Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Insane Stories From The Prison Drug Program | RDAP

Episode Date: May 26, 2023

Insane Stories From The Prison Drug Program | RDAP

He just gets up and, bam! Help! Fire! Fire! And I realize that you still can see Billy's handprint on my face. You can see like two of his fingers right. I'm like. Hey, this is Matt Cox.

Yeah, I don't know why you're doing that. It's on me. Oh. Damn. Okay. Hey, this is Matt Cox, and I'm here with Zach. We are going to be going over the ARDAP program. Residential drug abuse treatment.

Residential drug abuse program. Ardap. Ardap. Residential. Residential R. D for drug. A, abuse. P for program.

Okay. So you say RDAP and then people still say program. Whatever. So it's the ARDAP program in federal prison, which Zach went through and passed. And I went through twice and didn't pass. By purpose, not that I couldn't have passed. I may not have been able to pass, honestly, but I would have passed, but it would have been hell, the very last phase. But anyway, and I knew that, and I had a whole different agenda, which you could read in my book.

Like, what a, what a selfless, dude, what a plug. Okay, so check out the video. It's going to be funny. Zach is very funny. Zach had a vastly different experience with ARDAP, although both of us liked the program. And, yeah, it's, it's good stuff. It's Survivor meets federal prison. I'm spitting.

It's Survivor meets federal prison drug program. Yes. So you have to point out the fact that I was in a penitentiary, right? You make me sound soft. And you were in a low where there's harsh language. I was going to say people hurt. I got my feelings hurt once. I'm sure.

I'm sure. So. And that's that. That's a major difference to do it at a pen. As a matter of fact, I had an opportunity to go somewhere else and do it, right, to wait a year and go somewhere else and do it because they were so desperate for people at the pen, I said, I'm going to go ahead and do it now while I'm here. I'm like, why wait and go somewhere else when I can jump in this one right now? Because I qualified for the year off. With the murderers and killers.

Yes, I said, I'm going to jump in and do it with the murderers and killers. because I qualify it for the year off, get my year off now, because I got it off like, I got my year off like three years before I was due to be released, three or four years before I was due to be released. From Ardap. From Ardap.

Right. So if you complete the program, the Ardap program, which is a nine, if you don't get held back, the Ardap program, is a program where inmates go into a special unit. They're retrained or reeducated for nine months.

and during and at the end of that nine months really during the portion of that nine months the one you get one year off of your sentence now if you fail for qualified for qualified inmates you get because some some inmates did not like if they had a violence in their past or a gun charge or or some kind of a you know whatever anyway algorithm some kind of issue with pictures that or video making gang poses but anyway

so then they don't get they don't get the time off but if you qualify you take the course the program you pass it then you get a year off your time so you got a year in the halfway house

if you didn't qualify for the year off well I didn't get a year well they would qualify you for more halfway house time supposedly right not I know lots of guys that only got four and five months I mean halfway

anyway Obama kind of ruined that when he. The halfway house used to have one person. They'd have 10 people in one bed. Yeah, they charge 10 people to be there. Right. And he's like, you can't do that anymore. Right.

Here's what halfway houses were doing. They would charge, they would have an inmate would get out of prison and go to a halfway house. And they would charge them for the government for that bed. Let's say they're charging $100 a day for that inmate. Then they would put the inmate on an ankle monitor and tell, and, and so they monitor him at home. And then they would tell the Bureau of Prisons, hey, we have another bed available. They would then put another inmate in that bed, get another $100. So now they're getting $200 for the same bed.

They would then move that guy to home confinement. They'd say, hey, we got another bed available. They'd said, so they end up having 10. Yeah, like 10 people in one bed getting paid $1,000 a night for one guy in one bed when really these guys are all on an ankle monitor at home. And so Obama came through and said, what are you guys doing? I feel like you're taking advantage of the system. You know, like for us, for when, for those that are in prison, it was heaven because halfway house are like, come on, more, more, more, more, more, more, more.

Right. So if you, so guys could get 10 months a year. But the problem is when they did that, they no longer had the bed availability. And so people that could have gotten a year ended up getting four months, three months. Oh, it shut down the halfway houses for about eight. It was almost impossible to get an half. When he made that adjustment, it was almost impossible to get in a halfway house for almost a year. Yeah.

went from like my halfway house time was adjusted like three different times i even had one time literally my mom thought she's coming to pick me up in like a week and when i went in there to say hey they're my family's mailing and stuff did you guys get it yet and and they were like you're not leaving for two months i was like what he's no no i have my date they were like oh no that changed when did that happen right so yeah anyway i'm sorry but no problem so um our DAP, for those that didn't get the year off, basically they'd offer you more halfway house time. Now, see, what's funny about that situation is, in my view, being at the PIN, I felt like everyone at the low qualified for the year off. I felt like it was the year off that would keep

people in line that would make it very imperative to be there. And having the, when you're living in a unit where everything you do is like, you're in a fish bowl. Where not only are the staff watching you, but they've set up a program to where other inmates are watching you. Oh, absolutely. And so everything you do is subject to scrutiny based on the program. But tell them a little bit about the program and the requirements. So everybody understands. Well, I mean, so first of all, it's really not a drug program, right?

So to get it through Congress, I'm sure they called it a drug program. But really, the program is about behavior modification, right? So they're trying to modify your thinking errors. And this is a funny thing, is like prior to going through that program, I would have told you that like, these guys are locked up because, you know, yeah, they don't follow rules. Like I very quickly summed it up to, well, they don't follow rules that well. But the truth is, when you go through the program, you realize that the people that are locked up have fundamental problems processing situations in general.

You know, and I mean, to a degree where you're like, their immediate leap is like violence or breaking the law or just in pure insanity. And you realize like, bro, like that's your first thought is that? Like they're like, yeah. And you're like, oh, wow. And then you start to realize kind of like to me, I realized going through it. I started realizing like, yeah, my first thought is this. It's not what maybe a violent person's is, but it's still not the appropriate response.

And I'm like, yeah, that isn't appropriate. And you've never been in a situation where you focus on that. So I had never been in that situation. So what happens is you wake up early. Like you wake up early in the morning, let's say 6 o'clock. You then have a morning meeting where everybody goes to the morning meeting and you had, let's say you've got 150 guys. Yes. But I don't know how many more in your program.

Um, about, about a hundred, about 89, 100. Okay. Let's say, let's go with a hundred. It's a better number. I don't know. I think 120 is a full program. Is it? Well, then we had, we had a full program.

So whatever, 120. 120. It's about 60 chairs on each side. Right. And they have you facing, they line the chairs up to where like 60 people are sitting directly across from 60 people. And at the head of that group is a, what they call a facilitator that facilitates the meeting.

And in the back of that. that those two chairs sitting across from each other are the, what they call it, the DTSs, the DTSs, which is the drug, the drug treatment specialists that are there. Right. All right. So wait, I want, I want you to say this, Matt. This is important because, like, I loved the program and I was what they called a super programmer because I love that type of thinking. So I thought it was incredible and awesome. Right.

You on the other half. See, we've already had this. So, Zach, once again, read my book, which honestly, it's a very short, but it's funny because he read it and just laughed his ass off because he's saying he read the book and felt that I did not like the program. I mocked the program the whole time I went through it. But it's not to say that I don't think it was a good program. And to be honest, I've even had conversations with Boziac and, and, um,

Multiple times I've had short discussions, like with this guy, Art App Dan. Oh, I've never, you've got to meet Art App Dan. Anyway. Definitely. Yeah, yeah. He was a super dabber. He was a super dabber. I was a super dabper.

Yeah. So Artap Dan, we've had this discussion. And both of us agree. And Jess, my girlfriend, who passed the program, she'll tell you the same thing. She'll like, I hated every single minute of it. Right. She goes, but I think that every inmate should have to take the program because you learn so much about yourself and you realize how just fundamentally flawed you are. And so instead of your immediate

reaction being you and I have an issue and it's your fault, you learn to internalize things and go, how could I have contributed to this? Is it his fault? Did I contribute? Is it me? Was my reaction to that disagreement, the correct one? And you really kind of processed you, it gives you the ability to process your behavior and the way you react to things in a way that you never would have without that. So I think it's a great program. But yes, when I was going through the program, did I mock it mercilessly? Of course, because there are ridiculous things about it. Absolutely. Yes. So I want to add to what you just said because you're right. And it also gives a little wisdom because the way they categorize everything and they teach you what each behavior

in each thought. They place it in a category that what they call that cognitive thinking. It allows you to identify it and give it a name and know what those behaviors lead to.

So it kind of processes your thinking into compartmentalizing which allows what I noticed is it allows people who had those violent tendencies to actually see the type of errors

they have in other people. Like a lot of times that people got up and talk, they'd say, you know, you're struggling with this, which is something I struggle with all the time. Right. So it kind of opens your mind. So it fundamentally, it is good.

It was a good program for helping people who didn't have the ability to process start processing or people who really didn't know how to process. It gave them a process. I saw that in a lot of people, especially those that start and end it, some people, some Some of the success stories have been people who've gotten in there, and when you met them when they started and you met them when they finished, you're like completely different person. So they do have some success.

But I was a super dapper, so I mean, I, of course, I saw that. Oh, no, you would see. So there were people that there were guys in there that, of course, you have some people that, you know, they fake it till they, or they fake the whole program. Oh, yes. honestly even the people that faked it still learned something yes and they might even there were even guys that pretended to be faking it but the truth was you could see a difference it's like i know you're faking because you don't want to get out of here and have all your buddies make fun of you

because guys that weren't in that group in that program all the other you got to think look we're talking about 1800 to 2,000 people on the low in the low you've got 120 guys in the program so you've got basically 1800 guys on average making fun of the 120 they're in the program. Oh, he's an RDAP. Oh, they're all snitches. They're all snitching on each other. And we'll get to that in a minute.

But they're all telling on each other. Oh, you're a sucker. You're this. Oh, you got them telling you what to do. And ain't nobody telling me what to do. You know, all this. Oh, they would give you a hard time. I don't know if they did in the pen.

Wait until I'd take you that part. Finish. Go ahead and finish. Well, anyway. Yeah. So it was, you know, it was a hostile environment to be in. And I'm going to say, it's funny too because, look, let's face it, for me, being in prison, like, I'm a soft white guy. On average, I'm an average white guy in society.

In prison, as far as masculinity is concerned, I'm maybe a five or a six, I think, outside. I'm like a fucking one in prison. Because a masculine. At a low, you were a one? You had to least be on two. No, there were the guys that were there for pictures. Like if you say, by, you know, you have to understand the term that I'm using if you do, boom. Yeah.

Note monetization. I understand. So guys that were there because they like to take pictures and. Well, that would have brought you above a one, wouldn't it? I think it brought me up to maybe a two or a three. Yeah. But still, let's face it, you still got the gang members. You've got the guys that have been that have murdered people, the guys that have worked their way down from the pen.

