Marketing Secrets with Russell Brunson - Conversation Domination: John Parkes Reveals the Strategies Behind Our $150M in Ad Spend | #Marketing - Ep. 91

Episode Date: November 26, 2025

In this episode of The Russell Brunson Show, I share a powerful session from our recent Two Comma Club meeting where John Parkes, the guy who runs all our ads and has profitably spent more than one hundred and fifty million dollars, breaks down what conversation domination really means. Inside our higher level programs we focus on what is working right now, and John shows exactly how to use Meta Ads to be everywhere your dream customers look so you become the only voice they see. Key Highlights: ◼️What conversation domination actually means and how to show up everywhere your market is paying attention ◼️The DWELL method for building audiences that convert instead of just clicking ◼️How to use engagement, traffic, data, and layered audiences without confusing the algorithm ◼️The “special ops” way to run ads and get sales and leads for pennies on the dollar ◼️Why simple, native videos outperform polished creative and boost show-up rates If you run Meta ads or want to, this session will shift how you think about traffic. Winning with paid ads is not guessing. It is building the right audiences, structuring campaigns so the algorithm learns fast, and putting messages in front of people who already care. John shows the framework that makes campaigns cheaper, smarter, and more predictable. Take notes, refine your targeting, and start applying these principles. ◼️If you’ve got a product, offer, service… or idea… I’ll show you how to sell it (the RIGHT way) Register for my next event →⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://sellingonline.com/podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ◼️Still don’t have a funnel? ClickFunnels gives you the exact tools (and templates) to launch TODAY → ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://clickfunnels.com/podcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

At Desjardin, we speak business. We speak equipment modernization. We're fluent in data digitization and expansion into foreign markets. And we can talk all day about streamlining manufacturing processes. Because at Desjardin business, we speak the same language you do. Business. So join the more than 400,000 Canadian entrepreneurs who already count on us. And contact Desjardin today.

We'd love to talk, business. Do you have a funnel, but it's not converting? The problem 99.9% of the time is that your funnel is good, but you suck at selling. If you want to learn how to sell so your funnels will actually convert, then get a ticket to my next selling online event by going to sellingonline.com slash podcast. That's selling online.com slash podcast. Hey, what's up, everybody? This is Russell. Welcome back to the show.

Today, I'm en route for our Thanksgiving festivities. We're in L.A. right now, getting ready to go jump. on a boat for a couple days. So it's going to be nice. I'm excited to hang out. My family, my kids and all the things. I hope that maybe when you're listening to this is either Thanksgiving or afterwards and you're also having great family time.

So I wanted to, you know, there's a lot of times, obviously, since podcast and the places as well talk a lot about, like, strategy of traffic and things like that. And I don't typically go deep into tactics because tactics are shifting and changing and stuff like that. But inside our hiring and coaching programs, we definitely do a lot of focus on the tactical parts like what's working today what's you know how do we dominate these how do we how to make sure this is going to be successful so at a recent one of our um twocom club x meetings uh john parks who runs our advertising division of our company was there he talked about conversation

domination uh as it relates to um specifically uh paid ads and things like that which i thought was really fascinating and a great presentation um conversation domination i i call that one of my friends and howie schwartz way back they had a course called conversation domination And the course, the whole goal was like, how do you get it so that when you went to Google, he typed in your keyword that you'd be the first listing, second, third, fourth, this, like the all 10 listings, and you'd be paid ads, and you'd be everywhere, right? And so I actually bought that brand, that domain from them later because I was like, I want the same thing, I want something Google's my name, or it goes with Instagram or Facebook,

wherever, like I show up everywhere that we're at. That's conversation domination. I want to dominate the conversation about any topic that I am focusing on. And so that's kind of what, yeah, the lens that John made this presentation, through, but specifically with paid ads and stuff like that. So I hope you enjoy those presentations. We're a little more tactical than usual, but I hopefully get some wheels in head spinning. Give just my ideas and insights for how you guys can get more traffic into your funnels.

I appreciate you all. And I hope you'll have a great weekend. Talk soon. This is the Russell Brunson Show. Okay, so yeah, I'm John Parks. Over a decade in ads, over $150 million spent profitably. So excited to show you guys the art and the science of ads, okay? there's both a science side and an art side, and both of them are important, and sometimes I see

some of you with beautiful art, and you're floundering on the science, and you're like, isn't my video a good video? I'm like, yeah, but your campaign structure is totally wrong, and so it's completely a flop, or vice versa, right? So we're going to talk about both sides and the things you can do to maximize the results you'll get from what Darcy was teaching, right? So Darcy was teaching 100% truth, don't go for the absolute possible cheapest lead or sale you can find. Instead, figure out that number, that whole range is acceptable, right? Whether, if it's, let's say, you know, you're fine with $300 to make a sale.

Anything. Well, the $299 sale is as valid as the sale that costs you maybe $45 in ads. Both of them count, okay? And you've got to get in that mindset. And that is going to give you longevity and success in ads over time. All right. Okay. Let's talk about this.

All right. First we'll start with the science, okay? I believe in science. I don't know if any of you know this. It is a pretty funny movie. So, all right. Okay. So in the expert secrets book, Russell Brunson taught us that the next, it's a little

quote, the next question in the secret formula is where can you find this ideal man or woman talking about your customers, right? your dream customers. Where do they hang out online? What groups are they a part of? What email newsletters do they subscribe to? What blogs do they read? If you don't know that, who, it will be hard to find out where your perfect client can be found.

