Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Exposing Californias 3 Strike Law How He Survived A Life Sentence

Episode Date: January 11, 2026

Chris Curtis shares how he ended up getting out of prison with a life sentence, cleaning up and overcoming his addiction, and becoming a mentor of hope for kids just like he was.⁣ ⁣ Book https://www.amazon.com/Orange-County-Dark-Christopher-Curtis/dp/1644565935⁣ IG https://www.instagram.com/octhedarkside8083/⁣ ⁣ ⁣ 📧Sign up to my newsletter to learn about Real Estate, Credit, and Growing a Youtube Channel: https://mattcoxcourses.com/news⁣ ⁣ 🏦Raising & Building Credit Course: https://mattcoxcourses.com/credit ⁣ 📸Growing a YouTube Channel Course: https://mattcoxcourses.com/yt⁣ 🏠Make money with Real Estate Course: https://mattcoxcourses.com/re⁣ ⁣ Follow me on all socials!⁣ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/insidetruecrime/⁣ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@matthewcoxtruecrime⁣ ⁣ Do you want to be a guest? Fill out the form https://forms.gle/5H7FnhvMHKtUnq7k7⁣ ⁣ Send me an email here: [e-mail]⁣ ⁣ Do you want a custom "con man" painting to show up at your doorstep every month? Subscribe to my Patreon: https: //www.patreon.com/insidetruecrime⁣ ⁣ Do you want a custom painting done by me? Check out my Etsy Store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/coxpopart⁣ ⁣ Listen to my True Crime Podcasts anywhere: https://anchor.fm/mattcox ⁣ ⁣ Check out my true crime books! ⁣ Shark in the Housing Pool: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0851KBYCF⁣ Bent: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BV4GC7TM⁣ It's Insanity: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08KFYXKK8⁣ Devil Exposed: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08TH1WT5G⁣ Devil Exposed (The Abridgment): https://www.amazon.com/dp/1070682438⁣ The Program: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0858W4G3K⁣ Bailout: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/bailout-matthew-cox/1142275402⁣ Dude, Where's My Hand-Grenade?: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BXNFHBDF/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1678623676&sr=1-1⁣ ⁣ Checkout my disturbingly twisted satiric novel!⁣ Stranger Danger: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BSWQP3WX⁣ ⁣ If you would like to support me directly, I accept donations here:⁣ Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/MattCox69⁣ Cashapp: $coxcon69 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Orange in Orange County, California. I had a really good life. In the beginning of my life, it was great. My dad was a baseball coach. He was a bricklayer. He had his business. He was doing really well. As a kid, we had everything a kid could want. We had good Christmases.

We had a nice house. We lived in a great community. And then around the age of 12 years old, my parents sold the house. And at the time, I didn't understand what was going on because I was a young kid. But they sold the house. We moved into another. We rented a house down the street. So I stayed in it.

I had to change schools. It was far enough to change schools, but not really that far at all. But I had to change schools. And I met some new kids there. I still didn't understand what was going on. I was still racing bikes. And I was still just being a kid. And I met some kids in the neighborhood.

And I started hanging out, became good friends with these kids. And this was like the first experience that really, as I look back, that really made me kind of understand what was going on. So I would spend the night at this kid's house and we'd just being kids. And then one day after school, they stopped me. They weren't. But usually they wait for me after school. They didn't.

They were around the corner waiting for me. And when I get around the corner, they're all telling me I'm a drug addict. Hey, you're a cocaine sniff or you're a drug addict. And I'm like, what? And then come to find out their parents, knew my parents, new friends of my parents, and they were telling their kids, hey, his dad lost his house because of...

And at the time again, I didn't know what was going. I didn't believe it. But now these kids weren't allowed to hang out with me anymore. Right. Out to school, I was just known as a drug addict. Nobody wanted to hang out with me. Well, it was kind of being a young kid, that's kind of tough because you don't know what's going on.

So then that was like the beginning of kind of everything going bad. A few months later, my dad and my mom split up. Did you have any knowledge that they were having problems at all? Like, was it obvious arguments? Not at all. I remember that I'd wait a lot for my dad to come home on Friday to take me to race bikes. And there was always coming up. I can't go or just whatever.

I can't make it or I'm busy or things like that. But then my parents got divorced. My mom moved in with my aunt and then we moved in with my dad. and the house was a little bit more run down. It was in the same neighborhood, stayed in the same school, but it was a little bit more run down of a house in the area. And it was right behind the 55 freeway and orange

off of Sacramento Street. And there was another guy living in the back room. Me and my brother were there, and then my dad and his new girlfriend. He got a new girlfriend right away. So it was different. I still didn't know what was going on. But my friends would come over,

we'd hang out and then one night on Christmas, I mean on New Year's Eve, my dad comes out, me and my friend are listening to Records on the record player. That's how long ago this was. And he's got a white bile in his hand. And he pours them out on the table and chops up some lines and on a mirror. He does a line and then he gives it to me. He goes, go ahead, try this. Me being a kid, I'm like, the first thing I thought, though, the first thing I thought of when he was doing that was what those kids were saying. I was like, wait. Right.

But I did it, and right away I was high. I loved it. And then my friend, too. From that point on, we just started doing a lot of drugs. Along the way, I learned that my dad's roommate was selling a lot of people out of the house. It was a lot. It was all over the place. People were coming and going.

And as the weeks went by, it got worse and worse, because this is a new house. But as the weeks gone by, it was more and more. traffic, more and more people. Sometimes, he was Italian, so sometimes these people would come over to the house and we'd have to leave. These guys would come in with suits. I don't know, like, not too suited up, but they would come in, like these guys would come in, and they would have a little meeting or whatever, and then they would leave, and then we'd go back in the house. But we'd have to take up.

But that was a crazy environment for a kid being young like that. So I'd get lines for doing the dishes. I'd get lines, I'd get for Christmas, a carton cigarettes for Christmas. To wash the car, I did good in school, which was not often. That was going south fast. We just started doing a lot of drugs. The house, my dad's girlfriend was always drinking and always drunk. One time, she stabbed my dad in the leg.

And then there was a big old fight. I ended up hitting her with a two-by-four because she threw a two-by-four at the truck wind. It was out of control. I was just a kid. But I really didn't like her anyways. That's the first time I ever heard a girl and the only time I hit a girl, but I was just a kid. And then not long after that, we got kicked out of a Saturday work study. So if you get in trouble in school, I went to Sarah Bill Jr. High School.

If you get in trouble at school, you have to go to a Saturday work program where we spend eight hours all day in like detention. Well, we got kicked out. Me and my friends got kicked out of there. And what we did was we broke into the cafeteria because we were mad. and we just destroyed the place. Why did you get kicked out of the detention? I can't remember. I think it was because, for one,

the teachers didn't like us. We were the only kids in the school that had long hair. At that time, we were like, we were outcast. We were always getting in trouble. That school, Saraville, is predominantly a wealthy area because all the kids from Villa Park go to that school. You got Villa Park, and then you got the city of Orange,

which is just across from San Diego. area. And we didn't have any money for clothes like these other kids did for one. So we were dressed differently. And we were going down the wrong path now. We were on the loves. Happened. We got in trouble for talking. I think I was arguing with one of the rich kids or like that. I can't exactly remember. But we got kicked out and they kicked us all out because we were all friends. And we broke in the cafeteria and destroyed the place. I broke all the trophies, me and my buddy threw piano off the stage. And we were there all week and long, just going back and forth, party in there and just destroyed the place. Well, that Monday morning,

we went to school, the police were there, obviously, and they arrested us. They called us all and they knew it was us. And we went to juvenile hall. That was that, like, I think I was almost 14 by the time. And that was my first time being in trouble with the law. And we just spent the night there, and we were out the next day, but we were on probation. This is back in the 80s. And when I get home after getting out of juvenile hall, my dad and his roommate, they're pissed. They're pissed at you? Yeah.