Oh, listen. And when Obama went through and he was, he, Obama after you let the first wave of like a thousand guys go just let them out like half those guys are reoffending right right then he realized wait stages i'm gonna i'm gonna knock 10 years off your sentence but you have to do one year in the low then you have to do a year in the halfway house because there was no mechanism for what he was doing he was like yeah yeah you're right i'm gonna knock uh yeah immediate release immediate release immediate release you just let some guy like he doesn't realize like you let some guy that's been locked up for 20 years in prison out immediately without halfway house his family's given up on him he's got nowhere to go

of course he's going to go back to crime it's what he knows right you've got to put him in a halfway house and then he realized no you know what if they're in the pen they don't even know how to behave in society so you got to go from pen medium low halfway house i met a guy independent had to go to the low to take the program and i kept telling myself god i wish i could witness that because you have to complete the program to get out I go to torment he's going to go through. It's going to be unbelievable. Oh, yeah.

Same guy, Ledford. The guy's name was one of my cellies at one point was a guy named Ledford. Life sentence for meth. Listen to this. Life sentence for meth. They told him they would give him like 20 years, but he had to cooperate against his wife, which was involved in that he said, absolutely not. Give me the life sentence.

Gangster, straight gangster. Right. Goes to prison. She don't last a year. Within a year, she's out with something. other guy divorces him with some other guy some other guys calling uh his kids fucking daddy doesn't come visit him so snapped no he didn't i mean he he he did 20 something years right he has life did 20 years and then obama came along and said my god what are you doing like Obama said no no

I'm going to give him he's going to go to the low he has to pass the program he has to get out this guy one he was a super dapper but but but totally believed in it totally believed in the program he he was amazing and of course got out by the way if you like i'm friends with him on facebook this guy got out and hit the ground running like he's probably making 100 150 000 a year he's got driving an 80 000 truck bought a brand new house got out just in time for his dad had died when he got out like i mean this guy you know amazing guy he was you know it's meth it's just ruins he ruins people um but yeah he uh uh um yeah he was my my celly oh he was a super dapper he listen it's amazing who becomes a super dapper that's what's the funny thing

you don't know the guy you think never yes embraces it the guy you think oh he's going to be fine can't get through the program like just can't right you're like what's going on like what are you doing it's like oh that guy this you're like and that's what we have to describe is the the torment the choice mentally that people make to like you know what I'm fine the way I am I'm not even going to embrace what you're saying right but I want to say like what you were saying about in in the low how they made

fun of the people in the Ardap. Right, right. Well, I was in the penitentiary where it was definitely called snitching. And a lot of people were in gangs. So they would have to get permission from the gang to go to Ardap. And what I thought was hilarious is they would ask someone like, hey, I can get a year off my sentence if I take the RDAP. And some of the people, they're like, well, you can take it, but there's certain things you can't do while you're in there. Holy shit.

And you can't, what do you call it? They called it help ups. You can't do help ups. You can't participate in this. And if we hear about you doing that, we're going to, oh, I, many of people I've seen get jump on the compound for doing something in ARAP and a person that just gets in there going, what are you doing? That's snitching. And he's like, no, we, like, I have no understanding and they're going to jump you and you get beat up and taken off the compound. You can't even do the RDAB.

that it was never that extreme but there were guys yeah that's the pin well these are guys that are yeah they got major these are violent listen and and I had we had a DTS that stood up every day and said I hate gangs

because she goes gang members telling you that you can't get out of prison early to be with your kids making that requirement she's like you should never be a part of crap like that which I'm like yeah you're right But it's also hard to

It's survival It's about survival They had conversations about that That got one guy I believe killed I don't if he didn't die He was severely injured He had to be lifted off of the compound

Did I ever tell you that I did time in the pen Did I tell you what happened? No Yeah So I got into a disagreement With a guy So I got to a disagreement Somebody dropped a note on both of us

No no no that's not true That's not what happened That was a different time I went to the shoe. I've been in the shoe like four times. Oh, the shoe at the, at, at the pen and Coleman. I was at the low. Right. I get bitch slapped. I'll be honest. I got bitch slapped by a guy again, but go ahead. I'm sorry. I was watching. I'm going to tell you this story real quick. This is perfect. There's a guy sitting behind me who had he had a he was he was on a he was a registered. Yes. S.O. Right. But he was there for.

he was in Coleman for on a on an oxy on a pill case so and he didn't realize that anybody knew he knew but he didn't know like what happened was eventually he was so so adamant about about ESOs and their scum fuck they're this and he was so adamant about snitches and this and that they're garbage and one of the other guys said you know what something ain't right he's pushing too hard, you know, thou persist too much. Yes, the reverse psychology. Right. So he looks him up. He gets his, you know, they have

a poster. Yes. He gets the poster sent in. And he makes copies of it and passes it out. Right. That's one thing. The second thing is he looks into it and his co-defendant comes on the compound at the same time and said,

he cooperated. So you're a snitch and you're the other thing. So he starts to pass that. So it gets around but he nobody ever really kind of like he knows people know but he didn't say anything well i we would we you know there was the the cracker box right the the tv room for the white guys right so yeah that's called it's they call it um we see you know there were so many blacks there like the blacks had the big big tv right right they had the big big tv big tv and then you had you had the Spanish room which was size the same size as the cracker box yeah well the

Spanish also had one TV in the big room like there's a like eight TVs they had one TV there because they were a little bit larger than the white guys so we're in the uh i'm in the white tv room and this guy we would watch tv and stuff and he would you know people start talking you're watching whatever fishing shows and stuff that i couldn't stand right like you're watching you know deadliest catch and it's like oh god so you're sitting there and people they talk is of it he was somebody guy came and said yeah man i just got my halfway house i'm leaving in two months oh man that's good good for you bro good for you guys yeah and then this guy's name was billy and billy would suddenly say something like um yeah i don't

know where i don't even think i'm going to take halfway house well back then with his charge you couldn't take half away in florida you can now but you couldn't then so he goes and and i was like he's like yeah i'm not sure where i'm going to go when i get out i go well i know where you're not going to go and he and he looked at me go where i go anywhere near a church a daycare or an elementary school fuck you cox fuck you and he'd everybody would laugh and he'd be like you're a piece of shit fuck you And I'd be like, ha ha, yeah, but I can live where I want. You know, and he's, but this is a big guy, too. He's six foot tall, you know, but we also kind of just always joked around.

Right. And I would always joke around about stuff that he didn't, people didn't think it's fine. So one time we're sitting there watching TV and he was just a weird, the guys are weird. So what he's going to say, you're probably not going to think, eh, that's not too weird. Because they say weird thing. So you're watching TV, but anybody watching this is going to be like, that's a weird thing to say. So you're watching TV and there was a chick walking down the beach. And he goes, he's behind me.

And he goes, well, you wouldn't know what to do with that, would you, Cox? And I go, shit, I got a better chance of hitting that than you do. And he goes, he said, hell, I want to fuck something. He said, I'll knock your ass out and fuck you like that. And I go, shoot, I said, I'm a little bit young for you. I said, plus I have my GED. Or I go, plus I have my high school diploma. And he just gets up and bam, just, I like to put my hand like he punched me, but he didn't.

He bitch slapped me. So he bam. And I mean, knocked me out of my chair. I almost fucking hit the ground. It was so hard. Right. So I'm stumbling. I turn around, at first, you know, what I thought happened, I thought someone had, you know, you walked around with your chair on your head.

Yeah. I thought somebody had walked in the room and he, and because somebody had kind of the door, somebody had opened the door. And I thought someone dropped the chair on me. Right. So I'd jump up at first like, damn. And then I realized he'd hit me. And he's standing there. I was like, I hate that realization.

Like, wait a minute. Oh, like, like, damn, I got to do something now. I just want to go in my cell, curl up in a ball and cry. There's four other guys in this room. That's right. So I go, motherfucker. He's like, fuck you, fuck you. A piece of shit.

And then he turns around and walks off. Thank God, because Billy would have beat the brakes off me. I put up a fight. But I'd off was probably once he got me on the ground. Oh, he started squealing like a child, like a small stuck pig. Yeah. Go ahead. Help.

Go ahead. Fire. Fire. So, but he gets up and I sit back down and I go, what fucking piece of shit. Like literally, this is what's so funny is people don't realize. Like, in prison, something happens like that. it immediately goes back to normal. Like we didn't sit around talking about it and hug and how are you feeling okay and you want to talk.

You immediately, I sat back down. That's an everyday occurrence. Right. Boom, boom, boom. Fuck you guys walks off. I sit down. I start watching TV. Like it's, that happens all the time.

You see a fight right there. Man, man, man, man, man. You get broken up. You're like, that's crazy. So what happened with so and so? Yeah. So what happens? I start watching TV and my buddy goes, yo, bro, you okay?

And I go, huh? No, I'm fine. He goes, no, you're not. He's even to go look at the mirror. what i walk in there half my eye is bloodshot red half the whole white of my eye whoa and i thought no and i realized that you still can see billy's handprint on my face you can see like two of his like two of his fingers right like so i know i might bruise right might yeah i know i might I made it through count, through four o'clock count.

Right. I made it through 11 o'clock count and four o'clock count. And then they call me in the, all of a sudden, right after four o'clock. You see the two guys from like SIS walk in, and then we're all standing in our cells, still staying in there waiting. And all of a sudden they go, who's Billy's last name? Whatever, you know, Billy, you know, right, Cox and Baker to the front office. damn of course so we walk in the front office i walk in i stand there and i'm i walk in i'm like yeah what's up and he goes no no no turn your head he's like oh yeah yeah he's like he's

he's like i got i got four copouts already there was only four people there was only three or four people in the room oh somebody that wasn't in there like really yeah he's heard it yeah and put in a cop so that means four people put in copouts where notes to say saying, hey, there was a fight. Cox was involved, and so was Baker. So, Baker, he comes, and he's like, what's up? And they're like, hey, they're like, so, um, they go, so y'all got into a fight. And he goes, I don't know what you're talking about.

And he looks at me and they go, you got into a fight, Cox. He goes, I mean, I can see you got into a fight. He was, and I've got the copouts right here. I said, no, it wasn't a, there was no, there was no, fight. And he goes, I can see that you were in a fight. I said, no, no, a fight insinuates that there were two people at odds. I said, I was assaulted. And I said

And he looks at me He goes Damn Cox I go fuck you Like that Because I already know We're going to the shoe They're not putting us

In the same cell in the shoe Right And if you think of that I'm gonna what I'm gonna you bitch slap me From fucking behind You think I'm gonna be like No no

I'm gonna hold my water I'm gonna We're on the same team Fuck you you hit me So we go to the shoe He goes to the medium The last cell in the medium They're redoing our shoe in the low.

