Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Credit Card Scammer Steals Millions For Nfl Players Bella Barcode

Episode Date: January 11, 2026

Matt Cox interviews Bella Barcode, a former credit and jewelry fraud queen who opens up about her past life of high-stakes scams, betrayals, federal prison, and her powerful journey toward redemption through entrepreneurship, advocacy, and giving back to formerly incarcerated women.⁣ ⁣ Bella's links⁣ https://www.instagram.com/itsbellabarcode_/?hl=en⁣ https://www.youtube.com/@bellabarcode⁣ https://www.itsbellabarcode.com/shop⁣ ⁣ ⁣ Get 10% sitewide for a limited time. Just visit https://GhostBed.com/cox and use code COX at checkout.⁣ ⁣ http://evening.ver.so/cox use coupon code COX at checkout to save 15% on your first order.⁣ ⁣ Do you want to be a guest? Fill out the form https://forms.gle/5H7FnhvMHKtUnq7k7⁣ ⁣ Send me an email here: [e-mail]⁣ ⁣ Do you extra clips and behind the scenes content?⁣ Subscribe to my Patreon: https://patreon.com/InsideTrueCrime ⁣ ⁣ ⁣ Follow me on all socials!⁣ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/insidetruecrime/⁣ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@matthewcoxtruecrime⁣ ⁣ ⁣ Do you want a custom painting done by me? Check out my Etsy Store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/coxpopart⁣ ⁣ Listen to my True Crime Podcasts anywhere: https://anchor.fm/mattcox ⁣ ⁣ Check out my true crime books! ⁣ Shark in the Housing Pool: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0851KBYCF⁣ Bent: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BV4GC7TM⁣ It's Insanity: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08KFYXKK8⁣ Devil Exposed: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08TH1WT5G⁣ Devil Exposed (The Abridgment): https://www.amazon.com/dp/1070682438⁣ The Program: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0858W4G3K⁣ Bailout: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/bailout-matthew-cox/1142275402⁣ Dude, Where's My Hand-Grenade?: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BXNFHBDF/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1678623676&sr=1-1⁣ ⁣ Checkout my disturbingly twisted satiric novel!⁣ Stranger Danger: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BSWQP3WX⁣ ⁣ If you would like to support me directly, I accept donations here:⁣ Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/MattCox69⁣ Cashapp: $coxcon69 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Hustling was in my blood. Nobody couldn't do jury. It's the art you have to learn. I had high-end clients, NFL players. We did about 2.3 million. That's just what they caught you with. I met a young lady. I got introduced to the approval game

when I was about 18. What's the approval game? We just call it the approval game. So basically everything get approved. Right. But listen, kids, don't try this at home. Absolutely no. It's always consequences repercussions behind your actions.

Don't think you smarter than the program. It always works for a little bit. Yeah, for a little bit. Just not to get you to get a taste of it and think, yeah, this is the way to go. Yep. It's always funny, too, because when you eventually get caught, you know, you think, oh, they caught me for, you know, they got me for 500 bucks. and then the prosecutor steps in front of the judge or you get your indictment and it's millions.

You're like, what? Absolutely. So what did she say? Who was this girl? Like, how did you meet this person? I met her through a mutual friend. We call her Smooch. She was an OG.

She took me under her wing, taught me the game. Eventually I branched off and did my own thing. She asked me, did I want to go make some money in five minutes? I said, sure. and she gave me the credit card and ID. She sent you in and said like a crash test dummy or did she tell you what was going to happen? I mean, she gave me all the ropes. Like, you know, you go in here, ask for a cash advance.

Your card is going to decline. And instead of contacting the bank, you go contact me. That's all she said. Okay. So how did it work? I went in inside the candy store. This is a real candy store? Is that mean something else?

No, that's what I call it. Oh, okay. Went inside the candy store. store, export cash advance for $8,500. My card declined. Is this a bank? Yeah. Okay.

My card declined. I contact her. She got on the phone with a teller. So you call her. I call her. From off the bank phone, though. Oh, okay. So you're what?

You like hold your card, act like your call. Because it used to be people, they don't know. This is not how it works now. Used to be, remember, they had a phone number on the card? They do. No, they still. have them now? Yeah. Cars still have phone numbers. Are you serious? Yeah, 1,800 numbers. But see, we had the guy who made the cards. There's a 1-8-0. Yeah, exactly. It's a 9-25. So would her

number be printed on the cards? Oh, no, there's 1,800. Exactly. Yeah, her number be printed on the cart. Oh, really? Yeah, we had the guy who embossed the cards. Now it makes sense. Because when you told the story when I watched the interview with you, that was never really specified that I thought. Shout out to Chris. He didn't go into detail. I feel like he smoked a lot of pop before that. He's a church man. You don't even smoke marijuana, Matthew.

He's, you know, maybe that's the spirit of the Lord. So I like that. Now, like, the whole time I was like, I don't understand. Who are they calling? Like, are they, did they call? Does she call them? But we still have to make it look like we're looking at the backup. card down in that 1-800 number because you know it's eyes in the sky.

Right. You know, they can see everything. So you call or they call. I call. And you pick it up and she says, you know. Thank you for calling visa and emergency services. Sarah, can I get your account number, please expiration date name as it appears Zachman on the card? Deadpan.

She doesn't break it all. How's it going? No. Nothing. No, of course not. Is she there? No, the bank's mind probably like tap. Like they probably can hear.

You don't know if they listen or not, you know? So, you know, I give her all my information. She asked speak with the teller. Teller you're on the phone. She goes, this is Nancy with Visa Merchant Services. I can get your Visa Merchant number. The merchant number on Saturday Terminal. It's like a 16-digit number.

Only the bank know. Right. I already tell. She already know what bank I'm in. So she's on the phone to tell her. And she's like, hey, Nancy, this is. Once she gave her the merch number, she goes, okay, I see that you're at a Bank of America on such and such street. Right.

And she's like. And the teller, like, yeah. We are. Yes. Must have come up in the system. No, serious. That's what they really would say. And then she asked her for all information.

Ask her, does the name that appears on the ID is that the name, is that the name that's on the credit card, customer appears on the ID is that the customer is standing in front of you. For security purposes, can you verify last four digital or social? Right. Amount of purchase. She's in the cash advance for $8,500. She'll, hey, can I place you on a brief hope by verify funds in Ms. Banks account?

Get back on the line. I'm showing that funds are available in her account. Here's the authorization code. Give her the authorization code. And if she need assistance to put the transaction through her terminal, she assists her. So she's obviously had this. This is obviously she's had this job. She must have had this job.

So no, she didn't have the job. Somebody else had the job before and taught her to gain. Okay. And so it goes through perfectly smooth when you're just like that. That's exactly what happens. And they cut you a check. No, they don't cut you a check. They give you cash.

Oh, what am I thinking? Yes. No, back then, guess what they had, the old school knucklebuster, the carbon copy. Zuzu. When was this? This was back in the 90s. How old are you? You know, I'm not what they said.

26. Wow. So, okay, so you, so, and they just count out the cash and let you walk right out from a phone conversation. From a phone conversation. So does she get like an authorization? She gave them authorization code. That was the first time you did it. And that was when you did it with her.

With her. Yeah. So how long do you? And how much of the half? You got half. Straight down the middle. That's not bad. No.

She played fair. Yeah. Yeah. She played fair. So how long did you do that? I think I did it with her for about a year, I want to say. And what did you kind of just get the feel for it? Yeah, I learned it myself.

She used to say that she was getting the authorization codes from somebody who one of her friends who worked at a check-catching place. But she said she was just making them up. She was just making them up. She didn't want you to feel like you could go off. Yeah. Yeah. She, you know, she needed me then.

So how often are you doing it? Is this like a daily occurrence? Oh, yeah, it's like daily. No, it's like daily. We're going to hit five banks in a day. They used to call me the boat and the beauty. I was the first, like, she had a crew, but I was the first person to get out there. I'm like, I'm going there first.

Like, soon as she pull up, I was hopping out first. How many are you doing a day? I'm thinking if you're doing one a day, you're making four grand day. Then I was doing at least three a day. Okay. So you're making like at least $12,000, $15,000 today. And how many days a week? Sure.

If we can go five days a week, we'll go five days a week. Monday through Friday. That's $200,000. Just imagine her, though. She was making more than we was. She had a crew. It was like three of us. And you did that with her for a year.

For about a year, I believe. So, yeah. So that's several million dollars. What are you doing with that money? wasting it Matthew's just partying wasting it

like I was so young like as quick as it was coming as quick as it was going like buying cars buying jewelry like

I wasn't even thinking about investments then just just reckless looking back to you just yeah

taking care like taking care of my dude who I was with like just dumb why do you break off from her

does she get arrested so it was an incident and occurred where she left me at in Ohio, Cleveland, Ohio. You're into an argument? She said, fuck you. No, I got caught inside the candy store and she drove off and left.

