Mayim Bialik's Breakdown - Understanding Your Intense Emotions: 10 Signs You Might Be A Highly Sensitive Person & How to Harness It as Your Superpower

Episode Date: June 13, 2025

Are you a Highly Sensitive Person (HSP)? Roughly 1 in 5 people have the HSP trait, and in this episode, Mayim and Jonathan explore what it really means to be highly sensitive. They take the official Highly Sensitive Person quiz, share personal stories, and break down the science behind sensory processing sensitivity. Learn how emotional overwhelm, sensory overload, and even trauma or pregnancy can intensify sensitivity and why being an HSP is often misunderstood. Discover the best careers for highly sensitive people, how to navigate relationships as an HSP, and the powerful connection between high sensitivity, introversion, and neurodivergence. Whether you identify as a highly sensitive person or love someone who does, you’ll find practical tools, coping strategies, and surprising insights to help you thrive in a loud world. Don’t miss this empowering, science-backed look at the highly sensitive personality.   Dr. Elaine Aron's Highly Sensitive Person Quiz: https://hsperson.com/test/highly-sensitive-test/   Follow us on Substack for Exclusive Bonus Content: https://bialikbreakdown.substack.com/   BialikBreakdown.com YouTube.com/mayimbialik Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

1.2 to 1.6 billion people could be highly sensitive. Being told you're too sensitive, what it feels like is shame. Like, I am too emotionally reactive. I don't know how to interact. Everything seems like it's bothering me or it is bothering me. You may have difficulty in school. You may have difficulty in work situations that are too open-ended and don't have enough structure. Other people seem to have social stamina that highly sensitive people cannot tolerate. or match. Because it's so socially unacceptable to be a highly sensitive person, you end up sort of

adapting and it can kind of feel like you don't know who you are. Just don't feel. Hold it inside. What if we frame being a highly sensitive person as a person who's able to feel and then also communicate that to other people as a superpower? Some of these characteristics of being a highly sensitive person really make people remarkable in many ways. What I would tell parents of kids who might be displaying some of these qualities is that you are potentially raising an exceptionally emotionally attuned human being, a child who may be a gifted creator. Amazon Pharmacy Presents Painful Thoughts. I read somewhere that the average Americans spends 13 hours a year waiting in pharmacies

for prescriptions. Clearly, I am above average. I thought, Being above average would feel better. Maybe I'll read some greeting cards. Next time use Amazon Pharmacy. We deliver. And here's to being anything but average. Amazon Pharmacy. Healthcare just got less painful.

Hi, I'm I'm Biallic. I'm Jonathan Cohen. And welcome to a special MBB Explorers. Myam, the real question everyone wants to know is, do you cry easily? Yes. Do you get overwhelmed in crowds? Yes.

Do you feel exhausted after hanging out with people too long? I get exhausted after hanging out of myself for too long. Why do you ask, Jonathan? Well, you might be something called a highly sensitive person. An HSP. And it isn't rare or on the fringes. If you've heard of this term before, you are not alone. Because one in five people is estimated to be highly sensitive.

That is more than the number of people who are left-handed. You're left-handed. I know. I might be a highly sensitive person, too, but I'm, I don't know if I am, actually. Well, we're going to find out today. We're going to be talking about the diagnostic criteria for a highly sensitive person. We're going to talk about the science behind highly sensitive people.

And we're also going to be talking about what it's not, meaning what are the things that you might be experiencing that can overlap with HSPs but are actually distinct syndromes, disorders, or just traits. Now, you may have heard this term or you may have heard other things like you're being told you're too sensitive. What are some of the indicators that people might be possibly on the highly sensitive person spectrum, Jonathan? Even if they've never heard the term, although it is floating around social media these days, someone might have told you you're too sensitive. Yes. You feel different in group settings. For example, you feel isolated.

You don't know how to navigate really. You can feel overwhelmed in crowds. You can feel overwhelmed in busy places, for example. I've tried to take you to Costco. Have we actually ever gone to? I don't think we've ever gone to Costco. It's on my dream bucket list of things to do. It's not happening.

Okay, so too sensitive. You feel different or wrong in group settings. What else? You can feel burnt out in certain situations. Now, I think there's a difference between introversion, extroversion, and being highly sensitive, although many people who are very introverted can also be highly sensitive. So if you, for example, go out and feel totally drained afterwards, I think it is especially in group scenarios, especially when there's a lot of light music, when the world is around you is very busy. The other thing that people begin to experience is that they suppress their own needs. And that can also lead to burnout. It can lead to anxiety. We know that when you start to disconnect

from either physiological needs or emotional needs, it can create this underlying stress in the person. And that can lead on a long-term basis to burnout. And it can also lead to needing to manage and fix other people to try and make yourself feel better. Okay. So you've just sort of given us some broad strokes of the emotional consequences of possibly being a highly sensitive person. Let's talk a little bit about how many people this affects. This actually is a shocker. Okay. If you were to guess. Well, you told me one in five people, so I'm already doing the math. Okay, do the math. That's about 20%. Okay. 1.2 to 1.6 billion people could be highly sensitive. 20% of the world is useless, is what all the people who are not

sensitive her thinking. Well, that's maybe a label. And it could speak to the way in which people who don't experience this sensitivity can feel. Because like when I want to take you to Costco and you don't want to go, I'm like, why won't she go to Costco? I'm going to explain it today. I'm going to explain today's episode is about why I don't want to go to Costco. So we know that this is something that affects potentially millions of people. We know that it's not rare. Like, it's a thing that's out there. And we're going to be talking a little bit more about the specificity of these broad categories that, that you just described. So being told you're too sensitive, what it feels like is shame. Like, I am too emotionally reactive. I don't know how to interact. Everything seems like

it's bothering me or it is bothering me. Feeling different in group settings leads to isolation. can lead to what we call masking, right, constantly sort of like pretending you need to be somebody else. Also, there's that shame again. A lot of shame can be involved in this because there's a tremendous amount of awareness when you're a highly sensitive person about like things are operating. They're different. Also, you may have difficulty in school. You may have difficulty in certain kinds of work situations that are too open-ended and don't have enough structure. In terms of what you were describing about kind of not being able to keep up with other people, other people seem to have social stamina that highly sensitive people cannot tolerate or match. So what that can learn to is,

