Mention It All - Bring Back Tamra… And Jesus Jugs? Ft. Heather Dubrow (RHOC)

Episode Date: February 24, 2022

RHOC legend Heather Dubrow joins Dylan to talk about her tumultuous return to Housewives. They discuss her issues with Shannon and Noella, and how social media has changed the game of being on reality TV. Heather reflects on bringing her kids back on the show, and why it was so important for her to be authentic about her family dynamics. Later, she talks about her new show with her husband, 7 Year Stitch, and why helping Dr. Jen with her marriage is in line with how she lives her life. And finally, she responds to Tamra’s comments about her on WWHL, and says who else she’d like to see come back next season. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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We'll go check me, boo. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Mention at All podcast. I am Dylan Hafer. And today, I am joined by a very exciting guest, one of our favorite Real Housewives of Orange County, Heather DeBrow. Hi, Heather.

Hi, how are you? I am doing great. I'm so glad we could finally make this happen. Last time I saw you was in New York right before the season premiered. So it feels like we have been through a lot since then. Yes, we have. I remember we had a lovely glass of champs together. We did.

I was sad to see there was no new episode this week. Do you know why that was? Everybody was confused. I know. People think it's like an on-the-spot decision, but they actually plan it out in advance. And there's always a couple of weeks that are dark. So this will be the last dark week until the end.

Okay. So you must be gearing up for reunion season. And how are we feeling about that? Any anxiousness? No, it's funny. You know, I, I'm not anxious about the reunion. The thing for me is that when you are authentic, when you have truth on your side, when you're willing to make amends for things you've done wrong or overstated,

or whatever's happened, there's no reason to be upset. Totally. And, you know, this is your first time back on the show. show in five years. It's been like a decade since you started your housewives journey overall. I'm curious coming back this year, if you felt like the overall sort of Bravo landscape changed in that time and what you've noticed might be different, the experience of being on the show, not just specifically, obviously the cast you're in is different. Right. I mean, I would say what the two things that I've noticed and one is more global and one's

more specific to our show, is that social media has gotten really mean. I mean, look, there's always been trolls and all of that and people hiding behind, you know, a keyboard. But it really is so shocking to me, the vitriol. I mean, it's palpable, right? I mean, it's just, it's crazy. Even when they like you, they have something bad to say. I mean, it's just, it's really crazy. forget about having fix it again. I think it's at the point where you just really can't look at it. So I would say that has changed for sure. Andy Cohen and I were talking about that. And then I would say for our cast in particular, you know, look, the way that these shows live the best is obviously when it's a connected group of people. and I think from what I've heard, that's been missing for quite some time. So for me, to come back in,

and maybe you remember when I first joined the show 10 years ago, I was like plucked and stuck in the middle of a group. I had no, I didn't know anybody, but they were all very connected. And I think that's what the audience has been pushing against for the last few years. So when I came in, again, didn't know anyone except Shannon, it was almost like starting over again. But I felt it too. You know, of course they had let half the cast go and hired new people on. So it was a little bit disjointed. What I would say is by the end of the season, it is a really, very clear, tight friendships that have formed. And I think that was the purpose of this season, which is why I keep saying it's transitional. Totally. And like you mentioned, Shannon is the one person in this cast

that you had worked with in the past. And you two have a lot of history with each other. I would say that you have kind of an up and down relationship. You know, one week we see you really not getting along. The next week you're doing edibles in her living room together. What did you feel like, you know, where do you feel like that kind of dynamic lies? Because I think it is really interesting to watch that develop now over the course of like seven years. But it seems complicated. It is complicated, but I think after the initial situation with Nicole and the lawsuit and all of that stuff, I know a lot of people thought I overreacted and blamed Shannon for what happened.

But I think at the reunion, maybe it'll become more clear why I had the reaction I had. Maybe people will agree with me. Maybe they won't. I don't know. But there's a reason I felt so strongly about it. but after we made up, after I had her pinky promise with me at Shane's party, I know, I'm so silly. But I mean, we were done. And so it was hard for me to watch it and see that Shannon was talking about me a bit behind my back.

