Mayim Bialik's Breakdown - Part Two: Psychic Ability, Energy Healing & Remote Viewing: Her 100% Success Rate | Lisa Kudrow

Episode Date: July 23, 2026

Lisa Kudrow gets candid like never before in part 2 of our conversation, revealing shocking childhood experiences of claircognizance, a remote viewing experience involving her husband, and why she believes spoken language is actually primitive. She opens up about spirituality, consciousness, the power of the mind, and her thoughts on God, higher powers, reiki, and kundalini yoga.She also discusses her philosophy of trusting that "it's all going to be okay," why she believes things happen the way they're supposed to, and how those beliefs have shaped her life and career.Lisa shares surprising insights into the future of entertainment, explaining how the latest season of The Comeback reflects the growing reality of AI in Hollywood and why the show's themes feel more relevant than ever. She also reveals the inspiration behind the series finale, what it's been like returning to the iconic character of "Valerie Cherish" over such a long period of time, and how the entertainment industry has dramatically changed since the show's debut.She also weighs in on the Friends writers' room lawsuit, reflects on the expectations placed on women in Hollywood throughout her career, and discusses navigating fame in an evolving media landscape.Plus, Lisa asks Mayim about kundalini yoga, questions Jonathan about reiki, explains why she can't go to concerts, and shares rare personal stories and perspectives you've likely never heard before.From Hollywood and AI to spirituality, consciousness, intuition, and the future of entertainment, this is one of Lisa Kudrow's most revealing conversations yet!Follow us on Substack for Exclusive Bonus Content: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://bialikbreakdown.substack.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BialikBreakdown.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube.com/mayimbialik⁠⁠⁠Every self-made person started somewhere. Yours starts free at https://www.shopify.com/breakdown.Head to https://www.Superpower.com and use code BREAK at checkout for $20 off your membership. Unlock your new health intelligence. 100+ biomarkers. Every year. Detects early signs of 1,000+ conditions. #superpowerpodMake your summer wardrobe feel easier. Go to https://www.quince.com/breakdown for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns.Go to https://tidd.ly/4uVltMe and use the code MAYIM50 to get $50 off your Elastique order.Go to https://helixsleep.com/breakdown to receive 20% off sitewide, 25% of Luxe Mattresses and 30% off Elite Mattresses.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

We are creating a reality. We can control a little more than we thought we could. Ancient religion, spirituality, philosophy, quantum physics. It all pumps in to each other. Correct. I had an experience once with my husband, not remote viewing. I was with him. I decided he was in Joshua Tree with friends where they were camping,

sleeping out under the stars. I was home and I take a bath and I thought, just focus all your attention on being with Michelle. You were not on mushrooms. No. Remember me? That's right. Too afraid. Really focused my attention. I am with Michelle. But am I forcing it? Because I know he's a Joshua tree. There was sort of a structure, but he's outside on sort of Adirondack chairs and a fire pit. I thought, okay, so I didn't do it. Finish the bow. He comes home. I said, I actually tried to be with you. He said it was that Friday night. Stop it. We went to a restaurant. We were sitting outside on Adirondack chairs at a fire pit. Wow. And I went, okay, so I did do it. So you have the ability. I did it once.

But you have 100% success rate. I could be in my bedroom tonight and you might be in my bedroom with me. But I won't be. I promise. You like me too much. I do. Miami-B-Alex breakdown is supported by Helix Sleep. We were so excited to hear that Helix wanted to partner with us.

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Hi everyone, I'm Whitney Cummings, and I have a podcast called Good For You where I don't deliver the news because I'm not a dork, but I will give you the weirdest take and truest opinion on the news. The world is insane and sometimes it takes an insane person to make it all make sense. And when it comes to what's going on in the world, I promise not to bum you out because that is social media's job. If you want to laugh about this whole nightmare called life, check out Good for You, new episodes every week. Hi, I'm Miami-Mialik. And I'm Jonathan Cohen. And welcome to part two of our conversation with Lisa Kudrow, the multi-award-winning actress, star of Friends. She played Phoebe for a decade as well as so many other things.

She is also the star of The Comeback, a series in three seasons told over almost 20 years. Turns out she's a huge super fan of Miami-Mialc's breakdown, reached out to me, slid into my DMs on Instagram, and told me that she's a huge fan and just wanted to talk about her favorite episodes. I asked her if she would come do it in person, and she agreed. It's an incredible conversation. We cannot wait for you to hear. Part two of our conversation with Lisa Kudrow. Break it down.

There's something that I have tried to ask other actors before, and I've been shut down, and it sounds a little crazy, but I really believe it. Okay. If I were, if I had your experience with a variety of characters that I had had a long relationship, with. I believe that those characters would still exist somewhere and that I would visit them sometimes because I would be like know them so intimately for so long that in a quiet moment if I was by myself hiding my bedroom, I could sort of close my eyes and be like, where is this character right now? And like not only do they exist because like so much of their energy was

created but so many people have a relationship with them, it's like they can't just be closed off in a box and like discarded. And if I was the person who had the relationship with them as them, it's not like I would be having a, it would be like I was having a conversation with a friend in, in some way. Right. I've tried to ask that question and everyone's like, oh yeah, I just kind of move on with the rest of, you know, my career. But I don't believe that. Well, I mean, but I do. Do you have the same answer? Like, do you think about Lawson? Yeah, like I played, I was thinking I played a character for five years, then I played a character for nine years, then I played a character for three years. But if the circumstances arise where you were by yourself, could you close your

eyes and bring that character back in a way and be like, and if you were to have sort of like a curious investigation or like a conversation where like, hey, what's been going on? I think that character would sort of speak and be present with you. Interesting. I mean, look, I might have to bring a character back soon because they're talking about Romeo and Michelle. And I played Michelle Weinberger. I'm 60-something. Okay. So I don't.

Do you know where she is? I've seen a script. But that's the story. But I mean, in here, do you know where she is? I mean, I do from back then. Yeah. And I'm trying to rationalize. I mean, there are women in their 60s that still have vocal.

fry or, you know, sound like a valley girl and are innocent and fried a sound. I guess. It's interesting because I think also when I brought back Amy for the finale of Young Sheldon, Jim and I were asked to recreate these characters, but not in a sitcom format. Right. Meaning it was, it's a single cam. Right. That was actually very strange because my character lives. with not just a laugh track. It's not about that. It lived with the energy of hundreds of people

and a lot of the things that all of us would do were something we didn't rehearse all week, but when the audience is there and you can ride that laugh and you can get a second laugh and you can give a turn of your body and get like that stuff only exists in this, you know, dynamic of a live performance. Right. So it was very strange. And the very, voice came right back to me and like the posture, right? Like what would Amy be like 15 years later, right? Or whatever it is. But there was something about the rhythm that it's almost like I didn't know how to make her exist outside of set up, set up joke. Tell me Chuck Lorry what to do, you know? Right. No, that I would be plagued with this is going to be very disappointed. Just because, right,

I mean, it's a different, it's a different energy level. And, and, and, Ooh, it's just this is, I don't know how this is gonna work. I'd be very nervous. Well, we've, and actually, how'd it go? I guess well. Yeah, I mean, it, it went well. And, you know, for me, the fun was also like, what would Amy wear? What would she wear as a grown-up, right?