Was you want to go in with the guns blazing? You don't drive off and leave your person. No. With the cops pull up like, oh, hell no, I'll bond you out. She didn't even bomb me out, though. No? She didn't bomb me out. She said, oh, you're just hit.

Yeah, I was just hit. Oh, that's not. Yeah. So we kind of fell out, but we still. cool down to this day, but yeah, we fell out. So what happened when you, so you get arrested? Well, why did you get arrested? Were they just onto it and you went to the wrong bank?

No, I went to, I went to the wrong bank. We was in, like, High Park in Cleveland, Ohio. I don't even know if it was Cleveland, Ohio. I know it was high park. It's like a real rich area. Police station was right around the corner. We usually don't go inside grocery stores. We're inside a grocery store and a grocery store was glassed up.

Like, that's a no-given. We don't do glass-up banks, but we've been greedy. They called the police. they let the transaction go through, call the police. I'm leaving out the grocery store door, I mean the grocery store, and the police coming in, they're telling the police, like, that's her right there. I'll start running.

And I had this Louis Vuitton bag, right? And the Louis Vuitton bag, it was like a, just, like, you just snap it. Yeah. The money fell out. Augusta Marion turned into money. Anyway, we are in a nice neighborhood. I was. Anyway, I ended up paying a judge and the case got dismissed.

Like, it wasn't no case. How does that happen? I don't know. Cincinnati, Ohio back then, baby, we paid the judge, and the case was no longer. I just have a question. So are you guys, you said that there's a crew, so are you guys just in a car driving around the country? Okay, we're going to Ohio. Flying, we fly.

We pick a state. We literally get the map, pick a state on a map and say, okay, I'm going to this state. This is the state we're going to. And we'll be there all week. Be there all week. Do you immediately jump into just doing it yourself? Yeah, immediately. girlfriend called me. She's like smooth. I wish you knew how to do the phones. I say I do.

And it was on after that. And you sent her in? I sent her in. And she would, when I tell you, she was a go-getter, she was a go-getter. So what was the verse one? It went smooth? It went smooth. She never got turned down either. And she was ghetto. She ghetto. Like, she wanted those ghetto fabulous. I love her to death. She's a cool girl. That's my girl. But yeah, she ghetto fabulous. She never got turned down. So how did you figure out that? the authorization codes were just made up. I don't know how I figure that out. That's a good question.

That's a good question. I don't know how I figured that out. Yeah, I was going to say that's a crash test of me. If I don't know, I think, like, I think this is what's going on. Fuck it. Let's try it. I think that's what I did. Yeah, with her going into Bain.

Or no, maybe she told me she was like, man, smooth. She's like, smooth. She's like, smootch be making them numbers up. Yeah. And is there anything that would raise red flags? when you're doing that that first year. Like, okay, I have to find this type of bank. I have to make sure this happens.

Like, is there anything that would cause people to get caught doing it when you guys were doing it? Like, you just said your friend. So you have to go in there knowing that this is, you have to go in there with confidence, knowing it, this is your credit card, this is your ID, and you about to come out here with your $8,500. You can't be, you have to go in there with confidence. Like, you know, like, I'm coming out with my money. Yeah. No if and what's about it.

You have to have confidence. And know that this is yours. Like, I'm coming out with this money. I just did a keynote speech, like a Zoom call. Like, I'll do it for banks and stuff. And that was one of the thing that they were asking. They were like, you know, would you ever run? I was like, absolutely not.

I want to talk to the manager. Yeah. What's going on? What are you doing? And it had been times like that. Yeah. Like my car decline. Like, oh my God.

Like, this is absurd. Like, yeah, I'm not, like, I'm not leaving. Yeah. And they'll be like, calm down. They'll be like, calm down, ma'am. Your car declined because of security purposes. Oh, sure. Yeah.

Go ahead and we're going to let you use our phone and contact our bank. Bingo, the object of the game is to get to the phone. If you can't get to the phone, you know it's a no-go. Yeah. I'll just go to the game is to get to the phone. Sometimes they'll let us use our own cell phone. Oh, that's nuts. Yeah.

Back then, they'll let us use our own cell phone. It's funny when I would go in and get like a go into the DMV and get a driver's issue to me, you know, people were like, well, how do you know they're going to give it to them? Like, because if they think something's wrong, they're going to be like, they're going to say we'll be in contact with you. Like, they're not going to let you, they're not going to take the picture. Right. They're not, that's not, they're not getting that far.

Right. They're going to send you away or I said, they got a cop right there. Like, you're going to know right away. So. Yeah. You're going to know if something's not right. You're going to, you can tell. You can fill it in your gut.

Well, and running is a surefire way to get fucked. Yeah. They're definitely going to grab you now. Like if you're like, or you do the whole, oh, I got to get something out of my car. They're like, yeah, all right. Where's Jimmy? Jimmy? Yeah.

So how long did you do it by yourself? I'll say about a year and a half. And then the bank started getting hot than night. Start doing a jury game. The jury started doing solitary stones. Did someone, did any of your people ever get arrested? Or you were just doing it with the one friend? So, yeah, one of my people did get arrested.

And then the cops came right at my house. Like, Vallejo. Were you going to breeze over that? Were you going to not mention that? Valleo PD came and raided my house and then I end up getting probation for it. Because what happened was the- Yeah, what happened? She didn't get called in the bank.

She got away with the money. And then the bank called back that 1-800 number, and the 1-800 number transferred back to my home. I had it transferred to my home because I was at home doing the AP-4. And I think I was because I was pregnant. I was at home. But the number transferred, they ran. realized the number was transferred back to my house and the, um, the, um, Belial PD came in there.

I had got an attorney. The attorney was like, yeah, you do have a warrant. Were you home? I was, no, I wasn't home at the time. So they, what they do? They just broke in the door? Yeah, they just, the, the, the people on the front desk at the apartment let them in. Okay. And, because they had a warrant. They find it in? No, they didn't find nothing. So they end up, um, my, uh, attorney ended up telling me I had a warrant. So I turned myself in and I end up getting just probation for, I was on probation for that. It was just the one time, or did they tag, did they say, oh, this is connected to a whole slew of? No, it was just the one time.

Oh, man, you're lucky, you know. They could have, oh, we've had this happen. They couldn't figure it out, though. They was just like, we know, she dialed the 1-800 number. They couldn't figure it out, like, but we know it went back and they traced it back to my address. They was like, oh, yeah, something. They still couldn't figure out what it was. But they knew something was going on.

It was something. And they were saying, just take a plea. Yep. And you don't want them looking into this. Yep. That's what my attorney was saying. Just take a plea. You don't want them looking into this.

So yeah, they gave me federal. Felony. Just felony. What was federal? No, it wasn't federal. Just felony probation. San Joaquin County. San Joaquin County.

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gootransit.com slash tickets. Forgawa County. Salano County. Salano, Salano County. Like, Salano was like Martinez slash Vacaville Valleo. Yeah, they don't play. Okay. Just don't play. It's like Polk County here.

Yeah, probably so. They're desperately trying to fucking arrest somebody for something. So what's the numbers like on year two when you're the main person? Are the numbers better? The money better? Oh, the money was way better.

I had about a crew of four. Driving around in a van. We pick a stay in the map. I told you and fly out. Well, I know you fly out, but you still got to get from one place to another. We got to run a car, yeah. We were in the car. Mm-hmm.

Are you paying for everything, or everybody pays their own accommodations? No, they pays their own accommodation. I pay for their flights. But we had the hookup, though. But he hit his shit for two-thirds. Yeah. See, I went straight down the middle, too. Very jealous.

I just don't believe in that. Like, I believe in good business. I'm just saying. I doubt that I disagree. I think the banks would disagree that this is good business. So, all right, so you're saying the banks got hot. You got raided. You said, oh, I'm not going to do this anymore.

I said, I'm going to slow down with the candy stores. Right. Yeah. And then what happened? What did you do then? I went to New York and hit up Jacob. That was the first place I went to to see if the diamond thing worked. Well, I don't know what the diamond thing is.

Well, you remember when Jacob Watchers was in? Jacob Watches. Remember the Jacob watches the different color of Jacob watches and had Jacob in there? Do you ever heard of Jacob the Jewelor? I've heard of Jacobsons. Or is it Jacob? Jacob, the Jewel. The one who got caught with meets you now.

Remember the jeweler? Listen, I know you look at me and you think I'm hip. But I'm just a square white kid that grew up in the suburbs. Listen, there's nothing wrong with that. It's good to be a square white guy that grew up in the suburbs. I don't know. Any of it. Yeah, but Jacob was a big time.

He still lives big time. Right. He'd make fancy watches for all the rappers and celebrities. And so you decided to hit Jacob. My little place was to want to Jacob watch. So we went to Jacob. So, I mean, is this a robbery? No, it's the same thing.

You go in there and you say I want to buy three Jacob watches. Right. Coming to about 80,000. She's taking my credit card. My credit card decline. I contact the Coke and Spiris on her other line. She put the same thing straight through. Asked the same questions.

