Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - The DownFall Of Youtube Grifters | Is MeetKevin a Con Man

Episode Date: September 10, 2023

The DownFall Of Youtube Grifters | Is MeetKevin a Con Man

I used to be a fan of me, Kevin. I used to watch his videos. I used to enjoy his content. I didn't take his stock advice, but I at least enjoyed the content. I thought he was entertaining. It was it was cool to watch. And what happened was in January of 2022. He sold all of his stocks. And that changed his life forever. I'm like, this guy's a clown. He's an idiot. I hate him. He's a grifter. And I just started going after him ever since. And then after I started going after me, Kevin, And I started to realize that a lot of these other guys in the YouTube finance space are liars and grifters and frauds as well. He said he would refund everybody and he still hasn't. Like he hasn't done it.

He's in the middle of the lawsuit right now. He's trying to get it dismissed. Graham, Stefan, I think he's entertaining. He's energetic. He's non-confrontational. He's easy to watch, right? He's likable. He's very likable.

So I don't see this in him at all. but let me just say like you've heard the term of a fisherman knows a fisherman Mm-hmm Meet Kevin Conman Hey this is Matt Cox I'm here with Jay from Echoes from above And we're going to do an interview so check it out I appreciate it

Yeah thanks man really appreciate you having me here and yeah definitely interested in talking about some of the drama going on in the finance base all right um you know uh binance so i'm i'm actually doing it just because you mentioned earlier the finance space before we were on but yeah i'm actually doing an interview with a guy about that he was telling me months ago oh they're going down soon they're going down soon it's going to be an issue there's going to be some issue and i'm doing a video on that on friday once again not not really true crime you know kind of true crime but not you know i'm just being pushed but yeah uh so he's coming he knows all about it so he'll he should be pretty pretty good i'm interested because it all

it all just seems so scammy it is to me so yeah uh so okay so what's going on so how did you kind of get into this how did you start Yeah, how did I get into the space where I started going after these grifters, right? So the way it worked is you've got several people in this space. The main player is Kofizilla. He's the goat. He's the king of the space. He gets all the views.

He gets all the subscribers. And then you have smaller players in this space who kind of do the same work, except not as good quality, not as well research. Coffizel is just really amazing what he does. So you've got Spencer Cornelia who obviously has half a million subscribers. You have myself, 10,000 subscribers. You have Scott Schaefer with about 100K, and you have another guy named Chris Norland and another guy named Strongman.

So there's not really many of us in this space who do this, like five or six of us. But the way that I particularly got started was I used to be a fan of meet Kevin. I used to watch his videos. I used to enjoy his content. I didn't take his stock advice, but I at least enjoyed the content. I thought he was entertaining. It was cool to watch. And what happened was in January of 2022.

He sold all of his stocks. And that changed his life forever. That changed everything. He got destroyed in the comments. He went from being the most beloved person on YouTube to the most hated. And I completely flipped on him. I'm like, this guy's a clown. He's an idiot.

I hate him. He's a grifter. And I just started going after him ever since. And then after I started going after me, Kevin, I started to realize that a lot of these other guys in the YouTube finance space are liars and grifters and frauds as well. And then I started going after them. and then that's how Echoes from above basically started growing. Before that, I had just been talking about stocks. I had like 100 subs, wasn't getting any views.

Once I started going after Kevin, everybody else, then the channel started to grow. So that was my intro into it. Well, why did he, I don't understand why he sold all of his stocks, and why that was upsetting to people. Sure. So in finance, at least in traditional finance, crypto is different. But in the stock market world, everybody looks at stocks as a long-term investment. You don't sell.

I mean, there's a different reason why you could sell a stock fine, but you don't sell your entire portfolio, right? Okay. Kevin's reasoning is he basically tried to time the market. He thought that we were going into a really bad bear market, which he ended up being right about that. And that's basically why he sold his stocks. That's his reasoning. My reasoning of why he sold his stocks, because we all know that the stock market has bare markets, but you continue to hold when the bear markets come, you just buy more and you just ride it out

because the stock market is a long-term game. The reason I believe he sold his stocks is because this is the first time he had ever seen a bear market. He didn't start getting into stocks until 2020 during the greatest bull market ever. Once 2022 came, I think he just panicked. Because remember, he's got a lot more money in stocks than the rest of us. We've got five figures. Some of us got six figures. This guy had $20 million in the market. So when you're just seeing bloodbath after bloodbath, I just think the guy panicked and I'm not the only one who thinks that a lot of other people feel the same way that I do.

Well, I watched a video from another guy who went through all of his picks for like the last two years straight and I mean, every pick he, it was just consistently every pick he had had was bad. Yes. It was just consistently picking,

holding himself out as kind of an expert. And you know, sort of I don't really follow him and I was watching this video and then the guy made another video. about meet Kevin doing a reactionary video to one of his videos and this guy had like you said he had a couple thousand subscribers like he was a tiny but the fact that I guess he was talking bad about him and so he then oh this guy that like but he started bashing the guy but not not really disputing any of the facts just the guy's oh he's a whiner

he's this, he's that. He was actually kind of making fun of, I think. I think it was a couple other guys he was on a video with. He was making fun of him. Anyway, regardless, I've, like, I was introduced to him. I only have only watched a few videos because of a buddy of mine named John Boziac who told me, oh, you got to watch this guy. But that was a couple years ago, two, three years ago.

then he got arrested for the DUI um which I exposed oh really oh I didn't know that yeah I'm the one who exposed to the world that he got the DUI that's what blew up the channel and then he threatened to sue me and uh there was a mess um you know these guys react so badly to um bad press

you know you know what I mean like like some people when you hold yourself out as being this kind of lily white perfect guy and then bad things happen they don't like their first reaction is like to try and spin it or lie about it or you know just you know just deny it or it's where simply saying yeah i i you know i messed up like i i fucked up and this is what happened and it was definitely my fault and you know i think people that's really the best way to go at it um what was the crypto guy that did crypto zoo logan paul yeah like what a what a horrible like what it just whoever is whoever's kind of advising him or whoever he's surrounded by he should just whack all those guys i would just get rid of every one of those guys just get rid of them start over

go with a professional person that could actually handle um you know bad press for you or handle you know these types of things which these guys obviously don't know what this say. Like, oh, deny it, lie about that. Okay, well, you're a child. That's not how you behave. It's not how you do it. You say, look, I messed up. I made a mistake. Here's what happened. And lay it all out. I actually worked for a mortgage company one time that their credit line. So it was a lender and they had, but they were connected to a larger, several larger banks. And they lost a bank and then one of the banks that they still had a credit line with, it basically got shut off. So they were only able to do as many mortgages, fund as many mortgages as they had money for, which is a problem because usually they have a large credit line.

They build up the credit line. They sell them in batches or they already have their underwriting based on a bank and they're just selling directly to that bank. well what happened was you know so suddenly i have loans that cannot that are underwritten ready to close but we don't have money yep i watched everybody else dodging phone calls uh hanging up the phone not answering not returning calls you know telling the secretary tell them i'm not here like and i actually i remember talking to my father who was you know much older and and wiser than me. And he said, you really need to just be honest.

This is what's going on. This is what's happening. This is what I know is happening. And I will let you know as soon as, as soon as I know it's freed up. And we have money to close your, your loan. Yep. You know, don't give them advice. Don't promise them anything.

Don't tell them anything you don't know. And let, and if they don't hear from you, tell them that they could call back. And, you know, don't dodge them. them. Sure enough, within a few days of doing that, all of those customers, I was the only one who wasn't bombarded with calls anymore. They were waiting. Give me a week. We should know something in a week. So you just put them off and put them off and put them off. I mean, I explained what was happening, but give me another week. If something happens before then, I will tell you, just be very honest about it. And although people yelled at me and they were pissed off and everything, they

also realized that it wasn't my fault. I certainly didn't not want those loans to close. Eventually all those loans closed. But honestly, I probably, I don't know how many customers I had at the time, eight or nine customers that I was holding off. And we're still generating new customers. Like the company, they're still telling us keep generating. We're going to fix this. Don't stop. It's like, what are you doing? So anyway, the point is that I think I was the only person that didn't lose any customers. Everybody else lost almost everybody. They didn't know what to do.

Of course, they go to their credit union. They're going to go to another lender. They don't know what's happening. And that's the problem. You've got a lot of people out here who just can't take the heat. That that's the problem. Right. I mean, look, things happen.

You know, sometimes bad things happen. You address them the best you can. And if they're your fault, then you just own up to it. People will respect you more and they'll trust you more. why because you owned up to hey this is what i did i fucked up i made a mistake this is what i was thinking clearly didn't go that way here's what i'm going to do to rectify the problem that's what logan paul should have done instead he just it suddenly it was everybody else's fault and you know my team this and they hire this guy hired this guy so is everybody but him

which was horrible like didn't you hire your team like didn't you hire all the guys go ahead sorry yeah i just yeah i think that just yeah i think that just calls into question his character. I think that just kind of speaks to him. I mean, if you even look at right now, he said he would refund everybody and he still hasn't. Like he hasn't done it. He's in the middle of the lawsuit right now. He's trying to get it dismissed. He might win that because he probably has a better lawyer than everybody else. I mean, I don't know. But that's just the type of person he is. Some people out here are just scum. And he's one of them, in my opinion. I really don't like him. I made videos on him. I made videos on him. I mean, I saw,

I mean, you saw the text messages. It was a pump and dump scheme. You're running a pump. You're actively attempting to get people to purchase a product for more than you know that it's worth so that you can raise the value of your product. And then you can yank, then you can yank the carpet out. You know, it's a rugpole. You take off with the money and haul ass and they lose their investment. I mean, it seems like such a slam dunk to me.

