Mayim Bialik's Breakdown - Dr. Theresa Larson: Stop Pain - The Most Common Myths

Episode Date: May 16, 2023

Dr. Theresa Larson (movement health & inclusive wellness expert, Movement RX founder) joins us to discuss her work with adaptive athletes, what it was like to join the U.S. military after 9/11 and as a woman, and what you need to take full ownership over your pain. Mayim discusses first learning breathwork through Dr. T and they break down movement healing, downregulating the nervous system to improve mental wellness, why social support is so crucial to recovering from physical and emotional wounds, and practical ways to improve your daily ergonomics. Dr. T recalls growing up in a physically competitive household, her shift in self-esteem after her mom passed at an early age, and her job searching for land mines in Iraq. She explains her struggle to advocate for herself when her disordered eating impacted her military service, why disordered eating can feel extremely lonely, its prevalence amongst military personnel, how she was finally able to ask for help, and how her recovery led her to living with more intention & becoming less of a people-pleaser. Dr. T's Movement Rx Programs: https://instagram.com/mrxleaders?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA== BialikBreakdown.com YouTube.com/mayimbialik Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

If you were to tell me, like, the five biggest things that people can do just ergonomically in their own home, tell me what those are. Let's start with our feet. Okay. Let's put our, because we want, when I think of ergonomics, I want to align the most important aspect of my body, which is my spine and protect my spine, right? Because that's how we feel the environment. So our feet are flat on the ground. No foot prisons, which are shoes. Like ideally if you can take your foot prisons off.

So feet flat on the ground, toes forward. Okay, knees are slightly out. You know, whether you're wearing a skirt? Yeah, man spread. Yes. Yes. So knees out. So that hell allows your pelvis to kind of sit more neutral versus if your knees are

together, try it. Like you're kind of in this sad rainbow back. No, I feel very 1950s lady. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So knees are out and own it, right? Pelvis is neutral and I want you to just like gently squeeze your butt too just to kind of like know it's there know those tissues are there yeah or there okay and then now roll those shoulder blades down and back right so now your shoulder blades are kind of sitting more up and down versus rolled forward okay and then now so now my shoulders are just over my hips and my neck this this forward protruding neck that happens because it grabs

And I'm so tall, like, my neck just like, it's harder for tall people. I'm just kidding. Hard for us. We have to look down on everyone. We do. Tuck your chin back. Like you're giving yourself like this. No, no.

Tuck your chin like your eyes stay on the horizon, right? But you're, yeah, you're giving yourself this, like, sexy double chin like this. Yeah. Versus not like this or not like this. Yeah. Now, so now that you're in a good position with your spine, And now you have to set up your workstation that way. So our monitor, I kind of, okay, let's all like practice the salute here.

Put your hand up kind of at an angle. Am I in the Marines now? It's my ambialics breakdown. She's going to break it down for you because you know she knows a thing or two. And now she's going to break down. Hi, I'm I am biolic and welcome to my breakdown. This is the place where we break things down so you don't have to. Today, we're breaking things down from the far.

off state of Oregon. We are in Jonathan's studio, as it were, and we're going to be talking to a very special friend of mine who also is someone that Jonathan and I have talked about bringing to this podcast really since it started and it's taken us this long to get it together. But before we introduce Dr. Teresa Larson, I'd like to introduce my favorite person who has to get things together, Jonathan Cohen. You don't have many things together. This tech set up. Are you still chewing?

A little lunch. Jonathan, we're in Oregon. And there's snow on the mountains. Oh. If we were fancy, we would have a camera. We're most certainly not fancy. But if we touch the cameras, they will follow. If we speak too loudly, things might tip over.

Jonathan, I'm going to introduce Dr. Larson. I'm treating this like it's my lunchtime. I'm having some tea. Okay, good. I'm very glad. Dr. Teresa Larson, people call her Dr. T, has become one of the health care and fitness world's most sought after experts on movement, health, and inclusive wellness.

She has a doctorate in physical therapy from the University of St. Augustine in San Diego. But the reason that I know about Teresa Larson, Dr. Teresa Larson, is she is a former Marine Corps. engineer officer and combat veteran. And she wrote an incredible book in 2016. It's called Warrior. And it was actually the first book I read after my father passed away. I had a really hard time focusing on sitting in one place and trying to think about one thing for too long. This book was sent to me and I couldn't put it down and I became fascinated with this woman. In addition to the incredible military service that she participated in

and then really documented as part of her own journey. She also played professional softball in Italy, which is so cool. I mean, it's amazing. And in the U.S., she was an All-American Division I, softball player at Villanova. And she's a former body for life champion. This means that, like, at the height of her fitness,

she also had to look good in a bikini or, you know, doing athletic things. She's a fantastic, fantastic teacher and movement specialist, which we're going to talk more about what that is. But in 2013, she founded Movement RX with her husband to break free from the limitations that traditional PT puts on practitioners and patients. And they've created this company where practitioners can authentically treat patients, kind of the way we all think patients should be treated one-on-one catered to their needs.

And in particular, Dr. T works with adaptive athletes. So people who have challenges to their bodies or their abilities, often military veterans, but also works with business leaders and families. She's a huge advocate for challenged athletes' foundations, military and first responder division, Operation Rebound. And she serves on the advisory board for the mission, after a nonprofit focused on delivering digital health and wellness solutions to veterans across the globe. Besides all of those amazing things, Teresa or Dr. T has also been a part of our lives

in terms of, well, she's been a person who I literally got to meet as a fan of this book and just wanted to know everything about her. She's very tall. And when I met her, I could not believe how tall she was. She's a very tall woman. Dr. T. was a really important part of really what's been, you know, a very long journey for me, in particular in the last 10 years or so of my life. And she also has been instrumental to helping us understand as you had your hip replacement surgery, how best to direct your recovery, especially since you are a former athlete who is now athletic again after your hip surgery. it's really very exciting to welcome my friend, Dr. Teresa Larson, to The Breakdown.

Hello. Thank you. That was a fun intro. I enjoyed that. I mean, there's so many things that I want to talk to you about. But just speaking to sort of, you know, not only your stature, but also your, you know, your athletic ability, you come from a very athletic and kind of athletically competitive home. And I believe you said you are the smallest person in your home. So tell us a little bit about

your family. Well, yeah. So I am the runt in the family at a whopping six foot one. And my brothers are both six eight. And my dad was six four. And I believe my mom, so my mom passed when I was 10. And she, I believe, was five eight. So pretty tall for a woman. But I definitely surpassed her. But yeah, it was a very competitive, physically competitive household. My brothers and I would meet it together were like, we're surprised we're alive. Because my dad, as a single father, would leave us home alone together. And there would be knife fights or burning type experiences or just things that would cause me to hide under a table until my dad would come home.

But yeah, my brothers and I, you know, they love to like dig forts and build jobs. tree houses, and I wanted to be part of all of that. You know, as a little sister, I was like, I got to be part of all of that. But oftentimes they would, like, set up little booby traps for me because they know I would follow them to where their secret locations were. And so I get stuck somewhere, and then my mom or dad would have to come find me. But yeah, we had also some mean games of basketball growing up. So we grew up in a log cabin outside of Seattle, beautiful town called Woodway, and the basketball hoop was attached to a tree. So every year, it grew just a little bit. And I believe by the time I graduated high school was probably like 12 feet. But we would have like

two-on-two tournaments every weekend. And it was either one of my brothers and I or my dad and I, and it always ended up in tears, and there was some bloodshed somewhere. But we all are friends now, my brothers and I were always amazed that we're still alive. So that's a little glimpse into my upbringing. But we did, I was raised on a beautiful three acres of land and like where I could run around and had trees. It didn't have a TV. Literally my dad would just make us play outside all day until it was dark. Yeah. And my best friends were my cats. And your mother passed away, as you said when you were 10. She died of cancer, correct?

