Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Casino Scammer Reveals His Secrets | 100% WIN RATE

Episode Date: July 15, 2025

Matt Cox & Craig dive deep inside the wild life of a reformed Vegas cheater, limo boss, and tour bus driver for rock stars, with stories from prison to running with the mob. ⁣⁣Do you want to be a guest? Fill out the form https://forms.gle/5H7FnhvMHKtUnq7k7⁣⁣Send me an email here: [e-mail]⁣⁣Do you extra clips and behind the scenes content?⁣Subscribe to my Patreon: https://patreon.com/InsideTrueCrime ⁣⁣⁣Follow me on all socials!⁣Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/insidetruecrime/⁣TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@matthewcoxtruecrime⁣⁣⁣Do you want a custom painting done by me? Check out my Etsy Store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/coxpopart⁣⁣Listen to my True Crime Podcasts anywhere: https://anchor.fm/mattcox ⁣⁣Check out my true crime books! ⁣Shark in the Housing Pool: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0851KBYCF⁣Bent: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BV4GC7TM⁣It's Insanity: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08KFYXKK8⁣Devil Exposed: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08TH1WT5G⁣Devil Exposed (The Abridgment): https://www.amazon.com/dp/1070682438⁣The Program: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0858W4G3K⁣Bailout: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/bailout-matthew-cox/1142275402⁣Dude, Where's My Hand-Grenade?: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BXNFHBDF/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1678623676&sr=1-1⁣⁣Checkout my disturbingly twisted satiric novel!⁣Stranger Danger: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BSWQP3WX⁣⁣If you would like to support me directly, I accept donations here:⁣Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/MattCox69⁣Cashapp: $coxcon69

They had a contraption that could beat it. So I mean, all the casinos in Vegas, like you got a way to win, beat him for sure. And right as I get to the lobby, it opens up Henderson Police Department. All of a sudden, I just book it. Now, I'm running through the casino. My dad, he got in trouble for cheating at slots. Back then, he was using a light device. Okay, what is that?

Okay, so basically you have a slot machine, you have the hopper. When the hopper empties out quarters, okay, it's triggered by a light, like an infrared light or something. So this light will turn on, like, if it needs to, if you hit cash out 10 quarters, it stays on for whatever it is, two seconds, three seconds, long enough to divvy out ten quarters. Okay. So this device had a little, it was like a little piece of plastic, like it looked like a little shoehorn and had a little light on there. And you'd stick it in under, you know, you'd stick in the machine and it would stick

in there so you couldn't see it. You know, you sit down, stick it up in there. Right. And it would, and it was shaped perfectly. So when you stuck it up in there, it would go right in between where this lights on. And so basically when you hit cash out and you, and you clicked it and turned the light on, the quarters would keep coming out as long as that light was on. and so he was able to empty machines that way.

I remember a time when I was young, probably 18, 17. He actually took me with him one time to do it. And he did it at the airport in McCarran Airport in Las Vegas. Okay. Because there's like, in the middle of the night, these terminals were open. This is before 9-11, you know,

so you could just go there and go up to the terminals. Yeah. So there's all these machines back there, and nobody there, not even a camera on him. And, you know, he brings suitcases and just fill up them, fill up the machine the suitcases with quarters so if he's if he goes into but but if you go into a um a casino he what goes in and acts like he's playing the machine correct while he's sticking this thing up there and once he's got it and he goes to hit cash out from the videos they think oh

he just hit a jackpot well no not necessarily because you're hitting cash out okay well i can get to it later when i talk about okay well i'll explain all that okay but because it's the same concept of what what what I was doing. Okay. Just it was just, I was just wondering like, how do they not see it from? Okay,

because so what happens is so the credits will stop the thing that's going on when you cash out, like say you're cashing out 10 coins. So once you start hitting the thing, the quarter and you're like

you're catching the quarters. Yeah. Once you're, once it's, once it's activated, the credit stop, but the quarters keep coming out still. Yeah,

no, I understand. So they, but I'm thinking they think, they just think you're just cashing out, you know, they don't know, they don't know that it's supposed

to be 10 quarters or a hundred. Correct. So as long as you cover up that, you know what I mean, put a pack of cigarettes on there or whatever you would do. And so you'd also have to have a blocker for the camera. So if there's a camera over, you know, where the camera angles at, you have, so when you sit down, you have someone blocking that camera angle as you're putting it in there. Right. So they can't see you put it in there. That's the thing, you know, because that's where you can, you know, get.

Yeah, yeah, the guy stands the, what are the, the Romanian wall. And then you've got to be, yeah, and you got to be careful if you keep going to the same place and obviously he's hitting the certain. Because only certain machines would work, not all of them, not every machine in the, you know, had to be real slot machines. What happens? So you're, you're being raised by your grandparents. And at this time, my dad was still locked up. How old are you at this point?

I was like 20, I'm going to say 22, 20, maybe 21, 22 years old. Right. What are you doing for a living? So I'm doing odd jobs. I'm like painting. I'm delivering pizza, just like nothing really. Right. I don't know what I'm going to do really, you know.

So then I ended up, you know, I was doing drugs, I was on drugs and stuff like that. So I ended up doing a lot of fraud. A lot of fraud back then, like checks. I was doing checks, a lot of checks. I got into, you know, back then you could write a check for any. You can go shopping with a check. You can go cash a check. And so it was a thought that I did that for a few years until he got out.

He got out and I was in the midst of doing that. Basically, I was a criminal already at that point. Right. I just hadn't been in trouble for anything yet. He gets out for a little while and he ended up violating his parole. but when he got out, he had some friends from New Orleans that came out, and they knew it because he couldn't do the old way with the light device in the machine. Right.

So these guys come out from New Orleans, and they have, it's a father and son too, actually. So they couldn't do it anymore because they replaced the machines. Right, yeah, they put what was called on their roly bars, what they called it. They just put a thing over top of that. You can't get that device in there anymore. You can't get that device in there nowhere, right? So these, this father and son, they came out and they had a contraption that you didn't, that could beat it.

They wouldn't let no one see, you know, see it or whatever, but we went with them and kind of did it as a blocking thing, you know, whatever. And it was crazy because it was way better than the light because there was no electronics on it. It was just a bent piece of wire with a magnet on it. They were, you know, we were trying for the week there in town and, you know, just get our hands on it so we can look at it to try to make one, but never could, never was successful.

And then my dad went into his parole, a parole officer. And he was not supposed to be in casinos. That was like one of his things. And so they, when he was in there, the parole officer asked him for his wallet. He's in my wallet. What do you mean? Let me see your wallet. And he gave his wallet.

And he looked through it and found players cards before he went back on his violation. So we're both living at my grandparents house. And I'm sleeping in bed. And all of a sudden I get, I wake up and there's a gun in my face. And it's gaming control agents. They really had guns in my face. Where's your dad at? And I honestly didn't know where he's at.

I said, I don't have no idea where he's at. so they get me up and they marched me in the living room and they said well he we know he's in the house this is a big house in Las Vegas and I said well I don't even know if he's home or not I said he's look in his room and they I guess the gaming agent went into the backyard they were looking for him went to his bedroom his bedroom and his window is open and they said hey Tommy whatever called his name and he goes yeah what's up who is it who's out there you know and then they said gaming come outside and that's when he just never came outside you know so they so that I'm sitting in the living room and handcuffs and I don't even know where he's at or what's going on and they come in there and they say they're going to bring a dog so everyone has to leave the house because they're going to bring a dog in to try to find him and see if he's in the house and so the dog comes and they don't find nothing so they're about like where did he how did he just disappear so they they leave they tell me that if you help them or whatever you're going to get you aiding and abetting and all that kind of shit you know so of course I get a phone call like I don't know an hour later and it's him

I mean, he's at this park right by the house in his underwear. How did he get out? Okay, so he, we're all out front. Okay, this is the crazy part. So we're all out front. What he did was is when, when the, he knew the gaming was outside. He went into the living room. We had this big screen TV, like a big screen TV.

And it was like inside of a, you know, shelving. Right. He crawled up into top of that and crawled in behind it. Like literally fell headfirst behind this TV in the wall and was like just in this corner just wedged in there the whole time that we're in there like, talking about that once he heard that we're going to go out for the dog. He waited until everyone went outside and he crawled back out of there, went to the back sliding glass door.

He said he opened it up. There was a cop on both walls of the house right there looking the other way. And he tiptoed right through the grass. And we're talking he had to walk like 30 yards to the back wall. And he said he was waiting to hear freeze. Put up your hand. You know what I mean? He didn't hear nothing.

He finally got to the wall and slinked over it. And then ended up going to this park and then waiting and it called me. and then um i uh uh brought him some clothes and i dropped them off at this um hotel off a boulder highway a motel or whatever and they got him that same day somehow and that was that was that was part of the that was yeah that was violation basically yeah okay that was basically the violation um he uh um they knew he was playing machines they didn't arrest him like at that moment but that's they came that's when they came back to get him so okay that and that was the violation and so it's so it was the violation and so it's

then he went back to jail and then um uh and then so started my whole you know when i started doing it i ended up somehow getting a slot machine i got a slot machine it's in my house and i'm trying to figure out i remember yeah how this guy's beating it or what's it's doing you know and you know i've got the thing taken apart and i'm looking at the hopper and to see how it works and and i figured out what's going on that you just need to basically hold down that rolly bar if you hold down that rolly bar and you hit cash out it's just going to keep coins are going to keep coming out okay until you stop holding that down so i you know basically and that's the wire that they were that's what they were doing that's the wire correct so so so right so then i so i got these wires and all this stuff and

you know experimenting with them and getting them bent right to go up the shoe you know go up into there and then i end up putting two magnets on the bottom so when it's in there it can stick inside there and i got it to where it works you know in my house great it's different you do it in the house or you know actually out on you know a casino but got it in my house great and i kept practicing how to put it in really fast i could sit down and just put it in perfectly and so um the device is made yeah i know it works right okay so um i pick this small casino that's kind of off this it's off the strip a little bit um sand remo is the name of it it's gone now but and then it was hooters for a while i think too hooters casino they changed it went through different

And any of all, so they had, I would go in there and eat sometimes so I knew the layout. And there was these back machines, this four, you know, back wall. And there were, um, IGT machines, um, double diamond. And it had to be IGT reel machines. Okay. You know, um, slot reel machines. And the reason being is really, you can look down in between the, the reels and you can kind of see the hopper too.

Okay. So if you stick the device up there, you can see. Right. you know what it's doing how you're guiding it correct like i was you know great at it in the towards once i started doing it right and you have to do any look like look in there do anything like that i was great at it but so basically what would happen is you know i um like i explained before you stick it in and you know the quarters will come out so when i picked um san remo um i went in there and um uh i was by myself which is not you should have a blocker but i went in by myself because

like I said, there was no cameras on these machines, particularly machines. I went in, I put a dollar in the machine, so I got four credits. Right. Right when I sat down, I stuck my device in there. I hit cash out, pulled on the, you know, you just have to pull on a little bit where you're cup, it looks like you're just catching the quarters, and the quarters just keep kept coming out. And it took me about 20 minutes of machine, I think.

And I hit four or five of them. I walked out with about 4,400 bucks in quarters on the first. You know, you get about, you get about, so some machines have double hoppers. So if one goes empty, the other one will drop down. Right. So you get about 300 bucks per hopper. Right. And you can do it on dollar machines and stuff too, but it seems like dollars, the bigger coins would jam.

Right. And believe it or not, a bucket of quarters is actually more money than a bucket of dollars just because of the size of them. Okay. Yeah, so, yeah, so I ended up about $4,400 on that one. And when you leave and they, do they later go check the machine and realize something's wrong? That's the thing because you would think jackpot. So maybe a couple of jackpots got hit. You would think because I exhausted like that place after I did that.