She was making comments about me to Noella. Because as far as I was concerned, we were done and we were good. And we actually did hang out and I invited her to a dinner. They didn't show this. but we had a dinner together and we were just fine. Yeah, it's tough on a show like this when obviously you have cameras following your relationship. Just because you're not best friends with somebody, if you get to a place where you say, we've argued enough, we've come to whatever resolution we're going to come to,

and now we can just move forward, then I can imagine it's hard to watch on the show. Maybe for the other party, it wasn't, they weren't quite ready to move on. And it's like, I thought we, I thought we did this. Come on. Right. Right. So we, in the last episode, we saw the idea come up. I think from Emily that Shannon might be jealous of your new friendship with Gina. You two have been very fast friends. I think people are really enjoying your dynamic with Gina. What was your reaction to hearing the idea of jealousy brought up? And do you think that holds any water? I mean, at this point, I hadn't, I didn't see any of that.

I, you know, didn't notice anything. I mean, obviously I saw, I watched the show and I saw Gina, you know, talk about Shannon's reaction, but I didn't notice that at the table, honestly. I didn't see any of that. And, you know, it's hard. You're at a party and you're at these events and you're just trying to keep your head above water most of the time. So, yeah, I didn't, I hadn't seen that. Yeah, I think watching these shows and not having been in that situation, there's more going on at one of these luncheons than most of us have kind of happening in our social lives for a three-month period. I mean, you have what's going on with the edible and the living room and there's the situation at the table and Noella is going through it for like the 42nd time

this season. So there really is a lot to keep track of and I can totally understand why if you're there in the moment, you're like, I didn't even realize that that was a thing that was potentially happening. Right. And then what's funny about that statement is that when nothing, so it seems like all the stuff always happens at everything we go to. But the truth is, if nothing happens, they probably just don't show it. Right. There's always these events and dinners and drinks and all of that stuff that sort of gets left on the cutting room floor. And I think people don't necessarily realize that over the course of filming a season, you might do, you know, double the amount of, events we actually end up seeing. Yeah, it's true. You know, one of the things that I do wish, though, and I know, look, for every 30 hours we film, only 20 minutes makes it to the air, which is so crazy. So you can imagine how much we actually film that does end up on the cutting room floor. But what I wish that they had shown more of was the fun, because, like, in Cabo, there was a

whole day and a half that wasn't even shown. And we were in, you know, downtown Cabo and we were having drinks and you know, Emily lifted a purse skirt and showed her butt and was lying in the thing and we were running through this. I mean, we had so much fun and we did it. We had, there was so much happened. That was great, but it just, you know, there wasn't time for it. I did feel like we needed another episode of the Cabo trip because it felt like one week we were watching you on your real estate tour and Noella having a meltdown in the salt cave or wherever they were. And then the next episode, you're fighting at dinner. And then it's like, that's the trip. We're back in Osi. Yeah. Yeah. I wish they had shown more of that stuff. And even like that dinner

when Nuela eventually got there, that was such a long day. And they didn't show any of it. But we had this fabulous designer flying from Mexico City. And she did a fashion show for everyone. And everyone got these cool pieces. And then we went to Akre. And we and we, and we, and we, we, made um saviche we did like a cooking thing and they taught us how to make their special mango margaritas because we had picked mangoes from the trees there and there was a puppy rescue at the place and we got to play with the puppies and one of the dogs got to eating Shannon's dress. It was it was really funny. You're like so they make you seem a little crazy with the scheduling on the show but you're like no we had a good time. It was a fun itinerary. We really did. And look,

I do, I do that. I'm I always make an it. because I like to have a plan, but I'm pretty malleable. Like if people don't want to do one thing and they want to do another, I'm like, I'm like, oh. Girl, winter is so last season. And now Springs got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders.

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Spright is a registered trademark of the Coca-Cola Company. So speaking of the dinner with Noella, I've talked to a few different people who were dying to hear the uncensored version of what was on some of those cards. What was happening with the credenza? You got to go look at him. Okay, I won't put you on the spot too much, but it was pretty funny to hear. By the way, if you go on Amazon and you scroll down, they show what all the cards say. Okay, good. So those, those, those, that information would have been available to somebody who was purchasing them.

Yes. Yes, they were. I want to talk about Noella a little bit because obviously she's been really going through it this season. All of the stuff that's happening with her husband has clearly been really difficult. and traumatic for her. And I think she's, it's been a little tough with her being new in the group. It seems like all of you, when you're dealing with her, are a little bit at a loss for what she needs from you, how to kind of handle the situation.