again, like that kind of like shame, feeling defective, thinking maybe that you're lazy because you don't want to go out or don't feel motivated to go out. And in terms of suppressing needs, you mentioned burnout. A lot of times what happens is because it's so socially unacceptable to be a highly sensitive person, you end up sort of adapting. And it can kind of feel like you don't know who you are. Like, I'm constantly doing what they want, or maybe there's something wrong with me that I don't want to do that. I'll do it anyway. And that can lead to a lot of, well, my favorite word, resentment. So these are some of the categories of what happens when you are a highly sensitive person or you may be a highly sensitive person and we're going to help you figure it out. We actually have a

quiz that we're going to be taking in this episode. I cannot wait for the quiz, but what was shocking to me is it's equally distributed between men and women. Yes. And I think a lot more women may identify it or seek that out or have the experience of being aware of feeling drained in those social circumstances. Well, I think we're going to talk about it. Women tend to be more verbal. We do tend to be more emotional. Like emotions live a little closer to the surface for women, generally speaking, than men. Or for people who fall on the feminine spectrum, I guess we should say that as well, because I think that's maybe more accurate. But yes, the distribution seems to be equal,

but it's going to look different. Kind of when we talk about ADHD, it looks different in men and women. When we talk about neurodivergence, also looks different. And if you were already like, mm, that sounds like neurodivergence, or that sounds like ADHD, you're not wrong,

and we're going to talk about those overlapping Venn diagrams of all this stuff. So let's get into some diagnostic kind of nomenclature. Two of my favorite word. Diagnostic nomenclature, and what I'm kind of most excited about for this episode is beginning to give us a language to understand that so many people are just built in different ways. That isn't to say abnormal versus normal. I don't really like that classification.

But in the U.S. alone, it's estimated that 50 to 66 million people may identify with us. So if you are listening and you're like, not me. Probably you. We haven't even taken the quiz. If you're listening and you're like, I think that's me, it might be. you. And if it's not you, likelihood is you know someone, someone is in your friend group or in your family group. 20% of people in theory. So you should kind of really understand what is happening here because it impacts so much of how we interact and socialize and how we feel about ourselves. All right. So let's talk about what actually is a highly sensitive person. We've talked about some of the emotional categories that often get thrown around when we talk about it. This is a

term that was coined in the mid-90s by Dr. Elaine Aaron. She's a clinical. psychologist and a researcher, and she published a book called The Highly Sensitive Person. She was like, it's 1996. We're not very creative about titles. This book is called The Highly Sensitive Person. 1996. Let's just be straightforward.

Yeah, it's a very straightforward title. It was based on years of empirical research and also personal experience that she had. Fun game, what would we title it now? It would be like, coming into your Phoenix Rising. What you don't know, and they haven't told you about how emotions really work. The real reason you're burnt out and don't know it. You were made this way to excel and be written into a Lady Gaga song. I will say right before we get into the criteria.

We're not teasing also. We're not teasing. That's what it would be called now. I'm thinking, how would this be marketed on YouTube? Born this way. Born this way. You just want it to be Lady Gaga. The reason why I was saying this is, you know, we'll talk a little bit more about this after we do what you're about to do.

and after we do the quiz, I love some foreshadowing. I'm going to just plant the seed that highly sensitive people could be an evolutionary advantage. You were going to say that. Because you're a highly sensitive person and you have extrasensory abilities. That's the foreshadowing we need. Let's get back to the criteria. So about 15 to 20 percent of the population seems to have sensory processing sensitivity, SPS, and this is a clinical term, and there's a ton of medical literature,

and we'll get into some of that. It is a genetically inherited temperamental style. Jonathan, when you hear genetically inherited temperamental style, what do you think? I think that you've gotten it from a parent, that there is a biological genetic expression of this. And like I said, I think temperament, which I know it is not what I'm about to say, sounds like you're all over the map. You can't be pinned down.

And you're a problem. I'm going to take us on a little bit of a detour, but then I promise I'll come right back. So temperaments, there are four main temperaments. You can look at them by color or kind of by season. There's blue, there's red, there's yellow, and there's green. The four main temperaments are known as melancholic, choleric, saluine, and phlegmatic. What is phlegmatic? Phlegmatic is people who are...

Sounds like a little flatulence. Too many beans. So, phlegmatic is people who are reasonable, principled, controlled, persistent, steadfast, and calm. Really the opposite of what it sounds like. Right, exactly. That's phlegmatic. Melancholic is anxious, worried, unhappy, suspicious, serious, and thoughtful. Those two tend to be more, quote, unchangeable.

And then there's the more changeable temperaments, the ones that are going to kind of come and go. Senguine is playful, easygoing, sociable, carefree. hopeful and contented. That's me. And caleric is egocentric, exhibitionist, impulsive, histrionic, active, and excitable. Right. Yeah. So these are temperaments.

So what those are, there are genetic components to all of the ways that we are. And what Dr. Aaron was identifying is that there seems to be a temperament, a temperamental style that is sensitive in specific ways to sensory input. Now, sensory input is a very broad term. but what she said is that you see about 15 to 20% of the population with this kind of genetically inherited temperament. Okay, slow down a little bit because this is important and I'm trying to process. I think people are also, you know, following along. Say that part again.

Dr. Aaron identified that approximately 15 to 20% of the population has a temperamental style that has sensitivity. So, like, one thing, for example, could be, like, I hate linen sheets. They're too rough. But you're not an HSP because you don't like linen sheets. I think we need to talk a little more about the diagnostic criteria. This is a great place for us to take a break and hear from our sponsors. When we come back, we're going to get into the nitty-gritty of the brain science behind highly sensitive people. My Ambialx breakdown is supported by superpower.

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Next time use Amazon Pharmacy. We deliver. And here's to being anything but average. Amazon Pharmacy. Healthcare just got less painful. We process stimuli in all sorts of different ways, right? We process through all of our senses. And sensitivity is a very, very necessary component of life.

