Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - Real-Life Scarface: Attacks, Betrayal, and a Million-Dollar Comeback

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Starting point is 00:00:30 On June 18th, 20203, Ocean Gates' Titan submersible imploded during an expedition dive to the Titanic, killing all five on board, including Ocean Gate founder and CEO Stockton Rush. Numerous industry experts and employees from within Ocean Gate itself had warned Rush of impending doom, citing safety concerns and a lack of testing. His hubris, ego, and reckless desire for innovation over all else cost him his life and that of others. The catastrophic destruction of the Titan submersible sent shockwaves through the ocean exploration industry that are still being felt today. The Ocean Gate Titan submersible, a preventable tragedy, a two-part series available now on shipwrecks and sea dogs. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

Starting point is 00:01:21 As I'm getting up there, I see the lights coming. In 253 stitches, those guys were the crew of Sammy Garvano. You'll never find me saying anything illegal on the phone. So inwalk, Sean Atwood, you'll call me tomorrow and tell me if you want to cooperate. Deal. Stuck out my hand. He didn't know what he was shaken to. He had no idea what he was shaken to. I think we all have incidents in our life that change us.

Starting point is 00:01:46 When I was five years old, I was my birthday, and I was walking outside. I remember looking at my birthday cake and walked outside, and we had a pit bull out back. His name was Tarsus. He was on the chain for the first time in probably the summer, hot summer day out. It's hot as hell in Arizona, probably 120 degrees. And I walked out back and he had his face in his bowl and just turned around and boom, hit me like a ton of bricks. And so I don't

Starting point is 00:02:14 know if you can, you can see this scar right here. Right. Ended up hitting me and biting me pretty good. Ended up getting rushed to the hospital and 253 stitches. Completely rip my face apart. I think these moments change our life significantly. I actually don't have a picture of myself looking back without this scar. I, you know, it's basically my memory of myself. You know what I mean? And I'm actually happy because, you know, as you're as usual hearing the story going through life, you know, we all become who we are by, I think, certain defining moments. And that was a little one that was going to set the course for me. Growing up with a big ass scar on your face and growing up not as big as the other kids was something that always pushed me to want to want to try a little harder.

Starting point is 00:02:59 You know what I mean? So in our little town, you know, as in many towns across the United States, right. People bring in many different things, and this time they run in psychedelics. And for me, it was red sunshine with some psychedelic. And I tried it. And it was an amazing experience. You know, you seem to go over everything that you already know.

Starting point is 00:03:20 But your mind, you know, your mind is at a state that you seem to be going over everything that you already know. You can't think about, let's put this way, you can't think about anything that you haven't already thought of. So in your mind, you'll probably be going back over for whatever reading and things that you already know. If you're doing them, I get in the car, I do this, I say hello to my friend. And you start to realize in a more present way that you're doing something. And you may realize that you're doing something in a way because you're doing something. doing it in a more present way that maybe you're doing it in a way that is either incorrect for how you feel. You know, it's a contemplative substance, you know. And so I would say it presents

Starting point is 00:04:06 the journey inward. I thought it was very interesting. And so probably for the next few periods, like a month and another month or weekends, me and my friends would, we would trip. We would all get together trip. And I ended up meeting a guy by the name of Maya that came to town. And he then was supplying the entire town. Okay. So, I mean, are you selling? Did you start selling it? Well, that's, yeah, so that's kind of the window right there. So I'm hanging out with the guys. I'm not really, you know, I'm not just involved having a good time, just on the peripherals. You know what just a kid. Yeah, just a kid, you know. And I meet Maya. Well, Maya is a serious dealer. Now, he's only a year, year and a half older than me. But Maya's living on his own.

Starting point is 00:04:47 Maya's from the northwest, Washington, San Francisco area, and, you know, he's dealing significant amounts. I started picking up sheets from him because, again, at the time, you could probably get a sheet for $200. That's $2 a piece because you're getting 100 units at the time. So this is my... So five bucks. So this is my introductory to business school at the time.

Starting point is 00:05:12 Started selling just single hits to people. There's little parties in the weekend. We got little bonfire parties and stuff like that. But I'm not the type of guy to break it up and to put it into little baggies or anything like that because I'm risk-averse. Right. You know, a lot of people like to take risks. Just like my father, incredibly risk-averse. You think that people that do things that are, you know, risky, they're either, they either do it in a stupid way or they do it in a calculative way.

Starting point is 00:05:40 I'm lean more towards the calculative way. If I can't get it done within the high 90th percentile, I'm not touching it. If I don't have at least 89% of, you know, in my head and I factor in all the factors that I'm not even, I'm not, not even looking at it. And I'd usually be in the high 90th percentile success rate where I feel like I could do something. So start breaking it down. But I don't do it like everybody else. I'll keep it in my book at school, but I'll break them up into little pieces and have them already ready and only have a certain amount on me. Exposure.

Starting point is 00:06:09 Always wanting to just risk. You know, I mean, even as a kid, you know, at risk averse, not trying to get into any trouble, you know. So, yeah, I mean, you're thinking, so just to be clear, you're thinking I want to have, I want to have an amount that says I'm a user and not a dealer. Yeah, if I just have enough that I go to school with and I have enough to get through the day, and I can get rid of it quickly, and I've got it broken up into pieces that are ready to serve. Just the, it's a little piece of paper for anybody has never seen. It's not coming in liquid at the time, and typically is not distributed that way, unless you're getting it from some of that's really, really in the scene, you know, and it's actually very difficult to lay into where. work with. So paper is much more convenient. So these little pieces of paper and I would break it up and I remember in my mythology book. I had a mythology book and I would break it up into there.

Starting point is 00:06:53 And people would come and see me in the courtyard, break it up and they'd be like, what do I do with it? You take it. You know what I mean? You take it right now. And I could easily just get rid of it. You know, so this is my like little introductory. People are now tripping at school. And basically getting people getting people to experience it. You know, some people would freak out without a doubt. Some people couldn't handle it. Some people didn't understand that it was changing their perspective or that they were seeing things in a different light. It doesn't make you see things. You don't start to manufacture visions. You know, it just starts to kind of twist your brain a little bit to where you're thinking in different ways. So long story short, I like the fact that I can make a little bit of money with it, but we're also getting into swag at the time. Mexican brick that comes across the border. So for me, my first lesson was getting a pound of W in learning about breaking it down. Okay. So you get a pound that's 64 quarters. You can sell those for 20 bucks a piece.

Starting point is 00:07:49 And if you can break that down, you're at 1240. So you take a $600 pound that you can get typically on front because, again, that's the way the system works. You know what I mean? Because there's so much of it. Right. People are looking typically at a front it. So I remember getting my first pound from a guy by the name of Joel Chamberlain.

Starting point is 00:08:09 And the only names that I'll mention today are people that are passed away, essentially. But Joel was the first person that I got a pound from. He was a friend of mine's older brother. He was also in the scene doing his thing, but I didn't really deal with him. But he was a friend of my older brothers, and so he knew I was cool. So anyways, I ended up getting my first pound from him and breaking it down. And I thought I was going to be, again, this is the first little step to be, I guess, an entrepreneur.

Starting point is 00:08:38 I thought I'm going to do it different. Everybody sells a seven gram sack. That's, you know, there's 448 grams in a pound. So, you know, seven grams, 64. I say, I'm going to do an eight grams. So I'm going to give just an extra gram to everybody. You know, a little marketing because everybody else sells the same one. Right.

Starting point is 00:08:58 But I want to do something a little bit different, you know. So I do that, but I don't realize that if I do that, I'm losing out, essentially, a percentage. So if you break that down already, I'm maybe 20% down. So then I'm going to smoke some. Me and my friends are going to roll up the big blunts. And by the time I'm all done with it, even though I think I'm doing good marketing, I'm probably just going to make enough money to pay the guy back.

Starting point is 00:09:23 Right. So I end up going through that for a little while. And despite the fact that I'm trying to come up and trying to do well, I'm not really doing anything. Right. So I end up moving along and getting into this is where the rave scene starts to happen a little bit more. Now I'm in high school, probably my junior year, and we're going to rave parties. Psychedelics are a big thing, so we're all going to the rave parties. Everybody's doing psychedelics.

Starting point is 00:09:53 I'm not really, you know, I've sold some... I'm not a dealer at this point, really. You know, I'm just, you know, doing my thing. End up getting into the scene a little bit and connecting with a friend by the name R.J. He has a connect with a guy that he works with and... funds him to do certain projects. RJ's out in the streets and this guy is kind of behind the scenes. And the reason I mention him is because I'll end up working with this guy later on.

Starting point is 00:10:22 So I end up hanging out with RJ. And I, RJ, we go to Tucson maybe sometimes on trips to pick up trash bags full of bricks. Interesting things about picking up weight. counting money the first time I'm ever learning to count lots of money. So we're sitting there counting thousands and thousands of dollars in his car.

Starting point is 00:10:46 Remember telling me, face it, face it. I'm like, what do you mean face it? You got to face the bills. Got to face the bills. Won't take it unless it's faced. I'm like, bank? But yeah, apparently, face the bills. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:10:55 That's the first thing I learned is in the industry is you face all your bills. You know what that means? You put them face the face up? Like a bank. Yeah. Like a bank would want them.

Starting point is 00:11:06 You face them. You flip the business. bill face over because if it's all mixed, even if it's the same denomination, they just don't take it like that. Right. You know what I mean? Okay. I'm not exactly sure why.

Starting point is 00:11:18 You know what I mean? It's just, but I guess, you know, the baby is a professional, you know what I mean? A little professionalism, you know? So the first time I'm learning, you know, counting, you know, six, seven, $8,000 in the back. And then boom, we're rolling back with a trash bag. No, I'm just a kid. I have no vested interest in this.

Starting point is 00:11:32 I'm just hanging out with my friend. We're just cruising. But there's a trash bag, literally sitting in the back of the car. because if you get pulled over, it doesn't mean, it doesn't matter if it's in the trunk or if it's in the back. You're done. You might as well have it in the seat next to you. You know what I mean? Like, you're done.

Starting point is 00:11:46 You know what I mean? And it's actually hilarious because RJ would at times, of course, if we were carrying weight drive normal. At other times when we sometimes have weight, you know what I mean? He'd be pulling four lane changes in Phoenix. I don't know if you have like, you know what I mean? Without, you know, just blatantly, you know what I mean, driving kind of crazy. just a wild kid. Me and RJ end up linking up in Phoenix with his guy named Schooley.

Starting point is 00:12:15 He was a type of guy that used to throw rave parties down in Phoenix. We talk a lot about crime on this show, but let's face it, some of the biggest crimes are committed by the government. You've heard the story before. Big Pharma swoops in to take control. Now, the FDA is trying to reclassify NMN a natural compound in foods like broccoli and avocados as a pharmaceutical drug. Why? Because NMN is so effective they want to turn it into a pricey drug, keeping its health benefits out of the reach of most people. It's likely they're setting the stage for Big Pharma to profit,

Starting point is 00:12:48 making it hard for us to access something that could dramatically support our life. The truth is, I lost over a decade in federal prison. So I want to stay as healthy as long as possible. I'm 55 years old, and I'm not ready to slow down. I stay active, eat right, and do all the things that we're supposed to do. But that only gets you so far. That's when I started looking for an NMN supplement. Something backed by real science.

