Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Luxury Escort Builds Dark Web Empire

Episode Date: February 5, 2026

Glynis Franz shares her story from working as a high-end escort trapped in addiction, to the founder of a healing center helping others recover.⁣ ⁣ Glynis's links⁣ https://www.instagram.com/glamorousglynis/?hl=en⁣ https://peakpathhealth.com/⁣ ⁣ Do you want to be a guest? Fill out the form https://www.insidetruecrimepodcast.com/apply-to-be-a-guest⁣ ⁣ Get 10% sitewide for a limited time. Just visit https://GhostBed.com/cox and use code COX at checkout. ⁣ ⁣ Go to https://HelloFresh.com/itc10fm to get 10 free meals + a FREE Zwilling Knife ⁣ ⁣ Send me an email here: [e-mail]⁣ ⁣ Do you extra clips and behind the scenes content?⁣ Subscribe to my Patreon: https://patreon.com/InsideTrueCrime ⁣ ⁣ Check out my Dark Docs YouTube channel here -⁣ https://www.youtube.com/@DarkDocsMatthewCox⁣ ⁣ Follow me on all socials!⁣ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/insidetruecrime/⁣ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@matthewcoxtruecrime⁣ ⁣ ⁣ Do you want a custom painting done by me? Check out my Etsy Store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/coxpopart⁣ ⁣ Listen to my True Crime Podcasts anywhere: https://anchor.fm/mattcox ⁣ ⁣ Check out my true crime books! ⁣ Shark in the Housing Pool: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0851KBYCF⁣ Bent: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BV4GC7TM⁣ It's Insanity: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08KFYXKK8⁣ Devil Exposed: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08TH1WT5G⁣ Devil Exposed (The Abridgment): https://www.amazon.com/dp/1070682438⁣ The Program: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0858W4G3K⁣ Bailout: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/bailout-matthew-cox/1142275402⁣ Dude, Where's My Hand-Grenade?: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BXNFHBDF/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1678623676&sr=1-1⁣ ⁣ Checkout my disturbingly twisted satiric novel!⁣ Stranger Danger: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BSWQP3WX⁣ ⁣ If you would like to support me directly, I accept donations here:⁣ Paypal: https://www.paypal.me/MattCox69⁣ Cashapp: $coxcon69 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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It won't take long to tell you neutral's ingredients. Vodka, soda, natural flavors. So, what should we talk about? No sugar added? Neutral. Refreshingly simple. I was the high-end escort. Money might put me on game.

These things are a lot better than Backpage because Backpage is open to the public. Once you're on this site. That's when I start making a lot more money. Do you have any idea how insane this sounds, right? My mom was almost 40 when she had. had me. I was her first child. My dad was like almost 50. And one day she, she left for work. When I was 11, I was in the sixth grade. And she just didn't come home. She left a letter. Yeah. She had started working around within that year. So she had gone from like being a stay-at-home mom to

working again. I mean, did she like say, hey, I got an apartment. I'm down the street. No. I'll come see you on the weekends. We'll work out. No, just just gone. Like when did you hear from her again? There was a letter. Nobody knew she was leaving. And I remember our dad sat us down and said, you know, your mother left. So at the time, I hated her because I was, you know, like a teenage girl. But also when she left, it was like all of these feelings that I had of like not being good enough already, just being like an awkward, you know, kid. It was like in my perspective was that she was like leaving me.

Right. because she didn't love me. Yeah. So she leaves, and she leaves this letter, and we don't hear from her for maybe about a week. You know, she tells us she's going to continue to be, you know, present in our lives and be a part of our lives. But that doesn't really happen. She's not super involved. My dad is essentially raising us on our own, and I'm so angry with her.

I don't really want anything to do with her. And so, I don't know, she was, like, finding herself, I guess. She was going through like kind of, at least the way I saw it was like a midlife crisis. That's exactly what, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Right. Yeah, she starts working. She's going through metapause.

She leaves my dad. We had just bought this like big Victorian house that we couldn't afford, really. And she was the one who had wanted to buy it. And she left. And this is like before the 2008 mortgage crisis. Like things are getting crazy. It's a subprime mortgage. Rates are going up.

she's not financially contributing. My dad can't pay the mortgage. And so, like, all these things are happening. And I go from, like, kind of being an 11-year-old kid who's having some behavioral issues to, like, almost feeling like I am the only, like, adult woman in the house. Even though I'm not an adult, my sister is a couple years younger. And I'm, like, worried about paying the bills. And, like, all of these things are happening.

And I'm super young. So, I mean, I'm, like, stressing out, like, how are we going to pay the mortgage, you know? And I don't even have a bank account. And there's really nothing I can do to contribute. to paying the mortgage at the tender age of 11, but that was like a legitimate stressor. I had already been running away before my mom left, so I would run away from home and, like, disappear for, you know, a couple weeks, a few times it was a few months. Where are you going?

Oh, yeah. Where do you disappear? Where am I going at 11 to 12 years old? So my best friend at the time, she was 16 years old. Her name was Stacy. Maybe she was 15, 15, 16. And she was like an avid runaway. So she was constantly running away, too.

And I started running away with her, and we would just, like, couch surf. We would get on the train in Fitchburg, Massachusetts, and then we would, like, take the train up to Boston. We were, like, hanging out with, like, creepy older men. I mean, we were doing all kinds of crazy stuff. I was, like, smoking. I was drinking. I was, you know, doing some other stuff. and just starting to like break bad, if you will, I guess.

So what happens with the house and does that fall apart? I mean, it doesn't sound like. Yeah, no, it does. Eventually it falls apart. My dad ends up losing the house. When he was going through a lot of that, to fast forward, I guess, I was not even around. I was in juvenile detention, but he ends up losing the house. Why are you in juvenile detention?

I mean, I was pretty bad at 11, 12 years old, but when I was 13, 14, I got pulled over for driving without a license or a permit, really, and I got a DUI. Yeah. So I got a DUI at 14, and then I'm put on probation. And part of the probation stipulation is to, you know, be tested for substances. and alcohol and all of that stuff. And I can't pass those tests. So I'm constantly failing, constantly failing.

And I'm failing for pretty, you know, pretty serious substances. This is like ice? Is this like, or is this like? I'm trying to figure out of saying. Like blow or H? So, yeah. So I'm using, I'm smoking blow and I am using H as well and pills. And at that time, at least in Massachusetts, there wasn't, and as sad as it is, there's a lot of kids these days who are using substances.

It was not a thing then. Like nobody in my school, none of my friends and my age group were using the kind of substances I was using. So when I sort of failing tests with probation for H and blow, they were like, they were taking it very seriously. And where are you getting these substances? Yeah. Or 13 or 14. How are you paying for these substances at 13 or 14? So I was, I was middle manning quite a bit.

You know, I would like get people, you know, stuff and I would just kind of be the go-between and I would I would get money that way. Also, older boyfriends that were, you know, selling, selling drugs and stuff like that. So I wasn't really hanging out with anybody my age. And at the time, I thought I was so mature and developed. And probably for my age, I was. But nonetheless, I was still a kid. So there was a lot of, you know, creepy stuff going on. Yeah.

And so you fail, you end up getting, you end up, you fail some of these tests and you end up going to. So I end up going the first time I just go to Juvie maybe for like a month or two. And I'm released. and I'm put into my first. Hold on that minute. Hold on. You're racing through this. How did you fit in at Juvie?

I'm sure you fit right in, right? You probably walked in and it was like all a bunch of middle class white girls. Yeah. No. I mean, I was a little hood rat at the time. Or I thought it was. You know what I mean? So, you know, the like the hair gel slicked back tight and like, you know, the thin eyebrows.

I fit in fine with most of the kids then. Okay. Yeah. And after like two months, I was put directly into like a program for kids. So I went right from juvie to like a treatment facility. And I got out of there maybe after two weeks. And that was the first time I had been around like kids who were around my age who were doing some of the things as far as like substances. go that that that that that was doing um and i and i and i got out and i just started doing the same

thing right away again you're like network and hang out with these kids now now you have other kids that are like you like oh wow let me get your phone number let me where do you wear it what your name was you know that sort of thing or some of them yeah um it was a mix it was a mix of like you know the middle class kid whose parents caught them smoking pot or there was like some kids that were like, you know, they were like hooked, hooked on age, you know, like 15, 16 year old kids, 14 year old kids. So some of them I did stay in touch with. One particularly, actually like years later, to this day, like her and I still stay in touch. She lives out here in Florida now, but no, I was not hanging out with many people my age. I was hanging out with older adults.

People had cars, money, and substances. Like, that's really who I was spending my time with. Yeah. I just can't imagine being a grown man hanging out with, like, a 14-year-old. It's so creepy. I think about being a grown woman hanging out with a 14-year-old boy. And I'm like, ooh, gross. It gives me, yeah, the hebie-gbs for sure.

I mean, I just, yeah, I just think if a police officer stopped you and questioned you and you were 17 years old or 20 years old, and who's this? Oh, how old are you, 14? that cop would look at you like, are you, I'm about to yank you, especially in Florida. Yeah. We may get a couple of sheriffs out here to yank you, bring you in the woods and teach you just a lesson. And I don't even know if you're doing anything wrong. Yeah.

I just know that there's just no situation unless this is your sister or your niece and you're dropping her off at school that you should be hanging out with a 14 year old girl. I totally agree. I mean, it's funny you say that when I got that, before I got that DUI, I had crashed a car and I had been hanging out with this older boy and it was his car, right? and he'd picked me up. It was like a Tuesday night. It was a school night. And I remember I had like pajamas on. I had slippers.

Yeah, it's slippers. And he like picked me up and we're like driving through backroads drinking. He was probably like 19 or 20. And he let me drive and we're on these back roads, these dirt roads in, you know, small town, Massachusetts. And I end up going to take a left and he's like, no, no, no, take a right. And I take a right. And the back tire skid and the car like, fly. flips over, and it ends up in like a swamp in November in Massachusetts.

So it's like 20 degrees out. And I can't get out of the car. And I remember him kicking out the window and like pulling me out of the car. Otherwise, I probably would have drowned and died. And I remember afterwards, I was like, so what do we do now? And he's like, you should probably just leave. And I remember walking home like two and a half, three miles just like covered in brown swamp water with no shoes on. And every time I hear like a car, I'd like tuck and roll in the bushes because I'm like, oh, the cops are coming.

And if they see like the swamp thing at 13, 14 years old walking down the street, like they're probably going to stop. So, luckily, I don't think I had many interactions where I was with adults where the police caught me. None that I can remember. Well, actually, that's not true. The DUI was with adults. I don't know why they didn't put them in jail. They all had licenses. They were all of age.

But you were driving. But I was driving, yeah, to the club with my fake ID. Yeah, I would think they would have been here. Here in Florida, I think they'd have been arrested in charge with, like, contributing to a minor. Like, you know, this girl's 14 years old and she's driving. You're sitting next to her. You're 19. You have a license.

Like, what are you doing? Yeah, yeah, totally. And she's intoxicated? Come on, man. Yeah, it's pretty crazy. I agree. So you get out, you immediately, you get out of Juvie and the drug program, immediately go back to what you were doing. So how does that progress?

Like, how old are you still 14 or 15? Yeah, 14-15 at this point, I immediately go back to what I was doing, and I'm still on like pre-trial probation because I'm going through like the court system for this DUI. And I'm failing, you know, drug tests again. And so... You know what nobody tells you about dinner? It never stops. Every day around 5 o'clock, it rolls around again.

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commit you until you're 18 as like a cur like a way of yeah exactly and I was habitual and my charges weren't that severe but I think I think I think I think they took it really seriously because of the substances I was using and the reason I only stayed in that treatment program for two weeks was because my insurance wouldn't cover it and so I think in hindsight I think the judge was probably trying to commit me because it would give me access to more more services to get help and also like I couldn't stop using substances. I just kept getting loaded. And so I show up to court. My attorney makes a mistake of telling me that I'm going to be committed that day. And I'm like, sure, and I'm like smoking cigarettes at this point. I'm like, I'm going to go out front and smoke a cigarette. And I go out front

and smoke a cigarette. And I call my best friend, Heather. And I'm like, come get me. And she comes and picks me up. And I just am on the run for the next few months that I run away from the courthouse. And I'm like, my big plan was to like run until I was 18, you know, until I aged out. Yeah. Well, how do they catch out with you? So I was. Heather's a problem, by the way. Say what?

Heather's a problem, too. Oh, I know. Heather, bless her heart. She's, yeah, she's not doing it. Well, she lives out here, too. I think about her all the time. She was not as much of a problem as me. She was just, you know.

She's helping. Yeah, she was. She's helping. She's got that call and said, yes, sounds like a, sounds like you're a hit. You need to go back. in there. I'm not coming to get you. What are you talking about? Teenagers, you know what I mean? I'm like, they're keeping me forever. Come get me, girl. She's like, all right, I'll be there. Yeah, so she shows up, she picks me up.

And I don't remember. She dropped me off at, you know, some guy's house that I knew out in that area, out near Worcester. And, and yeah, I just, I'm just kind of on a rampage for the next few months. And eventually I end up back in like my home area. I'm in this like city called Fitchburg. This like kind of crappy like shitty, like shitty little town city, I guess. Not very nice. Kind of like poor area. And it's a college town.

And I go to some party for Halloween. It's like a Halloween party and I'm drinking. And I, it's the next morning. I'm super hungover. And I'm living out of like a bag of clothes and and I'm with Heather again. And Heather and I go and meet this guy that I had been spending time with who had like my bag of clothes and also some some age for sale. And I go and I buy some off him and it's like a McDonald's parking lot or something like that. And Heather and I pull out and a minute and a half later were pulled over.

and my first thought is, you know, they saw me buy drugs. And I'm like, and I also have a warrant. And by this time, I believe I'm 16. I'd been maybe on the run for three, four months. And I'm pulled over. Heather's driving. I'm in the passenger seat. And I'm like, oh, my God, they're going to lock me up for the next two and a half years.

I think I just turned 16. So like, almost three years. I'm like, I'm not going. And the cop asks for her name and her driver's license and she gives them all that information and then asks for my name. And I don't have an ID because I don't even have a permit or a license. So I give them like someone else's name and they go back to the cruiser to check. And I'm like, I need to get out of here. And she's like, Glenn, don't.

