Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - EXPOSING THE BEST REAL ESTATE SCAMS OF 2024 (AIRBNB, TRUMP, & MORE)

Episode Date: April 20, 2024

EXPOSING THE BEST REAL ESTATE SCAMS OF 2024 (AIRBNB, TRUMP, & MORE)

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you'll know just how healthy they are. Visit Spexsavers.cavers.cai to book your next eye exam. Eye exams provided by independent optometrists. What is your take on Airbnb? I've seen people talking about how the whole market is melting down. Everything that you can think of that you would normally see in a scam is present in this. No experience, make a lot of money, and it's going to last forever. What do you think about Trump's charge of the fraud charge?

I can tell you this. I can tell you this. A day job is a lender. So I'm a commercial lender. I've been doing that for about 16 years. I got into it right after I got at the Air Force. And, you know, I just started basically from, you know, trying to get into real estate. I wanted to get into flipping and then I couldn't get into flipping because I had no money.

And so I remember speaking to another mortgage broker and she was telling me that like, why don't you just start financing and I was just clueless. I had no idea what it was. So she kind of walked me through, kind of mentored me through that. and I got into it and from that point on, I just kind of, you know, just took off and read every single piece of literature I could on it. And yeah, and then, and then evolved to a mortgage banker to a lender. So yeah, that's how I got into it. So you don't, I mean, did you ever start flipping houses? Did you ever flip anything? No, I never start flipping houses. The closest to, I've never

flip the house. The closest that I do, I just invest. So I buy like apartment complexes and, you know, duplexes, things like that. Long term rentals, that's the type of investor I am when it comes to real estate. Long term investor. So I'm really big into apartment complexes and multifamily. Okay. Yeah, I was going to say it's, it's, you know, flipping is risky. It can be risky. Very. You know, like, it's funny, it's like anything, like the more, the more experience you have in it, then the less risk there is because you've hit one problem after another problem. And you're like, okay, I'm not going to do that again. I'm not going to do that again. Right.

But yeah, I remember the first, like the first property I had, I don't think I had any money. The first property I flipped. And I, we just, we got a hard money guy because I partnered with somebody who had borrowed from this guy before. But if you, if I just gone in cold, you know, a lot of these guys, you know, oh, just go find a hard money guy. Listen, if you've never done it. So you're going to go tell this guy, I've never done this before. I found a house. I need you to lend me the money. I feel like I've got it figured out. He's going to be like, yeah, listen. Until I've lit to you or you've been. So, you know, usually it's kind of like you'll partner. I guess if you knew the hard money guy, but who does?

So, but if, like if you grabbed somebody who's done, who's connected with him, you know, and then you were just one of, it's you and him flipping the property. You say, look, I'm going to do the whole thing and I'll give you a percentage, but you got to hook me up with a hard money guy to get the money, then you buy the house, you renovate it, you put it on the market and you sell it. And then the guy feels comfortable with you. So then he'll lend to you again. Look, I had such great relationships with some of these hard money guys. Like they were after five, six deals, I could call them up and say, listen, I got a property. I, you know, I was, it's, I don't know, I'm trying to think of this one property. I'm probably going to get the numbers all wrong.

But I remember it was like, it was not, it was like $40,000. This was, this was 20 years ago in Nashville. I was like, I need $40,000. I'm going to lose my deposit in a couple days if I don't get the money because I thought I was refinancing another property and I'd have the money and I didn't. I was like, look, can you just send me the money? And he's like, man, I'm leaving. I'm going on vacation tomorrow.

And he goes, just send me the address and I'll, I'll have, I'll wire the title company, the money so you can close. never went out to look at it never but i'd done five or six deals and i'd always paid on time and i'd always paid him back and i'd always never never been a problem and the big thing with him too is i remember if something was going to happen i always called him beforehand like i was like hey i need to pay off we're supposed to close friday right he's got you know this guy's got half probably a dozen uh loans out at one time and then i would call him on thursday and say listen these people's financing fell through

and it's probably not going to close till next week if even then might be another two weeks so I'm going to go ahead and courier your payment over to you because I was closing like the same day my next payment was due he was like you know what I'm saying because I I was like oh William you don't have to do that you can just mail it and I was like no no it's due on Friday I want to pay it on Friday like I was so overly you know transparent

about everything that was going on where I've known guys who they're like they'll pick up the phone and they're like oh man that's my hard money lender I was supposed to pay him its first payment or I was supposed to pay one of the payment like on Monday and it's Thursday and I haven't paid him yet and it's like and you're not answering the phone like he's well you know because here's what happened I'm like then tell him that he understands that but don't not tell him this isn't the bank where if you miss your payment, like the CEO's not laying in bed at night going, going, you know, that cost didn't make his payment like yesterday. You know, you're not just, he's not a CEO. He knows every single person he's lent money to. And if you just explain to him,

look, bro, here's what happened. Boom, boom, boom, boom. I don't have the payment. I'm supposed to be getting some money in on Tuesday. I can pay you on Tuesday. I'm so sorry. And I understand there's a fee. And it's out of my control. I apologize. He'll feel better. And he'll be like, good, this isn't somebody who's ever going to run from me that's a big problem with them and i was going to say the other thing is i've known hard money guys who have gone to people who are behind and said listen you're behind quit claim to eat the property over to me but don't make me foreclose on you if you do and i sell the property i'll find somebody that will finish the renovations i'll sell it if i don't lose any money on the property then the next time when you get your shit together

And you come back to me, I'll lend you again. But if you make me foreclose, not only will I not lend you again, I'll make sure that everybody around here knows what happened and that I had to chase you. And I've known guys that have done that. And six months later, they've, you know, they've lit to the guy again because the guy was like, look, I'm going through a divorce. Here's what happened. My wife emptied out the bank account.

She ran up one of my credit cards. That was a credit card I was using to finance the renovations. And just lay it out. Like, he understands. Like, I get it. just be honest that's a big thing it is it is and that's what I tell a lot of clients like listen communication is is key if you just can communicate with me and let me know it's what's going on we can work from that part but if if if I'm chasing you and and the the

workout team is calling you and they're saying hey Orlando we can't get in contact with this person they've never met they haven't made a payment or what's worse is that first payment you don't make that first payment, man, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, you're on the fast track to foreclosure. Like, it's, and, and not only that, but if you don't answer the phone, you don't do any of that stuff, it's, it's, it's big. And, and, you know, and I tell people all the time, like, listen, I don't have time to chase you around. We went through the process to get you the loan. We got you the loan. I gave you the money. I don't have. We, we, we closed like, I don't know, we do about 50, 60 million a year in volume in closing. And I just don't have time.

to be chasing individual people around like if you don't if you don't have enough sense in my opinion to communicate and let me know what's going on then we're just going to get your property foreclosed on and and let's move on right um so i really tell people to communicate communication is the big is a big key and a lot of times what people don't understand is is just in the foreclosure processing there's just there's a lot of time for you to actually step up and say something right if you don't say anything through the entire process and before the process when i was calling you tell telling you that you missed your payment then obviously you don't want the property right yeah i was i was going to say if you're it's funny too sometimes

because i've had this happen where i was flipping like literally i had probably three or four properties going and and you know two of them were supposed to close they didn't okay so they didn't close my credit cards are maxed i don't have the money and the one guy that lent me money on one property you know I just went to him and I said look here's the deal I'm waiting for the now I've got the money for your payment you know like I've got a little bit of a cushion but I'm this one property I'm now having to stop renovating it I'm gonna use some my my reserves to pay you and I'm hoping that one of these two loans closes the next couple weeks and I was like but I'm basically using my reserve money to make the payments to you and I have to

stop renovating it. And he went, let me come by the property. He comes by the property. He walks through it. And he's like, okay, you got the roof on. You've got the drywall in. You got the windows in. So what do you still have to do? And I was like, well, he's like, what, you're, what, you're, what, you're, what, you're, what, you're, what, you're, you're, what, you're, what, you're, I'm working on this, this, this, this. He's like, what's that going to cost. I was like, it's like, it's like 15 grand. And he went, all right, come by tomorrow morning. I'll I'll write an addendum to the contract. I'll lend you the 15,000 so you can keep working.

And we'll just put an addendum and I'll have my secretary notarize it. It's fine. Like, if I hadn't been honest with that guy, that could have been the end of me. Think about it. I'm using my reserve. What if these two properties don't close? You know, luckily a week and a half later, one closes.

I'm good. We're back on track. But that guy, you know, it's funny, even though I was actively committing fraud and multiple other areas he used to always say look you're super honest with me you're always very up front i've never had to chase you like and it was like you're a very honest guy and i'm thinking ha i got you fooled i've been honest with you trust me your time will come no um but yeah it's yeah so uh i was going to say with hard money with especially any lenders it's just like be honest with like just be honest up front like it's in my best view it's in my best interest to

lend if I'm the lender to lend you the money right nobody wants to end you that money more than me like I don't make money if I can't lend it but be honest not only work something out yeah not only that but I think you know especially because for me you know we you know I do a lot of the underwriting and whatnot and so we see a lot of things I see a lot of people lying going through the process line like oh what's your criminal do you have a criminal record oh no I've never ever had one or this or that and I always try to tell individuals that look you you think you can hide things but you can't like if if it's on record and I all I got to do is just when we pull up the background check when we pull up all these reports it's going to show up and you know I've

had individuals giving me bank statements and if they were fake bank statements and then when you it doesn't even the balance doesn't even add up at the bottom like like I You know, you could see the lines where they, where they copied and pasted numbers and all this other stuff. And he's just be like, why, why? When I own the mortgage company one time, I remember this husband and wife came in. And my broker, I had a broker that was doing the deal with him. He comes into my office and he goes, check this out. And he gives me these two W-2s.

Everything across the board was identical. Even the staple marks in the upper corner of the, that have been copied they're not they're not there but they're like even the smudge every except for their name and you know if you make a copy of a copy and you have a line the drum tends to to warp the lines it does so that everything is warped slightly but their names are like perfect and i just went i i called them in i said listen like i literally in front of them held it up to the light. I know what you're trying to do. And hey, good. You did pretty good. You know, you're clearly not, you're clearly not a professional at this. And I'm like, who's answering the phone

when I call? If I call right now, you know, triple A towing, which is what they said they worked for. I said, I'm assuming you own this company. They're like if I call right now, who's going to answer the phone? Will someone to answer AAA? No, no, someone will answer. So are you sure? You know, I'm positive. So I call. Hello. Hello. Hi. Is this triple A? Oh, you got AAA. Triple A going. Is your mom answered the phone? Listen, I called it over the next two weeks. I told mama take care of your W-2s. Don't worry about it. It's fine. I'm take care of the pay stuff. Don't even provide me pay stuff. It's like, God knows. If you just bought it. And then I was like, I'm going to call. And then I called like two or three times over the next two weeks. And the mom just, kept answering the phone. Hello. Hi, is this AAA? Oh, triple A. And so finally, I was like, look, I'm just going to, I'm just going to change the phone number and list it in the business

directory. You could use to be able to do that. And then I'll just have them call my phone number, and I'll just answer it because, well, no, no, I can know, bro, you've done enough. I'm going to make about $4,500 on this. So we're not leaving it in your hands. But yeah, people are it's so funny when they try and do stuff themselves it's just like stop bro what are you doing like you're not proficient at this like what do you what do you think you're going to change the five to a four you know or the four to a six or like all the numbers have to change across the board like they're going to get caught anybody who's really looking is going to catch you listen and they get caught all the time you know like that's so i see it and i go what what is this is it doesn't

you say your balance at the very at the very end of it is is twenty thousand dollars right let's just say it's $20,000 but then when you add up everything it's like it doesn't even add up to the 20 so what's going on or what's even that that that page left intentionally blank that gets people all time or i was just like my favorite is like oh my check that it gets direct deposited you're like right but you gave me a check for you know $1,800 every two weeks but i can see that you know $940 is getting direct deposit it doesn't match your your the the the pace of you gave me doesn't match the direct deposit for the bank account that you told me and then they're like you could just see it in their face oh oh oh I it's like stop bro you're don't you're not good at this like stick with you know

towing cars or whatever your job is like you know I not that you would do any of this obviously I'm the guy they want to bump into you're the guy that they're trying to avoid you're like you don't get the income ratio you're not getting alone to me i'm like i i see it all the time and i and i and i always tell people like you know especially when it comes to the the line about criminal history and stuff like that what what you know oh what happened oh well 10 years ago this happened it's always some long drawn out story about how they how they were like falsely accused and all this other stuff and but what's the weird thing about it it is that when you fill out an application and it asks you, you know, have you had any criminal

history and X, Y, Z time? And you mark no one there. And then when I find out about it, now you want to tell me the story. You lied on the application. So you're automatically disqualified. So, you know, I try to let them, oh, no, no, no, listen, I didn't know you meant the last 10 years. I thought you meant this time. You know, it just gets ridiculous. And I see it all the time. all the time i have a question because on like residential loan applications right like the basically the you know the um the one that the i mean this is these aren't commercial this is you know residential right the 1003 like they don't ask they don't ask for criminal you know i'm talking yeah they do they marry in oh the thing you make 30 mac one what during the the the the question

so now they ask you have a criminal record they do they do they ask if you've had any uh have you had any, um, any arrest or any, have you been in trouble with the law? And last, I think it's, I think on the bottom it says 14 or 15 years. So, uh, yeah, they ask. And and so you have to answer the question yes or no. And and most, I mean, you know, some people will lie about it because they'll be like, oh, they're never going to find out or, or maybe they think to themselves like, oh, well, you know, I wasn't formally charged or whatever. But what happens is when we do the background search and whatnot. We see all of those things of like, oh, you were, maybe you had domestic violence and yeah, it didn't go anywhere, but it's still on your record. Like what's going on with that?

