Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - $39 Million Mortgage Fraud | Juan Sanchez

Episode Date: June 19, 2024

$39 Million Mortgage Fraud | Juan Sanchez

So I come into Coleman and somebody goes, what are you here for? And I said, frog. And the guy goes, how much? I said, $39 million. Hey, this is Matt Cox. And we're going to do a podcast, a true crime podcast on Juan Sanchez. And Juan has, like, I'm not impressed a lot. As a matter of fact, my girlfriend mentioned the other day.

I'm saying what she actually said to me, she said, she goes, boy, you really like this guy. he's got an amazing story and she goes she said i think you got a little man crush on him i said if i was a woman i said i would this guy is so charismatic i said i would have his children i mean his story and he's he's super charismatic and i know you're like you're like hate hearing that but i think it's the accent that gets to him it's a that i think that's what that's what it is well thank god i said girlfriend oh yeah my girlfriend because otherwise be like i knew it anyway so great story and uh it's it's actually um it's a uh he's got a fraud story and so let's get let's get right into it okay so Juan where were you born I was born in

Spain as a matter of fact but I'm not a Spanish citizen I was born there by mistake and I was raised in Venezuela until I was about 16 that I came to the United States so you're a Venezuelan citizen I'm a Venezuelan citizen yeah I became a permanent resident here so I was a resident for many many years until I got convicted of my crime. Right. So you came in the United States at 16, went to school? Went to high school. Okay.

From high school, I did some college. Right. And, but it was difficult to do college and party. Right. So I ended up choosing, making the wise choice and party my way through, you know, college. And then I became involving the world of finances and real estate. Okay. At a very young age.

Right. And what, so were your real estate agent or? So there is the background story behind my behavior pattern, I guess. I found an industry that taught me how to use my talents. And I figure timeshare would be the right place to be. You know, it's a high pressure sales pitch. People come there for two tickets to Disney. 90 minutes later, they're in debt for $40,000.

Right. So if I wanted to sharpen my persuasion skills, that was a place to be. So I worked for timeshare for many years. and I developed training programs I trained the salespeople I became a very good speaker and my next step was I decided to open real estate schools

throughout the state of Florida but you weren't doing real estate no I was out of time sure but it was still sales base but it was still sales base so I figured being that I'm bilingual the Spanish market has always been a subscine market

it's an ignored market so it was a real estate was beginning to boom. We're talking about 2019, 2009, 2000, before the Twin Towers. And I opened the first real estate school in Spanish in the state of Florida. I actually

ended up opening seven of them. And where Orlando? Orlando, Miami, Tampa, Jacksonville. I mean, there were Hispanic people I was there teaching. And I licensed all these people. But I realized that these people wanted to learn how to sell. And I said, man.

I'm your guy. I'll teach you how to sell it. Time share style. Right. We're not going to go showing houses. What you're going to be doing is you're going to be closing these people on the sale. And I developed my own team of salespeople, hundreds of salespeople. So I became a broker and the rest is history.

I had hundreds of people selling for me. All right, that's it. That's the podcast. We're done. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it would you be great if that was the end of the story? So I still don't understand why. at this time. You know, I was just a guy teaching people how to sell. And I became very good,

very good, very sought after. I mean, developers were coming to me and giving me their whole projects and out of the sudden the market crashed. And we began to crash. We're talking about now 2006, 2005. You know, loans were getting a little difficult. People were getting greedy, kind of where we're at right now. And the cashback frenzy started. And there were properties that were not being sold whole complexes, hundreds of apartments. So the developers will come to me and say, would you mind partnering up with us? You'll be the broker. You develop the sales strategy and sell us out. And I was, of course, I was a developer without having to build anything. Right. And I did condo conversions. Okay. And I will go in and

just liquidate them. I will bring busloads of people. They will come down. They will buy each three, four apartments, and then they will walk away. But I never had contact with the salespeople. What made my operation really cool was that I had all these salespeople that were trained to do this. Wait, they would buy the properties and walk away. You walk away from the loan, stop making the payments. Well, what happened is these people, because obviously in order to compete, we had to do the cashback deal that everybody was doing. That is happening right now. Right. So to convince a borrower to buy a property that they are not really interested in, they don't really want. So you say, hey, look, if you buy the property, you come, you sign the documents, you give us the W-2's pay steps, if you qualify for the loan, you get it, will give you $30,000 or $20,000 and you can leave. And listen, you could use that money and with the hopes that the property keeps going up, which is kind of where we rent them out.

Do they rent them out? They rent them out. Okay. They were renting them out. Okay. But what happened is the market. The market collapsed. Nobody, their loans stopped happening. You know, I remember we, at one point, we had 60 properties. Stop happening. 60 properties waiting to close in the same complex. Right. And the title company called us and said, listen, the bank said, no.

You're not closing any of them. And I said, oh my God, this is not happening. Right. And it began to happen everywhere, everywhere. And properties started to go down in value. If you kind of move inventory, inventory starts dropping. Right. And we had clients that had bought apartments at $250,000.

Six months later, that apartment was worth $190,000. $190,000. And they figured, you know, I'm not going to pay for this apartment anymore. Plus, I got $40,000 in the closing table anyways. Right. The whole economy is crashing. I got $40,000. Why would I spend it on you?

And I have this nice boat that I bought with a $40,000 that I was supposed to use to pay the mortgage. And that's when, you know, they started looking at me. right because they started looking that there was a pattern of behavior here this is the FBI or at that point it was they opened a task force and it was called technically it was the IRS at that point but they they kind of branch out and it's like the financial housing administration department they made a they made it very very long so it was very hard to remember right and they approached me in 2007 they approached me in 2007 and they said listen we want you to talk about these loans and at that time I had retained console and my console

said listen if you don't know anything you don't know anything and I said I don't know anything where's the money coming from for all this is this I mean at some point this is money laundering well at that was it were at the not yet because they're they're buying and selling a product okay so right now it's just bank to consumer bank to developer Correct. However, some of these, a couple of these clients that came in were foreigners, from Venezuela specifically. Right. And these clients saw their investments go down in flames. Right. So they reached out to me and they said, listen, buddy, we invested with you and we lost our money. We're basically going to either get our money back from you or we're going to kill you and your family. And we're going to send you some. These aren't normal borrowers, by the way, because in the United States, like, I've had borrowers that have bought three or four properties, and then they, you know, they lost, they went into foreclosure, people, they couldn't rent them out or whatever. And not once, not once did anybody, I've never actually had my life threaten, not once.

Well, they were angry buyers. They were angry buyers. They were angry buyers. So they sent me a video at one point, which was of an image in a Venezuelan prison. Listen, who are these buyers? Well, these buyers were people that work for the Venezuelan government. Okay, so these were high up. And the Venezuelan government is very much like the United States government, like there's very little corruption and there's... Oh, very organized. Very organized. These aren't like almost like legal thugs.

And we're talking about not that high level yet. These are like prosecutors and judges and people in the Venezuela judicial system. Right. And it's basically, but there's still a lot of corruption. Oh, it's horrible. It's basically Venezuela, if you're, if you work for the Venezuelan government, it's basically like a mob run. It's like, it's like Russia. It's like these guys are getting to the top because they have the power.

Right. The brutes have the power. Right. So, so this happens and I get these threats and I got a video which I spoke with you a while ago about it. It was a, it was a, they decided to make an example out of somebody. Right. So they, they hired some inmates within the prison and they told them they had to. take turns raping this guy

and dismember him and make sure they put it on video though so they send me the video saying this is what's going to happen to you if you don't fix this problem and obviously that was a good persuasion technique because I said well how can we fix this problem right but I mean

look like the video literally they video them raping the guy and the guy they're screaming your name or something don't they say your name well the guy there's somebody saying this is what's going to happen to you if you don't behave okay so kind of like this pod it was a podcast on its own but uh you know it was just a little little lower budget yeah it was a little lower budget and uh perhaps not a youtube kind of channel

yeah yeah so then they sent to the video you read so what did you think when you watch the video well as i reach out i said listen obviously i don't want to get raped and dismembered yeah is there anything we can do to avoid this situation you know and they said yeah this is what we need you to do we need you to help us how much money had they lost at that point. A few hundred thousand. Right. Okay. A few hundred thousand. And they said, we need you to help us. We need you to help us. And we're going to tell you some things that you're going to have to do. So this is money that they sent you money. This is the money they borrowed from the bank. This is their money. Okay. This is their money. Money coming from Venezuela. Banks are not closing. So,

so these are cash deals. These are deals that are actually closing in an economy that nothing is closing. Right. So for us, it was kind of like breathing room, you know. So of course, they start extorting me you know this is what you have to do for us or otherwise we're going to kill you this is what you have to do so i get weaved into this financial movement of and some of those cases are still open so there's a lot of details that are i have to live out in the story but uh but there's there's a lot of movement of money a lot of movement of money and then as as uh as i get indicted i don't know that this is going on so obviously i get indicted on my case of my crime which is mortgage fraud right and then a year later I find out that there is this

explosion of money laundering coming from Venezuela and my name my name is being bounced around and the government basically one day goes and visit me some three-letter agencies that are well wait you've been have you been arrested you said you were I was arrested on my case okay had that happen well my indictment is my my my my my process was a little different. You know, on the sense that they, they reached out to me in 2007. Bad counsel, bad information. I decided to let them do their job instead of me. Instead of going in and cooperating and saying, look, this is what happened. Let me work with you. Correct. Let me listen. Mitigate the damage that's going to happen. Correct. So everybody else chose

that except me. I was the only guy that said no. Because my attorney told me, we got these guys. We got them where we want them. Okay. It's like a guy punching you and your coach telling you, man, your head can handle this thing. Don't worry about it. Keep hitting him with the head. So four and a half years later, I'm now in New York City, moved from Orlando. I have closed all my real estate offices. I'm now working selling art, okay, for a photographer. I didn't know that.