She's not going to wear exactly the same thing, but, you know, we still kept with a pencil skirt. It was like a sensible loafer instead of an orthopedic shoe. Yeah. You know, and I, the jewelry I chose, I chose a single pearl hanging because I thought that's what Sheldon would buy her. that if she said, buy me something nice, he'd be like one pearl, right? Right. Right. Well, there was also a tiara. Right. That's true. You know.

We've talked about Don Rio who created Blossom. We wanted to reboot Blossom not as a sitcom. We wanted to bring it back as a single cam. And not to say, like, it's a drama, but to say, well, what would it look like when someone grows up, right? Very different energy. And life is not always a sitcom. There's not always a laugh track to what happens in your life.

and we thought that would be this really interesting way, also for women of a certain generation, to say, yeah, what's it like when you're out of junior high and high school? We have been told there is not interest for that character, not in a sitcom format. And I thought, what an interesting statement. And of course, I have to make it philosophical. What are we being told, right?

What are we being told as women, right? This is how we want you. We want you perky and dancing and smiling and fun. Yeah. we have a harder time wrapping our head around what happens, you know, when cute kids grow up, right? When we all grow up. Like, what is this next phase of life like? And it almost feels like this strange irony.

That's something I wanted to do creatively. I can't because the exact reason that I want to do it, right? Well, but it might be an interesting movie or, you know, as I call those, a one-off. That's what, yeah, that's what we've talked about. I don't think it's women and don't want to see women. I think it's don't want to unravel a happy ending because you would have to. If you're now going to explore, there's a fantasy about when something's over like, oh, good. So hopefully everything just went well, you know, just like end of everything.

That's a perfect setup for can you talk about the comeback? Oh, right. Yeah. Can you talk about something that is spanning? My God, I'm never leaving. Never. And we'll order lunch. Whatever you need.

Then we'll go into dinner. No, but I wonder if you can talk about, you know, creating something that is spanning, not just time, but phases of your life. Yeah. Because the comeback started right after Friends. Friends wrapped January 2004. We shot the pilot November 2004, which meant Michael and I were writing it in the fall. So, and that was the beginning of reality TV. There were no housewives yet.

there was survivor, there was amazing race, and those shows, to me, were the end of civilization. I thought, you know, these people are signing up, I think, because they just want to be seen and get attention or be famous. The five of us, the six of us, well, me and five others, went through that and that was hard. And we had each other, you know, to try to ground us and support with that. I don't know if they know what they're in for it. It's not good. Also, Survivor, that ending, they all voted the most despicable guy for being despicable made him a good player and got the reward. Sounds like capitalism to me.

Well, I don't, but I mean, historically, this country has always been merit-based, and if you can be decent about it, you win the prize. And that woman was decent about it. And that was the most depressing thing I'd ever seen. It was a real shift. Kind of a signal of what was to come. What was to come, yeah. You didn't ask for all this.

No, but that's a great framing, though. Yeah, and then Amazing Race first season. And there's a married couple, and the challenge was eat spicy soup. It's so spicy that they're vomiting. They can't choke it down. So there's a bucket next to them. And it's the first time I had ever seen people crying, choking, and vomiting while the husband is screaming at her, get it down so we can move on. And this is entertainment now.

And that's entertainment. So to me also, it was, oh, this is the end. This is terrible. It's only divulged from there. That was the high point. But it, no, because there were guidelines then. This was, there were unions weren't involved. There was no duty of care, if that's what that is called.

So, yeah, I mean, but anyway. And, and there were no housewives yet who seemed to have a plan. and knew what they were doing. I guess they do. I think they do. Anyway, so I just thought, this would be, this is something. This is something to do.

And the only way you don't feel devastated for this person is maker and actress who's going to be on a sitcom. But the studio, and Michael Patrick King and I then worked out, and the studio is so panicked, they're hedging their bets. They'll do a sitcom. but let's have a companion reality show to go with it. And this actress who has tunnel vision about like just this is great, another opportunity, going to be back in the spotlight, okay, here we go.

You know, she's just, that's all, it's sort of like a narrow focus. And not seeing that the producer played by Laura Silverman phenomenally well is there to manipulate her and get footage and just try to, make it the best Joe entertainment show. Yeah. And then you have the showrunner played by Lance Barber who played the father of Youngsheldon. And that's why I'm here.

But and he is so abusive and punishing. And in pain because he wrote a show about four sexy single women in their 40s that the network said, make it more like friends. Okay. So they do, but you got to keep the 40-year-old woman somehow because that's the reality show we need.

Figure it out. So, yes, of course, his head is going to explode. And the other writers in our writer's room knew that abusive showrunners were in abundance. Okay. I was not drawing on friends. I have to say this because it keeps coming up. but it was so close to when I finished. If anything, the only thing that was like about friends to me was Juna and Valerie,

the young beautiful actress and that there wasn't really competition, you know, and that she was sweet. The only person it was really sweet to Valerie was that person. Because that was my experience on our show, I swear to God. We've really loved each other. So, yeah, and I didn't really know about there was a lawsuit with the friends from writer's assistant. And I didn't know the details. I just knew that there was one and I wasn't sure.

And at the time, I honestly thought, yeah, that's a writer's room, you know? Yeah, the lawsuit, just to frame it a little bit, there was a lawsuit regarding language and behavior in a writer's room, which unfortunately was ruled. It went to the Supreme Court, was ruled, you know, part. hard for the course, essentially for that job. The state, maybe state's what I meant. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, that, you know, well, that's what it is. And that is how we felt like, okay, just looking at the world, here's, here, here, here are the rules of engagement. And this is what society is. So this is what you have to work with. And it's hard to navigate. Okay.

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For a limited time, our listeners get $20 off to unlock their new health intelligence. Head over to superpower.com. Use code break for $20 off your $199 Superpower membership. After you sign up, they'll ask you how you heard about superpower. Tell them, Miami Alex breakdown sent you to support the show. I was on Big Bang when Me Too happened. So there was a tremendous amount of conversation then. Boy.

Yes, there would be. meaning we had to reckon with these things. Yes. But anyway, go ahead. Right. Well, I think, thank God. Because it, I mean, ultimately people had to treat people with respect in a workplace. So that part's great.

Sorry about the fallout from other things, you know, that everything got really sensitive and almost impossible. Yep. But it's a time capsule of how much abuse, discomfort. And we deliberately had Valerie just deterred. to get what she wants. So she would speak up and say, you know, that joke might be offensive. You know, you're saying Korean Barbecue. Don't think the audience is going to like it. You know, you see a basket of puppies. I see Korean barbecue. So, you know, and she's saying, you're not going to like it. And Jim Burroughs plays Jim Burroughs, the director. And he says,

you can't tell a bunch of 30-year-old writers that their joke's not going to work. Let the audience tell them. And at the time, it's, yeah, he's right. What's wrong with her? Doesn't she know to keep her mouth shut? And that was our joke. You were ahead of your time, though. We were kind of just reporting what was, there was no laugh trap. There's no, there's no music to tell you, you know, this part's funny. This part is serious. You know, we weren't doing that. So it just became sort of a time capsule of this is how it was, and ended up making people feel really bad watching it, really uncomfortable. It was cringe, which shocked me.

It just, I didn't know why. Until later, Bill Maher was commenting, someone made a joke about someone, you know, and it wasn't fair because the person was disabled. And, you know, you can't make fun of a victim. And I went, women are victims? Is that what happened? Because women are still victims?

