Matthew Cox | Inside True Crime Podcast - What Really Happens In Prisons Programs | RDAP

Episode Date: February 20, 2024

What Really Happens In Prisons Programs | RDAP

he's like um i didn't think it was a big deal you you didn't think it was a big deal refazed why didn't you mention it he said um i was i was i because i i mentioned it to him i did i did i was going to talk to him about i haven't talked to him yet boom knocks him slap out goes over to him with the pepper spray and sprays him unconscious in the face for about 30 seconds like boom Boom. Programming. You're like, what? People are looking around like, what the hell?

And, you know, they could tell somebody's in one of the shower stalls. Like, it's two in the morning. And they kind of step back and look, and there's four feet in the shower stall. Shower's not running. There's four feet. Said, oh, no, no, no, no. Like, I got to clear this up. I was just giving them a haircut.

And they was like, oh, man, that's a bad excuse. First of all, he ain't got a haircut. He got some big old shaggy hair. Same shaggy hair he had yesterday. Hey, this is Matt Cox, and I am here with Isaac, Zach Allen. And we are going to be doing part two of ARDAP. Residential drug, alcohol. No, alcohol.

No, residential. abuse drug abuse program yes yeah yeah yeah sorry make sure we get that art app for short um uh yeah hey do me a favor if you like the video hit the subscribe button hit the bell so you get notified of videos just like this also leave me a comment and share the video and we're doing part two of art app check it out here we go it's funny because as much of a just as horrible as i know that I come off when I do this. If I watch the first couple of minutes, I'm like, Colby made me look all right.

Yeah. You know? And then. And then. But anyway. So Ardap. Ardap is the residential drug abuse program that federal prisoners can be eligible for and can take.

And if eligible, they can, if eligible to get the year off, they can get a year off their sentence and up to a year halfway house, although that almost never happens. Well, now it does. Now with the First Step Act, I've heard that now people are in two years. They get the year off.

They can get up to three years off their sentence. So now it's having a big impact. So it's important to programming. All right. All right. So we were talking like basically before about like our experience with the R DAP. No, no. The last one was basically, I felt like it was like an overview.

We were kind of explaining the program. True. But we did talk about. We didn't talk about specifics. Well, we talked about our experience. A little bit, but we didn't talk about specific events, bad things, I think specific things that happened. Did we? Correct.

No, we didn't. We gave our, the reason I say that is because we talked about our view and what we saw. Right. Right. But we didn't specifically talk about things that happened in each program while we're there because the dichotomy of you attending it in a low and me attending it in a pen made it completely different. Yeah, definitely, definitely. Nobody got stabbed in mine. And nobody got stabbed at the institution or nobody got stabbed in the program? In the program.

Okay. Well, in the program, people got stabbed in the institution, but they had it coming. Of course. Of course. In the program, in, so when I say in the program, I'm talking about during the morning meeting. Right. Because we talked about, you know, in the RDAP program, there's a meeting every morning where everybody, 150 people at 10, and you're sitting, you know, across from each other. Right. So you get 75 people, rows, there's like five or six rows. 16, 15.

Yeah, yeah, of people. Like, yeah, like, exactly. They're like, like, 15 people apiece. So there's like, let's say five of them. I'm sure my math is off. But whether it's five row, five or six rows of 70, so it ends up being 75 people sitting facing the other 75 people. You're all facing each other.

And then in the middle, there's usually a podium. At the head of a, there's a, at the head, there's the, yeah, the podium. Did you have the podium in between the two people, or ours was off to the side? So the two rows are sitting perpendicular like this, and on the top part is the facilitator, and on the back of the open part was the DTS. Okay. They stood or... The drug treatment specialist, one of the people that helped run the program.

Correct. That's who was in on the back part of it. And that's how... So we were looking across, most of the time everyone's looking at the facilitator. And that's something I wanted us to talk about, too, is were you ever the facilitator? Oh, everybody had to be at one point. Did you ever do Word of the day? Yes.

Word of the day. You know what I thought? I forgot all about that. Word of the day. Did you have a particular word that you thought was interesting? There was only one word that I saw there that I took out with me and I thought was very interesting. I can't even believe they allow it to be the word. And that word was frenemy.

Friend of me. It was a friend and an enemy. Is that a made-up word? Yes, of course it's made up, you know, and I'm playing friend of me. And they allow people, you know, and you have to use that in a sentence. Yeah, yeah. You know. Well, not just, well, I mean, in the program and the low, you didn't have to use it in a sentence.

You had to use it in a sentence, and then you had to give your, the definition of the word. Correct. Okay. So, and they would write the word on the board the night before, so you had time to think about it. So. So the person. presented the word was explaining as someone that poses as a friend but actually is an enemy right and so i'm i'm saying to myself like what is even lifting about that yeah yeah the word had the word had

to have inspirational or uplifting or it couldn't be like a it couldn't be like you know something a negative type of word right and how negative is it to like identify someone as a frenemy right like hey you're really you're i think you're fake as hell but But you're nice. I'll deal with you. You know what I'm saying? It's weird. That's the one word I took out of all of the bizarre word of the day.

I'm sure you probably don't remember any of the. I mean, because a lot of them. But as a friend of me of yours, I thought I'd bring that up. I think, you know, they were, you know, it was, some of them were ridiculous. Some of them were just like basic, like success. Yeah. You know, some of them were, you know, were. Or succession.

No, I'm just kidding. So they were, they were just, they were, you know, they were just. just these words that were, you know, I don't know if they were even, I guess, success, um, motivation, um, you know, they were just, there was just these random words and you'd have to get up there and it just seems silly to me. But it, but luckily they did put them on the board the day before because, you know, yes, it, because other, if you were just on the spot like that. And then some people you had to help them to understand what the, what the word meant. Yeah, because you're like, wow, you don't, you don't know what that word is. No, I don't.

Okay. Basic English, we'll go. But yeah, so everyone had to be the facilitator. Fruition. Fruition. No, no, fruitation. Fruitation. Fruitation. I used to use the word fruation.

For fruition? Yes. And I was like, no, no, it's fruition. No, it's fruitation. I go, no, it's fruition. So I say, use fruitation in the Senate. And he did. He did it perfectly.

He said, you know, when something bears fruit, It like you, you do something and then ultimately, he goes, it ends up, you know, happening or it ends up, you know, bearing, like you plant a seed and it bears fruit. You know, it's fruitation. And I went, no. That's actually, uh, but he's the definition. The definition's correct, but not for fruitation, because fruitation's not a word. For fruition, you just gave me the definition for fruition. And so he argued with me and I went, okay, I walk off, I go get the dictionary, I bring it back and I show it to him. And he, And listen, the funniest thing was the guy's name was knowledge. He was also... Was that his nickname or his real name?

No, it was his nickname. He was also, he's from Jamaica, he'd set up a bank robbery and had been fighting his case the whole time because he was saying

that bank robbery is not a federal crime. It's a state crime. He should not... They don't have the jurisdiction to... They don't have the jurisdiction to...

to prosecute him in the federal system. It should have been a state crime. And it was like, how long have you been fighting this? He's like, about six years. You're going to do that whole sentence, aren't you? And then he was, listen, he came over here when he was two. He was 19 with, almost 19 when this happened. He had just filled out his paperwork to become a citizen.

And because he had a felon committed the felony before he filled out the citizenship. and one of the questions on there have you ever been have you ever committed a felony he said no but he had they were going to deport him back to jamaica where he had no family and hadn't been since he was two wow whoa right he's like i don't know anybody i got no family no family's like i don't know what i'm going to do he's like jamaica it's like damn that was harsh yeah that's It's crazy. And it was a nonviolent, like, robbery, too. The bank robbers, like, with a note, you know? He worked at the place and just told the people like, look, this place has been robbed multiple times. They come in, they rob it with a note. And then you go through this, like, this apartment complex.

Because once you enter the apartment complex, there's four different ways you can go out. You should have somebody waiting for you, jump in and leave. Like, even if they get to the apartment complex, there's too many cars. There's no camera. Like, he's like, we get robbed here all the time. They always get away. so he set the whole thing up and he set up two of them and he one person somebody ended up telling somebody who told somebody they end up getting him and he got messed up but the point is

is like damn like bro he's been here since he was two what are you going to do you can't send him to jamaica i mean he could work over there they've got a lot of work in fruitation anyway this is a dad jokes you know so what happened what are we talking about all right so um let me see if i can guide us through so the whole purpose uh and this is what I was really trying to get to of the RDAF is, as we mentioned before, is the program our way of thinking. So they had these eight positive attitudes. Do you remember them by chance? No, what are they? All right. Their honesty, which we struggle with, humility, open-mindedness, gratitude, caring, responsibility, objectivity, and willingness.

Damn, I'm lacking in all of those. But you know what? You're not lacking in willingness. it's that's my but how you're working on it did they used to do that all the time how you're working you say yeah man I'm struggling with this and they go how you're working on it yeah so like so they use those those are those attributes right because I want to get to the the rational self-analysis the RSA you know you don't want to do the attitude check first because you have to learn the attitude check before you do the RSA That's correct, which is an attitude check is, so they want you to always explain, like, how you're displaying one of the positive attitudes or if you are struggling with it. Not displaying, which is struggling with it.

So if you're not displaying one of the, like, if you're not being objective, you know, when you're telling, look, I'm absolutely not going to do that, Nicole Cox. If you're not going to do the chicken dance. What are you struggling with? We're struggling with willingness and objectivity. humility you think you're above it do you feel entitled are you entitled

are you entitled Cox do you feel like and those are yeah those are things that just get you to break down when they when they give you those mental cues you're like I don't want to be struggling

with all those things that's when you lay an egg but so I know good times so they use that the attitude checks to tell you you're struggling

with one of the And really, in any aspect, if I disagree with you, I can just throw one of those out and say you're struggling with it. Any disagreement at all. Like, hey, Cox, let me get $100. You're like, look, I don't really have it. You're struggling with open-mindedness. So, okay, let me, let me, so for context. Yes.

So here's what's happening is that every day you had to at least write, you had to, they gave you a booklet. And so every day you had to write. You had to do an attitude check. And sometimes you had to do like two attitude checks and an RSA. It just depends on the program. We're going to get to the RSA. Right. So they would say, so every day you had to do an attitude check.

And in the morning meeting, they would randomly call on people to, usually they ask for a volunteer. But if nobody volunteered, and then maybe 10 guys would raise their hand, they'd pick somebody. And if nobody raised their hand, which really never happened, they just randomly pick someone. So it's just better that everybody puts their hand up. So anyway, what happened is, what happened is throughout the day, something would happen on a daily basis that you would struggle with, with some kind of an attitude, having a negative attitude or a good attitude, whatever it was. But you're not doing something that somebody wants you to do. I discovered those attitudes that basically, if you're not doing something I want you to do, because no one can display those. It's impossible.

Right. It's absolutely impossible. Well, what I'm saying is they had you write that down. Right. In a book, there'd be one page, you had to write, like, you know, the group, your name, the group, the time, the location. And then you wrote a little quip about how, and there was a certain way you had to do it. And so I wrote a book called the program. And I, in the book, I probably have 20 of my attitude checks that I wrote throughout the program. And I included them in the book. Now, most people wrote decent attitude. They had decent normal. attitude checks. Mine were abnormal. So mine was like, you know,

February, August 11th, 2017. I was mining my own business when a peer, a crackhead corrected me over something trivial. My first thought was, who the fuck does this guy think he is? Which attitude was I struggling with?

Humility. After calming down, I realized that the peer that the peer has mental issues and I should be more patient with him he can't help that he's a pawn he's a pawn in the world of Ardap which attitude was I demonstrating with

humility because you could actually you can actually demonstrate both you can struggle and demonstrate I was struggling with it but I corrected myself and now I was showing humility by saying wow saying wow he's a loser Yes, that I should feel bad for him.