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Starting point is 00:13:54 Click the link in the description box or head over to verso, v-er.so. And use the promo code, Cox. For 15% off your first order. Get it while you still can and take control of your health before the FDA and Big Pharma take it out of your hands. So we're connected with the guys that are essentially throwing the events down in Phoenix. And we would go down there and I would just go with RJ and deliver packs, which essentially packs of mushrooms, pounds of mushrooms or GHB at the time. You know, for a period of a year and a half, I'm with RJ every day. We're just, you know, we're either going to Raid parks in California, meeting people, going to Tucson, just cruising around, you know, doing, he's dealing and I'm hanging out with him, you know, enjoying ourselves.

Starting point is 00:14:40 So we end up going to school these house. And, you know, when you're in a situation that can immediately turn bad. So we're in a house, and I know this guy is one of the main dudes in Phoenix. Well, not a house. We're an apartment. But I know he's one of the main dudes. And he's no longer alive. This guy's school. He's passed away as well.

Starting point is 00:15:07 But sitting there and we've just brought in, I think RJ has two gallons of the GHP, which was conspicuously brought in these moonshine containers. Right. You know, so it doesn't look like, you know what I mean? So it looks like something else that's illegal. Or like you could put kombucha in or something. You know what I mean? But they're very conspicuous.

Starting point is 00:15:29 They're like, I don't even ever seen a moonshine container that these big, thick, kind of like cement-looking, huge casks, you know. And in-walk, Sean Atwood. Oh, okay. There you go. And so, Schooley is his guy. And I think he's referred to him as Skinner. I've never heard him refer to him as Schooley. But Schooley, we call him Schooley because he had Schoolhouse Productions, which was an event company that would throw these rave parties.

Starting point is 00:15:55 So in walks Sean Atwood, baldhead. People would call him English Sean. We used to refer to him as British Sean. And I'll clarify again, because Brits don't like to be called English, because they're British, not English, you know. So he walks in, lambskin jacket, bald head. And immediately him and Scully go into the kitchen. And he pops out 13 ounces of peach glass, I don't know, which is the earliest. of amphetamine at the time, like, which is what everybody's probably, I'm not in that scene at all,

Starting point is 00:16:31 but he whips it out and says, oh, I just got this 13 ounces. He just flew back from Los Angeles. So he was just flying back from one of his connects, that he used to have his main connects out there, I'm sure, for his other guys, not trying to put you on blast, Sean. I know your career is already done and you're on to bigger and better things, but I remember you were calling and saying how it spelled like peaches and was stinking up the plane. And it did it. It literally, you could, the odor, you know, right. So I'm sitting in this apartment, just waiting for the door to get kicked in. Because this is the type of apartments, you're just waiting for somebody to kick in the door with a shotgun.

Starting point is 00:17:02 Right. Because they know that you live there and they know that you have plenty of drugs on hand at any given time. So you're not thinking the cops. Oh, yeah, not the cops at all. I'm sitting there thinking I want to get the f*** out of here because I know exactly. I mean, at any time. Do you know what I mean? And yeah, he ended up getting rolled later on in the bathroom of a club.

Starting point is 00:17:20 I think Who did? Schoolie. Yeah, he got his teeth knocked out over about, I think it was about five or six G's because I remember meeting up with him, his girlfriend and RJ, well, me and RJ,

Starting point is 00:17:33 but Schooley didn't want to, you know what I mean, like this, you know what I'm saying, with his girlfriend and then a black Mercedes two-door, you know what I'm saying? Okay. Anyways, so later on, probably three months later,

Starting point is 00:17:49 we're in a club called Club Freedom. So I'm hanging out with my good friend GP at the time. God rest his soul. And RJ and my girlfriend, Jessica, at the time. And we're there enjoying ourselves, having a good old time. My friend GP is wearing this J5 shirt, Jurassic 5, this hip-hop group shirt. And it's like a blue shirt with a big yellow J-5 on the back. So it just kind of gets a lot of attention, right?

Starting point is 00:18:15 And so he comes up to me and he says, hey, this dude came up to me and said, want to buy some pills. Well, I don't have any pills, but I don't know RG does. You know what I mean? And so he's like, does RG have any? I was like, well, yeah. So I, you know, you got it. He's like, yeah, yeah, okay, cool. So I said, go over and talk to him and find out what he wants. So he goes over, and he talks to him and the dude's like, yeah, he's pills, you know what I mean? So I said, talk to him over there, but don't bring him over here. Right? Next thing you know, I look up and the dude's standing there with my friend. And my friend, GP, I'm not exactly sure why, but And I'm not sure why he brought him over.

Starting point is 00:18:50 And likely the guy saw that we were over there. It's like a two-story club. And, you know, he's on one side. It's like a big opening. You know what I mean? You know, like, you know, because of the dance floor. Yeah. You know, and so we're on the perimeter.

Starting point is 00:19:02 We're on one side. He's on the other. Anyways, he comes over and it's this big old dude, right? He's like, you know, I get some pills. And I was like, so looked at RJ and he's like, that. And so I was like, well, how many can I get? And I was like, how many you want? And he's like, how many you got.

Starting point is 00:19:17 Now, this is, when you're a kid, and anybody asks you that question, you got to be about the dumbest person to answer. Yeah. You know what I mean? How many you got? Okay, you know what I mean? I like your shoes. What size are they? You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:19:30 I'm about to take them off you. You know what I'm saying? Anyways, but, you know, young, so how many you got? Are just like, I'm about 200 on me. You know what I mean? 200. He's like 20 piece. Boom.

Starting point is 00:19:42 Okay, four. You know what I mean? Agree of four Gs. You know, four. Right. You know, you don't, you know, $4,000. You know, you just say four. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:19:48 Okay, boom. See, I would be thinking police. No, not thinking. Yeah, not thinking police. You know what I mean? The tattoos, you know what I mean? And this is at the 90s, bro. Yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 00:19:57 I mean, even now, now all... Law enforcement had tattoos. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Hell yeah. You know what I mean. And they're your best friend and they're the dude at the bar, by the way. So you know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:20:08 You know what I'm selling you. They're, you know what I mean? So it counts out four grand? No. No? No. No. He grabs my wrist.

Starting point is 00:20:17 puts his hand on my wrist like this and says, I'm an undercover cop. See? The police are outside. This isn't true, though. It's all bullshit. Sorry. You're coming with me.

Starting point is 00:20:32 And I look at him, and I'm holding the pills in my hand in a cellophane. You know, a cigarette cellophane goes about this tall. Holding all the pills to the top, unsealed. You know, you could seal the cellophon back in the day. I don't know. You know what I mean? You probably in prison. They probably seal it and keyster it.

Starting point is 00:20:48 I don't know what you do with it. Anyway, I'm just joking. But anyways, I'm holding the pill and it's open and he's got his hand on me. And I just say, what pills? And I just go like this with my hand. No motion, just drop them. And you can just see all the, just, I didn't tell, I just dropped it. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:21:06 What pills? And immediately my friend GP, my man right now, put his hand on his wrist. So he gets your hand off my friend. And immediately, we're in the club, there's tons of people around, immediately I slipped and turned, right? Had just enough time to get out of there, right? Boom. And I don't know what's happened right now, my friend GP.

Starting point is 00:21:28 But they, it was just long enough to distract them because they didn't go at it or anything. And then boom, I'm upstairs. Run down the thing. Dip downstairs and I go downstairs and I see this at the dance floor. Everybody's dancing. I know I can't. I see the corridor to get out. There's no way.

Starting point is 00:21:43 Like I know that I still am thinking if I try to go. out there, they could have a dude out there. I mean, like, why wouldn't you have somebody run a point? Right. Well, are you thinking it, are you thinking he was a cop at this point? No, no, not at all. No, dude, no, dude, no, dude, no, dude, I could tell the dude, they're outside. No, that. You know what I mean? You just, you can feel it. You came in here by yourself. You could feel it. You know what I mean? He had another dude standing with it. Oh, did he? Oh, no, yeah, it wasn't just him. No, there was two, fuck, dudes. You know what I mean? But I didn't, that dude had kind of like, he wasn't standing with him when we first came up.

Starting point is 00:22:12 Right. But once he had his hand on me, that dude all of a sudden was there. You know what I mean, so I ran downstairs and I was out and got down to the bottom and I saw a guy that I knew. And this is actually hilarious because, again, I wasn't a dealer at the time. I tried to sell like, and I'd done it at school, but I tried to sell it once at a raid party. And I wanted to go dance. I got into break dancing and like seriously like into the music and, you know, it was just more into the culture of it. So I saw this kid. His name is John or Johnny.

Starting point is 00:22:42 I can't recall his name. He's wearing an Adidas hat. And I'm like, dude. I'm in some shit right now. I'm not the type of guy to be in. Like, just trying to explain to him. I'm not the guy. I'm not usually the guy because I'm not, you know, my friend RG.

Starting point is 00:22:55 I'm not the guy that's dealing constantly at the shows. But I need your hat right now. You know what I mean? And he gave me his hat. It was like this blue Adidas hat. And back in the day, Ravers, we used to always wear our hats like this. So I put it on and just started, you know what I mean? Just dancing.

Starting point is 00:23:09 Boom. And then I see dudes swarm and all around on the dance floor. Like looking for me, they think that I'm somewhere in the club because I have left yet. You know what I mean? And I'm dancing, dancing. And then I find that I see them dip and kind of go the other way and I get it clear and I just break for it. Get outside. Get outside and get outside of my friend Carr. RJ's out there. GP is, I don't know what he is. And my girlfriend, I'm like, go back and get the pills. She's like, where are the pill? I'm like, they're on the floor. She goes back inside and she's crawling around the floor with some girl.

Starting point is 00:23:38 Everybody's dancing. I have no idea. And there's hundreds of pills on the floor. And she's crawling on the floor trying to get all the pills back. You know what I mean? She doesn't be getting like 80 of them back. You know, you know? I mean. Out of 200. Yeah. Oh, God. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:23:49 It was, my friend took a, he took an L. You know what I mean on that one, you know? But yeah, just crazy stories. And it turns out those guys are the same guys that rolled schoolie. Those guys were also, interestingly enough, the crew of Sammy Garvano, Sammy the Brogavano's sons, if you're, as you know, the most famous guy that was a hitman for John Gotti. Right. Living in Scottsdale at the time, running the assing ring. He was rolling all.

Starting point is 00:24:16 all the dealers in all the clubs and taking market share. And we were just one of the kids that after that, boom, you got pills in the club and roll you. Was he on, um, uh, was he in witness protection? He was in the witness protection program. This is way before any of this came out. He's in the witness protection program. His sons are running a crew. I don't know, uh, exactly, uh, what the situation was with these dudes. Obviously they were his son's crew. You know what I mean? Sean had speculated there were some biker dudes that may be contracted out. He said his name was Gordon because I asked to do what his name was. That doesn't mean.

Starting point is 00:24:52 Yeah. Who knows? Yeah. Did they ever get those guys ever get arrested that you know of? I assume that their entire crew. They were part of the whole. Yeah. I assume that all those guys rolled on each other and, you know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:25:04 So after a high school, after graduating high school, I say, well, you know, I want to grow kind, bud. What if I do? What's going to happen? I might as well look up the laws and find out. So if I grow over 99 plans, it's federal. Now I'm looking at 20 plus years. If I grow under that and I have a certain amount of weight, then I'm looking at state laws.