So the only place available is the shoe in the pen. So they bring me to the pen. Do you have any fucking idea what these guys in the pin look like? You walk in their entire faces are tattooed. Which is unbelievable to me. I'm like, what in the... You're not getting a job at the bank when you get out, bro. But then you realize, oh, you're not getting out.

Yeah. Oh. So that's, okay, that's war paint. So they have little tears because they're crying inside. Yeah. Oh, you have tears. At other people's losses. Go ahead. You're a sad clown.

Yeah. So, yeah, bro, they've got them in the pin there. They got them in cages in the pin walking around like cage. And I mean small little cages. Yes. It's not like in the low. It's one big, the outside wreck for the, for the shoe is a big, big room. No, that room in the pin is broken up into tiny little five foot by five foot.

Section off. Yep. Cages. because you can't put two guys in the same one and they're walking around like a like a cage dog like just back and forward doing push-up yeah and you're going I mean when I walked in like I'm all handcuffed up

and I look at the CEO bringing me and I go yo bro you cannot put me in a fucking in a cell with one of these guys he goes he's snowcocks don't worry he said we're not putting you in a cell with it we got a cell for you it's fine I understand he's laughing about it I said this ain't good bro

I said there's no no landscaping here when we pulled in like if there's landscaping at the low there's palm trees yeah there's no landscaping to sit under the trees they better to relax i'm not designed for this i didn't stab anybody like i so he so they're like they put me in the cell immediately it was amazing how polite the ceos were at the pen all right cox look i hold on hold on right okay i got you some books okay so you can read i got you this here's your cleaning supplies here's this here's that if you need anything don't hit the bell okay do me a favor just kind of wave us down okay just kind of you know knock on the window

we'll come because we come around a lot a lot um also i got you i mean if you need anything if you're cold because it gets cold in here just knock on the door let me know i'll get you into the set i mean like the guards at the low talk to you like you're a piece of garbage yes because they can get away with it but in the pin they could get hurt yes so they could get attacked right so i was there for 24 hours literally like the next day they came and they got me they said yeah yeah We're releasing you. Like, I'm out in a day for a fight. What happened to Billy?

Oh, Billy never got out. Billy was six months away from being released anyway. I almost think that it was part of Billy's plan was to get into some kind of an altercation and not, and do six months in the shoe. So it looks like he went to the halfway house or just disappear. Or, you know, you know guys, you know how guys will run up a debt? Yeah.

And they'll be like, yeah, I'm getting released in six months. And they'll run up a debt when really, they're leaving in like a week and they'll run up like a $300 debt to a bunch of guys and then just boom go to the halfway house and disappear wow um oh yeah yeah so listen i got anyway um the point is is that yeah so i did so when i talk i don't say this but i could say when people say would you do your time i could say i did some time in the pin i did some time in the medium and i did some time in the low i don't but i've always thought i could do that you could. Do you remember the article

about the pen that was in Tampa Tribune where they talk about the riot in the pin and they talk about the Coleman prison compound and they say Matt Cox and Conrad Black were in the compound and they make it sound like I was in

they make it sound like I was in the area. Yeah yeah in the area where the riot was. They call it the same facility that or the same complex. They engrouped the whole complex that holds Yeah. It was like there was a riot in the complex. We're not sure. And this complex holds people like Conrad Black and Matthew Cox. We're not sure which area they were in at the time of the riot. So it was like, I was in a riot. Like it looks like when people read that. Look, Cox, it looks like you were in a riot with stabbings and all kinds of stuff. When really I was in my cell napping. It's like, yeah, if you could have known the, I was the arguments that were going on at the low over the chest game. I was looking out the window as they were landing helicopters and you could hear shotguns going off. I'm like, go.

I'm not over there. Those guys got it bad. So, all right. I'm sorry, sorry, back to Ardap. Back to Ardap. All right. I forgot where we were. We were at, okay, so listen,

I could tell you one more thing. So you have to show the environment inside of Ardap with that 120 guys, part of the whole thing is this. I know you know this. Right. So part of that is that a big part of Ardap is holding

your peers accountable. Is that how they said it in yours? Because our two programs have a little bit different of, you know, the things, the labels they gave things are a little different. And so you would, one of the big things was like the staff couldn't, couldn't monitor you all the time. So a big thing was like you had to monitor your peers. So if you saw that, if I saw that Zach was doing things that were wrong or inappropriate,

it's my job to say, hey, bro, your uniform's not really ironed. and Dr. Smith, or it's appropriate to be ironed. Well, you know, remember, you signed an agreement to obey all the rules of the institution and of Ardap at all times. Right. So, yes, when you're holding them accountable, you're like basically saying, you signed that paper, saying you were going to follow the rules and you ain't doing that. But yeah, you're right. And it would get so bad. So some of the guys are like, hey, bro, you're, you're smoking Tucci.

I know you were smoking Tucci in the bathroom. And so someone was like, hey, you're smoking drugs in the bathroom at night. Like, don't make me be in a position to pull you up. Stop it. If I catch you again and that they would say that. Oh, no. But listen, it would get so petty. I know this didn't happen in the pen.

So it was so, no, no, this part. It was so petty. Literally, I'm brushing my teeth. And I would, you know, I turn on the water and brush my teeth. Brush my teeth. And some guy, and then I, he's standing there. Some guy, boom, I turn it off. spit you know okay I'm all done go to turn around he's like hey Cox you got a minute

because that's how they always start got a minute and I go and this is what they call the confront and level and I'd go yeah what's up and he goes um I noticed when you were brushing your teeth you left the water on you know that's not good for the environment it's not good for for just for society in general we need to conserve water and so I'm just letting you know that in art app part of the rules are they want us to shut off the water so I just I'm just bringing that to your attention. And I'd go, now you're supposed to say, you know, I appreciate you telling me, and then you repeat what they said.

There's a whole little process you're supposed to go through. And like literally the guy that told me that, like the second day I was there, this is a guy that used to, he was a crack baby. He used to take his finger and rub it in his belly button. Right? And then he would smell it. He would also constantly nibbling on his, he would walk around rubbing his belly. and pulling on his teeth and he was he would picket his ears like he was a real but he'd

straightened up in ardap like we'd give him a hard time in the unit but he was a whole go fuck yourself but in ardap he's straightened up so so i'm looking at this guy he'd been there three four months before me and i'm looking at this guy thinking did a crackhead a crack baby crackhead just tell me how to live my life like are you serious like bro you eat with your hands i've seen you chewing on your toenails like you're a disgusting human being and i was and i had to turn to my bill i was like um yeah all right uh yeah good talk bro good talk like i just gotten there i don't know anything so i leave um but that was the kind of thing like you would you would type you'd be typing and then you'd get up to leave and somebody would say uh by the way

bro, I noticed that you didn't go to the bathroom and wash your hands before you were typing on the computer. And, you know, we all use those computers. So it's important that we keep each other clean. It's a clean environment. We want to. And you're like, yeah, well, they, um, they, they got on me for, um, the ice machine had broken down.

And so there was no ice. Well, there was a little bit of ice on the bottom. And they had taken the scoop. I guess the guard. It's like, hey, the ice machine is not working. They took the scoop. So I took my cup, the ice that was left and scraped it out of the back, on the bottom corner. And I actually got a help up for that.

Help up. So, yeah, so that's the point is that. So somebody comes to you and they say, hey, stop. Like, hey, I noticed that you did this. Like typically the proper protocol is to go to that person and say, hey, I notice this is what's happening. You confront them. Confront and level. You confront that person.

They then, if they're receptive and they go, you know what, man, I appreciate you telling me that. I didn't realize that. You're right. You're absolutely right. that was wrong and if they feel okay with that like yeah he he was good with it then that's it it ends but if you didn't do that or if he felt like you weren't receptive then the next day or within a week or so he could in the morning meeting they get to a point in the morning meeting where they say are there any pull-ups or help-ups help up and people would raise their hand so and so you

stand up and you say excuse me Isaac Allen mr. Allen and then you'd stand up and we would be facing each other. Right. And they'd say, oh, what's it about? They said, well, and then there was a protocol. I forget exactly what it was. They basically say, hey, two days ago, I was in the ice room. The guard had taken the scoop.

The ice machine was broken. I noticed that you went, you leaned it in the thing. You scooped at the last bit of ice with your cup. One, obviously, it's disgusting for you to take a cup that you use and put it in the ice. That's inappropriate. But two, you took the last bit of ice, which isn't fair to the rest of us. And three, you should have done that either because the goal. The card took the scoop, which is to tell everyone not to use the ice machine.

So part of the protocol is, and I'll follow it, and ask you, well, how did that make you feel, Mr. Cox, to see Mr. Allen doing that? I think, well, really, because ours was like, what were the damaging consequences? Right. So for us, how would you feel? I wouldn't, I don't. Well, like, the damaging consequences, they would say, well, and the damaging consequences are, it's, it's, you know, you're not. And then they would tell you what, like, thinking errors you were struggling with. You're struggling with whatever, you know, with, you know, should thinking and this thinking and

that thinking. They had to give you like two or three. And then they would say the way you need to work on it is. And then they would tell you, you know, you an assignment to do. They give you homework. Yes. You need to go around to 100 or to 50 of the people in the unit and ask them what the appropriate response should have been when you, saw that the scoop had been taken and like it was like they'd give you something to do homework

something to fill out um you need to come in here and do a rsa on the board or do something they'd have you do a skit acting out like what you did and what you learned from it and stuff like that but what you got to mention because we really got to give the the format of how all this it lays down but what you got to mention is when someone else approaches you like that and they stand you up in front all 120 people in the meeting and tell you what you did wrong, you're not allowed to say one word. No, you can't, you cannot, there are no rebuttals. You cannot put up an argue, even if they repeat what they said. And some of the people lied. Yes. There were ones where there were false pull-ups. They would, they would, something would happen maybe, and they would manufacture something

that didn't happen and say that you said things. You didn't say just because one, they wanted to pull you up. And, and you because, because not everybody had to do a pull-up. Like, they always tell you, you don't have to do a pull-up, but almost nobody ever graduates that program without doing a pull-up. Well, there's so many pull-ups required every day. Oh, you mean for the group? For the group. That eventually everybody's probably going to have to do one.

Yes, everyone needs to be on the receiving end of one. That's like understood. That's what the people in the phase three would tell you. But I'm going to ask you, did you have to accept the help? Yeah. Because could you accept or deny it? No, no, you had to accept it. Later, you could go back to your DTS, because you had an aside.

Let's say there's four or five. No, you had to go, you had to accept it. And then you could later go back to your DTS and say, listen, that's not what happened. And you could explain the situation because I've seen them where they flipped them, where they did that. And the next day, they pulled the guy up. Like, the whole thing came out in the wash. Like, they brought him in. They said, look, he's saying this.

