Massenomics Podcast - Ep.41: Bulking, Cutting, And Creatine

Episode Date: January 16, 2017

This week, we're joined by Professor Schanz again to discuss the Bulk/Cut cycle, the Official Massenomics Opinion On Creatine Supplementation, and a fair amount of nonsense..    Watch this episode in full color video... Or check out the super-high quality audio version below.. Make sure you LIKE the Massenomics Facebook page... If you don't already have a closet full of Massenomics gear, go to the MASSENOMICS STORE and load up on swag... Also, please CLICK THIS LINK TO GIVE US A 5 STAR RATING ON ITUNES... Click this text to follow Massenomics on Instagram... Vote Massenomics for President in 2016... Have your barber shave our logo into the side of your head.. Maybe get a Massenomics tattoo while you're at it.    Or you could sign up for our email newsletter at the bottom of this page. Stay Strong, M

M-M-M-M-M-M-M-Massanomics Welcome to Massanomics, the world's strongest podcast. Find us on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter at Massanomics. Make sure you go visit massanomics.com. There you'll find the rest of our powerful content. While you're there, check out our store and buy yourself some of that sweet Massanomics gear. ...do chores like the other day, last week, we had him just do the dishes. They loaded the dishwasher and all that stuff.

And then he just had to finish the stuff that didn't fit in the dishwasher to begin. So what he did was just took the dishes out of the sink and just set them upside down on a towel as though they were clean and that was it he didn't fucking do anything and and so we thought it looked it looked legit because the outsides of them you know were we're like oh no he did his chores that's great and then we opened up there's just all this fucking disgusting dishes and it had all seeped onto the towel sounds smart yeah yeah he's strategy yeah so well fuck it we'll start with that um everybody welcome to massonomics podcast we're here in the dungeon i'm making it making it happen for you i'm trying to think when this

is going to come out this is going to be a couple weeks after the first of the year. Does that sound about right? So everybody's... 41. Episode 41. We're still kicking it. Basically, everybody's just rounding out out of the holiday season. So I assume that you guys are all fatter than you were three weeks ago. If you're not, I am, for sure. Actually, I think I lost weight.

Did you really? Yeah, I just haven't been... I mean, you have those big gigantic holiday meals and then like don't really eat besides that. So at least that's what I do. And also if you're not waking up early or at your normal time, you kind of sleep in a little bit.

It's true. It's just hard. If you're being lazy, it's hard to eat as much. I think I don't have that problem. So I guess while, while we've got professor Sean's and that's one of the, one of the topics we wanted to cover today was kind of a, I don't have that problem. So I guess while we've got Professor Shanzan, that's one of the topics we wanted to cover today was kind of, I don't know about everybody, but I'm kind of on one of those accidental bulk cycles throughout the holidays.

I thought I had cut some calories, but I also have been much less diligent in paying attention to them. So, but there is a lot of people, I don't't know maybe i'll just turn it over to you on that subject but it's a pretty common thing that people will have to basically gain some fat and some general weight to add muscle mass and then um you know and then lose a little bit of that muscle in the process of leaning out as well um how does all that spell out traditionally austin well i think the best way to go about it with most people, depending on what your starting weight is or your body composition is to start off with, I think most people are, if you're just starting off weight training, you're probably not super

lean. You're probably just average at that. So one of the things is, is that when you're leaner, you have improved insulin sensitivity and you have better nutrient partitioning, meaning that when you eat and you take in nutrients, the higher your insulin sensitivity is, the more likely those nutrients are going to go to build muscle, recover, things like that, instead of being stored as fat. So most people, you know, it'd be prudent to start off at a leaner weight, a leaner body fat percentage, um, before they decide to start gaining muscle. So, so you're better off, like, if you're starting from, from really nothing, you're better off just going for lean than just to be like, I'm gonna tack on a bunch of mass to begin with. And yeah. And again, it kind of

depends. Like it depends on your starting point. Like if you're kind of skinny fat and you're maybe sitting around 20, 25%. Yeah. I mean, you don't have a lot of muscle, but I think it would be better off for you to lose body fat at that point. So when you do start gaining, you start pushing those calories. You're going to have more of it that goes into building muscle instead of storing fat. So if you start off kind of skinny fat, like I said, 20, 25% body fat. You probably don't want to just get fatter. Right. You're going to have a higher percentage of those calories you bring in that are going to go to fat. And then, you know, you're going to get stronger.

You're going to get a little bit more muscle. But you're probably going to end up with a higher body fat percentage. And then it's going to be even harder for you to lose it at that point as you kick up your body fat percentage. So, again, it really kind of depends on the starting point. If you're moderately lean, I could, you know, see an argument for, you know, starting off with pushing the calories and building muscle and building the strength base. I also suppose it probably depends somewhat on your goals. Like if you're just coming in and you're like, well, I, you know,

I'm kind of okay with, you know, my overall body fat. I just want to get strong. There's probably no reason not to just go hard at it. Yeah, I mean, that's true if you're just looking to get stronger, build a strength base. But at some point, I don't think everybody just wants to be strong and fat. No. If you get strong but you get too fat in the process,

it's just not going to be. Wait a second. It's just not going to be an easy road when you do decide you want to cut. Tanner's going for huge, too, though. What are you weighing now, Tanner? I'm about 275 right now, which is close to the heaviest I've ever been. But you're trying to get even huger, right? 285 by March-ish would be the goal, generally.

I play it by ear a little bit. Sometimes you start looking a little too fat in the mirror and you get some second thoughts, but I think I'm going to push through that this year and shoot for 285. Yeah, I mean's that's something you probably noticed too as you get heavier and heavier and it's not necessarily just straight muscle mass the more weight you gain the more it seems to actually go to fat instead of muscle unfortunately for sure and i'm you know tyler you're talking about doing it too there's a

strongman competition that's in march and uh that would be a big reason of why i'm doing that because i just want would want to be as heavy as i could be for that competition because a lot of that static strength stuff leverages yeah yeah if you're squatting or you're bench pressing and the more mass you can put on whether it's fat or muscle is going to help you from that leverage standpoint uh something you said you were talking about, it kind of depends on your goals, what their goals are. Would you find that you get asked questions a lot that people haven't thought of that part,

that they want to know what they should do? And then kind of the first thing you have to ask them is, well, what's your goal? And then their answer is like well i don't know i guess yeah you know doesn't don't you think that happens quite a bit literally every single time that is my response because it totally dictates how i'm going to answer that question what is your primary goal you're looking to build muscle you're looking to build strength you're looking to lose fat because why can't we just why can't we just do all those things at once

that's what everybody hopes well for real though i think that's a lot of what that's a lot of what comes kind of comes down from like the people that maybe aren't that experienced that's what i hear all the time like well i would just kind of want to lose a little bit of fat and gain a little bit of muscle and then get stronger and they think that those things can happen simultaneously and it just doesn't really work that way does it it? No, I mean, complete beginners might be able to shed some body fat and build muscle at the same time, just because there's a huge like newbie effect when you start your body super responsive to that training, because it's never had it before. So that's about the only scenario when it happens. And then one thing like

you're talking about build muscle, I rarely hear people use that term. It's always tone up. Goddamn. That annoys me. I just want to shape and tone up. And I'm like, well, you know, either you lose or gain body fat or you lose or build muscle. There's really no toning.