So make sure you know exactly who you're trying to attract. Okay, so let's talk about audiences. Let's start with this. Where do your customers congregate? And I made a little acronym for you. Where do they dwell? Oh, it looks like it changed dimensions. D-W-E-L-L.

Okay, where do they dwell? That's your acronym. To remember the different audiences that are available to you. All right. And then we'll talk about when we'll use these. When we'll lean more into kind of an AI broader audience segment and different things like that after this audience section here. Okay, so audiences.

First, let's start with the D. D stands for data. Write that down. Data. Okay, and I'll tell you what that means. W stands for website traffic. So write that one down. And I'm going to go deep under each of these.

E stands for the engagement audiences. Engagement audiences. L stands for lookalike audiences. And the second L stands for the layered, saved audiences, is what I call them. And I'll explain what I mean by that. All right. So D-W-E-L, where do my audiences dwell? So as you're building out your audiences, whether it's you or you working with somebody who's helping with the ads,

kind of think through it. Do we have Dwell audiences? Do we have that full stack? Is there some missed opportunity here? Okay. Okay, let's talk about the first D, the data audiences. What do I mean by data? Well, Facebook lets you upload meta.

I'll call it meta because it includes Facebook and Instagram and now WhatsApp can have ads and Messenger can have ads and even threads can have ads. And they have an audience network. So if any of you have ever used a free app, whether it's a game or another free app, and ads might pop up or show up. or, you know, things like that. A lot of those are powered by the meta ads manager's audience network, okay? So there's a variety of ads that can be run off of the Facebook ads manager.

And so I now call it meta ads because that's the overarching brand. So we know that we're not talking just about the Facebook platform. But all of those places, okay? So data, it'll let you upload data that you already have. So your list, right? We talk about building a list. So on your list, you might have people's first names or last names. their email addresses, all of these individual data points can be uploaded given to the platform

and they'll make an audience out of it. They'll say, oh, we know George Costanza with that email. We know that guy, right? This is his profile. Put them in your list, okay? Put them in your audience, all right? And then phone number. So I ring all these up because some of you might have these lists and not realize

that they're lists. Just because you can't upload them into click funnels and send them a follow-up. Email doesn't mean it's not a list, right? Some of you might have postal codes or, you know, or birthdays or, you know, their age or their country or any of this. Gender, city, state, all of that kind of data can be uploaded and make an audience out of it. Okay? Awesome. All right.

Website. So we all have websites. I use a W website or sales funnel, right? Landing pages, opt-in pages, sales pages, all of it. on your website you can put code it's called pixel you might have heard the facebook pixel the meta pixel you put that pixel on the funnel on the website and you can generate audiences from website interaction okay people who hit the landing page or more particularly people who hit the landing page just in the last seven days right i mean how many of you have visited a website

in the last seven days right how many of you don't remember by day eight the websites you visited you know there's a there's a you want to put kind of a limit on it you don't want to just be anybody who's visited my website in the last three years, right? It's just too big, too broad, too long. You're spending money that doesn't, that's not effective. So you kind of put a cap on that one. Okay. There are controls that let you say, well, those who loaded your page more than once.

Oh, that's interesting. Because sometimes you visit a website, you know, a sales page, and then you think about it. And then you pull it back up again, right? You just literally just revisiting the tab or, you know, or refreshing it on your phone or something because maybe you want to show your spouse or your partner or your, you know, or your dog, the offer and see if anyone thinks it's a good idea that you should buy this thing, right? So that would be a second page load.

Well, that seems like it's a big buyer intent signal. You can make an audience off of that, right? You can also make an audience off of the people who've, the top 25% page time. So tons of people come to your site. Tons of bots come to your site. You might not realize that, but a lot of your traffic is all of these bots. all over the internet that are doing crazy things like indexing your page or you know scanning it for a thousand different reasons you know there's there's a million trillion bots on the

on the internet that are loading everyone's pages and looking at stuff and indexing stuff and throwing it this way and that way and all this stuff well you're not interested in in them being a part of your audience so if you say that they have to have spent time on your page so the stop 25 page time you know the ones who hung out with me for a little bit watched my video read some copy, they're likely human and they're likely interested, okay? So you kind of get that just cream of the crop. You can even do that. Okay. Then those who take some kind of action on your site, so they opt in, or they, you know, for that free download or to get on your newsletter, or they register for, you know, for your one to many event, your webinar, your challenge.

Those kinds of people are audiences you can be specific with. That one, you go a little bit longer, right? So if you're going to try to retarget somebody who opted in, but didn't quite buy, maybe you hang out with them for two weeks. You put your ad in front of them for two weeks and you say, hey, don't you want to buy? Don't you want to buy? You know, for maybe two weeks, after which point on day 15, they're still not taking action. Maybe it's time to let them go. Let the birdie fly and go for the next one, right?

So you kind of limit that to 14 days. And then those who actually buy and you can make this audience as long as possible right now meta limits you to 180 days off of website audience. So you make a buyer's list that's half a year long. in essence, and you're able to then exclude them from these ads, which saves you some money. A lot of you are spending money that you don't realize you're spending, and it's disproportionately large. Because for them to have bought from you, think about this, they have to have been active on the ad platform you're advertising on, probably seen multiple impressions of yours in order to then take action, probably hit with some of your other retargeting levels, you know, spent time.

on your page and then been your target audience and then actually bought, right? So they've probably spent a lot of your ad money, right, relatively a lot for them. Well, once their buyers, now it's time to cut off that advertising to them and save the money. So that's why you want to build the buyer list and exclude it from that initial advertising. Yeah, you have a question? Yeah, that's the first one, the data, yeah. The data audience, you can, as well. The buyers, so you have more than six months. Yes, right, exactly that. Yep.