Did you go in the first time as you? You went in or did she go in? No, I went in. Nobody couldn't do jury. Like, jury is not easy. No, it's like electronics. You have to learn. It's like an art.

You have to learn. You have to really study jury to know what's good. What's VBS, I.F. She in color. I don't know why that would mean so much since it's free. No, that means a lot because you have to know your stuff, Matthew, when you're going inside these stores. You have to, no, you can't go inside a jewelry store and say, oh, I want to get a, I just want to get a Rolex watch. Oh, well, do you know anything?

That's how I did. I don't know anything. Yeah. I bought like three Rolex watch watch. I didn't know anything. You didn't go in there and say, I want to get an Orsia Profectural Day Day, President Charoli? You just went in there and said. I wanted the silver one.

And the next one I wanted was, I knew it was a, it was a, what is? Was it? A yacht master? No, submarine. Okay. Those are nice. Yeah, yeah. It was like $8,500. And you knew, though. But I knew because a buddy of mine knew. But I don't know anything about it. Like, oh, did you want the such and such? Like, I want this. That way. Yeah, you got to know it. Us is us coming in there. We black. We have to go on there and know our stuff. And you're not buying $8,500. And keep mind, too, this is that I think that Rolex is obviously standardized, right? Like, you know it's good. You know, it's a Rolex. The Rolex dealership. It's, I don't have to know anything about it. Right. Whether it's a two-carid guy. Like, what you got, where you got a Rolex money? You got to go in there and know your stuff.

Well, this is what I want. I want a presidential roly, day-day, oyster perpetual, two-tone, or I want platinum. I'm just, I love jury. I got an eye for jury. So you go in there and you get the watches? Yeah, we go in there and we got the Jacobs. Declined. Declined.

Transaction decline. Contacted my person. She, do the spill. And they just pack it up. They just pack it up. Thank you so much for coming, come again. And we go down the street to Aviani. I always say there's no better feeling in the world to walk into the bank

hand of a bunch of fake documents. Yeah, but kids, don't try this at home. Don't listen to Matthew. Have them hand you a check for $200,000 and thank you for ripping them off. Like, you walk out of their like, nice. It was like a thrill. It was like an adrenaline rush. Like, damn, I just got away with purchasing $80,000 worth of jewelry my first time.

What are you doing with the jewelry? I'll sell it. Okay. I had high-end clients, NFL players. So are you selling it for, they were taking a discount? Yeah. I'll sell. Say for instance, I had like a solitary stone with 40.

I'll take 35 for it. Okay. Should have gone to you from my wife's diamond ring. You know, this was in the 90s, Matthew. You better get her a lot. lab diamond. It's just as good as diamond. She wouldn't take a lab diamond? What's a lab diamond? That's like a cubic zaconian. That is not a cubic zaconian. Let's clarify that. A lab diamond is made in a lab and it's just as good as a diamond. It costs it just as much, but probably a couple of grand less.

She would have taken a diamond out of a bubble gum machine. She didn't care. Because it's in her heart. That's right. She could care a laugh. And that's what type of woman you want. That's the type of man I want, too. Is he sitting in the car? See the guy in the car? No, okay. He still has something. Something that obviously happened before we got here. Yeah. He won't even come out of that car.

He's sitting in the car like this. I ain't going in. All right. So what else? So what happened then? How many of these are you hitting? Jury stores. It depends on how I feel.

Jury service is different. Like it took a lot. It didn't, you had to, it took hours. Like you had to sit in there, get the magnifying glass. Oh, this is a VBS. This is G in color. I see the occlusions in here. You have to, it's the art of diamonds, you have to study them.

You can't, the jury store wasn't quick fast. I'm in a jury store for at least an hour. You want them to know. Are you setting up, like, it's confidence. She knows what she's doing. She's not, if it was some guy I walked in and just, hey, yeah, put it up like credit card. Yeah, they're going to be looking like, yeah,

something's not right about these people. We went to Tiffany, Bradley Banks and Brittle. We see a Brighton watch. You remember Brighton Watch? Yeah. Yeah. So, what, you're flying into New York, hanging out there for a week?

They had a diamond district. Yeah, I know. You hang out there for a week? More than a week sometimes with diamond district. Aren't you worried? Because at some point, guess what? Those guys aren't getting. Yeah, it takes about seven days to come back.

Before they start to realize. Yeah. I don't think these people are going to wire us any money. I don't think the bank is going to, yeah. But you know, so it is, if they get a copy of, if they file an insurance claim, they get a copy of our ID and the credit card, they'll get their money back. But if they didn't, they're not getting any money back. They just out of 80 grand.

Where, whose IDs? How are you getting your IDs? We get made by the Mexican. Okay. The Mexican? Make up any name. Prepaid cards. We go get the prepaid cards from like Walgreens and stuff.

Did you always use the same guy? Yeah. Okay. I don't know. He was on deck. Because there's lots of websites that don't make. No, this was back in the 90s when you can just go, East 14th and get the Mexican guy to make your ID in like five seconds, three hours.

Not everybody knows a Mexican guy. I'm going to go out on a wing here. And I'm going to tell you right now, I know, I feel very confident. Colby doesn't know a Mexican guy. I bet you Colby's never even been on a website to look for an ID. Never. I'm surprised they have them on a website. Now I'm like, what?

My kid, when they got one, I said, he's like, mom I got it off the website. I'm like, dude, like, you're about to be 21. You don't need a fake ID. He told him I wanted to go to the club. He's lucky he got it at all. You usually buy three of them before you get one that actually shows up. Or one even shows up.

Right, right. Because they're typically Russians. Yeah. Take your money. Yeah. So you've got, you're getting the jewelry. How long does that last? Does anybody ever get busted doing that?

The jury? Yeah. Is it just you? I got busted. it. Do other people do, are other people doing it? You said you had a crew. Yeah, but they was getting, it was another crew that was getting jury, but they was getting clusters. I was getting solitary stones. Real diamonds. Right. VVS, GIA certified with my paperwork. Right. So I'm just, you know. I got angry. I was asking. So what, what, so did you get, eventually you get caught or were there close calls? Like, do they ever, do they ever, do they ever, do they ever? So let me tell you, so we were on our way to meet a client. We had just left Boston, Massachusetts.

I did a legal U-turn. You remember I'm on probation for that situation that happened. So I got a three-way search clause. So they searched the vehicle. We had all the diamonds, the receipts, everything in the car from Boston. Get pulled over. They go through the car, search the cars. Me and my place is through in the car.

They start calling Boston back. We well away from Boston. Right. end up arresting us for all that when they found out everything was illegal. We ended up going to North County. Who's we? Me and my place sister. She used to come with me everywhere.

This was one of my, this was at the end was a person who turned, stayed on me. So we used to go. I mean, we end up getting arrested going down to North County. She ended up getting a bond. I didn't get a bond because I had a probation hold. So, I had to wait until Boston, Massachusetts came to, they extradited us back to Boston, Massachusetts. Okay. She ended up getting out.

How long was, how long did you have to wait? 90 days. Okay. And so you get moved back? I get moved back to Boston, Massachusetts. I'm fighting a case. I eventually get a paid attorney. You're still not getting bond, right?

Or do you get bond? We get bond. My bond was $20,000 cash. Hers was $10,000. No 10%. You literally take the $20,000 over to the match. Magister and you get bond you fill out the paperwork and you get bonded out. But I was in there for about, I would say about a week.

Okay. In Boston, Massachusetts. Get an attorney. I get a paid attorney. They have a blasted all over to Boston Globe. These would taste take about out of hub. That's what the headlines said. What did you say?

These would taste take about out of hub because the area we was called was called Newberry Street, but it was like real like they had Hermes. Chanel was real high end. Right. So how much were all the diamonds? Everything came up to like, we did two days, $120,000 shop and three in two days. And that's just what they caught you with. Yeah.

So, okay, so what's your lawyer saying? I don't remember. It was so long ago. He was a good attorney. He was a good attorney, but he was like, this was the wrong state to come do crime. We didn't get caught, though. I was being self-centered, thinking I was above the law, thinking, I was never going to get caught.

Right. Did a legal U-turn. And that's how we got pulled over with all the stuff in. That was my first time meeting that client. So I wanted him to know that everything was legit. Like he'd go all the paperwork. He'd go to single solitary stone. So that's why how, usually I don't ride around like that.

Well, what happens? So is the, what are they coming to you and offering you? And what's the lawyer saying? What's the district attorney saying? Eventually, I found out that, um, the feds had picked that was was basically

watching me it's not good no it's not good so they end up non-processing the case and the feds pick it up so how did the feds get on to you

like why were they watching did you ever find that out no I've never found that out but you know what I told you I didn't tell you but my good friend her dad was a federal agent

okay and when we got pulled over for that illegal you turn I asked her it was a paper I had and I asked her what was this number. I said, ask your father what's this number.

He said that's a federal number. So that's how I found out that the feds was on me. All right. So the feds pick it up. Mm-hmm. You get. I'm out fighting my case. Well, I'm going to have the feds pick it up.