Yeah, all right. And I'm Peter Leek. And I'm making all this money selling art, you know, and I'm a New Yorker. I'm writing my subway. and I'm dating this girl at that time, of course. She doesn't know. And you'll appreciate this. Most people that you start dating what you're being investigated by the facts

is not something you want to disclose on the first day. Not the first day. You know, like, listen, don't make long-term plans with me because I may end up going to prison. Right. Okay, let's leave on the now. So I have an argument with her on Sunday. And on Monday, I say, listen, come to the apartment.

I think we, you know, there is no need to be upset. She walks into the apartment I order Chinese food She's sitting on the couch I get a knock on the door You know Chinese delivery guy comes in Give him the money

He gives me the food He walks away And I hear this bang You know And my first thought was Man I didn't tip the Chinese guy Right But this guy is like super angry

Right You know So I'm looking at the bill And I tell my girlfriend at the time I said Listen I'm going to give this Chinese guy A peace of my mind

I opened the door and I feel two hands reaching out and pulling me out of the apartment. And there is NYPD and of course, you know, you know who it is. And if anybody's watching this, this is a whole production, you know. I have cops going up the stairs and cops going down the stairs and NYPD is looking at a picture of me and looking at me. You're a nonviolent, I'm a nonviolent white collar criminal and you've got 30 guys here with guns out. that your tax money is going to the good right place. And they're like Juan Sanchez, yeah. You have an extradition order to Florida.

You're under arrest. And then the agent that I had interview years ago came out from behind the line of cops. And he said, you thought I wasn't going to get you, right? And I looked at him and I said, no, I knew you would. I knew sooner or later. You're good. Yeah.

You're good. Yay, buddy. So I ended up on my journey. I went to Brooklyn Detention Center which I experienced my first stabbing experience which was three days into it a rapper stabs another guy in the middle of the unit

and I'm sitting there and you know as this guy's stabbing the other guy my cellmate is telling me hey hey you gotta get some ice you gotta get some ice and I'm thinking they're like ice for the guy right no no we're gonna get locked in man

you need some ice so you can drink some cold drinks and I'm thinking these guys are insane yeah they're preparing for the lockdown already yeah and other guy saying everybody to the shower everybody to the shower we got a shower before they lock us down and there's this guy bleeding on the floor and i'm like man this is not going to be pretty yeah i told you the guy i had a guy die in front of my cell one time i literally stepped over him to go heat up my coffee because i knew they were going to lock us down like didn't even by that point it wasn't even like these people are so interchangeable and they're just they're like furniture listen i've seen people taking shoes

off people that are down because hey these are my shoes so I don't want this guy to go away on the hospital with my shoes, you know, I need to play fault. So it's just, you're desensitized. You just, you know, numbed. Right. So I started in Brooklyn, and they work me all the way down to Miami.

Right. In which I proceeded to plea guilty to, I think, three counts of bank fraud and wire fraud. Conspiracy. Bank fraud, money laundering. Yeah, I know those. I signed an 18-year plea, and I got sentenced to 15 years.

And my attorney, my attorney, listen. If anybody sees this, I'm going to put the name out there because this is, this is insane, okay? Francisco Lopez was this guy's name. And he spoke Spanish. And my family hired him because he spoke Spanish. And I kept telling my family, I speak English. Why do you need a guy that speak Spanish? And they kept telling me where so we can communicate with him.

And I'm like, well, it's not about you. Shouldn't he want to talk to the judge and be able, you know? so I remember the first time he went in front of the judge and he's like well, George Honor I said oh my God I'm in trouble bro they hired Ricky Ricardo to defend me

so I play 18 years I play out to 18 years they sentenced me 15 years 180 months and I get shipped to a Coleman Coleman Low wait wait wait wait wait wait wait we're we're we're skating over

some stuff like like Well, I mean What would you want to know about my process? I mean, bro, I mean While you're in The guy that comes into the airport The Venezuela

Oh, that's later. Oh, it's later. Oh, okay, I'm sorry I'm sorry I didn't know, I was like, what are you doing? No, no, no So I didn't know the whole timeline So go ahead, sorry, sorry I'm down to 15 years Okay, I'm down to 15 years That's right, you came to Coleman and then you go ahead

And then they brought me back Okay, now I remember When I came to Coleman I had 15 years on me And that's when I met you Right And Coleman I said a little different Because they

You know They don't only care about your race But you are so You're segmented by crimes So I come into Coleman And somebody goes What are you here for? And I said fraud

And the guy goes How much? I said $39 million And he goes How much time did you get? Look by the way You know you say $39 million

You understand How how minor you made it sound Prior to it Like you said Some guys You just said $100,000. When I said the dollar amount, you said $100,000.

How did they get to $39 million? Because what they did is they use all the money that was in a specific development, all the money that was made on that development. So that money had been borrowed or given? Given or borrowed by different people. A lot of them in Venezuelans. And some American investors and some banks. But what they consider was the loss of that property,

Specifically, it was 39 million. All the properties go into foreclosure, did they add the total or did they take away? Oh, no. It was whatever was lent. Yeah, whatever was lent, $39 million. Even though after it was sold, $10 million, it meant $20 million may have been sold off and it's really only a loss of $19 million. They hit you for the whole. And at that time, my attorney was like this and it doesn't matter.

You don't want to fight that. You know, I'm like, okay. Yeah, you do. Of course you do because I didn't understand you get sentenced based on that. Yeah. okay so I got 39 million and they go how much time you got I said 15 years so you always have the guy in prison that wants to make sure you didn't cooperate yeah yeah he's calculated he's at he's he's okay 30 million that's level two and you a first time offender okay you're about the right

range yeah you're good you are gonna sit with those guys you see that guy over there I'm like yeah he's a fraudster talk to him well his name is Matt Cox and I said all right so that's when I met you and I said they talk you know they said to talk to you I guess you're here for fraud and we started talking and you're like dude you know what you're talking about because fraud is a it's an industry contrary to what most people may believe and and we have our own lingo on our own terms and you get the guys that go in there and they say they're there for fraud and they're not there and they're not for fraud correct and so they very quickly you talk to me for for three minutes about fraud or broke or real estate or anything in in my industry like

I'm very quickly going to be like okay this guy doesn't know it This guy's full of it. He's full of it. I mean, like his girlfriend says, it's like when you meet that one person and they can finish your sentences, that was kind of like what happened with us because we'll be saying like,

well, you know, and you go to the courthouse and you file, and I'll say like, a satisfaction of a mortgage. And I would be like, exactly. So we knew exactly what was going on. And it was really cool because I said, okay,

there's obviously people here that know about my crime and know about the industry and I feel comfortable, you know? Right. So I'm doing some time and then I get called back into Miami, right, where my case is from, because there's a new development now. There is some people that are interested on talking to me about these Venezuelan characters that at one point or another invested with the salespeople that I had under me. Wait a minute, you miss the part about going back to Venezuela. Oh, well, but that's going to, that's going to come in a, in the, because this is when I started talking to them and they know all this stuff.

Okay, so you're going to mention it. Okay, you got to talk about that. That's, that's, that's, because I, I go, you know, I, I'm talking to these new agencies that come and talk to me. And they say, listen, we want to talk to you about certain people that you have dealt with in Venezuela. And at that point, I retained a new attorney. Okay. Well, how did you pay for the new attorney? So, so.

So, this is brilliant. This is amazing. This is amazing. I'm in Miami, and I'm, I got 15 years, and I have this new development. I'm like, oh, my God, I'm going to do like 180 years. And I tell somebody, listen, I need help. And he goes, oh, talk to my attorney. Listen, I used to be a Medicare fraudster. Look at me. I got six years. My attorney's great. I said, dude, I need your attorney. Yeah. So what's the name? He goes, hey, Ryan, that was a fast trip. It was like you teleported. Yeah, just got in. I'll get all my expenses logged, I promise. you're okay. SAP Concur uses advanced AI, so your expense report will practically write itself. Quite the breakthrough. It's like we've been teleported into the future.

All right. So, just curious, would you give us written permission to convert your matter into energy patterns and reassemble you at, say, random travel destinations? Margaret, are you building a teleporter? No. Yes. SAP Concur helps your business move forward faster. Learn more at Concur.com. The name is Paul Petruzi. Perfect. So I reach out to Paul Petruzzi. and he comes down and he tells me, well, talk to me about Venezuela. So I'm talking to him and he goes, and you know all these people? And I said, yeah.

And he goes like, no, no, no, no. I said, I have their emails that they sent to me saved on my computer. He goes, that's phenomenal. He said, listen, you have a great opportunity here. And you're either going to get indicted on that case or you have to be able to play your cards right because they need you. I said, well, how much is it going to cost me for you to represent me? he's like, well, it's going to cost you $45,000. I said, well, we have a situation.