I once knew a pregnant woman who's, smell, sense of smell got so heightened that she couldn't be around people. Because everyone smelled too much. Well, so let's talk about evolutionarily why we are sensitive and why pregnant women in particular sensitive. So what happens during pregnancy? You're growing a human inside of you. And you need all the smells around you to identify danger. You know what? You're being kind of saucy. But what you're witnessing when a woman has an acute sense of smell. It doesn't happen for all women, but it is one of the features of pregnancy. What you're talking about is there are times in life as an organism when it is

increasingly important for you to understand information coming at you so that you can know if you should avoid it or embrace it. So a pregnant woman is actually, you know, operating in a world of like computers and ice cream and cars and living. linen sheets, but her evolutionary system is designed to keep that thing alive. So the increased sensitivity increases the probability that she will avoid noxious, toxic odors. Refrigerators, people taking off their shoes. Right, but I think it's important, you know, this kind of sensitivity and this sort of processing has been documented in over 100 species. So it is evolutionarily advantageous for us to have an elaborate system of processing

sensory stimuli and in certain environments, let's talk about pregnancy, the environment of pregnancy, for us to upgrade the sensitivity so that we are, you know, placing ourselves in an advantageous position. So what is it about roughly 20% of the population that seems to be living in a suspended state of sensitivity. No, they're not all pregnant, especially the men. But we are going to talk a little bit about some of these factors. The trait is considered innate, meaning this is not a disorder. Okay? Yep. I'm with you. So this is where we're going to distinguish it from things like ADHD or when we talk about neurodivergence. There's overlap, but this trait of sensory processing sensitivity is considered an innate trait that is heritable. We have some really interesting twin

studies because how do you want to know if something's heritable, find someone with exactly the same DNA. And in addition, so this is its own thing, but it can coexist with things like introversion, neurodivergence, anxiety, or even a trauma response. So you're going to see all this overlap. It can be hard, but it is distinct. So we're trying to understand sensory processing disorder, which is what people with, you know, the diagnosis or the the nomenclature of HSP have. It is distinct from all these other traits. It's its own beast. It's its own beast, but there are overlap in terms of the expression of the experience. A lot of times when we do these episodes, I just feel like an asshole. Because, yes, there can be, there can be different expressions. But I think,

what's important for us to stay on is that this is its own set of diagnostic criteria. A hundred percent the diagnostic criteria. Let's focus on that first and then we'll focus on the lived experience. And then I will talk about the lived experience. Which has overlap. There we go. Everyone is happy. There's no right or wrong.

Everything has overlap. Everything has overlap. So it is hard to use the way we talk about highly sensitive people without being like, oh, and also this. but let's just try and stick to diagnostic criteria. I'm going to give everyone an acronym. We love an acronym. Here we go.

The acronym is does. D-O-E-S or do's, if you want to go the Bambi-Root, D-O-E-S, like do-a-deer. D stands for depth of processing. O stands for overstimulation. E stands for emotional responsiveness and empathy. And S stands for sensory sensitivity. So when we are talking about the core characteristics of high sensitive people and of this sensory processing disorder, there's four things we look for.

If you only have one of them, Jonathan, do you get to know? Probably not. What if you have two? I don't know. Probably not either. We're looking for at least three, if not four, of these things in order for us to be like... For a bingo card, you need all four. You want a bingo card, all four.

Depth of processing. So highly sensitive people often need a lot of time to reflect on things before acting. they process more thoroughly, which can mean it looks like they're not focused. But actually the computer is operating. The computer is operating. That's right. And a lot of this processing may happen unconsciously, and there's ways that we can measure that and we're going to talk about that.

But this greater depth of processing often comes because of the sensitivity at which information is coming in. So it's a depth of processing because of, you know, what many of us, which is called like over-stimulation, right? But it looks like a depth of processing. What about the O? O is overstimulation. So this is kind of the one that a lot of us know about.

The nervous system can be easily overwhelmed. Lights. Hate lights. Don't like noises. Crowds. Don't like crowds. Deadlines. Deadlines.

It's an emotional overstimulation. It's basically describing Costco right there. Deadline, we've got to get out of the store. But yeah, it feels like overstimulation. It can feel like what we call flooding. Everything's too much. and you stop taking in more information or you start having an emotional reaction

when other information's coming at you. I recently saw the movie Sinners and I was very overstimulated. It was a lot of visual information, a lot of emotional information and a lot of auditory information. I can't do things like IMAX. I once did one of those like movie theaters

where the picture was on the side walls too, which is like, it's enough in front of me with earplugs in. I don't want it on the walls. anyway, over-stimulation. That's what it feels like. And some people will have a stomachache because of that or get a migraine or feel like crying and you don't know why. There's special HSP theaters where they only play black and white movies from the 20s. You're joking, but when my kids were little, there were movie theaters that would have mom screenings where they would leave the lights up so kids wouldn't get scared and the volume would be down so that parents could see not a sexy or interesting movie. but, you know, a movie that you could, in theory, bring your kids to, but where the lives

okay, let's talk about E, emotional responsiveness and empathy. So some of this overlaps with the reaction to overstimulation, but higher emotional reactivity and stronger emotional reactions, both to positive and negative stimuli. So this is something that's interesting. Very easy to imagine, like, oh, when someone's sad, when someone's experiencing something tragic, I'm feeling it or I'm feeling that empathy or I'm emotionally responsive when things are intense or when something scary happens. This can also happen from positive stimuli. It can be, it can be complicated even when someone is super excited and happy. It's not that you're not

allowing them to be happy, but for people who are empathic, that can that can be a case for emotional reactivity that can sometimes feel out of control. Not that long ago. we actually had a fascinating conversation on our substack with Dan Harris, and we were talking about your emotional register that you feel things really intensely on both ends. And actually, that's what makes you a great actor, what makes you a creative person and really unique. So some of these characteristics of being a highly sensitive person, you know, really make people remarkable in many ways. Yeah. And we're actually going to talk in a little bit about some of that specificity. Yeah, we're not here to shame people about falling into any of these categories.

