Media Storm - This Is How You Do It: Gal-dem's Naomi Larsson Piñeda

Episode Date: June 30, 2022

Warning: Some strong language Media Storm hosts Mathilda and Helena meet their mainstream media matches! In this crossover bonus series with The Guilty Feminist, they interview journalists trying to make an imperfect industry a little bit less so, about their noble goals and - you guessed it - the hypocrisies and insecurities that undermine them! Brought to you by The Guilty Feminist, every other Thursday. Our first guest is Naomi Larsson Piñeda, award-winning journalist and editor at gal-dem, Forbes 30 Under 30 alumna, and musician-by-night (@naomilars / @naomiinblue). Naomi speaks about reporting on Chile's social uprising, ongoing gender inequality in the music industry, and second jobs.  The episode is hosted by Mathilda Mallinson (@mathildamall) and Helena Wadia (@helenawadia).  For more information on The Guilty Feminist and other episodes:  visit https://www.guiltyfeminist.com tweet us https://www.twitter.com/guiltfempod like our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/guiltyfeminist check out our Instagram https://www.instagram.com/theguiltyfeminist or join our mailing list http://www.eepurl.com/bRfSPT For more information on Media Storm:  Follow us on Twitter http://twitter.com/mediastormpod or Instagram https://www.instagram.com/mediastormpod or Tiktok https://www.tiktok.com/@mediastormpod like us on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/MediaStormPod send us an email [e-mail] check out our website https://mediastormpodcast.com Media Storm is brought to you by the house of The Guilty Feminist and is part of the Acast Creator Network. The Guilty Feminist theme by Mark Hodge and produced by Nick Sheldon. This Is How You Do It theme by Samfire (@soundofsamfire)  Thank you to our amazing Patreon supporters. To support the podcast yourself, go to https://www.patreon.com/guiltyfeminist Become a member at https://plus.acast.com/s/media-storm. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Hulu original series Murdoch Death and the Family dives into secrets, deception, murder, and the fall of a powerful dynasty. Inspired by shocking actual events and drawing from the hit podcast, this series brings the drama to the screen like never before. Starring Academy Award winner Patricia Arquette and Jason Clark. Watch the Hulu original series Murdoch Death in the Family, streaming October 15th on Disney Plus. Welcome to the first episode of This Is How You Do It. For those of you who don't know the first new podcast from The Guilty Feminist, at Media Storm, Helena Wardier and I, Matilda Mallinson, take our frustrations at the world out on our own beloved industry, the mainstream media.

So today it's time. for something positive. That's right. There are change makers grinding away in the media working to showcase marginalised voices and make it all a little bit less sensationless and a little bit more uplifting. So we're teasing them in with some midweek, mid-afternoon wine and chocolate biscuits to tell us about how they do things right. This, by the way, is a guilty feminist and media storm crossover series, so it'll be appearing as a bonus episode on both feeds every other week from today. Time now to introduce our guests for the this episode. The award-winning political editor for Galdem magazine was shortlisted for the Amnesty

Media Award for her coverage of Chile's social uprising. And that's just her day job. By night, she's known to country music lovers as Naomi in Blue. She has even been of Forbes 30 under 30. Naomi Larsen Pineda, can I offer you white wine, pink wine, or a rhubarb refresher? Why is that funny? I don't know. This is what I have. next time you can provide drinks fine i will i'm going to go for pink wine because it's a hot day yes i'm so glad that you're not on a post-bastonbury cleanse i'm just going to continue the party excellent matilda do not spill that on any of the equipment matilda is a very spilly person that's a cute nickname that is spilly dilly oh god this is going to stick now

what we're here for. Tell us first what you do now. So I'm Galdem's senior politics editor and I'm quite new. I've only been there a couple of months but I'm really loving it. And what makes Galdem different to other news outlets? It is a publication that is dedicated to amplifying the voices of people of colour from marginalised genders. So we work with writers who fit that description and we tell the stories of how people of colour are marginalised communities navigate the world, living in kind of systems that are against them effectively. Could you give us an example? So one that we recently published this week was a story from Chile about a politician who had watched Michaela Coles, I May Destroy You, saw the stealthing

scene and was inspired to make stealthing a crime in Chile. So she's kind of trying to bring that into the course. Yeah. That is so cool. What a cool story. And for those of you who maybe don't know stealthing is when somebody removes the condom during what was consensual sex and that is a crime in the UK. It's classed under rape but what they're trying to do over there is actually make it into a separate crime I guess. Obviously you mentioned Chile there and a lot of your work has been focused on Chile. First of all just tell us why.