Like don't run. Please. And I'm like, no, I'm out of here. And I pull, I open the passenger side door and I start running and we're like on a hill. And I start running because I think that he's about to pop me for possession. And he was like, you know, in his 40s, which at the time was like a million years old, no offense. And I'm like, I can outrun this guy. You know, I weigh like 110 pounds and I like take off going to bowl.

And he catches up to me right away and we're doing the whole like left right, left right thing. And he finally like tackles me and he's trying to get me in the cuffs. But he's like, stop resisting. I'm like, I'm not resisting. I'm obviously resisting. And then some, like, motorcycle guy pulls over and he goes, do you need help? And he just body slams me, this, like, citizen who doesn't look like he would be, like, a good Samaritan because he looks like a hell's angel or something. He's wearing, like, leather.

He's on a Harley. He's, like, body slams me, and then the cop puts me in cuffs. And it turns out we had just not came to a complete stop at a year. sign. If I had just been chill, I probably would have been fine. And him running you, you're, if you're six, just turned 16, I don't have a license. My name is, you know, Jennifer Johnson. He's going to go, okay, well, there's a, whatever. Whatever, what's your, even if you gave a bad date of birth, he's going to be like, well, she's just not in the system. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I didn't think this through. Yeah, no, I was not thinking the whole process through.

We were panicked, you know? Totally. I was panicked. I didn't want to go, I didn't want to be locked up. And, and also I had a habit, you know what I mean? I didn't. I didn't. I didn't want to withdraw. I hear it's great to withdraw in prison. Oh, yeah. So fun. It's like the best experience. It's the best.

It's amazing. No, it's terrible. So now I get put in cuffs and I have like cuts all over me. You know, my fingers are all cut up. I have like rips in my jeans. I'm all cut up. And so because I am a minor, technically speaking, they can't even search me. They can't touch me.

And so I still have this, you know, this H in my pocket. And they take me to the hospital and they end up bandaging me up. And it's not much, you know, I'm 16 years old on the run, you know, living out of a bag. But it was enough to, like, get me off of empty. And they end up bandaging me all up. And during that time when I'm at the hospital, I end up putting it in my band-aid on my finger. And so by the time I finally do get to the police station after the hospital, they search me and they never find it. but I was charged with assault battery and a police officer, which was an adult charge.

So now I'm going to juvenile court for the Department of Use Services and the DUI thing. And I also have a pending adult charge for assault and battery on a police officer. Because it turns out even if you don't assault them, if there's any unwanted contact, it's assault and battery. Right. So what, do you have a question? I was just wondering, it's not even that important, but I'm wondering, do they ask you, like, why did you attack this police officer if they never found anything? Why'd you run? They did ask me why I ran.

I remember it was the state police and they were like, why did you run? That's the fastest guy on the force. I was like, well. But also they ended up finding out that I did have a warrant. So, I mean, it was kind of part of the reason that it was the main reason I ran,

but also I didn't want any possession charges because at that time at 16 years old, I'm like, oh my God, if I have a possession charge, like, I'm going to spend the rest of my life in jail, which definitely wasn't true, not in Massachusetts, but. What's your dad thinking, right? Like, what's your, your poor dad? What, are you at any point thinking, hey, you've obviously known you have a problem.

Are you thinking at any point, hey, maybe I need to try and straighten up. I need to try and go straight. I think leading up to this point, I really didn't think I had a problem. Like, I really thought that I was doing the things I was doing because I wanted to. I was like kind of in this delusion where I'm like, oh, like if I wanted to stop, I would, but I don't want to. And when I finally was arrested that last time and I knew I was going to spend some time in Juvie, like a considerable period of time, that was the first time that I actually got honest because I had been lying to probation. I had been lying to my dad. And my dad, like, he just like, he wanted to believe what I was saying so badly.

And I was just so manipulative. And the truth is, he was doing the best he could. But he was raising two daughters at like 60-something years old. After retiring from the military, retiring from the post office, you know, spouse left, can't pay the mortgage. And he's working overnight. It's 11 to 7 in the morning five days out of the week at the hospital because he had gone back to work to try and pay the bill. So he, like, wasn't that present, to be honest. Not because he didn't love me, but he was just trying to, like, provide, right?

And he just is, he's like a straight edge, man. Like he, like, does he never smoke cigarettes, doesn't smoke pot, like barely drinks. Like, he is just so out of the loop. He's no understanding. Yeah, he's totally out of the loop. And I, like, I was a good liar, you know. So, yeah, I think it was a little bit of lack of, like, oversight and parenting for sure. And I think he also felt a lot of guilt around my mom leaving.

I think he felt, like, partly responsible. because how it was affecting me especially. But yeah, he's like really concerned. I don't know if he was relieved that I was locked up or whether he was sad. I think it was probably a mix of both. At least he knew where I was. Right.

Yeah. So I end up, yeah, being committed to the state of Massachusetts. For how long? I was committed until I was 18. I spent two, a little bit less than two years, almost two years locked up in the Department of Youth Services with a bunch of other girls who were also committed until they were 18. Yeah, it was like behavior modification kind of, you know what I mean? It was like we didn't go outside, we didn't leave, couldn't have visits unless it was a parent or a legal guardian.

And that took even months, you know, no phone calls out except for like a legal guardian who is, deemed appropriate to communicate with. You have to take classes. So, I mean, we're kids, so we have to go to school. But the schooling, even at that time, yeah, I was a bad kid, but I was, I was smart. I was smart. And most of the kids hadn't made it past the sixth grade level. So we were essentially all in the same classes.

You know what I mean? So I wasn't like getting what I needed. I was definitely not going to pass the 10th grade. And so, yeah, I end up going to school because we have to. And, yes, we have some classes, like therapeutic classes, like DBT, dialectical behavioral therapy. But I don't remember them being super helpful. Did you end up getting your GED? Later on, yeah, I did.

So I got out of there after two years. And I went to, like, a girl's, like, really structured treatment program until about a month before I turned 18. So the last like six, seven months before I turned 18 and aged out of the Department of New Services, I was in like a recovery home for girls. And I end up getting my GED when I finally get out. So I end up getting out and I go to like dual enrollment and I'm like working towards getting both my diploma and my associates. And I'm like sober. I'm doing pretty well after like spending almost three years, you know, in the system. And.

And then I started drinking. and it kind of all starts up again. And I eventually just get my GED. I stopped working towards the diploma and I just take the test and get my GED. So when you get out, when you go back to live with your dad? Yeah, so I'm living with my dad. Until I turned 18, I was like on an ankle monitor and I was like very like the Department of Youth Services was very strict.

I was like, I had, they called in every, every night to make sure that I was like in by curfew. I couldn't leave the house. And then when I turned 18, I got off Department of Youth Services, but I was still fighting. Well, I wasn't fighting. I was on probation for the assault matter on a police officer. So I had adult probation for about six months after I turned 18. So I had like another layer kind of of supervision.

Yeah, and it was a suspended sentence. So as long as I like kept my shit together, it would fall off my record. Did you? I did. Until like maybe two weeks before, probably. Probation was up. I started getting loaded again. And I relapsed and I filled one drug test. But I had been so good that the probation officer, like, I told her I took like a Tylenol three.

And she believed me. And she didn't believe you. She did. She did. She did. She did because she'd only seen me like be good, right? And so she was like, okay, fine. And she like, let me off still. I mean, I think I'd gotten pulled over because I'd crashed the car in a school zone.

And the way I got caught for that drug test is I had fake somebody else's pee on me. You know what I mean? I was on my way to probation. And the cop, when I was pulled over, found the pee and brought me to the courthouse. You're going to pee. I don't know what this is, but you're going to drug test today. And she wasn't there that day. So I never ended up drug testing that day.

And then I came back and drug tests and I never actually like peed dirty. But I told her, oh, the reason I didn't is because I took like a Tylenol and all three because I, you know, I don't know. Right. I don't know my toe or something. I don't remember what it was. I kept like kind of like kind of getting out of things. Right. So that's and then you went to community college.

You went to college. You ended up getting your degree as an accountant. And that's the story. Thank you for coming by. Yeah, exactly. Everything turned out great. Um, no, probably about six months after my 18th birthday, right before I got off probation, I started having issues, but I was able to, like, get off probation and be, be off paper. Um, and, uh, I got a job as a, like, working at a Victoria's Secret. It was like my first job. And I finally got my license because I wasn't able to get my license until I was 18 because of the DUI and all this other stuff. So I finally got a license. I got a car.

I'm working at Victoria's Secret. I'm doing age. I lose my job day two during training because I, like, can't stay awake. In the back, you know, they make you watch these, like, training videos or whatever. Right. And, like, every time the manager comes back, I'm, like, snoring. And he fires me, or she fires me. I don't even remember if it was he or she, to be honest.

It was only two days of work. And then I just, I start working at the strip club. So I'm like, I can't hold a real job. I need to. How do you get that job? You just go in or you know a guy. No, it's not hard. Yeah, you just walk in.

You're, you know, 18 years old, you know, hey, I'd like to be a dancer. And, yeah, I don't know, it didn't occur. It just didn't occur to me that maybe this is a bad idea. It really just didn't. What's your dad think? You see, you're still working at Victoria's secrets? He has no idea. Yeah, he has no idea.

He just stopped asking questions. Yeah, I mean, I had always. I had been a wild child for a long time. So even when I was like home, after my mom left, I was like barely living at home. I was like doing whatever I wanted even as a kid. And so the only period of time where I was consistently home between the ages of like 12 and 18 were those two, three months until I aged out of the Department of Youth Services and was on the ankle bracelet. And it was because I was required to be there, you know, at a bracelet on. So like my dad hadn't really had much of a say in what I did.

for a long time, to be honest. I was doing whatever I wanted. I was a troubled kid, and I was a troubled 18-year-old as well. You started the strip club? Yeah, yeah, I started working at the strip club. Is this like a decent strip club? The first one, yeah, the first one was a nice one. It was like a fancy one.

It was in Worcester, Massachusetts. What was it called? Forget. there's a couple, but I ended up working at one for a little bit and then going to another one. I think it was called Centerfolds 2000 in Oxford. And they were like relatively, they were pretty nice. Yeah.

And they were, you know, like no touching, nothing like that. Right. So I was making decent money and I was, you know, supporting my habit and all that stuff. And, you know, had an apartment, car, all this stuff. and maybe after like six or eight months or nine months of doing this, I like didn't want to. Six months. That's a good run, right? Like, I mean, you couldn't keep the legit job for two days, but this is a good run.

Are you know what I'm saying? Oh, yeah. This one's decent. I don't think they, it depends on the club, but for the most part, they didn't care if you were just like low-key about it. Like most of the girls are using. Right. Not all, but many. Well, I dated a girl.

really, and I almost almost complete all through college, really. It was pretty much all. I think I maybe met her like my second or third semester. But I dated her and she worked as a stripper. And listen to this cliche, she worked her way through college and got a degree in finance. Swear to God. No, no, I've seen that. It's not always, I know that's the I'm going to college.

But it's really, but that was actually true. but she was worked at Scarlet's, which was like at that time, I don't know what it is now. It was a really high end. But they were like, no, you, if you show up after this time, you're not going on. You can't leave before this time. You have to be walked to the car. You have to, if you give, if we see anybody exchange a phone number or anything, you're done. That's it.

I mean, it was super strict. Yeah. But I also think that at that time, the mayor of Tampa was like they were really all over these strip clubs. Because the sex work. stuff. Yeah, they were sending in cops and everything. So they were scared. And they had a liquor license. Like they were like terrified. Like y'all could get the girls can get the club in huge trouble. Totally. So they were all over. So I was wondering, but I know other strip clubs. Well, I worked at a couple. The first few were pretty decent. And this is Massachusetts, right?

This is Massachusetts. So Massachusetts strip clubs, there's not that many in Massachusetts. And they're pretty strict. There was like one ghetto one in Worcester, but I never worked there. There was only two in Boston that were right next to each other. One was like a little ghetto and the other one right next door, which was like Centerfold's Boston was really, really nice. Very expensive, very high end, like every girl was a 10. You know what I mean? Like stunning women. Most of them like relatively normal women. There were a couple girls who, I remember I was working with one girl who was in law school. Like there were girls like that for sure. It just depended on on the place. And in that place in Boston, it was very strict as well. But because it was so strict,

it was, like, harder to make money. You know what I mean? It's harder to make money, especially when it's, like, really strict and really high end, and the prices are, like, very, very high. But what you're getting is really, like, you're just, like, Centerful is Boston. Like, if you're going in the champagne room, it was usually because some guy had brought his wife, you know what I mean? And it was, like, $2,000 to, like, even just get up there. And it was, and this is, you know, 15 years ago. Like a lot of it was just a lot of money for really nothing. Like you couldn't touch our knee.

The dances were like arms length apart and they were watching you. Like there was no touching. Super strict. And I was like, you know what? Fuck this. And I started working at some clubs in Providence, Rhode Island. And that was a whole other story. It was like there were like brothels.

Right. Yeah. There was cops coming in. and yeah, it was on the news and like recording. It was essentially, I think at the time, and you can probably look this up, but don't quote me exactly, but indoor prostitution in the state of Rhode Island was legal. So like in clubs and in massage parlors, like you could do sex work. Right. Yeah.

So it was kind of a free-for-all, and then that changed. but obviously like the clubs in the massage parlors did not. Right. And then they started like cracking down. And most of these clubs, especially the ones in Providence, were like owned by mobsters. I was just going to say, I feel like that's kind of a mobbed up area. And there's a lot of corruption. And it's kind of like to me it's like Las Vegas.