Not for long. Mm-mm, not for long. I end up being greedy going back. Going back what? To hit another lick. How much money do you have that you can't kick back and act like you're a soccer mom? I was taking care of everybody. Matthew like, you know, I'm just the type of friend that we all go shine, not just one of us, you know?

So if a person don't have it, I pick up the slack, paying rent, paying for plastic surgery. Just taking care of everybody. Splurgeon, we traveling, trips, everything was on me. Yeah, I paid for some boo-boob jobs. But that wasn't, those weren't friends. So you're fighting the case. Mm-hmm. And I'm fighting the case for Boston, and then I go on another run. Right. And what happens?

Another. We call red-handed in the act in Virginia. Is this another diamond one? Yes. Okay. I get two Orsure, Perpetro Day Dates, Rolex watches for 120. The judge was pissed. He was like, his name was Robert Dumar. He passed away. Wish he can see me now, Mr. Dumar. But he was like, I should have been in Hollywood. I should have been an actor.

Like, how could a young lady at your age get away with $120,000 Rolex watches? Did you tell them? That's nothing. That's nothing. No, I didn't tell him that, but, yeah. Your honor. That's just what they got me with. He said, 84 months.

I said, what? I went back to the bullpen. The guy was like, Mom, how much time you guys said, man, they gave me 84 months? He said, damn, who you kill? And I started thinking, I started doing the calculations. I'm like, dang, this judge gave me seven years. Yeah. Seven years.

How much times? I did the whole seven years. I lost all my good time. Really? Yeah, because people were trying to play. You were a bad in me. I was bad in there. My mom was bringing me contraband.

She was bringing me Mac lip gloss, peels. Anything I can sell because when restitution was so high. So what happened with the, you said, the friend you got arrested with? She was, you said she was so mad at me. She was like, she was pissed. Like, you knew what she was signed. up for. She's my place that she went everywhere with me. She was like the lookout. She's a pretty girl. She's still pretty to the same. She's a really pretty girl, nice body. Everybody

sucks. I was like, what do you do for? I'm just her sister. I'm just her sister. She just spoiled me. She was my lookout. She knew what she was getting herself into. Right. So she was pissed. She didn't go on his last run with me. And. And but you said she cooperated in the other case? At the end. Oh, okay. When I called my federal. case. It has CIA 1 and CIA 2 in my indictment. Doesn't mean it's her. Who else is going to be?

Matthew. I love it. They act like they're fooling you. We're like CIA or you know, confidential informant. C1 drove up with Mr. Cox. C1 has known Mr. Cox since high school. It's like,

they break it all down for you in Leighton. Exactly. But yeah, My girlfriend, her dad was a federal agent at the time. Right. So, yeah. She used to be behind the phones, too. I saw her the phones, too.

So what did she end up getting? Nothing. Nobody got anything, Matthew. I'm the only man that went down like the Titanic. And I remember the other interview with, what was his name? Trappernanonymous. Is that the guy that talks slow? Sorry.

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I met Rob four times. One time we were at a gas station, and I was sitting in my, I had a brand new BMW, and we pulled in a park. It was me and I was about to say her name. You got to be careful because, yeah, Vlad said the other people name on his show. I'm like, dude, you can't be. He's like, I said it. I say, yeah, that's true.

But anyway, we pulled in a park, and the guy was like, you have white smoke coming from your BMW. So to this day, I don't pull into no parks. I back in and parks. He was like, he had white smoke come from your BMW. So we meet some guy to sell him a Rolex, I mean a Brightland watch. The watch was probably like 40K.

So we got out the car, us green beans. We got out the car. He like, put your hands up. I can't believe y'all got out of the car. Right. Right. Give us everything. Gave him everything.

He took everything. He didn't take the truck, but he took everything. Our purse is the watch all that. You got robbed a couple more times? Yeah, I got robbed. Somebody broke in my house. They think I don't know who it was, but I know who it was.

They was looking for the diamonds that got, when I got arrested from Boston, Massachusetts, they was looking for those diamonds. Okay. Then another incident happened. A person think I don't know. Like, I'm still cool with one of the people. Yeah, I'm still cool with them to this day.

but I definitely know it was them. Like, you know, but yeah, that's why I choose. I mean, I'm cool with people. I'm cool with them, but I just don't trust. Like, trust comes slim. The guy, there's a guy who worked with a task force. I grew up with him, know him, everything. And I don't have a problem.

Like, I don't have a problem with him. Like, he cooperated because I've been arrested a few times. But, like, I've had, you know, he cooperated. And this is an Eric, Eric also, but we've never talked about it. We've gone to dinner. We hang out. And I don't know if they're thinking he doesn't know. But like I got the Freedom of Information Act.

I got, well, we've never had, you know, like we've never, but we've never had a car. And I wouldn't care. And I feel like they wouldn't care. But it's like, how could you do somebody like that, like a person who, a person who looked out for you, who was there for you. Like, not only did you rob me, but you didn't even look off on my children while I was incarcerated. Like, how could you, how do you live with yourself? Like, I didn't did some fucked up shit. I'm, excuse my French.

I didn't do some messed up stuff to myself. Like, I didn't did some stuff too, but it's like at the end of the day, like, your guilt kick in. Like, you can't, you don't live, you can't, you got to admit your wrongs. Like, I apologize. I'm sorry. Like, I didn't know what I was thinking. Like, I was desperate. Like, you know.

No, I don't think they think that at all. Because listen. I don't, I got a conscious. My conscious. I don't like to look out of my shoulder no more. On my indictment for this, for this crime, or sorry, the one where I went to prison, there's 12 people on the, I think it's 12 people on the, all of them cooperate against me, all of them. So when I got arrested, I cooperated against them, but it's too late. Yeah.

They've already cooperated against me. There's nothing I can do. Yeah, you can't. So, you know, I'm doing everything I can. I'm trying to like, let's, let's wrap this up. Let's get these fuckers. We'll all be in here together. They told me first.

They told me first. And it'd been three years. And the economy was collapsing, right? It's the financial crisis, 2008. So, well, that started in 2007. So by the time I'm late 2007, I'm getting indicted, the banks are failing all over the place. It's not people say the 2008 financial crisis, because in 2008 is when they bailed them out. But they've been failing for six months to a year.

So anyway, by the time, yeah, by the time I get, you know, they've got bigger fish to fry than little Matt Cox and a bunch of his little cohorts, you know. But they had all, everybody had always cooperated. The first time I got in trouble, my. But why would you, why would you try to cooperate on them, Matt, and you was the one that was out there doing a crime? They don't cooperate against me. They were committing, everybody was committing crimes. So much. So would you know, tiff attack? Yes.

Yeah. I'm worried about me. I'm worried about me. We could spread. No, if you was worried about you, you wouldn't have been paying that man $500 and a thousand. They're talking about, he'd already done it, gone and did his time. There are 25, they're trying to do 26 years here. We can get, Travis, you can do four.

You can do four. You can do, let's spread this around. He wasn't, you wasn't trying to do that to what he said by yourself. No, hell. No, I was ready to cut everybody's fucking throw. I realized, here's the thing, the first time I got in trouble, you know what my lawyer told him? I paid him $75,000 for him to plead guilty. You know what he told me, though?

I gave him a 75,000, he said, listen. 75K. 75K. And it was the federal? Federal. So he said, listen. He said, somebody had wore a wire on me, and he'd already talked to the prosecutor, right? He already talked.

Matter of fact, the person that wore the wire on me, Gretchen Zeyes, shout-ups to Greshon Zayas and Pete Zayas. You see them? You see them to this day? No, I know. I don't ever see them. I've never run in them. They hear? They'd be perfectly polite to them.

I'd be nice to them. But they're the kind of people that they would, they've rebuilt. their lives and I'm sure that they are so you forgive them yeah I have no problem with that yeah I forgive them too that's fine I don't have a problem with them so what happened was anyway whatever I won't get into it because people are going to scream it's not about you Cox I get it so but they had wore a wire on me I got in trouble I got three years but when I went to my lawyer and I paid him the 75,000 to plead me guilty he said listen he had already talked to their lawyer who let him know in you know that they've got a wire on your guy my people are going to these guys are

going to testify like you can't go to trial with this so he was like okay so he said 75,000 I plead guilty and try and keep you out of prison which was such bullshit because I was never there was no dollar loss in that case so anyway he said but here's the thing Matt he said I can get you pretrial a pretrial intervention I go what's that he said if you cooperate He said, from what I understand from the FBI, he said, they think you're running like a mill. They think you're just cranking out fraudulent loans. And you got about 10, 10, 12 guys working for you. I go, right?

And he said, if you will work with the FBI, he goes, if I was you, I would go, go get 10 of the most egregious files that your brokers have committed. Bring them here. We'll meet with the FBI. I can keep you from even being indicted because I hadn't been indicted yet. just a complaint. He goes, I can keep you from even being indicted. He goes, you work with them against those brokers. You don't have to go. He said, you don't even get. Did he keep you from being indicted? No, because I was, because you know why? I was fucking idiot. I watched the Godfather and I thought, you don't snitch. And I was like, you don't, Matthew? Stop. So, there's no street code. It's over.