So the D in D-W-E-L-L-L-D is all your data. So including all your buyers, you can upload them, and then that list is indefinitely there. It's not limited to 180 days. If you're running off of pixel data, 180 days, we do both and exclude both just to help cover the basis because neither data set will be perfect, so they'll kind of fill in each other's gaps, right?

as much as possible we try to exclude you guys from our front end offers it's imperfect some of you tell me you still see the ads some of you don't so all right engaged audiences okay so you're probably all over social media at a minimum with your ads which are causing engagement likes shares comments um you know even saves things like that watch time so these engaged audiences So those who engaged with any post or ad, which is actually just a sponsored post, so any post from your Facebook page or your Instagram page or your, you know, any profile that you have, those who watched more than 10 seconds of a video. You know, they've gone past the threshold of probably accidentally seeing it as they scroll and they probably actually intended to watch some of it, hung out with you for a little bit. So more than 10 seconds of your video might be a beginning threshold. those who saved a post.

Now, depending on how prolific you are on social media, if you publish a lot and there's a lot of posts for people to be interacting with, this saved audience, a lot of you don't even know you can save a post on Instagram or Facebook, but you can, you can save a post. People who are saving and making like a folder out of the stuff you say, those are called your like true followers, your hyper-buyers, right? If you have enough people saving posts that you can make an audience out of it, by all means, it's one of the best ones on this engaged stack, okay?

So you can try to make an audience off of people who save your post and see how big it is. Meta will say, oh, this is too small to advertise to. Or they'll say, oh, look at that. That's 400 people. That's big. And it's even big enough to make, like, the next type of audience off of, which is a look-alike. So look-alike audiences, this is. Any of the previous audiences I talked about, D-E-W, data, you know, website, engagement,

all of those are seed audiences or source audiences for these look-a-like audiences. Okay, so as soon as those audiences are in the hundreds, a few hundred people big, meta allows you to make a look-alike audience from those and take those audiences and say, Well, anybody who has saved a post of mine, let's take 1% of all of the people in this entire geo, in this entire country. And the 1% of this entire country that's most like those people, most similar to those people, have them be in an audience. And it's called a 1% lookalike audience. And you can do this in a variety of countries. It does require that you have so many 100 people already in the seed audience in order for this to work, right?

1%, 2%, you can go all the way up to 10%. We've been finding 1% and 10% to be the two that are working really well right now. Now, is that going to be true in six months? Maybe not, but just, FYI, those ones are great right now. Okay? But remember, though, garbage and garbage out. Okay, so here's an example. If I make a look, I'll just do it by raise the hands, okay?

If I make a look-like audience off of everybody who clicked a thumbs up on my post, is that a really refined buyer signal? Raise your hand. No, no, okay, good. I'm glad we're talking to the right audience here. That's great. Okay, great. I didn't get any hands.

That's awesome. If I make a look-like audience or if I make a seat audience that's based off of people who've bought my high ticket back in, is that a good buyer signal? Right? Raise your hand if you think that's good. Yeah. So I make a look-like off of that one, right? Or something we've done in ClickFunnels in the past is required that they be what we call hyperbuyers.

And what we meant by that was they had to not only have signed up for subscription of ClickFunnels, you know, the free trial, but they had to have at least paid us three times. And then they had to have at least bought something else, a Russell book or a program, right? And if we see them in these multiple places, then we say that's a hyper buyer, you know, and there's so many, so many of them, and it's a way, it's a, it's a, it's a, fraction of the everyone list right there's the everybody on my list there's those who kind of started a trial with us and then there's the hyper buyers right make a lookalike off of those hyper buyers and you get a really solid you know be picky and you get this golden gold out kind of an

audience instead of garbage in garbage out so think through that lookalikes only work for as well as as you seed them with the right seed okay um be picky with countries let's talk about that real quick. The way you need to think about your advertising is kind of like the legend of Michelangelo who carved the David. And there's, you know, I'll paraphrase here, but he talked about having this huge piece of Carrara marble, this big old beautiful white marble. And people are like, how did you get the David out of that block of marble? And he said, well, I simply continued removing marble until the David was revealed inside of it. I want you to think about your advertising and your audiences and your placements and stuff like that with that Michelangelo mindset.

Too many of us think of it upside down. We think to ourselves, we think, well, I'm selling a homeschooling course. And so, you know, for homeschooling. Well, this, you know, it's definitely for moms, you know, mothers of children age 27 to, you know, to 42. it's definitely for them, but maybe women age 22 might buy it. Maybe they might be getting ready to have a kid, you know, and might be thinking ahead. Maybe, you know, women age 60 plus might buy it because they might give it to their, you know, to their daughter who's trying to homeschool kids, right?