Yeah. If you're a celebrity with a huge moment, yeah. But that's the thing. That's why they were able to do it because none of them were getting indicted. Nothing really happened. And during the bull market, you had like 50 celebrities that were doing it. And they all just got away Scott Fried. The only one that's got some type of accountability is what?

Kim Kardashian, Floyd Mayweather, Paul Pierce, and Logan Paul. That's really it. Four. So when you see the government not doing anything, which I think the government shares a lot of the blame too, because the SEC and Gary Gensler, they're afraid to go after people unless they think they can win. That's the problem with the government.

If they don't think they can win, they won't go after you. That's what sucks about it. I mean, could you imagine? I mean, I don't know how much you know about trials, but there's just no way for Logan Paul to sit on the stand or let's say he doesn't sit on this. Let's say his lawyer says,

oh, you can't go on the stand. To present that those documents, those text messages, and the testimony that Coffee Zilla built a case that there's just no way the government could if they could just present his case. But yeah, you're right. It's, you know, it's, I don't know. Yeah, I used to work in politics. So, you know, I didn't work in trials or anything like that.

But I kind of know how they think a little bit. And just from my work in politics, I just know that for the most part, the reason why a lot of these people get off is because the government wants to look good. So if they're losing a bunch of cases, they're not looking good. So they want to look like, you know, like, for example, right? You ever heard this saying, I know you know this. They say like the feds went like 90% of their cases or something like that. Isn't that it? Something like that.

98.7. It's almost 99%. Right. And I think the main reason for that is because they only go after people that they know they're going to get. I really believe that. And I think that's what you're seeing with the SEC. I bet you the conviction rate for the SEC is the same. And it's because they only go after people that they know they'll get.

They don't want to lose. Yeah. Unfortunately, it's customers that, you know, or the public that suffer because they're trying to keep a high average up. Yeah. Let's start at the beginning. Where were you raised? Chicago, born and raised Chicago. Yep.

Are you still live in Chicago? Yeah, I'm out here. I'm in the suburbs now, but yeah, I'm still in the area. Not too far away from downtown. So, yeah. Yep. It's rough. Brothers, sisters, mom, dad.

Yeah, I've got like, I don't even know. A lot of siblings. I got quite a few siblings and, yeah, definitely a big family and, you know, yeah, big family and all that stuff. Did you go, you went to high school, graduated, high school? Yeah, middle school, high school. I try not to get too much into it, but like exactly where I went. Yeah, that's fine.

I mean, I understand you keeping it vague. Did you go to college or did you just go to work, right away. Okay, sure. Yeah. So I, after I graduated high school, I went to a junior college, then after I went to a university. And I got my degree in political science. And I started working in politics. So from like 2016, because I was still working in politics when I was in college. So that's why I counted. I graduated in 2018. But from 2016 to like 2021, I was literally just eat, drink, and sleep politics, working on political campaigns every day all day. Like, that was my life. So you worked for, you worked for somebody on their campaign or a multiple

campaign. Like, yeah, like I ran multiple campaigns. Like, I actually ran their campaigns and helped them win and stuff like that. Yep. Okay. You don't want to get into that. How, who, no? Yeah, yeah. Are these small time, like, is this like city councilmen? Is this running, people

running for Senate? Is it? Yeah, so I had the opportunity to work for a U.S. House rep, but by that time, I'd already left. So most of the campaigns that I ran was local stuff. So like state representative, state senator, you know, different things like that. I did work on the governor's campaign, but I didn't run his campaign. I was just like a staffer. But I worked for Governor J.B. Pritzker, who's the governor of Illinois and yeah, just stuff like that. So why was it just too spotty? Like it's not consistent work? Or why'd you

move out? Would you get burned out? You don't make any money. You're broke as crap. You're working. 12 hour 14 hour days and you're not making any money it's like I can't do this this is horrible so that's what I love it was really just for money um okay and so what did you do then you immediately started making videos and you're making you started making great money and that was it no no I actually don't make that much money on YouTube no I know I love it when people think you make a ton of money and I know yeah yeah I know they yeah they yeah they think Yeah, the only people make money are like the people get like hundreds of thousands of views and sponsorships and only the people with the huge follies make money. It kind of sucks. But yeah, no, the way did I make money now is because I work in insurance. So instead of working public, I went to the private and you make way more money doing that. Yeah, it's really because of my job and like other ventures that I make money now. A decent money. I'm not saying I'm like rich over here, but definitely doing better than I was when I worked in politics when I lived in my mom's house and I made like $500 a week or whatever the heck we got. It was that was miserable.

so why did you I mean were you already doing uh did you already have a channel were you like how did how did this happen I mean I know you said you know you didn't you don't like seeing these guys you know you know bullshit people but was there anything I mean well no you you you said the Kevin thing right that he had sold everything but is that exactly I mean that that that made you say hey I'm going to I started a channel. So I started my channel September of 2021. And when I started it, that was during the bull market. That's when stocks were hot. I was just talking about stocks. I was talking about different stocks that I was interested in, didn't get any views. And then I flipped my channel from stocks to just going after clowns and grifters and scammers on YouTube with me, Kevin sold the stock.

So that's how I went. And then there was a lot that took place ever since I did that. Even though I have a small following, I mean, I've been involved in a lot of the drama and YouTube finance. just because that's kind of what I do. I'm kind of known as, like, the drama, YouTube finance channel. So some of like the biggest creators, you know, whatever drama they've been involved in, I've been a part of, whether it's the thing that happened with Clear Value Tax, who has like 2 million subscribers, me, Kevin and his DUI, which I exposed, me and Scott Schaefer

went back and forth and had a beef. I mean, Spencer Cornelia, who you had on your channel, I was hammering the heck out of that guy before I flipped and started to be more nicer and started to realize that, okay, I'm going way too hard on this guy so yeah just a lot man it's been it's been a journey your channel so i'm gonna pull it up i don't have like if you were here and we would have somebody sitting over there and they would pull it up but it's just me so so um yeah we got 20 000 18000 25000 views i mean you've got you know these are these aren't aren't bad views at all yeah you would think that you know Well, I mean, I know that whenever we go, we've done like reaction videos or talked about somebody, you know, like jumped on the bandwagon of some little crisis that's going on and, which has always kills me because it's like, like, I'm, I don't really know what's happening.

Like I watch like, I watch like four videos and they're like, we got to do a video on this. And then so Kobe's like, you got to do a video on this. Or Tyler will say, you've got to do a video. What are you doing? You got to do a video. Okay. So then I'll do a video on it. And I don't really know exactly what's happening. You know, I'll watch some videos. I'll give my take. And those videos do great. They'll get like 100,000 views or 80,000 views or, you know, and which is amazing. And then next thing, you know, you're your, your subs spike. Yep. So using forgeries and bogus identities, Matthew B. Cox, one of the most ingenious comment in history, built America's

biggest banks out of millions. Despite numerous encounters with bank security, state, and federal authorities, Cox narrowly, and quite luckily, avoided capture for years. Eventually, he topped the U.S. Secret Service's Most Wanted list and led the U.S. Marshals, FBI, and Secret Service on a three-year chase, while jet-setting around the world with his attractive female accomplices. Cox has been declared one of the most prolific mortgage fraud con artists of all time by CNBC's American Greene. Bloomberg Business Week called him the mortgage industry's worst nightmare, while Dateline NBC described Cox as a gifted forger and silver-tongued liar. Playboy magazine proclaimed his scam was real estate fraud, and he was the best.

Shark in the housing pool is Cox's exhilarating first-person account of his stranger-than-fiction story. Available now on Amazon and Audible. How old are you? 28. Oh, my God. So, still, okay, look, still what I'm thinking is, so you started the channel. Why did you start the channel, though? I mean, I understand you started it, but it was just something to do on the side or do you have aspirations?

like are you thinking hey i want to be coffee zilla like that's the goal or are you thinking it's just something to do you put out what a video how many videos a week do you put out i put out a video every day are you serious yeah wow so you work 40 50 hours a week yep and you put out a video that's it yep so i'm thinking no girlfriend no i have a girlfriend i put out two videos because I put out a video every day on the second channel, too. When do you sleep? Well, the good thing is my videos aren't like super well edited and I'm able to record them very fast.