Starting point is 00:25:25 I'm looking at in a zero-tolerant state, Arizona in the 1990s, pre-medical. Two to five for your first defense if you get caught with over 10. You know what I mean? I know, it's nothing. It's a child's play. You know what I can do that stand. Matt did that standing on his head. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:25:43 It's not worth unpacking. I know, seriously. You know what I mean? I know. You still shit in McDonald's by the time you get out. There you go. There you go. So I decided to find out what the limits were and really what I was getting myself into.

Starting point is 00:25:56 Because you always want to, you know, look before you leap. Most people don't, but I'm the type of person. Again, incredibly calculative. I'm going to come back to look before you leave. You know what I'm saying? So I go into this endeavor with a friend of mine. At first we were growing small plants and then we learned to grow trees. That's what I learned, essentially.

Starting point is 00:26:13 If you take a plant through its full life cycle and a cutting, put it in a cutting chamber for about two weeks, you pull it out and veg it for two months, you can get a plant that's going to be about this tall. It's going to double its size based on the variety. It could triple it, you know, depending on Indica or Stifa. But in this case, we're growing an Afghani-based indica. We're going back to the Afghani, we're talking about these Afghan genetics. And the strain was called blueberry.

Starting point is 00:26:40 It was essentially the first, some of the first strains that were developed specifically for cancer and for people with end-of-life cancer pain because it was that strong that overtaking morphine you could use this cannabis. And you could still function, though. Long story short, I start to learn the cultivation process. And now, of course, we've got to sell it as we start to grow it. We've got to figure out who to sell it to. And I'm, of course, I know plenty of people.

Starting point is 00:27:12 But I know a couple of guys that I feel can take on the opportunity. And again, I'm not the type of person to just go, I'm not, I'm not 16 anymore. I'm not selling sacks. You know, I'm not, you know, I'm not that type of person. You know what I mean? I'm well past that. I'm already past the court, you know. Well, how much are you producing?

Starting point is 00:27:29 Well, in the beginning, our first plant, we probably got two pounds off of, or not a plant, our first set of plants, maybe four plants. We got two pounds off, maybe eight ounces off each plant. Right. But the key was finding somebody to distribute it to. Because if you could even find a pound of kind bud in 2001, in Arizona. Right. In one place.

Starting point is 00:27:51 Super expensive. Super expensive. It would be $4,800 minimum. You know what I mean? For me, I found two guys that I knew these twins, and I won't mention their names. They're twins. And really solid dudes. And I would only bless them with it.

Starting point is 00:28:07 Straight up. These are the only guys that I would deal with. So as just a younger person, I mean, let's see here, it's 70, 80, 90, I'm 20, you know, just 20 at the time, you know, and working at a restaurant, still doing my thing, obviously. But then now I've got these two guys that'll take pounds off of me for $4,000 a piece. And I'm giving them a good deal, you know what I mean, at $4,000 apiece. And so I end up working with them for the next probably six months to a year. as we build things up. And these are the type of guys that are dependable,

Starting point is 00:28:46 a type of guys you want to deal with. Type of guys, when you do a deal with them, maybe you leave a nice gesture. My friend used to like to drink bomb. He's like gin, so I bring him a bottle of Bombay-Saphyr gin. You know, do good business, right? Right. You know, have a little bit of, like,

Starting point is 00:29:01 a little bit of respect, a little bit of love in it. So we move on. We're doing great with the operation, and it's my first taste of success. making getting into that five, six figures, you know what I mean, which is great. You know, for just some guys that are making money, four or five pounds, doing our little every bi-monthly thing. They're picking up two pounds. For me to see, for me to see, you know, to see $10,000 from a bank is one thing. You see $10,000, just getting a quick payment.

Starting point is 00:29:31 $10,000 in the streets is like this. What do you mean to see $10,000 from a bank? From a bank. 10,000 is like, it's that. Okay. 10,000 in the streets is like this. Oh, okay. It's a bunch of, it's ones and fives and tens. There's not ones, but it's fives and tens and 20s and some 50s.

Starting point is 00:29:48 And hopefully, give me some hundreds. But hey, they weren't paying in hundreds. You know what I mean? It's that. Right. You know what I mean? And so I was going, you know, and it felt good to be a young guy. Yeah, that's why it's always whenever you see these guys with the duffel bags, you know,

Starting point is 00:30:02 and they say like, it's a million dollars and it's a duffel bag this fucking big. It's not. No, a million dollars is not. You know, it stacks like this high. Yeah. It is really, it's not that much at all. I'm going to say, we had, we had six or seven. It's a hundred, ten stacks.

Starting point is 00:30:14 Yeah, we had six or seven hundred, ten stacks will stack out. 100,000 and probably a shoebox, but it was all hundreds, so. Yeah, yeah. But, uh, it's always, you ever see, you've never, you ever watch a movie and they have like two duffel bags like a million? Oh, yeah, the way, yeah, that's got to be like three or four million. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:30:32 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:30:35 Right. You know, a bill weighs a gram. You just weigh it at that point in time, you know. So how long do you get in more houses? Not at this time. So this is my first introduction, but I have learned at this time how to be an A-grade cultivator. I'm putting out some of the best product in Arizona without a doubt.

Starting point is 00:30:57 I mean, there's probably nobody touching what I'm doing, and I'm doing it with love. See, my girlfriend comes back from New York. She doesn't want to be in New York anymore. 9-11's happened. Right. She decides that next, it would be like the next summer or something, I think, which would be about right timing. She decides she wants to come back. And so she's going to live with me, but we're growing.

Starting point is 00:31:19 So lay down some foundational rules about growing and doing anything illegal. Don't live there. Well, you kind of have to in this case. Well, you kind of have to. You have to have somebody living there, which I would learn later on. Okay. You have to have somebody living there. there. Right. All right. Which I would get that. I would pick up on that one. But if you want

Starting point is 00:31:39 something done right, you've got to do it yourself. And I do know that. You know what I mean? Without it down. So she comes back and we're living together. And I've been with her for gosh, four years at this time, five years or four or five years. We're, I mean totally in love. You know what I mean? I was in love with this girl. And my hun friend occasionally like would have to pick her up or something to work or something if I was busy doing something or like on a run maybe right because he didn't he worked daytime landscaping like he bright down the road from where you pick her up you know so my friend who was not attractive at all somehow thinks that my girlfriend is going to like him right so he starts to really like he

Starting point is 00:32:27 starts to fall in love with her you know what I mean like we're all living together and he's like falling in love with my girlfriend. But my girlfriend at the time, as we're getting closer to a large harvest, started feeling more uneasy about staying at the house. Right. Because there's a lot of illegal activity going on. Nobody's coming over. And here's a few rules. If you have a girl house, nobody comes over. Nobody comes over. Like you don't have friends. I had my friend GP, I mentioned. He was kind of wondering my best friend why I hadn't invited him to my new house for like a year. it was starting to get kind of like what's going on yeah

Starting point is 00:33:03 hey I'm up in the village and I'm just doing a job I was gonna drop by it nah man you know what I mean like yeah like time yeah sorry you know and a girl would be something I would completely recommend against

Starting point is 00:33:12 never have a girl from where you're doing it either because I've seen the girl get with another dude and then you're getting robbed or the girl something happens and you're getting rolled over you know you police you know what I mean

Starting point is 00:33:25 like it's it's again taking things out of the equation you know and I obviously I was with this girl for years and she had been you know she she was a a quote unquote roll dog so she was not gonna you know what I mean do any of that stuff and she certainly wasn't the type to do anything like that but she ended up moving back to my parents house temporarily which was like 10 miles away and then she felt awkward just staying kind of my parents so she ended moving back to her parents house she's living down in Phoenix at the time and I ended up hooking up with this girl, brought the girl back to the house. I just wanted to be with a girl.

Starting point is 00:34:01 My girl wasn't there. I, you know what I mean? But I was like lonely. You know what I mean? And, you know, to my fault, I brought another girl back. We were, we weren't together, but we were together. You know what I mean? Like, still in spirit. You know what I mean? But she, you know, I made that mistake. And I did not have sex with her. But my friend before I could tell her, because again, I was like ready to marry this girl. And I was, I remember talking to a friend of I'm like, I got a guy to tell her. I want to marry this girl. He's like, don't tell her.

Starting point is 00:34:27 My other friend was like, don't tell her. And I'm like, I got to tell her. Like, I'm going to marry this girl. I want to be totally up front with her and tell her that I brought this girl back into my room. We didn't have sex, but I did play around with her. You know what I mean? He ends up trying to probably proclaim his love for her. She does not hook up with him.

Starting point is 00:34:44 He tells her that I have hooked up with this other girl. I do not have a chance to even be honest because I think I'm being honest with her when I tell her, but she's already knows. Right. And so I completely ruined that relationship. and I learned a great deal about honesty. We're, again, a year and a half into this operation. We're just ready to clock our largest harvest, probably 25 grand. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:35:05 Maybe, I don't know, a good six pounds or something like that. Maybe 24, probably six pounds. You know, long story short, I come into the room and the whole room has been taken down. All the plants that aren't, we're 30 days away because it's a 60-day cycle in the main room. And he has taken down all the plants. killed them all. Just, he didn't save a single, he did it while I was at work. He didn't do it.

Starting point is 00:35:29 He didn't save a single genetic. And I, you know, hard I'd work to get those genetics. And in, and phyno hunt those genetics and essentially isolate. And how many, we went like six generations in because essentially every time you take a clone from a clone from a clone and you're selecting from the best batch, you're isolating the best genetics from the plant. Why did he do it? Because I didn't know he had already told her and proclaimed his love for her and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and knew that it was going to come down with me and knew that I was going to be leaving. That maybe I would call the cops on him. I don't know what he was thinking.

Starting point is 00:36:05 You know what I mean? Like, he was probably thinking that I would get pissed and, like, rat him out for the operation. He knew the operation had to be done because he was doing some behind the back stuff. Right. You know what I mean? You know, so, so, yeah, I was devastated. And it couldn't get those genetics periodically leading up to. 2010, I probably ran two or three different houses where I would find somebody, I would set them up,

Starting point is 00:36:31 I would bring in the genetics, pay for all of the equipment, and say you grow it, you cultivate it, we'll come in at the end, we'll trim it, and we're going to split it 50-50, and I'll move all the product, and I'll bring you back to 50%. You know what I mean? So a good deal on both sides, but one has a huge risk factor on one side and one has a huge risk factor on the other. A person that's growing it should never be selling it. If you're the grower, never ever should you be the seller. Does that make sense? Yeah. So what happened with those other operations? They worked out? Oh, yeah, they went all right. I mean, some dudes take some pills and they, they f*** up and they don't know how to water correct. And it's never, ever, ever. Perfect. And now, yeah, I mean, you're depending on other people.

Starting point is 00:37:12 The Stoics have a philosophy. Are you familiar? You probably read some philosophy. Stoic philosophy. Yeah, I'm sure you read a lot of philosophy. If it depends on, someone else, it gets zero percent of my attention. If it depends on me, it gets 100 percent of my attention. And if that makes sense, then a quick short narrative for you. You know what I mean? Depending on others is in Camby and Achilles. That's why services are so difficult to scale. If you sleep hot at night, you know how disruptive that can be. Whether you're having trouble falling asleep, you're waking up sweating in the middle of the night or all of the above. That's where ghost bed can help. As the makers of the coolest beds in the world, ghost bed is your go-to for cooling mattresses, cooling pillows, and cooling bedding.