Oh, that's depressing. I thought we were all the same. Shoot. Yeah. Can you also talk about what it's like to do three seasons this many years apart? Because I don't know

that I've ever known a show to do this and to do it so well. Thank you. What's fantastic is 10 years later when we're asked to do season two, because we got canceled right immediately. It made someone at HBO really uncomfortable.

But it's a different time. The TV landscape is completely different. There aren't as many 22 episodes of a multi-camera show. It's single camera drama, comedy, because the concept is funny, but there are no jokes. And so, yeah, so we're setting, we're putting it in that setting. And by the way, the number of writers you need just got cut in half.

Because you don't need 12 to 15 writers in a writer's room for 22 episodes. This is 13 episodes. And then we have our Valerie, you know, this time we're looking at our marriage. And this reality is back on this. Now it's a doc series going to be, or a doc that Jane's doing. And she's on an HBO show, so it's very meta. Yeah. And this time we have her confronted with actual personal.

Her hairdresser, who's her big support and closest thing to family next to her husband, has cancer. And he's sick. And she's at the Emmys that, how that went in. She's at the Emmys, which is everything to her. She gets nominated for an Emmy. Come on. and he can't go because he wasn't feeling well and she's kind of separated from her husband right now

at a big fight and she sees she gets a text that her Mickey it collapsed and is in the hospital and she's sitting there at the theater and she can't sit there she said let me just go call and see if I can find out and she leaves the cameras

that's the first time we're seeing Valerie without reality cameras on her she leaves the cameras and realizes she can't go back in that theater because she can't not know what's going on with him. She just can't and goes to the hospital and it felt to people like, oh, she, like Pinocchio became a real boy. You know, she became an actual human. So third season, and it's daunting to do this third season because people thought that was the best ending for the thing. Like, oh, okay, there's more. Okay, well, figure it out.

But Michael Patrick King said, okay, we couldn't think of anything. You know, I don't know what would be big enough. Now it's like an event. It has to be. And Michael said she gets the lead in a multicam, her favorite thing, which is great. But it's the first one written by AI and went perfect. That's exactly the meat grinder she would throw herself into. That's hilarious.

It's good. And we had to do some research and talk to people, keeping it just to entertainment, for the most part, keeping it to writing. Because, yeah, it could easily happen. So I've heard. I mean, commercials are probably, especially non-union commercials, you know, things, I'm sure are being done. And it's Valerie. So she's not looking at the big picture. What does this mean for humanity?

she is just against it at first because the writers are going to hate me. That's what that whole strike was about. And her husband who's, you know, a business guy. He's like a finance guy. Well, it was about a little more than that. It was about streaming. She's like, no, I was there. I know.

I spent a day with them on the line. And, you know, that's the villain. AI's the villain. So I can't have a meeting about, you know, a show like this. And then she realizes, well, I better because she just did a film. She thought was going to be a terrible experience on an indie film. Like, all right, someone's offering me something. So let's go, Lucy.

And the head of the studio, played by Andrew Scott. No, he's the best actor alive, I would say, right now. He lets her know, oh, no, we have writers. Doesn't tell her as beards. Have to have writers. Yeah. And it's okay with, and you know, Valerie's just looking for, it's okay, like someone's giving her permission. Good, done. But because the writers are beards, they're not going to participate in the writing. Jim Burroughs agrees to direct. He just wants to see what this thing is. Okay. And the end, he wants to see what this is. And then says, yeah, it's never going to be great. They're not engaged. Too bad. Good part for you. And it's also, yeah, an AI picked her to do it. So, yeah, so there are practical issues with AI.

It still hallucinates. So there's that. And she's realizing, one, reluctantly, she's now the only one in charge and who cares. Number two, she realizes we need a human writer. We need two or three human rights. because, yes, it might be fast and spit out a bunch of jokes, but you still need the human to decide which joke is going to be good. And then if anything goes wrong, as it goes along,

there's a studio paywall that it hits because they're doing too much with AI. And so, yeah, now you only get to use this much of it. So we need a human writer and no one will listen. And so it becomes about, like, that's the message. It's not pro-AI. It's not anti. It's the reality, though, of what we're dealing with. That's what we meant it to be. I think in each of the seasons, as you're describing them, that you've been able to touch on what's in the zeitgeist.

Yeah. Where are we? It's a time capsule. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. But every show, it turns out, is a time capsule. I just don't know that there's ever been a show that has had the ability to touch time in such a unique way because of how spaced out the seasons are, which is unbelievable.

So it's a time capsule for the television landscape. And then what we also wanted to do was show that the Valerie that you felt so badly for, Sarah as a victim or some witless victim isn't. She was creating her own reality the entire time. That's how she was able to keep going. And it looked delusional or she's in denial. And what's the difference? between that and coping.

Yeah. Unless you're headed for something very dangerous, actually physically dangerous. But what's the difference? It doesn't matter. There's also a through line both in the comeback and in your experience on friends and through many of these episodes

about the creation of our own reality. Right? It's like when you talked about your comeback character, you know, maybe describe the end. end, that end scene that you shared with us at the beginning, because there's a reframing of what everyone else's expectations are, right? Even with your son, if you had said, well, the doctor knows better than me, and so I'm going to just accept whatever they say, that is a frame of your reality. And let me be fair, though, with my son, there were moments where I went, okay,

shit, I guess, oh my God, watched Rain Man and went, is that what's going to happen? No. And it wasn't, but, you know, sure. Yeah, but taking even what she said and then just being able to evaluate with a grain of salt versus this is what I have to do. But I think it's important for people to know that even if you are pretty clear on something, it's not every second and every minute. For sure. It's just that luckily, the doubt is momentary. So don't feel too bad.

Or that there's another way of seeing something. Even getting fired from Frazier, you can see that in one particular way or you can start to say, wait, there may be more information. And I think all the podcasts are like maybe there's just more here than we're actually realizing. After something unpleasant happens, right? And then it turns out okay. Just remember it turns out okay is the thing that you don't need to fret, mature yourself too much.

You don't need to suffer too much. It's going to be okay. And I really, I don't know, again, here I go again. This might be really stupid. But, you know, even you embark on some creative endeavor, you know, that maybe I'm not paying enough attention to this aspect of it or, you know, going over the script or the fine tooth comb. You know, sometimes you're compelled to. Sometimes you're not. Sometimes it doesn't work out.

Sometimes it doesn't. Thank God. when it hasn't worked out, I have to say. And how nice when things did work out. Like, just trusting it's okay. Like, you'll know when you need to put the effort in there. You'll know when you need to put the effort in there. So God has two answers. Yes. And not now. I've got something better. The thing that struck me the most with truth was, I think it was like, James Glatfelder. Oh my God, I love him.

Yes. That was an amazing. That was an amazing conversation. Talking about, you know, ancient religion, spirituality, philosophy, it all bumps into each and then quantum physics. It all comes into each other.

And it reminded me, you know, in Judaism, there's no word for God. There's no Hashem, you can say, you can't, there's no name. because it's nameless, which sounds a lot like a field of information. Also, a lot of times it's translated to all that is, all that was, all that ever will be. Holy cow. I've brought that up. I've said that. You have? Yeah. I've talked about it that the fact that one of the most common

names for God in the, you know, that we use in like the Old Testament, you can't pronounce it. You're not allowed to pronounce it. Right. And so even the initials, you have to like break them up or when you write it, we don't write it. And it's an acronym for was is and will be. Oh. And that like this whole, this notion that even when you try and understand something that's bigger than you, you can't pin it down, which is a lot like a particle and its wave function, right? Yes.