I literally just record on my laptop, show whatever I'm talking about and just go. There's no script. There's no fancy editing. It's just talking and I can get a video done in 10, 15 minutes real quick for one take. Yeah, but what are you coming up with every day though? I mean, every day there's. What? Oh, there's always drama. Whatever's going on. You know, there's this big lawsuit going on where me Kevin just settled. You know, me Kevin's being got, me, Kevin and all these other influencers got sued by these lawyers and this guy named Edward Garrison. And he just settled. So I made a video on it. I literally just pulled up the case. Read it. Hey, me, Kevin's sued. This is why. This is why I don't like him. Bam, video's done. Didn't he also get sued by that? Didn't the SEC come in and find a bunch of them?

No, not them, no. If that happened, oh, I would have a field day on my channel. Not yet, the regulators have it coming on them yet, no. I feel like, oh, that was the Kim Kardashian. Yeah, the SEC came against Kim Kardashian. I think Floyd Mayweather and some celebrities, yeah. But none of the finance influencers, not yet. I think it's coming, but not yet.

Okay. So what else has happened? right now well you had spencer on your channel and i think that'd be a good subject to talk about because uh if you read the comments uh there was a lot of hate and i just wanted to talk about it because i don't know if you know what happened with spencer but like spencer like ruined his own credibility in his channel and you know him and i are cool now and i have no issue with him but i still think it's worth talking about because i think it's important for everybody to learn from that what happened he certainly didn't bring up okay well

I will because So Spencer Cornelia is literally like a mini coffee zilla, right? He goes after scammers, lifters, blah, blah, blah. He deleted the video now, but when the FTX stuff blew up and everybody hated Graham Steffen and Andre Jick and meet Kevin because they had endless videos sponsored by FTX and they got paid hundreds of thousands of dollars for it, Spencer, who's supposed to be a scam buster, grifter slayer,

you know, mini coffee zilla, defended them because they're his friends, and he plays cards with them, and they're all in the same agency. They're all in this agency that helps them get sponsorships and brands called Creators Agency. Spencer is in the same agency as them. And so instead of taking Kofi Zilla's position, he decided to defend them, which Kofi Zilla and him actually went back and forth a little bit. I mean, I know they're still friends, but they had a little back and forth. Like, Kofi's like, dude, what are you doing?

Like, I think Kofi even commented under his video. Like, I don't agree with you at all. I don't know what you're talking about, and everybody just hated Spencer from then. Like, he got a lot of hate for that because people are like, dude, you're supposed to be the guy calling these people out. Why are you defending them? So that was just a huge thing that I think to this day ruin his credibility. I saw in an interview with you, he talked about how his views are going down.

That's the reason why his views are going down is because of that. That is it right there. He really hurt his own credibility with that. I did a video about that, about, um, when FTX went, you know, when they yanked all, they had that separate channel where, um, meet Kevin and, uh, um, Graham Stefan. They yanked all their videos off. Millennial money.

I made a video on that too. I was on it. Yeah. I did a video on that just kind of explaining like, you know, one, of course, it, it looks bad. But two, you know, then Graham Stefan did the video, did his video kind of trying to, you know, hey, I didn't know, I didn't realize. I, you know, it's funny because. and I'm sure everybody gets this, right, you know, that Colby and I get contacted all the time by these little like scam.

It's not, they seem scammy to me. You know, it's always like some guy who want, they'll sponsor your video, they'll give you $1,000 and all you have to do is this or that. You know, the problem is, is it'll be like, you know, some, you know, some hair cream you rub on your head and it makes you grow hair. And I'm like, yeah, it's not true. Like, I don't, I'm not going to, I'm not going to say that. Like, you know, or it'll or, or I've even had, we even had several meetings with a, a startup company that was coming up with a cryptocurrency. Oh, God. And, and, yeah, yeah, listen, like they were, you know, and these guys were all into it.

Like they were, you know, the guy was talking about sponsoring, you know, for six months and pushing it and getting a link and you get, you know, this much for everybody signs up and we can do videos and, you know, and we had a couple meetings, but came down to it. it was like, look, I don't know enough about it. Colby doesn't know enough about it. The only thing I do know is that most of these are pump and dump schemes and they're scammy. And I said, look, you know, in the end, like, I can't, I can't be a part of something. One, just because of my past. You know, I can't be a part of this. I certainly can't ever be in front of the judge saying, Your Honor, I know how it looks.

But, you know, on top of that, at some point that just, like you said some point the SEC will come down on everybody and what's my defense there's no defense I have no defense at all like it you know especially getting into something that you really have absolutely no clue as to how it even works and I know guys that have been so I know a guy named Donovan Davis I wrote us actually wrote a story on him I don't know if you know this I write true crime stories I do know this yeah I'm familiar with you yeah oh okay so listen I you'd be shocked. I've talked to people over 20 and 30 minutes and they've just, and I'll mention something about prison. They were in prison? Like, oh, yeah. They don't do any research. Well,

let me just, well, let me just say this. I mean, I'm actually really like your content. Like, I've been watching you since like 2019. You came and you did that interview on concrete, which blew up, went, went crazy. And your story was just amazing. I'm like, wow, I can't believe this guy did all of this. This is crazy. So you had that. Then you went on Vlad. I watched that you went on Patrick Bet David I watched that and I was just like yeah this is this it was just cool it was a cool story so and I do want to talk about some of that in the middle of the interview because not only is your story amazing but like the whole Frank Amadeo thing like we just have to talk about that at so oh bro it's so funny so funny so real quick I'd like to say um that

Patrick bet David you know he's like six foot six yep he's really big and tall yep and And I'm like five foot six. Okay. So when I walked in his studio, you take like five steps into his studio. And his whole studio, I mean, this is when it was in Texas. Now it's in Florida. It's probably the same. It's on a platform, an 18 inch tall platform.

So I was walking in with like his producer, talking to his producer. And just then he stood up and I turned around. And so I am just like. and he was like two feet from me and he was like and he's looking down he's like hey so glad i'm like he's already a giant so and it might have might be 12 might have been 10 or 12 inches off the ground maybe not 18 and then of course i immediately turned there's this massive um Hulk you know he's got the Hulk he got a couple of he's huge i mean listen the whole thing is just over the top when you walk into his when you walked into his building he had a um

is it megatron or somebody he had he had like this massive megatron thing that had to be it had to be eight or ten feet tall in the lobby just everything about him is over the top big yeah he got he got all that money so he's able to build all that nice stuff so that's interesting yeah um what i was going to say going back to the uh um the so oh oh i know what it was donovan Davis. My guy I wrote a story about in prison, Donovan Davis is a guy who's in prison who got 17 years. And I'm going to give you the quick rundown on his story. He had a childhood friend who started a 4x trading company, right? Like a hedge fund kind of thing. Came to him and said, I'm trading with a master trader. We started the company. This is what our returns in. Can you put some money in? Donovan and his family have money. Hardworking.

They sell dirt. That's actually a thing in Florida. So, you know, because Florida's, you know, so close to the sea, you know, so low to the close to or almost level sea level. You sometimes when you build, you have to bring in dirt. So they buy, they lease land, dig out the dirt and move it, whatever. So they've made tons of money doing this. So he, Donovan ends up putting in like, I don't know. or what it was like a hundred thousand dollars a month later he's got like a hundred and seven

thousand dollars so that's an amazing return you know a month later it's like got like a hundred and fifteen thousand so he puts in another hundred thousand um month later he's got me more money then his buddy stop his childhood friend kind of you know stops by he says can i stop can i pit can i come and talk to your family he goes yeah sure goes to his family and they're like hey he kind of gives his little presentation and he says wow man he's like he and so he of course he gets to turn to donovan and donovan says i'm telling you man yeah he is doing great like it's been it's only been three months but he's really doing great and i've made like thirty thousand dollars and three months like that's a great return and so you know i mean let's face

that's like an 80 to a hundred percent return on your money it's insane and it doesn't happen so you know you might maybe in every 10 years you might have a good month or two but you're not making 200% on on your money for any given period of time uh anyway his family puts in a bunch of money oh his uncle puts in 50 his dad puts in a couple hundred thousand his brother puts in a hundred thousand listen within the next month or two they've raised a million dollars then they're using Donovan to like, oh, you can, here, I'll give you somebody. Oh, if they're pitching investors and saying, oh, you know Donovan Davis, everybody knows the Davis's.

They tell him, oh, yeah, he's an investor and so is his mom. And they're, oh, wow, people are investing. Then Donovan starts telling people about it. Well, Donovan ends up raising several million dollars for this company, right, over the next six months or so. They come to him and they say, you know, you've helped us so much. And we're still growing. if you gave us $600,000, we'd let you buy one-third of the company.

Donovan thought, wow, lucky me. And they said, all you have to do for your part, because obviously you don't know anything about trading 4X, all you have to do is keep raising money for the company. Donovan thought, I can do that. So that's what he did. He gave him $600,000 and he starts raising money. Over the next year or two, he raises $17 million. Jeez.