And in some cases, these are superpowers, as Jonathan indicated. Yeah, I think it's important to reiterate that because at the beginning it was like, do you feel burnt out? Do you feel overwhelmed? And people can feel like that. New intro. Do you feel like you might be the next evolution of human that can tap into things that other people can't and process things in a way that other people can't?

And do you feel like you're getting a lot of information and wondering what's up with everyone else around you, that seems to be oblivious to what you notice. Let's talk about the S of our doze or does. S is sensory sensitivity. And this one is kind of the one that gets tucked into sensory processing sensitivity disorder the most. So this is environmental and social stimuli can be overwhelming. Also being more sensitive, like the pregnant ladies, to smells, more sensitive than other

people to lights, textures, even background noise that others ignore. I can hear a clock ticking from clear across a room that some people are like, I didn't even know that clock ticks. So there's a family joke amongst the Coens that every time we would walk into a restaurant, we would all be sort of in knots about what my dad was about to do. And nine times out of 10, he would walk up to the manager and be like, can you please turn down the music? It's blaring. it's blasting in my head right now. And my sister would ask the lights to be turned down. It was never fun going out with us.

The notion that things that other people don't pick up on, but that you might, can feel kind of isolating. And, you know, for much of my life, I never thought to say anything. But now it's much more acceptable. I don't ask necessarily for, like, music to be turned down on lights, but I'm very aware of them,

and I can be activated by them. But background noise is something that if anyone's out there on the same, spectrum, you might notice this as well. You may also be a highly sensitive person, but this is something that we also do see with certain parts of the autism spectrum of being able to pick up on a refrigerator hum or, you know, a truck in the distance that has a motor running, you know, things like that. In addition, for sensory sensitivity, there's a really sweet and fascinating observation, which also has been, you know, actually studied by researchers, more sensitivity to beauty and to art, meaning literally

your ability to take in that sensory information is processed in such a way that your sensitivity carries with it a depth. Music is an example. People who often cry from certain musical progressions. I'm one of these people. My younger son is one of these people. That's a sensory sensitivity that we kind of maybe didn't think of.

But yeah, more sensitivity to beauty and art. I mean, how many artists or art lovers or art critics or art historians have an extra sensitivity that actually makes them more tuned into certain aspects of art. So that's the acronym. Do E-S. Depth of processing, over-stimulation, emotional responsiveness and empathy, and sensory sensitivity. It's visual and it's auditory and it's tactile.

And we'll get into some of the science of that in a little bit. Wyem, although most people at home have already guessed that you're a highly sensitive person and you don't need the quiz, Let's do the quiz And you are going to give us your score People at home or are listening If you're driving, please have someone else Do your score for you We're going to see

And everyone in the comments of this episode Please let us know what you scored Because we are fascinated to find out How many of our listeners are highly sensitive people? And the original quiz Which is more of a diagnostic tool Is a 27 point quiz We're not going to do the full quiz

We're going to do an abbreviated one Built on the 27 points where we've pulled out sort of the 10 most prominent. And I believe this is a yes or no. I'm easily overwhelmed by strong sensory inputs, bright lights, loud noises. Okay, yes. That's a yes for mine. Number two, I notice subtle details that others miss.

Yep. Yep. What kind of details do you notice? Everything. I can tell if someone's had a haircut. I can tell if someone who always has short hair has a haircut. I can tell if a man who always keeps his hair, like within an eighth of an inch, like, I can tell. I just can tell everything.

Some of it is also on the codependence spectrum. There's a tremendous amount of people pleasing that I'm just inherently like. I mean, we're not talking about overlaps because this is our diagnostic criteria. I don't, I'm just saying, I don't know if it's because I'm highly sensitive or because of wanting to sort of like tune in and lock into things. But I notice, I mean, it's hard for me not to notice a ridiculous level of detail about people. places things like I can tell if your eyeliner is a little bit too thick on one eye and it's very hard for me not to tell you that yeah I'm just very very dialed in go ahead new segment listeners send in pictures to us myam gives her analysis of it no hold bars no it's

like in the in the remember can you spot the difference yeah yeah things in the back of magazines when you're a kid I was like yes I can number three I'm deeply moved by music art and nature, I mean, if there was a scale, that's like all the way to the right. I should get two points for that way. You should get two points. So far, you're three for three. Number four, I need a lone time to decompress after socializing. So this is a great one because I didn't know that was a thing. But apparently, I mean, I need a long time during social time. During social time, you go into the corner say, I need a little long time before you go back out there. Yeah, I don't thrive in those environments. But yeah, it, my

nervous system needs to calm down. That's a yes. You did a hilarious TikTok, remember? Oh, that's right. What was the, it was. It was what introverts look like. After socializing you get in your car, you're like, yeah, let's do it again. Let's see each other every day.

Let's see each other three times a day. And then you look like, exactly. Okay, go ahead. All right, four for four. Number five, I get rattled when I have a lot to do in a short amount of time. I mean, yes. Okay. Although you are quite good under a deadline, but.

It doesn't mean I'm not rattled. There's smoke coming off of you. Some of us highly sensitive people are also high functioning, highly sensitive people. This is not a detriment all the time. Number six, I avoid violent media because it feels too intense. I really like a crime documentary. I don't like it to be violent or gory, but because I like the story, sometimes it is. And I think it's just like, I just sort of do it.

But when I saw sinners, like that's something, it's too much for Miami. I will say that there was a detox period for anyone who's new to the show. where Mime stopped watching crime documentaries, and it made a very positive impact. So number seven, I often absorb other people's emotions as my own. Yes, the veil is very thin between me and other people's emotions. Seven for seven, you're doing great. Thanks.

Number eight, I feel uncomfortable in chaotic or cluttered environments. I can function very well, but in other... What would be described as chaotic, though? Well, so in other people's chaotic environment, it's very hard for me. Like, when I know the chaos and it's mine, that's fine. But, like, you can tolerate, for example, like, things out. Like, sometimes when I go into other people's kitchens who don't choose to put things away, but, you know, again, this is the overlap with, like, I'm also just, like,

snickety and what we used to call just, like, anal retentive. But it's interesting because I'm wondering if there is a dysregulation, you know, that I didn't understand it's actually happening. Keep going. Disregulation, 8 for 8, but just to throw in a little story and increase the suspense as we get to our last two, we did a rapid fire with Jonathan a long time ago that we never used. Are you talking about yourself? I am.

