Mayim Bialik's Breakdown - Seth & Lauren Rogen: Genes are a Roadmap, Not a Destination

Episode Date: April 12, 2022

Seth Rogen (actor, writer, producer, director) and Lauren Miller Rogen (writer, director, producer, philanthropist) join us to discuss the origin and missions of HFC, their non-profit organization, that cares for families impacted by Alzheimer's disease, activates the next generation of Alzheimer's advocates, and leads brain health research and education. Lauren opens up about her mother’s battle with Alzheimer’s at an early age, and how her mother’s diagnosis affected the early stages of her relationship with Seth. Seth and Lauren discuss the ripples of mental health struggles on an entire family, why treating and preventing Alzheimer’s can be so difficult, and the benefits of familiarizing yourself with symptoms of neurological diseases. They explain potential causes of early onset Alzheimer’s, lifestyle changes that can help promote brain health, and the positive and negative effects of marijuana use on brain health. Mayim and The Rogens consider the need for universal access to medical and mental health resources and reasons Americans may be distrustful of the healthcare system. Learn more about HFC: WeAreHFC.org BialikBreakdown.com YouTube.com/mayimbialik Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Yeah, I'd say in general, Americans have like a real, like, skepticism and, like, mistrust of doctors. It's like auto mechanics is kind of how they view them kind of. It's like, yeah, you say I need a new muffler, but you need a little bit like. My family was never in denial. No. I don't think. What's that like, Lauren? Tell me about a family that's not in denial.

It's not fantastic. It's my ambiolyx breakdown. She's going to break it down for you Because you know she knows a thing or two And now she's going to break down It's a breakdown She's going to break it down Hi, I'm I'm Biolik and welcome to my breakdown

These are the people I'm not stoned off camera before we started I said I could be stoned, I wish I was stoned all day You don't want to start the episode like that? I think it's an ear catcher The reason that I mentioned it we are going to be talking to Seth Rogen and Lauren Miller Rogan about hilarity for charity, which is this incredible organization that they founded.

Lauren's mother had Alzheimer's that presented very early when Lauren and Seth had just started dating and she was in her 20s. And like long story short, they have this incredible organization that raises millions and millions and millions of dollars. and they do it with some benefits that are hilarious and there's comedians and they do all sorts of fundraising. But this organization also does a lot of education, outreach, and funding research. But one of the things that we're going to talk to them about, and Lauren especially is going to speak to in particular,

is a lot of what relates to mental wellness, mental illness, when you think about what one person in a family struggles with or has as their challenges, is what Lauren is so focused in on what they founded this organization to also do is to look at kind of the health of the whole family and what are the things that can be done to continue to support families who have a loved one in this case with Alzheimer's. But a lot of the things that Lauren talks about make me very, very angry, but also they're very smart. But first, let me introduce you to my favorite super bad or my favorite neighbor or my favorite long shot. Or my favorite American pickle, but I'd be the Canadian pickle, and I'm just going off of movie titles here. Because I didn't get my intro.

Hi, everyone. Hi, my name. Jonathan Cohn. My favorite Seth Rogen fan. That's really what he is. Jonathan, Seth's a fellow Canuck. It's true. Not the Vancouver Canucks.

I didn't know him. You don't all know each other in Canada? Especially not the West Side. I don't know that. He's like my side. Seth Rogen is from Vancouver. I actually didn't know that until. We didn't even wave our flag for him.

We should not wave our flag. I do want to briefly mention a little bit about Alzheimer's. It's not called old timers. And I'd like no one to call it old timers. Some people legitimately think that it's its name. That's its name. It's actually senile dementia. And it is a progressive disease.

Jonathan, what's progressive? It gets worse. That's right. It gets worse over time. And it destroys memory. It is what a lot of people know about Alzheimer's. but it also impacts other mental functions. What's the difference between that and dementia?

Well, dementia is a component of Alzheimer's, and as I said, this is senile dementia. Dementia can present when you're 20 for reasons that are not Alzheimer's, and then it's just dementia. Alzheimer's is a particular kind of dementia that comes because of particular plaques and tangles and things in the brain that literally make information. not able to get where it needs to get. And the reason it impacts memory is because there are certain parts of the brain that are impacted differentially. Alzheimer's is one of those things. We really diagnose post-mortem because it's a very specific brain scan.

But generally speaking, the medical world has started to have a pretty clear idea of a set of symptoms and distinguishing them from Alzheimer's versus, let's say, Parkinson's. Parkinson's disease has more motor function challenges, usually a specific. a gate away people walk and a what we call a Parkinsonian mask, a disruption of affect, because it's a different region of the brain. But anyway, I'm just going to include here that if you just cannot get enough brain science, check out the Gary Small episode because we do another deep dive into aging in the brain. Aging in the brain, correct. And the main symptoms of Alzheimer's memory loss, confusion, you know, if you've ever, you know, you see it a lot

on like TV shows, you know, where people like wander out of the house and it's usually older people. You know, they wander out of the house and don't know where they are and don't know how they got there. My grandfather had that. Yeah. He was in Toronto and he kept trying to walk back to Montreal to deal with a work issue. And that's how we knew things started to go. But it was not a job that he currently held. He had retired for 30 years.

Oh, wow. Yeah. So would he get out of the house? Yeah, he would get out of the house. He would get lost. He would then start a, he was like, he was a notary when he was working. And he was like trying to deal with a deal that like, a big deal that was. In his mind he was dealing with.

Well, what I find interesting is like it felt like he had the unresolved issues, emotional issues of his life then sort of resurfaced. And I've always wondered, you know, what is the play between sort of the big emotional stressors in our life that don't get resolved? And do they sort of come back around if we start to have these types of neurological conditions? For him, there definitely was something. He was always looking for his mother. He was always looking for this business partner that had a deal had gone wrong. And he had all these unresolved issues that he was trying to sort out. Oh, and oftentimes with Alzheimer's, some of the cognitive, you know, upset, you know, people will often experience agitation.