From his friends and family and other investors, you know, just people that know friends of friends, that sort of thing. Well, it's a Ponzi scheme. Donovan doesn't know it. So when the whole Ponzi scheme falls apart and Donovan realizes it's a Ponzi scheme, he goes to the U.S. attorney. I just lost all my money, all my investors, money all my family's money two million of his family's money he lost but the the u.s. attorney they do their investigation when they start of course they start talking to all the investors all the investors are like donovan said this donovan said that donovan said this donovan's

only telling these people what these guys told him to say he doesn't know well donovan gets indicted and because donovan feels like i didn't lie to anybody i didn't do any wrong he goes to trial which is a mistake right always a mistake because even though you feel like you didn't do anything like you didn't maliciously try and harm anyone your intent is really irrelevant in the federal system and so he goes to trial he loses he gets 17 years geez they indicted him and charged him

they based it on the victims the amount of money so out of the it ended up being like $20 million worth of loss out of $20 million worth of loss and over a hundred

to two it might have been it was over a hundred victims $2 million was his own money they charged him and sentenced him based on two million of his own money. They didn't even get to say, well, that was yours, so we're not, no, we're throwing

that in there too. So I mean, it's, people think it's a fair system and they don't really understand. You cannot and you should not talk about things that you don't understand and you certainly shouldn't ask people to put their money into things that you don't truly understand. Now, if you understand the system and something goes wrong, that's fine. You're informed, you understood how things worked. You gave them your opinion. You were licensed to do this. But when you're running around saying, this is a good deal, you should invest. And they do, you know, oh, I'm making this much money. It's great. It's great investment. It's super solid. It's this. And you know, people are hanging on your every word. You know, you have a, yeah, obviously you have a

fiduciary responsibility. But, you know, you just have, because people trust you more, you have more of a responsibility than the average goofball saying, oh, yeah, I heard that you should buy this stock because it's good. Well, that's, you know, people will trust you. Especially meet Kevin, you know. That guy, like, he's holding himself out there as like an expert, even though he couldn't pick his stock to save his life. Not at all.

So anyway, that's, yeah, that's, so that's the way I look at it. Like, I could never be in front of a, one, I'm not going to sit here and say, Oh, well, this, yeah, absolutely crypto. I don't know how crypto works. I don't have a clue. You could sit here for the next two hours and explain it to me. And even if I had a cursory understanding of it, deep down, I know that it's just too volatile for me to ask someone to put their money into it.

Yeah. So people get greedy. People realize how much money you can make when you make people think that you're a guru or you show things to them or how much companies will pay you. And the greed just takes them over. because there's so much money to be made in this grifter space. These grifters make so much money. It's insane.

I mean, look at the guy that's suing Spencer. Like, I couldn't believe how much money that guy made until I looked it up. I'm like, wow, this guy is rich. That is nuts. It's absolutely nuts. And he's really just trying to sue him out of existence, just a. Yeah. Yeah.

And he's suing another guy. It blows my mind because, you know, when you sue somebody, you have to spend just as much as the person that's the same. spend to defend themselves. So he's suing Spencer and he's suing the John Anthony Lifestyle guy. So the Derek Moneyberg guys spent like $600,000. It's like, dude, but you're making, if you're making $10 million a year or $20 million a year, what's half a million dollars? $600,000. Yeah. That's true. But it also just shows the type of awful human being he really is because like, why not just message Spencer first? You know, that's what most people do. They don't

just sue people. They send the cease and assist or they'll message them and say, hey, I don't like your video. Can you take it down? Because even, you're right, $10 million, $600,000, still is still a lot. Like, why do that when you could normally just threaten somebody and they'll take the video down anyway? It just shows that whatever Derek Moneyberg has against Spencer is personal, clearly. Like, I've never seen anything like that in my life. Never. By the way, I think Spencer is absolutely getting swindled by his attorneys. I'm sorry. I hope they don't come. after me. And I told Spencer this to his face because he came on my channel too. I'm like, dude, because when me, Kevin threatened to sue me for the DUI thing, my attorney said, okay, look,

this is what you got here. If Kevin sues you, you're going to spend anywhere from 50,000 to 100,000 at the most. I hope you're ready for that if that happens. Blah, blah, blah, blah. This is what we're going to do, blah, blah, blah. For Spencer to spend $300,000 and get to the point where the case is still not done. And he has to raise another $50,000 and he still doesn't know what's going to happen. I really think his attorneys are swindling him. I feel bad for him. I've never seen anything like that. That's like corporate money. Like, why are you spending so much? Like, I don't get it. It's, it is insane. I mean, but then, you know, like, if you watch that video, like, I mean, I fought Warner Brothers and I, E. Entertainment, you know, Devereux, Ephra-E. Devereoli from prison.

for a couple hundred bucks but my attorneys are working for nothing so they're they're just like it it's just nice to get to get your name called at mail time at a mail call yeah they're like oh i got something what is it you know we're reading no we're sitting there reading over the documents of the chow hall look what does that mean what did it say so it's amazing you know on the inside your your entertainment you're the threshold is so low you're willing to research stuff for hours and hours and days and write things and everything just so that you can have some interaction with the outside world yeah uh yeah that was a that was actually it was a good stuff I actually wrote a book about that called dude where's my hand grenade I don't know you wrote a book

I've written eight books I know you've written stories but I didn't know if that was like documentaries or actual books No I've written I want to say You know I always say roughly Because some of them like I wrote Ephraim Devoroli

The guy who Did you ever see the movie War Dogs? War Dogs? No, I haven't Okay so there was a guy Jonah, you know who Jonah Hill is Jonah Hill? Yeah, the actor, yep Jonah Hill played Ephraim Deverelli in the movie

War Dogs. Well, the real Ephraim Devoroli I was locked up with and I wrote his memoir. Wow. So when he got out, he was kind of a scheme like he basically they, he and his literary agent kind of like

created a situation where Warner Brothers would get a hold of the manuscript. Like they knew that they had gotten a hold of it. Like they put it in a situation where they could at least to allege Warner Brothers got a hold of the manuscript and used the manuscript to write the movie Wardawks to write the screenplay based on the manuscript.

Well, that wasn't true, but it allowed him to sue Warner Brothers because it certainly appeared that they had gotten on it. And they may have actually gotten a hold of it, to be honest. They ended up settling with him. Well, at the same time, I ended up suing Warner Brothers and Devoroli because I'd never been paid for writing it. and they ended up settling, well, Warner Brothers and I just parted ways. Like, in the end, there was just no way you're going to battle Warner Brothers.

I sued, or I sued Devereoli. I ended up settling with Devoroli. But, you know, and that, I managed to get a lawyer, I managed to get a lawyer who took the case on consignment. Right. Which is insane. To get an intellectual property attorney. to take a to take a case on consignment like they just don't do that it right it takes too long

to fight those cases it's not like it's not like a it's not like a property property injury attorney you know it's not like a car accident those cases are solved or sorry are settled within 12 to 18 months yeah they're very they're very cut and dry so that they're willing to say look give me a third of whatever you you know whatever yeah yeah whatever we have end up settling for and I'll put up all the money. Yep. But property or, but intellectual property cases, they go on forever. They go on for five, six years.

Those attorneys are not going to fork out all that money. Especially in Spencer's case, he's being sued. He's not counter-sewing. Yeah. You know, he's being, he's being sued for like five different things, too. That's insane. I mean, in the end, it'll most likely just get thrown out, but for $300,000, my God. yeah right

I hope he gets the outcome where he gets his money back I was telling him that I definitely hope he gets his money back because that's insane it's clearly a frivolous lawsuit and yeah I mean I think you and I could both talk about

the criminal justice court system whatever you're going to call it for a while I mean it's so corrupt it's it's really broken it really is because lawsuits are the same way it's terrible so what else is going on well i mean if you want to talk about frank amadeo i've always wanted

to talk about that i mean like i said i'm pretty familiar with your story so we could always you know we could do that all right what did you want i don't i don't know what else i don't know what else for me you you will want to talk about i mean if you're in finance youtube then there's a lot to talk about that's all i do i just talk about it expose it all kinds of stuff like that so it just depends whichever angle you want to go i mean i'm i'm okay with talking about amadeo i mean i'm curious that like i wrote a book about him also it's called it's insanity of course i wrote a i wrote a synopsis about his story which was maybe 12 000 words and then i expanded that to a book which is around 40 000 words uh because there was so much it was such an interesting

story and there were so much extra stuff that I could have put in the story. Unfortunately, I only, you know, being in prison writing these stories with these guys, I really only wanted to write things that I could prove or I had, you know, so conversations you heard or things that you heard, but there was just no way to prove it. Like I tried to stay away from that stuff. I tried to go off of based stuff on, um, uh, trans, or base it off of police reports, FBI reports, you know, something, affidavits, you know, things that backed up what Amadeo was saying, but just normal conversations. Like, I can't prove certain things. But when I was out, I was able to expand on a lot of the stuff that he had told me by contacting people that knew him on the outside. And I was able to do more research. So it was easy to expand that book. To be honest, if I probably had more time, I'm sure I could have gotten written a 90,000 word book, you know, but, but it doesn't, it doesn't really need, I would really have needed Frank's help to do that. And when I was writing the book, he was still incarcerated.

So it was impossible to communicate with them on a regular basis. Yeah. You know, anyway, yeah, so, so I expanded that book. So, like, I know a ton about him. that isn't just from him. Yeah, it's from other stories of people you spoke to. Right, right. But once again, may not all be, you know, stuff that's backed up.