And, you know, or what's even worse is a lot of times you'll see individuals who have some type of fraud, let it be against with the federal government. They did some type of fraud. Let it be like SBA loans or student loans or whatever. You see something like that and you just go, yeah there's nothing I can do for you it doesn't as soon as I see that it's over it's right done like you're not going anywhere right one of my charges my first charge ever was um uh it was government it was wire it was like defrauding the federal government like they took the wire fraud and they made it like wire fraud against the u.s government it was it was an odd you know because my I don't know I don't know what my

my lawyer was trying to prove by having me signed for wire fraud against the federal government, which was weird. It's like, why not just wired fraud? You know, like, why didn't, I didn't. Yeah, I was like, what do you talk? Like, that has, that wasn't my charge at all. It was, but he had me sign. And he, I remember he didn't want me to claim. He didn't want me to plead guilty to bank fraud. He's like, well, it's got a 30 year maximum or something. It's like, okay, yeah, but I can't admit, but based on the federal sentencing guidelines, Like, I'm not even close to that. I'm like, I can't even get, I'm getting probation.

So I guess he was like trying to argue that I don't want him to plead something that could get him 30 years. Like, he can't get me 30 years. I didn't steal any money. There was no money lost. Like, what are you doing? I think he was trying to justify the 75,000 I gave him or something. I'm not sure what he was thinking. Right.

But yeah, I could see. So I think one of my charges is fraud against the United States government or wire fraud against the United States government, which is weird. But I borrowed money since then. I had borrowed many, many loans. since that time. But is that, is that with, is that with, is that private like hard buddy guys? Or is that like institutions? This was 20 years ago.

But this was 10 years ago. Say 20 years ago you can get away with though, honestly, 20 years. And here's the thing. Actually, you can get away with it. It's not that like if you mark the box, you're automatically denied. It's the, you just have to be truthful about it, right? You have to be truthful and you have to. to and what I'm going to ask for is I'm going to ask for let's let's see those

documents that let's say you defrauded the government let's see did was there any money lost there's rules associated with that with getting a loan from for me or from any bank to if you had those type of charges right but what the problem that I run into is the line once you lie then you can't get anything it doesn't matter what the story is right it's over what about Well, I was going to say, and a lot of guys like lie, like it's drugs, but like they don't care about drugs. Like if you say, oh, I was arrested for marijuana or, right, like they're not going to not give you a loan. I get that so, I get that so much marijuana charges where someone, you know, 10 years ago or they were young and they had some type of whatever, some, some small charge.

And they lie about it. That's the thing. They lie. Like, it wouldn't mean anything. It really wouldn't. It would be like, oh, you got in trouble because. you got caught with marijuana 10, 15 years ago or seven years ago. It is cool, whatever. But you lie about it. And once you lie about it, you look at the bottom of these applications

and it says, to your knowledge, your stuff is true, blah, blah, blah, blah. If you lie, this is against the law, all this other stuff. So if once you lie about that, it doesn't matter if it was 50 years ago. It's over. It's funny. I was, I'd read some, I forget what the statistic was, but it was basically women who had been like cheated on right like they weren't concerned about the cheating they were concerned that you lied about it it was like what like men don't care that you lied about it they care that you cheated it was just so funny it was like what you did is what's bad but for women was like that i don't care about that what i care about is that you've been lying about it for six months now i don't trust you and it's like i guess for men they're like i never trusted you

but you'll let with someone up that was it right right um so let's uh can we kind of because we're just going back and forth at this what what about so i had seen a video well i guess i saw the topic of the video and i watched a little bit of the video this was after um this was when after j t recommended uh you to me actually i'd seen you and he talking one time you guys talked for it was like it was like an hour and change and you guys were talking about another what are you talking about you were talking about a scammer and you guys were laughing nonstop about the scammer mocking him and uh but anyway when i looked at your stuff i did see something on air and b that's why beforehand when we were talking i was like well i know you've done videos on air bs

because yeah i had seen them on your channel so what what is your take on eb And B, like, I know when they first started, everybody was just making tons of money and they were amazing. They were wonderful. Yeah, yeah. And in the last year, I've seen people talking about how, like, it's the whole market is melting down. What is the issue? Well, the issue is, is this is that, first of all, Airbnb, the way that at least it was portrayed in social media and what brought so many people into the market of Airbnb was the fact that, you know, you could get started with no, money. It was easy money. You, you know, all these things, everything that you can think of that

you would normally see in a scam is present in this. You know, no experience, make a lot of money, and it's going to last forever, right? And so you would see individuals who were, who were getting, buying, getting properties and doing this arbitrage where you don't have to own the property. Basically, you would go, just imagine if you went to a, a landlord and you said, hey, I'm going to sub lease. I'm going to rent this from you and then I'm going to sub lease it from you and rent it to someone else. That's what's basically going on. So individuals would basically go into an apartment complex, our single family, our duplex, and then they would rent it, right? And then they would take that and then put it on Airbnb and then have people pay them to, you know, do their vacations or stay there. And I was trying to let everybody know that this is it's not going to work. First of all, you're going to run into the landlord issue with most of the landlords didn't even know that their tenant were taking their properties and put them on Airbnb. They had no clue, right? And then you're going to run into the biggest.

The number one thing that I was trying to tell everybody is the cities. The cities aren't going to allow Airbnb just to come in and take over the residential areas versus the hotels that they've paid, you know, tons and tons and tons of money to, giving them all. types of tax rebates and all this other stuff so they can be in a zoned area they're not going to allow you to cut into their sales tax they're not going to allow that to happen they're going to put rules in place to say you're going to have to you're going to get charged taxes just like a hotel they're going to limit you on how many people can be in this area because no matter what anybody believes a city is a business too a city wants people to travel live there have schools it wants to have a whole ecosystem, right?

It's not an ecosystem once you turn, you know, a neighborhood and 95% of the houses there are Airbnbs. Nobody wants that. Nobody wants to live next to a guy who every, you know, you're going to have 300 different neighbors in the whole year. Nobody wants to do that. So I was really pushing this, letting people know, first of all, it's not as easy as you think it is.

Second of all, it's hot right now because it's the pandemic. and nobody everybody has money in their pocket everybody is traveling to vacations and all this other stuff so it's super easy but once everything slowed down which is currently what's happening right now now it's 90% no bookings what do we do giving back properties and so that's where we are right now well i was going to say the other thing of issue with them was it sounds like oh you don't need anything to start it well i don't know about you but furniture's not cheap even even cheap even cheap furniture isn't free. So, you know, and most of those places are, are financed pretty, pretty nicely. So you're spending at a minimum, if it's a two bedroom one bath,

you're spending at least, God, at least what, five grand, maybe 10 to 15. And that's still doing it on the cheap. Of course, if it's a three bedroom, two bath or three bath. And, you know, you can't just put, you can't put complete crap in there. And most of the one, yeah, most of the ones I, but IKEA is not even cheap. It's not cheap once you put, once you start stacking up, you know, a, you know, two in tables, the bed, the bed frame, the mattresses, all the, all the linen, you know, plus the cat, like, you start adding up, man, you're, you're, you're, you're looking at $10,000, $20,000. You know, it's, so it's, so, okay, so it's not an investment of nothing. It's five to $15,000 on a small one. It's 10 to $20,000 in furniture. Let's say it's $10,000 in furniture. Because cheap, actually, you know, because like flat screens and stuff, they're pretty cheap. If you could maybe do a lot of, you could probably buy a bunch of stuff on offer up or Facebook marketplace. You're still going to spend five to 10 grand, even if you do it super cheap and you could do it, knock that out.

Assuming you have a truck to deliver this stuff, you're picking it up. I mean, you're going to dump a ton of time and some money into it to get it started. If it stays rented, that's probably great. But at some point, well, like it, like you said it is now, it's starting to kind of collect. And now what? Now I've got a I've got a house full of furniture that I can't rent out for my for my my mortgage or my rent. So or what's even worse is you would have individuals like I said, they would tear up the property and they're just sucking all the money out of it during doing the Airbnb. And then when the landlord finds out, they hand back the property to them

and the property is torn up. Now the landlord has to sue, the guy who lived there. And it just turns into this whole big thing. And now, and then what you would see is, you would see these Airbnb hosts that would come onto YouTube or any social media and they'd be like, I have a thousand Airbnbs or 60 or 100 Airbnbs, but they don't own not one.

They don't even own one. These are all arbitrage, are all arbitrage properties where they, you know, are renting and sub-leasing them out. And eventually that's gonna fail. Like there's just no way you can you can uphold that. And so I've been just letting everybody know, like, it's real estate is not easy.

It's, and that's the thing. A lot of people think that you could just get in with no money down. You could have horrible credit. You could just, everybody just can pile into real estate. And I try to let people know, it's not that easy. And I know that's not what people want to hear, right? They don't want to hear that. They want to hear that it's super easy that you don't need anything.

you could just make money grow out of nothing, but that's not how it works. Yeah, I used to say that all the time, like when I, because I taught the real estate class for like 10 years in prison. And one of the things I would do when I'd walk in there, I'd be like, listen, like I know you guys have seen those commercials where it's like, you know, I bought this property for $1, you know, that whole thing. I was like, the truth is I'm like, look, I'm not going to lie. That's not the case.

You're just, you're going to need some money, you know, so, you know, because these guys, well, what if I had $2,000? that's not going to be enough like i'll tell you how to repair your i'll tell you how to take the 2000 fix your credit and be able to borrow 20 grand you know to be able to leverage your credit into flipping properties but you're not buying a property and that's that's tight but i'll but you know you're not going to buy it you're not going to buy a property for nothing down you're not going to flip it for nothing down you're not going to convince the the the guy the roofer to put the roof on and wait three months and the drywall or like that like it sounds good

And I could lie to you. I'm like, I could lie to you guys for the next few years and believe me. But it's, that's not, that's not the case. So let's start at the beginning. You know, it takes work. And listen, every property I've ever had that I flipped, I bought it for, let's say, I bought it for 50,000, right, put 25 in it. I was sold it for a hundred.

And right now you think you made $25,000. Well, are you wrong? You know, because I had to make four months worth of payments on that $75,000. that I borrowed to get the 50 because you're the 65 because I only got 65% LTV based on 100,000. So my payment every month was roughly $650 to $1,000 a month. Plus I didn't, you know, the 75 or the 65,000 you borrowed, you had two points on that, maybe three plus. So, you know, you start adding it up, adding it up. Plus you, you know, in some cases you had to, you had to help the person with their, you know, with their down payment or with the closing cost. So now I had to pay 3,000

of my 100,000 towards your closing cost. Like, you start adding it up before you know what, you walk away with 15 grand. And listen, if you thought you were going to make 25, you've, and you're mentally in your mind, you've spent 30. And then you get 15. You feel like I just got screwed out of 15 grand. And it's, it's never like it is, it's never like it is in the TV shows. You show up and you say, fix this, fix that.

That's perfect. And then you come back three days later and it's, or after the commercial break. And everything's done. and you say it's beautiful. It's not. Oh, good old HDTV magic. Yeah, it's kids are knocking holes in the wall. They're getting in and throwing rocks through windows. Your air conditioner gets stolen twice. I had to put it. We used to have to put our air conditioners in prison. We used to build little cages around them because they were stolen so much. We used to have poor concrete pads and bolt them to the pad, bolt them to the wall because they would get stolen so often. Or we'd have to wait

until after closing to put the outside air conditioner in, you know. Isn't that horrible? Yeah. If some guy falls off the roof and suddenly he wants to sue you and you're like, why? Why are you suing me? I don't understand because the guy that you hired to do the roof hired illegals and he doesn't have workman's comp. And now the illegal alien wants to sue you. And you're like, what's going on?