Maybe, you know, maybe the, you know what I mean? Like, why are we doing that? Why are we advertising to the maybes? Because we're all doing it. you too um the but that's the that's the wrong way to think about it don't don't be greedy don't think about like all the people i might be missing oh oh i've got anxiety of all the possible markets i might not be in i mean that's the fastest way to ruin your brand and to waste your budget think think of the brands over the last three years who who tried to dramatically change

their target audience how did it go for them like zero effective percent right Like, I can name a few of them. You all have visions in your head of what I'm talking about. You know, and they're like, oh, our brand is 40-year-old guys who drink beer and watch football. Like, that's literally their brand, okay? That's their market. That's awesome. That's where they live.

Fantastic. They're 80% of the market share. And then they jump over here. And it's like, what the heck are you doing? Like, this is not who drinks your beer. It's right here, right? So stay here because you're winning here. Here you are wasting all of your money and destroying your.

brand. It's just not you, right? And so don't do that. Don't be that, okay? Figure out who your target market is and stay there. Because that's who wants to hear from you. That's who's connecting. That if you spend your money there, you get results. If you spend your money over here, you don't get results. And then you come and you tell me, ads don't work for me. Well, who were you advertising to? You spend $100,000 over here to people who aren't your target market because you thought, well, maybe I could convince them. No, be picky, okay? And then it comes to countries here. So be picky with your country. Countries. Advertise only in countries who are highly likely to take action with you, okay?

For us, in the Russell Brunson and Click Funnels Arena, we've identified about 18 countries who love to interact with us and buy from us, okay? But there's the other 120 countries that don't. That's fine. They're doing their thing, right? Some things to think about in countries is what's the GDP per capita, right? Do they have enough money to engage with you at your price point? If not, I mean, if it literally is half of their year's salary to even, you know, get into your program, that's really a big ask, right? I don't know, sell your house, sell the cow, just get into my program, you know what I mean? like it's a little much so that might be a stretch okay so kind of find out where you're where your lane is and stay in it you'll save a ton of money okay um and if you don't have the adequate

seed to start this lookalike audiences which is a it's a real backbone for a lot of a lot of the advertising um i know for you it is for sure so um then you have to start with interests with layered saved audiences now what i mean by layered is, again, being picky, right? I could, let's go back to the homeschool model. I could, I could advertise to, you know, 27 to 42-year-old women, my homeschool product, right? And I'll hit a lot of them, but what if I added a layer to it and said, not only should they be in that age range, but they should also be following along, well, they should also have kids. They're not homeschooling their cat, right? Hope not. They could be.

Not very effective. Cats don't tend to learn the alphabet very well. So the, they got to have kids, right? So there's another layer. Okay, right, great. Well, how many 27 to 42-year-old women who have kids homeschool? Well, it's less than, it's 5% or so of the nation. So I'm still 95% wrong in my targeting. How do I narrow that down? Well, let's add another layer. Let's figure out who else is teaching homeschool. People who do homeschool, what is there, you know, who else are they following? What authors are they reading? What courses are they buying? And then I figure out these interests and I stack those in. So not only do they have to be, you know, this age range, but they also have to be female. Not only do that to be female, but they have to have kids. Not only do that to have kids, but they have to actually like these topics. Now I'm ready to advertise, okay? Now I know that my dollar spent in ads is highly likely to fall on fertile ground, right? Okay. So if you're not doing it like that, then you're not quite there. all right

all this being said some of you might have very mature advertising pixels that have a lot of data that they've consumed they know your buyers they've seen

hundreds or thousands of your buyers if that's the case you can back off on how picky you're being because it knows but until you're there you be picky

okay all right now group the very similar ones together and the save audiences is like I said, and consider using that layered strategy. Now, I say the word saved, because when you're setting up, some of you might set up your own ad campaign.

Some of you might get help. If what you do is you build an ad campaign and then you build an ad set and there you do all the targeting and then you throw in your ads and you click go, if that's your flow, then you're going to have to rebuild that every time. If instead you take a little preparation and you go into the audiences section of your ads manager and you think about it beforehand and you spend some time setting up audiences in there you're allowed to save them and you can name them i could you know i could name it the you know the super targeted homeschool mom audience extravaganza audience right that's what i name it whatever i name

it okay and then every time i go and i build my ad set i can literally just click on that one and i don't have to reset it up every time okay so it's just a time saver for you okay so identify the that work save them in little capsules inside of your audience area inside of the ads manager and then you can just pop them in you know oh yeah i remember this one was great throw that one in there oh that one's not performing okay here's version two pop that one in there and it's just easy to pop in and out test the different ones get your results okay so dwell dw e l you guys got it all okay any specific questions i'll take a question or two on audiences yeah Thank you.

Hi. Okay. So I have a business that's operating and we have a whole bunch of clients in the Dominican Republic, but I'm trying to open up in Orlando, Florida. So I'm wondering how can I use those, like that audience or that list to get people like in Florida? Yeah, it is hard to jump country and use the actual data. So what you could do is you could see what can I identify about my buyers. Sometimes you can use an engine like chat GPT or something, and you can upload a lot of stuff in there, you know,

and you can ask and just have a good half-hour chat and try to identify who that demographic is and really whittle it down. That can help you figure out how to get started in another country. But yeah, if you were to upload all of your Dominican Republic data in, you know, into meta and then run in the U.S. The pixel, it's likely to kind of stumble for a while and not really know. And that's probably what you're anticipating. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So then another question that I have is, so you're saying it's not really, because I'm working with an ad agency now and they're saying oh no we like to start the ads broad not necessarily with the interests right and I'm like what I'm pretty clear on my avatar so I guess I want to hear what

you think about that price point that can can can matter what's what's the what's the what's the entry level price point a 497 497 yeah yeah I wouldn't start broad unless you've got lots of change in your pockets if it was like a $7 entry point then yeah maybe maybe we could maybe because what you're going to do okay so just everyone in we're going to get into a campaign structure right now talk about this if you decide not to do what I just taught you then you're outsourcing it to the algorithm to the AI to the engine and you're saying I don't know I didn't do the legwork you figure it out you figure out what the buyers are and it will it's really good at it it just might cost you 30