So I went, I said, I sat there and, and I went, you know what so funny is that most of the women that are on the podcast, like they never cooperate. And like, like Jeff, like my wife didn't, she's ready to go to trial. You know, my wife is 10 days away from trial.

They let her, they gave her the witness list. And she saw all of her friends' names on. They're ready to testify against her. And she also noticed, she said, I always thought it was weird because every time one of my co-conspirators

would go off to talk to their lawyer for the day. And then they, they'd come back, they'd immediately move them. She's like, like, we'd be together for four months, and then one day they'd leave for the whole day. They had a court of parents, and the next day they moved them. Well, that's because they took a plea. And they're going to testify to you.

So when she finally got that list, she said, she went to her lawyer and said, can I get the deal for three years? And he was like, oh, they're not going to get that. That's off the table. It's 10 days away. They got people lined up. You know what's going on now. Because the whole time she would say, these are my friends. They're not going to testify.

shit. So I took, so the first time I said, no, no, I'll take the felony. I didn't have a felony. Take the felony. I'll take the three years probation. And he's telling me, you're probably going to go to jail. I was never going to jail. But even then, I was willing to risk going to jail because I wasn't going to testify. The next case I had, those guys were ready to line up. They're actually calling to testify. Then when I took off on the run, they're listed, they're those 12 people. Some of those are those, not all of them, because it had been a few years. But probably seven or eight of those guys are those same guys who are now calling and going in and testifying. And I knew right then, fuck that.

I'll cut everybody's fucking throat and nobody gives up. And by the way. They let you cussing here? Yeah. Oh. And by the way, when I left, everybody went straight into my house, stole all my shit. And this is what bothers me. I mentioned this to Jess the other day.

when my ex-wife went by the house to clean out the house, and we were friends, but we were both, but we still worked together. When she went by to go ahead and just... What was she? What did she do? Real estate. She owns a bunch of, it's lucrative.

If you marry me, it's typically lucrative. So they, if they asset, huh? You are asset. Yeah, I was an asset that married to her. So she went in to clean out my house. said it was cleaned out practically except for some of the bigger furniture and my dog had been there for three days she said there's poop everywhere there was they so you came and you stole

all my shit but you left my dog for three days like like you're like what like just pieces you know they don't care yeah i was like yeah i'm done they be because in the beginning my mom used to tell me about them girls they she's always telling me like they're so jealous like You don't see it. You don't see it, but them girls' jealousy. I never listened to my mother. I used to think it was just the drugs talking. Right.

To this day. I always tell my kids, like, I'm telling you, I told my oldest son. You listen to me. If you don't do nothing else, listen to your mother. Well, you have the luxury of experience now. And it's funny, too, because when you go to prison and you're in that, concentrated environment. And like, you know, I would always hear people like, oh, that person's jealous.

And then you get to prison and you really see jealous people, people making up stuff about other people. People working angles. I ended up being transferred from out of Dublin because of that jealousy. Somebody dropped the dime. My mom bringing me contraband. They transfer me to Wasiga, Minnesota. Anything happened to your mom?

Mm-mm. They just got, moved you? They just moved me. So your mom's bringing in contraband, everything. Every weekend she was coming to visit me. So you lost your gains eye. How much time did you lose? I lost all my good time.

But I mean that time, 54 days? I don't remember. Probably so, yeah. Because I think they only take 54 days at a time, but they just keep hitting you and clipping you. Yeah, because my mom's like, who books you won't put this money on on a phone? Like, that's circuit in the system.

I'm like, mom, like, said to myself, like, she blessed her heart. She didn't know. 30 days. Right. Just lost 30 days. Yes. Like, if they listened to my phone calls, it was terrible.

I was in Dublin. It was terrible. So where'd you go? What, what, different prisons did you go to? Wasika, Minnesota. It was a men's prison at first, and they turned it to women's. So I was in Dublin. I did five, I did, I want to say two and a half years in Dublin and the rest in

Waseca. That was hard time. I was away in Minnesota, away from my family. My kids didn't come visiting me. I'll tell you this story because I think you'll get this. So when I was locked up, in Atlanta City Detention Center. There was this little guy, a little black guy.

And I mean, he's probably five foot one. But I mean, jacked. Everybody called him Mighty Mouse. Like he's exactly if Mighty Mouse was a black guy. He's a tiny little guy just jacked up. Nicest guy ever. And so I was in there for fraud. And so he, he's, we start talking.

And I was like, what are you here for? He's like, hey, he'd actually gotten, he'd been to prison before a couple times for fraud. in federal prison and he said okay he said what happened was his girlfriend had called his probation officer and said you need to come to house right now he's got 10 cars in the house right now all them are stolen so what happened was and i was like what he's like yeah he's like i was fucking one of her friends the friend wanted me to break up with her i wouldn't do it so the friend called her this is the whole fucking thing and he's living in like a two million dollar house in atlanta what, 20 years ago, that was a hell of a house.

Absolutely. In Buckhead. Like, and this is, yeah, he was, he was, oh, yeah. He, um, so I was like, well, I don't understand. What, what, what, how did you get that the car? And so he went back and told me the whole story. And the, the, the quick version is that, oh, and he had Mighty Mouse tattooed on him, too. Listen, this guy, I would do anything to find this guy.

Just, I don't even have to interview him. Right. just to talk to him because he and I talked for hours. He was super and he was there on a probation violation. But he said, okay, he said, here's what I've been doing. And I remember, too, he was almost off probation. He was like, I was fucking only a month away from being off probation or whatever it was. And he was, he had back then used to get in the mail, you would get these convenience checks that were for like a car.

Like you're, you've been pre-approved for, you know, up to a purchase up to a $100,000 vehicle. And it was a blank check. for an auto loan, auto car, auto loan. So you would get in the mail and it'd be from various different banks. I really haven't seen these anymore,

but they might still do them. So he said, you know those two? I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, give them all the time. He's like, right. He said, so I made up, I think he made up a bank or he was using an existing bank. And he said, they redid the whole check.

And he would have either his like girlfriend or whoever somebody he's working with or he would walk into a dealership and you'd walk in the dealership and he would look for a car for a $100,000 Mercedes and he'd find it. Brand new cars. Find it, okay, I like it. Yeah. He'd test drive it, come back. And he said, I walk into the finance department.

And they'd say, okay, well, you know, we're getting the fill out of finance. And he's, no, no, no, I'm already approved. My bank sent me this check thing. I got this in the mail. And this is my bank. And they were like, oh, okay. They go, okay. Yeah, yeah.

I got to call the bank. And there's a phone number. They call the bank. His girlfriend would answer the phone, you know. As the bank. Yeah. As the bank, whatever, SunTrust, you know, credit. And same thing.

Rattle off, you know, whatever line, put them on hold, do this. Who is this? Is this the finance manager? Okay. And go through the whole process. I need the VIN number. I need the this. So make, model, go through the whole thing.

Is my customer in front of you? Yes, can you put them on the phone? Put him on the phone? Yes, he gives the last four digits of a social security number, his date of birth. Is it? Yes. Okay. Here, she wants to talk to you.

And she would go through the entire thing and she would say, okay, you know, the transaction is complete. And she would tell him how much. And the guy would say, where are he getting these account numbers from? It's just a blank check. So here's what they would say. What you can do, she would say, well, how do we get? paid, she'd say, okay, she would give them an authorization code and say, we can either issue you a check. It'll be there within the next, you know, five days, or you can actually fill out the check in front of you and deposit it.

And they would go, okay. And he goes, I remember he told me, said, you'd be shocked how many of these people actually filled out the check and deposit it. Like, why don't you know what's going on? He's like, I get all the paper. They think it's been approved. They've got an approval number. They've talked to the bank. They've got the check.

They got everything. They've got my driver's license. I go, do they? He's like, no, it's a fake driver's license. It's a fake, you know, whatever, some Russian website or something. They make a copy. Is they give me the keys, everything? I get in the car and I leave.

I'm like, okay, but now 10 days later, you're driving a stolen car. He was like, no, no, no. He said, what I've done is three states away. He's already had somebody go. And this was, it evolved into this. Somebody else had already gone and gotten the VIN number off the identical vehicle. So they would make that VIN number and crack the windshield.

And he actually had like the printer, the whole thing. And so on the doors he would replace it. He'd replace it in the windshield. And they would then take the paperwork, the registration paperwork, and change it on the VIN, or change the VIN, everything. And then they would go register the vehicle.

As soon as it got registered, they'd send in that it had been paid off. And the state capital would issue, I don't know why that was important. But for some reason, that's where they issued it. They would issue a title. So they would issue a title. So now I got a title with the car. He said, I'm like, yeah, but there's another one. Yeah, but it's four states away.