He said that. And he's got three of his buddies that were there. And that's not what happened. You just twisted what happened And so that whole thing would occur And then the next day he pulled you up For manipulation You manipulated a situation to your advantage

Or retribution You're upset with me because two weeks ago This is what happened Oh they had a whole thing Or you pulled me up Retaliation You pulled me up because you thought I was gonna pull you up

So you did it preemptively And twisted it Oh is it twisted It was good bro Oh it was the most dramatic Like the tension The tension would get Like it's most of time

People just kind of sitting there fidgeting, you know what I'm saying, talking to your neighbor whispering. But whenever the help up came and it got for real, a whole group mouth open. So where I was, people could actually refuse the help up. Oh, no. You could stand up and I'd say, hey, I'm helping you up because I saw that such, such, such.

And then the facilitator would ask, Mr. Cox, do you accept the help up? What? And you could say, no, I do not accept the help up. You can give a rebuttal. You have to tell them why you didn't accept it And then you sit back down Sometimes the DTS got involved

And I have a couple of stories about that I was just gonna say like what kind of pull-ups did you get Like me? No not you just in that program Like our pull-ups were like someone snuck You snuck some chicken out of the Out of the chow hall or you use We used to not be able to use

Like seasoning You couldn't bring seasoning in to the chow hall Like you could only use what was provided to you in the chow hall like so there was all these little like i noticed that you i was there the other day i saw you pull something out and you salt on your food you're not supposed to take you know you're not supposed to do that you're you're suffering from or you're entitlement entitlement oh yes so um same thing skipping the line you know what i'm saying or leaving early uh leaving something early or not finishing homework so we got a lot of um pre-scheduled people

pre-determined help-ups like we had to have at least two every day so a lot of times people would get together and say hey matt let me you know we're going to need some help ups so we actually facilitated it just to keep the BS down we'd help people up you know give us and every once in a while the DTS will get upset because you're like all BS help ups and then they give them assignments sometimes you would get an assign like they'd already have guys that look I'm going to stand up so-and-so's going to stand up so-and-so and they're going to give you assignment And your assignment's going to be bullshit, bro. I'm not going to make you do it.

Yeah, the phase three. But every so often, there was a legitimate issue. And a person would have the balls to stand up and give a help up on that issue. And those were the moments where everyone's like, you couldn't believe it because the reaction was real. The situation was real. And there's real content. This is what's fucked up. There's real.

This is a year at possibly two. Two years, like you said, a year and a halfway house. Let's say it's eight, let's say six months and a halfway house. It's still 18 years of prison are at stake. Yes. So when people think, oh, that's just silliness. No, this is 18 months where you can get back to your wife or your kids or your family members or like 18 months is not a joke. Contingent upon your response.

Right. To someone telling you you didn't do anything. Yeah. Or telling you something you did. Telling you that you didn't iron your clothes. So because I might snap at you for because I didn't shut off the water or because I snuck some chicken out of the chow hall because I'm starving to death. I might be if I don't accept that in the proper way and say the right things, I might get kicked out of the program or pushed back in the program because they would hold people back. Yes.

You know. And actual reaction. Right. Right. Just yeah, based on nothing. Like, like Mr. Cox, I'm seeing a lot of bad body language. bad bottom and you could just because like you're so the guy starts talking you're like well that's what being black is a privilege because we don't we don't turn red I cannot tell

you how many white guys turn red turned pink like eyes bloodshot like can you repeat what he just said so what we're saying they're like he said something about uh you know like oh you get curious you get like I'd see guys who get most of guys would get like that deer in the headlight look and they get scared. Like I got pulled up once or twice and it was fury. I mean, I was just like, this

motherfucker. Like he's he blatantly is lying about this. Like it's what happened is not what he's saying happened right now. And I was and so they actually stopped the pull up. Because I, the second time I went through the program,

I was never pulled up the first time. Right. I don't think. I'd have to check the book. because I literally, remember how they gave you like a date? What did you do the first time anyway? Like, um, I did six months. The first time you went six months? I was six months one time and like eight months or seven months the next time.

I was into phase three and the second time when I quit. The first one, I got right at phase three and they told me, hey, management variables on you. You can't be moved from the institution. I was like, oh, I'm out. I'm at this place. So, but, but what I'm saying. saying is the second time like I really got preferential treatment for some reason because I was extremely honest where most people were wanted the year off and I didn't by the time I it was

available to me I didn't quite I never really I kind of explain it in the book where if I passed the program I got the year off I literally would only get a few months of halfway house and I was more concerned I would rather do a little a couple more months in halfway in prison than get a year off my sentence and only get two months a halfway house because I needed as much halfway house as possible because I just didn't have any money right and my fear was I'm gonna get out there's nobody to give me money and I'm gonna I'm gonna need six or seven months in the halfway house like I never put in for home detention to try and get on an ankle monitor like no I want to I want to stay in the halfway house I'm saving as much money as possible so that I can rent a room get a fucking get a

you know get a job get enough money to rent to rent an apartment or a room and buy a buy a vehicle who you get out with nothing right so you give me to if they'd given me a month halfway house or two months halfway house I can't save that much money to to do anything in that time right I'm going to be on the street right so I needed that so but going in the program kept me at Coleman because if you were in a program they put a management variable on you and they allow you to not be switched and I wanted to just stay at Coleman because one I was writing multiple guys stories but two my mother was only an hour away and if they moved me she was going to have to drive at a minimum of four hours to see me and that's if

i went to miami any place house we're talking about six or seven hours right you know so i wanted to stay but so but because of that i was able to be very honest about everything and everybody and exactly how i felt and so there was just no filter so i ended up getting kind of prefer preferential treatment because one I'm well spoken um I was very honest and I had no filter so you we would be in our let's say our our class and there's 30 guys in the class and people would talk and then the the DTS would respond and then she would like we're talking about a good 20% of the time she'd go mr. Cox what do you think and I was like honestly I don't know what he said and I just blast the guy or I'd say I think this is exactly

I think he's being honest. I think that that's what happened, you know. So I ended up having a good treatment there. So the one time I got, sorry, the one time I got pulled up, I think I could a couple times, but one time I got pulled up halfway through, the guy was just lying. And I, you could, my body language was so fucked up, and I was so angry, and I was so ready to light. I guess he blindsided you.

I kind of knew what was going to happen because there had been an incident, but I wasn't going to pull them up or anything. Like, I didn't care. We got into a little, little tiff, little argument. where I never even said anything. He just, he was like bipolar or something. He just went nuts and started yelling at me in the line. And then so the next day, he pulled me up.

So, because that night he tried to confront and level me about it. And when he went, he goes, hey, Cox, you got a second? I just went, I walked right by him. I go, no. And then a little 20 minutes later, he stopped me and he goes, hey, Cox, man, he stopped, step in front of me. I was standing somebody. He was, hey, man, sorry about today.

He put his hands out. And I go, that ain't happening. And I walked off. So he was pulled me up to say, hey, you're holding resentment you're this or that but then he twisted the situation so in the middle of him twisting it making me look like i had said something even though i never even said anything to the guy he just went off on me because i had glanced back and looked at him because he was talking loud and i just looked back he was like the fuck are you looking at huh and then so he mouthed off to me

then his buddy mouthed off them they're both mouted off to me and i just started laughing i was like i was thinking i was thinking to myself are you nuts you're an art out with me like look how you're behaving like I'll pull you up tomorrow you know so but I just started laughing and then I just turned around and a couple of his buddies like hey hey hey hey hey they pulled him back and it was over but he then tried to apologize he then twisted the pull up in the middle of pull up I get I'm sitting there just looking and I'm like I'm about to cut you at half I'm gonna cut this dude's head clean off like I was gonna lean into him and so what happened it even though you're not supposed to you're not supposed to I had already told the DTS if anybody ever pulls me up and they're being

dishonest, I'm not accepting responsibility. Oh, Mr. Cox, you have to respect it? I don't care. I said, I'm going to cut that dude's head, clean off his fucking body in front of everybody. And I don't care what the consequences are. And so she could tell. Like, there's like three DTSs and they're sitting, they're going back.

He's going on and on. I'm, and I start going, like, you can see my body language and somebody even says, hey, hey, Cox, body language. I go, fuck that. Like that. And the guy was like, oh, you know, they're scared. Like everybody. They're like, they don't say anything. They're like, body language and I'm like fuck that

and I'm like like I'm waiting for him to finish so I can lose it on him. So you didn't hear a word he said. I heard he was lying and so the DTS ends up saying Dr. Smith happens to walk in. She goes you know what? The DTS stops it just stop. Hold on a second goes and gets the doctor

doctor comes in walks in and says what happened okay and she looks and she goes what's the pull up? He starts talking and then halfway through she goes stop Cucks, what happened? And she, and, you know, of course, people are like, holy shit.

Like, that never happens. And I said, here's what happened. Boom, boom, boom, boom. I said, then this happened. Then this happened. I said, and he asked me to shake his hand. I said, no. I said, he asked me this.

I said, that ain't never going to fucking happen. I just kept walking. And she goes, why did you do that? I said, because he's a piece of garbage. I said, and I am holding resentment. I said, that's why. and she went okay well I don't

I don't see that there's an issue here she was Cox has every right to be upset like everything you learn in the program she threw it out the window God I've seen that yeah and everybody and when I walked out guys are like

are you are you banging this broad like what's happening when she calls you in the fucking in her office what's happening here because that's that's unheard of right but yeah so that's the time that time I got pulled up

That was like insane, but I'm sorry, finish. Sorry, I don't know what you were saying. Oh, what I was going to comment on that and say, we had two guys in our program that the DTS loved, and they allowed them to get away and do things that no one else could get away with. Brutal honesty, I was going to ask you, have you seen anyone get kicked out for being brutally honest? I've seen three people get kicked out for brutal honesty.

Okay, here's, it depends. So yes and no. The problem is the brutal honesty was the guy when they said, how do you feel about your, the first time he had like a team. That's a team was when they called. I know this is completely silly. Colby's looking like, is this really a thing? So they would every once while they'd get, they'd team you. They would team several people sometimes.

They'd say, hey, we're going to have team on Friday. And then they would team like, let's say, 30 people. Right. And so you would go into your team and you would bring, you could bring like a representative. you could bring like a peer and you could bring like your big brother right so you could bring like three or four people with you to kind of like as your advocates

so they would but if something happened they would have an emergency team you ever heard of yes right so what happens is they so I had a guy one time they had a regular team in the first phase he had gone through team

everybody goes through one or two teams in the first phase so he'd gone in and they asked him about his victims and the very first thing he said well I mean my crime was Medicare. So the victims would be the United States government. And they'd say, well, how do you feel about that? He'd go, I don't feel anything about it. Like, what do you mean? And they were like, do you feel bad? He's like, for the United States government, they go, well, your victims are anybody on Medicare. It's everybody. It's thousands of people. He'd go, I don't see it

like that. He'd say, it was the United States government. It was $4.5 million. You know, he's like, I mean, I don't know, what am I supposed to say? Like, I paid back some of the money. You know, I you know he's like I have a nice house I have nice vehicles I worked out an agreement he said my wife's living well he's like we I did made a lot of money he's like do I feel bad about it no this is the first phase though my first phase you could do that because you don't know anything yet you're a newbie it was the third phase and they brought it up again and his brutal honesty was to be honest I just don't feel like I have any victims like I don't I don't feel like I have any victims so I don't feel bad about it I know what I did was wrong, and I shouldn't have done it. I certainly wouldn't have done it again. But do I feel bad for my victims? He goes, no. What victims?