In Las Vegas, prostitution is not legal, right? But it's only a misdemeanor. So I think it's the, oh, there's some county just out. It's like 20 or 30 minute drive outside of Las Vegas county or whatever. whatever that county is. And there, that's where, like, they have the bunny ranch and that's, that's legal. But, but if you're in Las Vegas and you're a prostitute, you get busted, it's like, okay, we take you down. We take a picture. You run your finger. Okay, can I go? And you're right back out. Like, it's just one misdemeanor after. Right. So. Yeah. So even there, if they're like,

oh, we're going to, you know, you're going to really, you know, crack down. Okay, you're cracking down on what are you giving me, though? I'm getting a misdemeanor. And even then, you know when they're cracking down, right? Like the mob is connected. So the cops are like, we could care less. And then they'll tell them like, hey, bro, we're supposed to be in the next couple weeks, we're going to be really cracking down for a couple months. They're like, gotcha. Totally. The cops at the front door, oh my God, I used to sleep with the guy who would do details at the front door. He was like a cop. He was friends with all the owners. I remember our manager at this club in Providence that I was working at had just gotten out of federal prison.

You know what I mean? For like embezzlement and a bunch of other weird. stuff and like you know he comes back to his old job and they open him with like uh they welcome him with open arms the owner dick shappie like i don't know if he used a mobster but if he wasn't certainly connected right it would be a yeah it would be shocking for sure he would like come in with like his like chest hair out like three buttons down and like he always he was like 70 years old you know what i mean he was so old and he always had like beautiful women sitting at the table with him with like huge tits and just have him on the podcast that's exactly what i was thinking of no no not him no but a guy like he came in and he's his shirt down to here and he's probably i think

he was like in his in his 60s right he's in his 60s he's got yeah he's a he's an accountant he does content with you know models an amazing hair by the way wanted to just point that out amazing hair in amazing shape and it was just like this guy was not you not no not an amazing shape. No, no, no, no, not the same guy for sure. Yeah, it was a crazy ordeal. That place, a lot of girls, Cuban girls would come down from Florida to go there because they would make a lot of money during the winter time here during the off season and then they would come back here for the summer. I was going to say the chick I knew, or the chick that I was dating, Chrissy, and there was a girl that would fly in on, I want to say, Friday nights from New York, work for like three or four days here and fly back

and actually had like, I think, had a kid in New York and she was like, I just, you know, I can't. Or was it, or was it the other way around? It depends on the season. Yeah, I was going to say, wait a minute, I could be wrong. She might have been flying to New York and then flying back and raising her kid here because it was so cheap here to live. But she was making so much money in New York. That's what I think happened. It was the opposite.

Okay. Yeah. But yeah, it was like, I remember thinking, this is a jet set stripper. Like, what's going on? Oh, yeah. There was a lot of us girls would do that go to different places during different seasons where it was popping. More money. So what's happening with the addiction?

Like, is it getting worse? Oh, yeah. There's periods of time where I get on like the methadone clinic. So at this point, you're kind of trying to get off? Or you realizing it's like, hey, this is an issue? I'm going in and added, like, treatment centers. And it's, so here I am working at this, like, kind of wild place in Providence where it's, like, all bets are off. Like, they don't care if you're sleeping with people in the champagne.

I mean, it's pretty much expected, you know, like, they don't really care what the hell you're doing. But I am so strong out, and I'm going into the bathroom and I'm, you know, doing what we do. And I'm getting caught all the time, and the house mom's, like, sending me home or putting me on week-long suspensions and all. like go to treatment and I'll come out. I'll be like, look, I completed treatment. She'll like let me work again. I'm like doing this thing like over and over again. And then finally I'm on the clinic for a little while. And and I wouldn't say things are better on the clinic. I'm not using. So I guess that's better. But, and I'm not like doing crime. But like I'm still, you know, handcuff to some like, you know, substance. And then I eventually like,

I meet a boyfriend, a boyfriend, and I end up, like, moving in with him and I stopped dancing, and I try to go back to college, and I'm, like, trying to do the thing. And I'm still in the clinic, and I kind of clean things up a little bit. And I moved to, like, out towards Boston. I'm in a relationship with this guy. Who is this guy? Was he, like, what does he do? Like, who's? Yeah, so he's, he was a cop, actually.

Yeah. Yeah. He was a cop. And he's like a really normal, nice guy. And he knows you have a problem. No, not really. Oh. No, he doesn't.

Because at this point, I'm not actually using any substances. I'm on the clinic. And so he doesn't know that at first. And then I tell him. And like, he doesn't really understand what that means. He's like, oh, well, you used to like, like, I tell him that I was doing pills or something like that. And he's like, well, you used to do it and you don't anymore, right? And like, cool.

You're good now. Like, you're good. Everything's all right, right? And I was like, yeah, for sure. And arguably, things were a lot better than they had been. But yeah, for like maybe a year, like, things are pretty chill. You know, he's, like, working. I'm on the clinic, which sucks.

So I'm, like, handcuffed to, like, where I am. So I can't really travel or anything. But things are okay. What does that mean? I understand. You're not using, but you're still on methadone? I'm on methadone, right? So I'm not, like, using listed stuff.

since I'm not going out in the streets and like buying. Does he know you're on methadone? He knows that, yeah. Okay. He knows him on that. So he's just, he's kind of hoping you'll wing off and you'll be good. Yeah, I actually end up doing that. Okay.

So I end up like weaning off slowly but surely, like after a year, I get off of it and we like go on vacation to like celebrate like my freedom, you know. And, and I'm off it for maybe a few months. And I start using it again. and he's working overnight's 11 to 7 in the morning, and I am, like, getting loaded. You know, I'm, like, going out and, like, being a weirdo in the middle of the night and, like, meeting, you know, dealers and just doing things I shouldn't do. And he's not hip to, like, game out of personal experience, but he is a cop.

Yeah. You know what I mean? So he's not totally, like, an idiot. And he's, like, knows something's going on, but he's not. quite sure what's going on and he's like wanting me to share my location of where I'm at. I was just thinking that. Like does he have your location on? Totally. He's like, yes, but this is again, I'm probably only 19 or 20 years old at this point. So this is like 13 years ago. So it wasn't like I had an Android. Do you know what I mean? It was like it wasn't as easy to just share,

but there were some apps, but there was also ways to kind of like fudge it. And so I'm like constantly kind of like manipulating, deleting my location history and like showing them other things, leaving my phone. And I'm just up to, I'm just always, always like kind of lying. And like, he'll catch me sometimes and just be like, why are you lying? And I'll convince him otherwise. But like, he is like not trusting me at all. And he knows I'm like up to something. Yeah, you can feel. You have intuition, right? Like, totally. He's like, what is going on? And he's like becoming like very insecure, honest, for good reason. For good reason, to be honest. And, like, he starts coming home. and I'll be like passed out at, you know, 6.37 in the morning.

He's, like, in uniform. And he'll, like, search the house, like, like, a cop would. Like, search the whole house. And he starts, like, finding, like, paraphernalia and stuff like that. And, like, I'm waking up with him in uniform, like, with stuff in his hand. And he's like, what is this? And I'm like. Could also be his job, too, right?

Like, I mean, if you got in trouble and he's with. Oh, it 100% is. I mean, it's more than just. It was many layers. It was one, like, he cared about me. like genuinely. Like he loved me and he cared about me and he could see that I was like not only lying to him, but like that like that I wasn't okay. Two, it was 100% his job, which he cared about in value. I mean, there was like a lot of layers of like why it was a problem, but he was

a normal guy. You know what I mean? He wasn't a, he didn't hit me. He wasn't like abusive. He wasn't a big drink or anything. He was like a very like normal, nice guy, honestly. And I just like could not like keep it together. And after like once or twice of him like catching me red-handed, he's like, you have to go to treatment. And I go to treatment, spend two weeks, he sticks it out, he's supportive. I come home. I start the same thing.

And he's like, you're out of here. Get out of my house. He's like, he changes his phone number. He changes all the locks. And like he's like, he completely like just cuts me off. He's like, I can't do this. Like, this is crazy. And in my wife's case, so she has.

had, she was on an ice conspiracy in Okachowby, which is at the big lake in the middle of Florida down there. Yeah. Yeah. I've heard of it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they, I always said, you know, like in Okachovie, they have, you know, they have dairy farms, you know, and they have, you know, ice. Do you know, they're saying? Like, that's like the two main industries. Yeah. And one of her co-defendants was actually a few of her co-defendants were dating officers, but this one was dating an officer, had a kid from the officer was dating it and when she eventually

gets busted because he was he knew and like there was a definite kind of overall conflict of interest and he knew what was going on knew you know had been that he not only got fired he lost his certificate

like he can never be an officer again and yeah so I mean it was dead she you know I boarding for flight 246 to Toronto is delayed 50 minutes. Ugh, what? Sounds like Ojo time.

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please go to conicsonterio.ca. She devastated this guy's life. Right. Yeah. And he didn't really, you know, like, what did he do wrong? Like, I never quite sure. I think it's just a matter of the sheriff just saying no. And all the sheriff really has to do is they have to kind of write a letter.

It doesn't take a lot for them to remove that certificate and say, yeah, I'm sorry. You're just not, you're not making a good decision. So I can definitely see him being, it's not just you. Like you said, it's you. He cares about you, but two, you're devastating your own life, but you're not taking me with you. Totally. Yeah. No, he was like enough is enough.

Like you and I are done for good. Like, I never want to see you again. Yeah. That's sad. It was sad. I mean, also understandable. I mean, he had to protect his peace, his livelihood. Yeah.

Yeah. His freedom. His career, all the things. Yeah. It was pretty devastating. But at the time, I was so young. I was like, oh, my God. My soulmate.

My life is over. You know what I mean? And I just went on like a tear for the next few years. Just like back in the strip club, doing the same. same thing, getting loaded, just the same, like, cycle. Possession charge here, you know, pulled over here, in and out of county jail. I'm just, like, getting in trouble, but relatively minor stuff, and I always get out of it because I can, like, show up, you know, and, like, look nice and put on, like, the, I'm a good girl type vibe. I was, like, highly manipulative.

Yeah. It's really what it comes down to. And then I meet, like, a boyfriend number two and another normal guy. That was like my M.O. I would like meet very nice normal guys. Like not drug dealers, not addicts. Right. Good job. Nice family. You know, stable, supportive, like nice guys. And then ruin it. And I would ruin it. Yeah, totally. I would ruin my life, their life, and like the whole thing. And I meet him and he, you know, works for like a financial, you know, company. He's in finance and he's relocated to Texas for work. And I have like a raging H habit. And he has no idea. He thinks something's up to with me, but he can't figure out what because I'm

like spending a lot of time in the bathroom, which is always like, why is she in the bathroom so much? But I think he thought I was doing blow because like that like made sense. He was from like Greenwich, Connecticut. So he's like, you know, he's like, yeah, yeah, but she's probably doing to blow. It's just like fine. You know what I mean? It's not a big deal. But I was not. I was, you know, like doing H, which I don't even think he had considered that as an option. And I'm like going in and out of the bathroom.

And he is like, hey, do you want to move to Texas with me? And at this point, I had a couple possession charges. I was on, I was failing drug test again. I was on, like, the sheriff's department, which is like drug court, you know, where you have to show up like three, four days. week and like test and and and and and I'm failing and failing and failing and in Massachusetts they're like relatively lax so I would fail and then I would eventually like check myself into detox again I'd be like look I you know completed a program they'd be like okay we'll give you another chance and

I do that a couple times and I know I'm pretty much out of like like chances on that front and so I like take off to Texas with this boyfriend and are you allowed to take off to Texas? No no no no I take off to Texas. I don't have a warm. I don't have a warm. aren't quite yet, but like any day. You know it's coming. Yeah, yeah, any day now. And I can't stay sober. I just can't do it, no matter how many times I'll go to the five, seven days spin dry in the detox facility. I get out and I do the same thing over and over again. Like, I cannot. And I'm convinced that it's Massachusetts is my problem. Like, if only I can get out of mass, I'll be all right.

And so I find this, like, nice guy. And I'm like, this is perfect. I'll, like, leave Massachusetts. I have, like, a nice normal guy, like, through osmosis, our lives, my life will get better. And things are pretty, I end up kicking out there. cold turkey, it sucks. And I like get it together for about eight months. And then I'm working, I'm bartending. We live in a nice place. We have like normal friends. I'm drinking a lot, but like it's not as bad as is using substances. And then I go back to Massachusetts to visit. And I'm only supposed to be there like five, six, seven days and go right back to Texas. So I go, I go to Massachusetts. I have a way.

warrant, but I'm like, it's all right. It'll be fine. You know, I haven't, I'm sober. And I end up relapsing. And I overdose. The cops come. They find, they charge me with the second possession charge. And I'm like 21 years old. And they're like sending me to prison for the first time. Because I have like multiple possession charges. I'm scounded from a warrant. Then I caught a new charge. How long do you go? How long are they sentenced you? I go for like a year, which. What did what the guy? What do you tell him? Well, I just disappear. I don't know.

She got on a plane. I haven't seen her since. Well, the craziest thing is that, so I took, like, a pill and some opiates, and I, I totally, like, I overdosed. I have absolutely no recollection, and I'm out of it for, like, two days. I literally wake up in prison, and I don't know where I am. And the crazy thing is, is it's not really the type of offense where you typically go to prison, state prison for. It's usually a county jail type deal, you know, possession charges.

But they were full. So I went to stay prison instead. So I'm in this, I'm in MCI Framingham. I'm like 20 or 21 years old. I have like fake eyelashes, you know, like the permanent fake eyelashes and like my hair's done, my nail's done. They're all calling me Barbie. You know what I mean? It's like, but I end up being there for about a year.

and the boyfriend is like, what the fuck happened? He's like, you're where? How? What? Like, what is going on with you? And he ends up like sticking, like, waiting for me for like a year. And I end up getting out and I get the second possession charge dropped. And I'm going to court.

I'm going to two different courthouses for the different charges. And I get out and I'm released to a treatment program. and then once I'm done with that, I leave and I end up continuing to get loaded in Massachusetts for a few months. I think I got out in August, and August, September, October, November. It got cold in Massachusetts, and I was like, I'm going back to Texas, and I, like, went back to Texas. And he was still the whole time he's with you. Yeah. Yeah.

And he takes you back. And you're still addicted, but now you're addicted in Texas. Are you detoxing in Texas? Yeah, I do. but then I start getting loaded in Texas, which is like the first time. Because before I really did clean up for eight months. I didn't know where to find it. I hadn't really sought it out.

But when I go back, I don't do that same thing. I start like, I start seeking it out. Like, where can I? Yeah, I was going to say, how do you seek it out? What do you? I mean. I wouldn't know where to go. You just, I mean, if you spot it, you got it.

