Marketing Happy Hour - Should You Hire a Creative Agency? | Jesse Green of Handcar

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey, Jesse, how are you? I'm doing good. Good morning. How are you guys? We're doing so well. I'm so excited to have you on the show today. You know, we've been connected over social media for quite some time, and I'm a big fan of what you're doing with Hand Car. So excited to hear a little more about that journey. But before we get started, I do have an important question that we ask all of our guests, and that is, what is in your glass this afternoon? I've been waiting for this all month.

Starting point is 00:00:30 I am, well, it's still, you know, it's still morning hours here right now. So I've got in my ember mug, keeping it hot, which is great. I've got some Madcap coffee, a longtime client of ours, still friends, daily stop of my usual morning, make it to the office. And then I'm double fisting water, which is usually my move. But after hours, if we were doing this, usually some type of spicy marg or cocktail of some sort is the move. Oh my gosh, that is so awesome. And madcap is actually like the reason that I got into coffee in the first place. I remember I went to school for a couple years at Grand Valley over in Grand Rapids, and the madcap was born and originated there. And

Starting point is 00:01:17 that's the first coffee I ever tried outside of Starbucks. And I like fell in love with, you know, how amazing just like regular local coffee can be. Um, so it's always so sweet to hear when somebody is sipping on that, but Cassie, what do you have? Yeah, I've heard such great things about that shop. I definitely need to go try it. Um, but this morning I actually have a recess it's peach ginger and recesses such a great brand. I'm a huge fan, but filled with just amazing adaptogens, which helps me feel calm and collected throughout the day. So that's what I have today. Yes. Yes. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Erica, what about you?

Starting point is 00:02:00 I just have some boring coffee this morning. I was going to grab an Olipop because I wanted to make a root beer float with're so excited to learn from you today. But before we dive into your tips and tricks and everything you've learned along the way, do you mind sharing us a little bit about your background and how hand car came to be? Yeah, for sure. Yeah, it's a kind of a weird winding road of getting the hand car. I was professional photographer for like 13 years, um, started like kind of a really weird journey in that I started super young. So, um, I took on my first clients when I was 16 and I was full-time in that by the time I was 17. So, um, working for myself is all I ever did.

Starting point is 00:02:58 Um, and it's all I've ever known. And it's that, you know, made things harder in some ways and easier and others. Um, my wife and I have been together that entire span of time too. So I definitely like dodged the bullet of like the unknown of being married and being self-employed. And like, it was kind of just like, that is what our life is. And that's, you know, all of that. Had a couple other businesses along the way, had a photo booth company that I started and was acquired later by a competitor had a web design business with a partner did airbnbs for a long time my wife's interior designer so we kind of collaborated on that but photography was kind of always the mainstay in that but where hand car came from was a bit of an accident that turned into something now that

Starting point is 00:03:43 four years later we're still cranking on but had a client that was a photography client of mine I was doing some social and content work for a local boutique hotel here in Detroit for a couple years I was shooting content or doing campaigns for Chaco Footwear the sandal brand everybody knows and loves. And client slash friend that was their brand manager at the time kind of came to me and was like, hey, this was this was about two or three weeks prior to Christmas came to me and said, Hey, I just fired my social guy. And you know, obviously, it's the holidays. You know, I, you seem like you know what you're doing over there with that hotel do you think you could come like save us for a month or two as we like get through the holidays like

Starting point is 00:04:30 you know find on board somebody all of that and my answer was like yeah on paper yes i i would be able to step in and do that i was like but i am also one human being i have a full-time job that was someone's full-time job like when would you me, when would you like me to do that basically? Um, and ended up bringing on a good friend of mine, um, to basically like he quit his job, joined me in it. And the idea was just like, Hey, I don't need this money. This was kind of a surprise gig. Like it's three months worth of work for six months worth of money. Do want to like see if we can turn this into something basically um and basically like three or four weeks into the gig they just called off the search for an internal person and just said we're just going to keep the contract with you guys um and it was really just like

Starting point is 00:05:19 again i was like i was living off of my photography income, but it was a exercise in like, if you put your heads down on one brand and like, I mean, it was just both of us like spending 40 to 60 hours a week, just like living, breathing Chaco. We would like, you know, we do all the social strategy during the day. And then we would both be in our like respective beds at home at night and like texting each other and being like, all right, man, like you start at the bottom of the DMS, I'll start at the top and we'll meet in the like clearing out the inbox each night