And so there's a lot of managing of those symptoms. And people, especially in the earlier stages, will sometimes come in and out of awareness, which is very, very painful. And I know this sounds like a weird thing to say, but there's been a lot of really, really beautiful movies made, you know, by artists and creators who have experienced this or, you know, have chosen to tell these stories. and can be really, really heartbreaking, especially with couples. And as Lauren's going to explain to us, you know, also being a younger woman, you know, her mother was quite young when her symptoms started presenting. Let's welcome Lauren Miller Rogan and Seth Rogen to our breakdown. Break it down.

Welcome Lauren and Seth to our breakdown. We're going to ask the question I've only asked Matthew McConaughey when he came on. Do you guys have any idea who we are? Of course. Oh, I'm kidding. Oh my God. Just check it. Very much.

So to the point that I won't go into detail and make you uncomfortable. Exactly. No, the goal is to make her as uncomfortable as possible. Well, Matthew McConaughey literally said, nope. Nice of him to come from out his book. And that's what he said. That's why his book did so well. He was saying yes to podcasts.

People he didn't even know. Because of our little podcast. It's very nice to get to talk to both of you. Seth, we've crossed. paths in some Jewishy ways because that happens in Los Angeles. I think we've been on a podcast together before. What podcast were we? Were we on Sharon Brouss' podcast?

No, it wasn't a podcast. Oh, that was just a conference? Was that just a thing? Or it was a talk? It was a talk or something like that. It was, I think it was Purim. Was it like? Yeah, yeah.

We did like a crazy Purim Zoom. There was a game. It was a thing. Anyway. That's what it was. It was for like a charity event or something like that. Yes, that's right. Yeah.

It looked like this, though. A screen and some squares. Exactly. And Lauren, I've actually been really intrigued by you, not just because of all the neat professional things you do. And I just directed my first film and wrote it as well. And so just excited that you exist. But also the work that both of you do together is interesting to me,

both as a scientist and kind of to both me and Jonathan, since our focus here is kind of like mental health as like an umbrella, but also more specifically kind of looking at the ripples of what happens in families when things happen. And I think that's been kind of a recurring theme for us, that everyone we speak to either has some trauma with a capital T or a lowercase T or something that happened, you know, in their childhood that was formative. Many of our actors, you know, have this sense of like being separate. We get a lot of, you know, former addicts here, just the full gamut. But I would like to talk to you a little bit about a couple aspects of the work that you do. So your life, Lauren, was touched specifically by Alzheimer's.

Your mother had early onset Alzheimer's. So can you just kind of frame it a little bit for us so we can understand? Yeah. I mean, it actually started before my mom, her parents. My grandfather had Alzheimer's. My grandmother had, you know, dementia that was caused by the doctors, you know, went always back and forth to two Alzheimer's and Parkinson's and just whatever it was because this was the 90s and diagnosis were even harder to come by then than they are now. So,

and so then when I was in my early 20s, my mom, you know, when she started repeating herself, it was like, oh, okay, this is, yeah, this is going to be the reality here. Are we allowed to joke all the time? Because Jonathan's going to be like, Miami repeats herself all the time. A lot. She of Alzheimer's? There's a specific way. You know what I mean? Like, like, um, I always say I've heard this expression that's like, it's very normal to forget where you parked. It's not normal to forget that you drove to the mall in the first place. You know? So like it's human to forget.

Like it's Lisa, actually Lisa Genova who wrote, Still Alice actually wrote a great book that is about the benefits of forgetting. So anyway, sidebar there. But yes, my mom was diagnosed when I was in my early 20s and she was in her early 50s. and by the time she was just about 55, she was diagnosed, and I'll say it in quotes, but, you know, because even back then it was unclear and... Well, and even still, I should say Alzheimer's is one of those diagnoses that typically can be made post-mortem because there's a very specific, a very specific pattern that you see that... So we're basically judging by symptoms when we're looking at people and trying to, like,

fit in what category they go in. Exactly, which is not easy and doesn't make any sort of, you know, makes it impossible essentially for any sort of treatment or prevention, which is, you know, where things were back then. And so, you know, it was really tough. And we were just starting to date, Seth and I. And so it really, truly, like, we had been dating like two or three months and my parents came out to L.A. and met him for the first time. And, like, when I dropped them off at the airport, I came back to his apartment.

and it was the first time I had like said it out loud to anyone that I was like worried and like the first time I like cried about it. And like, you know, and then from there, you know, it just progressively got worse. And by the time she was, you know, just about 60, she couldn't, you know, feed herself or dress for herself or care for herself in any way and really wasn't communicative at all. And, you know, and was, you know, completely different version of herself. And, you know, it really wasn't an unbelievable, just journey for my family and for myself to experience that and to watch my mother go through that at that point in my life. You know, I just wasn't, I thought I was alone and I was just like not prepared as most people in their 20s would be.

And so, you know, we eventually started talking about it. We went to a walk, like an Alzheimer's Association walk. And they were like, what is Seth Runga doing here? And so then we, you know, we were like, people ask that a lot. She doesn't seem charitable. Well, you know, we were young. We were young. And so, anyway, so once we started sharing our story, it was like, oh, we're so not alone.

And unfortunately, there are a lot of young people who are dealing with this with their parents. And so, yes, so we decided to, you know, throw an event. And, you know, then through that event, it was like, oh, what are we going to do with our money? I really want to take action and eventually, you know, founded our own 501c3 and now have like five incredible people who work for HFC and we've raised, I think, close to $17 million and help people and yada, yada, yada, yada. Well, no, and I appreciate, I know that you have to, not have to, but I know that you're in a situation where you have to kind of like describe. My Ambialx breakdown is supported by superpower. We all know the feeling of leaving a doctor's office and kind of feeling like we didn't get anything out of the experience. that was useful. Maybe they're like, you're fine, drink more water. There's no real data. There's no

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off with the code break. Head to superpower.com. Use the code break at checkout for $20 off your membership. And after you sign up, they'll ask how you heard about them. Make sure to mention my ambiolics breakdown to help support the show. Like that a lot. You know, we think so much, like, especially with these kinds of neurodegenerative things. Like, we think a lot about, like, what's the treatment and, like, you know, how do we make them comfortable and, like, how do we this? But, you know, what what you experienced, and I think what hilarity for charity is kind of done is it's expanded the conversation out to say, like, what's the structure behind the person that has the thing, right?