You know what I mean? You know somebody who's like. A fisherman knows a fisherman? Totally. You're like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like game recognized game. Exactly. So there's that.

And I think I'm working in like the service industry. I'm bartending. I'm waitressing. And like there's one girl who like I can tell and I ask her and and and she's getting loaded. And so there's that. And then also like later down the road, I'm like traveling all over the country like in my active addiction. We'll talk about that at some point. But I just like Google like where's the worst part of town?

You know what I mean? Highest crime rate. And I go there. And you just ask someone. You know what I mean? It's really not that hard. Wow. Yeah. So I was going to like West Dallas.

So I was living in Dallas. I would go to West Dallas. There's like this area, this road called Singleton or Harry Hines Boulevard, which is like the track. So like I start going to these places and I, you know, just like, hey, do you know where to, you know, and they take you. So I start doing that. And like it's like progressing. It's getting worse. And I start using ice, which I had never used before.

And so I'm doing that. And I'm doing H. and so I'm like twacked out. I'm like disappearing for three, four days at a time. He's like, where the fuck are you? And I have like his car. And I'm just totally MIA. But I had this relationship with him where I was like pretty honest with him.

I would like lie on the front end. And then I would just like tell the truth. Right. With the previous boyfriend, the cop, like no. I was lying 100% of the time because he would lose his mind. But the second boyfriend, I would be like, listen, this is what I was doing. I'm really sorry. And he'd just be like,

I don't really know what to say to this. And so I would do that. And then eventually things progress to such a point where we like break up. And he's like, I'll give you a chance to get on your feet. But like, you got to leave. You know, I'm not going to put you out on the street. But like, you have to leave. This isn't working.

I care about you. It was really sad. And that's when I met Money Mike who became my pimp. Money Mike. Isn't that funny? Just like the movie Friday. I know people, Joe, I think that. is where he got the name, honestly.

I don't know. I don't think I asked him where he came up with it. But, yeah, he was, like, a full-fledged, like, pimp. He... So, so, wait a second. So this, so you get tossed from your house. So... Well, I'm still technically staying there.

Oh, okay. So, but he's saying you've got, you got a week or so to get, or a couple weeks, two, three weeks. You got to figure something out. You start moving out. Yeah. You start to figure this out. So we're living in the same house, and it's a very sad.

situation because like I really care about him and he really cares about me but he just sees this cycle and and he's been going through it at this point for a few years with me yeah um and you know I'm causing chaos in the house you know what I mean every time he leaves he has to like figure out who's going to be there whether I'm gonna if I leave with the car will I be gone for eight days our our gang members gonna steal the car again because I'm out smoking rocks you know I mean, it's just like, where there was so many, I got our car, I say, our, his car, two separate cars stolen on two different occasions. One time it was resold on offer up, and we actually ended up getting it back, but it had been like, like, chopped up and like, you know, the engine

and the battery, everything was sold off and like replaced by like really, you know, trash parts and like sold to some sad woman who had like a child and like, and it was found like on offer up. Another time, I was like in the hood. I let some dealer use my car. They stole it. Gave it to somebody else. And we ended up tracking it down and getting it back. But like, like, it was just like, and he was not living this life.

And he's like pulled into this, like dealing with the chaos of it. He's like, this is crazy, you know. And so we're living in this house. It's very sad. It's very depressing. I want to be out of the house as quickly as possible. Like, I really don't want to be there anymore. It's very uncomfortable.

Like, you can cut the air with a knife. It's like really uncomfortable. and I'm, you know, disappearing for days at a time, which at this point he's like, I don't care what you do, you just can't have my car. And don't bring anybody into this house. And I had been in county jail at a certain point. I think I got another DUI, Tarrant County Jail in Fort Worth, Texas, and I had met this girl while I was there. Maybe I was there for like three, four months or something. I don't know.

I just kept getting like little petty charges and like over and over again doing a little county jail. time here or whatever. So I get a DUI. I end up in Tarrant County Jail and I meet this girl. And like, we become friends in county jail. You know, we become buddies. And I end up getting out before her. And I was like, oh, put money on your books and, you know, I'll like call you. And I actually do. And her and I become friends. And she ends up getting out a little bit after me. And she's a tweaker and she she grew up in like a really really rough part of east four where it's like rough life you know what I mean mom is a tweaker no dad had a kid super young and um and I'm like down and out at some point I'm like in some trap house phones been stolen ID stolen you know

whatever chaos is going on in my life at that moment something like that's going on and I use somebody's phone and reach out to her on Facebook messenger and I'm like do you have somebody that could pick me up. And I'm in Dallas at this point. And she's like, yeah, let me hit up my boy, Taz. So she hits up her boy Taz, and Taz ends up picking me up, and he's with Money, Mike. And I think Taz was like trying to like, I think he was trying to like be on some like pimp, pimp shit, but he like, he wasn't a pimp.

But money Mike was. I didn't know this stuff. You have any idea how insane the sale. sounds right like it's this is nuts it is yeah it is insane it is insane and it's not like it's not like you haven't seen a better life like like like you like you know like it's not like like some people we interview or really let's face it i mean i was in prison for 13 years so i mean i'm i sat down for hours and talk to these guys and you talk to them and you you get to know them and then after you know 10 20 hours and really spending time with them you're kind of looking at me you're like

you've never you didn't have a fucking shot right like you've never had a totally shot like that's how it was I mean when I was in juvie and even county jail I would say like 80% of the girls is like that yeah they don't have a there's no chance there's no chance there you were never going to like I don't know what was going to change the outcome of what's happening right now it's like so sad yeah but you like you were dating a cop you were dating the finance and they're so tolerant and it's which is even shocking I know I mean and like in the idea that you're now in this situation and a in a you know I know it's crazy a shitty house with a bunch of drug addicts that have stolen all your stuff and you're reaching out to some tweaker chick you

met in county jail, yeah. I know. It's. Do you look back now and or do you still kind of say, no, it made sense. I can understand. Or do you think to yourself, do you look back now and go? Because I look back on my, I mentioned this the other day. I look back on me in my 20s and 30s and I think, what made you think that was a, that was the go-to move.

That that, and I'm thinking, what? But at the time, when I made the decision, it made sense at the time. Of course it's the only move. Of course that's what I'm going to do. No, I think even then, because I had, you know, some people, there was always at least, you know, one or two, like, people in my life who had sense that, like, weren't living the same life I was living. And they'd be like, I don't understand.

Right. Why did you do this? Why are you continuing to make this decision? It's like the second boyfriend would always say like, and, you know, like, I'm married now and it's been well over a decade and we're still like friends and he's, you know, in a relationship, happy, healthy, everything's good. And he's like, I always, like, knew that like you didn't want to be a piece of shit. He's like, I knew that you weren't like trying to hurt me, but like it's like you couldn't see past your own nose. Like you kept making these decisions and I just knew that you had more sense than that, but it just didn't make sense that you were in the same. cycle. And so he was like, that's why I never got mad at you because I knew you weren't a bad

person. You were just making these crazy decisions. And I really do believe that, like, in hindsight, my decisions were really driven by my like substance use disorder. I mean, it was like severe substance use. When I was younger, when I was a kid getting into trouble, I was almost trying to get in trouble. I think it was an attention seeking thing. It was like, you know, like being defined in class, like almost like attention see. stuff, like pay attention to me. And maybe that was like correlated to like not having my mom there and my dad not being as present as maybe. I don't know if it was subconsciously correlated to that. I think it probably was. But after juvenile detention and like doing some time as a kid, I was like getting trouble is not not that cool. I actually don't want to intentionally get in trouble. And and so after that, once I turned 18, like I was really trying genuinely to fly below the radar. Like I'm like, I'll do crime. I just don't,

I really don't want to get caught. Right. You know what I mean? It's actually not that, that cool to, like, outwardly be getting into trouble. And I just would fall short. I don't know,

over and over again. And I think I was just doing whatever I could to survive at the time. At this point, at this point. Yeah, yeah. At this point, I'm like, oh, I don't have a place to live in Dallas. I can't be in the relationship with this person.

I also don't, want to be sober. Now more than ever, right? Like now I have no nice house and a cushy place to sleep and the boyfriend. Now I'm in a shitty area and like I definitely don't want to be sober here. If you sleep hot at night, you know how disruptive that can be. When you're not resting well, everything else feels harder. Your focus, your mood, even your recovery.

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Upgrade your sleep with Ghostbed, the makers of the coolest bed in the world. Some exclusions apply. See site for details. So Taz and Money Mike. Yeah. They pick me up and I don't necessarily know that Money Mike is a pimp, like when he's coming to get me. I don't know right away.

And he doesn't give me the full story. I know now that he had just done 10 years. He had just gotten out that week. So he'd done 10 years for pimping and pandering. Is this a black guy? Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah.

But he didn't, he didn't, like, tell me what he was in there for. I knew he had just gotten out, but he was, he didn't, money, Mike had no money when we met, you know. But he had previously, for sure. But I think when he went into prison, he, like, lost everything. Of course. But I, like, catch on pretty quick. I'm not stupid. And I catch him pretty quick, like, what he's up to and, like, what his intentions are and what his plan is.

And I had never been in a situation like that specifically, but I had been doing some, like, sex work-type stuff in Providence, you know, when I was working, like, working as a stripper. It was not to this level, for sure. But at that point, like, it's not like I hadn't done something similar. Right. And the way that I was looking at it at the time is like, okay, like I need to get some money. I need to like get a house, get a car, like become self-sufficient. I can't do it like bartending because I can't support my habit and pay bills. Like I can't do it bartending.

I just can't manage both. So I'm like, how can I make a lot of money as quickly as possible? I had like very little self-respect at the time. I was just like willing to do whatever. And I was also like very, it was very like disassociated and like pretty far removed from like my own like experience. And so I was like, you know, I was willing to do whatever. And so I started to catch on as to like, you know, what he was and who he was and what he was up to. I knew.

And I was like, eh, I'll get something from him. He'll get something from me. Like, he can teach me the game, whatever, and then I'll take off and run with it. And so, you know, I start, I start prostituting. Yeah. What is that? Is he telling you, like, go to a hotel. I talked to somebody.

I needed to go to this hotel, room 101. Or is it like you're standing on 56 and Bush Boulevard? Yeah, yeah. So in when you're working the streets, not always, but at least in my experience in Texas, there were girls. At this time, I'm the only girl because he's fresh out. but later down the road there's more girls, you know, more hoes. And it really just depends on how the girl looks, how old are they, what's their race on where he puts them. Right.

So some of the ones that are a little bit more tore up are the ones, you know, like walking the track. And I'm – We just interviewed – we just interviewed a guy named Pimp and Ken. Okay. Pimp and Ken. He's a famous pimp. Okay. What did he say?

What did he say? Oh, he kind of gave us the game, kind of. His, whether this is true or not, I don't have any reason to just not believe him. But one of the things he basically was doing was he was going, getting girls. And then they were going to strip clubs. And he was working deals out with the strip clubs to get the guys to run up bills. And then they would get a piece of the bill or get them to, you know, swipe their card and get money to pay it that way. Take them to the casino.

Take them to the casino, cash out money. I mean, it was insane. And string them along. String them along with the intention of sex. He made it sound like, yeah, but they never really have sex. You may seem more like a long-term kind of a scam. But there's probably some of that, right? There was definitely all of that.

He didn't have any deals with the strip club, but we would go into the clubs and come back and like give him, you know, some of what we would make, all of what we would make, really. But I was not on the track. it was primarily backpage at that time. So we would have like an outcall, which is like a hotel room, right? And at the time it was really like, I don't even think back page exists anymore. I remember the time when it went down. And he was like, oh my God, what am I going to do? Because it was really like you would post, let's say, at six in the morning.

That's like a really good time to post 5.30 a.m. 6. And as soon as you would post, the calls would start coming one to two minutes later. Hundreds of calls. Like hundreds of calls right away. I remember this is like, again, like 13 years ago, probably more than that. You could only post ads using Ethereum or Bitcoin. And at the time, like I didn't have a bank account. So like we would have to go to like a Bitcoin.

ATM, like put cash in, get the code, put the, like, the code for the wallet into the, into back page and then post on back. It was just, it was crazy. But we would get hundreds of calls. I mean, I wouldn't see hundreds of people each day, but it was like people would come in for the five or ten minute visits, but on their way to work, like construction workers and stuff. It was crazy.

And then there were some girls who would, like, walk the track, especially after. back page went down, but it was a little bit more dangerous, like on the track, and honestly, less money a lot of the time. Like, Backpage was so good as far as, like, money goes. And then after you do that for long enough, eventually there's people that you'll see who are, what did they call them? Not Johns. They would call them hobbyists. That was like the internet, that like underground term for a trick, right? Right. The hobby, that's what it's called.

And the hobbyists were not just like a guy who, you know, once a year has a little fun with a prostitute. No, like guys, where it is their hobby, this is like what they do for fun. They either see girls very regularly and many different girls or go to different cities and travel and like always, you know, in hindsight they were probably sex addicts, you know what I mean? Right. They had a problem.

And so once you see one of these guys who's like very enmeshed in this, like underworld, right? If they see you and review you on, there's these other websites that you can't just sign up for, you can't just, you know, sign up like you can for Backpage. It's invite only. So you have to have either an invitation from somebody who's already, you know, on the site or they have to review you.

So if a hobbyist who's on this site who's been verified and they've verify him because they'll like take a picture of his face. They'll have you take a selfie and you'll like at the time or you would have to like write a piece of paper with the date. This is like before AI, you know, it was easy to just edit these things out. And then they would send a picture of their ID, the hobbyist would. And then they would, you know, use their debit card. All of the things had to match. You know, the face had to match with the selfie, with the date and with the credit card. Now, I don't know this guy's real name, but the site moderators would be able to verify, okay, this guy is who he says he is. He's paying for the service. And then at that point, once he

reviews you, you can use that review as an opportunity to start posting on these sites. These sites are a lot better than Backpage because Backpage is open to the public, right? So like anybody can call and it could be cops. It could be like violent guys. It's very hard to like verify who you're going to see to keep yourself safe. And I didn't know how to post. I didn't know how to like do any of these things. And so like Money Mike is the, one who kind of like put me on game on how all these things, what to look for, what to say, what not to say, you know, all these other like alternative sites that aren't like well known to people. And so I end up getting a review eventually from one of these sites. And essentially

the review says, you know, like, she had a decent alcohol. She looks how she says she was. She did what she said she was going to do and she didn't rob me. Right. Which once you do that, you'll have to burn your whole name and identity and you'll have to start all over again. It's actually not a good look. if you're like a hoe and you have a pimp to like rub tricks, it's not good at all. Yeah. Yeah. So not a lot of repit-peak customers. Totally, exactly.

