Mention It All - Delusions Of Slander Ft. Jordana Abraham (RHONJ, Summer House)

Episode Date: March 2, 2022

Dylan and Jordana are back to recap RHONJ’s messy AF shore trip, where we get our clearest look yet at Luis and Teresa’s relationship—for better or worse. They also discuss the Gorga family’s never-ending loyalty issues, and why Traci should probably stay out of it. Later, they recap the latest Summer House, where Paige seems to be drawn to Craig’s games, and Kyle just can’t stop himself from ruining things with Amanda. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Ha ha laugh funny Mention It All A Bravo by Betches podcast We don't say that But now we said it With Dylan Hafer Hey everyone Welcome back to the Mention at All

podcast I am Dylan Hafer Joined by my usual Wednesday companion Jordana Abraham Hey Jordana So good to be back with you And another dramatic week of Bravo I had Agita last night

The Jersey episode I was like Do you know what I mean? It was having like anxiety vicariously through them. Yeah, it's the kind of thing where I feel like everybody's kind of circling each other and there's no resolution. And we have Jackie all of a sudden saying that she's done with Jennifer when it seemed like they were maybe going to be in a good place. And obviously, Dolores is having an issue with Melissa. You know, it feels like everything is just very unsettled. And I don't see a clear path to harmony within the group.

Totally. And you have like all the issues all brought up in one time in one place. And like literally everyone was just like it was like their opportunity to just like say everything. Just that outdoor area, Jen's house. Jennifer's house. We've been revisiting some some past topics of conversation. Evan and Jackie's rumors are going to come back up. we're still talking about whatever Margaret did in the past.

Jennifer and Bill, obviously, Teresa and Louie, it feels like nobody's issues are off the table right now. And in a way, that's very exciting. But it also makes it a little difficult to follow the thread of what we're actually arguing about at any given moment. Totally. Like everyone's just kind of like leveraging whatever the discussion is to sort of insert their problem that they have with someone else there. Right.

What was the thing with like, I think Joe Gorga suddenly, He, like, made a comment. Like, they were, it was like, uh, Margaret was fighting with Louis and Teresa. And then somehow Joe Gorga figured out a way to like bring the cook's thing back in. Right. Right. It's like, well, Margaret, how dare you talk about Louis when you did this thing in your marriage? And that's not that different from Bill.

And if Jackie had been through what Jennifer went through, wouldn't she want to be supportive? But then Jackie is coming for Teresa. You know, it feels like everything is kind of in the same. confused almost. It's like a circle, but also there's like weird interconnections within the circle. But we obviously start from where we left off last week, where Teresa has stormed out of the house. But that is not her opinion of what happened. I mean, Teresa, she has like the ability to just, I mean, I don't know how she gets away with it.

She just like, she just lies. Yeah. And I actually thought, so Jennifer, I feel like didn't really do anything. She wasn't particularly messy in the way she told the women what happened. It was just like, yeah, it was really weird. I went upstairs to get dressed and then there was this thing and Teresa went up and in a huff. Everybody's in a huff this episode.

But I didn't feel like Jennifer was trying to start shit or spread a rumor or anything. She just literally told them what happened and she didn't even know details. And then it's not that weird that when Teresa finally arrives, somebody's like, hey, what happened? And she's like, what are you talking about? Which is literally just like so, I mean, it's kind of like Teresa's of the opinion that if you just like say something enough or deny something enough or say something enough, then it becomes true.

Like with the, you know, with the Jackie. It kind of like when she was like starting the room about Jackie, like it, like if something that makes no sense, if you say it enough times, people will believe it. And I guess that sort of works because people have been. just kind of like let it go with her. Right. There's enough different things going on that we can't spend an hour trying to figure out why Teresa left in a huff.

But I do think this episode we see kind of the most interesting look we've had so far at her relationship with Louis because, again, when they're in the car to this barbecue, she specifically reminds him that they're on camera, which again, it's kind of like you're filming for this show. It shouldn't be that strange that you're on camera, but it clearly seems like she pretty much wants him to say as little as possible when they're on camera. And this continues into the barbecue when Margaret brings up the video.