And what surprised me, the more I look back at it, the real reason they were really upset about it was because I could have brought the cops to the house and got everybody. Right. You're bringing heat on a spot. Bringing heat to the pad. It's funny how these things that you think about going through the years. It's just one of the, as I was writing my book, I just, you remember a lot of things. And that was, that was the beginning of my being a criminal. I adopted all these character defects from that house, criminality, jugg-a-degg shit.

It's funny when you write a book, because it's probably the first time someone really has to sit down and chronologically go through the, the parts of their life. And it's like prior to like prior to writing my book, like I'd never done that. And like like you just said, it was probably the first time you ever sat there and kind of went like, wow, that I never put that together. Like you start putting things together that you're like, like you're a grown man. Never thought about it again. Never put it together. But then you start right, you write it out and you're like, fuck. Like that that like that's like why did he do that?

You know what I'm saying? You start thinking that. Why would someone say that? And yet, just as a regular adult, most people just never review their life the way you do when you write a book. And then since you did that, you'll understand what I'm going to say right here. So, and then you start remembering all these things that you never remembered before. You start remembering all these scenarios, all these events that happened that you totally forgot about because after you ride all day or if you sit there at night and you're thinking and then pops in your head. And you start remembering all these different events that happened in your life.

And yeah. I remember that house. I'm not going to say it was all bad times because I grew up there. We had a lot of fun. But eventually that drug addiction just took over my life. And I never, ever thought it would end up like it did. But when you're on drugs, you really don't think. And you don't grow up.

As a kid, you don't grow up if you're using drugs. You never become responsible. If you don't have the right guidance, you just go down a dark path. I remember a few times going to the probation department because I'd have to go every month to see the probation officer. My dad would be driving down the street and he'd have us a little mile on him and he was like cap it on the steering wheel and give me a little bit before we call a probation officer.

And I think back on that now, like, and it's crazy. How old were you? At that point. You have time, around 14. That went on for about a couple of. a year and a half, two years living in that house. I just remember just all the drugs. And I didn't really understand what it would do to me,

but it definitely changed me. And not only that, I could say that for my friends too, right, they had good families. But them hanging around with me, it kind of destroyed them too. Right One of my friends Ended up Committed suicide

Later in life Another one died Of an overdose A couple of them They're still They're doing good But and then Not too long after

A while later My dad's house got raided My mom got me out of the house Like a week before it happened Because I guess my mom was here Oromers about Whatever was going on And a week after I moved out of the house

The house got raided And they took everybody to jail of course. So that I lived with my mom for a while, and then once again, she lost the place. So we went back and forth, but my mom couldn't keep a place because my dad didn't pay child support or whatever was going on. And my dad ended up getting an apartment off LaSalle Street in Orange by Shiafer Park, and I ended up moving back in with him and his girlfriend.

And now he didn't know where to kick like I did, because me and my friends, not only we were getting from the house, but when we couldn't, when they wouldn't give it to us, we'd go to Santa Ana to score from San Anna. It's a, Santa Ana is like, oh, it's a gang infested area in Orange County. It's like L.A. So now my dad would have me go score on Fridays or during the week or whenever he wanted it. And there was times when, like, it'd be Friday night. My friends would be here to pick me up.

I'd just waiting for my allowance so I can go out and have fun and party or whatever. and he'd be like, hey, can you go to San Diego? and get some... Get some... I'm like, hey, I can. My friends are here. So I would take off, and then he would yell out. I didn't realize this once again until later in life.

He'd like, yell, hey, you're all restriction. Get back in the house. So I'd go back in the house, and you didn't take the trash out. Go to your room. So I go to my room, and I'd be like, mad, of course. And then he'd come in a few minutes later. Can you go to Sanana? Give me some cold now.

Of course I'm going to say, yeah. So I'd go down there I'd call the guy Come pick me up We drove down there Come back And my dad Give me a little

My allowance And then say okay Yeah you can go out now Right Here's I didn't really Figure it out Because the trash can was only A quarter of a way full

I mean why would you waste a bag And take it out But I didn't even realize Until later in life That he actually put no restriction For not getting him And It's crazy

So I stayed there for a little while But then after a while But then after a while, I just ran away and went and moved him with my brother. And we just did. I stopped going to school. And I ended up getting it. What were you doing to make money at this point? At this time, I wasn't really selling it.

I was just doing it. We were just whatever we could to get. I ended up back in juvenile hall for cash and stolen checks to get. I ended up back. I ended up going to YGC for 90 days after that. And then when I got out, my mom had a place in Anaheim. And then that's when I moved to Am. Anaheim.

Okay. This was a little, this was, I don't know, probably all that time. This was probably like 89 now. And Anaheim's a little bit different. At this time, around 89, 1990, the autumn was going around. That's when the speed started coming into play. And so I started doing that. And that's a whole different high.

When you do, I don't know if you've done it before, you kind of just stay in the side. You don't really do anything. I mean, some people do, but we didn't. Now I'm out on the streets. Running around the streets, running around with different types of people. And we're doing whatever we can to get that. We're stealing cans off the side of people's houses.

Like we would, in the daytime, we would, like, go around and look at people's like drive around, look at people's houses. You can see big bags of cans on the side of the houses. We'd write down the addresses. And then that night we'd come and just pick up all these cans. cans. Sometimes you made like 300 bucks a night, two, 300 bucks a night doing that. For like, what, recycling? Yeah. We'd have like bags and bags of cans. And from there, my mom, after a while, my mom just ended up kicking me out. I went to jail a few times.

I turned 18. I went to jail for not like for driving around without license and not going to court. And then, uh, once he kicked me out on the streets, that was pretty much it. What about high school? What's up? Were you still going to high school? No, I dropped out of high school when I went and lived with my brother. Oh, okay. Like eighth grade, I stopped going to school.

All right. And so now I'm at like 18 and I'm out running the streets of Anaheim. I start meeting different people on the streets. I'm doing, now I'm selling, doing whatever I have to do, trying to sell them. But it's pretty tough out there. When I first started running the streets, I wasn't really at, tough kid. I was a drug addict. And being new to an area and not growing up with these people,

I could say that in the beginning, I was kind of bullied, I was taken advantage of, because I wasn't really tough. There was a few times when I was hanging out with these gang members, and they kind of took me under their wing. And what happened was, there was a few times this guy disrespected me. And after this guy left, they beat me up. And they're like, hey, you ever let somebody disrespect you like that again, and we're going to beat you up again. And this happened a couple times. And during that time, we're running around the streets.

We're still in car stereos. We start getting shot at, and it starts getting pretty serious. And I learned that if I'm ever going to want to have anything on the streets, or if I'm ever going to make it, I'm going to have to toughen up. Are you a big kid? Were you a big kid?

Are you a big kid? No, right now I'm like six feet tall. But I was a- I'm five foot six. Yeah. What are you talking about? You weren't a tough kid. But all the way tall I was 17 years old, I was like 4-11.

Like I was a small kid. Like, and I've always been skinny. I mean, the only reason right now is because I work out. Like, right. I just bench 310 pounds last week. I'm in the gym every day. 51. At 50, I'll be 53 November.

Oh, 53. Oh. Yeah, but and I still can't gain weight. I'm like 190 pounds. I'm stuck there. I'm strong. I can't run to save my lives because my knees are so messed up, but I could bench 300 pounds.

If you can bench 310 pounds, you don't have to run. But the thing is, is that for me, the gym is my, holds my sanity. That, and I go to church. But anyways, we're getting shot at here and there. And then what happened next is what I never thought would happen. I started carrying a gun. Right. seen a lot of crazy things start happening.

This guy I know ended up getting murdered. He was friends of some other people that I knew. And in the back of my mind, if he can get killed, I can too. And it just changed everything. And then one day just snapped in me. And I was just like the rest of them. I was shooting at people. And I was just out of control.

I lost my way, pretty much. So when you say shooting at people, like, I mean, what do you mean, an argument with someone? Yeah, like, I'll give me an example. This is before I ended up going to prison for, I got shot, I got caught shot shooting two people in 95. But this is before, like a year before that. We were having problems. Me and my buddy were selling drugs, a lot of drugs, but we were running around the streets and we had some problems with these guys. I ended up shooting out one of their friends.