How is it my fault? You don't have a workman's comp. And not only that, but with the Airbnb thing. That's the reason why I'm against the whole syndication thing, too. Like, I mean, I guess there's a, there's a place for, for all of them, but, but for the most part, at least the way that it's marketed on the, on the internet, it's just, it just does it. When I do the numbers, when I do the numbers and I look at some of these syndication deals, because I'm a real estate nerd and I love to just look at the numbers and see, okay, if someone's doing this, like, there has to be, like, like, what's the, what's the, what's the prize that they? what's the reward for me if I was investing in it? And I just do that and it just does it.

The numbers don't make sense at all for these syndications. I just break them apart and I look at it. Because in my view, syndications, syndications you're going to make, the person who's going to make all of the money is the people who are creating the fund. First of all, they never, most of them, most of them don't put their own money into it. So any fee that they make on it, which is a guarantee, these guys are going to make fees. they're making fees off of nothing like like nothing what is that rate of return it's insane it just doesn't make sense they don't care if if the property fails

they don't care if they give the property back they don't care about any of that stuff because at the end of the day they've made all of their money and fees and they can turn over the property and just do the same thing over on another property right i was going to say they just keep kick and if you complain they'll just kick you off the app oh they will they will It's like, oh, that guy's a problem. Hold on. Like, you don't have to hear about him anyway. You can't even pull anybody at Airbnb, but they'll send us a tax.

Like, you know, I love that. Like with YouTube, something goes wrong. Like, you know, you can complain. It's like, to who? You're not talking to anybody. You're going to send an email to come back and say the same thing. You violated our, you know, the agreement, the policy agreement or what? Community guidelines.

Right. How you violated the community guidelines. How you violated the community guide review the community guidelines it's a book like she give me a hint but nope zero hit yeah no hands not how this works um what was the other thing I was going to say oh you know what's funny about Airbnb to bees I heard this the other day which I thought was unfortunately brilliant I thought was semi brilliant you know it was the exit the idea was brilliant. the execution was lacking. And this is me from a criminal perspective because you won't think this is brilliant at all. You'll be like, despicable. But, you know, we're coming at it from different directions. So these two women rented an Airbnb.

This came out later. Like the first two articles where it wasn't clear. I thought I knew. And I actually did a video with my buddy Zach. And I was like, this is what I think they did. And then it came out later. This is what they did. they rented an Airbnb for like a week they put it on Craigslist and a couple different like

now one of the women by the way has some kind of a real estate background not a real estate agent but she has some real estate background so they put it on Craigs list they put it on kind of like a a buy hair or sorry about buy hair payer but um a you know for sale by owner they didn't list it on the MLS or anything but they so they literally before they even are they are arrive at the place they've already got it listed people show up and it's a little bit under market market value and this was this was this was this was i might have probably i feel like it was a year ago maybe six months to a year ago whatever might have been longer than that my time uh i'm not very good with time but point is is let's say a year ago so people

show up and they're like this is when you know the market was really big like in flor It's gone down now. Things are on the market much longer now. It's taking longer and longer. But a year ago was booming. So people are showing up and going, oh my gosh, this is amazing. And they would say, well, listen, we got, you know, they go, I want it. And they go, okay, well, let's write up a contract right now. And you can give us a deposit. We're not taking less than whatever, 5,000, 3,000. And they would write them a check to the title company. Like, oh, you don't have to write to me. You can write to the title company. Well, they had somebody open. up a bank account or a DBA as a title company. Oh, right. They'd give them the check and they deposit and then they'd email them. It's funny because this is how ridiculous. Like the newspaper article said that they had faked, that they had created a fake title

company. But really all they did, they had a DBA and they created an email address, which was like a, it was like a Gmail, you know, so it was like Palm Coast title at gmail. So they would send them a G, they'd send them something from them saying, we received your $3,500 or your $3,000, whatever it is. We received it. And, you know, and then they would send them obviously a copy of the signed contract and everything. We've deposited it. And you're, you know, and basically they had 30 to 45 days to close.

So if you get five people a day at $3,000 is $15,000, that's $15,000 for. a week. They then close that little operation down. And so that's, you know, that right there, that's a couple hundredth. That's about 200,000. They close that down and go to the, how much is that? What am I saying? I don't think that, I don't think I did that math correctly, but whatever, 115 or 15,000 times seven. 105,000. So, So anyway, they did it for like 400,000. They basically closed it down and went to another. Now they got some cash.

So they do another Airbnb. They do the same thing again. So they got like 400,000 in cash before, before anybody even starts to realize, hey, we need to get the appraiser in. Of course, they're not responding at this point. They've got their money. Of course. And they're gone. And all of that was done.

Now, of course, the problem is it caught up to them very quickly because whoever opened up the, the bank account with the the the DBA very quickly you know said oh that was so so and so and so did that and then they track her now a trail a paper trail right like it's a good scam if you if you were able to get fake IDs and the things that most people are incapable of doing you know they weren't able to they weren't able to cover their tracks or do it with you know with you know anonymity you know they very quickly caught up to them unfortunately well not no fortunately for them it caught up with it or fortunately for the average person that was thought they'd hit it big um but yeah that was an Airbnb and I was just like amazed I was like wow like how easy that

scam was of course it broke down because they were idiots and they couldn't put it together properly but it was it was super interesting and then the the thing you were telling me about the Airbnb is also this it reminded me of this I'd met a guy who was in prison because and I forget exactly what it happened why this was illegal he was saying it's not illegal but of course you took a plea and accepted like three years so if it wasn't illegal why didn't you I guess I guess he took that plea fast you know but listen to what he did it doesn't say it sounds kind of like what it where is it what is it when you can rent your car out to people what's that you're talking about that Toro Toro

yeah so this is what it sounded like he was he had gone to um car dealers and and he'd gone to local car dealers and said look if somebody comes in and they're upside down on their car they can lease i will lease the car from them we'll keep in their name and i'll lease it from them and then And I'll rent out that, no, but it wasn't on Toro. So he's not buying your car, but he's leasing your car. And then he would lease it to someone else. So he'd, some guy would give him $1,000 down and he lease out your car that was upside down. And then what was, you were able to buy a new car.

So he's, so the car dealers are like, look, okay, you're about 4,000 upside down in your car. You really can't get out of it. We can't roll it into the new car. You can get in the new car. The problem is you're still going to have this car on there. They're like, oh, well, I don't want to do that. I can't afford both cars. Well, listen, we, there's actually a guy who runs a company here and he'll lease your car from you.

And they were like, really? Yeah, he leases it. And then he rents them out or releasees them. It's completely on. It's his responsibility. Obviously, he'll make your payments. I think the problem was he, some of them, he got upside down himself and then couldn't make the payments. And then, of course, he was also had basically said that he would be responsible for the payments.

And obviously he's not responsible for the payments. The car's still in your name. The lien is in your name. your name. I'm not making the payments. The 30-day late goes on your credit. But somehow or another, he'd done this to the tune of like 200 cars or something over the course of like two years. And eventually it caught up with them and the whole thing kind of fell apart. And there was an investigation and he got indicted and then went to prison for like three years. You know the weird thing about that as I listen to all of that, how intricate that is.

I always wonder, why spend so much time putting together that plan where you could have just done it the right way like you it's obvious that you can put together a plan that would work in whatever scenario right in a scenario that will benefit you so why wouldn't you put all of that effort all of the effort it seems like you're making this whole blueprint to do to defraud someone to scam someone i don't put it towards good i hear what you're saying but i don't feel like like i talked to the like I he still was struggling with how it was illegal you know like I don't think he entered into it thinking it was illegal what I think he genuinely thought the in let's face it you've talked to people before right you you know how how naive people are they're like they're

like oh I got divorced and my wife kept the car and so let's say you pull someone's credit I can't tell you I mean this has happened pull somebody's credit and they're like it's like you've had three 30 days late late on your on your Ford motor car vehicle or your Ford motor car loan oh no no no no that's not mine that's my that's my wife's no bro it's on your credit are you both on the account says it's in your name only like it's not a joint account it's yours it's no no no but we got divorced three years ago and the the judge awarded her the car so that's her responsibility yeah but it's on your credit yeah I know but I mean it's not mine no bro the judge doesn't work for Ford Motor Credit. So the judge can say that, but guess what? If she doesn't

pay, it's going to go on your credit. Oh, no, but the court said, stop it, man. It's like everybody thinks, oh, no, they're all working together. No, you now have three 30-day lates on your credit. But this is bullshit. Yeah, it is. But it's also keeping you from getting a loan. My point is that's why I think this guy was saying, I told them I would be responsible for the payments. I would. They have a lease with me. I'm responsible now. But you don't get to you don't get to take the responsibility away from from them. They borrowed from Bank of America. Bank of America wants them. And they don't get to say, oh, wait, Bank of America. I signed a lease. It's now John's responsibility. That's not how it works. He and his mind thought like the husband, oh, no, no,

I signed a lease. So it wasn't their responsibility. No, no. So he still was sure. struggling like, I don't understand. I don't think I did anything wrong. I don't this. You know, I had a lease with them. I was responsible. And then I got over my head and that happens, you know. And then I needed that money that was coming in to pay my bills. So I took that money to pay my bills. Like, listen to the first year, it was doing great until I bought that $2 million house and I bought that Lamborghini. I got a little bit over over my head. I thought it, you know, because once people start doing well for two months, they think it's going to last forever. Oh, man. Get it did. I hit it big.

It's going to last forever. Listen, if I have a good YouTube month, I got to tell myself every day. If I have a good month where it's like, wow, you're going to make a good decent check this month. I got to tell myself, bro, man, it's Christmas or, you know, it's, I'll look up like, why is this happening? Like, and there's like, oh, it just happened to be this month is the best month of the year. You know, next month, it's starvation. me and J.T. talk about this all the time where you'd be like, yeah, man, like YouTube will will make you believe that you should quit your job. I did quit my job. This is my full-time

job. You know, at least for us, like we, we have jobs. So it's like, so it's like, oh, man, look, you had a great month. And, and I, and, you know, me personally, I'm more, I'm very cautious, right so when it when it comes to like money and when it comes to you know if it's too good to be true it probably is you know so for me when I see like oh wow YouTube is doing great I'm like it's a cautious eye to me because it's like yeah this is only going to last for like one month maybe two months and then and then truly it does you know you know how YouTube goes it's like it's a roller coaster like you know so you may have a good month and then the next month is down or you may have good two months and then it's and then it's then it just goes you know down for hill from

there so we talk about that all the time and how you can't get tricked by the system here listen and i've had months where i'm like man i got like these four videos and they're amazing every one of them gets like 12 000 you're like what the hell and then i'll i'll talk to some crackhead who who ran outran the police four times and can't can't speak a coherent sentence and he gets 80 000 views ridiculous. I can barely get through the interview with this guy. You just don't, you don't know. Man, and I mean, there's a joke with creators where it's like the video that you put so much effort into that you did the everything. That video bombs. And then the video that you just like, oh, man, I just got to put something out because X, Y, Z, that's the one that's going to explode. And you're just like, scratch your head like, what? Like, it doesn't make. sense and i mean that's just the way the algorithm works listen i interviewed these got this one guy his name was um true crime kent it's got it's got a super successful spotify podcast no no video

he was so over the top funny it it i listen my like my sides are like i i couldn't stop laughing and he said and listen super dark disturbing humor yeah you know and i I would just, and he'd say stuff, we'd be talking and he'd say something. And I just suddenly just, you just see my face like, like, like, but I'd have to like bend over and be like, it took me a second. It was so disturbing. I actually for like four or five seconds, I thought, it's not what he said. I was like, no, no, that is what he said. And I was laughing so hard.

And I remember telling Colby, and usually anything we do that has violence or death or, you know, anything horrific like that, they don't do well. right typical i think it's like 70% of true crime uh true crime viewers or consumers let's say are women you know they like violent crime they like you right my guys the people that watch my channel is 92% male they like they watch my stuff for scams or for more i had to say it like this more sophisticated types of crime not no violence they're not anything i put up that has violence in it doesn't do well but this guy was so funny i was like colby this is going to be great this guy was hilarious and we interviewed him and another guy at crime con so and it did great it got like i don't know 30 40 000 views for me that's pretty good man i interview this i think it got

four thousand views what it was horrible I was like, this is the worst thing ever. Like this is, and it was, I can't even watch. I laugh so hard. Nothing did well. The shorts didn't do well. His video didn't do well. And it, you just don't, like you said, you don't know.