I'm talking about myself in the third person. And one of the things, the questions that we ask on these rapid fires, which we're releasing on Substack a lot, so if you haven't seen Substack, check it out, is what is your mother right about? And I don't remember what I answered, but like it's very hard to narrow it down to one thing. What my mother was right about was always clean the kitchen before you go to bed. And always clean the kitchen before you leave for a vacation because you never want to come back to a dirty kitchen. Number nine, I feel like this is almost unfair. I startle easily.

Oh, yeah. Nine for nine, last one. Number 10, I was often told I was too sensitive as a child. Oh, yeah. I mean, as an adult as well, but especially as a child. All right, so I'm 10 for 10. I know that people are like, what are the other 17? Maybe she only is 10 out of 27 and then I don't get the diagnosis.

You know what? Because we're having so much fun, I will rifle through quickly some of the other ones. One to four, you are mildly sensitive. If you answer yes. If you have four points in this game, one to four points, you are mildly sensitive. I'm mildly sensitive. If you have, you are mildly sensitive because you have one to four, but if you keep going, five to seven, you are highly sensitive.

I'm highly sensitive. And eight to ten, if you get the full bingo card, you are a strong HSB. I am a strong, highly sensitive person. Let's just go through very briefly in case people are wondering. Other things that are on the full scale, very, very sensitive to pain, needing to withdraw during busy days into bed or a darkened room to have relief from stimulation, particularly sensitive to the effects of caffeine. It's very interesting. I have a rich complex inner life. That's one of the statements.

Do you have a rich complex inner life? Uncomfortable from loud noises. Nervous system gets so frazzled. I have to go off by myself. I'm conscientious. Yes. Being very hungry creates a strong reaction to me, disturbing my concentration or mood.

When people are uncomfortable in a physical environment, I tend to know what needs to be done to make it more. comfortable. That's very interesting. I am annoyed when people try to get me to do too many things at once. I actually thrive under lots of different multitasking, but I get that. But look, that might be a no. I think we found I try hard to avoid making mistakes or forgetting things. This is some of that conscientiousness that comes up. I just like the wording of this. I become unpleasantly aroused when a lot is going on around me. That's like the name of my memoir. Unpleasantly aroused. Being hungry creates a strong reaction in me, disrupting concentration or mood.

When I must compete or be observed while performing a task, I become so nervous or shaky that I do much worse than I otherwise would have. But that's not for you. I've got a couple experiences in my life that we will save for another time. I sense other people's feelings without them saying a word. This is like the bane of my existence. That was the quiz. That was the quiz. We are very curious to hear what your scores are.

Do share it. I think there's going to be some very interesting patterns emerging about the people who listen to this podcast and who also identify or are in partnership or in a family, close family relationship with a highly sensitive person. I think, depending on how many responses we get, we could run a little statistics. I could do a little bit of statistics here because we know how many people listen to the show. Well, we're going to, yeah, but we don't know how many people will respond. Exactly. So the statistics would more be about of the people who respond, are we only getting people who are sensitive responding, which is not actually a full, you know, a full appropriate assessment. But what would be interesting is just to be able to say for this episode, 87% of the people who seem to want to comment on it were highly sensitive people.

Comment on the YouTube channel would be best. Let's talk a little bit about the science. So we talked about it being genetic, that this is a temperamental trait, which at least in the original criteria, was designated as genetic. And twin studies do suggest a strong genetic basis. However, however, what's different about twins? They have different experiences. They have different things, places they go. And so sensitivity can be different among twins based on other experiences. and sensitivity in general, you know, can be amplified or shifted because of trauma, because of any number of things. In one study, they found roughly 70% of HSPs had what we would call typical childhoods.

And I'm like, what's a typical childhood? 30% of the people in this study may develop anxious tendencies due to environmental stressors. So certain stressors, this is not changing the heritability of it. it's changing the presentation of it and the way that we can sort of identify it. And if we talk about the overlapping experience of the expression, that is where we get some of the similarities between traumatic response and the adaptation that happens after a traumatic response or developmental stressors, things like that, where people become hypervigilant and sort of may have a higher startle reflex, they may be oversensitive to different

some stimulation. There's been some really interesting imaging studies, which lets us know where activation is in the actual brain. You know, the region that I automatically and sort of first think of is the thalamus, when we talk about the thalamus, which is kind of like a this sized on either side of your brain. The thalamus is kind of like a processing center. It's like everything has to go through it. Everything you see here, you know, all these sensory systems are processed through the thalamus. It's incredibly important. And, you know, unfortunately, we know a lot about these structures from animal studies, and I won't go into those details. But besides the thalamus, which for me was just sort of like, this sounds like a thalamic processing, you know,

disorder or dysfunction, there's a lot of attention paid to the insula and the insular cortex. So that's I-N-S-U-L-A-R. And the insular cortex, I'm going to show a picture to Jonathan. It looks like this. So if you peel back the cerebral cortex, so you have these two halves of the brain, obviously.

And what most people think of when they think of the brain, it's usually like pink in your mind. It's actually gray, but it's pink if we, you know, like try and dress it up a little bit. And it's like the part on the outside that looks kind of like worms, right, all connected together. That's the cerebral cortex. It's like the outside.

It's a separate distinct structure. And then inside, there's all these little structures when you hear about things like the hypothalamus and the globus palis and like the the thalamus and the hippocampus and all these different regions. Those are like deep inside. And that's also where a lot of like emotional processing happens at the limbic system. But the insular cortex is this, this part of the, again, more of the outside regions of the brain. And what it is is it's a place that, integrates sensory information and emotion and also can regulate certain aspects of taste and what things kind of feel like, if that makes sense. So what we have is this region that seems to light up in these studies of highly sensitive people.

