Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Insane RDAP Stories: The Dark Side of the Prison Drug Program

Episode Date: November 16, 2024

Matt and Zach tell funny stories from their time in RDAP. Checkout Zack's YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@BlackZack365 Zach's Cash App: $blkzac50 Follow me on all socials! Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/matthewcoxitc Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/insidetruecrime/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@mattcoxtruecrime Follow my 2nd channel - Inside The Darkness! https://www.youtube.com/c/InsidetheDarknessAutobiographies Want to be a guest? Send me an email here! [e-mail] Want a custom Con man painting shown up at your doorstep every month? Subscribe to Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/insidetruecrime Get a custom painting done by me! Check out my link! https://www.etsy.com/shop/coxpopart Listen to True Crime Podcasts anywhere! https://anchor.fm/mattcox Check out my prison story books here! https://www.amazon.com/Matthew-Cox/e/B08372LKZG Support me here! Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/MattCox69 Cashapp: $coxcon69

He just gets up and, bam! Help! Fire! Fire! And I realize that you still can see Billy's handprint on my face. You can see like two of his fingers right. I'm like. Hey, this is Matt Cox.

Yeah, I don't know why you're doing that. It's on me. Oh. Damn. Okay. Hey, this is Matt Cox, and I'm here with Zach. We are going to be going over the ARDAP program. Residential drug abuse treatment.

Residential drug abuse program. Ardap. Ardap. Residential. Residential R. D for drug. A, abuse. P for program.

Okay. So you say RDAP and then people still say program. Whatever. So it's the ARDAP program in federal prison, which Zach went through and passed. And I went through twice and didn't pass. By purpose, not that I couldn't have passed. I may not have been able to pass, honestly, but I would have passed, but it would have been hell, the very last phase. But anyway, and I knew that, and I had a whole different agenda, which you could read in my book.

Like, what a, what a selfless, dude, what a plug. Okay, so check out the video. It's going to be funny. Zach is very funny. Zach had a vastly different experience with ARDAP, although both of us liked the program. And, yeah, it's good stuff. It's Survivor meets federal prison. I'm spitting.

It's Survivor meets federal prison drug program. Yes. So you have to point out the fact that I was in a penitentiary, right? You make me sound soft. And you were in a low where there's harsh language. I was going to say people hurt. I got my feelings hurt once. I'm sure.

I'm sure. So. And that's that. That's a major difference to do it at a pen. As a matter of fact, I had an opportunity to go somewhere else and do it, right, to wait a year and go somewhere else and do it because they were so desperate for people at the pen, I said, I'm going to go ahead and do it now while I'm here. I'm like, why wait and go somewhere else when I can jump in this one right now? Because I qualified for the year off. With the murderers and killers.

Yes, I said, I'm going to jump in and do it with the murderers and killers. because I qualify it for the year off, get my year off now, because I got it off like, I got my year off like three years before I was due to be released, three or four years before I was due to be released. From Ardap. From Ardap.

Right. So if you complete the program, the Ardap program, which is a nine, if you don't get held back, the Ardat, look real quick, the Ardap program.

Right. Is a program where inmates go into a special unit. They're retrained or reeducated for nine months. and during and at the end of that nine months really during the portion of that nine months the one you get one year off of your sentence now if you fail for qualified for qualified inmates you get because some some inmates did not like if they had a violence in their past or a gun charge or or some kind of a you know whatever anyway algorithm some kind of issue with pictures that

or video making gang poses but anyway go ahead so then they don't get they don't get the time off but if you qualify you take the course

the program you pass it then you get a year off your time so you got a year in the halfway house if you didn't qualify for the year off

well I didn't get a year well they would qualify you for more halfway house time supposedly I know lots of guys that only got four and five months

I mean halfway anyway Obama kind of ruined that when he The halfway house used to have one person They'd have 10 people in one bed And they charge 10 people to be there Right and he's like you can't do that anymore Right here's what halfway houses were doing

They would chart they would have An inmate would get out of prison Go to a halfway house and they would They would charge them for the government for that bed Let's say you're charging a hundred dollars a day For that inmate Then they would put the inmate on an ankle monitor And so they monitor him at home

and then they would tell the Bureau of Prisons, hey, we have another bed available. They would then put another inmate in that bed, get another $100. So now they're getting $200 for the same bed. They would then move that guy to home confinement. They'd say, hey, we got another bed available. They'd said, so they end up having 10.

Yeah, like 10 people in one bed getting paid $1,000 a night for one guy in one bed when really these guys are all on an ankle monitor at home. And so Obama came through and said, what are you guys doing? I feel like you're taking advantage of the system. You know, like for us, for when, for those that are in prison, it was heaven because halfway house are like, come on, more, more, more, more, more, more, more.

Right. So if you, so guys could get 10 months a year. But the problem is when they did that, they no longer had the bed availability. And so people that could have gotten a year ended up getting four months, three months. Oh, it shut down the halfway houses for about eight. It was almost impossible to get an half. When he made that adjustment, it was almost impossible to get in a halfway house for almost a year. Yeah.

I went from, like my halfway house time was adjusted like three different times. I even had one time literally my mom thought she's coming to pick me up in like a week. And when I went in there to say, hey, my family's mailing and stuff. Did you guys get it yet? And they were like, you're not leaving for two months. I was like, no, no, I have my date. They were like, oh, no, that changed. When did that happen?

Right. So yeah, anyway, I'm sorry. But no problem. So our DAP, for those that didn't get the year off, basically, um, they'd, offer you more halfway house time now see what's funny about that situation is in my view being at the pin i felt like everyone at the low qualified for the year off i felt like it was the year off that would keep people in line that would make it very imperative to be there right and having the when you're living in a unit where everything you do is like you're in a fish bowl

where not only is the are the staff watching you but you they're They've set up a program to where other inmates are watching you. Oh, absolutely. And so everything you do is subject to scrutiny based on the program. But tell them a little bit about the program and the requirements. So everybody understands. Well, I mean, so first of all, it's really not a drug program, right? So to get it through Congress, I'm sure they called it a drug program.

But really, the program is about behavior modification, right? So they're trying to modify your thinking errors. And this is a funny thing, is like prior to going through that program, I would have told you that like, these guys are locked up because, you know, yeah, they don't follow rules. Like I very quickly summed it up to, well, they don't follow rules that well. But the truth is when you go through the program, you realize that that the people that are locked up have fundamental problems processing situations in general. you know and and i mean to a degree where you're like their immediate leap is like violence or breaking the law or or just in pure insanity and you realize like bro like that's your first thought is that like they're like yeah and you're like oh wow and then you start to realize kind of like to me

i realized going through it i started realizing like yeah my first thought is this it's not what maybe a violent person's is but it's still not the appropriate response and i'm like yeah that isn't appropriate and you've never been in a situation where you focus on that so I had never been on in that situation so what happens is you wake up early like you wake up early in the morning let's say six o'clock you then have a morning meeting where everybody goes to the morning meeting and you had let's say you've got a hundred 150 guys yes but I don't know how many were in your program um about about a hundred about 89 100 okay let's say let's go with 100 it's a better number. I don't know. I think 120 is a full

program. Is it? Okay, then we had we had a full program. So whatever, 120. 120. It's about 60 chairs on each side. And they have you facing, they line the chairs up to where like 60 people are sitting directly across from 60 people. And at the head of that

group is a, what they call a facilitator that facilitates the meeting. And in the back of that those two chairs sitting across from each other are the what they call it, the DTSs, the DTSs, which is the drug, the drug treatment specialists that are there. Right.

All right. So wait, I want to, I want you to say this, Matt, this is important because like I loved the program and I was what they called a super programmer because I love that type of thinking. So I thought it was incredible and awesome. Right. You on the other half. See, we've already had this. So Zach, once again, read my book, which honestly, it's a very short.

but it's funny because he read it and just laughed his ass off because he's he's saying he read the book and felt that I did not like the program I mocked the program the whole time I went through it but it's not to say that I don't think it was a good program and to be honest I've even had conversations with Boziac and and multiple times I've had short discussions like with this guy Ardap Dan oh I've never you got to meet Ardap Dan anyway definitely yeah yeah he loves super dabber he was super dabber yeah he so art app dan we've had this discussion and both of us agree and jess my girlfriend who passed the program she'll tell you the same thing she'll like i hated every single minute of it right she goes but i think that every inmate should have to take

the program because you learn so much about yourself and you realize how just fundamentally flawed you are and and and so instead of your immediate reaction being you and I have an issue and it's your fault you learn to internalize things and go how could I have contributed to this is it his fault did I contribute is it me is my was my reaction to that that disagreement the correct one and you really kind of processed you it gives you the ability to process your behavior and your the way you react to things in a way that you never would have without that so I think it's a great program but yes when I was going through the program, did I mock it mercilessly? Of course, because there are ridiculous things

about it. Absolutely. Yes. So I want to add to what you just said because you're right. And it also gives a little wisdom because the way they categorize everything and they teach you what each behavior and each thought, they place it in a category, that what they call that cognitive thinking, it allows you to identify it and give it a name and know what those behaviors lead to. So it kind of processes your thinking into compartmentalizing, which allows what I noticed is it allows people who had those violent tendencies to actually see the type of errors they have in other people.

Like a lot of times when people got up and talked, they'd say, you know, you're struggling with this, which is something I struggle with all the time. Right. So it kind of opens your mind. So it fundamentally, it is good. It was a good program for helping people who didn't have the ability to process start processing. Or people who really didn't know how to process, it gave them a process. I saw that in a lot of people, especially those that start and end it.

Some people, some of the success stories have been people who've gotten in there. And when you met them when they started and you met them when they finished, you're like completely different person. So they do have some success. Oh, yeah. But I was a super dapper, so I mean, of course I said. Oh, no, you would see. So there were people that there were guys in there that, of course, you have some people that, you know, they fake it till they, you know, or they fake the whole program. Oh, yes.

Honestly, even the people that faked it still learned something. Yes. And they might even, there were even guys that pretended to be faking it. But the truth was, you could see a difference. It's like, I know you're faking because you don't want to get out of here. and have all your buddies make fun of you. Because guys that weren't in that group, in that program, all the other, you've got to think,

look, we're talking about 1,800 to 2,000 people on the low, in the low. You've got 120 guys in the program. So you've got basically 1,800 guys on average making fun of the 120 there in the program. Oh, he's an RDAB. Oh, they're all snitches. They're all snitching on each other. And we'll get to that in a minute.

But they're all telling on each other. Oh, you're a sucker. you're this you're that oh you're you got them telling you what to do and ain't nobody telling me what to do you know all this oh they would give you a hard time i don't know if they did in the pen wait till i'd tell you that part finish go ahead and finish well anyway um yeah so so it was you know it was a hostile environment to be in and i was going to say it's funny too because look let's face it for me being in prison like i'm a soft white guy on average i'm an average white guy in society in prison my in math as far as masculinity is concerned i'm maybe a five or a six

i think outside i'm like a fucking one in prison because a masculine at a low you were a one you had to least be on no there were the the guys that were there for pictures like if you say by you know you have to understand the term that i'm using if you do boom yeah note monetization i understand um so guys that were there because they like to take pictures and and That would have brought you above a one, wouldn't it? I think it brought me up to maybe a two or a three. Yeah. But still, let's face it, you still got the gang members.