Right. And this is not, I don't want people to think it's like an, you know, an advertisement for Hilarity for Charity, but this is, it could be. But why not? Exactly. No, because it's, it's also, you know, it's kind of this, like, three-prong sort of mission, right? There's this, like, there's the care component because there's things that are actually practically needed, especially for people who don't have resources.

But also, to broaden, like, an understanding of the importance of a support system. around that and and then also like the research that then gets funded because you you raise a tremendous amount of money and that literally is what funds the research that is needed to move along you know and like we talk about cures but it's also a lot about kind of treatment and quality of life and things like that but I did want to sort of ask about in terms of like the the structure of a family when my father of blessed memory was in hospice it was the first time that I was in a situation where I realized, oh, there are people who know more than we do who have more information and more ability to actually help. And it was like crazy that that

was their job to like help us. And of course they were paid, you know, but I think that's something that, you know, that you really highlight. And maybe you can speak to that a little bit. Like, you should not have to tackle this no matter what your socioeconomic background, where you live. Like, you should not have to tackle this kind of thing as a family without education and help. Like, can you speak a little bit to that component? I feel like I'll start with a story, which is early on in my mom's journey through all this. Shortly after her diagnosis, I was visiting her. They were still living in Florida, which is where I grew up.

And I remember I had a conversation with her, which was asking her if she was, I asked her if she was scared. And she says she wasn't scared for herself. She was scared for me and my brother and my dad. And that was because she had taken care of her parents. And she knew what lied ahead for us. And so, you know, our family always had an indication, but of course we didn't really know until we were really in it. And my mom's journey was actually quite different from my grandparents. How much care is needed to take care of someone with this disease.

I mean, my mom was a technically physically, completely healthy 60-year-old woman when she couldn't walk anymore. and care of herself at all. And so that is a level of care, a level of expertise that is beyond, you know, my loving father's, you know, capabilities. And so we had to call in help. And luckily we could, which is not normal. That is, I mean, it is, the cost for care is extreme. I mean, it's cost prohibitive.

Like, that's literally. It's literally like for, you know, for most people, it is ridiculous. And so that's why. you know, when we started raising money, it was like, well, how can we help people? Like, I want to help people today. Like, I'm not going to raise $2 billion a year to fund the research that's going to create the medication that's going to treat Alzheimer's. Like, I mean, sure, I would. If you want to give me the money, I'll figure it out. But like, you know, what we raise is something tangible that could really help people today, which is how we had the idea to create our grant program to award people literal care, like people who have, you know, chosen to have their loved ones at home. And can afford respite, have no break, have no chance to go to the grocery store or go to the doctor or like sometimes literally we've gotten thank you notes because someone went to a funeral because they received one of our care grants. Like, and these are just like basic things that people can't do when they're caring for someone with Alzheimer's. And so, you know, we really wanted to focus on like helping people today as much as we could on one side of it.

And then of course there's, you know, bring help and we can get to that on the other side, which is for tomorrow. you know, what people deal with every day when caring for someone with Alzheimer's is so extreme. And there is, you know, they need so much help and so much guidance. So we really try to focus on that. Well, what am I about to say almost sounds is, well, I think it sounds really trivial because, Lauren, your experience, you're dealing with this firsthand. But Seth, you're in a new relationship with someone who's like having a pretty life-changing experience that has ripple effects on you too.

you're like, oh, I'm a young person. Like, life just gets really real all of a sudden. What was that like for you to have her going through that? I implored her to seek professional help because I very quickly saw I was not capable of providing any valid guidance beyond love and emotional support. But as far as like the tools one needs to deal with like something truly devastating, like I, you know, I'm like a pretty cuddled. Jewish boy from Vancouver, Canada of all places. So you want to talk about secure in their lifestyle, a Canadian. I think also what Jonathan was asking is something that is very specific, I think in particular to early onset to this situation of like, we think, you know,

like as humans that like in our 20s, we're still invincible, right? I mean, and, you know, some of us, it goes on even longer than that. But I think that's something that I experienced. And, you know, my father passed at 73, which, you know, is considered, quote, young. He had multisystem atrophy, which is kind of like ALS, that sort of thing. But I was the first person, like, that I knew that had a parent that was going through something like this neurodegenerative. And I remember that notion of feeling, like, this extra kind of, like, self-consciousness about, like, burdening.

Like, you know, like, I didn't want anyone to catch my grief, right? I want that to catch my, and also when you have, you know, as Lauren, you understand, you know, very, very well, when you have something that's also like progressive, because I was dating someone at that time. It's like, it's like kind of uncomfortable. I'm like, you want to show like, I'm cool with it. But also I'm sort of falling apart. And so I guess that was part of, I think, what Jonathan was getting at also. Like, in our 20s, both for you, Lauren, and also like, as forming a couple, it's like, wow, this is something that I wasn't planning on dealing with. And it does bring up. like when you're thinking about having kids and like all this stuff. Like Lord knows the genetic load I gave my kids. And I was like, do I give this to someone? Just the meanness that is me? So I think that's part of, you know, kind of what Jonathan was asking. And also people from Canada have a whole different perspective about health care because their country is very different.

So I'm also wondering, Seth, like, did you have any experience with this kind of thing, you know, that felt different from the way, let's say you were dealing with it watching Lauren? Yeah, I'd say in general, Canadian, like, Americans have, like, a real, like, skepticism towards, and, and, and, like, mistrust of doctors in a way, they kind of, they kind of, it's like auto mechanics is kind of how they view them kind of is like, yeah, you say I need a new muffler, but do I need a new muffler? Like, you know, I think, Canada, that's, we don't really, that's not really a thing, like, because no one would be incentivized, really. to trick us into getting a new muffler, you know? And so I think it is weird, but I don't think it wasn't that big. I think ultimately, and I think like, you know, in COVID times, nothing proves this more. Like when the shit hits the fan, people go to the doctor, you know, as skeptical as you may be about something.