You just don't know, man. You just don't know. And you just like, and you'll see a video explode. And you're just like, why? I guess. Well, I, you know, like, and it, but it always works. way in a video that I'm just like I'm inspired to do I really really wanted to do it and it just doesn't it just doesn't do well it just doesn't it just doesn't like it I

don't know why that works that way and why it's uh it and I've talked to tons of YouTubers and all of them say the same thing say like yeah man that video that blew up I almost didn't upload it or it was a video that I really didn't even want to do and I just I was in a rush and I did it and like it's not even what I know what i normally do it's all that man it's just it's crazy i was just say i had a video the other day oh that grant cardone one the guy that came from grant cardone oh yeah yeah he used to be with grant i saw that video came here like he was like he flew in or i think he drove in i don't think he lives that far for me so he drove in said hey i'll drive in all this we talked on the phone for

30 minutes and i thought that's probably pretty good like grant cardone is going to get me some views just because of the name. We did the interview and I kind of like, it's not crime related. It's not, not that it wasn't a bad interview. It was more like a Joe Rogan interview. It's like he's just kind of talking about. So it's not a really true crime. So I thought, eh, it's probably going to do okay.

I think it got 30, 35. I think, actually, I think it got maybe 40,000 views in the first 24 hours. That's insane. Insane for my channel, but I was going to say, but you're right. Like I, I, we had two or three good months and I told Colby, my editor, I was like, listen, I'm doing this full time. He's like, in the look on his face, I'm all lit. This guy's super conservative. Like he's got, he's got a daughter. He's got, um, he's got another, another kid on the way. I don't know if it's a girl or a boy. He's married his high school sweetheart. Like my wife thinks he is the sweetest guy, you know, I'm almost positive.

he's super conservative he grew up like in lakeland you know what i'm saying like he's right right he's really a small town um i'm definitely probably the the worst influence of anyone he's ever met and everybody that walks in the door he's he's like because look at his face with some of these guys start talking it's just like like oh my god what did that guy just say so um but i told colby yeah colby i said like i'm gonna do this full time he was like you i see he didn't say anything He, but the look on his face was like, feel like you're jumping the gun, but okay, let's hear it. And I was like, look, here's what we're going to do. We've been putting out, we've been taking one long video and splitting it, putting out two hour videos a week.

But people hate that. They hate, you know, a lot of, I get a lot of hate for breaking up the same interview and putting it out in parts. So I said, here's what I'm going to do. We're going to do the one long video and just put out that video. He said, okay. I said, and I'm going to start doing three stream yards a week. So we'll be putting out four videos a week. That should be on average.

That should be eight videos or eight hours a week. And that should bring our numbers straight up. Right. And I said, and then this was all I'm going to do. And I mean, you know, he just didn't give me the confidence that I felt he should have. I was so confident. I did say he was conservative. I didn't need his confidence, but still, it would have been nice, you know?

It's like when you get a good haircut and you're like, man, I got a good haircut. And your girl goes, I need you to say. I mean, I feel like it's good, but it'd be nice if your girl kind of jumped in there. It is a great. You did get a gray hair. Like, get it. But I still. Yeah, but I also think, but I also think as so me personally, um,

J.T. the same way. He's an accountant or CPA, right? He's financial guy. I'm a financial guy. Accountant, degree in accounting. Just numbers wise. Like, I'm more, I'm just, I'm just, and based of my job, I'm just a conservative person. So I'm just, uh, it's, I would, I think I've never, never just jumped into something and was like, yep, I'm just going to do it. I've just eased my way. So I can see he probably was just like, like, can we take this a little bit slower? but listen it did work out but there have been some months it did it did there have been some months where i've been like man i hope a speaking gig comes along i'm right i'm gonna have to pull out some money on my on my credit card or pull out of my savings account or you know to pay

and i've done that a few times where you're pulling a thousand dollars out of your savings account to pay your bills and then this check hits and you you pay it back and there've been a few months what i didn't even pay it all that's like well well here's the thing that And a lot of times people believe that, I mean, you know, every, every, every kid nowadays wants to be a content creator or influencer. So everyone, you know, based on if you go online, it's super easy. And once you get started and you give it, you know, three months, then then you're making millions, you know. You know, that's, that's really what, what you see on social media. So, you know, it's, I try to tell people like the content creation, I love it.

I really do because I'm personally doing something that I truly enjoy. It's either talk on camera or talk my friend's ears off to their bleed in real estate. So it's, it's for me, it's great, right? But I can only imagine if you talked about something that you're not passionate about or that you just jumped on a train and are you have to do hours and hours of research before you do a video, like it would be draining. And coffee zilla style. Oh, no way.

I just, I could, I cut it. Like the amount of death that he goes into research is. I mean, so that's the reason why he has a million plus subs and I get it. Great. I mean. Yeah, but how many, how many coffee zillas have tried that formula and it didn't work? Oh, tons. You know?

I mean, he is great at it. He's great at it. But I'll bet you there have been a bunch of guys that tried the same thing and it just didn't. Of course. Of course. So much of this content creation is trends, time, luck. Like, there's just a lot of things that kind of just, and we just talked about it. Like, you make a video and it doesn't perform and then you make a video that you didn't think was going to do anything. Like, you didn't even plan for that. That's not even something that you put out there to explode. It just happens. So a lot of this stuff is just like consistency is really big. And I know, I know it's like that's one of the big thing that a lot of the YouTube. guru guys say is like consistency and everybody rolls their eyes but consistency is really a thing content creation like you definitely have to be consistent i i like i liken it to youtube has figured out a way to get content creators to run networks for them for free yes you know

and you know and what they want if you think about any network when you were growing up that on tuesdays they run you know this is going to date me barney miller comes on on two you don't even know what barney miller is your three young um so uh let's say uh the what's on that right now i know whatever 20 well what was on 20 years ago the the show 24 like so on tuesdays that comes out on right and then on thursday they run you know this other series that comes out right so it's it's every time the same series the same rough length like obviously it doesn't have to be the exact same time and it doesn't have to be the exact 42 minutes every time you know It could be roughly, roughly an hour, a little bit higher, a little bit lower.

So, but that's what they want you to do consistently. If you're putting out two or three or four pieces of content a week, then you need to be doing it consistently. And after a year or so, they'll reward you. Once you're monetized, and everybody's like, oh, should I monetize? You want to monetize as quick as possible, in my opinion, because it gives YouTube an incentive to push your stuff. Pushing something that's demonetized that they can't run an ad on, that doesn't help them. you know what helps them is that they can put commercials on your stuff and then they'll push it more so there's all these little things that can help you but in the end you can follow all of those and in

three years you have a thousand subscribers right or maybe it's a hundred thousand but it's true like you just it's true but if you don't try at all you'll never get it if you don't try it all that you don't have a chance you have zero chance that and that is that is a hundred percent true and so i try to tell people all the time like just start just start yeah you know but you know i get it i mean i'm pretty sure you've told tons of people to do that and they just like oh okay well i'm always like look even if it's shitty a shitty listen you know how bad when i talked to danny on concrete and he gave me that advice he gave me this advice which we talked about before we were on air yeah where he told me i i can't tell you for sure but i feel like this is going to be a

big video you really need to start a youtube channel and put some content out and he even told me And I was like, oh, I don't put it out. It'll be crappy. It'll be this. He's like, use your iPhone. And I was like, my iPhone, what are you talking? That's ridiculous. I don't want to do that.

It's going to be horrible. And he even told me, even if you put it out and it's horrible, that can work for you. And I was like, why? He goes, because in a year from now, when you have the right equipment and you're putting out quality stuff, people will be able to look back and see your old stuff and say, wow, look how far this guy has come. People want to follow you on your journey. and people are going to want to root for you.

He was 110% correct. He was. And it was the best piece of advice that I completely ignored to my detriment. I mean, not that I'm doing bad now, but I mean, like I said, I could have had half a million or a million subscribers right now if I had started just 18 months earlier, a year earlier, when he told me to do it. It's crazy how that works. And he would, like you said, he was 100% correct. if you would have had someone to some some some some content out there for people to attach to after you did those interviews and stuff man you would have killed it killed you do you know who jessica kent

is no no so she's this chick that went to jail right drug addict selling drugs um you know drug act drug dealer uh was pregnant went to prison got sentenced had a baby in prison you know baby goes to foster care she gets out of prison she gets the kid back she starts a YouTube channel just about her journey which sounds ridiculous right I always thought how silly that sounds like my journey you my journey of being a drug addict yes because there's people there are drug addicts out there that that will connect with you and when I was growing up there weren't there wasn't there wasn't a market like this where you could connect and now you can be any derelict out there we'll find a community you can you can say hey I collect smurf little tiny smurf dolls

and you could start a channel and probably make $100,000 because people collect those little sports or maybe they collect beanie babies or maybe they collect something like as insane as that is maybe it's Star Wars figures there's probably some guy who's got a million subscribers right now talking about Star Wars figures from 1980s. It's insane.

So anyway, what go ahead? I have just to add on to that when I first, even before I got into YouTube, I used to see all of these channels and force them and a lot more since I've done. been in YouTube. I've just seen tons of these. I just got out of jail. This is what happens in prison. These are the rep. This is what we do in prison. This is the music. This is how we get cell phones into the prison. Like I've seen so many of these videos pop. And you go look at the

person's subscribers and look at channel. A million subs. Yeah. Half a million. And he's just like, I'm scratching my head. Like it. And it's because of the connection. I don't connect. I've never been to prison or jail so it's just like what who would want to know that like but i get it it's it's the community yeah well especially for her because she's a girl yes right so that's an even even she's it's even more of a niche you had a baby you're a mother you got your your your kid back that's even more of a niche and she talks about the first time she did a video she like thought about it for the longest time finally sat down put my sat in the corner of a room she said it took her three I think she said I'm sure I'm wrong on this like three hours to end up making a 10 minute video because she said I kept didn't like the way the angle was didn't like the way I looked didn't like the way I sounded didn't like the fact that I kept saying uh um didn't like what I said she's like literally finally I got so frustrated I just sat it down and just rambled out for 10 or 15 or 20 minutes whatever it was and put the video up and she said immediately started getting people that were

liking it and interested in watching and then i put out another one and then i put out another one then she's like and then it just blew up and she's got like i don't know what she's got like a million subscribers now she's got saying i forget how many on tick talk and she's just massively huge probably making 30 000 40 000 a month you know she's and what's so funny is like you know her her life i think about six months ago kind of melted down she kind of like a melt down or her fiance it and put all that on the on it too it's like oh my god like all the things that you hide in the 80s and 90s now you just air out on youtube for views for views and get paid for it never have thought that growing up you know so it is insane these guys with the prison channels talking about how how they

make a stinger and and heat up their soup you know with a stinger and how do you charge your cell phone in prison without a charger and how do you god that thing you know how to make a how to make a knife like i have to admit that is it i mean even like those those just as you were saying it saying it it does sound interesting because it's like for for a person who's never been to jail or any of it it's like how do you do those things when you have no resources like it is interesting i mean i I do get that, see that point in it, but. I've been to prison. Yeah, man.

So I can imagine if, if someone who's been in that type of community, they're just like, they connect with that person and be like, yeah, this is what we used to do. You know, it's kind of like going to being in high school. Like, you know, you're just like, yeah, this is what we did in high school. And it brings back those memories, you know, X, Y, Z, you know, I totally get it. I hear you, but I don't get it at all. Like, I can't stand watching those videos. I mean, I can't, me personally, I, I understand the intrigue, but me personally, too, I just, it's just not my thing.

It's not like, yeah, I'm not sitting here watching prison video, like, but people in, they love them. Yeah. So, wait, let's, that's what, let's, what about, let's talk about, we're so off, off, uh, kilter, off the subject. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we are. What about what, what do you think, how do you feel about the current, um, um, what, what do you think, how do you feel about the current, um, economy or I guess not the economy but real estate the what's happening in real estate right now you feel like well I mean that you you were correct first the economy is literally affecting the housing market but you know in general the the housing market is in shambles right now it's it's super unaffordable and where

you at I'm in St. Louis okay go ahead sorry so you know it's just super expensive all nationwide so So you have inflation that's killing everything. Most people go into the grocery store and they can't afford what they afforded two, three years ago. I mean, I'm pretty sure you've seen meat, chicken, steak, all of that stuff is high, eggs, everything is high. Not to talk about gas, energy, everything is high. Everything is high because of inflation. and then the interest rates, which are already high now, too, individuals can't pay because Americans, we love monthly payments. We love monthly payments. So before, individuals were okay

with paying a high price for a home, but they were getting it in a package of a two to three percent, four percent interest rate, and that made it palable to them. They were like, ah, I could do that. I could do that so long my monthly payments are this but now that the interest rates are at you know seven eight percent now people are just like I'm out of this and so now you have low demand you have low demand with the supply gaining traction here and so you having a lot of properties that sit on the market way longer than they were two years ago I mean if you go to the condo market in Florida I mean properties are staying on the market for 180 days without out even with having three people look at them.

