Mayim Bialik's Breakdown - Timber Hawkeye: Work Less & Live More, Non-Violent Communication & Engraved Clocks

Episode Date: August 10, 2021

Timber Hawkeye (best-selling author of Buddhist Boot Camp and Faithfully Religionless) details his life’s journey after having an enlightened experience. He explains why he left his solid corporate job and comfortable life to strip himself of all possessions, moved to Hawaii where he survived on just $7k per year, studied psychology and world religion, and built a world of being of service to others. Timber discusses how he was able to achieve freedom through simplifying his life and valuing time rather than following society’s recipe for happiness. Mayim and Timber examine the cognitive dissonance that stems from the vicious loop of internal conflict, the importance of aligning our actions with our values, using nonviolent communication to identify unmet needs, and ways we may identify as victims.   Mayim breaks down how the brain physically changes after having an enlightened moment and the isolation that comes with setting high standards for others.  Timber's Website: BuddhistBootCamp.com Timber's Buddhist Boot podcast: https://www.buddhistbootcamp.com/podcast BialikBreakdown.com YouTube.com/mayimbialik Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

My uncle used to say, I don't want a lot of money. I just want $1 more than I've got. Essentially creating this endless loop of never having enough. And I think that is not just a panda. That's the biggest endemic, is not enoughness. If we don't define what enough is, we will never have it. It's my ambialics breakdown. She's going to break it down for you.

Because you know she knows a thing or two. And now she's going to break down. Hi, I'm I'm Biolic and welcome to my breakdown. This is the place where we break things down. So you don't have to. Today we're going to break down Jonathan's self-awareness. You can't even get through the intro without falling off your chair. I can't.

I just came in before my introduction. This episode is going off the rails. We are going to be breaking down new neural pathways from a life of mindfulness with a man named timber. Hawkeye. And we completely get into how he got the name Timber Hawkeye. I don't want to say it was my favorite episode. It's not even this my favorite episode. This is like my favorite experience that I've had. Our episodes are like children. You can't pick a favorite. He's my favorite. Also, I'm still expecting my introduction.

You're wondering who the self-aware man to my right is. That would be Canadian cutie Jonathan Cohen. And I'm, you're my little Buddha and slice of in love. I'm certain that's true. Jonathan, why are we both wearing charcoal gray today? Because timber doesn't wear any other colors than this, and we wanted a match. Which I respect. I wore a uniform at some point in my educational career, and I thought I was going to hate it. And it turned out that I loved it. What are you talking about?

You mean when you went to private school? Yeah, I had to wear a uniform. Did you dress like a mountie? Yes, that's what private school is in Canada. It's just horses and mounties. Moose? Your mom sent me a picture of a moose, by the way. I don't know what's up with that. But I had to wear like a little white polo shirt and blue pants. And it was phenomenal. And I didn't have to-

Turning everyone on right now who likes uniforms. Did you wear knee socks? That's a different type of uniform. Okay, wait. Hold on a second. Tell us the, a white. White polo. Long-sleeve shirt? Oh, like not buttons all the way. No. Like a polo shirt.

Oh, no. You could wear. There was two choices. One was like just the little buttons, like go just down. the little buttons. Then the actual dress shirt. Okay. And then what on the bottom? There were like blue navy, like dark navy blue pants that were like, not suit pants, but like kind of dress pants.

And then they also had short versions of that for the summer. Did the shorts come up for the summer? Did the shorts come above your little bony knees or below? I don't remember that. That was a long time ago. Okay. What shoes did you wear? You have to wear black shoes.

Dress shoes? Actually, I don't think so. I think you could wear sneakers. Like black and white sneakers? No, there had to be all black sneakers. Could you wear like black on black bands? They didn't have those. The purpose of this story is to say that it was actually quite freeing and what I thought

I was going to hate the structure of it. I actually really liked it. And it was maybe, I don't know how many years ago there was a period of time where I got rid of all the clothes in my closet and I pared down slightly more than timber did. He said he has like five shirts and two pairs of the same colors. But I had like, you know, I had black or white t-shirts. and then a series of like, you know, five different pair pants. So you're probably wondering why we're talking about someone who has such a small wardrobe.

Timber Hawkeye is a bestselling author of a book called Buddhist Boot Camp, which actually was a collection of letters and emails that he wrote to a group of friends when he left his corporate job and moved to Hawaii to begin a path of enlightenment that led him back to the mainland. and he also wrote a book called Faithfully Religionless. He studied at the Tasahara Zen Center in San Francisco, among other places, and he studied with a llama. He has a podcast.

He offers a secular non-sectarian approach to being at peace with the world, both within and around us, with the intention to awaken, enlighten, enrich, and inspire. And if that just sounds like, what? He's this awesome dude who left the trappings of, money and wealth and consumption and he's the real deal. He lives in an RV. One of the things he talks about is the difference, and he's going to explain this, between feelings and emotions. And I was like, what? This is a person who has, who dedicated his life to studying psychology, philosophy, religion and doesn't ascribe to any particular religion or, you know, he's very pleasant.

He's funny. Filled with little nuggets of wisdom that expand in your mouth over time. You know, there are certain people I've met in my life and you get a sense that they are enlightened. He's very humble, which feels appropriate. He was born Jewish, ordained Buddhist. He uses a Hindu mantra. His morning meditation is a Catholic prayer.

I mean, he's a really good time. Really, really incredible. I don't really have anything else to say. I'd like to talk to him. Break it down. Do we address you as Timber? Yeah. Okay.

I just didn't know. Do I address you as mine? Yes, but I'm just a little different. I don't know. Welcome, Timber. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having this incredible platform to discuss mental health in such a colloquial way. Such a gift.

We are different kinds of gifts, but mostly we've had a really beautiful time talking to people on different kinds of journeys. And you obviously have a very, very special journey. There's many ways that your story kind of starts. And I think what's so fascinating is you have this story that kind of keeps starting again and again, you know, meaning, you know, your first start, obviously. We all were born somewhere and raised somewhere. And then you moved to America and to the Bay Area. in particular, which is its own incarnation of amazingness and its own journey. And you've kind of had a series of other starts in your life.

And, you know, I think my favorite one is the one where you decide to just have a backpack and go to Hawaii. That was a good one, yes. That's a good one. But, you know, it's one that we hear kind of similar incarnations of. When you hear people's journeys, like I went to grad school with Sam Harris, for example. And, you know, we had Sam on. And Sam has this kind of, you know, transformative and kind of revelatory experience. And, you know, he went to the Far East and things like that. But the question for me and also as a person, you know, rooted in some very, you know, monotheistic biblical concepts is like it's not so much what happens on the top of the mountain. It's what happens after, you know, after that revelation.

Yeah, there's a book by Jack Hornfield called After the Ecstasy, the Laundry. Correct. Correct. And also this notion of, you know, we. We don't live in a time when we're used to thinking of people having these kind of enlightened experiences in ways that are not sort of very out of the ordinary or like something that like your mom talks about, you know, with her friends. Oh, did you hear about the guy who? But what I'm interested in sort of what your life's journey seems to have been is sort of what happens after that experience?