I said, I don't have any money. I already paid an attorney that screwed me. The feds took everything I had. I mean, but when I get out, I'm amazing. I'm an amazing salesperson. I can pack your office. He goes, well, that sounds great. How about we talk about it in 15 years when you get out?

And I'm like, listen, no, whoa, listen, man, give me a chance. They said, well, I'll come back in a couple days. I go up to my unit and I talk to the guy I said, listen, what do I do? He goes, pray. You need to go to your cell and you need to pray. And I said, okay. And then God is going to give me 45 grand?

He goes, maybe. Maybe it's happened before. I said, all right, I'm gay. So I go to my cell and I pray. Man, and the next day I go, I got it. I got it. So I call a friend of mine and I said, listen, this is what I need you to do. I need you to send me the list of all my friends in Facebook.

I'm going to weed some out. We're going to leave some in there. And I'm going to send an email blast to everybody on Facebook. She goes, okay, okay. So I write that email, which I read a couple days ago for the first time. And it was February of 2013. And I say, dear friends and family, you haven't heard from me in a year. And it's not that I've been, you know, ghosting you. It's just that I'm got indicted and I got sentenced to 15 years. This is my case number. If you want to research it. And during that year, I've lost everything I had. I lost friends. I lost family. I lost money. But I'm holding on to the one thing that I'm giving up today, which is my dignity and my pride. I need to hire an attorney. He's going to charge me $45,000. And I need your help.

If you can help me financially, that's fine. If you can't, your prayers are well received. Thank you for your help. you know, your friend, whatever. Well, dude. That thing went bonkers. I mean, I was reading the comments a day ago, and people were doing garage sales. People were doing bake sales.

I mean, my attorney will go visit me and go, listen, can you tell your friends to stop sending me $20 checks? I'm not the Catholic Church. Tell them to put money together and send it to me in a lump sum. He had to open a PayPal account so people could send him $2 here, $5 there,

$10 here, $15 there, and they pay my attorney's fees. So it was unbelievable, unbelievable. When Paul called me and told me, listen, your bill is paid. Don't worry about it. Nice. So that's, that's amazing. That's the power of social media. Yeah.

You know? That's the power of, you know, to be honest, I mean, I, you know, like I don't typically flatter people, but that, that's just the power of you and your friendship and what you mean to people and how much they like you. Because I tell you right now, and people like me, I ain't raising $45,000. Nobody's giving me $45,000. Yeah, I guess, and that's what you realize. Yeah, like somebody told me the other day, man, you're not, you guys are not bad people.

You are good people that did something wrong, you know? And our nature has never, I mean, at the end of the day, I know you from prison, and you know me from prison. And we've helped each other. We helped a lot of people without having to help them, you know, because we're needing to help them. Right. Because we, that's what you do. That's your nature, you know? So I pay my attorney, and Paul is happy, and he takes me, and he represents me, and he's like, well, we need to talk.

Tell me about these guys. So I said, well, I know this guy, and he sent me this email about this person, and he goes, do you know who these guys are? And I said, well, I think I know, but he goes, listen, man, the money that these people are using to buy this stuff goes pretty high up in the government. I mean, you have the key to unleash a huge investigation. But if you do this, they're going to kill you. Right. I mean, you understand that you're not going back to Venezuela unless you want to die. And I said, all right, that's fine.

Let's do this. You know what I mean? So I end up talking about different things. And one of the stories that called his attention the most is at one point they called me over. And they're like, listen, you need to come to Venezuela and you need to face us. you need to tell us where the money is at. And I'm like, dude, the money's gone. No, no, no.

Because, and this happened to a lot of people. When people lose money, they think you have the money. Right. When people make money, they don't want you to have the money. So if things are bad, you better have some of my money. But if things are good, I don't want you to keep a dime of my money, you know? So, of course, I think I have the money and they're telling me, and I know they're going to kill my family and they're going to kill everyone. everybody, so I have to go there and I got to face them.

So I show up and I'm facing them and they're like, listen, you need to come up with the money. And I'm like, well, you got to let me go back to the States. You fly to Venezuela. At that time, I'm dating somebody else. Right. And I'm telling her, listen, I'm going to go to Venezuela. And if I don't, first of all, if I don't call you in 24 hours, they kill me. Now, if I call you in 24 hours, then you know I'm alive, but you need to be like on top of the game because I may have to call you and tell you I'm getting out right now.

okay okay okay so I land this is just some chick you just met or you've been dating for her I've been dating her but everybody that has taken a chance of and I'm a big commitment everybody for an American chick that you've been dating for a month so how long you've been dating her well I've known her for a while but ever since I she was one of my salespeople so she know this whole investigation process and she knew the disaster and and uh because I was married for a long long long time and everybody that I dated kind of knew that I came with a lot of baggage. Right.

But you know that theory about everybody likes a bad boy? I think everybody likes that story. Everybody likes to be with somebody that is complicated. It's codependency, basically. I'm going to fix him. I'm going to turn him into a good guy. Yeah. You know?

That way I can say I save his life. So I go to Venezuela and I meet with these guys and I'm like, listen, we're going to lock you in a hotel room and you're going to stay there until you get us the money. And I'm like, dude, I have to go back to the United States to get the money. They're like, no, no, no. you have to get us the money right now I'm like okay let's do this so that night

they hired some prostitutes and they bring some prostitutes to the hotel room and they're like listen we have some prostitutes and we're going to be having sex in the room next door but we're keeping an eye on you and I'm like listen that's fine no problem so they got this around she hookers and they're like there and smoking and drinking

and it's just it looks it was bad who are the people that are holding you this is this Venezuelan military Venezuelan security people. You know, private, private citizens. But the people that are telling you that you have to give them back the money are people that work for the government.

Oh, absolutely. These are people that are high up in the government. Which I later find out that these are people who's the source of the money is Colombian drug money. Right. And they're telling them, where is my money? Yeah.

And they're telling me, where is our money? Right. Because this guy wants his money. Yeah, these guys will kill us and we'll kill you if you don't come up with the money. The problem is you've already, the money's already gone to the developers. Developers have always spent the money on their bills.

It's over. It's gone. And whatever was an escrow they took. So listen, it's gone. Your money is gone. But you always have this thing like, don't worry about it. I'll make up the money and I'll pay it back. Yeah, yeah.

Of course, you're saying anything to stay alive. So I'm there and there's guys to get drunk and I'm like, man, I still have my passport in my hand. So I call this girl and I'm like, listen, I'm going to try to get out of here. You need to get me on the first flight that leaves the United States, that leaves Venezuela to anywhere, to anywhere, to anywhere, to anywhere. so she's researching and she goes dude there is one but it's $1,500. I said

I don't care. I'm on that flight and I'm going to call you when I'm on the plane if I don't call you by the time the plane takes off they found out I left and I'm dead and she's like oh my God listen I can deal with this stuff I'm like listen we can't break up when I get there that's fine but just get me there okay all right all right so she buys a ticket she's like

we've got the reservation man these guys are wasted I sneak out of the hotel room I call a cab and I'm sitting in the lobby going oh my god oh my god oh my god know, the cab comes in and like, I got to go to the airport right now, American Airlines, right now. He goes, do you have any luggage? I don't have anything. Let's go. I need to get on a plane. I get on a plane. I call her. I come back. Now, the amazing, I'm going to go a couple steps ahead. When I go to Coleman that I meet you, I actually meet the Colombian guy who gave the guys the money, who gave the instructions to get their money any way they could. So basically, he was a guy that got the kidnapping set up.

So I used to tell people and I used to tell you all the time, listen, that's my kidnapper over there. I'm going to go say hi to him. So I will go say hi to him and we'll talk and I'll say like, listen, man, you know, you know, I was kidnapped because of you, right? And he's like, well, I feel bad about that. I never really met you, so I didn't know who you were. I'm like, that doesn't change the fact that I was kidnapped because of you. Yeah, but, you know, if I knew then, if I knew you then, maybe we would have come to terms. Maybe.

Maybe not. So on that side note, I go back too much. Miami, you know, and I'm telling my attorney that story about, you know, who I got kidnapped. And he's like, oh, this is fantastic. He said, this is phenomenal. I mean, this is exactly what we need, what they've been looking for. So I end up talking to the federal authorities about that case. And this is all public records, obviously. Yeah. This is the FBI. This is FBI and the EA and NSA and IRS and I remember the first time we met I walked into the room and of course there's all these people and one of these guys goes my name is whatever whatever

FBI and somebody says my name is this and IRS and the other guy says my name is this you know DEA and I said well my name is Juan Sanchez FBOP and they all started laughing and they're like oh my god this guy is great this is a guy we need it's hilarious so we sat there and I told them the story and everything that is going on and they're taking notes And they go, listen, you have a very odd memory. You seem to remember a lot of details, and that's not common. I said, well, check them out. So they go check them out.

They come back. They said, man, you hit it right on the head. That's exactly what we're looking for, and let's move forward with this. So they decide to lead me sitting there in Miami for a couple months. Then they send me back to Coleman, and I'm sitting there, and nothing is happening, nothing is happening. And I'm like, oh, my God, this is, you know, I remember. called my attorney and I said, I felt like I just got invited to the prom. I had sex with my date and never called me again. I just got screwed. And he's like, listen, they're working on it.