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Starting point is 00:38:33 You'll answer a few questions and get a personalized recommendation. Even better, our listeners can get 50% off site-wide for a limited time. Just visit ghostbed.com slash Cox. and use the code Cox at checkout. Again, that's ghostbed.com slash Cox with the code Cox at the checkout to save a whopping 50% off sitewide. But to move on with the grow houses, again, depending on other people is a challenge. So off and on, I would mess with it, you know, the grow houses and keep a couple going. But again, two to three people that were semi-dependable throughout time, you know.

Starting point is 00:39:11 moving on so my real opportunity came out of a bit of interesting tragedy so in 2008-9 the love for cultivation came back a little bit of some really good genetics it was working with some guys that were cultivating at the time they were getting amazing genetics and um i had lost the last last genetics that I had had. Because again, to start from seed and to do all, it's such a true, so you've really got to get verified genetics from somebody that you know puts out a good crop, you know? So I met some friends through my brother when he was out at the time, and they had amazing genetics. And they were some of the best working on some of the best cultivated genetics in Arizona at the time. So I ended up getting some of these genetics, and I started working with

Starting point is 00:40:11 But at the time, I had an opportunity to link back up. Remember how I mentioned the guy with my friend RJ, his guy? There was a dealer that would fund my guy. We'll call him an angel. He had an angel, right? And this angel investor would call him. He would fund him to the tune of, you know, tens of thousands of dollars to pick up product. And RJ would do that.

Starting point is 00:40:38 Well, RJ ended up developing a huge ketamine habit. ended up getting in touch with his guy through a friend of mine, I end up start moving some product in our town. And then I end up going out for a little pickup to start to pick up a little bit more. And again, I like to say that I don't like to do things in any way that I think I can get in trouble for doing them. Let's say, you know, calculative. You know what I'm saying? Take all the risk out of it. So I could have easily just went out to California. A person, let's say, let's put this in the third person. A person could easily go out to California and pick up 20 or 30 pounds of chronic.

Starting point is 00:41:21 Right. Worth, you know, final street, 100K, 100 and something plus. You know what I mean? Now, they could drive back with it. And chances are you're probably not going to get pulled over. You know, you can get a rental car, you can dress nice, of which I learned from people to do that. You know, you definitely don't want to look the part as we talked about. Do you get pulled over?

Starting point is 00:41:46 Oh, no, no. A person might do that, but I would never do that. I would never drive. That is because even the chance, let's just, you know, the one time you do, you could do 100 runs. Right. But the one time they catch you, you're going to pay back for all those runs. So I've got to go out and pick up some weight. So I go out to see my guys.

Starting point is 00:42:08 And I go out and I have some very good friends out in L.A. that are willing to host me so I can meet, have a house to place to pick up the weight. Okay. Right? They're very kind, lovely people. I love you guys. You know who you are. My friend has once called me the Walter White of cannabis.

Starting point is 00:42:24 That's kind of affectionately what he notes me as with my exploits and past exploits, with not only cultivating specifically and moving into the research as a medical ham researcher. But that's now. We'll talk about then. So moving to pick up the 20 pack, a little interesting. introductory lesson and just picking up, wait, so you've got to go meet the guys. They pull up in a car. You're meeting people you have never met before, right? As they pull up, two dudes get out, hippie-looking black dude, just wearing it. You know what I mean? His name's peace. Okay. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:43:00 And I won't mention the other dude's name because that's his probably, that's his, is, is God-given name. So anyways, I meet peace and friend. Right. Which are, which like kind of like number two. The one dude is basically like a number two to my dude. You know what I mean? They do all the major distribution. They meet the guys that then fan out from L.A.

Starting point is 00:43:21 across the United States and distribute all the product. Right. So, dude show up, meet them. You look at each other to make sure you're good. You give each other a hug. You feel each other out. You know what I'm saying? You're not just, you know, because you're really,

Starting point is 00:43:38 everybody's trying to feel a situation. And you can just tell. I'm sure you can tell, right, with somebody's being... No, I got a wire warrant on me. No, you didn't. For like 10 minutes, it took me about 10, 15 minutes to realize it. But after you started thinking back... Yeah, yeah. If I had walked in the room thinking it, I would have caught on right away.

Starting point is 00:43:55 Well, here's a lesson for you. Everybody is wearing a wire. Right. That's all I feel. No, no, I'm going to tell you right now. And if you're even doing anything illegal, and this is why if anybody that's watching this wants to go back 15 years, you'll never find me saying, anything illegal on the phone. Never. It's either, I'm going to see you there, where are we going to meet.

Starting point is 00:44:18 Right. I will talk to you when I get there. Where are we meeting for lunch? You know what I mean? There's no, you know what I mean? Anybody that, and anybody that then chooses to talk, you know what I mean? Or if you're in person, it's a person and you're doing a deal with somebody and they're reiterating, like I said, what you're doing. Oh, oh, so it's 2000, right? Oh, so for the pound, are we going to? going to be able to get more of these in the future? You know what I mean? I wouldn't say anything. I'd be like, Tony Soprano, oh, this pie is good. You know what I mean? You just don't say anything.

Starting point is 00:44:48 You know what I mean? And I've had people try to. And that's why going through the situation that I'm going to tell you about, why I am here to tell the story today in good stead. Right. So long story short, get on the train, but not the L.A. Union Station train because there's a ton of security there. So you get on this little train station.

Starting point is 00:45:06 There's nobody there. You're riding with Amish people. And some black folk. Right. Because it's run into Detroit and Chicago. Not a lot of people take the train anymore, you know. So would I take the train looking like this? Would I take the train looking like, you know, with the baggy pants?

Starting point is 00:45:21 No way. Take the train wearing the Ralph Lauren sweater looking kind of like, I'm not really that threatening. And if I wanted to be cool, I just couldn't be that cool. Right. I wanted to be cool, but I just couldn't be that cool. You know, and, you know, if it's a duck, you know, if it walks like a duck, quite like a duck, yeah.

Starting point is 00:45:47 It's a duck, you know, and we know the police profile and security, and they got about 30 seconds, any person in authority to kind of look at you and suss you out, you know. And so my friend was even kind enough, who I love, my man Pick, which is in his real name, my man, was able to give me these glasses. His mom didn't name him pick. Right. Horn rim, looking like Malcolm X's white cousin. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:46:09 Yeah. Perfect. You know what I mean? Get on the train. Now you got to have luggage. You got to have your luggage attached, little tags. And then you put your name on them. You don't write any false shit. You put, you know what I mean? You know what I mean? It's your luggage. You know what I'm saying? If you don't put the tags on, they go through to make sure that the tags are on the luggage. If they don't see a luggage tag, guess what they see? Somebody's trying to run some product because people do that. But the only thing it says is, please notify a security representative if you see something suspicious. Well, there's nobody to notify. It's, nine o'clock at night when I'm getting on the train. And again, let's make sure that we're going to make it safe. We're driving overnight. We're going through the middle of night. We're going to be entering a train station in Flagstaff, Arizona at like three in the morning. Now, unless somebody's waiting for me and knows that I'm coming, there's like no chance that I'm going to get in trouble, right?

Starting point is 00:47:01 And very little, right? So I get the wait. I go inside the house, getting ready to plan my trip, which I just talked about. and I have to wrap it all up because you can't just carry, you know, 20 pounds like it is. So you got to get a food sealer, you know, those little seal meals, and you got to seal every pound. And you take a pound that's like this big and you break it down into a flat brick like this. And then you put it into another sealer. You wash your hands, right?

Starting point is 00:47:29 Then you wash the bag and you put it into another seal. You put them in the shower and take 20 pounds, wash them all. Because guess what? You could put them in all these nice sealed bags. that nobody could smell, that no dog could smell once you triple seal it. But guess what? You get some resin on the outside of the bag, and a dog will pick it up right away. And you're...

Starting point is 00:47:49 You know what I'm saying? So, now you can pack up 20 pounds. You know, like I said, around 100K, you know what I mean? You know, full net, you know what I mean? And you can carry that in two little bags. Get on the train and you're cool as a cucumber. You know what I'm saying? Just trying to blend in.

Starting point is 00:48:06 You know what I mean? Trying to be the mark on the train. you know, and heading back to a college, which is perfect. So now you get to Flagstaff and you're only 45 minutes north of your house. So what do you do then? You could have your car. All you got to do is just drive down this two-lane canyon. Pretty safe.

Starting point is 00:48:22 Chance. I mean, I've never seen police officers in that canyon. You think I drive my car down there with 20 pounds? No. No, son. You know what I mean? Only a fool would touch down on the streets with weight like that. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:48:36 So what do you do? Oh, you get somebody else to do it for you. You get a shuttle. You get a cab. You ever seen a cop pull over a shuttle bus? No. You know, they just don't do it, not unless there's somebody really doing something. You ever see a cop pull over a city bus?

Starting point is 00:48:55 No. No. Hmm. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, so you get a shuttle. And the shuttle whisks you right to your safe area. You know, and the shuttle driver's talking about, he's smoking I don't know what he's talking about like you know what I mean like he wants to be cool

Starting point is 00:49:11 and he has no idea and you don't look like the guy you know what I mean you're just you know what I'm saying you know and you make it back and you're able to start breaking it down you know so something that goes for 18 or you get for 18 it get it there for 15 but here 18 you know what I mean 18 and then what 32 so you're making probably 15 on each each month a person could just easily distribute 20 of those one person person could take two a week. You're dealing with five different people. And again, you're not dealing with too many people because if you're dealing with too many people, you're risking not knowing who you're dealing with. So, long story short, we do that for a good little period of time,

Starting point is 00:49:50 you know, and I go on a couple of trips. I have to do a couple to prove myself, but now I'm getting de journo. Delivery is de journo. You know what I'm saying? It would always come in these military, you know, those military, like laundry bags. There'd be five of those in there. So you're talking easily, you know, 100, 120 pounds that are being moved across. How in mailbags, big mailbags. It makes me think of big mail bags. Yeah, yeah, and it's easy. It's like, and nobody can really tell.

Starting point is 00:50:15 You know, I remember getting it and pulling out of the trunk. I was like, oh, you guys got my laundry? You know what I mean? Oh, no. And I'm walking in L.A., you know, my friend's ghetto apartment complex. I'll say, I have a Pulp Fiction. You know what I mean? You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:50:26 You know what I mean? You know what I mean? Yeah. Anyways, so I'm doing great. And we're eating steak. You know what I'm saying? We're, you know, my wife and I, you know what I mean? Like, we're doing our little trips.

Starting point is 00:50:39 It's just me, her, and my son. You know, I'm not like bawling out hard. You know what I mean? You know, I mean, come on. You know, making like 20, I don't know. You could do the math. You know what I mean? At 20 packs a month, fronting them off, always easy, fronting them off, getting 32,

Starting point is 00:50:53 three to 32. So I can make 12 to 14. You know what I mean? And I wasn't breaking any of it down. Occasionally cutie pies, quarter pounds will call them. You know what I mean, here and there, you know. Doing well. and then, of course, well, the other shoe has to drop at some point in time.

Starting point is 00:51:11 So I'm working with a friend of mine. I'm still working as a chef at the time. I work for this restaurant and owner for about six years, never missed a day of work. You know what I mean? It's a solid employee. I'm at the time running the line as a chef. And running packs, not out the back, but constantly setting up, you know, sending up my deal so I can keep my things blown.