You've got the guys that have been that have murdered people, the guys that have worked their way down from the pen. Oh, listen, and when Obama went through and he was, Obama, after you let the first wave of like a thousand guys go, just let them out, like half those guys are reoffending, right? Right. Then he realized, wait, stages. I'm going to knock 10 years off your sentence,

but you have to do one year in the low, then you have to do a year in the halfway house because there was no mechanism for what he was doing. He was like, yeah, yeah, you're right. I'm going to knock, yeah, immediate release, immediate release, immediate release. You just let some guy, like, he doesn't realize, like you let some guy that's been locked up for 20 years in prison out immediately without halfway house.

His family's given up on him. He's got nowhere to go. Of course he's going to go back to crime. It's what he knows. Right. You've got to put him in a halfway house, and then he realized, no, you know what, if they're in the pen,

they don't even know how to behave in society. So you got to go from pen, medium, low, halfway house. I met a guy in the pen that had to go to the low to take the program. And I kept telling myself, God, I wish I could witness that because you have to complete the program to get out. I go to torment he's going to go through is going to be unbelievable. Oh, yeah, same guy, Ledford.

The guy's name was one of my cellies at one point, was a guy named Ledford, life sentence for meth. Listen to this. Life sentence for meth. They told him they would give him like 20 years, but he had to cooperate against his wife, which was involved in that he said, absolutely not.

Give me the life sentence. Gangster, straight gangster. Right. Goes to prison. She don't last a year. Within a year, she's out with some other guy, divorces him with some other guy. Some other guys calling his kid's fucking daddy,

doesn't come visit him. Oh, he snapped. No, he didn't. I mean, he did 20-something years. He has life. He had 20 years. And then Obama came along and said, my God, what are you doing? Like Obama said, no, no, I'm going to give him.

He's going to go to the low. He has to pass the program. He has to get out. This guy, one, he was a super dapper. Really? But totally believed in it. Totally believed in the program. He was amazing.

And, of course, got out. By the way, like I'm friends with him on Facebook. This guy got out and hit the ground running. Like, he's probably making $100,000 a year. He's driving an $80,000 truck, bought a brand, new house got out just in time for his dad had died when he got out like i mean just guy you know amazing guy he was you know it's meth it's just ruins you ruins people um but yeah he uh uh um yeah he was my my sely oh he was a super dapper he listen it's amazing who becomes a super dapper you

don't it you don't know the guy you think never yes embraces it the guy you think oh he's going to be fine can't get through the program like just can't right you're like what's going on like what are you doing it's like oh that guy this, you're like, how are you behaving like this? And that's what we have to describe is the, the torment, the choice mentally that people make to like, you know what, I'm fine the way I am, I'm not even going to embrace what you're saying. Right. But I want to say, like what you were saying about in the low, how they made fun of the people

in the R-Dap. Right. Right. Well, I was in the penitentiary where it was definitely called snitching. And a lot of people were in gangs. so they would have to get permission from the gang to go to Ardap and what I thought was hilarious is they would ask someone like hey

I can get a year off my sentence if I take the RDAP and some of the people they're like well you can take it but there's certain things you can't do while you're in there holy shit and you can't what do you call it they called it help ups you can't do help ups you can't participate in this and if we hear about you doing that

We're going to, oh, I, many of people I've seen get jump on the compound for doing something in our DAP and a person that just gets in there going, what are you doing? That's snitching. And he's like, no, we, like, I have no understanding and they're going to jump you and you get beat up and taking off the compound. You can't even do the RDAB. That was never that extreme. Oh, but there were guys.

Yeah, that's the pin. Well, these are guys that are, yeah, they got major, major, these are violent. Listen, and I had, we had a DTS that. stood up every day and said I hate gangs because she goes gang members telling you that you can't get out of prison early to be with your kids right making that requirement she's like you should never be a part of crap like that which I'm like yeah you're right but uh it's also hard to it's survival it's about survival we they had conversations about that that got one guy I believe killed I don't if he didn't die he was severely injured he had to be

lifted off of the compound. Did I ever tell you that I did time in the pen? Did I tell you what happened? No. Yeah. So I got into a disagreement with a guy. So I got to a disagreement. Somebody dropped the note on both of us.

No, no, no, that's not true. That's not true. That's not what happened. That was a different time I went to the shoe. I've been the shoe like four times. Oh, the shoe at the pen and Coleman. I was at the low. Right.

I get bitch slapped. I'll be honest. I got bitch slapped by a guy. Again? But go ahead. I was watching. I'm going to tell you this story real quick. This is perfect loop.

There's a guy sitting behind me who had, he had a, he was on a, he was a registered. Yes. S.O. Right? But he was there for, he was in Coleman for, on an oxy, on a pill case. So, and he didn't realize that anybody knew. He knew, but he didn't know. Like what happened was eventually, he.

He was so, so adamant about, about ESOs and their scum fuck, they're this, and he was so adamant about snitches and this and that, they're garbage. One of the other guys said, you know what, something ain't right. He's pushing too hard, you know, thou persist, persist too much. Yes, the reverse psychology. Right. So he looks him up. He gets his, you know, they have a poster. Yes.

He gets the poster sent in. And he makes copies of it and passes it out. right of what that's one thing the second thing is he looks into it and his co-defendant comes on the compound at the same time and said he cooperated so you're a snitch and you're the other thing so he starts passing it so it gets around but he nobody ever really kind of like he knows people know but he didn't say anything well I we would we oh you know there was the cracker box right the the TV room for the white guys right so yeah that's called it's it

there were so many blacks there like the blacks had the big room right right they had the big big big TV big TV room and then you had you had the Spanish room which was size the same size as the cracker box yeah well the Spanish also had one TV

in the big room like there's like eight TVs they had one TV there because they were a little bit larger than the white guys so we're in the I'm in the white TV room and this guy we would watch TV and stuff and he would you know if people start talking you're watching whatever's fishing shows and stuff that I couldn't stand, right?

Like you're watching, you know, deadliest catch. And it's like, oh, God. So when you're sitting there and people, they talk, he was somebody guy came and said, yeah, man, I just got my halfway house.

I'm leaving in two months. Oh, man, that's good for you, bro. Good for you. Yeah. And then this guy's name was Billy. Billy would suddenly say something like, yeah,

I don't know where I, I don't even think I'm going to take halfway house. Well, back then, with his charge, you couldn't take half way. In Florida. You can now. But you couldn't then.

So he goes, and I was like, he's like, yeah, I'm not sure where I'm going to go when I get out. I go, well, I know where you're not going to go. And he goes, and he looked at me, he'd go, where I'd go anywhere near a church, a daycare, or an elementary school. Fuck you, Cox, fuck you.

And he'd everybody would laugh and he'd be like, you're a piece of shit, fuck you. I'd be like, ha ha, yeah, but I get to live where I want. You know, and he says, but this is a big guy, too. He's six foot tall, you know, but we also kind of just always joked around. Right. And I would always joke around about stuff that he didn't, people didn't think it's like. So one time we were sitting there watching. TV and he was just a weird

guys are weird so what he's going to say you're probably not going to think ah that's not too weird because they say weird thing so you're watching TV but anybody watching this is going to be like that's a weird thing to say so you're watching TV and there was a chick walking down the beach and he goes he's behind me and he goes well you wouldn't know what to do with that would you Cox and I go shit I got a better chance they hit that than you do

and he and he goes he said hell I want to fuck something he's I'll knock your ass out and fuck you like that and I go shoot I said I'm a little bit young for you I said plus I have my GED or I go plus I have my high school diploma and he just gets up and bam just I like to put my hand like he punched me but he didn't he bitch slap me so he bam and I mean knocked me out of my chair I almost fucking hit the ground it was so hard right so I'm stumbling I turn around I at first you know what I thought happened I thought someone had you know you walked around with your chair on your head yeah I thought somebody had walked in the room and he and because somebody had kind of

the door had somebody had opened the door and I thought someone dropped the chair on me right so I jump up at first like damn and then i realized he'd hit me and he's standing there i was like i hate that realization like oh like like like am i got to do something now i just want to go in my cell curl up in a ball and cry there's four other guys in this room so i go motherfucker he said fuck you fuck you piece of shit and then he turns around and walks off thank god because billy would have beat the brakes off me i put up a fight but i'd off was probably once he got me on the ground i just to squeal in like a child like a small stuff Pig.

Yeah. Go ahead. Help. Fire. Fire. So, but he gets up and I sit back down and I go, what fucking piece of shit. Like literally this is what's so funny is people don't realize. Like in prison, something happens like that.

It immediately goes back to normal. Like we didn't sit around talking about it and hug and how are you feeling okay. And you want to talk. You immediately, I sat back down. That's an everyday occurrence. Right. Boom, boom, boom. Fuck you guys walks off.

I sit down. I start watching TV. like it's that's that happens all the time you see a fight right there you get broken up you're like that's crazy so what happened with so and so yeah um so what happens I start watching TV and my buddy goes yo bro you okay and I go huh no I'm fine he goes no you're not he's even to go look in the mirror

what I walk in there half my eye is bloodshot red half the whole white of my eye whoa I thought no and I realized that you still can see Billy's handprint on my face you can see like two of his like two of his fingers right like so i know i might bruise right might yeah i know i might i i made it through count through four o'clock count right i made it through 11 o'clock count and four o'clock count and then they call me in the all of a sudden right after four o'clock you see the two two guys from like sys walk in and then we're all standing in our room and ourselves still staying there waiting and all of a sudden they go um who's

billy's last name whatever you know billy you know right cox and baker to the front uh front office damn of course so we walk in the front office i walk in i stand there and i'm i'm i'm like yeah and he goes no no no turn your head he's like oh yeah yeah he goes i got his cox i already happened he's like i got i got four copouts already there was only four people there was only three or four people in the room oh somebody that wasn't in there like really yeah yeah he's heard it yeah and put in a cop so that means four people put in copouts where notes to saying hey there was a fight cox was involved and so was baker so baker he comes and he's like what's up and they're like hey they're like so um they go so y'all got into a fight and he goes i don't know what you're talking about and he looks at me and they

go you got into a fight cox he goes i mean i i can see you got into a fight he goes and i've got the copouts right here. I said, no, it wasn't a, there was no, fight. And he goes, I can see that you were in a fight. I said, no, no, a fight insinuates that there were two people at odds. I said, I was assaulted. And I said, and the guy, and he looks at me, he goes, damn, Cox, I go, fuck you. Like that. Because I already know we're going to the shoe. They're not putting us in the same cell in the shoe. Right. And if, and if you think of that, I'm going to, what, I'm going to, you bitch slapped me from fucking behind. You think I'm going to be like, no, no, I'm going to hold my water I'm gonna we're on the same team fuck you you hit me so we go to the shoe he goes to the

medium the last cell in the medium they're redoing our shoe in the low so the only place available is the shoe in the pin so they bring me to the pen do you have any fucking idea what these guys in the pin look like you walk in their entire faces are tattooed yeah and they're It's unbelievable to me. I'm like, what in the... You're not getting a job at the bank when you get out, bro. But then you realize, oh, you're not getting out. Yeah.