You're saying, oh, everybody in Medicare, he's like, I mean, think about it. That's like, what, 0.000, you know, for everybody in Medicare. Like, no, I don't feel bad. Nobody in Medicare knows that they were hit in some way or victimized. He's like, no. Bam, straight out the door. You haven't, but that was brutal honesty. Right.

Stupid brutal honesty But brutal honesty Think about it It was honest It was being honest So why you say it was stupid Brutal honesty Because it got a kicked out of the program

Because the truth is Well you don't How did you know what brutal honesty gets you kicked you out of program And which one does it Because brutal I think Well the one where you're brutally honest About basically what he was saying

Is I haven't learned anything And I'm not He was honest But the truth is he should have been Even if he felt that way Which I'm sure he did He should have not been honest in that situation.

He should have lied in that and pretended to say, no, what I did was wrong and I know this and I know that I victimized people by doing that because it's the appropriate thing to say and it's what they want. And the truth is, is like, if you end up stealing $5,000 from Bank of America, your victim is Bank of America.

There are idiots out there that will scream, you, every single person, that it's not even measurable. What I did to Bank of America isn't even measurable. So are there, victims at Bank of America? No, it's just Bank of America. So I think what he said was correct.

I think they have an improper interpretation of what a victim, what your crime is. They don't understand it. And as a result of that, they kicked him out of the program. So he should have known that. He should have simply lied. Yes, I know I have victims. I know this. I know that.

He should have really, and his brutal honesty got him kicked out. Some brutal honesty is brutal honesty where you say something like, like for instance I was do you remember the thing you do when you first go in you have to take like a survey not a survey it's a series what is a survey is so much of questions they ask you and one of the things they asked me was um

the guy goes and in a way I almost just threw him a bone you know what I'm going to say right if you read you read the book so you know so I threw him a bone because I actually was I done the tat that little survey and I said he goes what are you hoping to get out of this program and I went I would like to be able to tone down my narcissism a little bit and let's face it saying that about yourself is it's brutally honest am I narcissists yeah every everybody's a narcissist everybody has some

narcissistic traits right that okay so that's not brutal on when it was a true narcissist say I want to tone down myself what no right well I'm not saying I'm not saying a true narcissism. I'm just saying my narcissism. And there's a scale, right? Like, you have the top scale, right, which is, you know, let's face it, like probably Trump, right? He doesn't think he ever does anything wrong. And I, by the way, between you and I, I know

you'll be disgusted by this. Like, I actually, there's a lot of stuff about Trump I do like. My problem is he's such a narcissist. And by the way, that's bad for the algorithm. My problem is not being able to admit when you're wrong. There are things that you've said that are wrong.

Admit it. Also, Also, you know, so there are some things that I think he's done and said that I wish he was, like when he goes off prompt, when he's reading the teleprompter and he goes off, it's like, oh, God, don't go off script. Well, some of it is fantastic. So, but, okay, well, so I'm saying that's a top scale. Right. I'm saying me, I'm not top scale narcissists, but I have some narcissistic traits. And so I tell the guy, I say, I'd like to tone down the narcissism. I said at least to the point where I can actually care about other people and at least pay attention to what they're saying when they're talking.

And he goes, well, what's happening when they're talking right now? I said right now when other people are talking? And he goes, yeah. I said, I'm just waiting for an opportunity to talk about myself. And listen, that is brutal honesty. So is what the other guy. Yeah, but that got him kicked out. So how do you decipher what's going to get you kicked out and what's not going to get you kicked out?

I think he should have known better. So I'll give you an example of a brutal honesty that should have gotten someone kicked out. But didn't? but didn't. Okay. All right. Someone says I've been smoking or I've been using drugs

since I've been in the program. In what phase? Two and three. Really? Yes. Here's, Bruton, honestly, I think to get you kicked out was a guy.

Did he get pulled up or did you just admit it? He admitted it. He stood up himself. He pulled himself up. Okay. Wait a sudden. Now, I think that's different than being caught. This is a guy who basically, that's a cry for help.

I could see him getting not kicked out, but maybe being held back one phase. Because there's three phases, right? Being held back one phase. I could see that. But maybe not being kicked out. What do you think? What happened? Well, I happen to know he did it so he could continue to smoke.

It was kind of like. Oh, like I'm struggling with it. Yes. Nice. The amount of mental manipulation that these guys undergo. Oh, that's what I thought to myself. And one guy that got kicked out, this is a real honest. I think it gets you kicked out.

One of the DTS was saying that when normally she's like, okay, I'll take care of that for you. And you know when I say I'm going to take care of something, I take care of it. And he goes, no, you don't. Here's four examples of when you told me stuff and you didn't take care of it. And he pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. it's like immediately she says leave your excuse from the meeting and kicked them out what do you think about that brutal honest that was just stupid like the problem with the DTS is that they're first all they're all they're all emotionally damaged like all of them have three females yep no we had

all we only had one male we had like five females one male and they were all insane Yes. It's funny that the male, the funniest thing about the male DTS was, nobody wanted to be there less than him. He wanted to be in that program. Less than the inmates. He only, I swear, the only thing I think I ever really heard him say was he would, he would sit down and the big, he had like the big, you know how you had the big meeting, it was like maybe 50 guys or 30 guys. They'd have a big circle. You had to do it like once a week.

A process group or something. Right. You'd sit down and people, they'd go around slowly. He would go in, sit down. Everybody, of course, everybody's there on time. You know, they're all sit, boom, ready, quiet, waiting. He'd sit down and go, okay, we left off with Mr. Cox. How are things, anything you want to talk about?

And then you go, well, yeah, you know, I was going to say today that, or, you know, a week ago, this is what happened. But this is what happened. You'd talk for a little bit. say anything you'd go halfway around the group or maybe the whole way around the group right and then just as things were wrapping him he'd do this several times during the meeting 10 minutes later and then at the very end of the meeting he'd go well all right uh i think this is a good place to wrap it up like that's all he ever said he this guy he didn't personally say he was great And his guys under him in his class were like, he was amazing.

Why he says nothing. He says he doesn't hound you. He's not deciphering and giving critical. He's burning up the clock on his 20 year retirement. Yes. Like this is the guy who I did like 20 years in the military got out and now he's doing this for 20. He's working on his second government benefit. I believe that part of his strain was dealing with those females there because we had.

We had, so there was another program called Challenge that I started before I went to RDAB, and they had two male and one female. And both of the males would like, whenever you'd talk to them about something that the female advice gave you or said, they couldn't help but roll their eyes. Like, oh, my. Okay. So that advice is. So don't hug someone when they're spitting in your face and ask them how, what's behind,

this oh yeah it's in so you're right they are they are emotionally damaged and the r dap we had three female and i felt like they picked the guy that they were probably most attracted to because this one woman um picked this it's like she loved the thug right you know and there was a thug every phase in three there was a thug that she would pick to be mentor so let me let me take you this about my super being a super dapper. I was loved by everybody in the, in the

R-dap. In the unit or the staff? The unit. Okay. And despised by one of the staff member that loved thugs. The other two thought I was hilarious because I wrote skits, but the one staff member hated my

guts. I could just tell by every exchange. And I thought it was hilarious. I thought it was absolutely hilarious that she hated my guts. So you didn't even try and win her over? No. No, I used to lean into it. I used to lean into it.

And so they picked mentors and they didn't pick me to be a mentor. And there were actually like two groups where they had discussions about that, about why didn't they pick Zach to be a mentor? Right. Like as much as he helps everybody in here, I don't understand it. You definitely think it was her. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I could, I, like, the way my mind works, I could decipher how they, they put it together, but it's, it's, so it, you're right.

The staff member are, the, the DTS are like flawed individuals that sort out us or the people in the group by what they prefer or what they like. So someone liked you, and that's, that's the whole point. That's why they, that's why you didn't get kicked out for brutal honesty, because I've seen people get kicked out for way less. like I saw a guy get kicked out for not accepting a help up right you know and he didn't accept it so they go we kicked him out so I'm like going yeah but you know you're allowed to not accept it exactly that's what we kept going but aren't you allowed to do that yeah but we can tell that he wasn't progressing he was in the first phase

yeah you almost never to get you'd have to be a complete maniac to get kicked out in the first phase the first three months you'd have to be a maniac well a lot in the pen a lot of people got into fights and different situations so they were they were gone in and out in and out in and out it was hard for them to keep people down there it was hard i was just going to say there was this one so by the way so we had one woman who was a spanish woman uh she was extremely just angry and bitter and so she was one she wasn't that hard to deal with except that she was angry and bitter um then we had this one woman a black woman who was a i don't want to say she was a I do feel like she was a pathological liar.

She had some pathology, right? Some issues with it. Because she was constantly saying that she used to tell people that she had a master's degree. Right. That Dr. Smith wasn't the only person that had a master's degree or doctorate or whatever she has. And so she would tell people that they had offered her to run the program, but she didn't want the responsibility. She liked her life the way it was. But come to find out, of course, it was just absolutely wasn't true.

right right like she used words like edjimicated um you know so it was just like there was just like are you serious did she just say like we you know it's like a couple of guys were like did she just say edjimicated like there's she constantly saying things and i used to i had a list in the book i list things that she said um um uh well go was one of one she used to say all the time uh what it was was what it was i mean she would say something to be like like it's almost like she was well spoken but it's like, I feel like you're almost saying this on purpose, but she, she wasn't. So we just, it was like, it comes out later. I actually asked Dr. Smith.

Dr. Smith actually said, I don't know why she tells people that. She's like, no, she doesn't. She is, she is, but she tells people that all the time. But she said lots of stuff, like, oh, people say, oh, how was your weekend? And she'd go, oh, we flew to New Orleans, we did this, we did that. And it wasn't true. Like, you didn't fly to New Orleans because two days later, somebody would ask you, and she'd say she went somewhere else or she went, did this.

It was these little, but, you know, you're in prison. You don't know. Right. So she had some issues there. But she actually liked me. At first she hated me. The first phase she hated me. Second phase she liked me.

And then we had one that was, her name was Dr. Neesmith. Or not, I'm sorry, sorry, just Neesmith. Her name was Neesmith. Neesmith was bipolar. And she had some people she absolutely loved and some people she absolutely hated. And she absolutely loved me. Right. You know, the very first day we got into an argument.