Starting point is 00:51:35 I like little five people, people I trust. Well, I go to drop off a couple of things kind of happen and culminate. It begins with a girl that I'm working with is going to a company party, and she's getting packs that she's bringing in because she's from California. And she had mentioned to me in like, you need some weight, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, no, I'm good. But by me saying I'm good, she knew that I was good, not like I didn't want any. Right.

Starting point is 00:52:03 she's like, well, what do you get them for? And I was like, well, I'm getting packed for cost. I'm not going to buy your packs that are coming out here. And you're, you know, what I'm charging for people, you know what I mean? Anyways, she gets busted on the way to a company party with a bunch of sacks, this little town. You know what I mean? They probably smoke some weed and got pulled over. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:52:23 At night, the cops are very, like, super predatory. You know, they're like on the side of the main road. You know what I mean? Profiling and, you know, you look like you're not squirt. squared away, you know, they might check you out, you know, especially no, you know. No, I know. Some people call it doing, doing their job. Go ahead.

Starting point is 00:52:40 Yeah. Yeah. Well, or I call it profiling a certain area, a certain. But with that being. And they happened to catch this shit with that. I was pulled over and searched seven times by the time I was 19 years old. You know how. You were selling dope.

Starting point is 00:52:53 But, well, you got, you got a good argument. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyways. So, um, of doing well. and I again mentioned to her just in passing, because she's a server at the restaurant, and then, you know, time goes by. Then I go to drop off pound to my friend Doboy.

Starting point is 00:53:17 Shout out Do Boy. And anything I ever did, I did it in such a way that you wouldn't see it. So if I was delivering, I would, I mean, I'll put on a shirt and a tie for you. I'll put on, you know, I mean, like, back then, I would, I would try to not look this, you know, I mean like this, but more like businessy. And I used to carry around a briefcase. Right. And that's what I used to carry my weight in. And so I go into a business. And these people were business owners. So I go and see them. We go on the back. And it never looked completely, you know, you might guess, oh, what's he doing? What's in there? But you have to know, and unless somebody's

Starting point is 00:53:52 going to say, you're going to catch that person with something, there's really not a lot you can do about it. You know what I mean? So long story short, I'm visiting and dropping off at a person's house. And I always, even, no matter where I am, I always make sure I'm covered. So I pull in my car and I pull in up in front of his house blocking his front door. It's in my truck at the time. But I get the out of this side and I put it in, I used to like to carry a refrigerator bottle, like a little lunch freezer things that, you know, like keep your lunch cold. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:54:28 A little like a lunch bag. And that's what I would put them in. You know what I mean? You could just barely fit one in it. You know what I mean? And then I could also put that underneath my hood of my car, of which any time I was driving even around my town, I'd pop have it in the hood of my car. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, you got to check the oil real quick. You know what I'm saying? People aren't even thinking about it. I don't know why. I actually had surveillance watching me while I did it once. And they had no idea. I'll go on to tell you the story. This is hilarious. So, yeah, I drop off the pound. I have no idea at the time. There's an investigation being run on the house next door. So here's my friend's house, the house here. Across the street is the narcotics task force running an investigation on this house next door who's selling this, right?

Starting point is 00:55:20 They've got a snitch, a snitch by the name of Sean Reese, the one-tooth bandit who we used to call the one-tooth bandit growing up. And I realized why he snitched on us because we, you know, used to call him that. He used to say, he must be dead already, too. I don't know. Actually, you know, I heard he got new teeth and he's in New Mexico, but he had those, like, real bad teeth from the mom let you have the bottle all day and the teeth never grew in. You know what I'm saying?

Starting point is 00:55:50 You ever seen that? Or the teeth never grow in? No. It's from a mom that let the baby just sit on the bottle or a pacifier and never, like, and their teeth don't grow in. It's always like, so we'd be like, I remember on probation once, like a work crew thing back in the day. He was on it, and he'd gumming down the sandwiches.

Starting point is 00:56:06 And, you know, we're making fun of him. And I understandably, I get why you did it because we were mean. You know what I mean? You know, but I heard he's got new teeth and he's living in New Mexico. You know what I'm saying? Good for him. Yeah, there you go. Hopefully the new teeth, you know, I said him on play.

Starting point is 00:56:22 But he ends up, and the reason they find out is because he picks up some, he comes in and picks up some from this guy who I went to school with. And then he comes over to my dude and double teams it, picks up a sack, double dipping. picks up a sack of one. Two investigations sets up these two dudes in one and then asks a dude, yo, where are you getting this from? And do-boy had to say, I'm getting it for me in, you know, small town, maybe want to be cool. You know what I mean? I'm getting it for me. I don't know. Anyways, but I got a lot of respect for doughboy because he didn't say anything. He got rolled on. They hit him coming out of the bar. Again, they're going to catch you slipping. He liked to drink. They pulled him over coming out of the bar. Of course he had a little and a pipe on him.

Starting point is 00:57:13 Went back to his house because if they catch you with something like that, zero tolerance state, they're going to come back to your house and they're immediately going to get a warrant. Hit his house, found almost a fresh pound. I'd probably dropped off three days ago because they're running an investigation. You know what I mean? I get a call. This is a friend of doughboys. He just wants you to let you know. He got busted. And I'm like, I don't know. Who's calling me, first of all right? Do you know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:57:40 And I was like, okay. Is he all right? He's like, I think he's going to be all right. And he's like, I'm kind of like a lawyer. I was like, who are you? And he's like, I'm like kind of like a lawyer friend of his. You know what I mean? He said he just wanted to let you know.

Starting point is 00:57:53 So looking back on it. You probably told somebody in jail that was getting out maybe to, hey, call this, never tell this guy. See, I don't. Yes. I don't know if it was that or, or if it was. was them calling me and fishing. Oh, that doesn't seem. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:58:10 But I felt, I felt it was genuine. And I said, thank you so much. I didn't say anything. You know what I just said? Thank you so much. I hope he's all right. You know, which I genuinely do. He's a good dude.

Starting point is 00:58:19 He's always been a good person and an honorable person. It did not snitch on me. Did not give the list of 10 names that they ask you for. You know what I mean? When they roll on you, they ask you. And I will go into this. You know what I'm saying? So, um,

Starting point is 00:58:33 Do Boys Busted, my name has probably been mentioned by this other girl. I don't know this yet. I have no idea about this yet, but this is all kind of, you know, and then, you know, as they would say, my name is ringing in the streets, you know what I mean? Like I'm supplying, you know, potentially, you know, allegedly, I'm allegedly supplying 20 to 30 pounds of chronic a month to this little town and valley. There's, you know, little town, little town, you know, and if you think about how many people smoke, you know what I mean, in this little town.

Starting point is 00:59:03 town, I'm generally supplying most of the people. And anybody that knows, I'm breaking down it from five people. And those five people are all in different towns or in different sectors. You know what I mean? Long story short, getting ready to go to work one day. And I've got my studio equipment. You know, I got my little shirt, SM7B. You know what I mean? You know, got my nice setup. I got I'm making some music. And I hear dog barking, my dog. And I'm smoking a joint. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:59:40 Put my joint down, put it, you know, sat in the ashtray or whatever. And I go out and I walk out. And I'm just assuming it's going to be some regular person. And the music had been loud, so I didn't really hear all the knocking. I just doing my dog, Des, Des, get back, tell him my little dog, my little miniature pinch. You know what I mean? Not Fierce dog or anything. And man, I open up the door.

Starting point is 01:00:02 And there are four or five, maybe, five narcotics officers standing on my porch. One's got the battering ram, and they got their name of their narcotics task. I'm not going to say what it is, because I'm not, you know what I mean? I'm not going to go into the, you know what I mean? It's the local narcotics task force. They run the entire valley in our county. And immediately shut the door and lock it.

Starting point is 01:00:29 and then boom boom boom sheriff's department we're going to knock it down and i just like opened it up let them in boom they come in right now i'm surprised as hell now there's been a couple things leading up to this one time there was a car that drove by and was taken it was all the dope that let let up no no no there's a couple things like all the sales and the drug dealing yeah um um the selling of high quality cannabis goods pre-market ahead of the curve we can call that so um i had seen what okay so i i live in my room here i've been basically doing illegal shit since i was you know 15 16 years old right so i even to this day when i drive you'll never catch you'll never get me for a ticket or anything

Starting point is 01:01:27 like that i live in my rear room here it's just something that you build up from years of not wanting or waiting for an officer to get behind you so you can hide your, always, always at least like carrying some on me. So I'm always a felony because it's a zero tolerant state. So like just living like that. And it's a minor shit, you know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:01:45 But again, like the levels of paranoia. Like I pretty much have PTSD from always doing that, you know, and having to be fear of the law. And never really having a, I have had respect and have met a few really good police officers. And I love the police officers in our town because it's a wealthy town and they don't prey on the individuals in the town. Right.

Starting point is 01:02:05 You know what I mean? It's a different thing. You know, they pull people over for tickets, you know, like the speeding tickets. That's it. But long story short, yeah, they roll in. And I'm like, what am I going to do? But I know that I don't have any weight on me. Because, again, collateral damage.

Starting point is 01:02:23 Think about what's going to happen. You know what I mean? Now, again, we had had some things leading up to this. Somebody had drove them by. And somebody was like blatantly taking a picture as they drove by. Like, they pulled up and we're outside. and they're like, he,

Starting point is 01:02:34 king, like, you know, they weren't trying to hide. So I thought, my wife thought maybe they're taking a picture

Starting point is 01:02:37 of the house next door. Um, a suspicious car down the road one time when I was walking to go see a friend, you know, that lived in the neighborhood. But apparently I've been under surveillance

Starting point is 01:02:47 for three months and I really had no idea. Right. Whatsoever. You know what I mean? They don't do their own surveillance. This is a key point to the conversation. They hire out and subcontract their surveillance

Starting point is 01:02:59 to PIs. And they, those PI departments, often have people that have to issue bench warrants and summonses, right? They have to issue a summons. Right. You know, the people that bring you and they're like, are you been served or whatever? Yeah. Right. Okay. So we get a call from a little bird, and I cannot say who. My wife does. She gets a call. And essentially it's the effect of, hey, some people have been getting busted in town. Did you hear about this purpose? that got busted, and it was from a family friend person. Well, that person may have been related to this

Starting point is 01:03:50 company that was running the investigation on us. So we were able to essentially a couple of days before that happened, literally the week before that happened, maybe three days before, get a phone call that said some things have been happening. Did you hear it? And it just, it wasn't them saying, hey, something's going to happen. They were just highlight. It was a weird call out of the blue. Person doesn't call or contact us or regular.

Starting point is 01:04:24 We're not in regular contact with them. You know, we would look back and realize that that person was possibly connected likely with that. I don't want to go, you know what I mean, into that agency. Right. trying to tell you, like, prepare yourself. Because my wife's ex used to serve. My wife's ex used to work for that company and serve. Okay.

Starting point is 01:04:48 But it wasn't him. Yeah, but it wasn't him. Right. It was somebody else that was, that just kind of gave the, you know what I mean? And so they came to the house and they caught, they caught me with 12 burnt joints. which was 12 roaches. But there was a little bit of a wrinkle. They caught me with an ounce of hash.