When you're actually sick, a doctor, you know, you welcome a medical expert. So, yeah, they went to doctors, which was nice. But, yeah, my family was never in denial. No. I don't think. Like, you know. What's that like, Lauren? Tell me about a family that's not in denial.

Not fantastic. It is protective. You know, my dad wasn't like, you know, my brother and I arrived at it sooner, I think, because we weren't with my mom as much. And I always say it's like, you know, when you don't see a baby for like two months, you're like, oh, it's so big. Oh, my God. And that's how it was, you know, I'd see my mom every few months and I'd be like, oh, God,

it's gotten this much worse. Whereas my dad was with her every day. So he didn't really notice it. So there was a little bit like, I think there's something. No, no, no, no, it's fine. I think there's something. No, no, no. I think there's something.

Yeah, there's something. And so luckily, there wasn't that to deal with. Yeah. And Seth's family also, like, his mom and his sister, you know, are social workers. So they're very like, that's so handy. It really so like literally So like literally he's like not joking when he was like I'm not equipped for this you should go see a therapist

Like you know what I mean like to get that suggestion from a 25 year old dude Like is Did he recommend that you call his mother? Right Yeah like you know Never Was and anyway she'll call So you don't have to call her she'll have to call

there's an incoming comment. A lot of people look at things like Alzheimer's, you know, Parkinson's, like you hear these things, you know, kind of like floating about. And many people are generally dismissive of this kind of conversation because of everybody's going to get something. And like, oh, we used to just call it getting old. And it's like, well, people didn't use to live past 50. So a lot of the things that also we're dealing with is because we are living longer. and you know we had what was his, sorry I shouldn't say that. Dr. Gary Smalls.

Well, Gary Small. No, David Sinclair. You know, there are people who are like, we can live forever. Like, we'll fix everything and you'll live forever. But like I'm a little bit more of like a not so much. But what is, even besides the early onset, like what is sort of, I'm not asking this to be a jerk. What is the point of educating people, meaning what can we gain by having this kind of

information so that we're understanding things, let's say. say earlier or better than we used to. Well, I'm so glad you asked. So, you know, when this first started, things felt pretty hopeless and bleak, I would say. Like, you know, I would say I would search the corners of the internet and there was nothing but a lot of sad stories out there. Eventually, however, I found other things other than sad stories like hope and science that was proving to provide some hope and light in the area of brain health. And so I first met Dr. Richard Isaacson, who was formerly at the Wheel Cornell Alzheimer's Prevention Clinic in New York.

And he was the first person that really like, he took a deep dive into my genetics, into my mom's genetics, into my brother's genetics, into my uncle's genetics. And that's because early onset is a very small subset of Alzheimer's and it is special. Actually, I'll say this. Actually, my mom technically did not have early onset. Wow. So she had Alzheimer's that had an onset that was early. Got it. And we don't know exactly why, but there are hypotheses, which is had she perhaps not had a hysterectomy at 47 years old in 1996, given. what she was given at that time. Perhaps she would have still gotten Alzheimer's,

but it would have happened in her late 60s or early 70s. Can we just like do a full stop right there? Wow. We can. We can do. We can absolutely. That's enormously like fascinating, terrifying, and also, gosh, how do you wrap your head around that?

Lots of people are asking why right now. Yeah. Why would that impact? Well, I don't want to get deep up into Lauren's business, but I'm going to make a general, a statement that there are many things that turn on certain genes, and there are many hormones that are acting as messengers in the nervous system. And a lot of things in particular, forgive me, that are done to women and have been done to women for hundreds and hundreds of years

under the guises of good Western medicine have a lot of impact that were often not fully researched. So one of the things that has come under a lot of scrutiny is the administration of hormones, which we start giving girls very, very young in the form of birth control pills, you know, anyway, not to get too political, but that's fascinating also because you want to trust the system and to be, oh my God, what ifs have to be enormous. Yeah, absolutely. And so once, you know, I started learning about that stuff, started seeing that my mom and my uncle were pretty similar genetically, but his Alzheimer's didn't happen until his late 60s. He's since

passed away as well. You really look at those factors and it becomes pretty clear. And so early onset Alzheimer's is sort of reserved for some of the genes like the PSEN1. Right. And they're specific for early onset. Yeah. And that's a very aggressive form that is, I can't speak that scientifically to it. But because that is not what my mom. My mom had two copies of the APOE 4. Gene, which is a, you know, a gene that is an indicator. And so basically, but in learning that and learning my own genetic makeup, you know, I was able to say, okay, so I made up of this, this, this, and that. Smart doctors and people have been able to say, so since you're made up with this, this, this, and that, take this, this, and that. Live a lifestyle that includes

this, this, and that. And your brain health will be, your outlook will be better. And so you know, I have implemented these lifestyle changes over the last, I guess, five years or so at this point. And my overall health has, I mean, changed dramatically. Okay, I have to ask. So this is like our second full stop because, you know, even as a scientist person, like a lot of times you hear like, oh, eat blueberries or like, you know, and my mom's always like sending me these lists and I'm like, you know, whatever. Because I'm very, I'm very like genetically deterministic. I'm like, it's in there. second my mom and dad did the dance, like everything was said. And it's true. We want to also be, we're invincible, right? We want to drink. We want to smoke. We want to like party. We do all the

things that we do. Like, I try all the drugs. I'm not saying I did, but some people do. And we want to believe that. Okay, so Seth, it feels like he covered that. No, but we want to feel like, I just get to like eat fast food when I want and I want to eat pizza and I want to drink beer and I want to like live my life. So I'm going to go ahead and ask, what are these things? Right. I mean, look, I would like to do all those things, but you can't. And so, you know, I think there's a statement that I've heard that I think is really smart, which is something along the lines of your genes may be the roadmap. They don't have to be the destination.