30 grand to get there, right? And so that and that's your question. Well, do you want to do the legwork? Do you want to spoon feed it and get it kind of started on the right vein and then say, oh, look at this. I know where buyers are. Then you can back off and be like, hey, you get it. You know, take the training wheels off. Go. Go, beautiful algorithm, right? But until that point, this is where you live. That's my opinion on it, especially on higher price points. Because for a $500 product, you're going to spend $700, $700 to acquire that $500 buyer potentially in ads. It can be up to three times the cost of the thing. Well, now you're going to have to double that if you want the algorithm to do the legwork and find your thing.

I think you've got a long journey ahead of you if you don't do some of it yourself. Got it. So start picky and then be as picky as possible or? Right. I mean, the only, yeah, so the only caveat there is be as picky as possible. The only caveat is if that gets your audience so teeny tiny that it can't handle your budget, And you're trying to shove $10,000 into an audience of only, you know, 15,000 people, you'll get really high frequencies, right? So that's the only other thing to watch everybody as you're, as you're being really picky in your audiences.

When I say be really picky, I mean get into the millions, right? Get into like a two, three million size audience. That's picky. If you're geo-restricted, if you can only hit these certain zip codes, then we've got to talk about dropping a zero on that. you know but if but if you're okay to be like countrywide um picky would be you know to take the 300 million people in the united states and wittled it down to a few million right and then that's your picky audience go with that again outliers big huge budgets and things like that would change what i'm saying but that's the general and so and you said and then take the training

wheels off so at what point do we know when to take the training wheels off and that the algorithm a few hundred that seems to be the mark so once you have yeah two or three hundred sales at which point you can try broader right now I'm going to teach you something here in a minute okay so that was that was awesome and that was a great question let's do one more question then we've got to move on

hey John yeah hey great question because it was mine but I have a piggyback because you hear like people say that just let it do its thing but now it makes sense it costs more what would that actually look like to back up once you get a couple hundred customers what does that actually look like when you're going to set your new ads up is that just look alike or like what would those ads look like structured inside of meta I would I would build out an advantage sales campaign which I'm going to talk about just a second

and I would set up a lookalike potentially a 10% lookalike which is fairly broad you know you're taking, in the United States, for example, we're taking 300 million, and you're cutting it down to 30 million with the 10%. So you're just saying, well, give me the 10% most likely, which is still very broad. And then you're also doing an Advantage Shopping Plus campaign, which is going broad, but leaning into the AI engine, and it's going to know a lot of things if you've got a few hundred units under your belt. Yeah. Cool. Cool. All right. Okay, let's move on. Okay. So, The science of ads includes that targeting stuff that we just talked about, Dwell. And it also includes the campaign structure.

So you actually get to choose a few different things when you're setting up ads. You get to choose. Oh, you know what? So we talked about this. But when you're building out your layers, think about things like this. Who sells something complementary to you, something upstream from you, something downstream from you, who's in your red ocean, your dream customer? Right. So these are the things you're thinking about when you're trying to find those interests. And interests are becoming harder to find, but it's still very much worth it when training the algorithm from scratch.

Okay. So there's those. If you want to take a picture of that and have a brainstorm session later on. That kind of gives you a concept there. All right, cool. And then which one? This one? Yeah, go ahead. Yeah. awesome okay cool i see your oCD people you're cropping it adjusting its dimension and then yeah i i get what you're doing and then you're probably sticking it in some notes at so it won't get lost okay it's fine you know do you i'm just kidding all right um and then and then another concept um i do like to explore you know expand and explore these concepts with you know with my friend Chad DVD. That's what my kids think it's called, so I just go with it. I haven't corrected him

yet because it's funny. They also, yeah, anyway. Okay. All right. So, three ad types. Okay. Conversion focused and targeted. So this is your go-to. This is what you almost always do when you're making a sale, right? So you choose of all the campaign types that are allowed to you. You know, you click on the one that says sales. What do you know, so basically when you set up, a campaign for those of you who aren't familiar with it. Meta says, okay, well, what do you want? You know, you're like, I want to run ads. Well, what do you want from me? You know, what do you? I'm here to help, but tell me what you want. Do you want just like, blah, awareness for your brand? Do you, you know, are you Coca-Cola? Do you have $10 million to give me this week so that everyone can

just see Santa Claus drinking a Coke? Or do you want to go more targeted than that? You know what I mean? So do you want, do you actually want sales? Do you want leads? Do you know, what do you want? And so you get to say what you want. Well, I want conversions is what you choose. And typically it's a lead or a sale. You know, a lead would be they're registering and not paying you. So for a one to many presentation, challenge, something like that, that's not paid, a webinar. Or you would say, I actually want sales, which is where they do transact with you. You know, they buy something for five bucks, seven bucks, $70, $500, whatever it is. So that's almost always what you choose. Okay, there's only two other options that I'm going to even let you play with.