Oh. So that's, okay, that's war paint. So they have little tears because they're crying inside. Yeah. Oh, you have tears. At other people's losses. Go ahead. You're a sad clown.

Yeah. So, yeah, bro, they've got them in the pen there. They got them in cages in the pen, walking around like cage. And I mean small little cages. Yes. It's not like in the low. it's one big the outside wreck for the for the the shoe is a big big room no that room in the pin is broken up into tiny little five foot by section off yeah cages because you can't put two

guys in the same one and they're walking around like a like a cage dog like this back and forth doing push-up yeah and you're going I mean I when I walked in like I'm all handcuffed up and I look at the the CEO bringing me and I go yo bro you cannot put me in a fucking in a cell with one of these guys he goes he's no cox he's don't worry he's there we're not putting you to sell with it we got a cell for you it's fine i understand he's laughing about i said this ain't good bro i said there's no no landscaping here when we pulled in like there's landscaping at the low there's palm trees yeah there's no landscaping sit under the trees they're gonna relax i'm not designed for this i didn't stab anybody like i so he so they're like you know

they put me in the cell immediately it was amazing how polite the ceos were at the pen All right, Cox, look, hold on, hold on right. Okay, I got you some books. Okay, so you can read. I got you this. Here's your cleaning supplies. Here's this. Here's that.

If you need anything, don't hit the bell, okay? Do me a favor. Just kind of wave us down. Okay, just kind of, you know, knock on the window. We'll come, because we come around a lot, a lot. Also, I got you. I mean, if you need anything, if you're cold, because it gets cold in here, just knock on the door. Let me know.

I'll get you into the set. I mean, like, the guards at the low talk to you like you're a piece of garbage. Yes. Because they can get away with it. But at the pin, they could get hurt. Yes. So they could get attacked. Right.

So I was there for 24 hours. Literally, like the next day, they came and they got me. They said, yeah, yeah, we're releasing you. Like, I'm out in a day for a fight. What happened to Billy? Oh, Billy never got out. Billy was six months away from being released anyway. I almost think that it was part of Billy's plan

was to get into some kind of an altercation and not, and do six months. months in the shoe so it looks like he went to the halfway house or just disappear or you know you know guys will run up a debt yeah and they'll be like yeah i'm getting released in six months and they'll run up a debt when really they're leaving in like a week and they'll run up like a $300 debt to a bunch of guys and then just boom go to the halfway house and disappear wow um oh yeah yeah so listen i got anyway um the point is is that yeah so i did so when i talk i don't say this but i could say when people say would you do your time? I could say, I did some time in the pen, I did some time in the medium,

and I did some time in the low. I don't, but I've always thought I could do that. You could. Do you remember the article about the pen that was in Tampa Tribune? They talk about the riot in the pen, and they talk about the Coleman prison compound, and they say Matt Cox and Conrad Black were in the compound, and they make it sound like I was in. They make it sound like I was in the area. Yeah, yeah, in the area where the riot was. They called it the same facility that are the same complex. They engrouped the whole complex that holds Matt Cox.

Yeah, it was like there was a riot in the complex. We're not sure. And this complex holds people like Conrad Black and Matthew Cox. We're not sure which area they were in at the time of the riot. So it was like, I was in a riot. Like it looks like when people read that. Look, Cox, it looks like you were in a riot with stabbings and all kinds of stuff. when really I was in my cell napping.

Yeah, if you could have known the, I was, the arguments that were going on at the low over the chest game. I was looking out the window as they were landing helicopters and you could hear shotguns going off. I'm like, glad I'm not over there. Those guys got it bad. So, all right. I'm sorry, sorry, back to Ardap.

Back to Ardap. All right. I forgot where we were. We were at, oh, okay, so listen, I could tell you one more thing. So you have to tell you, so the environment inside, out of ARDAP with that 120 guys, part of the whole thing is

this. I'm just, I know you know this. Right. So part of that is that a big part of ARDAP is holding your peers accountable. Is that how they said it? Yes. Yes. Yes. Because our two programs have a little bit different of, you know, the

things, the labels they gave things are a little different. And so one of the big things was like, the staff couldn't monitor you all the time. So a big thing was like you had to monitor your peers. So if you saw that, if I saw that Zach was doing things that were wrong or inappropriate, it's my job to say, hey, bro, your uniform's not really ironed and Dr. Smith or it's appropriate to be ironed. Well, you know, remember, you signed an agreement to obey all

the rules of the institution and of our DAP at all times. Right. So yes, when you're holding them accountable, you're like basically saying you signed that paper saying you were going to follow the rules and you ain't doing that. But yeah, you're right. And it would get so bad. So some of the guys are like, hey, bro, you're, you're smoking Tucci. I know you were smoking Tucci in the bathroom. And so someone was like, hey, you're smoking drugs in the bathroom at night.

Like, don't make me be in a position to pull you up. Stop it. If I catch you again and that they would say that. Oh, no, but listen, it would get so petty. I know this didn't happen in the pen. So it was so, no, no, this part. It was so petty. Literally, I'm brushing my teeth, and I would, you know, I turn on the water and brush my teeth.

Brush my teeth. And some guy, and then I, he, stand in there. Some guy, boom, I turn it off. I spit, you know, okay, I'm all done. Go to turn around. He's like, hey, Cox, you got a minute? Because that's how they always start. You got a minute.

And I go, and this is what they call the confront and level. And I'd go, yeah, what's up? And he goes, I noticed when you were brushing your teeth, you left the water on. You know, that's not good for the environment. it's not good for just for society in general we need to conserve water and so I'm just letting you know that in ARDAP part of the rules are they want us to shut off the water so I just I'm just bringing that to your attention and I go

now you're supposed to say you know I appreciate you telling me and then you repeat what they said there's a whole little process you're supposed to go through and like literally the guy that told me that like the second day I was there this is a guy that used to he was a crack baby he used to take his finger and rub it in his belly button

right and then he would smell it he would also constantly nibbling on his he would walk around rubbing his belly and pulling on his teeth and he was he would picket his ears like he was a real but he'd straightened up in Ardap like we'd give him a hard time in the unit

but he was a whole go fuck yourself but in Ardap he straightened up so so I'm looking at this guy he'd been there three four months before me and I'm looking at this guy thinking did a crackhead a crack baby crackhead just tell me how to live my life like are you serious like bro you eat with your hands I've seen you chewing on your toenails like you're a disgusting human being and I was and I had to turn to him my bill I was like um yeah all right uh Yeah, good talk, bro, good talk. Like, I'd just gotten there. I don't know anything. So I leave. But that was the kind of thing.

Like, you would type, you'd be typing, and then you'd get up to leave. And somebody would say, by the way, bro, I noticed that you didn't go to the bathroom and wash your hands before you were typing on the computer. And, you know, we all use those computers. So it's important that we keep each other clean. It's a clean environment. We want to. And you're like, yeah, well, they got on me. for the ice machine had broken down and so there was no ice well there was a little bit of ice on

the bottom and they had taken the scoop I guess the guard it's like hey the ice machine's not working they took the scoop so I took my cup the ice that was left and scraped it out of the back on the bottom corner and I actually got a help up for that help up so so yeah so that's the point is that so somebody comes to you and they say hey stop like hey I noticed that you did this like typically the proper protocol is to go to that person and say, hey, I notice this is what's happening. You confront them. Confront and level, you confront that person, they then, if they're receptive and they go, you know what, man, I appreciate you telling me that.

I didn't realize that. You're right. You're absolutely right. That was wrong. And if they feel okay with that, like, yeah, he was good with it, then that's it. It ends. But if you didn't do that or if he felt like you weren't receptive, then the next day or within a week or so, he could.

In the morning meeting, they get to a point in the morning meeting where they say, are there any pull-ups or help-ups? Help-up. And people would raise their hand. And so you stand up and you say, excuse me, Isaac Allen, Mr. Allen, and then you'd stand up and we would be facing each other. Right. And they'd say, well, they'd say, well, and then there was a protocol.

I forget exactly what it was. They basically say, hey, two days ago, I was in the ice room. The guard had taken the scoop. The ice machine was broken. I noticed that you went, you leaned it in the thing, you scooped at the last bit of ice with your cup. One, obviously, it's disgusting for you to take a cup that you use and put it in the ice.

That's inappropriate. But two, you took the last bit of ice, which isn't fair to the rest of us. And three, you should have done that either because the guard took the scoop, which is to tell everyone not to use the ice machine. So part of the protocol is, and I'll follow it, and ask you,

well, how did that make you feel, Mr. Cox, to see Mr. Allen doing that? I think well that well really because ours was like um what were the damaging consequences right so the for us so how would you feel I wouldn't I don't well like it's the damaging consequences they would say well and the damaging consequences are it's it's you know you're not and then they would tell you what like thinking errors you were struggling struggling with you're struggling with whatever you know with you know should thinking and this thinking and that thinking and that thinking. They had to give you like two or three. And then they would say the way you need to work on it is. Yes. And then they would tell you. Give you an assignment to do.

They give you homework. Yes. You need to go around to 100 or to 50 of the people in the unit and ask them what the appropriate response should have been when you saw that the scoop had been taken. Like it was like they'd give you something to do homework, something to fill out. You need to come in here and do an RSA on the board. or do something they'd have you do a skit acting out like what you did and what you learned from it and stuff like that but what you got to mention because we really got to give the the format of how this it lays down but what you got to mention is when someone else approaches you like

that and they stand you up in front of all 120 people in the meeting and tell you what you did wrong you're not allowed to say one word no you can't you cannot there are no rebuttals you cannot put up an argue even if they repeat what they said and some of the people lied yes there were ones where there were false pull-ups they would they would something would happen maybe and they would manufacture something that didn't happen and say that you said things you didn't say just because one they wanted to pull you up and and you because not everybody had to do a pull-up like they always tell you you don't have to do a pull-up but almost nobody ever graduates that program without doing a pull-up well there's so there's so many

pull-ups required every day oh you mean for the group for the group that eventually everybody's probably going to have to do one. Yes, everyone needs to be on the receiving end of one. That's like understood. That's what the people in the phase three would tell you. But I'm going to ask you, did you have to accept the help? Yeah. Because could you accept or deny it?

No, no, you had to accept it. Later you could go back to your DTS because you had an assign. There's like I say there's four. You could deny it? No, you had to go. You had to accept it. And then you could later go back to your DTS. and say, listen, that's not what happened.

And you could explain the situation, because I've seen him where they flipped them, where they did that, and the next day they pulled the guy up. Like, the whole thing came out in the wash. Like, they brought him in. They said, look, he's saying this. He said that, and he's got three of his buddies that were there.

