Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - 11-Year-Old Witness to Murder | Collier Landry Speaks

Episode Date: November 2, 2024

Collier Landry recounts his mother’s murder, when he was 11-years-old, and how he helped authorities convict his father. Landry recalled hearing a ruckus in his house, later finding out that the noise was his father murdering his mother. Check out Coilliers Links https://campsite.to/collierlandry Follow me on all socials! Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/matthewcoxitc Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/insidetruecrime/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@matthewcoxcrime Follow my 2nd channel - Inside The Darkness! https://www.youtube.com/c/InsidetheDarknessAutobiographies Want to be a guest? Send me an email here! [e-mail] Want a custom Con man painting shown up at your doorstep every month? Subscribe to Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/insidetruecrime Get a custom painting done by me! Check out my link! https://www.etsy.com/shop/coxpopart Listen to True Crime Podcasts anywhere! https://anchor.fm/mattcox Check out my prison story books here! https://www.amazon.com/Matthew-Cox/e/B08372LKZG Support me here! Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/MattCox69 Cashapp: $coxcon69

She says, call your, I want you to know something. I would never leave you. And I was like, well, of course not, Mommy. I know that. And she goes, if I ever do, I want you to know that your father probably had me killed. Next thing I know, it's, I'm startled awake by hearing a scream. And I look at this clock, I have this Batman clock on the wall, and it's about 3.18 a.m. and then I hear two loud thuds about 60 seconds apart.

And between those thuds, I hear my father muttering. I recognize his voice. And then I count 12 footsteps as they walk down the hallway. And I always slept with my door open. And in the doorway, I can see out of my peripheral vision, the two feet stop in my doorway. Hey, it's Matt Cox, and I'm here with Collier Landry and Collier has an interesting story. In fact, I remember watching a documentary on the story, on this related subject. So as soon as I saw it, I was like, oh, wow, I looked into it.

I was like, oh, wow, I need to talk to this guy. It's super interesting. And I watch some videos. And so anyway, check this out. I was watching one of your first, you know, we were contacted. Then I started watching one of your videos and I was kind of like, that sounds familiar. And then I went and as you were telling the story,

I remember and I remember telling my girlfriend as we were watching. I was like, oh my God, I remember watching this. Like 20, like before I even went to prison, I think I watched. Or maybe it was when I was in prison, I watched one of those, you know, one of the documentary type shows. I don't think I watched the whole, I don't think I had watched an independent. entire like a two hour documentary i want to say it was one of those one hour no you probably watched

forensic files that yeah yeah okay like everybody else has yeah yeah yeah so and then i got to the part i i watched one of the shows where you actually had confronted your father um and i never you know i don't know what ended up happening with that we were we were like we were doing like four or five different things at the same time and i was like oh i'm going to interview this guy i've got to interview this guy so that's my documentary that's a murder in mansfield that i made when I can front him. Forensic files is how a lot of people know me, mostly because I was this kid that was involved in this massive murder trial, and I was like the center of it, all of it, right? And that's how a lot of people know me. And then I, in my process, which we're going to get into all

this, but I had made a film called a murder in Mansfield because I did all of these things to try to find out why my father murdered my mother. Right. And it culminates in this, you know, sort of scene, which is like right over my shoulder here, of me confronting my father in prison. So, okay, so let's start at the beginning. You were, you know, obviously you were born. I was born. I was born in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania,

in Brinmore Hospital on February 28th, 1978. And I, all my family was from from Philadelphia mainline area and I grew up I guess like you know like every other kid I guess I thought I had a really normal life I think when we're when we're young we're you know we don't we obviously don't realize what adulting problems are or the situation that we're necessarily in so my family right when I was born we moved from Philadelphia to Pensacola, Florida for about six months. My father was in the Navy. And then we moved to Dahlgren, Virginia when I was like one year old. And I lived on a naval base where I grew up for

the next four years in Dahlgren, Virginia. And my father was a, was a doctor. My father was a doctor on that naval base. You know, I just, I grew up. I thought I just had like a normal life, normal kid. and it wasn't really until, you know, airplanes landed in the backyard and going to the Chesapeake Bay and, you know, going to preschool and that was my sort of thing. And I had like, you know, I was talking about this the other day with somebody. I was just filming with Vice and we were getting into like my backstory. And I was like, you know, I do remember like good times with my parents around that.

You know, I remember really thinking that I was really in a happy family and my dad. You know, being home more and things like that. And it wasn't really until we moved to Mansfield, Ohio, which is where I grew up, the rest of my life, that things started to change. And when we moved to Mansfield, my father had taken a job as a president of a hospital there. And, or not a president, but like he was like, whatever, he was running the hospital. Right. And he was a doctor who was an osteopath. He went to Penn.

And as to my mother. and the thing is is that that was a place where we didn't know anyone right and like I said all my family is from you know Philadelphia so we were this sort of city folk if you will that is Mansfield is now it's it's grown but at that time it was a very small town and it's in the Midwest and it's you know it's they're not used to having people like our like like we were right city folk in the country. So it was a lot for my mother to sort of relate to and my father. But one of the things that, and this is, I think that you, something you could really understand is, and this is unbeknownst to me at the time, but it was an opportunity for my parents

in a place where no one knew who we were to create a life and to sort of have a little bit of a revisionist history in their lives. or, you know, just sort of create a new character, if you will. And so I think that the persona that both of my parents projected was they came from good, wealthy families in Philadelphia and, you know, obviously we're Ivy League educated, but they sort of created this facade. And part of that facade was that we were a happy family. and I grew up spending 95% of the time with my mother.

I was her constant companion and I just kind of thought that was normal. And my father, who was a doctor, was always, quote, working. And so I started to realize as we moved to me as well, I was five years old, six years old, seven years old, I started to realize that like my father was around less and less. Like he wasn't home for family meals or he would just sort of disappear at night. I would often find him sleeping on the couch late at night or if I came up in the morning he was he was gone or he was watching up watching CNN Larry King in the middle of the night

and I remember just sort of going I don't something something's off here but maybe not maybe it's just me you didn't hear them they weren't arguing in front of you or anything like that no so my my parents did argue and and my father was a very violent person growing up. So my father had a massive proclivity for violence, but it didn't really start until I was around seven, where he was violent with me and my mother, like, overtly. I'm sure he was

manipulative to her. I'm sure they got in arguments and all these things. My father wasn't around a lot, you know, and he was, quote, like I said, always working. And then I started noticing this change in the family dynamic. And I had kids that I was going to school with that were children of doctors that were in single parent household. So their parents were divorced. I didn't really quite understand how that worked, but I knew that it wasn't great. And I saw the pain that they were going through with the sort of manipulation between both parents and whatnot, bouncing around on weekends. And, but I still was grateful for this family unit that I perceived that we had. And over the years, my father, my father was,

around less and less. But one of the things that we did do, we did two things together. We would go, I would go with him with his medical rounds to the hospitals, and he would see his patients, and I would, like, tap dance and sing and perform for the people to entertain them, right? Because I was one of those artsy-farty people. So we would do that. And then we would go on ski trips, and mostly would be myself and my father.

So I learned how to ski when I was, like, eight years old, we would go up and one of the things I remember if my mother didn't come with us, which often she didn't. She would stay in the lodge if she did. She didn't personally ski. She did a couple of times. It wasn't really her thing. But I noticed that when I would go with my father, it would be like just father and son trip to go up there. I noticed that oftentimes I wake up in the hotel room by myself or I would see my father talking to a woman and like I remember one time going to look for my father. I woke up and I put my clothes on and was like walking around the hotel looking for him. And I found him in a bar, like the ski lounge lounge, talking to this woman.

And I was like, huh, this is weird. But I didn't really think anything of it. As I was getting older, so 9, 10 years old, I started to develop asthma. And it was pretty serious. And I was not an athletic kid. I was on steroids because of the asthma. I started having a lot. a lot of problems. I couldn't play in gym class. Like I could because it was

exercise-induced as well. It was just really bad, right? Especially during the winter. I think getting bronchitis a lot and things like that. But my father started getting really abusive towards me for not being athletic, calling me a stupid little fat boy. We would play catch in the yard and he'd try to like throw the baseball at my nuts and tell me I was a pussy, you know, things like that, abusive things. And I noticed that things were getting more and more contentious between my parents and there were situations where my father was apoplectic right and he would literally at the drop of a snap of a finger could just he was a rageaholic just you know everything would just hit the fan i remember we were making breakfast on a Saturday and i dropped

an egg on the floor and he just lost it and he threatened to kill me and then my mother begged for mercy and slammed the door and shattered all the windows he was just he was just that type of person so I also grew up in this situation where besides the trauma

that happens later I grew up in a very contentious household of like you know I had a tiptoe around didn't want to set my dad off right and I never really understood why he was that way and he was very Jekyll and Hyde so sometimes he'd be really

really nice right so or he would have these rage fits and then he would apologize as most you know as most abusers manipulators narcissists do i just kind of thought that was normal right right no i know i i know i i like i understand i mean one being in a very similar household and two i was just thinking i was i was uh as you were saying it i was thinking it's funny like you don't notice that's you don't know there's anything wrong i i'm actually working on a story with my my girlfriend and we're and as we're kind of going through it and like everybody

involved in the stories on drugs well you know when you're surrounded by water you don't realize you're in water you know what I mean like a fish doesn't know it's in water so it's the same thing when all you when your only reference is you know you've got a sweet mother and a father who's abusive you kind of assume well that's how it is with everybody right yeah absolutely absolutely don't you realize how odd it is until you get into a normal situation and you go wow my family's fucked off you know but yeah so i know exactly what you're saying you just don't see it no you don't at all and it's a um it is a situation where you just um yeah you just you you can't see the forest for the trees right you don't know your water when you're in water you don't know you

