tips that you can share with our audience about how to be a really good strong cross-functional partner? Yeah, I think it's, you know,

Starting point is 00:10:07 thinking outside the box, really being willing to kind of like flex your skill sets, tap in different team members. And on our teams, we have a lot of creators. that work with us directly. So I think, yeah, really being able to, like, think outside the box and think innovatively and say, like, these traditional strategies work, but how can we really, like, bring something new into this or bring in a new platform or, you know, and I mean, at Vayner, too, it's really helpful to us, like having teams across the board, because then we can kind of tap into our different resources where it's like, is there an influencer

Starting point is 00:10:42 play here, you know, is there a sports play? that we want to bring in or, yeah, is it organic social that we need help from our creatives on? So I think definitely keeping an open mind and agility is huge in today's landscape. Yeah, I was going to say just moving so quickly and having to connect the dots with your various clients in their respective industries, right? Because they're all so different and require such a nuanced approach to how you're actually communicating with the end user. I think that's fascinating. Thank you for sharing. That's really, really great advice. Pivoting back to just the brand side of things, you know, only from this report, only 29% of brand leaders

Starting point is 00:11:22 say that their voice is consistently authentic. So why do you think that consistency is so hard to maintain for these brands? And what advice would you give to brands trying to close that gap? Yeah. So at Vayner, we've been advocates for social first for a long time. But I think historically, it's been a pretty under-resourced component of marketing strategies, right? Like, it's been seen as an add-on. The teams are always small. Maybe it's one person doing everything that's doing strategy and content creation and posting and everything else. And so I think that's been definitely a major challenge. Like we, I think people, they're coming into the modern century now, right? We're seeing more and more brands because I think we're seeing it work, right? So

Starting point is 00:12:05 now we're seeing the proof points of brands that are really growing on social. But we just continue to encourage brands of all sizes to invest more into organic social. That's where the attention is now. I think another thing, though, too, is, you know, posted is better than perfection. And I think especially with social, a lot of like brand leaders, we get caught up with wanting everything to feel perfect. And I think the reality of social today is that's just not, that's not what consumers want. That's not what feels authentic to them. So it really is about, you know, of course, like within reason, you want to be hitting your messages and you want to be staying on those tracks and posting valuable things. But to really maintain that authentic voice, there should be lo-fi content.

Starting point is 00:12:51 There should be content that's really platform-native, that's speaking to your consumers. You know, and we know, like, they're not fooled by polish anymore in the age of AI. So it's really just posted is better than perfection. Just start posting, post consistently, and dedicate resources to it. Yeah. I'm curious too on that, Casey. Like I feel like that is becoming more of a notion where teams are getting a little bit more comfortable with trying and testing different things and just kind of posting and seeing what happens with something. But there's still, whether it's a pushback from leadership or the creatives and social media managers themselves are hesitant to present these new and different ideas and to actually get buy in from them. So do you have any tips for not only presenting ideas, but being confident in your own? concepts in order to hopefully instill confidence and leaders signing off on this stuff. I'm just curious what you would kind of say to that too. Yeah, I think, you know, being in the platforms and being able to find examples where it has worked for other brands is great.

Starting point is 00:13:56 We have some different strategies that we deploy across the board through some of our other creative teams. Like one, for example, is something we call handle strategy where it's like, you know, maybe if you want your brand's, you know, like actual handle grid to look perfect and polished, we can understand that, but you can make something kind of adjacent to it that's like, you know, daily handbags or something like that. And then you still are infiltrating feeds with your brand, but it's just not, you know, under the direct brand handle. So that's like one way to kind of like sneak around it, but still be able to build up views. and attention, and then maybe by proving it through there, they'll be more willing to do it on the

Starting point is 00:14:41 official handles. Yeah. And then the other question, kind of piggybacking off of that is we talked a little bit about social listening and just paying attention to what are consumers talking about and asking. And, you know, obviously for smaller teams that have maybe less access to these large tools and things that we can use for this, do you have any recommendations for strategies to get started on social listening, even if it's just manual process of like going through and checking what people are saying around your keywords or setting up Google alerts, is there anything that we can start doing just in terms of social listening to stay on top of those conversations? And the reason I'm asking is because I think, in my opinion, that is