So what happened was we rented a room at this house. And we were selling drugs to sell drugs at it. The first night we're there, this happened. So this guy shows up and he wants to buy an ounce of money. And I'm like, all right. Well, hey, tell him to come in. He's like, no, he don't want to. I'm like, all right.

So I got my gun. I go out there with the ounce. And I tell him, hey, give me the money. He's like, no, give me the dope first. And I show him, my God. I go, if I wanted your money, I'd just take it right now. So he throws the money out of the sea. It's a big water cash.

I picked the money up for the on the passenger seat and he just takes off and in my mind I'm like what's going on here so I started shooting at him this is right at Disneyland

like in the middle of the daytime right by Disneyland right by the Jack and Jill Hotel it's not there anymore but and then I go in the house and I tell the girl hey why is your friend shooting at me and then I go in the room shut the door and clips like dude what are you doing I go dude count the money

or the money's fake I don't know what's going on so he counted the money and it's $5 short But in the back of my mind, I'm like, why is this dude taking off like that? And that's how it's become. Hey, real quick, just wanted to let you guys know that we're looking for guests for the podcast. If you think you'd be a good guest, you know somebody, do me a favor. You can fill out the form. The link is in our description box.

Or you can just email me directly. Email is in the description box. So back to the video. When you were interviewed by Johnny Mitchell, he was talking about it. He's like, at that point, like, you've got like that attic. brain, everything is just reactive or you're not really thinking, you don't have the ability to think problem solved. Yeah. I'm saying? You're, you're reactionary to everything. You thought I just got ripped off. Yeah. Just like what's going on here. For $5.00. Yeah. Or the money's fake. I didn't

know. And then my buddy was like, dude, because there's all stuff like that was always happening. And I was always like doing stuff like that. And that's how I just got out of control. And we ended up getting kicked out of that house that night. They're like, yeah, you guys can't be here. But that started a little bit of problems. That was a whole, because you got different cliques running around in Anaheim and Orange County. So, and then a while later, I'm on the phone with my buddy that was at the house. He was now back in prison.

And I was talking to him on the phone at this house. And this girl was there. And one of their friends got in a high-speed chase and got killed in the, you know, crash and got killed and was getting chased by the police. and I was telling Cliff about him, we kind of laughed. We didn't know that we didn't care about the guy, but we just kind of laughed about it. So the girl was friends with all these guys. She went back and told all her friends,

told all her friends with your guys. So they're calling my friends, they're calling my friends and telling them, telling them, hey, we're going to get Chris. And one of my friends, it's funny because one of my friends told him, like, if you go after him, he's way too smart, he's going to shoot you. And sure enough, a couple months, later, I'm with this girl, and I pull up to this apartment complex.

And there's a bunch of guys out there. I don't recognize them. I don't know who they are. I don't recognize them. But I got my gun. She goes up there to take care of them. And then these guys leave. And then she calls me up there.

So I go up there and I'm sitting on the couch. And then these guys, those same guys come in the apartment and they're looking at me and I realized who they were. It's all these guys' friends who say they're going to get me. There's like seven of them. And then they just look at me like, all right. And then they take off. So I tell the girl that I'm there with him.

I'm like, hey, we're leaving right now. And she's like, what's fine? But we got to get out of here. And then the guy in the back room, he's an older guy, all tatted up. You could tell he's been to prison. And he goes, hey, those guys, they're going to get you if you leave here. Just stay here. I'm like, look, man, you got kids here.

I go, I don't want to cause any problems here, but I'm telling you right now. I'll shoot these guys. I wanted to get out of there. For me, my best survival for me at that time is to get out of there as quick as possible. I don't know if they're going to get guns, they got guns or whatever, but I'm not waiting around for, but I'm not calling the cops. So we're leaving. So we start leaving, and there's like seven guys at the bottom of the stairs. And I tell the girl that I'm with her, just go get in the car.

They're not going to mess with you. So she goes, she goes in front of me, she gets in the car. And I'm at the bottom of the stairs. I got my hands in my hand in my pocket. And I'm like, hey, what's up? And they're just looking at me. They don't say nothing. And I'm sitting there for awkward for a few,

seconds, I just walk off. So once I get in the car, I shut the door, they rush the car and they're like hitting me through the window, trying to hit me through the window. And I'm just like, what the hell? Well, then they start opening the door, so I just pull up my gun and I start shooting. And that was it. And then she's freaking out. She thinks they're shooting at us. She stalls the car. So I get out of the car and everybody's gone, but one guy, he's kind of like crawling away on the concrete. And I just turned them over. I'm like, he's stupid, like, you stupid fucker? I carry gun because everybody's out

this on Friday night there's people everywhere and I knew at that point it was over there's no way of getting away with this so she's all still freaking out so I go back

getting the car tell her to get in the passenger seat and we take off not even five minutes later the police page me on my pager telling me I should come turn myself

and it's over so I tell her hey we're going to go to my friends house we'll paint your car they're going to be looking they're going to be looking for this car. So we went, painted the car, and if that was it, I was on the run.

From the next two months, I was just running the streets. They were raiding houses looking for me. Every place that I'd been, they were raiding that house looking for me. And then eventually, I was at my buddy's house because my motorcycle, the chain had broke, and I was changing the chain on my GSXXR 750. I was driving around his car. And I had a terrible feeling like, I'm like, something's wrong. You get intuition.

So I didn't even like bleed the clutch because on a GSXR back then I didn't really, I took the chain all the way off and happened with the clutch and it needed to be bled. And I just didn't do it. I didn't even know how to do it. All I knew was that I was having a bad feeling. So I had the chain on and I just used the starter and pushed it out in the driveway, hit the starter, and it got me going. As soon as I get to the end of the driveway, there's unmarked cars coming from both directions.

seem coming. And that was it. It was high-speed chase. And Well, how long did that go on? I mean, when you, high-speed, and you're on a, but you're on a motorcycle. Yeah, yeah. But the problem with it is, is that I don't know if you ride a motorcycle, but your clutch is your best friend. That's what you use this. Right. Down shifting and front brakes. But if you're going too fast and you hit those brakes too hard, you're done. If you use your back, if you use your back break, that's going to be a problem too. So here I am in a high-speed chase. doing 110, 100 miles an hour through Anaheim during lunchtime.

And I ended up coming around a corner. And now I'm doing about 80, 90 miles an hour, and a crossing guard comes out. Signed. And I kind of clipped him. And I crashed. And I slid far on my elbows. I mean, it messed me up. But I ended up running a little bit and, like, ran up some stairs and some office building

and kicked the door down. It was a janitor's closet. I just kicked the door down, shut the door, and let a cigarette. The helicopter was already above me because I remember during the high-speed chase, the gear shifter fell off. I didn't even have time to tighten it. I just knew I had to get out of there. I had a crazy feeling like something was going to happen. So the gear shifter fell off as I'm flying down the street.

So I had to pull over. And when I pulled over, I ditched the cops. That was not a problem. But then I heard the helicopter above me. And I, yeah, so they were, it was over. And then they came and kicked down the door, like seven guns in my face. and that was it. They took me into jail.

And the funny thing is, is that, because you shoot somebody, attempted murder, that's a life sentence. So I'm thinking I'm getting a life sentence here. And it's over. But the- You're saying in California,

that's a life sentence? I don't, in California, yeah, for attempted murder like that, it's a life sentence. You get 25 to life for that. And I shot two people at the time. But they were two people

that were attacking you. Yeah, I get that. See, this is the, this is where, this is what I'm going to talk about right now. So the investigators were like, dude, you should just turn yourself in. I'm thinking to myself, he goes, they said they started the whole thing. And I'm thinking to myself, what are you talking about?

But when I get to court, they offered me six years, 85% with two strikes for aggravated assault of the firearm. I'm like, right. I signed. Like, yeah, I'm out of here. And you hadn't, you, I've been just jail several times. I've been to jail several times, but no, I haven't been to prison. Okay. But I signed for that two strikes.