I love that. I'm going to use that, by the way. So I am, I kind of but still thought that I was grateful for my life, right? And my mother was just the kindest, most gentle, a beautiful woman, by the way, and just a kind person to everyone and just really taught me the foundation of kindness. And also my parents didn't suffer fools. like I was the kid who education was a very high priority in my household and I was a kid who was who would school would end would get to play with his friends like get a week off from from school school and then go back to summer school and take summer classes in science art math whatever it was

right right and I loved to learn so I was like into that right and that's how I grew up and And I think a lot of it was, I often wonder what I think back on things is maybe my mother was trying to put me in these things so I wouldn't see certain situations. So if I'm away with friends or at school and doing activities, that I'm not seeing what lies beneath the surface of their relationship, which was, my father was a manipulative, consistent womanizer and abuser. And I ended up finding out much later in life that my father was a manipulative, consistent womanizer and abuser. much later in life that my father was having affairs on my mother, even before they got married

in 1968. And they had been together since they were in high school. He was like maybe 19. I think she was like 17 when they met. And they had had a relationship, like from the very early stages of their relationship, he was, he was a womanizer. He built some of the nation's largest banks out of an estimated $55 million because 50 million wasn't enough. And 60 million, seemed excessive. He is the most interesting man in the world. I don't typically commit crimes, but when I do, it's bank fraud. Stop.

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Stay greedy, my friends. the channel join matthew cox's patreon things really started to change when my grandparents started dying so my mother's mother passed away in november of 1987 her father who was my pop-up who i was probably closest to out of all my grandparents was uh he passed away january 1988 and he had come to stay with us at the end of his life and then my father's father passed away in May or June of 1988. And the other person left was my grandmother, who was my father's mother. Now, my father's mother had three children. My father, a middle child who was my aunt, obviously, and then a younger son,

who was my uncle, who was my godfather, who was very close to my mother. And my mother was extremely close with her mother-in-law, because she didn't really have a relationship, a very good relationship with her daughter. A daughter was a little bit of a tomboy. My mother was a traditional, beautiful woman, into fashion, into art, into like the high society type of things, you know, loved going to museums. And that was something she really shared in common with my, with my grandmother. Now, both of my family's backgrounds were poor working class people, you know.

And, but in this town of Mansfield, they had sort of portrayed that they had different lives. You know, they came from wealthy families and relations, relations to, famous people and things like that, which a lot of them was not true. My father also portrayed this persona that he was a naval war hero. And my father would tell these stories to patients, to girlfriends, to people of like things like going. And I remember we were at this country club that we had joined in Kataba Island, which is northern part of the state of Ohio. And I remember that we were at this dinner. My father was telling this whole story about how he was in his fighter jet, in the South China Sea, and he had to

eject because he got shot down, he ejected, and the ejection latch wouldn't work. So the plane went down in the South China Sea, and he had to take his trusty Boeing knife, military issue, and cut him his way out of the cockpit, and then swim a couple miles to shore and get picked up by a search and rescue team days later. It's a great story. It's not true. You look, you get happened.

But I grew up thinking that my dad because he was in the Navy, and I used to watch airplanes land in our backyard when we lived in Dahlgren. And I thought that my father had flown airplanes. And this is like around the time the top gun comes out. So like 19. What is talking to 87, 86, something like that. So my father was very into top gun. And I thought, oh, and he would tell me these stories, right?

Because that was something my father was really proud of. Of course, when you're trying to relate to your father, I was like, oh, okay. And I bought it, of course. And I remember his call sign, he said, was bumper, which was my nickname growing up because when we lived on the naval base, I used to point to the nose cone of the airplanes and call it a bumper. I used to say bumper.

So he said his call sign was bumper. And I remember him telling me, he's like, oh, they found my helmet. I'm going to get my helmet. I remember asking my father for like years. Did you get your helmet? You get your fighter helmet? Because I thought that would be cool to have, right? I wear my dad's fighter helmet.

it's obviously bullshit my father even told people he flew for the blue angels which is like the navy's color guard right like the most elite elite fighter pilots in the world and there are photographs of my father that he would even have in his office of him with probably more medals on his jacket on his officer's jacket than the joint chiefs of staff for the president I mean, it was just absurd, but again, I didn't know any of these things. Now, I do remember going to the Army surplus store with my father, where they sell those medals. And I do remember getting some for myself because I was a Green Beret one year for Halloween. I think the last Halloween I was in there, you know.

But it was, I grew up in this sort of facade. And, but I kind of didn't believe it. But really when things started to unravel was around, my mother wanted to have, my mother wanted to adopt a baby from China, from Taiwan specifically, like a two-year-old girl. And I was supposed to go over, this is February of 1989, I was supposed to go over with her to China and I got really, really sick the night, like a few days before, really bad asthma. And I didn't go because I probably would have died on the airplane.

And my, I was left with my father. and I had never been alone with my father for more than a brief period of time, right, or with other people around. That was two weeks that I was with him, and it was absolute hell. He was so abusive to me. And I remember, so my father had a real proclivity for violence, and he loved violent movies. And I remember he was watching Commando, and I didn't really like watching those movies growing up. I didn't like to see people getting shot and.

murdered and things like that. So I would cover my eyes and he would call me a pussy, smack me, you know, don't uncover your eyes. You need to see this. This is war. I was in the Vietnam War, like all this crazy shit. My father was, let me be very clear. My father was in the Navy in the ROTC program. He never was a fighter pilot. He never saw combat. He was, yes, he was in the Navy around when the Vietnam War occurred. He never was in, in Vietnam. He never did any of these things. And he never left the United States, apparently. But he would tell me these stories. I mean, just, you know, as a war hero, decorated war hero.

And I'm just, but I, you know, I felt bad. And I believe that I was doing something wrong, right? So this time, very specifically, he would say to me, he was watching these movies. I was in playing a computer game on the computer and I'd unplug the speakers. to the computer. So I wouldn't disturb him. Literally it was just like trying to be considerer of my father. He comes into the office where I'm playing the video game.

It was like Math Blaster or something, if you remember that. And he says, why is there no sound coming through a computer? And I told him, I told him why I unplug the speakers. And he just lost it. And he grabs the speaker wire and he shoves it in my face. He's like, I'm going to fucking stick this in you. He sticks to the back of the computer, and he starts screaming at me. He starts taking books and computer games and throwing them at me off the shelf and screaming

at the top of the long. So also, my father is six foot four, a good 225 pounds. He's a big dude, you know, and I'm a kid, an asthmatic little chubby kid. He starts chasing me around the house, making me stop and salute him every time he said, what are you? And I'd have to stop and salute him and say, a stupid little fat boy, sir. run around and do all these choices. He's just screaming at me.

He's throwing things at me. He's whipping me with a belt. And he did that for a period of about two weeks. And I remember he, and then he would stop. And then he would apologize and say, it's okay, Daddy, sorry, and all this stuff. Like, you know, the master manipulator, right? Is he drunk? Like, is he?

No, no. So, okay. So everybody says that. So I want to be very clear. My father never drank. My father was not an alcoholic. And as far as I knew, didn't abuse drugs. Like I, you know, I, I only saw my parents drink on very limited occasions.

My mother liked in Arametto Sour. I think my father maybe drank scotch, but like they weren't drinkers. You know, alcohol wasn't something I noticed in my house. He went, now his father was an alcoholic, but he wasn't. And so he was just a rage-filled human. And I, I, um, so this was the time I was without my mother, you know, and then it's this apologizing back and forth, right? So finally my mother comes back and I'm now aware of like why she's ever like let me be with my father for longer than certain periods of time.

And I thought, you know, okay, there's like some real issues here. So she comes back from China. and then flash forward a few months later it's Memorial Day weekend 1989 and I go with my father to this barbecue party and we go like out the outskirts of Mansfield into the country country and go to these people's house and they're like racing quads and they're barbecuing and people were drinking beer and playing volleyball and I had never seen anything like this as a kid because My mother was very preppy, very properly, as was my father. We didn't really, like, no offense, but, like, we didn't, quote, associate with people like that. Like, you know, they're, and not that there's anything wrong with it.

I had a blast, by the way, like riding a quad. But I'd never seen anything like that. Dirt bikes, all this. I wasn't aware that those things like this. I, you know, I raced bikes when I was a kid. It was like BMX kid and all that stuff. But, like, I never, I never saw that, right? And there was a woman there, a young woman.