Starting point is 00:05:48 um and it just moved fast from there um it was like that was 2019 going into 2020 so that was like covid time um and the crazy thing that happened was is like that was our only client it was just living and breathing choco and covid hit and they ended up having to furlough like the majority of their staff like a lot of companies did so their marketing team went from like 12 down to two and we somehow survived that cut um and we became everything so we became at that point we became graphic designers marketers strategists um we filmed a you couldn't do any like photo or video shoots so we did they were launching a new kid's sandal and we used my kids and my nieces in my backyard to film a full national like ad campaign to launch the sandals because you couldn't do anywhere they literally shipped me a

Starting point is 00:06:39 kiddie pool to pull that off um but anyway long story short fast forward um we didn't have even a name on the business until like eight months into it it was just like two dudes working on chaco um then we finally got a couple other clients put a name on it moved into the garage that i bought which is where the name came from because it was a former hand car wash garage um and then it just kind of started started rolling from there and uh now we're you know four years and some change in and team of nine and you know figuring out a day at a time but I it's it's always just the funniest story because I did I was not dreaming of getting into this business I had dreams of someday having other people around me and not just being a solo kind of preneur like I

Starting point is 00:07:23 was for all of my career. But this exact like orientation was not in the plans. It was it was a mixture of opportunity and my, you know, the classic entrepreneur's inability to say no to anything. Absolutely. Yeah, we're talking to more and more people recently who have just become accidental entrepreneurs. And I feel like going through the pandemic was kind of that catalyst that pushed people into that direction.

Starting point is 00:07:50 But I'm sure too, with, with some of these clients that stuck around during that time, I, I, I can imagine that your adaptability and being able to just make it work throughout that time spoke volumes to them. And I think that's a lesson that we can learn too in the corporate space as well, just as professionals of how to be flexible, how to stay nimble, no matter what challenges and things come our way. But would love to hear a little bit more about the projects and some of the different brands. You mentioned Madcap and Chaco and doing all of these different things like graphic design and strategy. But today, what does that structure of the agency look like? What are you guys working on and who are you working with right now? Yeah. Um, yeah, so we're, I mean, at our core, we're a creative agency. Um,

Starting point is 00:08:37 we definitely like very much started in the social space. Um, we're still, that's still a big cornerstone of what we do, but we're also doing bigger brand strategy now kind of across the board not just on social um our kind of like unique differentiator has always been that we paired social strategy for mainly cpg brands um with the content that supports it basically so we've always had a creative team in house that's obviously always been like near and dear to me with my background. So that was kind of always our differentiators. Like we essentially built these packages for these CBD brands where we were

Starting point is 00:09:14 taking social completely off their plate. You know, we were managing it. We were doing community management. We were doing, you know, content, calendar planning, all of that stuff. But we were pairing that with monthly or quarterly like actual asset deliverables um and that was actually like a lesson i learned from back when i was a wedding photographer like i said for 13 years i for probably 10 years of that i only had one package it was like it was a it was a take it or leave it type of deal but i had like my you know pitch to people when i was working with

Starting point is 00:09:45 them was always like i've built this package to be exactly what i need to do exactly the type of job i want to do on your wedding day it was like it was the right amount of hours i needed to pull it off it was the you know the digital files it was the like and and so i kind of took some of that learning into this when we built out our package for social clients was like selfishly these are the pieces that need to come together for us to do a good job running your social I'm not super concerned with you know in that space specifically in social I'm not super concerned with what you need from like a deliverable standpoint like you are trusting us to take on your social you're trusting our expertise this is like very much a collaboration a partnership especially with social it's just a constant back and forth but as far as like what we need to pull it off in the way that we know from our expertise to

Starting point is 00:10:32 pull it off like i need x number of photo deliverables that i don't want to count on you to get that you know from especially in an age of low budgets and you know longer lead times and creating content and assets i need excellent number of design hours that our internal designer is doing and i'm not bothering your designer with it and waiting for it in their queue um and then as time goes on you know time went on and things changed and reels and tiktok came into play like it was like okay and i need x number of short form videos that are produced by our team and aren't worried about who you're talking to on the side and all of that stuff, all that stuff can like hedge into our overall strategy. But like, I built this, you know, we built this thing to like hedge our bets against