And that's not what happened. You just twisted what happened. And so that whole thing would occur. And then the next day, he pulled you up for manipulation. You manipulated a situation to your advantage or retribution. You're upset with me because two weeks ago, this is what happened. Oh, they had a whole thing.

Or you pulled me up, retaliation. You pulled me up because you thought I was going to pull you up. So you did it preemptively and twisted it. Oh, is it twisted? It was good, bro. Oh, it was the most dramatic, like, the tension would get, like, it's most of the time people just kind of sitting there fidgeting, you know what I'm saying, talking to your neighbor, whispering.

But whenever the help up came and it got for real, a whole group mouth open. So where I was, people could actually refuse to help up. Oh, no. You could stand up and I'd say, hey, I'm helping you up because I saw that such, such, such. And then the facilitator would ask, Mr. Cox, do you accept the help up? And you could say, no, I do not accept the help up. You can give a rebuttal. You have to tell them why you didn't accept it.

And then you sit back down. Sometimes the DTS got involved. And I have a couple of stories about that. I was just going to say, like, what kind of pull-ups did you get? Me? We got, no, not you, just in that program. Like, our pull-ups were like, someone snuck, you snuck some chicken out of the, out of the chow hall. Or you use, we used to not be able to use, like, seasoning.

Like, you couldn't bring seasoning in to the chow hall. Like, you could only use what was provided to you in the chow hall. Like, so there was all these little, like, I noticed that you, I was there the other day. I saw you pull something out and use salt on your food. You're not supposed to take any of that. You know, you're not supposed to do that. that you're suffering from or your entitlement entitlement oh entitlement yes so um same thing skipping the line you know what i'm saying or leaving early uh leaving something early or not finishing homework

so we had a lot of pre-scheduled pre-determined help-ups like we had to have at least two every day so a lot of times people would get together and say hey matt let me you know say we're going to need some help ups. So we actually facilitated it just to keep the BS down. We'd help people up, you know, give us. And every once in a while, the DTS will get upset because you're like, ah, these are all BS help ups. And then they give them assignments.

Sometimes you would get an assign. Like they'd already have guys that, look, I'm going to stand up. So-and-so is going to stand up. So-and-so. And they're going to give you an assignment. Yes. Yes. And your assignment's going to be bullshit, bro.

I'm not going to make you do it. Yeah. The phase three. But every so often there was a legitimate issue and a person would have The balls to stand up and give a help up on that issue. And those were the moments where everyone's like, oh, you couldn't believe it because the reaction was real. The situation was real.

And there's real content. This is what's fucked up. There's real. This is a year, possibly two years. Like you said, a year and a halfway house. Let's say it's eight, let's say six months and a halfway house. It's still 18 years of prison are at stake. Yes.

So when people think, oh, that's just silliness. No, this is 18 months where you can get back to your wife or your kids or your family members or like 18 months is not a joke. Contingent upon your response to someone telling you you didn't do anything. Yeah, you're telling you something you did. Telling you that you didn't iron your clothes today. So because I might snap at you for because I didn't shut off the water or because I snuck some chicken out of the chow hall because I'm starving to death. I might be if I don't accept that in the proper way and say the right things I might get kicked out of the program or pushed back in the program because they would hold people back yes you know and I might action right right just yeah based on nothing like like Mr. Cox I'm seeing a lot of bad body language bad body and you could just because like you're so the guy starts talking you're like well that's what being black is a privilege because we don't we don't turn red I cannot tell you how many white guys guys eyes turned pink

like eyes bloodshot like can you repeat what he just said they can't even hear him they're like he says something about you know like oh you get furious like I'd see guys who get most the guys would get like that deer in the headlight

look and they get scared like I got pulled up once or twice and it was fury I mean I was just like this motherfucker like he's because he's He blatantly is lying about this. Like, what happened is not what he's saying happened right now.

And I was, and so they actually stopped the pull up. Because the second time I went through the program, I was never pulled up the first time. Right. I don't think. I'd have to check the book. Because I literally, remember how they gave you like a date? What did you do the first time anyway? Like, a month?

Six months. The first time you went six months? I was six months one time and like eight months or seven months the next time. I was into phase three and the second time when I quit. The first one, I got right at phase three and they told me, hey, management variables on you. You can't be moved from the institution. I was like, oh, I'm out. I'm at this place.

But what I'm saying is the second time, like I really got preferential treatment for some reason because I was extremely honest where most people were wanted the year off. and I didn't by the time I it was available to me I didn't quite I never really I kind of explain it in the book where if I passed the program I got the year off I literally would only get a few months of halfway house and I was more concerned I would rather do a little a couple more months in halfway in prison than get a year off my sentence and only get two months a halfway house because I needed as much halfway house as possible because I just didn't have any money right and my fear was I'm going to get out there's nobody to give me money and I I'm going to need six or seven months in the halfway house. Like I never put in for home detention to try and get on an ankle monitor. Like, no, I want to stay in the halfway house. I'm saving as much money as possible so that I can rent a room, get a fucking, get a, you know, get a job, get enough money to rent a, to rent an apartment or a room and buy a, buy a vehicle who you get out with nothing. Right.

So you give me two, if they had given me a month halfway house or two months halfway house, I can't save that much money to, to do anything in that time. I'm going to be on the street. Right. So I needed that. But going to the program kept me at Coleman. Because if you were in a program, they put a management variable on you and they allow you to not be switched. And I wanted to stay at Coleman because, one, I was writing multiple guys stories.

But two, my mother was only an hour away. And if they moved me, she was going to have to drive at a minimum of four hours to see me. And that's if I went to Miami. Any place house, we're talking about six or seven hours. Right. You know, so I wanted to stay. But because of that, I was able to be very honest about everything and everybody and exactly how I felt. And so there was just no filter.

So I ended up getting kind of prefer preferential treatment because one, I'm well spoken. I was very honest. And I had no filter. So we would be in our, let's say our class and there's 30 guys in the class. and people would talk and then the DTS would respond and then she would like we're talking about a good 20% of the time she'd go mr. What do you think? And I was like, honestly, I don't know what he said.

And I just blast the guy. Or I'd say, I think this is exactly what. I think he's being honest. I think that that's what happened. You know, so I ended up having a good treatment there. So the one time I got, sorry, the one time I got pulled up, I think I could a couple times, but one time I got pulled up halfway through, the guy was just lying. And you could, my body language was so fucked up.

And I was so angry. And I was so ready to light. I guess he blindsided you. I kind of knew what was going to happen because there had been an incident but I wasn't going to pull them up or anything like I didn't care we got to do a little tiff

little argument where I never even said anything he just he was like bipolar or something he just went nuts and started yelling at me in the line and then so the next day he pulled me up so because that night he tried to confront level me about it and when he went he goes hey Cox you got a second

I just went I walked right by him I goes no and then a little 20 minutes later he stopped me and he goes hey Cox man And he stopped, stepped in front of me. I was standing somebody. He was, hey, man, sorry about today. He put his hands out, and I go, that ain't happening. And I walked off.

So he was pulled me up to say, hey, you're holding resentment, you're this or that. But then he twisted the situation. So in the middle of him twisting it, making me look like I had said something, even though I never even said anything to the guy. He just went off on me because I had glanced back and looked at him because he was talking loud. And I just looked back. He was like, the fuck are you looking at? Huh? And then so he mouthed off to me.

And then his buddy mouthed off them. They're both moutting off to me. And I just started laughing. I was thinking I was thinking to myself are you nuts you're an art out with me like look how you're behaving like I'll pull you up tomorrow you know so but I just started laughing and then I just turned around and a couple of his buddies like hey hey hey hey hey they pulled him back and it was over but he then tried to apologize he then twisted the pull up in the middle of pull up I get I'm sitting there just looking at him like I'm about to cut you at half I'm gonna cut this dude's head clean off like

I was going to lean into him and so what happened it even though you're not supposed to you're not supposed to. I had already told the DTS, if anybody ever pulls me up and they're being dishonest, I'm not accepting responsibility. Oh, Mr. Cox, you have to respond. I don't care. I said, I'm going to cut that dude's head, clean off his fucking body in front of everybody. And I don't care what the consequences are. And so she could tell. Like, there's like three DTSs and they're sitting, they're going back. He's going on and on. I'm, and I start going, like, you can see my body language. And somebody even says, hey, hey, Cox. body language i go fuck that

like that and the guy was like you know they're scared like everybody they're like who they don't say anything they're like body language and I'm like fuck that and I'm like like I'm waiting for him to finish so I can lose it on him so you didn't hear a word he said I heard he was lying and so the DTS ends up saying Dr. Smith happens to walk in she goes you know what the DTS stops it just stop hold on a second

goes and gets the doctor doctor comes in walks in and says what happened okay and she looks and she goes, what's the pull-up? He starts talking, and then halfway through, she goes, she goes, stop, cox, what happened? And she, and, you know, of course, people are like, holy shit, like that never happens. And I said, here's what happened. Boom, boom, boom, boom.

I said, then this happened, then this happened. I said, and he asked me to shake his hand. I said, no. I said, he asked me this. I said, that ain't never going to fucking happen. I just kept walking. And she goes, why did you do that? I said, because he's a piece of garbage.

I said, and I am holding resentment. I said, that's why. And she went, okay, well, I don't, I don't see that there's an issue here. She was, Cox has every right to be upset. Like, everything you learn in the program, she lost, she threw it out the window. Through it out the window. God, I've seen that. Yeah, and everybody, and when I walked out, guys are like, are you, are you banging this broad?

Like, what's happening when she calls you in the fucking, in her office? What's happening here? because that's that's unheard of right but yeah so that's the time that that time i got pulled up that was like insane but i'm sorry finish sorry i don't know what you were saying oh um what i was going to comment on that and say there we had two guys in our program that the dTS loved and they allowed them to get away and do things that no one else could get away with Brutal honesty, I was going to ask you, have you seen anyone get kicked out for being brutally honest? I've seen three people get kicked out for brutal honesty.

Okay, it depends. So yes and no. The problem is the brutal honesty was the guy when they said, how do you feel about your, the first time he had like a team. That's a team was when they called, I know this is completely silly. Colby's looking like, is this really a thing? So they would, every once in while they'd team you. they would team several people sometimes they'd say hey we're going to have team on Friday

and then they would team like let's say 30 people right and so you would go into your team and you would bring you could bring like a representative you could bring like a peer and you could bring like your big brother right so you could bring like three or four people with you to kind of like as your advocates

so they would but if something happened they would have an emergency team you ever heard of right so what happens is they so I had a guy one time they had a regular team in the first phase he had gone through team everybody goes through one or two teams in the first phase so he'd gone in and they asked him about his victims and the very first thing he said well i mean my crime was medicare so the victims would be the united it'd be the united states government and they'd say well how do you feel about that he'd go i don't feel anything about it like what do you mean and they were like do you feel bad he's like for the united states government they go well your victims are anybody on medicare it's everybody it's thousands of people you go i don't see it like that He said it was the United States government. It was $4.5 million. You know, he's like, I mean, I don't know.