Like in the book, I talk about a whole kind of a, kind of a coup that he attempted. And I go into it. But, I mean, I really have only conversations that he had with another inmate talking about it. although it all jived with what was really going on, certainly was similar to the rest of the story. What's so funny? Just, just, just, just, just, just, just, just, just, just, just, crazy, man, like, everything you're saying is just so funny.

Have you seen, when I first heard of, he has a channel? He has a YouTube channel, because you know he got back out. He got out. That's what I was going to ask you. Where is he at right now? Because that is so fascinating. He's in Orlando. Okay, wait, what's his YouTube channel?

I think it's called Oh my God I think it's called The Frank Amadeo story Or Frank Oh that's Oh that's channel Oh I found that channel

I did find that I saw something that said that I didn't know that was his channel So he actually Did a whole video About him explaining Why he's not guilty You know

In my opinion He is guilty But he feels like because he feels like he didn't because mentally he did not have the ability to understand that what he was doing was illegal uh he feels like he feels like that makes him not guilty i mean you're still committing you still committed a crime whether you could formulate the understanding that you know or the intent to commit a crime for most federal law that's irrelevant um and the you know he he also There were also things that as I wrote that story, I can't, well, I should, Robbie shouldn't even say this.

I really like Frank. But there were things that he told me, you know, that he would, he would say, you know, like, I never even had control of the money. I never this. I never thought. Yeah, but, and maybe the U.S. attorney's wrong. Maybe he's lying. But, like, it was pretty clear that there was like, there were $60 million was siphoned off to account. that he did have control of.

So, you know, and now what that money was, I never really got a complete understanding of what that fund was, but he always says, you know, I never had control of the money. I never directed where the money knew how, or was in a position to direct where the money was going. You know, however, the U.S. attorney says

that there was $60 million that was directed to an account that was solely in his, in his, in a company's name that he controlled, that he wrote the checks for that he was in charge of. Like, there were little things like that. So the problem is when he gets manic, he says things that, you know, I don't know how else to say that that aren't true. You know, he gets manic. He rambles things out. And if you've been around them long enough, you understand, well, you kind of just look over.

You don't really pay attention to that. Or he probably didn't, he didn't really mean that. Or he's, he's manic right now. He doesn't really know what he's saying. so you know but the the stuff about you know thinking god has been talking to him like every you understand that like everybody says it everybody every oh yeah yeah no he's always said that right this wasn't something like he came up with after he got in trouble he's been saying this for two decades since he was a teenager yeah you know the wife um the sister

his, all of his business associates. And I would even have those conversations with them where I'd say, well, was it kind of like a tongue and cheek thing? Like he, it was just a kind of a joke? And they go, well, he would joke about it. And I go, so it wasn't like real. They go, oh, no, no, no, he believes it. No, no. I mean, we, but he was like, but you know, you know him. You can joke about it. Like, he knows it sounds crazy. But it's not that it's not, it's not, it's not that he doesn't believe it's true and and that's i don't know if you've ever been around someone like that he he's an odd character because he you know that he believes it it's true to him for him that's going to happen um but he'll joke about it you know you can say you know that's crazy

you know that sounds crazy right frank i'll go yeah i know i know it sounds crazy it does sound crazy Yeah. Yeah. So how did he have his own tax office in prison? How do he do that? Because you said in one of your videos, law office. Law office. I'm sorry, tax office. Yeah, law office in prison. Because you said he had like bloods and cribs, like guarding the door and people like typing stuff. How do he do? How do he get them to do that? um so first of all he's because he's an inmate and people they the inmates respected him for the staff it's good because he keeps people settled right and if he's if your lawyer is working with you and you have something in k in the in the courts you're very unlikely to get in trouble. So he's working on tons of people's cases. And really what happened was he had so much junk that they started letting him store it in like what they called like the library, the unit library. And before long, he's got boxes packed up. And then eventually the unit manager was just like,

look, let's just remove the library. These guys can use the other libraries. There's the main library and let's just give you this room. And so he started using that room solely. The other thing is you know, you hear about in federal prisons or well in prisons in general, let's say federal prison about rehabilitation. They're very concerned about rehabilitating all of the inmates. You know, that's a lie. Like that it sounds good. It says it on all the websites. They'll certainly, They pitch it well, but the truth is they don't really have any teachers. And the teachers, the few staff members that also act as a teacher don't do anything. They don't teach the classes.

They have tutors, people like me and Zach, that actually teach the classes for them. They sit in a room in the back and play on the internet. and periodically twice a day you go in there and say hey i need more paper or hey can you open up the locker so i can get more folders and they go i'm in the middle of world of warcraft here but yeah sure i can do that and they get upset and they get up and they chew you out of the way because you're upsetting them and uh you know you're you're throwing off their day so you know they open up some stuff they ask you to fill out some paperwork, ask you how things are going, you go fine. And that's it. You get paid $80, maybe $110 a month. And that's, so, you know, we had a guy named Harmon who worked, Zach and I worked for. He did nothing. So there were tons of, so there's, that's like GED, but then when you say, okay, well, what about other classes? So there's tons of classes that are offered. Like there's real estate, there's finance, there's, there's a, credit courses, there's all kinds of different types of, there's creative writing one and two,

like they teach these different classes. But the inmates teach those classes. So you'll have one teacher who's over what's called the ACE courses, the adult continuing education courses. But they don't teach anything. They just keep the paperwork. And I would teach the real estate course or Zach would teach, whatever. So one of them was legal research. How to use the legal computers to look up cases and do case, case research. Well, Frank taught that class. Buried by the U.S. government and ignored by the national media, this is the story they don't want you to know.

When Frank Amadeo met with President George W. Bush at the White House to discuss NATO operations in Afghanistan, no one knew that he'd already embezzled nearly $200 million from the federal government. money he intended to use to bankroll his plan to take over the world. From Amadeo's global headquarters in the shadow of Florida's Disney World, with a nearly inexhaustible supply of the Internal Revenue Services funds, Amadeo acquired multiple businesses, amassing a mega conglomerate. Driven by his delusions of world conquest,

he negotiated the purchase of a squadron of American fighter jets and the controlling interest in a former Soviet ICBM factory. began working to build the largest private militia on the planet, over one million African strong. Simultaneously, Amadeo hired an international black ops force to orchestrate a coup in the Congo while plotting to take over several small Eastern European countries. The most disturbing part of it all is, had the U.S. government not thwarted his plans, he might have just pulled it off. It's insanity. The bizarre, true story of a bipolar megalomaniac's insane plan for total world domination available now on amazon and audible frank started teaching that class and

of course as he taught that class he was able to cherry pick people that he thought could help him write motions do research and he slowly started building up a little a little staff and he ended up having just you know he had like four people maybe six people that are typing up motions he's writing the motions he has guys that are doing research for him and guys that he's teaching how to write motions so more complex motions he would handle and stuff like um child custody divorces uh you know things like that or maybe it's just you know some minor uh you're trying to get your I don't know trying to get things removed off of off of you like you'll have detainers and things like that like that you got arrested and went to federal prison and you were in a medium because

you still have charges in Georgia that are pending well he would hire guys that those and so they the the BOP would put a detainer on you and that raises your custody level well Frank would go and get those taken off you he'd say look you know he's in prison for the next 10 years you know, we want you, one of the things you do is you say, we want to fast track it. He wants to go to trial immediately, bring them back to the state. Well, of course, the state's like, even if he lost, he'll go to prison for two years. And they just book club on Monday, gym on Tuesday, date night on Wednesday. Out on the town on Thursday.

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they don't want to pay to bring you back to go to a trial so you can get two years when you're going to end up doing eight or ten years in the Fed and so then he gets the custody level and then the guy can be transferred or he gets moved to a lower custody or he gets that taken off and now maybe he's not a menace to society or whatever he was you know he was his his criminal history was raised because of this charge so then he can go and fight a 2255 to try and get your sentence reduced because now guess what Georgia dropped those charges like there's all these legal maneuvers that they were doing and he's training these guys so and he was there for years so yeah he got a whole he had a whole staff it was insane did any oh go ahead i was gonna say and and he actually had like i don't know what day it was i'm just gonna make up a day but it was like um spanish tuesday okay so he'd have a couple spanish guys there to do translating for spanish guys that had cases and they'd come and he would sit outside in an area that we called Stonehenge. It was because there were these concrete benches. There was a big round area and they had concrete benches that lined the whole circle. And in the middle there were concrete benches and tables. So there were like

four of those in the middle and these things. So it kind of looked like Stonehenge. And so they called it, so he would sit there at one of the tables and have a couple of Spanish translators. and then guys with, literally, there would be a line of eight or nine guys with their legal work. Waiting. And then they would go and sit down and they'd talk about the legal work. He'd say, go get me this, get me this, give me this. And he'd decide if he could fight the case or if it was worth it or if it wasn't worth it. Like sometimes he was like, look, there's nothing you could do.