Yes. So she, yes. So she passed away from breast cancer. She, I think that was one of my first memories of hers when I found, like my first childhood memory was preschool or kindergarten. And I remember my dad coming into class because it was a parent student, meet the teacher, kind of experience. And she wasn't there.

And he said that she was with a doctor. her. And I was around five, five years old when I found out. And she passed away when I was 10. And that was a huge, had a huge impact on my family. And the way my family was run by my dad and how he was and all the emotions and emotions that can get bottled up when there's a loss. So yeah, but she was, I mean, my memories of her. So she was such a humble. amazing woman. And even though she wasn't physically present in my life, you know, and I still miss her, especially with kids now, it's like, it's like the grieving happens all over again in a way. She still makes an impact on me because of her humility. Like, she's always very humble and very

kind. And I feel like the world needs more of that. And it's like, okay, well, I'm going to be that then, you know. And did you, um, and I, I know the answers to these things, but I'm asking for everyone's benefits since not everyone is inside of my head. Tell us a little bit about, you know, did you know you wanted to join the military, for example? You know, were you all military geared? Like, how did that work? So, well, it kind of started growing up because I was as a little sister, I saw my brothers as Boy Scouts. And I always looked up to them and wanted to be like them. And basically, since my mom passed away, there was a shift in my self-esteem and just the way people perceive me, as you know, from a loss,

it's like people come out of the woodwork to say, I'm sorry, and I want to help, and then it goes away, right, after a few months. And then even my friend's group changed, and I found I, like, hated Girl Scouts. It was lame. Like, I didn't want to bake cookies and sew patches and shit like that. I wanted to, like, get out in the woods. And so I ended up, and I got more attention in the Boy Scouts, not because I was a little girl, but because I was like this tough little sister of my two older brothers who were giants. And so I would go out on, like, excursions with my brother's Boy Scout troop,

which they didn't really appreciate their little sister, you know, being in the background, but I was stoked out of my mind about it. But they, I always look, I have always and still do look up to them. But at that point in my life, I idolized them. And so in high school, I became very competitive in sports. I think I got more into sports than they did. And I was very successful at sports. And I got a lot of attention from sports. You know, being written up in the paper, you know, getting offers to colleges. Like that gave me a lot of attention. And so I knew that physical fitness or that kind of physical way of being would give me attention. And going into college, I ended up getting a college scholarship for softball. So I was a pitcher, which was awesome because the pitching mound is like in college, you know, 40, 43 feet away from the home plate. And I'm 6 foot 1. So by the time I was done pitching, I was like 30 feet away. And so very intimidating. But I also did ROTC at Villanova. And because I was like,

well, my brothers both joined the Marine Corps. One was an officer. One was enlisted. So kind of like the Boy Scouts was like, all right, I'm going to do that too, because that's what they did. And that's cool and sexy and, like, badass.

And also very physically competitive. And what most women wouldn't do, actually, it's not, there's not a lot of women in the Marine Corps compared to the other services. And at this point, I was more used to being around men anyway, having grown up with brothers

and, like, kind of being in these male-dominated environment. So, yeah, the military was almost like a progression, if you will, of my life. Like, it made sense. I did look at going to, like, the Naval Academy or West Point. I got into the West Point. Naval Academy didn't have softball. So I was like, oh, no, I'm not going to play.

I'm not going to go there. But West Point did. But when I went to visit, I was like, oh, how. Hell no, am I going to be stuck in the military all throughout my college career and having to be freezing my ass off most of the months of the year? But then I chose to go to Villanova, which was similar but different. I got to party and do all the normal college things, but also play softball and pretend to be a Marine for four years until I actually had to become one. Right. So it was in my family because my dad was so patriotic, right? And my brothers were so

military-centric too and my dad's side of the family it was like well I felt like it was almost like the next thing for me to do and I kind of knew what I was getting into but not really My Ambialx breakdown is supported by

superpower. We all know the feeling of leaving a doctor's office and kind of feeling like we didn't get anything out of the experience that was useful. Maybe they're like you're fine drink more water. There's no real data. There's no game plan. This has happened to me many, many times, especially on the perimenopause journey. That's why we're fascinated by what superpower is doing.

They send a licensed professional to your home or you can visit a nearby lab. One simple blood draw with over 100 biomarkers. That's way more than you usually get. It unlocks a true understanding of your body. Their app has detailed information on heart, liver, thyroid hormones, metabolism, vitamin, and mineral levels, even environmental toxins. From disease prevention to treating that annoying brain fog or simply optimizing your body, your gym game, superpower is the most comprehensive and advanced system out there. I've been super tired of constantly guessing or just trying to read articles online about what to do

for health. Superpower gives you an actionable health plan based on personal results. It's a real game changer. Plus, they have an on-demand clinician team to answer questions. Supplement or prescription suggestions can be directly bought through superpower so you don't have to go anywhere else. They also have nutritional guidance, tips for lifestyle and behavioral adjustments. You even get your true biological age that you can track over time.

Superpower used to cost $499.99. Right now, it's $199 for the full experience, which is much more affordable than anything else out there. Make this the year you stop guessing about your health with superpower. Superpower. Not only did Superpower reduce their price to just $199, but for a limited time, our listeners get an additional $20 off with the code break. Head to superpower.com. Use the code break at checkout for $20 off your membership. And after you sign up, they'll ask how you heard about them. Make sure to mention my ambiolics breakdown to help support the show. You know, I think for many people, especially if you live on a coast, you know, of the United States, you often don't meet a lot of people, you know, who join the military. And there's definitely, you know, either a lack of awareness or misinformation about sort of people who joined the military. And as you know, I did a U.S.O tour where I went with a group of, you know, like Miss America went and Angela Johnson. and, you know, some comedians and actors. And, you know, I got to see Americans stationed all over the world. And it's a really diverse profile, actually.

But for sure, you do not see a lot of women in those positions. But what I wanted to also have you frame for us because, you know, I think for a lot of people listening, we lose track of kind of what happened when in the military. Tell us the time in history that you joined and what we did. was going on and where you served? Yeah. So there's actually a really interesting thing I want to share on this too about. So I joined right after 9-11. So 9-11 happened when I was a junior. And I was walking in my ROTC uniform from where I was living to class. And one of the guards who I was friends with, because why not become friends with all the guards around campus, was like,

did you hear, did you hear? And I didn't because I wasn't watching the news that morning. But that day, it kind of changed the course of my trajectory and the service. And like all of us, it changed all of our lives, actually. Not just service members, but, you know,

we had to remove our OTC uniforms and not wear them again, because, again, potential threat. But then we knew we were going to war. And so now it wasn't just this, game we were playing anymore in ROTC. It was like, no, you signed up for this. You will be going to war when you get out of Villanova.

So that day changed the intensity and the game, if you will, the thinking of like, okay, now this is real, this is real world. And so I joined, it was 2003. So I became a second lieutenant in 2003. my brother, who is a captain in the Marine Corps, actually commissioned me. Once I graduated Villanova, it wasn't like I go straight to war. I had to go through a lot of training. And so I started in the winter.

I did what we call the basic school, which is six months long of Marine Corps officer infantry officer training. So the thing about the Marine Corps that's different than every other service is that they train all their officers to be rifle platoon commanders, which means you're trained in infantry tactics for six months. You go through learning how to do demolition, weapons qualifications, all that stuff, using all of the different kinds of weapons. And, you know, there's a lot of military history you're learning, but also just tactical

strategy, things like that, running a platoon. After six months of training, then they kind of rank you in your platoon, or your company, I should say, of Marines that you go through this six months of training with, which there's about 200 of us. And while they say, what do you want to do in the Marine Corps, I don't know if they really give a shit, they're just like, well, because of your, you know, because of, you know, how you did in military, you know, the didactic portion and the physical portion, this is what we think would be good for you. And so engineering was what they gave me. And so I was, I was going to be an engineering officer. I was, I was, became an engineering officer, which meant my job.