I'm sorry. And they kind of look at me cross-eyed. That reminds me of my next question. I kind of want to tone up a little bit. What do you think I should do? Shake weights, primarily shake weights. So how effective has the shake weight been for you, Austin? Great, great. My forearms are gigantic now. We were actually just talking about this today. I want to do a thing where we go through like all the most ridiculous like pieces of fitness

equipment. And I want to find the most raving five-star reviews that i can you know i want to find the person who like the thigh master like the thigh master changed their fucking life yeah have you guys there's this one i i'm pretty sure it's not a real exercise device but i have seen it like on facebook and it's like this tug rope and like i like you put it between your legs i got one of those you're have seen it like on facebook and it's like this tug rope and like i like you put it between your legs i got one of those you're pulling on it like that's not real is it i don't think it is but it's absolutely hilarious i kind of wish it was a real thing i i haven't it's not that far off of a real like there's a little doubt it could almost be a real thing it wouldn't surprise me there was a thing i saw that like you, I swear, I'm pretty sure it was real, but you like put it in your mouth and you shake it and it's supposed to like train your neck.

Have you ever seen anything like that? As I was doing the research for that thing, that was something that I came across. The other thing I thought I was going to clown on for that deal was that it's like a, it's just a big stick that's a little bit flexible that you can shake and shit and it's supposed to be like oh it's great for your shoulders and all this stuff and it's supposed to build strength and cardio but it's just a looks like a bow from a like a bow and arrow but don't they call it like the body blade yeah something like that so so i thought it was just one of the most ridiculous things i'd ever seen and then as i started looking into it it apparently is actually like

comes very highly recommended for like rehabbing and prehabbing shoulder injuries and shit like that i was like so this kind of is a real thing yeah so i can't shit all over it but there's no way that's like a like gonna be your fitness routine but anyway back to the back to the bulking thing so most people don't understand though that you really can't do all those things at once. So, like, if you're going to lose fat, you are going to have to sacrifice some sort of muscle for the most part, especially if you're going to lose fat at an expedited pace, right? Yeah, yeah, I would agree. I would say that if you're going to, if you want to lose fat primarily, like you're going to have to, you're going to have to reduce your calories to a point where that's probably going to sacrifice a little bit of muscle mass, a little bit of strength, but overall, once you lose that fat

and then you get back to the point where you want to gain again, it's going to be better for your gaining, like I said, because you're going to put on more muscle without as much fat going to it. And what about the other way around? So if you're going to just, if you just, if you are now at a point where you wanted to really commit, you're like Tanner, you just want to get, add more muscle. Like you're going to have to sacrifice a little bit from a body composition standpoint. You're not just going to be stacking muscle on muscle, right? Not unless you start juicing. Can we? By all means.

And also, if that's what someone's doing, not the juicing, but trying to just get bigger, gain weight at a certain point, just to hit that number of calories becomes hard while trying to maintain a certain level of quote unquote cleanness of your diet. You know, like if you, the number of calories is going up, how many chicken breasts can you really stuff down your throat? Yeah. Like you gotta go, like I would have to go, you gotta go so hard with chicken and rice and fucking broccoli. You gotta eat a lot to get a significant amount of calories.

What is a chicken breast? 150 calories or something like that? Something like that, yeah. So you just need, I don't know, 50 chicken breasts a day. Well, that's when, though I would still eat clean when I was trying to just get calories on, is I would just drink a fuck ton of whole milk. That would just be, I think Ryan had done the same thing. He you know a fuck ton of whole milk you know that would just be you know i think ryan had done the same thing he just adds you know yeah he drinks a lot of

shit ton of whole milk and i think if you're trying to do it that's not a bad way to you know yeah there's the old uh 20 rep squats and gallon of milk a day tried and true but yeah a lot of people got pretty fat on that i mean milk's one of those iffy things people sometimes tolerate it some people don't tolerate it at all just kind of depends but most of the time if people are looking to get lean like milk's one of the one of those that you just kind of want to eliminate not all dairy products but just milk because the lactose the sugar and it's because there's quite a bit of sugar right i mean yeah i mean it doesn't stop me from drinking a lot of it but there just is quite a bit of sugar in it correct yeah there's i mean per cup amount it's pretty decent i think it's something like seven

or eight grams per cup so it's no mountain dew no no mountain dew but it's just it's the different types of sugar that makes a difference um yeah so my like three gallons of whole milk a week was a little hefty well i mean sometimes you gotta sometimes you got to do what you got to do. You know, I talk about, you know, trying to, you know, not get too fat while you're gaining weight. And Tanner was talking about how hard it is to eat clean. Well, when I was really skinny and I was trying to gain weight, like, yeah, I kind of, it was really hard for me.

I didn't have much of an appetite. So it was really hard for me to eat clean and eat enough calories so yeah you know i kind of went the shitty route with that and would just just whatever whatever i could a lot of milk a lot of i remember eating these like entire box of like 99 cent noodles at the store that was just like 200 grams of carbs and just awful for you pretty much but you know you know, it worked to build muscle. You know, I also got kind of soft because of it. But, you know, it laid the foundation for me to eat more and actually gain some muscle. So, again, it kind of depends on the person.

I think with that, at least then you learn, like, the habit of eating more. You know, because there's a lot of people that, like, you know, you said you're having trouble gaining the weight. Well, you almost just have to make yourself eat like a real asshole for a while, like I do all the time. What do we have next here, Tanner? Oh, let's see. I was going to fire another question at you.

