Mention It All - Has RHOSLC Become TOO Chaotic? Ft. Gibson Johns (RHOSLC, RHOM)

Episode Date: January 24, 2022

Dylan is joined by Bravo interviewer extraordinaire Gibson Johns, who shares his thoughts on everything that’s gone down with Jennie Nguyen. They unpack the (lack of) response from Bravo, and how it’s affecting their view of Jennie on the show. Then, they recap the latest episode of the Zion trip, which has more friendship flip flops than an Old Navy sale. Later, they also discuss Real Housewives of Miami, and how the reboot is exceeding their expectations. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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See Home Depot.com slash price match for details. Betch's Media presents. Ha ha, laugh, funny. Mention It All. A Bravo by Betcha's podcast. We don't say that, but now we said it. With Dylan Hafer. We'll go and check me, boo.

Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Mention at All podcast. I am Dylan Hafer. And today I am joined by a guest that I'm very excited about. He's never been on the show before, but we've been, I'd say, Bravo, you know, social media friends for a long time. Please welcome Gibson Johns, the host of, um, I'd say Bravo, you know, social media friends for a long time. the host of We Should Talk, which is an In The Know podcast, Gibson, hello. Thank you so much for having me. I feel like I've been waiting for this day, you know.

We've been, we've been social media friends for a while. And we met for the first time in person a couple months ago, but I'm excited to talk to you. We met at that fateful night. It was the book launch party that was truly an event to remember. Yeah, it was, we haven't gotten a second BravoCon, but I would say that's the closest we've gotten to that. What was your most, like, amusing Bravo Lab interaction at that party, would you say? I had a couple. I would say a highlight was definitely doing a photo booth moment with, like, most of the New Jersey cast. That was definitely very fun.

I think we were holding diamonds, though, so, like, it wasn't totally a perfect moment. I had, like, a heart-to-heart with Mary Amens from D.C. and then I also had like an interaction with Leanne and Cameron from Dallas who were like all over the place. Yeah. I think we jointly had that interaction with Leanne and Cameron and it we sure did. It just went on for a while. Yes. Yeah, to the point where like Leanne came over, Cameron left and then she was and whoever she had been talking to in the meantime, that conversation totally ended.

So Cameron had to like drift back into our conversation. She clearly didn't want to be doing. So Leanne was just going on about something. I forget what it was. Yeah. Yeah. unlock in. Always, always a trip. Yes. Yes. So we

today are mostly here to talk about Real Housewives of Salt Lake City. And when I asked you to come on the show last week, it was like, okay, great, we'll recap this episode that's like the Zion trip, cool. And then in the time that has elapsed since then, Salt Lake City has become ground zero for whatever the fuck is going on with Jenny. Exactly. What was your like first reaction when you saw those posts? that were going viral last week, and how do you feel kind of in the few days since then, as it's been dealt with or not dealt with? Yeah, so I was on a full day shoot that day.

So I literally wasn't on Twitter all day. And I was sort of like, you know, when you're on your phone for like two seconds, you sort of see something pop up. And I think it was actually a Bravo ad that just posts where it was sort of like, you had the screenshot of Heather Gay that was like when you see the resurfaced Facebook post. and I was like, what the fuck is going on? So I looked at that really quickly and I was just like, Jesus Christ. Like this is just objectively, blatantly racist and inexcusable.

And I mean, like all the above words. And I think one of things that kind of just, I don't know if it was stunned me or shocked me or wasn't surprising, but just how recent they were, you know, it was a year and a half ago. And that to me just like brings it to whole. and a whole other level of like just dumbfounding and like in multiple ways

sort of like how are these just discovered how were they not discover when she was cast on the show? Yeah especially I think the timeline with when she came on the show because she started filming basically at the beginning of 2021 which means that these Facebook posts were like

three months before that and it's like did they... Which is like what the yeah exactly yeah and then I think it just snowballed so quickly from there, right? So it's like, you know, you have this disgusted reaction to these posts. And then you're sort of like, okay, where are the reactions from the cast members? Or is Bravo going to condemn this? Or is Andy going to speak out?

And, you know, I think there's, I don't really know what the precedent is for all of this. I feel like they sort of, it sounds like they sort of, it feels like they sort of do it on case by case situation. I feel like we've gotten so many different reactions over the years. But I think one of the things that also confusing was like, okay, like they're starting to release these statements and nobody's mentioning Jenny by name. And it's sort of like, what is the directive that's happening behind the scenes here? Um, which I still don't really understand what it was. Yeah, it seems kind of unclear. Because at first, Jen Shaw was the only one who had kind of called it out, you know, called out Jenny by name. And then there were like these rumors that Jen was going to get fired because

they were so mad that she had called out Jenny specifically, which like, I feel like anytime something like this happens on Bravo, there's always that first round of like rumors and sources. And I'm very much like, I'm going to wait like a couple days until things settle. And so it doesn't, I don't think Jen shot is getting fired, at least not for this. But yeah, then that for everybody else was kind of making these, you know, they weren't vague because we knew what they were about, but they weren't also saying exactly what it was. And then I noticed, like, Meredith just, like, tweeted something extremely vague, but then yesterday posted something that was like, I want to be more specific.