And I met her. Her name was Sherry Campbell. And I, towards the end of the evening, I'm walking with her daughter, who's a couple years younger than me, we're walking around the lake and we're like skipping stones and all this. And I look back and my father has his arm around this woman. I was like, huh, that's kind of interesting. And we're getting ready to leave and he gives her a kiss on the cheek, which wasn't

like necessarily totally out of character because my parents kind of did the, you know, thing that you do with, you know, friends. and whatever. But I took note of it. And I asked my father on the ride back home, I said, who was that woman? And he explained to me that she was a patient and that she was terminally ill

and that he was there to comfort her in her health problems. And that's why he had his arm around her because he was consoling her. I was like, oh, that's horrible, you know. I didn't really think anything of it. That was satisfactory enough answer for me. On school ends, and in June of 1989, it was Father's Day.

And my father goes, takes me to his office and he says, or go to his office, we pick up some stuff and he stops to go get a suntan. You know, this is like the late 80s, so the sun tanning is in. And this woman, again, Sherry Campbell, is at the suntan place, just happens to run into us. and she has two radio control cars, and she, you know, says, hey, happy Father's Day, I got these for you guys, and all this. It's like, oh, yay. And I'm like, of course, you get a kid, radio control car.

You're his best friend. But I noticed something that's kind of odd. I see a ring on her finger that I recognized my mother was wearing at one point. And it was a diamond slide ring. It was very unique. Like, it wasn't a standard ring. And I said, oh, my mommy has a ring like that. And she just kind of giggles and she looks at my father.

I don't pay it any mind, and as we're getting ready to leave, I get in the car and I look up and my father is full on making out with this woman. And I had never seen that other than movies, right? I thought, oh, okay, something's up. And my father gets in the car. And so I ask him, and he goes, I need you to tell your mother that I took you to the office and I gave you the radio controlled cars and not tell her about meeting Sherry or anything like that. I need you to do me that favor. And of course, I'm afraid of my father, so I don't want to say anything to him, but I know that something is seriously wrong with this. And I lied to my mother out of fear from my father. Right. So we go to

that night, and then in the middle of the night, I get very sick and obviously racked with guilt as a kid because I never lied to my mother. And the next day I'm playing with the radio control car, my father is not there. And I come in the porch, I'm just so overwhelmed with guilt. And I say, mommy I need you to sit down and I tell her I said I think daddy's having an affair and she was 11 years old okay and I say to her this is uh yeah

1989 and I say to her I said I think daddy's having an affair and I tell her the whole story of meeting Sherry meeting Sherry back in Memorial Day um you know she got the cars and how she had the ring and how they were making out and all this stuff my mother said thank you for telling me She was upset that I lied to her, but she was thankful and she understood why my father put me in that position and it wasn't fair to me.

And she's grateful that I told her the truth. She goes in, she makes a phone call and there's a lot of screaming. And that was when I realized that like, oh, my God, like some of these other kids, I'm going to be a child of divorce. I don't have this particular I don't have this perfect family that I thought I had despite my father's behavior and despite my father not being around all the time

I still thought I had a family unit intact and I realized that that's not the case so this is like I said end of June 1989 and this is when things really started to unravel so my parents started to engage my mother files for divorce because unbeknownst to me at that time

my mother and father had a had an understanding which was my mother had said you know my father's name was john but he went by jack she's like jack you can do whatever fuck you want don't involve our kid the moment you involve our kid that's the line in the sand and he did he involved me by introducing me to one of his girlfriends and that was it for my mother and she'd filed for divorce and for the next several months it was getting really ugly and my father would like leave little notes in my bed saying, I love you, buddy, and everything will be okay. And, Daddy, like, basically the victim, like, mommy's doing this, but mommy will come to her senses type stuff that he was saying this. And I'm thinking, myself, I don't know what's going on,

but, like, it seems like you're at fall here, buddy. And because my mother was my most important person to me. I spent, like I said, the majority of my time with her. But it kept getting uglier and uglier. And my father, I would, if any time, I would spend time with my father at this point, this is towards the end of 1989, we would randomly run into Sherry Campbell. And he'd be like, look who's here. It's Sherry. You're at a Kmart. And she just conveniently, we would just, sherry was sick. Yeah, exactly. I thought Sherry was going to die. I thought Sherry was, oh, now she's, she's definitely not terminally ill.

No, okay. And, uh, because she's still around. Um, so that was a lie. And what happened is, is that, Yeah, we randomly run into her and he had was like moved in with her staying there. He wasn't at our house hardly at all. He would come back and get things and things were just really, really ugly between my parents. And my father gets nastier and nastier. This is like like around Thanksgiving of 1989. My father's telling me things like he's going to make sure because I believe my mother finally filed for divorce in in November of that year, November 1989, officially, and my father started telling me how he's going to make sure that

I get yanked out of the school that I'm at and go to public school, like all the other, quote, poor kids. And I'm going to, he's going to make sure that my mother and I don't have a house to live in, that, um, that, uh, he, that, uh, he's going to make sure that my mom is working at McDonald's and that I don't have enough clothes and that, and that we are, we suffer. And that's how I'm going to grow up. And he's going to create a beautiful, wonderful life with Sherry and her children and give them everything. This is what he's telling me as an 11-year-old child.

And I started noticing my mother's demeanor was really beaten down. Because unbeknownst to me also was the fact that my father is a doctor, but the whole reason that my father is a doctor is my mother who graduated from the University of Pennsylvania School of Dentistry and got her dental hygienist degree was working in Philadelphia in the 60s and 70s, earning $25 an hour to put my father through medical school. And my mother ran all of his books and took care of all the accounting for my father's practice because my father went into private practice after he left the hospital because he was asked to leave because it was womanizing and because he had so many complaints against him,

which, of course, I didn't know any of this as a child. So my father starts telling me all these horrific things. So my mother is driving me after picking me up to school, from school, we're going to a restaurant called Bob Evans to eat. And she says to me, as we're driving down the road, she says, call your, I want you to know something. I would never leave you. And I was like, well, of course not, mommy. I know that.

And she goes, if I ever do, I want you to know that your father probably had me killed. And I was like, well, how is that, mommy? and she said she starts going into this fact that you know so my father's italian and she said you know your father has mafia connections and you know your your father just has ways to to dispose of me who knows if that's even true yeah based on all the other like you know who knows what he's telling her exactly and you know my mother did know my mother did i ended up finding out eventually like my mother did know her family and there wasn't these connections like at least not that way but there was she was just in fear of her life and i had kind of seen that at that moment like

okay something's up so the holidays are here and it's just not a great holiday you know christmas my father isn't around like he's with his new family buying them all kinds of presents and stuff like that and it's just a whole thing right and my grandmother who's my again my my father's mother was supposed to come stay with us for Christmas and have a wonderful holiday. She doesn't come for Christmas. She instead comes for New Year's. And she arrives on New Year's Eve, or December 30th, 1989. And what's interesting is my mother, when they were arriving, she saw my father drive down the driveway. We could see my grandmother was in the car. And she said to her best friend who she's on the phone with, well, Jack's here with his mother,

so I guess he can't kill me tonight. And the irony of all this is that my mother used to say things like famous last words. My mother had a very sardonic sense of humor. Right. So, you know, she used to say like famous last words, but famous last words. So I, my grandmother arrives and we have dinner, whatever. My father leaves. and my grandmother and my mom

are sitting in the living room and I give everybody a kiss good night I give her a hug, night mommy. Next thing I know, it's I'm startled awake by hearing a scream and I look at this clock, I have this Batman clock on the wall and it's about 3.18 a.m.

And then I hear two loud thuds about 60 seconds apart. And between those thuds, I hear my father muttering. I recognize his voice. And then I count 12 footsteps as they walk down the hallway. And I always slept with my door open. And in the doorway, I can see out of my peripheral vision, the two feet stop in my doorway.

And something's telling me, don't look up. Because I firmly believe that if I had, at that point in time, there's no, it's nothing to make the whole little bigger. she left with the kid. Yeah. Because that's actually probably more plausible. 100%. 100%.

And the footsteps go away. I somehow go back to sleep. I wake up a few hours later. I jump out of bed. I run straight to my mother's room. And there's a bunch of sheets that are off the bed. It's in disarray. I'm looking for blood stains.

I'm looking for anything I can find. I come downstairs. My father is sitting on the couch watching CNN. and with a towel wrapped around his waist. I said to him, where is my mother? And he doesn't respond right away. So I said to him again, I said, where is my mother? And he looks at me and he goes, well, Collier,

mommy took a little vacation. And I knew at that moment, it was game one, motherfucker. Like, you fucking killed her. But I don't really want to believe it, but I'm like, this is what's happened. So my grandmother comes in and my father says to me, um my father says okay so we're not going to contact the police we're not going to contact the

FBI and I thought that was really bizarre when he said the FBI so I'm like what like we're in Ohio like at the FBI um and he goes into this whole story of explaining that the thuds that I heard was my mother throwing her purse at him and that she had come downstairs and attacked him and started screaming at him over the divorce over money and through her her purse at him, threw all her credit cards at him, left the house, walked down the driveway in the dead of winter with no coat, and got into a car that was waiting for her at the end of the driveway and left. Uber?