Like no one wants to touch this stuff and because not only do that people, is it too expensive, but everyone's afraid if they purchase, then the values will drop also. So you're going to buy a house at a, at a high interest rate and it's and it's overpriced. But then in two years, you may lose, lose some money on that house too. It's just too risky. Yeah, I was going to say a lot of people, um, one, they might want to move but they're not going to move like it's funny i actually did a video the other day where the guy was talking about moving in miami so i the guy came here he's

he has a youtube channel he's like hey i'm thinking about moving to miami i'm done he actually was basically saying i'm moving to miami and his producer was here and i was like oh are you going with him he said i now i can't i can't move i was like why he's like i got like a 2% interest rate on my house he's like i'm not going to say he's like i would go i wouldn't mind going. He said, but I mean, I'm, I'm going to, what, get out of? I'm going to sell my house at 2%. He's like, that's, he's like, no, he's like, there's no way. It's like, I'm not, he's like to move across the country. He said, and I don't want to rent it out because I'm not going to be down the street. So, you know, I can't rent it out because I'm going to, I want to be close to a rental

if I have it because I don't have, what am I to pay property management company? He was, and he was going back and forth and he had all these reasons and they were all like all valid reasons. So there's a whole slew of people that are just sitting tight on their 2% interest rates and are not going to they're not going to move they're not going to even if it's go up or down they're just going to sit there like they're never going to be able for this house at this price again because they've got a 2% interest rate and they know they'll get a 6.5% now and they don't want to do that no no and not it's not just the 6.5 it's 6.5 plus if you bought your house let's say you bought your house 10 years ago and it was a $200,000 house, right? That house is at least a $400,000 house now,

$500,000 house. So are you going to not only get hit on the interest rate, but also get hit on the amount of money that you're going to have to take out to loan? The purchase price is way higher, way higher. And a lot of the, and a lot of people are in a situation where a lot of seniors fixed income where where are they going to go you know right yeah it's just it's just a very very very tough market and i had on my channel i have been telling people i don't know two years ago hey look this is what's going to happen and now we're here and people are just all surprised but it's to me it was very easy to see obviously because i'm in this is my this is my job that i'm in the industry so i totally get it but it was just it was obvious that

when the government was pumping all of the money into the economy, like it's gonna stop somewhere. There's no way for people to continue to stuff their pockets with money and the spending that was going. I mean, the ridiculous amount of spending. I mean, let's be honest. People, Walmart was running out of toilet tissue.

Like, I mean, let's be real here. How far do you think, how much longer do you think we could do that where everything is running out. It's not it's that's not going to and for some odd reason a lot of the pundits, a lot of these real estate agents really thought this was going to last for the next 10 years, five years. Oh, it's going to run up. So you better buy now. Because if you don't buy now, if you don't buy today, then you're going to lose out on the on the greatest wealth generation. Yeah, I honestly, I shocked that it didn't crash a year or two ago. You know, like I like a year,

year like 18 months ago I was like well more like see about three years ago when I started interviewing people that's right I was like you got about a year to 18 months what's been three years it's just now starting to you know trickle down and really the prices haven't dropped too dramatically it's just that the inventory like they've dropped a little bit but the inventory is what's on is what's staying and that's just an indicator that guess what now they're going to start like and they are dropping but not as significantly as I'm sure in a year six months to a year from now those people that kind of have to sell maybe now they are desperate to sell yeah and so they really start making those cuts because things go wrong in people's lives

they get divorced they retire let's say you're retiring and you don't have your house paid for well you can't afford that house anymore you know you just went from now you're on social security, you retired, and your $5,000 a month just got cut to $2,100. You've got to move. You don't have a choice, even if you have to take $100,000 hit on your house. That's what you've got to do because otherwise the bank will take your house. Yeah, right now the commercial side is seeing that huge drop where you're seeing 50, 60, 70% price decreases. So that's where the huge drop is happening right now. And I'm trying to inform everybody to let people know that you have to really look at this and understand that it's going to affect the residential. Because what a lot of people don't really

understand is that a lot of those business districts, they all eat off of each other. So if you have an office building that's there, when people go to lunch, where do they go? They go to the Starbucks that's right there. They go to the restaurant that's in that business district. Well, now that those office buildings are vacant, now no one's going to go to that restaurant anymore. So that restaurant closes down. And then now that that business owner doesn't have any money coming in, how is he going to afford the house? So then he loses his house. It's just, it's a domino effect. And I'm trying to inform my viewers and anyone who will listen that you just have to read between the lines. And all of this stuff is interconnected. It's just not a stay in your own lane scenario.

I was going to say the aren't I looked it up honestly maybe a month ago were like the top 10 cities that had like 20 30 40 percent vacancies in these cities themselves you know um commercial vacancies are like like half the buildings are are 30 percent empty 40 percent empty yeah San Francisco it was outrageous right uh and I I just um yeah I can't I can't imagine that like half the buildings are just vacant and that they wouldn't be dropping their prices dramatically to try and get people in those buildings. Like, you're just going to leave them, you're just going to leave them empty? Well, the problem is, is that if you bought a building for half a million dollars, or no, if you bought a building for, I'm sorry, for half a billion dollars, for 500 million, it's a big skyscraper, right? And it's in the middle of San Francisco. Well, you have, there's a certain number that you have to to make to make those mortgage payments now if you realize that with you have a 60% vacancy even if you cut those those not that number in half or what

you used to rent let's say you was renting renting for for $10,000 a month and now you're going to say I'm going to give people a deal at $5,000 a month even if you got to a hundred percent you still couldn't make the mortgage payments at $5,000 that's the problem people bought the properties at an overvalued price and they no matter what they do if they don't make the if they don't if they don't charge your tenants this number which is probably market rate or more they can't make the payments anyway so the only thing they can do is hand the keys back to the bank that's it they can't do anything else who I think I don't how many how many buyers of half a billion dollar real estate are there not many a lot

Right. You got what maybe in the United States, maybe 40, 50 outlets, and all of them are super smart and all of them have the same data and understand, oh, you're in a predicament. How about we just wait until you give it back to the bank and then we buy it cheaply from them? I was going to say one I would go I would go to the bank and try and renegotiate like you're either getting this place back now or we're going to renegotiate um I was going to say what do you think now that we're talking about commercial real estate what do you think about Trump's being charged Trump Trump's Trump's Trump's charge of the fraud charge where they're talking about the go ahead yeah where he's been I forget what the actual number where he said hey the hotel's worth 800 million they came back and said eh we think it's worth 700 million they lend them the money he makes the payments he pays them back and now he was you know obviously he lost the case where they came in and they said oh you tried to defraud them out of 100 million dollars because i said it was worth i thought it was worth 900 000 they said yeah that's fraud that's not fraud that's every single person out here in real estate i think it's worth yeah i'll be honest i mean like like is it fraud i would have to look more deeply into it but i could tell you this i can tell you this i could tell you

every barber thinks that their property is is valued more than what it is I speak how much do you think your property's worth sir oh my property is definitely worth five million but you bought it for half a million last year what did you do nothing I didn't do anything to it but you have to understand that this happened and this happened this happened around the area and it's worth this much right well I don't think it's going to it's worth that much well I do I get that all the time That's why you send out an appraiser. Of course. That's just the rule of thumb.

You come in and say, I want this is what I think it's worth. Why? Because this hotel sold for this and we have 100 more rooms. This one sold for this, but we're on the beach. All these things that you are kind of like, I think it's worth 800,000. And the truth is they're like, yeah, those are great, but they're not worth, you know, it would be worth 600,000. That brings it up to about seven, but not eight.

and you know that's what the appraiser determines but yeah just like you said listen i sold cars one time for six months it's horrible uh every person that came in i'd say oh how's well how's your trade and they go oh it's great i go any damage no no no no damage is a perfect condition and you would walk out there and as you're walking around it's like what about this ding what about this oh yeah i forgot about that what about this you know this thing oh god that was my daughter drove it i been that I happened. That was like a year ago. I never even noticed that. You're right. You're right. I don't think they're committing fraud. I just think they kind of forgot about it. And, you know, but that's, so that that that bothers me that every real estate agent out there does the same exact thing. Every homeowner does the same thing. They put your house on the market for 300,000. You ended up taking a taking 250,000 because that's what the bank said it was worth. Right. Did you just, were you trying to defraud them out of $50,000? No. You're just trying to get the most. right you're just trying to get the most right so yeah i i see that all the time and it's and it's my job it's my job to figure out what the value is and we do our reports and everything like that

to to figure out what the price is for the value of it and so i mean that's just kind of the underwriting underwriting way so as far as you know was he defrauding or not i mean i mean probably not i mean he's probably doing what everybody else does i don't know that for a limited time at McDonald's, enjoy the tasty breakfast trio. Your choice of chicken or sausage McMuffin or McGrittles with a hash brown and a small iced coffee for five bucks plus tax. Available until 11 a.m. at participating McDonald's restaurants. Price excludes flavored iced coffee and delivery. The extreme details of it, but based off of what you just told me, like, yeah, I just, I mean, I see that all the time.

I probably see it two times today. Listen, it would be different if he provided fraudulent documentation. Like, now there's something different. You went out and you created fraudulent documentation or you, now you've, now, there's a problem. You see what I'm saying? Then I'd be like, hey, yeah, that was, that's, no, you can't do that. Like, you can't start providing. I totally understand that.

To boost your value or what if he provided, you know, fake leases for properties that were. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've seen, I've seen that happen before, too, where, where individuals will provide me a lease. I just had a deal recently where, you know, the, the landlord told me or the owner told me that, you know, this property is leased up or whatnot. And we sent someone out there to do inspections. And when we went inside the building, I mean, it was like the building was down to studs. Like a couple of a couple of units down the studs. And I'm like, what's going on here? He's like, oh, you know, we have at least, but we haven't fixed it up yet. And I'm

I'd be like, well, that'd been nice for you to let us know that. So those lunas aren't leased. No, they are leased. No, no one can live in it. It's not livable. Yeah. You know, so I see stuff like that all the time. And, you know, it's a definitely trust and verify scenario, you know.

Yeah. Yeah, they're trying to offset their, you know, the debt to income ratio or what the value of the property is by providing false leases or backdating. Exactly. You know, exactly. Like that's exactly. And the thing is a lot of these guys think that they can get away with it because, I don't know, they just think a lot. And I say this all the time. And there's, you know how you said that sometimes people are naive. I mean, you, we have attorneys, Dennis, doctors, and they're horrible. When I say they're horrible, they're horrible with their finances. They don't know, they, they, they, they, you ask them what their credit score is and they'd be like, what? I haven't ran that thing in 10 years. Like, like, they have no idea what, when it comes to their, when it comes to their finances. Hey, what's this?

What's that? I don't know. What, what is that? Well, it's your finances. That's what I'm asking you. What, what happened here? I don't even remember that happening. Like, I see it so many times where you have these individuals who you believe would be, you know,

they're having these great professions, right? And you would think that they'd be up and up on their finances. But out of all the clients, I deal with professionals, accountants probably are the worst because you expect more from them because they deal with numbers, but they're really bad. You doctors, attorneys, it just goes on and on where you just say like, what? You don't keep up on this stuff? And they're like, no. The worst. Can you give me your tax returns?

Hmm. I don't know. I have to find those. he's like what the worst listen the worst credit i ever saw ever um which was still maintained other than somebody who let everything go but this is a guy who's maintaining his credit was a doctor and i mean he had like you've got credit cards for 40,000 50,000 and you've got late payments for 19 for 30 dollars and i'm like you've got a 60 day late for 19 then 32 then like Like, you literally went, you know, then, then, you know, $42.

And then you made a payment for $110. He's like, well, I mean, I just wait, you know, I don't use that credit card. So I just, I just wait until it adds up to something. Like, it's only $19. It's a 30 day late. It's $19. It's a 30 day late for $19. You make $200,000 plus a year.