I was kind of the jack of all trades, if you will, master of none. That's what they consider engineering is like I would build stuff. I blow shit up. You know, um, that. So, you know, those two. Sounds like my job. Yeah. Those, those, those two major things. It was the best thing for me. I got to pick up a, uh, engineering platoon of, um, 50 to 60 men and woman. I did have to go through about three months of engineering and training. So really, once you graduate college and you go through, like, your commission, do you have about a year of school that you have to do because there's so much responsibility on you, whether you go engineering or logistics or public affairs. It doesn't really matter. Like, you may still find yourself on the

battlefield on the front lines, man or woman, and you need to know what to do. And so, yeah, I picked up an engineering platoon, and this was all during when the war started in Iraq and Afghanistan. So there, well, Iraq started. So I wasn't in Operation Iraqi Freedom. I was in Operation and During Freedom. Excuse me, I was in Operation Iraqi Freedom, three, right? There's different phases to it. But I was in Iraq, not Afghanistan.

But I was deployed there, like probably a year after I picked up my new platoon in California. So while I was trained, so here's the thing, like, while I was trained in engineering and being an engineer platoon commander, right? My job in Iraq was to go and search out landmines with my Marines. I had to send the women, the three women that had deployed with me to run vehicle checkpoints because at the time, women weren't supposed to be on the front lines. But in all reality, there were no front lines. but my enlisted woman I sent to the vehicle checkpoints because they were the ones that would search

the woman coming through the different checkpoints to their villages, right? Like we had checkpoints everywhere just to make sure there were no bombs, right? Or landmines or anything that would be destructive. And but I, even though I wasn't supposed to be technically running convoys

and out with my Marines outside the wire, I was determined to do that because these were people I'd trained with. These were men and women I'd trained with and I wasn't not going to be with them. The one thing they didn't train me for, though, was dealing with things like other leaders, seeing me with a bunch of men, right, and wondering, what are you doing? Like, you're frattingizing. That's going to be a complication. you know, and I had to really stand up for myself, like, look, I'm a leader just like you,

and these are my Marines, and there's nothing going on here, and we're here to fight a war, not to deal with this stupid shit that you're talking about. The other thing that, yeah, the other thing that they didn't, the Marine Corps didn't necessarily train me for, but I think growing up with my brothers and staying alive throughout my upbringing did was I was asked to be a female, terrorist escort. So when the Delta Force and Navy SEALs, Delta Force or Navy SEALs, would capture a terrorist cell, right?

They would, it would be men and women, but because women were, they don't have, they're kind of like property in the Arabic culture, they were sent back to their villages. They were, they, once the cell was captured, they didn't want to keep the woman. So they tried to find the most intimidating woman Marine on Camp Fallujah, and that was me, to go and be the one that touches, you know, literally escorts her back to her village. And so like, while I'd be running convoys in the middle of the day, right, at night I'd be called to do these different missions. And this is really where the humanity of the whole thing hit me. right i i signed up to serve my country and fight this war but when i came face to face with the perceived

enemy this tiny little lady who was caught up in something that she probably didn't want to be caught up in maybe she did but right was baby brainwashed and here i am face to face with her right she's just like me we just grew up in different parts of the world have different you know on the on the exterior we look different we have different jobs but underneath we want to be loved and cared for and, you know, safe and happy. And I was like, oh, man, you know, I'm glad. Maybe what I was doing was saving her life. Because if a man did touch her or, you know, she was contaminated, if you will, she would have been killed. So at the very least, I felt very, that job was the most important, was that maybe I was saving her life. So this kind of leads to some of what I

wanted to talk about kind of before we transition into more of the the kind of actual practical physical work that you evolved to do. But, you know, the one of the things, you know, I knew I had obviously read things like Catch 22. You know, I had read a lot of sort of general literature about the military and in particular, you know, I studied a lot of World War II in college for my degree. but, you know, your book was, you know, a very, a very personal look into kind of your journey, you know, before the military, in the military, and then after. And you, in addition to all of the things that we're talking about, and you detail this in your book so beautifully, you were battling full-blown bulimia and a variety of,

disordered eating that started young, as for many of us, we sometimes don't put it together, you know, until it becomes a problem with a capital P. But you really had to design and advocate for yourself when it became clear that your personal struggles were, I mean, at your assessment, interfering with your ability to serve, you had to then advocate for yourself and ask for help, which is generally not something that there's really time or energy for in really any structural bureaucratic organization, but especially the military, which brides itself on being superhuman, you know, where we're machines. We go in, we do a job, you know. So can you talk a little bit about, you know, what kind of the mental strain was for you. And I also don't want to

make this sound like, it's so hard for women because we're so sensitive. What you experienced is something that many, many in the military experience and continue to experience, you know, the rates of PTSD, the rates of suicide, you know, something happens. And this is also not to bash the military because you are a loyal and devout patriot. But there's there's something about that pressure cooker and kind of the culture that we're in that I think for many people, we're finally noticing there's a need there. So can you talk a little bit about that advocacy process? Yes, I did struggle with an eating disorder. It became a full-blown, became full-blown bulimia my first year as a Marine. It was disordered eating throughout college, which is super common. I didn't know, I didn't want to

admit I had an eating disorder, obviously, because there was this culture in the service of if you ask for help, you're weak, or if you have any problems, just don't talk about it. about it, right? Push it down, push it down. And it was also the story I was telling myself, but what I'd perceived, you know, in my own family, as well as with peers around me, you push it down because you have a job to do and you have people to take care of and you have a huge responsibility. And so jumping from college to the Marine Corps was like a huge increase in pressure, which was awesome in a lot of ways, but then also just like, because I didn't have the skills of self-care or how to manage the stress I was up against. Even in college I did,

I was a freaking roller coaster of emotion. If I want a game, I was the best thing in the world. If I lost a game, I was the worst thing in the world. If I did well in school, I was awesome. It was just all over the place. And so leading into the Marines, it was just this increase in pressure, obviously, but I didn't know how to how to take care of myself as a leader. And everything I've been taught was about mission accomplishment and troop welfare. okay, well, what does that mean? Accomplish the mission and then take care of your people. But nothing about it was like take care of yourself.

Nothing about it. You know, I'd heard your podcast with Dr. Mate, I think that's what the name is. And, you know, like the world is, doctors don't ask you about your trauma growing up or anything like that or teach you skill, like give you like proactive skills to take care of yourself. It's like medicine, medicine, medicine. So anyway, service, that was a digression, but, or a. a little side note. But I really liked that podcast, by the way, that episode. But yeah, I wasn't taught how to take care of myself. And if you think about it, like, this is a huge time in our

life. It's 22. That's very young to pick up such a big responsibility. And we're going to war. I don't know any other of my girlfriends going to war, actually, you know, or having, like, I was in charge of millions and dollars of equipment, let alone human lives. And here I was, I got to push it down. I got to push it down into the basement, so to speak. I couldn't, I needed to just focus on the mission and focus on my troops. And eventually, right, like, it just, I broke. But I was, you know, I needed to go to war.

Like, I wouldn't not go to war with my Marines. And that was a choice I made. I knew something was wrong. But I'd been trained as a Marine leader. to suck it up, accomplish the mission, and take care of everyone else. That was my job. And so naturally it was like, well, if I go to war, it'll probably go away. Yeah, that was my thinking, right?