You cannot pin it down. I'm saying yes, which I understand a little better now after. But the collapse of the wave function gives you one point. But, you know, the Heisenberg uncertainty principle. You can't know the location and the speed of a knot. Like, that, to me, like, that's divine. And when people would say, how are you a person of faith and a person of God? I'm like, look at the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.

Is there anything more incredible than you can't know something when you try and pin it down? Unless you let the wave function collapse. You know, one's belief or faith isn't in the story of Sodom and Gomorrah. you know, like, and lot. The other thing from the Gladfelder interview that has stuck with me and we sort of reviewed as we were prepping for this conversation is his notion that the crisis of meaning that so many people are facing, the solution to that is actually in reenchantment. And this idea of reenchantment actually, I think, connects back to childhood, to play,

to creativity, to recognizing that there are many ways to, towards an end goal. It doesn't have to be so serious. And again, I'm not saying we don't have to work hard. We do. But sometimes being able to just be relaxed enough to notice the things around us to be amazed has such an empowering and magical influence on us. And we realized that, you know, Dr. Ellen Langer.

Loved. She actually has the same idea, right? redefining mindfulness as being aware and noticing. Literally. The little moments of aha that we can get by simply like, I never noticed something in my yard before, on my walk before. The impact on our physiology is very similar to what Gladfeldar is talking about in terms of reenchantment.

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ethical values, and humanistic philosophy. Directed by Academy Award winner, Giuseppe Tonatore. The film blends documentary and fiction. An intimate look at the Italian entrepreneur known as the King of Kashmir. See Brunello, the gracious visionary in Select Theater's July 24th. And yeah, Ellen Langer literally proved your physiology will change from your perception of your surroundings. Yes. And that, I mean, she's one of the strongest cases. And this was in the 70s, also for a woman at that time, right? To be doing this kind of research. One of the experiments was the chambermaids, which is what we used to call people who worked in hotels and

change the sheets and stuff. Yeah. And they did an experiment with these chambermaids where they told, they told, they had half of them as a control group where they just changed the beds and did the things and they had to weigh themselves and see how much they weighed. And the others, they said, guess what? The work that you do is a chambermaid, it's basically exercise. Right. Because you're like putting the sheets and that's like doing a squat. And you're carrying things. And those women, from doing nothing more than their job when they were told it was exercise actually lost weight. And it was statistically significant. It was published in like a peer review journal and blah, blah, blah, all the things. But she also did this study where they brought,

I believe, older men, right, in their 80s to a setting where they made it look like, basically. They brought it to a hotel. And they designed it like it was 30 years prior. I think it was. The music, the food. Like everything, the style, the movies. And they, I mean, all their physiological markers for blood pressure, like all these things. Eyesight. And everything improved. It's unbelievable.

Alex Graham, who created Who Do You Think You Are, did that as a show. Wow. And I think it was a one-off. Well, he also did Colonial House. Yeah, yeah. Those were fantastic experiments. Oh, yeah. But, yeah, he first.

told me about that because he said yeah we're doing really interesting show incredible and said and on our show too you could see how improvement yeah like he documented that's amazing that's amazing yeah i mean that opens just like this rabbit hole right like what is the intention that we bring to everything that we're doing yes if we have that self-consciousness if we're terrified of speaking up what is that going to do right to our physiology what does that do to our ideas how open can creative Can we be? Right. Yes. Exactly. I mean, I don't know what to say other than it's true. I'm telling myself that podcast is great exercise. Well, it is. I mean, and I'm telling myself that, you know, I can have some chips if I'm so busy. And then guess what? I can. And I haven't gained

weight. And if I tell myself, oh, you've eaten a lot of chocolate today, but I'm so happy, but I've eaten a lot of chocolate today. And two pounds more. on a scale. That's right. And like two pounds. I didn't even eat two pounds of chocolate. What? How did that happen? You know, it's true. Yeah. All that stuff. It's so we are creating our reality and physically too. Yeah. And I mean, people have always, it's kind of annoying when someone, my husband used to say, because he's always been like what we're talking about, okay? He's always been aware that we can control a little more than we thought we could and there's impact and thoughts have impact and all that. And he would say if I got sick, why do you want to get sick? And I won't want to

punch him. When you're sick, no one wants to hear that. And the worst is, why did you want to get cancer? You know, he didn't say that. He didn't say that. He didn't say that. That's the thought that no one dares say. That is the most punishing thing. And so what I say is, it's not that you wanted it, it's just what had to happen. That's all. And he's always said, and I never believed him, I thought it was so stupid. When it's your time, it's your time. And I've come to honestly believe that. Do you mean in life or in death? Both. All of it. All of it. I mean, when it's your time to figure it out, you'll figure it out, you know, if there's something you need to do or you need to wake up from something or release yourself from something you've been punishing yourself over.

When it's your time to do it, you do it or you don't. I don't. It doesn't matter. It's a very peaceful perspective. It really is. It is. I try to remind myself of that. But you,

but here's my, I have two questions. I was going to say, do you have any questions for us before we say goodbye? Don't. Oh, well, you should. At some point, you might have something else to do.

I have nothing. I'm just exercising through the podcast. Me neither. Um, okay, where do I start? Okay, you're a Reiki practitioner. I am. How and when did you start that?

So this is, look. No? Yes. Yes. Yes. And, you know, what has been amazing about this conversation for me is your openness about feeling uncomfortable about specific questions. And Reiki has been one of those topics that I've always been almost ashamed to talk about.

because there are so many different versions of it. And when I was growing up, it was this, like, weird thing that wasn't publicized or talked about. And, like, when I tried to explain it to people, they were like, you know, this, again, is almost 25 years ago. Oh. In, you know, very... Suburban Toronto.

Suburban, you know, not overly open Toronto. And people are like, what are you talking about? Like, this is so weird and strange. What happened to you? Yeah, exactly. You were so smart and promising. Yeah, and it was like weird. And, you know, all, anyway, so the short version of how that happened was, it was family tragedy.

My sister had extreme health problems from the time she was very young at, like, a little. 11, she had back surgery, she had a ski accident or water ski accident. And her level of physical pain after that far surpassed the actual accident itself. And over the year, she had fibromyalgia. She couldn't walk up and down the stairs. For a while, my brother, like, when she came down for dinner, she would, like, come down on her butt and, like, scooting down the stairs. And then he would have to piggyback her back up up the stairs. And she was very sick and saw every different type of specialist.