What are you doing? Like, you would have to work, you'd have to, this is so bad. You'd have to actually work to make it this bad without getting your credit card shut off. Yep. but he was a doctor he got a lot of leeway from like the credit union and stuff but they did keep digging him 30 days 60 90 and this went on for like he had like five years worth of it that was just horrific and and i was just like this is i mean you have like a 505 credit or like a 480 credit score like you're a fucking doctor bro like you've got a hundred thousand dollar

mercedes that you know it doesn't even make sense like how they all have nice cars one thing that I see you know that it's not like he couldn't pay the $19 right you're just like are you serious yeah I've seen a dollar dollar late I've seen $10 late payments I saw just recently someone came and they had 25 late on on one on one credit card I just think to myself like but but then when I look at their personal financial statement It shows that they have $60,000 in cash in their account. And you're just like, what? Like make this make sense.

And it just does it. And, you know, and, you know, that's just the industry I see. I just see so much bad financial choices. And so for me, when I see a lot of the stuff online and I just deal with it every day, it's super easy for me to be like, look, what are you guys doing? Just do this, do this, do that. and stay on track, you know. So, yeah, it's tough.

Yeah, I, yeah, I don't know. I, you know, what I, you know, what I love is that they do that and then they go, you know, it's like you realize that your, it wasn't, it's only 19 bucks. It wasn't worth making the payment. Like, I'll just wait. Right. It adds up to something. That just was a difference between, and this was back 20 years ago, that's like the difference

between you getting a six and a half interest rate. And if I can get you alone at all now, you're like 11% and 20% as opposed to putting down 5% on your house and now you're putting down 20%. Like the amount of money that costs you was outrageous. That's stupid decision. And the funny thing about it is those are the guys who are going to fight me tooth and nail on interest rate. Those are the guys who are going to fight me and say, say, what are you doing? Did you know I could, you know, I could go? And I'm like, you can't go anywhere, man.

What are you talking about? My buddy, my buddy Jimmy got a got a 6.2 and you're telling me it's seven and a half. Like, did your buddy Jimmy pay his car payment late three, three months in a row? Does your buddy, you start to, I would hammer him. I'd be like, yeah, you need to go talk to Jimmy. See where he, where he. Yeah, that's what I say all the time. Please tell, ask your buddy, buddy, your next door neighbor.

They always, their cousin, their next door neighbor, they all have better rates. And they told me that what I what they expect and and I'm not getting it. And it's like, well, just go show your neighbor your credit report. See what he says. Right. I don't want to do that. Of course not. I just always, this is funny too because I'm sure it wasn't just my experience with my

brokers. I used to tell him like if the guy comes in the door and he's a problem, he's talking about the interest rate, talking about the application fee, talking about that, you know, he's complaining about this complaining about if he's complaining from the very beginning to do yourself a favor draw a hard line in the sand and don't cross it tell him right then this is what the rate is well i'm not paying that i'm that i understand i'm sorry i can't lower it well can you work on it a little bit no can you work on your interest rate right or can you work on the uh what about the application for you that's just a made up feat i understand but that's what the guy

that owns this place charges i've never seen him drop it i mean i can ask but i tell you right now i'll walk in the other room he's going to say no well what what's up would you your broker fee, that's my broker fee. I don't lower that. It's set. It's scheduled. That's what the set fee is. I do not. Well, you can work on a little bit. No, I can't. And they were like, why why not work on a little bit? I said, if the guy sits down when he's begging for the money and he's paying the ass, he will be a nightmare by the time you get to closing. You're better off not dealing with him. It's the guy that walks in and is like, yeah, that's cool. Okay, that's it. That's it. Okay. No, I get it. I understand. I understand. I should.

That guy's a joy to work with. I'll wait for that guy to come in as opposed to the guy that's bitching and moaning because by the time you get to closing, he's been a nightmare. And trust me, you cut your fee, you waive the application fee, you cut this, you did this, you've bent over backwards. You're the one collecting the documents he's supposed to be getting. And by the end, I promise you that fee isn't worth it. I always say my saying is that you make your money on the deals you don't do. That's what I say. and and and and and what i mean by that is exactly what you said all the problem people and there's

tons and we and you know you know how many deals you say no to to how many deals you say yes to it's just it's the number the percentage is high right so it's a high percentage right so for me i see tons and tons and tons and tons of deal and i say no no no no no no no to majority of them right And the ones that I say yes to, you know, if, if I say yes to you and then I'm talking to you and then you're going to be, you're going to make it hard for me. And I just move on. Yeah. I just move on. Well, let's go go go speak to someone else. Like, because obviously you don't want the money. And, and especially if they're a problem trying to got hair all on the deal and stuff like that and you're trying to work with them and they don't want to work with you, then go work with someone else. What, you know, what's funny about that is that if you do that from the very beginning, you draw that hard line. No, this is what it is.

I understand. You know, I'm not trying to be difficult. This is just the way it is. I understand. Well, I mean, maybe you should go to Bank of America. I get that. Like, I understand. I mean, this is what we specialize in.

I don't think you're going to do very well. But this is it. None of that has changed you. If you draw that hard line, it's almost like a bully. If you stand up to him and kind of punch him in the face, he typically is like, okay, bro. Well, yeah, I just thought, that's cool. And then he start, they, they, sometimes they walk, but sometimes they step in line and they're not a problem anymore, especially if it's like, they call you up, hey, bro, this and this and this, can we this? because no no that's so much easier than well man i don't think i can make the deal then you can't make

the deal work i totally get it i understand i have other clients that aren't going to be a problem no i'm good i'll i'll meet the guy i can it's fine it yeah that's okay click they pretty quick you don't have to do it much for them to start realizing okay i can't bully this guy i can't i'm not going to get my way it's super important man yeah super important and and so i really push push that i just don't really play i got man i'm too busy to be sitting here dealing with oh you don't want to do this you know okay man just just go to Wells Fargo all right go to Wells Fargo you know Wells Fargo kicked me out two months ago you know my credit union said no I do know I saw the inquiries you've been to four places

you already know you got nowhere to go right ain't that the truth so I'm actually going to do a real estate course where I oh you know so this is try not to laugh it's okay you can laugh I didn't just try not um I saw it in your face there was a split second where you wanted to grin but you were like don't do it don't do it um it was a slight second I was like oh okay but I but I uh you know when I was in real when I was in when I was in when I was in prison I taught the what they called the residential real estate class I taught it for 10 years It's funny. It's fine.

I know it's funny. I was there for bank. I'm listening. But it was so, you know, like I saw, it's like I have it down. The only thing I need to probably, you know, kind of look back into was your new construction. You know, some of the new construction things that honestly, I don't really zoning and stuff, but I don't think zoning is really cheap. But then zoning is a little different, slightly different, any county you go to.

So other than the new construction and, you know, permitting and that sort of thing, I kind of probably need to look over that again because I haven't done it in like 20 years. But I'm actually going to do a real estate course where people can buy the course. And I mentioned that because I did a video, I think the Grant Cardone video that I did that you talked about. In the middle of it, we were talking about the guy says, did he say it was so funny. he's like yeah i mean like like if you were any good at this and you were making money at it he's like you wouldn't be selling courses and i was like i actually got a course too i have a real estate course too right you know what I'm saying like like it's like well i'm not grant card on and

I'm not making out of the money and it's an easy course and it's inexpensive but yeah it's funny so i used to teach it in prison like i would go and there would be 40 guys so in in prison they have something called an ace courses adult continuing education courses and i think they're supposed to be taught by the staff but you know there's a they they don't pay the staff extra to teach the courses so they let the inmates teach them and you have a staff member that's over courses which never comes into it doesn't know what i'm teaching so i used to have these guys go in and they would it'd be 40 of these guys in there and And it was the first couple courses, first couple, you know, the entire thing, whatever, it was like an eight week, eight or 12 weeks.

Let's say eight weeks. So the first eight weeks or I don't know what you want, semesters, I don't know, quarters. So the first few quarters that I did, listen, after like the third quarter, that class was packed. I mean, packed. Oh, these guys were walking up to me after class and shaking my hand, bro, the Cox, that was a good course. That was a good course. I was like, it was a good class, bro. It's a good class.

Like I, and then guys start coming to me saying, what do you teach it in that class? And I'm like, what do you mean? Go, my cellie's taking your class right now. He walked in the other day, Wednesday night. He came, walked in, put his book down and said, bro, I'm going to be a millionaire when I get out. This guy, I've been taking Cox's course. He's like, what? He's like, yeah.

Like, he's like, this guy thinks that you are a guru, bro. Like he, and I was just being suit. said super honest like look you're going to need money you're going to need this this is how this works this is not hard to do you know but it takes time you have to be able to realize that I'm doing this now because in two years I'm going to walk into a bank and I have to provide these documents so from the for instance one of the things I would tell them was this is funny and this is residential not commercial obviously but one of the things was like like who's getting out of here and they're going to move in with their their mom or they're a family member

and they'd all raise their hand and I say okay I get it I say so in two years from now you want to buy a house right you want to be able to borrow money from the bank right right I said so is your mom going to make you pay rent and they'd be like no no she won't make payment right I go right so in two years when you walk in and you apply for the loan and they say okay we need two years worth of residence residential you know history where you've lived and how much you paid and you're going to say oh, I live with my mom. I said, guess what? You don't get the loan. You don't get the loan. You don't get it. And they're like and they're like, what? Well, uh, well, what if I, so, so you're saying tell tell them that I pay my mom, whatever, $500 a month. I'm like, right. Is your mom a management

company? No. So they're not going to accept a letter from your mom saying, first of all, they're not I can accept the letter from your mom. Second, two, even if it was a management company, you know, she's not the management company. You have to have a management company to verify that you rent this place and you're paying it every month. And then you don't have to provide the checks. But it's got to be a licensed management company. And I'm like, and you don't have that.

They're like, right. They're like, dang, bro, so what are you saying? I got to go rent a place. Right. Well, we don't have any money. I was like, no. You can pay your mother $500. So every, on the first of every month, you write a check for $500.

You give it to your mom. You let her cash a check. And I said, I know what you're thinking. She's going to be like, oh, sweetie, that's so nice. If you said, no, no, mom, cash a check. Give me my 500 buck back. But you get your, you get your, you've got your canceled check for $500 saying January rent. Right.

And you collect them every month. And that way, and then they don't care if it's your mother. So no, no, no, no. I rent a room from my mother. I pay her. What, the loan officer is going to say, come on, man, you got, what do you got canceled checks? You're going to go, I actually do. too.

And they were like, oh, okay. And I'm like, damn, trust me, it's that there's no better verification than canceled checks. Man, don't, don't get, you know, I said, don't think, oh, I can get a receipt. A receipt doesn't mean anything. You can go buy a receipt from the dollar general store and write them up. Don't. So, you know, there were all these little things that I told them and you should see, they were just holy, oh, this is gold, you know, and it was gold.

And I was like, look, but that takes discipline. You know, and I explain the whole reason why the bank wants to know that you're paying this because, you know, that you've been preparing the whole time. So they don't care that you got out jail two years ago. You've been paying your rent on time. You've got your W2s. You've got your pay stubs. You've been putting money in the bank. You know, I did the whole thing.

If you put $20 a day in the bank and then, you know, I did the whole calculations. Like, don't be an idiot. Like, be smart about it. That's what separates, you know, winners and losers they say hey where do i want to be in two years and i have to do something every single day toward that it's not going to have to be huge but it has to be something yeah but most people think that's too much work you know that's yeah but that's that's those people end up and yeah i was going to say but that that's the thing that's what separates those people

from successful people and you know and that's fine listen somebody has to live in the projects i get it somebody has to dig bitches it's just not going to be me it's not going to be the guy that says you know what mom it's the first i'm going to write you check for 500 bucks who you deposit sure yeah of course do that you know so i kind of would go through the whole thing and and of course listen these guys would get out what was the funniest thing about that course by the way was after like a year some of these guys would sit through the court they'd stand up in the corner there was no chairs for them they'd just stand there and some of these guys i'm sorry and just listen and just listen look because they'd been through it like they'd already

taken the course once and now they're just standing through it So I would get to a point where I would, I would, I did a class on alternative financing, right? You know, owner financing, you know, hard money lending, owner financing, things of that, like, of that nature. And I would talk about, I'd say, you know, you can do this, you can do this, you know, owner financing. You can also do, you know, where guys would, I'd give them scenarios and they'd say, well, what if the person already has a mortgage on the property? I'd say, well, you can do what's called the, um, I'd go, shoot, and there'd be some guy in the back, you'd get a wrap around mortgage. And I go, a wraparound mortgage, exactly. And you can, and then I did this and this.