What am I supposed to say? Like, I paid back some of the money. You know, I, you know, he's like, I have a nice house. I have nice vehicles. I worked out an agreement. He said, my wife's living well. He's like, I made a lot of money. He's like, do I feel bad about it?

No. This is the first phase, though. Keep my first phase, you could do that because you don't know anything yet. You're a newbie. It was the third phase. and they brought it up again and his brutal honesty was to be honest I just don't feel like I have any victims

like I don't I don't feel like I have any victims so I don't feel bad about it I know what I did was wrong and I shouldn't have done it I certainly wouldn't have done it again but do I feel bad for my victims he goes no what victims you're saying oh everybody in Medicare he's like I mean think about it that's like what 0 0 0200 you know for everybody in Medicare like no I don't feel bad nobody in Medicare knows that I

they were hit in some way or victimized he's like no bam straight out the door you haven't but that was brutal honesty stupid brutal honesty but brutal honesty think about it that was it was honest it was being honest why you say it was stupid brutal honesty

because it got a kicked out of the program because the truth is well you don't how would you know what brutal honesty gets you kicked out of program and which one does it because brutal I well the one where you're brutally honest about basically what he was saying is I haven't learned anything and I'm not he was honest but the truth is he should have been even if he felt that way which I'm sure he did he should have not been honest in that in that situation he should have lied in that and pretended to say no what I did was wrong and I know this and I know that I victimized people by doing that and I they because it's the appropriate thing to say and it's what they want and the truth is is like if you end up stealing a $5,000 from Bank of America your victim is Bank of America there are idiots out there that will scream you every single person that it's not even measurable what I did to Bank of America isn't even measurable so are there victims at Bank of America no it's just Bank of America so I think what he said was correct I think they have an improper interpretation of what a victim what what your

crime is they don't understand it and as a result of that they kicked him out of the program so he should have known that he should have simply lied yes I know I have victims I know this I know He should have really, and his brutal honesty got him kicked out. Some brutal honesty is brutal honesty where you say something like, like, for instance, I was, do you remember the thing you do when you first go in, you have to take like a survey? Not a survey. It's a series.

What is a survey? There's so much of questions they ask you. And one of the things they asked me was, the guy goes, and in a way, I almost just threw him a bone. You know what I'm going to say, right? if you read you read the book so you know so i threw him a bone because i actually was i done the tat that little survey and i said um he goes uh what are you hoping to get out of this program and i went i would like to be able to tone down my narcissism a little bit and he and let's face it saying that about yourself is it's brutally honest am i narcissists yeah every everybody's

a narcissist everybody has some narcissistic traits right that okay so that's not brutal on When does a true narcissist say I want to tone down myself? Right. Well, I'm not saying a true narcissist. I'm just saying my narcissism. And there's a scale, right? Like you have the top scale, right? Which is, you know, let's face it, like probably Trump, right?

He doesn't think he ever does anything wrong. And I, by the way, between you and I, I know you'll be disgusted by this. Like, I actually, there's a lot of stuff about Trump I do like. My problem is he's such a narcissist. And by the way, that's bad for the algorithm. them um he the only prop my problem is not being able to admit when you're wrong there are things that you've said that are wrong admit it also um you know so there are there are some things that i think he's done and said that i wish he was like when he goes off prompt when he's reading the the teleprompter

and he goes off it's like oh god don't go off script well some of it is fantastic so but okay so i'm saying that's a top scale right i'm saying me i'm not top scale narcissists but i have some narcissistic traits. And so I tell the guy, I say, I'd like to tone down the narcissism. I said at least to the point where I can actually care about other people and at least pay attention to what they're saying when they're talking. And he goes, well, what's happening when they're talking right now? I said, right now when other people are talking?

And he goes, yeah. I said, I'm just waiting for an opportunity to talk about myself. And listen, that is brutal honesty. So is what the other guy. Yeah, but that got him kicked out. So how do you decipher what's going to get you kicked out and what's not going to get you kicked out. I think he should have known better.

I'll give you an example of a brutal honesty that should have gotten someone kicked out. But didn't? But didn't. Okay. All right. Someone says, I've been smoking or I've been using drugs since I've been in the program. In what phase? Two and three.

Really? Yes. Here's Bruton honestly I think To get you kicked out was a guy Did he get pulled up or did you just admit it? He admitted it He stood up himself

He pulled himself up Okay wait a second Now I think that's different than being caught This is a guy who basically That's a cry for help I could see him getting Not kicked out But maybe being held back

One phase Because there's three phases Right Being held back one phase I could see to that but maybe not being kicked out what do you think what happened

um well I happen to know he did it so he could continue to smoke it was kind of like oh like I'm struggling with it yes nice the amount of mental manipulation

that these guys oh that's what I thought to myself and one guy that got kicked for a limited time at McDonald's enjoy the tasty breakfast trio your choice of chicken or sausage McMuffer or McGrittles with a hash brown and a small iced coffee for five bucks plus tax. Available until 11 a.m. at participating McDonald's restaurants.

Price excludes iced coffee and delivery. Now, this is a real honest I think to get you kicked out. One of the DTS was saying that when normally she's like, okay, I'll take care of that for you. And you know when I say I'm going to take care of something, I take care of it. And he goes, no, you don't. Here's four examples of when you told me stuff and you didn't take care of it. And he, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. It's like immediately she says, leave, your excuse from the meeting and kicked them out.

What do you think about that, brutal honesty? That was just stupid. The problem with the DTS is that they're, first of all, they're all emotionally damaged. Like all of them have major problems. Yeah, no, we had all. We only had one male. We had like five females, one male. And they were all insane.

Yes. it's funny that the male the funniest thing about the male DTS was nobody wanted to be there less than him he wanted to be in that program less than the inmates

he only I swear the only thing I think I ever really heard him say was he would he would sit down and he had like the big you know you had the big meeting it was like maybe 50 guys or 30 guys they'd have a big circle

you had to do it like once a week at a process group or something right you'd sit down and people they'd go around slowly he would go in sit down everybody of course everybody's there on time you know they're all sit boom ready quiet waiting he'd sit down and go okay we left off with mr cox how are things anything you want to talk about and then you go well yeah you know i was going to say today that or you know a week ago this is what happened but this is what happened you tell talk for a little bit he wouldn't say anything you'd go halfway around the group or maybe the whole way around the group right and then just as things were wrapping him he'd do this several times during the

meeting 10 minutes later and then at the very end of the meeting he'd go well all right uh i think this is a good place to wrap it up like that's all he ever said he this guy he didn't personally They say he was great. And his guys under him in his class were like, he was amazing. Why he says nothing. He says he doesn't hound you. He's not deciphering and giving critical for, yeah. He's burning up the clock on his 20 year retirement.

Yes. Like this is the guy who I did like 20 years in the military got out and now he's doing this for 20. He's working on his second government benefit. I believe that part of his strain was dealing with those females there because Because we had, we had, so there was another program called Challenge that I started before I went to R-DAP, and they had two male and one female. And both of the males would like, whenever you'd talk to them about something that the female advice gave you or said, they, they couldn't help but roll their eyes. Like, oh, my. Okay.

So that advice is. So don't hug someone when they're spitting in your face and ask them how. what's behind this. Oh, yeah. It's in, so you're right. They are emotionally damaged. And the R-Dap,

we had three female, and I felt like they picked the guy that they were probably most attracted to. Because this one woman picked this, it's like she loved the thug. Right. And there was a thug, every phase in three,

there was a thug that she would pick to be mentor. So let me, Let me take you this about my super being a super dapper. I was loved by everybody in the, in the, um, our dap. In the unit or the staff? The unit. Okay. And despised by one of the staff member that loved thugs.

The other two thought I was hilarious because I wrote skits, but the one staff member hated my guts. I could just tell by every exchange. And I thought it was hilarious. I thought it was absolutely hilarious that she hated my guts. So you didn't even try and win her over? No. No, I used to lean into it.

I used to lean into it. And so they picked mentors and they didn't pick me to be a mentor. And there were actually like two groups where they had discussions about that, about why didn't they pick Zach to be a mentor? Right. Like as much as he helps everybody in here, I don't understand it. You definitely think it was her. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I could, I, like, the way my mind works, I could decipher how they, they put it together. But it's, it's, it's, so it, you're right, the staff member are, the, the DTS are like flawed individuals that sort out us or the people in the group by what they prefer or what they like. So someone liked you, and that's, that's the whole point. That's why they, that's why you didn't get kicked out for brutal honesty. because I've seen people get kicked out for way less. Like, I saw a guy get kicked out for not accepting a help up. Right. You know, and he didn't accept it.

So they go, we kicked him out. So I'm like going, yeah, but, you know. You're allowed to not accept it, right? Exactly. That's what we kept going, but aren't you allowed to do that? Yeah, but we can tell that he wasn't progressing. He was in the first phase. Yeah, you almost never, you'd have to be a complete maniac to get kicked out in the first phase,

the first three months. You'd have to be a maniac. Well, in the pen, a lot of people got into fights and different situations. So they were, they were gone in and out, in and out, in and out. It was hard for them to keep people down there. It was hard. I was just going to say there was this one. So by the way, so we had one woman who was a Spanish woman.

She was extremely just angry and bitter. And so she was one, she wasn't that hard to deal with except that she was angry and bitter. Then we had this one woman, a black woman, who was. I don't want to say she was a I do feel like she was a pathological liar She had some pathology, right? Some issues with it Because she was constantly saying

That she used to tell people That she had a master's degree Right That Dr. Smith wasn't the only person That had a master's degree Or doctorate or whatever she has She said And so

She would tell people that That they had offered her to be To run the program But she didn't want the responsibility She liked her life the way it was so but it come to find out of course it was just absolutely wasn't true right right like she used words like edjimicated um you know so it was just like they were there was just like i was like are you serious did she just say like we you know it's like a couple of guys were like did she just say

edjimicated like there's she constantly saying things and i used to i had a list in the book i list things that she said um uh uh well go was one of one she used to say all the time uh what it was was I mean she would say something It would be like It's almost like she was well spoken But it's like I feel like you're almost saying this on purpose But she wasn't

So we just It was like It comes out later I actually asked Dr. Smith Dr. Smith actually said I don't know why she tells people that She's like no she doesn't She is she is but she tells people that all the time