And indeed, it's a region of the brain that we know is involved with kind of elaborate sensory and emotional processing. So it makes sense. So a lot of attention paid to the insula or the insular cortex. Also, all the things that you would expect based on descriptions of highly sensitive people shows up in studies that are published in all of the major, you know, peer-reviewed journals that you would expect with all of the correct double-blind, all these things. You know, the regions of the brain associated with empathy, with, you know, deeper emotional processing. Those all, quote, light up in a significantly, in a statistically significant way. for people who are highly sensitive people and have the sensory processing sensitivity.

I mean, it's fascinating to see the physiological difference or to understand that their brains are really acting differently. Yeah, and there was one study that was published in nature that also looked to correlate highly sensitive people and people with sensory processing sensitivity with other aspects of personality. And what it correlated with, they would give them basically these kind of like the big five personality, you know, questionnaires. And sensory processing sensitivity is closely linked to neuroticism and also openness, just kind of interesting, meaning taking in a lot of information being, in theory, open, but also neuroticism, which is kind of more of a tendency to fixate, to focus, and, you know, can be kind of pathologized, but those seem to be

connected as well. There's something very interesting about the idea of openness, and we're going to talk about some of the coping strategies, management strategies, because as we said, it can definitely have advantageous qualities in your life. You can use it to get ahead and to connect with people and to notice things. Based on your explanation of how much you notice things, you could be a fantastic FBI agent if this podcasting thing gets boring for you. Sometimes people can be overwhelmed by this and you may want to go to Costco. You may want to go to a concert or feel like you can go to the social situations. Okay, so we've identified what a highly sensitive person looks like. We've talked about sensory processing sensitivity, which is the trait that was identified

as prominent in people who are highly sensitive. We've also talked about the science. We've done a quiz to confirm that apparently I'm strongly, possibly a highly sensitive person. Let's now move into how you can either understand this for yourself. Or for someone you're living with or relating with. Or for someone you're living or relating with. And if you are a highly sensitive person, how you can frame that so it feels a bit more like a superpower and less like a detriment. So in childhood, people who are highly sensitive can often be labeled as like shy, dramatic.

difficult or interesting old souls mature for their age, precocious, right? Because a lot of these features that can kind of be how it presents. Also, kids who cry often, who are very, very worried or interested in animals, overwhelmed at birthday parties, that's a warning sign, right? Many of these kids are misdiagnosed as anxious or oppositional. And these days, many of these kinds of kids are likely screened for neurodivergence, which they may also be, or they may be labeled ADHD if it looks like they kind of can't control themselves, right, in certain situations. What if you have a child like this and you're a parent and you're like, I notice that my child is withdrawing, I want them to, I have to push them to have resilience. What do you think the

best strategy is to, you know, to address that, to both honor where you. your kid is at, but, you know, like, how do you combat? Like, I personally don't think you should be pushing them with the understanding or with the idea that you're like, oh, I want them to build resilient, so I'm going to not let them isolate because then they're not going to want to socialize. Like, how would you approach it? I'm going to answer that by describing what this looks like in adulthood so that people can possibly understand what is this personality that your child may be presenting with, and what does it look like when allowed to thrive as it is. So, people who are highly sensitive often have jobs in healing spaces, caregiving, helping professions,

we call it, and many times they're creatives. And yeah, many of them may struggle with overstimulation or a different kind of stimulation in the workplace and social expectations. They may, you know, be people who need to have different kinds of emotional boundaries. And they can also be researchers or people who are just focused on less busy, chaotic environments. And while these people may be at higher risk for things like burnout or overwhelm, right, what I would tell parents of kids who might be displaying some of these qualities is that you are potentially raising an exceptionally emotionally, emotionally attuned human being. You are dealing with a child who may be genetically, temperamentally predisposed

to being a gifted creator or an innovator, right? Right? Or a healer. So with that in mind, what we don't want to do with these kinds of kids is say, you're wrong, you're bad. There's something wrong with you that we need to fix. And I know a lot of people are like, oh, but sometimes kids need medication for ADD. I'm not going there. I'm going to stick with this kind of like highly sensitive person categorization that we're talking about. That child is likely experiencing things on a level that parents in previous generations

were told to dismiss, right? Kids were told there's something... Roll them in the deep end, get them into school, make sure they play sports. Let him cry it out. He'll figure it out, right? Like, he's going to go to that party and have a good time. The other side of this is that a lot of the permissive parenting movement also has made room

for, in many cases, an accommodation that many accuse parents of not being able to kind of build resilience. So as a parent, like, that's the challenge. Honestly, as a friend, as a partner, that's the challenge. that's the challenge what's the balance and if you're that person it's also that's what it looks like in adulthood too like what is that balance which i'm going to talk about next you know what i hear what got to drag you to Costco it's for your own good that you overcome this fear let's talk about some some practical tools right like practically speaking if you're experiencing this and

you are new to understanding this kind of like diagnosis or this diagnostic nomenclature um what do you do? So we're going to talk about a few categories, nervous system regulation, emotional boundaries, sensory awareness, and reframing sensitivity as a strength. So let's start with nervous system regulation. We love a nervous system regulation. So if you are a highly sensitive person, you're always going to be a highly sensitive person. That's the other thing about heritable traits. They don't change depending on if you had a bad day. They can shift in intensity, but this isn't like something that you're going to make go away.

You are a highly sensitive person. But there are things that you can do to feel more in control of the things about you and perhaps not have it be as disruptive to your life. But a lot of that, I think, is about expectations. So for nervous system regulation, guess what? You are a person who's going to benefit from things like breathwork,

learning about breath, learning about the physiological ways to activate your sympathetic nervous system. Jonathan's taking a deep breath right now. Right now. Guess what? Baths sitting in a warm bath can be very calming and regulating. Down time. Like structuring in unstructured time in your day.

In addition, your nervous system is going to be really, really sensitive to things in the environment. I just wear earplugs anytime I have. have to go on an airplane. I wear them the whole time. Everything feels like too much sound, whether it's the clicking of the, you know, keys of the person next to me, to the actual sound of the plane, like the ambient sound, it's too much. The person coming over, the loudspeaker, it's all, so I just wear earplugs all the time. I can still hear, but it just kind of dampens it. Some people were noise-canceling headphones, but things like dim lighting. I was going to say, if you're at home, changing your lighting, changing your light bulbs to a soft orange light at night will change your life.