At the same time, she's six years older than me. My brother is three years older than me. My brother was injured in a car accident and left with a traumatic brain injury. And at that point, she... He was in a coma. It was an extensive injury, yeah. Very extensive injury. It was your desire to see your brother heal in a way that doctors were basically saying

we don't necessarily know if he's ever going to walk, talk, communicate. Yes, and that was a little. a little bit past, but sort of the way I got to Reiki was that I saw my sister have a drastic transformation in her health after it cratered after my brother's accident. So like the stress and the family stress of my brother being in the hospital only made her physical condition worse. So like there was these parallel tracks of two injuries. And years after my brother's accident, my sister dropped out of business school and like started changing her life and worked at a health food store and started doing yoga and started basically looking at all the psychosomatic

stress aspects of her disease and eventually started to get out of a wheelchair and be able to walk and ended up backpacking around the world. And, you know, she caveats that story by saying that, you know, she walked cautiously. You know, she wasn't like running up mountains, but like her body was strong enough to be able to do that. And so one day, she's at the kitchen table while my parents are away and it's like where I'm throwing parties as I am, as I do, and I'm 17 years old. And I go and reach into the toaster because I've made myself a snack and I singe three fingers on my right hand on the toaster oven grill. I go to put them under cold water. And she's like, why don't you let me cup your hands for you? And I don't know what Rakey is at this time. But I've seen.

the blister starting to form on my hands. And I'm like, what are you talking about? She's like, just sit down. So she puts my fingers in her hands. And I'm like joking with her because we knew something. She was up to something. Well, you know, she was a vegetarian and we thought that was crazy. And we didn't know what yoga was. And I'm like, do I have to chant? You know, what do I have to do? She's like, just sit there and be quiet. And I could feel my fingers pulsing and throbbing. And 10 minutes later, the blisters were almost gone. And I was like, well, that's pretty cool. Like, how did you do that? Right. And she's like, well, you know, she tells me it's Reiki.

And I'm like, cool. But is there, is there an intention she has while she's cupping? Or I know, now I'm asking you to explain Reiki. Well, I can explain Reiki, which is, and I think this is true with all different forms of energy healing. You're kind of tapping into that universal access and you become a channel for it. And it just flows freely through you into. I heard and talk about that on an early podcast where, and that's how it can be remote. It can be remote. It can be remote. But that's the idea.

Yeah. So that's why it's pulsing. And the body then is, you know, the recipient is basically doing what it's the natural function of the body, which is to expedite whatever healing process it is. But that's a big idea. It's a really big idea. It's like, well, if you take away the limits of whatever the issues are, then it has its, you know, our natural want is to sort of come back to some form of equilibrium.

I don't mean to be a party pooper, but the pulsing may have also been from the injury and not necessarily the Reiki, but I'm not supposed to say that. Yes, that's true. I'm just saying. You've never felt pulsing? I've never felt waves in exchange. Yeah, but I'm saying in this case, we can't necessarily say Reiki caused those sensations that he was feeling because it could have been that he had singed his hands and that was the throbbing.

It could have been. And the scientist in the room will say that this is an anecdotal account. The blisters may not have been as extreme as I remember them. I remember them extreme. I remember them being decreased after that happened. What was the mechanism? All I know is that a week later, I'm in a basement of the woman who taught my sister because there happened to be a class. And he's a teenager.

And I'm a teenager. And she's, it was a level one Reiki class. And I had to agree to finish the class if my parents agreed to pay for me to go. because I had a history of signing up for things and then dropping up. And I thought I was going to learn some sort of secret spell that I could say that would create miraculous healing. And it turned out that that is not the case at all. God bless you. Yeah, that's what I thought at 17. And I'm like sitting there being like, they're talking about energy and this and clearing yourself and this is so slow and boring.

and this woman talks a lot. And it was a four-day class. And on the final day, I'm doing, and you receive and you give sessions as a practitioner learning how to do this. And on the fourth day, I'm treating a woman who's lying on a table, and my hands are over her head,

and there's this pulsing in my hand that I don't understand. And it's extremely strong, and it's kind of undeniable, and my hand is sweating and pulsing. and I'm like, maybe this is what, for the last four days, this woman is talking about, about energy. And I'm like, that's weird. How does that happen? Because if everything she just described about, you know, the system of healing and this energy flowing through us and the body doing the thing,

and I'm like, well, that isn't explained in anything that I've grown up understanding. And so I left that weekend and I was just extremely curious. And for the next four years, I just did as much of it as humanly possible. That's starting at 17. Wow. Okay. Oh, you started that early. And I became an assistant to her, and I started pretty much twice a month was assisting

classes that she was teaching. And I just saw all these people. Some of the classes were 20 people, some of them were smaller, and you have like multiple tables of these people. people who are like, they're lying down and all of a sudden there is something that emerges from them that is usually highly emotional, highly cathartic, screaming, crying, sweating, pain that starts and then dissipates. And all of a sudden, you're like starting to map that everyone is holding something that you would otherwise not know. And your hands can have an intelligence to sort of go

to those places and find those things. And then you start to incorporate, well, distance is also possible. You can tap into the same stuff from a distance. Yeah. And as you start to work on people, you can also start to like, the things that they're carrying emotionally in their body are also available in the field around them. Right. And so, you know, then it's like, starts to get wormhole where you're like, well,

what is this information? Where is it coming from? and who's providing it. And that's really hard to go to high school parties and talk about things that are, you know, not that. Yes, that would be hard. Also, I mean, like you were saying, going to certain venues and it's hard.

And for me, same, I can't go to concerts. I never could. And, I mean, one part is, emotions are going to get, too. It's too much. Everyone's just going to get worked up. And, oh, my God. You can feel that.

Yeah, too much. Yeah. Also, too loud. Yeah. And then where are the exits? Because then something happens. Everyone panics, trampled. Yeah.

You know, that's from forever. Was this your experience? Like, for me, it's lovely to be nominated for Emmys, but it terrified me. Oh, wait. Do you have that? this experience?

And I was like supposed to be happy and everyone was like, that's amazing. And every time it happened, I was like, uh-huh. Because now I have to go. Now I have to go. There's too many crowds. I have to get dressed and they have to pick a thing and forget it. I don't know how to dress. Yeah.

I mean, someone dresses me. Okay. Yeah. Yes. But I've somehow figured out some of that. Like that's now a little easier. Yeah. But a party, I can only do a couple.

No, I can't drink anymore. That was how I was able to at least get through a party. Like, just like a little liquid courage. Right. You know, like after a glass and a half of white wine, I'm delightful. You know, like I could manage it. Yeah. It's still not.

Like, I won't be staying late. Yeah. But no, I started not being able to drink without having allergic reactions. And I was like, they took away my liquid courage. Do you know what I just learned? And maybe it's not right. I'll check with you guys. Things like alcohol and, you know, I think, yeah, I don't know, other things.

Yeah. Actually, there's GABA, which is the filter. Yeah. And it increases the amount. Right. Of filter. Right. So it's not releasing inhibitions.

Correct. It's actually creating more of a filter so you feel a little safer. Yeah. You feel like the smartest person in the room or the, yeah. Maybe just let go a little more. because... Correct. Good.

Yep. Wow, I didn't know that. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't know that until recently. You had two questions. That was your question for Jonathan about Reiki. Yes.

Reiki. Yeah. I'm all in, by the way. And same as you talk about like placebo, nocebo. My father used to say everyone ignores placebo. It's real. It's 40%. A lot of medications are only 40% effective.

So what's the difference? And no one's looking at it. But that's really interesting to me. So that's why I keep saying, what does it matter what the exchange is? Right. Yeah. And whether, you know, you can just decide, I'm going to eat chocolate because it'll make me happy. Maybe, you know, or an effort and chocolate, you know, certain neurotransmitters so you feel better, right?