Starting point is 00:11:13 not running into any walls that like, they're going to, you know, ultimately screw us by not having their pieces in place. So to get back to your original question um you know we work with mainly cpg product-based brands um to create kind of a holistic digital organic strategy we don't do anything on the paid side we've always been focused just specifically in organic um but our big calling card especially on social is like it's always goes back to storytelling and again that comes back to my wedding photography career too is like it was always about story and I think that's you know a missing link from a lot of brands and I think people are starting to wake up to that a lot more but I mean that's that's in our pitch with clients all the time

Starting point is 00:12:02 it's like it's it's about like, we're going to elevate aesthetics. We're going to make, you know, everything come up to par with where we believe you need to be. But like, we're also going to be looking for all of those little red threads to pull on of where are these consumer moments? How can we, you know, not just say hello to this person and, you know, commend them for buying the product, but like, what else is there? What else are they, you know, pull on that a little bit more.

Starting point is 00:12:29 And that's why, again, going back to that to that like package we like built that in a way that like we are set up for success to do that um and we you know community management is like the biggest way we get there um because that's just like that's the front lines um that's the you know we are making sure we're tapping in with every consumer and giving them a great experience. Like the bar is just so unbelievably low to make a consumer feel heard and excited. And we got to learn that firsthand with Chaco that just has like such a fanatical fan base, which was like obviously just a really fun account to manage because anybody that has them and has worn them for 20 years and worn them all around the world is like fanatical so we got to learn that not every brand is like that but like community management has become such a like hallmark to what we do

Starting point is 00:13:14 because that's where we find those stories that's where we pull that from because like we're in there we're seeing what's happening the brand has no idea what's you know happening in their dms and what their consumers are actually doing but that's like that's our closest way to see that, feel that, and then go back to the brand and be like, hey, this person's doing this. This feels really exciting. Can we build something around that? Can we get a little budget to shoot a video around that or do something? So that's what gets us excited.

Starting point is 00:13:40 And then that's just, long story short short has expanded into a lot of other service offerings, like go to market campaigns and brand strategy and, you know, just ad hoc content and photo video design work. So very cool. And you kind of have a hand in all of it, but you root it back within that story piece. And I think that's so just important for people to, you know, extract out of their brand. I'm curious to hear just from your perspective, maybe an example from the past or, or like a hypothetical example of if somebody doesn't know where to start with pulling a story out of their brand, what would you say to them? I think it, I mean, it goes, I was, I was thinking about this kind of ahead of this conversation and like one of the like words i've come back to a lot is like there's probably a better word for this but like taste i

Starting point is 00:14:34 think like it's having somebody in the right seat that has taste and like vision to pull from that because i think you can toss anyone in the DMs and they're not gonna see that vision beyond just like oh this is a person saying hey I'm wearing your shoes I'm very excited about them um but I think having somebody that's like in that seat correctly is really important um and so I think like I think it's just being conversational. It's being human. Um, you know, making, making marketing as human as possible is where that kind of magic lies. Um, and I think that's how we found it. Like we, one of my favorite stories with, with Chaco that I've told a million and a half times in my team, you know, it's very tired of hearing, um, was like

Starting point is 00:15:23 back during those pandemic times, we had, it was an exact example of this of like a girl that you know we were seeing in the dms all the time we're like why is this girl like mentioning us in her stories every single day it's like why you know where where what is what is the deal um come to find out you know like i said pulled on that red thread a little bit more she was doing a self-inflicted urine chocos post she was posting every single day her different outfits and her like nine pairs of chacos she owned and you know this was just something she decided to do as like a new year resolution and like obviously you can jump on board with that you could do something cool you could drop her a pair of shoes in the mail like whatever like there's very easy ways to like and low-cost

Starting point is 00:16:01 ways to like tap in on that make somebody just feel valued beyond what we were already doing of just like saying what's up every time she you know did it um but we you know thought a little deeper on that and and we said like okay like you know we're in this very weird time we'd already started to like mess around a little bit during that time with like how can we elevate even like zoom interviews and we started doing a lot of stuff with that where we were like interviewing consumers but like turning that into like actual consumer facing like brand piece to like match with that weird you know phase of time so we'd already kind of mess with like what that formula looked like um but choco is this really incredible thing in that they have a factory in