So now I got two strikes. I'm going to prison with two strikes. One of the dangerous prison systems in America. And I'm off. 24 years old, going to prison. And it didn't even take long for me to end up on a level four prison. I think within six months I was on the craziest yards in California. But I was able to make it through it without getting struck out because and then you get caught with a little bit of mad.

or knives or stabbing, they strike you out. It's a violent strike. You're done. It's 25. They charge you again in prison for drugs. I almost got in trouble. I almost got caught a few times. No, I'm saying the question is, if you had been caught in prison with a little bit of drugs

or they would charge you with a felony in prison, then you'd never get out. It happens all the time. I've seen dudes all the time going with two strikes and not come out. By the grace of God, I left out during that time in prison. there's some strange things that happened. I see some crazy. My first time walking onto the level four yard there at Old Corcoran, there's two northerners stabbing another northerner.

Right before, we're just getting off the bus. That was my first experience on a level four yard. That was on B yard. And I went through some crazy situations. I almost got caught with knives several times. I almost got caught with a bunch of times. But I was able to make it through that. And by the time my six years was up, I had a pretty good head on my shoulders.

I was clean. I was pretty healthy. And I knew that if I did make it out and I did get in trouble, I'd get a life sentence. Because back then in 2002, if you get caught with a little bit of a misconduct or any felony, that's a third strike. They're going to give you life of grism. And when I got out, I thought that I would never use drugs again because I knew that, you know. that it would be over. Well, that didn't happen.

I did good for a couple months. I started hanging around with my old friends. And not long after that, I was selling drugs again. And this time, I was selling a lot of them. I was a little bit wiser, of smarter now. And I had a better head on my shoulders. And I was selling a lot of drugs. I was going from state to state selling drugs.

It doesn't sound like you had a better head on your shoulder. Selling drugs. But back in the 90s. In a state. I'm in a state that will give you already. Let me finish my same. On game day, pain can hit

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plus acetaminopin. Advil, the official pain relief partner of the NFL. Ask your pharmacist at this products rate for you. Always read and follow the label. So back to, back in the 90s, I was just crazy. I was just, I was just didn't, I was just crazy. I was working for people, pretty much

running around with people that were selling drugs and I was doing all the crazy stuff along with that. And now I was more, I could say that I was just a little bit more reserved. I wasn't out there. How old were you? Now I was 30 years old. I wasn't out there looking for looking for trouble like I was.

I was selling a lot of drugs and I started shooting up when I got out. And I was shooting it up. And the crazy thing is is that what I would do in the morning when I got up is I would get up in the morning I'd make a list of everything I have to do to make sure that I did it.

And then I would shoot up and then I would go do all that stuff and then whatever else happened after that but didn't matter. But it was crazy. I would take off the eye. Idaho and I would bring a bunch of drugs out there. First I'd stop in Lake Havasu, but I'd get like six or seven outfits and load them up with speed and I would just drive all the way there.

I'd have an SKS on the back seat with a towel over it, fully automatic, and I would just have a bunch of things and I would just go. And I did that for months back and forth. And luckily I didn't get caught out of state, but what eventually ended up happened was because I would only stay in California for like. 24 hours, do what I had to do and then get out because I knew that the cops would be looking for me or they would hear or whatever. You just don't know.

We have cell phones now. They can track that stuff. And one time I stayed too long. I stayed. I couldn't get out of there because I had to meet my connection and I couldn't get out of there. So now I'm here. Now I'm going on two days. And sure enough, I leave in the hotel room.

I got a Glock 45, several ounces of me. And then here we go again. cops, unmarked cars, you know. How are they getting, how do they get on to you? Was it controlled by or? No, no. I think that, yeah, I don't really know, but previous to this, my buddy got pulled over one of my rented cars and there was a tech nine in the back and a bunch of stuff. And he got pulled over in the car and had my name in it.

Well, the cops called me. These are South County sheriffs. They called me and said, hey, we got your car over here. You want to come get it? They know how I'll parole. I'm prolly at large. I'm like, no, I'm cool, man. But I told him, I go, yeah, all that stuff's mine. I was just fun out.

And because my buddy, I didn't want my buddy to get charged, which he did anyways. But I told him before he left, I go, dude, there's tech nine in the back. You get in trouble because he's already out on bail. I go, dude, you get pulled over with this. You're done it. And I think this house is being watched where I was at. And they were expecting me to leave in that car. Well, I left on my motorcycle, because my motor cycle.

because my motorcycle was in the garage. So I jumped on my motorcycle because I always have motorcycles. And I jumped on my motorcycle and took off. They didn't know it was me. So when he got in the car and left, they pulled him over and he got busted with that stuff. But those same cops are the ones that busted me.

So they were out looking for me or whatever. And they ended up surrounding me. And they already know since I ran last time, I'm going to run this time too. So the helicopter was already there. I was in a rent-a-car again, and I take off. I got a clock 45 and several ounces of them. I'm in another high-speed chase.

I was careful not to hit nobody because I didn't want a violent strike, but last time I didn't care. But this time, I didn't hit nobody, but I ended up, you know, dumping the car, jumping some fences. It was pouring in pools to get rid of it. And then I balanced, I jumped on a block wall, walked along the wall because the helicopter was on me with the light.

As soon as the light went off me, I balanced a gun on a tree branch, jumped off the wall, jumped over another fence, and there were cops there. There were like seven guns on my face again. I got down, and he put me in the car. That was it. The police investigators came and seen me the next day and said, hey, we found your gun. I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about.

I just walked out. I was done. I knew I was still kind of high and still coming off the streets, so I didn't realize the magnitude of what was going on, but it was funny because the police report said that the girl was picking lemons out of her tree the next day. The gun fell out of the tree. Yeah, that house. And the gun fell out of the tree and landed in a bucket.

Whether that's true or not, I don't know. That's how they're going to say that. Obviously, the gun didn't touch the ground. It was obviously hid. But since, so now I'm fighting a three, they're trying to give me 107 years of life now. So I spent, I don't know, six, eight months. and the county jail. And at the end, I was trying to get the Romero Act.

And the Remarrow Act is where they strike a strike. And they give you like 10 years. And they give you another chance. That's if you plead guilty. So I tried to do that. I was going to plead guilty to 107 years to life. Because 28 to life and 107 years to life at that point, you're never getting out anyways at that time.

So you might as well try it. So I pled guilty. and I didn't get the Romero Act. But instead of 107 years, they gave me 28 to life. And I was off to prison again. So what is 28? I mean, I've only done federal time. So 28 years to life means you have to do 28?

Yeah, before you're eligible for parole. So it's a lot. But at that time, at that time when you went to parole, I don't care if you have seven to life. You could do 40 years on a seven to life, which there's people that are in there. For four, was there on seven of life and been in there 40 years because they just deny you every time you go into the board of prison terms. So I'm never, what doesn't matter once you get life, you're never getting out.

I don't care who or how much money you have. You're not getting out. So that's it. I'm done. I'm off to prison. It's a weird feeling. Okay. And you're thinking what?

In 28 years, I'm going to go in front of the parole board and maybe? No. Or you're just thinking I'm done. You're done. That's it. Okay. Yeah. That's why people sometimes, the Johnny Mitchell saw, a couple of people said, oh, life sentences, how's he out?

Or whatever. You got a life sentence, how's he out? Well, they change laws for one. Right. But 28 to life means you do 28 years. But that's if you get no trouble. It depends on what happens during all that time, too. You can get more life sentences for stabbing.

You can get whatever happens in prison. When you're on these crazy yards, you don't know what's going to happen. But definitely me, at that time, they were not letting anybody out. So, yeah, that was it. And it's a weird feeling getting a life sentence. You see, like, I've been to prison where people have life sentences, and you see them in there, and they're going through the days. They're never getting out.

And I've had Selleys that were lifers. And I remember one guy telling me, an older homeboy telling me an old Corker before I've ruled, he goes, just remember this, I'm telling you right now. If you ever use it again, what the door sounds? like when it shuts in your cell, that's what you're going to be hearing for the rest of your life. I'm like, yeah, I'm never going to use drugs again. But I never forgot that, especially after I got in trouble again.