And, you know, what if you don't have the down payment, this and this? I'm going, well, if the lender's okay with it and not all of them are, but subprime lenders used to be okay with this. You can do what's called a, a CLTV loan where you put down 5%. The bank lends you 80 and you hold, I said, and the owner can hold a 15%. And I'd look over at somebody and go like that and they go, second mortgage. and you should see these guys would lift over and be like oh my god it was hilarious like some of these guys could teach the course yeah and the thing is is that those those things are somewhat true now but it's the it's just the percentage is a lot lower now before it used to be like that 15 percent now it's like you can get 10 10

right right still have to come up with that other 15 percent are 10 percent depending on the property type that you're purchasing so depending on the lender too right like every lender also yeah because some lenders don't allow that at all like just it's just it's you have to bring in all cash for the down payment there's no second mortgages and second mortgages aren't allowed it's just not and and and and you're thinking commercial why are you thinking residential said again are you thinking more commercial or residential oh well well that's definitely more commercial residential residential residential residential residential is hard to do that because I mean you can get an FHA loan for three and a half percent so there really is no reason to do it there any reason for a secondary mortgage or

yeah I wasn't and I wasn't thinking like conventional you know VA conventional or FHA I'm thinking I was thinking subprime because there's there are they don't call them subprimes anymore they've got another name right forget what they call them but like they're actually kind of making a comeback where they're letting you do second, it's subprime. It's the same. Oh, and it definitely is subprime. And you're right. They are making a small comeback. But I tell people all the time, those type of loans, they are risky. And I understand most of the people, and this is the truth, most of people who are getting those type of loans, they don't really have the experience to understand that that high leverage stuff, it could set you up for disaster if you don't know

what you're doing. And a lot of these guys don't know what they're doing. And they're just, especially in this flipping market, they're doing things like that where they're doing that high leverage and they don't really put into effect that the holding cost is going to come along with that. They thought that they were, they watched an HGTV special and the guy said he sold it in two weeks, you know, or one week. Right. Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, And a lot of these, I was, a lot of these I was thinking about, like, when I'm explaining it, like, alternative financing, I'm talking about, like, you know, I'm going to take over your first mortgage, put 10% down or 5% down. And then the owner can hold a 10% or a 15% set. Right.

You know, right. Well, what I'm doing is I'm just giving them extra tools that may, you know, and I explain to them too. Like, listen, bro, like, I tell you right now, I'm like, you have no. you like in a deal like this you have almost no negotiation power you virtually not like you're not you got to go in and say you want 200,000 for your house here's how I can do it don't say well I can give you 190 they're not going 190 your negotiation power is in the financing I need you to be able to I can pay you you can pay your first mortgage I need you to hold a second mortgage. I can't, you know what I'm saying? Or a wrap around mortgage with a balloon payment or you can

negotiate like that. And I said, I think a lot of times being willing to negotiate makes those or you know, makes the seller more amicable by, because you have this interaction where you're trying to make the deal work. And if it doesn't work, that's fine. But you're, you can't do that and say, oh, and I need you to replace the carpet. Oh, and you're like, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not doing that. And then you need to have an exit plan. You need to say, look, we can do an 18 month balloon payment where I promise, well, I'll have the payment paid off in 18 months. And you need a reason why you're doing this. Why am I doing this? Because, you know, I claim this much on my, I started my business two years ago, but I've only filed one set of taxes. The next set of taxes isn't due yet. And I, I'll be honest with you. I've written off a ton of stuff. And I, I'm not going to be able to get a loan from the bank. But I have perfect credit. I have the down. payment like you need to be able to answer those questions reasonably so you know I went through that whole thing but it was just amazing doing that class because I'm basically going to do the same class but I do need to look into some of it I only mention that because why we're updated right

while we've been talking my calendar thing came across and it said credit course outline so I know when we were talking it was like and I thought I need to do my credit course But yeah, I do need to And it's all residential Like I don't even try and do commercial Because I've only I've never done a commercial loan Yeah In the mortgage company it was all

We were FHA Residential Yeah it was all residential Yeah I'm a commercial guy So a lot of my stuff is It's all commercial I don't do resident unless I do residential only if it's an investment

Which is still commercial So So it's still You know I don't do primary residents Or anything like that So I stay away from that stuff yeah well a lot of the people we would do it would be like four plus you know but you know if it's four units or under then it's still residential so yeah it is it well it depends it depends

it is for i mean property type wise it is right but if you're going to um use it for an investment and not live there then it's automatically in the commercial zone right well i meant the lot like you're still getting a residential loan you can get a you can get a you can get a you can get a You can get a conventional loan on a four unit, on a quadplex. You know, you can get an FAC loan on a quadplex, but you can't get a one on a five. Okay, but the reason why you're able to do that is because you're telling the bank that you're going to live in one of those units. No, they're still in that. It's still an investment. Hey, so what did you want to talk about?

Well, I want to tell you about Wagovi. Yeah, Wagoe. What about it? On second thought, I might not be the right person to tell you. Oh, you're not? No, just ask your doctor about. Wacovi. Yeah. Ask for it by name. Okay. So why did you bring me to the circus? Oh, I'm really into lion tamers. You know, with the chair and everything. Ask your doctor for Wagovi by name. Visit wagovi.combe.

For savings. Exclusions may apply. It's no, no, no, no. It can still be an investment property. You don't have to live there. You got to put down 20% or 25 as an investment property. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. The FHA portion of it, the FHA or VA portion. of that three and a half percent, that doesn't apply to someone who is not going to live there and is just only using it for an investment. That's what I'm saying. Yeah, okay, okay, okay. Yeah. What else? Like I was going to say, like, I bought a 10 unit one time, but it was owner financing. Yeah. Yeah. Those are good, though. I mean, especially if you get a good deal on it, you know, like it can work out. It was a great deal. It was in the middle of hell. It was horrific. It was horrific.

but yeah it did it made a ton of money um that's what's about bad i love i love me some commercial multifamily man that's that's my thing i you know what else i did was uh one time we bought a property on two lots and we only bought it like i bought it for 60 or 80 000 i forget because i remember my payment was like 600 bucks a month but it was a property on two properties and we were going to bulldoze it and build two buildings things or two like two duplexes so okay for that's worth it it's going to cost 3500 bucks to scrape these things off the lot so we roughly paid 20 or you know 40,000 or 30,000 per lot we're gonna we're gonna build like two duplexes or triplexes like whatever the numbers worked right

right well we bought it and that's an old Cuban guy shows up and he shows up and he uh you know to the closing and we sign and he goes oh and I mean barely like I don't know how this guy's live in this country this whole time barely speaks english but he's like oh you follow me we go to the place and i was like okay for no no i said i've seen it and i only walked around the building i've never been inside because i'm bulldozing it i don't care what it looks like right right he said no you collect to collect the rent rents do i was like oh he's like yeah and i was like oh that's right it's a rooming house listen went knocked on the first door the person handed me and Keep in mind, this 20-something years ago.

Yeah. Handed us a check for like $350. It was his social security check. Covered the whole month's rent. So, okay. Took that. Went to the next door. The guy gave us like, gave me 85 bucks.

Went to the next door. Guy gave, like, it was like 75 bucks or something. Right. Next door, 80 bucks. Next door, 65. Next door, 75. next door 85 next door we're going through one place gave me he paid 115 because he had a kitchen and a bathroom right in his room still not a big like these are not these are these are basically bedrooms regular bedrooms some of them are very small like like half the size of a normal kids bedroom where you barely fit a bed and a dresser in there and they're paying 75 bucks as we're going for 14 rooms 14 rooms and I went when I was done I had collected like if 1400 because of the one checked

it was 350 and you know so it was like 1400 something in cash except for one check and I said how often do you collect this and he said well I'd only collect the 350 once it wasn't it was like 357 or 342 whatever wasn't even and he's like I only collect that once but normally yeah He said I collect about like $1,100 or $1,100 or something like that every week. What? Every week. And my, listen, my, my mortgage payment was like $6.50, including the insurance. Right.

I remember I turned around. So suddenly now I'm serious. Now I'm like, now I'm grabbing a paper going, okay, room number one was how much? Now I actually started writing it because I thought I'm evicting all these. Google right we're going to come in here and just evict of everybody said i was tear down the whole place i drove straight back to my business partner i said we're not we're not we're not pull those in that place because what are you talking about i said bro this thing's making 14 i mean is making uh almost 40 like 4500 a month now what i found out later was like the the electric was like

1400 so what we did was we went in and i realized we went in and we put timers on all of the switches because these guys were turn on the lights and they'd have their fan and yeah walk away they'd go stay at their girlfriends for three days with a lamp the fan a fan in the window and the light on for yeah for four days three days and so I realized okay we're yanking out all these we're putting in timers we're putting timers that we had to have an electrician build a box with a timer on it for because they had window rattlers right they had the window units yeah yeah some of didn't even have that so and we would put those on in florida by the way and we would say like you want me to put one of these things in there and they'd be like well what are you going to charge me a

week and you go well what is what do they charge you like who the guy charged like 15 extra bucks a a week i can't i don't want to pay that i'd rather just not have it i barely say here anyway like some of these guys are staying there because they stay somewhere else but they need some belies to keep their their stuff because they can't stay with their girl it's kind of like storage right well and And, you know, maybe they're with some girl, but it's, it's, it's not a good situation. Like they're right and argue. They need some place to go. Yeah, listen, I didn't.

When that happened, we turned around. We bought like the house next door, turned it into a rooming house. Went and bought it. Like I was like, I'm buying all rooming houses. This is insane. These things were such money makers. And I remember the electric went from 1,400 down to like six or 700 bucks. When you put the timers on.

within like a month and a half we put in low flow toilets we put in and you know the the lights we put in this is before they had LED lights they used to have something they were they were fluorescent bulbs but they looked like a pig's tail they were like squiggly do you remember those yeah we would put they were like 12 bucks or something as opposed to like a dollar light but they last for like four years and they were generate like 15 watts of power or 15 watts or seven watts instead of like for to put out like a hundred watts of light yep i remember we'd buy those and screw those in listen these guys were it was it was a hilarious situation because some of these guys like they had mental problems they're in and out of jail never

had to evict anybody that's good yeah listen i had one place one time i had one one place one time we had bought a a crappy single family we turned it into a four unit i mean renovated the hell out of it rented out it was being rent out for 1 25 a week guy moves in so one day i meet a guy there at the place i show him the place he comes back and he says okay here's my first 150 for the first week and the 125 deposit okay keep in mind this is a hundred percent occupancy on all these okay because no they're not all moving out at the same time ever so if you've got eight living there. As soon as somebody moves out, if they just bolt, I'm keeping their deposit. Right.

Do you stick a sign in the front yard? You couldn't make it home without somebody saying, calling you and saying, hey, I want to rent it. Right. That's how fast people were ridden them. Yeah, because they were all basically new. We'd put new stuff in and they weren't they weren't shitholes. Like we didn't have, except for that first one I bought, I almost did nothing to that one. But the ones that we've renovated, they're new. They've got. So, um, but the one one guy he gives me 125 plus 125 for the deposit so he leaves i'm sorry so i give him the key and i leave he go he's happy um that was let's say on friday so on sunday i went to collect

rent from the guy next door i drive so i drive by knock on the door guy opens door and he goes oh yeah yeah yeah here's the 125 i said okay cool and he goes hey he said um you got somebody rent next door and i went no i rented it he goes oh no no no he's that That dude moved out, bro. He goes, here. Here's the key. He gave me the key back. And I went, oh, well, he doesn't get his money back.

And he goes, no, no, no. He's gone. You won't see him again. And I go, what, why? And I said, what happened? He goes, oh, he said, all right. So there's a newspaper in Florida called the Florida Sentinel. And it's a black owned newspaper for black people.