You know, what do you bring down from the mountain? What was the mental state that kind of makes you? want to say drop everything because in a way you you picked up everything you know so i'll let i'll let you talk and then in like 40 minutes stop talking and we'll say goodbye yeah the the interesting part i love that you want to focus on what happens after um but you said you know after after enlightenment so to speak and and i really like one of my teachers said there are no enlightened beings there's only inlined activity and so i got to question what is enlightened activity and i believe it's when what The Gandhi said that happiness is when what you think, what you say,

and what you do are all in alignment, all in harmony. So inline activity, I believe, is when you are congruent, where you're not creating any internal conflict, that thereby creates this vicious loop of, you know, not being happy with yourself, not being able to sleep at night, whether we're talking about, you know, believing or saying one thing and doing another or cognitive dissonance, where you're just making excuses for your behavior or whatever.

is, I believe that I just looked at it logically. I was not drawn to Buddhism or monastic living or anything of the sort by how holy or otherworldly it was. I simply made a very logical decision to not contribute to my own suffering. You know, all of Buddhism can really be summed down into pain is inevitable, suffering is optional. And so when I heard that, I thought, optional. Like, you mean we choose to suffer? And it turns out we do unconsciously or habitually. And so I took a pause, a timeout, going, why am I choosing what I'm choosing? And it turned to this really interesting journey to not drop everything.

Like, you know, I was working in the corporate world. I was making good money. I had the condo, the sports car, the designer clothes, the furniture, the whole thing. And I realized I'm on this conveyor belt that everybody else is on. and I know where it's going. And it's pitched to us as the path to happiness. But I haven't seen anyone who, you know, anyone I know who's happy has jumped off the conveyor belt and done something different.

Wait, okay. So just to kind of like backtrack, I'm just going to ask it. Like, were you depressed? Were you, no, you weren't depressed. No, there was none of that. I realized that if I stayed on that treadmill, then that's where it would lead. It would lead to depression. It would lead to needing to mask my pain, my suffering with drug, sex, alcohol, all of that,

which my 20s were filled with. And I thought, what if I stop, as you call it, the God-shaped hole, stop trying to fill it with all these things and just take a closer look at it and go, what is, what do I really value and I value time? And so the first big step, like you said, I had many beginnings. The first one was I moved from the Bay Area to Seattle and I took a 50% pay cut. And that's when I first realized how happy I am has nothing to do with how much money I'm making. You got to slow down a little bit. So you take a 50% baker.

Now, that to a lot of people, like, that sounds terrifying. You said, let's scale back, scale down. No. So it was more of, for so many years, I followed, like I said, the recipe and I bought, you know, the stuff. and thereby getting into debt, just like everybody else. And then one day I was just so committed to getting out of debt. And one day I was writing my last check to the credit card company. And I thought to myself, well, gosh, I'm not going to send, you know, this credit card company,

$1,000 next month like I do every month. What am I going to do with that extra 1,000? And instead of starting to think of, oh, well, I can start a family or can buy a fancier car or a bigger place, I thought, well, I don't have to make that extra money. That was the shift. That was the, I can just work less and live more. That's what started kind of everything. And instead of thinking, how much money can I make is like,

how little money do I really need to make? And it turns out, moving to Hawaii and living there for 10 years, making $7,000 a year and living my best life ever, I was like, I guess that's the magic number for me. And anything above that, I can just donate and give away because that's all I need. My Miam B' Alex breakdown is supported by Superpower. We all know the feeling of leaving a doctor's office and kind of feeling like we didn't get anything out of the experience that was useful. Maybe they're like, you're fine, drink more water.

There's no real data. There's no game plan. This has happened to me many, many times, especially on the perimenopause journey. That's why we're fascinated by what superpower is doing. They send a licensed professional to your home or you can visit a nearby lab. One simple blood draw with over 100 biomarkers. way more than you usually get. It unlocks a true understanding of your body. Their app has detailed information on heart, liver, thyroid hormones, metabolism, vitamin and mineral levels, even

environmental toxins. From disease prevention to treating that annoying brain fog or simply optimizing your gym game, superpower is the most comprehensive and advanced system out there. I've been super tired of constantly guessing or just trying to read articles online about what to do for health. Superpower gives you an actionable health plan based on personal results. It's a real game changer. Plus, they have an on-demand clinician team to answer questions. Supplement or prescription suggestions can be directly bought through Superpower, so you don't have to go anywhere else. They also have nutritional guidance, tips for lifestyle and behavioral adjustments.

You even get your true biological age that you can track over time. Superpower used to cost $499. Right now, it's $199 for the full experience, which is much more affordable than anything else out there. Make this the year you stop guessing about your health with Superpower. Superpower. Not only did Superpower reduce their price to just $100,000. But for a limited time, our listeners get an additional $20 off with the code break.

Head to superpower.com. Use the code break at checkout for $20 off your membership. And after you sign up, they'll ask how you heard about them. Make sure to mention my and Bial, let's breakdown to help support the show. Pairing everything down and simplifying to the very base of like, what do I need to survive, can be wildly freeing. And I actually think that's an exercise that most people don't ever do. And if you do it, there's an enormous amount of freedom.

a minute because it's like you just get rid of everything. All our preconceived ideas of the way that most people spend money are keeping them trapped and therefore they feel this endless pressure to keep up with it. Exactly. And it's not about surviving. It's about thriving. It's not what do I need to survive? Like how can I thrive? And it's like, well, I can't thrive with a mortgage over my head and having to pay for the sports car. And then with the sports car, I have to pay for insurance. And with insurance, I have to pay for the parking space. And with the parking space, it's like by making one decision, I made so many other decisions for me. And even though one of them may quote unquote contribute to my overall joy, all everything it comes with, the baggage it comes with

is just weighing me down. Does that make sense? So I think people will get to that thriving, but as a starting point, when you're early in the process, why I say, what do I need to survive? Because it's like, I don't need a sports car to survive. Well, that's an enlightened approach, Jonathan. Let's just pause and acknowledge that because many people think, like I, I, I, I, I can't exist without this, whatever this may be. And that's why I say literally what do you need to exist because, yes, you'll get freedom on the other side of it, but as a starting point, as an exercise,

it's literally like, okay, I don't need to go out to dinner all these times. What if I, like, okay, because that sets your bar, and that's how you get to the lowest possible threshold of what it is to actually need to keep yourself fed and clothed and have a roof over your head. Hold on. That is all true. I think that where a lot of confusion can come in, and I'm not speaking about you, but I know for me,

because I do tend towards a more, I tend towards a deprivation philosophy. And some of that I do believe is genetic. Some of it I believe is epigenetic. Some of it is cultural. And, you know, I come from a people and an economy and a mindset of, like, like, I need to go without because there's not enough to go around. That's still a mindset of scarcity. What I'm suggesting is not a sacrifice.

It's an upgrade. So that's what I was saying. So I'm saying that I think some of what Jonathan's talking about. The pairing down and all of that, yeah. Exactly. Can feel like I don't deserve it. You know, I don't need it. And I think what you're talking about is really a, right, right, it's a radical shift in that concept.

So when Jonathan, when we were talking about eating disorders and the notion of restricting, like, how long can I go without eating? That's very different than like, I live in an ashram and it's really awesome and I only eat brown rice. Like, that's very, very different. Which is why I never tell people that the goal is to end up living in a monastery. In fact, once you live there, they tell you the goal is not for you to make this your home. It's to pick up what you need to learn and take it out into the quote unquote real world. So it's not about deprivation or scarcity. It's truly, it's not, oh, I don't deserve money.