They're working on it. It takes time. They bring me back down to Miami and I'm sitting there and out of a sudden I'm watching the TV and no, I'm lying to you. I'm sitting in Miami and at a sudden they take me downstairs. And when they take me downstairs, I'm handcuffed and I'm standing there and there is a guard calling out names. And the guard is like Gonzales, Martinez, Rodriguez, whoever. And it's one of the guys that kidnapped me. And I'm sitting there going like, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. So I'm facing the wall and I'm doing like this little happy dance handcuff. And the guard is like, hey, dude, you got to go pee? And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no. So I see the guy on the corner of my eye and I'm like, oh my God, they busted this guy.

So I go up to the unit, I call my attorney, and I go, man, do you have news for me? And he goes, no, do you have news for me? And I said, yeah, you know, one of these guys from Venezuela just got arrested. And he goes, oh my God, just hung up and I'll call you back. So long story short, he gets arrested, and then they tell me the story, oh, he gets arrested. And I'm like, oh, I get it. This is a guy, so you understand the nature of these people. this is a guy that went to the American embassy in Venezuela

after he got denied entering to the United States one day because he was bringing $100,000 cash and didn't declare him. So they sent him back to Venezuela, I told him, sir, we don't want you to come back ever again. He applies for a visa. So he came to the United States with $100,000 in cash.

In cash, because that's how they move money back for Venezuela. They don't believe in transfer. They just bring bags of money. And that's why they change. of law right now where they're basically saying you cannot do business with anybody from Venezuela in cash. Right. So he came in the United States with 100,000 in cash, said, didn't declare it, and they caught him while he's in immigration as he's coming through. Correct. He's extorting me

by this time. I'm already his victim. So he's calling me from immigration. You have to get me out of here. You have to get me out of here. And I'm sitting there going, dude, how? You're on the other side of the fence. Right. Well, you got to fix something. You got to figure out something. So I'm making calls to attorneys, he finally gets sent back to Venezuela and that puts more pressure on me because now they're blaming this on me because everything that happened it was because of me. Right.

So they're like, listen, I don't know how you're going to do it, but you have to bring me back to the United States. I'm like, dude, the only way I can tell you to do it is go to the embassy and try to get a visa again. So, he goes there, he gets denied. He calls me, he goes, your idea

didn't work. I got denied. I said, know it has nothing to do with my idea it has to do with the fact that you brought a hundred grand cash right well you got to fix it so or you know we're going to kill your family remember with this member this guy blah blah blah blah i'm like okay so i get arrested and the agents are telling me like listen how do we bring these people from venezuela here because there is no extradition right and this is a member of the government yeah it's a member of the government and he's not stupid. I said, well, it was kind of stupid. There is one thing you can't do. He applied for a visa once, and they denied him. Maybe if you give him a visa, he'll come to the United States. He goes,

you think so? And I said, I think so. Well, time goes by, and I'm reading the newspapers, and guess what happens? This guy sitting at home one day, eating breakfast, and he gets a call from the American embassy. And they tell him, hey, Mr. So-and-so, we made a mistake. We want you to come to America. The guy goes to the embassy, gets his visa, comes back home, and tells his family, pack your stuff. We're going to Disney. So the guy has literally like Mickey Mouse shirts and ears and the whole family. And he's his wife, his kid, everybody.

He gets on the plane, lands in Miami, and sure enough, the EA is waiting for him on the gate. So he kept saying because I remember you showed me the article. I'm reading this article. He's like, it was like a booby trap. I landed in a booby trap. And I'm like, well, yes, you did. But these guys don't understand that. The United States doesn't work like that.

Once they said no, they said no. Right. You're not coming in again. So that case happened. And because I became... In Venezuela, somebody says, no, you can make a call. You can talk to a buddy. So my brother works for so-and-so.

I can give this guy some money. Like, you can always fix a situation in Venezuela. And remember, these are the guys that fix the situations in Venezuela. So that's why they kept telling me you have to fix it because they know how to fix it in Venezuela Right. And I have to explain to them that's not how it works in here. There's nobody I can pay up, you know? That's a crime.

Mind you, I was already breaking the law on my own end doing my financial crimes. Right. Okay. So thank God that happened because I had to expose the case and I had to expose the extortion and I had to expose the abuse and the fact that my family was at risk and I had to talk to my kids and say, listen, if I do this, my life. is at risk you know i may get killed because of this you guys we're got to put it on the balance you know and uh can i ask you a question you keep saying they were extorting you the extortion they're saying look if you don't get us our money back we're going to kill you or your family whatever but weren't they also because only because i've only because i know i've heard the story

like didn't you also like you lost a bunch of their money didn't you convince them to give you more money and that was a problem because I didn't really have to convince him that much so you are you they already listen I just want to make this clear they already feel like you owe them hundreds of thousands of dollars they've lost hundred thousands of dollars and you basically go to them and you say I can get your money back I'm trying but you have to give me more money to do it because they were offering me the money okay listen we have to move this money and you have to move it and I said well if you want to make your money if you want to recover the money we need to reinvest money to make money that's how it works so this this was like

digging a hole to cover the other hole and it just became it was it was it was but they sent you more money but they send more money and listen if i unfortunately if i pick up the phone today and i said i think i got to figure out guys we got he they'll send money because the amount of money that they have is ridiculous right and then but the amount of money that they have that's ridiculous and they're getting money from the cartels they're laundering cartel money correct now i grew up here i didn't grow up there so the the source of the money to me was never disclosed right so it's like this and we have this money we need to move it over there if you don't move it for us we're going to kill you and if you don't give us your money our money back we're going to kill you right i know i read that in your

transcripts where they were they you were it just kept getting worse and worse because they kept threatening you, you have to do this or we'll do this. So the threats got worse and worse, plus the videotape. Escalating, correct. It kept escalating. And once you were in it, it was just. I mean, I think I have been in prison for like six months. And I told the federal government, I said, listen, if you want me to give you some information, I need my laptop and I need my cell phone. Right. So they bring me my cell phone. And I show the agents, I'm like, look this, Look at this. They had to write it down because it was something like 780 missed calls from these people in like 30 days.

Just because I wasn't picking up the phone. I was arrested. Yeah. But they were like, listen, you need to call us back. It's like the crazy girlfriend. They'll be like, listen, you need to call us back. We need to talk. Hey, why aren't you picking up my phones?

Listen, we're going to kill you. We know you're hiding. Then they'll call again. Hey, dude, sorry about that. Listen, we need to talk again. And I'll be like, dude, this is insane. even the agents were like, man, these guys were playing a number of you. I mean, you, you, you, you, you, you, you were definitely, definitely under pressure. So they finally get indicted. One of them gets arrested. The other

ones are still in Venezuela. It's a big case that is, according to my transcripts, is one of the largest cases in the hemisphere. Yeah. That got exposed at that time. And, uh, and, uh, I benefited from it, of course. Right. You know, well, weren't you? didn't you get that didn't the CIA show up one time the CIA showed up at one time the people that I didn't know showed up at one time like I was getting I mean I was I was I was a golden boy yeah yeah because I was the only one that spoke English the only one that had that was truly a victim of their abuse because everybody else was a co-defendant so they don't want to talk because they're incriminating themselves in the crime right I was the one

that they put the gun to his head and say listen you got to commit this crime or will kill you. It doesn't make it less of a crime, but it makes me a victim of a crime, you know? And the government knew that I was willing to risk my life to provide them some kind of information to help me in my case because I have gone 15 years. I have gotten over-sentenced to start with.

So it took a while, but they corrected my sentence and I went down to nine and a half years, which is still a lot of time. Yeah. and then I ended up doing eight years and a month in federal prison and six months of those in the shoe in my last six months in solitary and then after I got released on June

I picked me up because I'm not a citizen I was a resident so they had to deport me so then it was a battle of well if you deport me you're going to send me back to a country where they're going to kill me so there is something called the Convention Against Torture, Cat which is where my case is at right now

because the bottom line is this, they understand that it's a life sentence to send me back but those six months on ice which you didn't serve because obviously you're a citizen are insane insane that's a whole different

ball game with a whole different group of people because in there all you see is like these people that are crossing the border. So people will come to me and said, I'm going crazy. I've been here for seven weeks and I don't know what to do. And I will tell them, listen, man, I did eight years in prison. Oh my God, how come you're not crazy? And I used to tell them, look, you didn't know me from before.

Maybe I am crazy. You know, maybe this is a crazy meeting. It's different. The abuse is different. The system is different. you know, but I'll tell you what, this is what surprises me. It's not the crimes that we committed. You know, we made a mistake, and it was a reckless behavior that got us in prison. When people think that when you say we made a mistake, it's like, I stumbled into fraud.