Starting point is 01:05:14 Now, remember I talked about the hash before? I was making significant amounts of processing significant amounts of hash at the time. And there was nobody in town with it. And I mean, nobody. You know what I mean? It's very rare. It's like an oddity.

Starting point is 01:05:28 You know what I mean? You just don't see it at the time. And that was getting around. And there's one more person because I had, not been introduced to somebody, but my same friend, Do Boy, had told me that somebody else that I had known from school wanted to connect. I ended up connecting with him, and I ended up only hooking him up with first and button then the hash. But I never did in hand-to-hands. Because, again, these are some rules.

Starting point is 01:05:57 Everybody is an undercover, literally. The person that you're talking to was wired. You're being watched. You're being surveilled. Right. You know what I mean? So if you take this into account, you're likely, nobody's going to see you do anything. So after three months of surveillance, and we'll get back to me sitting in the house after they've raided. After three months of surveillance, they could not figure out whether or not I was really the guy or not. Because they came into my house and I had a little bit of hash. But here's the problem. In Arizona at the time, hash is still a narcotic. Right. It wasn't legal yet. We're still pre-legal cannabis. Right. And it's listed as a Schedule 1 narcotic, which is right up there with Hatteramine. Anything you could think of a lower level.

Starting point is 01:06:36 Here's the problem. If you have more than seven grams, because in our state, the scourge of methamphetamine, if you have more than seven grams of any narcotic, it's a minimum two and a half years in prison. I can't help you. Like, there's just nothing we can do. It's two and a half years in prison. And you clearly have it. You clearly have it.

Starting point is 01:06:54 I have an ounce. I've got three times that amount. I got four times that amount. They got a search warrant and you've got it on you. And I'm not 100% sure if they have a search warrant at this time. In the heat of the, you know what I mean? You don't ask, let me see the warm, you know what I mean? You assume.

Starting point is 01:07:11 Right. You know. And so he's got me dead to rights on this. And he, you know, he sets me down in my daughter's room. My wife, I don't know, has already been pulled over. She is in a police. She has a narcotics officer driving her car, and she is in the back with our kids. She had just left.

Starting point is 01:07:32 It was my daughter's. It was January 20. 29th, 2010. And I know that because my body of birthday was on January 28th. And I thank God that they didn't come during our birthday party. I think they had the respect to do that because they wanted to try to work with me. You know what I'm saying? Long story short, I'm sitting in my daughter's room with three of the narcotics officers,

Starting point is 01:07:57 one who was very attractive, who was not with us. And he sets me down, he says, you know, I, I know we didn't catch you with too much, but we got this hash, and I don't know what to do about it. You know what I'm saying? You know, we, you know, and you know, the narcotics is over seven grams, he says, and, you know, and he's kind of, you know, car salesmanning the situation. You know what I mean? And the car's got, you know, 40,000 miles on it. And, you know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:08:25 Anyways, I said, I don't know what to do about this, you know, and says, you know, maybe, you know, you could help us out. You know what I mean? And I'm like, well, help you out. What am I going to help you out with? You know what I mean? He's like, well... You already got dough boy. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:08:39 Well, yeah. He's like, well, you know, you... You know, you... You know, you... Give us a list of names. You know what I mean? I'm like, why would I want to do that? He says, well, you know, again, you know, we could be looking at some serious, you know,

Starting point is 01:08:53 two and a half, you got your kid, you know what I mean? He's got me in my daughter's room for dramatic effect. Yeah, yeah. You know, he didn't sit me down to living room where we were at earlier. Right. You know what I mean? He's got me in my daughter's room. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:09:04 Like that's gonna, you know what I mean? I'm sure for somebody looking at 20 years or something, they probably, you know what I mean? But anyways. You're looking at two? Two and a half. Yeah, come on. You know what I mean? And again, so he's like, well, maybe you can just give me a list of the names.

Starting point is 01:09:18 You know what I don't know anybody. And I don't. At this time, I mean, I know my people. Oh, fuck you. You know what I mean? You know what I mean? He's like, well, you don't know anybody. And at this time, he's not found the way.

Starting point is 01:09:29 He knew he was going to come and find. find the weight. Yeah. So he was he was hoping for a lot more than this. He was hoping for 20 packs. Oh, 18 packs. Yeah. He, yeah, you know what I mean. And I had just had a fresh deliver. I had to find 18 packs still sitting somewhere else. Yeah. But you always keep it somewhere else where they can't just run a investigation on. They can't just search and you always keep it with a square. Because if it's with a square and they leave their house and they don't have dope with them, you can't pull them over in. There's no way. Yeah. You can't pull them over. You can't. You can't. You got to with this. No. Yeah. You just, you know what I mean? You know,

Starting point is 01:10:00 you know, some grandpa, you know what's there. You know what I mean? Maybe they don't even know it's there. Remember Ray Leod and Goodfellas? They take the guns to, to the mom's house. Oh, yeah, yeah. Why are we always taking them to my mom's house? She says, you know what I mean? I don't even remember that scene. They go in the mom's garage or the helicopter phone. Yeah. You know, they can't search their house. They're not, I mean, you know, they're likely. They have to get a warrant. To get a warrant on somebody else's house that hasn't committed a crime, hasn't done anything, you know, is next to impossible. Right. You know what I'm saying? So long story short, I'm not feeling too bad. You know what I'm I'm saying. He's like, well, you know, you know, this is going to be pretty serious. You know what I'm saying?

Starting point is 01:10:34 And he's like, maybe he'll give us some bad guys. You know, I'm like, I don't know any, I'm like, come on, I don't know any bad guys. Like, you know, I'm like, I'm a good guy. You know, I'm like, I know any bad guys, you know? And so you can see he's kind of like running out of steam. He's blown his popcorn fart of a bust. No offense. You know what I mean? And he's trying to lean on me like the car salesman with this is going to be a big thing for you. You know what I mean? I said, well, you know, like that scene, have you ever seen the 25th, Yeah. Love it. Yeah. Well, you know, Judge, I do have shingles, and it is a chronic medical condition.

Starting point is 01:11:10 And I really only use this as my medicine. And I don't have any baggies, and I don't have any scales. And, you know, it's going to be legal in like four months. Actually, the legislation just passed already in November. We're just waiting for them to write the legislation. So, you know, I literally said this to him. Right. Do you know what I mean? Like, you know, like, I'm talking to him like the judge.

Starting point is 01:11:37 Oh, you know, I mean? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like in that, it was hilarious. You know what I mean? And you can see he was discouraged. And at that point, he could really, you know, he's like, well, you're the guy. And I'm like, I'm not the guy. Doughboy was the guy.

Starting point is 01:11:51 Because he already got Dope. You know what I'm like? D'Oboy was the man. And it seems like it makes sense. Yeah. You know what I mean? Anyways, so he wants a list, and I just say, I can't help you. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:12:01 He says, well, I'll tell you what? This is hilarious. All right? He says, you tell me whether or not you want to cooperate tomorrow. I'll let you go to work. Nice guy. So I'm like, you've just raided my house. I'm sitting here.

Starting point is 01:12:17 And I'm pretending like, I don't know. Like, I've not read every crime book. Like, I don't know anything about, you know what I mean? Like, I don't know. I don't know. You might have to tell on somebody? Right. Do I work for you?

Starting point is 01:12:26 Like, so do I work for you? I don't know. You know what I mean? You know, like just, you know, pretending. And he's like, so, look, I'll tell you what. Talk tomorrow and you tell me if you want to cooperate or not. And I was like, this will let me out. Right.

Starting point is 01:12:40 I said, what? They said, you give me your word. You'll call me tomorrow and tell me if you want to cooperate or not. And I looked at him. And I was like, deal. Stuck out my hand. Right. I put it out.

Starting point is 01:12:56 so quick. He didn't know what he was shaken to. He had no idea what he was shaken to. And I'll go on. And I'm a man of my word. I shook the man's hand. And I promised him I would call him the next day at 1030 and tell him if I wanted to cooperate or not. So what did I do? I pretended to go to work that night, which was up this town, like a town outside of Cottonwood where I live. They have to go up this little town. So I put on all my chef's gear. in black, because I'm planning to be in black that night anyways, because I'm going to need to be in black, get in my car and I drive up, and I make sure that I'm not being followed, and on the way, I've got one of my guys that I supply to, that lives on the way to where I work at in this town

Starting point is 01:13:43 in Jerome. Make sure I'm not follow, boom, dip in, because it's a two lane, you know what I mean, dip into his house, and I roll up, and I'm like, dude, he's like, what's going on? I just got busted, and he's like, you know what I mean, like waiting for the cops to come in, you know what I mean? because, you know, you just tell somebody you just got busted. Like, what the fuck are you doing here then? You know what I mean? Like, I'm running for the cops. What are you doing here?

Starting point is 01:14:04 You know what I mean? I was like, I just got busing. He's like, what the fuck? He's like, come in, come in. You know what I mean? So I come in. And I'm like, dude, I need to make some phone calls. I can't use my phone.

Starting point is 01:14:12 You know what I mean? So I have my regular phone and I had a burner phone. Never use your regular phone. I still have that phone to this day. I've had that phone for, I've had the longest running cell phone number of almost anybody I know at 23 years. Do you know what I mean? It's had a cell phone number for 23 years? Nobody.

Starting point is 01:14:28 And that speaks a lot to credibility and to somebody that doesn't want to just disappear. You know what I'm saying? But I always had a burner because you use a burner. You know what I mean? Even on that you don't say anything. You know what I'm saying? Funny story about the burner. I tried to put the burner into a cup of water to burn it.

Starting point is 01:14:46 I'm starting getting texts like 30 minutes later. Those phones are nicer than my iPhone. You couldn't put an iPhone in water. Hilarious. I'm joking. You know what I mean? So long story short, he gives me the opportunity. Boom. Well, they find a little bit of money. I like maybe a grand on me. You know what I mean? And the phone. And it was in an envelope. But I always write on the envelope car money or car savings. Like you always, you designate. Because you can be driving through a place with 10K. And if you don't have a designated reason for it, they don't take it from you. They could if they see it. You know, you'd have to be able to approve receipts. And then you got to get it back. You know, it's a big deal. So long story short, they take a picture of the cell phone, and I can see. I know the way they laid it out, and they put the money out on the cell phone. They did it for a picture, for their own evidence. One thing they did, which is hilarious, is they took my passport. I look for my passport. I don't know how long after that, and I never found it. I used to keep it right on my studio. But which that passport was awesome. Because I had Stamps, Mutual Khan, Guadalajara, London, Italy, you know, I mean, all over the world. You know what I'm saying? But long story short, he gave me the opportunity. So I go up there and I get on the phone immediately and don't go to work, which is the first time I've ever not gone to work is a no call, no show. We're getting close.

Starting point is 01:16:01 Anyways, no call, no show, you're fired. But at this point, I've got other things to do. He's going to let me go and go to work. Well, I'm not going to work. I'm going to go pick up the weight and get rid of it because I don't know if they're going to hit the house. I don't know. At this point, I don't know what they've got. He mentioned in passing when we're in the house, he said, I almost picked you up today coming out of such and such place.

Starting point is 01:16:24 So he knows where it is. So he doesn't realize he knows where it is, but he knows where it is. He was fishing. Yeah. He waited for me. He waited for my response. You know how you, if you say something immediately? You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:16:35 You bite. You know what I mean? I just. So the whole time I'm sitting there, he's talking, he's talking, he's talking. And I'm just sitting there like this. Just listening. Calm is a cucumber. Now my heart's racing inside.