Like, which obviously hindsight's always 20-20, but no, you know, working in the holistic house space, like that is going to exacerbate you. Whatever, whatever is going on internally that you're bottling. up, your strengths will come out and your greatest weaknesses will come out in war. They can't not. And so, and that was, it was very hard for me as this woman who worked so hard to put up this, have an image of perfection and do no wrong and please my brothers and please my dad and be the best for my Marines. I was like more worried about letting them down, right, than anything else. And I knew when I was over there, it's like I was worse than I, I was worse than when I was

in Garrison back in the States. And I would spend a lot of time alone when I could. And any time I had to be alone, I would have bulimia, right? The symptoms of believing would come out. It was very lonely. And the people I did reach out to for help quietly were just like, well, your career is jacked if, you know, effed if you, if you say anything, right? So just know that. And I mean, I even brought up having with a psychologist, like the symptoms of bulimia, like, and he's like, well, explain to me what bulimia is, you know. So there's just a lot of not knowing. And the eating disorders aren't uncommon. Actually, there's a higher percentage in the Marine Corps than other services because there is more strict physical standards. But it isn't uncommon. I didn't know that at the time.

But as a young woman, and I'm probably going to get all teary eye with this, but it's, I remember, like, getting letters from my dad. And I would call him on the sat phone, which was the phone that we had to connect back to the States. And I would be crying. It was my only time to kind of let it out. and he would, I remember him saying, Teresa, like, you're important to me. He's like, I'm praying for you and you're important to me. Like, and he'd already lost his wife, right? And so, like, I can only imagine what he was thinking. Now as a parent, I'm like, I can only imagine how hard it was for him to hear his daughter

in this like war zone struggling internally. And he wrote just that to me, actually. He's like, you are at war. The irony is you're at war, but you're more at war with yourself. And the best thing you can do is get help. And I don't know, it was through the conversations or his letters. I was like, this man loves me and I don't want to hurt him. And so that's when I asked for help.

I'd actually come off a pretty intense mission where my mind was anywhere but the mission. it was on the mission, but my mind was also on like, when am I going to do my bulimian X? When am I going to do the binge and purge? And that might be triggering for some people that listen to this. But I was binging and purging like seven times a day if I could. I mean, I made it happen. And I don't, again, I know that can be triggering for some,

but I knew that my dad loved me, even though I wasn't loving myself at the time. and I didn't want to hurt him. So that was my trigger to ask for help. And by no means was the asking for help, an easy ask for help because I was facing these guys that were like, oh, you can't go out to eat. Wait, do you have a hard time going to the buffet?

You know, like kind of just that response of, wow. Okay, now I really feel like an idiot. You also had a very, you know, for those of you who have read Catch 22, you had a very catch-22 kind of decision to make in that if you continued to stay, even in a state of unwellness, you were basically, you could have an honorable discharge, correct? Like there's a complexity to how you are discharged. And the fact is having this kind of challenge is not seen or at that time was not seen as,

oh, this is someone who needs help. This is an honorable situation. So you had to. And I mean, I highly recommend Warrior because you detail kind of, you know, every hurdle you had to cross. And it's kind of like, you know, there's so many people who listen to this podcast who struggle, you know, with one thing or another. And it's hard enough to admit it to yourself and to get help. But your realization happened in a structure known for privacy, structure, secrecy, and not letting anything interfere. with what you are hired to do, right?

That's your job. And so it's just, it's such an unbelievable struggle to have the presence of mind also in, you know, that aspect of your, your disease or your lack of wellness, your dis-ease to also have to battle a bunch of grown-ups, you know, who in many cases are disparaging,

not out of malice, but because they had no idea how to deal with you. Yep. Absolutely. And that is, so when I look back on my service experience, and I was able to be honorably discharged with this medical condition, but it was a fight to all of a sudden asking for help. It was like, you're a disappointment, what's wrong with you? There was a lack of understanding.

Like the military knows alcoholism very well, but not these other similar addictions. and so eating disorders are like any other addiction. It's an addiction. And I tried to paint that in the book because there's this whole buildup of intensity to the disorder and then the depression and the aftermath and this constant yo-yoing, which anybody who's had an addiction, which is super common in our country, will relate to. And it's this is darkness, you feel. And so, yeah, it was, you know, I was up against this tough culture, very masculine culture of

not understanding, saying, you know, dumb stuff, like what you can't go out to a buffet, like can't eat chocolate, like, what's the deal? And also having to, like, fight for my treatment, right? I got combat medevaced for, you know, medevac from a combat zone. And I was not a high priority patient. And I remember going straight to the top, the head of the hospital. My dad was always like, just go straight to the top. Let's just don't worry about it.

Well, I got, you know, like in the service, there's a protocol, which I didn't follow often, which I got in trouble for is what it is. You know, it's why I run my own business now. Nobody wants me to work for them anyway. Just run my own thing. But I went to the head of the hospital and he was like, oh, my gosh, you just came back and you haven't been treated yet. What's going on?

And so he got me care right away. And so I was put into an outpatient clinic. And I remember getting in trouble. But I'm telling you, even though it was so hard that asking for help experience was the most groundbreaking for me. Because I started to face because I started to focus on me and what I needed to be healthy and what I wanted. When not what my dad wanted or my brothers or what was cool or sexy or everyone else wanted me to be. It was like, what does Teresa want? And that's hard, you know, especially if you've lived your life to please everyone and try to be perfect.

And so it really started to uncover this new way of being and life for me, living more with more intention. It didn't mean there was no more hard. There was a lot more hardship to come, of course, as life tends to always throw hard hits at us. But I'm proud to be from the Marine Corps because the people I served with. But there must be a change in the way we treat and help our warriors understand. understand how to take care of themselves. And it's coming around little by little, like, you know, I work with a retired Navy SEAL commander and he teaches mindfulness, right? Going from being a Navy SEAL to teaching mindfulness meditation. Like, who does that? Well,

he did, right? Like mindfulness is now being integrated into some units. Um, asking for help is more, it's okay now. And they are talking about it's not a weakness. But it really does depend on the unit. And so if the leader believes in self-care and self-help and being vulnerable, then that will, that's like in a company. If the leader is that way, then it'll impact everyone else. And so I have compassion for the people that didn't know now. It's like, man, it does suck probably to be you as ignorant as you are. But like, I do, I do understand that. that a lot of people don't know. And I hope that you'll take the time to learn

that this is something that people struggle with and most likely you struggle with something too, right? We all have battles that we know nothing about that a lot of people will never see. And so, but that whole experience of asking for help, I think has given me a lot of strength in my life because I remember, I remember what it was like in those moments of like, no, who, who am I, right?

This whole identity shift. And now all of a sudden I could go from doing no wrong as a Marine officer to like, you know, almost like trash. It felt like it felt like. And I've had to just not recreate, but like tap into who I really am. And I love this quote by a friend of mine, Gretchen Evans. She won the Pat Tillman Award this year. It was like, what lies with?

within us is greater than what we're up against, is stronger than whatever we're up against. And that's so true. Like, I didn't know myself. I didn't know what Teresa wanted. Teresa wanted what everyone else wanted her to be, which was this indestructible female warrior. And yet, Teresa has feelings and Teresa wants to be loved.