Right. And so, you know, so basically there's lifestyle changes. So, like, the most important one, of course, is sleep. And so, you know, I wear a sleep tracker. HFC has a partnership with whoop. You can get a whoop and it tracks your sleep, it also tracks your exercise. but since tracking my sleep, I have done things to improve my sleep.

I'm super into what she's saying right now. This is so crazy because he's obsessed with sleep just because... Oh, but she gets so annoyed when I send her the screenshot of my... So annoyed. Of your sleep.

Lauren loves her sleep. Oh, I mean, I can't wait to look at my score every morning. Well, the two of you should talk and Seth and I can go have a beer. I love a score. She loves a sleep score. I would be like, oh, I didn't sleep well last night. Here's the data to back it up.

And she'll be like, That doesn't mean anything. You're so obsessed. Okay, wait. It does. So sleep. Sleeping is good. Sleep is the most important thing because when you're sleeping at night, as, you know, these smart doctors would say, is when your brain is taking out the trash.

So like when you're not sleeping, your brain is building up plaques and proteins. And literally when you're sleeping, when you're deep sleeping especially. I can. So wait, wait. So what disrupts sleep, Lauren? Oh, I mean. Well, for me, alcohol. I will wake up.

Every freaking hour. I can have one glass of wine and that's sleep score. Okay, so alcohol, what else is bad for it? Eating late. Eating late. You want to have a consistent bedtime? Oh, shut up, Lauren. I love how she's like upset with you, but we've had like seriously reputable medical experts.

Not that you're not reputable. Tell her the same thing. She will ignore them entirely. She's not done telling me what I'm doing wrong. But you're talking to her and it's landing. It's all landing for her. Consistent bedtime. One of the most important things that I did that first really increased it was I got a pad that cools my bed.

Oh, Jesus. A pad that cools her bed? You can't sleep hot. A cool room is very important. And especially like as a lady, like, and I'm not even that old, but like I'm, you know, I'm already sweating like crazy. But now I don't. Okay. Who's the sweatiest person I know?

I'm the sweaty. person, all of you know. Okay. So sleep. Okay, so that's number one. So sleep one. I would say the second is exercise, which is you have to move your body. You know, you want to, and look, having muscle is legitimately really important. Thank you. Is that realistic for everyone? Maybe not. But literally walking, making sure you're getting, I think it's like at least three days a week of like 60 minutes of like a zone two cardio. So like a good hike, a healthy walk. Like those. things are hugely important, but having muscle on your body really, really helps. And then there's diet, which is so painful because, God, I love food.

You know, sugar. No sugar. Such a bummer. Sugar's the bad thing. I mean, it's such a bad. And sugar's so good. And I still have sugar. I, you know, I try not to have it frequently.

It's, you know, a treat, you know, on occasion, but like sugar's the hard one. But, but, you know, diet is important. It's, it's, I don't know if it's about eating blueberries all the time. that that would be bad for you. I think it's more about a sort of larger approach to, you know, eating cleaner, more mindful, et cetera. I'm taking notes. I'm literally taking notes. Go ahead.

Good. I mean, you can also go to our website. Oh, I will. Okay. So sleep, exercise, eating. Anything else? Those are the big three. Here she comes.

Yeah. And then there's mental fitness. I knew she was going to freaking say that. Which is, you know, like keeping your brain active, like learning a new thing. Okay. you know, a new hobby, language, et cetera, et cetera. Wait, is included in mental, so mental fitness you're speaking specifically about, like,

exercise literally for your brain. Is there anything in here about like mindfulness or like meditation or like spirituality? Sorry, that is the last one. Thank you. Oh, okay. You're welcome. So then there's mental well-being. Okay, got it.

So, yes, exactly. So, you know, whether it's meditation, which of course is excellent for your brain health but also overall health. Yep. You know, and then of course, you know, maintaining a healthy emotional well-being. Stress is really bad for your brain. And, you know, and I, you know, it's hard.

You know, I think like all of us these days are living in a place where we're constantly just like, oh, God. Lauren just, she signed my death warrant is what she just. You sleep too hot. I sleep. I'm going to, here, this is like she gave me the doze and don't. I don't, okay, I did cut out alcohol.

I, I eat too late. I got myself off at 10 p.m. What time do you guys stop eating? They stop eating at 3 p.m. At 8. I could work towards 8. What? He's so mad.

What? Go ahead. We had a conversation not that long ago. She's like, now you don't want to eat dinner past 7 o'clock. I'm just like, I don't want to order dinner at 9. That's not healthy. Which we did for a long time. Yeah.

But it impacts your sleep. Yeah. Okay. I do. I do exercise. You do exercise, yep. I do taekwondo. The eating thing is a habit that is, I would say.

If you can exercise, then eating earlier isn't that hard. Yeah, we do the intermittent fasting thing where we, you know. But okay, here's, not that you have to solve all my problems, but maybe a couple. I'm here for you. Sometimes I work until 8, 30 or 9 at night. And we don't get a dinner break. Like, I get like a couple of vegan chicken fingers, which I'm trying to cut out. I'm vegan.

I'm trying to cut out soy. And like, that's almost always the thing. You'd think I was the star of the show and the executive producer. You wouldn't know it from the food that happens in my life. No, it's hard. On set. On set is hard.

Yes. We have doctors who come and, like, talk to us all the time about how, like, especially people in the film business have a rough. Well, and also, like, you know, this is also a little bit champagne problems, which I know you,

I know your organization does address this, but the fact is, for most of the world, you know, these things are extremely difficult to access without the proper government, like support funding, which is also I know a lot of the advocacy you do. Mental fitness, I think I'm pretty good. I speak languages already. You speak languages. You play music? She signed my death warrant with stress. Well, the stress is out of control. I have different genes that she doesn't have. Yeah, yeah. Stress is a tough one. Stress is a tough one. I mean, you know, I think Seth and I started

the beginning of this year meditating together. We're pretty good at it. We've lost a little bit. We've taken a few breaks, but we were really good. We'll get back into it. It's hard, though. It's hard. It's hard. Like, look, it's hard. It's just hard to be a person out there.