It's I deserve free time. You know, I value time more than money. So I have more time more than money. What I talk about the baseline, it's not for deprivation. It's just so that you know a threshold and then you can build up from there. So like when I spent time living communally, like I didn't imagine that as a grown man that I would be sharing a bathroom with that many. people and like that hadn't occurred to me as something that, you know, was a possibility. Yeah, it's, it's really about making our own choices and paying our own prices. And yeah,

you can have your own bathroom. The question is, are you willing to work 80 hours a week to have that? And if you go, no, okay, well, then what's got to give? Okay, I want my own bathroom, but I don't need a five bedroom house. Okay, great. I'm going to say what Timber's not allowed to say. Most people are spoiled. And most people are lazy. And I'm not, I'm not putting my myself outside of that. But what I can tell you, and I will say, and this is not just because you were born in Israel, where I have spent a good amount of time, one of my most favorite experiences with living a simpler life was on kibbutz. My family lives on a secular kibbutz, and the summers and the time that I spent working harder physically than I've ever worked

in my life with the least amount of stress. besides taking care of the cows that were my responsibility, and my needs and the needs of those around me, those were some of the most pleasant experiences I've had. And that notion of also, and I am a person who believes in labor. You know, I really do. Like, I believe in a way of getting in touch with your body, your strength, and your limits.

To me, psychologically, it's very, very rewarding. And I don't want to say that, you know, people who live on kibbutz live a simple life. Because that's not necessarily true. but the choices that people make, the choices that people make, and yes, the choices that people do make in a socialist democratic, you know, structure are also very different than the choices that are even available in a capitalist structure. So, and so I'm not suggesting we, you know, throw away capitalism. It's, it's really about following the ripple effect as far as not asking how much does this cost, but what does this cause? And what I mean by that is tying. this back into what I said earlier, that our thoughts, our words, and our actions have to all be in alignment. And so we can't say, oh, you know, we want to live in the world with less violence

and then go drop $15 to watch a movie with a lot of violence in it because we are thereby contributing to more filmmakers, making more movies about violence. And then we're creating this internal struggle within us. We say one thing, but we do another and we don't see the connection. You know, and as someone who is committed, who here's a perfect, example. We expect companies, you know, they have their websites with what that says, here are our core values, here is our mission statement, here is our vision statement, and we hold them accountable. We say live in line with your values. We don't get upset with Walmart for not being altruistic, for example, because they never claimed to be. But if a company that does claim to

be altruistic, does something that perhaps isn't, you know, then we call them out on it. We go, hey, nothing wrong with you doing what you did if you didn't claim that. But if you this and you do that, then there's a problem. But why don't we as individuals, you know, if there was a myem.com, you know, what would your core values be? What would your mission statement be? And would you be living in line with every single one of those things? Those conversations do exist in my life. And they mainly exist with Shep. You know who Shep is. And Shep is a person who was my mentor and he's kind of a spiritual guide. And he happens to be an entertainment lawyer and a musician. but he wasn't my entertainment lawyer when we started becoming kind of when he became my mentor.

And these are conversations that we actually do have. And we do. We have a lot of, I think, very interesting and valuable conversations about, you know, what are the standards that we hold to and we compare every opportunity, every work opportunity. We do. We compare it to that. However, Timber. Uh-oh.

No, like, what happens for me, this became about my experience, is I'm accused all the of being judgmental and not open-minded and rigid and cerebral and too emotional because I often hold people to extremely high standards because I hold myself to extremely high standards. No, I do the exact same thing, Mime. I've never heard anyone actually relate to my experience as much as you just summarized. I mean, that's exactly it. I hold myself up to my standards and I would love to see other people hold themselves up to their standards, not mine. They don't have to live in line with my values, just their own.

For me, it is a cause of a lot of isolation, you know, like psychologically, if not kind of literally and figuratively. 100%. Yes. It's very, very true that it is very isolating because you do, you know, you put the bar elsewhere than most, and that leaves you out and leaves other people out. Like when I'm interviewed by like People magazine or like Us Magazine and they're like, what's the thing that makes you the most crazy? And like, I'm supposed to. to say like when my, you know, like, when my yoga pants lose their elasticity. And instead I'm like, injustice. Injustice and dishonesty make me very uncomfortable. And it's like, and hypocrisy. So I think we're on the same page, 100%. With all due respect to People magazine.

This is why they don't have you on. This is why they don't have you on. Because you trash them on your podcast. I don't trash them. This is the thing. I'm not trashing them. I'm saying that like, And I think for me living in Hollywood is a very big challenge because I don't feel aligned with a lot of my industry. But we can't change the industry. We can bring integrity to it. And I think that's actually my. I'd like to say that is what you do. And I think you do it beautifully.

And the idea is not to create a bubble where nobody pushes our buttons, but to get to a place where we don't have any buttons that can be pushed. That's so hard for me. You know, mindfulness doesn't make people. less irritating. It makes us less irritable. Let's pause there for a second. No, let's say that again. I want to say it again. Okay. Say it again. Mindfulness doesn't make people less irritating. It makes us less irritable. I want you to continue a little bit, kind of walking us through. You go to Hawaii. How old are you at this point? Probably around 27. Late 20s. Correct. Were you in a relationship at that time? At the time, yes. But it ended shortly after getting there because I wanted to live a simple and uncomplicated life. That was my driving force.

So being in a relationship with someone else is rarely simple and uncomplicated. Which is why it ended through three months after I moved there. Took three months, though. That must have been an interesting three months. Well, it worked out well for everybody involved. But I remember even asking, you know, there's 800 different schools of Buddhism. And in some of them, you know, some of the monks and priests are very much. celibate and some can get married and have children. And I remember asking some of the priests in one of the

monasteries where I lived, you know, if our intention is to live a simple life, why would you get married and have children? And he said there's things you can't learn about yourself outside of a relationship that you can only learn when you're living with a mirror, so to speak, when all of your sharp edges are pointed out to you. And if you make a commitment to smooth those out, then a relationship is actually really beneficial on your journey, not detrimental. You're welcome. That's beautiful. What was that, Jonathan? I just said, I said, he said, you're welcome. And And I said that's beautiful. I was just helping her thank me for pointing out all the sharp edges that she's smoothing.

Okay. So you go to Hawaii. So I go to Hawaii. And my intention is to live a simple and uncomplicated life. I didn't have a place to live. I didn't have a job lined up or anything. I didn't know what I wanted to do. But I knew very clearly what I didn't want.

I was on Oahu. Mainly because, again, I didn't want a car and on a place like Oahu. If you know, there's eight islands, there's 1.2 million people in Hawaii. and a million of them all live on Oahu. So that's the place with great public transportation where I didn't need a car because I was just trying to go, okay, how can I, you know, escape by? I'm going to ask an uncomfortable question.

Did you smoke a lot of wheat? I've never done drugs in my life, actually. Look at that. That's amazing. It's the one area of every spiritual book I've ever read where every teacher talks about their trip and their drug days and I'm like, I can't relate. Right. Okay, you don't have to. I think that's amazing.

Another question. Did you have the sex in that time or was your plan to be celibate? So I didn't have a plan to be celibate. The third precept in Buddhism of the five is sexual responsibility. And in my 20s, I abused sex a lot because I associated it with being loved and being attractive. And I felt like I had nothing else to offer other people other than sex. So I slept with anybody and everybody. Sure. And then I realized, okay, if Buddhism calls for sexual responsibility, mainly to not have sex outside of a, you know, lasting or at least intended long-term relationship with love with not having sex with someone who's in a relationship with someone else and, you know, definitely protecting the integrity of adults. And I thought, well, asking me at that time in my 20s to have sex responsibly would be like asking an alcoholic to drink responsibly. So for me personally, I chose to be celibate. I chose to put sex aside and learn new ways to be intimate with people. And it blew me away how I learned the value of vulnerability and transparency and how to be there and make connections with other people and find my own worth and value outside of sex.