Starting point is 00:16:40 rockford where their headquarters is um that they do all of their custom sandals they do like short run like limited run sandals there and then they also do all their repairs there it's this like incredible facility there's not it wasn't enough storytelling around it at the time and it's like made in the USA in that you know portion of what they do which is really great so just like a lot of really cool levers to pull on with that but with this girl we we're like okay cool like we want to tell this story she's this like fanatic she loves them she has so many pairs so we actually like set up a zoom interview with her we were like hey we just want to talk to you more about like what you're

Starting point is 00:17:12 doing it's really cool turns out we like surprised her and we actually sent me and another guy just single camera went out to the factory and that was where we took her interview from and we kind of surprised her and we're like hey you know katie great to meet you blah blah blah like oh by the way we're at the chaco factory right now and like we're gonna let you build a custom pair of sandals over zoom right this second um and we're just like filming that from the background and we're literally walking her down the factory line being like okay what color buckle do you want what color strap do you want and then like you know final like kicker and that was like hey we actually already like pre-designed a custom printed back heel strap that says you're in chacos do you want? And then like, you know, final like kicker. And that was like, Hey, we actually already like pre-designed a custom printed back heel strap that says you're in Chacos. Do you want to put that on there? And she's like,

Starting point is 00:17:50 yeah, you know, that kind of thing. But, but she, I mean, just beaming in this like zoom interview, just like could not break the smile off of her face. Walked her through sandals got made literally right in front of her on us, just like walking a computer down and it was like again like during 2020 when like consumer consumer and just like human touch points were so hard to come by um so like to see you know the factory workers excited about it her excited about it like and then to like drop those sandals in the mail right after

Starting point is 00:18:22 that and then you know get the earned media of like her sharing about that we got to turn it into like a two or three minute like long form you know video that got really great interaction um and it was like the cost of it was you know our gas to drive to the west side of the state and some shoes from their fact you know like from the brand standpoint other than like you know the production costs like this was nothing and it was just because we were in there seeing this otherwise she would have just slipped through the cracks you know even with an internal you know person on social you just can't do it all and we like we just had the wherewithal to like look beyond that be like there's there's something else here we can like pull on this in a pretty nimble way that

Starting point is 00:19:03 isn't gonna break the bank but it's gonna like get some buy-in from this consumer for an even longer period of time. That's so brilliant. And I'm sitting over here and this might be really nerdy of me, but I got chills when you were like, yeah, and we surprised her and walked her through the factory. I was like, that's such a great connection point. And I think people really identify with that. And even if it, you know, it's not something that directly touches them, they're like compassionate for this person who got this amazing experience with the brand and they can kind of identify with that and say, okay, this brand really cares about its consumer. And that's an amazing story to bring to life. Something that we don't really talk a lot about, but it goes kind of hand in hand with

Starting point is 00:19:45 storytelling is elevating your brand through design and excellent design. That's something your team is, you know, phenomenal at. I'm just curious to hear from your side, how important is design and crafting, you know, scroll stopping content? Could you kind of share your perspective on why design work is key in creating content that elevates your brand? Yeah, I think it's huge. Cause like we have, like, I guess just to give you a quick like breakdown of our creative team, we're super small, obviously, but it's like, I, you know, serve as creative director slash CEO. Now we have our social and strategy team is kind of on one side and then we have our creative team on the other side creative team right now has me we have a short form you know lead uh photographer uh senior photographer retoucher

Starting point is 00:20:31 and then our graphic designer um and the great thing is like we're all here we're all local we're all like in our studio together quite a bit so there's a lot of like past back and forth of even like you know photo assets getting elevated with design video assets getting elevated with like kind of there's just a lot of crossover there um but design has been so design specifically has been so important to us from the beginning and christina our designer is just like a freaking rock star and has been here since basically like a year and a half into this thing um and she is just so good at taking the like existing brand sandbox that they give us right because we don't have you know total control we can't do whatever we want brands already have you know kind of these walls set up or they work with