Like, I'm disgusted by my co-workers posts. Exactly. Right. Exactly. I love when a housewife calls another housewife their co-worker because to me that's just like... It's a reminder of their actual relationship. It's, like, both shady and just extremely honest about the fact that it's like, we're not friends outside of this context.

For sure. for sure. Yeah, I think with the, with the gen firing, like that, that rumor that came out, I think like a day or two later or something, it was sort of like, yeah, you know, what the likelihood that she was going to be fired over speaking out against anti Black Lives Matter post likely, like, no, that that that wasn't super likely, but I think even just the fact that it was a rumor that was being allowed to be believed for a day or a day or a half a day, to me just spoke to like, okay, like, We need some sort of response here. You know what I mean? Right. Especially because those rumors weren't about Jenny, who should, if anybody's going to be fired, it's Jenny who shared those racist posts. And I, like you, was a little confused about what precedent has been set at Bravo

with these things. I literally scrolled back on Bravo's Instagram all the way back to like summer 2020 because I was like, I need to see like what was happening in this moment because in pretty quick succession, we had the post about Stasi and Kristen and Brett and Max being fired from Vanderpump Rules. And that was obviously, you know, not a super similar situation to Jenny's, but, you know, kind of in that sphere. And then that guy, Pete, was fired from below deck med just a couple weeks after that. And both times they got these, you know, text posts on the Bravo Instagram feed that was like, brought the production company and the network are like,

you know, whatever, whatever. And, you know, since then, they spoke out, you know, in support of Tiffany Moon that one time when Cameron and her family were coming at her. And, you know, they've posted in the past about, you know, reaffirming their commitment to Black Lives Matter and all this stuff. And so it is a little confusing when it, you know, as a fan, as a person who, you know, works in the realm of all of this stuff. It's like, okay, so what is the actual like company priority because, you know, they did a whole special called a movement, not a moment. And then it's like, okay, so where's the movement now? So let's continue this movement, right? Exactly. Right. Yeah. And then I also think about the moment where it's like Kenya wore the Native American

Halloween costume and they, you know, I think they release a statement and edited out of the episode or something like that. I, you know, I can't remember exactly what they, but they acted fairly quickly on that as well. And she was clearly like forced to, apologize, basically. I actually have seen the rerun of that episode, and it's extremely funny because they just blur out her costume. Oh, they blur it. Oh, my gosh. I haven't watched out an episode. There's a couple shot. Like, I think they did edit out, edit her out of some of the shots, but then also they just like fully blur out the costumes. Wow. Okay. Yeah, I haven't seen that. I need to go back and watch that. Oh, my gosh. Okay, so we'll see what happens

with Jenny. I have to say the Watch What Happens Live moment last night with Lisa and Andy, I expected Andy to say something, but then he really just asked Lisa what she thought and then moved right along. So I was expecting a little bit more of a statement there. Yeah, I think I was too, and I think everyone kind of was. And it was, I think, I know that episode was definitely recorded. Like, it wasn't a live episode, but still, it was obviously after those posts emerged. So it's sort of like, the posts sort of speak for themselves, right? Like, they should, they married. a response and they merit a condemning of the posts. And, you know, I think, you know, you want to think that there's sort of like a longer, a longer term play that there are in terms of what their

response is going to be. It seems like it's going to play out at least the beginning of this next season. But I do think that people are owed a more immediate response when stuff like this pops up. Because I, unfortunately, like, stuff like this is clearly getting through the cracks of the casting process, which is really, really unfortunate. And, like, you know, I think that somebody has to answer for that. So. Totally. On a lighter note, I did love Watch What Happens Live when Andy just says to Lisa, the reactions

to your reunion outfits were really poor. He's like, what do you have to say about that? She's like, I don't know. I think everyone is comfortable. I loved my dress. So, like, uh. Yeah. Yeah.

I just listened to the bitch-dush episode about those reunion outfits, and it's just like, they're right, like everyone, it's, there has never been such a universally negative reaction to reunion outfits. And it's, again, I still don't know what the directive was, because you know there's always a directive on the outfits and, right, like, they clearly got, they clearly got the jewel tone memo, but it's like, are we going for like formal wear? Is it just like anything goes as long as it's blue or purple? Oh my gosh. Really upsetting. To be fair, like, I guess Lisa's, I mean, like, it's all relative, but her outfit was honestly one of, her dress was one of my, I guess, top half of that group. But, you know, it's slim pickings there.