Like that was the one place I went. I didn't go nowhere else but there because I felt comfortable. Right. And I was by myself then. and I exhaust I mean I would go there so much I'd go in there and the machines would be empty still so I'd be like damn I can't have to wait you know they're not the machines are empty from me last time I went right um and you know there were some things too like if you would have it in there too long when you're when you're cashing out and the quarters are coming out if you held it for more than

10 seconds it would tilt the machine too you had to like stop you had to keep radically stopping you know you can maybe hold it like 10 12 seconds right with the quarters coming out and then you had to like let it off so you know the credits would go because if it did if it was kept going without those credits going for so long it would tilt the machine then you got to pull the thing out was tilt the machine shut it off yeah we just basically give a code like 3400 I think it was what it would say and start blinking and then you would have to um you know call the the the slot guy would have to come down open it up reset it right like no big deal you just pull it out pull the thing out put it back in you know um and then at the same time um I meet a girl another girl I was dating

and we ended up getting into a lot of, like, check fraud again, but kind of on a whole other level, like, um, cashing them, not just buying things, but actually, you know, cashing them for cash, like with, with telecheck and surgery, that kind of stuff. So, so she's going out with me and we're, and now I'm, I have her, so she's, like, blocking for me, you know, as far as I'm going, so I'm going in circus, circus. I'm hitting all the casinos in Vegas, like, I'm going absolutely,

and not only that, I'm doing that, and she's cashing checks and at the cage, you know what I mean? So we're going into some casinos and walking out with, you know, $15,000, and sometimes more but the crazy thing is is that both of us really but complete degenerate gambler I've always been a degenerate gambler and just put it back in right I would literally go play blackjack and stuff like that and put it back in so it's like um yeah it's nuts like you got a way to win beat them for sure but yeah yeah still would give it back it's crazy and how much do you make per machine well each machine okay so you're going to get around each if it's the hopper's full

you're going to get anywhere between three to like $450. Some machines have double hoppers where those, like if one empties, the top one will dump. Right. I used to like sometimes at San Remo, like I would, it would empty, then you would get a little code would come up at, like the light would start flashing. I pulled it out, called over the slot person,

and they'll come and fill it back up. You know what I mean? Like, cool. Then I'll just do it again, you know? Is this suspicious that you're walking around with, Do you have more buckets of quarters than everybody? Every casino I've been. It's all electronic nowadays, so I can't.

Well, what I do is once I'd get a couple buckets full, I would just walk back out to my car and put it in the car. Right. I wouldn't. I mean, I'd take it back. At first, I would just go cash it at the cage because you would just, I wasn't really worried about it at first. You know, it got until later when I was just thinking,

I meant I better start doing something here. I keep going to the cage cashing these in. They're like, wow, you sure are winning. Yeah, you sure are the only one winning here. You know what I mean? So I started, I would just put them in, you know, put the buckets in the car in the car. And at one point I had the whole trunk of the car were full of quarters at one point. Like it looked like a low rider in the back.

Like it was just, I mean, we're talking quarters just everywhere like all the time. Okay. Like nonstop. I mean, how do you, by the way, how do you convert these quarters into actual cash? Like, do you roll them and go into bank? No, you just go into casinos that you're not doing that at. okay and they have the they have the automatic things you just dump them in the and it spits the thing out that's right they have those at like

public probably yeah grocery stores and stuff that's right you just do it like that and then once I'd get that you know green cash in my hand and I'd go back to the casino and usually blow it playing machines that I like to play right still so it was a vicious cycle yeah how are you choosing which casinos to do this in basically the smaller ones at first it was the smaller ones because I just felt more you know safer they had, like, probably less technology, right, you know, so to speak. And then it, um, the bigger ones didn't, so it got to a point to where those machines were kind of like phasing out. Yeah. And the ticket started coming in, you know, the tickets without,

so there wasn't no coin. Right. There's still a lot of coin, but then it, there was, you know, but the ticket, it's not going to work. You have to have coin. So the bigger machine, the bigger casinos kind of were going, already going on that ticket premises, you know what I mean? And then when it, when it came down to it when it went so bad in Vegas I kind of burned it out for a while like I would go to Laughlin and do it I'd go to Mississippi we'd fly to Mississippi and do it on the you know the river boats yeah I was going to say in that in the book of busting Vegas they they eventually that those the MIT kids that were doing the card counting get they're just blackballed like they're just they can't go anywhere and so they end up going

Monte Carlo like they're going to the UK like they're flying all over the world doing this and they're just getting kicked out everywhere. You know, they'd get, sometimes they'd have two hours, sometimes they'd have four days. But eventually they catches up to him and they just kicked out. They had the black book or that, whatever that. The black book, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

My dad never made the black book. He passed away. His good buddy, though, that I grew up with, he made it. His name's Louis O. Layjack. I think he's dead now, but he made it in there. But the, like, another time was we were on a cruise ship type thing. You know, the ones that would, like, get on and they just float out to it. international water so you can gamble.

And I guess those are owned by like the English, I don't know, like the English, I don't know who owns them, but we did, we were out there one time. We hit all these machines and we were done. We basically emptied them out. And we're standing there waiting for the, for just, you know, to go back. And we're sitting there, we could see the lights of wherever it was.

I can't remember. It might have even been Florida or maybe Mississippi, somewhere down in Gulf of Mexico, or Gulf of America, I should say, back then Gulf of Mexico. But the, and as we're standing there, these two plain-closed security guards come up to us, you know? And they just said to us, they go, do you know what keel-holding is?

You know what does that mean? They go, look it up before you come back. And they left and walked off. And so come to find out what keel-holding was, is back in the day on ships to punish the whoever did, whatever they did, they would tie your legs and your arms with rope, throw you down, and then drag you under the ship back and forth. You know, I mean, so I think that was the way to say, like, if they knew something was up, they couldn't come back yeah you know what keel holding is like that's where you know so yeah we

never went back and did that there then um my dad got out um soon after and he he didn't know really what i was doing i didn't you know the machines i didn't really tell him anything yet and then um i told him i was working on it right i didn't want him to get in trouble there's you know there's a lot of reasons and he uh so then one day when i first got it was super bowl sunday I never forget, I was by myself, and I was at Circus, Circus. And I'm at this machine I hit all the time. I play this machine all the time. Well, there's like a little side door there in,

you walk in, there's machines right here. There's a little side door, and then there's like a street here. And a little street here, it's like you can kind of go in, knock the machine out, and go out. So I'm in there playing the machine. And I look over, and I see it's like security. I think security guard might be looking at me over there. And I'm like, wow, and I look over, and I see another one over there. you know what I mean? Then I see this other one like sitting there and he's looking at a piece

of paper. He's looking at the paper and he's looking at me. He's looking at the paper and looking at me. I got to go. And I said, oh, well, it's time for me to go, right? So I've got three big, gigantic buckets full of quarters. I would never cash out there. I would always take him out with me and go somewhere else because you just don't want that, you know, that attention. You don't want to hang out that long. Right. So I've got these three buckets of quarters and I'm walking, going to walk out the door and they kind of surround me. They're not touching me, but they're surrounding me, you know. Hey, we need to talk to you. Come this way. And I'm like, no, I'm just going to, I'm just going to leave. I'm good. I don't know. You know what I mean?

They're like, no, we need you to come this way. And so right then at that moment, I took the three, the three bucks, you know, the quarters and I just dropped them. So we're talking, you know, $750, $800 with the quarters just, boom, all over the whole casino floor. And everyone's looking down. Right when they look down, I pushed a guy out my way. I hit that side door. Now I'm running. And this is, is, they chase you? Oh, yeah. So I'm running. And so I'm across the street, pretty good distance away. and I hear this tink, tink, and I kind of turn around to look and then all of a sudden something just hits my legs and it trips me up and I slam on my face. This security guard pulled out his billy club thing and threw it and it suddenly bounced to the ground, bounced to the ground, and then caught up in my legs and then tripped me down and knock me down.

He's talented. When they cuff me was bringing me back, I was like, dude, that was gangster. Like I was they're getting mad at him like, if I'm supposed to get caught, I guess. That was gangster. So I'm arrested. me in the back room and um this gaming agent comes and gets me and he is looking through the things or whatever and he's like looking at my last name he's like Rita Rita you know are you related to Tom Rita I said yes my dad you know Tommy Rita he goes god damn man I remember you when you was

a little kid because I've been chasing your dad his whole life you know and he goes I put him how is he you know I said well he just got out you know what I mean and he was like man Appalink fall far from the tree so we're driving to jail and he says can we call him he's out and I said, I guess I'm going to call me to, so I call him on the phone. And the dude, like, they were like old high school buddies or something laughing and joking. And then he said, he put me in jail and he goes, he goes, he goes, he goes, he goes, how much money got? And he goes, I said, I had like $400 in my pocket. He goes, I'm just going to charge you with one thing right now so you can bail out. But, you know, they're going to be more coming later. But, and I was like,

yeah, that's how that was. That was the first time I got arrested for it. It's Sam the Sheep Dog and Wiley Coyote, you know, checking in, checking, how you doing, how you're doing, how you're going. Well, you got to remember, think these gaming enforcement agents back then, especially too, like, they didn't have a lot to, there wasn't anybody really doing that kind of stuff. Right. So, like, you know, they were.

It's almost exciting for them. Yeah, that's, you know, they don't, yeah, there has to be. And how, what, what year was this? This was 2003. 2003-ish, yeah, something like that. All right. So now I get out of jail, all that. And then obviously my dad knows now that, you know, what I'm doing.

And so he ends up basically going with me, we're doing it. Saying, why did you cut me in? Yeah, basically, yeah, that's basically what he was saying, you know. But, you know, and he wanted nothing to do with anything fraudulent, like the checks and all that kind of stuff, he wanted nothing to do with that. Like, he just wanted to do, he wanted to do that, but he also marked cards. Right. How is that working, by the way, the check, when you say that, like, I was, like, I was, I was, okay.

So, I'm thinking, you have a fake ID? Okay, so basically what I would do was, what I did was, is I would look, for example, on, online for like, I would type in things like, um, uh, wire transfer or, um, you know, anything like that, wire transfer, wire transfer, basically, any wire transfer number. You can just Google wire transfer number. And a lot of these things will come up with, like, mostly like, um, places where you can donate stuff to. and they'll show you like the wire, wire info, like the routing them. Right, the right, right. So as long as I, I would get an account number

is basically what I was looking for. Right. Any kind of checking account number. Say if it was Bank of America, I got a checking account number. Great. Then I would make the checks. I would use the routing number.

They're all the same. You know what I'm saying? And then make an ID, you know, whatever name you want. It didn't matter. It didn't have to match the numbers on the check. Okay. And there's no way for them to even,

it's like Bank of America says a private banking institution. So they can't even call the bank and ask them. right hey what's is there any money in the yeah they can't tell them anything about it you mean so um we're doing that and we were making the checks you know with the software you could get back then but then i learned that you could just take um you know those ads that for the custom checks you can just order them they're written they're real checks now you got real

ones yeah and they just come it doesn't even matter if they don't ask you for ID or anything like that right then you just get the real checks and then back then it was just there was there was um telecheck where the two check systems that you had to like kind of beat and it was go by your driver's license number as far as prior bounce checks. So as long as you had a good driver's license number, they would cash the check. Right, because when they're putting those,

when the system's running, the checking, the account number, the driver's license number, as long as none of that's been used before, like in bounced. Right. Or if it's new,

then the check would get cashed. And you could go in shopping and do it. You know, whatever you want. I used to go in there and hit machines at the grocery store. Some of them, they had grocery stores had machines. They go in there and get $1,500 out of the grocery store and then go shopping.

And then just write a check. I wouldn't even pay for it with the money I had because why, why pay for groceries with that's crazy yeah that's who would do that who would do that i don't i have no idea i have no idea but yeah so to when your dad so your dad got out and you you so now he knows what you're doing right and you and he says oh show me how to do this like right so he we were doing it together and then he kind of got his own little thing going like his own little girlfriend and he's out doing the same thing you know um but he was also marking cards So we, we would, we would do that together.

Once we started going, I was going to all different kinds of casinos now at this point. Okay. In Vegas, circus, circus, so I got arrested there, doing the checks, pretty much in all the casinos as well. That was, that was becoming just as lucrative as the, as the slots were. Okay. Those are just incredible how easily those would cash. And those were a lot more risky. Like, you know, you have to put your fingerprint on the check.

So people use super glue and they do this. in that. Yeah. I used to just chew on my skin. You know, I'd chew, like, get the skin torn away. Yeah. And then I would just, like, stick the top of my finger on it. Like, not my whole, right. My whole finger. I'd just stick the top on it and then we'd never have a problem. Leading up to the downfall of all this. So at one time in Laughlin, I'm out there and I'm playing, and, um, I go to cash a check and I stick my finger to do the thing. And she grabs my hand and puts it all the way down and does it. All right. It's it for me. I'm thinking, oh, man. And it was for, like a $500 check or whatever.

No, he just had gambled like money. The machines were like, we're out there. Laughlin's only got a few casinos. And we'd already emptied them all out. Me, my girlfriend, they were them. So we couldn't really do the thing no more. We'd gamble with all the money back. And so we, I went and cash this check for $500 and got it.

And I ended up going and winning like $3,000 or something, four grand. And I go back to try to buy that check back. Like, hey, I don't, like, can I buy the deal? They were like, I was already in the safe. You're screwed. And I didn't think nothing of it until like later when, when the shit hit the fan on all that.

So I'll get to that later. But, um, so basically between me and my dad, my dad, we were out, you know, hitting these, um, hitting these, um, slot machines all through, all through Vegas. And, um, we were necessarily, we'd work together sometimes, but we kind of were just, I'd go in and sometimes to hit certain machines that we'd always hit and be, they'd be empty because he did it. Right. You know, and stuff like that. And so.