While we've got the professor in the building. As long as the professor in the house. We are also talking about the pronunciation of this word, whether it's creatine or creatine. My money's on creatine. What are your guys' thoughts? I don't know. I say creatine, but it probably is creatine.

I only say, and Tanner, you're in the creatine corner. Well, I mean, I will say it like that as a joke because it's funny to me that everyone I ever heard say it for the last 15 years said creatine. And now people are saying creatine. How did it change? My official position on it is that the E is at the end of it for a reason. So if E was not there, it'd be fucking creatine, right? For sure. There'd be no doubt about it.

So why is it there and why? It doesn't make any sense. That's the real question. That's all you have. Because the English language is a bastard. So how do you say it? That was my question. How do you say the?

I say creatine. No, that wasn't my real question. How important do you think that is as a supplement in someone that's strength training, trying to get stronger, trying to build muscle mass? How important is it? Where would it fit in in your pyramid of supplements? I don't know if I have a pyramid of supplements. But honestly, I think creatine, it's probably the most researched supplement in supplement history. I think hands down as far as i've seen like because in my understanding is it's almost hardly even studied

from a performance standpoint anymore because the you know the the truth is kind of out on it and to where now it's being studied for things like uh you know cognitive disorders and stuff like that yeah yeah absolutely so like so like the the stuff the truth behind what creatine is is pretty much a fact then right so what are those facts well um yeah it's it's pretty well documented that that it has some um you know strength and performance increases um you know you have your atp pc energy, which is phosphocreatine, creatine, whatever. So getting a little boost for your short burst activities, 1 to 10 seconds, where you're doing 1 rep max or real heavy, maybe 3 rep max lifts. You get that boost from it.

One of the good things from creatine from a hypertrophy standpoint is that it'll draw water into the cells. It's what's called a hygroscopic compound. And what drawing water into the cells do is it kind of compromises the integrity of the muscle cell wall and forces it to remodel and get bigger and get stronger. So taking creatine, drinking a lot of water with that to basically get your muscles to swallow more helps to initiate protein synthesis. And like I said, that rebuilding, remodeling of muscle cells. So people tend to think of it from a strength standpoint, but I almost think it's more beneficial from a hypertrophy standpoint and its ability to draw in water.

Which in the long run is a, you know, will give you more to actually add strength onto. Right. But, um, what about the loading? Like that's a pretty common thing with creatine that you hear is, Oh, you first start taking creatine. You got to take a shit ton of it for five days. Um, what, what are your thoughts on that? Tell about the way creatine works from a saturation standpoint first yeah so um yeah there's a couple school of thoughts there if you're not taking creatine and you want to saturate yourself faster i mean you can't store any more creatine in your body you could you know you could load it essentially and take a whole bunch of it within the first week or whatever and reach your saturation point and then you kind of go with the maintenance level after that to me it doesn't really matter if you want to

reach saturation point faster go ahead and load i think you're probably wasting a little bit of creatine in that point you'll be excreting some but you'll reach saturation point faster if you're going to be in the creatine supplementation for the long haul which i think pretty much everyone could be where you just probably should be. If you're lifting and training, like weight training. Yeah. I think it's so cheap. It's so effective. Um, and then, you know, like you were talking about, there's other benefits to it, cognitively, um, things like that, that I don't see why not. It's just, it's so cheap and there's very, like some people have some gastrointestinal

distress with it, but for the most part, people have very few problems with it. My philosophy was always, if you don't have diarrhea every day, you're not taking enough creatine. That was always my go-to. I always have a hard time with it because I just seem to forget. You know what I mean? And, and I'll all and i may space it for days on end which is and but part of it like you said the creatine works on saturation and this is only from what i read on the internet i don't actually fucking know anything but so if i'm wrong but like but basically you know you can't just come off the street and say all right i'm gonna take me some creatine before i go work out and i'm gonna going to be more awesome for having done it. Like it is something that you won't probably see the

benefits until you've taken it for like consistently for a little bit. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. It's not like pre-workout we're going to get it. And caffeine is fast and everybody knows that, that feeling. You're not probably going to get a performance benefit from one or five doses of creatine. No, no, it's a long haul supplement. It's one you're going to have to take for a while. First, obviously you have to, you have to reach that saturation point. And then because of the effects, it's not like caffeine, it's not immediate, you know, mental performance effects. Like you need, you need time with it. You know, it needs to go over however many workouts where, you know, you're constantly, you're pulling that

water and you're getting a little bit of extra energy for your sets um you know and that adds up you know long term for muscle and strength gains how about as far as timing just from a day-to-day daily standpoint of of intake does it make any difference at all or like around your workout not around your workout morning right right so the the important thing creatine, just taking creatine by itself, I guess essentially there's better ways to increase the absorption and the bioavailability of the creatine. And what you want is you want an insulin response, which will help drive creatine into your muscle cells.

And you can get that by taking it around your workout or by ingesting carbohydrates with it. What I do is I take it before my workout with carbohydrates so that, you know, I kind of get a double whammy effect there where the workout and the carbohydrates itself should act to pull in more creatine. You could also do it after your workout with, you know, with a carbohydrate supplement of some sort so you can help, you know, that a carbohydrate supplement of some sort. So you can help, you know, that you'll have that insulin response to help drive it into your muscle cells. So really before, during, after, you know, that kind of peri-workout window is going to be ideal. And then if you

wanted to make sure you maximize creatine uptake, you probably want to have some carbohydrates with it because of that insulin response that accompanies it. You said you take it before you work out. What is your source of carbohydrates before you work out? I take this supplement called Plasma. It's a casein hydrolysate, and then it's a cyclic dextrin is what the carbohydrate is. It's really just a super fast digesting carbohydrate. It has high osmolarity,

which means it moves through your gastrointestinal system fast. So you take basically a slow protein and a fast carb? Actually, the casein, and there's another one, casein or casein. I don't know. I kind of like creatine and creatine. I have no opinion on that, though. It's fucking creatine, guys. Yeah, like casein or my cellular casein protein um we know as slow digesting proteins but actually when it goes

goes under the hydrolysis process um casein's actually the fastest digesting protein a bit ironically there so it's actually a very fast digesting protein it's a trap yeah so really fast digesting protein really fast digesting carbs ideal for your workouts because you want to get that stuff in your bloodstream where it's going to be available for your muscles to to take in and use right on so if i just take a i'd call it cheap economy large quantity tub of creatine monohydrate am i missing out if i if i'm not buying something a little flashier a little more pizzazz um there there are yeah there's a bunch of different types of creatine out there the crealcaline um is another one that i see quite a bit.