Yeah, 1989. She pulled her iPhone and got the Uber. That whole story doesn't make it. In a town where I don't know very many people in the middle of the night without my credit cards, without anything, without a, yeah. Without a coat. Yeah. And left her personal vehicle there?

Left her personal vehicle there. Left her just left her children there. Didn't grab the kids. Just left. And so that's already very fishy. Right. And I know my father is lying, right? Because once he involved me with the sherry, with the mistress,

I started realizing that all the shit that my father told me my entire life was all bullshit. like my father was a liar and i was like okay so this is the type of person i'm dealing with so i was i became even closer to my mother during this time between when i discovered that he's a womanizer and has this relationship to when she goes missing so our bond only gets stronger because now i believe my mother i believe and i see the pain that my mother's going through in this whole divorce and separation and divorce and i'm just like this guy's a horrible fucking human being my father's a real i've already didn't really care for my father to begin with.

And now I'm like, you're a fucking asshole. And now my mother's gone. And now you're feeding me this bullshit. So my father leaves and my grandmother, who's there and she's bought the whole story. And she's like, okay, you're not going to call anybody. You're not going to tell anybody because he doesn't want us to tell anybody. Like, yeah, that's fucking ridiculous.

So my mother had just bought a, huh? It doesn't make sense. Like you're going to try and track her down at the very least. Of course. And what I, what I do is I grab. My mother had just bought a cordless phone. I grabbed this cordless phone. I'd go upstairs.

And I had saved all my mother's friend's phone numbers. And I had hidden them in a Garfield that I had in my room. I grabbed that list. I go into the bathroom. I locked the door. I start calling everyone. I tell them what happened. I tell them, I can't call the police.

I told my father I wouldn't call the police. Call the police. Right. So a black and white shows up at the house a few hours later. And two, you know, uniform officers come in and my grandmother is just livid. with me, screaming at me, saying, your father does that not to call the police? Why did you call the police?

I was like, I didn't call the police because I didn't call the police. And they're coming around, but my grandmother is literally helicoptering. She is hovering over everything. She's telling them to get out, get out of the house. You don't have a right to talk to this kid, blah, blah, blah. And I'm trying to like explain to them. My mother would never leave me.

Like something has happened to her. This is the bedroom. They're just kind of looking around or whatever. Turns into a missing person's report. So I follow up the next day with my mother's, friends, and they say, this is a missing person's case. You know, we filed a report. I'm like, well, it's not, like, she is missing. Yes, but something has happened to her. She's dead or she's, you know, locked in a room somewhere. And, you know, and they all knew that my mother would never

leave me because my mother did have friends in town, you know, other doctors, wives and stuff. I had friends growing up, but, but she didn't have a family here, you know, and the family was all back east. And they were also very estranged, especially after my grandparents passed away, which I'll come to find out later. Why? But my, so the next day, so we have this like, it's New Year's Day by this time, and my father's girlfriend shows up and we have this whole like, you know, pot, or pork roast dinner. It was just terrible. But earlier in the day, what happened is the detective showed up.

And his name was Dave Messmore. Knocks on the door. My grandmother, again, is like, you can't come in. You can't do this. And he's like, well, I just want to, you know, have a word. is the doctor here? No, he'll come back later. He's like, if I just have a look around, he charms his way. And I'm like, come on in. Come on him. It's my grandmother, again, loses it. And she goes to call my father on the phone.

I grab him, I pull him aside and I say, give me your card. Like my mother would never leave me. Something's happened to her. Give me your card. I'll contact you. I'm going back to school. It gives me his business card. The next day I go to school, the first thing I do as I walk into the principal's office, I give her the car, so you need to call the Mayasville Police Department, you need to call this guy, you need to get him here. Dave Messmore comes down to my school, and over a period of like two or three hours,

I lay out the entire history of my mother and father and everything that happened from our whole, the whole situation and the girlfriend and all the details, meeting her, my father's abuse towards me, my mother, what really happened on New Year's Day, on New Year's Eve and what I heard and everything and I tell him I said

I'm going to go home because my father won't be home my grandmother will be dealing with my sister if he was adopted from Taiwan I said I'm going to go upstairs and pull the bookshelves out of the wall and look into our crawl space to see if I can find my mother's body or I'm going to start I'm going to start

looking for clues I'm going to see if I can find her one person that she would never leave the house with. I'm going to see if I can find this. And I just started laying out what I sort of plan was. I think he was looking at me like I was fucking crazy. At the time, I'm almost 12 years old, but I'm still 11. He's like this kid, but I was a very articulate child.

And growing up with parents that really valued education, like I wasn't watching television and stupid shit. I was reading books and read my father's medical books for fun. And, you know, our idea of going on a family vacation was go see all these museums. and everything. So education is a really high priority in my household. So I was a well-spoken little kid, and I begin to gather evidence against my father. And over the course of the next 25 days, and today is a very key anniversary date, January 25th for me. But over the next 25 days, I start gathering evidence, and myself and Dave Messmore begin to put together.

and ultimately, it leads to my father's arrest, which is on January 25th, 1990. But I start gathering evidence, and some of the things that are happening is my father's coming home and he has all these marks and cuts on his hand. So I report that. He is really sore,

and he has me rubbed Ben Gay on his shoulders because he was so sore, and he said, from moving boxes in his new practice in Erie, Pennsylvania. And I'm just telling the detective, everything as all this is transpiring over the next to several weeks but it wasn't until mid-January 1990 my father takes me to his office to go pick up some paperwork and I'm watching my father like a hawk you know so I don't let him out of my sight right and every night like during this time

his divorce attorney is over at the house Dave messmore keeps coming to the house with other and other officers do to want to talk to my father he wants to question my father but he refuses to talk to him And I see Dave at the doorway, and mind you, I'm talking to Dave behind my father's back at school, reporting on everything that's going on inside the house. And it's like we have this thing and he's pretending not to know me and I'm pretending not to know. It was really weird. It was crazy. But what happens is I go with my father to get this paperwork in his office and on the drive back, we stop at a gas station. He walks in the gas station to purchase some stuff and pay for gas.

and I'm watching him through the windshield. I start rummaging through his car. I open up the center console of his truck, and I find two photographs right next to each other. One is of a house that I've never seen before. And the other one is of his girlfriend, Sherry Campbell, with her two children sitting in front of a fireplace that's wrapped in plastic,

so it looks like a new fireplace. And I just kind of put two and two together. Like, this is a new house. She's involved. this is something significant. So I say I go to school and I tell Dave Messmore

about this. Towards the end of January, so around January 21st, 1990, because I don't hear from Dave after telling him about this house for a couple of days. I notice my father's behavior is becoming,

he's becoming more and more stressed at home. But oddly, my father is not angry. My father is turned actually into this sort of very passive person in a lot of ways where I was watching I was playing a video games

I got Nintendo for Christmas that year was a fighting game and he saw me playing and he goes I didn't know this was a violent game I wouldn't have bought it for you and I'm thinking to myself who is this guy

like you're Mr. Violence you're Mr. I cover my eyes when you're watching Commando and you're angry with me and I'm playing a beat him up double dragon game and this is what you're upset about

I was like this is so bizarre but my father comes to me is around January 21st, 1990 and he says, is, you know, Collier, I know it's been really hard on you, you know, with your mother leaving us. It was always, it was always with him over the course of this sort of investigation. It was everything that he would tell me was, your mother left us, your mother left us. You know, hopefully she'll come back.

We would pray at meals at night for her safety. I mean, it was wacky shit. And I said, I was like, okay. And he said, well, I have a, I want to. take you on a, like, let's just do a father and son bonding trip. And I have a medical conference in Florida and I'll take you and we'll have it just a father and son bonding trip and they'll be really great. And I'm thinking to myself, okay, man, every year we would go to Tampa, Clearwater Beach, and we would go for medical conferences. But they were always in the

spring. They weren't in the middle of January. They weren't right after Christmas because obviously these things are structured to like families can go on spring break and the kids can go bush gardens and whatever and it's a fun trip right it's clear water and I knew something was up and I the next day I tell Dave Messmore I call him up and I said this is what's happening and he realizes like because I tell him I was like I'm going to drown the Gulf Mexico I'm not coming back from Florida and he knew that and as potentially the only key witness in a murder case he was very concerned So the morning of January 24th, I get yanked out of my house.

Can I wake up? What's that? Oh, yeah, of course. Please, please interrupt me. Is this a year later? No, this is, no, this is a few weeks later. A few weeks later. So it's, yeah, okay.