Oh, okay. So if I continue practicing these positive attitudes, I will get through this program, and although I doubt I'll need, wait, although I doubt I'll need these skills, I'll be able to deal with crackheads in the future, or in the, on the stress, Jesus, God Almighty. First of all, I can't see and I can't read. I'll be able to deal with these crack heads on the street. Now, if my DTS had read this, I would have been crucial. crucified. Like, she would have, they would have been like, I want to crucify you. First of all, I was using, what did they call the words?

Loaded. I was using loaded words by calling him a crackhead. Which is the next thing we're going to cover is the thinking errors. Right. But through this whole thing, I have just multiple insane ones where I talk about, like my first thought was, if I had baseball bat, I'd hit this dude in the head. And then, of course, you know, what was I struggling with? You know, objectivity. You know what I'm saying? After thinking about it. And I thought, there's really no reason to pick up a murder charge. You know, and then I would go through the whole thing again. Which is open-mindedness there. Listen. Listen, but that's what happens. You'd have a book full of these.

And in the morning meeting, people would randomly have to call them. Like, luckily, I never got called. I might have got called once and it might have been a questionable one. But that was it. And then you had to pull them out and give them. This is what they had to do, was that every so often they'd say pull the last five attitude checks out. Right. And you pull them out.

and there'd be a stack and we'd pass them down the row and there'd be a stack of them and they'd say they were going to read them honestly I don't think any of mine ever read because I gave them ones that were like oh I'm done I'm done that's a bad one like I talked about Dr. Smith I called her a name like I said some I see people get kicked out for that yeah yeah yeah yeah so anyway but I'm sorry that's what that was my experience with the attitude checks so you were saying well I thought the attitude checks in my opinion and they were worthless, you know, because if, if, because basically, as I was saying, you could be struggling with, there's no way to display them all at once.

Even if you're in a great mood, you can't display all the attitudes. No, but what, but are you only have to pick one or two? That you're, that you're struggling with. Right. Or, or you're displaying. Right. You can't. That's not all of them, though.

No, you can't. But in any situation, I can say you're struggling with any of the attitudes. I mean, yeah, you would see people, I twist them, you know, slightly here and there, but it's untwistable. So, like, right now you can say I'm struggling with objectivity. Right. I might go, you know what? You're absolutely right. Or I could say humility.

Like, you're not being, you're not taking into consideration that you might be wrong. You're not being humble. You know what I'm saying? Or you could say entitlement. Well, entitlement's not one of them. But you could say, you know, whatever. Yeah, you could, you could, you meant, it was always a way that you could manage to twist it. Yes.

and that's why I could never like I did them but they were BS like I never took them seriously because I just felt like like any situation every situation we're in we're struggling with one of the attitudes

we are displaying one and we're struggling with one right so I just on some some scale some yeah so I never I never took it seriously so what was the one what is RSA's well RSA but I want to get to the thinking errors first Yeah, thinking errors.

So this is, this, what I thought was, was, was, what I thought was classic about the, the thinking errors is that, like, that is what identified where we could possibly be doing something wrong. Those are the things that I took from there that actually helped me, which were the thinking errors. So the thinking errors was rhetorical question, like asking, in response to something, like asking a question that has no answer. Right. What do you think I'm stupid? yeah that to me that has an answer but all right awfulizing awfulizing which which means thinking the worst result yeah i can't which is is declaring that i think it's i can and i won't there's another i were missing one yeah it might have been i can't i won't yeah that does sound familiar

i would like i can't doing something you're you're declared you haven't even tried right Like you just, you just, you think it's impossible before you start. Right. So it makes it impossible. Right. Blaming. You know, this is not my fault. It's somebody else's fault.

Right. Like I take no responsibility for what's going on. Right. Should. They used to always do the one, I'm only here because someone snitched on me. Not because you robbed a bank. Yeah. No.

Not because you were selling drugs. Not because you committed fraud. Of course not. I'm here because I got told on. Right. You know, I mean, the crime I committed, that's, that's nothing. I would have gotten away with that. That's right.

Should thoughts. Like, it should definitely be this way and not the way it is. They should have given me this much time. They should have done this. Correct. This program should give out five years off my sentence. Exactly. Statement of facts.

Yeah. Which is 95% of, you know, 95% of America believes this or, you know, oh, you know, like, everybody does it. Yeah, everybody's doing it. Everybody's selling crack. Yeah. Makes it okay. I know, he, she, it statements.

Yeah. Which is like, he has it or he's done it. If he's doing it or she's doing it or you're doing it, it's basically twisting it around to like, I'm not the only person. Right. You know, I think on TV they call it, what about, what about is them?

You know, if I'm doing it, but what about what you're doing? Right. That's a big argument with people a lot of times when you directly, when you say, well, this is what you're doing. doing, they're like, or this is what so-and-so did it? Yeah, but what about so-and-so? You ever in political debates? I was noticed, not debates, but when these people are talking on like on TikTok or shorts or something, they're always like, well, what

Trump, you know, Trump did this and they'll go, what about Biden? He did this. Like, it's always, you know, it's always like, wait a second, we're not someone we're talking. It's deflecting onto someone else instead of answering the question. That's, that, that is actually huge because that is one of the big things is deflecting. It's like, never mind what I did. We're about what you did or what somebody else did. Loaded words, which is like you said, calling someone a crackhead. Oh, I had one time I said, they went around the room and said, what are loaded words that you use?

And they were just going around. Like, they'd go to one guy and he'd say, you know, look, I forgot like, you know, bitch. And somebody else would say this. And when they got to me, I go junkies. a dude got up and walked out of the room he was so pissed I was thinking what just happened they were like and listen keep in mind I don't have a drug problem

so when I said junkies I'm in a room full of junkies like I'm in a room for a guy's drug problem so they were like like the looks on their faces and I'd never said anything that it hit and I'm going to say offensive things but never something that had really hit people everybody everybody shifted in their chairs

and it was like oh wow Like, that really bothered these guys. Oh, yeah. A crackhead. Yeah. Yeah. Like, to me, that's, I don't think of, you know, because you know, in the unit, like, listen, prison in general, you and I being out here joking around, like, oh, that guy's a crack.

Like, we're joking around, right? It's like calling somebody a bitch out here. Oh, bitch, you're crazy. Listen, that ain't, that's not cool in prison. That, that right there, you say that in the wrong person, the wrong time, you could get hurt. Just like that. Yeah. And when I got out, my old.

my old boss, the guy that hired me at the gym, he stayed all the time. And he, and I, multiple times, I was like, honestly, Trian, I said, you got to stop doing that. I was like, like, I'm not getting, I'm not angry. I'm not going to snap, but I said, it's offensive. It does, and it still bothers me. And I even had Joey, which is a guy that worked there at the gym. He told me, he is, oh, I've told him too. He's, I've told him. He's like, like, bro, like, he's the first time he said it. He was, I almost lost it on him. Right. Because, Well, you've been to prison. You don't say that. But so in the unit, you know, let's face it, you're really, how can you put this? It's a harsh environment. Guys don't say please and thank you. Guys aren't, it's just a very, very masculine environment. So when I got there and I would say stuff like that, like people get offended.

And I was already so hardened by just my, you know, it was just extremely aggressive. He's been known to cure insecurity just with his life. laugh. His organ donation card lists his charisma. His smile is so contagious. Vaccines have been created for it. He is the most interesting man in the world. I don't typically commit crime, but when I do, it's bank fraud. Stay greedy, my friends. Support the channel. Join Matthew Cox's Patreon. Well, so in, I never, I would always, I would always, I would always, I would always

almost say I never had a problem with loaded words, right? Because people imply things and I kind of look through it and smile. But there's a loaded word I'm having a problem with now is the word criminal. Like someone asked me, you know, is he a criminal? You know, and I'm kind of like, wait a minute, why? Like, it offends me. It's weird. But loaded words is saying something or labeling somebody a certain way. And sometimes it could be like, you're stupid, you know, that's stupid. Saying something I know it's going to get an emotional reaction. Right. That was big. So you're saying now when someone asks, it bothers you when they go, oh, is he a criminal? Yeah.

And they just say, so criminal, I don't know anybody really says criminal. It's like, does he have, is he locked up or they'll, but see, almost everybody knows. But you don't, you don't, you don't, you're not dealing with people that think that, that classified, which is one of the criminal thinking errors, by the way. Right. That when you judge people like, okay, I'm going to label you. You feel, they call it, I'm going to power orientation. I can't believe you remember these the terms that ever you're good well because I can't remember any of these things you're power orientation I can't I haven't thought about that well I

remember a lot of them because we you know Anthony Robbins all these courses I went through I went through power orientation would a lot of times people want to feel good about themselves right so by labeling you as something by putting you in a category in a subcategory a category that's lesser than the category they've put themselves in. Correct. And so that allows that person to identify you as, no matter what you do that's good, I'm going to go ahead and throw you in that category. People do that religion all the time, all the time. Like they'll, like, despite the fact that they're cheating on their taxes, despite the fact that they're constantly kind of ripping people off, despite the fact that they never really do the things that they say they're going to do

and that they mislead people and manipulate them, they feel they're a good person because they go to church on Sunday. Yes. I'm a good Christian. Really? Like, you're kind of a scumbat. Well, it's, it's, you condensen, you, you're raising yourself up mentally, right? And the have to need to must, like, the thinking process that I don't have an option.

You know, like I have no choice. I have to do it. Right. I need this. Bro, bro, there's no way I can do without this. I got to, I need you to do this. Yeah. You know, like thinking there's no other option.

option. All right. The reason we bought that up is for the RSA, which is the rational self-analysis. So what happens is whenever you get into a situation, so let me give their description of it. Right. It's the same thing, by the way. I want to say the same thing is that by the end of the day, you had to do, you had to write up one RSA. Right. So every day something had to happen that you had to have an RSA to establish that this is something that happened. This is what my thought process is. This is how I corrected myself. What did you think of the RSAs? Honestly, like, I felt like you're going to, you're going to, I know this is this. I don't want to say this.

Say it. Say it. I felt like it was overcomplicated. Like, I got out. So here's the problem. The problem was that to me, like the attitude checks were simplistic and it was how I, my mind already worked. Which I said, I thought it were too simplistic.

I didn't even like them. Right. to me, it was like my, I very quickly jumped from, here's the problem, here's how I feel about it, and then here's the solution, where the RSA broke it down into categories. Like, this is what you can explain, where to me it was overly complicated, where to me, I streamlined right to the, right to the answer and didn't have to break it down. But to most people in the program, they had a problem processing. situations, and they needed to figure out how to break those things down systematically and do it

very, very quickly, if that makes sense. That's where the RSA came in. All right. So I agree. The RSA was kind of complicated, but I thought it was the best tool because it's something that I had never been introduced to before. So that's why I kind of liked it. So the rational self-analysis, what they basically told you to do.

was they said something happened so you had an event yeah all right and then you had your i love that he remembers totally the total okay so then you'd have your opinion or your thoughts of the event so something something simply happens so i'm gonna give an example so you call and jess's phone goes right to voicemail oh she's sheeting she's with some guy right she's she's uh she's uh well what she's doing. She's not answering my phone call on purpose. She's pissed. She's, she's seen her ex-boyfriend. That's what happened. That guy's like, yeah. Yes, the thought, so an RSA is designed, rational self-law is designed for you to rethink what you're thinking. So you have to like tell yourself, wait a minute. So first there's the event. There's the event.