It's registered in the other. He said, there's no national at this time. I don't know if there may still not be. I don't know. He goes, there's no national thing, you know, that says where cars are registered. So now I'm driving around in this Mercedes and I have a brand, he has a title that says it's paid off. And then he was selling them to drug dealers. He said, he was like, yeah, I would go.

And I was like, why don't you sell? He's like, well, I can't because they're going to issue me cash. They're going to use it, but a drug dealer will pay me $50,000 in cash. And then he had all these stories about the drug dealers would show up like $25 grand and try and strong arm him. And he finally had to get to a point where he would go to. pick up the money with another guy that had a gun and the whole thing. He's like, he's like, he's like, you don't want to deal with drug dealers. He's like, they'll try and, you know, try and rob you every time. He's like, especially for 50 grand. He doesn't look at me. Like he's like,

he's like, oh, I'm tiny. I mean, I'm not going to get into a fist fight with the guy. And he's like, and he's like, I'm not going to shoot anybody over 50 grand. He's like, I'm making tons of money. And he was doing this nonstop. So, wow. Yeah, it was, it was like that's, so I feel like that similar. Yeah. Because, right? Like, it's, that's why when I heard your story, I was like, wow, I've never met anybody that did that.

Well, what the diamonds is similar. Because I was, diamonds, you know diamonds. I was making, like, more money. With the banks, I was making money, but the diamond money was different. Right. See, Zach would be great right now, if Zach was not in jail. Who is Zach? Zach's a buddy of mine.

Oh, okay. And he ran a scam he called Wasn't Me, which was they would. and he had crews of people. But the problem is the people that he was dealing with, they're drug addicts. Yeah. So he's like, they were good for two. He's like, maybe one.

As soon as they got the money, he's like, you're giving them 30 grand. He's like, they're gone. Yeah. You know, I think he had one or two guys, a few guys that he's like, they were good maybe four times. You know, he's like, so what he would do is, and he had somebody who made fake IDs for him. And here's where Zach would get these people.

He would go and sit in the courthouse. house for first appearance. And so they come by, oh, this guy, he's a burglar, this guy, this. And somebody walk in, they go, he's check kiting. He's been arrested three times. Search credit card, fraud. Zach would write his information down and then bond him out and say, hey, I got something for you.

And they go, okay. And so he's sent him, he's like, but, you know, they're all drug addict. So the point is, is that he'd make a fake ID. He'd have that guy go into three different banks because you only open about three accounts. But he was usually what he do is give everybody had three IDs. So you can make nine accounts. He would then deposit a little bit over $10,000. Well, let's say, let's say $10,000 into those bank accounts. And then when they issued the card, the debit card, he would have them clone it, send them the clone, mail it. So they're in, let's say, Ohio, mail it to Florida. He would

would then go into multiple post offices to the point of sale machine and say, hey, I need nine $1,000 money orders. And then they'd go, okay, and they put it in. He'd swipe the card. That's probably why the post office don't take credit cards no more. Only debit. Well, no, it would still, it was a debit card. Oh, okay. Because it was attached to $7,000. Oh, so he used the pen. Right. Oh, yeah. He has the pen. The guy opened the account. So, boom, he's got it. Whatever. Let's say it's however much. Let's say it's 10,000. So he, he, he, call the guy up to say, okay, go into Bank of America. He would walk back into Bank of America and he'd say, hey, I need to get out, you know, $1,100

out of my account. And the teller would go, you only have like, you know, whatever, $900, whatever the amount. And they'd go, no, I have $10,000. I just deposited like $10,000 the other day or, you know, $9,500, whatever the amount was. And they were like, oh, no, it says you just remove $9,000. You go, from where? They go from a postal, you know, the U.S. Post office or whatever in Tampa, Florida. And he'd go, we're in Ohio, you know, like, what are you talking about?

And they go, oh, gosh, you need to talk to Sally. Wow. And the bank manager. Bank manager comes, looks into and goes, oh, my gosh, do you have your debit card? I got it right here. And he'd be like, what's going on? And they'd be like, you're going to worry. They go, don't worry, we're going to put your money back in the account.

And that night they put the money back in the account. And the next day he comes in, look, he's like, I feel weird about this whole thing. I just want my money back. So he takes the money back. So they've got the $9,000 and they give him his original money back because they think he was defrauded. Right. So he just made $9,000. He's doing that.

Each guy, he's doing that with nine accounts. That's $81,000. He would give the guys one third because he said one third is just to fly you out there. Of course, it didn't cost anything near that, he said. But, you know, he still, it's a lot of setup. He said, he said, they get the one third. They get their 30 grand or not even 30, whatever. $20,000 he is, and they disappear because they're drug addicts and I couldn't get them to come back.

Maybe they'd do another one and halfway through the next one. And he's written them cars, renting them hotels, renting them everything. He'd get phone calls from the hotel saying, listen, the two people you rented this hotel from, they've got the police here or they're naked in the parking lot, screaming at people. They can't stay here anymore. You have to find someplace else. But he did that. He was making tons of, so it sounds like a similar.

type, like when you're McDonaldizing it, right? You're turning it into just a mill. Yeah, absolutely. So, you eventually have to take off. That's why I see, Zach needs to be here. When he get out?

Well, it's not good looking good. Oh. Well, he's going to plead, I think he's going to plead guilty. They're dropping almost all the charges and he's taking like a felony for time served. He's only been locked out like nine months. So they'll let him

He'll immediately go to the feds. And when he goes to the feds, he was federal because it was in it. No, no, it was state. How did it become federal then? He was already in federal, federal probation. Oh, okay. So he has to go, the federal violation. Oh, yeah.

His federal judge hates him like. He's going to give him the max. He's going to, he said on me, he's a, he can, the max he can give me three years. Oh, that's not bad. He goes, so I'm assuming it's three years. Zach, come on home. Yeah. And don't do crime anymore.

Let's not the first. Let's not first. How old is you, Zach? How old is Zach? He's 56. Come on, Zach, cut it out. No, he's 50. He's two, I'm 50, he's two years older.

He's 50, no, he's 57. No, Zach, no better. We're not just that. He got out a few months after I got out. And then he was out maybe nine months and went back to, back to jail, serve that sentence, put back on probation, was out another year, another year, back again. Zach got to do, you got to do better, Zach. Bella said you got to do better, Zach. start calling him can't do right

can't do right yeah mr can't do right yeah you know what I mean those guys in prison there was always one or two guys right yeah but I definitely I was definitely yeah I look back and I when I hear like the kind of money that that Zach would give people

and the kind of money like I would give people and I'm just like fuck this guy of course there is there is the Eric Tamargo James Red this is you know

know my store. I'm going to send you a link. Okay. I'm going to tell you real quick, just real quick. Okay. So I'm making synthetic identities, fake people, right? Mm-hmm. And I'm buying houses. I'm refinancing. I'm getting $150,000, loans, whatever. So at some point, one of the title companies gets wise and they're like, something's wrong. Like, this person, James Redd, somebody had obviously told them, this person doesn't exist. So, and I'd already done a closing with this title company. And so they call up and they said, listen, you, Mr. Cox, we're not, like, they say, we're not closing

another loan unless James Red shows up, because what I was doing was going and picking up the package and saying, I'll bring it to my client. And then they'd sign it. You was. Yeah, I would, because I was a mortgage broker. Oh, okay. So they, then I'd bring it back to them with a copy of his driver's license, and they'd notarize his stamp and notarize his signature. And then they'd give me the checks. And I'm selling them the house or I'm the on the broker or whatever. I'm the mortgage broker. I'm involved in the

transaction. So they give me the check and I leave. Sometimes the checks are broken up into different companies for whatever reason they're giving me in the checks. Like they trust me. Well, now they realize like somebody has called them and said James Red doesn't exist and they've never really seen them. All they have is a copy of a driver's license. So I, so the the title person says that unless this guy shows up, we're not cutting any more checks. There's no more closings. So I'm like, fuck. And I went, okay, well, and actually the person that told me was a broker involved in the transaction.

She's like, what are you going to do? And she's like, we can go to a title company. I said, no, I said, he's going to have to show up. And they were like, how? I said, well, I said, I got a guy. And here's what I had been doing was I was make the fake IDs, make the copy of it. And I would just go and I would take a mug shop. from somebody I actually knew.

Stop. Don't judge me. I'm not. I'm listening. And I would glue it on to, you know, the, the, and make a copy of it. Because they're just getting a copy. Yeah. So, copy and paste.

The name of the guy was Eric Tamargo. Mm-hmm. And so I call up Eric Tamargo and I said, listen, Eric, I need, can you come by the office? Sure, he comes by. And he would clean, he would do construction. jobs for us. He would, you know, whatever. He's just kind of a jackleg guy where he, trim, we need a tree trimmed. He'd trim it. Whatever. So, okay. So we do the whole thing. And he comes in. He's like, yeah, what's up? And I go, okay, listen, man, I've got to explain something

to him. And if I explained him what I've been doing. And he's like, holy shit. I'm like, yeah, he's like, how much, what do you know, man, what kind of money are you making? I was like, well, a lot of that money goes back into the properties. Like, I don't make that much money. You know, we're buying the properties, we're renting them out, which is all bullshit. We'll let him go in foreclosure. But I don't want to let him know how much way I'm making. Exactly. So I tell me, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And he's like, okay, okay. And I said, I need somebody to go in and sign. I tell him this. How much sign did you get, Matthew? Me? Yeah. I did 13 years. I got 26 years.