No, so this has been, so my mother goes missing on December 31st, 1989. This is now like January 24th, 1990. Okay. I thought maybe because, you know, a lot of times of, sure, homicide detectives or cases, you know, they take forever. Of course. and which is very interesting because now that seems to be the process

but this was not the case with my father so what had happened is and like I was saying my father's behavior was becoming he was more and more passive

he wasn't getting aggressive but he was very nervous so I I began to think okay you know I tell Dave Messmore. I've been telling Dave Mess for

all this stuff. And then, so they yank me out of the house. Children's Services comes in. They say, we're from, you know, child services. You need, you have 20 minutes to pack a bag and get your stuff. And so I started packing my clothes and I say, okay, what about my dog? And they said, we'll come back for your dog. I never saw my dog again. I pack a bag for my sister. As I coming down the stairs is when I discover the entire house

and my grandma's screaming at these people, the entire house is filled, they're coming in with men and women in white coats. And they've got all kinds of contraptions with them. Like, they're executing a search warrant in my house for my mother's body. And it was complete mayhem. I get taken to a friend's house, a friend of the family's house, and I'm not going to school that day. I go and I, I'm approached by a,

a social worker comes, and I don't know what a social worker is, you know, a caseworker, but I know it's not a good thing. And she basically explains me, I'm going to be staying here for a while. I won't be going back to my home for a while. And they're kind of looking for my father. And I'm like, okay. So that night, which is January 24th, 1990, I have what is literally the worst asthma attack in my life. And I,

I'm pretty convinced that I'm going to die. And I'm in a home. I don't have my medication. I don't have the stuff that I need to breathe, really. I don't know how I made it through the night, but I did. Next morning, they take me to the hospital because I somehow stabilize. They take me at the hospital, and I go to see a family friend who's a doctor. And as I'm walking into the hospital, the lobby is filled with people, and there's an honor box.

You know, honor boxes where they have the newspapers. and I just, as we're walking towards it, I get kind of veered away from it and go into the room and the doctor's there gives me an injection for steroids. I get a breathing treatment and I'm like, okay, I can finally breathe. And this is January 25th, 1990, and this is when

this is when they tell me, they say, Collier, Lieutenant Messmore found your mother. And then there's like this eternal pause. and she was dead. And the first thing out of my mouth was that bastard. And then that's when the circus starts. So I have a question.

Did you, I mean, did you, are you still, you're still, you're 11? I'm 11, almost 12. So did you think? were you still holding out hope that maybe she was alive or you just kind of knew i knew but in that moment man like you you have that like you have this little like glint of hope yeah in you that maybe what you really know to be true is really not true like they're going to say lieutenant sver found your mom she was you know uh she was vacationing in the bahamas uh she was in aruba she was uh shopping in toronto and she this and that she was you know you kind of hope that it doesn't have the ending because

nobody wants to think that their mother has been murdered right and their mother's been murdered by their father right so my father they leave me out of this room and of course I see the honor box which has Boyle arrested for wife's murder wife found you know on the headlines and um this was January 25th 1990 so 33 years ago and I, I'm just like, and I already knew that my life was altered. I was like, this is, like, I've officially crossed the Rubicon now. Like, my whole life is over as I know it, like completely over. And I just, it's really hard to explain, or it's really hard to articulate the emotions that come through that.

think, you know, and I think for you, maybe you can relate on a totally different level, but I think, you know, you were convicted for, you went to prison for 12 years, right? Yeah, almost 13 years, yeah. Yeah, and you, obviously, you committed a crime, you knew you were guilty, you talked, we talked about that, but, you know, there is a finality when somebody, like, when the judge, you know, hands, when the judge says your sentence, right? You're, you're sentenced to however many, you did 12, 13, but maybe it was like 20 years, when you were out for good behavior or whatever it was, right?

But when you hear those things, like, you officially know like, okay, it's no joke, this is like reality is set in. Like, there's no coming back, right? I mean, I'm sure you've had that, you had that experience. Despite your guilt, like, it still hits you like, oh, this is real.

Like, it puts a button on it, right? Right. So I feel like, I mean, I didn't know exactly what was going to unfold, but it was a circus. So I go into the foster care system temporarily. I'm staying with friends, actually. I'm not even in the foster care system yet. I'm temporarily saying with friends. My mother's mother comes in time, or my mother's, I'm sorry, my mother's

sister, my aunt Carol comes in town. They have a memorial service with my mother's friends. And I testify at the grand jury hearing to indict my father, tell them everything I know, and I helped them secure his indictment for my mother's murder. Did you know, I'm sorry, did you know any of the details at that point? Like, did you? I just knew, Sue, I knew a few things because they started asking me questions about, have you ever seen a blue tarp around? And I said, yeah, it was on our porch.

Anything else? Oh, there was, you know, there was this green indoor, outdoor like astroturf carpeting that my dad had rolled up on the porch for months in 1989 you know they started asking me have you ever seen this here i was like yeah i saw this yeah i saw indoor outdoor carpet now i didn't know the details of what they had found you know but what it happened was is while i'm having the worst asthma attack of my life the night before on january 24th they are excavating my mother's body from underneath the basement floor of this house that I had found the photographs of that my father had purchased with his mistress,

Sherry Campbell, and they dug up her body underneath the basement floor, and it was covered with green astroturf. There was new bookshelves, and they almost didn't discover it. They just happened to see a splatter of concrete on the wall that wasn't cleaned up, and then they knew that the floor had been excavated, and they ripped everything up, and then that's how they dug her body up. and it was wrapped in a blue tarp which I saw for months just sitting on our porch so the charge was premeditated murder because my father had planned all this for months

right he bought all this equipment set it out so this wasn't like a tarp that you had for 10 years for painting one time this was he went out and started collecting bought the house or yes had a whole all of it all of it and so I testified at the grand jury and a couple of things happen states like okay we're going to go with somebody right my father's side of the family wants nothing to do with me because they feel very strongly I'm the reason why my father's arrested and they're under this you know spell of my father who is a psychopath and a master manipulator and narcissist that he's

innocent and now I have somehow involved police and dishonor the family And I'm the bad guy at 11 years old. My mother's side of the family. Even though the body ends up in his mistress's basement. No, no, no, it's not his mistress. It's his house that he bought with her. And she forged, she wrote her name is, so her name is Sherry Campbell. She's not married to my father.

My father's name is Dr. John Boyle. He's still married to my mother. She writes on the documents to purchase the house, Sherry Boyle. And then she puts an N period. because my mother's name was Noreen Schmid Boyle. So the initials line up N-S-B, right? So if any of they ever checks, it looks like that, right? Because nobody knew what my mother's mill name was, really.

So it's this whole thing. So everything was very calculated. And he even asked, and it comes out in trial later, he even asked the real estate agent about lowering the basement floor in this house, which was brand new, by the way, about lowering the basement floor. But it was at the lake level, so you can't really get underneath the floor too much because of the water level. It'll fill with water, right?

Right. So it ends up being this whole, it's a fiasco. So my father's side of the family wants nothing to do with me because they feel that I'm the whole reason that this is all transpired. And my father's innocent. My mother's side of the family, my godmother, says to me verbatim, this is my mother's sister.

We cannot take you in because you look like your father. Okay. so i was there's a whole bunch of really really logical people very very logical and rational people involved in this entire situation and it's very it's it's a very peculiar situation to be in when you are the youngest person in this scenario yet you are the adult right and i'm just dumbfounded I'm completely devastated that my family has nothing to do with me. And I go into the foster care system, which I don't know if anyone understands the foster care system in the United States or how it works,

but it's fucking horrible, despite the circumstances in there. It's just not great. And I basically have to, while in foster care, come to terms with the fact that my father has murdered my mother, he's about to go to trial, I'm the key witness in this trial, and even though prosecutors said to me, well, you know, we don't need you to testify if you don't want to. You don't have to testify. I was like, over my dead body. Because, you know, when it goes to trial, I'm 12 years old. So I turned 12 a month after all this happens after they take the body up

and I'm in the foster care and all this stuff, right? And I really, in the nader of my life, I have to somehow find the courage and the strength to go, okay, I'm going to do what's right. I've been doing what's right for the last several months for my mother, for my family, and I'm going to tell the world what I know and face this monster in court.

And a lot of people were under the impression that I was, it was like videotape testimony like you phone in. No, I was in the courtroom. And the videotape is because they were filming me in court for the news because the trial was televised live throughout the courtroom and they actually had. It was such a circus that the courtrooms filled up every day. It was like the hottest ticket in town.

And so they had to put television monitors out in the hallways of the court so people could line up to watch the trial and of this doctor, you know, who murdered his wife. And my father had a high power legal team and all these things. And, you know, for that time, right? There's no Johnny Cochran, but like for Mansfield, he had a high power legal team. And I just thought to myself, like, the thing is, is that you have two choices. You can tell, you can do the difficult. thing, which is tell the truth, face this monster, and honor your mother and do what you know

is right or you can do nothing. And I realize, and I don't know how I realize this, but this is all a testament to my mother and how she, her upbringing and what she instilled in me. But I realized that if I didn't do any of this, there's going to be two things that we're going to happen. One, decades later, when I'm looking at myself in the mirror, I wouldn't be able to live with myself. Second thing is, if my father, you know, if my father somehow gets acquitted and I don't do anything, I'm not going to be able to live with myself.