Then there's the, you write up the first thing you thought up. And, and then what you do is you ask like which one of the thinking errors that your thoughts are attached to? to which one are thinking errors or which of the positive attitudes you're not displaying with your thoughts are attached to it was a you know it's funny like is it awfulizing awfulizing is she's cheating she's with someone else is that one of them though i used to get them wrong all the time like guys are to read mine they're like i know that they'd be like this isn't even an attitude this it even i'm like i know them all i knew them all so um it's what you thought and and what's so bizarre is anything can happen because i think i had

mentioned one time where I saw I'm in class teaching and these guys walk in and just go to wailing on this one dude right just bum bum bum bum bum this is in the RDAP no this was that wasn't in hard app oh okay but I'll get into

some RDAB events but anyway I'm teaching a class and two guys walk in and just go to pounding on this like they just walk like I'm teaching and they come in and I'm thinking to myself like what are you guys doing class has been going on for 10 minutes

you know what this is my breathe out they walk in and they just walk up to a guy and just bomb bomb bomb both of them then when he hits the floor they're kicking him boom boom boom boom boom people are screaming and running out is Zach still writing on the board it's like hey can I get some quiet here

kick quietly no commenting while you're teaching algebra this is algebra class we're subtracting while you're in the wrong so guys walk in and go to wailing on this guy. So you asked two people and like you, they asked one part

what I did? I'm like, what the hell is going on? He's like, man, he just came in here and just started beating that poor guy like crazy. Then I asked another guy and I go, what the heck? I mean, what, what's up with that? He goes, man, that guy finally got what he deserved. It's all a matter of

its perspective. It's like, hey, that guy finally got what it's. So a rational self analysis is the way you see an event. So if you take an event by itself, you really shouldn't add or subtract to it. You should just look at the event as an event. But your thought process around it is what the RSA is telling you to change. Right. Because your perception of it is kind of what guides you. Right. And so that's the whole purpose of a rational self-analysis is to change

your perception of it because this event alone, because they ask you to describe really what you see. really all you saw was two guys walked in and they started punching this guy. Right. Like that's all, that's all you know. So it's not the poor guy, yeah. You don't know if he owes money. You don't know if he disrespected someone. You don't know if those guys got the wrong guy.

Right. You have no idea, but in I put the analysis, I put the opinion, I add the extra to it. Right. So a rational self analysis is to prevent you from adding extra. You called just didn't answer her phone and went to voicemail. Right. Period. That's all that you know so far.

And that was an RSA, and that's what we had to do all the time. So there was a lot of events I made RSAs about because especially someone skipping in line. That used to drive me crazy. I can't tell you, some people took that personal, like you're absolutely disrespecting me. They'd be like, oh, so F me, huh? I heard people yell that. F me. Is that what you're saying?

F me? Like, no, I was actually saying, here's your money. I like the lead. I was saying, oh. Actually, it was the entire line. I was saying F the entire line. But you're included. I didn't want to leave you out.

Oh, man. I was going to say, you know what? I used to do with the RSAs because I hated doing them so much. What? Contracted out? No. So if they, when they pulled your journal, when they pulled your journal, they would say rip out the last seven days.

So I just took the same seven days and just rewrote them over and over and over again. Because the worst that happens is they asked the last seven days, here you go what you're you're absolutely right they don't read that stuff they don't I mean all the way across the board because a lot of times I wrote gibberish or I wrote words that weren't complete sentences

and they didn't circle or highlight anything they might because it's too much I don't know if they asked them to do too much or if those people really aren't trained or maybe randomly they did it I do know that there was Dr. Smith had a

She had a, God, I don't know, like a, what did they call it? Like a clerk, a clerk. She had a clerk. And he would say, like, you know, like, she's like, does she read them? He's like, almost never. He's like, honestly, it may be. She might say, pull out so-and-so's, you know, let me see what his are. Like just one person.

Out of 150 guys, she grabbed one or two. Tamayo, his name was Tamayo. Tamayo. Playing the law of numbers. Yeah. so you know the chance and it was like I said once again they they never bothered me and mine were every almost every one of them was well no those seven were reasonable semi reasonable um but yeah and honestly like most of them are you know ridiculous like it's you know someone you know I got a small piece of chicken and I went to chow and man that motherfucker gave me a small piece of chicken he gave his home boy a big old piece just before me and he he gave his home boy a big old piece just before me and he he he he yeah so they would do that whole thing it was just like stop bro what do you it's amazing

how the sometimes if you're not analyzing it how the mind works so i bring up the rsasas to talk about like situations that's happened in in the rdap itself i'm talking about in the morning meeting or in the group that happens right after rdap have you seen like fights has there been any fights in the program during the program there was only like listen first of all by the way i i heard in the low this was in the whole time the program had been going there was only one fight at fist fight ever in the art out meaning and that was the one that i saw really and it was you want to hear the circumstance so let me tell you the circumstance behind oh listen your circumstances is yours or yours i've heard some of yours yours yours are yours i've heard some of yours yours are way worse. This wasn't even like a fight compared to your fight. But literally what happened was the one guy, which was so funny too, because he was there for tax fraud. So they gave him, he was supposed to get probation, but he fought so long and gave them such a hard time that they finally made it a criminal case because they were so pissed at him. Right. Could have

just been civil. Pay this fine. He made it, was such a dick about the whole thing. He ended up getting it turned into a criminal case. and ended up fighting, even then, didn't take a plea, didn't take this, didn't take a trial? I don't know if he took him to trial, but I remember that he took it, it was such a long process and they filed so many motions that when he finally did get sentenced, he ended up getting like four or five years. He got like five years or something for tax fraud.

Wow. Now, he went big guy. It's not like a little tiny guy, but he was a white guy, white hair, probably six foot, maybe six one, but he was also 60 years old. He was probably late, 59 or 60 years old. And there was another guy that was Samoan, but when I say Samoan, I don't mean Samoan like a big fat guy, like a big fat brown guy. I mean Samoan like the rock Samoan. He had been to trial.

He was a member of like the Crips or the Bloods in Hawaii and had been to trial in the state of Hawaii three times for murder. and beat every single case. Wow. He got caught by the feds on a drug trafficking charge. They couldn't beat it. No, of course, the feds. Got 10 years,

you know, mandatory minimum, was taking the ARDAP program. His mother was sick and dying. And if he didn't pass the program, like literally, he was about to graduate, and he would graduate and he would be home, and his mother had about six months to a year to live. She was taking chemo and everything,

They were saying, like, it was just slowing it down. So she literally is ready to get out, go see his mom so he can be with his mother before she dies. Wow. But he's smoking, what, Tucci? In the, in the bathroom. And this guy went in the bathroom one night and saw him smoking it. And the next day, he said to him, he confronted and leveled him, right? That's a term.

I don't know if anybody saw the last program, but he did a confront level where you go and you confront. Do you meet a meeting? No, no. Because he said, look, the guy, I don't want to get this guy fucked up. First of all, that guy was massive and dangerous. And, you know, he just, he's like, you know, like, and everybody knew he wanted to get home to his mom. So he goes and he says, look, man, this is what happened, blah, blah, blah. He tried to talk to him.

And the guy goes, instead of saying, man, I'm sorry, you're right. You know, and just, he said, like he said, I'm going to come front level and he'll own up to it. I'll say, hey, no big deal. Don't even worry about it. Like, we're good. Instead, the guy goes, nah, bro, that didn't happen. You don't know what you're talking about.

And he goes, no, no, I do know what I was talking about because I came in and then so-and-so came in and he also saw you. Now, he doesn't want to pull you up. But I'm just saying you did this. Like, just own up to it. I won't pull you up.

I just want to let you know that I did confront level you. And like, if I see you again, I'll pull you up, but it's not a big deal. And he goes, you don't know what you're talking about, bro. That never fucking happened.

He says, you understand me? That never happened. And he was like, all right, man, okay, I understand, I understand. Not realizing that that was a threat. Like, that was basically a threat. Like, do you understand me? That didn't happen. But that's enough for me to know it could go bad.

Like, this is not a guy. That to him is this ghost of a threat. Like the next rung is I'm stabbing you, you know? So he goes, he goes, all right, man, okay, all right. And he walked away. Wow. And then the next day, we're at the morning meeting, and he stands up and he says, I'd like to pull up Mr. So-and-so, the big, the, the, not the, the, the big Samoan, and he

stands up. And I remember thinking, oh, you knew about it ahead of time? Yeah. Listen, he was part of what Dr. Smith used to call the narcissist group. So this guy was a friend of mine, a guy named Joseph Vitaly, another guy by the name... Which guy? That's Samoan? No, no. The white collar guy for the tax fraud. He was a friend of York. Yeah, she used to call... So was he part of the narcissist group?

He was a part of the narcissist group. So he already told us at lunch, this is what happened. And we were like, yeah, but bro, you know, he's trying to get home to his mom. And I wouldn't pull him up. I would just, you know, I'm going to confront and level him. And if he owns up to it, then, you know, I'm going to give him a chance. If he owns up to it, no big deal. Like, that's fine. I get it. Like, but, you know, he is. He's in a drug program. He's smoking, you know, drugs in the bathroom. Like, this has been going on.

Like, and I saw him. So if he owns up to it, not a big deal, I don't care. But if not, then, you know, I need to do something. Like, it was, he was semi-buying into it, but he was also an opportunity to have a valid pull-up for him. And we're saying this guy is a, he's a gang member. He's already beat three murder charges. Like, this could go bad. But also being in the ARDAP program.

in the low, you felt a certain security. Like, you couldn't really get hurt because the people in the ARDAP program you felt like weren't going to hurt you because they had so much to lose. So he felt, and keep mind, this is a guy that came, he literally, he got to prison and within a couple months, he's in the ARDAT program.

So he doesn't really, the tax fraud guy. Okay. What's funny is he has a strange name and it's in my book. I just don't want to have to go through it. He has like an Italian name. so the tax fraud guy felt comfortable he didn't really experience like first of all he turned himself in never went to the county turned himself into the front gate to the prison so let's face it

he got there he was in a unit for a couple months and went straight into art app so you haven't really experienced prison prison you came to a low that those are the worst ones right they people warn you about them they call the police and they're like officer he uh such such yeah so he he stood up he calls a guy up the Samoan stands up and the Samoan is sitting there staring at him and by the way

this is the next best thing too by the way the Samoan was in like the second row the tax guys in the first row they're facing each other they're across from each other yeah but they are

but the Samoan's one row back so he has to so he can't like you know there's a row in front of people in front of him he actually goes he goes moves tells people to move and he steps out of the row. Now, here's the funny thing about that, the Samoan. Typically, you just stood up where your chair is, right?

Right. But a week or so before that, a couple of guys had suggested that you, that if you were too close to each other, then you stepped, you should step out of the road to get some distance. Right. So people were like, he's pretty far away.

He's like 10 feet away from him. But he stepped out of the road. the row. No big deal. And then for some reason, the tax fraud guy also steps out of the row. Oh, no, I'm sorry, he's in the front row. So he kind of steps into the row. So now he's guys, and he steps out and he's standing right. So now he's got a straight shot right to him. Right. He takes five or six steps and he's right there. So as he's explaining, I saw you in the bathroom, you were smoking, you know, K2 or Tucci, whatever he called it, K2. And, and, and, and, and, And he's like, you know, and then I confronted and leveled you, and you told me that that never happened.

And I, that's not true because so-and-so also saw you. And I've got back up. Oh, my, and the guy. And then so do you remember the thing? You tell what happens. Right. And then you say what the, what they called it the, the, the damaging consequences of your actions are. And then they had the damaging consequences.