Starting point is 01:16:47 But in like I told you before, in any seriously sticky situation, I get super calm. I probably more nervous here talking to you than I am in a situation getting rated. Like I actually start to yawn. You'll notice if I'm really nervous, I'll start to yawn. It's like a weird reaction. But it looks good because you're not, do you know what I mean? You're totally chill, right? Long story short.

Starting point is 01:17:10 Go and wait till that night. I call my dude, my angel. My angel's in California. He sets me up with a guy in Sedona. That guy comes and meets me. Picks me up, takes me to another car because I can't. My car's like burned. I'm not going to be driving that around.

Starting point is 01:17:26 Plus it's like a bright red Chevy truck. Like, you know, it's very distinct, you know. So he gets me a car. which is totally straight, like an old man's paperwork, you know what I mean, like a squares car. You know what I mean? So then we go and we set up a time so that we can meet out at the spot so that I can go and get the wait. So this is probably we set up for maybe like 9 o'clock at night. So we go and we have to park.

Starting point is 01:17:52 I have to park the car. So like I pull off the main road and I pull off onto a side road, right? And I parked the car here. Well, it's not really in front of anybody's house. It's just kind of like nondescript on the side of the road. I've got to run down this long, like, like an irrigation ditch. There's like six feet deep, seven feet deep, these huge irrigation ditch, right? And they run behind people's properties, you know, like water irrigation culverts.

Starting point is 01:18:15 So I'm in all black in my chef's uniform because it's, you know, black on black. And I dip the car. And I tell my dude, I was like, come back in about 15 minutes. We tried to time it as best we could, right? So I got to watch time. Boom, I go. I dip into the back place, pick up the packs. there's still 18 out of the 20 left because I just got in a fresh delivery.

Starting point is 01:18:35 Put the duffel bag on. And now I've got to run back down the ditch, huffing it down the ditch. Boom, boom, boom, boom. Just sweating and really paranoid, running with a decent sentence on my back. You know what I mean? Anyways, I end up making it to there's like an overbridge. So, you know, there's always a bridge. It goes over a goalie, you know, because there has to be a bridge because it's, you know, a goalie, right?

Starting point is 01:18:58 Anyways, I run as I'm getting up there. I see the lights come in. And it's like 9 o'clock at night. It's in a pretty chill neighborhood. There's not a lot of police or not a lot of like anybody out. I come running up. And as I come running up, I can see the lights and I already have to go underneath the little bridge thing. It's a sheriff.

Starting point is 01:19:16 Freaking sheriff out of nowhere is in like, you know, sheriff's SUV. What turns out when I'm assuming is I had parked the car there 15 minutes earlier. Somebody maybe had called on this car like being out. Right. You know what I mean? So he sees a car. So I come running up and I'm underneath the bridge. He's literally pulling over.

Starting point is 01:19:35 I thought it was going to be my dude and the lights and I ended up looking. It was him. He couldn't see me because I'm weighed, you know, it's seven feet down and then dark, you know, pitch black, dark, goalie, you know what I mean? And I'm saying he stops on the bridge, literally stops. You hear the little break screech. And I'm just sitting there holding the duffel bag. And then I hear the, and I see the red from the brake lights start to pull off.

Starting point is 01:20:00 as he's starting to pull off. Anyways, he sees the car. So he's on the car, right? So he's trying to figure out what's up. But he stopped for a second to see if there was something weird going on in the goalie. He ends up making it to the car. He's still in sight. I sneak up out of the goalie.

Starting point is 01:20:15 Throw the bag right as I'm getting up out. Boom, bag's gone. I'm out of here. Run down the road and I have to still make it back like, I don't know, quarter mile back to where I'm back to my safe spot. Right. Where the weight was. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:20:30 Because I can go in there. You know what I mean? Anyways, long story short, ended up getting all the way back to the dude. The dude picked it up like, I don't know, maybe like an hour later because I told him, I said there's a sheriff. You know what I mean? Keep it on the low. So he came back.

Starting point is 01:20:42 Dude was able to get all his way back. And to this day, I still have amazing credit. You know what I'm saying? With the guy. You know, if you were still in business, everything was legal and that's all, you know, but, but yeah. So the next day, the next morning I got up and I am a man of my word. I got up and I called the best lawyer I could find.

Starting point is 01:21:00 which was the former, the former, the former prosecuting attorney for narcotics for over 15 years for the county had started his own defense firm. And I went with that guy. I called him up. We got a $1,500 retainer. And I said, please let this dude know. I've got a call with him at 1030. Please let him know. I do not wish to cooperate. So just like the man of my word that I am, I got on the phone with Brett, we got on a three-way, the gentleman. And I said, I'm on the phone with you. I'm a man of my word and I'm here to meet with you and here's my lawyer. And my lawyer said, Ian Peterson does not wish to cooperate with you. All right. Boom. So then we go back and forth.

Starting point is 01:21:39 So I got to meet my lawyer, right? And sit down and talk about the case, right? So again, I haven't gotten arrested. I hate to interrupt the podcast, but I need your help. Have you been or do you know anyone that has been arrested in Polk County? If you have, please contact me. We are desperately looking for guests that have been arrested in Polk County by Grady Judd. last video we did actually got a million views. If you've been arrested, please go in the

Starting point is 01:22:05 description box. Either contact me directly. My email's there. Or you can fill out the form that we've got. There's a link to the form. My email address is there. You fill out the form or email me. We will contact you. And we're going to try and get you on the program. Amazing. You know what I mean? Thank you. You know what I'm saying? And basically, again, led the guy a little bit. But hey, I'm a man of my word. You know what I mean? I didn't agree to cooperate, but I didn't not agree. You know what I'm saying?

Starting point is 01:22:33 So lawyers told him, we're going to not cooperate. Then this is where the car salesman stuff starts. So the guy is the leader of the narcotics. Right. He's the narcotics detective. He runs the show. He's all, well, my boss is saying that this is going to be a problem. And, you know, if you don't cooperate, we can maybe even push for more than the two and a half years.

Starting point is 01:22:55 You know what I'm saying? You know, my boss is really wanting to push for this. And it's like, come on. Like, you know, it's like the car salesman guy. Oh, my, can I go authorize the free gear shifter for him? Yeah. You walk in there and talk to the dude for a second about his weekend and go back and say, yeah, I can authorize the $500 off in the gear shifter.

Starting point is 01:23:10 You know what I mean? He doesn't run the cases. You know what I mean? But he's trying to lean on me, right? So the lawyer who I really thought was working with me, um, ends up in the, we're meeting for breakfast. And he's like, um, so, you know, if you want, you know, we can just squash. this right now if you just cooperate, you know what I mean? And I just stopped and looked at him.

Starting point is 01:23:32 I just said, look, you know, he's still standing up at the time because I'm sitting at my table and he's like kind of getting up. And I just said, if you mention it to me again, we're done. Like, you know what I mean? There's, I'm not going to cooperate on this. It's going to go to a plea. Like, we're not going to trial on an ounce of hash. You know what I mean? And even if I got to go and even if I got to go and bite the bullet, I'm going to plea it out. My first offense. I got it. If you just drag it out until they pass the laws. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, not that you didn't break the law when it was still illegal. Oh, sure, 100%.

Starting point is 01:24:01 But I think that a judge would be like, fuck. Yeah, that's what they're trying to do. And so I found out that's what they were doing with the hash because it was still a narcotic. And they hadn't passed this law called any extraction or preparation thereof making hash extraction, shatter, all these different cannabis extractions legal. Even when they made medical legal, because I actually worked to bring in the medical program and launch one of the first state license dispensaries in Arizona. Hash and Hash was still technically narcotic. And they hadn't taken it off the books. And we actually had to work with the health department and with the state to change that law to make it to where it was essentially any extraction or preparation thereof.

Starting point is 01:24:40 And that's what it said on the books for medical, any extraction or preparation thereof. So that would be, that would fall into that category. But they're trying to clear, they're trying to kind of like get the low hanging fruit at the end before it goes legal. They're trying to clean up all these cases, you know what I mean? Which rightfully so, I get it. You know what I mean? They got their job and I had mine at the time. You know? So, long story short, I've got to do a self-surrender.

Starting point is 01:25:03 You did a self-surrender? No, or they just, they just, they put the, you did, they got you dead to rights. They caught me. I caught me with a dozen passports. Oh, okay. All right, all right. Yeah, so I essentially, I thought I was going to have to bond, so I'm ready. I've got a bond agent ready to go and I'm ready to do myself surrender.

Starting point is 01:25:23 I got money put away. I'm good. They give you OR, or what is it, released on your own recognizant? Is that what they gave you? Well, so we'll get to the story. ROR, sorry. Yeah, and I assume that possible would happen. So in my case, I'm waiting, waiting to find out.

Starting point is 01:25:38 It's like right around Valentine's Day. Yeah, because that's here. I was busted. They came in January 29th, so now it's been about two weeks. It's almost Valentine's Day. I remember this because the narcotics officer had a date, and he couldn't meet me the next day for self-surrender. he's like I got to we're like negotiate I'm negotiating my own day to come in and surrender this is

Starting point is 01:25:58 awesome you know what I mean I got to say it felt kind of cool you know what I mean I'm not like you know I used to tell my my wife at the time my girlfriend at the time you know um you don't see me out here knocking over liquor stores of the born to lose tattoo on my name right you know what I'm what is that oh no that's from heat it is yeah I change it to my neck but the chest you know Yeah, I'm here, I'm doing something. I'm doing it in a calculative way. I'm not going to risk our family. I'm not going to risk a little bit of exposure for myself.

Starting point is 01:26:27 You know what I'm saying? But I do have to give it to my wife. When they asked her and they questioned her and they sat her down. You know what I mean? She didn't say shit. Right. You know what I mean? She's solid.

Starting point is 01:26:36 You know what I'm saying? I don't know. I don't know. You know what I mean? And she didn't know. Right. Yeah. So long story short, let's see here.

Starting point is 01:26:47 I'm supposed to do the self-surrender and then we postpone it. And I'm being threatened with this felony and I'm going to have to go in the next day. Went and bought myself a nice new Ralph Lauren sweater so that I could see the judge in it. I'm all ready to be bonded out. And I get a call from the lawyer that night. He's like, okay, you sure you want to do this? And I'm like, yeah, like we're doing this. Like, you know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:27:12 Okay, I'll see you tomorrow morning at like 6 a.m. I got to show up to the county jail. Because I want to get out. I don't want to stay in. So I've already got my bond set up so I can get in and pay my bond, whatever it's going to be to get out. Anyways, long story short, I end up showing up there at 6 a.m. in the morning,

Starting point is 01:27:29 and I'm waiting. And I'm waiting. And I'm waiting. And I'm like, this sucks. Like, I'm waiting now to get arrested. You know what I mean? So I call my lawyer and I'm like, what's going on? And he's like, what are you doing?