Also, the scary reality is when you're testifying against your father and you have somebody who has this type of behavior, if he gets acquitted, he's going to, my life is over. My life is already over, but now my life is over again. And I'm going to be reliving this nightmare every single day of my life. Hey, remember when you try to put me in prison for murdering your mom? Oh, by the way, I did it because there's no double jeopardy.

You know, it could be something as simple as that. So I just, I mean, it's a really hard thing to face. But I did it. And I said, I'm going to do what's right. And I'm going to go in there. And I testified for two days at trial against my father. father and he is still incarcerated to this day right um but you you still have how much time did he get so he got 20 years for aggravated murder which is premeditated murder in ohio at that time

um and then a year and a half for abuse of a corpse but he's on old law so every time that he wants to be released he has to go before the parole board and plea his case and then they can can give him more time. It's not like a 20 years and you're out type thing. What do you mean give him more time? You mean, he goes to the parole board and they don't let him out on parole. Exactly. And they keep him inside again.

Nowadays, the system has changed from my understanding is where if you're charged with a crime, they just give you a flat rate. So it's a, you know, it's a one size fits all. Okay, you committed this crime, then this is what you're going to. and on 20 years and one day you're out you know and you're on probation right

that doesn't that wasn't occurring when he was when he was sentenced so he's still incarcerated 79 years old when he goes in front of the parole board what is does he still say oh I'm innocent shouldn't be here

or does he say I fucked up I don't he does he what does he do well well so I had a relationship

my father for decades because, I guess we can get into this but from what I understand is he still is in denial of it or he's responsible for her death but finally in my film when I finally confront him because I basically I grew up in this town

and I was known for this and I did not want that I didn't want anyone to know me for anything but who Collier is. And so I basically went off to music school for a few years, dropped out and moved to Los Angeles because I wanted to be, I wanted to tell this story. And I was either like, okay, I'll become a rock star, become famous and tell my story and change the world and help people. Or I'll become a filmmaker.

I'll tell my story, change the world to help people. That's what I ended up doing. I ended up becoming a filmmaker. And this whole process, for me was trying to understand why my father murdered my mother. So in my film of murder Mansfield, I confront my father for the first time. And I've had, you know, I had had a relationship with my father. I come to visit him in prison all the time and over the phone, phone calls, and, and I have 400-some letters. I read them on my podcast, moving past murder to expose

like narcissism and gaslighting and things like that, right? But this was the first time I've ever put it to him like you murdered my mother and I want to know why and he has this whole story of just that she came down the stairs and she confronted much like he told me in that morning but he left out but he now added the details of he pushed her she hit her head on a piece of furniture and when he came back to her body she wasn't breathing and he tried to give her CPR Now, I imagine he didn't call 911 or anything like this. Right. But in the film, as I discovered, and through my process of healing,

I end up reading the case file. I found out, I find out that the back of her skull was smashed in, most likely with a hammer. So my mother's principal cause of death was suffocation because when they found my mother's body, she had a plastic bag tied around, tied over her head. So my father had hit her in the back of the skull and tithed her up with a plastic bag and she suffocated to death.

And my, but my father denies this. And I even ask him, I say, well, how does she get the plastic bag over her head? He was going, oh, I put the plastic bag over her head. And I'm like, oh, okay. And he's like, I'll put the plastic bag over her head because I didn't want her to look at me. I'm like, oh, yeah, you didn't while you were murdering her? of course you didn't so there was all these really just strange things that he has in his defense so I guess the first time he was up for parole was in 2010 and I'd actually gone to the parole board

and vouched for his release for two reasons one is I wanted to curry favor with him because I wanted to tell this story I'd always wanted to tell the story and I knew that he wasn't getting out because there was a little a laundry list of people that were going against him and I had no means for him to come live with me in California. I could barely take care of myself. You know, he couldn't move in with me now. I don't have the ability to take care of someone else. And I just knew it was impossible.

But I knew that it would curry favor with him because I wanted his participation to be able to tell this story. And so I would visit him in prison and I would phone calls with him and stuff. And I had a very surface relationship with my father for 25, 26 years. I'm never really getting into the nitty gritty. When he did, when he was first up for parole, he did come to me. He did tell me that he was, quote, responsible for her death because his behavior led to my mother's murder.

Because my father's always maintained as the one-armed man or somebody else did there. He's got all these theories. Like when he was in prison for years later, he was getting everyone riled up with theories that she was in a Chinese baby smuggling ring and gold smuggling ring. and pedophile ring and selling sex slaves and just like crazy, crazy shit, you know, QAnon type stuff, you know, just so out there. And it's just obviously grabbing for straws. But so I don't know in the parole files what he actually has really said, but his story has always been maintained of that he's quote responsible for her death, that he pushed her,

that it was an accident. And that's been the whole thing. Now, he didn't give that story a trial. He said she left. She got into a car and left. They got into the fight. She threw the purse out and the credit cards. No jacket gets down the driveway and leaves, which of course is a lie, right?

And there was really no circumstantial evidence as far as like fingerprints and blood in his car, as far as I know. I did recently find out that he had rented a cold storage for her body. And because he had given his ID so he could store the body while he dug her grave. in the house well what about i'm sorry um what about the uh the girlfriend that signed for the house i mean she signed she's i mean i know that's you know like identity kind of a you know she she had to know something was odd that she's signing for her and um you know like she was never questioned what was her well no she was definitely a question and she took the fifth of the trial and my father was going into business with her uncle

who was a chiropractor, you know, they were going to do disability medicine, which is like workman's comp and things like that. That's what they were going to do together. And he was like a sketchy character from what I understood. But here's the thing is that she told me that she wrote Sherry Boyle because she thought they were going to get married. And he'd always told her that she was separated from my mother and they were divorced and all this stuff. But when you're, you know, she was 27, 28 years old and all this happened. You know, when you're, when you're in a relationship with a narcissist and a manipulator, like, you know, it's very easy to run mental gymnastics around someone, especially someone like her. And she just believed it,

hook, line, and sink her. And she said that he came in before the real estate agent came back in and he told her to put that N period initial in front. And she didn't really understand why, but she just did it. And so she was always under this impression that my father, I mean, for a long time, I had to sort of reconcile with the fact, like, did she know about my mother's murder? Because I blamed her in a lot of ways because I was like, not that she caused my mother's murder and that she was a participant in it, but that she was, that she was guilty by association because my father was having this relationship with her. And that's why she was, that's why my mother was murdered in the first place, which isn't really true. My father is a psychopath. And she was also pregnant.

So I have a half sister that was born 12 days before my father was arrested. and it's you know she was in a position and she thought like she had the whole world on her at her doorstep she's going to marry this doctor she's going to live this amazing life she's going to start a new life she had already been through a series of marriages or in relationships that didn't work she had two kids from those relationships or marriages and she's going to marry a doctor it's like the fairy tale for somebody you know who's you know from the Midwest I was like oh my god I'm going to have this amazing life, right? And he had the jackpot.

The sad thing is that my father was also hitting the jackpot. He had a girlfriend that was 20 years younger than him. He was having a new baby. He's got all this money. He's getting ready to make. Somebody told me that my father was going to make $160,000 a year working 10 hours a week at this sort of consultation practice that he was doing in Erie, Pennsylvania.

I mean, he had it made. And there was no reason to murder my mother. And if anyone, it would have been flipped because my mother probably was the one who should killed him because he was winning the divorce because he had all the money. He had restricted. at her accounts and was controlling everything. But my father had supposedly told my mother, and this, I believe, came out in court that he told my mother,

you're coming to Erie with me one way or another. And my father wanted to have his cake and eat it too, like any good narcissist, psychopath, sociopath, does. And one of the things that, I don't know, I lost my train of thought. But yeah, he was able to pull the wool over Sherry Campbell's eyes. Again, it took me a long time to sort of reconcile this and go, okay, she's not, because she's not guilty.

She's guilty by association. Right. Do I think that they helped plan my mother's murder? No. I think that my father is just so good at manipulating people and gaslight people. That, I mean, he's a psychopath. and all of this was just literally premeditated and carefully thought out. That's the difference between like narcissism, psychopathy or sociopathy.

Psychopathy is it has a plan and you're very calm and it's very executed. It's very methodical. Jeffrey Dahmer is a psychopath, people like that, right? And my father's the same way. So I always say sociopath, sociopaths get into a, get into a, get into a fight in a bar and they immediately get to a argument they immediately get into a fight a psychopath just kind of says okay goes to a he gets in his car drives to a gas station fills up a thing of gas goes to your house and burns it down with you and your family in it correct correct

both not good both not good one has a plan though but one has a plan that's very methodical and very well executed and that was my father now the fault for all these personality disorders is there also is a massive degree of hubris that is involved with these types of personalities like dumb cops will never figure this out

I can do wherever the fuck I want you know what I mean and that's what my father's attitude was and ultimately he got caught by an 11 year old kid right because he was sloppy and because I was determined because I knew what he did

and it yeah it's it's fucking wild man when I talk about it and like I said today it's like been 33 years since I found out

that she was murdered and he was arrested and it was the trial this century in my hometown I mean in Richland County Ohio it was

just I can't imagine you know I think at the top of the conversation you were bantering and we were talking about you know crime and you mentioned

something like oh it takes years sometimes these things. I think now if this crime had been committed, you know, there'd be every YouTuber and every TikTok are talking about it much like they're talking about the Idaho 4 and this, in a Walsh case and whatever the case is of the moment, right?