So at some point, you, you, you, oh, sorry. Yeah. So, so that's what led us into like going, focusing now more on the blackjack and kind of working together. Right. So how does that conversation happen? Like, you just say, hey. I just said, you know, we're kind of stepping on each other's toes here. And it's, um, uh, I knew the, and I was, I was losing a lot of my money playing blackjack

too on just on the square by myself. So I kind of like had an addiction to playing blackjack. Um, I've learned later on that it's a sucker's game no matter what you do. You can't, because you have to go first. I mean, think of a free throw contest. If we went out and shot a basketball in a free throw contest and you shot first and missed, then I automatically win. Right.

That's the same thing. That's the advantage. they got on that and they play perfect you know by the perfect blackjack because they're hitting on 16 standing on 17 on 17 on that yeah that's to their advantage to be you know at the end of the day but so we would go in and now and do the the um he would mark the cards so how that would work was is we would basically he would go in by himself first and he's going to put the work in it you would call it and he's sitting on like like say first base you want to that's first a first person to get a card so he would took him a

a half hour and he'd get all the tens marked since i know what to look for now i'm gonna come in and sit on the end like i don't even know him right you know i'm saying no and so say if it was a five dollar five five five dollar minimum hundred dollar maximum table right he's just betting five dollars and he's also while he's doing this he's doing something else too he's doing he as he's hitting and standing he's showing his cards like man look at this like no talking as he's just the dealer but he's doing crazy things like hitting 17s staying on you know um um um staying on um an eight just so stay on the eight because he's he what he's doing is he's setting up like so when they're watching him play it's only like five bucks that's going to come into play later when

i sit down and i'm betting a hundred or two hundred dollars a hand down on the end right because now if i need a say i got an 11 right i'm i'm flipping up like man i got 11 i'm going to double down right and we in he can you can see that there's not a 10 coming right he might take a he's got to hit sometimes so if him hitting a 17 now is not going to look so crazy if he's been doing that the whole time. So is this a certain type of blackjack? So you're actually able to pick up the cards and look at them? Yeah, correct.

They deal them out and, you know, you can pick them up and then you slide them underneath. But you can also flip them over. It don't matter. You're not, you don't have to hide them. And he has some type of substance on his fingers? Yeah, correct. So he's got a, he's got a dye on his fingers that you'd basically have to wear certain kind of glasses or like contacts to see it.

Okay. And he can, and he's basically going to get, they're going to say you get stelt two tens, you know, he's going to like, when he sticks it under the chips, he's going to like smudge it with his fingers the tens only and this dye is he got like something that he can keep um reupping the die or re well he would he would have to go back out to the car and maybe get more right sometimes um because you don't want to have it on him he doesn't want to have it on him yeah yeah in case something happens case of grab and then it's like what are you talking about correct could have been anybody right and then so he was doing that and he had no problem doing it with the

with the invisible they called it right and then some other crew got busted with the invisible and so he quit doing that because they were kind of onto it they were able to like if they if they took the cards you know confiscated cards off the table they could they have proof and they can get your finger you know they can have proof so he started doing just a regular like die he made i don't know how he made it you never told me but this way but you had to be trained to see the mark like i could see it playing his day so if i'm sitting on the end and he's sitting here and i he's going to basically feed me the make sure if i have a 10 or not 10 coming that's why he would be playing like hitting 17s and doing crazy stuff because it's not crazy

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Conditions apply. It looks uncommon for him to do it again now, like he's playing. And then I'm just talking shit, too, actually, on like, God, this guy, man, what are you doing? You know what I mean? Like getting frustrated because he's staying on eights, you know what I mean, and stuff like that. So that became pretty profitable. And that became pretty lucrative. We could go in and I could turn like a thousand into, you know, six or seven thousand really fast with just a couple.

Until they, you might get like 20 minutes. You start winning like that. They're going to change the cards. Right. Once they change the cards, it's, you know, you're done. What do you say when they change the cards? I just play a couple of hands and just leave. And just leave.

I'm just going to leave, yeah. And then do the, does the, what do they call it, the manager or the security, did they ever come over and like something's wrong? Stand behind you as they were something's wrong. Well, yeah, there's been times where they would ask me to leave or say, we don't want you playing blackjack anymore. Just thinking I'm counting cards is what they're thinking. Right.

They don't know that, which is not illegal to count cards. Right. But they don't have to serve you either. No, they would just basically say, you know, go, if it would be funny, sometimes they would tell me, you can't play, you can't play slot machines all you want. You just can't play blackshad. Right.

And be like, it's the last thing you want me to go do is go play slot machines. Right. Right. I can't lose on that one. And so, you know, that would happen sometimes. And so, uh, we would, uh, we end up home and like to Mississippi a lot down to the riverboats, you know, um, because Vegas was just burned out. We were just, my father's sister, Aunt Pat, was married to Claudiano's or something like that.

Anyway, he owned the Sands in Reno, Nevada, and eventually they sold that, and they had, like, two casino boats that went somewhere. I forget where they were. They were, maybe they were in Mississippi or something, and they did the casino cruises or something. Yeah, they'd take them out and go back. But he used to always say, like, you know, you just. you can't beat, you just can't beat the house, you know, it's just a matter of the fact that they're, they're just going to make, like, and they don't make a ton. You know what I'm saying?

The percentage that they, on average, win per night is like 2%, 1.5%, 3%. He's like, that's like, that's why you want to get so many millions of dollars going through the casino. He's like, because if you have $10 million running through the casino, then the casino that that night makes, you know, uh, whatever. you know, uh, you know, 300,000 or 600,000, you know, depending on how much you can just get to run through it. Because he's like, in the end, every million dollars it goes through it, you're making X amount of dollars. Oh, you can't, you can't win. He's like, that's what he's

saying. He's like, even if, say, the only person that could win is somebody who walked in, you know, bet whatever, you know, bet, won the bet, walked out, never played again. He's like, and that's not going to happen. Okay. Because for an example, when you're, how you're saying that for, like, if you live in Las Vegas, like I did, let's say I go into, uh, Palestinian and win, like the first time I ever hit a royal flush with like $1,500. I won $1,500. That was probably a huge mistake. Well, it was like you can't, sooner or later, since I live there and I'm gambling,

palestations are going to get the $1,500 back. It might take a month. It might take 10 years. It might take two days, but they're going to get it back a little at a time. They're never going to lose. I remember my grandfather told me when I went home and I won two royals actually. And I said, man, I won two royal flushes. Man, I know what I'm doing playing this.

you know and he goes um if you meet a man if you meet a person that's one more than four the three royal flushes in one year you'll meet a person in debt that's yeah that's a pretty yeah pretty factual statement yeah you can't you can't you can't do it i mean you there's professional gamblers that can go in and and have an edge obviously like you know um even on blackjack you know that can count cards you know they have an edge and they can do it kind of under the radar they're not doing it in large amounts right they're able to just go in and win a few hundred bucks, and they have the discipline to do that.

Right. And, you know. But what happens? You just get greedy. You start thinking on that good. You start, what happens? Well,

I think that, yeah, you just want more is basically what happens. Like with the card counting, it's, it's, the counting in the cards is easy. That's not the hard part.

It's, it's the being able to do it because you're going to be basically towards the end of every, like say it's a double deck. You're going to start, your bet's going to either go up or down towards the end because where your counts at,

whether you're going to be like plus eight or minus five or wherever it's at, you're going to either keep your bets low because it's got the, you know it's the house edge at that point, or if it's like the player edge, you're going to bump your bet up. And so it's kind of obvious as a,

from a pit boss to look at that and see that, you know what I mean? God, every time he raises his bet, 90% of the time he's winning, because he just basically knows that there's face cards are coming. There's more tens and there's more tens than small cards. And the counting cards, that's basically how they do that. And then if it's the, if there's more small cards,

that's when the dealers always make their crazy hands, you know, 16, 21, that kind of stuff. But to be able to do the betting right to where you're not kind of going on notice, that's the real talent. I think that's hard to achieve, you know, anymore. And I know you mentioned it, but I've making notes. I might have forgot. Why did you guys move to cards from the slots? Like if the slots are guaranteed.

Because they were phasing out. Well, one, they were tripping over each other, right? Well, basically, yeah, there were also, the coin was starting to become, yeah, it was harder to find, harder to find it. And there's no, there's no way to beat the electronic. No, not that, not any, not that we had. I mean, I've heard stories of people beating the, um, with the tickets being able to, like, do something counterfeit the tickets somehow to put them in the machine and get the credits to work. Like, I don't know how they did that or that was never nothing, but I, I never seen it firsthand, but, you know, I've heard about it. Um, so with your dad.

And he keeps, well, first, wait a minute, whatever happened with your charge, you did get charged. Okay. So I got charged for that. No, so it's now it was kind of pending. Yeah. You know, um, uh, I went to court whenever it was 30 days later and they said no charges filed yet at this point. Well, yeah, they have a year and a day to file. Right. So I'm thinking, oh, okay. I got, and I'm thinking to my head like, well. Maybe this guy won't file. Well, I'm thinking in my head like, you know, I don't think they really had anything on me. Right. Because I had to leave the device in the machine granted when I did it when they surrounded me I left the device in the machine but there's no camera of me putting the device in the machine right even though they had found it afterwards who's to say I put it in there you know what I'm saying and and how they caught me was is someone just told on me somebody I knew or something had called and tipped them off for whatever reason I don't know why but that's the that's the that's from the discovery it just said that's what it said in the discovery they didn't say who it was or what they did but they just someone called and tip that off on that one so now I'm um a few months go by I'm gonna say probably four months go by And I just forget about it, like that arrest.

Then the next thing I know I wake up one day and there's like eight cops in my bedroom pointing guns at me and my girlfriend, you know, get up. You know, we have a search warrant and I get up and I remember saying like, can I put my pants on? You know, I grab my pants to put on. And then they pat my pants down and they pull a cheating device right out of my pocket I had in my pants from the day before. And I'm just dead in the water. There's eight felonies as you walked in the front door. You know what I mean? Right.

There's a, my office that's got like, where they're doing the checks and the IDs. Like this is a whole, you know, there's a whole thing there. So they go through there and they were handcuffed on the living room, you know, on the living room in the, on the couch in the living room. And they ripped the whole house apart and they're taking out computers, the slot machine, you know, you name it, everything. And then they, and I told you I was on some drugs back then too. And so they, right when they're done, we're figuring, like we're going to jail and they tell us,

they get up and they unhandcuff us. And they say, we're not going to take you to jail today, but. you know, you'll be going later. Really confuse what's going on. So then they left. And so now we're both sitting there. And like five minutes later, there's a knock on the door again,

and it's one of them. And she opens the door and he looks at me and goes, oh, I almost forgot. And he reaches in his top pocket and he throws, like it was like an eight ball of what I had, it throws it to me and I catch it. He goes, you probably can want that,

I'm sure. And then he goes back and gets into his car and he drives off. Nope, not making that up. And she looks at me. She goes, why would he do that? What does that mean? Right.

And I'm like, to think that means, like, I'm going to prison for, like, a really long time is what that means. Like, like, he was basically saying, I don't even need this. Like, I don't want this. You know what I mean? Take, it wasn't like a large amount, you know, like a personal amount, I guess. But yeah, yeah, and I knew I was like probably screwed. And so, um, again, didn't hear nothing for months after that. And so, um, about, I'm going to say six months later, they come, um, they come to get me finally.

I pull on my street, they're standing there, block me in on the street, you know, and they arrest me. They take me inside and they're, where's your dad? They're going to get him to him. I'm, well, what am I mean? What's my charge is? Because, you know, it was from the raid or whatever. And they said, well, conspiracy to cheat a gambling with you and your dad. Manufacturing a cheating device for me, possession of a cheating device for me.

My dad, they didn't have nothing on. Yeah, I was going to say, why? They just had conspiracy. Just because he happens to be in the same room. Just because my dad, I guess. Who knows? He wasn't even, at this house, he wasn't even at this house, he wasn't even at the same house. He was still, my, my grandma had since passed away, so he was living at that

condo. We weren't even living together then. Okay. They just, were just like, he's my dad, and that's, you know, he's got, this, he's going for conspiracy too. So, so as, as they're there, he pulls up to my house. He didn't even know that they're there. He pulls up to the house and then they end up on a high speed chase chasing him down, and then they got him. And so now we're, um, both in jail. And so we get a bail. He, he bailes out. My bail, it was, I was charged with multiple things other than the conspiracy to cheat a gambling. It was also charged with burglary, forgery, theft, and uttering, which for checks. So anytime you, if you wrote a check and you, like a fraudulent check, that's what you would get charged for.