And or you just did it yourself because you made a decision. And you made the association with that action that's going to cause. whatever result that you're looking for. Right. But what if it doesn't, anyway, I don't, now I don't remember. I'm going to ask you. Oh, well, sorry, Ma'am. You'll have to come back again. Oh, sure. You've got another six hours by the time I catch out a sentence. So, Ma'am, no, my question for you was about, I've heard you talk about Kundalini yoga meditation. It does do, and it does affect. you. Yeah, I've had, I have had some experiences we had, I'm trying to think who we spoke to. It was Sue Warner, who talked about being a total materialist. I think this was her story and a skeptic.

Also, Federico Fijin talked about this. That sometimes you are struck by something. Right. And the Fadryko example was he was just like going about, he was in the kitchen in the middle of the night, like getting a snack. And all of a sudden was struck, you know, struck by a. light that pierced through his soul and made him feel connecting. Right. So this is, there are poses, postures, breathing all these things. And this is the Kundalini rising. That's the energy that, you know, certain branches of yoga have described for this place. I've definitely felt things. And the thing with Kundalini, there's a lot of repetitive movements we do. So there's like a lot of somatic stuff that gets kind of activated. There's a pulse that you can start feeling.

I mean, to me, it's kind of like it's all the same, right? It's all these different ways to try and get at the same thing. The same like connection with source or that awe, right? That sense of like, yeah, right? That feeling, that knowing in some way. Yeah. Yeah. But, I mean, does any of it help?

Like, can you use it to sort of, if you're having anxiety over something? Can you use it to? I've found, I mean, I think breathwork of a variety. of ways can be helpful. I think it depends. I mean, I think, and this is one of the reasons also, we talk to so many different kinds of experts and people, what works for one person doesn't work for another, right?

There's so many different ways to get at that. For some people, like box breathing is it. For some people, walking meditation is it. For some people, Transcendental Meditation is it? And like Thomas Campbell, they're like flying in the, you know, stratosphere. And I think for other people, it's like being able to be reminded that there's some sort of gut.

guidance, that we have a purpose here, that everything isn't random, that just because I experience something challenging doesn't mean that I'll never work again or my, you know, relationship, I'll never love someone again. Like I think that also can, you know, they're different for each person. Yeah. The hardest thing I think is knowing what's yours to take on and what's not yours. What's somebody else's thing. I think most people don't know the difference. You've actually taught me the most about that of any other. Oh, me? Yeah. Why? Because I have so many things that you want to make yours that you know are not yours to fix. Well, the notion of Allen on in the rooms and that level of like, well, people have chaos in their lives and you can love them and really care for them and want so much

for them. But actually, what is your role in helping them? Right. And being supportive. And what is just going to entangle you into whatever thing that they're in. Right. That was my first big one. And it was in Alonon one time, one person who just talked about someone. If your name's not in the sentence, it's not your problem. That's how we say it. That's interesting.

Like if you say any given problem in a sentence and your name's not in it, it's not your problem. It doesn't mean you don't care about it. It doesn't mean you're not engaged with it or that you can't be loving and supportive. Right. But in order to do that, as you said, without it becoming yours. And I've experienced this, you know, as a parent, your children will experience things. And sometimes it's very, very hard to tell the difference between they're upset and you're upset. Or what is it like to feel empathy, right? For your child, for a friend, for your parent, and not have it consume you. Right. It's very, it's a huge challenge. And what's interesting is, you know, there's there's a porousness to our physiology as well, right? When we let things in that are. or not ours, they can have an impact as well on our immune system, on the way that we heal. Yeah.

Yeah. For me, the one where I need it the most is things that make me angry. And if someone, I'm thinking, I really hate being, everyone does lie to. Everyone hates being manipulated without skill. I don't manipulate me all you want if I don't know what's happening. Fine with me. Also, talk behind my back. all you want.

Right. It's not happening as far as I'm concerned. That's fine. But that stuff, oh, boy, that can really get me going. It starts a whole circuit. What does it look like for you to get angry like that? Well, it takes different forms, but, you know, a lot of bad language. And then, yeah, just how dare, wishing them ill.

And how do I let them know that that's not, you know, like, how do I slam that shut hard? And that's never the way to deal with any of that. It always has to be, you know, just, it's not yours. It's their thing. They don't mean harm. They're trying to help themselves. And they think they're protecting themselves. They think they're advocating for themselves.

and they're not. And so, and that way you can just sort of, I got really good for a while and then, you know, I got knocked off balance, you know, but really good for a while being able to just say, yeah, okay. Yeah. I don't think, I don't, I can't help you with that. But I understand. It's a boundary, yeah.

That's an energetic boundary too. Yeah. It's important. I have a very hard time with other people being wrong and not like either point. Just factually wrong? No, sometimes, but that's just, you know, I was raised by English teachers. We can't help it. No, but like when someone speak really well, so that's good.

No, like if someone believes something that that is not rational, I have a really hard time just letting them believe that. Like, I want to fix it and tell them that they're wrong. How do you know what's rational and what isn't after what we've been talking about for? 12 days just now. Why is you so happy? Well, I'm so happy because someone's acknowledging his point. I've never seen him happier in his life. No, I'm very happy. Because there's other information. Sometimes it's like so obvious, but then you're like, well, actually, if you see it from this other angle, it's not obvious at all. What's wrong, for example? What would be wrong? Although I can think

of some things that are wrong. That would be wrong and irrational. Okay, I'll just give an example like, I don't know if this is a good example. If someone's in, you know, an abusive relationship, like a really damaging abusive relationship, and they, for, you know, their own good reasons, right, don't want to leave. Right. And they might say something like, oh, well, you know, I can't leave because I don't, I don't think I can afford it, so I'm just going to stay. And my response, if I were allowed to, would be, have you looked into it? There are ways that if you need to escape an abusive relationship, that you can get that help.

It's very hard for me to be like, oh, well, that's their path. Oh, not for me. That is not hard for me at all. That's their path. Really? That is not hard. No. It's not that you don't feel the pain or, you know.

I understand. I completely understand. Yeah. Yes. but I'm not being asked. They're not seeking help to get out of it. They're just saying

basically, here's why I'm still in it. And it doesn't even matter and here's why. All they're saying is, I'm still in it. And take people at their word. Well, yeah. Also, when they're ready, they'll be out of it one way or another.

a horrible way or a healthier way? A healthier way and yeah. It's hard for you to see them actively in it because you know the pain that they're going through to be in it. Also, I don't like, I don't like, you know, if there's a reason that they're, you know, making up that is like not true, then yeah, you're right. That's just what they need to say because they're not ready to leave.

They're not ready to leave. But sometimes you just can't see that other option. Right. And sometimes people are asking, you know, Because, I mean, the only thing I think you could say to me is, oh, did you want to? I wouldn't even go there. Yeah. You would wait for them to sort of more formally say, do you know of any ways? Because then that indicates that they have a willingness to seek alternatives. Although, that's rationally what I'm saying. Right. Right. Wouldn't be the thing to do. But I know me. Yeah. And I know I would say, oh, if you really want to change something, I could tell you. a couple things that maybe would work for you. Right. You know, I mean, I...

Yeah. Then I would say, I'm very excited about them, so I'm going to tell you about them anyway, you know, and see if it sparks anything. Right. Yeah, so while I'm saying, but I don't, I don't get worked up. Right.

Over it. Yeah. Because it's not mine to get worked up over. You're very good at solving problems, though. Me? Yeah. Oh, well, my brain was made for that. Yeah.