So what are you, real quick, like, what are you charging? In the beginning? Probably not very much. At the time, maybe, like, for, like, a quick visit, it was, like, maybe 75 or 100 bucks or something like that. But, again, it depends on the girl. Right. Once you're on this site, what are the-

That's when I start making it? a lot more money. Oh, okay. So once you're on these, once you get on one site and you get that one review, and then you're verified and they finally let you in. Do other people start reviewing also? Did they connect to that? And there's like six or eight or ten?

Mm-hmm. Okay. Yep. And some of these hobbyists are like well known in these communities. You know what I mean? Like a whole underworld. So if they review a girl, like their review is seen as being like, you know, very like valuable, right?

And once you get on one of these review sites, you can get on the other ones, too. And you can use your verification from that initial site to get on these other ones. So you're in a way better spot as far as you're not concerned about showing up and it's a police officer now. A lot less likely. Right. Like 90% less sketchy. I wouldn't say 100%. But, yeah, a lot less likely.

And also, when you're on these sites. sites, it also gives you an opportunity to talk to other girls. They call them providers. A verified provider is somebody who's like been reviewed and verified and like all of that stuff. So when you're talking to other verified providers, you can share information on like certain people to avoid. Oh, anybody who's calling from this phone number or emailing from this, don't see them. You know, they won't visit you or they're a time wasteer or, you know, I had a really weird call with this guy from this phone number. I think he might be law enforcement, that kind of thing. So you're like suddenly like communicating and there's ways to also like verify some of the guys that you're going to see.

And the other side of it, too, is some of the guys who are reaching out to see you, they're willing to pay a lot more money because they know what they're getting. And they're also willing to give you more personal information. So you can make sure that they are who they say you are to keep yourself safe. Right. Whereas on back page, they're like pretty unwilling to give you most information. So I'm in a much better spot now for sure, but nonetheless still, you know, doing sex work. Right. How long does this go on?

Two, with Money Mike. Yeah, I guess because I'm assuming Money Mike is with, is the whole time, no? No. Oh, okay. So Money Mike, once you get on the site, do you? No, I'm saying with him. Are you connected with him on the site? No, having a pimp when you're a provider is not a good thing.

So you don't want people to know that. Okay. Yeah, typically. Even when they do inherently, like you just, they pretend like they don't. You know, they don't want to know that. They really don't. So they don't want you to be under management, right? Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I am still with him. You know, we have like a really nice loft in Dallas. There's other girls now. We're all like living in this house. I'm making pretty good money. I also have like a, a bunch of regulars. So I'm not seeing, like, as many people. It's, like, very regular people. And some of it, there isn't any, like, sex involved.

It's really, like, at this point, I have people who have seen me enough who, like, will pay me to go on a trip with them. Right. know how to stay safe. He's not like following me as closely. Like he, if he knows I'm going to see a certain person at a certain time, like he already knows that person. He knows where I'm going. He knows that, you know, I've been seeing them for a year and a half, you know, every week. And he trusts me now, like, I'm more reliable. Like, he trusts me to, like, give him money. He's, like, letting me keep a little bit of money, which is, like, not typical. And none of the other girls at that time at least were doing that. And so I start like, I start getting like resentful

because I'm like, I'm making a lot of money. I'm working really hard. And like he's not really having to like motivate me to like go hustle and like all these other. What is he doing? So what's he doing for the money other than? At this point, nothing. Right. That's the point. Like at this point, I cannot see the value in this thing. I'm like, I make enough money now. Like I'm already verified. I make enough money now where I could pay my own bills. Especially if I got rid of him. Yeah. And also, like, he wouldn't, like, let me get a car.

And I was, like, one of my, like, 10 years old, like, this is – because he wanted to keep control is, like, really what it was. And the biggest thing is these other girls were not, like, they were not working like I was working. And so I felt like I was, like feeding the whole family because I was. And I was also, again, still like, I talk about this like very matter-of-factly and like I don't It's it feels like another life a little bit. You know what I mean? It really does and I know how crazy it is And how fucked up it is. I'm not discounting that, but it's just like what my reality was at the time. So I guess I talk about it in that way because that's It just is what it is. It's not how I live today, but like it was just like very much an alternate universe and I was very like deeply enveloped and like the experience that I was having at that time.

Like, this was my life. This was, like, the culture. Like, this is, I was, like, also kind of, like, brainwashed, you know, which is just kind of what goes with, like, you know, Pimp, you know what I mean? It, like, starts with, like, you know, like, being really sweet and nice. And then it's, like, a control thing. And then by the time, like, you know, you're, like, so deeply involved.

Like, he had my ID, my birth certificate, my Social Security number. Like, he had the, my phone was connect. It was on his phone plan. The apartment was, like, you know, like under his, his name, like everything was his, the car. Like, I had really, truly in the, in the grand scheme of things, nothing. But I was able to, like, open a secret, like, prepaid bank account. And I started, like, taking some of the money, he would let me keep him putting it in that account.

And I was, like, making a plan to leave. And I knew he was, like, not going to let me leave. So one night, I, he was out with a couple fresh turnout. So a couple girls that, you know, were like kind of like new. He was, you know, like taking them on calls and all this stuff. And they had just like posted an ad. So they would like go have a drink, post an ad. And then like the phones would just start ringing.

And like whenever they would get like a guy who was like serious, gave an address, was able to provide some kind of verification, he would like take off and take one girl there. And then if there was another one that was close by, he would take her there. And they would come, you know, he was running around. And I told him, I had, like, a regular. And we never were really allowed to have people at the house, at our own house. We would always, like, have a hotel room or something.

But this guy had been seeing for a long time. He almost became, like, a sugar daddy, right? Like, he, like, bought all the furniture and the house and, like, that kind of thing. And so I'm like, hey, don't come back to the house. Don't, like, because the Muslims here. That's what we call them. because he was Muslim. And he said, okay, no problem because he like knows this dude.

And was he there? Yeah, he was there. Oh, okay. I thought you were just trying to keep him from coming back. Well, I was trying to keep him from coming back. So the Muslim knew about Money Mike. He knew about the pimp. He knew, like, all the things that were going on.

And he was like kind of like one of those like to be treated like shit and told what to do type of guy. You know what I mean? And so he was there, and I also had another regular there. And, you know, I just, these are my friends, you know, and I pack up all my shit. And I bought, I or one of my tricks had bought pretty much everything in the house. Like, everything was mine. That was 80% of it, like the bed, the couch, like the silverware, everything, right? I didn't take everything

I didn't take the bed or anything because I looked at it like this when I was leaving at the time yeah I was I had a pimp he definitely was controlling and like using me for money

and like I was but in a sense when I got into it I was also like using him and like he was not great but it could be a lot worse Right. You know, he wasn't, like, beating me or, like, raping me or anything like that.

You know what I mean? So I'm, like, I really don't want to be in this anymore with him or these girls. But I also, like, I don't want to, like, totally fuck them over either. I, like, left the bed and I left some of the stuff. But I, like, took all my shit and the Muslim and that other client helped me move everything out. And one of them had gotten a U-Haul, and we, like, packed everything up in, like, two, three hours, like, just threw it. went into this into this U-Haul truck and I like took off. So you already had rented an apartment?

No. So I had a hotel room already rented. I pretty much had one all the time. And there's like certain hotels where they kind of like know what you're up to and like they don't give a shit. And so I already had a hotel room rented. I didn't have an ID or any of that stuff for like a regular debit card or credit card. I only had that prepaid card.

It didn't work at a lot of places. Right. But I already had this hotel room, and so I was just paying cash every day for this hotel room. But the problem with that is he knew where the hotel room was. And so, like, I got a new phone, and I was able to get into all my accounts and change my passwords before he even knew I was gone. And I was, like, staying at this hotel. And he would, like, drive by, check on me, but he, like, couldn't get into the room, you know? All your stuff's in a U-Haul.

Are you paying for the U-Haul? No, I had one of those two guys. Yeah, let me store all their stuff in the garage. Okay. Yeah, one of the two guys. So I had all that stuff there, and my plan was just to, like, come up, like, stack my chips, make some money. And I'm making a lot of money at this point. I'm making hundreds of dollars an hour, you know.

So what is this, like, a week? What are you making a week or a month? I mean. Five grand? Probably more than that. Definitely more than that. Eight or not? I would get $500 to $600 for two hours.

Right, but you're not working eight hours a day. No, I would see one or two people. Okay. Or sometimes I would just see one person for 12 or 24 hours, and I wouldn't do anything for the next, like, two, three days. So I was probably making, like, I don't know, eight, seven, eight thousand. I had a raging drug habit, though. Right. So I was probably spending like half of that on drugs.

But I made a lot of money pretty quickly. And within a month of being in that hotel room, I was able to like buy a car cash. So I bought like, I think it was like $16, $17,000 car. Right. And then I maybe like two to three weeks after that I like moved into my own apartment. Okay. So within a month, you're kind of. Month and a half, yeah.

Month and a half, you're kind of straight. Yeah, I was wearing a strip club at the same time as well, but he, Money Mike, had like called and pretended to be a patron. Got your fires. Yeah. Totally. I mean, yeah, he totally did. He was just, he was, he was like having people pose as tricks and trying to reach out to me. Like, he was like definitely trying to like make sure I failed.

It was like, I was a renegade, right? I was like a girl who went off and is like actually being successful without him, which like isn't good for. for business for him, especially when the other girls see, you know. He's flagging my ads, all that stuff. He, like, called and said, oh, this girl, you know, so-and-so robbed me at the club, which I was, I mean, he taught me never to, like, rob tricks in it also. I knew it wasn't good for business, so I never did that. So I was like, it was him. Yeah, yeah, he's trying to, he's trying to set you up for failure, so you come back with your tail between your legs and say, yeah, exactly. Can I come back? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I didn't do that, though.

Right. And so I'm just doing it on my own, and I'm making even more money now because I'm, like, traveling all over because I don't have him, like, controlling my movement. And so I'm, like, going to California and I'm going to Houston. I'm going to Austin. I'm coming to Florida. I'm, like, all over the country, Boston, New York. And when you travel, you make even more money. It's just like you're, like, a hot commodity, limited time only.

Crazy. And, yeah, so. How long does this go on? probably about two or three years. I'm all over the place. Two or three years. I mean, well, I was going to say you should have stacked up some money, but you've got a drug habit. Yeah, I mean, I did have money, but I didn't have it in normal places.

I had like cash and like Bitcoin when it was like, 14. But it was like I had like the actual wallet where you needed the coat, you know, like, you know how it'll have like 15 different words. And so like all of it's gone. There's probably a lot of money in a Bitcoin account someplace that I don't even know how to access, right? Because I'm like, yeah, I'm on drugs. I'm all over the place. But eventually I end up coming to Los Angeles. And financially I am doing pretty. well. I'm pretty comfortable. And I come to Los Angeles. I come to visit. And I come to see actually like a trick, honestly, for a couple weeks. And he like puts me up someplace. And he's like paying me really well. He's like an ex-NFL player. And I had met him in Texas. And I'm supposed to only be with him for a week. And I decided to extend and stay two weeks and like stay for the other week on my own and I brought in a bunch of like ice and H with me, you know, and I run out because I end up extending the trip. And I have just like a really like insane habit at this point because I'm

making so much money. And the more money I make the buyer my habit gets because I can sustain it. And it's so easy for me to just, you know, I can, in two hours, make my rent, you know what I mean? Right. Or even if I can't, sometimes there's guys that I can just call and they'll pay it. You know, it's like, and I just have a really insane, you know, substance use habit. And so I end up staying for another week. And what ends up happening is I'm in, do you remember when they had the shared Ubers?

Do you know, like you could order an Uber and it would be like a shared ride, like with another person? Can't you still do that? I don't know. Maybe. I know they ended it during COVID, but maybe they started again. I don't take Uber's that off anymore. I always see one like it's a share ride or something. It's like I'm almost positive. You can still do it. I never do it because I think I don't want to share an Uber with somebody. Right. Well, I did that when I was in L.A. and I had a phone and my phone, the case was the wallet, you know, so I had like my ID and my debit card and credit cards in it. Yeah, on the back of it. Yeah. And whoever was in the car took it. I mean, they, they, they still. stole my phone. And so they stole my wallet. Yeah, never take a share to write again. And I was supposed to leave like the next day. It was around Christmas time. It was like right before Christmas

and I was supposed to play straight from L.A. to New England to see my family. And I lose my ID, lose the debit card, lose the credit card, lose the phone. I can't even post ads because I can't answer calls because I don't have a phone. And the only way to get into my email is through my phone number. It can't be another phone number. And I can't get a new debit card delivered to me because they'll only deliver it to my home address, which is in Dallas, right? So I can't go to the bank because I don't have an ID. So I'm like in this situation where I like can't get money and I can't even get a hotel room, right? And I don't really know anybody in L.A. I have some family in Los Angeles, but I'm definitely not going to call them because they didn't even know I was there and like what I was doing. So I'm

not calling them. And I need I need to get substances. You know, I'm starting to not feel so good. And so just like in any city, like if you're looking at cop, where do you go? I go to Skid Row. That's the obvious choice if you're looking for to get high. And I go to Skid Row and I meet this this guy, Martine, who speaks like no English. And this was maybe two days before I had lost my wallet. He gets me some drugs. Everything's good to go.

He's in this like trap house motel called the Hollywood Indelx. And when I lose my wallet two days later and I'm stuck, I don't know where else to go except to Martins who speaks no English. And I like knock on the door at two in the morning. and he's like, what are you doing here? And I was like, I'm stuck. I stay here. And he's like, doesn't really say anything because he can't speak that much English.