But she said lots of stuff like Oh people say oh how was your weekend And she'd go oh we flew to New Orleans We did this we did that We did and it wasn't true Like you didn't fly to New Orleans Because two days later somebody would ask you and she'd say she went somewhere else or she went did this it

it was these little but you know you're in prison you don't know right so she had some issues there um but she actually liked me at first she hated me the first first phase she hated me second face she liked me um and then we had one that was her name was dr knee smith or not sorry sorry just knee smith her name was knee smith knee smith was bipolar and she hated she had some people she absolutely loved and some people she absolutely hated and she absolutely loved me right you know the very very first day we got into an argument and I pushed back and I was the only person I think had ever probably pushed back on her um and as a result she backed down and immediately decided she liked me she was the one that I told you like I would fill out my book and hand it to

her and she would look at it she would hold it for a week and she's supposed to review them oh yeah and then a week later she'd call me in to get my book and I would think because I either hadn't done the work or I wrote ridiculous things that you should not have I answer questions completely inappropriately I mean like absolutely inappropriate like not not like in a sexual nature but just in a comical ridiculous nature one of them was like what would your life be like in 10 years if you stopped using drugs and what would your family life be like and what would your political or your your community life be like and I put down wait and what would your relationships be like and my answer was you gave you one paragraph and my my answer was hopefully in 10

years from now i will be dating a 22-year-old ex-stripper who is only with me for my vast real estate wealth i will have no children i said no family to speak of i said and since i'm a currently a convicted fraudster i am a pariah in the community and therefore will have as little to do with them as possible that's it that was my answer i said i said i said and I'll be absolutely happy and then I put Go Art app No oh and then I put

I said hopefully I'll die at the age of 95 betting my young bride Like that was like ridiculous Like hilarious hilarious But also people would read it and go Oh bro you're gonna get thrown out

Gave it to her Two weeks later She's read all of them Looked them Graded them came back in She goes okay And by the way My whole book was riddled with those

There were no There were no serious answers In the book Comes back and she would go okay Cox and I'd go I'd walk in waiting for the lecture waiting for the what the hell are you doing you think it's a joke what are you doing she comes out she goes look she said look through your stuff she said you clearly have a good grasp of the material she said um just keep up the good work like you're doing great and I was like thank you take my book and I leave this happened over and

the whole program she never looked at my books never wow there were guys that would like barely say something out of line and she'd make them erase the whole page and rewrite it because you had to write in pencil but I'm saying so like I really got lucky like if I ever took that program again based on like this podcast or this book if they saw it I'd be dead there's never let me I won't make it through phase one

so I know a guy that did that who wrote that down and called the DTS what did they say that he wrote something in the book that it's trifling and I don't think like this is a good idea and these questions are asked, you know, to belittle us and stuff like that in his book.

And he got kicked out for that. Can you imagine? And you wrote stripper comments and they never said a word. Of course. Who doesn't want to date a next stripper? Like, yeah, you dealt with a lot of different help-ups, but the help-ups that I had, I think I got helped up probably in the whole time,

about four times in the group. So you're saying someone pulled you up for something you did. Right. So normally where I was, help ups were generally false. They were fake. Really? See, no, man. Ours were, I'd say 99% of them were real.

Stupid, but real. Well, ours were fake, stupid. Every once in a while, there were real ones. Generally, so I was always surprised. I had to ask myself that question. Real help-ups, I was always pleasantly surprised at the tension and the resolution. There were good ones where someone actually had an issue with somebody, and it got very tense where that person was mad,

and they talked it out, and they actually resolved it. I was very happy to see that. You know what I'm saying? And that kind of gave me hope that, you know, there are alternatives to doing it. Well, can I also point out that, like, because you have to think, look, first of all, in the low, they didn't like it. He was upsetting, okay, in general.

Because, of course, in the low, you're kind of almost pretending that, you know, that you're upset about people snitching and this and that. But the truth is, most of the people at the low cooperated in some form or fashion. Now, they may have cooperated and justified it, and they may hate snitches, but they're justifying their cooperation. But most of them did. In the pen environment, not only do they despise snitches, but they're ready to retaliate against snitches. that's the environment you're in so you're in an extremely tense oh man ours is just 18 months or you get there were so in the meeting I think you how many fights did you have we all what physical fights is just one okay in the meeting physical fights I've witnessed probably

eight and you have to imagine the kind of guys that are in the pen like these aren't a couple of attacks accountants I would say eight fights and one assault where somebody lost an eye so it it was so you mean when I say fight a fight is physical yes okay physical you said it you said an assault so well there was one assault and there was eight fights well what's this what's the difference between a fight and an assault oh you mean the guy would just got oh that's right there's this guy that got just attacked yes he was no fighting back even it was just an attack yes okay so and and then there were there were fights where it's it's like you know um like I don't know why this this jackass helped me up all my blah blah like listen man

Bum, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, B, Break it up. You know, pepper spray, everybody in your rooms. My God. So, all right, so for me, I, I had, I never had, so the point I was trying to make is where I was, 90% of the help-ups were coordinated. So we, we had a help-up team where guys would go around and say, hey, listen, we got to have two help-ups each day. So it's coming around to you. You got to be helped up. So John's going to help you up.

He's going to say that maybe you skipped in line or you in a line. You told kind of a joke that nobody appreciated. And we're going to help you up for telling that joke. Oh, bro. See, that right there, that would have never. These guys in my program were snitching so much. You couldn't get a coordinated effort like that. That's all we did.

That's all we did. So every day we'd have two set up helpups going. Wow. And every once in a while. That is manipulation. Oh, yes. That's how we did it. It looked good for the ladies.

Look good for the ladies. That's what it was. You know, and the help up was fake. For me, I was kind of an overachiever. So I love joking around in comedy. So my favorite part of the meeting was the upbeat ritual. I hated the SB. Oh, my God.

It was embarrassing and just. Bro, I came up with. So some of the people I talked to that are in R-Dap, they still they still call me and I give them suggestions of upbeat rituals still and they some of the upbeat rituals I've done are been solidified on the Ardap phone on the Ardap phone did they ever listen to your phone calls yes I forgot about that that's something else we can talk about we had a guy by the way real quick we had a guy that was working in some chick on the outside. She had sent him like $3,000 and he was he was bragging about it on the phone

and they heard him. And of course he's also talking about he's calling women, you know, bitches and huh. Yeah, this and that. Yeah, yeah. I got this. Yeah, yeah. And he and I got this one girl. Man, she sent me $3,000. I told her I got no money when I get out. So I, she's, she'd been saving her money. She sent me $3,000. He had it on his, on his, uh, his, um, his, his inmate account. They team him, they play the tape, and they tell him he's got one choice to, one, call these other women, all the women, tell them all about each other, and two, send the $3,000 back or keep the $3,000, go back to your old unit, because you're getting kicked out of the program, do the extra year, and you can spend that money. You can keep living the lifestyle you're living in here. He had to call all of them and send the money back. and got it went around everywhere like they are listing to phone calls bro oh sorry go ahead

we kind of had the same similar situation so man I made me lose my train I know you the guy you said that people call but you said that you got pulled up right I got helped up so helped up yeah helped pulled up so I I got blindsided so every time all of mine none of mine were ever coordinated even the ice thing was not so I got helped up one time because because I was doing a game for the upbeat ritual and I said the word porn. Like I asked about the, I forgot what the upbeat ritual was and I said the word porn.

And so then they helped me up and they said, you know, that's offense. All of our DTS are women and you use the word porn and that's offensive and I don't know why you chose to use those type of words. That's the help up I got and I'm going, wow. I accept the pull up Yeah, I accepted it

Yeah There was one they told me that I What'd you have to do? I had to Most of the time They asked me to do skits Because that was my thing I'd write a little play

And we'd do a little bit So he's not trying to hurt you Was he trying to get you messed up? Oh yeah Oh really? Oh yeah They helped me up one time Because we were putting together

Something for our group Yeah One of our groups were putting together something we had to present. I think every, I think each Tuesday and Thursday we had to do a presentation. They had something that went on right after the meeting where it was like a class. Right. Yeah.

Everybody. And so each group had to present each time. And so we were had, we had to do a presentation. And we had a couple people that know what they were doing. Or I was. Oh, you go around to help facilitate with all the skills. Right. And so I was telling them, look, try this over this.

Which is something you would have done anyway. Exactly, and they helped me up because they said I was trying to take a leadership role Like you weren't listening to you weren't opening to anybody else's ideas I said, and I want to go, are you kidding me? I want to go, what idea that you have that I wasn't listening to? Mr. I don't have nothing, I'll do whatever you asked me to do Those were the type of help-ups I got

And what they did for me, they played it off of the woman that didn't like me they basically like fed into whatever disdain which made me think that somewhere someone was talking like this guy thinks he's all that yeah yeah you know yeah they they they would anybody it's funny because like they wanted you to participate and they wanted you to take a leadership role and they wanted you to help everybody else and then if you did it you were manipulative you were entitled you were like there there was a way to manipulate any given situation to attack someone in that program. Yes. But, yeah, I, you know, like, you have to admit, like, you learn so much. Like, you could categorize people. Like, after that, nowhere near as good. Like, Dr. Smith, you could walk into her office, sit down,

she could talk to you for three or four minutes, and she could start telling you about yourself. And you would be like, oh, my God. Like, she would say, she goes, so one of your family members, was an alcoholic, was it father, mother, and you're like, um, uh, and, well, you don't think that's just from the paperwork and and they

and they may, no, they have the PSI. I mean, I'm sure they have your PSI. I'm sure they read it, but I mean, she could categorize like your personality type.

Like she, like that, because they see a thousand guys like you and me. Like I like to think I'm special. Right. But in that program when they're masterfully having these people come through and they're seeing the same basic and there are only like so many personality types, right?

So they can categorize. you and then they can subcategorize you in there and what kind of help cause that personality time so she was all of them were all pretty good like these weren't stupid people but they were all disturbed like there was some issues and and i'm glad you say that because i i felt like the human side of them is the the part i thought was bad i thought that their emotions played pulled the negative of what was positive like you said they want you to do certain things and I'm kind of like one of them overachievers so when I did those things

it's kind of like well we still don't like you right I asked you to do this you did it you gave it your all you were very good at it and now I'm going to target you and say this about you but I did what you says you know it yeah there was no way to win but that's the thing they were very like Dr. Smith may very well be one of the most

manipulative people I've ever met ever had a Dr. Smith did you? Yes was it a man no this is a woman kind of an attractive woman with black hair straight like Indian like Indian half Indian yeah yeah the same Dr. Smith we had serious little she probably in Beaumont Texas she must have come from Beaumont and then come to because she had just only been in our program for like maybe a year before I got there yes yeah she was listen here's the thing

about Dr. Smith she was she was super manipulative oh my God it was over the top but here's the thing about her first of all she was she in prison she was a 10 right because she was But she kind of had a little belly and she looked dirty. She looked. Somebody told me. Someone had a perfect example of her. They said she's cute, but it looks like if she kicked her shoes off her feet would stink.

I don't know what I'm going. How perceptive. When I met, when I met her, like I'd seen her. Would you agree with that though? Um, no, but I would have before I met her and talked to her. Because when I talked to her, here's what her thing was. To me, she's about a sick. Right, five or six.

When you talk to her, she jumped up to like an eight. Well, she was intelligent, but she didn't look disheveled. I never saw her feet. No, not her feet, not disheveled. I mean, like, did her hair look like it wasn't? No, she had straight, long black hair. Right, but it's like she kept it up or she just threw it together in the morning. She looks fine.