And all these people speculating on forums and things, I think that that would have been, that would have been what was happening right now, you know, and all this content be floating out there and it'd probably be years before my father would be brought to trial, right? And now, as you know, the system is all about plea bargains and things of that nature. That's how they get people,

right? So who knows? and he would have probably had higher power lawyers and would have done it pro bono just for the clout of the case and this, that and the other. So when I think about the timing of everything, it was a very swift justice that was dealt. My father was arrested January 25th.

My father was convicted on June 25th. So do you still speak with him? I haven't spoken to him since around 2020 around the pandemic because his prison was the one that was taken over by the National Guard in Ohio when the guards all got COVID so it like made international news

and so I had communicated with him to make sure he was okay also because my father and I shared the same blood type and I wanted to see that was when COVID was out and everybody was talking about blood types and things like that I thought okay I'm asthmatic is he is he sick and he was quarantined he had COVID

but he had no symptoms and I was like okay hopefully I'm okay okay but no he's still incarcerated and fairly healthy for a 79-year-old guy who's been eating shitty prison food for 33 years. Do you plan on, you plan on?

Yeah, and I've been slowly like contemplating, you know, reaching out to him again. I mean, I have letters from him, recent letters. I had a stalker that just, well, I guess it would be almost a couple years ago now, January 2021. She was starting a pen pal relationship with him. And then she would send me her correspondence with him. Because I would ignore her.

Right. So that was fun. There are odd people out there for sure. But it has been, you know, I have spent my life trying to cope with all of this in a way that is healthy, in a way that is positive, and in a way that can affect change in the world. and I started a podcast last year and it's called Moving Past Murder and I share my personal story

and I talk about how these things relate to me it's part true crime part mental health and I share my father's letters from prison I talk to people I play like I have all these taped interviews and my father did from prison like five years after he was convicted of like him spouting these conspiracy theories and I have new ones

that have just come to surface I find letters I find people that reach out to me And, you know, being abandoned by my whole family and having to grow up in foster care, and I was finally adopted after about a year. I was adopted by a really great family in the area. And they were strangers, pretty much, but they had a very large family of like brothers and sisters, so I had a lot of cousins. And that was a unique experience.

And it was really challenging growing up with them in a lot of ways because they took on a kid. I don't think they quite realized what they were getting into, but they just wanted to help. and, you know, we couldn't go anywhere without people knowing who I was. So they had this relative anonymity and all of a sudden they adopt this kid. It's a whole other thing. And they, you know, so that was a rough go for them growing up, but we have a wonderful relationship now and we have for decades, you know.

Right. And they've been very supportive and very understanding. And even, you know, I remember my adoptive, George would, I would get these letters from prison from my father and my, and he would break them down and my father would be like manipulating me. He would say things like, oh, I really wish that I could have a filet of fish sandwich right now. I would give anything to have McDonald's. And he was like gaslighting me and trying to, or not gaslighting me, but trying to manipulate me to feel sorry for him because he's incarcerated. Because my father was always constantly working on and probably still

to this day would be working on trying to have me rescind my testimony. He tried for years. And I even went as far as my father had hired a lawyer while he was incarcerated for an appeal and had alleged all this new evidence that the body that was in the grave that they pulled out from the grave was not my mother's. So I gave permission to have that body exhumed when I was like 16 years old, 17 years old, and gave DNA testing to further prove that it was her just to give my father a benefit of the doubt. Just for my own piece of mind, I wanted to know, like, is this real? and obviously it was her and then as far as it's coming to Los Angeles

becoming a filmmaker because I was obsessed with telling the story and finding out at the core of it was to find out why my father murdered my mother and going as so far as enlisting a two-time Oscar winner to direct this project and then getting into the prison and that was years of my life I spent going back to Ohio seeing him in prison getting to know the prison staff

they had a production facility in the prison where he's at now, and I would go into that facility, I would go into the actual prison and sit and teach them, because they had a production facility, I would teach them how to use editing software, and I would help them order cameras and show them how to shoot and show how to do graphic design and teach inmates this. And then I would sit with my father, like not in the visitation room and just chat with him and then be teaching these people. And it was just to build this whole bond so I could get in there and be able to tell this story. it was really extraordinary to be able to do that and very cathartic and even though you know

confronting my father and asking him why did you murder my mother i ended up realizing that it was such a great discovery because even though people were like well you didn't get your answer you didn't get your why i'm like yeah but i did get the answer by telling me nothing you tell me everything because he's a psychopath and i think that if my father had told me why if he had said i murdered your mother because of x y and z that would never be good enough because i'd have even more questions this way i'm able to put it to bed in my mind and go no you're just just you realize when you're talking to somebody like that and you're and this is who they are that you realize that some people are just born evil and my father's one of those people yeah i was going to say if he owned up to it

completely you know then there would actually be some atonement or or you know redemption there for him and that's not who he is because the person that does this doesn't ever want that does i'm saying he's still trying even to his dying breath you know maybe when he realized maybe when he realizes yeah i'm not getting out of this maybe he does it but i doubt it but you know to that probably go to his grave saying you know the one armed man well it was it was always like he what he did say is and then and then there's a story of the knife and that comes out halfway in me confronting him she came at me with the knife i didn't know what to do i'm like with the knife where the i want the knife what are we talking about here the golden child um i'm just like oh okay

so where did this come from so there's all these stories he there's never going to be you know for him there's never going to be I murdered her because she was in the way of me starting a new life that I wanted or I wanted to take my money the money I was going to be making but but she wasn't even winning the divorce that's the thing is she wasn't going to take all this money and even the police were like she had more motive to kill him than he did her he was going to get out of it and have money and a new family and a new life my mother was the one who was going to suffer I was going to be the one that was going to suffer. So she, you know, him committing this crime was not, it's not logical, but we're not

dealing with a logical person. And the fact that he just still has to have all these reasons and excuses just shows the psychopathy and everything behind me. Because at the core of this, he's a narcissist. He's a psychopath. And he's someone who, it's their fault. It's what she did to me she was going to divorce me yeah dude you impregnated another woman and you're going to go start and like why would she be married to you and we see this happen all the time right this is not something that's new that these people behave like this and they say well you know and him his comment of you're going to come to erie with me one way or another she did and my father ultimately wanted to be able to go down in that basement and look down and say, I fucking told you so,

bitch or whatever he was saying. You know, he wanted to know that she was right there beneath his feet. And that's a psychopath. Right. So do you have a relationship with your step-sister? So my half-sister was, well, there's two, but it's totally fine. my half sister and I had a relationship up until when I made the documentary she was going to participate and then she decided not to and I had offered both her and her mother a chance to be a part of it

and she was actually going to be a part of it and I think her mother convinced her and I don't think she did to not do it but I wanted Sherry to be able to tell her side of the story so people didn't look at her and go oh well you're at fault and of course giving people these opportunities they don't take them and then when something comes out then they are looking at the story looked at or they're excoriated for their behavior. And they're like, well, I didn't do this. And it's like, well, yeah, this is my adoptive parent's older. This is why Collier was trying to get you to participate.

So you can tell your side of the story. So I chose not to do it. That everybody's upset that people have an opinion about her. Well, guess what? You didn't tell your side of the story. And I gave you plenty of opportunity to do that. Exactly. Listen, I have the same thing happen all the time.

I contact people and they, and then, you know, no, I don't want anything to do with it. Okay. Well, then I always explained it. Then you realize that somebody else, most likely law enforcement, will tell your side of the story well they'll tell your story and they're probably not going to do it the same justice or tell it from your you know your perspective yeah and then it comes out and they go you made me sound this way or you this or made this or that wasn't true and that well you had a great opportunity to clear all of that up you know so it's so funny too because

sometimes it's like like sometimes it's even minor what like when I would read articles about myself I would get all been out of shape and upset over minor details and of course I was before I started writing and now once I started writing I was like eh that's not a big deal eh that's not that's pretty accurate I probably wouldn't have said it that way but yeah you know and everybody so I look back now and I think there's about 95% accurate and the few things they got wrong were stupid my outy wasn't wasn't white it was silver you know you know what mean it's just stupid like like you don't know anything that my outy was silver like it's really not crucial what's what's funny is so when you make a film about your life right and and i wasn't really

supposed to be in it i was going to be part of it and i was going to be shooting it and then we kind of called an audible at the last minute and so i'm like i mean i'm like i mean i'm look terrible like I'm wearing like set clothes type thing like like a fat grip you know anything but I was people were like oh what was the editing process like and look I work as a film editor and I edit content and I you know I make movies and shit like that but I was like I didn't want to be any part of that process because of course everything would come in vanity so like what you were saying like with the color of the audience and there's all vanity things like I was like I look fat here I sound stupid here like don't don't put this in but it's like that doesn't serve

the narrative of the story like and nobody gives a fuck what color your your Audi is no one gives a shit about the sweatshirt that I was wearing. What they give a shit about is the content and what we're talking about, which is amazing in a lot of ways. But yeah, you know, and sometimes these things can become a solipsistic endeavor, and I'm very grateful that that's not what this turned into because it's a very powerful, powerful documentary, and it's not even true crime. I mean, I'm so new to this world of true crime, you know, discovering all these people

and seeing this whole sort of underbelly that exists. I mean, like I said, I was just working with. the company with Vice doing this. Well, where is the documentary? So you can, so the documentary is actually on my Patreon. Okay. But I made it with an investigation discovery.