And he just like lets me in. And I end up staying there for like a month. And he wasn't creepy at all. He like didn't want anything from me. He was like really nice. Turns out he spoke more English than he initially, you know, let on. But I end up like staying there for a month, like getting my money up and like figuring out. And my plan is always to go back to Dallas.

I have an apartment in Dallas. And I just kind of get, like, wrapped into, like, the streets in L.A. And I'm in, like, MacArthur Park and Skid Row. And you mentioned that you've been to Skid Row. But MacArthur Park is, like, an area right next to Skid Row in downtown L.A. It's, like, mostly, like, gang, homeless. It's an extension of Skid Row. And that's where I'm staying with Martin.

And I end up kind of being introduced to these, like, gang member guys. And I kind of get involved with them. I'm, like, hanging out with one of them, copying drugs, spending time with them, just, you know, doing weird crime stuff. They're stealing cars. They're, like, they, like, had certain blocks and they would go from tent to tent to, like, you know, like, collect their, like, tat. It was like all kinds of weird stuff. And then the crash unit, the gang units following us, and I'm doing ice, and I'm becoming more and more paranoid. And with my paranoia, it's like oftentimes is grounded in some form of reality, but then it gets to a place where it's like way more grandiose.

And I take off to Vegas because things are getting too crazy. And I'm like paranoid that like the cops are coming, which I think they were. They were coming. I mean, they were literally, they were all out on bail. And then they would get arrested with guns and drugs. and then they would just let them out again as long as they continue to make their court dates. They would let them rebond and rebond and rebound and rebound.

What year is this? Nine years ago. Okay. In 2017. And I end up going to Vegas to like get away from them because I'm like kind of having like psychotic breaks and one of them ends up going to prison for life. And then the other one is still out when I come back.

And I had met some guys also gang members. but not quite as chaotic as these dudes, who were, you know, crossing drugs over the border and people. And I had met them because I would go get H. And at this point, it was like, whatever, opiates, at this corner on Skid Row, like a tent, right? Nothing fancy. But I was coming with a decent amount of money because I was making a lot of money at the time. And so I was getting like more than they hold at a corner in a tent in Skid Row. You know what I mean? And I was consistently

like going back and picking up on a consistent basis. So it got to a point like they knew me. They know what I want. And they would have to oftentimes go and get the, the, the quantity that I wanted and come back. And so that happened for long enough that at a certain point, whoever they were getting it from was like, just bring her straight to me. Right. And I end up going to this like loft apartment in downtown L.A. It's like on the top floor of this like skyscraper eventually. And I meet this, this guy. And I start just, getting it directly from him and he's involved in like counterfeiting uh again like transporting over the border he's like working with you know um the cartel like um he's selling like very large quantities

of drugs um and i'm just i'm consistently picking up from him and i'm just doing it for myself but i'm getting a lot because i have a big habit and it just didn't make it. sense to me to go back and forth every single day. So I would get like a week's worth for myself or like two weeks worth. And then I start picking up more because he's giving it to me at such a cheap price. I would pick it up for like three or four other people that were selling it themselves. So again, I'm kind of like middle manning. But I'm making so much money at the time as a sex worker and the risk was so much lower that my goal was not really to be like a drug dealer. Like I didn't want to be a drug dealer because like the risk versus reward financially was just not there.

I'm like the risk is higher and the reward is like lower. I think I'll like I'll just do it a little bit, right? I'll pay for my own shit and distribute to other people, which makes you, yeah, a drug dealer. Right, totally. Whether you make any money or not. In my mind, even if you lost money on the deal. Totally. The cops would be like, yeah.

Well, I was making money for sure, but not like a lot. It wasn't like my main goal, right? It was like almost like a side thing. And so I'm doing this and like, you know, I'm like this white girl around like a bunch of like serenio Mexicans. And like I'm coming and I'm very consistent. Again, I'm consistent. I come. I get, I have the money.

I leave. Nothing weird happens. And so I start to get to know some of these guys. The like main guy, he doesn't use any drugs. He is like a, for sure like a gang member. But like has kids is like kind of like. It's like he has a whole operation going. And I, and I, they, they ask me if I'd be interested in transporting drugs over the border.

And I'm like, no. No. No. Yeah, I tell them no. I'm like, nah. First offense, I'll get at least 10 years, right? Yeah, 80% of my time. I'm like, eh, no, I don't want to do it.

Because honestly, I also was like, how much money is this worth? And like to just cross, it's not worth that much money. It's like, depending on what you're crossing, you're likely going to be making like $500 a kilo. Yeah. And so the only way that you're making a lot of money is if you're crossing a lot of kilos. Yeah.

And if you're crossing a lot of kilos, the likelihoodness of you getting caught is like infinitely higher. And even still like the money's like not that great. Right. Do you know what I'm saying? I was making good money. I didn't make. Yeah.

10 keys, I'm making 5 grand? Like, that's nothing. What are you talking about? Totally. I was making more than that. The risk was a lot lower for me. So I'm like, no, I'm good. And they kind of keep asking me like, come on, you know, you should do it.

I'm like, I'm good. And then maybe a month or two later, they're like, what about people? And I was like, well, how much money? That was like my first question. Because at this time, there were periods of time in the past where I had like tried to get sober and like get my life together like attempts obviously failed attempts but um at this point for that like five year period between like money mike and and to now um at 24 25 years old um there was no attempts at sobriety i had like kind of given myself into like this is like the life

that i'm going to live i'm probably going to die young and i'm going to die this way and that's fine um and so it was like always kind of like more like more money more drugs or like more chaos like to almost feel something it was almost like i had like gotten to a place of being like numb to all the chaos, you know what I mean? If you can believe, like, the life I was living had gotten, like, almost, like, mundane in certain ways to me. And so I'm like, all right, I might be, like, willing to do that. Gang members are not always honest about things. So they're like, oh, it's no big deal.

Like, if they catch you, they'll just, like, cite you out and, like, let you go because it's the first offense. Now, I, I, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm like, all right, I'd be willing to do that. And the truth is, at least in Los Angeles, like, or California, which is like a border to Mexico, for a long time, they did do that. Okay. So if you talk to, like, some of the OG gangsters who were, like, involved in all this, like, 20, 30 years ago, a lot of the time your first defense, they would just be like, if they couldn't tie you to, like, a bigger indictment, they'd just be like, all right, get the fuck out of here. Don't let it happen again. And then if it happens again, you'll go in.

But it's not like that today. And I also like, I didn't consider the political climate, right? I wasn't exactly in touch with like, you know, current events. But they told me that like, oh, they'll probably just let you out. And like, worst case scenario, you'd maybe do a year and a day. And I'm like, okay, fine. And it was also more money than drugs. It was worth a lot more money.

Right. So. Well, how is that working? Like, what do you mean people? Like illegal immigrants. No, I, thank you. Yeah. No, I know.

But I'm saying, like, are we talking about, like, two people and we're just driving and nobody, like, hey, we're all together, we're just friends. Like, we, oh, yeah. Or is it like they're hidden in a vehicle or something? They're hidden. Yeah, yeah. Oh, really? Yeah. So sometimes it was just two or three, but the time I got caught, there was four.

But you don't want them to be in sight. Right. You 100% will get caught if they're in sight, which is probably, it's the reason I got caught for sure, because I had one in the passenger seat because I couldn't fit them all in my trunk on the last run that I did. So, so I end up going to, so I'm going down to San Diego. And it was like a two-for for me. I can always make money when I'm in a new city. So I would go down and I would do what I was doing, you know, as far as like escorting stuff. and I would go down with this like this other guy who's involved with all these you know gang member dudes

and him and I would drive down stay in a hotel room he knew the people on the other side of the border they would come and like meet us and and and they would give me like they would essentially tell me the morning of like what route I was taking right so they would like be like okay you're going to go here you're going to go here you're going to go here um there were a few times where I use their car, but it's always a bad idea to use their car. So the guy I was with, who I was like, homies with, he's like, don't use their car again. Because a lot of time they'll put, like, drugs in there and they won't tell you. You know what I mean?

Like, you never really know what you're, like crossing. He's like, use your car because he had, he had, you know, done all this before. And so I'm using my car and I have like Mercedes at the time. And I don't know if they had like a tracker on me or like on the car. They could have. I have no idea. Not that I was aware of, though. But when I would see them, like, before a run, because I would usually go down for about a week and I would do, like, three, four, five runs.

And then I would, like, go back up to L.A. for three weeks. And then I would, like, come down again. And I would do, you know, three, four, five, six runs. And then I would go, you know, I would do it, like, every, like, two to three weeks. And I would have, like, a Bluetooth headphone in my ear. And they would tell me the root the morning of. and then they would guide me, like, in my ear. You don't want the phone up to your head because it's just a red flag, right?

Well, one, how much, how much were you getting paid? Yeah. So if I just brought them from the pickup point to, like, like, an address or a stash house, it was, like, $2,500. Per person? Yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah.

So $7,500 for three people. Yeah. And then, and I would do like, you know, four or five runs. If it was, if I, if I brought them to my hotel, because usually you'd bring them to your hotel, sometimes you would. They would, like, shower, you get food, water. You know what I mean? Like, they, like, traveled through the desert and hid in a bush for God knows how long,

and then you would sometimes take them to Los Angeles. And when you take them to Los Angeles, you would meet their family members and, like, do the money exchange. Because they don't pay until they're across the border. Because they get caught all the time. So if I did the exchange, then it was like $5,500. So it was a lot more money, but it was also a lot more risk because they didn't necessarily want to pay.

The family always was like they were going to pay. But sometimes the individuals themselves would try and run off. But they didn't have a phone that even worked in the United States. They weren't like really getting far. You kind of had to, like, sit on them. So, but I was usually with that other person anyways. I wasn't, like, by myself entirely. I would do the run by myself.

Right. But he was, like, always at the hotel. So I would have them in my ear and they'd be, like, guiding me. They'd be like, okay, where are you now? You know, take this right, take this left, take this right, take this left. Do you see anything? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then I would get to a point where I would be, like, at a bush or something on a dirt road.

in the middle of nowhere. And they'd be like, okay, are you on this road? In 300 feet, you're going to see a tree on the left side. When you see that tree, you're probably going to lose service. And when you lose service, like, take a right and then slow down. And then, like, the service area would drop, like, the cell service. They, like, knew where I was. And I would, like, slow down.

And then, like, a couple of legal immigrants would come out of a boat. bush with blankets on their feet. Slow down, pop your trunk. Drive it five miles an hour. And Juan and Pablo are going to jump in the back. 100%. Yeah. And they would jump in the – well, sometimes they would try to get in the passenger seat.

And you'd be like, no, no, no. And so you'd put them in the trunk always. Just to get through secondary. And then you would put them in the car, you know. But yeah, they would always have blankets on their feet because – so they would – and they always smelled like onions, too. They would, like, come through Mexico and onion trucks a lot of the time. Okay.

So, like, when they were getting to the actual border, they'd come through on onion trucks. And then I think they would use the blankets at night when it was cold. And then when they were closer to the border, I think they would put blankets on their feet for tracks. Because they were walking. For tracks? I have no idea. They would always have blankets on their feet. They don't have shoes?

They would have shoes and then blankets on top of the shoes tied to their feet. Maybe to not leave tracks. To not leave tracks. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Sorry if I hadn't explained that while I was like, yeah, I think that's the reason.

I mean, none of them really spoke English, and I speak like very little Spanish. So, like, we weren't, like, talking much. But, yeah, they would come. They would have the blankets on your feet, so you would want them to take the blankets off, like ASAP. Yeah. Because it's red flag. Yeah. And you would, you know, put them in the trunk and then you would turn around.

And the people who are in Mexico somewhere, you know, they're like calling, calling, calling to see when the service is picking back up. So they'll be, from the moment the cell service chops, they're calling over and over again to see when it picks back up. Because when it picks back up, they know, like, they know where you're at. I also am pretty sure that, like, they had, like, people at the border, both on the Mexican side and the United States side, like, in, like, ranching houses or something. Right, watching. Yeah, for sure. because they like, they always knew exactly where I was. Yeah.

So it was like tracker or like, they, they always knew where I was and I don't really know how, but they definitely did. And so they would be calling, calling, calling, calling. And then as soon as service picks back up, they know exactly where you are. And so they're like, okay, do you see anything? How many people are there?

What's going on? Be chill. You know what I mean? And like, don't talk to me. Like, listen to me, but don't talk. And then I would just, drive through secondary and then they would usually just wave me through. Yeah. They didn't even stop me like, because I wasn't crossing the actual border. I was going to like the border.

Yeah. You'd already cross the border. I wouldn't cross it. No. Oh, you're just picking them up on this side and driving them through secondary so that you can, to now you're in the, now you're just free free range. You can just go anywhere. Right, right. So like there's somebody else that brings them all the way to the Mexican-American border. And then, like, I'm on the United States side, and I pick them up. I'll pick them up, like, right at the border. Okay. Yeah.

So I didn't have to go through, like, customs because I hadn't crossed. So it would just be, like, a checkpoint. And... How many times did you do this before you got caught? I don't know. A lot. I don't even know how many. I was probably doing it for, like, less than a year.

Okay. more than six months. So like somewhere in between there. And yeah, I would just make a bunch of money, you know, cash money. And then I would like go back to L.A. And it was like pretty easy. It got to a point where it was like they were just like waving me through. They wouldn't even push me to secondary and look at my ID.

They would just like see me, see my car, wave me through. But I was usually picking up like two people. I was like the average number, sometimes three, but usually two. and I would just do multiple runs. Usually I would take two or three people and they would start calling me over and over again. And then as soon as the service would pick up, they would know where I was at. And so they'd be like listening in my ear. The last time that I did a run, I was greedy.

I showed up at the little bush, whatever bush or, you know. wherever I was because it was always different every time. And they wouldn't tell me until the morning of, like, where I was going. And four people ran out. And I'm in, like, I don't even remember what kind of Mercedes, but it was like an older one. And it's like not a big car. It's a sedan. And I put three of the immigrants, the aliens, in the trunk.