I'm like, dude, that's it. Yeah, so I went through, I'd just get up in the morning, I'd work out, I'd go to the days and just kind of just do my thing. People say, I don't know how you do a life sentence. Well, you have to. Once you get a life sentence or once you get, you got to deal with it. You got to adapt. Yeah, I had a guy. when this was when I just got locked up and I was this is when I thought I was going to get like 10 years.

Yeah. And I was sitting there thinking and I go, man, I don't I don't think I can. I don't locked up for a few months. Yeah. And I go, I think I can, I don't think I can do this. And I just been locked up. I was in the U.S. Marshall's holdover. I hadn't been sentenced. Nothing. I just got locked up. Yeah. And I'm like, I don't think I can do this. I remember the guy goes, he goes, well, the good thing is like you don't have to. And I went, well, I go, I'm immediately, what do you mean? And he goes, they're going to make you do it. Because all you have to do is keep yourself entertained. You know what I'm saying?

He's like, he's like, you don't have to, don't worry about, don't worry about whether you can. They'll make you do it. I was like, you're going to. I remember thinking it was a dick thing to say, but the truth is he didn't mean it like that. I'm saying. He was just like, look, like stop focusing on that. Like you hear these little bits of things that happen when you're locked up. People say stuff. They say it harshly, but they don't mean it that way.

Yeah. And you realize there are little bits of wisdom that you get. And he was right. Like I'm going to stop focusing on it. Like, I had a buddy who said, listen, he said, 80% of my time is just keeping myself entertained. Yeah. That's it. He said the 20% is just the stuff you have to do.

Go to chow, take a shower, walk the wreck yard. He's like the rest of it's reading, watching movies, playing cards or whatever these guys. Like, you adapt. So you adapt? Yeah. Or you're miserable. You got guys that are just miserable. Or then you got guys that just killed themselves.

Yeah. I've seen that happen. Seeing guys shoot up a bunch of heroin and just get it over with. Yeah, I'm too much of a narcissist to do that. Like I'm going to, I'm going to get through this just out of spite. Yeah. Well, the thing is, is after a while, you just get used to it. You get used to the violence.

You just get used to it. You become numb to it. And you just go through the days and maneuver through all the, bull crap. I started doing and started doing school a little bit about 10 years in. Even though I was getting out, I started doing these

classes, self-help, because they started doing all that stuff in like 2012. And I remember my cellie telling me, I don't know why you're doing that stuff. You're never getting out. We're never getting out. We're never getting it. We both had life sentences. He's like, we're never getting out. We're just doing a bunch of morphine and snored

because they're giving it to us at the time through medical. They're just giving everybody morphine for knee pain or whatever kind of pain there is. The epidemic was just like it was on the streets. It was in there. The doctors were just giving that stuff out. But I told him, I go, I don't want to just sit in here. Like, I'm going to do something.

And I think I did it a lot too for my daughter so she could see that I was trying to be a better person. But in the back of my mind, I was still using. I remember that. And then I just thought to myself one day, I'm going to write a book. I was going to write a book. I started writing a book. And I did with a pencil, piece of paper,

and a typewriter. Didn't have word or nothing like that. I did it with a pencil, a piece of paper, typed it out. It would have been a lot better if I had word. I'll say that.

Because I had to rewrite everything. Every time I'd like I said myself, I'd think of something at night I'd have to go through and just rewrite that whole chapter just to put one thing in there that I thought. And I wrote it. I tried to get it published,

but they weren't doing that. I finished around 2013 or 14. Was this your book about you? Yeah, about my life. Orange County, I didn't know the, if, I didn't know if that was the first one you wrote. Yeah, this is the only one I wrote. Okay.

But I'm planning on writing another one. I just haven't figured out exactly what I'm going to do yet. But it's, it's a, it's a challenge. Yeah. Because we had in, at Coleman, the, in the federal facility, I was in a, at the medium and at the low. they had like core links is it's like the email system yeah they probably have it in state in California right like you can email do now they got all that as soon as I paroled they got all this texting free phone calls but that literally happened right after I paroled where they

they got tablets and all that I did the same thing you did I wrote everything out and then I would type it into the corlink system like I was going to send an email but you could save your emails as for a few weeks. Yeah. I think like 30 days. And that would allow me to, then I could print it. So I'd print out the chapters and I'd go give it to people and have them read it.

And then they would come back and say, you misspelled this. This is a run on sentence. Yeah. They would correct it. And then I'd go back and I could make the changes. And then I would email it to somebody on the street and they would cut and paste it into word. But I mean, it was such a so. a pain in the ass. But the same thing. I wrote on the legal pads. You had to buy them from

commissary or steal them out of unicorn. Yeah. You have just something. It's, it's a horrible, horrible way to go about doing it. And the thing too that I all my life, I told myself, I can't do this. I'm a drug addict. I got ADHD. I can't do school. I can't. I can't. That was my big thing. And then here I go. I start going to college, start passing all these classes, wrote a book. And I did. didn't even know how like my spelling wasn't even good like I didn't use like there over there and then over I didn't even understand all that but I learned a lot I learned dialogue how to write dialogue I learned all that stuff all this stuff I said I could never do I did I ended up getting an

AA degree later on did did you ever did you ever get to that point where you thought prison was like a gift um in the end yeah you know you know Because, like, I mean, some guys, like, you, let's face it, you might have had another six months on the street and been dead. Yeah. You see what I'm saying? It saved my life. It saved my life.

There's no doubt about it. I would, it saved some, or save somebody else's life. Let's just put it that way. Because either I was going to end up shooting somebody again, or I was going to end up getting shot. But one thing I could say is that I was pretty, I never went to a situation where I knew I couldn't win. I just, I didn't trust nobody.

It lets me really close to me. But I never put myself in a situation where there was a thought that I could lose. And if there was, I would leave and come back later and then deal with it. I was just like that. I developed running around early on on the streets. I learned quickly of what not to do, who not to trust, which is nobody that you don't know, and to always be ready. I always had my gun loaded.

I always had the safety on to where I could just turn it off and that's it. And I went with that thing everywhere. And I lived like that. I lived like that for years in prison. You can't really hide or nothing in prison, but I always, I just always looked out for myself and my friends for that matter.

But yeah, writing that book, I learned a lot about myself during that time. I started remembering a lot of things growing up on what triggered me and all these events that happened in my life that eventually changed me. And then I went to a level two because they changed the point system in California. I ended up on a level two prison. And they took me off the...

Because I was on for like three or four years. They took me up the... And that just crashed me. And I started using math and selling me in prison. I was running around like I was on the streets and ended up in the hole. and I woke up in ad seg it was like 2015

during that time though at that prison I did do my electrical vocation so that was good even though I was high I still did my vocation and I still was doing all these things but the mess up ended up taking over and I ended up in ad seg and I woke up in ad seg

just like 2015 and I woke up it was my daughter's birthday and I was like I don't want to do this one more like I just I don't want to be on the because come on a minute because come on it. I don't know if you've ever done it or heard about it, but it's terrible. And I've been, at this time, I've been using the opiates for like four or five years.

And I just didn't want to do any of that no more. I didn't want to die in prison being a scumbag. At this time, I'm still like never getting out. In the back of my mind, they're talking about letting people out. It's happening, but I don't go to board until 2013. So by then, I just, I just didn't want to die in prison being a scumbag. I wanted to be somebody my daughter could be proud of, my family, my mom, and I'd made a decision. I'd just beg God, like, hey, the next place I go to, I'm going to get myself involved in all these groups

and hang out with these people because a lot of people started doing groups at the time. So when I went to High Desert State Prison, I started going to these groups and hanging around with these people and learning all sorts of stuff about myself, about victims' impact, CGA. and it changed me. What's the G. What's the A? Criminals, Gangs Anonymous. Okay.

It's like NA, but it's for gang members. Okay. There's a lot of different sections in there, but the one that really helped me understand about myself, what's a lifestyle of addiction. So what the lifestyle addiction is, is that you get addicted to being a criminal, to commit crime.