Burglary, forgery. Why burglary? I don't know. If you're going into a building to steal money, I guess. So it was burglary, forgery, theft, and uttering was the ID. Right. So I, and I got conspiracy to cheat of gambling, manufacturing, a cheating vice. I got a whole bunch of charges.

So my dad gets out, bails me out on all of them. So now I'm waiting to get out of jail and I don't get out. What's going on? So the next morning, you know, whatever, I wake up and go to the guard. What's going on? I was bailed out and he'll look in the computer and goes, oh, no, you have burglary, forgery. But it was another charge, different one. Okay.

Right? This went on for a month. And we're talking like maybe $35,000 in bail bonds. So he bails you out again? They just kept you same charge, burglary, forgery, theft, uttering. I had, I had court in every district, every justice court in the courthouse. I think there was like 15 of them back then. I had a, I had a case in every single one of them for burglary forgery theft uttering.

This is just from the check fraud. The check fraud, correct. You were going, you just hit all the different districts? Yeah, correct. So this was just, no, they kept refiling on me and they were just doing it in different courtrooms and this, you know, I had something out of Laughlin. They just didn't want you to get out. They just didn't want me to get out, correct.

And so then finally they ended, my dad, they ended up arrest. to my dad and putting him in jail, I can't remember why he ended up going in there. It was sort of the gaming stuff, but he got pulled over, and I don't know why they, he ended up going to jail. And so now he's in jail there and he's in county. And so one day I go to court, to call me in the court, and they said, they dismissed my charge to check this, this burglary forgery theft. If I go to seven different courtrooms that morning and they dismiss them all. I go back to my unit. That doesn't sound like a good idea. That sounds like the feds picked it up. That's right. I go back to my unit. And now, now they tell me, roll up your

stuff, and I'm thinking I'm leaving. I'm thinking, fucking, it's great. I get up. And so as I leave my unit and I go to the elevator, there's my dad, too. Right. You know what I mean? He's like, man, are we getting out? And I said, I don't know.

Yeah, like, this is like, yeah, I told you didn't have nothing. You know what I mean? It's bullshit. And so we go and, of course, we get downstairs and there's the U.S. Marshal. There's the U.S. Marshall. There's a U.S. Marshall's right. Yeah.

So now we're taking over to the, and we're taken over to the federal courthouse. And now my dad is charged with the same thing. We mean, conspiracy. You know, this is nothing to do with the gambling. This is a fraud case. The feds picked up the fraud case, all the checks. The gaming stuff was still pending in the state. So I couldn't believe that when they detained me,

they detained me as a flight risk. I'll explain later. At the time, I couldn't understand why, but they had these. Well, there was also, I had pending, I had pending, I had pending, I was picked up on a writ and picked up on a writ, you know, they picked me up on a writ and took me over to the fed. So since I was on a writ, right. It was like, they were like, he's got all these pending charges in the state still.

You know what I mean? We're just, boom. So they, so they detained me. And I couldn't believe it too. They gave me a court date of like four months down the road. And I just, I couldn't even, I'm like, there's no bail? Like, I couldn't understand it. Yeah.

And so, and then I had a, I actually did a, you know, I appealed the detention hearing because there was only one case pending in the state. All the other ones that got dismissed, but there was one check, one burglary forgery theft that was holding on. And so I figured if I could bail out of that one. actually I was already bailed out on that one excuse me I was already bailed out on that one from the beginning you know what I'm saying so I was like I went back for detention

hearing and they played a tape of when I was in jail like a year before that on the first time I ever got arrested for the cheating and I was telling my girlfriend then that I go man when I get out of here we just take off and get out of here man I'm done doing the shit I was just basically saying like and they were saying that they played that recording in federal court had nothing even do with like the original

like I'd been out of jail since then right what's the you know so they detained me and I ended up being stuck in there and ultimately oh and then they put me and so we will be go to me and my dad are cellies now in in federal holding now

for a year that's nice for a year you know oh he used to drive me crazy in there man I tell you what he did he would drive me crazy and like one time they actually I got in trouble

for messing around I was in the law library and I just I made it to where you could play like games on it and shit on the computer so they got in trouble for it

so they sent me to the hole but so this was city jail back then was the was the fed holding back now it's private cca it's a cca now but back then it was city jail like the worst jail in Vegas not county city and there was unit two was the fed fed unit so I got in trouble and they moved me from that unit to like the main like we're like people are coming in and out all the time but I was a porter

because I was a fed you know so I basically I'm a porter now in a four man cell with just one other dude but it was great because there's like cigarettes coming through there there's a lot people coming in it it was like you know it wasn't boring like the fed unit right so i'm actually kind of like happy and then one night they came like two weeks later this lieutenant came and told me roll up my stuff and because you're going back over there and i'm like why i'm like what's going on and he's like man your dad won't leave me alone he was bugging me every day to bring you back bring you back me back i said well you can put me in a different don't get me

i love my dad i said but you're gonna put me in a different cell though right like it's great but he's like no no you're going right back in with like straight up but i'm glad now looking back that was great you know i mean he's he's passed away and you know he and my dad was a really really, really good dude, man. He was, if you didn't like my dad, you, you were just, something was wrong with you. Right. Like, he was just great. He was funny and just a good, just a good guy all the way around. And, um, good criminal, you know, I was just, you know, I was just, you own the casino. Yeah, you really get a criminal. Great father, great father, you know what I mean? taught me a lot. Well, even the security guard

liked him, right? Just, you know, security. Yeah, the security liked him. I was a gaming agent that was talking about. That wasn't a security. That was the game. agent even when he got out on supervised release like when we were both on supervised release I'm going to jump back but I'll tell you this but we were both on supervised release we both had the same officer um E.O Elizabeth Olson was her name and she uh but there's also the head of the probation this dude like loved my dad for some reason because my dad when I my dad lived in this house he had two girlfriends like that were like in their 20s that were kind of taken care of him and this dude like like couldn't understand how you had no money it's just my dad was

was so cool that you know you just saw he got down so this dude would like live like like sit and talk to me dad for hours and just talk to him like you'd call him on the phone and just talk to him like man what's going on what are you doing and so she she she she hated my dad and she couldn't do nothing about it you know i remember one time she told me she goes you know he might not be able to do nothing but i can lock you up you know because she would he would veto everything that that he would do like so one one story is is he he was getting high my dad was getting on as well um when he got out he's getting so he basically knew a way to beat the test, but he'd have to know ahead of time that, you know, he's going to do it.

So he goes in there and he gets, they can throw a drug test on him in the U.S. probation and he goes, tells him, he goes, I can't really pee yet, but I'm going to go downstairs and put some quarters in the, in the meter, you know, so I don't get a ticket. And they're like, all right, go ahead. So he goes down there and then he just leaves. And he goes and he like flushes his system out, does whatever he does, how he can beat it. And he had a way he did it. He comes back like three hours later and they're freaking out.

you know, we're putting you in jail or whatever, and he goes in and he pisses and it's clean. And so the male, the male guy that was testing him, he goes, where'd you go? What would happen? My dad said, my dad said, my dad said, my dad went and put a diaper on. Depends and my dad said, started like choking up a living. He goes, man, I, I, you know, I left because I shit my pants, man.

I was embarrassed and I went home and changed my diaper. That's what I did. Right. And the dude was like, man, it's all good, man, no trip. So when she, she came in there, like, like yelling at, out of him. He was like, man, just come. Get back. Dude, he's fine. Leave him alone, man. He's, he's clean. Let him go. You know, and, uh, he was like slick with that, man. And, uh, so, let me get to one me. So we're, we, we were, we were both in there in, um, fighting the Fed case.

And then I get a, um, I end up getting one to three years in the state for the, for the gaming stuff. Okay. And I get 30 months in the feds, which is like, first time ever, like, going, knowing what I know now, like going back. But I guess that back then, that, was what they're kind of going after was this check fraud, you know. So I get 30 months in the feds and my dad gets eight to 20 years in the state. Okay. And he gets 30 months in the feds. I mean, run concurrent. Right. We both get them run concurrent. Okay. So now, so after we go, we both go to state prison, we're in different areas in state prison, but we're both in state prison. And then I do my year. Okay. That was another thing I got screwed on too. So I get there.

I got no credit for time served on my state case. But I got sentenced to the one to three years. I said, well, I've been locked up for over a year now. Right. She goes, yeah, but the case you pled guilty to, you were out on bail on. It was one of the cases I bailed out on. So I basically paid bail to not get credit for this case now, which is horrific. So I go to state prison. I do the year.

I get, I get paroled to my Fed case. Get to the feds. And I'm thinking in my head, hey, I've got, I've been down two and a half years now in this 30-month sentence. Right. I'm done. So I get them, they send me to, I go to Safford. I make it to Safford in Arizona. I'm in Safford.

And they tell me, like, no, your time starts now. like you know you were on a writ you weren't in our custody we don't care if it's concurrent or not so i'm like screwed double screwed so so now i so i know i write a letter to my dad who's in prison like hide it over to him saying like man we got screwed like we're not concurrent yeah and so he ends up writing a letter to get back in front of his judge who was jacky glasses who sentenced him same judge who buried oj okay jacky glass and so um uh she calls him back she he gets she calls him into court and she goes you know what i'm sick of the fed's doing this i'm giving them 30 days to come and get you so your time can run over there and that's that it's 30 days

come and go they're marshaled ain't going to come and get him they don't care so she goes back 30 days later and the judge says uh well you left me no choice i'm sentencing you to age or 20 years in prison but i'm suspending the sentence now giving them probation okay now you're done here you they have to come get you now right so they did so they come and get him and now and next thing i know i'm in safford i didn't even know he was coming until like the laundry guy told me he goes are you related to Tom Reed? I said, yeah, why? He goes, he's going to be here. They were doing his, you know, yeah, yeah. And so I was like, oh, shit. So my dad shows up now. We're both together in Safford. How long have you been there? I've been there like, probably about a year now,

a year into that, you know, so he'll, yeah, so he'll, yeah, so he's got, he's got two years and change and you've got another year. So he just beat like the eight years, you know, he did two years on that eight year low manager. So, so, so when he first gets there, we're like, he wants trying to get his release dates. We go to, what was it called again? Like, R&O? R&D. R&D. So we go to R&D and we go in there together and then he comes out and I go, what

they say? And he goes, well, he'll get back to me in whatever in a week. And I go, you're burnt. Just like I'm burnt, whatever. So we leave and we go to spin up. We don't make it one lap. And I hear, you know, Rita, R&D, so we don't know if it's, we know it's probably him because we were just there.

So we mob back to R&D as we're walking up. They're all out there. And they're like, looking at my dad going, you need to roll your stuff up right now. You're out of here. We need to get you off this campus by like, within the next 20 minutes. you're done before five o'clock yeah because basically what happened was is when when jacky glass sentenced him she's told it she said zero days credit for time served on his state case when he's in prison on that so when he went to when they calculated when grand prairie calculated

his time since he didn't get credit on anything else the feds gave him the credit on it okay from the day of the of the arrest so he was past his 30 months so then he's out the door just like that and so and then i'm sitting there like i look at the arre you're supposed to be doing in at least 10 years in the state and fed. And I look at the R&D guy who I'd been fighting with the whole year trying to get my credit. Right.

I didn't even get my credit because I could tell you the state didn't give me credit because I was on bail. Right. And I didn't even get credit the whole year I fought the federal case with like, because I was on a writ.

Right. So that, so the thing is is when you have a, when you have a, um, if you're on a writ and the state says concurrent, that doesn't mean anything when it comes to the feds. Um, and I'll get to that too

on my second part of the story that I actually, used that to my advantage and and got it right that time because it was the same kind of thing was going to go on but the um so i end up doing my time and getting out and uh i got a job at that point driving limousines um what year was this this was 2005 okay so i get out in 2005 and i'm completely spooked from any criminal i don't even want to jaywalk right because you got remember i got arrested and i never got back out once they got me and you know what i mean and at the time. I had a girl, my girlfriend at the time who was my co-defendant. She, a beautiful girl.

That's why we ended up breaking up, because we just got taken apart because of jail. You know, we both went to jail. She sat and she was my co-defendant on the Fed case also. She sat in there for 18 months and got credit for time served at the end. She didn't tell on nobody. She sat there and held her mud. And then so her court-appointed attorney that she got, she ended up marrying him. That's what she said. She's, like, super hot, so everyone's always, you know what I'm saying? So, like, so she ends up marrying him, and then you should have her on, too, because then, then, like, a couple years after into that marriage, it says he gets, he gets disbarred as an attorney in Vegas is all over the front page. She was charged with, you know, helping as well, like, whatever he was doing, like some other shit.