I don't think there's that much of a difference before them to justify the price differences that I've seen. Is there like a CEE or a CCE creatine or something? I don't know. Like a concrete or HCL creatine or something like that? Yeah, creatine hydrochloride. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, or HCL creatine or something like that? Yeah, creatine hydrochloride. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, the HCL stuff. Yeah, again, there might be some small differences in it, but nothing that I've seen would justify the price increases.

I mean, really, a lot of the research is done on creatine monohydrate. It's effective. It's cheap. The only thing I would say with the creatine monohydrate is if you can find a micronized version, a little bit smaller, it gets in your muscle cells a little bit easier. And what about dosage? I think five grams is what I see in a lot of things. Is that an appropriate daily dose for most people? If you're on maintenance, yeah, probably. What if you're huge? Yeah, that's a legitimate point, actually. You know what I mean? Like what if you are 1.5 normal people?

Yeah, because mine is like, because what I do when I take creatine, I'm like, well, this scoop is supposed to be for a normal person. So I just do a giant fucking sort of double scoop, and that's kind of my go-to. I don't think, when you're on maintenance, I don't think it's a terribly exact science. No, no. And it's not expensive enough. You know, the thing is is creatine used to be it used to be kind of expensive you know like i it definitely was two or three times more than what it is now when i was in high school you can buy 40 years half a year's worth for like 25

dollars yeah the same day i spent 20 bucks and i haven't and i've had it for a really long time uh yeah i mean if you're if you're if you're larger, you have more muscle, you have more stores available for creatine, so... Like GNC, like that kind of creatine store? Yeah. Right, right. So, I mean, yeah, 10 grams, like normal is 5 grams. If you want to do 10 grams, it's probably not a bad idea.

It definitely won't break the bank. And if you start shitting like crazy, just dial it back, right i think that's a good bet that's my go-to with all my supplements is like if i start pooping out of control just tone it back a little bit sometimes i don't know where which is what's responsible for what though yeah i do change a lot of variables at one time sometimes it's like well i did have like a weird amount of tequila pre-workout drinks last weekend. But so Professor Shantz, you did spend a little time working at GNC, correct? Is that where you kind of got all this? Were you reading all the back of the...

Yeah, many, many moons ago, I was a sales associate at GNC. And no, I didn't learn a damn thing working there. What about some of the claims that are on the sides of the... Oh, God. What's the GNC brand? I mean, there's the GNC red cheap label brand, but then what's that company, Celltech? MuscleTech?

MuscleTech. They're kind of sold big, big at gnc right yeah they they were when i was there which again was quite a while ago i honestly like a lot of so many new supplements come out it's tough to keep up with all of them so i don't know but the thing is is like they all use the same variation of ingredients so if someone asked me about a new supplement i'm like yeah i've never heard of it but send me the label and i can tell you my opinion of it then what what year was it that you worked there like it was 2006 or seven or eight nine i don't know either way were pro hormones sold at gnc at that point in time no they were pretty much on the way out okay because i can remember when they were. They were in like a glass case.

I think what they would do though is anything that would come in, if they could put it behind the glass case, they automatically knew. Charge double the price. They could charge double and people would be like, this is the new hotness right here. Like it's practically illegal. Yeah, they still use it. I mean, even when pro-hormones.

They have it. They still have the glass case now. Oh, they do. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. Even after they phased out the pro-hormormones they still use the glass case to make it look they just put something else in there that's over questionably legal the other thing is they um i also like how they name everything now so like everything is named after something that's probably not would probably make you fail a drug test you You know what I mean? So it's like HGH test fucking homicide.

You know? It's just like named after shit that's going to get you in trouble. It sounds intense. Do you think there should be some regulation as to what is and isn't, what should and shouldn't be put on the labeling of supplements? Should be more, or how do you feel about regulation? I think Austin's libertarian views on the subject of regulation. That's what I'm curious, but this particular subject is also...

Do you feel like increased regulation? Because you know how shady the supplement issue kind of is from a disclosure standpoint. What I think the best route to go with that would be um no i would not like to see the government regulations put on the supplements because then you would not see you know 20 creatine that you can buy for half a year the prices would increase exponentially with the heavy heavily government regulated stuff so um what i think would be best is that companies... The companies just be a little more damn honest and just don't lie.

What you would ideally have seen is that you would have these companies get tested by independent labs. And they would say, you know, there's some high-level independent labs that people trust. And they get their stamp of approval. This independent lab said this amount was in this, you know, supplement and, you know, it checked out and this is exactly what's in there. So reputable company, you know, from a reputable independent lab. So ideally you'd have people that were critical of what they're buying to the point where, well, you know what, we're only going to buy, you know, supplements that have been independently tested by these labs, and they got the stamp of approval.

But that would require some accountability on the consumer's part. And that process would just, even though that stamp would be there, that process would cause a significant increase in price as well. So for something to have that stamp, they are having their products tested regularly and then it's inherently more expensive and most of the people are going to flock to what's cheap and it may just dissolve i mean that's a point there would be a price increase to have to get those you know tested but you think if if you if they were to make everybody you know like force everybody to be tested and verified that that that is the That is the regulation if it was mandated. And then everything would just be more expensive.

Well, yeah, and you would be tested by government agencies. So it would probably be a crap process in the end. I mean, with supplements, you generally get what you pay for. Unless you're in the CrossFit space. Because if you're in the CrossFit space because if you're in the crossfit space all of the supplements are just twice what they should be it's fucking unbelievable because people buy them they're like oh well you know we're we have disposable income so everything that's marketed to crossfit the first thing that they do double the price double the price and then they make

they just and sometimes they can do it well and they can make it as clean and and well as possible there's some brands that do that and there's some that just don't. They just make it more expensive. We should start selling this podcast a little more specifically to CrossFit. Yeah, it's now $200 a month if you're a member of CrossFit. Yeah, that's interesting though. So, creatine in general is good. You should be taking it.