And these are things that are unconsciously being processed by your nervous system. And if you are in HSP, you may not even realize that's part of what's going on. So why not stack the chips in your favor to have less dysregulation of your nervous system? Also, something that may not be obvious, decluttering your space. can have a huge impact. The other thing about nervous system regulation, you're not going to like this one. You cannot watch violent or emotionally disturbing content

if you're a person who is very sensitive. Media diet is the new diet. This guy. There may be times in your life. I will watch things if I want to watch like a crime documentary that I know is not bloody. I have to watch it in the day. I was going to say, watch it early in the day.

Have some decompression time. Because my body will literally get kind of, of overstimulated. So that's nervous system regulation. Those are just the basic things that you can kind of do to start learning better how to kind of calm your body down. Emotional boundaries is a huge one and a really hard one. Maybe like I don't know if it's the biggest. It's hard to have favorites here. I mean, it's hard because for people who are highly sensitive, you just want to fit in. You just don't want to be different. And so setting boundaries seems like, oh my gosh, it's another thing and I want to be weird. Guess what? These are the things that you can do to change the way you function as a highly

sensitive person. Practice saying no. No. And no is a complete sentence. It doesn't have to be like, no, but this is why. The acronym I've been taught, you don't have to justify, argue, defender, explain anything. You can just say no. Oh, sorry, the acronym is jade. You don't have to jade it. You don't have to justify argue. Don't be jaded. Just say no. Would you like to do this? No, thank you. You can say no. Thank you. That's also nice. But saying no without feeling the need to get your nervous system revved up to explain your no thank you it's a full statement when you learn to say no as a full sentence as a full statement the amount of space mental and emotional space that you get is unbelievable yes so much of my life was spent well it's no but i have to think about how to make

this understandable and and well if i say it like this and if i angle it like that they won't be upset it's exhausting. It is exhausting. And people who are people pleasers know this very well, but it's super important for highly sensitive people to learn the know. Also, have you ever been with someone and after you spend time with them, you feel exceptionally rung out? And your mind is racing about all the things they said and did and the things that they're planning and the things that they need and what if they did this? If you find yourself unable to separate from, sometimes those people are called energy vampires, sometimes it's just an overstimulating person or even an overstimulating environment. Some, I'm going to be honest, some contemporary museum exhibits can be really overstimulating.

Because like a lot of, like, let's put you in a room with a ton of lights and static and see if you like it. And if you feel it's artistic, I don't know, because I'm so overstimulated. You have to limit that time in those kinds of spaces and with those kind of people. You just do. There will be people in your life that are seemingly, well, we get along, but you feel badly afterwards. Or just overstimulated. Pay attention. Pay attention. Is your system revving? Is someone calming or exciting to your system? Now, exciting is not necessarily good. One more thing from emotional boundaries.

If you are a person who leans towards understanding energy or kind of into metaphysical conversations around these things, this would be a time to think about visualizing a protective bubble around yourself. It's a conceptual bubble, but it can help create a sort of resonance in you that feels like you're giving yourself some resilience and some protection. I'm going to spend time with someone that I find very taxing. What would you instruct me to do? The first thing I would instruct you to do is have little mini check-ins during your time with them. Before you are in close proximity, when you're just starting to be like, let's say you're driving up and you're meeting at a

coffee shop. Before you got out of your car, notice yourself. What it feels like in your body. How do your solar plexes feel? How does your heart feel? How does your sort of belly feel? Then when you get there, maybe there's a little nerves. You're not sure how the conversation is going to go. That's totally normal. But then sort of as you settle in, how do you feel?

Do you feel like you're being pulled? Do you feel pushed? Do you feel centered in yourself? Do you feel like your solar plexes are kind of like starting to fold in on themselves? Or do you feel like you're expansive? if you start to feel like you're being drained, and that for me can feel like literally my solar plexes are kind of folding in or I get this feeling that I'm like,

I'm not really hungry. I feel that right now. Well, take a breath and pull your energy into yourself. But then what? Okay, keep going. Because, but this is the work is to either, if you feel like that and you're being pulled like that, you may be giving your energy away

or it may be pulled from you. So you have to either cut a cord, you have to set a visualization to re-center your own energy. And if that could mean taking a deep breath, focus on your feet, pull energy up from the ground, up through your entire body. Imagine it going up over your head, cascading down around you, creating that little bubble. That little bubble is your energetic body and you want to feel protected, safe, secure in that little bubble. You can also do that before you go see this person. 100%. Well, that's why I'm saying you should do it before.

you should during and definitely after tell yourself you're safe to ask yourself to be shown if there's anything that you need to be aware of. I had a spiritual teacher who said especially when he would travel, he would go through the airport imagining himself floating in this little bubble protecting his energetic space. That's very helpful. Thank you. Let's talk about sensory awareness practices. So we've talked about nervous system regulation. We've talked about emotional boundaries.

what are some of the things we can do to kind of help us understand better the sensory awareness that we have? Some people find writing about this helpful, meaning getting it out of your head, out of your body, and onto paper. What situations do you identify and write about them, write about what it feels like, what you think about it? Writing can be a very good way to, like I said, get it out of your head and out of your body. Jonathan, grounding techniques are really important for regulating sensory awareness sensitivity. Some grounding practices, well, I love a weighted blanket. I even have a small weighted blanket so it can travel with me. I have a weighted pillow.

Walking barefoot, this is like a thing, putting your feet in the dirt. Like it's actually a thing and there's a really interesting science behind it, which we don't have the ability to get into. Some people do tapping, which is I think, what's it called, the emotional freedom technique where you tap, different regions. What's another grounding activity? Lie on the ground anywhere. It doesn't have to be outside even. Surrender to gravity.