Starts off low, and it just escalate. It becomes easier and easier. Then you start carrying a gun, and then you start shooting people, and then that because it just becomes like nothing. It's the escalation of violence, escalation of criminality, all that. And you become addicted to that, more than you do drugs, running around the streets. And I didn't realize that I didn't, so, like, when I first got out in 2002,

like before I started using drugs, I was selling them. I was selling drugs before I started using them. It's that lifestyle of addiction comes into play. Selling drugs and running around, doing all. That's just as addicting as a drug. You get the excitement. It's fun. Not all the time, but it's fun.

And then I learned that. Not only was I a drug addict, but I was addicted to that lifestyle. And you take a lot out of these, you don't take a lot out of these groups, but you're able to pull out of each group that helps you change. And that was one of the things that I learned that.

The lifestyle addiction is pretty serious. Anybody that is listening right now that has been through that, they understand that. I don't think it's just because, I mean, for me, like, I've never been an addict. I mean, so I don't know. But, I mean, as far as like the addiction to, so I don't know about addiction to drugs, but that makes sense to me. I had taken a program called ARDAP in federal prison. It's for a residential drug treatment program, right?

Yeah. But listen, they almost never talk about drugs at all. It's really a behavior modification program. And they focus on that kind of antisocial disorder, which is really just being a criminal. And it is, it's all about addiction to criminality, to committing crimes, to the feeling, that feeling of entitlement, that feeling of beating the system of, and people ask me, every once while I'll, I do a podcast and people will ask me like, go, so do you ever think about it anymore? I'm like all the time. Like, I'm telling you right now. Like, I'll see an abandoned house

because a lot of my stuff was real estate fraud. And my first thought is like, where are the owners? Like, would they notice it like if I, is anybody monitoring the title? Like, like, is anybody monitoring the title? Like, and I think about it all the time. You find you, you, you, you come across somebody's information, I think, man, would they know. Like, could you, could I have a credit card? Could you fill out a credit application and have their credit card mail to their house? If you could, they're right down the street. You could just wait down the street when the, you could have a credit card like overnight and stuff.

Like, it immediately goes through my mind before I can even stop myself and go, what are you doing? Like, your life is so good out here. Yeah. Why would you even entertain that? But it happens so quickly. Yeah. But by the time I've cycled through the whole thing, it's already cycled through. And then I say, what are you doing?

But it's, it's, it's, it's a, it's a bad situation. Yeah. Yeah. So I've seen this thing on Instagram or TikTok where it has this dog with a sad face. And it says the dog's watching, essentially what it's saying is, me watching somebody do crime and make money while if I do it I know God will make an example out of me. Have you seen that? Yeah, yeah. And they're doing it and getting away with it. But I know if I do it, but I know if I do it, I'll go to chill. Yeah. Yeah, I just, yeah.

One more thing I want to tell you if this, you ever think about this? It's the idea of, for me, committing fraud is so comforting that if I'm laying in bed and I, I can't. And this happened more when I was in prison because I sleep now I go right to bed. I'm done because I'm now I'm old. When I was in prison and I would be laying in bed and couldn't quite go to sleep. And so I would lay there and I would start in my mind, I'd start planning a fraud. He did a scam of some kind. And it was so overwhelmingly comforting within three or four minutes straight to sleep, straight to sleep. Oh, that's true. Like that's not normal. That's not normal behavior.

Yeah. Yeah. That's fucking. I just For me I think about it too bro like And it's just It's just part of our It's embedded in us

That's what I'm saying It's like Becoming a good person And becoming a good citizen It's like growing up all over again That's what I was told A long time ago When I started this journey

And recovery It's like growing up all over again Not being a criminal And just But I'm doing well And so good out here Dude it's great dude but even though like you said you're still in the back of your mind you're still like

all these thoughts come into your head it's just it's just there it's like it's like being the alcoholic thing where they say well like you're you're you're you're still an alcoholic you're just you're just I'm just not going to do it today I'm saying like there is you're it's like they're it's like they're not like they're cured no no I'm just in recovery I'm just not and that's kind of how I feel it's like yeah I'm just it's not I'm not saying hey I'm a wonderful person but I'm going to be a decent person today yeah like I always tell people like, I know that I won't use, because I know if I use a, they'll pick up a gun and I'll end up in prison in that order. And you hurt whoever along the way, create victims and all that.

So I just, for me, it's really easy for me not to use drugs because I know that it's over. My life is so good right now. I got, I just, I'm very blessed. I'm very grateful to be out. And I have good friends. my family, I get to go see my family, get to see my daughter. And I never thought I could have a life like this. I just thought all those years that it was just never going to happen.

For one, I thought my life was just over, let alone being out, I'm off parole. I got up parole about six months ago. I'm totally free. Right. Well, let's jump back to that. So you were in prison and you were taking the classes. I got you off. I think I got off on a tangent.

But you were taking the classes and you were taking little bits and pieces away from the different classes. You've written the book, and so what happens? I mean, you're Sally saying we're both life. Yeah, that was in the prison before that. But now I'm sold up with my buddy, Danny Federico, and he's going to all these groups.

And he's pretty smart. But I just started changing. I was still me, like you said, you're still in prison. But you just maneuvering through all the bull crap, and you're just going to groups, going to work. Since I did that electrical, vocation. As soon as I got to that prison, they put me in maintenance. So I was a stationary engineer working in the boiler room, doing all the age back, doing one of the highest paid

inmates in the facility. I actually was. I was making like $100 a month, which is a lot of money. Yeah. Usually it's like 16 cents an hour. But then they started talking about this law, Prop 57, where if you're a non-violent three striker, you have action to go in the board and getting out, no matter how much time you have left. Well, as long as you got 15 years or more in, if you can make it through the board of prison terms, they're going to let you out. And again, I'm just like, yeah, you hear, I've been hearing stuff ever since I started. They're going to change the three strikes law.

They're going to change this. Or they would change it and it wouldn't apply to me because I got caught with the gun and the commission of a crime, all these other, you hear all this stuff. So, but still, I'm just going through. I'm clean. I'm sober. I'm just going through the days. and next thing COVID hit.

This is 2000. 20. 21. Yeah, was it? Six months before that or something like that? 2020. I think it was 2020. Yeah.

So. I could be wrong. Anyway, during that time we're stuck in ourselves, I get a slip in the mail. Says, hey, you're going to board. Within six months, you're going to the board. I'm like, what? And I was kind of preparing because I've heard all this stuff,

but you just don't believe it. And then next thing I get that piece of paper, so I did everything I could to make sure that I had a chance of getting out. But in the back of my mind, I'm thinking, there's no way I'm going to make it through this board. It's very difficult to make it to the board of prison terms. I've seen several people go and get denied that were really smart people. And so I did everything I could.

Even though in the back of my mind, I was thinking this is not going to happen. If these give me a three-year denial the first time and then bring me out, then they'll let me out because now they're letting people out. It's happening. And even though my board date wasn't supposed to be until 2013, the law stated, as long as you got 15 years or more and you're a non-violent three striker,

you have a chance of getting out. Now, my controlling case, I shot two people, that was violent. My prior, my prior was, I shot two people, I was violent, but my controlling case was non-violent because I didn't hurt nobody, it was just selling drugs. So I was eligible for the law. And I went to board and I got town suitable on my first time.

And I was out 2022. How long? So I got three, two questions. One, one is when you were headed, when you were about to go to the board, did you tell anybody or were you? Well, everybody, everybody knows. Oh, did it? Everybody knows. Because it's like, I've seen guys that they don't say anything.

when they're about to get released because people get jealous. People are petty. Yeah. Listen. I really haven't ever ran into that. Maybe I just didn't know because they didn't know. But usually everybody knows when you're getting out. Okay.

Again, once you get found suitable, it still takes four months to get out because it's got to go through all the proper channels. And then the governor's got to sign it. You still have to see. Once you get found suitable, the governor still has to say, okay, yeah, this guy's not a threat to society. he let him go. But that was the longest four months of my life because anything can happen during that time. You get a little ride up for not locking your door. Just several things can happen.