Starting point is 00:15:22 important to have some of that backing too, right? When presenting new ideas is saying, hey, these are what consumers are asking about and these are the things that people want to see. So just curious about social listening to a hundred percent i mean i'm still i always joke i'm like change averse millennial i like totally get it now but i i still think this is me i'm sure you guys can really um but i i still think like reading the news every day is so valuable right if you work in social flipping through the apps every day is valuable but there are definitely ways that you can become more efficient at it um our team has been exploring using AI in different ways to like scan headlines or conversations and give us like a

Starting point is 00:16:08 recap in the mornings to just point us in the right direction. I've heard of some team members creating Finstas and then curating their algorithm to be about a specific topic. So if you have a broad client list, that might not work. But if you, you know, work at a brand or if you work on one or two, you might be able to do that. And then you can kind of stay more on top of those specific category conversations. But yeah, I know it's like we're inundated with content every day, but I think it's really just dedicating the time to it and then using tools where you can to gain some efficiency. Being a consumer first, I think is kind of important, right? And I think that's why too, I know it doesn't always work out this way, but being a fan of the brand that you

Starting point is 00:16:51 work for first and foremost in the industry that you work in or industries if you work with multiple clients and just if that's a natural thing to consume content similar to what audience you would be targeting in work. That's kind of nice too, but I love the Finsta idea. That's such a great concept. I know. I thought it was really smart. Yeah. We had a we had a marketing happy hour guest on a few weeks ago, a woman named Betty Enfiyakov who works in the influencer industry. She actually mentioned that like her as a as a entrepreneur and her as an owner of her own company has actually hired a Gen Z kind of consultant that helps with social listening to scan client pages and things like that. I mean, it's incredible. They kind of keep her up on trends and things like that. And I just

Starting point is 00:17:37 thought that was an interesting idea, you know, similar to obviously having a Finsta and something else to kind of just, you know, have as a in your back pocket. But we're trying anything and everything these days. Yes, exactly. Yes, we are. So Casey, I mean, you've kind of already alluded to some of this too, but as PR does become a lot more integrated with marketing and influencer strategy and social, etc. What new skills and or mindsets do communicators do you think need to have an order to succeed in 2026 and beyond? Yeah, and this is a good one too, and it was something that we uncovered in our research is that people, a person I already trust agrees with something was an emotional trust signal for consumers. So I think number one was

Starting point is 00:18:27 like my gut, it aligns with my gut instinct, and then number two with someone I already trust is saying this. And so, you know, through a PR lens, it's really interesting when it comes to creators and just like the entire creator economy as a whole, because we're seeing like creators, yeah, become this new cohort of just influential people that people are really listening to they really trust them so I think you know for brand people for comms people they they really become an important channel they already have but they continue to become more important looking to 2026 and beyond and I think it's like those traditional tactics are still working right like gifting branded

Starting point is 00:19:11 content that's still all going to work but I think we'll continue to think outside the box like through a PR lens is there like an edit editorial angle, you know, like for example, with tattoo removal, is there, like, we work with creators a lot there. And so it's like, does it make sense for us to work with them to place a feature story? And then that kind of boosts that credibility even more. We're also seeing really interesting events are coming back more and more, the return of experiential. So I think there'll be something really interesting to come with kind of creators and then bringing them IRL to some of these events. events because people really have affinity towards their favorite creators. So I think that's just sort of like another way in for brands. And I think just connecting them with the consumer, right, and not having it be closed off to them, I think is a really interesting concept. And I think perhaps in the past, you know, brands have shied away from doing that out of fear of, you know, overwhelming amounts of crowds and things like that. But I do see it happening.