He was doing probably, I don't know if it had was her idea, probably not. I don't know, maybe, but I thought that was kind of ironic. Like, yeah, yeah, motherfucker, that's what you get. I'm trying to, I mean, because I didn't really like them, obviously. but yeah that's a whole she'd be a great guess probably um uh so i get out and i get this job so my my ex-wife my kid's mom gets um she was living with his attorney also with my kids and he has in this guy had a drug problem so his dealer was a limo driver a limousine driver but he was like this is he worked for this company called CLS and he got me a job driving limos

And this is like the most lucrative company, like in Vegas. They had contracts with most of the doors in Las Vegas. Like the big ones, like the MGM properties was the number one contract. So back then, probably even now, like how the limousine business works in Vegas is you, you, um, limos can take cash rides like a taxi, but there's fixed tariff rates. So like if you're in a town, I was in a town car. I started off in a town car working day shift. Right.

Which there wasn't a lot, a lot of money there compared to night shift. So basically $40 a ride The dormant would load you up at the ride You got to tip them 10% You got the ride And a lot of times in Vegas It's just picking drops You know for 40 bucks

The SUVs are like 50 bucks And then you have the stretch 10 passengers You know, we're like 80 bucks More people in it But the big hustle in Vegas was at the time It was strip clubs So if you brought someone to a strip club

Like if you both got in my town car And you suggested Hey you guys want to go a great strip club. And you guys were going to, or you said, take me to a strip club, right? I'm going to get $100 a person

from the strip club. Whoa. Okay. So that's going to be a $200 bill. So now in the day shift, you didn't get too much of it, you know, so at the night shift,

though, they were killing it. These guys are killing it. So it took me a couple years and I ended up, you know, I was doing fine even in the day. I was actually making a living for the first time in my life legally. I had custody of my kids.

I was doing everything I'm supposed to do. I did my three years paper, no problem. a perfect, you know, perfect record on that. So I finally, it takes me about three years to get into, I finally get about two years and I get into a stretch SUV. I had a stretch escalate. It held like, you know, 20 passengers.

There wasn't a lot of them back then. There was only a few that were working on the trip. So it was a privilege to be in a vehicle like that. You know, you made all the money. And so I got into that. And now we're talking, you know, you get groups of guys, you know, 10, 12 at a time, 15 at a time you're taking into the strip club do the math like yeah i'm killing it and so um

also so the guy who got me the original guy got me to job his name's just what his name was a good looking dude and you know stuff like that well he was the dude that had like all the girl like he would you know if you needed a hooker if you needed drugs whatever you need a chris brown was the man right you know he was the one he was basically the making more money than any other driver on the strip out of all the the thousand limo drivers there were right he was the man and i ended up chris brown's a A comedian. He's a rapper. Rapper, singer.

Same name, different, different guy. Yeah, I understand. And so he drove the stretch escalating. And there was two of them in the company. And not because he didn't get me it. I got it myself, but I ended up getting the other one eventually. And now I'm driving. I go from basically kind of not making much to like top dog now.

Right. And so I'm out there, you know, killing it on strip clubs. And I'm not doing anything. You know, I'm not, I didn't go out and sell drugs. I mean, not to say that I was an angel, but that wasn't like my premises of going out to work. You know, it was just basically, I want to get strip clubs or do normal rides because I'm making, you know, $500 on a slow night, $1,500, $2,000, $2,000 on a busy night.

Right. I'm making more money than I, you know, ever made legally. So the owner of the company, Charlie Horky, he, um, he, um, he had a drug problem. He'd be on one and he was a complete degenerate too. So this guy's making a shit ton of money. Like, we're talking millions. He had a Ferrari. He had a giant mansion, um, in Vegas, like that had like next to South Point.

And he was into like roping and rodeo. like the roping rodeo part of the NHR but like do it at his house like this guy was a baller you know what I mean right and so um then he started like doing things that like illegal things like he was doing like like making the employees cash payroll checks and then give him the cash back which was odd you know what I mean and I kind so he's giving him a check for $5,000 they cash it for $5,000 give him the money back and they give him the $5,000? Yes, they give him the $5,000 back. Now, you got to remember, like, in this business, there's, there's, you know,

I think there was 100, 100, like, limos that he had, you know, whatever, like, what shift you had or what, there was also what's called starters. The starters would work at the properties. They were the liaison between the doorman and the customer. You know, the dormant would talk to the customer need a limo. They would have the starter, get the limo, and it was kind of like a pecking order. So, but if, so if you didn't adhere to, like, this demand of, like, doing these certain things, you would, like, lose the door that you're, that you're, that you're, you're,

you have, you know, position in. You might, all of a sudden, now you're not in the, in a stretch SUV now, all of a sudden, you're back down to a town car. Like, if you didn't, you know what I mean? So this is like there were, there was one, he had a, he had a, um, a guy, this guy, Teddy who was, uh, like his enforcer, his under boss, basically, that would be out there just forcing these drivers to do that, right? I was such a good booker that he couldn't really do nothing to me.

I was left alone. And I told them, you know, they tried to get me to cash a check one time. And I told him, I said, I go, like, I just got out of proof for check fraud. Like, I'm not messing with nothing like that. I knew something was wrong with it. It ended up being a check kinding scheme is where it ended up being. Right.

And then they, so then some drivers started getting busted, selling drugs in the company, like on their own accord, you know, and I'm watching this go down and I'm like, but nothing to do with it.

You know what I'm saying? That's just crazy. And then so I got a phone call from Charlie at one time, the owner, and he just called me at one time and he says, hey, you're going to be driving a friend of mine

from California. He's an entertainment lawyer. He's super cool. You know, whatever. You're just, you're going to be on charter with him all night take him where he wants to go and then just bill it to the company i said no problem right

and then he goes one more thing he goes this dude's like a pussy hound he's gonna want he likes girls i told him it's 1500 a girl and he gives me this whole speech and i'm just going okay yeah whatever whatever whatever he's basically don't get don't have him ripped off if he wants a girl because you basically you could call an escort agency it was legally calling escort agency and you'd get like a two hundred fifty dollar kickback right to set him up with whatever customer might be or you could take him to perump which is 70 miles away where it's legal prostitution there right you can or you know you can take him to a strip club you can do whatever you want but i just said yeah i got you no problem whatever it is pick the guy up he's with his wife and he doesn't say he just goes take me to belagio

right that's it take him to belagio he throws me a hundred bucks and goes have a good day i called charlie up i said man look i took the guy to belagio he gave me a hundred he goes all right go back to work last i talked to him end the story so now eight months later dropped my kids off at school coming home one one talked me out of going not going i'm pulling up to my house and i'm surrounded by like 30 FBI agents. Okay. I don't know what I did. This is crazy.

I'm thinking my head. I've done nothing here. I've done nothing. This is crazy what's going on. And so we'll tell you when we get down there. They take me down to FBI headquarters now. And I'm thinking, the first thing I say is, first it was the metro that got me and then the FBI came.

I said, am I, what am I charge with? They said, we don't even know. These guys have bigger badges, they want you. And I seen the FBI and I just looked at him and said, am I under indictment? And he goes, yeah. And I just, I knew it was all bad. I've already done a Fed thing. Right.

And so we get down, they don't tell me nothing, we get down there. They put me in a, in a room with two agents. They put a tape recorder down. They go, we're going to play something for you. And tell me what you think. Say, hit play. And it's my, it's a phone conversation between me and my dispatch at work. And she goes, hey, are you next to X caliber?

I said, yeah, I am. And she goes, there's a ride waiting, go see the doorman. And then she, he gets pausing, looks at me, goes, explain that. I mean, I'm a limo drive. this is this is a normal thing correct and so um that's what i said i go i'm really confused now i'm like what do you mean like what is this am i getting punked it's a joke and so then they leave the room and leave me in there for like an hour and you know they're little tactics then they come back and they go explain this and then they play again and now it was that conversation between me

and charlie where charlie sitting there talking about the yeah the hooker and i go and you're saying i got you got you got you yeah i go he goes what do you mean you got what does that mean and i go Well, it means I could, I go, I could call to escort agency. It's legal. Right. And, you know, you get a kickback. I go, I didn't say, and then I go, I could have took him to Perump. And I go, well, how many times have you gotten Charlie a hooker?

Has he requested you to get a hooker? And I go, well, how many times have you gotten someone that you drove a hooker or client? I go, I've got him an escort through the escort agency because you could, I pay taxes on that. Yeah. Maybe in the four years I've been doing this, maybe three, four times. I did it like that. You know, I had nothing to do with Charlie. Then I just, so a customer guy didn't ask me, hey, you know what to find

some girls. Yeah, sure. Give me your phone number and I'll call the escort agency. Give them the number. And then they give me a kickback for it. I don't promise them anything. And they're like, okay. And I'm like, what am I charged with? And they go, oh, you're charged with racketeering. I'm like, Rico. And you go, yeah, what's my role? Your role is facilitating prostitutes for CLS criminal organization. Well, good luck fucking proven that. And I'm thinking, you got to be fucking kidding me, right? Right. So I'm just at loss. I'm at a loss. You know, so I go to court and thankfully you know I got I didn't get detained or none because like I said I had I had a house and I'd been doing good so I get released and uh and then so starts this case you know what I mean and it was um um long going for you know for years and so I ended up uh obviously being very disgruntled very discouraged because of it you know like I said I now I wasn't I didn't have a job no more obviously driving limos you know what I'm going to do um I started losing everything lost my house I lost this I lost this I lost that So the FBI, so we're going to go to, my attorney, we're going to go to trial.

Right. We're going to take this to trial. Boom, boom. FBI 302 report comes out. And that was that interview between us when we were sitting in the thing. And the FBI 302 report says that, um, uh, I said, I got in Charlie a hooker at least four or five times. That's what they said.

And that I did it all the time. And I, like, and I go, first of all, I never said that. Pull up the, pull up the audio recording of that. And they goes, oh, they don't have an audio recording is nothing. They, one to ask questions, one takes notes. And there's two of their, there were two agents against you. Correct. So anybody listening, if you ever, ever, ever in that position, don't ever.

Yeah. Even if it's a friendly conversation, just tell them, men, you want to learn because it's, they're going to lie. And that was my first, and I thought at first that, you know, the FBI was like these people that were, what's the FBI? I got none to worry about. They're going to be honest. They're not going to be grimy like that far, far from the truth that you can be.

Right. So they completely lied. So now the, matter of fact, the, my attorney, after I seen that, my attorney goes, at one point they wanted me to testify against charlie yeah yeah that's i'm sure that's why they so i so so they so they set up this meeting between you know the two fbi guys in the in the u.s. attorney you know and basically they're presenting this to me you know this is what we want you to do and you know i said first of all i never once turned in one illicit gain to cLS nor did i receive one if i say anything other than that i'd be committing perjury i have no idea what he does or

doesn't do. I don't deal with a man. I go to the key room like everybody else and get my keys and go to work. You know what I mean? I don't know what you're talking about. And I said, second of all, like, you guys completely lied on this, um, this, uh, 302 report completely. And then looking at the indictment, you guys also lied to a grand jury about this part portion of it. They did. Like, you completely lied to a grand jury and a real person. I don't trust anything you guys are saying. Right. If nuts, fuck off. And that was that. And then, um, uh, um, um, so, A couple years go by, you know, and they still haven't given me a deal. They haven't done anything yet.

So I start, I run into a guy and I start, I'm going broke, you know what I mean? Like I need to do something. And so I run into a guy and he teaches me how to do credit cards, like the dumps, like basically getting these credit cards for online and now you're able to like download them, you know, and put them on, you know, put them on cards and go in and do your thing. So I do that. and um not a lot but i'm doing it um just to make some money and then one day um i started getting started doing drugs again and so now i'm kind of starting get out of control with this shit now now i'm out there fucking i got i'm in hotel rooms i'm just living in hotel rooms in Vegas basically right you're all you lost the house at this yeah i lost the house at this point

you know what i mean and so i'm sitting there and i've got like a a fraud lab in my backpack basically and i'm sitting there doing i found ways to do things with like these gift cards that was just crazy. Like, I could get these gift cards and just read, like they were for 200 bucks. And I could read, read, once it runs out, I can take me five seconds to make it put 200 bucks right back on it with my computer. Right. It was the craziest thing ever.