So that's what drove me to at that point in my life to say, okay, what would it be like if this didn't drive my life? I mean, it's yet another thing that you and I have in common conceptually. I'm not saying like I did exactly what you did. But I have definitely lived a life sexually that is very, very different from what most people that I know have experienced. And I feel like out of place. I feel like people think, oh, you're just like a religious, you know, you're prude. I mean, once you frame it in a Buddhist way, like sounds hip and cool. But if you frame it in any other way, it's like you're living in the dark ages.

It's just an appetite. You don't understand. You don't like. Oh, but I also, again, I told you, I abused it. So I lost my virginity at 13. And I was going strong up until those late 20s. So I knew what I was missing and I wasn't missing it. Much like I'm sure you can relate.

Or maybe not. I don't know. I mean, I've been plant based for more than 20 years. I don't know when you started. And I know what I'm missing because I've had it, but I'm not missing. I think I just found my people. Do you want to get married to me? I think it could work.

She's always upset that the house smells like meat. I can't with you. I don't. I would be too, Jonathan. I'm sorry. Well, my feeling is open a window. Do you know what I'm saying? I hadn't cooked meat in the house in two days she came in this morning.

That's what your insides also smell like. It's two days. You get to Hawaii. You don't have a job. I assume you have, like, where are you sleeping that night? So I found a place that rents out by the week. you know, whether you stay in a hotel or a hostel or whatever, I didn't have any savings, but I didn't owe anybody any money. So I felt like, okay, here I am at ground zero.

What do I really need? And I realized, you know, 12 hours a week job, that would be fine. So I found one just managing an online art gallery for three hours a day. I spent the rest of my time playing volleyball. And I realized it was like, this is, this is really great, but it also afforded me a lot of time. And so the question asked me, well, what can I do with this time? What has always interested me, but I couldn't pursue because I was working around the clock. Well, now that I'm not, what can I do with my time? I started studying both psychology and world religion simultaneously to understand what people believe and why we believe what we do and not just religion, but even prejudices. Where did you pick them up?

And more importantly, why are you still carrying them? Yes, and why was that what you wanted to study? What people believe and why? Because you could have studied any number of things, right? You could have studied economics. You could have studied, like, why that? Because from the moment, as you said earlier, I moved with my family from Israel to the States. It was my first year of high school.

It didn't speak a word of English. And I moved to San Francisco. There were like 3,000 students in my high school. Only six of us were white. And I was immediately fascinated by all the different cultures and religions and languages. And instead of doing what my family wanted to do, which was stick to your own, don't date a girl who's not Jewish or we'll send you back to Israel to serve in the military. I was like, you can't do that to a teenager, take him to an ice cream store with 31. full flavors and tell them you can only have vanilla. So I wanted to know anything and everything and

read the different Bibles and speak with different people and look at different therapeutic approaches and to realize why do we create our own suffering? Like why and how many times and how often do we identify as victims without realizing it? And the more I studied it, I had a friend one time who told me he's like, Timber, you're like a Buddhist monk. And I'm like, what does that mean? And I looked it up and I'm like, who he's right. You know, so instead of picking up a book on it, I decided to go and speak. Lama Rinchen was living in Hawaii.

He had fled Tibet together with the Dalai Lama. He was just older, wonderful, sweet man. And I started visiting with him and speaking with him. I'm very fortunate that unlike other previous experiences and other monasteries, where they try really hard to get you to take refuge with them, you know, like be part of our lineage and they commit to us. And I felt very, I didn't feel any of that pressure with Lama Rinchin. I actually sat in front of him and I told him, I said, with all due respect,

looking at all the different statues around here with multiple arms and the imagery and everything is so complicated. I was like, with all due respect, I don't think the Buddha ever intended for his teachings to get this complicated. And luckily, he laughed. He said, the Buddha did not do this. This is Tibetan culture. If you want a simpler approach to it, he's like, try Zen.

You might really like it. And me being me, I don't pick up a book on it. I move into a Zen monastery. You know, because I have the time. That's how I think we learn, you know, learning English, moving into, I had the option to go to a different high school with a lot of my cousins from Israel, who speak Hebrew, can hold my hand. But I chose to go to one where I don't know anyone and force myself to learn the language.

Similarly in Zen. And then there I learned, which is interesting because Zen tends to be very rigid, very hardcore, and it was there that I learned how rigid I have been with myself. And it's there that I learned to be gentle, which is shocking because usually that's the most rigid environment. But compared to me, it was just a breeze, if that makes sense. Yeah. I actually, just to give a little bit of context, I studied Zen Buddhism at UCLA for about two years.

a friend of mine and I were part of, it wasn't in coursework. We had a teacher and we would meet with a group of students and sometimes we'd go five times a week and sometimes we'd go one time a week. And it's like the hardest philosophy you can study. It bends your brain. Precisely. And actually, I want to pause right there because that's neuroscience. I mean, you're talking about creating new neuro pathways that literally bend your create, right? I mean, this is your area. This is why I was so looking forward to talking to you because you understand how we, we're By changing our behavior, we change the way we look at the world. We understand ourselves, right? Right. So I did want to kind of like take a little, you know, a little brain neuroscience pause to talk about. So when you had that experience, right, in this moment of like, if I stay here for 30 years in this cubicle, I'm going to get like a clock with my name etched on it as my present for being here for 30 years, which like my mother-in-law, she was a medical tech and ran blood lab in a hospital. in San Jose and like literally at like her 30 year, they're like, here's a clock.

And she's like, I've given my life. I've saved thousands of people's lives. And you get a clock with your name, you know. But at that moment, many things can happen to humans. When they have that moment, they can, you know, have a nervous breakdown. And I'm talking about in the clinical sense, you know. And they can really check out from a conscious, cognitive interactive experience, and many people will start a mental decline from being worn down

like that that can lead to, name it. Anxiety, depression, panic disorder, you know, if your preference is food to fill that hole, you'll eat until you can't, or you'll restrict food because that feels like control. So there's all these things. And what will happen if you go to a conventional Western doctor is they will say, here's a pill. We're going to give you this pill. And, you know, the most common and most widely used are the SSRIs, the selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors. And it's like, let's just put more happy, you know, in all those synapses, and then you'll have more happy to pull from. And some brains will say, all right, and then they'll go back and they'll punch the clock and they'll do the thing, right? And other people who may not have, who may not have

the resources or the ability can spiral significantly. And this is where you see, you know, sometimes people are hospitalized or people will turn to alcohol and drugs or their alcohol and drug use will become such that it is a tool to manage the unmanageable feelings. And I'm not saying that what you describe leads to suicide, but what I will say is that what we know about the human brain and the capacity to cope with these situations is that, depending on your genetics, your environment, your resources, your education, what ethnic group you come from, your race, you have less and less access, you know, to, quote, help. Yeah, and that's why I said if I stayed on that, you know, trajectory, and I stayed 30 years,

then I would have had the exact breakdown you're describing. Correct. And another thing that some people do is they're told, well, get into therapy. Let's leave bad therapy out of it for now. Because I'll put bad therapy with also bad Western medicine, you know. but quote, good therapy is a typically a longer term commitment to trying to restructure your brain so that it produces more happy, right? So that the things that, let's say, SSRIs are doing, you learn to do yourself. And one of the things that's recommended is learning to breathe correctly, right? Learning to work in meditation.