She always looked disheveled. No, not to me. And she was, listen, but manipulative, like you can't believe. Like, I mean, just... Maybe we're not talking about the same kind of a pot belly, a little bit of a belly. I don't remember any pot. There's no pop belly.

Brian just told you. She was, she's a six. Like I said, like, on the street, she's a six. In prison, she's a nine, maybe a ten. Yeah, I agree. She was attractive. Yeah. Yeah, she was probably 110 pounds.

She used to be married to. Was she divorced? Divorced from a basketball player. Like a guy was like a professional basketball player. It had to be the same one. Indian descent. Yeah, Indian, black and Indian, probably mixed. She was mixed.

Mean, it could be mean as shit. Oh, yeah, she was, she could be brutal. I wonder if it's the same one. It's got to be the same one because she probably moved. She probably moved from Beaumont and went there. Wow. Yeah, yeah, she was, uh, she was something else, something else. When did you take it?

This is 14, 15? I took it in, I took it in 2000 and, um, 2018. Yeah, I think she left about 15. Really? 15, 16? Yeah, because she got there. Like I said, a year or so before I ended up in that. And I went to the program.

So, so definitely probably 16. She probably got there in 16 because I started the program at first in 17, went for six months, got out for three or four months, got back in for eight months or seven months, and then got back out. Might have been almost eight months. What a small world. Right? Well, it's a BOP. I didn't, I didn't, yeah.

I didn't have her long. I had the guy, but I'm telling I had no problems except with that one woman. Her name was Pruitt. Her name was Ms. Pruitt. That's the only woman I had a problem with. And she did not like me. So, bizarre.

So. How long was each program, by the way? I was thinking about something you used to say. The one chick I told you the first time I went through, she didn't like me. How long was each phase? Yeah, each phase. Sorry, three months.

Three months each, nine months. Right, right. So it was, it was 12 weeks. so I remember the first time I was the first phase I was in this one chick I can't believe I can't remember her name the the black DTS chick that I told you about and literally like she when the first day I got there she was she started laughing when she saw me that I was going to be in her group like literally like looked at me she was she was Cox and I was like oh man and after the end of the week like I didn't say anything like the first week I figured I'll just be quiet right the first week so I didn't say much But at the very end of the last week, I was walking out that she was saying goodbye to everybody as we walked out the door. And she looked at me and she goes, and she goes, Cox, she goes, how's it going? And I go, and I go, 11 more weeks. And I turn her and she goes, oh, and I just kept on walking.

And she was like, huh, huh, like I made it. And I made it. And I go, 11 more weeks. I'm out of here from you. But yeah, but she ended up liking me. She ended up really liking me. But yeah, I know what you're saying, bro. But they can make your life.

Yeah. It was rough. It was, it was. So for me, the overall experience, it was fun for the camaraderie that I had and the people that I dealt with. And it was, it was fun because I got a chance to show off. Yeah. Some skills and everything. And I love that type of.

In the pen, I'm sorry. In the pen, let's face it. Like in prison in general, I hate to say this, but in prison, in society, like I'm, I'm, I'm sharp guy. Right. I'm not the, you know, I'm not Elon Musk or whatever,

but I'm a sharp guy. In prison, you're a rocket scientist. I can only imagine what it was like to be in the pin. You must have been like the brainiac of brainiac. Yes. Like, yes.

So known very popular on every compound that I've been on. Very, very popular. Yeah. Like. I hear you. Popular, not in the way that I was popular. All the guys wanted to know me. Hey, Cox, now.

Including me. No, no. Can I buy you? Do you need some tennis shoes? No, I don't need any tennis shoes. Thank you. Appreciate it. Come in myself for a minute.

I don't think so. But anyway, hey, let's wrap it up. So I'm going to wrap it up. All right. Hey, so if you like the video, do me a favor and hit that subscribe button. Hit the bell so you get notified. Share the video. Like the video.

I never tell anybody to like it. the video so you gotta do like like the video love it yeah and leave me a comment and also go to zack's channel Zach has a channel we're gonna leave the description or leave the description we're gonna leave the channel link to his youtube channel in the description he's already started to put up videos subscribe he's at like 630 subscribers we gotta get him over a thousand a thousand um subscribers and we have to get him a 4,000 hours of watch time he's almost at a thousand right now watch the videos we need to get him monetized i really appreciate you guys watching thank you very much see you i didn't learn anything bro i i literally do you understand

all this all this is for the camera because i think like do you understand that at one point so you know the books you know the questions you were answered you answered i was answering the questions like ridiculous talking about you know like it's like will you where where will you be in 10 years if without drugs in your life. And I put, you know, and it was like, hopefully I'll be married, I will be married to a gold digging ex stripper who only cares about me for my, my vast wealth. And, you know, and then it's like where you're, it asks about family. Like, I will have no family since, since everybody's given up on me.

I will, you know, a community. I said, I'm a pariah in the community. Fuck them. Like, I mean, I was just, like, literally, like, just brutal. And I was like, you know, and, you know, basically that's where, like, she and I have an arrangement. And I will hopefully die betting her at the age of 95 years old. Like, you know. And you understand, so you have to give that to your, to your, like, the, the, uh, DTS, right?

And they review it. Like, every month or so, they call you in for a review. Right. My DTS calls me in. Other people she's calling in, by the way, making them rewrites that you had to write everything in pencil, rewrite statements, do this again, do that again. Oh yeah, she calls me in and she says this.

She says, Mr. Cox, I reviewed your book. She said, and I was like, okay, and I thought, fuck, because when I did it, I didn't think anything of it. She goes like this. She said, I reviewed your, your material, and I was like, yes, ma'am. And she said, obviously, she said, you have a good, you have a very

good grasp of the material. She said, you're doing excellent work, just keep it up. I said, okay. took the fucking book and walked off I mean she didn't read it of course she didn't why would she read it I'm well spoken she's going to me during the class

she's like Mr. Cox what do you think about what he said because the first two phases you're just trying to get these these fucking savages to eat with fucking utensils and say thank you but me

I'm okay with that I knew the third phase they will destroy me the third phase is when they come for the con men so we'll talk about So phase, phase one is intro, like you call it. Right. What was phase?

Like, what was your hardest phase? It had to be phase three. Because you're pulling, like, what do you mean by hardest? Like, all of it was easy to me. Jesus. Dude, I'm, I'm, I'm, listen, they, do you understand they brutal? In the third phase, like, the guys that were sailing first through the first two phases, like that basically the con men, the fraudsters, the, you know what I'm saying?

They were okay. They were okay in the first two phase by the first. third one, that's when they came for you. Because at the third one, they want to see improvement. So I broke it down, and I'm going to bring it up. What was the, I'm

just trying to so we can hit each section. And of course, you, anyway, what was it called when they called you in to meet with the... Team? Team! This is great.

This should be being recorded. Oh, I was going to say. Yeah, yeah, team. Go, bro, they're teaming me. They're teaming you? Will you come with me? Yeah, you had to have a, yeah, okay. Yeah, had to have back, not backup.

What was it called? It was called sponsors. Yeah, yeah, it was sponsor. Well, I think they did. Yeah, you needed a peer and like a sponsor, and then you brought your big brother. Did they call them big brothers? Yeah, we had the big brothers going on.

You had a family, a brother, a brother tree. My poor big brother. This fucking guy was terrified of me. And you had, what were those guys called? that were in charge like you had that they graduated the program that mentors mentors oh yeah you had a mentor and then you had the comps people that had completed the program that were still there but they weren't meant see they and where I all right so all this stuff we should put on camera so yeah he's recording this he'll throw this at the at the end of it

all right so we can cover cool Okay. Yeah, it's good. All right. Yeah, these are good. So we can, so we can talk about each. Each phase or just? I wanted to do the, uh, the 10, the, I want to do the, the, the, the, the, uh, you do, you, do you understand I kept all my art app stuff. Like, I don't know where it is upstairs in a box, but I kept the books. I even had the armband. These were the armbands.

I took a photo of the arband, arm band for the cover and put it, this is sitting on an art app book. That's what these are. these are the different phases yes low phase one phase two and this is the book this was remember criminal lifestyle that that's the name that's the book yes i'm trying to think of 10 thinking habits 10 thinking habits uh yeah the what did i call them didn't i have thinking errors right right it was um blaming yeah um wasn't one of them like a should

should thinking yeah was should be the this way, it should be that way. What was the acronym for it? Because I remember H. Hog Crow for the positive attitudes. I just memorized them. All right. So do you understand? Did they ever do random tests for you? Yes. Okay. So, so every, like everybody was terrified at the random test. And they were all like, bro, what are you going to do? Like you don't know any of the material, any of it. And they just randomly do the test. And I was like, right, right. And they're like, what are you going to do? I was like, oh, I'm going to fail it. I'm going to fail. I'm going to fail it.

And they were like, well, I was like, yeah, but I mean, you don't have to pass the test to pass that, that section of, I said, but I'll get through it. I'll explain. I was nervous. I was uncomfortable. I, you can ask me any questions. I said, you understand. They think I know all this material because I'm great in class. Right.

They've, I said, you know, they've gone through my book. They keep giving me these passing scores in my book. So if I fail the test, I can blame it on dyslexia. I can blame it on whatever. I was like, oh, I'll get through it. They're like, you're such a cocky prick. so at one point there was

they were going to randomly screen people right like in the morning meeting and just ask you questions so my big brother came to me he goes Cox are you ready for this like if they call you like you know the you know what the 10 attitude

to errors or error whatever they are thinking errors are right I went no no and he goes well what about and he starts asking me questions like no I don't, I don't have any idea. He's like, yeah, but I wrote you. He was, I gave you the flashcards.

And I'm like, yeah, I've got him here somewhere. And he was like, you're wasting good stories, Matt. Well, it's going to be on the end. He'll put this on the end. But the funny thing about that is so we get, so he's like, he's so he's terrified. If I fail, he's like, you understand if you fail, he's, I'm supposed to be helping you. I'm your big brother. He's like, yeah, he's like, I'm supposed to be helping you.

I'm like, oh, yeah, you dropped the ball, bro. Because he's like, I thought you didn't need help. Like you're you, you're smart guy. I'm like, yeah, I know. I figure that'll carry me through. Like, I don't really expect to pass a program. I like the unit. It's clean.

Everybody's very polite. It's nice. I like it here. I go to bed at 10 o'clock anyway. I don't sleep during the day. You know, like all the things that are bothered everybody else. I don't do those things. So anyway, he goes, he's like, oh, my God.

Oh, my God. He's freaking out. I go, but you, what, he's like, you've got a learner. You got a little toe. He goes and gets the guy that told, that put us together, right? That told him I would be a good, a good student or whatever. And he goes, oh, oh, my God. He's good, this is what's happening.

If they call on him, I'm going to, I'm going to get fail. And he goes, Cox, you got to remember him. So they give me, he had like 50 cards. I memorized them in two days. In two days, I memorized every single card. I just all day long. Your pressure does work. It does because I felt bad.