And so I'm going nuts with this. I'm just going nuts. And the, um, the, uh, one day I'm at the, um, M casino and I'm up in this suite. And I, I'm so, like, stupid. Like, I would book these rooms under like a fake name with a fake credit card. Like, if it comes back bad and you're in the room, like, and it's just, get you. Yeah. It's pretty stupid. So I'm in this room and I'm, uh, hanging out and just getting settled in. I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm with this girl. Um, actually my girlfriend, different girlfriend,

but it's my, my girlfriend today, actually. But we, uh, I get a phone call to come. The phone rings and it's front desk and the front desk goes, hey, she goes, the front desk needs to see him. I said, so I pack everything up. It's time to go. It's time to go. Let's go. Let's go. We pack everything up and then we go downstairs and you remember on federal pretrial team something and this is this is not good yeah so i go downstairs and i go i'm gonna go first you go get the car right so i go in the elevator i got the backpack and right as i get to the to the to the lobby it opens up and then there's like henderson police department hey mr campbell or whatever name i was using i wasn't using like i had this fake id right whatever name was i go what's up and they go hey we just need to talk to you real quick

can you come in this you know ruin i'm thinking like um i don't know man i'm just trying to like to flash back to Circus Circus now in my head, you know. So this is just another crazy one. So then I go, I don't know. And then I just book it. Now I'm running through the casino. They're stop police and they're chasing me. So I'm running through the casino.

I don't even know where I'm running to. I run. I go down these escalators and I get down to this like banquet hall or whatever. Like they have conventions or who knows. But there's like this huge empty room with this marble floor and this dude's like waxing the floor, the marble floor. So I run and right as soon as I hit the floor, I slip. ball and I slide like 40 feet just

and I hear behind me I hear boom boom keys and shit and I look back and now there's three three cops or they're on the ground too I get up to try to run it's so slick that I can't even I'm like it's like a cartoon I'm just falling down and they're doing the same thing

now we're all out of breath we're all looking at each other now and they're like saying just stop and I'm like now I'm just crawling now we're just crawling across we can't even walk on it right because it was a funniest probably thing you ever if you're looking at from the outside so but I get through that and I start running and I'm out this pool area now

and then I'm running and the next thing you know my legs just stopped working I didn't understand what's going on my legs wouldn't work no more and I guess they've tased me I was tased oh I thought it was another guy

with the um with the billy club no no this time I was just exactly this is the same to nothing my legs working I was tased my adrenaline was going so much I didn't even realize it

and so I go to jail I go to jail there and I get charged with over a hundred felony charges for this is credit cards credit cards for each credit card number thing they found it was like it was a felony charge so I got over a hundred credit card charges and I got the pending limo case but in my brain I'm thinking like a weight is lifted off my shoulder because I'm thinking I was scared to go to trial on the Fed case yeah I really was I

no matter how much he said that we were going to beat it I was still scared and to me I'm thinking well now I'm going to go to prison for this for sure I just would get a concurrent or something and yeah I'm going to have to take a deal so I sit in there for like three months and I they're trying to offer me a two to ten on that fraud stuff. I got really lucky that there was no detective on my ass on that case. It was just like, you know, they caught me with the stuff there. What it happened was when I checked in with the credit card number, I used two different ones. And the first one came back stolen. I didn't know that. It said, oh, it declined. And I said, hold on. And I gave her another one. That one went through and I got the suite. Right. So then at that point, she had,

I had just left the Mirage for, I was at the Mirage for three days. And what I would do is I would get these rooms under the fake name with the credit card now I could like at the MGM properties I'd have I could do whatever I want at MGM and just charge it to the room you know so basically eating any restaurant going in the gift shop buy whatever I want you know so I just got done beaten like Mirage for like $15,000 worth of stuff like that well when the when the card came back stolen the girl at that that front desk there used to work at the Mirage right and I had my dumb ass had told her when I was checking in she goes like what are you doing I said, oh, you know, we're here for the magic convention, you know what I mean?

And I have to stay an extra day. I just checked out Mirage, but I just need to stay an extra day so I want to get the sweet. So she remembered of me saying that. So she called her buddies down at the Mirage. She used to, hey, did you have this guy stay? And they said, yeah, dude, he beat us for fucking, you know, boom, boom. So that's how they ended up busting me on that. And so I'm in jail.

They came with a deal for one to, they came up me and said, we're going to give you one to five years, excuse me, two to five years, concurrent with whatever, you get on your federal case. Okay. And so I go, cool. So it's funny, the credit card state, state, you would think that it could have been picked up by the feds? You would think so, but it didn't.

Like I said, I was lucky there was no detective on that case after me. Right. They just caught me on that one card because when they, when they arrested me, the Henderson detective that came, you know, he was just like putting the info in. And I remember asking me, he goes, hey, do you know, you know any bigger fish? You know, you can, you know, I said, man, you got the biggest fish you're going to get on this one, you know, just I ain't got nothing to say. And I never heard from them.

They never interviewed me. never did nothing, you know what I mean? And so I get this two to five and I'm sitting there in jail still and I said, um, concurrent with whatever I get in the feds, which there wasn't nothing even on the feds deal yet. So I wanted to get to the feds because the feds had perump the corporate corrections of America, the CCA or the holding in the feds was like 50 times nicer than county jail I'm sitting in. Yeah. So I'm trying to get over there, right? So then I, but then I'm thinking like it's going to be concurrent. So I asked the judge, I said, so, so what we're going to do is so if I plead guilty to this,

then we're just going to wait for the feds to come get me. And they go, yeah, that's what we're going to do. And then it hit me about from the last time when I remember it was concurrent and I got screwed. So it kind of hit me right to end and there. And I go, well, Your Honor, then if they come and get me on a writ,

they're never going to start the time over there. It's not going to be concurrent. Even though you call it, say it's concurrent here, it's not going to be concurrent because they're never going to start my time until I'm done here. They're going to take me there. I'm going to go to court, find guilty.

They're going to send me back here to finish this time, the original jurisdiction. and even my attorney didn't even, like, well, we don't know what, what do we do or whatever? I said, well, I got an idea. Why don't you just O-R me? Because I wanted to get out of there or that, you know, oh, army, I got a federal hold already. Yeah, they're going to grab me and bring me straight over there.

Correct. Right. And then I'm going to, then I'm going to be out of your custody. Yeah. I'm going to be in their custody because I'm released from custody on this case. And now my time will start there and then just sentence me an absentia to the two to five years, you know, and then that time will start in state, but I'll stay there because I'm in their primary jurisdiction. Yeah.

That makes sense. So the judge, like, recessed it and came back and told me I should have been a lawyer. That's brilliant. And he goes, that's what he did. So they take me to, and don't forget to when I was on pretrial the whole time, I tried this pretrial officer at my ass, like, you know, because I was giving dirty UAs and doing all this stuff. And so, um, uh, the O Army, I go from, from county to Henderson, back to Henderson. Henderson was also, you had perump, but Henderson was also a Fed holding for like immigration.

Or if you were arrested, let's say on a Saturday night in a Fed case, it would take you to Henderson to wait until Monday morning court to go over to the courthouse, you know, to where they would, the, you know, that's how you would end up in Perump going from that courthouse. Right. So I figure, well, that's what I'm going. That's what I'm doing. So I get there and they tell me, well, I have court for them.

When I ran from them, I got charged with an evading charge that wasn't a felony, but it stayed in Henderson. It didn't get bound over to county like the felonies. And so I had a warrant because I didn't go back to court because I'd been in jail the whole time. So they just gave me credit time served for that. I leave court. They put me in this holding tank

and it says USMS on the, you know, United States Marshal Service. Right. I go in there and they, um, give me my clothes. There's two other guys in there.

And I tell that I ask the guys like, I'm sending to you guys are going to the feds too or they're like, no, we're getting out. One of the feds. Like, oh shit. I'm someone going to the feds.

That sucks. And then they, the cop comes to bring them there, you know, their, you know, their, you know, their personal stuff.

Yeah. And he's got mine. And he has, and he has him there to and he goes, what was your name? And I told him, Rita, you know, he goes, hold on.

And he goes back, and he comes back like five and a second with my personal stuff. He adds it to me. And I'm like, my phone's in there. My phone is in there. Like, all my stuff's in there.

And I'm thinking like, Jesus Christ. You're fucked up. They fucked up. I'm getting out. Right. Sure enough, they walk me out the fucking door.

Nice. And so now I'm out. And so I just like basically dropped that bag and I just ran. I'm gone, right? And so I go, I go, I go, stay at a buddy's house.

It's not unrelated to anything, you know, just, I know I'd be safe. And I call my lawyer, my lawyer, completely, you're out. Fuck you how you're out. Calls me back that night and says, well, the feds think you're in the state and the state thinks you're in the feds. Nice. He goes, so, so I suggest to you is, is that you're, this was like August or something

of that year, I think 2015. And he goes, um, coincidentally, we have a deal for you. I, I'm, they did it all for a deal and it was, um, 27 months. right run concurrent with whatever you got in the state or whatever it's going to be and I said I'll turn myself in at the jail right he goes he goes so he goes so he goes and I and we're back on calendar for like October they were sentencing me on the state in January you know in absentia so he just goes all I can say is this as an attorney I advise you that you should go turn yourself in right now to the U.S. marshals he goes but if you don't don't miss court you want to be in court

on that October to take that deal because you want to get in the fed you don't want nothing to happen you want to get in fed custody yeah for this to be concurrent because if something else happens and they pick you up and you go back to the state from something else you're going to you're going to it's going to be screwed up you know so I said okay cool so I hung out for the four or five months I had no pre-trial officer right and I and I and I was so I go to court that day to plead you know to take the deal and it's funny too I'm walking in and my pretrial officers walking out as I'm walking in to court he looks at me stops where the fuck are you how are you out I said I don't know how I'm out just got out they're

let me out. That's what I said. Let me just let me out. He goes, how come he didn't check him? No one told me I had to. I thought I violated pretrial. That means I don't have it anymore, right? Right. It's gone. It's not true. I know. It's not true. He turns around and he marches in there with me and we go upstairs.

And this is the crazy part, too. So we're upstairs now. I plead. And even the U.S. attorney's like, what is he fuck is he doing out, you know? And so I take the deal. I plead guilty. But the fact that you showed up, it quashes any argument that they can have it. You're on this. You're on Europe. And you're like, I didn't know they let me out. I'm here. I was told to come here.

This gets better because I figure I'm going in now for a while. Right. So the judge goes, he goes, he goes, is, is Perump even here today? That's the CCA. He goes, no, no one had court today for here for it. He goes, well, what are we going to do? Like, they're not even here to take them. And he goes, and the judge goes, he's not a flight risk.

I mean, can you come back Tuesday? And I'm like, yeah, fuck yeah, come back Tuesday. I'm here today. I thought I was going in today. And they don't know what to do in terms of the pre-trial guy goes, well, you need to get right down, you know, if he comes back, you come right down to the, you meet me across, you know, at the pretrial office, I said, sure, no problem, I got you. So, so court's over, boom.

And I just left. I didn't go back over there. Fuck, I'm just going to come back Tuesday to turn myself in. I ain't going to go back to the pre-trial guy. And I'm fucking with me the whole time. Right. So I just left and, like, I came back that Tuesday. I would have gone because they was just going to process, dude.

They were going to let you write back off. Well, he was going to, like, drug test me and do all this shit. I didn't want to go through all that. I mean, I don't want to go through all that. So I was just like, he might have like, even my lawyer said, you go, when you're in the other room, I'm like, man, you're not dirty. Are you?