So, almost always this, all right? There's one other type of campaign that you might want to run. Now, this is where you literally choose that you want to focus on awareness. Now, some of you might be like, whoa, what the heck do you mean by that, right? Because some of you who are media buyers would never dare click this button. This is for special ops only, okay? So you don't ever choose this and then try to spend. spend $10,000 and think you're going to get buyers.

You won't get any buyers, right? But when do you use this audience? You use this audience when you have a very filtered down, focused audience that you know you want to target. Okay, so what's an example of this? People register for your webinar, okay? So you're out there and you're using lead conversions to get people to register for your webinar.

Lead conversion, focused, they're registering for your webinar. You have a super successful run for 10 days, and you get 1,800 people registered for the webinar, and you're super psyched, and you just hope they show up, right? So you got 1,800 people, you paid good money for them. Now, there's this fun thing you can do, which is an awareness-focused ad, and you throw it up, let's say, you know, 24, 36 hours before you go live on the webinar, and you actually choose, not conversion, you choose awareness, and you say, hey, man, everybody in this 1800 list that I'm uploading, as well as I'm going to couple it with the pixel data.

So anybody who you saw as a lead on the pixel, and I saw as a lead as joined my list, those two, right, because they fill each other's gaps. They're essentially the same audience, but it can be helpful to give both. To these people here run an awareness ad or basically reach, reach as many of them as possible. irrespective of whether you think there's any conversion that's going to happen and literally just show them a video of me saying you better show up because remember how you're going to learn this, remember how you're going to learn that and to learn that. And at the end, I'm going to give away this thing.

So please, you know, you've got to show up. This is important for you to show up. It's going to, you know, these are all the benefits for you to showing up, right? So you kind of get back in front of them, remind them, increases your show up, right? Now you set, you have controls when you run an awareness or reach ad. you can control the frequency of these ads. And that's important because it's a small audience, you know, in this case, 1800. It could be as small as a few hundred.

And you set the frequency cap. And maybe you set it to two or three impressions a day. So you don't, because if you don't, you could, you know, end up spending and giving this person a heart attack because you show up 30 times in their feed and you end up spending, you know, $1,000 to try to get them to show up in the webinar. And it's not cost effective, right? So you set up a reach cap and you just say, you know, two, maybe three impressions in a day, otherwise completely saturate this audience, up to three times this day. And then they show up to your event. Isn't that cool?

Can you see the use case of a special ops awareness or reach audience? Very few media buyers are doing this. I know of two in the whole world, okay? So like this is super, I think this is super, the kids are saying alpha. This is alpha. That means that it's important and good data. Yeah, it's alpha. Okay.

This is alpha for you guys. All right. So, yes, I'm 42 and I have six kids. Okay. Think of other use cases of that, right? So you've got hyperbuyers. So you've got this list, this 5,000 person list. And they buy everything you launch.

And they just always do, right? They're just those people. Well, why wouldn't you run maybe a two, you know, two frequency, one day impression, reach campaign to them for the first week when you launch something new. You could probably get sales for 30 cents. You know what I mean? Like it would just be wildly effective for this tiny special ops audience. Okay. So there's, hopefully I see some of the light in your eyes. I mean like, oh, how about that? Because the other choice instead is to just put them in a standard conversion event campaign. Then they're lumped in with everyone

else. And then you're paying typical dollars to get to get the conversion, right? Why would you do that? You know, if you've hyper-filtered this audience and you know, you know, you know, then you spend to them, right? Because these campaigns literally cost like 20 bucks. You know what I mean? Like they're wildly inexpensive because you're paying for the impressions and you're literally paying for so few of them, right? They cost 20 bucks.

100 bucks might be high, you know. Cost per impressions. Cost per impressions are anywhere from $20 to $80, you know, CPM. if any of you know the CPM terminology. So if you literally are wanting 1,000 to 2,000 impressions, you're literally paying 40 times 2. That would be the cost of this campaign, complete cost, right? Okay, cool.

All right, then the last type of campaign. So what you're probably going to be running is a lot of money in those conversion campaigns, a little bit of money in the special ops reach or awareness campaigns, tiny bit of money. and then maybe an additional 10, 15% in this frosting on top kind of campaign, okay? This is the AI-powered Advantage Plus sales campaign. Now, you can lean into this more over time as you have more and more signals coming in.

But this is also, this is kind of replaced what they used to call broad audiences. But it's literally the AI saying, oh, you sit back, I know who's going to buy. I've seen all your sales happen and all your leads. I got this, you know. So you kind of take a back seat and you let the AI do all of the finding for you. This can be great. But so far, you know, in 2025, halfway through, it's more of a frosting on top choice than it is a run-everything choice. Okay?

So we run this in conjunction with the ones where we still are controlling more of the conversation. That might flip eventually. I don't know, but that's what we're doing right now. Cool. Okay. Yeah, you have a question? Hold on here. Here, stand up.

Where would you categorize as lots of sales? A few hundred. I'm going to continue to stand by that, yeah. Like 300 or something? Yeah, let's say 251. At that point, yeah, let's flip it on. I'm going to cut it in that. half that's yeah okay you're like my kids you're like I'm like do your chores they're like we'll

win I'm like this evening well win win well before dinner we'll wins that 439 do my 439 that's when you're doing your chores and you better be done by 449 okay all right I love my kids I'm just trying to make you laugh because you guys are all asleep all right my chickens too I've got 30 chickens we didn't intend to have 30 chickens this is story time by the way We're breaking between science and art, so you guys need this. Okay, 30 chickens. I started with five chickens, but if you give a mouse a cookie, or if you get a kid, a chicken. And then the neighbors are like, oh, you have chickens, well, we don't want our chickens anymore.