But many of the things that are needed to bring us back from that brink are things that you need time to do. That to me is the second step in the sense that, you know, people automatically do not hear this from people all the time. Like they want to chase whatever it is that's making them happy. And my side's pause, let's first stop doing what makes you unhappy. Correct. Because if you don't do that, you just keep putting icing on a really bitter, nasty cake and you think it's going to make it sweater. But ultimately, you didn't take out the bitter ingredient out of the cake. Correct. And so what I was going to, what I was going to say is that, you know, for some people,

therapy can be effective. It usually depends on what kind of match you make. And, you know, I don't say that lightly because the notion of humans connecting with other humans and being able to be heard and held and to be able to process information is a very intricate relationship that therapy seeks to construct. And what therapy is ultimately seeking to do is to kind of build you a scaffold from which you can approach your life and make more, let's say, congruent choices. And with time, the decisions you make based on therapy, which sometimes means cut out people who are toxic, right? Stop having sex with people you don't know and drinking so much that you don't know where you are, right? Those changes in behavior can take longer, you know, obviously, but what they ultimately do is we're looking to kind of create pathways in the brain that have other reward systems that are ultimately more, you know, globally rewarded.

So this third thing, so I'm saying kind of like Western meds and sort of like being just passed through your internist who's like, here, take some Zoloft, see what happens. Then we have like this sort of therapy pathway. And then what I'd like for people to understand about what you did is you were able to remove many of, I mean, to my understanding, you were able to remove many of the outside, I don't want to say negative because that word has a negative connotation. detrimental. That's why I don't use right or wrong. I use, is it beneficial or detrimental? So you were able to remove simply by virtue of the fact of removing yourself, you know, from that job, that mortgage, whatever it was, that relationship, whatever it was. And what you were able to do is give your brain an opportunity to, it's not even reboot. You were able to let your brain start behaving in a way that was congruent with your needs. And that absolutely is a thing that if you were to put your brain in a scanner before you left, and at some point after you were there, what we would see is that your brain had changed. And this is not just like the brain is plastic, like take home message.

What it is is that the choices we make and the behaviors that we engage in, the conversations, the way we spend our time, the food, the sleep, all of those things absolutely change. That's why Buddha was Buddha because he was, and that's why you could argue Jesus was Jesus or Moses was Moses. Like, these are people who were living in a way that they were not necessarily worrying about, does my tea have too much sweetener in it, you know? And you find this with great enlightened people often is that, you know, I mean, people talk about Einstein. Like he couldn't wear the same socks, you know. Like there's a certain amount of conservation of mental health energy.

that you were able to hone that is now part of who you are. But people might be like, but does timber, like, get really mad and throw things? I don't think you do. I'm sure you feel feelings, but you are in a different place. For me, the big shift in that

was understanding the difference between a feeling and an emotion. I feel everything everyone feels. But the way I define the difference is that a feeling lasts 45 seconds to a minute and a half and then it moves on to another feeling. That's the feeling. And they're all valid.

They're all one. And we all experience experience all of them. But an emotion is oftentimes when we have the feeling, you know, somebody cuts us off on the freeway and we get upset. But instead of moving on to the next feeling when our favorite song comes on the radio and we would typically be dancing in our seat and singing along, instead of doing that, we get stuck in that feeling of upsetness. And we create a narrative around what happened. And we say, oh, it's always those jerks and pickup trucks. People live their whole lives like this. Oh, 100%. You can spend you, and that's

actually my mother. I'm going to share something really personal here, but you know, something happened with my dad's parents when she was a teenager because they met when they were 15 and they got married at 18. And she got so upset with, with his parents that she decided when they get married, they made up their last name because she didn't want to carry his. She wanted nothing to do with his side of the family. Not me nor my sister were allowed to meet anyone from my father's side of the family. It was this whole. And so now, gosh, 44 years later, she is just as angry as she was then. And that different. is that anger she's feeling today, that's not a feeling. That's an emotion. The feelings she felt

way back when came and went. But she hung on to it and she fed that narrative and that story. And she's my greatest teacher of how not to be. This is what emoting looks like. So yes, I feel, but I don't emote. I know that Jonathan is so deep in my head right now and I am so deep in his head right now because I have a list of things that I would like you to fix in him. And I know, and I'm I know that he has a list of things that he would like you to fix in me. And it's making me feel like maybe this relationship is just attachment and suffering. Or we're our greatest teachers. Or you're each other's greatest teachers, you know, an opportunity to, it's like taking two sharp rocks and putting them in the dryer.

And they're going to just rub against each other so much that they're going to smooth out each other's edges. And there's lint. There's lint in the dryer trap. It's not even a- It's choking me. He has asthma. He can't breathe. Anyway.

When you use the word emotion, you immediately go to a narrative associated with whatever the feeling is. And then that gets really complicated because you attach a set of belief systems to it. And you make up a story which then you believe is true. And then it becomes a self-fulfilling circle where I'm now angry at the story that I just told myself. And I feel justified in my anger. And yes, 100%. And then you're just stuck in that. And you're like, well, I can't not hate that person because I just told myself all these things that are horrible about them.

And I believe all those things. And Miami and I talk about this all the time. Most people are so actively participating in that without even knowing it. Like the speed at which they respond is fueled by all of these thoughts that they're having. You just describe mindlessness. It's the opposite of mindfulness. Yeah. And so really it's only in the slowing down is like, oh, I had this crazy reaction.

What is that even based on? and Mime is laughing because I'm laughing because I texted her this morning she like snapped about something and like especially when you're texting because like you one text is down here and then three texts go by and I'm like are you responding up here?

I think you should just like I literally texted slow your roll. Like I didn't even have time to say what you heard me type wasn't what I said at all. And you know that's a tiny example but most of us when we have that speed And actually the speed and the intensity of that emotional signal is an fantastic sign that we have to slow down and say, wait a second, what is that based on? It's not that we shouldn't feel.

It's that we should say, before I snap into a reaction, let me take this as an opportunity to evaluate. Yeah. And that's what nonviolent communication does is it acknowledges every feeling. And then it goes, that feeling is indicative of some unmet need. What is my unmet need here? So if I'm jealous of someone, it's like, what, why am I? Like they didn't do anything wrong. I'm jealous.

What is my, well, I obviously don't feel secure or safe enough or heard or loved or seen. So if I can communicate those things rather than get mad because I'm jealous, that will bring two people closer together rather than farther apart. You just became a couple's therapist. But here's one of the things that I would add to the mix. Working on knowing yourself and working on understanding yourself. and then working on being in a committed, congruent, and present, mindful relationship, it takes a huge expenditure of time and energy. And I think a lot of people might say, if it's that hard, it's not worth it.

It's harder not to, I think. It takes an equal amount of time and more energy to be unsettled at time. Exactly. Exactly. It was Carlos Custineta who said, you can make yourself happy or you can make yourself miserable. The amount of work is the same. Why don't we circle back because this reaction is completely tied to something you said, which was most of us or many of us identify as victims without realizing it. And I think that is completely tied to the stories and the reactions that we have. And our vocabulary, yes, that the words with which we describe our experiences, when you say to someone, anyone, you make me feel, fill in the body. blank. No one can make you feel anyway. Exactly. I mean, Eleanor Roosevelt said no one can make you

feel inferior without your consent. And I'm not only angry, I believe no one can make you feel anything without your consent. So when you tell someone, you make me feel angry, upset, whatever, what you're essentially saying is, poor me, I'm a victim. I have no control over how I feel. So that's one way we identify as victims. We also identify every time we say any sentence that says, I have to, dot, dot, dot, instead of I choose to, or better yet, I get to. Oh, so deep. That's very deep. But it's, you know, we all make our own choices. We all pay our own prices.

And people say, well, I have to work 80 hours a week. I'm like, you choose to. And I go, no, I don't. Don't do that. Like, I have to. I have to pay the mortgage. I'm like, you choose to pay the mortgage on a big house. The idea is to follow that train of thought and go, why do I make these choices?