You know, so what do you fuck do you think? Dude, I'm in fucking on the run. Yeah. And he goes, well, you might be, because he goes, he'll probably piss you and then put you on cuffs. Yeah. And so I didn't show up there. And then I just, but I came back that, that following when I was supposed to,

turn myself in. And then, um, uh, sat there. I had to wait, I waited like three months, got sentenced. Um, and then, um, I got the 27th. seven months. And then what's funny, too, is, is so then they, so I'm not, I'm not on a writ or anything like that. So I'm waiting to go to prison and it's like taken forever. Like, we're talking like, it's like almost three months. Like I'm, you know, it doesn't take that long time. So then all of a sudden when I, usually a couple weeks. Right. So then when, so they wrote, so I got sentenced

to an absentia to when I was, while I was sitting up there for two to five years in the state. Right. So now when, um, they roll me up when I, and they said, you're going back to the courthouse. Something's going on there. And I don't know. I'm not going to prison. They're like, well yeah you're getting you're released from here but you're going to the courthouse so they take me down back down to the courthouse and the marshal lady tells me she goes oh yeah your high desert state prison's picking you up the state and i'm like for what she goes because you have a sentence there and i'm like i'm like yeah but i wasn't on no writ what do you mean i'm not in their jurisdiction you can't they can't do that she goes well that's what it is you don't know

what you're talking about we can argument and she ends up like slamp me to push me shut up and pulling that whole move right i'm thinking well you're wrong completely and and so i end up so i go to state prison now i'm in state prison and i'm trying to get a release date and then finally my the bop the i came up on the bop website and i had a release date on there and so i'm figure well fuck my fed time's running's all i was worried about right it's running so i'm cool so i order a tv i get all this shit and then right as like it takes about two months to get your tv and the the day after i got my tv and i'm all comfortable they come and tell me roll it up you're being released and i'm like fuck and i go down and the you know the guard goes uh

i've never heard this before but they made a mistake the marshal's made a mistake and you need to be over there, not here. I said, I know. I fucking tried telling them that. They're idiots. And then they picked me up the marshals and it was that lady too. And right, right as she walked in and see me, she looked at me, she goes, don't say a fucking word, shut up. She looked at me. She's like, shut up. She knew I was going to be argued about it. Right. And I was like, yeah, whatever. I didn't care. I would have stayed in the state, really. It didn't matter. And they got a TV. Right. And so then they sent me to, so when I got released off from my, um, I ended up going to Victorville. I was in the low at Safford before. Since I had the state case pending.

like no running concurrent they put me in victorville which is a medium which is a medium which i actually like the cell living i think it's yeah yeah i like it better than the dorms honestly no i i i agree i just think that the the the clientele is not as nice i got lucky when i was in victorville there was like the the shot caller guy for the white like he wasn't like a gang member yeah no i meant like but it was just like it was going to it was a smooth operation there yet you know at that time yeah i just it's it's it's not that it's the that the there's more at the low than there are there are tougher criminals at the medium at the low you can be talking to a guy who fucking used to work for NASA you can be talking to lawyers you can be you know what I'm

saying no yeah at the medium it's you know former gang members it's also serious fucking but also at the lows too you can be talking to a guy who's who yeah yeah yeah so especially in the federal system yeah at the lows you know but the medium's nicer because you do you have your own cell you have your own toilet, your own sink. So it's, it's a cleaner environment. I've been to camp, too. I've been to camp, you know, and I like to camp too because the camp, there's no Saffenders. Yeah, yeah. So it's, and it's, I was, I went to camp from Safford, you know, ended up in camp. So, um, I went to, um, Atwater. So how long, so how long, so you did what, two years? On that 27 months? No, you, well, you, yeah, how, you did what, you four months in the

state. So you did what another 16, 17 months? Yeah, correct. And then what's funny, too, is is I got credit on all that state time. Nice. Yeah, which I figured they owed me that from, like, my first case. Right. Where I got screwed because I just kind of knew what was going on. And a matter of fact, I saved a lot of people on that federal, on that concurrent, you know, state stuff. I've saved a lot of people sometimes, like, look, you're not, that's a lie. Yeah.

You're on a writ. And, you know, in matter of fact, I think even the U.S. public defender's office actually put a whole thing on it to remedy that now. Right. Because like I did the 2255. I did all these things and it wasn't working when I was originally, it originally happened to me. Right. And so it kind of sucked to do, my first case, I got a one to three and 30 months, and I did like four years almost.

You know what I'm saying? So it was like. So you got out, what year did you get out? Oh, so I got out in 2005 from the, from that first case. I did my three years paper, and I was off that paper for about two months when I caught the RICO case. Right. So now I'm back on pretrial.

Right. So like the feds have had their, their hooks in me from, you know, No. But when did you get out? When was the last? Oh, 2016. 16. And how many, how much paper? I had, okay. So I ended up going, excuse me, I ended up getting out in 2000. I went back for just a little bit. Okay. So I got three years supervised release and I got out again. And so I tried to go do limos again. Right. So when I went to the Nevada Transportation Authority wasn't wanting to let me do it. Right. They were like telling me that I'm the reason why they even have that board now is because of the CLS case. Okay. You know, as far as, like, wanting to do criminal background checks on the drivers and all that kind of stuff. But there was other people that were co-defendants that were driving. So I fought them tooth and nail, and it was tough. And I finally entered a program called Hope for Prisoners with this gentleman named John Ponder.

I don't know, have you ever heard John Ponder? Okay, John Ponder does amazing things. Like, he was a federal prisoner for many years for, like, a bunch of stuff. He got out founded this Hope for Prisoners in Vegas. And basically what it is is you go there and, like, you take these, he has like a class. you take a couple week class and start it off and then like um they would teach you like basic stuff you know how to do a checking account how to do this how to do that and you graduate this class and it was like you would have like when i graduated it there was like winona judd was there

at my graduation and then you they have like he has like the district attorney these these detectives they come he's not asking no one to tell on nobody he's just basically bridging the gap between law enforcement and the right and the people that get out so not and you get and then let's say you go try to get a job somewhere and they deny you because you're a felon. Well, if you graduated Hope for Prisoners, right? The governor would vouch for you, would call that job up. Like, hey, this is, you know, or some detective might or some, you know, the Attorney General, who knows, like, because you know, because you, you, you meet them and you know them. They have this big ceremony and, like, they're kind of like, they're giving you this second chance as a, as a, as a, and very

effective. And, like, the recitism rate is, like, was, was nailed from people going through that program. Now it's, in all the county jails, Hope for Prisoners, he's big time now. right um as far as that i'm the president to trump trump pardon him he helped write the first step act nice like he's done a lot of stuff and um he'd be a great one for you to have on um john ponder for sure um he he kind of mad at me but right so so i got denied over and over and over again to to drive limos right i couldn't just know but i had to paid an attorney thousands of dollars and did all the hope for prisoners went there with john ponder all three unanimously voted for me to drive again.

Okay. And then, um, I ended up, I relapsed like two weeks later and got a dirty way. So now I'd been, I'd been out for about two years. And so my officer I had, my supervisor, she was a bitch and she just didn't, she just didn't like me. So she, you know, she, she doesn't give me, you know, um, rehab. She doesn't give me anything like that, no option to do anything like that. She basically just wants to lock me back up.

Right. So I go to, um, um, um, um, she arrested me one day in her office and I was in the midst of moving at the time too I was moving from apartment to a house and so I had all my stuff in a U-Haul at the time I was married I was married to this Russian girl at the time

and she hated that too like she hated I was with this for some reason I don't know why I think she in her head was thinking that because of my charges from the CLS case that like she then there's just and now I have this like Russian wife that I'm like

you know what that is a scam no that it's like like you know like they said i was facilitating prostitutes for cls you know and all that my charge which was not even the case but i think she was thinking like and this girl was like 20 in her 28 years old really pretty girl right she's like what is she doing with me you know what i mean that type of shit so so anyway so um i go i go to court she arrested me that day and all my stuff was in the you i go to court and i don't have my regular my regular lawyer they just give me this other court appointed it wasn't the um public defender's office. It was just some other lawyer. He goes back there and sees me in the back and he goes, so you're going to be, you have to go in front of the other judge, you know, for this

next week or whatever. I go, well, I can get out today, right? I mean, what's going on? And he was like, no, this, this magistrate, don't ever let nobody out. She never has, especially on a dirty like this, you're not getting out. Right. I said, man, so I go back into court. Of course, they detained me. And then at that point, you know, I said, Your Honor, can I speak? Can I say something? And she said, yeah, speak. And I said, you know, I'm like, this is an atrocity. First of all, this is my first. They're trying to, oh, and the deal they gave me was 90 days in jail and 33 months more paper. Holy shit.

After, because it, you know how the paper works. Yeah, yeah. 33 more months paper. And so I'm like, this is an atrocity. They're trying to give me 90 days in jail, 33 months more paper. And I go, I got all my stuff in a U-Haul. I go, listen, I turned myself in to go, my time last time. I go, if anything I've earned this court is I'm not a flight risk.

Right. Like, you know what I mean? If you don't let me out, I go, how am I going to lose all my stuff? I give you this whole story. and she just goes, you know what? All right, I'll let you out. She lets me out, you know, and they were highly upset. All right.

And I looked at that attorney too. I said, oh, yeah, never. Yeah. And I threw his card back out of him. Then he gave me, I threw it back at him. I don't even want you, dude, you're done. So I, so I end up getting the 90 days, 33 months more paper. And so then I go do that.

I get out, and I'm just like, I can't believe I got 33 months more paper again. You know, boom, boom. So I get in it. So I obviously go right back to what I'm doing. And I get another one. and this time I go in there and they're trying to give me

like six months and what it was like 21 more months paper or something and so but I don't take no deal and I said we're just going to leave it up to the judge I go to the judge and I tell the judge I said your honor I'm going to be honest with you if any time you give me

if it follows supervised release I'm just going to obscure I'm never checking in with US probation ever again right so if you I can I can say that I'm just not going to do it all abscound I don't care what it is it we're just wasting our time here he goes, well, what do you want?

And I said, well, I just want to be released. I mean, I figure, I've been doing this for, I've been, I was clean for 26 months. You know what I mean? This case has been going on so long. And he gave, and he gave me 10 months is what he gave me. Okay. So I got 10 months, no paper. And then I left.

And I forget that pretrial officer came up. She goes, we were in the elevator. She goes, well, get down to my office, you know, because I had to turn myself back into the marshals like the following Friday. Right. And my attorney goes, go to your office. He goes, he's just got, he has no more supervised release. Right.

Come here office for you. He's got to show up and go do his time. Yeah. And then I just left and never had to deal with them again, you know? And like I said, but I never, just so much as gotten a speeding ticket since then, since that, when I got back out. But then you got out and, but you did end up getting the license or so you can drive. Oh, limousines? Yeah.

Yeah. I did do it, but I also had to go back and deal with some bureaucracy because of the dirty way. Yeah. But they were willing to no big deal. So I got out and I actually started working. I started working again. They gave me like on a probational thing with the license. Right.

And then I had, a friend of mine, Keith, who was driving tour buses for, you know, rock bands. Right. And so he had gotten sick. Diabetes, he ended up cutting his leg off. Jeez. So he got me a job taking over a tour for him because he was sick. And I went to do it for like, I was only supposed to be gone, like, I think five days or something. And I went to go do the five days.

And I was gone for like seven months straight. I was out working on music tours. went out with you know Struggle Jennings and on a jelly roll tour I did Struggle Jennings probably on four or five different tours um

Static X I mean a bunch of bands I do like right now I'm with um as I'm out here with Tommy Tutoam Tommy Tuto Titoch 8675309 I know I know you said he was one of the coolest guys He's a great guy he's a great guy He's a great guy Big country all of them that are on there

They're great guys But you know he's he's 79 years old I think Tommy Tuton When you say drive it So it's a, it, what kind of tour bus is it? It's a big, yeah, it's a 45 foot prevo with, and I pull a trailer behind it too. You know, full-size tour bus. It has 12, it sleeps 12.

Okay. 12 bunks in there and they basically live on the bus, you know, the bands, I got to get, they give me a hotel every day. I get a hotel room every day. Okay. You don't live on the bus? No, no. I mean, I have a bunk on the bus on some tours if there's not 12 people.

Like on this bus, I have a bunk and I can opt to really, you know, whether or not, they, they pay from my hotel rooms, but I get it. get a buyout for the hotel room so I can get one or don't get one. But I usually get one anyway because I just like to be away, you know, off the bus. Well, when you say there's a bunch of people on the bus, like if it's just Tommy Two-Tone, like it's also their band. He says Tommy Two-tone is banned, you know, like a sound tech, you know, stuff like that, a tour manager.

Okay. You know what I mean? That's usually who's on the bus. And then we're pulling their trailer with all the gear. It's just kind of a, you know, he's not selling a bunch of tickets like that to where he can have like semis bringing his stage. So we just kind of take everything is on the bus. right and this is like this was a five week long tour so i mean not on the road for five weeks

it will will be five weeks this is the last week of it we go from here tomorrow we go to um um um mount dora yeah and then we from outdora we have two days to do somewhere in texas then we go to um tucson Vegas and then san diego and we're done and i drop them in l a and then I'll go back to Vegas. Yeah, I just went, I was just in Vegas like a month or so ago. And we saw Jelly Roll and Post Malon. Oh, great show. Yeah, yeah.

Great show. I was on the tour right here, this BB 23 cents for Backroads to Baptism, 23. Okay. And that was in 20203, it was his first big arena tour. And I was driving Struggle Jennings. And that was a great, that was a great tour, man. That was the most fun I've had on a tour, I think. You know who calls me all the time?

I don't know if you know who this is. Haystack. I know who he is, but yeah, I know who he is, yeah. Yeah, yeah, he calls me all the time. He used to, I guess he knows, um, jelly roll. So, yeah, I guess struggle went on, um, Ian Bick, I just seen. Oh, yeah? Yeah, he went on him big.

Oh, cool. You probably could get him on. He's, he's a cool cat man, too. Cool. Yeah, he's, he's really cool. He becomes like friend, friend of mine, so I like him a lot. Yeah, I was going to say, well, we have to get his information. Um, yeah, I was going to say that the haystack thing, it's funny because my, my, my, my,

My wife grew up listening to Haystack. Wow. So we're laying in bed one day, and I'm on Instagram, and I'm like, this guy, it keeps texting, man. I go, he's like a, I don't know, I said, knows somebody like jelly roll or something. It has something to do with jelly roll or something. I said, or he knows them or something, because I said, I saw some post where he had put jelly roll's name. I said, I don't know. She goes, well, who is it?