Right. so he goes The damaging consequences of your The damaging consequences are And the Samoan goes I got your damaging consequences And I mean three steps And swings on the guy

So the tax guy ducks And he catches him in the arm Missed him These are two massive guys bro Both them were big Catches him in the arm Swings again catches him in the back of the head like misses the head

guys jump in to grab him to try and stop it right they all want to be a hero in front of all the DTSs are there they grab him the one guy what was my my buddy's name this guy god this guy was nuts

he jumps in he gets swung on he almost he gets a almost gets another like it's amazing because you know I love it when you see these fights and movies you know you've seen enough fights to know like you watch the ones in the movies and you're like that's not how it goes guys are never making a good

connection. Nope. Unless they get you on the ground or you're unconscious or something, they get you pinned or something. Like almost never do you actually get a good strike. So anyway, they hold everybody down. They grab them and pull them and they're holding them down. And they, of course, the DTSs hit the deuses,

which is a little red button that they have on their, on their radios. They hit the button, you know, boom. And everybody from everywhere is coming. All over the compound. Cops immediately discus. Covers. Sorry. Correctional officers immediately discused.

on that, like they, boom, converge on that one location. So we're talking about 20 seconds later, 30 seconds later, because you never see these guys move this fast. The COs won't do anything fast, but when they hit that button, boom, they just run. So they immediately pour in there and grab these guys and drag them apart. Here's what's funny is that I remember the tax account guy. Like, they both went to the shoe. The tax guy comes back right away the next day.

like look he didn't do anything wrong i just pulled him up right think about it was like what did i do actually i think he came back that that day i remember but i remember the next day we were like damn bro like you dodged that you he's like no he hit me in the arm and we were in the shoulder and we were like yeah but he hit you in the shoulder we were like yeah but it was your shoulder he's like i can barely move my arm he goes if he'd made contact with my head he said i think i'd be dead and we were like he barely like it didn't look like he even had a good solid connection but this is a big guy wow i mean he was like i'm telling you he'd have knocked me out he'd have broken my jaw my i'd have been messed up anyway yeah so they dragged the simoan off and um he does he does not see his

mother i found out like a year or so later when i was actually just about to leave prison they said his mom like died i don't think he ever ended up getting through art app like i think brutal brutal so that's my that that that we all were like that was a fight

that was definitely a fight there was punching people got there were some connection not the kind of fights that you saw these are low fights these are low fights

it's only and you only had one these are low fights you only had one I think I well there's there's in the meeting or in group

I'll just stick with the meeting and I'll just give two examples, because I'll give the stabbing examples I thought was in the eye. In the eye. Yeah. So, no, I'm going to give the fight first.

Okay. Because I thought it was funny. So it was one of those mornings where, you know, they asked for, we called them help-ups or to pull-up. Yeah. They asked for help-ups and nobody helped each other up. Oh. So the DTS, you know, they make the announcement, nobody has

a help-up. You're all doing so wonderful. Yes. that nobody needs any help so we're all sitting there we're looking around there might have been one fake one that morning but we're all looking around so um a buddy of my name um ray he's like out of hell with it so he throws his hands up raise his hand ray so ray helps up um uh and and in in the pen it's clicked by so if if you're black you can really so blacks have privileges we can help any race up unbelievable the whites can only help up the whites they can only help up the blacks if it's cleared what about white privilege

imprison it you lose it sorry you have the privilege of getting your stuff taken that's all you so if if the whites can only help up the whites unless they get clearance oh my god and the spanish can only help up the spanish only the blacks can help up we can cross races like we we're There's so many of us there. So whenever they send one of you guys, it's kind of like, look, wonder why that is. Your people did this to you. So it was a white guy, raise a white guy.

He helped up another white guy. This was, you know. Help up. I bet you the other guy didn't feel he was helping him at all. No. So what had happened was apparently guys, because you had to be pressed. A uniform had to be pressed and tucked in and looking nice. Of course.

His wasn't pressed. No. So in the desperation for a help up, Ray said, eh, you would just, we'll give you an example. He goes, Matt, I noticed your shirt wasn't pressed this morning. You know, in our DAP, we're required to have a pressed uniform shirt and pants. And I feel like you're struggling with, like, responsibility. Did I put on responsibility? Yeah.

You're struggling with responsibility and, um, willingness. Standing like, he's standing. He, did you have to stand like you, arms straight? Like, you had to. True. So what happened was both of them. soldier. Both of them were on one side. So they're sitting, one sitting in the third row and the other one sitting in the first row. Ray was in the back. The guy he helped up was in the

front, the other white guy. He helped up. So he told him that, you know, I think he's strong. He went through the process. So they handed the other guy to Mike. After he finished talking, they handed the other guy to Mike. And the mic, and the guy turns around, he's supposed to repeat back what Ray said. Right. And instead of repeating back that I'm struggling with willingness helping this, he said, are you really going to help me up because you think my shirt's wrinkled? That's exactly what he told him.

Ray's like looking around. Yeah, yeah, because you can't do that. You can't. Right. You know, so then one of the mentors is like, Mr. Matt, you need to repeat back what Mr. Ray said, right? He goes, and so everyone stops. They look at him.

He goes, are you kidding me? You're really going to help me up because you think my shirt is wrinkled. Right? So everyone's like, Mr. Such and such. He throws the mic down and he's like, he doesn't like, excuse me, let me get to this guy. He just barrels through people where he actually knocks people in the chair down and he grabs Ray by the neck. Like, and I guess Ray in the thick of the scheme of things, because he never moved. He was standing there like this with the mic in his hand.

He was just in shock. Yeah, the whole time he went down. Like he went down like this with the mic. I'm like, I'm on the other side of the room watching the whole thing. Because Ray, like you said, Ray came back like four days later, you know, and we're talking about it. We're laughing because he begins choking Ray. So he's on top of another person choking him. Everyone's trying to move out of the way.

The people he's knocked down everything. Nobody's trying to pull him, pull him off him? No, the staff did. Of course, they hit the deuses, and they're trying to pull him off. They can't get him to let go of Ray's neck to when the other staff members come and stand him up, he's actually still got Ray's neck in his hands. So when they, so like 20 seconds later, because all you hear, stop, stop, the damaging consequences are. Stop, stop.

So when they pull and stand him up. he's still holding Ray. It takes a staff member on the right and a staff member on the left to pull his arms off of Ray's neck to get him to let go on his course. And that's when he let go of him. But I wouldn't even say that was a fight.

It was just... It's an assault. Yeah, that's an assault. It was bizarre to me because he had on... His shirt was actually wrinkled. His shirt was like... It's, for him to get that mad...

I know. Like, all he had to do was... you're right you know my i my shirt is is you know it is wrinkled i am i am i am suffering from whatever our exactly for and and it wasn't like he was anxious to do it yeah like we sat there under duress yeah somebody needs to pull up something yeah somebody needs to pull up somebody yeah for something stupid like what are they going to ask you to do do three our essays or or um iron three of your of your three of your um iron your your roommates uh you know shirt for the next two days like it's nothing like that's just a stupid that and he didn't even expose you because he this guy was on drugs

also yeah he's not to even even expose you to something you actually did wrong yeah you know but he was absolutely offended like are you like he was dumbfounded like you're gonna pull me up because my shirt is right that was stupid so you get kicked out of the program you're not going to get the year off all because you had a little temper tantrum Correct. Yeah, that was the bizarre one. So anyway, that fight is because Ray was the other mentor I told you about that was kind of my buddy. And I bring that up because what was funny about that to me is the fact that Ray went down and when they pulled him back up.

You know, he never let go. Ray never let go of the mic. That's what I meant to say. I haven't finished my pull up. Like, all right, I need you to. he never let go of the bike like when he went down or when he came back up

he never he still had the mic in his hand he never defended himself or tried to fight the guy everybody else is trying to get him off I'm just trying to get him off I'm just trying to get your off

yeah are your shit next time are your shirt next time all right so the other fight during the meeting happened in the in the at the beginning of the meeting it wasn't a fight

it was that was also in us So I guess these are all assaults. Yeah, the other one is like the, the guy, the tax guy, he didn't fight back. He didn't fight back. And you're right, because they're all assaults. Because when I think about them, one person that gets helped up, gets mad, and attacks the other person, you know, because I've had some guy running, you know, and they had to, yeah, they're all assaults. Yeah. They're all assaults.

Because you help me up. You just embarrass me. I'm going to, because we had a Samoan guy, too, that's not. They let him actually stay. But they didn't actually get in the fight. They were he was chasing the guy, right? He couldn't get to him. And they still let him stay.

But anyway, they ended up, like, actually resolved. I was a surprise. We had some funny shit, bro. We had a guy one time that worked in the rec yard. And so another inmate that worked at the rec yard, there was another ARDAP participant that didn't return, like, the, you know, the ab wheel thing. Right.

Like, he didn't return it. he so he had to go get it from him and he knew he had he had signed it out so he saw that he was like oh it's a pull-up so he went to it was it was pull-up but it wasn't he went to him he said listen man I signed your wheel in you left he's like oh man I can't believe that he's like I let my buddy use it he was supposed to turn it in he's like yeah man but you know it's your responsibility you should just come and had him sign it out he's like yeah man he's like but I put it in everything he said look I don't want to be an issue man he said just give me a couple bags of chips at commissary and like a six-pack.

He said two bags of chips. I don't care what kind of chips. He has two bags of chips and a six-pack of Coke. Like that's all. He said, like, we'll just quash it. He had to pay for it to turn that wheel in or something? No. Or it's just extortion.

It was extortion. Holy. Like, you don't want me to pull you up. We're both in the program. You give me a couple bags of chips and a six-pack. I won't say nothing. Holy smoke. So he looked at me, he goes, you serious?

He said, yeah, bro, I don't want to mess. I don't want to get you messed up. Like, I don't want to pull you up, so just give it. And he's like, okay. So the next day, I'd like to pull up Mr. So-and-so. He stands up, the guy that left the wheel for manipulation. He said, yeah, I was in the rec center and I left the wheel. He said, I got a call.

My buddy said, hey, I'm using the wheel. Let me do it. He goes, okay, make sure you're turning in because I signed it out. He said, no problem. I left. He goes, that was my fault. I messed up. he said but then mr so-and-so came to me and told me he knew what i had done and he signed

it in and he wasn't going to say nothing if i got him two bags of chips and a six-pack and so everybody is like like you know you're supposed to be perfectly quiet but even then the whole room went ooh he was a little um and all of a sudden and he said so he said the damage and consequences is you're manipulating and you ain't gonna get you he's I ain't got your fucking chips or your six pack motherfucker

Listen We roared laughing Everybody be quiet Everybody be quiet Stop that stop that It was like Beautiful Anyway like

You know so he went through the whole And they did They seriously went through the whole thing And the guy was like You're right I did do that I did this And he said the whole thing

I did do it I did this I didn't want to pull him up And he said the truth is you know, I don't have commissary. And, you know, I, I, I just thought, you know, he always gets lots of commissary. I thought no big deal would make it, you know, do it a personal, you know, out of the thing. He said that was wrong. It was manipulation.

Like, he had to do something. He didn't get, he didn't get refazed. He didn't get anything. It was no big deal. Lots of people got, like, let's face it, 95% of the people that got, 99% of the people that got pulled up didn't end up being kicked out or even held back. Right. The problem was when it was.

repetitive or it was major there was some stuff that was major right there's like the time that a couple guys went in the bathroom and and there were shower stalls and you would go into go to the bathroom where the toilets were well there was there was a whole room with shower stalls and you know they could tell somebody's in one of the shower stalls like it's two in the morning and somebody's I can hear somebody in a shower stall and they kind of step back and look and there's four feet in the shower stall like there's the the big door and there's four feet under there and you're they're like Hmm. Shower's not running.

There's four feet. And two knees. Hmm. This is an odd situation. Yeah, it is. It is. This is pull-up situation.