And I pushed back. And I was the only person I think I had ever probably pushed back on her. And as a result, she backed down and immediately decided she liked me. She was the one that I told you, like, I would fill out my book and hand it to her. And she would look at it. She would hold it for a week and she's supposed to review them. And then a week later, she'd call me in to get my book. And I would think, because I either hadn't done the work or I wrote ridiculous things that you should not have.

I answer questions completely inappropriately. I mean like absolutely inappropriate Like not like in a sexual nature But just in a comical ridiculous nature One of them was like What would your life be like in 10 years If you stopped using drugs And what would your family life be like

And what would your political or your community life be like And I put down And what would your relationships be like And my answer was You gave you one paragraph And my answer was Hopefully in 10 years from now I will be dating

a 22-year-old ex-stripper who is only with me for my vast real estate wealth I will have no children I said no family to speak of I said and since I'm currently a convicted fraudster I am a pariah in the community and therefore will have as little to do with them as possible

that's it that was my answer I said I said and I'll be absolutely happy and then I put go art out no oh then I put I said hopefully I'll die at the age of 95 betting my young bride like that was like ridiculous like hilarious hilarious but also people would read it and go oh bro you're going to get thrown out gave it to her two weeks later she's read all of them looked them graded them

came back in she goes okay and that by the way my whole book was riddled with those there were no there were no serious answers in the book comes back and she would go okay cox and i'd go i'd walk in waiting for the lecture waiting for the what the hell are you doing you think it's a joke what you do it she comes out she goes look she said look through your stuff she said you clearly have a good graphs of the material she said um just keep up the good work like you're doing great and i was like thank you take my book and i leave this happened over and the whole program she never looked at my books never wow there were guys that would like barely say something out of line and she'd make them erase the whole page and rewrite it because you had to write in pencil but i'm saying it so like

i really got lucky like if i ever took that program again based on like this podcast or this book if they saw it, I'd be dead. There's never let me. I won't make it through phase one. So I know a guy that did that who wrote that down and called the DTS. What did they say that he wrote something in the book that is trifling and I don't think that like this is a good idea and these questions are asked, you know, to belittle us and stuff like that in his book.

And he got kicked out for that. Can you imagine? And you wrote stripper comments and they never said a word. Of course. Who doesn't want to date a next stripper? Like, yeah, you dealt with a lot of different help-ups. But the help-ups that I had, I think I got helped up probably in the whole time, about four times in the group. So you're saying someone pulled you up.

Someone for something you did. Right. So normally where I was, help-ups were generally false. They were fake. Really? See, no, man. Ours were, I'd say 99% of them were real. Stupid, but real.

Well, ours were fake, stupid. Every once in a while, there were real ones. Generally, so I was always surprised, I had to ask myself that question. Real help-ups, I was always pleasantly surprised at the tension and the resolution. There were good ones where someone actually had an issue with somebody and it got very tense where that person was mad and they talked it out and they actually resolved it. I was very happy to see that.

You know what I'm saying? And that kind of gave me hope that, you know, there are alternatives to doing it. Well, can I also point out that like because in the, you have to think, look, first of all, in the low, they didn't like it. Like it was upsetting, okay, in general. Because, of course, you're in the low,

you're kind of almost pretending that, you know, that you're upset about people snitching and this and that. But the truth is, most of the people at the low cooperated in some form or fashion. Now, they may have cooperated and justified it, and they may hate snitches, but they're justifying their cooperation. But most of them did. In the pen environment, not only do they despise snitches, but they're ready to retaliate against snitches. And that's the environment you're in. So you're in an extremely tense.

Oh, man. Ours is just 18 months or you get out of there were so in the meeting I think you how many fights did you have we all like what physical fights there's the fights just one okay in the meeting physical fights I've witnessed probably eight and you have to imagine the kind of guys that are in the pen like these aren't a couple of tax accountants I would say eight fights and one assault where somebody lost an eye so it it was so you mean when I say fight a fight a fight a fight fight is physical.

Yes. Okay. Physical. You said an assault. Well, there was one assault and there was eight fights. Well, what's the difference between a fight and an assault? Oh, you mean the guy who just got, oh, that's right. There's this guy that got just attacked.

Yes. He was no fighting back even. It was just an attack. Yes. Okay. So, and then there were, there were fights where it's like, you know, like I don't know why this jackass helped me up. Like, listen, man.

Bama, bum, bo, bo, bo, bo, blah. Break it up. You know, peppers, for everybody in your rooms my god so all right so for me i i i had i never had so the point i was trying to make is where i was 90% of the help-ups were coordinated so we we had a help-up team where guys would go around and say hey listen we got to have two help-ups each day so it's coming around to you you got to be helped up so john's going to help you up he's going to say that maybe you skipped in line

or you in a line you told kind of a joke that nobody appreciated and we're going to help you up for telling that joke oh bro see that that that right there that would have never these guys in my in my program were snitching so much you couldn't get a coordinated effort like that's that's all we did that's all we did so every day we'd have two

set up helpups going wow and every once in a while that is manipulation oh yes that's how we did it it look good for the lady look good for the ladies. That's what it was. You know, and the help up was was fake. For me, I was kind of an overachiever. So I love joking around in comedy.

So my favorite part of the meeting was the upbeat ritual. I hated the SB. Oh, my God. It was embarrassing and just. Bro, I came up with. So some of the people I talked to that are in R-Dap, they still, they still call me. And I give them suggestions of upbeat rituals.

Still, and some of the upbeat rituals I've done are been solidified. On the Ardap phone? On the Ardap phone. Did they ever listen to your phone calls? Yes. I forgot about that. That's something else we can talk about. We had a guy, by the way, real quick.

We had a guy that was working in some chick on the outside. She had sent him like $3,000 and he was bragging about it on the phone. And they heard him. And, of course, he's also talking about, he's calling women, you know, bitches and home. Yeah, this and that, yeah, yeah, I got the, yeah, yeah. And he, and then he, yeah, and I got this one girl, man, she sent me $3,000.

I told her, I got no money when I get out. So I, she, she's, she's been saving her money. She sent me $3,000. And he had it on his, on his, his, uh, his, um, his inmate account. They team him. They play the tape. And they tell him he's got one choice to one, call these other women, all the women, tell them all about each other, and two, send the $3,000

back or keep the $3,000, go back to your old unit, because you're getting kicked out of the program, do the extra year, and you can spend that money. You can keep living the lifestyle you're living in here. He had to call all of them and send the money back. It went around everywhere, like, they are listing the phone calls, bro. Oh, sorry, go ahead. We kind of had the same similar situation. So, man, I made me lose my train.

No, no, the guy you said that people called, but you said that you got pulled up. Right. I got helped up. Helped up. Helped up. So I got blindsided. So every time, all of mine, none of mine were ever coordinated.

Even the ice thing was not. So I got helped up one time because I was doing a game for the upbeat ritual, and I said the word porn. Like I asked about the, I forgot what the upbeat ritual was. And I said the word porn. And so then they helped me up and they said, you know, that's offense. All of our DTS are women and you use the word porn and that's offensive. And I don't know why you chose to use those type of words.

That's the help up I got. And I'm going, wow. I accept the pull up. Yeah, I accepted it. Yeah. There was one they told me that I. What did you have to do? I had to, most of the time they asked me to do skits because that was my.

thing. I'd write a little play and we'd do a little play. So he's not trying to hurt you. Was he trying to get you messed up? Oh, yeah. Oh, really? Oh, yeah. They helped me up one time because we were putting together something for our group. Yeah, one of our groups were putting together something we had to present. I think every, I think each Tuesday and Thursday we had to do a presentation. They had something that went on right after the meeting where it was like a class. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Everybody. And, so, So each group had to present each time. And so we had, we had to do a presentation.

And we had a couple of people that know what they were doing. Or I was. You had to go around to help facilitate with all the states. Right. And so I was telling them, look, try this over this. Which is something you would have done anyway. Exactly. And they helped me up because they said I was trying to take a leadership role.

Like you weren't listening to, you weren't opening to anybody else's ideas. I said, and I want to go, are you kidding me? I want to go, what idea that you have that I wasn't listening to it? Mr. I don't have nothing I'll do whatever you asked me to do Those were those were the type of help-ups I got and what they did for me they played it off of the woman that didn't like me They basically like fed into whatever disdain which made me think that Somewhere someone was talking like this guy thinks he's all that Yeah yeah you know yeah they they they would anybody it's funny because like they want to

you to participate and they wanted you to take a leadership role and they wanted you to help everybody else and then if you did it you were manipulative you were entitled you were like there was a way to manipulate any given situation to attack someone in that program yes yes but um yeah i you know like you you you have to admit like you you learn so much like you could categorize people like after that nowhere near as good like dr smith you could walk into her office sit down she could talk to you for three or four minutes and she could start telling you about yourself and you would be like oh my god like she would say she goes so well one of your family members was an alcoholic was it father mother it was probably mother and you like um uh and

well you don't think that's just from the paperwork and and and they may no they have the PSI I'm sure they have your PSI I'm sure they read it but I mean she could caterer categorize like your personality type like that because they see a thousand guys like you and me like I like to think I'm special right but in that program when they're masterfully having these people come through and they're seeing the same basic and there are only like so many personality types right so they can categorize you and then they can subcategorize you in there and what kind of help cause that personality type so she was all of them were all pretty good like these weren't stupid people but they were all disturbed like there was some issues

And I'm glad you say that because I felt like the human side of them is the part I thought was bad. I thought that their emotions played, pulled the negative of what was positive. Like you said, they want you to do certain things. And I'm kind of like one of them overachievers. So when I did those things, it's kind of like, well, we still don't like you. Right. I asked you to do this. You did it.

You gave it your all. You were very good at it. And now I'm going to target you and say this about you. but I did what you said, you know. Yeah, there was no way to win. But that's the thing. They were very, like, Dr. Smith may very well be one of the most manipulative people I've ever met ever. We had a Dr. Smith.

Did you? Yes. Was it a man? No, this is a woman. Kind of an attractive woman with black hair. Straight black hair. Like Indian. Half Indian.

Yes. Yeah. The same Dr. Smith we had. Are you serious? Little, she probably, probably a hundred. In Beaumont, Texas. She must have come from Beaumont and then come to, because she had just only been in our program for like maybe a year before i got there yes yeah she was listen here's the thing about

she was she was super manipulative oh my god it was over the top but here's the thing about her first of all she was she in in prison she was a 10 right because she was yeah because she had a little belly and she looked dirty she somebody told me someone had a perfect example of her they said she's cute but it looks like if she kicked her shoes off her feet would stink I don't know what that's exactly what he's going how perceptive when I met when I met her like I'd seen her would you agree with that though um no but I would have before I met her and talked to her because when I talked to her here's what her thing was to me she's about a six right five or six when you talk to her she jumped up to like an eight well she's intelligent but she didn't look disheveled

I never saw her feet. No, not her feet. Not disheveled. I mean, like, did her hair look like it wasn't? No, she had straight, long black hair. Right, but it's like she kept it up or she just threw it together in the morning. She looked fine. She always looked disheveled.