Do you just want to adopt our five? Okay, sure, yeah, so we were from five to ten. And then another neighbor friend literally dropped his chickens off and told me two days later. that I had four extra chickens in my coop. And then the spring came around, and the kids were like, remember when we had chicks and they were so cute? Can we just get some more chicks? And so we went and got some more chicks.

I think it was like 13 more. Yeah. So, then you have 30. And three of them are roosters, and the neighbor doesn't like that. But what am I going to do? I guess I could eat them. I ate the last rooster. Okay.

So, um, transitioning to the art. Okay. Now you're awake. Okay. This is another gift from the previous movie, if you haven't seen it, right? Much more artistic than the science guy. Um, I'm just going to show you a few examples of art. Um, only because I want you to relax and calm down and be able to listen to what Heath later on today says about the messaging and the copy and what works. He's going to primarily be talking about your page, but in your head you're going to be like, oh, if it sells here, it'll still there, right? Okay, so you're going to have that pre-frame of messaging works in both places. You're going to see two videos here, both very short, both vertical,

so they're very mobile-friendly ads that were recorded recently within the last few months for two offers that we have running, one with McCall Jones and one with Catherine Jones-Lish. And a couple things I want you to recognize. One, how casual they are, how casual the setting is. Two, how much they feel like just somebody ranting on social media. And then three, you'll notice that the first one worked. And so then we told McCall, who was the second one to run hers, she ran it a month after Catherine started running hers. And we said, hey, McCall, Catherine, this video from Catherine worked really well.

So you'll hear the exact same hook lead out, okay? It's the exact same words used in the first five seconds, after which Catherine Jones goes on, you know, her copy journey, but the hook is the same, okay? I want you to know that because if you find a hook that works, lean into that and make 10 more. The hook being the first chunk of the ad, okay? It can be visual hook. You know, there might be something funny or shocking or visually unique about your video, right? Maybe you're wearing a bright color. Maybe you're walking so there's motion. Maybe you know, maybe you do something funny with the camera. Maybe you're holding something that's unique, like a Yoda doll or something. Russell once did one with a Yoda just like literally standing

here behind his shoulder. Didn't even acknowledge the Yoda. it was just there and he was just talking and everyone's like well what's with the yoda right so it was a visual hook it stopped to scroll and then there's contextual hooks and that's the thing you say both of these are contextual hooks and so she just talks about how um how she didn't want to be dramatic but she's going to be dramatic right and it kind of gives permission for her to go on a rant so watch these you guys i don't want to be dramatic about this but i think i have to be dramatic because why are people spending four years going to school, two years going to trade school. When you're going to a coding boot camp to learn a skill to make money, when the most in-demand internet marketing skill right now,

if you know the right way to do it, takes you 20 hours to learn. And here's the thing. Those numbers are flawed because those four years are coding school. It's not time until you make money. That's time until people say you have enough skill set to maybe go try and make some money. When you know how to learn on a building the right way, you're zero to 20 hours from time to money in pocket. We've talked thousands of people at and that is the average number of hours until their first client are you trying to make money quickly on your own terms because if that's the case something like college something like trade school something like a boot camp cannot be the answer there is a high demand skill right now begging for people to fill it if you know the right way to do it then you can win

and win quick russell brunson and i katherine jones lish we're pairing together to teach you this amazing skill set of funnel building our goal is to teach you more in those 90 minutes than most people learn in a lifetime get your free seat below and we'll see you there was that like totally doable right i i know that she got she had some good words right and a good pace um but other than that like the lighting was totally average it was she was just out on a sunny day like there was nothing fancy about the lighting about the coloring nothing fancy about the audio you even heard the wind um it was just clear and quick and to the point and mobile friendly There was a call to action on the end.

She had a very clear audience she was speaking to, and there was what we call an end card at the end, which tends to help conversions. It just recaps what you're wanting them to do, right? It's like, oh, there is this event happening. It looks like a flyer, you know, and you should go and take action, right? So we do like to throw the end card on there.

We do like to blaze in. We call them burn in the captions. You know, some things captions can show up just because you turn captions on or whatever, but we like to burn them in like that. But other than that, it was pretty, pretty light on the editing, like nearly nothing. And so how many of you think you could make a video like that in 20 takes? Right?

You could do it, right? It's not that big of a deal. Okay, so here's McCall's version of that, but for her own offer, but not dissimilar. Listen to the hook. It's the same. Okay, I wasn't going to be dramatic about this, but I think I have to be dramatic about this because why are coaches lowering their prices and adding these crazy guarantees for their offers? Why are they literally destroying themselves, trying to add 18 million different things into their offers

when all they have to do is tweak the positioning of their offer, and they can get way more sales at way higher prices with lower fulfillment. And here's the thing. Even if those things did work, then congratulations. You know how about a bunch of clients paying you not a lot of money to do so much work for them. It's a total recipe for burnout. Now, do you want a business that is fulfilling and lucrative and not stressful? Then the whole make it hard to fulfill.