What was it like being in that environment with her and kind of navigating that whole experience as she was experiencing it? Well, I mean, my particular experience with her was so odd because I met her three times. You know, we had lunch at Nobu, and then she came to my house for the party where I really didn't get to spend time with her because, you know, it went off the rails pretty quickly. And then I saw her at Shane's party where everything was fine and I actually brought her a little gift and to say thanks for being sweet to Max and, you know, whatever. And then the very next time I saw her was when she came over to my house, I thought she was. was going to come over and just like have an easy conversation. Like you called me a fake bitch, like what's going on? No big deal. And get past it. And then she started, you know,

hurtling these lies and accusations at me. And it was so weird and so disjointed. I was like, okay. I like, I physically like had to sit back. But from that point, I was kind of done. So even though I felt horrible for her. And I don't wish anyone going through any of that, especially, you know, in the public eye, I mean, devastating. And she's children. And I can't imagine going through all that. So I felt terrible for her. But I just didn't want to be, you know, I didn't want to be additive to her issues,

but I also didn't want her to be subtractive to my life. It was just a very odd place to be. Yeah. I think that's an important thing to kind of recognize, though, that maybe I can appreciate everything that's going on with you. but I'm not the right person to kind of be there for you. We've seen that on this season of Salt Lake City. Meredith has kind of done that with Jen,

where she's like, I want the best for you, but I need to take a step back right now. And I think especially in a heightened environment where there are cameras and everything is happening, you know, for the show, it's worth kind of checking in with yourself and saying, yeah, I actually can't take this on right now. No. And I think it was also a lot for everyone because, you know,

obviously no one really knew her. Yeah. Right. And you've seen Gina and Emily and it feels like everyone is kind of taking their turn to go, you know, have a heart to heart or whatever with Noella. And everyone leaves kind of like, I feel really bad for her, but I don't actually know what is the right thing to say. What do I offer, you know, does she need to help?

Do I do carpool? I don't know what is kind of the course of action here. Your other new cast member this season is Jennifer, and you have been, I think, really great with her talking about the issues that she's been going through with her marriage. And it seems like you are kind of in a position to offer her a lot of good advice because you and Terry have, I mean, you definitely don't have the same dynamic in your marriage, but maybe kind of a similar perspective. And I'm curious to hear kind of how you felt talking with Jennifer about that. Yeah, you know, it's funny because, you know, she's a doctor and her husband stays home with the kids. And it was like an opposite version of me and Terry because I stayed home for several years and wasn't working. And so I understood both sides of it, I think.

So I like Jen a lot. I think Jen is funny and she's smart. and she's controlling in like the best possible way. But the thing about Jen is, I mean, it was really hard for her to open up to everyone and talk to everyone and tell them what was going on. And it was so sad and brave of her, I thought, and so out of her comfort box. And I think that's why like when you look at that, I think everyone very easily sort of rallied around her because it was so honest and wrong.

You and Terry, I think, have a great relationship on the show. I love seeing that again. And I know you guys have a new project that you've been working on together. Your show Seven Year Stitch is coming to E next week. Can you tell us what that is and why you wanted to take it on together? Yeah. You know, so I'll tell you about the show first. So what we've done is we've taken couples that are in that precarious seven year mark where like the honey. Moon is over and real life is set in and they're pointing fingers at each other and what do we do and why am I with you. And we're separating them. We're separating them for seven weeks. During that time, we're doing an internal external makeover, like full body, mind, soul and trying to make them the most confident best individuals they can be with the hopes of bringing them back together to stitch them back together. So that's the premise of the show. And we've wanted to do something like this for years. You know, Terry and I, we have our separate careers, but together, we've written three books together. We have our skincare line on Shop HQ. We, you know, we've done all,

we had podcasts, like all this stuff. And through one of the books that we wrote, the Dubrow Diet, we had taken this couple on e-news on, like, to show their progress. And we thought it was just going to be a weight loss thing. We thought, okay, we'll bring them on the show, we'll show their progress, the weight loss, blah, blah, and big reveal at the end. But what happened was, we became very involved with them and their family and their dynamic and why this why they got to where they got to and what was going on and we realized that they needed more than just the diet they needed everything and so and they're great people and and they were on the brink of maybe separating and getting a divorce and now they're fantastic and together and wonderful so when we talked about