And you can have your opinion about whether or not the video should be brought up. But she brings it up, I think sort of just wanting to clear the air a little bit. And Teresa does not want Louis to respond. to this at all. In a way that it's like, you're at this group event and it has been brought up. You can't just pretend that it hasn't been brought up. So even if you don't want him to feel like he needs to explain himself, he's going to, he's going to speak. Right. And I mean, you got a, you got a kind of weird glimpse into their relationship. And it, I mean, I said this, I think,

last week that I was, or two weeks ago that I was Team Louis. And now I'm kind of like, I don't know if I love the way that like you guys are that you're talking to her fully. I mean, Teresa is a very difficult person I would imagine to date. But the way that they were that, that, um, he was talking to her was a little, was a little weird. And I think, um, I forget, who is Tiki's wife? I forget her name. Tracy. Tracy even said this to Tiki when she was like, um, what did he say to her? He's like, she's not, if I don't leave now, she's never going to learn. Yeah. I didn't really like that. That felt like very...

Right. Tracy said it's how she talks to the dog. Yeah. It feels like you're sort of explaining... It felt like how you would sort of teach social skills to like a second grader. Like you have... Right. You know, okay, so when you get in an argument, sometimes it's best to just walk away. And if you don't leave, how will you learn to, you know, handle your issues with whatever?

And it's like, okay, that's one thing when you're sort of... of maybe showing somebody who hasn't been in that situation before, but it felt very much like, no, I'm coaching you to be this certain way. And if I don't do the, if I don't do the coaching, then you're not going to know how to be. And it's like, you know, Teresa has her faults for sure, but she's a grown up who has been handling her issues for a long time. And so it's, it's this weird back and forth where Teresa doesn't want him to answer, but then also he doesn't, he's trying to sort of shut her up, it feels like. And it feels like neither of them are kind of just able to have this conversation in a normal way.

Right. And I mean, I think he was like maybe wanted to do that, it seemed like, and she was just like, didn't we even want to take the risk of him saying something that he would regret? And so she like would literally wouldn't let him speak. And then everyone's just. screaming. But I mean, it was interesting to see them interact with each other in this way. It also reminded me that like, it reminded me of Teresa in a relationship with Joe Judeyce, where no matter what he did or said about her to her on camera, she was always, she was never like really like fighting or until the very end or like she was always pretending everything was great between them on camera. And I had forgotten about that. You know what I mean? even when like throughout that the classic famous line of like my bitch wife and he's on the phone

with it sounds like a woman or something. Like she would still kind of deny anything potentially bad in the relationship. So it does seem like that's a trait she carried over to this relationship. Right. Like everything can either be explained away or just fully or just like fully not addressed. And it's nobody's business, which maybe it's not. but also that any sort of question, and I think this kind of comes up with Margaret, that Margaret feels like, not that she isn't happy for Teresa or not that she wants to drag

Louis through the mud, but just that this is a thing that's out there in the world. So can we just hear your take on it? Right. And Teresa views that as this, like, grave attack on her happiness and her relationship. And I think there's a fundamental misunderstanding. there where maybe it is none of Margaret's business, but I don't think she has the negative intentions that Teresa is fighting back. Right.

And she won't even, it's almost like, to me, it's almost, it makes it seem worse that she won't even let them discuss it. I'm like, what are you scared of him saying? Like what, like what? We have to shut down the conversation so intensely. It almost to me, it makes it a bigger deal. Like, I think if she had gone about it, like, okay, like, let's have the conversation. Let's get it out.

Let's talk about what happened. and he explained it in normal way, even though it seemed like they were saying he was lying about what was in the video. I do think it would go away. I think it would be like, okay, like we've gotten rid of the mystery, we've heard his take on it.

It's no longer interesting. But the fact that she won't let him say anything, I'm kind of like, what are you, what is, now I want to know more, you know? Girl, winter is so last season. And now Springs got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cut off.

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So things sort of spin around the group and suddenly we're talking about whether Jennifer was digging up things on Evan, It seems like we have pretty good info that she was, at least talking to Frank about it. That seems like something real that happened. And then you were talking about Melissa and Jennifer's issues. And this is where things sort of go from just arguing at a party to something a little more serious, where we're bringing up the stuff that Jennifer had said about Joe's business last season. and clearly this is something that has really been bothering Joe and he doesn't feel like Teresa has been, has had his back.