And Teresa loves to read books and be like Ferdinand under a tree and not fight, you know, and like... Well, this is a really, you know, kind of a... you really set us up for a perfect segue into, you know, what you've dedicated your life to. And I love that you said that you run your own company because that's your favorite person to work for is yourself and not someone else. And you and your husband have this incredible company and, you know, the movement RX programs. And it's a whole, you know, philosophy. And you have, there's a 90-day mindfulness and movement experience. And what you, what you

kind of started off doing though was and I was kind of trying to explain when we were prepping for this episode and I was talking to Valerie and to Jonathan, I was like, even though what Teresa does is movement and adaptive function and you know, you have clients who have, you know, lost a limb but are still able to, you know, build strength, be confident in their body, you know, kind of compete at the level that their body wants to be at, I see what you do as much more a combination of kind of your journey and where you arrived and how you then apply that to physiology. So maybe you can try and explain it in a more articulate way, but, you know, one of the first things that you and I connected on, you know, I read your book and when we started getting to know each other, you were one of

the first people who started talking to me about breath. And, you know, I was, whatever, I was a dancer since I was four. And like, I had done yoga in college, like at my fittest. I was like, I do yoga and I do me. But you were one of the first people that was speaking this language. And I'll be honest, I didn't expect it from you. You know, this like Marine and like this big, tall, strong, amazing woman with like, you know, like this, what I saw is like, you had it all. You were gorgeous and athletic. and like, you know, you had all these incredible accomplishments and like, you were the person that I think I would have been if I were six one and born into your family. Like, yes, that's the girl that I was, but not. But, you know, here was this side of you that was like, Ma'am, do you know what it means to

actually breathe? Like, do you know how to move grief through your body with your breath? And it was astounding to me. So can you speak a little bit about sort of how all of that experience, led you to, you're not like a out there energy worker kind of person, but you do this hard, hard work of being mindful in your body. Talk a little bit about what you do. Yeah. Well, first of all, if I was five, two, are you five, two? I'm five, four. Oh, five, four. Okay. If I was five four, I would be you. You're the mini version of me. Okay. So I just want you to know that. Yeah, so the adaptive world, this is a great start for it. So I do work in the mindfulness space and movement space.

And that's pretty general and broad, but more specifically, I found that kind of my new platoon after the service. Like I needed to re, I needed to reignite my purpose because I joined the service with the purpose of service in mind, the serve of my country. and now I needed that purpose again, which most people need a purpose. I mean, yeah, if you're living, breathing, homo-saving, having a purpose is very nice. But service members particularly in their transition. And so I found that, you know, I wanted to go into medicine and movement medicine because,

well, I saw my mom struggle. I didn't want to be a medical doctor, but I wanted to be in the fitness space, not abuse the fitness like I had as when I had bulimia. but like understand movement and movement healing because it is really the low-hanging fruit of medicine. We need to all move more, right, and move more often and move better. And so I was in a gym in San Diego after I got my doctorate and I was like doing deadlifts. And there was, I was part of this, yeah, this ginormous global cross-foot gym. And it was, there was an adaptive individual who's a Navy guy who lost both legs and he was doing this deadlift and he was like doing

it very I mean he was rounding his back right and all the things that we don't want to do when you're lifting very heavy weight and I just went over to him and I was like hey bud I can help you let's even though you're paying like all this money every month let me help you because um I don't want you to hurt your back and it was really awesome to help him and help his position and whatnot and I realized like how many more of him are out there who are on getting coached, right, and going into these performance centers and no one knows what to do with them. Even the coach came up to me. It was like, thank you. I don't know what to do with them. I was just going to tell them to like figure it out. And so I kind of embarked on this like,

okay, well, I don't want to be in traditional rehab. I don't find traditional rehab inspiring. I don't want to be in a wallpapered office, singing elevator music all day. Like, I want to be in the trenches with people, right? And especially with, these adaptive individuals, which one and four of us, adaptive means disabilities, really. Like, it's a more proactive way of thinking about it. One and four of us have an adaptive need. Disability could be invisible or visible. And so I was just like, well, okay, let's look at the strengthening world, like the fitness world.

Who's doing adaptive training? Who's working with those with disabilities? Like those are the missing limb, those who have a traumatic brain injury, those who have PTSD, those who, even someone who has a total limb loss, right? or a like a total hip or a total knee. Like those are permanent things. Who's doing that? Like what coaches are doing that and very few are talking about it

because they don't know, right? Normal fitness training certificates and even PT, the PT training you get is all about pathology, but it's not about the functional training afterwards. There's not a ton of function, absolutely, but actually any after, you know, in the PT school, but in, you know, a fitness certification, it's just for able-bodied normal people, not for the 25% of the population that needs it the most but gets at the least,

fitness training, you know, fitness education. So I took it upon myself to start doing classes and teaching and creating content, and I got some grants, and it kind of turned into me now advocating for wellness programs and companies like making sure that they have inclusive programs to those of disabilities because people who work in companies have missing limbs or in wheelchairs or hard deaf or, you know, have PTSD or anxiety or depression, right? Most of the most of these permanent injuries or disabilities we see are actually invisible. But, right, like wellness, wellness program should be inclusive to that.

And very rarely are they. And so I've kind of, over the, the last seven years of, we've created some college content, college course content, taught veteran, the VA, and are just being loud about it, you know, like sharing with the world that if you have a disability, you should be taken care of, right? And there is training now to help your coach or health provider or you understand what to do in your new normal. which part of this though I feel like a lot of my courses kind of are kind of life coaching courses because I do tap into this idea of like look to be to improve your movement you have to learn to be

aware we all do it's just like I had to become aware of I am not bulimic I have bulimia right the fact is I had bulimia it doesn't mean anything about me as a person now or what my future will look like, I suffered with it. And because I leaned into that suffering and why it happened, I'm able to now be, have a healthier journey moving forward versus, oh, man, I had bulimia and I struggle with food and it just, I just suck and like, you kind of make it mean something. And I, and it can fester and kind of infiltrate all areas of your life. So if you look at these adaptive injuries, or injuries in general, people can get injured and then they make it mean that they're not good enough anymore. They're not whole. I've heard these kind of terms. I'm not a

whole person anymore. I'm not an athlete anymore. I'm just getting old. And those are just stories. It's not a fact. And I think when people, so my job is the PTs to make those clear distinctions of, no, you just have this happen. You lost your legs, right? Or you lost a leg. But it doesn't make you mean. doesn't mean you're not a whole person, right? You decide what you need, who you are. And that is really powerful in the emotional health space. And practicing mindfulness is a tool. Meditation to you is a tool to help with that clarity, giving yourself space from your thoughts. But the breath, right? But it's got to start before you can create space from your thoughts, which is what we talked about, Miami's, The breath. The breath, when I started, when my therapist told me to just breathe, I was like,

ah, why? Like, what's the big point of this? I breathe already. It's like an involuntary thing, you know? And then, and even in PT school, I was like, oh yeah, the phranic nerve, you know, helps with your diaphragm and helps with your diaphragm. It like innervates the diaphragm. And, you know, the vagus nerve impacts your diaphragm and your breath and your heart and all that stuff. oh, that's all great and good. But once I started to learn that the breath can impact neck up, like once, so this is the great thing about like biofeedback, EMDR, like these somatic therapies of when you can calm the body, it also creates, it can help create less ruminating calm in the mind.

It doesn't mean it's going to go away. But you got to start by downregulating the nervous system, which is a huge part about helping with chronic pain. and yeah, just being present in your body, creating calm, then work to create space from your thoughts. And when you can learn those two skills, and the breath is the most powerful part of it. And there's different ways of teaching the breath, like box breathing, holotropic breathing. Like, there's different ways. But if you can pay attention to that one physiological thing that you're doing frequently throughout the day and make it better,

biomechanically and just start to pay attention to it, your life will start to improve. Just your calm, your reaction versus response. Not to say it's the BL end all, but it is the first thing that we look at, whether you're coming in with a physical injury, which usually comes with an emotional injury or just an emotional injury. Well, so that's a great place for me to ask you to elaborate a little more. So, you know, I think of... For example, my grandmother was diagnosed with breast cancer in like the mid-50s, right?

And very little was known. Like it was like whispered. Like you do, I mean, even for most of my childhood, like, you was like, you know, you didn't talk about it. And the solution then, given the technology and lack of technology, was they did a radical, they called it a radical mastectomy where there was no scan, there was no biopsy. there was no like targeted gene therapy. It was just like, I don't even know honestly if that was the only way to treat it,

but that's what they did. And I know this is a different kind of example because we think of that as more of a cosmetic thing, but no one spoke about it. There was no support, like nothing. And you know, I hear of these other stories in my family and I'm sure every family has them, right? Like there was like my great aunt, Khamka,

I mean, the name alone is fantastic. And Khamka, and it was like, this was like, oh, she talked to cars, right? And it was like, always the joke. And I was like, it took me years to be like, that was, she was likely schizophrenic, right? I mean, some, you know, there's all these like anecdotes of like, oh, this one went to a home and we never heard from him again, right?