Why do I choose to work 80 hours a week? Why do I choose to have that huge house? Why do I choose to have that sport car? And if we keep following that train of thought and we realize, we're doing all of this to maybe impress our parents or to keep up with society or. to look good on our Instagram feed, and we finally see the truth of why we do what we do, hopefully, in theory, we change why we do things, I think. But we need to first be really honest with ourselves as to what motivates us. And most people, like Jonathan said, the hardest thing for

us to see is ourselves. It takes a lot of work. Here's my question. Go ahead. You published a series of letters and communications, like surrounding this kind of transformation and life. Yeah, when I moved to Hawaii, I started sending letters to my friends every month to let them know what's going on. And after eight years, my friend said, you need to publish those letters. You now, like, you have a podcast and you have a website. Like, you have a whole, you have a world now where you are of service, you know, to other people in sharing what has moved you, what has touched you, what has grounded you, you know, like any one of those verbs. But here's the thing. how how do you tolerate people like like no and I'm not just asking I'm not being facetious like

I feel like if I had what you had like if I had that experience and I had that ability to like have that time I don't know that I'd want to come back and like have have to deal with people in their inanity I think that's the the commitment of the monastic vows, it's to be of service. I truly believe we're here to learn to be selfless. And if I was to take everything I learned and benefit from it, but not share it with others, it would be the most selfish thing in the world. But you could share it with 10 people. You could share it with 20 people. Like you, I mean, and this is not a criticism. Like, I think it's amazing. And that's how it started. I shared it with my email list of my friends. And it turns out they took my emails and they forwarded it to their

friends. And they forward it to their friends. And then a friend said, you need to create a blog. And so I did. I didn't even know what blogs were. And, you know, it's just, you know, it's, just kind of spiraled from there. And my intention is when I'm invited somewhere, my, my answer is yes. And I had no intention of because I never sat down and said, I'm going to be an author. Like, that never happened. I just took my friends there essentially, because when she said, you need to publish these letters and I thought, who would want to read them? And she said, Timber, that's not for you to decide. You publish them. People will decide if they want to read it. So I did. And before I knew it, I'm speaking in, you know, maximum security prisons and huge corporations.

high schools, you know, the book became required reading in six schools here in California. And it's like, how did that happen? And I think it's because there is an underlying hunger for an alternative. What other narrative are we not hearing? You know, because there is no, you know, monetary motivation to spread this, you know, there's, there's no money to be made. It's just happiness to be had. What do you do in terms of profit, you know, like, meaning do you like, do you liked, like, are there things that you dedicate, you know, a certain amount of your earnings to? Of course, 100%. So the moment the book was published, I separated myself, Timber Hawkeye, from the book, Buddhist boot camp. And I said, any money that the book makes, because I don't

claim ownership of the information in the book. This is ancient stuff that I merely translated so people today could understand. So any money that the book makes goes right back to the book. It goes right back to sending books to prisons, dictionaries to prisons, so inmates can get their GEDs. It goes, you know, the shirt you mentioned, that all goes to mercy for animals. You know, it's really about the cystic fibrosis foundation. These are my big go-toes because I already learned. I don't need a lot to be happy. Again, I'm at $7,000 a year. And that may sound unreasonable to people. And I'm not suggesting everybody's line is drawn in the same spot. But we need to define what enough means to us or we'll never have it. And that's the, that's the

vicious loop many people get stuck in. My uncle used to say, I don't want a lot of money. I just want $1 more than I've got. Essentially creating this endless loop of never having enough. And I think that is not just a panda. That's the biggest endemic is not enoughness. If we don't define what enough is, we will never have it. I love that. Tell me also, because like this is just, you know, curiosity. What is your life like? Do you live in an apartment? Do you live in a house? Do you sleep in the park. So when a book was first published, I went on a tour that was supposed to be three months and ended up being three years of sleeping on people's couches across the U.S. UK and Australia, giving a talk every day and just not knowing one day from the next where it was going to land.

And when I came back, I thought, well, I can't imagine signing a lease somewhere because that would, you know, because every other day I'm invited to speak somewhere else. Like, I need to not be locked down. And I can't imagine doing that. And so what made the most sense is, getting an RV and saying that way I can park it here one time and not to drive it, but just because again, all I had was a backpack. So like I just need, this is on the mainland, not in Hawaii. You can't have those there. But it was just like I disagree.

I don't have to buy furniture. I don't. You know, it's like everything I've got is right here. And when I'm invited to speak, I can go and then I'll have a place to come back to. And at first it was parked down in the Ventura area by the marina. Then it was in Morra Bay. Now it's on the coast. And it's this great opportunity where either.

are so many ways to think outside the box. And this works for me. Is there a spot next to you for me to park? Do you have an office? Like, where are you now? I'm in the RV. No, you're not. 100%. Okay. So, you cook in the RV? Yeah. Yeah. The first thing I did is I picked a floor plan that had this like long couch next to the stove. And I was like, get that a couch out of there. And I built a three foot counter because I prepare all of my own meals, make my own cashew milk, the whole works. I'm like, I need kitchen space. I will say 90% of what I own material stuff is kitchen related. Amazing. Okay, okay, I got more, I got more questions. Okay, so that's that. Your clothing, you dress simply. So that goes back to the decision fatigue. Yes, I have five great t-shirts and two pairs of pants.

I eliminate, because, you know, every time we make a decision throughout the day, makes our next decision that much more difficult to make. So I eliminated that with just, I know what I'm going to wear. It started with wearing robes. When I took the monastic vows and I was in full robes, I was like, wow, this is so great. Like, I never have to worry about what am I going to wear today. It's always the same thing. What color robes?

So the first ones wore maroon when I was in the Tibetan temple. When I moved to Zen, they were all black. And it was my own teachers who said, Timber, why are the ropes? Why can't you just be the guy in town with the bright eyes? And I think that's the invitation for all of us. Because when I wore the robes inside the monastery, they made sense because we all look the same.

We all, you know, had the same haircuts. We're all one. And so our robes made sense there. But when I left the monastery and I'm walking around the streets of Honolulu wearing maroon robes, they didn't communicate. Look at me. I'm just like everybody else. It said, look at me.

I'm different from you. And people started treating me differently. And one day when an old lady on the bus offered me her seat, I said, uh-uh, the robes got to go. And so now it's really about just how can I take those teachings and not just make them applicable if you're in the mountain somewhere, but in downtown LA, which was the first place I went to. I'm like, I need to be able to live in L.A. and not blame the traffic or anything else. You know, you're not stuck in traffic. You are traffic. And the moment you realize that is just so liberating, because then you're not saying everybody's in your way. You know, you're just saying I'm part of the

whole. And it was this beautiful incorporation of this is where the rubber meets the road, so to speak. This is where the teachings matter. You have tattoos? I'm covered, yes. Oh, really? You could probably read this one. It says Savlanut. Very good.

That is patience. I actually have a tattoo of a cherry blossom on the back of my neck, which is a common, it is a Japanese flower and a symbol of something that you wait all year for. And it blooms very, very briefly. And you appreciate it so much because then it is. gone very quickly. Like our lives. That's right. Like happiness, like beauty, like all those things. Okay, other questions I have. Do you eat chocolate? Dark chocolate? Too much, yes. I mean, it's a dumb question, but I want to ask it. Do you have a, quote, guilty pleasure? Like, do you drink caffeine? Yeah, so no caffeine, no drugs, no meat, no dairy, no eggs.