Yeah, I would say anybody that's doing any type of strength training, could benefit from what about if you're not training if you're not training you're probably not listening to this podcast but even if you're not training um i don't think there's any benefit to not taking it well yeah i mean one thing they've noticed is that people that get older they have less creatine in their muscles in their body in general. So they could probably benefit from the creatine. Talking about some of the studies that have come out that have shown like, you know, cognitive preservation reductions and like Alzheimer's, things like that from having adequate creatine stores in the body. So yeah, there could be an argument to be made for, you know, older people or, you know,

people getting up there in age to supplement with even if they're not training. And you said as a negative though, it may may like this sounds like a joke but one thing it could possibly give you the shits or something like that but what about uh other negatives i've heard like someone's mom said that it could give you cancer or or like someone's mom said that it's steroids syndrome but like is there other other really big negative side effects to worry about? I don't think so. There's always talk about people with kidney issues like they have trouble

filtering excess metabolites from protein. Creatine being one of those. If you do have an inherent kidney problem, it's something to be careful with, maybe monitor, talk to your physician about. But if you have a kidney problem.

Stop being a pussy. Yeah. Anything orally, you're like. Yes, exactly. That's just anything that's going through your mouth. Yeah, you're exactly right. One of my favorite things that I've seen on creatine is Dr. Andy Galpin has a, you know, he teaches one of his graduate classes. And when he teaches those students, one of the first things he does on the on on creatine is Dr. Andy Galpin has a you know he teaches one of one of his

graduate classes and when he teaches those students one of the first thing he does on the topic of creatine is he goes to his slideshow and the first slide is they go to the the negative effects of creatine you know they list all the pros and they go to the cons and the cons there's one bullet point and there's nothing in it and then they move on to the next subject yeah and that's most yeah you know that's kind of the long and short of it i mean they're really there's not so many you know there's no like biological free lunch it's not like you're going to take one thing and it's going to make you awesome it's kind of some subtle increases but really i don't think there's a whole lot that's proven out there to be problematic from taking it right very very little downside quite a large upside and it's

cheap yeah so the official massonomics position is yeah thumbs up thumbs up and and the also the official massonomics position is it is pronounced creatine i've i've realized i've been fluctuating between creatine and i actually a while back i'm sure it bothered you guys but i think i accidentally said creatine once after really digging my heels in on it but it's it's creatine and creatine. A while back, I'm sure it bothered you guys, but I think I accidentally said creatine once after really digging my heels in on it. But it's creatine for sure. That's our official position. We're going to have to get a poll going on our Facebook page.

Can we do that? Yeah, I think we can do that. We should do that. We'll probably have to hire somebody to do it for us. Yeah, we're doing it. Did you guys want to see what's in my sack? I always want to see what's in your sack we always want to see what's in here we always do all right uh you know usually everyone closes their eyes i don't know if that would be as as appropriate for today i really want you guys to see what's coming out of my sack while it comes

out this time all right all right can we smell it first uh yeah you. The sack or what's in it? I didn't have quite as much time to prepare what was in my sack today, but this is what I had in there. Not just what it is, but specifically the brand of what it is. The Quest Bar, who does not sponsor the podcast. So that means we're going gonna give it a negative review is that what we're doing no we got leverage here well and i just uh i wanted to open it up with why the hell are these things like so popular in fitness now versus some other kinds of protein

bars like i see these all the time within the last few years. Yeah. I've seen them. I just. Have you had one? I have. They're the ones I had. I did not like. They were very chalky. Very chalky texture. Everyone I've had is like that. Is it the taste that you're.

You know what? When I look at supplements for the most part. The taste. Like if I had to review supplements. The taste is not even on the list. Yeah. Like for the most part. Like I would.

If I had to weight it. Choke down on it. 90% of the weight would be. What's in it. if i had to wait down 90 of the weight would be what's in it the benefits all stuff and the taste would be 10 however i'm going to redirect for just a minute there's the company that's called paleo ethics that is now the new supplement sponsor for the crossfit games instead of progenics i got samples of some of their products when I was in California, and it is the most fucking disgusting tasting shit I have ever had in my fucking life. I didn't know if you were going to say good or bad. Their pre-workout legitimately tastes like dirt.

And normally pre-workout is like a caffeinated, sugary, fucking wonderful thing. And this stuff tastes and smells like dirt. Right. Because the thing is they can only use paleo ingredients right yeah so it's got to be clean as shit but it's fucking disgusting and uh i would sacrifice a little bit of sugar or something for something that doesn't actually um before we leave today i will mix just some in water and you can smell it and it'll fucking like it'll it'll hang with you it'll fuck up your night for sure but the quest, like, taste you guys aren't too thrilled with?

I'm like what you said. I really don't care about the taste of something. If it's, like, going to meet my requirement, then I'm like, yeah, I don't care. So I don't know if I even call it a negative, but, yeah, they're, like, a little bit harder to eat than some other protein bars I've had. This like, they're super dry and chewy, but I, there, I really, then again, I don't care. It's just fine. I would eat it.

Is a protein bar something that you have often? Or like in a case like today where like you worked out, we did a bunch of shit and then like, I got to get some food in me. Yeah. And then we were coming to podcasts right after and I was like, Oh, I want something right now. Cause we're super dedicated. But it's right at the camera that was good but so and quest is really they're really popular don't you think like i think they've taken off really quite a

bit in the last year or so is that is that a crossfit thing at all or i don't know i really don't know i guess i'm not sure what are guess. I'm not sure. What are your thoughts, Austin? Well, I'm just looking over the ingredients here. It's got milk protein and whey protein isolate, so not a terrible protein in there. Does it have any sugar? Less than one gram, so really no added sugar. A lot of it's this corn fiber, which is probably why it tastes so bad because that's the the texture the consistency that chalkiness that we're getting

and then it's got the the sugar alcohols and they're only two grams some you'll see are like they'll be like a 30 gram carbohydrate um protein bar and then they have 20 grams of the sugar alcohols and the sugar alcohols have like less than like a regular gram of sugar like they're four grams per calorie or four calories per gram but with the the sugar alcohols they get processed a little differently they get metabolized primarily in your large colon by gut bacteria and the large colon is the official colon of mass anomics as opposed to the small colon but anyways the issue with that is is when that gut bacteria is metabolizing it that's what gives you gas so if you find yourself eating a protein bar that gives you a lot of gas,

check to see how much sugar alcohol is in it because that gets primarily, like I said, metabolized in the large colon, and the result of that metabolization is gas. Flatulence. Which is awesome. Which is awesome. So the Quest Bar doesn't quite pass the taste test but it's probably legit from like a nutritional standpoint yeah and price wise is the other thing from what i've seen there

all this stuff's fairly expensive i don't know it's like three dollars which seems like quite a bit for that's an awful lot yeah that's just seems to be like what those cost you could have three dollars oh yeah you could eat you're not gonna find them cheaper really yeah That's an awful lot. That's an awful lot. That just seems to be what those cost. I don't know. $3. Oh, yeah. You're not going to find them cheaper, really. Yeah, that's crazy. I just don't have any. It's just cheaper to buy real food.