No, not to me. And she was, listen, but manipulative, like you can't believe. Like, I mean, just. Maybe we're not talking about the same kind of a pot belly, a little bit of a belly? No, pop belly. I don't remember any pop. There's no pop belly. bro i just told you

she was she's a six like i said like on the street she's a six in prison she's a nine maybe a 10 yeah i agree she was attractive yeah yeah she was probably 110 pounds she used to be married to divorced divorced from from a basketball player like a guy was like a professional basketball player

not a big time it had to be the same one indian descent yeah indian black black and indian probably mixed she was mixed mean it could be mean as shit Oh yeah, she could be brutal I wonder if it's the same one

It's got to be the same one Because she probably moved She didn't leave us She probably moved from Beaumont and went there Wow Yeah Yeah she was She was something else

Something else When did you take it This is 1415 I took it in I took it in 2018 Yeah I think she left 15

Really 15 16 Yeah because she got there Like I said a year or so Before I ended up in that And I went to so so definitely probably 16 she probably got there in 16 because i started the program at first in 17 went for six months got out for three or four months got back in for eight months or seven months and then got back out might have been almost eight months what a small world right

well it's a bop i didn't i didn't yeah i didn't have her long um i had the guy but i'm telling I had no problems except with that one woman. Her name was Pruitt. Her name was Ms. Pruitt. That's the only woman I had a problem with. And she did not like me. So, bizarre. So.

How long was each program, by the way? I was thinking about something you used to say. The one chick I told you the first time I went through, she didn't like me. How long was each phase? Yeah, each three months. Three months each, nine months. Right. Right.

So it was, it was, it was 12 weeks. So I remember the first time I, the first phase I was, was in this one chick, I can't believe I can't remember her name, the black DTS chick that I told you about. And literally, like, she, when the first day I got there, she was, she started laughing when she saw me that I was going to be in her group. Like, literally, like, looked at me, and she was, ha, she was cocks. And I was like, oh, man. And after the end of the week, like, I didn't say anything like the first week. I figured I'll just be quiet, right? Right. The first week. So I didn't say much. But at the very end of the last week, I was

walking out that she was saying goodbye to everybody as we walked out the door and she looked at me and she goes and she goes cox she goes how's it going and i went and i go 11 more weeks and i turn her and she goes oh and i just kept on walking and she was like huh huh like i made it i made it and i go 11 more weeks i'm out of here from you but yeah but she ended up liking me she ended up really liking me but yeah i know what you're saying bro they can make your life yeah it was rough it was it was so So for me, the overall experience, it was fun for the camaraderie that I had and the people that I dealt with. And it was fun because I got a chance to show off some skills and everything. And I love that type of.

In the pen, I'm sorry. In the pen, let's face it. Like in prison in general, I hate to say this, but in society, like I'm a sharp guy. I'm not the, you know, I'm not Elon Musk or whatever. whatever, but I'm a sharp guy. In prison, you're a rocket scientist. I can only imagine what it was like to be in the pin. You must have been like the brainiac of brainiac.

Yes. Yes. Known, very popular on every compound that I've been on. Very, very popular. Yeah. Like. I hear you. Popular, not in the way that I was popular where all the guys wanted to know me.

Hey, Cox. Now, including me. No. No. Can I buy you? Do you need some tennis shoes? No. I don't need any tennis shoes.

Thank you. Appreciate it. Come in myself for a minute. I don't think so. But anyway, hey, let's wrap it up. So I'm going to wrap it up. All right. Hey, so if you like the video, do me a favor and hit that subscribe button.

Hit the bell so you get notified. Share the video. Like the video. I never told anybody to like the video. So you got to like like the video. Love it. Yeah. And leave me a comment.

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We've got to get him over 1,000 subscribers. And we have to get him 4,000 hours of watch time. He's almost at 1,000 right now. Watch the videos. We need to get him monetized. I really appreciate you guys watching. Thank you very much. See you.

I didn't learn anything, bro. I literally, do you understand that? All this is for the camera because I think, like, do you understand that at one point? So you know the books, you know the questions you were answered. I was answering the questions like ridiculous, talking about, you know, like it's like, where will you be in 10 years if without drugs in your life? and I put, you know, and it was like, hopefully I'll be married, I will be married to a gold digging ex-stripper who only cares about me for my, my vast wealth. And, you know, and then it's like where you're, it asks about family.

Like, I will have no family since, since everybody's given up on me. I will, you know, a community. I said, I'm a pariah in the community. Fuck them. Like, I mean, I was just like literally like just brutal. and I was like, you know, and, you know, basically that's where, like, she and I have an arrangement, and I will hopefully die betting her at the age of 95 years old, like, you know. And you understand, so you have to give that to your, to your, like, the, the, uh, DTS, right?

And they review it, like, every month or so, they call you in for a review. Right. My DTS calls me in. Other people she's calling in, by the way, making them rewrite, you had to write everything in pencil. rewrite statements do this again do that again oh yeah she calls me in and she says this she says mr cross i reviewed your book she said and i was like okay and i thought fuck because when i did it i didn't think anything of it she goes like this she said i reviewed your your your material and i was like yes ma'am and she said and she said obviously she said you have a good you have a very good

grasp of the material she said you're doing excellent work just keep it up i said okay off. I mean, she didn't read it. Of course she didn't. Why would she read it? I'm well spoken. She's going to me during the class. She's like, Mr. Cox, what do you think about what he said? Because the first two phases, you're just trying to get these, these fucking savages to eat with fucking utensils and say thank you. But me, I'm okay with that. I knew the third phase, they will destroy me. The third phase is when they come for the con men. So we'll talk about, so phase, phase one is intro, like you call right what was phase like what was your hardest phase it had to be phase three because you're

what do you mean by hardest like all of it was easy to me Jesus listen they do you understand they brutal in the third phase like the guys that were sailing first through the first two phases like basically the con men the fraudsters the you know what I'm saying they were okay they were okay in the first two phase by the third one that's when they came for you because Because the third one, they want to see improvement. So I broke it down, and I'm going to bring it up. What was the, I'm just trying to so we can hit each section. And of course, you, anyway, what was it called when they called you in to meet with the...

Team? Team! This is great. This should be being recorded. Oh, I was going to say, because it's, yeah, yeah, team. Go, bro. They're teaming me. They're teaming you?

Will you come with me? Yeah, you had to have a, yeah, okay. Yeah, had to have back, not backup, but yeah. What was it called? It was called sponsors. Yeah, yeah, it was sponsor. Well, I think they did. Yeah, you needed a peer and like a sponsor, and then you brought your big brother.

Did they call them big brothers? Yeah, we had, we had the big brothers going on. You had a family, a brother, a brother tree. My poor big brother. This fucking guy was terrified of me. And you had, what were those guys called that were in charge? Like you had That they graduated the program

That mentors Mentors Oh yeah you had a mentor And then you had the comps People that had completed the program That were still there But they weren't meant See they

And where I All right so all this stuff We should put on camera So yeah he's recording this Huh He'll throw this in At the end of it Yeah just uh

All right So We can cover Cool Okay Yeah it's good So we can talk about each Each phase or just

I wanted to do the 10 I want to do the You do you understand I kept all my Ardap stuff Like I don't know where it's upstairs in a box But I kept the books I even had the armband These were the armbands I took a photo of the armband

For the cover and put it This is sitting on an Ardap book That's what these are These are the different phases Yes, low phase one, phase two. And this is the book. This was, remember criminal lifestyle? That's the name, that's the book.

Yes. I'm trying to think of the 10 thinking habits. 10 thinking habits. Yeah, the, what did I call them? Didn't I have? Thinking errors. Right, right. It was, um, blaming.

Yeah. Um, I can remember the, um, wasn't one of them like a should, should thinking. Yeah. Which should be this way. It should be that. What was the acronym for it? Because I remember H. H. Hog Crow for the positive attitudes. I just memorized them.

All right. So. Do you understand? Did they ever do random tests for you? Yes. Okay. So, so every, like, everybody was terrified of the random tests. And they were all like, bro, what are you going to do?

Like, you don't know any of the material, any of it. And they just randomly do the test. And I was like, right, right? And they were like, what are you going to do? I was like, oh, I'm going to fail it. I'm going to fail it. And they were like, well, I was like, yeah, but I mean, you don't have to pass the test to pass that, that section of, I said, but I'll get through it. I'll explain. I was nervous. I was uncomfortable. I, I, you can ask me any questions. I said, you know, I think I know all this material because I'm great in class. They've, I said, you know, they've gone through my book. They keep giving me these passing scores in my book. So if I fail the test, I can blame it on dyslexia. I can blame it on whatever. I was like, oh, I'll get through it. They're like, you're such a cocky prick. So at one point, there was. they were going to randomly screen people, right?

Like in the morning meeting and just ask you questions. So my big brother came to me and he goes, Cox, are you ready for this? Like, if they call you, like, you know the, you know what the 10 attitude, the 10 attitude errors or error, whatever they are. Thinking errors are, right? I went, no, no. And he goes, well, what about?

And he starts asking me a question, like, no, I don't, I don't have any idea. He's like, yeah, but I wrote you. He was, I gave you the flash cards. And I'm like, yeah, I've got him here somewhere. And he was like, you're wasting good stories, Matt. Well, it's going to be on the end. He'll put this on the end.

But the funny thing about that is so we get, so he's like, he's terrified. If I fail, he's like, you understand if you fail. He's like, I'm supposed to be helping you. I'm your big brother. He's like, yeah, he's like, I'm supposed to be helping you. I'm like, oh, yeah, you dropped the ball, bro. Because he's like, I thought you didn't need help. Like you're you, you're smart guy.

I'm like, yeah, I know. I figure that'll carry me through. Like, I don't really expect to pass a program. I like the unit. it's clean everybody's very polite it's you know it's nice i like it here i go to bed at 10 o'clock anyway i don't sleep during the day you know like all the things that are bothered everybody else i don't do those things so anyway he goes he's like oh my god oh my god he's freaking out i go but you what he's like you've got to learn it you got to he goes and gets the guy that told that put us

together right that told him i would be a good a good student or whatever and he goes oh my god he's good this is what's happening what they call on him i'm gonna i'm gonna get fail i'm gonna And he goes, Cox, you got to remember him. So they give me, he had like 50 cards. I memorized them in two days. In two days, I memorized every single card. I just all day long. Your pressure does work.

It does because I felt bad. You know, it wasn't for any other reason that I was like, I felt bad for him because he needed the year. And he was such a nice guy, too. He was. That's the part of, so phase three is teaching. When you go on, like, so the first one is the introduction. Right. You say they feed you.