So everything was like pushed away. It was especially during World War II, we didn't have time and energy, our culture to be like, let's, you know, delve deeply into emotional processes. But that being said, we have, you know, so many generations, and especially in the military, of people who have experienced not only a physical thing, but I don't think there is a physical challenge, deficit, surgery, or injury that does not have a critical emotional component.

Jonathan, can you speak a little bit to, you've, you know, you've had hip pain, on and off for about 20 years, I think, by our last calculation, and you had a hip replacement surgery just over a year ago is your hippoversary. Oh, congrats. Can you talk a little bit about what, and I know it's, again, it's not a military injury, but what did it do to your quality of life, your kind of wellness surrounding those limitations? Well, I'm going to tie it back to the Gabor episode, because we're, we threw a shout out and if you haven't heard yet, check it out anywhere you get podcast.

The term mind-body versus the mind-body connection, there is no difference. And when we have something going on with us physiologically, there is an emotional component even if we don't think there is. Even pain produces a response that, you know. And we're constantly in some sort of cycle of making up a story about ourselves. So we can't help it. That's the way we form meaning.

And Teresa, as you were saying, you know, oh, someone has some major life injury, they now have to figure out where they are now. And they have a story related to that. And that story is not always a positive. It's usually not positive because we aren't taught how to reframe our experience in a way that celebrates ourselves most of the time.

We're often overly focused on what we can't do. but even when we're just having small amounts of pain, like for me, when I started having hip pain, I was like, oh, I can't play basketball the way I used to play basketball. Which was a huge outlet and source of joy for you, and then it's gone. And that was, I would play for like four or five hours a day

in my early 20s, and that was my social connection, and I would, this is a gym rat, and I would just hang out. And, oh, now I can't do that. Who am I without that? And, oh, I can't get on the court and play the way I used to and sort of be the, you know, one of the better players on the court. So then who am I?

And then how does that change? How I'm, what my social circles are. And then, oh, when I do try to do that, I have this pain response. What story do I make up about the pain response and my relationship to the pain? And how do I make sense that I'm having that? And that is just, you know, just take that and expand it to every part of our life where we are these emotional, psychological people in physical form. and we're also trying to navigate

and make sense of all this physical feedback and we're not really taught a language on how to relate to it. And also those kinds of surgeries, like when you had your hip replaced, I mean, in this day and age, there was at least a conversation about we're going to send a physical therapist to your home.

But I'd say for most of history, like they would saw off a limb on the battlefield and then it was like, there you go, off you go, just do your best, you know? And the notion is that, I mean, the notion of kind of what we're seeing is that, you know, even the experience of war, even the experience of that heightened intensity, anxiety, cortisol, stress, even that then can do things to your physiology that we now know, you know, post-traumatic stress disorder has

a physiological component. It has a neurochemical component. And then it has this emotional component, you know, and for those of us in neuroscience, like, those are all the same thing, you know, meaning like it's not even, I don't even think of it as mind-body. It's just the way humans and, you know, most mammals and most animals, you know, kind of exist. Yeah. Well, I like that you share that because I think the lay person, even to this day, I think doesn't understand. A lot of people don't understand there is a mind-body connection. Like they go together.

You can't, physical pain is also emotional pain, right? And you can have a physical injury, but, and you might heal for. from that injury, that cut will heal, but you might be in the same place that injury happened and emotionally you'll be triggered and that will create the same pain response. Pain is fascinating. And it's also scary. So I understand that with people. That is part of the education I give patients or clients is like that is one of the big tools is teaching them about pain and disclosing the myths and then sharing the facts about it and sharing. that you decide what your life, what this means.

And ideally make it positive. Because also the other powerful thing about our minds, as you know, Maya is that up to 62%. I think the research shows your thoughts can be negative. And that's just an evolutionary. It could be more. I think it depends on the studies you read, but we bias negativity.

And so just knowing that for me has been helpful. full and say, oh, you know what, there I go again, going down the negative hole. Like, let's turn the other way. But, you know, a lot of doctors don't explain pain well or help you with what's next after an injury. It's like, oh, you know, like a total hip PT, there's a lot of rehab that goes into that. After you've lost limbs, there's a lot of rehab, even a TBI, learning how to balance yourself. There's a lot of rehab. But after that rehab, it's like, oh, I don't know. I mean, try Zumba or, you know, good luck. Like, hopefully you find some adaptive sport.

But even then, like, adaptive sports are great or, you know, sports. But, like, we even though we may not be collegiate athletes or high school athletes or pro athletes, like, we still need to train our bodies to be strong and healthy. And so, but how do you do that in that what's next phase after rehab, which is where I find most people, are, whether they're in, you know, it's years and years after an injury and they're still dealing with pain because they haven't completely maybe faced or worked through some of the emotional components of their pain because there is always an emotional component. And it can be devastating to some, especially physical, your physicality, like it was in the ring corps for me. It was so huge. I had to find another purpose that was physical,

but it didn't abuse it. Right? So, but the key is, is that every time I start working with someone, it's one, going through the fact versus story kind of scenario of like, what are the facts around your injury. And then me as a health provider, I take a lot of responsibility and saying, look, you can do anything you want to do. We can make it happen. But it's going to take time and you have to be brave. And we have to like lean into the physical dysfunction, you know, dysfunctions here. as well as the emotional. And you have to be willing to face those versus just being like, this is just where I'm at, like I'm just old or I'm just injured. Like you have to be willing to face it. And I found that the adaptive community, those that do really embrace that are very resilient.

Anyone who can embrace that thought process of like, right, you can't use the excuse of getting old or that you've been injured. Like you really, your body is super resilient. and so is your mind. And I think more health providers need to, like, instill that in their patients. People who have this great responsibility of knowing the human body need to be infusing this resilience into people. Now, I'll tell you this.

So for you, Jonathan, you know, and from what I experienced working with you, not to disclose all of the gritty details and that they have to remind yourself of is that your resilience, It's, you know, your recovery also is dictated by how fit or how active you were before, but also the people you're around, your social support, right? So imagine, like, you having good social support, loving family, right, to the injury, and then after, that will help you in your recovery. People who kind of didn't have the great social support, you know, in the military, having a crappy unit, not good support network,

getting injured, you know, that carries over into the aftermath after an injury. And so, you know, anyone listening take a look at like, you're people you're around, right? That has a huge, that plays a huge role in your ability to recover, especially emotionally. I just want to try a couple fun things because, I mean, I don't know, I think it's fun. You probably do too. I think Jonathan does as well. Let's say someone has an injury or they're recovering from an injury. or they're having pain and they can't figure out what it is. What are the top three things you would say that people need to know about pain? So, well, pain is subjective person to person.

It's different. So, you know, understanding that the way you experience, Ma'am and Jonathan is going to be different than me, we could have the same kind of injury. And that's powerful to know, based on how we were injured, the people were around. And so, you know, first, know that, like take a look around, get some perspective on your situation. The second one is about pain is that it, if you don't have any self-care practices in place, such as breathwork, down, regularly, anything to calm the body, not hype it up, but I'm talking, like, calm it down.

We're so distracted now in our culture. There's so many notifications. It's like the saber-toothed tiger is on every text message almost. And like pain feeds off of that extra stimulus and tension that we get from just normal life. And so you, one thing that can very much help pain physical and emotional is like having a self-care practice like meditation, breathwork, something calming. It could be hot, cold immersion, hot, cold immersion. It could be like sitting in a dark room, right? Like just being quiet, like turning off your phone, just something.