Puzzles. I love puzzles. Me too. I love puzzles. a puzzle, really? Well, what kind of puzzle? I don't like. Let's talk about it. Puzzles. Oh, God. What kind of puzzles do you like, if not jigsaw?

You like word puzzles? I like word puzzles. Like crossword puzzles? Yeah. You like wordal? I do. Okay. It's all right. Okay. But what kind of puzzles do you like then? I like, I don't know, on my device. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Thought puzzles?

It's matching things. Oh, yeah, yeah. I do like some thought puzzles. And then I don't want to give it too much time. That's well. Yes, no one should. Yeah, because I want to relax. Do you feel like your path was redefined? Oh, I do.

To a degree. Only because of some of the things I told you that I kind of heard, saw on some level. Even as a kid, I mean, I could, I, there are things I knew. Have you ever considered doing any healing arts yourself as a practitioner? Because if you're tuned into receiving this kind of information, I'm curious if it ever occurred to you that that's something you might be able to, you know, channel for lack of a better word. It takes so much effort. I mean, I did. I had an experience once with my husband.

It's like a not remote viewing. I was with him. I decided, I'm going to try this. He, okay. I didn't. Yeah, of course I didn't tell you this. And I haven't done it since because it was so exhausting. But he was in Joshua Tree.

I knew he was in Joshua Tree with friends where they were camping, sleeping out under the stars and taking mushrooms. And I was home and I take a bath every night. I like being in the water and it's calming and all of that. And I thought, ooh, this is a good place. Just focus all your attention on being with Michelle. Just be with Michelle. You were not on mushrooms.

No. Okay. Remember me? Yes, that's right. I'm too afraid. And really focused my attention and started, oh, okay. I'm with Michelle. I am with Michelle.

I'm with Michelle. But am I forcing it? Because I know he's a Joshua tree. So don't implode. No, I'm with him. Oh. yeah, this isn't right. And I didn't get it right.

He was outside. There was sort of a structure, but he's outside sort of Adirondack chairs, Joshua Tree camping and a fire pit. No. Okay. Yeah, I thought I got, okay. So I didn't do it.

Got it. Finish the bell. He comes home. I said, I actually tried to be with you. But somehow. there was a structure, you were at a fire pit on like Adirondack chairs. He said that was what, that Friday night, we went to a restaurant. Stop it. And we were sitting outside on Adirondack chairs at a fire pit smoking cigars. Wow. We didn't camp. We didn't camp. Holy. That was one night we treated

ourselves. Okay. So I did do it. All right. Good to know. So you have the ability to. I did it once. Yeah, but like I could, I could be in my bedroom. tonight and you might be in my bedroom with me. No, but I won't be. I promise you. I don't believe you. I promise. You like me too much. I do. I'm in awe of you. But I won't. You have 100% success rate.

But also that's like, I mean, on the scale when Julia Mossbridge talks about, you know, precognition, when she talks about remote viewing, when she talks about this kind of synchronicity, you had three facts. You didn't have one. That's right. Because if you had said like, oh,

Adirondack chair, like, you had a structure, like a building, you had chairs, you had a fire pit, which like people might also say like, well, what are the chances like you're camping? Of course there's going to be a fire pit. So that's kind of a common thing. But the Adirondack chair. There was also laughing. There was also the fact that he wasn't supposed to be in a building. A number of people around also sitting in them and there was an extra person and it was a guy. Yeah. No, there were a lot of things that were right. New reality show. My and Lisa learned to become. The one. Miam and Lisa try to debunk each other.

But I mean... Maybe I want to hang out with Michelle. But it was exhausting. You mean you felt physically like, it took a lot. And I don't, I'd rather focus my attention on being here. And I will say that as you do things like that, maybe not going remote in that way because it sounds like you were traveling, there are ways to do it with less effort. it becomes less exhausting as you sort of lean into it a little bit more.

Did it scare you? No. Not at all. Because it's a creative imagination. And so I make up what I'm about to say next. It sounded like you were like really trying to go there versus kind of going into a state and allowing it to come to you. Right.

And the going is very taxing, but the coming to you is actually quite pleasant. Right. That's interesting. But you're saying, practice it with intention. In theory, it might not be as exhausting. I'm going to suggest a book, which is, I have to check the name of the book. I think it's called How to Read the Akashic Records. And when you asked about the readings, finding that place and the access to that

is an interesting exercise because once you know how to access it, you can kind of go and it's, you know, like wandering around a little bit, instead of going, you're just kind of like seeing what presents. Okay. So imagine, you know, this huge library of information, just like we talked about that everything exists and it's available. Well, if you go to the place where the information exists and you make it intentional and you kind of open that space, you can kind of stand there and see what is brought forward and it just becomes a little bit of a... Why not? Yeah.

Why not? A little curious wandering into the records. Okay. But have you never had an experience like something you can't explain? Her house has been hunted. Oh, God, Canuth and the five-year-old when his... Oh, yeah. What the? That what?

Yeah, Henry, with his son, Henry, that was not... Well, Henry just corroborated what he experienced. Correct. We're talking about when Kevin Canuth saw a man in his child's bedroom. Not a man? No. It was an older child. It was that's right. It was sorry. It was a child. That's right. I'm sorry. Five or seven year old. Right. His son was not that little. No. And then his son was terrified and said that there was a boy in his room.

And the boy looked terrified. Yes. Well, there's something happened. Yeah. And that would something happened that he could not get out of. I haven't had things like that. I don't think. You haven't had things like that. Like my mom thinks my dad is a hummingbird. Like, you know, it's. Oh, sure. No, no, sure. She's, you know, she's got a whole. thing about that. Something in that vein, though, the Tara Swart episode where... She saw her husband at the foot of her bed after he died. Oh, right. And, you know, she

didn't say it exactly, but she said something to the effect of, I used to be a part of teams who would recommend institutionalizing people who would have claimed to have the experience that I had. I mean, her whole worldview had to change. So, you know, how do we

as people both be open to that type of information? but also as you explain, be here and now and present and available and not, you know, driving in our cars, saying ghosts are guiding me to, you know, the wrong exit.

Yeah, my younger one, we used to joke he sees dead people. He's got some special perceptive abilities, I would say. But they scare him, they don't scare him. Well, when he was younger, he would say,

he would say, like, yeah, there's a darkness in the house. And I kept buying lights because I thought that's what he meant. But that's not what he meant. There was something that he was, you know, picking up on. By the way, I also think with children, we grow a lot of symbology at, you know, oh, they said this, they said it wrong, they meant this.

What if they knew exactly what they did? Yeah. And it was the wrong word for a reason. Mm-hmm. And all the things that they invent that we think, oh. Isn't that cute? That's so cute. And, oh, yeah.

I don't know. I just, it makes me like, what if. That would be an interesting experiment to me. Yeah, that creative imagination is something also that, you know, young worked with and like when people do shadow work and, you know, I've done some hypnosis work where, yeah, you you conjure aspects of yourself, different parts of yourself and you tell stories, right? But it's nothing's accidental that we say and think. It's all rooted in something. that has either truth or resonance. Yeah. It's some very, very interesting work can come out of that kind of exploration. But that's why, to me, I don't care whether your, you know, your father is coming back, not coming back, but represented by a hummingbird for your mom.