Starting point is 00:21:18 us to you know finish finish setting up the walls and that's what we always say is like give us the sandbox that we get to play in and then we'll just we'll let it rip from there um she is so excellent at that like production design aspect of that of like okay you know the you know one of our new clients we're working on this year is an outdoor brand called rumple that makes these really awesome uh blankets uh sacks that pack into like a camp sack for like van life uh you know they're waterproof they're incredible but like you know we're we're only like two months into working with them and like already just spitting out these beautiful things that are based on a new direction they want to go this year um so design is just huge and i think like that goes back to even from

Starting point is 00:22:00 a social strategy standpoint it goes back to like having a versatile mix too because it's like yes you know reels perform best right now but like that's not number one it's not like viable that that's the only thing you're putting out because you just can't like produce that much video that like only that's going out but number two it's just like holistically doesn't feel good that that's you know if that's all you're you're spitting out so like design is huge for us we do a lot of like um you know informational carousels that like just feel elevated to the brand and fit in really well with what else they're building to like tell stories in a way that isn't just a caption um we do a lot of you know part of our initial like onboarding functionality is just like bringing all the design up to kind of standard too so we're a lot of times in like one fell swoop we're like making sure you know all

Starting point is 00:22:50 profile pictures are oriented oriented you know cover photos uh instagram highlight icons like we're going through and kind of like auditing all of that off rip and then letting a lot of that inform kind of what we do from a storytelling standpoint going beyond that um i think one of the best examples of like accounts that we run that we do that on is uh cat footwear is is um who is owned by the same parent company as chaco we've done a lot of work within the wolverine worldwide portfolio but cat footwear is really cool because it's obviously you know has a heritage of construction and uh you know 100 plus year old company um so we get a lot of like really cool touch points where we can tell those stories and those like

Starting point is 00:23:29 really valuable stories especially in today's day and age where the trades are so lacking for people um and talent that that can you know be in there so we get that like great honor of like chasing after that and building kind of a brand around uh that with just like really awesome product to back it up which is great um but from a design standpoint i think that's that's one of our like favorite accounts where we shine because we can do um just like storytelling around any holiday or moment or like you know uh caesar chavez like there's so much like things where we can just like extract like the brand elements but like parlay that into like a story that's not even connected to the brand but it's just like in the overall you know construction trades industry

Starting point is 00:24:14 so um it's so important to us it's like if we did not have that we would be sunk uh in in just like being able to pull that off and And like, and if we, if we had to rely on each of our clients separately and like their in-house, because most of our clients do have, you know, an in-house graphic designer. But like, we just would, we'd never make it to their like priority queue, especially as an outside agency. So having our own thing to back us up and be able to move as quickly and nimbly as social does is just essential.

Starting point is 00:24:48 Do you have any advice to going back to kind of square one for brands going in and, you know, developing whether it's that brand identity from scratch or even looking to refine brand elements, if they're having a hard time figuring out what that should look like or what that brand essence should be visually, any tips for kind of shaping that and figuring out the direction for just overall identity and design? Yeah, I think, I mean, we do a fair amount of that. And I think like, it comes back to like, I mean, as like cheesy as it sounds like it's, it really is like brand legacy. Like, what do you want to be known for in the great ether 10 years from now? Um, and I think like, I think it's twofold, right? Like, I think there's building that the walls of the sandbox is huge and that's a process

Starting point is 00:25:42 and that, you know know i think being intentional with who your consumers are how you want to be talking to them like what your mission and values are um but then i think like especially as it relates to social like also like letting your hair down a little bit is is okay um and having having a little bit of fun with that and knowing that like beyond 24 hours nobody's going to know this exists you know remember this existed anyway so like lean you know lean into that too but i think like you know back to your original question i think like how do you find that i think it's like it's it's introspection and it's exercises and it's inspiration um and you know we do a lot of

Starting point is 00:26:23 that work with brands and especially looking outside of their industry is huge. Like don't, don't get lost in what everybody else, you know, down the street making your same product is doing, um, look outside of that to, to what else exists out there. What, just what you're excited about by, you know, regardless of industry, I think is huge. Um, so our job and like what we always tell brands when we're working with them whether it's social or brand identity or campaigns or whatever is like our biggest thing we always say is like you can never give us too much information