And I looked at all of them, and one of them in my mind. my like delusional drug addicted mind, looked less like a pie. Do you know what a Pisa is? Yeah, yeah. Okay, less like a Pisa, you know, like a, you know, a Mexican from Mexico. Yeah. Then the other three, you know, he was like younger.

He was probably like 19, 20 years old. He definitely looked like very Mexican. But in my mind, he looked less Mexican than the other ones. But she also had such good luck. I had gone super, yeah, super cocky. And also, like, the people that I was, like, running for, they were, like, hyping me up. They're like, you're good. Like, you're a goal.

Like, you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah. Like, you're, like, all-star, right? And I'm like, yeah, I'm a delusional, drug-addicted all-star for smuggling immigrants. But I will say, too, like, driving the Mercedes. At the time, I had, like, blonde hair. And, like, even on drugs because my, like, main job was being, like, a high-end escort at this time. Like, I always, like, was, like, dressed well, you know.

You don't look anything like the people that are, they expect. Exactly. So you said, Pedro, get in here. Exactly. I didn't get actually the one in the passage. See, his name was Jorge. I did ask his name. And I'm like, okay, you know, get in the front seat.

And I had, like, you know, sunglasses. And I gave him a pair of sunglasses. And I had an ice coffee because it was, like, six in the morning. It was Friday the 13th, I remember. And I gave him my ice coffee. And then I gave him, I was like smoking cigarettes still at that time, like my Newport 100 and I like gave him a cigarette because like in my mind this made him look more American. Cigarette sunglasses in a nice coffee, which arguably probably did a little bit.

And as soon as it picks up, right, I'm, they call me and they're like, where are you? You know, how many do you have what's going on? And I tell them and they're like, just drop them off. He's like, the people in Mexico are like, just drop, like, at least one off. Like, we'll get them on the next run because they're doing runs, you know, 24-7 all the time. And I'm like, no, it's all good because it's my last run for that week. I want to make more money, you know, and I've just gotten greedy. And I've already, like, done a couple runs this week.

I have a bunch of cash at the hotel room. And another thing that they would always tell you is do not bring any. anything with you. Don't bring a joint. Don't bring any pot. Don't bring any blood. Don't bring anything with you. Like, do it before and do it after. Like, they do not get high before you go on these trips. They would just, they didn't want you using any substances or having any on you. And I didn't listen to that ever. And I never had. I always had something on me because I was, you know, I couldn't go five minutes without getting loaded. So, like, I would be like on the, drive there, you know, to, you know, the border on the highway, you know, driving with my knees,

smoking Newport, you know, hitting, you know, pieces off the foil, you know, I was always still doing it because I don't listen. And they're like, just drop them off. And I was like, no, no, no, it's good. And they're like, all right, listen, it's on you. Like, maybe you'll get through. You're an all star. You know what I mean? Like, all right, fine. And so I take all four and I'm coming up to secondary and I still have them in my ear on Bluetooth. And even the kid in the passenger seat, Jorge, was like, he doesn't want to get caught. He wants to get across. He's like, no, no, no, I'll get out. And I'm like, no, no, no, it's okay. You know, stay. And he's like, all right, fine. And I come up to secondary and this time around, they, like, stop me. And they're like, and usually I don't get put to

secondary. They let me just keep going straight through the checkpoint. They're like, just wavy through, you know. But this time they're like, no, no, no. And they point to the secondary lane. And I'm like, that's not good. I literally say out loud and they're in my ear. I'm like, I'm burnt. And they're like, all right, don't say nothing. Like, just let us listen. And I go to the secondary and like, I'm so out of my mind again at 6 a.m. Friday morning. I accidentally like continue to go forward rather than to the right. And you see the Border Patrol. They think I'm trying to run. I'm like, oh, sorry, and I end up reversing out, right? And I pull into the secondary.

And I'm just, like, total hot mess. And they stopped me. And I have, like, this elaborate story. They have these, like, yacht show every year in San Diego. And I'd already, like, thought about, you know, what my story would be. Oh, I'm here for the yacht show. I'm picking at my boyfriend. And I have, like, my hand around him. And I'm like, you know, pretending that, like, we're in a relationship. And he's like, you know, this super, on, you know, Hispanic gentleman who speaks zero English and has a pair of women's sunglasses on and an ice coffee and a cigarette in his hand. And so the Border Patrol agent is like, okay, where are you going? Where are you coming from? And I have this like pretty dialed in story,

actually, pretty elaborate. And he's like, okay, he's like, what about you, sir? How are you today? And the guy just, he just blinks at him. He doesn't speak any English. Right. You know, he doesn't say a word. And the Border Patrol agent looks at me. He's like, oh, he doesn't speak any English. And I'm like, oh, yeah, his English is not that good.

And most of the Border Patrol agents, especially there, they speak Spanish. So they start talking to him in Spanish. And he doesn't, he doesn't wrap me out. Right. He doesn't say anything. But they're like, ma'am, do you mind if we take a look in the car? And I'm like, actually, you need a warrant for that. And they were like, actually, we don't.

So just pull over. And what we're going to do is we're going to have you and him get out and just stand over here. And we're just going to have the dogs do a little walk around, right? And I'm like, I'm like in high heels and a dress. And I have like a full face of makeup on like too much makeup for sure. And I also have I have shit on me too. But it's already, you know, safe where no one can find. it. And they have the dogs do a walk around and then they smell, they alert at the trunk, you know.

And I think also, too, one of the things that you would do, which I didn't do because I was expecting only to pick up two is a lot of the time you'll put, you'll inflate the tires more so in the back. So it's less obvious because you could, you can see the weight, you know, if you're looking at a vehicle. And they're like, oh, it's in the trunk, you know. And they open the trunk, and then there's, you know, one Mexican, two Mexican, three Mexican pop out. And the three are sitting right there. And me and Jorge are standing on the other side of the car. And they, like, start asking those guys, you know. You go, that's crazy.

You didn't say. I don't say anything. I don't say anything. I knew at this point that I got was burnt. And they start asking those three. like, Paisa's like what's going on. And a lot of the time what they do is they'll say whatever they need to say to try and stay. They don't want to go back.

Right. And so they're like, she forced us in here, you know, gave this crazy story. Like she's tortured us. This crazy white woman. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they're like, and they totally throw me under the bus and some. You know what I mean? And they're like, you're going to prison.

And in my mind, right? I really genuinely believe still at this point that I am, they're going to question me and then they're going to let me out. Like, I really believe that, genuinely. And so they bring me into custody. They bring me to the Pine Valley, like, Border Patrol Station. I'm, like, kicking, but I'm in, like, a room where there's cameras, so I can't, like, do any of the stuff I have on me. and eventually they like bring me in like two agents to talk to me and the first thing they asked me is like oh do you want to make any phone calls like do you want to get in your phone? I'm like no, you know, I'm not letting them in my phone because I'm thinking about all the things

that are in my phone like not only is this all this stuff that I've been doing but all these people I've been involved with with you know selling stuff and like middle manning and and and also like the sex works. I mean all of it. I'm like oh my God there's so much crime in there. I'm like no, I'm good. Like, they had told me that if they ever, if you ever get caught and they ask go on your phone, don't let them. Like, if they have to, they'll get a warrant, you know?

And so they're like, do you want to go on your phone? I'm like, no. And I'm kind of like defiant. And they're like, well, do you want to talk to us? I was like, I want a fucking lawyer, you know? And they were like, pissed. They were like, you're going to fucking prison. And I still was like, sure.

You know what I mean? Sure, I'm going to prison. And they put me back into the holding cell, and I spent maybe two or three days there. And then they, because I told them I was like withdrawing, they sent me to the hospital for maybe two days. Because they had like a contract, like the feds had a contract with like some shitty hospital. And so I was there with like a U.S. Marshall for a day or two. And then I went to MCC in San Diego. And I was like, I'm going to prison.

I'm like, they're serious. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm like regretting all of the choices. Like I shouldn't have done that last run. I shouldn't have done. I shouldn't have brought four people. I probably would have been fine had I just stuck with two or maybe even three I would have been fine. Like what was I thinking? I should have talked to those people when they pulled me in. You know what I mean? I'm like what? This is the worst. And and I really, I do the rest of what I have left. And I really start like withdrawing while I'm in prison. It's almost a week later. You know, like that's when it gets really, really severe because I've been such. a long run. I like fall off to top bunk. I have a seizure. I hit my head. A couple months, I'm like cross-eyed. I don't know why. They took me to like UCSD, which is like where the trauma unit is. I spend like two weeks there with like a U.S. Marshal and my little like, they called them minions because it was like the yellow jumpsuits that like button up. So it looked like those little minions. I'm in the minion. I'm like cuffed to the to the hospital bed with like marshals with me 24-7. They like can't figure out what happened. After

my head and why I'm cross-out. It's like, it's all chaos. And I end up being sentenced to 36 months. I'm supposed to do 30 months. And, you know, they move you. 30 months because it's a good time. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, that's what I'll probably end up to. Yeah, yeah. And so I'm at MCC for a while, and then they moved me to another federal facility with Tai Mesa. And then they move me to another one, Santa Ana, and, you know, they move you around before you finally land in prison and um uh COVID happens and um I've been in for like 18 months at this point and I wasn't on an indictment because I didn't talk to them um I didn't like rat anybody out or anything like that I just uh they started releasing a bunch of girls who had like nonviolent

offenses which I've been in and out of county jail I've been to state prison uh You'll get out early in like state prison or county jail, like on good time or like they'll drop charges. That happens all the time. People are coming in and out. But as you probably know, like you don't really, you don't get out early in the feds. Like you do your time. No, unless it, but for COVID they were. Right.

Right. Exactly. So I remember the first girl who got released, this girl we called her chicken because she looked like Chicken Little, the cartoon. And chicken went down to Zoom. we didn't even know what Zoom was at the time you know what I mean it wasn't a thing before COVID right and we're in prison so we're like totally removed from like what's happening in the world and she gets out that day and she was like a super young girl

who would like potentially unknowingly cross drugs like bought a car in Mexico type deal who knows though that they all have the same story you know what I mean they all have the same story which is the funniest thing because usually the people that they're working for give them the story to tell the cops and so when people come in They all have the exact same story and you're like, yeah.

All right. Sure. Oh, it was, you know, my car broke down in Mexico and I bought this car. Yeah, and it had kilos, you know, below in the door. I'm like, that's crazy. Jennifer, too. Also, yes. So, chicken, it was super young.

She was not about that life. She was not an addict. She wasn't like a criminal. And we're like, oh, she's telling for sure. She's got out the same day that she did this like imaginary Zoom unicorn court. And we're like, she's telling for sure. And then the next day, another two or three girls who weren't on indictments and didn't have violent offenses or like known gang gang affiliation. They same thing.

And they get out that day, like within an hour of going to this court. But they're coming back telling you, hey, I had a Zoom with a whatever, my lawyer or whoever, a judge. Yeah. And because I'm nonviolent, they're going to let me. letting me out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So now we believe it. At first, we're like, chicken's talent. You know what I mean? But then it's like, it's happening every single day, right? And there, there's no movement. Nobody's coming in. The few people that do come in, they're like, they're having to quarantine for like 30 days because this is before the test. This is like height

of like COVID lockdown, right? You've already done how much time? 18 months. Yeah. It's not like they didn't get some time out of you. No, they did. They for sure did. They definitely got some time out of me. I don't think another year is going to change anything for you. I don't think so. I mean, also too, because I'd been in and out of just like the system since I was a kid, I like knew how to do time. Yeah.

You know, I learned when I was a teenager, like no calendars, no marking dates. Right. Just like program, get busy. And so like I learned how to do time. And because of all these experiences I had had leading up and all these different lives I had lived, right? I kind of knew how to just adapt and go with the flow. You know, it was like this like chameleon kind of vibe of like,

okay, this is what we're doing. All right. Like blinders, right? Just like committing to the bit, if you will. And so I had no intention or hope that I was going to get out. I just essentially as far as I'm concerned, every time I'm like I've been incarcerated. like state prison, county jail, Juvie, all the different times.

I just like see it as, oh, I'm going to be here forever. Like, I convinced myself in my mind, like, this is my life now because it makes a lot easier to get through that time. And so when I get called down to, like, the Zoom court, they tell me I'm getting out that day. And I end up being released and I'm, like, genuinely shocked and surprised. Like, I thought I was going to be doing another year. And I end up getting out that evening, like sit downstairs for 12 hours, you know, when they're like processing you out, exactly.

And I think I had like a warrant, but it was a warrant for a court date from while I was incarcerated, so they didn't hold me on it. And I like got out and I went to like a recovery home because they wanted to say. send me to the federal halfway house. But while I was in there, when you have all that time, I had like made a phone call on three-way with my dad to some like recovery home to give me a letter. So when the date came a year in a year, I would have this letter of admission saying I could go here, right? And it ended up being really good that I did that because my year came a lot sooner than I was, you know, expecting. And so they let me go to this recovery home. And, I didn't necessarily have intentions when I first got out of like staying sober or I was going too long enough to like not be on paper.

That was always like the plan. But I don't know. When I was, when I got out, I had only about three, four months sober because I'd been like getting loaded in there. And COVID made it hard to do that because we were like locked down 24-7 pretty much. And something like shift in when I got out. And I was like, well, maybe I'll, like, try and do something different with my life. How old were you? When I got out, I've been sober six and a half years, like 27.

Okay. Yeah. I'm trying to think of, you know, a lot of people, like, sometimes you age out of crime. You know what I'm saying? You just age out of, and then, you know, sometimes your brain isn't really fully developed until you're, like 24, 25, 26, right? So, you know, you're not really thinking clearly. You're still kind of like a kid.

So I'm just wondering if there was a, because this doesn't sound like there was, doesn't sound like, because honestly, you've had, you've had more rock bottoms than this. Totally. This isn't even a rock bottom. In the comparison of the rest of your story, this isn't really even a rock bottom. No, I think it's kind of like what's that shift? What? I don't think, I've talked about this before.