Go in your living room. Go if you're in your bedroom. Lay flat on a hard surface. And if you want to get wild, put your feet up so that you're getting blood flow down. You mean like straight up in the air? Could be straight up, could be like on a chair, anything. So all of a sudden, you're just like, it is. an unbelievable sensation, how quickly we go from moving around. Like, as soon as we get that level

of stillness, things just slow down. Amazing. Another sensory awareness practice is before you get out of bed in the morning, before you pick up your phone, take two minutes, track your whole body, start at the top of your head. Do you feel any sensation? It could be tingling, it could be fullness. A lot of times I wake up with allergies and I'm like, I can't breathe through one nostril. Do a full scan. Start at the top of your head. Go down. What do you feel in your shoulders? Just anything. doesn't have to be negative, doesn't have to be positive, could just be neutral. What are you feeling in your chest, your belly, anything interesting happening in your pelvis, your legs, your feet, any sensations, it literally kind of primes your brain, and you really can be

doing this throughout the day. So those are some things for sensory awareness. And finally, and kind of to close out this episode, let's talk about the reframing sensitivity as a strength. Jonathan mentioned at the start of this episode, what if people who are highly sensitive people are here to deliver messages, right, about what's really going on. When I react deeply, emotionally, to a piece of art, to a piece of music, I kind of can't believe that everybody's not feeling it, right? Like, I'm here to show you the depth of emotion that can be experienced. Doesn't mean everybody has to be like that way. And you know what? If everybody was like me, we did have a very hard time. We need all different kinds of people. But

what if we frame being a highly sensitive person as a person who's able to feel and then also communicate that to other people as a superpower? I 100% agree. People should see you react to a Knicks game. Sports. I mean, I'm very, very excited by sports and wish, I mean, I do go in person, but it's very overstimulating. I love sports. I always cry in sports games, even if it's not my team. Find yourself a highly sensitive person and make them a good friend. Because Yes, there are ups and downs. Yes, sometimes they won't go to Costco. Yes, they get overwhelmed at airports and in public settings,

but they give us a glimpse of what is possible. And there are so many people who are a little dead inside. I don't say this lightly. Life has beaten many people down and life is difficult. And a lot of people have built up an armor. They don't get too high. They don't get too low. which, look, that has its own benefits,

but to have an infusion of someone who just feels extremely deeply is really a blessing. Yes, and I do appreciate that. But obviously, the things beyond just quote unquote feeling deeply can feel oftentimes like an impediment because it does. It can change,

it can change social outings, it can change plans. You know, I think my kids, I've never like given them this framework, but I think once they learn about this, especially my older son, he's going to be like, oh, that explains so much. I mean, this was maybe five years ago already. It was like Christmas, and your kids wanted to go shopping,

and we ended up going to the grove. A very, very large, excited mall. And they were so, they're like, Mom, is at the Grove on Christmas? This has never happened before. It's like the busiest, like, time and parking and the thing and, like, just everything. That's another way of saying, you know, You went there.

It was busy, but you weren't that overwhelmed. And so I think it's important that even if you are a highly sensitive person, try not to shut yourself in. Know that you can have grounding techniques. Don't push yourself past what you can tolerate, but also don't be afraid to go out in the world and join, for example, your kids to have that experience or your family or your friends. Choose your moments. And I think using some of these managing techniques, whether that be grounding,

whether that be body scans, whether that be creative visualization, you know, don't allow it to isolate you. Also, before we close, I do want to give special attention to the difference between highly sensitive people and neurodivergent people. So I just want to kind of give that a little bit of time because being an HSP and having sensory processing sensitivity is a trait, right? It's a specific trait and it means that your nervous system is more sensitive to stimuli. you have a different way of processing it, right? We went through this whole acronym. Neurodiversity is an explanation of a variation in cognitive functioning

and cognitive processing that changes the way you experience everything and is a term that is designed to include ADHD and dyslexia, different kinds of learning, many on the autism spectrum. But I think it's important to not collapse these two. they can overlap and a lot of people who are highly sensitive people may be given that diagnosis but I think it's important to remember we're talking about a trait right a heritable trait versus an umbrella term that is encompassing a description of of brain processing and functioning that usually reflects more of kind of cognitive and computational abilities even on the emotional

level in our conversations you know we've been speaking to a lot of highly sensitive people people with extrasensory ability. And I'm not saying that highly sensitive and extrasensory are the same, but there is some overlap to them. And Thomas Campbell, for example, was like, you can filter. With exercise, with experience, with training,

you can learn to filter out. He's like, acknowledge it and then use techniques to filter. And so we don't cover as much the techniques, but there are ways that you can learn and request to limit and filter the type of information you're getting to feel less overwhelmed at any given moment. Again, thinking about it from a perspective of allow it to be what it is when you want it to be that way. But if it's becoming interfering in your ability to go out in the world, there are tools and techniques for you. And maybe for another time, or maybe for the comments

section, there is overlap between highly sensitive people and extrasensory perception. This is something that's a little harder to study, obviously, because of a lot of the things that we talk about here in terms of how do we study and understand extrasensory perception. But of course, it makes sense to me, I guess, as a highly sensitive person, that there is this spectrum of being able to tap into certain emotions and in many cases unconscious processing that some people might more easily be able to extend to extrasensory abilities. Final request. If you've made it this far in the episode and you are a highly sensitive person who also has extrasensory abilities, definitely let us know.

We hope that you have enjoyed our exploration of highly sensitive people. We know that there's so many more aspects to this and hopefully we'll be able to talk about it other times. I know that a lot of people are probably wondering what's the role of trauma and they kind of mentioned adverse childhood experiences, ACEs can contribute to highly sensitive people's experiences and processing, but there's so much here and we really appreciate you all learning with us as we learned that I am a 10 out of 10 highly sensitive person. Don't forget to follow us. Follow Miami-Bi-Alex breakdown on Substack. We've got a ton of bonus content there.

Our newsletter all about the podcast is over there. And you'll be notified of things before they even happen anywhere else. So please follow us on Substack on Myambialics Breakdown and Jonathan Cohen at Jonathan Cohen. From our breakdown. For the one we hope you never have. We'll see you next time. It's Myambialics Breakdown. She's going to break it down for you.

She's got a neuroscience Ph.D. or two. And now she's gonna break down, so break down, she's gonna break it down.