doing a show and this show came to fruition. We were like, we love this. This is about us helping people stay together. But here's the thing. When you make someone their best self, it also could have the opposite effect where they feel like I am now feeling myself and I am now good and I don't need you. Yeah. So the question is, right? So the question is, did we help stitch them back together or did we just accelerate the separation? Right, because I mean, there are situations where maybe they're not meant to be together and you're giving them the tools to figure out what they, what the next step needs to be. Totally. And so for us, the reason why we wanted to do the show, it's not dissimilar to why we came back to housewives. I mean, one of the reasons, big reasons, we came back to housewives

was because, you know, we thought after Max came out and she had so much support and there were, you know, obviously, you know, tragic stories about estranged families and kids that had, you know, taken their own lives because they couldn't come out safely and, you know, just all kinds of stories. We thought, okay, well, maybe we could show what our version of a normal family looks like and start conversations in other people's homes. I had no idea that Kat, I mean, I knew she was a lesbian, but I had no idea she was going to talk about it on the show. But I'm proud of her, and I'm glad she did. And I feel like between her and Max, like, you know, really, been able to do that if the comments are any indication. So when it comes to seven years stitch,

Terry and I thought, God, we're so lucky. We're together 25 years. We've had good days, bad days, good years, bad years. And we've managed to get through it. But there are definitely people out there that go, oh, well, if I had their money, you know, I'd be great too. But it's not about money, definitely. But it is about resources. So we thought, okay, what if we give these people our resources and try to help them. Yeah. And going back to what you said about your kids and bringing them back on the show, I know when we talked in November,

you were saying that it was fun kind of coming back now that they're a little older and they can sort of participate in a way that they wasn't really on the table before. Have your kids been watching the show this season or sort of following along? And how has that been? Yeah, a little bit. And then, you know, we had like a little fight at the dinner table in one of the episodes. or the kids did, two of the kids. And so, you know, and they were like,

why would they show that? And I'm like, it's normal. It is not a big deal. Who cares? Move on. I liked seeing in that scene when there was kind of the tension going on that your son kind of was stepping up and, you know, helping. It's nice to see because I think sometimes we've seen Max come out of

Rochelle a little more on the show, but we don't always hear from your other kids as much. So it's been fun this season to kind of see all of them. pretty actively participating. Yeah, and you're also going to see, so we go to New York in a couple weeks on the show, and Gene and I go, and Max and Nicky are there, which is great. So hopefully, I don't know what they'll show, but hopefully you'll get to see more of Nick. He's such a cool kid.

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and thick, rich ketchup. We all know it's not a cookout without Heinz and Kraft. Your scenes with Kat, I just want to say, I think it's been really amazing to see. And especially right now, there's so much in the news, there's these, you know, don't say gay bills and all of this stuff. And I think now maybe more than ever for you to be on the show, not just accepting your kids' choices, but actively encouraging them and uplifting them to embrace their identities. I think it really, you know, it stands to make such an impact. And I saw some comments.

When you had that People magazine, I think, did the article about Kat a few weeks ago, and there was some great photos and all this stuff. People were making these comments that were like, she's a kid. Who cares? Why are we talking about this? This should be a private thing. It's nobody's business. And to me, that's kind of the exact atmosphere that creates this, you know, sentiment of we shouldn't be talking about this. This is something to be put off to the side.

and I love the way that you have kind of flipped that on its head and said, no, if you want to talk about it, we're going to talk about it because it's not something to be ashamed of. Right, exactly. And the people that are making those comments are missing the point entirely. This isn't about, you know, getting an article in People magazine. It's about someone might pick that up at the airport and read about our family and go, okay, maybe I can talk to my parents or maybe I should listen to my kid or have these conversations. And then there's other people that make comments like, should I come? out saying I'm straight. No, you don't have to because that's accepted and no one's persecuting you. Right. That it's not, it's not something that needs to be a storyline or needs to be attention getting. It's just that this is the reality of what's happening and there's nothing. You know, it's not even that it's a positive thing. It's that it's just normal. It's just what's happening. And, you know, the fact that you're not afraid to talk about it or bring it on the show or, you know, feel like it's something to be kind of kept to the family conversation.