And I go, it's, I don't know. It's same as, I go, haystack, and I mean. She sat up, woo, straight up a minute. She goes, Hey, Stack is texting you. And I went, yeah. And I go, he's like a rapper or something. Like, I don't know who these people are. And, you know, I listen to country music, you know.

And she goes, do me your phone. And I'm like, what? And she's like, oh, my gosh, do you have any idea? Dude, I grew up. I mean, she's never, never been impressed with me. Right. Now she's suddenly impressed. Hey, Stack is texting you.

And I'm thinking, yeah, I'm somebody too. I'm fucking Matt Cox, man. What the fuck's wrong with you? Anyway, but he still texts me. That's cool. You did you get him on or what? I've tried to get him on. I've tried to get him on.

Does he have like a criminal past? He does. He does where he was accused of, I think he even went to trial. He was accused of like, you know, messing with some chick. And he actually goes, I think he went to trial and won it at trial. Because he's like, this absolutely did not happen. but at this point he's becoming a big time star right and so somehow another she had access to him

or was in a position to say this and so he i'm pretty sure he went to trial isn't that the story isn't it weird like a lot of these guys like they have this case like they're just getting big they have this case and then they win right and then they're they're they made it you know like snoop dog has the same story yeah it's just funny it's that's that's there's that story of that Yeah, the problem is, is that you see these, the problem with people that accuse you of things that you haven't done is that, you know, one, those people don't get charged. And two, that if somebody who really did, was in a position where they were taking advantage of or, you know, forced to do something, well, then now it makes them not nearly as credible because you saw an opportunity thinking you could make a bunch of money by accusing somebody of something. and so you make that and now you know so now people don't believe that the actual victim so just like right now they're the ditty thing they're saying like he might they might they might walk i don't think

they can prove the case from what the jury's heard and it's really when you think about it too i was kind of wondering like what did he really because a lot of you hear all this other stuff about it and it's it's like bullshit like you don't what the jury what they have as evidence is well the media hyped it up so much and i'm you know i'm sitting here saying the whole time i've been like look i don't i don't what's the crime i've seen it too like like well first of all how do you say you're a victim like, well, the 15th time I went over there. Like, why'd you keep going over there if it wasn't, you know what I mean? I don't understand it. Right. Well, I hear you. But here's the thing is that, you know, based on the statute, did you pay somebody to fly in from

this state here for that purpose? For that purpose. And if they say, what did you, did that actually happen? Well, yeah, that did happen. Okay, that means the definition. And therefore he's guilty. And you're like, okay, yeah, but the spirit of that is not. what happens you know but i hear what you're saying so it's just two different things being legally guilty and in the spirit of the law in the spirit of the law i don't think he broke the law but the actual um law the actual um statute he may have statutorily be guilty of it but the problem is now they're saying they didn't really prove that and we've interviewed other guys who have been who we got this guy uh shan g and he's like he absolutely they have not

not proved it. And when he comes on the program and says that, man, people butcher him. You this, you that. It's like, I get it. He's not a good person. Right. He's definitely not. Yeah. Nobody's saying that he's guilty of what they're saying he did. That's the whole thing. You know, they're even saying what's the other guy who's in, you know, who's locked up and who got convicted, the movie producer guy. Oh, yeah, yeah. Weinstein, Harvey Weinstein. You know, He was a big promoter to him is Candace Owens. You know, Candice Owens? Yes, yes, yes.

She's got this whole thing where she's like proof saying he's innocent. Right. Like, these girls knew what they're doing. This isn't like they're going in there. Like, you know, was he a good guy? No. That's, you know, he's using his position to like, but is it, it's morally wrong. Yeah, but is it like, look at my case, for example, like with this, with the limousine case, you know, with the charge they had me on, you know, facilitated.

Like, when that person, I never even did what, what he's asked me to do. Like, it never even happened, first of all. Right. Okay. So that's another. situation and then i got charged with it was using a communication device to facilitate interstate comp something right no once again you didn't do that right right right i didn't do that you correct and basically so in in in los vegas for example like basically we we we talked about

possibly procuring a you know a girl right which is solicitation like to solicit a girl which is a misdemeanor in a state of nevada first of all right so how do you conspire to commit a misdemeanor right you know and the only reason it was even on the like the the the federal is because it was it was him and it was that you know i worked for that company but it was completely it was so messed up to charge me with that because like i really didn't do i didn't don't give me wrong i was no angel yeah i'm not saying that but i'm saying but for what they they had nothing and they had they so i was so not even on their radar but when they i i wasn't working for a month actually when i got arrested right i had gotten uh suspended so i'm i wasn't working for some a whole another for that's

a whole story i don't want to get into but i was suspended for that month so but when they arrested me that morning they the first thing they told me it was it goes yeah we've been following you around at work the last two weeks you're a busy boy huh and i'm thinking like dude i don't even fucking worked in the last two weeks what are you talking about i didn't busy boy you know and so yeah they i was like they were just using me to want to no they're hoping you'll get on the stand and you'll say everything they want you to say so that you that you can get time served or correct like i said and i told them flat out like like not i wouldn't do that like if i was involved in something criminal with them i wouldn't do that in the first place but i'm

not going to perjure that's not how i get down but like i couldn't even help i'd be lying if i told you anything other. I've never done anything illegal with the company or gained any money from the company illegally. So, like, how could I even say that? And you, and you guys know that. That's what's so scary about it. Zane knew that. Right. Like, my phone was tab. You know how kind of what a square it was. My phone was also tapped because his, his phone was was tapped Charlie's phone. They had all the phone conversations. And then nothing else I did. Right. Other than that phone call. Like, like, and I'm out working and doing things. Like, that's how much of a square I was at the time. Like, like, the system fixed me. And then broke me.

right at the same time when I got out so it was it was very disappointing for that to happen whatever happened to him he so he got Charlie got 40-something months right and then he got out and he's doing something else something to do with transportation not here I think of some kind of I'm not sure what he's really doing but he's doing something and then I'm like other so only three of us went to prison me Charlie and then my best friend basically and co-defendant on that case too was it names bones Adams he's the two-time boxing champ of the world on bansome weight 2001, I think 2002, Clarence, Bones Adams. Well, not Clarence is dead, but Bones Adams.

His name, Clarence is dead. Okay. He hates that name, but yeah, Bones Adams. Bones Adams. He'd be a great guest to get on, too. He's really cool. He's from a Detroit boxer. He was a starter at CLS.

He worked at Monte Carlo out front. It was basically the liaison for the doorman and the customer. And he got, he'd cashed one of those checks is what he got in trouble for him. Okay. You know, and so another weird thing, too, is like, So on those phone conversations, like this guy, Teddy, who was like Charlie's like underboss, that guy, he was never on the indictment at all. And he was the one enforcing all this stuff on, on the drivers and stuff. So he'd been working with the FBI, obviously, the whole time.

Because why wouldn't he be on the indictment? And the Chris Brown guy, that that rat, he never, like, he had to text to conversations about girls to my friend Bones. And it was in the indictment. But it just says another person or an unknown person. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But we know who it is, you know, obviously. But so he was, he was. He's cooperating.

He was, so, yeah, he got... He's listed as an unknown, unnamed co-conspirator. So the story is that he went to Australia and got caught, taken cooking to Australia. Okay. And then he got busted for it.

And so he was working with the, with the fed. So I told you, he was the man on the strip doing all these things, but he was setting people up. Right. For this, like,

he wanted to give them something. He was, it's hard to give, give them something when you're the man. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, he's the one doing, you know, doing everything.

So, and he's like setting people up and like left and right. a real scumbag, a real scumbag. Like, and like I said, he never, he's even charged,

which is weird too. You see some people cooperate, but they still get charged. Most people still get charged. Yeah. You know, and from what I hear, though, was that he was allowed

to even sell on the strip, just not over a certain quantity because he was just that working for him like that. And then they, when they came down on the company, it was all just like pretty much, even Charlie, like the check kiting's things he was doing.

They said he was check kiting on this fraud part with those checks. Basically, he was a degenerate. So he was robbing from Peter to pay Paul. Right. But every month, those, they might be upside down on those accounts, but he would always pay it off.

Right. You know, it wasn't like there was really, you know, he made enough money to do that. So it was a really fabricated indictment. You know. We got to get it. We got to wrap this up, bro. This is fucking killing me.

No, that's good. Motherfuck. I'm sorry. I don't think the audience even, I'm laughing. I don't know if the audience can hear. I'd be the frustration that I'm feeling every time you're you're and they're squealing and I'm thinking unbelievable yeah so if the audience can't hear

there's screaming kids in the background screaming constantly on a trampoline I do have one question um so in the movies when these guys get caught cheating in the casinos they get brought to a basement room and beat up does that happen oh yeah no that doesn't happen anymore um back then you know obviously when it was like mob ran or whatever, before there was, you know, really even a gaming control board that was actually enforcing, you know, cheaters. Right.

They might have been enforcing the laws of the casino. But I know, I've heard stories from my dad back in the, when he was first in Vegas, he worked for the Stardust, which Tony Splotro was running that casino at the time. Right. And my dad was a car mechanic, so he was a dealer there. So he was fixing games to steal. That's how, and they were stealing money.

from the Stardust, for him, for Tony's Plutcher. That's how he's, like, letting him do it to steal money out of there for himself. Okay. Might be one of the reasons why you ended up in a cornfield. I don't know, but, uh, it goes way back on, onto that. Like, growing up, I seen all these, these cheaters and, um, like, my dad knew all of them, you know, there wasn't a lot of them, but they were doing a lot of, uh... So your dad said that there was, they would pull people out there and beat him up?

No, I was saying, well, back then, like, the cheaters in the casino were, like, either in, like, they were in on it themselves, you know, the ones that were, you know, the ones that were running the casino to steal from the casino or I guess if you came in as an outside guy, yeah, they're going to probably beat your ass or kill you for sure. Like there was no, you know, you're dealing with a, it was all brand new back then, you know, and criminal organization running the casino was really regulated, I guess. I didn't, by the time I was doing it, no, there was the keel-holding incident where they told us about keel-holding one time on the boat, it never happened, you know.

It's not their, I mean, the security, it's not their money. Why were they going to? all right you know what I mean like um it's go ahead other than the slots and the marking cards are there any other schemes that maybe you didn't do that that you knew about that oh absolutely absolutely there was there was there was doing um um um Baccarat a lot of different Baccarat schemes I seen them do they they had basically at one point they had a little microphone going to a phone and basically watching the Baccarat cards get dealt out they're speaking

you know, watching the game and speaking like 10, seven, like the computer program on the other end that would calculate it all together. So when they're shuffling the cards, they're putting them all in certain order, right? And then now the dealer would have to be on this one, but the dealer could, if he was a card mechanic, he could take those cards and shuffle them

to where they're going to not be shuffled. Right. It's going to look shuffled, but it's not. And then they would basically put it right back to that certain way and it would know the computer, then now they would know what's going to be house or bank coming up. That would be called a bomb. Another way they did it was a camera in their sleeve.

and then when they would have you cut the cards like on a four-deck shoe or whatever you sit and fan it and when you fan it like that with the card you're going to see every camera's going to catch all those cards just going to go back to somewhere else that's going to be able to look at that now and so as they're playing

they can figure out where they're out on the deck and then they can and they still millions that way there's crews that do it I don't know about today but they did you know back then I remember I remember my dad's friend who was blackbooked he was used to do that just called it dropping a bomb

I don't know why they called it that But that's what they called it And then there was a lot of poker games They'd set up to private poker games A lot of cheaters in that Here in Vegas You know, they'd get these private games At these parties

And then they would have cameras And all kinds of shit Right Yeah, so Are you banned from Vegas casinos? I am not, no, I'm not I'm not I'm not

Um Yeah, I mean I'm good I don't know It's hard to get black books Yeah It's hard to get blackbooked Um

when my dad passed away and I was in that you know hope for prisoners thing not too long I ended up meeting a gaming agent and he told me that he would if I wanted to he would try to put it in for him

to get put in there just out of respect just because he knew who he was he knew who he was you know he was just like man you know you should have pushed it you could have got him in there

after he was dead or whatever you're not supposed to want to get in there I know but if you're already dead I mean it's because you're going to be in history you know going on in history on that thing like my dad's friend Louis O'Lajack, he's, the name right before him was Tony Splotro. So that tells you how many, there's not that many people that can put in there. I think it's only like 30 something.

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