The second one is, when you have to apply it. So now you have to start doing stuff. And in the third phase, you actually have to teach the phase oneers. So where I was, they made you responsible for a certain group of, so you had some phase one people in your group

and some phase two people in your little family tree. Right. You know, so I'd be like, all right. And I had a person just like you. Like, no, I don't know that stuff. I go, are you freaking, okay.

I'm like, dude, you're taking this shit too seriously. Yes. And you're taking it too unsurricular. here's what's funny um so one of the things that happened i think i talk i talk about this in the book i very quickly realize you know how you had to go to like a you had to go to like this different groups therapies you had to learn how to do a pull up you had to go to the classes right you so i real i went to like two classes you had to go like 10 of them 10 here 10 there 10 this and you always had to attend a i realized right away if you don't attend the first a meeting they never put you on

the roster and they never checked to see if you continue to go So I just didn't go. I never went the first time. The second thing was those classes that you're supposed to go to, I went the first two times, and then I just signed the instructor's name over and over and over and over again. And, of course, my roommate was like, what if they check?

What if they double check? I'm like, well, first of all, it's signing a random sheet. The fact that they're going to grab mine and go grab every single one, I said, someone would have to go and tell them. There's 100 fucking guys here, 150 guys sitting in this unit. Like, there's no way. I'm like the likelihood that they're going to pinpoint me and then go through every single one. And if they do, he's like, yeah, what if they do?

I said, then I'll say, I lied. I lied. I signed them. I signed their name. I said, what does it matter? And they're like, oh, bro, that's all. Right. So they get all upset.

But I never went. I just never went. And I had guys actually come to me and say, I never see you in class. And I go, which one do you go to? Well, I go to the one at six o'clock. I go, oh, on what? Tuesdays? And they go, no, no.

on Wednesdays and Fridays, like, oh, I go to the one on Monday and such and such. Whatever it was, and I had that. They didn't go to. That's the one you went. Come on. Boy, you were a nightmare for a dedicated person like myself. All right. If we can do the 10 thinking errors, then I'm ready to start.

Did you guys have a prize closet when they gave out prizes? They did give out, they did give out candy and stuff like that. But I don't know that we didn't call it a prize. It was something that was, I think it was described. expressionary for Dr. Smith to do herself. Right. Or maybe the DTSs or whatever. Because they all had like a little box in their unit.

It was so like you want to feel like a child. Yes. Yeah, yeah. You were doing so good. Pick two items out of the box. Yeah. Skittles. Do you have skittles?

Yes. They had skittles. Which you could resell on the car. That's in Coke. But if you found. Sugared sodas. If you were caught, reselling them.

Yeah. booked out all right so let's do the thinking errors and we can start yeah all right so you said one I can't remember the order so one was definitely should should thoughts I wonder if somebody blaming is one um honesty response what honesty responsibility willingness open mindedness humility yes I got all those right there caring gratitude only only because I knew the acronym. Objectivity, gratitude. I got it all.

Honestly, humility, open my neck, gratitude, caring, responsibility, objectivity. Williness. What is that? Those are the positive attitudes. Oh, for God's sakes. Oh, here it is.

Absolutes. I can't. I can't, yes. I can't. And there's another I one. There's rhetorical questions? Rhetorical questions. Rhetorical. Yes.

Ophalizing. Yes. Which is, Jess says that to me. I'll be like, man, you know this and this, you'll go, you're awfulizing, which is hilarious. Wait, statement of fact. Statement of fact, yes. He, she, it statements. Yes.

Blaming. I got that. Loaded questions or words. He, she, it statements. Loaded words. Loaded questions. Yeah. Or,

or rhetorical question. Or words. Loaded words. Yes. Look, look. Look, have to, need to, must. I can't believe that you just, you just finished it with must. God, bro.

Okay. You were, you were a super dapper. What? What? Do you know they used to call me the, oh, fucking put your cape on. Yeah. Like with your super dappid ass. Should statements?

I got should, yeah That's it Blaming That should be 10 So have to need too much Rhetorical question Otholizing I can't

There's another I one It's probably one of these That's just altered Right Is that 10 of us? 10 of them right 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 There's another eye

Thinking and generalizations over generalizing way making excuses for not doing something there's another eye one it'll come to me that's good enough though all right are you ready Jesus making assumptions

without knowing the fact oh my God well what how long are we going to do I want to walk out of here by noon a really yes so it might have to be a two-parter come on let's go we can do this all right

right right right by noon you said You had till two. I have to be somewhere at two. It's 30 miles back to my house. And it's past my house I have to be. You'll be right. Where is it?

Bradington. Is it another bank job? No, it's not another. Could you imagine? I'm robbing a bank of America. Yes, I'm all here to rob a bank. No, it's, it's, it's, it's a doctor's appointment. I finally got Medicaid, so.

nice getting the pills all right maybe all right so start start all right is this see you got to you got to do the closer right me yeah yeah yeah yeah right now you're doing this oh so we both you know it's within basically so if you need to pull it closer pull it I know it seems funny with it right in your face right okay um uh what okay so that's it right all right I don't know if you guys know this or not but when I was locked up I wrote a a whole bunch of true crime books, and all of the books are on Amazon, Barnes and Nobles, Audible, their e-books, check out the trailers. Using forgeries and bogus identities, Matthew B. Cox, one of the most ingenious conmen

in history, built America's biggest banks out of millions. Despite numerous encounters with bank security, state, and federal authorities, Cox narrowly, and quite luckily, avoiding capture for years. Eventually, he topped the U.S. Secret Service's Most Wanted list and led the U.S. Marshals, FBI and Secret Service, on a three-year chase, while jet-setting around the world with his attractive female accomplices. Cox has been declared one of the most prolific mortgage fraud con artists of all time by CNBC's American Greene.

Bloomberg Business Week called him the mortgage industry's worst nightmare, while Dateline NBC described Cox as a gifted forger and silver-tonged liar. Playboy magazine proclaimed his scam was real estate fraud, and he was the best. Shark in the housing pool

is Cox's exhilarating first-person account of his stranger-than-fiction story. Available now on Amazon and Audible. Bent is the story of John J. Bozzi Fosiac's phenomenal life of crime, inked from head to toe, with an addiction to strippers and fast Cadillacs, Boziac was not your typical computer geek. He was, however, one of the most cunning scammers, counterfeiters, identity thieves, and escape artists alive, and a major thorn in the side of the U.S. Secret Service as they fought

a war on cybercrime. With a savant-like ability to circumvent banking security and stay one step ahead of law enforcement, Boziac made millions of dollars in the international cyber underworld, with the help of the Chinese and the Russians. Then, leaving nothing but a John Doe warrant and a cleaned-out bank account in his wake, he vanished. Boziak's stranger-than-fiction tale of ingenious scams and impossible escapes, of brazen run-ins with the law and secret desires to straighten out and settle down, makes his story a true crime con game that will keep you guessing. Bent.

How a homeless teen became one of the cybercrime. industry's most prolific counterfeiters. Available now on Amazon and Audible. Buried by the U.S. government and ignored by the national media, this is the story they don't want you to know. When Frank Amadeo met with President George W. Bush at the White House to discuss NATO operations in Afghanistan, no one knew that he'd already embezzled nearly $200 million from the federal government.

Money he intended to use to bankroll his plan to take over the world. from Amadeo's global headquarters in the shadow of Florida's Disney World, with a nearly inexhaustible supply of the Internal Revenue Services funds. Amadeo acquired multiple businesses, amassing a mega conglomerate. Driven by his delusions of world conquest, he negotiated the purchase of a squadron of American fighter jets and the controlling interest in a former Soviet ICBM factory. He began working to build the largest private militia on the planet,

over one million Africans strong. Simultaneously, Amadeo hired an international black ops force to orchestrate a coup in the Congo while plotting to take over several small Eastern European countries. The most disturbing part of it all is, had the U.S. government not thwarted his plans, he might have just pulled it off. It's insanity. The bizarre, true story of a bipolar megalomaniac's insane plan for total world domination. Available now, on Amazon and Audubold. Pierre Rossini, in the 1990s, was a 20-something-year-old

Los Angeles-based drug trafficker of ecstasy and ice. He and his associates drove luxury European supercars, lived in Beverly Hills penthouses, and dated Playboy models while dodging federal indictments. Then, two FBI officers with the organized crime

drug enforcement task force entered the picture. Dirty agents willing to fix cases and identify informants. Suddenly, two of Racini's associates, confidential informants, working with federal law enforcement, or murdered. Everyone pointed to Racini. As his co-defendants prepared for trial, U.S. Attorney Robert Mueller sat down to debrief Racine at Leavenworth Penitentiary, and another story emerged. A tale of FBI corruption and complicity in murder. You see, Pierre Racini knew something that no one else knew. The truth.

And Robert Mueller and the federal government have been covering it up to this very day. Devil Exposed. A twisted tale of drug trafficking, corruption, and murder in the city of angels. Available on Amazon and Audible. Bailout is a psychological true crime thriller that pits a narcissistic con man against an egotistical, pathological liar. Marcus Shrinker, the money manager who attempted to fake his own death during the 2008 financial crisis, is about to be released from prison, and he's ready to talk.

He's ready to tell you the story no one's heard. Shrinker sits down with true crime writer, Matthew B. Cox, a fellow inmate serving time for bank fraud. Shrinker lays out the details. The disgruntled clients who persecuted him for unanticipated market losses, the affair that ruined his marriage, and the treachery of his scorned wife, the woman who framed him for securities fraud, leaving him no choice but to make a bogus distress call and plunge from his multi-million dollar private aircraft in the dead of night. The $11.1 million in life insurance, the missing $1.5 million in gold.

The fact is, Shrinker wants you to think he's innocent. The problem is, Cox knows Shrinker's a pathological liar and his stories of fabrication. As Cox subtly coaxes, cajoles, and yes, Khan's Shrinker into revealing his deceptions, his stranger-than-fiction life of lies slowly unravels. This is the story Shrinker didn't want you to know. Bailout. The Life and Lies of Marcus Shrinker. Available now on Barnes & Noble, Etsy, and Audible.

Matthew B. Cox is a con man, incarcerated in the Federal Bureau of Prisons, for a variety of bank fraud-related scams. Despite not having a drug problem, Cox inexplicably ends up in the prison's residential drug abuse program, known as Ardap. A drug program in name only. Ardap is an invasive behavior modification therapy, specifically designed to correct the cognitive thinking errors associated with criminal behavior. The program is a non-fiction dark comedy, which chronicles Cox's side-splitting journey. This first-person account is a fascinating glimpse at the survivor-like atmosphere inside of the government-sponsored rehabilitation unit. While navigating the treachery of his backstabbing peers, Cox simultaneously manipulates prison policies and the bumbling staff every step of the way.

The program. How a conman survived the Federal Bureau of Prisons cult of Ardap. Available now on Amazon and Audible. If you saw anything you like, links to all the books are in the description box.