My guilty pleasure, dark chocolate, yeah, I'll have a square or two after a meal. I, again, like 88% we're talking super dark. Yeah, yeah, yeah, very, very dark. And my guilty pleasure, probably pretzels. Yeah, I like pretzels too. I've listened to your podcast. And I know that you, as you said yourself, put a lot on your plate. You keep yourself very, very busy. Jonathan says I'm the busiest person who keeps saying they want to retire. See, what a wonderful mirror, Jonathan is to hold that and go, look what you're doing. You say you want, it's like I truly, I hear everyone saying they want to live a life of leisure, but I rarely. see anyone do anything leisurely? What's that about? Well, I've heard that it's not mine originally,

but I've repeated that people are like actually very bad at doing the things that they like. But again, that stems into, do I not deserve this? Or did I not earn it? And when you free yourself from all that guilt and all that shame and you balance it with, I volunteer more than I work, you know? And it's like... And I think that's been, I mean, just to get personal, you know, I'm a person who has a very difficult time saying no. When you say no to one thing, though, you're saying yes to another, and that's what I try to focus on. I am under, you know, in particular sponsor direction to say no. And I've been really, really good about it. And it's very, very difficult. That's great. Because, again, you're saying yes to someone who wants you to come over. You're saying no to someone who wants you to

come over. You're saying yes to spending more quality time alone or with Jonathan or with your kids. It's just all so interesting and juicy. And honestly, it's what makes us all exactly alike. no matter how unique you think your challenges are. They're not. We're all battling similar demons, but I don't think it's a coincidence. It's so we can help each other out, I think. Timor, I've heard that on your mantle, you have a collection of different items from a variety of faith. And because I think so many people use teachings of one tradition or another, and then they say, oh, this is the right way, this is not the right way, and there's so much division. Can you speak to what that means for you and sort of how you see the path of mindfulness sort of in all traditions.

Yeah, it was Rumi who said beyond right and wrong there is a field. I will meet you there. And I pretty much committed to setting up camp there. And so my altar has boot on it, sitting next to Jesus, sitting next to Tyler Durdon, and they get along just fine. And the idea is because when you commit to one way, one thing, and my, I, I, I, I, I, we can talk about this. My difficulty with Judaism, for example, is I remember growing up and in the synagogue that we just chant, Adonai, O Elohim, Adonai, O Elohim.

It's like, my God is the God. And when I moved to the States, I was like, wait a minute, they're implying that all other gods are false gods. Wait a minute. Like, where's the superiority complex coming from? And then I was just like, I got really angry at Judaism. And then I realized every religion does it. And that's what drew me to Buddhism, where it's, it's.

It's complementary. It works with, you could be a, you know, Christian practicing Buddhism. You could be a Jewish practice. You can be atheist practicing because in Buddhism there's no God. There's no creator. There's no creation theory. There's no right or wrong. There's conducive or detrimental.

And it's up to each one of us to look at what we're about to eat, what we're about to drink, what we're about to do, who we're about to sleep with, you know, where we're about to work, what we're about to buy. And so is this congruent with my. values or is this detrimental to my overall well-being? Which is it? Because my ultimate well-being, my happiness is when everything is in harmony. And if there's disharmony, tempting as it may be to blame someone else for it, we have to take our personal responsibility. And I love breaking that word down, our response ability, our ability to choose our response to the outside world.

Not in defense of any particular denomination or religious practice. For me, and this was, you know, my rabbi taught me this. He said, do not confuse religion with God. Because religion is the structure that humans make to try and make sense of being human and the world. But I mean, some of us call ourselves post-denominational Jews. And I guess that's sort of where I fall into my religious and ethnic and cultural identity as well, which is separate from religion as well. But for me, like, there's only one, meaning there's one, there's one sun that we all look at. There's one gravity. You don't get to define, like, well, this is how gravity, I mean, besides on other planets. But let's just say, like, negative 9.8 feet per second squared. Like, that's gravity. So to me, we have an entire unbelievable world of people trying to make sense of the human experience.

And that's then going to be influenced by culture. It's going to be influenced by the patriarchy. it's going to be influenced by capitalism, you know, by all of these things. But to me, the feeling I get when I see my child born, the feeling I get when I help another, that's the same no matter what religion I am, no matter what culture I come from. That feeling, to me, that is the concept of oneness. That's Echad. And that exists no matter what God you pray to or gods you pray to.

So I come from a particular cultural heritage that I find resonates with me. but to me it is for nothing. It is of no use to me if it does not increase my connection with my fellow human beings, no matter what they believe or where they come from. Amen. That was beautifully said and wonderfully articulated. And that's what I resonate with most is allowing someone else's reality and truth and oneness to be just as real to them as mine as to me and not argue with them, not to try to prove myself superior by making someone else inferior, to be right by making someone else wrong. I made,

Buddhist boot camp has one principle is that the opposite of what you know is ultimately also true to somebody else, somewhere else because of their time, place, or circumstance. The second you think you're right, you're wrong. Yeah. As Bono said, the God I believe in isn't short on cash. So anyone who tells you that this is the price to get into God or God's world or the next world

is likely someone you may not want to listen to. Yeah, trust those who search for the truth, be leery of those who claim to have found it. So I agree. Faith, God, the Bible, religion, and the church are all separate from one another. You can have, I mean, my memoir is called faithfully religionless. I have a tremendous amount of faith,

but I don't ascribe to one religion. And it's very liberating. Because, as Jonathan pointed out, That way my altar can have many different guides on it from whom I derive much knowledge. Whereas if I was to say, oh, I don't like that piece of wisdom because it didn't come from my lineage. Like, why would we dismiss that just because it's not where we would normally, I just don't understand that line of thinking of being dismissive or exclusive. and I believe segregation is at the root of so much of our anguish. And inclusion and inclusivity is where we thrive.

One more question. Where does your last name come from? Even my first name was made up. It was a nickname. When I moved from Israel to the States, my first name was Tomil, which means palm tree. And the last name my parents made up when they got married was Gal, which means ocean wave. So my parents named me Palm Tree Ocean Wave and end up. living in Hawaii. Is that a coincidence? But when I moved to the States, no one could pronounce

my birth name. And so Timber was a nickname that I actually got in psychology class, just like Norm every time he walked into cheers. Everyone yelled Norm. Everyone yelled Timber. And my parents actually disowned me when I was 18. They didn't approve of who I was dating at the time. Again, I had to, I had to just a nice Jewish girl to bring home. And so they were very much your debt to us. We'll never be proud of you. And so I had my name legally changed to timber in 95. And I remember I at the same time, my first graphic design was published. And they asked, well, what name do we attribute to it? And I said, Timber. And they go, what's Timber's last name? And I froze. I'm like, I don't, I don't know. And I tried to tell them the story about my mother changing her last name because she didn't

get along. They didn't want to hear it. It was some company in New York. They were just trying to get a name, get me off the phone and move on. I lived on Hawkeye Street. I said Hawkeye. I hung up. And since then, I've been Timber Hawkeye. Do you have a relationship with your family? Yeah, my dad and I are actually quite close, which is really strange because he's still

with my mother. And she'd be right on the couch next to him, like listening to our conversation, sometimes even like contributing to the conversation, but she won't like be in it. It's very, very strange. But my dad and I, after they disson me, I went back three years. years later and I said, you know, you may not approve of my choices in life, but I don't want the last words I ever say to you to be F you. Like if you still don't want me in your life, that's your choice. But I just wanted to reach out. And he dropped everything he was doing and he just said,

I just want you back in my life. And it turns out he's been going to therapy. And we changed the dynamic of our relationship from father's son to friends. And when we went back to Israel recently. I picked out all the books that I have found really instrumental on my own journey that I found translated to Hebrew and I picked them out and gave it to him and he read them all, including the monk who sold his Ferrari, which was such a interesting parallel to my own life. And he read it and he said, I really, I'm proud of you for your decisions. They're not decisions I would make, but I totally get why you made them. And my dad was with me when I took the monastic vows and put on the ropes. And it was this beautiful, again, adult to adult looking at eye level at one another. And it's been

great ever since. Amazing. And you have an older sister, correct? I do. She's a corporate attorney defending Trump and people who dig up baby seals. You're not far off. Just the exact opposite of me. And there's no animosity between us and there's no hostility. But she didn't get this gene. She didn't get this one. There's a lot of racism. There's a lot of, difficulty and that's what's really interesting is I get to practice, not just in theory, but in my own life, in my own world. I've got some really challenging, just like everybody else. You know, just because I've learned how to duck and dive around them doesn't mean that they're not in my life. I just don't react to them. I interact with them. When you say that,

what I hear is, Maim, let's get married. So I'll be at the RV later today. Timber, tell us where people can find all of your stuff. The Buddhist boot camp.com or timberhawkeye.com, they both go to the same place. The Buddhist boot camp podcast, there's only two episodes a month. They're only less than 10 minutes long. It's a way for me to walk my talk, so to speak, to not overload my plate and just say, this is good. I send out one email a month.