There's a way to attract your ideal clients, stand out from your competitors in a way that draws people in, makes fulfillment easy, and gets you paid what you're worth if you do it the right way. Russell Brunson and I, McCall Jones, have paired together to teach this new framework all about how offer building for coaches and consultants and experts is so different than it is for other industries and it's easier too. Our goal is to teach you so much in 90 minutes that you can turn around your entire coaching business. business and you can break through to that next income level. Get your free seat below and we'll see you there. Again, there's an anchor. Okay, so what did we notice? Same hook on the front. Different personalities, totally fine. You don't have to be McCalla Jones. She's very theatric, right? But that's her, and it's native to her, and that's fine. Catherine is more direct, educational. That's great. Both of them, in both cases, they were outside. We're finding

that outside out converts, okay, be outside with an interest, you know, and it's not like there was anything fancy in the background. Catherine had a university building behind her. That's not the greatest thing to look at. She wasn't sitting in front of the Taj Mahal or the local cathedral or anything visually interesting other than an university building. And then I don't even know the parking lot McCall was in, but she was literally pacing a parking lot. That's fine. but it's visually it has visual depth okay that's the thing has visual depth the worst the worst I see is when people are like how I'm doing this one on our and they're literally like against a wall like what the heck are you doing like like at least just stand like five feet away from the wall and now I've got

visual depth or something you know what I mean like it's like oh my gosh is that your bedroom door like just get outside you know what I mean what is happening okay so like it's not a lot to screw up that would screw it up. But other than that, you know, it's quick, it's fast-paced. And the other thing I want you to notice is McCall Jones messed up a ton. There was so many jump cuts in hers, which meant she said something and then she stumbled. And then she started saying something interesting again, maybe 30 seconds later. And then, you know, her husband who's holding the camera is like, yeah, no, this is going great. Yeah, ooh, okay, I keep talking, right? And then he just went back and he just cut, cut, cut, cut. And all of a sudden he was able to make one minute of interesting

out of five minutes of ramble, right? That's also acceptable. Just, do the second part and make it not rambly, make it, like, move, right? Make the message be clear and concise. Okay. All right. I am almost out of time. Well, kind of over time. Sorry, Miles.

But, no, so I want to show you one more ad type because this actually worked. Okay. How interesting is this image? Zero out of ten? One out of ten, right? It's literally someone's driveway. It's like the dumbest picture ever, okay? But you stop scrolling because you're wondering why the end.

heck did they take a picture of the driveway? And you're like, did something happen to the driveway? So you stop and you just read a very normal person's very normal picture. And this guy is named Brian Newman. Does Brian Newman really exist? I don't think he does. I think he is a fake profile that they use for ads. There's a few reasons why I think that.

But I want you to realize that a very normal looking person like Brian Newman, when you click over on it, gets a bunch of posts about, I think, his dog and Jesus, both good topics. but it's not like he's some business guru or something, right? Or in this case, insurance. He made a very normal post. I'm going to zoom in here. And this is the ad. This is the ad.

Like literally a picture of the driveway is the ad. I'm going to read some words to you here. I zoom on a little bit. Okay. And I saw this show up more than once with some copy variations. But listen to how normal this sounds and why this is effective. Okay. I mean, when I'm done reading, I'm just going to ask for a raise a hands if, like,

if you would actually like kind of take action after reading this so i'm 38 i have two kids a mortgage and barely enough time in the day to breathe let alone deal with crap like this so when i checked my bank account last week i saw that my car insurance auto paid pulled two hundred and nineteen dollars i freak i drive a 2012 camere no tickets no accidents i barely you know leave the school work schnooks which is local to his zone it's a store um loop here in st louis where you know why the hell am i paying more now than I did when I was 25 and reckless. I called the insurance office over near South Grand to ask what was going on. You know what they told me? Rates have gone up across the board. No explanation, no option, just a polite deal with it. I hung up and I

vented to my co-worker. Right, so he goes on, right? And then eventually you get this thing where the coworkers like recommend this site, right? So basically, no joke, this website she said I should go to, offered me full coverage for $47 a month. At first I thought I had to be some kind of gimmick, but it wasn't, it's legit. The only catch is most agents won't mention it because they don't make money off of it. So there's the elephant in the room, right? Like, well, why is it available and no one talks about it? Well, it's because the agents won't recommend it. They don't make money off of it, right? That's a very important part of the copy. So I switched that same day. Now I pay less than a quarter of what I was paying. And honestly,

it feels like I finally beat the system. Who doesn't want to beat the system? Everybody wants to beat the system down, right? Down deep, this is deep desire we all have. So like, I told my brother down in Springfield, my neighbor across the street, one of the dads of my kids' soccer practice at Forest Park, they all thanked me later. So now he's getting status. They all thanked me later, right? And so I'm sharing it here too, if you're in Missouri and tired of getting ripped off just for being a good driver. So he's calling out the audience, are you a good driver that lives in this area that's tired of getting ripped off? Oh, that's me, that's me, that's me. Right. Well, great. Check your rate below. It's free. Take 60 seconds. Link, right? How many of you

would have gone and clicked on the link? Like, it's a really, really well-crafted, recommending normal guy social post. So native to the platform. So native. I just loved it when I saw this. They're crushing it, I'm sure, because I keep seeing it. Anyway, so you can do it. You can make ads. The art is totally available. Like I said, he's going to get into that messaging and above the fold on your page and all that cool stuff. You've got the science now under your belt. I just walked you through it. So that's what I've got.