God, 10. So, oh, I was on the run for three years. I was on American Greed, Date line. I was on, this was before they had Vlad and podcast. So what happens, I tell Eric, I need you. should go in and sign. And he goes, holy shit. He's like, that's a big favor. I said, I know. And he said, well, wait a minute. He said they have a photograph. They have a copy of the guy's driver's license. Of James Red's driver's license. I said, yeah. He was, well, they're going to know it's not me.

I go, here's the thing. No. I said, here's the thing, Eric. You're the person. I've been using your driver's license photo. No, I'm sorry, been using your photograph from when you were arrested for beating up your wife a couple of years ago, your domestic violence footer. And he goes, motherfucker, he jumps up. He's like, you motherfucker. He said, I ought to, I go, oh, I said, Eric, listen, the only reason I used, the only reason is that I knew if it ever

came down to this, you were the only person I knew that had the balls to pull this off. And he goes, he's yeah. Yeah, you're right. By the way, Eric still text me. He texted me yesterday. So,

so. What the, yeah. Matthew. It gets worse. It gets much worse. What? So he says, well, I'm not doing it for free. I said, no, no, bro, of course. I'm going to pay you.

I said, how much do you want? And I remember thinking, if he asked for more than like 10 or 15 grand, like, I'll just go do it myself. I've never gone in by myself. I'd always sit people. Or, I mean, I didn't send people. I always just got the packages. So I went, how much? And he goes, you're making a lot of money.

He said, bro, a lot of that money goes back in the properties. And he goes, I want $500. $500. I go, are you serious? I said, Eric, that's a $500. bucks it's going to be five minutes you just sign some paper you're getting a lot of trouble for this you're making right right exactly right exactly that underplay for the overplay you got to act like and i was like well you got to do it for us i'm not just giving you 500 but no no no bro i know you're good for

it i'll go sign first and i said okay cool so he goes in i make a fake ID he goes in so do he know to this day how much money you was making oh he's seeing me tell tell this story it gets worse he goes in What was really funny that the title company chick, her name was Mary. Eric and I are sitting there. He had to, it was easy to do the signature, by the way. You know what I'm saying? Like, it was like a J and then a squiggly line and an R and two Ds. Like it was so easy.

So he's sitting there. And suddenly Mary comes walking out. And she goes, Mr. Cox, I don't know why you're here. And I said, well, for the closing. And she goes, I told you, unless James Red shows up, I'm not doing it. And I went. And Eric stands up on Q and he goes, I'm James Red. And she goes, hold on a second.

She walks off, comes back with a file with the photo and goes, I'm sorry, Mr. Rick. Come on in, come on in. Signs. Signs. And the checks, when she's cutting it, got all the checks. Again, I would never have it just like one check for $100,000 to me or $150. It was always like some money went to this company, this company, these five people, this per whatever.

So she pulled out a bunch of little, little stats. She's like, okay, Mr. Cox, here's the checks. And I go, oh, yeah, yeah, I'm good. I'll drop him off to do. Oh, okay, fine. So she now kind of feels silly. Like, I don't know why I didn't believe this guy exists. It's clearly him.

He signs perfect. We leave. We get into the car. And he's like, yo, bro, it's like, that's a lot of checks. Like, yeah, those aren't my checks. They're going all over them. You see that. I'm barely making anything.

He's like, okay, so I've counted out the $500. He's like, oh, still, it's a lot of money. And I was like, yeah, man, I was going to buy more property. So a week later, we got another closing. I call him up. Can you come in? Sure, he comes in. Eric, I got into the closing.

He goes, yeah, I've been thinking about, bro, you're making a lot of money on this. There's a lot of people making money. I say, okay, well, how much do you want, bro? And I'm thinking, more than 10 or 15, I'll just do it myself. And he goes, I want $1,000. God. Was he on drugs or something? He was like on $1 or something.

He'd been in jail for Mary. And I'm like, a thousand dollars. Eric is five minutes. You already. Matthew, you is wrong. You are so wrong. And I gave him the thousand bucks. So Eric got, and he was on federal probation, by the way.

He got busted like six, like a year later when I took off on the run. He gets busted for this whole thing. He did like three years. He never told on you? Of course he told on me. He told me he's a lot of everybody. Matthew. What does it matter?

I'm gone. I was on the run. So he goes back. You was not a wrong with your family? No. Oh, okay. No, I can get another family. I've had plenty money.

That's how you felt absolutely. Talking about. $500. Oh, my God. You're such a manipulator. I feel bad. Yes, you should feel bad. I don't.

I feel great. Oh, my gosh. So, so, oh, listen, that's nothing. I, I didn't even tell it. Like, wait, listen. We see this story. I mean, we all have done bad things, though. You ever, you ever survey homeless people to get there, steal their identities?

No. Yeah. That's, that would be horrible. Let's move on. Which was a sign, Matthew? Cancer. So, listen, everything, like, you have the same reaction. No, you're not, you're at least, at least laughing about it.

Like my wife just I know I mean so just How could you do that to those guys? Why would you do that? Like those innocent people And she did five years in the feds for a conspiracy

I met her in the probe In the in the halfway house Like you know what you were signing up for You're right, yep When you got out What happened when you got out So when I got out I had like

Dibble and Dad And I was like yeah This ain't it It ain't like I had dibble to lit up put my feet in the sand for a second. I was like, this is not it. So eventually I end up getting my,

I end up start doing personal training. From personal training, I got my esthetician license. From my esthetician license, I got my phobotomy license. And I started doing, like, I had a body, like a meddy spa. Eventually, I lost my passion moving to Atlanta. And then I ended up getting my appraisal license. So now I'm into investment. So me and my son, we got a,

I'm real private, but I'm going to just let you know, Matthew. But we got a nonprofit organization that's called Kansas Ministry, we give back. And we're in a process of opening up a wellness retreat where kids will be able to come on. We purchased 30 acres of land. And kids will be able to come to on a treat and fish, horseback riding. in Georgia, horseback riding, yoga, a lodge where they can stay over. He's of that nature. So I really want to give back to single moms who coming home from prison who didn't have help.

So that's what the home is going to be used for. I'm a big supporter of single moms. Yeah, it's not easy. It's not easy raising boys, you know. I have three of them. So what happened? I wrote this book when I was incarcerated. When you were locked out.

Yeah. in 2010. Is it like your story? It's a memoir about my life, yeah. It's about my stories called recidivism, beauty before bars, literally break down the layers of who Bella really is

and how does she overcome recidivism. So I just hope that me telling my story, if it wasn't for my 21 year, I would never tell my story, man. My son was like, Mom, you never know how your story can impact somebody else's life. When did you go on?

What was the first one you went on? Travel Anonymous. How long goes out? Chris. August, I mean, April 7th. Okay. And then from then, everybody started. I shut down.

After I went viral, from that podcast, I shut down. Why? I don't know, Matthew. I just like, I don't know because, you know, I'm just, I'm kind of self-sabotaged. Like, you know, I kind of like shut down. I was like, yeah, I ain't going to be able to do this. Like, this is getting too much attention. I don't like all that.

Too many people start reaching out to you. Too many people start reaching out. Trapped queens reached out, American gangster. I denied that request. They wanted me bad, too. What about my true crime story? Oh, no, they already. Is it trapped queen?

It's the same. Oh, okay. They only wanted to give me $2,500 for my story. Like, who got... Well, that's just for an appearance. They wanted a whole... They wanted my story. I'd rather do God's work what I'm doing now

and allow God light to shine. because that's what his light is doing instead of going and selling my soap with 2,500 and they see the numbers. I'll take the $2,500. I mean, I did my true crime story. You did? Yeah. You took it? You took the $2.

No, no. What was it then? I want to say $35,000 or $5,000. And they paid my wife. And they paid Allison. See, I don't know. It's more about an impact. I don't care about the money, Matthew.

It's the impact I'm leaving on somebody. else's life. Somebody who's going through trauma who's scared to tell a story. Don't be afraid to tell your story. You just never know who life you might change. So to me, it's the impact that I'm leaving on somebody else's life. It's not about the money. I don't understand what you're saying. I don't care about the money. I don't care of the money. That's what I'm saying. Like, God is go, God is go take care of me. He's going to bless me. So it's not about the money. It's about the impact. I just felt like they portray you to be, I don't know. Like it's not this gangster.