No, no, no. The mistake happened when we thought we could get away with it, and nobody gets away with crime. What showed to me is, dude, it's happening today, again, the same. Same thing. Same. And the government, like, you said the mortgages, the, the, the, and now it's the PPP loans. Yeah, the real estate industry. The real estate industry. I have had people that knew I did, that know that I did time, come to me and go, listen, how much time did you do? I say, well, eight years. Oh, years. So you have nothing on your credit, right? I'm like, dude, are you kidding me? You're really going there. Like, you're going to create me some false credit history and then we're going to, what,

dead loans man yeah because he's back there yeah oh listen i'm constantly being contacted by people i i actually did a video where i had a guy fly in from uh from new york to try and convince me to commit you know help him commit fraud now i tell you that do a video yeah i did i'll solve my channel i do a video i talk about how this guy like i'm constantly i was constantly being contacted by guys saying hey bro if i can talk to you like you know if you could set it up like I'll go in the bank. You just have to set it up and I'll split everything with you. I'm going, what are you doing? I'm not going to commit fraud with you. I'm not committing fraud. And I had one guy that actually flew in from new, like he approached me like he was a real estate

investor, like he's going to invest in real estate and want to just ask me some questions. You can ask me some questions. Okay, what's going on? What do you want to know? Like I'm selling my business in New York. I'm going to come. Like, what do you think I should do? I have $750,000. What should I do with that money in Tampa? What would you do? I'm like, I don't know. You could buy rental properties. this so we had a few conversations it ended up to a bunch of ended up we started texting each other so yeah and i so i'm just like yeah do this do that like we start texting every once while he's asking me questions and this and that he's seen my videos and he likes me and so i i kind of feel like we're we're like friends like we're kind of being friends and then one day he says hey i'm coming

to tampa and i said oh okay he said i'd like to love to have a uh uh a coffee with you right so we're going to have a coffee i want to buy a cup of coffee i want to meet you while i'm there sure no problem come come we sit down we go to Starbucks. He buys me in some coffee. We sit there. We're talking. And as soon as we sit down, he's like, look, bro, I wanted to fly in and let you know I'm for real. And I go, for real about what? And he goes, dude, I'm like, what? And he goes, listen, I need to make some money. Now I'm going to sell my, I'm selling my business and I've got $750. What can I do? I go, I told you buy real estate. And he goes, no, bro, like, I want to do some fraud. Like, like what you did? Like, what would you do? Like, I'll pay you. And

I'm like, what are you doing? I'm not committing fraud with you. And so he goes into this whole thing. No, no, we this. I go, let me explain something. I said, I'm already indicted. Like, as soon as they grab you, they're going to look at your phone. They're going to see my name.

And so I go through the whole thing on how they'll grab me and add my name to the indictment. And then I can't really defend myself against fraud because I've committed fraud. Yeah. And I said, and on top of that, oh, I would never say nothing. It doesn't matter that you said. Your phone's going to say it. And I said, on top of that, the really big problem is this. you know, I said the really big, uh, big problem overall is I said that if I was willing to be

involved in committing fraud, why would I need you? Correct. Why would I, why would I create a co-defendant that will cooperate against me? Like, why would I split a scam, which I'll get, you know, they don't understand that like if you steal $10 million, everybody gets charged with the same $10 million. They don't get that. So they don't understand conspiracy means I'm conspriced. I'm getting everything you're getting.

So, correct. Why would I split everything? If I think I'm going to get away with it, why wouldn't I do it myself? I can do it myself. Why would I do it myself, take all the money and leave? Why would I give you half and allow you to testify and get your sentence cut in half? Like, why would I do that? Like, it's so stupid that you would think I would be involved or involve someone else.

And two, one, to be involved, but two, why would I involve you? I don't need you. You need me. You're asking me to teach you. Right. And then that's the other thing. He said, what if I gave you like, if I gave you like 25 grand for you, you to just teach me, like, spend a week with me.

I'm like, what are you talking about? You'll get caught. That's a guy that you need to tell him, listen, let's do this. Give me 25 grand. I'm going to look you in my bathroom for 13 years, and then I'm going to teach you exactly what you want to learn. Right. Which is, you're going to spend 13 years in a bathroom.

Right. And you're going to get out with nothing. With nothing. Right. You know. It's just, yeah, yeah. But they don't understand. And I don't know what your demographic is on your channel.

But what made my case. case appealing for the federal government, okay, sexy as my attorney used to say, your case is so sexy. And I would like, well, I guess we have different definitions of sexy, you know, is that my market was the Hispanic market. So these were Spanish-speaking people that didn't know any English. So anything looks good to them. This is a guy that has, these are people that don't know anything about the mortgage market. These are people that literally destroy the mortgage market, the real estate market. Right now, if you look at the demographic of people buying, Miami, all Hispanics. Capital of fraud in the United States, Miami, Arizona, Vegas, all Hispanics.

So I remember the agents telling me, the biggest part of your case is not so much what you did. What you did was pretty big. But the fact that the people that you did it with were all Hispanics. and the market that you target was Hispanic, Spanish speaking. So we're back to lack of education, man. That guy that is asking you to do fraud with him, he doesn't know.

These guys are ignorant. People are asking for PPP loans right now and saying, oh, don't worry about it. I got $200,000 and I'm going to ask for forgiveness. Oh, you will. Yeah, yeah. Not of the loan. You're going to ask for forgiveness

when they're sentencing you, you know? But it is what it is. You know, it's a, man, it's never. ending. Never, never, never, never ending. And now you have technology. Now you have, you know, I'm still trying to figure out this technology thing. But when I got out, like iPhones are like, like, they're magic. It's unbelievable. Listen, I get out and I go to, I have to open a bank account. You know, I can't work because, oh, that's another beauty of this thing. I got out in December 23rd, but I'm waiting to be authorized to work. And it's June. Right. I don't have a driver license.

So I have a seven-year-old nephew that we have. have the same problem we can't drive so it keeps telling me like uncle can you take me shopping no bro i'm waiting for you to be 16 to take me shopping like how so if you're in that limbo how do they expect you to like if you didn't have family to help you how do they like you you're lucky you have family that can help you and let you stay there and take care of you but if you didn't have family what do you do so in there in the government government's mind they're saying no no you go live in the street and you starve to death or we know we know we can push you enough where you'll break the law right where you're going to work without a permit

where you're going to drive without a license where you're going to you know what I mean right and it's crazy but this is the funny part so I get out and I and I have my prison ID which I lost so literally I'm completely undocumented right now I'm the definition so you all see it I am the definition of an undocumented citizen because the only idea I had was my prison ID I don't have anything else I don't have a driver license so every time I went out to a bar or whatever the waiter will say like do you have an ID? And I will say, I do, but I don't know if you want to see it. And they'll be like, oh, yeah.

And I'll be like, here it is. And I say, yeah, it's a prison ID, bro. It's the only thing I got. Yeah. I'm a convicted fellow. Okay, no problem. So I go to, I have to open an account because my daughters are like, listen, that we need to give you money, but we're not going to give you cash.

Right. We have this new thing called cash app. Right. Or sell or whatever. I said, yeah, let's do it. So I go to Chase. And, of course, I give my prison ID. And the lady's like, okay.

And I said, this is my social security number. So she's typing. And she looks at me. And she goes, give me a second. So she gets up. She comes back. And I'm telling my daughter, they're not going to take me. And my daughter's like, yeah, yeah, dad.

They're not going to take me. She comes back and she goes, we have a problem in the system. I don't think you can open an account with us. That's all right. So my daughter goes, well, let's go to Bank of America. I said, let's do it. We go. You know Bank of America.

I know. Prison ID. Social security number, yeah. we have something showing in the system here we're not going to be able to open it at this time i said oh thank you no problem i said i tell to my daughter how many more banks do we do this i call a friend of mine he goes what are you doing man go to chime i said to chime he goes yeah chime dot com i said like an online bank he goes yeah man i went to chime literally name date of birth congratulations is it yeah 10 days later I got my chime check card all I kept thinking is

Lord thank you for not having chimed 10 years ago when I was committing fraud oh yeah yeah the stuff that it's available now like I'm literally back then I'm walking into a bank saying can I have that $9,000 and then they would check and they'd be like well he's got like half a million in his account here's nine grand like now I realize like now I would just transferred it to Bitcoin or I would have bought, you know, whatever. I would have just, you know, moved the money buying, you know, Ethereum or whatever and laundered the money through there. There's a, you know, or cash app or PayPal or whatever there is available now. The other thing is funny is when you say the Bank of America, like I opened a Bank of America. I walked in,

I gave them $1,000 and opened an account. And a month later, I get a check in the thing saying, we cannot we cannot open an account for you we can't accept your money we can't open an account for you and they sent me in the money back i tried to do a secured visa with them i sent them 500 bucks because they initially like yes then they come back boom here's your 500 dollars back like and i and you know my friend stacey was like what's the problem with bank of america i'm like you know i do owe them a couple million dollars i feel like they're holding resentment over the two million that i owe them but that was like 15 years ago and like did time. I did time. I mean, it's not on my credit. Like, I don't get it. Like, the only other bank

I've got is, I opened new Wells Fargo because the halfway house had a deal with Wells Fargo where they said anybody they sent them from the halfway house, they would allow them to open the account. So they opened it. But Chase turned me down, Bank of America, turned me down, and then I just like, all right, I'm done. This is it. And it's insane because even to find a place to leave. Oh, yes, same, same thing. Listen, I had 10. I called like 10, 15 places. I tried it. And I will go into the leasing office and go, listen, I want to apply for an apartment here. My kids are going to be paying for the apartment while I, you know, get back

on my feed. We have a $300 application fee. I said, I understand. Is it refundable? No. I said, okay, I'm going to give you the heads up. I'm a convicted felon. Was it a sexual crime? No, it wasn't a sexual crime. It was a financial crime. Oh, you shouldn't have a problem. All right. 300 bucks application fee. Next day. Sorry, we have to turn you down. Dude, I told you I wasn't a sex offender. Where's my $300? Yeah, what happened? Sorry, we look at your record and we cannot take you. Dude, I don't, I'm not a sex offender, but I have been sexually offended by this comment. I think I just got fucked by you guys. So it's, it's getting out of prison is so difficult. So I understand why people are struggling. Yeah, well, you know, that's the whole thing.

there's like there's like a 70 or 80% recidivism rate and people are like it doesn't make sense why would you get out and commit a car well you have no idea the difficulty like well even even if you could even if you can get a job like like you go out and you apply for jobs and get jobs and everything else then as soon as they run your stuff they they anything that goes wrong at the job you're fired you're probably anything I didn't do it what doesn't matter you're the first person they look at if they want to hire you at all like you're always the last person they want to hire Unless they understand the tax write-off that we are, because we are a tax write-off, you know? And which is what I tell my girlfriend, listen, you should be able to write me off with your taxes.