I'm half Chilean. My mum is from Chile so I've got loads of family over there. I went a few years ago in 2019 to sort of live there and float around. around for a bit but then that's when the social uprising happened how how was it reporting in that environment during the social uprising it was super intense i had come from a perspective where it was very personal the reason why there was this social uprising was due to inequality that had built up for years and years and years it's to do with kind of the internet intergenerational trauma from the dictatorship which only finished you know just over 30 years ago that's the pin of shape

Yeah, the Pinochet dictatorship, who was this sort of fascist, awful person who was around for 17 years. Love them. Yeah. The fascist. Shout out to all the fascistice. Yeah, so there was so much bubbling a way that ended up in this huge wave of protests all up and down the country, fighting for indigenous rights, women's rights, LGBTQ plus community, but also just, you know, working class people. It was kind of everything. It was this huge amalgamation of stuff.

And they have a really big protest culture in Chile anyway. So they're protests every single day. And I was in the middle of it all trying to spread the word of what was going on to the international community. When there's something like protest and protests about so many injustices that you just mentioned, and there's so much emotion and there's so much trauma as well wrapped up in all of that, how do you report whilst keeping that kind of trauma, in mind. So I think it's, I think it's super hard because inevitably you take on some of that trauma as a, as a reporter and as a journalist, because you were literally listening to and trying

to understand and trying to be empathetic. Listening, like fully listening is really important and giving people a space to, to share in a trusting way and being accurate in the way that you report their experiences to. That's something that I always, Ask myself, we're taught as journalists that we need to be objective. How do you reconcile objectivity with empathy when you're in an environment, which is so emotive and where you say human rights are at stake? I actually think in that context, objectivity is bullshit. I hear there wasn't too direct questions.

It's like, it's obvious. Like, we know what is right and wrong. You say it's obvious, but so many people. It's because it's such, it's part of the institution, right? It's the old guard in the sort of old-fashioned mainstream where, yes, that is how you were taught and how it's meant to be, you know, this objectivity of the BBC and this non-bias. But I think we just, we live in a different age now where I think we should have learnt by now that actually it's kind of impossible to be objective. Galdem, we have, we're very clear in who we are. I mean, we tell the truth.

That's, I think there's a difference between this trying to be objective and then the truth, right? The truth is way more important than this, like, striving to be objective. And so I think that's where the difference. Because reality is a motive and reality maybe is moral. Yeah, as an example being in Chile, and there was kind of quite famously, the police and the army used sort of, what do they call it, non-lethal weapons, crowd control.

weapons, rubber bullets and tear gas and things like that. But they use them in such a way that they actually seriously injure people and even kill people. And there was a huge crisis of people losing their eyes that they were blinded. You know, that's that's police brutality. That's human rights abuses. If by me speaking to the victims of this and speaking to human rights groups not getting a quote from the from the Chilean state if that's not objective like I just like don't give a fuck

because it's the truth of what is happening So Naomi it's genie time We're going to pretend you're a genie But instead of three wishes You have one wish Stinging genie

You're a stingy You're a stingy Inflation times genie Exactly there's a cost of living crisis Okay You get one wish One wish to change anything you like about the mainstream media.

What is it? I was thinking about this and the first thing that came to my head was that I wish people like Pierce Morgan would just fuck off. Yes.

It's just so... It's just so... Like, why? Why are these people still with so much power? When we know that they like consistently lie, I feel like I'm talking

about Boris Johnson right now. What was it? Like 20 years ago he got sacked from the Daily Mirror for publishing those doctored photos about the British soldiers

abusing Iraqi prisoners. Yeah. Everyone's forgotten about that. Yeah. And he is now super rich, he's super powerful, and I just feel like somewhere down the line, the mainstream media is just allowed shit people fundamentally. Absolutely.

To continue rising to the top. But you could be talking about Boris Johnson because he was sacked for fabricating quotes way back. I mean, if I fabricated quotes or images, I would never come back from that career-wise. No. I don't understand where that community comes. Yeah.