Like, no, I'm a mom. At the end of day, I'm a mom who, I'm a single parent who did what she had to do to survive to take care of her children. Hustle, hustling was in my blood. And at the end of the day, I steal who I am who I am. But forget about all that. Like, what's you doing now to impact the world? Like, what's you doing, Matthew, to impact the world? If you sleep hot at night, you know how disruptive that can be.

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site wide. I gave a homeless guy a bottle of water and a whatever like a candy bar the other day. I keep them in my car and give them out sometimes. See? That's what I'm saying. You leaving your mark. Matt will never give himself

credit. I mean, this, there's a lot of comments that you'll see on these videos saying, you won't believe you know, this podcast helps me get through my day. Exactly. No, I get, I do get. Do you understand what I'm saying?

I get tons, here's what's funny. I get tons of comments from people that say like, you don't understand how much your story has inspired me and how, the one that really fucked me up. Oh, man, this father's thing. Okay, hold on. Oh, you bought the cry. No, no, I'm not. I'm going to do it.

Okay. Hold on, I could do it. Okay. Was the, the woman that said she did like six weeks. I could be wrong the weeks, but like six weeks, like twice a week where she did chemotherapy. Wow. And she said, I listen to your podcast every single time for like, it's like four hours or three hours. I don't know how long it was it.

She said, you have no idea of the impact and how you got me through. Listen, it was so fucked up. It was very upsetting. I mean, to me, it bothered me because she was so, you know, she went, it wasn't super long, but it was what she said was like that it was just like whole. Holy shit. The idea that this person is getting, is taking all of this out. And it's really, here's what's funny.

What bothers me about it is that, like, I got out of prison. I was broke. I put my life back together. I tried to do the right thing, right? And listen, many opportunities where people have come to me. Matter of fact, when I first got out, I was doing the podcast, people were just reaching out saying, look, I'll PayPal you, four grand, three grand, just to talk to me for one hour. I have questions, but they're fraud questions.

I get them DMs all the time. Yeah, I'm not going to do that. Yeah, I get them DMs all the time. It's like, are you crazy? Like, did you, did I not just tell you that I just did seven years in federal prison? And you're going to get me another statement. Yeah. Are you dumb?

So I, listen, I had one time a guy befriended me for six months. And I thought, because, you know, what happens is what the, podcast. It's like people will reach out to you and they just want to talk to you, ask you some questions about a business that they're doing whatever. And the guy had a legitimate business. So I was like, all right, so I talked to him. We talked for a little bit. And then, but now he's got my cell number. And so he's texting me. So we kind of start becoming friends, right? We're texting, right? I'm living in someone's spare room. You know, I don't have any friends. So after six months, he flies down from New York. Here. Yeah,

meets me at a Starbucks. Like just a couple days before he did, listen, man, I'm going to be in Tampa on Tuesday. Because I got a girlfriend that lives down there. And I'm going to go see her. And I thought, I never mentioned a girlfriend. But, okay. He's like, I'd love to, you know, can I take you to Starbucks? You know, just meet me for Starbucks.

Okay. I go. Starbucks, I go. He buys me some Starbucks, whatever. We're drinking Starbucks. And he says, listen, you know, we've been talking for a while, man. I just wanted you to know I'm a real guy. You know, I've been to prison.

And I already knew that. And this is what happened. He's like, I never told on nobody. I never nothing. I'm like, okay, okay. He knows my story. Right. You know, so, you know, they're not impressed me.

Right. You just did five years you didn't have to do. Right. So we're talking and he's like, I didn't even make half a million dollars. He's like, and any of me, if you just train me, if you just tell me how to do and help work with me. And I'm like, what? What are you doing? Like, what are you talking?

Like, did you just fucking befriend me for six months so that you could fly down here because you thought you were going to coax me into, yeah. But so regardless of all that, I'm just saying, in general, I get emails, messages. I get, you know, DMs of people like, bro, you have no idea. Like, I got out of prison. I was in the halfway house and a guy started telling me to watch your podcast. I started watching your podcast. and I realized, like, listening to you and the things that you've talked about, I realized that, you know, I can do this.

So I ended up doing this. And then the next thing you know, the guy has got a job making $100,000 a year, or he's flipping properties or he's doing stuff. And they're like, you're inspiring and this and that, and I'm thinking to myself. But here's what I think to myself. I'm not trying to be inspiring. I'm just trying to make a living. Yeah. Doing what I like to do.

But you're doing God's work. See? See? Killing me. So, but I get that all the time. It bothers me. Why? I get it all the time.

I don't feel like I'm trying to do anything. Right. I feel like I'm trying to make a living and just live a decent life. Right. Well, I get it all the time. I just, I got messages in my, in my DMs from that last interview. People telling me how I impacted their life and how they have, they like to hear my story. Like, keep on doing what I'm doing, my light shining.

So it helps me to keep going because sometimes I'll be like, I don't want to come on this interview, Matthew, R. Vlad. If it wasn't for Chris Trapping Anonymous, I went that came on either one of y'all podcast. Why, did you call him? Did he say go? I told him. Oh, what do you say? And he was like, I said, guess who reached out to me?

He was like, I was like, I was like, and now I said, and then I, after you, after he reached out, you reached out. Right. Like, the next day, I was like, I was like, I'm just don't want to do podcast no more because I'm just not. I get tired of telling my story. Like, I'm just not that person no more. But he was just like, Bella, like, yo, he's like, you my testimony. He was like, because he said, you came on my podcast. He said, you went viral.

You went back and published your book because I have been having this book since 2010. You never did anything with it? Just sitting there. Just sitting there. He's like, you published your book. He was like, you changed your life. He's like, why not? I was like, I don't know.

I'm just tired of telling my story, Chris. He was like going on him. He's like going both of them. So I'm here. I was there, now I'm here. So you have the ability to have a platform that would reach millions of people that you could actually help and you want to help, but you won't do it. Oh, oh, damn. It sounds like my public.

Because prior to this, we were talking about how. I said she should start a podcast. I said, you know, you're an attractive black woman who's sharp and articulate. Like that's a good, that's a good recipe for a YouTube channel, right? For a podcast. Yeah, you said that. And I don't, I don't want to do. I got to do the head.

I don't, I'm private. I'm private. Do all that. So. Oh my goodness. So one minute you're saying, I want to. help people. In the next minute, you're saying you don't want to make the effort. We're going to make it happen. We're going to make it happen. I'm assuming you had to have gotten

contacted by a producer, right? Four. You said you had a movie coming out. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So my published, who published my book, he wrote the script for me. Okay. So the, it's not, I'm going to do a series. It's not a movie. It's a series. You make more money with series. I've heard that. Yeah. You make more money. So it's going to be a series that's coming out. I've had many, many meetings about series that have never happened. So why? They just fall apart.

They just, it just, I mean, Colby's been hearing about this for four years now. And I mean, and I mean, literally going to Los Angeles, meeting with people, you know, you're amazing. So my publishing company,

he has sex mongoloid. You ever heard of sex mongoloid? No. Sex mongoloid and sugar babe. Sugar baby. You never heard of sugar baby? It's on BET. Yeah, you're not going to believe this.

I don't watch as much BETV as you think. I need to catch up. You need to catch up. Yeah, because when I was in prison, I was watching a little bit of BETV. You need to catch up, Matthew. I know. I know. I feel bad.

How did you get your name Bella Barka? Was that self-given? So let me tell you. So Bella means beautiful. Bella stands for Beautiful. The Barco comes from the, you remember, so if you ever seen the orange is black, You remember our badges? You had the barcode on the bottom?

So that's where the barcode comes from. They used to scan our badges whenever we go to the conversator, whenever we go out the unit. So that's how I came up with Bella Barco. So that's where Barcoe come from. Okay. Our badges had this little scan on it. And every time we go out the unit,

they'll scan our barcode. I'm like, it was so irritating. But, yeah, that's how I came up with Bella Barcoat. If you had to total the total dollar amount over your entire criminal career, what would you suggest? because it helps with a thumbnail. About 2.3 million. Yeah, and I need these people to order this book

to learn more about Bella Barcode. Do you have it? You have an E version? No, I don't have an E version. I just have Kindle. Do you have... And I have it on my website. Kindle's an E version.

Oh, okay, I didn't know that. You have a soft copy. Uh-huh. Do you have the hard copy? Mm-hmm. And you have an E version, a Kindle. Yeah, a Kindle is the E-Verience. Yeah.

If you have Kendall, they can order it on all the problems. Yeah, but no, I want them to go to my website and order at it's bellabarcode.com. What about, what about one more is audible? Audible. Do you have audible? I've been getting a lot of people asking me. Some people only buy audible. I'm thinking about it and I'll be the voiceover.

I'm going to give them, I'm going to give the readers what they want. With my supporters, I do. I like to give my supporters what they want. And a series? And a series. Coming out soon. What's the series going to be called?

That I don't. It's not going to be recidivism. No. That I don't. I can't drop that jewel now. You want me to drop all the jewels. It's going to be the bling,

bling, crew. Did you ever see that? Did you ever see that? Did you hear that? What? God. God.

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the website buy a book thank you very much see you