Starting point is 00:26:54 like just throw everything on us you know everything you're excited by what you're chasing after and then like let it be our job to like distill that down um and so you know even from a you know social planning standpoint it's like just tell us as much as you humanly can don't keep us in the dark about what's coming down the pipeline or what you know what the brand is chasing after as an overall kind of like push um we will you know we'll take that information and do with it what we what we will and you know kind of come back to you with the plan but like, you know, we'll take that information and do with it what we, what we will, and, you know, kind of come back to you with the plan. But like, you know, we do a lot of that same exercise in like helping people identify who they are is like, is walking through that with them and letting that be messy and that being okay. Because you don't have to show it to people until you're ready to

Starting point is 00:27:41 show it to people. So yeah, absolutely. So if somebody's out there and they're listening to this and they're like, oh my gosh, I really want to work with Handcar. What does the process look like when a client comes to you for creative needs? You know, how are you determining that scope of what they are looking for from just their initial outreach saying, hey, I want to work with you. And then how does your team kind of execute on that? Yeah. Yeah. That's a great question. And there's, you know, there's a couple different like ways people, you know, work with us, our bread and butter, you might say is like our full, you know, social strategy package, but we're, we're managing. And we're also doing, you know,

Starting point is 00:28:18 creative deliverables that go along with that. But outside of that, we also do, you know, as a full studio, we do a ton of just like ad hoc campaign work um across photo video brand identity that kind of thing um you know biggest thing is just is reaching out uh we're you know it's very conversational it's very uh you know we'll have some people that come to us with a completely baked out brief of like hey we need this and we need you know we're gonna shoot this commercial we need this. And we need, you know, we're going to shoot this commercial and we need X number of cut downs. And, you know, they're, they're just ready to roll. And we can just say like, okay, that's, this is how much it costs. And this is when we can do it. Um, and then there's others that come to us that are like,

Starting point is 00:28:54 I have no idea what we need, but we do need something. And so that's when it's like, all right, let's, you know, have a, have a 30 minute conversation, like talk about what that actually looks like. Um, so that I can give you a proposal that you know actually plays into that and puts you on the best best path forward and like I think the biggest thing like that we've done too and this goes against kind of like agency model of old which is like trying to hook people in for a long-term relationship and you know we we love that like most of our clients are super long-term and have been around us for, you know, two plus years. But when we're like talking to somebody new to is like, I'm,

Starting point is 00:29:33 we're also always down to just like start small. Like let's do some, let's just do something, especially for those people that come to us. That's, you know, don't really know what they want. They don't know if they need to do a full rebrand or if they just want to kind of elevate social. They don't know if they need to do a full rebrand or if they just want to kind of elevate social they don't know if they want to continue managing social themselves but want to like work with us for our like social playbook that we do where we just kind of give you the plan and let you run with it um but our biggest thing we always say is like let's not like hem and haw on this for six months if there's like something tiny a photo

Starting point is 00:30:02 shoot you know a bundle of assets that will like carry you forward for not like let's just do it so you know how we work and know how we roll with it we don't have to sign this big long-term you know contract right off rip like let's let's just do some work um and that's kind of you know it's the midwesterner in us of just like wanting to get you know cracking on something. But it's also just like where, you know, where we get to shine and where we get to show, you know, how much we can do in, you know, nimbleness is kind of our cornerstone here. So like how much we can do and how far we can kind of extrapolate that value with our team. And we just want to like show people that,

Starting point is 00:30:42 you know, too. So yeah, absolutely. I'm interested to hear from your perspective, you know, why would a brand choose to work with a creative agency like Hand Car versus, you know, trying to DIY, you know, what, whatever it is that they need in their creative work? Yeah, I think it's like, it's hard. It's something we run up against all the time, right? Especially like agency world is tricky in that way because um working with brands especially they're they're constantly battling back and forth and it depends on who leadership is and when leadership switches their strategy will

Starting point is 00:31:13 completely change but it's like brands are constantly going back and forth of like is it in-house is it you know agency is it you know whatever and like sometimes i have no faults of you know the agencies it's just they bring it back in-house because that's what you know the new leadership wanted and you're kind of just like stuck there kind of you know bummed out of like everybody had a great time this worked out really well but like we want this in-house um so i think like the constant battle of that and like why i think why like the agency model still has so much value is like is is the shared resource of just so many more people for the cost of what you know one person in-house would be um with