But that was the longest four months of my life. I was stressed out. And I got out in 2022. I went to L.A. We went to a transitional housing unit. And that's where it started. What's the transitional? Is that like a halfway house?

Yes, a halfway house. But transitional housing housing. housing is people that are getting out of prison. They want you to be in an environment where they can watch you. You have to stay there for at least six months. Everybody has a life sentence

unless they have a place to go or it's just, I don't know. I don't think, I'm pretty sure that everybody has to go because they have, they want to watch you for six months and keep an eye on you. Some are really strict. You can't leave. You can't have a phone. You can't have nothing

for the first 90 days. The place I went to was ARC in LA and I was allowed to have a phone, get a car, do whatever. I like to get better that way because you got to acclimate back into society. And the only way to do that is to get right in and do it. Did they take a portion of your check? No. Like if you were working? No, they don't take nothing.

You don't have to pay anything. But they actually take your money. Like if you're worth, when you start working, they take half your paycheck and they save it for you. Okay. So when your time's up, you have money to get a place and move out. Right. I immediately started working for picking up trash for Caltrans. They have this program called CEO.

And so I was, you work three days a week. Then Monday and Friday you have off and to do whatever, to go to groups or go counseling. But you can only work there for like 70 working days. And then once that's over, by then you should have a job and you move on. So the next people that are getting out can come to the program. I already knew what I was going to do, though, because I wanted to be electrician. So it only took me two months, and I ended up getting a job working as an electrician. And I've been an electrician ever since.

So, I mean, are you like a licensed electrician? No, not yet. You have to have 8,000 hours before you can become an electrician. And the hours that I had in prison, they don't count, which I have about five years in there working around electrical. but in the I don't know a couple more years 8,000 hour

8,000 did you how much say 8,000 hours that's ridiculous that's a long time four years that's not really there's not really

there's a lot to learn in four years and a lot of people they can't pass that test I know electricians that have been doing this forever they cannot pass that test it's not easy

in the California to get your journeyman's card to pass that test it's not easy in other states you can pretty much buy your license or you can get five contractors to say okay yeah this guy's good you get it for like five hundred dollars and then that's probably florida state of california it's not happening

like that you got to take this test and you got to be able to answer a hundred questions and you get three minutes per question to answer these questions and you got to like they'll give you a question you got to look in the code book find it answer the question it's not easy i know a lot of good electricians that are really smart that haven't been able to pass it. Maybe they're not studying hard enough. I don't know what it is, but it's not an easy thing to do or everybody would have one because there's a bunch. I don't, I bet the electricians that I work with, I don't do any of them have it. And they're running, but they're running.

We're running big jobs. They're actually running a really big jobs. Like, they're running the jobs. So who's signing off on the permits and everything? Well, the, the company, you, you're working on another company. Oh, yeah. So the company's licensed.

Okay, I get it. The company's licensed. But I'm talking to have your journeyman card because by law, I think it states that I'm not sure about this, but I think for every journeyman you could have two apprentices. And in California also, they want you to have an EG card. And what that is is for apprentices that says that you're going to school. But they don't know that law in California. There would be no electricians. So, but.

I'm going to take it pretty soon and I'm going to study hard for it and I'm I could do it if I made it through the board of prison terms the thing is too is also I think that people the

I can't like for me it's hard to learn because I got ADHD but if I study hard like really hard you could do it if I got through the board of prison terms I could do anything it's it's funny because to me

like I wouldn't care about failing the test. I care about not trying to pass the test. Like if I fail it, fine. I'll take it again. I'll pass it eventually. Yeah. Like I'll, I just keep busting my ass and eventually I'm going to pass.

Some people are so afraid to fail at anything, they don't even fucking try. Yeah. And that's what I would sound telling somebody before that if you don't try, you're failing right off the bat. Right. But if you try and fail, you still succeed.

did in my book. Yeah. Because at least you try, but you got to really, you got to really put effort into it. Like, I'm going to, it's going to take me hours and hours and hours of studying that book to get ready for it. And I'm going to do it. So, and I don't, go ahead. I'm sorry, go ahead. Go ahead. I'm going to do it. There's no doubt about it. And it's a huge pay raise. You make like $5 an hour. And that's just at the least once you pass that. So right now, you're working now, and you had told me before we started that you and a buddy had kind of started like a nonprofit where you wanted to kind of talk to, you wanted to talk to kids that were getting out of juvenile facilities? Well, no. So let me explain the whole thing to you.

So my buddy Ronnie Herald, we were in prison together. He just got out like three months ago, but him and his wife started this before he was getting out. He did a bunch of time too, like 26 years. It's called www. www.star-20203.org. And there's two parts to it. There's an anti-recidicism part and an at-risk youth part.

So the at-risk youth part is my part, and his part is the anti-recidicism. He wrote a book called the Encyclopedia of Self-Help. It's a big book. He spent a lot of time writing it. So what he's trying to do is he's trying to get his books into all the prisons. and then go into prisons and talk to these people

to reduce recidicism in California or anywhere for that matter. And my part is the at-risk youth. So I'm trying to get all my books into schools and then go speak at these schools. I've been to a few schools and talk to kids, but I'm trying to really get it into all the schools that I can get like five or six books into these schools

and then go into these schools and talk to these kids. And as far as I'm concerned, any kid nowadays is that. rescue because you got both parents that are working. They're not able to spend time with their kids like they used to. Any kid can end up with a friend like me with a dad like I had. If you're not keeping your kid in sports or you're not there with your kid or you're not watching them all the time, they're all running the streets.

They're out running around with their friends getting involved in who knows what. Families out there now, they don't have the money to send their kids to college. It's California and all over the country. It's just people do not have money. It's expensive out there. Right. Both have to work. My goal in five years is to be able to, when kids getting out of school,

at-risk youth or not, whoever, to get them into school to become electricians, fully paid for it. So when they get out of school, they can go to school, learn the trade, work in the trade, and then become electricians and have a lot of school. a good successful life because it's good money. Hey, sorry to interrupt the video. Just want to let you guys know that we're going to have an extra 15 or 20 minutes of content on my Patreon.

It's $10 a month for about an hour's worth of extra content every single week. Back to the podcast. Funny because I mean, I know we already talked about this, but I thought it was interesting. Is that like, look, 20, 30 years ago to be an electrician or a plumber or a framer or a framer a drywaller or a roofer any of those those trades is not a great they're not they weren't 30 years ago that was not a money making career that was a I don't have a this is the only thing I can get kind of career and you weren't you weren't making a ton of money but now these trades are making they're basically making the same money you are as a lawyer like lawyers the average lawyer I think

makes like a hundred the average lawyer in the nation on average makes like 150,000 a year people think all if you're a lawyer rich no you're not you're making about a buck 50 yeah on average yeah i'm telling right now electricians if he's been working for five or six years he's probably making over 150 these guys are making insane money it it it's not just like electricians plumbers and it's a trade that it's not like there's a ton of people going into it yeah no it's shrinking that's the problem that's the problem right now like and fewer people are entering than are actually retiring yeah and it's not like we're building fewer properties. No. We're building more properties with less people. Yeah. It's getting to be so that that dollar value is getting that the value of that job,

an hourly pay on that job is becoming insanely expensive. So those are great jobs now. Yeah. Yeah. I make a lot of money on side jobs. Like on Saturdays and Sundays, I do side jobs. Like just Friday and Saturday, we're Friday and Saturday. I made $1,000. next week in 700, maybe more. And that's including my weekly pay. But again, like, people like, how do you work? I have no choice. And plus, I like to work.

If I'm not working, I don't feel, and I'm a hard worker. I got that from my dad. Even though my dad was a drug addict, my dad was a hard worker. He was a brick mason. And I'm pretty sure I got that from him, but I work hard. And I love it. Like, I'm hyperactive, I got energy. My knees ain't what they used to be.