Starting point is 00:20:13 And it's a great point. It's exciting to see that that is kind of where we're shifting. Or young communicators or brand strategists that are early on in their career and listening to this episode, what's the advice that you'd give them for building a career in this new sort of earned attention landscape? I think my biggest advice is practice what you preach. So, yeah, we're all marketers. We are all in the weeds every day. Beyond the platforms, like we talked about. So as a consumer, yes, scrolling, consuming, but also create yourself. And I know that can be tricky for those of us behind the scenes.

Starting point is 00:20:50 At Vayner, we say everybody's a creator, which I love, and I have tried to do myself. And even just like my own personal experience, I hear all the time from people like, I see your content, you crush it at content. You know, and it's led to new connections for me as well. So I know it can be scary, but if you're not already creating content, that's my biggest tip. Go out and do it. First of all, it builds your personal brand. And then it also shows cases your understanding of what you're doing, right? It's like the proof point is right there. You're demonstrating that you understand what you're talking about. Yeah. So get in there. Start posting. Yeah. And I know it's sometimes easier said than done, right? So I'm curious if you

Starting point is 00:21:36 have any advice around just like getting started or again, confidence is a big piece, right? But I even saw a metric from Kelly Gordon at Creative People, a creative marketing recruiting firm. And And she said that a lot of brands now hiring are asking for, you know, links to social channels and to see if that person applying for a role creates content themselves and is kind of like essentially a personality because to your point, it's practicing what you preach. They're able to see firsthand how someone thinks about content and is developing it themselves. So I think it's a really good practice, to your point, get out there, build your personal brand but also it's a really good portfolio builder almost too for looking for jobs and kind of

Starting point is 00:22:19 showcasing the work that you've done i think yeah it really can only help you in this field if you can showcase yourself through that way through what you're doing for your clients and it is definitely hard what i usually do is like i mean i'm a ticot doom scroller but if i see like a fun format that i like i mean i don't i really don't have any formal strategy but if i see a format i kind of like will be inspired to think about, and I'm talking I mostly post on, like, LinkedIn, but turning, like, the TikTok formats into LinkedIn posts have done really well, you know, and it can be, like, silly things, like, POV, XYZ. There was one, it was, like, some dramatic music that I used, like, I'm going to can lines for the first time. What tips do you have? Like, one of those, like, silly trends. And I think,

Starting point is 00:23:07 yeah, it just brings a little, like, fun into the work, too. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, don't be afraid to experiment, right? And people are not going to be as critical about what you're posting as you are of yourself. So I think I try to remind people that all the time. Like, don't be afraid just to share whatever feels right to you and is authentic to you. And you'll learn over time. And with consistency, too, I think that confidence builds and you get more comfortable doing it. So 100%. Love it. Yes. Well, Casey, this has been absolutely wonderful. Of course, we'll have all of the links below to the report to your channels at VaynerX, but just give us a little bit of a snapshot and highlight of where we can find all this awesome information and just learn more about

Starting point is 00:23:50 what you guys do, but also the report itself. Love it. Yes, you can always find us at vaynerx.com, but I would really recommend following Vayner across social. Our channels are really fun. So we're on LinkedIn, Instagram, TikTok, VaynerX, VaynerMedia. Yeah, follow us and follow along there. Amazing. Casey, thank you so much for joining us. And you guys will be around often over here. So definitely stay tuned for more from Casey and the VaynerX team.

Starting point is 00:24:19 Thank you again for joining us. Thank you. Thanks, Casey. Thank you so much for tuning in to this week's episode. If you enjoyed this conversation, I would love your feedback. And if you're ready to take things to the next level, sign up for my weekly newsletter in the show notes. You'll get weekly career and marketing insights. straight to your inbox. And if you have an idea for a future Marketing Happy Hour episode,

Starting point is 00:24:43 shoot me an email. Hello at Marketing HappyHR.com. Thank you again and I'll see you next Thursday.

Marketing Happy Hour - How Social Media is Redefining PR and Brand Credibility | Casey Madsen of VaynerX

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