I don't like the idea of rock bottom. Everybody's different. I think everybody's different. Yeah, I think, obviously I'm speaking for the perspective of like almost all of my crime was fueled by addiction, right? So I do think that it's bottomless. Like if you think it can't get worse, it can get worse. If you continue to like operate and live the way that you've been operating, maybe for a normal part. person who's not like, you know, fueled by addiction, they have like a big thing happen. And then

they're like, all right, I need to like get on the straight and narrow. But like for me, because my addiction was so severe, it was like, eh, I've already done. Like nothing mattered. You know what I mean? I was like numb. I was so disassociated. I couldn't like, I couldn't even connect to some of these like experiences I had had, like all the trauma and all the chaos and like all of that stuff. I was just like so far removed. And I think in hindsight, it was. It was probably for the best or I probably would be a lot more fucked up now than I was then. And, you know, I've done therapy sense. We're doing well now.

But when I was in it, I was just like, okay, like I didn't really get too deep behind, like, the curtains when I was, like, in the midst of all this stuff. So, like, I think rock bottom is, like, very subjective. And for me, rock bottom is not so much, like, the external circumstances. But for me, it was, like, a few days after I got out of prison, I just had a moment where I was, like, I actually don't want to die. Right. And I genuinely believed in the depths of my soul. And I think it was 100% true that I was going to start drinking and using again. Like, I knew for sure.

I had done it 100 times. I mean, 100 times. I'd been to jail. I'd been on probation. I'd had parole. I'd been through all this, and it was never enough to hold me. So, like, what is going to be different? And it was like this, like, kind of, like, deep sense of, like, sadness and hopelessness, I think.

where I was like, I'm going to do this again, and there's no way that I can stop myself from doing it. And I think that that experience of like complete desperation was the starting point of me being willing to like not just change the fact that I was drinking, using, doing crime, sex work, all this other stuff, but also like completely shift really everything in my life. like everything, my perspective, my ideas on how the world operated and how people in it operated, my motivations, my relationships, my friendships, I think my biggest thing that, like, put me on the edge in that very beginning of, like, you know, getting sober was like, I'm never going to be able to make money. Like, I used to make money. I'm like, especially like now I'm a federal felon.

I have a GD. Like I did some college but never finished, right? Like, I'm never going to be able to get a real job or have a career. And even if I do, it's never going to measure up to the amount of money that I was making. You know what I mean? Because when I was arrested, I had a shitload of cash in the hotel room. I'm positive that the person I was with took all that cash. Right.

And I had like Bitcoin and like all these weird accounts, but none of them were in my real name and like all of that's gone. You know what I mean? They took everything. They took the car. They took, you know, the $6,000 handbag. They took all the stuff. So I like came out truly with nothing. I had a pair of Bob Barker, Velcro.

Oh yeah. You remember the Bob Barkers, right? That's the name brand of the, like the state issue, all the state issued stuff is Bob Barker. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the game show guy. Yeah. Yeah.

Yep. Yeah. So I had like Bob Barker Velcro shoes, you know, a pair of like white commissary sweatpants, hoodless sweatshirt, and like a two inch long toothbrush. Like that's all I had when I got out of prison. Yeah. I weighed like almost 200 pounds. Are you serious?

Wow. Yeah. Yeah. It was a little rough around the edges for sure. Yeah. I thought I was like from the streets. I'm not like, I'm a small town girl from like Massachusetts. Like, life wasn't perfect as a kid, but, like, my parents loved me to the best of their ability.

You know, my mom, her and I have had challenges, but we have a relationship today. Like, things are very different for sure. But I had to do, like, a massive amount of work on myself. I really had to change everything. And you stayed, you, well, you weren't released in California. Yeah. Oh, you were? Mm-hmm.

Okay. Yeah. So you were released in California and you just stayed there? I couldn't go back home. I knew Massachusetts was not a good place for me, but, like, also, like, my dad's remarried. He has like a gang of like stepkids running around. There's no space for me there. I don't necessarily want to be there either.

My mom and I didn't talk for 15 years. So when I first got out, we were like, I had just like reinitiated contact with her. My older siblings from my dad's first marriage, they all live in Los Angeles. But like, they were like, we support you and we love you. But like they hadn't, they had no idea what, like, they knew that I was like on. the streets doing drugs. Like, thinking I was in prison, they're like, you can't stay here. You know what I mean?

We love you and we support you, but like, you can't stay here. Plus, like, there's a whole background check. They have to go through all kinds of stuff in order for you to even, like, be released there. So I ended up just going to this, like, recovery home that really wasn't even a recovery home. It was like a boarding house, essentially, like labeled as the silver living. I was all dudes. I was the only girl there.

Almost everybody was, like, doing drugs there. and it was like 500 bucks a month. I like borrowed $100 from like five family members to pay for like the first month sober living, sober living. So I'm surprised I stayed sober. There was like bed bugs. It was like crazy. And I remember like my federal probation officer showing up and being like, you can't stay here.

He's like, this is a men's like boarding house. You know what I mean? Like this is not somebody. you could stay. And so I remember like, like panicking and trying to figure out a solution because he's like, if you don't figure out a solution in the next 48 hours, you're going to the halfway house, the federal halfway house. And I was like, oh my God, if I go there, I'm definitely going to be doing crime, you know, with a bunch of. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm going to be, you know, back in it. So what you figure out?

I ended up finding another sober living. It was COVID, so it was like empty. It usually costs like $2,500. which at that time was like unimaginable to me. I didn't even have insurance, let alone a cell phone or like $2,500. I remember I called and heard how much it was hung up. They called me back there like, how much can you afford? Right. Because they were dead empty because it was the height of quarantine, you know, no toilet paper, everything.

Nobody's on the road. And this one guy, Jimmy the Poet, who was in that like crazy men's... We know Jimmy the Poet. Yeah. Do you really? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we interviewed him.

Jimmy Duh poet? Yeah. From California? D. West Virginia? Yeah. Oh, no, really? You know Jimmy?

He's like, we have a video. Oh my God. That is so funny. Okay. So, Jimmy the poet. Are there a lot of Jimmy Duff poets? Jimmy Duff. Keep your crown on?

Yes, of course. He gave me a bunch of stickers and different things with that. Okay, so that is hilarious that you know him. See, now you know I'm telling the truth about all these characters. So I get into this crazy boarding house recovery home. Nobody is in recovery except for Jimmy the poet. And he got sober in prison, right? And so he meets me and he's like, you met him.

He's very enthusiastic. He's like, oh, dope, you're out. Congratulations. You know, he's like, he's just such a big personality, very eccentric. And I'm fresh out. I haven't seen a man, let alone 19 men. And I had no idea I was going to be released. Like, you know that feeling when you first get out.

It's like almost excitement, but like overwhelming anxiety. Yeah. What is going on? They keep waiting for him to show up and say, there was a mistake. You got to cuff up. Totally. And like I don't even know how to. I remember like my plan was like, okay, I haven't smoked cigarettes in this long.

I'm not going to start again. And as soon as I get out, somebody's like, you want a cigarette. I'm like, give me a cigarette, right? And I'm in this room and there's like five or six guys, right? And they're like asking me all these questions. I'm like, I'm sorry, I just, I don't know how to act right now. I, like, I didn't even know. It was like a little alien, like, back to Earth because I'd been incarcerated.

And Jimmy, the poet is, like, rapping. You know what I mean? And, like, it's just, like, super happy. And, like, I hated him. I'm like, get away from me and give me some space, please, you know? But he's, like, genuinely, like, being nice to me. And in my experience, leading up to this point, like, especially with men, it's like my relationships had been transactional. So it was always like, what do you want?

I was like, what do you want for me? Yeah. Like, what is your motive here, you know? And after three, four days, I get this visit from federal probation officer. He tells me, you better figure it out or you're going to the halfway house. And so I start freaking out even more. I don't even have clothes. I have no money.

Jimmy the poet. had been really kind to me. He, like, went to, got me, like, shampoo, conditioner, deodorant. Like, I didn't even ask him for it. He just, like, showed up and gave me these things. And, like, I'm still very, like, weary of him and also kind of annoyed. And when this happens, I start to freak out. And he's sober. He's, like, in recovery. You know what I mean? He's, like, active in his sobriety. And he keeps telling me that I need to do. And I'm like, you know, I'm good, right? but at this point my I'm like okay I want to get

loaded this is too much for me to handle like I want to go get loaded and instead I asked Jimmy the poet for some help and he ended up connecting me with a sober woman and my like sobriety journey began and he also suggested I go to this nonprofit organization called a new way

of life have you ever heard of homeboy industries no it's a nonprofit that's pretty big that helps out people have been incarcerated and, you know, have a history of crime and homelessness. So it's similar to that. So a new way of life. It's a reentry project is what it's called. It started by this woman who did a bunch of time and has been sober for a long time

and really started this to like be of service to people who need like job force training, getting back on their feet, financial aid, education, all of that stuff. And he tells me about it. It's in South Central. I don't have any money. So I take the bus to South Central. I apply for the stimulus that they're doing. doing during COVID for people who have been released within that year. And I get like a $15 or $1,600

stimulus check. And I'm able to like move to this other place where they've like lowered the rate. And it's like a safe sober environment. And that's really where my journey like kind of started. Like everything. That was six years ago. I've been sober for six and a half years and like the first few months were in prison. So you go from there? What do you do? Go get a job? I mean, that's not where you're at now.

Yeah, no, no, it's not. So I, so first of all, the house manager and that recovery home relapses, like, very quickly and, like, she becomes a client. And there was, like, not that many people in the house, maybe four or five, because it was COVID. And all of the other people have been there longer than me, but, like, they're not a good option. You know what I mean? And so I genuinely, even just a month out of prison was probably the best option because I was the most serious about staying sober.

Like something shifted during that, like, first few days that I got out to, like, the next month where I, like, got very serious about, like, changing how I lived and, like, very involved with the help of Jimmy the Poet, who kind of was, like, my Eskimo into all of this. So I become the house manager. And that means I'm not paying rent. Huge deal, right? I get the stimulus check. I'm able to buy some clothes. I'm able to, like, you know, get some, like, become a human being. No more Bob Barkers, get a real toothbrush.

And then I get a job working as, like, a behavioral health technician in a rehab, like, you know, like minimum wage. And I'm taking the bus to this job. And I'm doing that every day. And I've become really active in, like, my sober recovery community. And my life's usually to get a lot better very quick. I go from being a behavioral health technician to an administrator at, like, another treatment facility. like an admin assistant, and then I go from that to being like an operations, like housing director, and then eventually an admissions coordinator, then an admissions director, and then business development.

And I start to really, like, very quickly kind of like work my way up. And I go from being a felon, you know, with a GED to, I remember my first salary. I think it was $55,000, right? I thought I was rich. I mean, in Florida, you would be rich. That's actually not bad money. In Florida, you could have California. That's nothing.

But here you could actually go rent a one-bedroom apartment, have a car, insurance. You could have everything for 55. Yeah. So for 55, I'm like, oh, my God, I'm rich. And that's like the minimum salary range at this time. And it's like maybe I've been out for about a year. So I have like around a year sober a little over. And I get my license back and I paid off and I'm legit.

You know what I mean? And I purchased my first car. and I had had many cars. I've crashed many cars. But I had never had a car that, like, I had purchased on my own and, like, through honest work. Yeah. So I can't tell you, like, it was very, like, empowering for me where, like, I knew that I

had worked hard and earned this and saved and been responsible and reliable. And it was, like, it was very empowering for me. I remember when I started, like, paying my own phone bill in my own name under my actual government name. It was like, I, like, would get excited to pay, like, bills because I just felt like I was, like, a human being, right? And, and then eventually I, I, uh, I worked for, you know, a company for four years and it's so full circle. And, and I was, you know, the director of business development at this facility. And one, two of our programs were programs specifically for first responders.

struggling with mental health and addiction. So take to, you know, five years after getting out of prison, I'm literally the number that they would call when a Border Patrol agent or an FBI agent is struggling with alcoholism. Right. It was just like, on it, like, you couldn't make this shit up. You know what I mean? It's like. Truth is stranger than fiction.

Totally. And maybe about a year and a half into, you know, being released, I meet my now husband. And, you know, we dated for three and a half, four years and got married almost two years ago. And April, it will be two years. And, yeah, life is, I mean, unrecognizable. Yeah, I mean, it's truly, it's pretty crazy. I currently own and just opened up my own treatment facility in the Hollywood Hills called Peak Path Health. I've started a podcast called The Peak of Possibility.

And yeah, I remember just thinking that, like, okay, I'm a felon. I don't have a college degree. I'm never going to make good money. And I'm never going to be able to, like, leave this behind me, like, this, like, this dark cloud. And for the first few years, I didn't share my story super openly. It wasn't necessarily a secret. Like people in my close community and my recovery community, my family, my loved ones, they knew some of the story.

But, like, I wouldn't talk about it openly because I think I still had a lot of shame and embarrassment. Not around prison, but, like, definitely around, like, the sex work and the prostitution. I think I was really embarrassed about that. But I found when I started talking about it a little bit more, I was kind of surprised and shocked how many people women especially have had similar experiences and feel like they're like irrevocably broken. I think it's possible to kind of like have these experiences and like come back and like have a life and be like a normal human being. And I think it's pretty profound, you know, to see people have that like turn around, whether it's related to, you know, mental health or addiction or just

like being a criminal and doing like stupid shit. You know what I mean? I think, I think that it's like really powerful to kind of see those like those come up stories and it's really, um, meaningful to me to get the opportunity to, like, help people who are struggling, maybe not with all the same crimes that I was struggling with, but also that too. But, like, people who are stuck in, like, a cycle of addiction and alcoholism and be able to show up and have, you know, resources for them. And that was probably part of the purpose. It was definitely part of the purpose of starting Peak Path Health and the Treatment Center.

So it's all been pretty exciting. Okay. Well, if people want to get in touch with you. Yeah. So the Treatment Center website, it's a luxury facility in the Hollywood Hills. It's called peak pathhealth.com. If you want to check out the podcast, we're on YouTube, Spotify, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook. It's called the peak of possibility.

And I think that's about it. Hey, you guys, I appreciate you watching. If you would like to get in touch with Glynis, we're going to leave all of her links to the website and all of her social medias in the description box. You can go right there. You can click on it. Shoot over there. Follow or get in touch with her through the website. Once again, I really appreciate you guys watching. Thank you very much. See ya.