You know? Yeah. And then, of course, guys are constantly coming up to him, especially at night when everybody's, nobody's at their job. There would be lines of guys waiting to talk to him. it was it was really really hilarious yes that that's what i'm saying it is hilarious that's a crazy story so did anybody ever or i'll say this did frank amadeo ever have a violent encounter did anybody ever try to harm him in any way ever absolutely okay absolutely well i want to hear about it because i thought this guy was like untouchable at this point oh no no no no this is this

actually I was sitting there oh my god what's so funny is everybody involved in that little inner counter I know okay so the one guy's name was um

gosh I don't even uh we call them pork chop so they called them chop you know it's pork shot but they called them chop and he uh this poor guy like you know the people you meet in prison you know like this guy literally his mother had been stabbed to death by his stepfather I think his sister got stabbed to death

and I think one of his sisters survived and he survived and then I think the guy himself ended up killing himself or went to prison for whatever I mean this guy had been in and out of the system anyway he had gone to frank and asked frank to do something for him and frank had had put it off or told him he needed to get something I forget what the case was But he'd gone to Frank a couple times. And look, pork chop wasn't the sharpest, you know, knife in the drawer. So I don't know exactly what the issue was. Porkchop felt Frank should do it.

Frank was asking him to get to do something. It was just a breakdown in communication. And the truth is, here's the problem. A lot of these guys were like, well, you need to do this. And you know, no, no, no. You're not paying me. I'm doing you know from frank from frank's perspective not that I ever saw him do this bro but I mean if it was me it's like I'm doing you a favor so if I say go get these cop outs

or get this paperwork or order this or get me the transcripts that's what's your that's your part nobody's paying me I'm not a public defender I'm doing this out of the kindness of my heart. A lot of guys don't see it that way. Chop didn't see it that way. So me, Donovan, and this, well, I was going to say Donovan, Donovan, Donovan's a black guy, too. But so Donovan's there, but this, this black guy who was Jamaican, who was huge, huge. We're sitting there.

And I'm sitting there talking. And I'm talking to Donovan, and I happened to catch Chop and Frank talking. They're together and they're talking. So here's what I was told happened. Frank ended up saying something along the lines of, and keep in mind, I think that Chop was, I'm going to say he was like a Crip, right? He's like a, you know how it is, like they're associated with the game. Like, he doesn't do anything.

The guy, the guy slept all day. I don't know what he's doing. He's not doing anything. But at some point, he was a Crip, whatever. So he ends up saying something where Frank ends up saying, like, that's what's wrong with all you, you Crips. You know, I try and explain things to you guys. And he ended up insulting him somehow. And Chop just lost it and slapped them right in the face.

Wow. I mean, like, he stumbled back. I want to say he might, I don't think he fell on the ground, but he almost fell. and so chop started coming towards him well the big jamaican you know because donovan and i were like and we both kind of jumped up but the big jamaican realized that frank stumbling you you caught it realized what was happening right away and i mean he went for chop immediately started running right at him he's got to he's got to butcher him i mean he's just got to kill him the guy was six foot 60 and he not not a not a tall skinny six foot six this

guy was massive. He's another guy named Lay. So Lay sees what's happening too. He starts coming. Lay another, another big black guy, massive. Tattoos on the face. Hilarious, by the way. I mean, he would, he, he, anyway, some of these guys crack me up. Big guy, I mean, dangerous guy. But, you know, but really nice guy. You know, he'd probably kill you for a couple hundred bucks. but very, very nice person, you know, other than that. So he, he, listen, they went straight after Chop. Chop jumps up and he's all like this and they're coming at him and everything. And then Frank immediately turns around.

He goes, wait a second, wait a second. That's an isolated event. That's not what's going on here. I don't know what he was thinking. He immediately calls everybody off and they're, they're ready to go and chop ends up running off. So Donovan has to go talk to him later and explain, you know, ask him what the problem is. And so I heard that happen to Frank. I heard another time a guy had essentially lost,

he lost emotion or something that he was sure that he, Frank had assured him that he was going to win. Now, that's what he said. I can't imagine Frank assuring anybody of something like that. He wasn't one of these guys. Oh, it's a slam dunk because there is no slam dunk. But the guy insisted that Frank had told him he was going to win, whatever. he supposedly grabbed Frank in the bathroom

and threw him against a wall and guys immediately moved in and grabbed the guy and yanked them off him. That's what I heard. So I know of two things that happened but those things never went anywhere. There was never any real, so we're talking about just somebody grabbing you by the shirt,

pushing you up against the wall and yelling at you and people pull you off. And another guy actually physically did slap Frank. You know? I don't think it was a part. hunch. I think it was more of a smack or something like that because Frank wasn't really bruised or if he had been bruised, he would have ended up going to the shoe. Something would have happened, but listen, the problem was is these two guys, I know Lay and the Jamaican guy. I can't believe

I can't remember his name too. Super cool guy. They were going to kill him. Like they wanted to go just beat the hell out of him. And Frank was absolutely, no, no, no. You know, Frank was, he'd got manic when he came back down he realized he had insulted the Crips somehow and you know even though typically he could behave that way because he was

typically fighting your case but in Chopp's case he wasn't fight that was the problem you didn't file this you didn't do that and you know and Frank was like you haven't given me the documents how am I supposed to do that's what's wrong with you

whatever Crips and you know bow so even though frank had uh some altercations it sounds like he still had some protection in there because of what the work he was doing oh yeah a lot of people can't let this guy get killed like no no he can't nothing can happen to frank yeah okay got that's what i thought no because he's he's literally helping guys like from your stories he's helping guys get out he's helping guys do all kinds of crazy stuff which is crazy that's pretty amazing yes I mean, you know, without a doubt, he was, he's an amazing individual. I mean, I met a lot of interesting, super, you know, interesting guys, but, you know,

every once in while you meet somebody that you're just like, you know, in this environment, for you to pull off and do the things that you're doing with all of the restrictions, it's difficult. It beats most people down and they just end up trying to get into a routine and that's it. But for you to do something like the things that he was doing, you know he's an amazing individual yeah that doesn't sound too gushy what happened to you uh the very first day you went to prison like what happened like he you kind of walking through like everything like from the moment you got in well it always been prison or you know a lot of people

don't realize the difference being prison and jail yeah no not jail prison like i know jail you sit in as you wait for your trial and sentencing right and then once you get sends now you go to prison it's like okay he's there now yeah i mean i think we got picked up in the morning i don't know when we got there probably got there around maybe 12 or one or something like that like it was it wasn't too late and you know you you get processed you come off the bus and you know you you walk in with your hands cuffed and everything um and your leg shackled and we waddled in and you know they take your stuff off and they change you out they give you clothes and uh you know you're basically still stuck in like your or they don't give you clothes right then

you're still actually stuck in your your your transport gear which is just your bus clothes like tan slacks or tan horrible tan you know like old man pants and a beat up white t-shirt with holes and so that's just horrible. Like, I always love it when you watch the, um, whenever you watch the, uh, uh, TV shows and there, the orange jumpsuits are always real bright and clean. I ain't seen, I've never seen a brand new jumpsuit ever, never seen. They were disgusting, weren't they? Oh, they're horrible.

They've been around for 10 years, 40 people have, maybe, maybe more people, 100 people have worn them. Yeah. And they're just torn and all kinds of, so, you know, uh, then you meet with the staff every, the head of every department comes and kind of gives you a talk real quick, right? Like, you know, SIS comes and they tell you, you a member of a gang, you remember this, you remember that, no, no, no, no, okay, okay. They leave. Stay out of trouble. I looked at your jacket. You know, you got into a fight at the last place. You're like, that wouldn't my fault. You know, whatever

the case may be for that inmate. You know, medical comes and looks at you briefly. They've already, they get a, they get a file. They know you're okay. They kind of, just cursory kind of run through the motions. You meet with three or four people. Then they tell you what housing unit to go to. And, and, you know, you get talked to like you're just a dog. Every single person talks to you like your dog. Like, I never had, until I got locked up, like I'd never actually been spoken to like I was just garbage and had to take it. You know, like really. Like, it's different than your dad yelling at you. Yeah. vastly different than that. Anyway, yeah, they tell you, go to your unit.

They give you a big bundle. You know, you get like a rolled up blanket and sheets. You don't get a pillow. You know, you think you're going to get it. If you say, hey, man, I didn't get a pillow. They go, oh, no, you got a pillow on the bed. Oh, okay, you don't have no pillow on the bed. There's no pillow on the bed.