I'm an excombe. You know, the eating me should give you some kind of tax benefit because I know it doesn't give you emotional stability. But so I have become a little bit of an activist. Actually, I dressed up for the podcast, for the podcast. But I'm usually wearing like a, you know, screw the BOP or a prison reform now or something like that. So this is my, I don't know if the camera, which camera, that one, this one, this one right here. Wait, but no, this one just, this is says something. Well, I have, this is the mask that I wear.

Abolished mass incarceration. So this is where I wear when I go into establishments, all right? So the other day I'm wearing my mask, of course. So I work like this and which is phenomenal because, you know, they ask you to put on a mask now when you go to the bank, which is, we, I know. How many people did we do time with that were like, dude, I put my mouth? going on and I went to the bank well I listen prior to prior to being incarcerated I went into a bank one time like I'm opening a fake bank account I went in with a baseball cap right they said take your baseball cap off you can't be in here with a baseball cap now I'm

okay with a baseball cap and a mask and a face shield and glasses and everything oh yeah anybody can open a bank account right now without a facial recognition situation so I'm wearing this mask and I go into a I think it was a store and the lady goes You don't believe in mass incarceration? And I said, no. She goes, oh, so you're okay with criminals being out on the street? I said, yeah, I think so. And she goes, really?

How about the murderers? Do you think murderers should go to prison? So I said, well, let me ask you, has the murder rate gone down since they've been going to prison? Because I think it has really has gone up. She goes, well, that's not the point. I said, well, what is the point? Logic is not an argument, I guess. I said, so it's a combination of things.

I think we live in the perfect storm. You have a system that doesn't work, which is the judicial system. You have a bunch of youngsters right now that don't understand the consequences of their actions, and you have access to a bunch of ways to commit crimes right now, anything from social media to, you can create, back in our days, to create a fictitious person was a lot of work I mean you have to find somebody

I mean homeless that had an actual identity and then you had to find somebody to create the identity and put credit on it and this and that the latest thing is which we were talking about online notaries remote

it's called remote notaries yeah good times good stuff what I was going to say is like right now I've got a buddy who owns a couple of like four or five title companies and he's like you understand that you don't like now you can create the document scan it send it in and you just hit a button for to fill up to send stuff to public records you hit a button that says certified that it's a certified original copy so it can be all completely fake you can make it up on on on Photoshop you can Photoshop the stamp the signature you can pull the signature all if you create this whole document that doesn't look anything like an original and then you just scan it and you send it in and say certified original copy and they immediately say this is a certified original copy and now it's in public records so simplicity which is what they're looking for has made it easier right oh and the same thing where before like let's say you bought

let's say i you rented me your house so you rent me your house and then i go and i satisfy the the first of all i don't you don't have to see me i can go i can contact a real estate agent online and I can say, look, I've seen some of your real estate listings. I like this when I want to rent it. So then I don't need to go through the house. I already did the virtual tour. Just send me, I want to rent it. They can then email me the, they can email me the lease agreement.

I sign the lease agreement. I send it back. I wire them the money. They've got the PayPal, whatever. I cash, I sell them the money. They've got the money. They run my information. They say, okay, great, you're cleared.

Send them the money. Now, mail me the key or lease. leave the key in the mailbox. Now I have possession of the house. So now I can go downtown. I don't have to actually go downtown anymore, by the way. I can just now search the title to the house, create a fake satisfaction of mortgage, satisfy the mortgage on the house, transfer the deed to the house into someone else's name.

I can then turn around and I can put the house on the market. Don't have to have a sign in the front yard, nothing. Just stick it on the market. Stick it on the market. Or not even that. I can just contact one of these companies that will buy your house online. they then do a review of the house and they say yeah your house is worth $300,000 you go okay that's a little bit less than I wanted but yeah I'll do it okay they schedule a closing now I could go to the closing virtually I don't have to go to the closing I actually sign all the documents over the internet I then ask that then they so I've now they then say hey where do we want the money sent I have them transfer the money to an account that I opened online so now I got the money online so that well first the money goes in the title compensation Then title company now sends it to me online.

They wire the money, which they do all the time. You open up a bank account, which you can open up online all the time. Now I get all that money. I then take that money and I transfer that money and I buy Ethereum, Bitcoin, whatever. I buy a bunch of different stuff in a virtual or wallet or what they call it? Visible wallet or whatever. Yeah, they've got some kind of wallet now. So you buy this wallet that can't be transferred.

I can then turn around and I can buy whatever I want, gold, cars, whatever, and they can't track the money. So the money's all gone and I haven't done anything. I haven't left my house. I just use my, you can just use your computer. Like it's so easy to commit fraud now that it's insane. As opposed to what I had to do and what you had to do. Like I'm making documents. I'm driving stuff around. I'm going into banks. You remember the days of a a light table where you have to put like, you know, you turn it on and you put a document on top of the other document and you have to like make sure the lines matter. I'm holding up the stuff to the light.

I'm sliding around. Yeah. Then, you know, oh, listen. No, no, no. It's not good. It's not good. What's happening is not good. Yeah, I'm shocked that, you know, one, I'm shocked as there's just a ton of fraud.

It's also more difficult to catch people. Yeah. In some ways, it's easier. Like, if you're smart, you could really get away with it. If you're dumb, you're going to get caught right away. But this is the problem that people don't understand. At the end of the day, it's not about catching you. about catching somebody that will lead them to you yeah and there is usually you know

I mean there there is usually that one week link of course I mean on everybody's case had these guys that are like you know oh I had the credit card mailed which I haven't mailed to I had it mailed to my cousin I'm like your cousin well yeah but that's the whole thing like they won't when when they get there if they're going to go to the house yeah but but but I'm not there but your cousin is yeah but my cousin's not he he doesn't know that what yeah but when they walk over and they have your picture and your nephew answer or your cousin's wife or somebody says hi hey my name's john i'm with the fbi i do you know this guy the most people's initial reaction a decent citizen's reaction is to help so a decent citizen's going to go oh yeah that's jimmy

yeah why what's up like they don't think so guess what you're done no they wouldn't they would do that because your cousin works at walmart and he's a good citizen like he wants a good citizen wants to help the police. He's not thinking, protect my cousin. He's thinking the police need to know who this person is. Oh, I can help them. That's my cousin. He's not thinking you're about to go to jail for 12 years. Like, he's just thinking, hey, that's Jimmy. Like, and not just what about your, what about your nephew? What about your niece? What about their girlfriend? Like, you've got to make sure that your cousin who knows what's coming answers the door and says the right thing. And did you, and which means you now have to make him a part of the conspiracy by

telling him and you know what the problem is. What are you doing? I remember you and I reading a book in the library many many years ago and then you went to therapy right when you got out of prison for one hour every week I had to go for one hour. It's done wonders by the way. I'm all better. Absolutely. Absolutely. Give me the number of the guy. So I am I'm going to therapy right now. No. Because I well listen I don't know if how you we talked about this also where prison does a number on your psyche, you know? Yeah. And so I said, listen, I'm going to go to therapy and I'm going to talk it out.

So we're talking and the guys listening to me and I'm, of course, telling my story and what's going on. And he goes, listen, I'll tell you what your problem is. He goes, you have a narcissistic personality. And we talked about this, remember? And I said, I said, really? And he goes, really, dude? You're going to, you don't know it? He goes, you spent 15 minutes here and all you gave me was all your accomplishments and

how you do this and how you do that. Because the problem with narcissism is the next, the best you can hope for is to remain narcissistic. The next step is to become a sociopath. And that's when your actions cause pain to other people, but you don't care. Well, people like us walk that line. And we jump back and forth, back and forth.

There is a lot of people like us, you know. So that guy that is involving his cousin and to listen, can you get that package for me? Don't worry about it. You don't have to say any. Don't even open the package. As soon as they, UPS comes in with those papers or those credit cards, you call me, I'll go back. Nothing is going to happen to you. Right.

You're a sociopath. You're not thinking about the ramifications to that other person. All you're thinking about is how do I get this person to do what I want them to do so that I can get that package. Yeah, but you're putting him in danger. This could have happened. Like, that's all irrelevant. It will never happen. Right.