Right. What it is. So he goes and gets the Florida Sentinel. And he comes back and he the guy's on the front page for a homicide now bro he said to tell you he appreciates you rent in the place here's the key keep the money he and he showed him the picture he goes he ain't coming back he took off I said oh wow and he and I said man I said okay so I turn around I said all right well I appreciate it and I said I'm about to leave well look I'm about to leave and the guy goes do you have somebody and I went no I just you just you

just told me he moved like he didn't you know I guess he thought he was going to call me or something but he didn't so the guy goes hold on he goes running down the street he comes back with his cousin and says man I'll I'll rent it right now and I said okay it's 125 plus a 125 deposit gave it to me I said here's the key I just took his name just like that got into my car and left and I was like these places like somebody would disappear and like the guy in room number four would say hey by the way the guy in room number seven he got arrested he got into an argument he stabbed his girlfriend he's probably he's not coming back for a while so you might as well just rent it out so we just bag up

all this stuff in garbage bags we put it in a storage unit and then like two months late and we'd rent it out within a couple days and two months later the guy would call you up and say hey um i'm so and so. I used to rent number seven. They told me you bagged up your stuff, my stuff. I'd like, yeah, we got some garbage bags. Well, where do you want to meet me? I'll drop them off. Man, that's rough. For me, that would be tough. To be tough for me. Listen, it was, it was such a cash cow. I can imagine. I can imagine. It was. You had to get, you had to, you had to, you understand what you're dealing with. Yes, you do understand what you're dealing with. I think that's things you have to you go into it and you understand what you're dealing with right for for me personally

the way that my that i'm set up i could deal with that because a lot of my stuff isn't short-term a lot of my stuff is your leases right so you know and i don't want any of that that type of activity moving around my place listen here's what's funny at all is that that's what you think you think transient but the truth is that once and that is what happens for the first six months But after that, you got eight rooms and after six months, you might have one or two people leave a year. And keep mind, they're not moving their stuff. All the furniture is bolted to the ground. Like, you really have a bed or to the wall.

You've got a dresser, a nightstand, and a bed, and a mattress. Because you have to furnish it. And keep mind that all that stuff that we even have in is basically we would make it out of like two by sixes. not not the not the um you know not the nightstand and that stuff but like the bed you make a bed frame out of like two by sixes you drop the mattress in and you know they have you know so you buy really cheap stuff and then you go to like um goodwill or whatever and you get like a um what do you call it a dresser and you just bolt it to the walls not that they deal it but um so so what ends up happening is you get these clients that just stay there forever and then the keys are an issue for these people so you you you buy something at home depot where you have a doorknob and you just push the buttons like you know one one two and it and it opens the door and you can open it like and uh everything stainless steel so so what was great is that they were cash cows and then it was funny and like you said if you

know what you're dealing with and i would get these phone calls where guys would call up and say they don't even know my name. They're calling me on like Mr. Rentman, Mr. Rentman. I mean, that's good, though. It's like 11.30 at night. It's like 11.30. I'm like, yeah, what's up?

This is, this is, you know, this is a so-and-so room number. And they just said, tell you, room number one. And I go, and they called the guy, Two-Face, because he actually, they said he had split personality and he got a government, he had a Social Security disability check. And I go, Two-Face. And he go, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. me too face listen man you got to talk to the guy in number seven he ate my macaroni and cheese and i go what put him on the phone i go did you eat his mac and cheese man i ain't that man's

mac and cheese what you're talking about i didn't eat i go come on man i like some mac and cheese now you know i would fuck with them and then i put the other one i said can't you just call the police he'd say they won't come anymore they told us to call you they said forget this we not dealing with this anymore but you know that's funny listen it was like we never it's a hundred percent occupancy because they give you the deposit you don't get your deposit and if they you don't pay then they just leave they do not want you to even make an attempt to evict them because they don't want any problems with the police they just leave oh that's true that's true i didn't think about that they just pack up their stuff and leave they just leave you just go there one day and it's empty

No, you put, you know, you start the addiction, you put a little note on the, well, here's what's really funny. Listen to this. My ex-wife at some point, she went and became a hotel motel operator in the state of Florida. Okay. You can license any structure as a transient facility, which is basically what a hotel and a motel is. Right. You have to have an inspected. So every three years as a hotel motel operator, from the state like you have to have your property inspected and then the county inspects it once I think once a year and so there's certain things you have to have and she would she explained it you know she can explain it and it's really really honestly it's a joke it really is a joke like I mean it's like you have to have a a fire extinguisher at first she tried to put them in the hallway but they would sell them they'd steal them and sell them so then she just put individual ones inside of the room people still fire extinguishers well crackhead steal them and they go how she would do that and then you have to have a thing on the on the inside of the door you have to

have a little thing that says shows a diagram of the house and how to get out you've seen them on the hotel you got a little star on it's got a little red line going how to get outside so she said you have to have that and she said then you have to have your operation your hotel transient license notification transient facility hotel motel and then it just says a little thing this is a we're renting this daily. And then she said, you can't give them a lease. You have them sign a guest registry. And here's the thing. She licensed several of her properties like this. And so what happened, what that allows you to do is it allows you to simply call the police and say, this person is renting my rented my place. I want him out. He hasn't paid. I want him out. And you're allowed

to pay weekly. You could do it weekly, monthly, and it's still transient. Okay. The cop show up. The first few times she said the police would show up, they would argue with her. I'm in a residential neighborhood. You can't have a, she's like, it's licensed. What are you talking about? I got a license.

I've been inspected. I'm perfectly. And they would make phone calls and come back and go, I can't believe this. Show them everything. And they'd go, because zoning determines what you can build. Right. But you can have a license motel or hotel anywhere. I didn't build it.

I got a license. And they would throw, they go and knock on the guy's door and say get your shit get out you got to go right now and throw them right out right then that's that's crazy you wouldn't think that that would be allowed no you know what she said she said you only have to do that once she said at all of the tenants see it and they know right then she says they tell everybody everybody that moves in oh no no this is zone you see that she'll just throw you out she don't have to evict you she don't that's it's over she'd have to evict you nothing she'll call the police they'll throw you out are you serious absolutely

And she tells them this up front, but in their minds, they don't believe it. Listen, she did that a few times. She said, then I just stopped doing the inspections or anything. I just, she said, because now they all believe it. Now they just leave. Yeah, because they're like, oh, she's not playing around. Yeah, playing around and the notices are up. Yeah.

She got the, she would come in and check for the fire extinguisher. She's like, oh, they always, they're stealing them and this and that. I'm like, we don't get the inspections. And she'd say, yeah, I know, I don't get the inspections, but I keep replacing them. She said, so they think that you get the inspections. You're a horrible person. That's crazy. You're vicious.

Yeah, so there's some tricks there. Yeah, I see. I see. I definitely want to get some, uh, do some, um, rooming houses when I, soon as well, I'm off probation. I'm going to start buying some single family houses and, but I'm not going to call them rooming houses. I'm going to call them micro suites or maybe eco units. I'm going to make it sound trendy. Micro units. Eco suite. I'm going to do a little, I'll do a little website,

you know, a little. And then what I might do too is I'll put in, um, uh, what do they call it, surveillance cameras, like in the hallways. Right. And around the facility, the house. And around it and then all the tenants will be allowed to to see that you know so that gives them feel like hey it's oh there's security cameras there's could be nice a lot yeah that that will be nice i mean especially what you're following you may be able to you'll probably be able to fill that up i'm pretty sure you have a lot of people who watch you in your local area look i already have a couple of guys that have bought single family houses and turned them into these like bought this one guy bought a three unit

No, sorry. Three bedroom, two bath. He turned the living room and dining room into bedroom. So now it's a five bedroom. Rented it out. They share the bathroom. They share the kitchen. He's making like $1,800 a month in profit. That's what his name does. I don't know if you know the YouTuber, Spencer. Oh, okay. Yeah, Spencer Cornelius. Yeah, I've interviewed him. Yeah, you did. I saw you did an interview with him too. And he does the same thing. he's doing that now where he calls it uh what does he call it is it house no it's not house hacking it's like room hacking or something like that or well i have a video but he same i have a video where i talk about it and i call it something like real estate a real estate a real estate act is the name of yeah it's it's called something and so when you go to his his videos and he sells a course where he talks about it he even has a new a new channel that he's making

that's like all for like real estate and he talks about it and he's really really big into that. And so he like written like currently right now, he's renting like rooms to to individuals. And sometimes in some of the units, he actually builds out like you were just talking about the living room, turned into a bedroom and all that other stuff. And so he loves it. He says like for him, he thinks it's like the best thing ever. So it is because, you know, it's, some of them I had, they were horrible. They were in horrible areas. You're not going to get decent but if you are decent people but if you buy in like a lower middle class area and it's a decent it's a decent property like it's not a slum it's not a it's not a it's not like you're a slum lord

it's it's not like a horrific area or a horrible house like it's in good condition it's all brand new and you do a decent job of it then it becomes like look where does that guy that works at tire kingdom that's divorced that has two kids that has to make his child support you know where does he cut he can't cut child support he can't cut his car payment he can't cut on the insurance for his kids he can't you know like your living is where you can cut so if you say hey i need some place to sleep at night while i'm working on paying child support and all these other things that i'm paying right well your living expenses and for a hundred and ten dollars a month or one and listen if you could rent a place for a hundred dollars a week i'm not a month

You could rent a place for $1, 125 a week and you don't pay a less to a mother. That's crazy. No, that's not. No, I'm in a week. But you do the numbers on, do numbers on 150 times five, you know, times five rooms, you know, times four weeks in a month. And there's more than four weeks. There's four. But let's say four.

Like, you're basically bringing in like $3,300. And, you know, or $33,500. dollars and you're you're you're paying out with water electric everything out you're paying out you know with a PITI if you buy a house for roughly between 100 to 150 depending on your interest rate you're paying out what 1500 a month you know and you're collecting 35 and that's the one of the things that I really try to explain people there's just so many ways to do real estate it really is I mean you we talked about Airbeats to certification there's this there's the long term like what I do. There's just so many ways you can do it. You can do the, I guess what it's

called like house hacking where you basically live in it for one year. Then you rent, there's just so many ways that you can do it. You can live in one unit and have three other units, do a four a fourplex or something. Like there's just so many ways you can cut up real estate. And it doesn't mean that you have to do it one way to be successful. And that's what I'm saying. I think that the message that I push along is that I just want you to if you're going to jump into this like you have to understand what the risk are you have to do the research you have to know exactly what you're getting into if you think that you're going to get into what you're talking about what I'm talking about what anybody's talking about with zero money into it bad credit you never did any research

at it all and tomorrow or after a year you're going to be a millionaire that's crazy yeah that's crazy And a lot of people think that. A lot of people think that. They do. They do. It's unfortunate, but it's just the way it is. You know, I mean, even on my course, I have a disclaimer on the rest of it. Like, it's not going to be hard.

I mean, it's not going to be easy. It's going to be hard. You got to work towards it. And, you know, I mean, I get comments on it being like, well, why would I buy your course? I'm just like, oh, well. Well, go back to your job at Walmart. I mean, you know, it's fine. There's nothing wrong with that.

Some people need, some people need to work for somebody else. And that's fine. But it's going to be, it's going to be hard. Like, listen, no millionaire. You're never going to meet a millionaire out there that's going to say, just kind of fell in my lap. I tried this. It worked. I tried that.

It worked. I tried this. Next thing you know, I made $4 million. Who knew? Well, well, you know, I mean, if you go on Instagram, there's tons of guys who will tell you that. and all these and all the people that watch that believe that and believe that oh this guy just one day I turned around and I had millions of millions of dollars that's the reason why I'm driving this Lambo like I was going to say and I happen to what's funny about that is like I know a couple

people that live in like these tall skyscrapers in downtown Tampa and I know a couple I actually know three or four guys that have Lambo's I know one guy's got a Lambo and a Ferrari and I could get lots of pictures with those and I could shoot those videos standing on the balcony of the 35th floor and looking over Tampa. And I could, you know, and you would say, man, this guy blew up. He's amazing. I'm on a bias course, but the truth is I'm not going to do that. Because that's the kind of behavior that led me to prison to begin with. Good. I'm going a different day this time. But yeah, there are definitely those guys. Listen, I, I really, I liked talking to you. I appreciate you taking the time to, uh, to

do this. What is your, what's, what's the name of your, um, oh, you're right told me this. It's Orlando Minor. Uh, your, your YouTube channel, Orlando Minor, um, is on YouTube, of course. Well, yeah, yeah, we talk, we talk about housing. We talk about financial news. Anything that's really based on the economy, housing, real estate. We talk about it all. So yeah, come on over. If you like that type of stuff, we throw, we make it exciting and entertaining, you know, know not talking like you know a lot of people come on and it feels like you know when you're talking about real estate people feel like you have to talk like you're uh like i'm like i'm like a teacher at a university and we try to break it down to where everybody can understand it and

throw some funny into there so people love it okay all right do you have instagram or anything like that i do a same thing same name orlando minor you'll easily find me on there everything across the board is orlando minor hey i appreciate you guys watching if you like the video do me a favor hit the subscribe button hit the bell so you get notified of videos just like this. Also, I'm going to leave all of Orlando's links for his YouTube channel, his Instagram, and anything else he sends me in the description. Should just go to the description box, click on it. It'll bring you right there and subscribe. Also, do me a favor. Please consider joining my Patreon. I really appreciate that.

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