You got to find a pillow. So you get there, you go into the unit. The units are huge. They're like four stories big, four stories tall. they're massive. Each one holds between 6 to 800 people. They're four units, four units at every building. So there's like four, no, there's three housing buildings, three housing units with four units in each building. About six to 800 guys in each building, about 150 to 180 guys in each unit in the building. So you go in, you walk in there and there's a sally port and you get through

the sally port. They open the door. Usually they're just, they were open. So you go in and you go up to the cop and he says, he looks at your card and he goes, you're in room 205 or 2702 or whatever it is. You go to your room and you, you know, you walk in and I went into mine and there was a little a little Mexican guy in there when I say little he was basically my height so the Mexican guy in there and he was like what do you say he was a Texacano

so do you know what that is? No. So he was he lived in Texas he was Mexican but he actually was born in Texas but he's 100% Mexican and so yeah

he he you know he said hey here's your bunk here's this he kind of just told me if you need something to some soups or anything I can give them to you just give them back to me you're like we had a little conversation and then I was looking for a pillow or something I left the room walking around the unit and all of a sudden they start screaming the CEO starts screaming lockdown lockdown and everybody's running around actually I think I was trying to find some see if I could get some coffee from somebody

whatever it was, I was, or Gwater, whatever it was, everybody's screaming, a lockdown, lockdown. And the guy, the Mexican guy comes running up to me and he says, Sally, we got to go, you got to go to, you know, because people are doors are slamming. I'm still. And he runs up to me and goes, Sally, you got to go, go to the room,

go to go to the room. I was like, well, what's going on, bro? What's going on? And he said, somebody got stabbed in the yard. And I went, someone got killed in the yard. He said, nah, nah, no, he didn't, didn't kill them. They just stabbed them up a little bit. And I remember thinking, you're stabbed them up a little bit. That doesn't sound like it's like jumbo shrimp. You know, it just doesn't, it does like

that just doesn't even make sense. So and I was like, well, you know, he goes, yeah, so we went in the room. They closed the room. We were in there for a few hours, two, three hours. And then it was dinner time. They popped the doors and they let us out for dinner. and like nothing the guy ended up two two guys got into a fight and one guy owed somebody money or something i never really found out what happened and the other guy got him in the rec yard and got him in a corner and stabbed them a bunch of time so they both ended up getting yanked off the yard put throw them in the shoe and they'll be shipped to different locations and that's it guy didn't die or anything but people were getting stabbed in in that institution they were getting stabbed or cut um you know all the time but really the worst one of the worst fights i saw was actually in the in the low um but there i did see i did see some a lot of fights in the in the in the there's more fights in the medium but there were still lots of stuff happened in the low but yeah that so you know went to bed that night and no pillow very upset it took me a week or two to get a pillow yeah that must have been

and I'm sure the beds are not comfortable at all. They're rock solid. So you're sleeping on basically rock solid floor in the form of a bed. You're sleeping on, they call them pans. So it's just a sheet of metal with a little lip. Like I don't know what that little lip was. It was like a pan, like a pan you'd put in your oven. And it was just a little lip and it was a pan and it was clearly just made out of sheet metal.

You laid on it was hard as fucking rock. You know, you had a foam, like a four inch, three or four inch piece of foam that had been laid on by a thousand guys over the last 10 years. So there's no foam left. I mean, it's virtually, you're basically, like you said, you're basically laying almost on the steel. And I was sleep for, so you sleep on one side. And you could do that for about an hour or so until that side started hurting. And then you roll over to the other side, sleep on that for. So it was like every hour or two, you're back and forth, back and forth,

because you can just never really get comfortable. That sounds absolutely awful. What were some of the things that you were here at night? Because I've heard different stories of like what happens in night in prisons, but I just kind of wanted to hear like your account. Like our guys actually like, you know, like having sex with each other and sharpening tools and all kind of stuff like that. So when I was in the, when I was actually in the U.S. Marshal's holdover, I, I heard a guy getting raped.

Jeez. Everybody heard it. Screaming, hollering, the whole thing. You know, nobody hit the button. Nobody. Nothing. So, so obviously the, the COs in there heard it and just didn't do anything. I don't even know where the COs were.

Like, the CEOs would leave. So, you know, like, you always think that there's a CO there all the time. sometimes they were but they also had an office like they could go in their office close the door you could be there could be somebody shooting walking around with a gun you got bet you couldn't hear it through that door you know and it was so loud to begin with there's banging con that's the thing about prison is one you know when you think of prison and you see these movies it's always some solitary guy in a cell by himself alone and man i wish i wish that's what it was What it really is is you're never alone.

It's noise 24 hours a day, screaming 24 hours a day, and you're never alone. Like, I love being alone. I have no problem being alone. But anyway, yeah, so that happened. That was in the Marshall's holdover. But when you're in prison, like... Well, before we get to that, can we just talk about that part? Like, what was that like hearing that?

what was everybody else's reaction was what are the other animates doing are they just like what was i was locked up in in the cell with i think one or two other guys i was in what's called uh at atlanta city detention center but i was in the marshals hold over there and uh yeah you could hear it but it's not like it was right next door it was on a i was downstairs it was upstairs on the second tier and you could just hear it and i remember saying And bro, can you hear this? He was like, yeah, fuck, man, Jesus. You know, it was just a cellie, two cellies.

And, you know, you realize that maybe, you know, it felt like maybe they were fighting. We really kind of figured out the next day. That's what. And I had my suspicions, you know, but it was really the next day that you found out that that's what happened. The next morning when you can, because, you know, eventually it stops. It doesn't go on forever. We're talking about, you know. I don't know if you ever been in a fight, but let's face it, five minutes of fighting is an eternity.

Yes, it is very tiring. Right. So, you know, we're talking about four or five minutes and maybe every once in a while you hear some more yelling or something five minutes later, 10 minutes later, whatever. And then that's it. You know, you go to sleep. The next day, the guy was, I think the guy was gone. Or I think maybe they were both gone the next day. Is it?

I mean, what was the story behind that? He just saw him and said, I'm going to take them. Did they get into a fight? Like, how does that? No, no, this is two cellies. Two cellies, and one of them was gay. Okay. And the story I heard was that the one celly who wasn't gay raped the story, like the

celly that was gay, which, of course, if you were man raping a man, and I'm pretty much said that they're both gay. But, um, whatever. So that, but I was going to say in prison, like, you don't really hear about stuff like that because there are gay guys. Like, there's so many. many gay guys you know and if you see some guys there are some guys that are in prison in the medium who guys in the medium that like they get off on pressuring a guy does that make

sense like they like sure they could go to a gay guy and they could give him some money and he do what he does uh you know like they're like prostitutes right so he could do that but he'd rather or find somebody he can pressure into it right so they have mental some kind of a mental condition about dominate dominating someone remember there was a black guy named bear and bear hung out with a bunch of other guys you've heard of the term booty bandits yeah i have so bear had tried to talk to me a couple times hey man what's going on was everybody what's up like but i knew something was wrong i could feel something was wrong with the guy and i didn't really want to talk to anybody anybody i've been there a few weeks maybe a month or two um and i remember one day i was walking just

walking around the second tier and he sees me bears sees me bears come like two or three of his buddies are standing next to his door and bear goes yo man let me talk to you for a second i go yeah what's up i walk over towards the rail and i hold the rail and i go what's up and he goes yo man let me talk to you in my room for a second, man. And I go, ah, I'm good. He goes, ah, man, I just want to talk to you in the room. And I went, man, I said, we can talk out here.

I said, nobody can hear. He's, man, I just want to let you know, like, if you need anything, like, you need, like, I got, I got, you know, I got, you know, I got, uh, I got, uh, I got weed. Like, I got cigarettes, whatever you need. I got, I go, oh, I'm good. I don't, I don't really do any drugs or anything, but I, I got you. man you won't you can't come in my room talk to me and keep mind the moment I walk in the room his three buddies are going to walk in behind me and close the door yeah now I'm in the room of four guys he's when you think I'm going to jump on you or something and I go you know if I don't

go into your room I don't have to find out and I said is there anything else you know and he goes no I man ain't like that I said no I get it and I appreciate it and you you we had our talk and I get it and you know not trying to be rude or anything I said But I'm good, bro. I'm good. I appreciate it. Thank you. If I need anything, I will let you know.

Just turn around and walk off. I think maybe he tried to talk to me one or two other times, but that was it. Like, he realized, like, I'm not, I'm not stupid. I'm not, you know, like, oh, okay, I'll go in your, like, you know. And the truth is, had I not been in the, had I not already been locked up over a year, I probably would have walked right in his room. Yeah, man, what's up. Wouldn't have no idea?

Huh? You wouldn't have had no idea? I wouldn't have had, I would probably, I would have been clueless. I would have been like, like, you know, because I had this feeling when I was on the street, like, nothing bad's going to happen to me. It's that air of arrogance that, I pretty much can handle whatever comes my way. Well, you get arrested, you go to prison, you get 26 years, you realize, no, no, bad shit. happen, keep your head down, don't make friends. Don't trust anybody. Everybody wants something from you. And that, you realize that right away in prison, everybody wants something from you.

You know, sometimes, luckily, it's as simple as friendship. You know, maybe it's just entertainment because they want to talk to somebody that is their mental, you know, equivalent. And that they have very few people that they can talk to and have a normal conversation with. So, Sometimes that's all it is. And if that's it, then that's great. You're lucky. Count your blessing. But most of the time, they want something from you.

Even if it's just knowledge, sometimes it's like they're, hey, bro, you know, but you talk to the guy and he's always cool to you, but he's always trying to pull information out of you. He's never stopping by just to say, hey, what's going on? How's your mom? What's happening with it? You know, that's never the case. It's always about getting something from you.