You know, it wasn't for any other reason that I was like, I felt bad for him because he needed the year. And he was such a nice guy, too. He was. That's the part of, so phase three is teaching. When you go on, like, so the first. one is the introduction right you say they feed you the second one is when you have to apply it so now you have to start doing stuff and in the third phase you actually have to teach the phase

oneers yeah where i was they made you responsible for a certain group of so you had some phase one people in your group and some phase two people in your little family tree right you know so i'd be like all right and i had a person just like you like no i don't know that stuff i go you freaking like dude you're taking this shit too seriously yes and you're taking it too unsuriously here's what's funny um so one of the things that happened i think i talk i talk about this in the book i very quickly realize you know how you had to go to like a a you had to go to like this different groups therapies you had to learn how to do a pull up you had to go to the classes right you so i real i went to like two classes you had to go like 10 of them 10 here

attend there, attend this, and you always had to attend AA. I realized right away if you don't attend the first AA meeting, they never put you on the roster, and they never checked to see if you continue to go. So I just didn't go. I never went the first time. The second thing was, those classes that you're supposed to go

to, I went the first two times, and then I just signed the instructor's name over and over and over and over again. And of course, my roommate was like, what if they check? What if they double check? I'm like, well, first of all, it's signing a Random sheet, the fact that they're going to grab mine and go grab every single one, I said,

someone would have to go and tell them. There's 100 fucking guys here, 150 guys sitting in this unit. Like, there's no way. I'm like the likelihood that they're going to pinpoint me and then go through every single one. And if they do, he's like, yeah, what if they do? I said, then I'll say, I lied. I lied. I signed them.

I signed their name. I said, what does it matter? And they're like, oh, bro, that's all. Right. So they get all upset. But I never went. I just never went. And I had guys actually come to me and say, I never see you.

in class and I go, which one do you go to? Well, I go to the one at six o'clock. I go, oh, on what? Tuesdays? And they go, no, no, on Wednesdays and Fridays. I go, oh, I go to the one on Monday and such and such. Whatever it was. And I had that time.

If they didn't go to, that's the one you went. Come on. Boy, you were a nightmare for a dedicated person like myself. All right. If we can do the 10 thinking errors, then I'm ready to start. Did you guys have a prize closet when they gave out prizes? They did give out candy and stuff like that, but I don't know that we didn't call it a prize. It was something that was, I think it was discretionary for Dr. Smith to do herself.

Right. Or maybe the DTSs or whatever, because they all had like a little box in their unit where it was so like you want to feel like a child. Yes. Yeah, yeah. You were doing so good. Pick two items out of the box. Yeah. Skittles.

Do you have skittles? Yes, they had skittles. which you could resell on the car that's in Coke but if you found if you were caught reselling them

yeah booked out all right so let's do the thinking errors and we can start yeah

all right so you said one I can't remember the order so one was definitely should should thoughts I wonder if somebody

blaming is one um honesty responsibility willingness I got that open mindedness humility yes I got all those right there caring gratitude only because I knew the

acronym objectivity gratitude I got it all honestly humility open my net gratitude caring responsibility objectivity willingness what is that those are the positive attitudes oh for God's sake oh here it is um absolutes I can't I can't yes I can't and there's another I one. There's rhetorical questions? Rhetorical question? Yes. Awfulizing. Yes. Which is Jess says that to me. I'll be like, man, you know this and this you'll go, you're awfulizing. Which is hilarious.

Wait, statement of fact? Statement of fact, yes. He, she, it statements? Yes. Blaming. I got that. Loaded questions or words. She

It statements Loaded words Loaded question Yeah Or rhetorical question Or words Loaded words Yes

Look Look Have to Need to Must I can't believe That you just You just

finished it with must God bro Okay You were You were a super dapper What? what do you know they used to call me oh fucking put your cape on back with your super daffin ass should statements

I got should yeah that's it blaming that should be 10 so have to need too much rhetorical question awfulizing I can't there's another I one it's probably one of these that's just altered right is that 10 of us 10 right One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine. There's another island. Thinking and generalizations over generalizing way.

Making excuses for not doing something. There's another eye one. It'll come to me. That's good enough, though. All right. Are you ready? Jesus, making assumptions without knowing the fact. Oh, my God.

What? How long are we going to do? I want to walk out of here by noon. Oh, really? Yes. So it might have to be a two-parter. Come on, let's go. We can do this.

All right, right, right. By noon, you said you had till two. I have to be somewhere at two. It's 30 miles back to my house. And it's past my house I have to be. You'll be right. Where is it? Bradington.

Is it another bank job? No, it's another. Could you imagine? I'm robbing a bank of America. Yes, I'm all. No way to rob it. No, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's a doctor's appointment. I finally got Medicaid, so.

I'm happy. Nice. Getting the pills. All right. Maybe. All right. So start, start, all right. Is this, see.

Sound fine? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You got to, you got to do the closer, right? Me? Yeah, right now you're doing this. Oh. So we both, you know, it's within basically.

Okay. So if you need to pull it closer, pull it close. I know it seems funny with it right in your face. Right. Okay. Um, uh, whatever. Okay, so that's it, right? All right.

I don't know if you guys know this or not, but when I was locked up, I wrote a whole bunch of true crime books, and all of the books are on Amazon, Barnes & Nobles, Audible, their e-books. Check out the trailers. Using forgeries and bogus identities, Matthew B. Cox,

one of the most ingenious con men in history, built America's biggest banks out of millions. Despite numerous encounters, with bank security, state, and federal authorities. Cox narrowly, and quite luckily, avoided capture for years. Eventually, he topped the U.S. Secret Service's most wanted list and led the U.S. Marshals, FBI, and Secret Service on a three-year chase, while jet-setting around the world with his attractive female accomplices.

Cox has been declared one of the most prolific mortgage fraud con artists of all time, by CNBC's American Greed. Bloomberg Business Week called him the mortgage industry's worst nightmare, while Dateline NBC described Cox as a gifted forger and silver-tonged liar. Playboy magazine proclaimed

his scam was real estate fraud, and he was the best. Shark in the housing pool is Cox's exhilarating first-person account of his stranger-than-fiction story. Available now on Amazon and Audible. Bent is the story of John J. Boziak's phenomenal life of crime. Inked from head to toe, with an addiction to strippers and fast Cadillacs,

Boziac was not your typical computer geek. He was, however, one of the most cunning scammers, counterfeiters, identity thieves, and escape artists alive, and a major thorn in the side of the U.S. Secret Service as they fought a war on cybercrime. With a savant-like ability to circumvent banking security and stay one step ahead of law enforcement, Boziak made millions of dollars in the international cyber underworld, with the help of the Chinese and the Russians. Then, leaving nothing but a John Doe warrant and a cleaned-out bank account in his wake, he vanished. Boziak's stranger-than-fiction tale of ingenious scams and impossible escapes,

of brazen run-ins with the law and secret desires to straighten out and settle down, makes his story a true crime con game that will keep you guessing. Bent, how a homeless teen became one of the cybercrime industry's most prolific counterfeiters. Available now on Amazon and Audible. Buried by the U.S. government and ignored by the national media, this is the story they don't want you to know. When Frank Amadeo met with President George W. Bush at the White House to discuss NATO operations in Afghanistan,

No one knew that he'd already embezzled nearly $200 million from the federal government. Money he intended to use to bankroll his plan to take over the world. From Amadeo's global headquarters in the shadow of Florida's Disney World, with a nearly inexhaustible supply of the Internal Revenue Services funds, Amadeo acquired multiple businesses, amassing a mega conglomerate. Driven by his delusions of world conquest, he negotiated the purchase of a squadron of American fighter jets and the controlling interest in a former Soviet ICBM factory.

He began working to build the largest private militia on the planet, over one million Africans strong. Simultaneously, Amadeo hired an international black ops force to orchestrate a coup in the Congo while plotting to take over several small Eastern European countries. The most disturbing part of it all is, had the U.S. government not thwarted, his plans, he might have just pulled it off. It's insanity, the bizarre, true story of a bipolar

megalomaniac's insane plan for total world domination. Available now on Amazon and Audubour. Pierre Rossini, in the 1990s, was a 20-something-year-old, Los Angeles-based drug trafficker of ecstasy and ice. He and his associates drove luxury European supercars, lived in Beverly Hill's penthouses and dated playboy models while dodging federal indictments. Then, two FBI officers with the organized crime drug enforcement task force entered the picture. Dirty agents willing to fix cases and identify informants. Suddenly, two of Rossini's associates, confidential informants working with federal law enforcement, or murdered. Everyone pointed to Rossini.

As his co-defendants prepared for trial, U.S. Attorney Robert Mueller sat down to debrief Racine at Leavenworth Penitentiary, and another story emerged. A tale of FBI corruption and complicity in murder. You see, Pierre Rossini knew something that no one else knew. The truth. And Robert Mueller and the federal government have been covering it up to this very day.

The devil exposed. A twisted tale of drug trafficking. corruption, and murder in the City of Angels. Available on Amazon and Audible. Bailout is a psychological true crime thriller that pits a narcissistic conman against an egotistical, pathological liar. Marcus Schrenker, the money manager

who attempted to fake his own death during the 2008 financial crisis, is about to be released from prison, and he's ready to talk. He's ready to tell you the story no one's heard. Shrinker sits down with true crime writer, Matthew B. Cox, a fellow inmate serving time for bank fraud. Shrinker lays out the details, the disgruntled clients who persecuted him for unanticipated market losses, the affair that ruined his marriage, and the treachery of his scorned wife,

the woman who framed him for securities fraud, leaving him no choice but to make a bogus distress call and plunge from his multi-million dollar private aircraft in the dead of night. The $11.1 million in life insurance. The missing $1.5 million in gold. The fact is, Shrinker wants you to think he's innocent. The problem is, Cox knows Shrinker's a pathological liar and his stories of fabrication. As Cox subtly coaxes, cajoles, and yes, Khan's Shrinker into revealing his deceptions, his stranger-than-fiction life of lies slowly unravels.

This is the story Shrinker didn't want you to know. Bailout. The Life and Lies of Marcus Shrinker. Available now on Barnes & Noble, Etsy, and Audible. Matthew B. Cox is a conman, incarcerated in the Federal Bureau of Prisons, for a variety of bank fraud-related scams. Despite not having a drug problem, Cox inexplicably ends up in the prison's residential drug abuse program,

known as Ardap. A drug program in name only. Ardap is an invasive behavior modification therapy, specifically designed to correct the cognitive thinking errors associated with criminal behavior. The program is a non-fiction dark comedy which chronicles Cox's side-splitting journey. This first-person account is a fascinating glimpse at their survivor-like atmosphere inside of the government-sponsored rehabilitation unit. While navigating the treachery of his backstabbing peers, Cox, simultaneously. simultaneously manipulates prison policies and the bumbling staff every step of the way. The program.

How a conman survived the Federal Bureau of Prisons cult of Ardap. Available now on Amazon and Audible. If you saw anything you like, links to all the books are in the description box.