You can find it on Amazon. You can find it on Hulu, but investigation discovery has it or Discovery Plus now. But it's also my Patreon. People go to my Patreon. You can just subscribe and it's on there. And you can get a whole bunch of other content. I've got like, you know,

I've got letters from my father in prison. I do episodes of podcast ad free. And there's, player there you can download all the episodes i think i'm on every episode to 74 and uh there's a whole um yeah there's a there's a there's a there's a bunch of content on there to sort of you know shows my life and a lot more of the stuff that i'm doing and uh but yeah that's where they can find the documentary so you you just said you have the episodes on the on patreon but you have your episodes on your your youtube yeah so i have episodes on my youtube and i do ad free ones all on patreon

but yeah so my you do everyone can find me at my website which is call your landry.com uh you find me on tic-tok instagram wherever at call your landry um and you can join my patreon through there but everything is on my website the podcast because my podcast is called moving past murder which was something that i started as a continuation of what the documentary was which was you know i made the documentary i made that because I was very, very passionate about growing up that when we looked at cases, because I had from a personal experience, the bad guy goes to jail, the victim is dead, the state gets this restitution, the gavel hits and we say next, like what's next, right?

Next case, next case. We never examine the consequences of violence, the consequences of communities on ancillary victims, friends of the victim, family members of the perpetrator and what it's like. and also to expose, like, this is what it's like to not only have your mother murdered, but having it done by your father. So you're both the son of the victim and the perpetrator. There's not a lot of people that are in this world that can experience that and talk about it. So I made the film to show that and to show what healing is like.

But also, I do that further in the podcast, moving past murder, to show my process of going through all this. Like I said, it's part true crime, part mental health. you know and it's it's me exposing things that I go through and you know I do it on TikTok too but the podcast is a way to really find me how what on YouTube or just yeah it's on YouTube it's on Apple Spotify where I get a podcast from yeah how often are you posting so I do every a new episode every week okay every Friday new episode comes out of moving past murder yeah I have a new podcast. I'm starting called Survivor Squad. We're just getting ready to release, which I host, co-host with Tara Newell from Dirty John. How is it getting guests? Like, so I have a sort of

mixture. I reach out to people or people come to me. They've seen the film. They've heard they've watched the podcast. They've seen the story. And I have so many people, one of the things that is really, one of the things that is really powerful about making something and being so vulnerable is that that vulnerability and authenticity really resonates with people. And so I get messages out the woodwork of people who have seen the film who've listened to the podcast that it has resonated with. They've just said, thank you so much for telling your story because it has helped me so much in my own personal journey of healing because I,

I never got justice or I'm a victim of sexual assault. Unfortunately, a lot of these people are victims of child sexual abuse that reach out to me because they haven't healed from that trauma, you know, the adverse childhood effects, the ACEs, as they call it. And they say to me, you know, watching you do this, first of all, they're horrified by what happened to me. And they're like, well, what I do has happened to me is pales in comparison to you. And I'm like, well, yeah, but it's not a, it's not a, it's not a, it's not a try.

It's not a contest, right? It's like everyone's trauma affects them only uniquely. Like, no, like, yeah, my shit is so horrific. But like, that's the exception, not the rule. That doesn't discount the way that somebody's been through through their own trauma. But I'm so glad that the message helps them and helps them heal and get on that journey and feel reassured of that journey that they're on to heal them. because that's a really powerful thing.

And I know my mother would love that I was doing that for people. So, yeah, it's been, it's been a really amazing journey. But as far as guests, you know, just people reach out to me. They say, I'd love to be on the program. Or I reach out to, like you, I reach out to them and I say, hey, I love to have you on the podcast, you know, and I think people have interesting stories. And I like to, you know, like I said, it's true crime mental health. But I'm trying to steer away from necessarily true crime as this, you know,

salaciousness of it all, it's more of, I want to talk to people who've been through extraordinary circumstances because we've all experienced trauma. We all have. If you were born before 2020, we have all experienced some sort of trauma with COVID, right? That's a traumatic event that the world experienced unless you live in a cave in Afghanistan or something like that. So there is a, there, we all have had to deal with certain tremendous circumstances in our life, or extraordinary circumstances in our life, and how to come through and build resilience. And, you know, I tell people all the time, I say, you know, it's not what you've been through that defined you. And this is what I aim to show through all the work that I do

is it's not what you've been through that defined you. It's what you take from that and what you do next that defines you. And some people can go through, you know, I had a psychologist tell me and she goes, you know, you're the outlier. If you were sitting under a bridge in East L.A. with a needle in your arm saying, fuck the world, no one would blame you. You have every right to do that. But you don't live you that way. And, you know, there are people that can just literally take this up.

They're angry. They hate the world. This injustice happened to them. They've been through all this trauma. They bottle it up inside. They say, fuck the world. I'm just, this is, it's not fair. I'm just getting, and they can be, they, they self-harm, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they're not only on themselves, but others. Or you can take that, and you can say, this, I've been through this shit and I'm not going to let this affect those around me negatively. I'm going to turn it into a positive, and look, I'm up here talking about this, I'm far from a perfect person, absolutely, absolutely, but I am someone, I am someone, I am,

who I feel can look themselves in the mirror every day and go, I've done the best I can, the best I could, do the best I could when I was younger to honor my mother and carry that through my life and try to be positive. But I'm also a perpetual optimist, which I found out was a trait my mother had, so it's an apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Yeah, I was going to say, it's definitely perspective. Yeah, life is going to use it as a crutch to fail for the rest of your life. No.

Yeah, but listen, so many people do. Yeah. So many people do. Look at what you're doing. You're literally taking something that is, I mean, granted, it was something of your own creation, but still you could also come. I mean, how many people come out of prison and reoffend? You know, recidivism is a real thing, you know?

And you chose. Yeah, exactly. Fraud is actually the highest recidivism, right? Really? Yeah. Murder is the low. lowest yeah yeah because most of them get out and they they never reoffend that you know it's usually it's very circumstantial and and you know of course they're under the microscope the rest of their

life and you know so you know very few people do they actually get out and commit our murder again I mean they're out there but very seldom when does that happen yeah I'm talking about the people to get out yeah yeah um and then there's you know then drugs then you know so it keeps going but yeah fraud's the worst. Interesting. You know, especially because the people that commit fraud have such psychological problems. Like it is all just, it's narcissism and just straight arrogance and it's so hard to know how to easily manipulate the system and then not do it because you're so desperate to prove how

smart you are, you know, which is also why most people get caught, you know, it's hard to just shut your mouth. Like commit the crime, shut your mouth. it's not really so much about the money as it is about letting everybody know how smart I am. So then you get caught. Well, there you go.

Stupid. The same thing that gave you the guts to pull it off is the same thing that is your detriment. Yeah. You know, which was definitely, you know, definitely my undoing was that I just allowed, you know,

just shot my mouth off, allowed too many people to know what was going on and included too many people and was not, you know, nearly as careful. And, you know, it just kept, just caught up with me and caught out with me and caught out with me, you know. And then, of course, every time I got lucky and got away with it, I just became more brazen. I didn't get away because I was lucky. I got away because I was just that good. And I'm like, once again, oh, this is bad. This is bad. You just got lucky. Walk away. No, no. I'm just that good. Okay. Okay. So I thought I was pretty clever, right up until the judge said, yeah.

You're not so clever, buddy. No, not that clever. Yep, my YouTube channel is YouTube.com forward slash call your landry. My podcast is called Moving Past Murder. I post new episodes every Friday on YouTube and on Apple, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast from. I also create individual content for YouTube shorts

and on my YouTube channel, I'm offering a membership soon. You can find all things, Call Your Landry at www. I have a large TikTok following as well. Find me on TikTok at Collierlandry. Everything is at Collierlandry. So check it out. And thanks for having me, man. I'm super stoked to talk to you too.

Hey, I appreciate you guys watching. And if you like the video, do me a favor and hit the subscribe button, hit the bell, leave stuff in the comments and I'll respond. And also, I'm going to, we're going to leave Collier's YouTube links. of his links in the description box and I appreciate you guys watching. Thanks a lot. Join my Patreon. If you like these videos, it helps me more than you know. Also, if I have, listen, I have, I've got multiple true crime books that are out there. By all means, check them out. They're on, they're on Amazon and Barnes & Nobles and there's audibles. And I really appreciate

you guys watching. Thank you very much. And I will see you.