Oh, wait. That's where it comes from. I do think that at some point, the media will kind of have to turn around and look at itself and say that, like, we allowed this. Like, we allowed this happen. We allowed people like Pearce Morgan to broadcast to millions of viewers in the mid-morning and really harm trans and non-binary people

and, like, take the piss out of them, live on air and say, oh, I'm a two-spirit penguin. Horrible, horrible stuff. And at some point, you do hope we'll turn around and take a look at ourselves, but I'm not sure what it would take to get to that point. And I think that the media that now props up, Piers Morgan, or the people who hire him would say, yeah, but this is just the market. You know, there's a market for it.

And if our viewers want it, we're just giving them what they want. But I think what that misses is that the mainstream media very willingly creates this market. very willingly flares up unfounded fears, us and them fears, because it's so much easier to make a profit off a lie than it is of the truth. It's so much easier to make a profit of hate than it is of understanding. There is no moral responsibility in a free market. And so this is what the free market does to an industry, the media that should fundamentally be public service-oriented.

No, you're so right. I think we created this. We created this. And on that note, we're going to take a quick break. have a sip of wine and a chocolate biscuit and we'll be back with you shortly. The chocolate biscuits are still untouched. But the rhububub juice is proving a winner.

Delicious, actually. It is, I know. My dad makes it. Oh, I've made that. Squeezes it with his own hands. No, that's one. My dad makes rhubub juice. That's what my dad does. We'll have everyone next episode, okay?

So, we've gotten rid of Pierce Morgan. He's gone. We've gone on it. Now, let's talk about the stories we do like. What is your favourite story that you've ever reported on? I did a story for The Guardian a little while ago that I think is my favorite because I got to meet Laura Marling. Do you love Laura Marlon? She is my queen.

Pierce Morgan, bad. Laura Maling, Queen. I did a story about gender inequality in the music game. industry. I kind of hate numbers and I hate data and this was like my one and only data story. Because I think my theory was if you go see a gig just in your local pub, you're more than likely not going to see a woman or a non-binary person on stage, right? I wanted some hard solid facts, but couldn't find them anywhere. So then I was like, okay, I'm just going to look on this one gig listing site and then go through every single band that was playing across the UK. Google them,

find out what the makeup of that band was. How long did this take you? Oh my God, it took so much time. Did you have some kind of Excel formula to help you get through? No, because I do not understand. I do not know anything about Excel. I only recently learned how to add up the cells. Are they called cells?

Yeah, I still don't know that. I still couldn't do this. This is, yeah, maybe not great for women, John. It was. You don't represent all women, okay? This is what I feel like this one is. that pressure. Like if I'm, if I'm with a bunch of people and it's like, oh, let's kick around a ball. Does anyone want to play? And none of the women want to play. Then I'm like, oh, I have to

play. Yeah, for the kind. Yeah. I feel that way when I'm parking and if it's like particularly tricky and I feel like everybody's looking at me and I'm like, no, because I'm really going to like fulfill the stereotype that women can't drive. I will, I will park for you. One time I was parking in a really, really, really crowded car park and this man came up, hadn't even tried to park yet. So I haven't demonstrated how... Your skills. My skills. He came up and he said, would you like me to park for you? Oh! Stop!

I know. I would have been like... I lost it. Would you like me to do your shopping for you? I park my ass off. I part like I have never parked. Oh my gosh. I'm so proud of you. Thank you. How did we get on to this? So data. Okay, so yes. Yes. So you were trawling through

this gig listing site. Yeah. And I imagine the conclusion was a hell of a lot of men. More than two-thirds of the live music acts performing on this random day in October, I think it was. We'll feature no women on stage. And that was five years ago, you said that article came out. And it is still a problem.

It's still a hot topic. I went to Prima Vera Festival in 2019 and again this year. And in 2019, they had committed to a 50-50 lineup. So that was 50-50 of men and women. But in committing to that, what they had also done, I think just naturally, it meant that there were more people of colour playing. It meant that there were more people with disabilities playing. It meant that there were more marginalised genders playing.

And honestly, it was the best festival I have ever been to. That year, it felt so amazing. One day, I remember I turned to my friend and I said, we've only seen women today. And it was absolutely amazing. And this is coming from someone who was a very big fan of men with guitars. yeah honestly i don't ever want to go to a festival again where they haven't committed to it yeah it sucks it sucks okay i have a question actually because a friend of mine shared his playlist with me and i noticed that it was pretty much all men

good music but all men and he said yeah okay you're probably gonna think i'm sexist i just don't really enjoy listening to female singing voices as much as male singing voices can you say that sexist because that's not a choice i feel like he just really hasn't listened to that much music yeah exactly exactly A female voice is so diverse. A female voice is not like a homogenous group. You know what I mean? There's so many different sounds. And also, you know, it's not just singers.