Starting point is 00:31:53 social especially it's just you know it's the it's the constant you know conversation out there in LinkedIn world is especially as like you know social media managers are wearing so many different hats um they're expected to be a content creator and a calendar planner and a copywriter and like you know obviously like we still battle some of that even internally here of like our you know strategists here is like there's there's still some of that that like we try and go up against of like you do need people to be very versatile and kind of a pocket knife but we try and like you know uh put a cap on that as much as as much as we can while still you know doing an amazing job but i think what brands run into when they bring it in house is it's just like it's your resources are depleted so quickly because it's just one person they and

Starting point is 00:32:37 and finding that person that is good at all of those things is just it's it's so much to ask um and and i think like and and the biggest thing that like we say too and again why we like have creative you know outside of their internal structure is like we can just get we can just get a lot more done we're just not stuck in the corporate kind of rigmarole of meetings and and all of that like we can just kind of like, we always like always using the analogy of like letting us run the ball down the field while you go and focus on everything else. Like just give us what's going on. You know, we tell you what's going on. We were briefing kind of both ways, but let us run with it while you go and handle, you know, the rest of the stuff of like actually

Starting point is 00:33:20 getting product in consumers hands. So I think that's like where the advantage is like you get you know tap into percentages of you know the nine of us plus freelancers or have one person that then you're trying to like ad hoc each project and do each shoot and you know they're still doing a lot of that but like let us make that lift as much as humanly possible as a multi kind of faceted team and just like the benefit of multiple different points of view um you know we have an incredible team here that like we always laugh that like we just have such varying and odd backgrounds we've kind of built this ragtag team of people that aren't uh you know typical marketers um we have you know somebody that worked in uh coffee for 15 years we

Starting point is 00:34:04 have somebody that was a pastor we have somebody that was you know, somebody that worked in coffee for 15 years. We have somebody that was a pastor. We have somebody that was, you know, a behavioral therapist, like all this crazy stuff that has now come into like, you know, I got to kind of extrapolate those people out of that and not take them out of that, but like something new and exciting for them that like pulled out pieces of them that they didn't know they had. And it just gives us this incredible point of view that like spans beyond traditional marketing again versus like just the one person you've got that like is kind of shouting into an abyss we've we've got a you know room of 10 people that are that are able to shout you know across the desk instead instead yeah and I think to your point too,

Starting point is 00:34:47 there's, there's benefits of being super close to the brand, but also that becomes a roadblock at the same time. So having people are kind of outside of that, not as close to it, who can kind of expand their horizons and, and their thinking process, I think is also super beneficial of working with an agency. Yeah, we just get like a, we get a ton of like shared learning from even just our other clients too, of like, Hey, this worked really well over here. How can we parlay this to this? Like there's, there's a lot of that too, which really comes in handy.

Starting point is 00:35:17 Yeah, absolutely. Well, Jesse, this has been awesome. As we close out, we have to ask one of our favorite questions, of course, tying in career as we always do here on the show, but would love to know, what do you know now that you wish you knew early on in your career? Yeah, I think like, it's a great, it's a great question. And I like appreciate that introspection. I like, I, I struggle with, you you know one of my struggles is like is celebrating

Starting point is 00:35:46 the wins and like feeling you know feeling excited about where we are and that's I think that's a lot of like entrepreneur struggles too but it was cool to kind of like think on this question a little bit and I think like and I say this a lot to our team too is like there is so much value in relationships and playing the long game. And I don't mean that from a standpoint of like, I'm constantly just like, you know, seeing, seeing who I'm talking to and how I'm going to make that angle later. Cause I'm not like, you know, I'm not big networking guy. I'm, you know, I'm a, I'm an introverted extrovert in a lot of ways. So like, if I'm in a crowd of people at a, you know, a cocktail hour or something, like I'm not,

Starting point is 00:36:24 I'm not just going to walk up to a group of people and like if i'm in a crowd of people at a you know a cocktail hour or something like i'm not i'm not just gonna walk up to a group of people and like start a conversation i kind of you know slip into the shadows and scroll my phone or something but um i think the value that i saw and like again going back to my my wedding career is like relationships are everything. Um, and like this entire business is thanks to making good on relationships prior. Like I said, this was a friend that I shot photo campaigns with, but then turned into this and now turned into a big team. And, um, and almost all of our clients since then have been a friend or a friend of a friend or you know we did previous work here and that brand manager moved to a different you know company and then they like brought us back in there um you know the the director of marketing at rumble that we we just