And then things just go fully left when Jennifer calls Joe a little bitch and Melissa is not having that. And they get a little physical with each other. I personally, I thought the little bitch comment was, I found it funny, but I understand why for Melissa it, it felt like an attack coming from Jennifer that was kind of really unwarranted. Yeah. I think like she, I mean, I think they're very protective of each other too and they're not

going to like just let this person. It's like, um, it's like an ego thing. And then I thought it was very interesting about on that on that line where like Bill kind of just like walks away. And that whole thing with Jennifer and Bill, that was very telling, I guess in a way. But also I think that like, I think that like, I think that. guys, I think everyone kind of likes Bill. Like just generally speaking, I think he's like a liked character.

He is much less controversy than Jennifer. And I think he sort of enjoys the friendship that he has with these guys. And so, and he enjoys it enough that he's not going to say anything. And also, I think the fact that he doesn't want, he doesn't want to risk someone coming and fighting with him and bringing up his shit. So that was very interesting. Yeah. I think he is the least.

out of this group the least kind of inclined to take up for his wife. And you could look at that multiple ways. Because I think you could say, honestly good for him. He's not getting involved in the women's drama. There's that whole line of like that the women's business and the men should stay out of it. But then I think in this group for a lot of them, it's like, no, you should have my back. You should stand up for me. And when they're leaving the party, Jackie says that she doesn't think Bill can stand Jennifer. And I think that's who knows what the true dynamic is there. But there's an argument to be made. I mean, he clearly doesn't. And when Jennifer brings it up to him later in the episode, he sort of is like, I don't know what you want for me. And he didn't really say,

he didn't really say anything when she said that, which was interesting in itself. Right. And I think particularly when when she's saying to him, I want more, I need more from you. And he's not really picking up on that. It's like it does make you kind of question whether he like fully has her back in a broader sense. Right. And I think, I mean, I think it's, I think it's, I think as many reasons for him that he's not going to eat boss. I mean, I think, I don't necessarily think it's, oh, because he doesn't like her. I think that he, he doesn't want, I mean, he's a doctor. He probably doesn't want to be like, have his shit like aired.

And if you, if you get in, you have to be prepared for what comes back. Like Joe Gorga, he, he gets involved and he gets, you know, his reputation is definitely like on the line. Like that crook thing. He's, I don't know if it actually did cause him issues, but he said it caused him issues. And I think there's like one of fear of like, you know, just throwing stones in glass houses for him. Maybe he has some secrets that he doesn't really want to be like the part. of the drama. And two, again, like, I think he likes those guys. I don't think he, like, wants to fight with George Gorga. I think he enjoys his friendship in that, um, in that group. And also,

I just think it was funny because like Margaret's husband didn't really say anything either. Yeah. And that, no, that didn't really seem to be addressed and like, it's almost more there's, it does seem like there could be a little bit of a double standard there. But I think maybe in a way Margaret doesn't want her husband to be involved in the same way that Jennifer does. And so it's kind of like, I feel like Margaret is getting what she needs out of Joe, whereas Jennifer isn't getting what she needs out of Bill in that situation. So it's like it's a difference in the expectation. And I think Margaret is perfectly content with Joe kind of being less involved, whereas clearly,

Jennifer has feelings about it. And I think as Louis comes more into the group, it's kind of this dynamic that needs to be explored of he did sign up for it in the sense that he has agreed to be on the show and kind of what is Teresa, what does Teresa want his role to be? Because it seems to me, I'm sure Louis has feelings about,

you know, the people talking about his stuff on camera. But it almost feels like Teresa is more unhappy. with the way that he is getting involved in the show. And, you know, we've seen the other women kind of set the boundaries of Joe. Gorga is obviously like a main character, whereas some of the other men are a little more in the background and that there's kind of growing pains with what Louis's role is going to be. And I think Teresa kind of needs to figure that out for them.