Yeah, you always justify it. There's no chance that's going to happen. It will never happen. I used to have offices everywhere, and I used to do the same thing everywhere. We used to bring the people by bosses. We used to do cashbacks, and I had all these mortgage brokers,

and all these realtors, and everybody. And at one point, they will come to me and say, this and do it. Is this, like, legit what we're doing? Yeah, it's fine. So relax. What's not legit about it? Are we selling drugs?

No. Okay. Are we robbing people? No. All right. so it was not legit about it well nothing was legit about it right but you become a sociopath you don't care you don't care about consequences and that's a that's a that's a dangerous place to be well you know you either become you know super you become either super successful crushing people on your way to the

top you know or you become a criminal you know crushing yourself people on you know your way to the bottom um or on your way to prison you know it's it's it's you know it's you know And like most actors and, you know, are sociopaths or, you know, and are narcissistic. And I mean, you know, you've got to be able to, if you can wreck, to me, the big thing is recognizing it. Correct. Like, if you can recognize it, then you can pull back. Like an addict. Right.

And I think I've had this conversation with you where it's funny people in the comments say this. They're like, it must have been killing Cox to not talk, to sit there and listen to this guy's story. like they'll say that in the comments like and they're they're right like I'm wanting to constantly jump in jump in talk about myself talk about myself like I used to when I went to Ardap you weren't okay I yes I was there when you got kicked out yes yes well no I didn't get kicked out I signed out twice listen they didn't want you they that's not what happened but anyway this guy not only did he go to the Ardap and they didn't want him that's not what happened he decided up with

the only Caucasian-Asian guy Oh the guy That was after I was out of Ardap Oh you were out of Ardap I already I already quit Remember I got the I wanted to stay in Ardap so they would keep me at Coleman

So they wouldn't move me to a camp Because my mom kept was coming to see me That's correct So I kept I would go in They put the management variable on me And I drop out Yeah And then they take it off and I go back in

They put it back on me and I drop out So have you done an episode I'm sorry to interrupt you Have you done an episode On Ardap on this thing? No but I wrote a book on it I know you wrote a book on it But I think I think these guys will enjoy

Ardop That's a that's a I should do a whole Of course I should have somebody here from Ardap There's a guy no named Ardap Dan They call them Ardap Dan You should even explain what a pull-up is And all that stuff

I mean it's a great The book's great Well you know I was in there During the one During the one of the few times when a guy pulled up another guy and the guy attacked him in Ardap swung on him

jumping, boom, it was a huge fight anyway my point is that when they were doing they did the psychological evaluation so they asked all these questions and the guy at the very end of the whole thing he goes is there anything you would like to get out of Ardap

and I went yeah I said I would like to be able to have a connection with people at a point where, you know, when they're talking, I'm actually listening to them. I said, because I've had entire conversations with people for like, and they've talked for 20, 30 minutes, an hour. And when I walk away, I don't know anything about them. I said, I haven't paid attention at all. And he goes, well, when I go, he goes, well, when other people are talking now, what are you doing if you're not listening to them? I go, I'm waiting for an opportunity

to talk about myself. I said, so if I could get to that point where I cared enough about them to pay attention, I said, that would be a huge, huge deal for me. And this is what people don't... The guy was just like, the DTS was just, the look on his face was like, I can't believe he just said that. And this is what people don't understand. To commit fraud, you need to be that guy. Oh, yeah.

Because there's a point where you are talking so much about yourself and talking so much about yourself that people go to, at least in my case, that people say, okay, man, I want to be like you. Yeah, they get wrapped up. They get wrapped up in the interest of your life and the things that you're doing and how amazing you are. They get sucked in into that whirlpool.

Listen, I used to have seminars like I see happening nowadays on investing in real estate. So these people will pay to hear me talk and then I will eventually send them to my developments and have them pay to buy there. on YouTube the huge thing is the gurus and listen I remember

it was perturbing because I will lead him and lead him and lead him to the point where they will say okay give us the secret where would you put your money and that was it and I was okay I got you and in prison it was the same thing people will say listen what are you doing you're here for fraud right I'm yeah

do you mind going for a walk with me on the regular and I'll be like yeah so they'll talk about you know we start talking and I'll say you know yeah i used to live here i used to do this i used to do that and i knew it will come in a second listen if you had money to invest you had 40 grand what you did and and you will see me like you'll see the fangs coming out you know if you had money to invest what would you do and my first question always was how much money are we talking about i was so so then they'll say well between, you know, let's say 50 to 100 grand, and I'll say, okay, listen, I'm going to teach you the first lesson you're going to learn in prison. Don't ever tell me how much money you have to invest. And he was like, why not? I said, because the first thing that I thought is how much of that 100 grand I can take from you for me and how much of that you'll be happy with for the next five, six years until you figure out that I just screw you out of money.

Don't do that. But people tend to gravitate towards people like us and open up, which is, I never understood it. And I have friends in prison and I used to tell me, man, why do people talk to you about money? Don't you know that you're here for fraud? And I was like, yeah, but that's how it's always been, you know. And I'm sure it's the same thing with people that are, well, I don't even have to tell you. How many doctors, how many fraudulent doctors we ask in prison? Listen, can you check me out to see what else wrong with me?

I mean, it's just people are drawn to people with our personalities. Yeah. And it's dangerous. Very, very, very dangerous. All right. So I'm, I, all right. Let's wrap this up. You want to wrap this up?

Only because there's, like, there's things I want to ask you, but I think they're off limits. Yeah. I know that there are cases. There are things that are going on. For now. But I'm definitely, as things, as the dust settles and things clear. But when you were incarcerated towards the end, you started doing a lot of legal work, right? I started doing a lot of legal work.

That's how I ended up in the shoe. Oh, okay. Yeah, I ended up in the shoe. You were helping the guys get out of ice, guys get their cases moved along. Yeah, and right now, like, I work, I volunteer for a law firm. And my, what I do is I do research for guys that are on detention. Yeah. And it's, it's, the system is a disaster.

Yeah. The system has to change. Yeah. I mean, if the Bureau of Prison System and the justice system is horrible, I can only imagine what ICE is like. It's, yeah. Like, this is how they treat you when you're a citizen. Yeah. What if you're not?

This is, that's like the cream of the crop. Then you go to ice. Oh, yeah. I used to always say, look, like the Bureau of Prisons is how the government would treat you if they had total control over you. Like, that's what the system would be like. You'd be moved around, told what to eat, told. what to do, when to do this, when to do that. They would give you bare minimum medical.

Like if they had all total control, this is how they would treat you. Well, I'm going to tell you a story that you will appreciate because your sense of humor is a little dark like mine. So I came here very young to the United States. Right. And I grew up very non-Hispanic. You know, I lived in Minnesota out of all places. Insane Cloud, Minnesota.

So I always thought I was white. Always. All my life, I thought I was white. Even when I went to prison, I was like, I'm white. white. You know, I'm with the white folks because I'm white. Well, until I went to ice and I realized I wasn't white. I'm brown. And so I do seven months there because I'm brown with the browns, you know? Yeah, yeah. That's what we do. So I come out of ice and I'm like, okay, so I'm brown. So I realized I'm not white. It was a little, you know, personality issue, but I'm brown.

And I'm comfortable with my brownness. But I have friends that are white that know me from when I thought I was white. So the other day I was talking to somebody and he go, and I said, well, you know, because I'm, the big joke, because I'm brown, right? And he's like, dude, but you're not brown. You're white. And I said, dude, what the hell are you talking about? I'm brown.

And we had a whole argument about why I wasn't brown. And I'm like, dude, but I'm brown. And I'm okay with being brown. And he's like, no, but I'm not okay with you being brown because you're white. And I'm like, oh my God, this is the most senseless conversation. conversation. I have ever had in my life. That's what the system does. The system kind of segments everything. I mean, it just gives you a different perception on reality. And yeah, when we have to sit down and we have to talk about a bunch of other things that are going on. So I was going to say,

do you remember Red Bull, Andrew Levinson? Yes. Okay. So he and this guy named one were having an argument one time when Obama, I think I've told you this, Obama was president. and one was a black guy and Andrew Levinson is obviously a white guy and so who like to have sex with midgets by the way yeah I think I did hear the story yeah so he so they're having an argument and one is the black guy is saying that Obama is not black and Andrew Levinson Levinson is saying he is black and so as I'm walking down the hallway they go wait wait wait cox cox come here come here You know, they always want you to settle an argument. Come here, come here. And I go, what's up? And they go, listen, is President Obama? Is he black?

And I go, and I looked at him and I go, no, he's not black. He's a white guy. And one goes, see, see? And Andrew goes, he goes, Elevinson goes, he goes, wait, wait, wait, why do you say he's not black? And I go, he doesn't even have a felony. And so one just like, so in me, Andrew starts laughing and one's like, it's all upset. I go, what did you expect me to say? Anyway, so that reminds me.

And people need to understand. Race in prison kind of goes, I mean, you have your racial issues and you know that if there's ever an argument, like Matt is my white friend. And if there was ever a fight between whites and browns, either he's going to punch me or I'm going to punch him, but that doesn't have anything to do with our friendship. It just has to have.

I remember, I had white bunkeys that used to tell me that. You know, if there is ever a fight, I'm going to have to beat you up. But we're still bodies, right? I mean, after that, we're going to hang out. And I'll be like, yeah. Yeah, you just have to ride with my car. I'm just going to have, yeah, you're going to have to be with your people.