And I would suggest 15 to 20 minutes a day of some down regulatory practice. Because that, right, it decreases bodily tension, which will decrease pain response, tell your brain there's less of a threat because, you know, this is a lot more than three things, but the brain, you know, no cceptors are, you know, basically, relaying to the brain, there's a threat and the brain is relaying through the spinal cord pain response. If you can lessen the threat response, right, by calming the nervous system, you'll have less of a pain response. Pain is subjective. Do some down regulatory behavior, let's say, meditation, quiet for you said 15 to 20 minutes a day. Was there a third one? I think that was two.

Three is that we are designed as humans to be pain free. So being pain free is possible. Now, I'm going to caveat that with, and we're actually designed to be, you know, closer to 100 years old. But so you can't use that you're getting old or you have an injury as your excuse to not do something. Now, some people with major injuries, spinal cord injury may have pain the rest of their life, but that doesn't mean you have to be an excruciating pain.

but we are as humans designed to be pain free. And so no doctor can guarantee it. Like I can't sit here and say, if you do these things, you're going to be pain free. Because honestly, it's your ability to work through your trauma, right,

which is wounds, physical and emotional, get the help you need and constantly every day do this self-maintenance to work on your being but the possibility, right,

of having this amazing new normal and being pain-free is there. If you were to say, if I were to say to you, what are the top five predictors of someone recovering well? Okay. So first of all, and I, this is before I even give you the five predictors, I want people to think of this. One, what's your social support like?

Are you using your time? How are you using your time or is other people using your time? Because if you can't manage your time, you can't make the time for self-care. right embrace are you willing to embrace the actions needed to change um that is a big one and then are you willing to like really go all in on taking ownership so those are like honestly as a PT it's like I could teach you all the sleep stuff and nutrition but like if you can't manage your time and are you aren't willing to like fully embrace and have the social support like then it may not

work. So ask yourself those. Do you have those things in place? Social support, accountability, time management, ownership of life, like willingness to take ownership. Something that comes up for me and Jonathan, both individually and in relation to the other, is let's put it this way. How much of your life can be sacrificed in the name of the things you're doing for self-care, which might put you off from a lot of other obligations. For example, and I think you would relate to this in terms of food, because you can have food rules and guidelines and restrictions that are absolutely sound and reasonable.

I believe that for certain of us, there comes a point where it excludes you from a portion of society that I think can be isolated. And I think in many cases when we're struggling, we really want to believe that the thing that we're doing is the thing that's going to make a difference. And the fact is it's a lot of different things, you know, that we do. Yes. But I feel the same way about, you know, for example, if you're in a friendship with someone and they can't speak after 7 p.m. Because their self-care routine takes two hours and they don't want anything stimulating in their brain. I would say, you know, there's a balance.

Here's the big three predictors of injury, and then I'm going to tell you the things that you want to think about that are going to help your recovery overall. So the big three things to help prevent injury, in terms of especially physical, I should say, but emotional goes with it, is that you want to look at previous injuries, and that can be a predictor for future ones.

So are you leaning into those previous injuries and really doing all that you can to help yourself, rehab, get help for those things. Right? And that takes a practice of mindfulness, like just being aware. What have I had before? What am I still getting achy about when it's achy in my body or struggling with even in my thoughts? Like, why am I going down this pattern again? Stop and assess it. Right. So that's a big one is looking at previous injuries. The second one is asymmetries that you have in your body. If you have many major asymmetries, right, like let's say you cross your legs one way all the time what you're constantly doing the gangster, leaning in the car, or whatever, you know, that can be also

a predictor of injury because if you go out and play basketball or CrossFit or whatever, and you're asking your body to be fairly symmetrical and it's not, right? And then the other big one, which is, you know, important for everyone is don't progress so fast. Like you had a total hip a year and a half ago. You might just now starting to feel like you can get back into playing basketball fully. And some days it doesn't feel so great. And most days it does, you know, wherever you're at with that, like it takes time. You have to respect the tissue healing time.

Most people, they have an injury. And then they expect to be back to like 100% after like two months, one week, whatever the injury is. And it's like, no, dude, lady, you got to like give it time. I learned quite a bit is also about setbacks and how setbacks were not an indication that progress wasn't being made. And I began to see, especially as I would like feel really good and then all of a sudden not feel so good,

it wasn't about the fact that, oh, I failed or it's not working, but I would notice my bounceback time from not feeling good and how I was able to overcome those small setbacks as really the indicator of how I was doing, where at one point it was like, oh, my leg would start to feel really achy after I did too much exercise, even if I didn't think I had done too much exercise and it would take me a week of being in pain, it started to reduce down to three days.

And then it started reducing down to two days. And then it's like, oh, if I do this rule method and I was able to, you know, manage it enough, I was able to sort of like come back out of it. And then if I didn't, it was like, oh, well, I really need to rest. And I've been like going a lot harder than I thought and using that more as the evidence versus, oh, I need to be able to just go at full speed. listening to your body that is a huge that's a huge part of it right your your body keeps the score which is also a great book vandercock right yep yeah um thank you but yeah so that is huge

like listening to your body of what it needs and respecting the tissue healing time after a major injury typically a year before you actually feel like you can get back to somewhat normal function and that normal is still a new normal. And so you may need more recovery, right, than you normally would. And so that leads me to these key recovery pieces that you want to think about for all of us. It's one of the social support, right? Like, you want to make sure people need people, whether you're introverted or not. I'm pretty introverted.

So, but I do make an intentional time to talk to people that it matter to me. particularly my husband, in the day. But the other one is sleep. We don't think about sleep in terms of recovery too often, but getting enough sleep is super important. So seven and a half to eight hours, a night, ideally, right? Ideally, I use actually where I woup to kind of help track my sleep. There's other wearables because I want to know the data on how I'm doing. The other one is food, kind of limiting, so your gut is like your brain, it's the second brain, you know, and our nutritionist that we work with, you know, speaks a lot about this, is working to eat, and this is helpful for those of us who've had eating disorders or anyone, like, eat enough during the day and try to

limit the sugar. Not saying take it away, but just actually swap. We're all eating too much of it. Yeah, swap sugar with maybe fruit, you know, fruit. or vegetables, but have some, but just try to eat it during the day and then not eat a few hours before bed because it gives your gut a rest. And that gut rest also helps you get into a deeper sleep. Moving often is very important, right? And ideally expressing full ranges of motion. Like, I love to get against the wall and check my posture. I love to touch my toes. I like to go out for a walk.

I'm seeing deer walk in front of me right now. I like moving often because the thing is you could sit at hours and then go to the gym and you can still feel like trash and you got to move often. And then the next thing is mentally what are you doing to tame those monkey mind, those monkey thoughts? I consider the mind like a sixth sense, really. That's actually what I learned from my mindfulness meditation coach years ago. I needed to learn how to relax.

No amount of talk therapy helped me at that. And so I did biofeedback and I did meditation. And that's, I think, around the time I met you. Yeah. And man, so learning how to tame the monkey mind was through breath. You know, actually a lot of these physical practices, getting good sleep, eating less sugar, moving more. But then like learning how to breathe effectively, sit down. down and be still, right? Breath is still a movement, actually. So we are actually moving off all the

time, but learning how to be still in our body and just focus on the breath is a practice of mindfulness. And that ability to focus takes you away from the constant going up here, which doesn't solve your problems, but makes them less of a big deal. Right. We all have problems, perceived problem, whatever, right? We all have stuff. how do we respond to that stuff? That's what the stillness and breathwork do. So that's a big one, having that kind of practice, whether it's meditation or just simple breathwork. And then the last one is just social support, making sure that, you know, there are days when I know my introverted self is like, I'm done. And I got to tell people like, I'm not able to connect. You know, I have actually

boundaries around when I like to connect with people and when it works. And then there are times when I, like, need to talk to a friend, right? And it might not fit into the perfect time of day, but I know I need that social support. But that's still really important. So don't shut your, you know, anyone listening, don't shut yourself off from the world, allow people in, but make sure that those things you can control, unless you have a two-year-old or a baby, you know, sleep, food. And not controlling food as in like what you eat, but like just being mindful of eating enough and eating less of the white, the sugar. And not not eating like every day's your effing 12th birthday. Yes, right, right, exactly. Very good. And then moving often and then practicing a taming of the mind.