Agreed. Yeah. And one thing I was also thinking is that although Joe is not really like saying anything, and I agree, like Margaret sort of definitely holds her own and I don't think expects that of him. He was sitting next to her. Like, and that in a way is like its own form of standing like literally physically standing by someone. It's like Bill kind of like like walked away, which I think was a bolder move almost, you know.

Right. Like where are you going, buddy? The drama's over here. She's like you look like you were going to finish your dinner. This episode is brought to you by Prime. Obsession is in session. And this summer, Prime Originals have everything you want. Steamy romances, irresistible love stories, and the book to screen favorites you've already read twice.

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I think that's probably best for everyone involved. Yes. That was very, I mean, it was kind of like, it was funny because usually they'll show them like debating. And it was just like, oh, of course, like there's no way. Yeah. Jennifer's not going. It wouldn't make sense. But so Dolores is brings up and then kind of again talks about at the party how she feels like Teresa is in a pickle, she says, because Teresa wants to be there for her friend Jennifer, but then Melissa and Joe feel like they're not getting enough family loyalty support from her. And so she's kind of stuck in the middle. And to me, I think that is accurate. I think that's the situation Teresa is in. But I also think that it's kind of.

of a situation of her own making because Teresa has clearly chosen in multiple situations not to speak up on her brother's behalf when she could have. So it's like she's in a pickle because she has not given her brother the support. I mean, I find it interesting that literally you could probably say that the running theme throughout the entire series of Real Housewives of New Jersey. Like this, this is sort of the running issue that's been here since season one. It's like loyalty to my family or loyalty to my friend. Do I defend someone even though it's there, it's, you know what I mean?

Like their family ties and their family loyalty, I feel like is the crux of all of their issues. Even with the the Jude ice girls and Joe Gorga, it's like a loyal, it's like it all sort of stems around like being loyal to your family, which is an interesting running theme. And I feel like with almost with the Gorgas and Teresa, they should have a discussion where they're like, listen, we're either going to like blindly defend each other in all scenarios where anyone says anything against us or we will, we will completely take it case by case based on who we think is right in the situation. And like they've never fully agreed on one lane. So I think there's just like there's every season there's like they're like someone's mad at

someone for not being loyal in this way. And it's like just pick aside. Either we're all deciding to be super loyal to each other or we're all deciding to the. like we're only as loyal as we think you're right. And that would solve the issue of everyone's expectation. Like you said, it's about expectations. It would solve the issue of everyone's expectations about like standing up for each other. Yeah. And I think you're right that they need to figure that out sort of once and for all.

And I don't, I think they've kicked the can down the road a lot with that. And they've sort of had these ups and downs. But you know what? I don't think it's going to help. And that is Tracy deciding that she needs to be. one getting in the middle of it because she's like, she, I don't dislike her. I think she's doing a good job on this season. But her telling Teresa that she needs to stick up for her brother, it's like, it's like at the zoo,

like a kid putting their hand in the cage. And it's like, you're going to get bit. Oh, my God. It reminded me of that meme with like, Whoopi Goldberg from Ghost. And she's like, you endanger girl. Like, do not go there. I don't know if you know what you're doing. Right.

Like, we haven't had a lot of newbies on this show in a while, but I would imagine if you have been given any sort of primer on how to get by on Real Housewives of New Jersey, getting in the middle of Teresa and Joe seems like not the best strategy for your long-term casting. Totally. Or, I mean, even making any sort of comment about Teresa that is negative. Like, do you remember the first season?

that Jackie was on. She said something about, like, her being in jail. And, like, that was it for her. She was like, yeah, it's, it was over. It's the kind of thing where I think, you know, you can push back on the idea that it's the Teresa show. You don't necessarily, you can challenge her. And I kind of wish more people would sometimes. But I don't think you can really push back on the idea that that is, that the Teresa and Joe dynamic is something that you will never know the full scope of. And obviously they have a whole thing going. And so I was like, okay, Tracy, best of luck with that. I need to see how that unfolds because I am worried about her.