Like, he skipped the confront level part and went straight to the pull-up. He was having the confront level in the shower. But, and the guys they stood up, both of them had, they had to stand up. The one guy said, no man ain't like that everybody was like holy shit nah man ain't like that like you know you're supposed to just accept it like hey I was in the shower because I didn't say what way what they were doing

he's like I don't know what you were doing but I knew though there was four fucking feet I couldn't see your heads something's up all all four of yeah and the guy said and the guy goes he said he said he actually said something they were like hey hey hey hey hey but he said oh no no no like I got to clear this up and he said he said no man I was just give him I was just I was just I was just give him a haircut. We just give him a haircut because, you know, and there was like, oh man, that's a, that's a bad excuse. Like, that's not, first of all, he ain't got a haircut. He got some big old shaggy hair, same shaggy hair he had yesterday. When he went in, it's more shaggy now. But anyway,

we had some hilarious ones. Hilarit. Law enforcement often questions him, not because he's suspected of a crime, but because they find him fascinating. He is the most interesting man in the world. I don't typically commit crime, but when I do, it's bank fraud. Stay greedy, my friends. Support the channel. Join Matthew Cox's Patreon. Sorry, go ahead.

All right, no problem. Guys playing their, oh, listen, I got some good ones. Keep going. You got some good ones too. But anyway, do the fight. Do that one. All right. So, anyway, I want to hear, what was the guys playing there?

What? the what oh guys were paying their bookies and so you're getting a big old thing full of full of commissary and instead of coming straight back to ardap to the unit you walk and meet another guy and there's like a guy that saw sees the guy right he sees them and he's like so he goes to him and says look I saw you with the commissary I saw you give it to this guy he's a known bookie you give him a whole thing right like you're gambling and you're paying your gambling debts. Like, one, you're not supposed to be, of course, obviously, participating in gambling. And two, you're not supposed to be giving your commissary to anybody else. And so obviously, and

across the board, everything you're doing is a pull-up. And instead of the guy, the guy just said, he said, no, man, he said, that's, what he said, no, no, no, I owed him that from the store from before I even came into Ardap. Like, he gave him some spiel. Right. But of course, he knew that was a lie. Right. Like, you know it's a lie. So now he's going to pull him up the next day. So the one guy, the gambler, starts thinking about it. He thinks about it, thinks about it. Now, the other guy, by the one was going to pull him up, he was there for pictures. So the one guy's a hardened guy. That's what was so funny is you'd have these soft, soft guys that were there for being perverts that are, you know, they're just as soft as cotton.

pulling up guys that are like gangsters like dangerous people right murder three times right exactly and not thinking anything of it like do-de-do you know he's like oh listen it's all you pay in the dude right and it's just like I understand that in the real world you don't talk to me in another unit you don't say hi to me I'd kill you but here you're telling me I'm going to pull you up and I'm going to tell on you I mean it yeah it's crazy so he says it he says and he's like yeah okay he's like well okay I don't okay I'm okay and he leaves. The confront level goes badly. The gambler thinks about it a little bit and goes

into his room, like after count, he goes into his room and leans into him and says, if I get pulled up, I'll fail the program. I'm a month away from graduating. He has, let me explain something. He said, I'll come in here and I'll beat you to death. Do you understand me? I got a wife and two kids that are depending on me and i don't care what you think you saw like i mean he just leans into him and although he says the whole thing right and he of course the the the pervert is immediately like he comes and tells like you know oh my god this is what he said because we all kind of know what's happened like you know half the unit knows when there's a bull up right at least 25 percent of it so he's terrified we're like bro no no he's not going to do

nothing. He's not going to do that. Then get him killed. And then this one guy, what was his name? The same guy that was one of the guys in the narcissist group, right? God, what was his name? Anyway, he says, I'm going to pull them both up. One, because the one guy threatened the other guy. So I forget he was going to pull him up. And I'm going to pull up the other guy for him for manipulation because he's not doing, like he's not pulling him up. He should. could have pulled them up. One, you're paying your gambling debts and then you're threatening this guy. This guy's not doing it because he's afraid, so he's being doing whatever. Like, oh, listen, we got, oh, his name's on the tip of the tongue. Anyway, we went like, don't do it, bro. Don't do it.

Like, honestly, he is scared. Like, we're telling him, like, if somebody wants to pull them up, that's fine, but don't pull them up. He's like, this is a perfect pull up for me. This is perfect. Guerrero. His name was Thomas Guerrero. Listen. Thomas Guerrero was insane, insane. But anyway, we had one of those, we called him a blindsider. Yeah, but he didn't pull them up.

Oh, he didn't? And in a very real way, I'm going to be honest with you. I was disappointed because the drama of that pull-up would have been amazing. Oh, those are the best meetings. A legitimate pull-up, blindsided someone

and having them to confront that and watching me, You ever notice how the tension, like you got a regular meeting, you know, mumbling and all of a sudden, every, all eyes are, I don't know, this mumbling that you're talking about. Like, our meetings were dead silent. Nobody, we were, we were terrified. We were terrified. Like, guys would be like, if you lean in and said, like, man, that's crazy. The guys would go, huh, oh, yeah, they didn't want to answer.

And they were, they were, no. Because literally, the two guys did that. The DTSs are watching. they would go mr cox mr cox mr allen did you have something to say what did you just stand up and listen you better damn well say something like oh i was just saying that uh i was just saying that uh i was just saying and you better come up with something oh so you were saying that that was funny that he that you think that's funny you think that he's trying to help him and do the right thing and while he's doing that while you should be learning you're you know talking to mr allen do you think that's funny

someone pull him up right now someone what's what's he what's he um not suffering from. What do they call it? What's he struggling with? Some boom guy would be like, Mr. Jones will stand up. He's standing up, you're struggling with and they go through the whole thing and they'd be like like, Jesus. Like you've, I've watched.

It made me wish I was you so I could say stuff like they used to just beat the slaves. I mean, what's with the humiliation? Why not just beat us? I had, we had a guy. So you weren't allowed to bring in seasoning to the chow hall, right? Was that yours too?

No. Okay. We weren't, but no. Okay. So we had a guy one time. So these guys ate together. It's because all the Ardap people eat together pretty much. So you're sitting there and you're eating and the one guy pulls out some seasoning, right?

Like he had a top ramen soup, right? He'd pull out the seasoning. So he cuts it open. He's got it cut up. So he pulls it out and he puts it on his food because the food is super bland. And a lot of times they just don't have salt. they don't have any seasoning like they're just out like there'd be months go by you don't have any salt and so he put some seasoning on it and other guys look and see like they're all sitting there like

like like that's like like you would you would think he pulled out some some uh some powder cocaine and snorted it on the table like like it's no big deal but i mean you think he put a little seasoning and they all went like not he's thinking these are my buddies i'm almost through the program and this was by the way this was like the second or third day i was in the in the morning meeting this happened. So the guy, they go in, everybody raises their hand, you know, any pull-ups, like one guy raises his hand, stands up, he says, yes, I'd like to pull up Mr. Johnson. Mr. Johnson stands up.

And he's like, yesterday we were having lunch together and you pulled out seasoning. Mr. Johnson knows we're not supposed to have seasoning. I know because we've had this conversation many times. He pulled out season. He seasoned his food. and you're struggling with entitlement and what you know so he names a couple of things he's struggling with and then so Mr. Johnson goes you know you're right yesterday I did you know I did pull out my such and such I did season it you know I am struggling with this and this

so he starts to do it and then suddenly the DTS goes wait a second who was sitting at the table um my big brother was there and so and so was there okay she was standing up. Mr. So-and-so, Mr. So-and-so, stand up. And they're like, she's like, why didn't you raise your hand? You saw him with put the seasoning. And they were like, and so the big brother, who's basically about to graduate, right? He's like, um, I didn't think it was a big deal. You, you didn't think it was a big deal that he snubbed his nose at the rules, that he suffers from entitlement. you're a big brother. You didn't think it was a big deal.

Really. Re-phased. Then the other guy, he's like, why didn't you mention it? He said, um, I was, I was, I, because I mentioned it to him. I did, I did, I was going to talk to him about, I haven't talked to him yet because he started to say he did talk to him, but then he realized, oh, I better not say that because now what if this guy turns on me and says, you never talk to me. So he's like, because I don't know what happened.

This guy went off the reservation. Like I don't, so he's like, oh, I mean, I didn't talk to him yet. going to talk to him about it because it was wrong and I knew it was wrong. She's like, why didn't you just pull him up? You didn't talk to him yet and you didn't pull him up. So I remember sitting there thinking, and the next thing you know, damaging consequences, and then, of course, they all give them an assignment on what they have to do. The one big brother, because, you know, they can't fuck up at all.

He gets refazed. But while they're sitting there just going through, I remember thinking, this is the second day I'm there, right? I lean into the guy next to me and I go, are we talking about salt? and you know what he does not a salt you know what he does like he I say were we talking about salt

he goes like this he goes like to talk to me like he literally is like don't talk to me don't talk to me like and I thought

what the fuck on July 18th get excited this is big for the summer's biggest adventure I think I just smurf my pants that's a little too excited

sorry smurfs only there's July 18th am I what is happening right now this guy's terrified these guys are all petrified nobody is I'm looking around like seasoning people yeah this is we're talking about salt and saizan mixed together in a packet that they bought that I have that I brought in my own I can't bring my stuff into the like at every unit in the in the place guys are bringing in big old salt things that they bought from commissary like

nobody cares but art app you couldn't so it was like three three people got pulled up actually that's not even true i think it's four people because i think one of the guys said i asked my big brother if i should do it he said not to worry about it and so that guy got pulled up so there was like four people got pulled up because one guy sprinkled salt on his potatoes like it was like this is insanity bro you'll never make it through this but and you were right And I was at a soft app slow. Tell me about the static. All right.

So, real quick, apparently we have a, I think we spoke about Jackers in a podcast before. Well, we have, let's be clear, you have snipers. Sniper. And you have gunners. So there's two categories of Jackers. So he's a. A sniper. So he was the one that would look out the window.

So if a distance, so he's a sniper. Yeah. So he's out. He's from the distance. He sees them. He, he, yes. So the problem he had is he didn't have a. You got to do that.

Got to get me on this one going. The problem was he didn't have. You ever walk by one of those guys? And you're like, what's happening? Unfortunately, yes. Yes. Yes. All right.

The problem he had. Was it a silence of the lambs moment where he's. Yeah. So like, oh, he did poke him in the eye. Sorry. All right. The problem he had was he didn't have a cell. where he could see the people that he wanted to see the gun.

So what he would do is he would like borrow a couple of people's cell that he could borrow. But unfortunately, there was a gentleman that had a perfect cell. At every move, all the staff members go out and they stand in front of the unit to watch the compound as they're moving and they come back in. So he would go in a gentleman's cell, right? And I guess the gentleman said something to him because, you know, we operate. by cars in the pen so he would go in his cell without his permission to gun so like he'd come back and he'd be looking out the window in the guy's cell so he did that a couple of times and the

people in his car he was from louisiana people in his car told him to stop right and he's like okay i'll stop you know but um i got a problem he would admit he had a problem this is in the program you guys know i got a problem i'm struggling with jacking yeah i'm struggling with jacking you guys Jacket on the pull-up right so so he was told to stop and he went back in the guy's room right so when after he was told to stop he still went back in there so he's got a problem he's got a problem you're very judgmental I mean I know I'm struggling with uh objectivity I'm struggling like he was struggling with his objectivity but anyway he he was told like listen bro, but the people in this car that's in the unit,

he's like, bro, they've already told them that you were in there this morning. Oh, man, you guys, go, I have a problem. He's like, well, what do you want me to do? You know, he's like, well, who told him? I don't know who told them, but someone's already told them that you were in there again.