Okay, I'm going to ask something that is like a little bit related to something we were going to see if you like us enough to talk about. And I'm not asking this like in an inflammatory or sensationalistic way. But let's talk about, I think we should talk about pot because I think especially over COVID, A lot more, I mean, I've heard a lot more people drinking, a lot more people using different methods of, you know, THC and potness. This is a great example, at least to me, of something that like, different than alcohol, right? Different than alcohol. And in many ways is extremely relaxing, right? It's like an amazing plant.

But also can contribute to a lot of other challenges to a life if it impedes. let's say, an ability, you know, to function effectively or to eat well. I mean, it's like the munchies is like a real chemical thing, right, that happens. So I'm kind of wondering, not just about pot, but like about things kind of on that spectrum, there's this balance, right, of like the things we want and need to try and make us less stressed, you know, but there's a little bit of a tradeoff. And I feel like you're a couple to ask about that because obviously, you know, Seth, you know, is known as being someone who talks about this a lot. And I'm curious about that.

Well, Lauren can speak to this as well, I would say. But we, yeah, we both smoke a lot of weed. And I mean, I think like anything in life, different people find different ways to navigate it. You know, I think there are some people that it affects their motivation or desire or ability to do things. Do I know a lot of lazy people who do nothing but don't smoke weed? Yes. So I would not necessarily. Would those people be lazy without weed? Maybe. It's not a, it's not a scientific study I've seen done necessarily, you know. We could do it. We're happy to be your subject. Yeah, please, let's do it. I think that, yeah, I think as far as like munchies and things like that go, like I think it is habitual. Like you can easily work, knock it out of your system. It's like me and my writing partner have been talking about a lot as well is like we just kind of don't do that anymore. We don't. Like I think.

You know, I think that for us, weed is something that is, is so consistent that it's not like we're like, let's get really baked and then eat a bunch of chicken wings. Like, right. That's not, we're not doing that. And so, you know, the diet of it all, I would say for us is not, you know, affected, you know, with weed. But, you know, scientifically we have talked to doctors about this.

No doctor is going to be like, smoke weed. Sure. Yeah. But no one's strongly said. Jonathan could find us a couple doctors. tell you. Well, I mean the brain. Yeah, yeah. But they will say that it's better than alcohol. Those things better than alcohol and that it's potentially as anti-inflammatory effects and

that it for sure relaxes people and takes stress away. Right. I'd say, again, yeah, no one is, no one's saying that the negative effects way outweigh the positive ones for us personally. Right. And I think a lot of people would probably fall into that category as well. But I'd say It is like anything, like, you know, some people, you know, wear glasses and some people don't. So I think like not everyone needs the same things to get through the day, you know? And so, yeah, I think. But it is encouraging. I think there is a way for almost everyone to incorporate some sort of weed derivative into their life, be it CBD or something to help them sleep or relax at the end of the day.

that have no psychoactive effects. I mean, I think that there's a lot of very positive effects and offerings that weed has. So it's nice that you'd be great if it was federally legal in America. Well, yes, and I'm actually curious. Anything that you can share, I don't mean anecdotally, although if you'd like to, you can, about weed and sleep. Because also you bring up sleep, and that is one of the places that a lot of people do, you know, essentially instead of popping,

and I don't know, I don't take sleep drugs, so I don't know, an ambient or whatever. This is something that more people, you know, are... It's much better than those things. But if you're not... You don't get quality sleep. When you've Taylor, our doctor was like, if you've taken an ambient,

it's equivalent to someone like punching you in the face. It's like, go night night, right. It's like you would never conflate an unconscious person and an asleep person necessarily. They must be having a really good rest. Yeah, I think that's what sleep drugs offer is they essentially knock you unconscious. No, but Wheed doesn't do that. And so I think weed is probably a great thing for a lot of people who are having trouble sleeping,

especially an incredibly healthier alternative to things like Ambien and pharmaceuticals. And the other thing, and this is, again, just kind of like something anecdotal that I'm talking about. No one needs to know why. I am bringing this up. But a lot of people who have trouble sleeping because specifically of trauma, of night terrors find, you know, a very different kind of sleep. So I'm also one, like part of me, like, again, as the scientist brain starts working, I'm like, part of me is like, well, they're getting rest.

They're not being woken up, right, by terrible. But then the other part of me is like, but there's some processing that's also being kind of bypassed, you know, that I also hope. It changes the REM sleep that. that we get. In some ways, I'm curious if, I haven't spoken to experts

about this specifically, but I've seen. Those study whoop needs to do. Yeah, no, it is interesting because I've had doctors, you know, part of one of like,

you know, the neurological workups is like, how are your dreams? But like, and I have crazy dreams. But I've always had crazy dreams. I've always been, you know, the kid who was like,

let me tell you about my crazy dream. Right. And like, you know, and, you know, remembers them and, yeah, that's actually what's more interesting because everyone has,

dreams. Everyone has crazy dreams. The interesting thing is not necessarily that you it's that you remember. That's the part of your brain that I'm most interested about. But also anecdotally, there's a lot of people who smoke weed a lot who don't remember their dreams or claim to sort of not dream. And it's usually when they try to taper off that their dreams become sort of like wildly active. So it's interesting that you've always had really active dreams. Yeah. I don't think it changed it at all. No. And I've never had very active dreams and continue to not have very much. I'm always like, how do you not know your dreams?

What happens to you at night? Where do you go? Nothing. I was looking at Seth, your funny Twitter, like tragically funny, Twitter feud where you did mention Tourette's syndrome. Is this something you talk about, it being in your family?