Can you look at this? Can you look at my legal work? Can you read this? get what do you think about this what would you do about this what would you do if you got out and you had $30,000 uh can you help me write this can you i got a business plan can you look at it you know it's damn bro it's like every time i see you that you give me a fucking assignment yeah you know we're not friends you know i'm certainly not in a position to ever ask you for anything so how is the one way relationship you know and you realize that right away yeah i actually used to say that

to people on the phone all the time when I would call people, I would say, I feel horrible when I call people because I knew it was a one-way relationship. I'm on the inside. There's nothing I can do for you. And the only time I called you is to ask you for something. Yeah. You know, it costs me money to call you. You know, it, it's just a horrible situation. You're in such a bad spot. But, you know, the guys I always felt the worst with the guys that had relationships with their kids or that were trying to maintain some kind of a marriage. Yeah, that'd be tough to doing, tough to do in prison.

Yeah. Horrible, horrible situation. I'd seen guys do it amazingly. But for the most part, if you weren't like a multi-millionaire, you know, yeah it was it was almost impossible there were a few guys that but nobody that had like a 10 or 15 year 10 or 15 year sentence those relationships are over like unless like I said unless they unless the girls the women were you know from Latin America or you know the Philippines you know like if there's an American chick like she's not waiting 10 years bro it's not going to happen she's

not waiting unless you're a multi-millionaire and basically you're able to still continue to support her in some way then she's going to wait yeah you know which which is horrible i'm not even i'm not even suggesting that it's that it's a um a flaw on the on the part of women i think men are i'm sure men are i exactly the same way it's just in america we're just not just not we're just not you know we're not prepared for that yeah Yeah, we're different than other cultures, for sure. So what else? What's going on?

That's really all. Yeah, that's really all I got. So wait, you want to know what happened with Frank? When he got out? Yeah, sure. Yeah, go for it. Okay, so Frank gets out. I'll just tell you what I kind of know.

And I know bits and pieces. So he kind of got out. He went to work for, I want to say like a law firm, like doing bankruptcy something. And he kind of started consulting. And by the way, not that this is somebody that I've gotten bits and pieces and I formulated some of this. So it's not like anybody told me or Frank told me. It's like other inmate or former inmates have told me that know him or have told me bits and pieces. And one guy had, you know, I knew he was already working for a law firm.

Another guy told me he was doing some consulting for a couple of different companies that were in financial straits. And he was helping to merge some companies and restructure some companies. So, you know, which to me is like he's trying to build Mirabalus like this. He's, you know, I always compare him to Spector on, from 007, you know, it's this evil organization that's put together to try and conquer the world. So he's basically trying to put together Spector, which he calls Mirabalus, which he was doing anyway. So he got out and he was working for this company, this. law firm, which anything he's a part of, he very quickly takes over. So somehow or another, he starts to put together, get a few companies that are having problems and restructure

them. This is going on for a year or so. After about, he'd been out about a year and a half, and one day the U.S. Marshalls show up and they, they arrest him and they take him, he gets violated. His probation gets violated. So, because he was out on, he was out on the First Chance Act, which put an ankle monitor on him and allowed him to finish out his time outside of prison. Okay. Yeah.

Well, they said he violated his, you know, his supervised release, threw him back in the Marshall's holdover. It takes about, typically you have to have a hearing within 30 days, but there was COVID was going on. So it took, let's say, four or five,

months to get him in front of a judge when he gets in front of a judge he says you know your honor i haven't really been like they violated my probation because they said the probation officer said that they one got a they had that he was engaging in criminal activity and two he had left the jurisdiction without permission right so like all states are broken up into different jurisdictions like Florida's three different jurisdictions. And they said he left the jurisdiction without permission. So he gets in front of the judge and he says, Your Honor, I've never left the jurisdiction.

I have an ankle monitor on. And if I had left the jurisdiction, then they certainly have data that shows that. They can prove that. Secondly, I'd love to be able to confront whoever said I was engaged in criminal behavior because I haven't been. So what proof is there that I've been engaged in criminal behavior?

I haven't been indicted. There's no investigation, so I'd like to know what that is. So the judge asked the U.S. attorney, can you provide these documents? And the U.S. attorney says, well, the probation officer told us that he left the jurisdiction. And also the probation officer is the one who told us all this. So they turned to the probation officer. The probation officer says, well, I got a phone call. from someone who said he had left the jurisdiction.

And I got a phone call that said he was, that another person believed he was currently committing the same fraud that he had committed that got him in prison. So that's, that's criminal behavior. And they were like, that's it. You got two phone calls? And they said, well, we'd like proof.

So they said, well, give us some time to get the proof. So he scheduled it for like a 30 more days, 30 days later, they show up. They still have nothing. So the judge says, okay, that's it. He's got 10 days to come up with some proof or I'm letting them go. And so they couldn't. So they put them back on home confinement. Only where before he was a little bit out there, like he's talking to other inmates.

He's like he's a little bit doing stuff you shouldn't really be doing. But not really, they're not going to throw you back in jail for that. it'd have to be super excessive. You'd have to basically get charged with a crime with another inmate or with a former inmate or someone with a criminal record. So anyway, so what my understanding now is that he's basically

terrified. Like he didn't talk to anybody. He just goes to work, comes back, like all these crazy kind of getting out there and doing stuff. He's like, stop doing everything.

He's just very concerned. because he feels like they're targeting him trying to throw him back in prison, which I think is possible. If you go to his channel and watch some of his recent videos, you really see Frank walking around. He's in a boardroom. He's talking about how he's innocent. He's, it's kind of interesting.

You kind of get to see him in his glory. Yeah, I'll definitely, I'll definitely check out his channel because that was one very interesting thing about your story was you meeting him and him helping you and stuff like that. So, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, he shaved 12 years off my sentence. Yep. For sure.

That's crazy. If it weren't for him, I would, the government was never going to reduce my sentence. Yep. Twice. So do you know what the likelihood of filing what's called a, if you file a 2255, one in 305. one in 3,500 actually result in relief for the inmate. Wow. One in 3,500.

He filed two and convinced the court to file a Rule 35 in my case twice. Like it's, you know, I don't want to use the word miracle, but it's a miracle. And Frank considers himself and what does he say? he says, I'm like, Emperor of the World, he's like, well, I'm like, that doesn't even, you're going to be Emperor of the world, he doesn't even, like, who says Emperor? He's like, well, you know, think of me as a, what do you say, an Old Testament prophet. That's the way I like to see it. I was like, okay, like God has a divine, he has a divine goal for me. It may not go according to plan. It may not be easy, but ultimately I will prevail. It's like the trials of Job or Moses or, you know, like, things didn't go either. It wasn't easy. But it ultimately, he had a divine purpose. Which is there I love that, bro.

There you go. He says that. Yeah. So, anyway, listen, I'll talk forever. Yep. And I know you want to go. I can tell you're fighting off some yawning. You're good, man.

Yeah, I do got to go. it definitely was good talking with you and hearing your story and stuff. Like I said, I've watched you for years. So this was actually really cool to just kind of talk to you and get your brain and stuff like that. That's hilarious. Yeah, you got to try and, uh, trying to think. If you could possibly

get me Kevin on or Coffeezilla or whoever Tyler ended up getting you on, I think you should try. I think that'd be really cool. I mean, I don't even know. Like, I don't know enough to be, I don't know enough to be dangerous. Fair enough. But listen, here's what I know is the meet Kevin like i don't get this from graham stephan grand stephen i i think you know i think

he's just kind of a nice guy going he he he ended up if if there was no youtube he would have ended up being you know just a uh a run-of-the-mill realtor a realtor yeah ebs that's a realtor yeah but he's entertaining he's energetic he's he's he's non-confrontational he's easy to watch right he's likable he's very likable um so i don't see this in him at all but let me just say like you've heard the term of a fisherman knows a fisherman um meet kevin con man yes like i'm just telling you he talks for three minutes and i'm like oh man this this guy's sleazy like you know you know he's he's a con man i mean this is this is this is you know so that's just that's how i feel that's like my my take on him you know it's the

it's the same thing with uh with she says what's the guy the um uh caught the um the guy that did the zoo token uh Logan Paul Logan Paul I can't remember same thing yeah the problem with Logan Paul is he's one of those guys that um thinks he's the smartest guy in the room you know and you know that's that's when you're not the smartest guy in the room and you think that it's just not a good situation but he he definitely he thinks he's got everybody fooled and it's like you know why fool anybody people people like him he's got a huge following yeah why try and fool anybody why not just be honest about everything that you're doing like especially when he's got he's got a ton of money like I don't get these guys that have a ton of money and just it's just

greed they just want more and more you're greed yeah it's never enough All right. I mean, like, what is the difference between 10 and 15 million? You're not going to live any better. Yeah. So, all right. I appreciate it. Yeah. Yeah. Appreciate you, man. Definitely was going on. Yeah. Hey, I appreciate you guys watching. Do me a favor. If you like the video, hit the subscribe button. Hit the bell so you get notified of videos just like this. Also, leave a comment in the comment section. I try and respond to as many comments as possible. Although, to be honest, in the last two weeks, I've really, been slipping. Regardless, do that. I appreciate it. And we're going to leave, we are going to leave Jay from Echoes from above and below. We're going to leave the link in the description so you can find a channel, although, to be honest, if you punch it in, it comes up right away. So I appreciate you guys watching. I really would be shocked if anybody's watching this long. But, all right, see you.