Starting point is 01:27:42 You didn't get my call? And I was like, what? He's like, you didn't get my voicemail. I missed his voicemail. voicemail. Okay, Ian, it looks like they're not going to proceed with any charges, wait for a summons in the mail. So this is what makes me think. They didn't have a warrant. He thought he was going to come and catch me with 18 or 20 pounds, allegedly, and I was going to fold immediately and roll on everybody. And you know what I mean? But instead, he came with, caught me with little than nothing. I held my constitution, got a lawyer, which was a smart thing to do. And then I ended up. up waiting one year, nothing ever came. I didn't get shit because it was already medical by then. Right. You know what I mean? So a little popcorn fired of a bus. He could have, he could have, I think he could have still prosecuted me on the, on the narcotics with the hash, but I don't,

Starting point is 01:28:34 thinking back, I said, leave me with something. Because when he, they raided me and they wanted to leave, and I'm like, you're not leaving me with nothing. If you raid me and leave me without anything, people are going to think I rolled. I was like, give me some paperwork. Give me something. I literally said, give me some charges. Like, give me something. You know?

Starting point is 01:28:52 Because again, and that's, and this is great to clear it up to this day because I was able to walk away from the streets clean and then move into legal cannabis. A lot of people, maybe not a lot of people, but a few people would assume he got busted. He must have got rolled on. He must have flipped. I would be shocked if they didn't have. a warrant. They had to have a warrant. Where I'm not not, not a battering ram. No, I'm not I, I'd like to highlight that in this little town that I live in. Okay. What? Things don't always go as

Starting point is 01:29:25 okay. Coture. We live in a, in a town where I was once searched. I was once, uh, in my car and pulled over and I tried to explain him. Why are you attempting to search me? I haven't done anything illegal. I'm not driving erratically. I haven't crossed any center lines. I don't have a real light out. I just had stickers on my car. They pulled me over on the freeway. And some kids over on the freeway on to search us, right? That cop told me when I said, why would you, what reason do you have? What probable cause do you have to search my vehicle?

Starting point is 01:29:54 And you know what he said? He just looked at me and said, because I want to. Yeah. And he did. And he did. And they will. And they do. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:30:04 And so, yeah. So I never saw a warrant. When I asked for a piece of paper, he could have left me with a warrant. They didn't leave me with shit. He didn't leave me with a Chinese menu. Right. You know what I'm saying? You've seen that one.

Starting point is 01:30:13 right with the Chinese menu you know what I mean in training day gives a lady like a gives a lady a Chinese menu and says it's the warrant oh it's a classic you know what I mean but yeah I do not believe that they had a warrant I believe that they came you know and they came all in undercover cars they didn't come heavy like they came in like all three nondescript it was like a geo metro outside and like a what was it a Chevy Tahoe but not these were you know what I mean they were like compensated cars but and I will We'll talk about this, is later on, my brother would get pinched and arrested and put under a case by the same officer. He would later get his due.

Starting point is 01:30:52 That same narcotics officer would catch my brother later on for hash. Moving forward, I think everything that we've talked about was building a skill set for me to be able to be a professional businessman and do things with honor. and do things in the right way. So looking at, you know, somebody who is in that industry, you know, you think, like you were saying earlier, you know, you just get the way, you sell it, you know, you don't have all these other liabilities. You don't have to worry about typical overhead. You don't have to have a retail store. You're not paying taxes. On most drugs and certainly cannabis, you might have 100% markup or a 50% margin, we'll call it.

Starting point is 01:31:43 with that. So learning a little bit about the business and what mistakes you can make help you in the future with other businesses. So you learn about essentially budgeting. You learn about distribution. You learn about new markets. You learn about opening new markets. You learn about consignment, net 30s, net 15. I didn't know what a net 30 was.

Starting point is 01:32:07 I'd been doing it for net 15, which is basically we'll give you a product and you can hold on to that product for the next two weeks. or 30 days, whatever the net is, and then you'll pay, you know. And these are all standard distribution deals, things that I would employ later on, and realizing that, yes, where I succeeded in having a great product and being on time with my product and having a solid supply chain with that product, loss prevention. I mean, I could think of only a quarter pound that I have lost. actually one pound and one quarter pound that I've lost in the entire time. You know, so you think about loss prevention, you know, as a store, you know.

Starting point is 01:32:51 So those comparisons, I think, are interesting in what bring you into a modern business and give you, I guess, the fundamentals for being able to do those standard things like budget, have your source, have maybe an A supplier and a B supplier, you know, and all these things would. essentially play a huge role, not just that, but of course my cultivation knowledge. So I've been living illegally cultivating plants since 2001, probably about 10 years up until this point, off and on. And I've been busted for, or raided, but not served any time. And of course, beat all charges on that bus we talked about. But now I'm ready to take my skills as it's just going legal and move into something more credible. So my wife and I started the first caregivers company Association, Arizona, which is medical MMAZ caregivers, and this was pre-dispensaries, pre-legislations. So the laws had been voted in, but I like to be ahead of the curve and have always been ahead of the

Starting point is 01:34:01 curve in many different things we could go into, but with this specifically. And so what became a nefarious illegal skill now. is turning into something that multi-million dollar companies are looking for, huge investors are looking for that skill to cultivate because it's going to be legal and this is now the green boom and we're going to see this huge boom in the cannabis industry. And so basically taking that illegal knowledge, I decided to open a business in the space and I opened up a cultivation store, essentially like the ones I used to have to go down to to get the cultivation products and opened up the

Starting point is 01:34:41 first one in our town and ended up working with a dispensary, the first dispensary licensee at the time. They had just been given their license in doing some co-branding. And then they found out about my skills in cultivating, of which nobody had any skills in cultivating or any real skills in cultivating. And I was able to prove that by showing them product. From that time, I had my own genetics that I had been developing and essentially working on over a period of time. And as a cultivator, you have your own genetics that you develop and you keep, you keep a mother for a year or two or you keep this genetic line going, you know, because it takes

Starting point is 01:35:20 time, as we said before, and losing those genetics is terrible. I was able to take those genetics and essentially work out a deal with the first dispensary holder in northern Arizona to launch the largest state license dispensary at the time in Arizona at over 10,000 square feet. So this is a really interesting scenario for me because I've been living a constant, a legal life with cannabis. I have been holding down jobs, of course, respectable person, but completely on the other side of the law. And now it is my job and responsibility in a new partnership to launch the state license

Starting point is 01:35:57 cultivation to work with the city managers, the chief of police, the head of the SWAT team, well, the commander and chief of the SWAT team. he's passed on now Jody McCut. She was an amazing guy. And the entire city to put in some of these legal operations. So I'm immediately from one side of the fence to the other, which is for me really, really hard to wrap my mind around. Because just a year ago, a year and a half before that, I'm getting, it was about two years. I'm getting arrested and charged with cannabis and nearly avoiding peril with those charges. and now I'm heading the largest state license cultivation in our area.

Starting point is 01:36:38 I'm working with the most credible people in the town to do so. And I have the knowledge to do it, which nobody else does. I ended up working with an investor who was the professor of anthropology at U of A. He's most well known for developing the human genome project. I don't know if you've known the human genome project where they map the genome. That was mapped out of U of the U of the Anthropology Department under, under this particular professor's watch. And he was also a state legislator at the time.

Starting point is 01:37:10 And so I ended up getting the opportunity to launch the cultivation on our area because he had an issue, somewhat of an issue with one of the county attorneys for Maricopa at the time. And he was going to be risking some exposure because this is all so new and medical. And even though it's medical still. he was going to be risking some political exposure. So I ended up spearheading the whole thing. And I was the person that had and was most responsible for setting it up, running it, and of course bringing in all my genetics for it.

Starting point is 01:37:46 Ended up setting that facility up and working in essentially the first research for cannabis. So this is really where I take all of the love for the plant and really what the plant has taught me over time about myself. and decide to make a serious go at researching the plant. So my dad always told me to do your homework. And, you know, whilst I'm not a physician, you don't have to be a physician to understand plant physiology or the physiology of the human body and how this plant can affect it. And so over the many years, I've become the first and only that I know,

Starting point is 01:38:26 at least in the United States, dedicated medical hemp researcher. that essentially I give accredited medical lectures to physicians, DOs, MDs, PhDs. Let's see here. Have founded studies and work with children with neurological disorders, humans with neuropathic issues, work with cell proliferation, cancer. Probably worked and touched almost every living being, including experimental research with rare white binkled tigers and lions, using cannabis treatments for. cancer or for anxiety. An interesting scenario is we were working

Starting point is 01:39:09 with one of the particular guests out of Africa Wildlife Park in Arizona. And it was a 130 pound albino boa with a 7 inch tumor that had grown. And they heard about our research and ended up meeting up with them and going out

Starting point is 01:39:25 and treating the snake over seven week period. And it's like the star of the show. It's 130-pound snake that everybody, you know, gets to touch and see, you know what I mean, as well as some of the other animals and mammals. And that seven-inch tumor over a seven-week period shrunk by over 85% to about an inch and a half and died. And so just interesting to see the effects of leaving psychoactive, which is, hey, the weed

Starting point is 01:39:52 gets you high, you know what I mean, to non-psychoactive beneficial cannabinoids in the plant physiology that can help people for so much. different things, blood disorders, arthritis, fibromyalgia, cancer treatments, as we're seeing right now, neurological disorders, MS, leukemia, and out of our little small town, we ended up launching our product and our story of this little girl, the miracle of baby Kirsten, she's known online as, and essentially taking that company from an $800 investment, and this is crazy, to over eight figures, as I was telling Kope. So we've done over $10 million in revenue, sold over one million units of our product over time in the past since 2016.

Starting point is 01:40:35 In the meantime, I've started multiple other companies and we work in the space, but we've gone completely into non-psychoactive CBD research. And so that's where, as a medical hemp researcher, I'm out essentially educating physicians on the benefits of it and trying to really break new ground so that we can forward the industry. We've been able to launch nationally, and we've been able to affect many, many different people. we're also heavily involved in the pet space as well because it's branched out into helping pets as well.

Starting point is 01:41:05 And we work with some of the top brands in the pet space. That was that Forbes article that you saw that I sent you over as featured in. So, yeah, so today to have been featured for our work, I thought it was going to maybe be on the cover of the newspaper or the cover of the news for something like you. Something, you know, either way, let's put that one. It was going to be either way. I don't know if you were, if you've ever thought about that. Was it going to be either way you were going to be on there for something? Did you ever think about that?

Starting point is 01:41:34 I mean, no, I didn't. Okay, well, I did. I was, you know, hoping to fly under the radar or the rest of my whole life. Oh, boy. Well, I had a feeling that, you know, it was going to make a splash in something, you know what I mean, and end up, you know, hopefully it wasn't going to be for something negative. And I'm glad that it wasn't, you know, back to the future switch, you know, he's busted or to, he ends up launching the state license facility helping children, you know, just a much better,

Starting point is 01:41:56 much better snitches. He snitches. You know, life's to choose your own adventure. You know, there's many different times in your life. And again, if I was looking at 20 years, I may have considered as well. You know what I mean? I'm not going to take anything away from that. You know what I mean? But, you know, I do believe that I made my own decisions and nobody else is going to pay for my decisions, you know. Hey, you guys. I really appreciate you watching. If you like the video, hit the subscribe button, hit the bell so you get notified of videos like this. Also, we're going to leave all of Ian's links in the description box. So you can you guys.

Starting point is 01:42:26 just click on it, go straight to the website, go straight to the podcast, and subscribe and follow and do everything that you feel comfortable with. Leave me a comment, share the video. Please consider joining our Patreon. It really does help us. It's $10 a month and we put Patreon exclusive content on the site. So please check it out. Thank you very much. See you.

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