So I don't know what's going to happen to you. That's exactly what my buddy had told. Well, not my buddy, but this is a friend of mine in the unit that told him. So after he told them that, they call the morning meeting, basically telling him you're going to have to go. everybody in the car we've warned you about jacking we've seen you jacking again you're going to have to go you have to get out of the car or you have to turn yourself in like check in or it might have been you have to check in or you have to leave the program well that was a given well jacking off in somebody in another car's room is probably uh taboo for yeah it's probably a go to the shoe you gotta get yourself off the compound or you're gonna get you might get hurt yeah so i mean he was that's why i never masturbate in another man's room

Good for you. Good for you. You know? And that's not even theoretically speaking. That's actually, but anyway. He just cracks himself up. I know. It's funny. All right.

So after being told that, they start the morning meeting. So the guy that warned him is sitting on the front row. And he is in the meeting. So apparently, instead of just turning himself in or going or knowing what the consequences is, he feels that he has to retaliate somehow. So as the meeting is starting, after we give our pledge or whatever, that little morning, Oh, yeah. Stop it.

Do you know it? Do you remember it? I remember ours, yeah. Well, kind of. I was trying to remember it. I was going to write it down. Unfortunately, I loved it. I thought it was awesome.

Oh, my God. It's the, I am committed to my treatment for the betterment of my life through community as a method. humble I present myself you know I just you know I will embrace my community with honesty integrity a genuine heart

and an open mind I'm cutting it with things I was thinking yesterday I was a problem tomorrow I will be the solution that's just pieces of it but yeah yeah it was a whole yes you had to give you a little morning

and when everyone I call that anyway it was like It wasn't the pledge. It was the mission statement or something. Yeah, they had a different name for it. Program statement. Program statement, thank you.

That's what it was. But here's a problem. When 150 guys say it at once, goosebumps. It's doctrination. It is so cultish. Yes. The cultishness of the whole sitting there was the first few weeks with all these guys saying it in real solidarity and seriousness. Oh, they make you memorize it.

That's part of. Phase one is to memorize it by three weeks in. Of course. You know the program statement? If I, yeah, they make you remember. Like, I can't really remember. They call somebody, Mr. Johnson, stand up. Say the program statement.

Yes. I present myself in the community and then they would ramble it all off. Yeah. Scary. So right after the program statement, everyone sits down and you, well, I'm watching. So you see him stand up. So he sat two rows behind the guy that gave him the warning. So you see him stand up.

and kind of slewitch, not slouch, but squeeze in between the two guys in the row in front of him, right? And then he takes the guy that warned him from the back. He's behind him. He takes him behind the head, pulls his head back, and sticks a shank in his eye. Right in the meeting. It's a whole, boom, yes. Grabs him. Yes.

In the eye. In the eye. The guy Wiggled So it didn't go into his eye This way It went into his eye Under there

So it didn't pierce the eye It didn't pierce the eye It didn't pull it out To have a big eyeball On his thing No he didn't Oh So because he wiggled

He got him right under the eye He stuck it in there But the guy was able To fend him off Because whatever he did He stuck him in And you could see The thing in his eye

And there's blood Did he have the thing Stick him? No No No Because he didn't let go Whatever he didn't let go

Whatever he did did with his hand, he pulled it out and made him fling it across the room. So however he reacted, right? But you see him, ah, my eye, he's screaming. You know, and this is as we're the, um, the, um, the facilitators talking. Okay, group, we're, ah, you know, but I

see him get up, right? And I don't see what he's doing. I look at the facilitator thinking the facility is going to say something. Then I, when I look back, he's screaming. But then I see the, the blade go flying across the floor. He screamed, my eye. So the guy was sitting next to his best friend.

So after he stabs him in the eye, him and the best friends start fighting. You know, they're, boom, boom, and they're going blow for blow. This is connections. Boom, boom, boom. The DTS are screaming, stop, stop. So they're spraying the pepper spray,

which is long douches like, and I want to say this, by the way, the guy that got stabbed in the eye was one of the better R-dapper. He was really liked by the DTS. And I'm going to tell you why because he clearly didn't. He didn't have it coming. No.

He clearly didn't have it. Because basically all he told him was stop. Well, he had to deliver the message that you need to stop. So he was the deliver of the message. So he was in someone else's room jacking off. They told the people in the car, the people in the car go telling him to stop. He tells him to stop. He doesn't stop.

He goes back and goes, listen, you were in there this morning. and they've already told the people in the car. So I don't know what's going to happen. You know what I'm saying? It's kind of like I'm the messenger and you're going to stab me in the eye. So anyway, they stab me that. He's fighting the other guy.

So as he's backing up to fight him, a guy from the Florida car jumps up and co-cocks the guy. Boom! When he's not even looking, knocks him slap out. Like when he hits him, he goes flat on the floor

right in the morning meeting between two chairs. one of the DTS goes over to him with the pepper spray and sprays him unconscious in the face for about 30 seconds

like boom to the point where the other DTS goes I think he's out like that's not a roachia spray he's dead he's trying to he's not even reacting

to the pepper spray you're just but I think that was his anger like you son of a bitch you know god it was unbelievable um i tell you i saw that guy a little bit later and he doesn't exactly remember what happened he thinks that um that he passed out or he tripped and fell he goes i think i tripped and fell and knocked myself out like yeah yeah that's what happened yeah that's the way i see it too i remember it too but but he he still claims it was weird because

when I saw him he was on suicide watch only there because he could get to see more nurses. I asked him so it was funny because I asked it, it was a police officer there also and it was one of the COs that were there and I was watching

someone on suicide. He was watching someone else. Right, because you were a suicide companion. Suicide companion. And me and the CEO were asking him like, why do you do that? And he was trying to tell me that women actually love that. Oh, they love it. They love it. I love it.

Yeah. And I go, well, you know what? I go, I've, that voyeurism, I've heard that some women do like that stuff. But I'm like, how do you know? He goes, well, I can always tell about it looking at him. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Listen, so that reminds me there was a guy named Henry.

His last name was Henry. By the way, I don't know his first name was. Black guy, very muscular, in great shape, by the way. So it's not like some slob, right? Like, good looking, well-toned. Like, like, he was. in great shape. So do you remember how on Wednesdays they have the staff come in to Chow Hall?

And if you, so if you have a grievance or something, you can go, which is really makes sense. You can go in front of the other 500 guys in the Chow Hall or 400 guys, whatever it is, what, five or 600 or 600 guys in the Chow Hall in front of everybody and go up and talk to the warden or the assistant warden. Like that's a good idea. So at the low, that wasn't like that you couldn't do that? No, you could do it. You could do it at the medium. They did it at the medium. You had a line.

You went up and you could talk to it. I'm just saying, I'm saying if all of your buddies are like, what the hell is he talking to the cops for? Like, what's he going and talking to the warden for? Like, now you, what if it's something that like, hey. Did you have to have a witness there with you? It's funny because that was like at the medium. At the low, they didn't really do that.

They went up by themselves. Just went up by themselves. Wow. Like at the medium, you would bring somebody with you so they could say this is what they talked about. Right. Like he's not telling on nobody. He just went up to him because he has a problem where they turned down his mother for visitation or something like that.

Right. So the guy goes up to the new assistant warden, which was a female. Right. And, oh my God. I'm sorry. I missed a part. The new assistant warden did an inspection of all the units. So our rooms are clean.

We're all standing up just like for count. You're standing there. And she walked around the entire unit. walked by Henry, actually looked in his room, might have said something to him. And he was like, yeah, you know, maybe he said something back. And then she kept walking. She talked periodically. She'd stop and say something.

You know, they want to see him approachable. Walked left. For the next day or two, he couldn't stop talking about how the word, how she had, like, looked at him. There was an exchange, something for, in his mind, you know how these guys get. They get mental. like nothing happened there bro and he's like no bro RSA

She wants me Yes She wants me The RSA I can see it in her face She wants me man She looked at me She looked at me

She looked how I work She know how I work out How I look How she know I put time in And she wants me Bro She wants me And his buddies

Being good friends Said I think you're right I've seen it bro Injected So Henry Was not much of an artist by the way. He drew a picture of himself

holding his shlong. So in the picture he has a shlong that's probably this long and he's like holding it all muscled up naked, muscled up, looking at you. Not a great picture. He showed it to me. He showed it to everybody. We were all like, it's not bad. It's not bad. First, you know, you're not going to retire as an artist. I can tell you that. But it's, it's, I don't, I can't

say the rendition is, is, is, is accurate as far as I haven't, you know, we haven't been. It's a character tour. Yeah. I hope so. Like based on the way your trousers fit, I'm going to say you went overboard here, but possibly. So he says, I'm going to give it to the ward. I'm going to give it to the assistant warden.

And of course, his buddies are like, that's the way to go. That is the way to go. Listen, we were all sitting. Wherever they send you, but go ahead. I made sure I was in the chow hall. This wasn't an ARDAP, by the way. This wasn't in ARDAP. This was another, no, no, no.

I know you told me. I've told you this, so we were all in the ARD. Like, guys are watching him in line approaching the warden. They, I'm sorry, the assistant warden. And we're like, oh, my God. I think it was an assistant warden. I don't think she was an assistant warden. So he's walking, he's walking, getting closer.

And we're like, he's not going to do it. He's not going to do it. And sure enough, if he don't go and unfold and give it to her. And she goes, she takes it. And she goes, says something to him and he she taps the

the correctional officer next to him she goes and he looks at it and he goes he goes gets another guy the guy walks over and he goes and they're like okay

I fold it up and she says I'm going to you know like I'm going to keep this and he's and she's like and they walked behind him, handcuff him, and walk him out of the chaw. Out of the chaw hall.

And we never saw Henry again. Oh. Never saw him again. Like, I know he's shocking. Or the dick pick. Listen, he was that close to an amazing relationship. And I don't know what it was. Maybe she said, look, you're just not the artist I need.

Right. I don't know. Right. But it didn't go the way he planned. Well, I think it did. It just didn't conclude the way he thought it. Well, I don't. I don't, first of all, let's be honest.

I don't know what happened in the shoe. Right. She may have been, there may have been late night visits. I don't know. They may be married to this day. So in all fairness, maybe it worked out perfectly for him. And handcuffed him to let her know she's in the bondage. Maybe she thought, you know what?

After looking at this, I need this man to be like a captive audience for me. I need him secluded in the shoe so I can see him on the regular. I don't know what happened. What I do know is we never saw Henry again. Did someone else pack his stuff? Oh, yeah, yeah. The COs, congressional officers showed up and packed all this stuff, you know. Nice.

Worked out a lot. Yeah. Love to work out. So it didn't, I don't think that it carried over into the area that he thought it was. Right. But yeah. Yeah. So there are guys that have issues.

Issues. You know, what was he? work. What was he struggling with? Objectivity. I think by the picture, I think humility. Humility. Thought a lot of himself. I'll tell you that. Thought a lot of himself. Like, I couldn't with a straight face draw that picture. Or thought himself a lot. But, uh, so that, I think that covers it, though. You think the Ardap, uh, interesting program. I loved it. I know, I know you. Listen, I, I,

loved the unit. I didn't mind the program. It's just that my problem was, look, I was writing, I was writing books. I was writing stuff. And it took up so, but people are like, oh, it's not a big deal. No, it is a big deal. Like, it took up a lot of time. Like, it wasn't like, oh, you go to a morning meeting. No, bro. There's homework. There's assignments. They're filling out the book. If you took it. You got to communicate with people. You have to communicate with people. And you have to help people. And you have to, like, even the way I did it, which was, basically not participating at all and sliding by still took up a significant amount of time. Like I'm trying to finish up some stories that I was writing. I'm doing all kinds of little things.

And yeah, it was, you know, and it was, I ended up having to pay, I got caught for not paying my restitution. Like there were some things that, you know, so I ended up the whole time, I told you this last, the other time was that like the whole time I ended up paying either one. So I'm going to say one full restitution payment, one like partial restitution payment because it was my, my commissary account was actually empty, but they paid me the same day. So they would pay you and boom, they take it. Yes. So your payment hits and then like, most immediately going to snatch right out. So they didn't get like the $75 or whatever they were supposed to get from me that month.