Right. And when you're the new person coming into the group and she obviously, she's Melissa's friend that has been brought onto the show, it's like, okay, I don't know. But yeah, I thought this episode was really entertaining because, I don't know, when the Jersey Housewives are down at the shore, it always pops off. Yeah, I mean, last summer it was like Joe, it was like them throwing the food because Joe said something about Joe Jude ice, I think, right? Yeah. And we had Melissa flipping the plate of cheese and. Yeah. Well, you get, you get a lot of like strong personalities in a house. I mean, that's the whole summer. I mean, to never, not to fully transition this to summer house right.

way, but that's sort of, if you get enough, like, either, like, toxic or intense personalities in a home for a weekend, you start to see some things. All new drinks are now at McDonald's with refreshers like the strawberry watermelon refresher and the mango pineapple refresher with popping boba to crafted sodas like the Spriteberry berry blast with berry flavors and cold foam. Who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire. Try them all now at McDonald's. Refreshers contain caffeine. Copyright 2026, the Coca-Cola Company.

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A lot of strong reactions this week to the tech. and calls from Craig, who is, he asks if she kissed anyone and she says, yes, she kissed Andrea, big surprise. And he's like, I don't want to hear that. I don't like hearing that. Blah, blah, blah, blah. He hangs up on her. Page is very upset.

He calls to apologize the next day. This feels like some classic, insecure man bullshit to me. And it's like hard to watch a little bit. I mean, it's kind of seems so weird to me because, like, like page seems kind of attracted to it. She's like, it makes her like him more, I think, um, as opposed to less. Like it's not a turnoff for her. It's kind of a turn on.

Um, which I thought was, I guess indicative of like sort of the way that this that. And that, I mean, that makes sense. She's probably like, okay, like it's a little bit more gamey and this is like kind of hot. Right. Right. I definitely get that too because I think. what she's saying doesn't necessarily, there's like a subtext beyond what's being said, because when he's like, I don't like you making out with that with him.

And she's like, well, you're fucking whoever you want to fuck. It sounds like she's saying I should be able to make out with whoever I want, but she's really saying, okay, so then you stop fucking other people too. And then we can be exclusive together. And it's like a little more of a game than that. but it seems it's like she's they're starting to foreshadow that this is kind of the route she wants to go down even though Andrea is right there and seemingly a little bit more straightforwardly into her right she clearly doesn't like that I think as much as like the

little bit of like the push and pull of the Craig situation um and I think she was like I think I almost think the tables turned for her like when she found out Craig was hooking up with Kristen, I think they got her like much more into him because she was like, oh my God, he can get Kristen Cavalari. Like, now I'm like in a new league. Like she seemed like very, she's impressed by it. The prize looked a little shinier at the end because it's like there's this now there's going to be this extra level of I triumphed over not just the random blondes of Charleston, but

the blondes from the hills of California. Exactly. Although to me it seems like Kristen wants, does not. very much to be excluded from this narrative and like is not even I think she's denying it right or something that they've been up it's a little unclear to me but they certainly are not allowed to say her full name on summer house because right we're getting like blurred out last names the page pages alluding to people from California it's like okay we're right we're gonna beat around this bush just a little bit more but I um I don't think Kristen has ever been really trying to date Craig I don't really see

No, I think Kristen, to borrow a phrase from a house size of Salt Lake City, I think Kristen is a good time girl. And she and Craig have had a good time. And it's probably never going anywhere beyond that. But yeah, as we get further into this season, we're probably around the halfway mark. I am still very curious to see how much Paige and Craig we're going to get. He shows up at the house next week. So we'll see. I'm a little nervous for him and Austin to be there. but oh yeah i mean the next week it seems like austin's going to be bringing the drama with the

uh lindsay sierra like love triangle there i know and as much as i enjoy drama i'm like austin's not worth it ladies get your shit together sierra find anyone else you know right i almost feels like that's like they're like they have like this weird rivalry like that like like it's almost like not even about Austin for some reason it seems like it's I don't know like don't like don't you feel like there's like and even on watch what happens live when you see them talk about each other like they clearly just like do you think it's about Austin or something else because they clearly don't like each other with Lindsay and Sierra yeah yeah it's hard to say I think I don't know if Lindsay maybe feels threatened in a way by Sierra like because Lindsay sort of has

the Queen Bee energy on Summerhouse. And I do think the dynamic has shifted a little bit the last couple seasons with Paige and Sierra. But I don't, I don't know. I feel like they're just kind of aren't quite each other's cup of tea. And I do think that it almost feels like Sierra likes messing with Lindsay a little bit and that Austin is kind of a vessel through which to do that. Yeah.