There's, I want to ask you one more thing. Another thing, I mean, you, you excel in so many realms of the body and how it moves and how it should move and what if it doesn't move. If you were telling me like the five biggest things that people can do just ergonomically in their own home, tell me what those are. So I'm going to guess. One of them is move often, right? Yeah. Yes. Okay, what else? What else? I feel like I should know. Should we play this game where we try and guess? Oh, Jonathan knows them all. Okay, go ahead. Tell me, Jonathan. Move often. Move often. Get on the floor. Get on the floor. Yeah. Don't always sit on chairs or on couches or on soft surfaces. Put your body on the floor. So, okay, those are good starts, Jonathan. Yes. Go ahead. Look on, look to the horizon. Change your point of view for what you're looking at.

So those are all like big general things, but here's specifically to what we're doing right now, which is sitting and then we'll talk about it in standing. So let's start with our feet. Okay. Let's put our, because we want, when I think of ergonomics, I want to align the most important aspect of my body, which is my spine and protect my spine, right? Because that's how we feel the environment. So our feet are flat on the ground. No foot prisons, which are shoes. Like ideally if you can take your foot prisons off. So feet flat on the ground, toes forward. Okay, knees are slightly out, you know, whether you're wearing a skirt? Yeah, man spread.

Yes. Yes. So knees out. So that hell allows your pelvis to kind of sit more neutral versus if your knees are together, try it. Like you're kind of in this sad rainbow back. No, I feel very 1950s lady. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. So knees are out and own it. Right. Pelvis is neutral. And I want you to just like gently squeeze your butt too. Just to kind of like, no, it's there. No, those tissues are there.

Yeah. Or there. Okay. And then now roll those shoulder blades down and back. Right? So now your shoulder blades are kind of sitting more up and down versus rolled forward. Okay. And then now, so now my shoulders are just over my hips and my neck, this forward protruding neck that happens because of gravity. And I'm so tall, like my neck just like it's harder for tall people. I'm just kidding. It's hard for us down on everyone. We do. tuck your chin back like you're giving yourself like this no no tuck your chin like your eyes stay on

the horizon right but you're yeah you're giving yourself this like sexy double chin like this yeah versus not like this or not like this yeah now so now that you're in a good position with your spine now you have to set up your workstation that way so our monitor i kind of okay let's all like practice the salute here Put your hand up kind of at an angle. Am I in the Marines now? No, no. So we don't want to be like this.

It's the hand is kind of tilted down. Yep, like kind of like a 20 or 30 degree angle. You too, Jonathan. Come on. So salute. He's Canadian, but okay. Okay, yeah. Well, the Canadian military is still salute, I'm sure, right?

So my monitor top, if I were to put my hand straight out from my salute position, I should be able to touch my monitor top. Oh. Right? Okay. So the top of my monitor is there. And so my eyes are kind of at a 30 degree angle, if you will, down. They're not looking up.

So that you can sit in that position. You want to maintain that. Yes, you want to maintain that. Now, your hand, if you put your hand out, like stop in the name of love kind of song deal, your hand, you shouldn't be closer than an arm's distance away. Oh. So stop. Stop.

And then stop. So then when you're working, ideally, like I'm on my laptop, which is propped up right now with my station to talk to you all, but ideally you want your elbow to be at a 70 degree angle like this. So I'm like working like this. I just, yeah, I just took over the screen, but you want your, okay, wait, hold on. I think I've got a solution here. Oh, yeah, you do.

See, okay, so he's a little stiff. in his ligaments. That's about 70. Wait, no, no. That's, this is 90. That's 90, right. So, so we, yeah. We actually want more like this, okay?

So. Got it. Yeah, I want the elbow to be slightly bent. And the elbow is in front of the shoulder itself. So I don't want my elbows back. And I don't want them, like, locked out. I want them slightly bent. So that allows my shoulders to stay over top my hips.

Right, Skelly? Yeah. This poor guy lost his limbs. So can you also in just so that people, why does this matter? Like if you were to give me the 45 second pitch, because a lot of people might be like, this is an elitist thing. This is for people who are like, no, but for people who are like at a level of like concern that like is not for normal people. Why does this matter no matter what you're doing? Meaning if you're a stay at home mom, if you're a professional athlete or stay at home, home dad. Why does this matter? Like, give us the elevator pitch. Yeah. Well, your body becomes the positions it holds. So, and you're the most important thing that we think about with this ergonomic setup is your spine, which is the very thing that helps us experience the environment.

So the more hunched over you are, right, that actually actually shows that the better posture you have, the more confidence you can develop. It's like power posture, but point is like your spine, we're protecting our spine. We're protecting the tissues around our spine. We're protecting the tissues around our spine. So they will work more optimally for you with whatever you're doing if you can align yourself in better positions, doing work, standing, sitting, lifting laundry, lifting kids. If you can be in better positions, you will be healthier and have better longevity. If you want to live longer, then start moving well and taking care of your spine. And also, you know, nerves run through the whole spine. Like the spinal cord is actually just the structure for, you know, the bones,

the vertebrae and then the, you know, the, the discs in between, people hear about discs, that is housing the ephrine and aphrine nerves. Like all the information that comes in, all the, from the outside world to your brain has to come through there. And all the information that goes out goes from your brain down and out. So the fact is, you know, we have an absolute epidemic in this country of lower back pain. I mean, if anyone knows any vertebrae, it's, L2 to L4 because that's what it's fused, herniated, all that stuff, upper neck stuff. I know several people who have had fusions up here.

They like move your thing to the side and they go in this. Like we have an epit. And that is from compression. And whether you believe in chiropractic or not, these kinds of things that you're talking about are the ways to try and give your spine that alignment so that you are preventing impingement of nerves that causes pain and debilitation. pain and debilitation and also leads to a tremendous amount of back surgeries in this country. And back surgeries cannot guarantee that pain will go away. So this is part of being proactive.

Like, you know, as you mentioned, your spine holds the central nervous system. It houses the peripheral nervous system, the autonomic nervous system, fight or flight, right? And so people don't realize all the things that go into it, like we do. But like if you, regardless of what you're doing, right, if I was to go to a third world country and teach this, which I would love to do, teach people about movement health, you can prevent so many injuries by moving more and keeping better alignment in the spine and learning how to load your spine so it doesn't hurt you and injure you. Because most of the injuries that we see are preventable out there, like 96%, 82 to 96%, according whatever research you're reading, you have the muscular skeletal aspects of the injury are preventable,

like learning how to move more, move often. And then when you're doing these prolonged positions, whether you're sitting in an airplane, working at a desk, standing sitting, if you can make it, if you can be in a better position, you will be better off in general. Like you will be healthier. Teresa, I'm, I am so in awe of you. And I just am so thrilled that we got to have this time with you. You represent so many things that Jonathan and I seek to do and, and, to do the kind of work you do. Thank you so much. And we highly, I mean, there's so many things I want to plug. Where can people find out the most information about you, find out about MovementRX, all of that? Well, if people go to Movement-Rx.com, that's a great spot to start. We've got our

mindfulness and adaptive programs on there. So just toodle around. You can contact me there. And then my favorite, my favorite social media is LinkedIn. And it's not as much of assessable as some of the others, I feel like. But the, but yeah, you can reach out to me there too. All right. From our breakdown to the one we hope you never have. We'll see you next time. It's my and Bialyx breakdown.

She's going to break it down for you. She's got a neuroscience PhD or two. One fiction. And now she's going to break down. She's going to break it down.