It's drummers and musicians of all kind of producers. Producers, I think, the ratio is far, far worse. Our resident artist, Samfire, is also a female producer, and she's part of a group called 2% Rising. And it's called 2% Rising because 98% of producers in the music industry are men. and also if you think about it like that they're the people who kind of create the sounds effectively of what we listen to

so it almost in a way it makes sense that your friend would think like that because so much of the music that we listen to and consume has been through the ears and the hands of men they're kind of putting a little man tinge on the music

oh man tins sounds like the worst after shave ever Can I just say something about Paul McCartney? Yes. Because I've just come back from Glastonbury, and I feel a bit croaky. And so it was really mad for me to see, like, mad in a good way to see Paul McCartney headline. But he, there was not a woman on stage. And the two guests that he bought on, Dave Grohl and Bruce Springsteen, like, fine.

Yeah, they've contributed to the world of music. But do we really need to men with guitars? You know, there were tens of thousands of people in this crowd. I just think, yes, you have lots of power. You need to fucking take responsibility of what image you're projecting to these people. Get fucking women musicians on stage. The power of pulling someone from an underrepresented musical demographic onto that stage in that moment. You could have done so much more with that moment than you.

you did because your brain's just not on it and bringing it back into the world of journalism editors need to take that responsibility to in terms of the diversity and the types of stories that we're covering it's got to be a constant we are all poor mccartney and i guess i guess with organizations like galdem where you are constantly consciously trying to correct an imbalance some people might look at it and say oh but you only commission writers of color you know I couldn't write for you guys and some people

would be like oh but how's that helping but this is the issue unless you are constantly consciously correcting the imbalance it just doesn't happen exactly tell us a little bit more about the music you make what you do what your sound is can you sing for us come on we need some more female gigs female gig number one here in my living room

I mean to be fair I need to up my Spotify numbers say I'm very late. So I'm an artist called Naomi in Blue. Yeah, sing a songwritery stuff, but I have a band. It can get a bit heavy, a bit psychedelic sometimes. It's been quite helpful actually to balance the journalism side and the musical side, because it's another way of telling stories effectively. Do you feel ever the pressure to only be doing one thing? Can't be doing journalism and music. Pick a lane. I think it is actually really vital that you do lots of different things because we as human beings are multi-faceted people and I cannot think of anything worse than only doing one thing because I would just I think I'd lose it because it's also it's not

always going to go well your career and then so you have the other thing that you do to fall back on and enjoy and give that gives you happiness and I think that goes either way especially now that one job won't even pay you a basic living wage and you might still be on two facts you may as well pick up a couple thing you kind of have to and I also think as a As a freelance, it's just so hard being a freelance journalist, although I would say that I do recommend it, I loved it, and it was great and I got to do, like, so many amazing things. Yeah, love it. No illusions.

It is, it is a grind. You know, it's just constant rejections, it's constant late payment. Chasing massive multinational corporations to pay you. You have so much money. To pay you for something that you published, Microsoft. Yeah, and to pay you like 70 pounds. This is also, yeah, exactly. you need to have a little side gig as a freelancer

and I think anyone who doesn't have a side gig is lying because it's literally impossible to survive I could add a few things to my Twitter by it yeah yeah Naomi where can people follow you and do you have anything to plug I'm on Twitter you can find me at Naomi Lars N-A-O-M-I-L-A-R-S

it's part of my surname Bacalph I don't know what I thinking it would have been easier just to put my actual name. And I'm on Instagram as well as at Naomi in Blue. And on Spotify, people can stream you, I guess. Naomi in Blue, Spotify, wherever you listen to your things. And a few more plugs for our listeners. In case you haven't noticed the last two guilty feminist episodes,

see Deborah joined by none other than Jonathan Van Ness of Queer Eye Galore. Helena's really excited next to me. Too excited. So head on over and give them a listen. It was just great. They've got such a soothing voice and I love it. Even more silky than the hair. The hair. The hair. Anyway. Meanwhile.

Meanwhile, over at Media Storm, we've been investigating abortion access. How reporting has unfolded in the US over the shocking overturning of Roe versus Wade and the surprising ongoing barriers to abortion here in the UK. So that episode will be out next Thursday, the 7th of July, in time for your morning commute. See you then.