It almost seems more about like them showing. like them, them finding out who's alpha rather than actually like liking Austin. Because like you said, he's like fine at best. Exactly. But I did, I will say, I did really like the way the women in the house went about having their sit down with Amanda and sort of telling her what Kyle had been saying. And I thought for as messy as Summerhouse has been for a long time, they are doing a really good job. this season at having respectful, necessary conversations in a calm and thoughtful

demeanor. You know, their race conversation a few weeks ago, I think was a high point. And then also, I mean, this could have been handled so poorly. And I thought they did a good job. Right. They did a good job of like not inserting their like opinions and what you should do. And instead just being like, this is what we, this is what we know. and like we just wanted to tell you.

That being said, I thought there was a lot of crying. I can't, I mean, there's a lot of crying by everyone not Amanda for like, something that to me didn't fully like affect them. Like I didn't really feel, I guess if they were feeling a lot of empathy for her,

sort of, but it didn't really seem like they needed to all be crying while telling her this. Like, right. I think there's, I get why they felt like it. was their responsibility to bring this to her attention. But it's not like they walked in on Kyle cheating on her or like it wasn't like a smoking

gun. You need to dump him. It was like, we want to make sure that we're all on the same page. It's like you guys are fighting a lot. But like why do we all need to be sitting here crying? Like we're let's just discuss it. Like why is it so sad? Like just discuss it.

I don't know. It's tough. It's tough to watch though when Kyle comes out. and sort of crashes the party and they fill him in on what they've been talking about. I was glad he didn't blow up at the women and, you know, try and call them out. Whatever. He waited. Yeah.

But it is just the kind of thing where he feels like his relationship is being attacked, but then maybe he, if he doesn't want it to be a topic of conversation, then maybe he should not be talking to Danielle about it. or he should not be fighting with Amanda while they're in this shared space of the house. Like, it just feels like you kind of can't quite have it both ways. If your relationship is going to be a mess in the common areas, people are going to have thoughts about it. Exactly. I'm so sick of Kyle's crocodile tears. It seems like Kyle, like, literally, it seems like Kyle, anytime he's like, Amanda tries to have, like, a real conversation with him about something that's upsetting her, he just like, if he can't win the argument, he starts crying. and then she gets over it.

She, like, feels bad and she, like, hugs him and they move on. And he does this. I've noticed this now, like, three or four times. Like, he does this every time. And it's almost to avoid, like, like, having to, like, fully deal with the actual issue at hand. Instead, it's like him showing her emotion. So she leaves him alone. Right.

And I think he knows that Amanda has that weakness, not like that she's weak, but that it's a weakness for her. because she loves him and she doesn't want him to be sad. She just wants the relationship to be better. So when he starts getting emotional, then it sort of clicks into place for her. No, no, no, no, no. I don't want you to cry. I just want to make sure that we're, you know, working on this

and that things get better. And it's like, okay, but if he knows exactly how to get out of the conversation, then you're never actually completing the conversation to the point that you need to. I totally agree. I think it seems, to me, it seems kind of manipulative. And I don't really like it. Like, I don't like that he's, he literally pulls that card whenever he feels like he's has no defense or response. She's like, you're saying this about me in our relationship to Danielle. And he's like, well, like, he's like making a lot of excuses. She's coming back at him. And then he's, he just like cries and it's over. Right. And he loves going for the I just, it feels like I can't make you happy. or what do you even want from me? And it's like, if you actually sat and listened for the duration of this conversation, maybe you could get to the point where she's outlining what she needs from you. But it feels like you're not cut.