But they got like my $18 in for sweeping up the compound or whatever job I had at that. time, which was some silly little job. But yeah, other than that, like, I love that unit. I love the structure of the program. I love that everybody was on their P's and Q's. They were all, it was super quiet, super quiet. The people realized how loud prison is. You know, because you went to the unit, like, I don't know what it was like in the

pin, because in the pin they have a lot of respect. My understanding is this is much, it's still loud. Yeah. Yeah, that was probably the worst for me was the constant yelling and screaming. I am a huge fan of quiet yes me too me too

I liked it for the the structure and the activity and the creativity that it had to spark in everybody and like you said you had to communicate with a lot of people

I have a lot of ideas floating in my head so the upbeat ritual was my favorite everybody came to me if they had to do an upbeat ritual

and I designed these elaborate I did these skits and plays on each of the attitudes. My favorite one was the thinking errors. I did them as a, like a police lineup, like someone to be saying,

what are you struggling with? They go bringing the thinking errors and people came in. You know, like they go blaming, step up to the mic and blame it, come up and go, hey, you're not going to put this on me. You know what I'm saying?

You know, a little skit. So it gave me an opportunity to be creative. So I enjoyed it. It was a good, it was, to me, it killed, it took a year because of the lockdowns, like 15 months,

but it killed. 15 months a time. Yeah, it has a lot of lockdown. So it's never nine months. It took 15 months. You can't say these things, Kyle. I would be like, well, I can do it. I can pull up. You can't pull it off. You can't pull it off. You can't pull it. I can't call it.

Yeah. In general, yeah, this is already, remember I just told you it's like 30, it was like, um, 43,000. It's already at 40. Like I woke up this morning. It was at 39. It's gotten five, almost five. Oh, it was. almost at 40 it's gotten almost oh it's gotten over 4,000 views in six hours really less no no about six hours about six hours so this guy's amazing okay so we're part two R-dap part two R-dap this time this time we kind of focused just for your introduction we focused on us and and our views of it this time

we ought to focus on, like, the program and the things that happen. Yeah, specific events. Right. Well, last time we gave it, I thought we kind of gave an overview. Right. Fly? A little gnat. Oh.

Yeah, I think, like, sometimes, like, Jess will, she tries to grow plants, but she's killed pretty much everything. She's tried to grow. Because did we talk about. They attract flies. I'm sorry. Did we talk about people who got kicked out? I think we generally talked about it.

we didn't talk about anything too specific that we couldn't go over again we certainly we didn't talk about team so i was never i wanted to be a mentor right but i was let me let me um oh i thought i was just talking to you but oh okay no no i'm sorry i thought we were so you're still laying the ground work okay yeah that's that's what i was all right okay sorry so um i i was never a mentor but i talked to someone and you were like disappointed about that oh my god pissed anyway that's that's a whole that's a story for the podcast But because I didn't bring it up, right? And so finally I brought it up. And anyway, I'll bring that up in the podcast. But the point I was going to make is I never went to team with anybody. But one of the closest people, I was close to somebody that was a mentor and was back there like when person, like to give me some funny stories about the people who got kicked out. I wanted to be there when someone got kicked out, you know, because their reaction, you know. Like, a dude that went off and, and F you! F you!

This whole program, like, the whole program is BS, right? And one dude mooned him. Like, y'all could kiss my white ass. He told him. Boy, I don't think we didn't have anybody. For a limited time at McDonald's, enjoy the tasty breakfast trio. Your choice of chicken or sausage McMuffin or McGrittles with a hash brown and a small iced coffee for five bucks plus tax. Available until 11 a.m.

participating McDonald's restaurants. Fresh excludes flavored iced coffee and delivery. Book club on Monday. Gym on Tuesday. Date night on Wednesday. Out on the town on Thursday. Quiet night in on Friday.

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Bro. Like the kicking out stories were always my favorite. So someone, I get back, A, such and such is gone. Right? I go, who went back there with him? I used to always pray. It was my, it was my,

oh, I got to think of his name. It was my friend. Give me a minute. I'm going to think of his name. I got to remember his name. I would pray it was him because he'd tell me, I go, how did it go? Was it smooth?

People didn't ask you to come with them. I got asked all. the time. But I couldn't do it. It had to be a mentor. Did you have mentors? No, no. You understand we had multiple people go to team. It wasn't one person with you. There's like, you had three people, three peers come with you. One we had, you, no, three. We had mentors. Those were the people who hung, handed out the mic during the meeting. Right. Yeah, I know who the mentors were. Right. So it would have to be you and you had to pick a mentor. No, we would have, we would have like, somebody from your process group somebody from your

whatever group then we would have your big brother so you'd have you'd go in there with three other guys and guys would be like yo cox cox can you can you come with me and I go I don't know bro like you don't I don't think you want them talking to me about you because I honestly like you're not doing great oh yeah and they would go no I want you bro like you're good you're smooth like you can you can I'm like I don't And I'm like, I'm not on your behalf. They would be like, no, I know you, you're not going to get me kicked out. I'm like, I'm not going to get you kicked out.

But I'm not going to go in there and say, oh, he's taking the program seriously. No, I want you to be honest, bro. And I'd go in there and I'd talk. And when they'd ask me, I'd say, I mean, honestly, he's, you know, is he trying? Yeah, he's at 80%. Like, he could do better. Like, you know, he's this, he that. I'm like, you know, I mean, is you taking it seriously?

Like, I think he seriously wants a year off. But, you know, and I would just tell him, like, this is just what's going on with them. but that what they didn't understand is that helped them because the other two guys are bullshitting trying to get you a good resolution but when they hear me say look here's what I've noticed the changes and I tell them some changes do I think he could do better absolutely you're doing okay they're like fuck like they don't believe the other two clowns because they know they'll lie but I'm not going to lie for you I'm not going to sit here and lie for you like what sorry go ahead not did you ever see anybody get out Get kicked out? Not when I was sitting there. But I've seen people get called in because she wouldn't do it really there. They would talk about it, come back. Then you'd go into Dr. Smith's office.

And there would be the DTSs would be there because all DTS has sat in with you. Yeah. And so you'd be sitting there. And of course, she would say, how's he doing? They'd go, he's doing great. He's this. And he's that. You know, honestly, I think he could do better.

And they'd say, whatever. And then there was this one DTS, the guy I told you that just didn't want to be there. He'd be like, he's doing fine. he genuinely didn't want to be there ever um so the people who got kicked out you didn't hear any weird stories about their reaction sometimes they'd yell and argue but they didn't do anything crazy like because keep in mind they wanted to be able to come back in three months you couldn't come back for three months and they would bring you back in three months so where they'd give you a chance right um so yeah that that so that was an option for them you know listen and dr smith

talk about manipulative? Listen, one time she, one time, one of the guys, this young white guy who worked in facilities. You don't want to say this for the podcast? Oh, he's got to, you don't, you didn't watch the last one, did you? Colby, we did the whole podcast. And then all the stuff, he said, I'm recording this. He then clipped that and put it at the end. Oh, really?

Which was hilarious. So that's why I said, are you recording this? He said he's recording, though. He'll, we'll do the whole introduction, the podcast, and then he'll clip it. and put this at the end. Oh, I didn't see. How did that work? How did it work out?

I don't work? It was the second, the last 10 videos I put out, it's the second ranking one, aside from the first ranking video, which is also your video, the other video you did. That's why I keep telling you,

like put stuff on your channel, posted, you've got like 1,200 subscribers already. Oh, I got to start. You haven't done anything. Yeah, I got to start. All right. The problem, you know, the problem was people were complaining

because you didn't realize we were being recorded, right? So you were way back from the mic, talking and I knew we were being recorded so I didn't really say anything because we were just talking and I wasn't positive he was going to put it at the end but then I noticed like you can definitely hear because you you definitely didn't realize you were you knew we were being recorded you didn't know he's going to put it out because you were way back here and they could barely hear me you could hear you but just not great and people complain you know any little thing

that's wrong they take the opportunity to complain oh all right so all right though if you read the have you gone on your channel and read the comment yes have it's disgusting i know like they love you i know it's crazy i get you at least for every seven well okay for at least every 20 comments on my channel from my subscribers at least one guy's calling me a douchebag at least somebody's being like cox you narcissistic prick why don't you let that dude fucking talk why don't you like there somebody's always criticizing me yours is it's just gush it's just disgusting it's disgusting disgusting gush all right Like, look, look, because time...

We love you, Zach? I know. We love... Oh, God. All right, so time is of essence. All right, so I'll let me, I'll bring me, I'll bring the topic up. Did you guys do skits? Yeah.

Do you remember any of them that you thought were hilarious? I thought they were all pathetic. It was horrible. You're grown men. Oh. Oh, listen, I was very much, when they, you know how, did you ever do the things where at the end, the up, the upbeat ritual, right? That was my favorite. I hate,

but they had guys like dancing like chickens and doing, right, like I was, listen, I would say, I was like, I would say, I was like, I'm not doing that. Like they'd go, like guys would have to dance like a chicken. Everybody got up and circled around, right, as they, and they all had to kind of walk around and dance. I just walked. And I mean, I never, I'm not doing it. They were like, Cox, come on, come on.

I go, we're all done here. You're glad I wasn't in there with you. I would, oh, oh. Listen, what's so funny is like there were some stuff. I had no problem with. I have no problem with this and this and this, but there's some stuff like, look, you're not going to humiliate me. Like, that felt like it was humiliating. Some of the things they had. We did some humiliating. So, yeah, that was my favorite. Did you, so you did the, do the thing where they had like the game, right? Didn't they do like a game? Well, that was the upbeat ritual, right?

But sometimes they would do a game where they would, you didn't have to do a, they had like a game. No, it wasn't the upbeat ritual. It was something where they had like a game where you would stand up and they would call people. Maybe they would have different things. Sometimes it was a skit, whatever. Sometimes it's just call people randomly. Like they would say, I need somebody from, you know, whatever, from Green Group, you know, and then somebody would stand, they'd raise their hand. Or if you didn't raise your hand, they'd pick you, which is even worse. So they pick you and you stand up and then they'd give you a true or false. And then they'd give you some question. Do they give you treats out of the closet? Sometimes you would get that. Or if you, of course, if you lost, then you

would have to do like something at the end like dance like a chicken or yeah talk like that was like review that was like review for those tests uh ardap test to make sure you know the material no this was just a funny thing like they would say you have to tell tell me something right now something embarrassing about yourself uh when you were a kid and then guys would say you know oh when i was seven you know my mom kept telling me to hold it and hold it and we were in the car and i ended up peeing in my pants and you know or something stupid I was at a friend's house and it was two in the morning I woke up and I got scared and I made them call my mom and come get me and you know like that's that's during phase one this was in the morning meeting I've never seen them do it in the

morning meeting they did that in phase one when people introduced themselves I mean no I mean I keep in mind everybody did something different well yeah all the all the programs were kind of ran different but that's when we did that or they'd ask questions and they'd give out prizes you know, they'd say like, okay, we're going to give out stuff from the closet. We're going to ask some random questions because they've got the test coming up. So they'd ask them random questions. That's how they did it where I was. I remember one time they were asking questions like, you know, they were silly questions.

Like, you know, what's the percentage of, you know, registered Republicans compared to registered Democrats? And then they'd give you the thing, you know, true or false. It's this or this. I know that answer. Well, I don't know. But they would say, and the guy would be like, like, you know, true or B or whatever it was, right? I remember I stood up one time and I was, you know, I'm standing up.

I'm already, like, irritated, right? It's morning, I'm tired and I'm standing there. And they go, um, true or false? There's, uh, there's 900 trillion such and such, you know, gallons of water. In the ocean, I go false. And because he was going to give multiple answers, right? It was multiple, or whatever it was, and I go, false, before he even finished it. And they went, he went, well, and I, and the guy goes, yeah, it's false.