That's it on the first of every month with some food for thought. And yeah, it's all on Buddhist boot camp.com. Everything you want to learn, there's a link there to videos, interviews, This one will be on there eventually when it goes live. So thank you guys so much. Timber Hawkeye, what a tremendous honor it is to be in your presence. I can't even, I thank you so, so much. Shaloha.

Thank you. Shalom and aloha. Thank you. Why your arms are crossed? Because I'm upset. I ever said I wanted to marry anyone but Timber Hawkeye. I enjoyed that very much. I had so many things I wanted to ask him.

I felt like I was. I was all over the place and I feel badly about it. You didn't meditate before you came in? I took a deep breath. One single deep breath. The rest of the morning she didn't breathe at all.

And then she took one deep breath and she said, I'm done. I've mastered this. I mean, I have so many questions. Now I want to watch the video about his RV. I'm really upset. He doesn't have guests

on his podcast because I was going to invite myself. He doesn't want to talk to you. Yes, he does. No, he doesn't. I like how you. turned it into like complaining about my own episode. It's like, I never complain.

I simply point out sharp edges so that you can smooth them. Do you have any sense of self-reflection or self-awareness? Like any? Like, how self-aware do you think you are? On a scale of one to one. On a scale of zero, not self-aware at all, to 10, there is nothing about myself that I don't know or am aware of. Where do you think? I fluctuate.

Between 8.3 and 8.7. Are you serious right now? You do often point out things that I'm not aware of. Like, sometimes I'm not aware of I come off a little sharp. But you think you're in the eights. Yeah, definitely. What do you think you are? What I am right now is fascinated.

Because I'm curious if you have that level, what do you act the way you do? Because you're aware and you don't care? The reason I'm asking it is not to be critical of you. I'm not at an eight, so I'm happy that you are. What is so attractive to me about this consciousness, right, is that it appears to me that nothing is hidden, meaning nothing is hidden from yourself,

nothing is hidden from other people. like everything is what it is. It's very like it's laid bare, you know, and not just because he doesn't have a lot of things or he doesn't have a mortgage, you know, or like whatever. It's there is a level of study and introspection, you know, that has led to a tremendous amount of honesty. I think if you had more self-awareness,

you'd know why I'm so frustrated with you so much of the time. Who has more high-level emotional reactions mirror you? Me. But that's also true. It's true of a lot of females versus males. It's true of a lot of people who've been in therapy since they're 17 versus not, you know? It's true of people who attend 12-step programs. I mean, like, it's, I don't know that it's necessarily like that that means that I'm less self-aware.

Yeah, I'm absolutely a more emotional person. I'm a more emotive person. You know, I don't think that's a detriment. You know, I mean, I always say this. Like, I wear my heart on my sleeve. It's very clear. I'll say this, that there are many times where I go introverted and I can come across as cold or. Says every man who fears intimacy and is withholding.

I mean, I adore you to pieces. But, like, that's withholding. I don't think it's withholding. I think it's going internal, figuring out my internal world to then come back out more clear, refined, and present. No. And what I was going to say is that there are times where I don't always know how I'm coming across in that introverted state. That must be the 1.7 on a scale of 1 to 10 that you don't know is happening. There it is.

We found it. Speaking of knowing things, let's do it ask my anything. God, love it. Ask my am anything. Yeah. Andrew A. asks, I was wondering about the notion, can we feel anxious when we feel gratitude? Oh, you mean if we're in a state of gratitude? Neurologically, is that true?

If so, can making a list of things to be grateful for each day minimize anxiety? What an interesting question, Andrew. I'll give you the neurochemical response, which is, if you're an anxious person, you can be anxious anytime. Meaning, it is physiologically possible to have a veil of, quote, anxiety, which really is a conglomeration of chemicals and processes. You can have that at any time. You can have that when you otherwise, quote, shouldn't be anxious, right?

That's a physiological, you know, state that you can be in, which is. which is why people are often given drugs for anxiety, because it decreases that system by elevating other chemicals that kind of mask it. However, the notion of a gratitude list, which is something that is prescribed in 12-step programs in particular, I don't know if that's where you're referencing this from, the notion of a gratitude list is to bring awareness and mindfulness

to the things in your life that can and should, ultimately, decrease anxiety because you have a notion that there is still goodness, no matter what you're dealing with. So many people begin their morning with a gratitude list, and sometimes it's three things. It's actually a really interesting thing to practice. Practice it for a week. You know, wake up and before you open your eyes or before your feet hit the ground, three things. Often on my list is cats. Not just my cats. The fact that cats exist is something I'm grateful for, right? My kids are often on that list. Jonathan is often on that list. Only sometimes, though. No, because

even when you frustrate me, I am grateful for you. I'm grateful for the lessons you bring me. I'm serious. Like, there's gratitude. So the idea is that with practice, and this is a, this is science, with practice exercising those chemicals. I mean, when Timber talked about, you know,

kind of that reframing that he did, for example, by moving to Hawaii and, you know, all these things, you are teaching your brain to lay down new pathways. And you're teaching your brain that the old ways that your brain is used to thinking, which often are anxious ways or depressed ways, they're not the only ways that you can kind of exercise your brain. So I'm a big fan of a gratitude list. I also have a group of women that we share gratitude lists pretty much daily. I'd say

at least five days a week. And we share them with the others, which is also sweet, because then you realize how many things you can be grateful for in the lives of people that matter to you. And that's also a beautiful thing to share. So yes, you can be anxious while having gratitude. But have Having gratitude is one of the things you can do to not be anxious. If you want to ask Maim anything, you can do so at Biolicbreakdown.com. B-I-A-A-L-K-B-D-D-O-K-D-com. You can also send an email to Ask Ma'em at Biolik breakdown.com. Miam, how do you spell your name for those people who are super confused?

Ask Myam. A-S-K-M-A-Y-I-M. Check out the YouTube page, subscribe, click the little bell notification to get notified. Ding. And subscribe to the podcast. Everywhere you get podcasts, it helps us make more. And check out Mime's social channel. Send us a message.

Follow me on social. Why not? Tell me how enlightened I am. Am I? Do you believe me? Is it 8.3? It's probably higher. It's probably 8.9.

I bet you it is. I think what everyone should do is go to Timber Hawkeyes' website. And I mean, just what that man has to teach, I want to learn. from my enlightened breakdown to the one that we hope you have. We'll see you next time. It's my ambialics breakdown. She's going to break it down for you.

She's got a neuroscience PhD or two. One, fiction, and now she's going to break down.