You're sort of cutting it short before you get to the point of, okay, what are the next steps? Yeah. And he turns the, right, he turns the conversation away from anything having to do with like a resolution and just into whatever it is for him. And also like what he did with, at his birthday party speech was kind of like to me also, you're taking, you're taking, like, you're taking the issue, which is that you guys are fighting and you're complaining about each other to other people and turning it into an issue with the other people in the house. Like you're like, pretend it you're kind of like projecting your own issues onto everyone else so that you don't have to deal with them with each other,

which was also annoying to me. It's, it's a little bit reminiscent of what's going on with Teresa and Louie where we don't see as much of the, dynamic between the two of them in a way that, like, we don't know if they're fighting a lot. We don't know how they have talked about these issues. But Teresa seems so much more focused on everybody else talking about the problems rather than actually addressing the problems. And it seems like Kyle is sort of choosing to go down a similar path where he can't be the bad guy. So everybody else has to be the bad guy for trying to make him be the bad guy. And it's like, maybe there isn't a bad guy in the situation.

Maybe you just need to actually have, you know, an open and honest conversation with Amanda, with yourself about what needs to change and what's been going wrong rather than just kind of being, calling everyone a hater, basically, for showing concern. And your dynamic. Like the appropriate response to that, to me would have been like, wow, like, I'm so sorry that, like, that our like the way that we've interacted with each other has gotten to such a point where everyone around us is noticing and it makes them uncomfortable and concern for us and like we really should figure out like how to deal with our problems and like also how to like maybe not confide

in people on camera um or talk or talk about our issues like with other people and not each other in a constructive way so that we can like make everyone you know what I mean not upset everyone and make everyone feel like there's tension between us, which spills over into tension from the other house. But instead he's like taking the complete opposite approach of like, this isn't anyone's anyone should, everyone should just be blindly supportive, which was like a crazy thing to say. Yeah, I think actually we had talked earlier in the season about how it felt like they maybe had some sort of agreement of that they were going to try and make things seem good on camera.

And then that fell apart very quickly. But in the way of Kyle talking to Danielle about their issues, now it almost seems like he's the one who is making more of a mess on camera. And I could see Amanda sort of having valid feelings of like, hey, if you need to get this off your chest, that's one thing. But can you talk to somebody who's not on the show? So it could be like its own separate thing. Whereas by doing this on camera and by doing it with somebody, the house who feels kind of a loyalty to both of them, it's basically, you're asking for it. Right. You're basically guaranteeing that the storyline is going to continue. And while that's good

for us as viewers, I don't really know why either of them don't want that storyline to be going in a more positive direction. Totally. And also how about like, I'm sorry for embarrassing you by like having your friend, by having, the fact that your friends have to come to you and tell you that I'm talking shit about you behind your back. Like, that must be so embarrassing for you and I apologize. Like, none of that was said. I don't know. Yeah.

And there's the thing of when your friend has, is dating somebody and you sort of put up with it because it's the right thing to do. And then the second they dump that person, everybody's like, oh my God, thank you. Like now we can. Right. Can we keep it 100? Is this a safe space to say what I've been thinking for the last? last six months. And it feels like Kyle and Amanda, unfortunately, it feels like they're kind of at that point in their relationship where you just know that like Paige and Sierra and to a maybe

lesser extent, Danielle and Lindsay probably have like years worth of things that they want to say to Amanda. And they're like, okay, don't say it, don't say it. Don't let it out. Don't let it out. Because if she actually does marry him, which she did, we're going to be the biggest asshole in the world and it's like Kyle stop giving all of these people more things to put to like put on the cons list yeah I feel bad for Amanda she like clearly feels like a lot of pressure to get married and a lot of like negative feelings around it but I guess it happens so we'll see how it unfolds but how many episodes are left for them together I don't know this was episode like seven so I feel like we're probably around the halfway point um we'll see

And they've been, they're filming Winterhouse in Vermont right now. Oh, wow. I know. Somebody sent in a photo of Austin walking through a parking lot and stow yesterday. So we know that it's off to the races. Oh, yes. I saw that on Bravo by Betches. Great, great sneak peek.

Thank you, Jordana. And thank you for being here once again to talk about these messy-ass shows. I live for this. Thank you for having me back. And I'll see you next week. Yeah, see you next week. We're sure to have more drama with Austin and Craig coming back to the summer house. But in the meantime, don't forget to rate, review, and follow the show wherever you listen so you don't miss an episode.

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