Yeah, a protein bar is not on my radar of something that I eat very regularly. If I was like, I need some protein quick, I'd rather just like grab, you could get like, you could get like a half a pound of sandwich meat. You know, you get like a half pound of sliced Turkey for that. Yeah, exactly. And just eat it, which I'd probably would enjoy better than a,

than a chocolate chalk bar. You know, I think. Yep. Um, so we don't have an official position on the quest bar. Um, mainly because they haven't decided to pay us money or send us samples.

Yeah, and as always, we would certainly change our tune if they wanted to give us free stuff or money. Then they would probably be pretty up there on the list. Best protein bar ever. That's why we're brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Okay, that was it. You could tell everyone about what, tyler you and i were putting together right before we yes so we finally got and i don't have i don't know it's probably more work for us

to just check our instagram we'll have pictures of it but uh we did finally get our uh strong fit sandbags all put together and by put together we mean we put 600 pounds of fucking sand in them sand that was directly from where austin tyler's vagina boom good joke got jokes um so uh we did have to go to the hardware store because here in south dakota we have no source of actual sand so there's no way to get sand without uh especially this time of year. So we went and bought all of the sand at the store and piled them up. But they look fucking sweet. I'm a little bit concerned about the heaviest one we got because that's a 280. It's basic.

We filled it to 280. It's a 280 to 300-pound bag. But it is fucking gangster heavy. It's super heavy. It looks like it looks like a full heavy bag like punching bag size except it's just full of solid sand so it's just horrifyingly heavy and you're getting you pick it up and it kind of has a little bit of fold in it yeah just enough to where you're like picking up a limp 280 pound body you know yeah that's just like that but it's also super dense yeah you know it's uh but man they look great and we got them in the in the gray color with the red logo print

them on them they do they do custom printing on them now so if you want to get it done um you can go and get pretty much anything that's not like a like a picture you know i think any vectorized art you can have put on there and um yeah that gray now all of a sudden we're like after we see them we're like now we need to start having more merchandise in this gray with the red print on them because it looks really sharp so um we got what did we get 120 pounder which i thought was not going to be that crazy heavy still turned out it was still 120 pounds. Still 120 pounds.

And I had a 180 before that. So we got a 120, a 220, we have the 180, and then a 280, which is more than enough for us now. We definitely don't need anything heavier. We still haven't really done any. We haven't really tried them out. We pretty much filled them and we're wore out. Yeah, and set them in place.

Part of the thing, too, is like we were talking about this, if you wanted them, like you kind of got to really want them. Like you're not going to just buy this on a whim because they'll show up in their empty bags and now you've got to go get hundreds of pounds of sand and you've got to fill them up and you've got to weigh them. Not that it's inconvenient. No, it's just you have to want.

It's just part of the process. They're not going to ship them full for you right someone they will yeah i'm sure they will if you want to pay 700 and shipping but um but yeah they're they're pretty sweet i'm looking forward to using them but after we were done we had to we thought about just taking now we'll take the bags to them we'll fill them up we can fill them up at my house we can do whatever and it was like no fucking way. We'll haul 50-pound bags one at a time down the basement before I'm going to haul that 300-pound thing into the gym.

That's for sure. Right. But, yeah, that'll be. What the hell are you going to do with the 280-pound bag? I would say just try to load it. Yeah, that's definitely not something that I'm going to try to do a carry on. What about a squat? I don't know.

I mean, the 180, I can squat pretty easily, but I don't like to squat them for, like, max effort. No. So I usually like to get that 6 to 10 range, you know, and it really burns your glutes and everything, like hamstrings. You feel it lower back. It's exceptional for that. The 280, I think if I did it it it would just fuck me up yeah you know i think that's could be still be used as a load

but just like what we do atlas stones with you know a pickup and maybe a short move to the platform and yeah i think getting used to to pulling off the floor like that lapping and then and then loading in general yeah it's way more valuable of a training tool than just having a 280-pound stone. If you have a 280-pound stone, you're either going to load it or you're not going to load it, and it's going to hurt and it's going to tear you up, and then you're going to not do it again for six weeks.

At least this, it's not chewing you up. Stones are pretty unforgiving. The bag just chews up your soul. But the 120 is nice because we had, had you know i think uh my wife and a couple other gals from the crossfit gym were over practicing some atlas stones and we have what are our weights for that we have a i don't remember we have 70 a 120 20 and then uh and then a 180 we have a 160 or just 180 180 and the 120 stone was just a little bit too much for you know a couple of them to lift so getting to the um a 120 bag would the 120 bag would be easier because

you can actually engage it with a stone if you're at your max strength for a stone and you go to pull it it just isn't you can't put power to it with your hands because you just it just pulls you off of it but the uh the bag you can at least get a hold of so they can train that movement you can do multiple reps of it until you can get to that stone so i think that's a good weight for them plus for us it's great to be to work overhead and to do lighter carries that was one thing thing Julian recommended was like, you know, at the end of a training session, just grab the 100, 120-pound bag and just carry it, you know, almost Zurcher style,

or just hug it and just carry it for 400 meters. You know, and it'll light your glutes, lower back, hamstrings up, and kind of balances you out because you're not doing it just in a static or, you know, a fixed movement like a static or a you know a fixed movement like a squat or a deadlift or anything you're actually carrying it around and it kind of irons out some of those kinks yep but so that's pretty much gonna gonna be our whole thing for a little bit trying to figure out how to move that 280 yeah that's that's what you asked that's kind of the what we're gonna figure that out out as we go. There you go.

You know, what it is exactly. I probably literally couldn't do anything with it. I did just, you know, we had to mess around with it. And I did just, like, clear it from the floor. And I was like, oh, yeah, it's heavy. You know, it's like, yeah, it's official. Yeah. We had, well, plus part of it was we had them and we didn't use them today.

We just got them filled up. But we kind of just thought, well, I was tired it was we had them and we didn't use them today. We just got them filled up. But we kind of just thought, well, I was tired. Like they look so good, but I didn't want to just sick and tired of looking at them empty. I was like, well, I'm going to get these filled up. And so we basically spent all that effort just to take pictures of them today. But they're worth it. They look sharp. Next time.