Right. It's what he's thinking about him, feeling him and deciding or needing him and deciding that he's there. And he is there. I don't, I mean, what does it matter? How much happier would people be if more of life was an improv game where we were meeting people where they are, right? Instead of trying to convince someone that the hummingbird isn't the association they made, which just puts us against each other. What if it's like, I'm going to just put whatever I think down for a minute long enough to enter your world. Yes, and. Enter your world.

And maybe I'll walk around that world and I'll make a connection with you and I'll either agree or I'll go back to my own world, but your world doesn't have to terrorize or invalidate whatever world I'm going to go back to. Yes. But I feel like that's what all this is right now. For me, I am, especially telepathy tapes. It's a big yes-and because it doesn't matter. If none of it is real, how is that possible? You know, then, you know, I'll know.

I'll find out, you know, we'll all know. but why shut it down? That's the stuff I'm more suspicious of. Why shut it down? What's the problem? What's the problem? What's at risk? And I have a feeling, you know,

I don't go all the way to, you know, deep state doesn't want us to know because it's their domain and maybe. But there's some like institutions that shut it down, especially academic institutions. and, you know, I don't know. Everyone's so afraid to be shunned and shut out. And someone was brought it up.

It was, yeah, a neuroscientist that I know who had a revelation while meditating. But also, and so everything flipped. But was saying, or someone was saying, I can't remember what it was. like, yeah, but it's, you know, it's a lot of women and older women that are doing this work. And like men, too. I said, but it's because once they retire, they are free to say they're not dependent on their job or getting a grant or publishing or. Just like, I'm too old to give a shit. Yeah.

So in some ways, you not had Rupert Sheldrake on, have you? Not yet. Not yet. We've talked about him because we talked about him with D.T. Young. and we talked about him also regarding telepathy tapes because it comes up in one of the episodes with animal communication. Right. Come on.

I mean... Come on. Anyone who has had a very deep connection with an animal, you know there's something going on. Yes. Especially as they get older, because they're kind of oblivious as puppies and they're just exploring and you can't really get their attention

the same way. And as they age, they become more and more attention. tuned to and like things are just exchanged without any form of communication. That was one of the things. We had Vinny Todd Tolman, one of the NDE experiencers who we had on. He died in the bathroom of a dairy queen and watched himself be zipped up. That's a recent one. Yeah. You haven't seen that one. It's an unbelievable episode. It's an unbelievable episode. But one of the things he said is he always liked animals, but after his NDE and he was dead for about two hours, zipped up in a body bag. And then an EMT literally was like, I think he's not dead.

and brought him back. It's a whole thing. The N.T was like, the people in the front were like, don't mess with the body. You're going to get fired. And he was like, no, something in me is telling me that this guy's not dead. Anyway, what Vinnie said was that before his NDE, he liked animals. But after his NDE, he came back with a way to communicate. And he was here with our dog who historically does not do well with men. and the dog went right up to him and looked him in the eye. And he said, he said to the dog, oh, you were hurt.

And so you're here to heal people. And I was like, what's happening? He said he just, after his NDE, he came back with an ability to experience their consciousness, their communication. That's what this dog was communicating. Yeah. And he was. He was a traumatized dog. We didn't tell Vinny anything about this dog.

No. This dog was tied to a telephone pole in the desert and left for days. And then we got him, he was pulled out of a kill shelter where they spray the concrete floors down every night. He had respiratory problems. He had a big scar across his face. He had been star. And he was terrified of men in particular. Anyway, he walked right up to Vinny. And Vinny was like, yes, I see you. It was amazing. Oh. Yeah. No, yes. Of course I believe. All that. Why not? All that and more. But why not? Yes. I believe. I mean, yes. Let's see. Sure. That's the title of the episode. Let's see. Why not? It also makes life a lot more fun.

Right? Yeah. Well, look, it's create your own, choose your own adventure. I mean, it's whatever you want. All right. My real last question for you. Have you been shown what's next for you in a way that you were shown what has already happened? that I've been shown what's already happened. Meaning when you were younger, you got intuition. Oh, when you're on Letterman, don't do that. Have you seen more about what comes next? Oh, it's glimpses of things that it's like maybe or maybe not is how I feel about it. And then once it comes to pass, I'm like, oh, all right.

So I guess that was a thing. Yeah. Well, we look forward to seeing what's next. Everybody has that. I'm not letting you get that clever last line. But I guess Everybody has that I'm not the only one

Do you have that? You just don't pay attention Yeah I think it's the not paying attention You just don't pay attention Yeah or you're not like tuned into it Or you're too busy with you know Things that take up our attention

When I was little, very little Like I didn't speak really clearly Until I was still not Three And I remember watching people talk grownups, my brother and sister, six and eight years older, and just watching them going, oh my God, you're not even listening to each other. That's not what he meant. And now you're really mad. And, oh, this is all getting out of hand just because you,

oh, wait, no one, you're not listening. And I just thought, uh-oh, you get dumber as you get older. like you can't see people's intentions any. You get dumb. Lisa, it's going to happen to you too, I guess. It's going to happen to me too. But just please remember this. Just remember this thought. So I have certain things that just remember this.

Wow. That's so special. That's so special. Isn't it? That's a very, very powerful realization to have then and now. Because, I mean, I feel like our, my role here is English to English. translation. And yours is to help translate what I'm saying to other people. Right. But part of it to me, looking back, feels like, right, because spoken language is so primitive. I mean,

it's like fire compared to what communication probably can be. That's the thing we hear about telepathic communication. And when I've heard or felt like I've received messages from someone else is that you feel their intentions so much more than what actual language conveys. Right. Like I could see, oh, I know exactly what you just heard. And that's not what they meant. But wow, you're coming with a whole bunch of like a stack of information that's hollering.

You know, that's a, I don't want to call it psychic because psychic has a bad association to it. But it's, what were the four clairs? Yeah, there's clairvoy. is the one that people thought, but there's Claire audience. There's Claire cognizance. That's Claire cognizance. You have a lot of Claire cognizance is what it's called.

This has been an absolutely delightful conversation. I know. I said I know. She had pre-pland. I am delightful. Me too. All three days of it. Where can people find out all the things about comeback

or anything else you want to direct people to? The comeback, all three seasons, is on HBO Mac. Or whatever it's going to be called. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. I love your... Thank you. Everything I get to hear about on it. Jonathan, I really didn't know what to expect when we decided to have Lisa on. I had such a wonderful conversation with her completely off the record, and she really wasn't sure what she would talk about.

Turns out she was a fantastic guest and reviewer of some of our favorite episodes, too. I said to her, she's walking out, hour three, we're getting... getting more information, unbelievable stories that what she describes about seeing how people misunderstand each other as adults, it hit me so hard because I could remember being a kid and looking at people being like, they're such a mismatch. And as we get older, we rely more and more on our rational minds and less and less on our felt sense. And like, when you can't feel someone, all of a sudden there's conflict. There was actually a lot you have in common with Lisa Kudrow. I think you're from the same village.

Maybe we're cousins. You probably are cousins. Jonathan, this was really, really terrific. So, so glad we got to do this episode. It was so special. We talked to Lisa so long that there's actually bonus material, not in either one of the episodes we've released online that you can get only on Substack. Go to biolik breakdown.substack.com or just look up Myambiolix breakdown on Substack. From our breakdown to the one we hope you never have. We'll see you next time. She's gonna break it down for you She's got a neuroscience PhD or two One fiction one now she's gonna break down

So break down She's gonna break it down