And I go, and I sat down and then the DTS, one of the DTSs goes, wait a second, Cox. How did you know it was false? I said, I didn't. She was, yeah, but you didn't even let him finish the question. I said, I knew I didn't know the answer. So I had a 50, 50 chance of picking the right answer. False. I said, and she was like, that would have been a perfect, that would have been a perfect moment to go,

I had a 50-50 chance of picking the right answer true or false Yeah Listen they hated me sometimes They were just like Fuck Sorry sorry go ahead

So I completely You've taken me I try to follow you down The rabbit hole I'm sorry But I've done upbeat rituals All like all of the famous game shows Except for Wheel of Fortune

I've done Oh they did that's right I did Jeopardy I did my favorite was the $10,000 pyramid I used to do Family feud I did it as a family feud

type of thing Then I did it as Hollywood Another one of my favorite was Hollywood squares Where I'd get the phase three And put nine of them When you try to do tick-tac-tow And then you'd ask a question And they'd say true or false

That kind of crap Yeah did Did you ever do the one where like The person had to start a sentence And the next person had to say like one word And they had to just keep words Oh in alphabetical order I don't know about alphabetical

They would just know They'd go in the rows Where they'd say You know I one time I had a cat And the next guy would have to say And he got outside And the next guy would say

And he got run over by a car And the next guy would say And he We brought him to the vet And the next guy would say something Like you only had like Five seconds To come up with a

Attaching citizen Yeah keeps going around Like I brought to a picnic Start with the letter A Apples Oh no they did that too They did that too They did that too. Listen, they did tons of them. You had to keep in mind that the inmates had to come up with the games. Right.

So it was, they were, some of them were just insane. Oh, I, listen, I had, I think I had them all the games. I did the prices right off the commissary list. Oh, yeah. I think, well, I think, listen, a lot of those games get circulated. Like I've done, they did that one too. Like, and they would say, okay, how much? And then they give you the, how much is a bag of Keefe? Is it $3.99? Is it $4.25? Is it? And listen, you know, those guys knew that. They knew the commissary list. There's only like 200 items. Like they knew them. Well, you picked the popular item and you picked the unpopular. But I even went to, I went even further at the bonus round of the one I did, we had a bag of commissary and we said,

how much do you think this bag is worth? You know, you can't go over. You know, so they look, you know, we did sides against each other. But yeah, all kind of, I used to love the upbeat ritual. We used to do, we did rap songs. Like I did to Big Pimpin. I did programming.

Programming. Spreading the team. Oh my God. Listen, they did. They had, of course, they have, they have, they had guys in the program that wrote songs. Yes. And there were, obviously, they would write songs about the program. And sometimes they'd come up and they'd sing the whole song.

I don't mean based on a real song. Like, they'd come up with their own song based on. And, you know, some of them, if. you didn't realize it was art at related like they were good like i've been in i've been in i remember when i was in the um county jail it's funny because jess has a story about this uh where so you know the song hallelujah yeah um she has a story where she's like laying in bed she was she was there was a girl that used to sing that song every night the doors would all close and she would she would lay there and sing that song she was and i mean she said normally you know like the

units like loud and banging and people are yelling and stuff you know she said doors would close she would start singing and she said silence and she said girls would lay in their bed and cry from that song she said it was she was amazing but i remember being in and what did jess think about her oh jess of course jess loves that song you just you know in general just love stuff like that she's always looking for inspiration she's you know a girl so but i remember being in prison or And this was in the lockup, right? This was in the U.S. Marshall's lockup. And guys would, even the guys that they would sing like R&B,

and they would just start singing a song. Right. I don't even know the song, right? But you were just like, it's like you're listening to him going, that guy's talented. Like, I don't even like the music. And you've got me going, just, you just, what, what is it called? Acapello?

Acapello. Just Acapello. But, you know, and sure not. You know, people stop talking. They quiet down, they listen, and they're like, fucking amazing. Have you had anyone sing that couldn't sing? I mean, yeah, there's those guys, too. We had a guy.

That, I find that to be amazing. You know, get up and, oh, I am doing it. You're like, what? And people are looking around like, what the hell? We had a guy named Bobby, a white guy, a 40, like a 40-year-old white guy with dreads. Wow. That's out of touch. They used to sit in the unit, in the low, and he would, on his, you know, on his, the locker, and he would, um, he would sit there.

And I mean, you just like, it was like, first of all, you're not good at it. Secondly, you're embarrassing my people. Like, what are you doing? You're a white guy with dread singing rap and you can't sing. And you're a 40-year-old man. Like, stop, bro. It's over. Maybe 15, 20 years ago when you got started your sentence, okay, maybe, but it's over.

I think he does, uh, he does an installation of pools now. Ah, nice. Yeah, we're Facebook friends. I'm talking about in front of the group. Has anybody got up in front of the entire group and that could not sing? I've seen that three times where someone will stand up and absolutely cannot sing. If you, if you ever been present when someone. start singing they can't sing there's something that goes through everyone's mind like first of all

people look and they start looking around like okay what's going on is it just me yeah like am i the only one that thinks this is horrible you know you start like getting the room's opinion you know everyone starts looking just a glance it's amazing how much you starts off at a glance then it starts like actual head squiveling around like oh my god should we stop him does he does he know yes you know You know, like, I bless a man. And you're like, what? And then somebody, you know, after a while it's,

you get the silent consensus. Yeah. And then someone stops him. Like, hey, Bill, Bill, Bill. Yeah. We're good. Yeah. You're good.

But yeah, that's, that's, I've only make that observation because the third time someone did that, I started noticing. I'm like, there is a, there's a little thing that people go through. when someone that can't sing starts singing. There's that silent communication among a group of people who don't know each other,

you know, strangers. It's like, like, Matt, what the? Listen, listen, I got to start this. Okay, start this. What are we doing? Talking. No.

All right, we're just going to wing it. We might as well, like, all right, ready? Look. It's like the angle. It's bothering me. God, sorry.

America. Level? All right. All right. Using forgeries and bogus identities, Matthew B. Cox, one of the most ingenious con men in history, built America's biggest banks out of millions. Despite numerous encounters with bank security, state, and federal authorities, Cox narrowly, and quite luckily, avoided capture for years. Eventually, he topped the U.S. Secret Service's Most Wanted list and led the U.S. Marshals, FBI, and Secret Service on a three-year chase, while jet-setting around the world

with his attractive female accomplices. Cox has been declared one of the most prolific mortgage fraud con artists of all time by CNBC's American Greene. Bloomberg Business Week called him the mortgage industry's worst nightmare, while Dateline NBC described Cox as a gifted forger and silver-tongued liar. Playboy magazine proclaimed his scam was real estate fraud, and he was the best. Shark in the housing pool is Cox's exhilarating first-person account of his stranger-than-fiction story. Available now on Amazon and Audible. Boziak's phenomenal life of crime. Inked from head to toe, with an addiction to strippers and fast Cadillacs, Boziac was not your typical computer geek. He was, however, one of the most

cunning scammers, counterfeiters, identity thieves, and escape artists alive, and a major thorn in the side of the U.S. Secret Service as they fought a war on cybercrime. With a savant-like ability to circumvent banking security and stay one step ahead of law enforcement, Bozsche Boziak made millions of dollars in the international cyber underworld, with the help of the Chinese and the Russians. Then, leaving nothing but a John Doe warrant and a cleaned-out bank account in his wake, he vanished. Bozziak's stranger-than-fiction tale of ingenious scams and impossible escapes, of brazen run-ins with the law and secret desires to straighten out and settle down, makes his story a true crime con game that will keep you guessing.

Bent. How a homeless teen became one of the cyber. cybercrime industry's most prolific counterfeiters. Available now on Amazon and Audible. Buried by the U.S. government and ignored by the national media, this is the story they don't want you to know. When Frank Amadeo met with President George W. Bush at the White House to discuss NATO operations in Afghanistan, no one knew that he'd already embezzled nearly $200 million

from the federal government. Money he intended to use to bankroll his plan to take over the world. From Amadeo's global headquarters in the shadow of Florida's Disney World, with a nearly inexhaustible supply of the Internal Revenue Services funds, Amadeo acquired multiple businesses, amassing a mega conglomerate. Driven by his delusions of world conquest, he negotiated the purchase of a squadron of American fighter jets and the controlling interest in a former Soviet ICBM factory.

He began working to build the largest private militia on the planet, over one million Africans strong. Simultaneously, Amadeo hired an international black ops force to orchestrate a coup in the Congo while plotting to take over several small Eastern European countries. The most disturbing part of it all is, had the U.S. government not thwarted his plans, he might have just pulled it off. It's insanity. The bizarre, true story of a bipolar megalomaniac's insane plan for total world domination. Available now, on Amazon and Audubord. Pierre Rossini, in the 1990s,

was a 20-something-year-old Los Angeles-based drug trafficker of ecstasy and ice. He and his associates drove luxury European supercars, lived in Beverly Hills penthouses, and dated Playboy models while dodging federal indictments. Then, two FBI officers

with the organized crime drug enforcement task force entered the picture. Dirty agents, willing to fix cases and identify informants. Suddenly, two of Rossini's associates, confidential informants working with federal law enforcement, or murdered. Everyone pointed to Rossini. As his co-defendants prepared for trial, U.S. Attorney Robert Mueller sat down to debrief Resini at Leavenworth Penitentiary, and another story emerged. A tale of FBI corruption and complicity in murder.

You see, Pierre Racini knew something that no one else knew. The truth. And Robert Mueller and the federal government have been covering it up to this very day. Devil Exposed. A twisted tale of drug trafficking, corruption, and murder in the city of angels. Available on Amazon and Audible. Bailout is a psychological true crime thriller that pits a narcissistic con man against an egotistical, pathological liar.

Marcus Schrenker, the money manager who attempted to fake his own death during the 2008 financial crisis, is about to be released from prison, and he's ready to talk. He's ready to tell you the story no one's heard. Shrinker sits down with true crime writer, Matthew B. Cox, a fellow inmate serving time for bank fraud. Shrinker lays out the details. The disgruntled clients who persecuted him for unanticipated market losses,

the affair that ruined his marriage, and the treachery of his scorned wife, the woman who framed him for securities fraud, leaving him no choice but to make a bogus distress call and plunge from his multi-million dollar private aircraft in the dead of night. The $11.1 million in life insurance, the missing $1.5 million in gold. The fact is, Shrinker wants you to think he's innocent. The problem is, Cox knows Shrinker's a pathological liar and his stories of fabrication. As Cox subtly coaxes, cajoles, and yes, Khan's Shrinker into revealing his deceptions, his stranger-than-fiction life of lies slowly unravels.

This is the story Shrinker didn't want you to know. Bailout, The Life and Lies of Marcus Shrinker, available now on Barnes & Noble, Etsy, and Audible. Matthew B. Cox is a con man, incarcerated in the Federal Bureau of Prisons, for a variety of bank fraud-related scams. Despite not having a drug problem, Cox inexplicably ends up in the prison's residential drug abuse program, known as Ardap. A drug program in name only. Ardap is an invasive behavior modification therapy, specifically designed to correct the cognitive thinking errors associated with criminal behavior. The program is a non-fiction dark comedy, which chronicles Cox's side-splitting journey.

This first-person account is a fascinating glimpse at the survival-like atmosphere inside of the government-sponsored rehabilitation unit. While navigating the treachery of his backstabbing peers, Cox simultaneously manipulates prison policies and the bumbling staff every step of the way. The program. How a Conman survived the Federal Bureau of Prisons cult of Ardap. Available now on Amazon and Audible. If you saw anything you like, links to all the books are in the description box.