Starting point is 00:37:14 started working with um this is now the fourth brand we've worked on with him um which just like i think there's just so much value in doing what you say you're going to do and following up and answering emails. And that was always the thing I used to say when I shot weddings. It's like people would ask me, and I would always just be honest and I'd be like, I'm not the best photographer in the world. I'm not the most artistic photographer in the world. But I answer an email and I deliver things when I say I'm going to, and they look beautiful

Starting point is 00:37:42 and I take my job really seriously. And I've parlayed that into this where it's like, we're just going to do what we said we, you know, we're going to do it. We're going to elevate it and blow it out of the water. And we're going to do it fairly and kindly and like, and, you know, kind of carry ourselves with that. And I think like that has just made our relationship so strong that like, even as people move and especially in the marketing world, like people just jump ship all the time so like that's just another you know for for us especially it's just

Starting point is 00:38:09 another opportunity as they move on to their next gig if we were good to them in their previous gig especially like people in the director of marketing position like you know how it is like as soon as they come in they want to swap everything for their relationships and their their past things and you know we get to be the benefactor of that we're also you know also have to have the flip side of that when it happens with the companies we're working with too but um yeah i think that's the biggest thing like that i've just learned over time and that i always say to my team is like just play the long game like if it's if it's a not right now it's a it's a no worries we don't need to be annoying about it we don't have, you know, be intentional about follow-ups and keeping relationships alive,

Starting point is 00:38:49 but like, I'm never going to hound somebody to work with us. It either works or it doesn't. And you know, there's so many times that it's two years later and they come back and because that relationship was handled correctly, it turns into something. Absolutely. I couldn't agree more. I always say that relationship is at the core of literally everything in marketing and everything in life, honestly. And so what I'm hearing you say too, is you're not one of those people on LinkedIn who's messaging all these people over and over and over again, especially when they say no, like some of these salespeople can be. So I think just handling those relationships, you know, in an appropriate and, you know, just human way is so essential and so important. One thing that I like to talk about, too, is I feel like I go through my career or go through my life and I'm like collecting my people along the way to just like having my back to like bring out when I need somebody who has that, that expertise. And one of those people

Starting point is 00:39:45 is my really close friend, Amy, she's a photographer, as well. And she has worked on a couple brand projects with me too. And, you know, we talk all the time about, you know, marketing life, you know, these different things and projects we want to work on together, and we're out here making it happen. So I love to hear that that's something that you do as well. Well, I'm curious to know where everyone can find you, follow along with what you're up to now and get in touch if they'd like to work with you. Yeah, me personally,

Starting point is 00:40:15 all of my accounts are just at jessiedavidgreen, Instagram and the like. And then for the company, everything is at handcar.co. That's both our website and our Instagram handle. You know, get to see a little bit of behind the scenes of what we're doing in our studio here in Detroit. Tap in and work with us. Or just reach out and say what's up. That's, you know, again, relationships are everything. So let's, let's just chat. Super good. We'll link everything in the show notes for people to find you there. But thanks

Starting point is 00:40:50 again for joining us. This has been so good. Thank you guys. This was so fun. I really appreciate it. Love everything you're building and appreciate you, you know, just having these conversations with people. It's really awesome. We are so excited to share that our first ever free marketing happy hour digital resource is now available. Download the dream career game plan today at marketinghappyhr.com forward slash freebie. That's marketinghappyhr.com forward slash freebie. This five-step workbook will guide you through defining your goals, building your network, diversifying your skills, influencing where you're at, and investing in your growth.

Starting point is 00:41:34 Cassie and I created this resource with marketing careers in mind, but the framework can be applied to any industry. Our hope is that this workbook will help you truly elevate your career, whether you're in the market for a new position or just looking to make your mark in your current organization. No matter where this resource finds you, we are cheering you on every step of the way. So go check it out at marketinghappyhr.com forward slash freebie to download and make your career dreams come true.

Marketing Happy Hour - Should You Hire a Creative Agency? | Jesse Green of Handcar

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