And I'll have to, you know, I'll just eat out of a freaking straw for the next two weeks. But then we'll be cool. You know, we're friends, whatever. So that racial barrier kind of disappears. When I got out, my kids were like, dad, you're super politically incorrect. I mean, you have to like tone it down a little bit because you're not in prison anymore. And I was like, yeah, but I don't, you know, I earned my stripes. and I did my time

and they're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. Nobody knows that you just got out of prison. So, tone it down a little bit with the racial things because... Oh, yeah, it's so brutal in prison. Like, it's so brutal. Like, the things when I, even when I went into prison, I would have never said things that once I got into prison,

after a few years, I'm saying horrible, vicious things. You know, and then when I got out of prison, it's like, immediately you're getting the looks and you're like, I can't talk like this anymore. Yeah. Like, if you, look, for instance, saying, it took me a while to start saying please and thank you because in prison nobody says please and thank you is like yo bro give me let me get some of that coffee when i first got there i'm like i mean

yeah yeah can you say please or what man come on man let me get some of that coffee let me get and you're like i'm like god these guys are these guys are savages listen like two years later i'm like yo bro you got any sweet and low let me get some of that and i'm like whoa i got out now i'm realizing I have to say thank you and please and be polite and be nice and be like it's hard to get back used to that. And you know when you realize you're not that person when you start dating somebody and you're like, hey, listen, can you give me that? And they're like, what do you become your maid? Why don't you get up and get that? Or when you have an argument, like I will say things like this and if they're there they said, if anybody talked to me like that when I was in prison, they wouldn't be able to.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, but you're not in prison. Yeah, yeah. So I guess what? I get to talk to you however the hell. What are you going to do? Staff me, shank me. well you know you keep my name out your mouth that's what you do you're lucky one out in the streets what i said to jess the other day she was we were we were doing something i forget i looked

and i i i said um i don't know what she said she was going to do but i i said oh i said i wish you would i wish you would and she looked at me and she goes she says don't get hurt okay i'm not about that life no more and we listen i get It's such a joke now. Thank God. And I have terms that I have to like, like I went to the doctor a week ago. And my daughter's called me and they're like, Dad, where are you? And I say, I'm a medical.

And I'm like, oh my God. And I said, I'm at the doctor. And then I kept saying all day like, yeah, because I went to medical. I'm like, Jesus Christ. And the Tupperwares. I keep telling them, listen, do you have a bowl? Yeah. And I'm like, it's not called a ball.

And sorry, I got it. So it's, you know, it becomes part of your life. Yeah. It's a lot of time. Yeah. A decade in prison is a long time. It's a long time. Like I was telling.

Yeah, yeah, my buddy. Your body that left. Yeah. Forget about everything else. Forget about the gangs. Forget about the stabbing. Forget about that. If you're listening to these podcasts, if you're watching me right now, I want you to

imagine the next 10 years without getting laid. Yeah. Without somebody from the opposite. obviously, because there's a lot of sex going on in prison. But just think about that. Just think that somebody told you tomorrow, June 24th, whatever the day it is, that until the year, 20131... Yeah, you can't have sex.

You can't have sex again. You have to think about it like this, too, is that, you know, it's funny how much stuff is how many people base crimes on their pride and being a man and this and that. Okay, well, you're saying you're being a tough guy and a man. Well, if you get locked up, you're not having sex for 10 years. How much of a man does that make you? That's it. Like, if you start really breaking it apart, you're like, oh, wow, yeah, you know what?

Like, you can't turn the TV. You have to ask permission to turn the TV. By the way, you know who's having sex during those 10 years? Your wife. Yeah, exactly. Lots of it. Yeah. Good times.

So, yeah, I mean, there is a lot of things about prison that people don't think about the TVs, the lights, the bathrooms, the showers, the, you know, I remember when I took a shower without sandals without you know shower shoes i was like my god it felt uncomfortable it was weird i was like is this is this even has it i mean for a year for really six no for six months after i got out of the halfway house at four o'clock i started feeling uncomfortable because at four o'clock count so i would feel uncomfortable that i'm supposed to be in my cell waiting to be counted it's like what's cell what are you thinking like mentally you're just it's insanity you're so i'm so So, it plays in the grocery store, all the, all the stuff you can buy.

Like, there's not a commissary. There's not like two items that you can buy in this group or three items. There's, you know, 150, which one you're going to buy? I love going to the supermarket, but I just, like, I go with a shopping cart and go around and around and around and around. And it's what you said. Too many choices. The only aisle that I don't go is the one where they have the Roman noodles. That one I just breeze right through it.

But everything else, it's just, it's different. It's different. It's a different world. Good times. Yeah. And I think a lot of people that, you know, like they said, a lot of people watch this podcast and it's really cool to hear the crime stories. And it's cool to see, man, they had a, because we had a lifestyle.

Yeah. We had a, we had a, we had, I had a lifestyle. You know, I had, man, I, I never look at a price tag of anything, anything. I will go to a restaurant and, listen, I remember many times, I will go out with people, with a group of people, and I will give my credit card to the waitress when I walked in. and I will say, listen, bring the check in that card because I don't want to be fighting who's going to pay one. Yeah.

So I didn't even know if they overcharge me. She would just bring the credit card slip. I will sign it, and that was it. I mean, private flights. Best hotel suites. I hear people, people used to bitch about gas. Like, man, it's $1.75 or it's a dollar. And I never.

Like, the things that people thought about back then that I would hear them complain about, it never even occurred to me. Like. and then you go back to a shoebox and leaving of a shoebox for years. Oh, and you're calculating commissary to try and buy, like, do I haven't?

Okay, I can't get the extra cream. I don't have enough to get the extra cream or it's $1.65 and I only have $1.25 after all of this stuff. And, man, it's an eye opener. Then you come back and like all my clothes at first they were like monochromatic. So there's outfits that I wear that people go, dude, you look that you're an inmate.

And I'm like, oh, yeah, I guess I bought like a precent shirt. You do understand everybody complains that I wear nothing about white and black shirts. Okay, so we're on the same boat. Yeah, I wear blue jeans, all I wear, blue jeans, white or black shirts. That's all I wear. I'm still wearing the same blue jeans that I got. When I got to the halfway house, I went to Walmart. I bought $300 worth of clothes.

I bought four blue jeans. I'm still wearing 90% of the time I'm wearing those blue jeans. And I'm going to tell you one thing. I wouldn't trade this for the world right now. Oh, no, it doesn't even matter that you know that it's like to me that I'm, I'm just getting by every month. Like I could care less. I can care less, man. I'm happy. I don't have to worry about all the stuff. So yeah, the stories are cool and the lifestyle is cool and, you know, going into a place and people knowing about it or going to realize how good they have it. You got to have, you got to be stripped down and have nothing before you can really realize how, how, how, what a gift. Listen, what a gift like, like this. I don't need a TV. I don't really need much. I just need this. And it's crazy sometimes. Like, I thought I was going to watch a lot of TV when I got out.

I'm like, okay, I'm going to catch up with every show. Man, I don't watch TV. No. Oh, I've been totally broken of that habit. Yeah, I'm off that habit. The only time I watch stuff is sometimes I'll put in like Netflix, which like I don't even pay for Netflix, just pays for Netflix. Like I'm on her account.

Like I have YouTube premiere. I'm on somebody else's account. Like, oh, but can you add me to your account? Why? Because I don't have enough money left over the end of the end of the month. Yeah, yeah, no problem. I'll put on documentaries or I'll put on a TV show. I don't watch it.

I listen to it. I'm painting while maybe it's on, but I'm barely even paying attention if I do that at all. So yeah, you're right. I mean, like, all these people,

oh, I watched the whole series of this. I'm like, and I have people telling me, hey, have you watched a show? No, you have to watch it.

When do you watch these shows? You should be having sex with your girlfriend. You should be having sex with your boyfriend? You think I spent 10 years in prison to come out and watch TV? What, four hours a day of TV?

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, that comes later. That comes later. if ever right now it's catch up time catch up with my kids have you watched orange the new black no I live I live yeah orange is the new black and let me tell you it's not the new black

it's fucking orange I wear it for six months in the shoe orange is orange that's it yeah man so let's wrap it up sorry I mean you know I know good to see you man we're going to continue this

yeah yeah as soon as other things resolve themselves resolve themselves and I get a little more You're assuming you don't go back to Venezuela and get hacked up. Well, I remember this nice guy in prison, his question for a long time was, how much do you think they will pay me if I tell them where you are? That's not true. That is true, and you know that you used to ask me.

Listen, so they want to kill you? Yeah. How much do you think they will pay me if I tell them where you are? By that point, I'd already contact to them. So I don't know if this is more like a Ransom video that I'm doing here And it's going to be distributed somewhere else Right now.

Yeah. They're waiting right now. I want to come. I don't know if I should be getting out of this place And they're going to be some. Yeah. All right. Hey, if you like the video.

Oh, so this was Juan Sanchez. I'm sure he'll be back. And if you like the video, subscribe. Hit the like button. Leave a comment for the algorithm. Share the video. send it to as many people as you can and that's it

and I appreciate you watching and same here see ya hasta manana