I'm kind of slowing down, but I love going to work, and then every day after work, I go to the gym, Monday to Friday, right after work. Go home, get my stuff, go to the gym. And I love it, dude. I love it. I love working with electrical. It's exciting. It's dangerous. But it's got to be careful.

You just got to know what to do and what not to do. And I love it. A buddy from L.A. that we were a cellies. his brother got out a few years before him and what does he do he's not a welder he's a welder he's a welder inspector yeah for commercial so he big ass book studied the book took the test got hired on he makes like sixty dollars an hour well and that was like the that was like he makes like the starting pay was like 60 and then so he'd been doing a couple years sent the sent a book to his brother in prison and said you need to do this this is a because they're their own boss too

you're basically told go here check out this right up the sheet that you did everything and he's like so i'm driving for 45 minutes to an hour i get paid for that i go to the job i inspector the course of an hour or two i spend another hour writing everything up i spend another hour driving back he's like i mean he's like this is a joke like this is ridiculous that yeah but these kinds of jobs It's one of those jobs that exists, that pays well that nobody knows about. It's like the same thing for electrical inspectors. Same thing. Yeah.

Yeah. Their jobs out there. And the same thing, you got to really work hard to pass that test being an inspector. And then I have another friend named Chad Brewington, him of his wife, Summer. They started, they started clothing line. This is this shirt right here. It's fucked. We used to be fucked.

Now we're unfucked. And what they've been doing with their, he's a plumber. So he owns his own business. But what he's been doing before he started this is he was, he's been like donating money to like recovery road in Anaheim. If somebody needs to go to a halfway house for addiction and they don't have the money, he pays so they can get in there. So he decided to start this clothing line. And what they do with the money from the clothing, the selling the shirts, they use that to help people get into programs or donate it to, programs or whatever.

And that's www. we are un-f-k-E-D.com. That's their website where you could buy these shirts. They got a bunch of different kinds of shirts and that money goes to help people get into programs, recovery road. It's great.

A lot of people, I didn't say like 90% of the people that I used to run the streets with that are not, haven't passed away because a lot of people have passed on. They're out here doing good for the community. They're running recovery homes. They're sober. They're helping people.

And that's also been a big help for me, too, once I got out, that this was all going on. I mean, we still have. Now it's fentanyl. It's not like it was back in the day where, in 2002, back then, where it was. Now it's fentanyl. And these kids are dying. Two people are dying every five minutes in the United States from fentanyl overdose. It's crazy.

If I was alive or me and my friends, were live today doing what we were doing, we probably all be dead. More of us now than are. It's, fentanyl's crazy. And it's everywhere. It's in pills. They're putting it in everything.

The meth, the heroin, everything. But, yeah, there's... I just hope, along with me trying to get my books in schools and trying to raise the money, which is a lot of money to send a kid through electrical school. That's a lot of money. But also, I want to start giving money to kids for sports. So they could be in sports. It's very important, I think, for kids to be in sports. So they could be doing something with their free time. Because sports take a lot of time. But again, that costs money

where families don't have. I'm just trying to find my way and trying to give back after all the destruction and victims I created throughout my life. And I just, I hope that I could do some good now. Yeah, I, I hear you. I definitely think the, the, the trades thing is huge because it's so, it's so lucrative now. Yeah. And that's the thing, that's a big thing with kids, too, is that they, it's, you want to be cool, you want to make much.

So selling drugs is, it's quick money. you get to drive a nice car you get to always have a little bit of money in your pocket you get to be the cool guy in the end you go to prison but at least they don't see that and those people are removed

it's like gang you join you join a gang and you end up shot or whatever yeah but they don't see that they don't it's not going to happen to me caught up with the wrong people and you fall down the wrong path and or you

become friends with a guy like me with the dad like I had And it's over. And it can happen very easily. A lot of people do that. A lot of kids do that because they just don't have an out. If you gave them an out, say, hey, here's the light at the end of the tunnel. Most kids are in those neighborhoods where, you know what I'm saying?

Everybody they know that has any money is selling drugs or committing crime. There's just no good influences. Yeah. If you said, hey, this is something you could do and you could make really good money doing it. then at least they have an out. Yeah. Well, it's like that a lot for like the blacks and the Mexicans. They, uh, they grow up in these cultures, especially Mexicans and blacks where they,

their all families aren't gangs. It's, it's like, I don't want to say that. It's just what they grew up with. It's a cultural thing. And it's hard to get out of. You got these, I work with some, some younger Mexican kids, and they're younger and they're doing it, man. and they're from L.A., they're from wherever, but guaranteed half their family will grew up with games.

And it's like that for the white kids too, but not as bad. If they're in them areas, they're going to end up in, it could happen to anybody. But it's one of those things, man, where it's easy to fall through the cracks. And this country with this fentanyl, but all these gangs and everything that's going on, it's out of control.

Well, listen, let's, I mean, are you, you feel good about this, this interview? Are you good with everything? Yeah. Okay. If, if anybody wants to find or donate or find any of the, anything we've talked about, like, do you want me to put, I can put there's any links or anything I can put in the description box? Yeah.

I'll do like a website or. Yeah, I'll give you all that. I'll give you all that. Also, too, like, if you want to support, if you want to send donate to the, the at-risk youth website is what you do is you go to www. www.star, 2023.org, and you scroll down to good causes, and then you'll see at-risk youth with my book there, and you click on that, and the at-risk youth part comes up, and you could click to donate on there, and you could donate, click the button. It's a website. It's a dot-org.

It's a, it's a real nonprofit. Everything's there. And then I'll give you the information for Chad Brewington's website where you could buy these shirts that will also help people in recovery. And my book, of course, or it's kind of the dark side is on Amazon. A portion of that money goes to at-risk youth. And yeah.

Yeah, my Amazon, too, none of it goes to at-risk youth. I get all that money. So. But I hear you, but you're a better person than me. I wouldn't say that. I wouldn't say that.

we all we're just trying to make it and just trying to do our thing I work hard I'm very grateful to have life I'm getting married next year yeah dude and if it wasn't for God

dude I wouldn't be here I go to I was say I met my my wife in the halfway house and when I when you said like prison saved your life like that's the same thing she says yeah she's like I'd be dead right now

prison was like a gift I'd be dead right now yeah No doubt. And she was, by the way, she was, it was like she had a conspiracy, like a 60-man conspiracy. She's selling everything. And she's like, oh, I'd have never made it. Never. Yeah.

Yeah. But yeah, that's great that you're getting married. Yeah. What's that? I said that's great that you're getting married, too. Like, it's funny because that was one of the things that I had just decided that was done. It wasn't in the cards anymore. Yeah.

You know what I'm saying? Like I'd gone to prison. I'm going to get out. I'm going to be in my 50s. Like that part of my, that's over. Don't even think about that. That's not even the daydream about getting married or having a girlfriend or that's over. And then you get out and you're like, hey, things are working out.

Yeah. Well, for me. Yeah, me and my girlfriend, man, we get along good. We both, we've both been through the same. She went through it just like I did. And she told herself she's never going to get in a relationship. She was single for like six years, but then she met me and she couldn't resist. Yeah.

But that's good though because I'm saying it's good to have that shared struggle. Yeah. Like we both we both hit the halfway house at the same time. We both got jobs about the same time. So we both started rebuilding our lives at the same time. That's a great, that's a real bonding experience. Yeah. Having that a similar struggle.

So it's good that your that your girl has that in her, her pass. I'm not that I wish that on anybody, but you know what I'm saying? But it's good because you have that shared experience. Hey, I really appreciate you guys watching. Do me a favor if you like the video, hit the subscribe button, share the video, hit the bell so you get notified. Leave me a comment, all the stuff you're supposed to do. I really appreciate it. Also, I'm going to leave all of Chris's links in the description. We're going to leave the link to the website. We're going to leave the link so you can go buy his, the, the, the shirts for his buddy. If you want to donate, go to his website.

You can donate. You just explain the whole thing. I really appreciate you guys watching. Also, do me a favor. Please consider joining my Patreon. We put special Patreon exclusive content on the Patreon channel. Please check it out. I appreciate you guys watching.

Thank you very much. See ya.