I really have appreciated that this season. No, but I will say this. It's their stories to tell. So, you know, when Max came out, she came out when she wanted to come out. And, you know, we knew Cat was gay. I had no idea she was going to talk about it on the show. But that was her decision. And even after we were supposed to just do this, like, fun little thing in the garden

because we have this edible garden and she wanted to change it over to fly. And so we were just there. And I had no idea she was going to, you know, start talking about that. But I was so proud of her. Yeah, totally. And I think, you know, the show is better for it because I think Housewives, obviously we like the drama. And, you know, it's fun when people are arguing. But it can be so many different things. And I love that this is sort of an aspect that now this franchise has embraced and has kind of expanded the world of what Housewives can be. Yeah. I agree. I was really. proud of it. I did want to bring up this week on Watch What Happens Live, Ms. Tamara Judge made an appearance. And she said that she wanted you to come back to House Lives for years and was happy to see you back. But of course, she would have liked to be there with you. I'm wondering, what would your thoughts be about a potential Tamara return in season 17, maybe? Well, I tried to

have her come on the show this year. I invited her to a party. You'll have to ask her why she didn't come. but I mean, I invited her to a party. I wanted her to come back. I thought it would be fun. I mean, for next season, I have no idea. I mean, am I coming back next season? I have no idea. I'll say this.

The season ends in a very unexpected way. I've never ended a season like this before. So it ends in an unexpected, cool way. And I will say this, the connectivity that was missing from the show and the true friendships, they're definitely there. And so what I've been saying is that this is a very transitional season. And I believe that it is. And I believe that at the end of the season, it's exactly where it should be and set up for next season.

I love that. I love that we're laying some breadcrumbs for the future maybe. Is there anyone else from your past tenure on OC that you would also like to see come back? Or are we good leaving everyone else in the past? You know, I mean, it would sound so mean for me to say that since they brought me back, but I actually think Alexis Bellino would be good. I've been saying, I'm an Alexis fan. I think she's hilarious. I think she is, you know, a heart of gold, I guess. She is. Our kids were in, it's funny, a cat and Alexis's son were in a theater group together a few years ago. And so I kept running into her. And I just think she's great.

And I've spoken to her over the years a little bit about this or that. And I think she'd be great. Wow. I love to hear that. I actually yesterday, just by chance, was rewatching a little bit of season, season seven. Your first season, I was when Alexis planned the glamping trip. And this was when like half of your cast had just had surgery. And it was just O.C. was in shambles, but a very fun season to watch.

And it was fun seeing you 10 years. ago, it's crazy. I know. That was so funny. My memory of the glamping was that I decided to, you know how girls like put, or guys do this too, I guess. You take a, like a scarf and you tie it around your head, like a head scarf thing. So I thought I was going to be very edgy at glamping and do that the next day. And I walk out and Alexis and I both have it on. We look like such morons. And I was going to go back to my cabin and take it off. So we didn't look like idiots. And I turned around the cameras already saw us. I'm like, okay. There we go.

Sometimes, sometimes when you're filming, you just got to roll with the punches. You might look a little stupid, but that is part of, I feel like that's part of the experience. 100%. If Tamara comes back, maybe we could have a cut fitness party 2.0. Maybe things would go a little better this time, hard to say. You never know. Well, Heather, we have been loving this season. It is not over yet.

So make sure you're watching on Wednesdays. and seven-year Stitch next Tuesday on E. Make sure to watch that too. Thank you so much. It was great seeing you. Great to see you too. Thanks, Heather. Thanks for listening.

Don't forget to rate, review, and follow the show wherever you listen. You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches. And until next time, be cool. Don't be all like uncool. Mention It All is produced by Sean Kilby and Jorge Morales Pico. Editing by Sean Kilby.

Social media by Dylan Hafer. guest booking by Nicole Pellegrino. Be sure to follow at Bravo by Betches on Instagram and Twitter. All pay off your home, travel for life, drive a Ferrari. In celebration of the world premiere of the Monopoly Big Board Buckslot Machine by Aristocrat Gaming, Yamava Resort and Casino at San Manuel is giving one person a $1.6 million dream package. The biggest prize in Yamava's history. Club Serrano members can earn daily instant prizes and secure a spot in the finale May 29.

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