Next time we're going to do some serious stuff out of them. But those you can get on strongfit.com. Yeah, that's pretty much just the spot for them. I don't know if there's any other. I think there's like one other manufacturer of like that type of bag. But I've never seen them or used them. And the StrongFit bags, I've owned them before. And I've used them.

And they, I don't know, they hold up. I don't, that 180-pound bag, I've got it over my head and I fucking chuck it on the ground. I don't worry about anything. So that's like falling from 12 feet high. Basically. You know that can take it. That's assuming I'm not throwing it. But uh

they can definitely take a beating. It doesn't even actually make sense that they don't break. It makes me nervous because if I lost 200 pounds of sand on the gym floor, fuck. It would be super annoying. I'd just leave. Yeah. Like, oh, it's there when I got here.

But, yeah, so strongfit.com, you can find the bags. Check them out. We dig them. But, yeah, the printing thing is pretty slick. That was the first. They just started doing that now, and I dig it. It'd be a totally different animal. They'd be just as useful if they were blank,

but I think they legitimately will make you stronger because it has our logo. And if you'd like to get our logo printed on them, I suppose they could do that for you too. That's a good idea. You can inquire at, if you email Richard at strongfit.com as well. But what else we got, Tanner? You come prepared. Another thing I wanted to mention is that as long as we make sure we have all our ducks in a row,

by the time you're listening to this tomorrow, which would be tomorrow to you if you're listening to this on the day this comes out, we should have our Pioneer Belts interview article out with with matt the owner of pioneer that's tanner's way of forcing us to have a deadline now because all right yeah we got some shit to do but it's uh it's uh gonna be a pretty comprehensive piece about uh his background and how he built up uh you know his really how his family yeah how his family built it up and how he's maintaining how it's been handed down. I don't know, I might be biased because I was talking to him, but I just think he was really cool to listen to and I think it'll be pretty cool to read about

what they've done and what he sees for the future of Pioneer. In hindsight, it was so good of a conversation because we recorded it so we could dictate it um or what's or transcribe it but um is that it was it was so good to where it's like i wish we could have just used that recorded that conversation as a podcast episode but it was just like a few components of it where it just didn't fit right it was it was more of a loose conversation yeah it was just like a few components of it where it just didn't fit. It was more of a loose conversation. Yeah, it was just kind of chat. So we couldn't quite pull it a podcast. That was never the intention anyways.

I would say we'll definitely have the most comprehensive profile of Pioneer Belts out, that's for sure. Yeah, and it also couldn't be a podcast because matt gave us his uh all sorts of off the record off the record opinion on stuff that's unfortunately for you guys you won't get to know about because i don't want to piss them off and then have us publish everything he told us not to would which would be the most interesting stuff but if we only quoted him on the off the record stuff it would be amazing best yeah we would get so many views and listens it would be wonderful but uh matt was too good to deal with for us to uh for us to burn it but

hopefully uh hopefully all those things will come out in the wash eventually anyways so the cool thing too he talks about a lot of their sponsored athletes you know there's a lot of uh big time power lifters in there you know, like Pete Rubish and Huck Finn, Andre Milanochev, and the Lillard Bridges. He works with the Lillard Bridges on their knee wraps that they make. And he talks about that process and working with Ernie Sr. But it was just, I don't know, after working with him on it, it just makes me want to buy Pioneer things. You know, I just kind of believe in their company a little bit and another cool thing he's uh big time made in usa kind of

guy uh all the materials that they source you know i don't know if he would say 100 usa but just about everything that they physically can uh he wants to come from usa and you know he markets it that way too but i just thought that was pretty cool. Trump's got to love those belts then. Yeah. He did. What was it? He had a controversy.

He posts quite a bit on Instagram of it because what they do is a ton of custom belts. Basically anything you want on a belt, he'll put it on there, pictures and words and everything else. And it was some play on the uh grab america oh yeah uh and it was something about that and he caught a ton of heat i know that post kind of blew up and people were like flipping out about it and uh that was like two days after we interviewed him and i was like damn i missed it yeah i would like to ask him his opinion on that do you remember like did he put did they he deleted the post damn it yeah because it was like and then he had to kind of apologize i wouldn't say he apologized because i don't think he felt like he did anything wrong you know he

basically he says it's not my belt. I make what the customer orders. Oh, he just put somebody else's belt on. Yeah, yeah. It's not his. Oh, God. People are so sensitive. And it wasn't anything terrible.

It's not like it was his opinion. No, no. It was just made up. And that's what he said. Yeah. Geez. Yeah, yeah. But they were.

So there are some people going off that they're never going to buy anything. They were fans of Pioneer, and they're never going to purchase the thing from him again. Oh, that's their problem because they're missing out. Yeah. You got the, you also ordered a custom lever. Yeah, a custom lever for my lever belt. It's got the Mastonomics logo engraved on there. It looks awesome.

It's powder-coated red. We're getting to the point where, like where everything that we have now is massive. We're talking, we're like, well, we've got to get some smaller spray paint templates so we can, because we have the big ones for platforms and stuff, so we can just fucking tag everything with the logo. Who's going to be the first

one to get a Massanomics tattoo? I don't know. That'd be a big step. Tyler's kind of the one with all the tattoos. I don't really care. I would probably just because I don't really. That'd be a big step. Oh, Tyler's kind of the one with all the tattoos. I don't really care. I would get... Yeah. I would probably just because I don't really care too much about what goes on me. You know what I mean?

But then if you guys buy me out or kick me out, we'd have a fucking real problem. Hey, how about... So that was about it on the Pioneer article. We'll just check that out if you can. You'll probably have seen it. Well, if you're listening to this, you see it tomorrow um but unless we totally drop the ball don't get it done by then i think it is currently like 35 pages yeah that has to get condensed down because it basically is right now a i would say if you were a college student, this could be your senior thesis. It took a long time for me to get it to what it is now,

with knowing that quite a bit would have to be cut out. But I just couldn't. It's too hard for me to decide what to cut, because I liked almost all of it. I didn't want to just start cutting things out, but we'll get it there to a manageable, readable level by that time. Because most of our readers don't actually know how to read so what we usually do is we just condense it all down to memes and fucking like cartoon gestures so we'll get that out to you guys shortly yeah it's yeah it's mostly mostly eggplants and peaches and that's it um how about the soap did you use your power clean soap

i i bar i really dig the uh what's mine the lemongrass tea lemongrass tea what did you think of the lemongrass tea i dig i dig the scent i think you got a deal where i didn't read it yet but apparently there's instructions on how to use it i don't think i was using it we've talked before about my slightly subpar hygiene what's the quote i'm cheaper than i am clean and i was i apparently really was burning through this soap it's been just a few days and it's like halfway gone but i think there's like a way because it is all like natural stuff that you're not supposed to just fucking lather it up like crazy you know and even like the storing of it they had some record i'd have to go back and look so basically i did i did somehow i did so but so wrong what about aside from uh i did going through

it quite a bit yeah i dig it and had you been using a bar before i have i have used bar but i bet i use a bar only randomly like maybe a month or two out of the year because like i'll i have some barred soap so when i'm out of soap i'll open a bar and i will use that until i remember to buy new soap yeah and that's usually like the extent of my bar usage but um what about the scent it's good good. Yeah. I want the mint. It's good. I love me some mint soap. You ever had like, you ever use like a mint soap?