I talk a little bit. Like, just like that. It doesn't come up a lot. Yeah, I wrote a book. Well, you've never been spoken to by a neuroscientist who has a podcast. Yeah, there you wrote a book that, where I talk about it a little bit,

mostly in regards to my dad, who it's much more noticeable in him. And I have two half-brothers. And I don't know. Actually, I feel like maybe they have some lingering feelings of it as well, you know. And so, yeah, it's, but yeah, it was worse when I was younger. And I'm sure it. Did you have vocal stuff or motor stuff?

No, never. It was more like twitchy. Got it. facial. I would twitch in different ways. Yes. Yeah. Sorry. Lauren, can you demonstrate again? Got it.

That just looks like contemplative. It's just consternated. If they haven't seen the trailer for the 2022 trailer for your institution, charity, I don't know exactly what to call? The charity. Organization is the word I'm looking for? These Canadians. I don't know what word to you. You throw amazing events and, you know, the use of, I saw my grandfather go through Alzheimer's and I was only 12 at the time and it was not a pretty situation.

But yeah, you have to use humor. And so just so appreciative of that. You should tell people where to find that trailer. Yeah, do you want to give us kind of like the website and all those good things? Or website where you can find all sorts of information is we are hFC.org. that links to a site where we actually have recently created educational coursework for high school students and college students to learn about brain health. And that's called HFC universe. And then, of course, on all the social media stuff, I think it's we are HFC.

Yeah, we are HFC. We are HFC. HALERITY is our events and HFC is our organization. Look at that. Some corporate structure for God's sakes. Finally. Are you presenting the org structure next with the reporting lines? PowerPoint, please.

We really appreciate you coming and talking to us. And Lauren, I especially appreciate how much light you're shedding on, again, kind of like the family structure surrounding these things. Because I think, again, a lot of people think of these things as isolated or when I think of, you know, my father was bipolar. And, you know, I think a lot about, like, his experience. And while that was part of the story, the rest of the story was everybody else, you know, and all the things that go. into that. So it's obviously a very important topic, but also a really important aspect of it to touch on

that I think people will relate to for a lot of different things. I really appreciate you adjusting our dinner dinner time. Well, we're glad to help in always. Exactly. Early bird gets the worm. Thank you. Thank you both so much. Really nice to talk to you. It's easier to get a reservation at 5'000.

Are you Googling cooling pads for my bed? No. Freaking Lauren Rogel. making me go to sleep early. I just think it's hilarious that, I wish I could have captured your reaction when I told you like the exact same things.

You don't need to capture it. I'm happy to recount it right now. Let's do a little reenactment. Maim, you know, a consistent bedtime. Oh, shut up, Jonathan. No, I don't say that. You know, winding down for bed. Winding down for bed.

Not being on your screen as you. fall asleep. Who's going to answer these emails, Jonathan? At 12 o'clock at night. I don't email at all the way. I wonder when they go to sleep. Don't you wonder if they like wind down for bed? Right now, I think right after this. If you can't eat, there's no point in being awake. Once the eating stops, it's right to bed. Pretty much. That's the only thing that stops me from wanting to eat is going to sleep. It's like last bite of cake, brush your teeth, fall asleep while answering your last email. I'd say eat it in bed, but she'd do. tell me I can't do that either.

How are you going to brush your teeth? I don't need to brush my teeth. She didn't say it's, I got to do it to prevent Alzheimer. She did not say brush your teeth. Mouth health is actually very tied to your brain. You don't want that plaque. You got to get rid of the plaque. It's your heart, not your brain.

That's what I threaten my children with. You're going to have a heart attack. I don't say you're getting... Sorry, that may be your parenting technique. Hey, Fred, as a 13-year-old, you're going to have a massive coronary if you don't Pressure teeth. So intense, though. Like, also just to think of what, you know, she was dealing with.

And I understand, you know, there's a clinical difference between early, early onset Alzheimer's and Alzheimer's that presents early and all the complexities there. But, you know, I'm 46. Like, 50's right around the corner. You want to go for a walk? No. No, but it's just, you know, we're mortals. The larger takeaway here is that there is a playbook for general health. We have owners manuals for this thing that we carry around that we live in.

And most of us are absolutely clueless. And under the delusion that we can do whatever we want. And there's a medical system that we can take a pill to fix us. And the reality is that we are very complex creatures that the things that we do, like sleeping in a too hot room and like tossing and turning, people are like, oh, that's just sort of normal. Here's, okay, I remember the first time you told me that your feet were hot. I was like, your feet are what? You're like, my feet are hot.

Okay, one second, one second. Tell them about the time. I have a point, and I'd like to, go ahead. Tell them about the time you wore your shoes on the wrong feet. And the reason I bring that up is because you criticized me for being aware that my feet were hot. And yet I did ever say to you, wow, what type of lack of physical awareness. This might be a two-parter episode. You know why?

Maslow, you're bringing up... That's right, I am pulling up Maslow! Maslow's hierarchy of needs. The reason I bring up Maslow's hierarchy of needs is that the most basic thing that is kind of our first order is the physiological needs we have. So these are breathing,

food, water, shelter, clothing sleep. Okay, so that's your basics. Yes, and if you have food... Oh, I'm sorry, are you, Dr. Maslow? Shouldn't you know that consuming it late can have an impact on you? I'll get there. It's higher up on the hierarchy of needs because if you think of those physiological needs,

next is safety and security. That's employment, property, family. The next level up is love and belonging. That's right, folks. Yes, love is love and love conquers all, but also it is not the most basic need that we have. Next up is self-esteem, confidence, being a unique person, which I say like that. the highest part is self-actualization, which is things like creativity, acceptance, you know, out here, experience, purpose, like what even is that? Meaning and inner potential.

And a lot of things that, forgive me, wealthy, Western white people talk about do tend to hang in this top part of the pyramid that I would consider. It's not that it's not important, but here's the story. The things that I'm talking about are... I still haven't made my point. How many minutes can we go without me actually making my point? The things that we're talking about, a lot of them are in the bottom, too. No, Jonathan.

When I was a child, Jonathan, when I was a child, did I know what kind of bed I had? Did I get to choose what kind of bed I had? I'm not done. I'm not done telling you my sad story. Did I know what kind of mattress was most comfortable? Did I know to even think about, are my sheets soft? No. That's not what we're talking about, though.

But you could have had the same dinner that you had that night, any night that you had a dinner that you were growing up, you could have had it an hour earlier. Okay, Jonathan, we're not talking about many people are raised in an environment where. Yes, I'm in agreement with you. And you're also right that the notion of. of being aware, like it makes me sad. The notion of being aware that your feet can be hot is, and you are, you are a person very in touch with your body and you have trained to be that, like you've worked very hard at that.

It's something that you have cultivated. But for many people, that awareness, there is no time or space for that awareness. So this is not to undermine at all. If anything, it's to highlight the work that Lauren and Seth are doing in. In that, everyone deserves to know what are the basics of our health. Yes, absolutely. How we optimize that is very different. And I'm just saying we do need to be careful with the conversation around that.

I agree. There's many things powerful about also people like Lauren, you know, who take this kind of experience and truly transform it into a way to help people have access to things that she, acknowledges she was very lucky, you know, to have. I couldn't help but think about, you know, even when my father was in hospice, like, what do people do who don't have hospice? You know, and my parents, I grew up in Kaiser, you know, Kaiser health care. I don't know if that exists every, everywhere. But my dad was a public school teacher and our insurance was Kaiser, you know, and it was kind of an institutionalized corporate, you know, system. But hospice, you know, was one of the things that was, you know, but we, it wasn't enough. I mean,

we ended up paying out of pocket for someone to, I mean, my mother couldn't pick him off the floor every time he fell. So, like, what do people do? You know, like, they do the best they can. Well, this is with all medical conditions. Yes, absolutely. You know, my brother had his accident. We were in Canada.

We had a lot of support through the Canadian system. And even that, we had to go well outside of that in order to get him help and support. Because, and my mother stopped working and changed her entire career to be a, to care for him. And, I mean, people are. we don't have a system of support to help families through caring for people who are going through that. Well, and I think especially, there's something I forgot to ask them, but I'm sure they don't want to get back on the phone with us. But one of the things is that also like the way that we treat old age, you know, in Western, really in Western society. I mean, I don't want to say like exclusively, but for sure in this society, I shouldn't say Western society, in this society.

and it could be North America. You know, it's very much like put them in a put them over there. You know, it's like you're going to, and I think growing up in L.A., it was very much like, you don't want to get the disease of old. You don't want to get the disease of wrinkle. Yeah. You don't want to get the disease of gray, of stretch mark. You know, so many of us don't, but if you come from a traditional family or you come from a family where it is culturally,

or religiously, you know, even part of the structure to take care of elderly people, you also get all of that wisdom. I mean, you know, a lot of the studies about kind of reports of happiness and people living well into their 80s, 90s, as thriving people. There's a great documentary, happy.

It shows that where older people are listened to, where older people are heard, where they are given value, exactly, there is a role for them. Anyway, so that's all of the people. also part of this conversation when you talk about things like Alzheimer's and even early onset, which like, you know, 50s and and, you know, beyond as it were. But there's a real fear. There's a real fear of aging in our society. And it really is, I mean, not to bring all of us down, it is a fear of death and dying, you know, and in cultures or religious traditions that don't see, you know, death is the end, right? Death is not the end is what some people say. There's less of a fear of being, close to that, you know, and witnessing that. And indigenous people honored this for all of human history until, you know, the invasion, as it were. My positive take on this, my sort of summary here, and this goes with many experts that we've spoken to, is that no matter what situation you're in,

there are very minor things. It can be taking another deep breath a day to having a few minutes to just clear your head and walk around your block, if it's safe to do so, that can impact your stress level, reduce your stress level, and just... And help you sleep also. Help you sleep. Get off your phone a tiny bit earlier. Change if you can the temperature of the room that you're sleeping in or lighten your blanket or have a consistent bedtime if it's possible and your work allows it.

I think there are a lot of very small things that people can do. And we have some impact on... how we age and what our physical experience is. And we need to know this. And that's the type of information that I think needs to be democratized and that there are so many people out there still that don't understand that they can do small things

that will change their health. Not to embarrass my mother. I mean, she's not here, but she can still be embarrassed in the universe. You know, my mom grew up in a very specific situation. She grew up in a tenement house. and, you know, it was possibly a little bit of a glorified tenement house by standards. But, you know, she grew up, she grew up in poverty.

You know, I think a lot about the stories that she has told me about places that she would try and find peace because there really was none. You know, she never had a room of her own. She didn't really have a space of her own. Her grandfather who had tuberculosis, like active tuberculosis, lived in the apartment with them. So he kind of like took up, you know, the other space and they tried to sort of isolate him, you know, so that they wouldn't all be sick all the time. But, you know, there were certain things that she would talk about, you know, that like the library, you know, was a place for her. Because, like, it was, it was an open public space, you know, where she could dream. Dream and be.

And she said she would take like a shoebox or an empty box and, like, put little things like just to create. peace, like just like a concept. And, you know, the fact is, you know, when you close your eyes, that's what your imagination and your, so that's why like also having organizations that foster that, you know, for young people, especially in challenging situations is so important because it increases the ability to have access to these higher levels, you know, of needs. Anyway, I didn't mean to like make such a tangent, but, you know, Lauren and Seth, they bring up a lot of things that then, you know, stimulate other ideas about how it's true,

how we treat families and how we, you know, how we care for people. If you want to tell us how you care for people, you can do so at Bialik Breakdown on Instagram. Send us a message. If you haven't already followed the show, subscribe anywhere you get podcasts and check out the YouTube channel.

Click the little bell notification for new episodes. I'm very, very grateful that they spoke to us. And yeah, that's it. From our breakdown to the one we hope you never have. We'll see you next time. It's my Bealick's Breakdown. She's going to break it down for you. She's got a neuroscience PhD or two.

One fiction. And now she's going to break down. It's a breakdown. She's going to break it down.