Oh, that fucking, that tingly thing. Yeah. Yeah. When I, anytime you stayed at, if I stayed at a nice hotel,

I know it's an actually nice hotel because one, you have to, for some reason pay for the wifi still, the more you spend on hotel room, the more likely you are to have to pay for the wifi and two, you'll get mint soap. And you probably haven't used it yet, I would guess, Professor Sean. He hasn't showered in a week.

Are you also cheaper than you are clean? I don't think so. So you're cleaner than you are cheap. Yeah, probably. I'm just not really that smelly of a guy like Tyler. Not that smelly. I just. I don't have to overdo it.

Well, you're not smelly anymore now that you've been using your Power Clean soap. I'm just below what smelling good is. Like, there's smelling good, there's acceptable, and I'm just at the lower edge of that acceptable range. Yeah, you're not down to smelling bad. No, no. You're just not. I'm just not winning any awards.

Yeah, that's fair. Tanner, we're about to wrap up here. So what else do you got for today? Anything for Professor Shanz? Because he's going to be, it's probably the last time we have him on for a little while. I'd say a couple months. The Arnold will probably hopefully get three or four episodes in.

Nothing else important. I was going to mention that Professor Shanz and I engaged last night in about a ten-hour-long poker game that went until four in the morning. Did you either of you win? Do you want to tell them who came out on top? Out of everyone, I think Professor Shanz won more money than anyone else. Oh, yeah. Hands down.

Actually, you might have been about the only person that really won any money. Yeah. Yep. It still doesn't make sense. We played for 10 hours, and it was basically just a redistribution of everybody's money until everybody ended up with pretty much what they bought in with except me. Yeah, one guy that lost all of his money, and you won his. Otherwise, we played poker for...

I played about nine hours straight of poker to lose $30 or $40. Jesus. I think if I had to play nine hours of poker, it would be unacceptable for me to lose at all. For my time, I'd be just so upset. It was pretty fun. I thought we were playing for three or four hours, and then it was like 2.30 in the morning, and I'm like, what?

That's what I remember. When I looked and it was three, I was like, no, that can't be. I don't stay up past 11. I've had a couple of those, not playing poker, but a couple of those nights where you're out and you're drinking a little bit. And because I normally am in bed, like if I close down the bar, if it's a quarter to two and I'm leaving, it's a, it's a rarity and it wrecks me for like a week.

But there's been a couple of times where go somewhere, do something. Next thing you know, it's like three or I'll look at the clock and it's like four o'clock in the morning. And I get this, like, it's like I go through all the stages of grief. It's like, I go through, it's like, it can't be, it can't be. And then I'm mad. I'm like, tomorrow's going to be ruined.

Why didn't fucking anybody tell me? You know, I start bargaining. I'm like, if I just go home and I get a little bit of sleep, everything's going to be okay. And I can take a nap tomorrow. It's like,

no, I'll have to sleep until noon to get, to get a decent amount of sleep. And then my next day is ruined. I started trying to predict like, can I take Monday off for this? On a Friday night. Well, Austin, weren't you saying it feels almost like even without being drunk,

it feels like you're on a hangover just from being that far off your sleep schedule? Yeah, I woke up, and I'm just like, oh, my God. Like, I had, like, two beers throughout the entire eight or nine hours. But, yeah, just from such a messed up sleep cycle like that i felt hung over tyler can you believe this guy tried to offer me well i think a miller high life i had to tell him oh thanks no thanks he's a i'm a coors man he didn't know about it man or coors guy man okay man i'm a coors man all right so i remember that coors man i'm not your guy buddy I'm not your friend guy so well I think that's going to do it

for us today unless Tanner wants to interrupt me before we wrap up no I'll wait until the very very end alright guys well that's going to do it for us today thanks a lot for listening don't forget go to where are we at now massanomics.com make sure you scroll to the bottom of the page. You can sign up for our email newsletter.

There you're also going to find our store. You can buy yourself hats, shirts. We should have a pre-order for a shirt out by this time. No, just a caveat on what you're saying. There should be a pre-order for a shirt. Yes, there should. And we're not going to disclose it just yet. But go there

and check it out. A new shirt. A new shirt. It's the new hotness. You'll also be able to find updates on that new shirt if you make sure you like the Mastinomics page on Facebook. Go to youtube.com forward slash Mastinomics. Make sure you subscribe. We're dropping this podcast in both video and audio format now.

Multi-camera. Multiple camera. We're figuring all that out now. This will even be partially three-camera angle video. Yeah, we're really coming up. And yeah, so make sure you go to YouTube, subscribe to the channel. I'm Tyler.

You can find me on Instagram at Tyler F. N. Stone. That's Tyler E-F-F-I-N Stone. I'm going to save Austin the embarrassment. He does not have social media, and every time we bring it up to him, it's fucking super uncomfortable on the podcast. It's just as weird and everybody asks why he doesn't have any and we're just going to move on to

Tanner. It's because my girlfriend doesn't let me have any. You can check me out on Instagram at Massanomics. Anywhere else? That is it. My cell phone number. That's not much better than me. My cell phone number is. He only manages the official account.

That's about it. All right. And we'll release Austin's social security number then at some point in the future for you guys if you want to know more about him. Fair enough. That'll do it for us today. Thanks a lot for listening, everybody. You just heard the Massanomics podcast with your ears. You're welcome.

Check us out on Facebook. Find us on Instagram at Massanomics and make sure you visit Massanomics.com and buy some of that sweet Massanomics gear from your From your friends at Masanamics Studio, home of the world's strongest podcast, stay strong.