I think Lisa's reunion look will be a win as long as she cannot have the spray-tanned orange hands this year. Yes, yes, there's only one way to go from there with that. It's so good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom Rack. now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince, Sam Edelman, frame and free people. Join the Nordi Club to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first, and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free. Great brands,

great prices. That's why you rack. Okay, so on this episode that we had last night, the ladies are in Zion. They do a flashback to the bus, which reveals that they've been in Zion for less than nine hours, which is just unfathomable to me. We're getting two episodes out of like 12 hours. Yeah, I mean, I think this season of Salt Lake, it's a pretty long season of housewives. It seems like they've earned it. But this trip, especially, even the women, you can tell her like, wait, fuck, this is the first day we've been here.

Jenlin always says that when she's, she hugs Meredith that, like, wait, we're, you know, I'm jumping ahead, but like, she hugs Meredith and she says that. And they almost like laugh. They're like, holy shit. Like, it reminds you that's a summer house episode from last season where it's all in one day. And you're just like, oh, my God. Oh, my God.

Yeah. Yeah. The trajectory of like Meredith being okay with people and then blowing up and then being happy again. And like Jen kind of has the same roller coaster ride. This episode really was kind of emotional whiplash of like, wait, who's screaming at who? Now they're sleeping in the bed.

together, now they're in the pool. It was chaotic and in a way that I found really enjoyable, but it is just kind of wild how these women can go at it and then be chill the next moment. Oh, completely. And you're right. Sometimes there are

moments, and I think one of the biggest moments of this was when Jen and Lisa were arguing on the Springer van, but like, they'll have full-fledged arguments for five or ten minutes that they show us, and I honestly lose track of what we're even arguing about. I'm like, This person didn't have their back, but then it's also, I feel like there's like a hidden meeting in some of these arguments.

But it was complete with Blas. Meredith left and came back three times. I counted. I was like, I mean, because she had to have her say, I guess. But I, I, you know, and then she, you know, she was definitely on one. She was slipping into her, like, slightly different voice, you know. Like, she puts a different inflection on some of the words when she gets, you know, in the heat of the moment. But also, I think sometimes.

these arguments get so overwhelming for me, we're like, there are some hidden comments in these arguments that, like, could be a 15-minute conversation in and of themselves, but they just get glossed over. Like, I think we're kind of glossing over a lot of the, like, Meredith was seeing this guy when she was separated from Seth, and Jen might have hooked up with him, and, like, these comments keep kind of surfacing, but we haven't fully attacked them. Right. There are actually, if you go through down the list of this cast, there are several cheating rumors slash accusations that have been thrown out there. And somehow none of them have really become storylines on the show yet because you obviously have, you know, the, Meredith having 10

boyfriends and as Lisa says in the next episode, fucking half of New York City. Oh my God. I'm still reeling from that. The idea that Jen has potentially cheated on Sharif, which we have never quite unpacked. And then there's also been a rumor on Lod so, I mean, grain of salt, that Mary was having an affair with Cameron at some point in the past. And it's like, wow, we really have, there's truly a lot going on here, considering that none of these things have even really been topics of conversation on the show that much. They're kind of throw away things. Yeah, and to me that speaks to sort of, I'm definitely enjoying this season still,

but it's speaking to sort of, again, this feeling of being a little bit overwhelmed by just how much is going on, Like, you know, we came into the season, at least I came into the season thinking, okay, this is this going to be mainly about Jen Shaw? But then it kind of ended up being for a while mainly about Mary and her church and those accusations. But then like we have these things like even like the sort of seeming implosion of Lisa and Meredith's friendship or some of these cheating accusations or other things that are popping up that on other seasons of other franchises would be a full season. You know what I mean? Like Lisa and Meredith's friendship, to me that reminds me of Carol and Bethany, potentially for. when they fell out, Jill and Bethany falling out, those were full-season situations. And it's like, we have like five or six of those that could represent full seasons happening at the same time. And I'm, there's all these threads that are just interweaving with one another. Yeah.

And I mean, I have to say, like, I have been enjoying this season, but, like, I really am good on the idea that Meredith was involved with Jen's arrest in some way. Like, we, I think everybody watching the show is, like, on the same page that that didn't happen. And so it's like, it's almost a little bit like, can we stop like going back and forth and talking about this when there's all this other stuff that we could maybe dig into a little bit more?

Because like, I think Meredith, her reaction to this like FBI rumor is basically just to like laugh because it's so ridiculous and then kind of be like, wait, do you guys actually think that this is something real? because if you do, like, what the fuck? I know. And that's kind of been my feeling watching it, because I'm like, this isn't true, like, this isn't what happened.

Come on. Totally. It was kind of like a funny thing to like, you know, mention when the trailer came out. And then maybe this first couple episodes, like when Meredith was on, Watcher Happens Live, like very early in the season,

she sort of played at Koi when she was asked about it. It was kind of a fun game. We were all playing together, but ultimately we all, I think, believe that it wasn't, that she was not involved. and now we're sort of, you know, two months later and we're still kind of like, you know, quote unquote parsing through that question. And Meredith's just laughing at all off in real time.

So I'm with you in that I'm over it. And I also think that it's almost serving as a distraction to the actual real issue at hand, which is what Jen is accused of, right? And I, you know, I think throughout, you know, the season she's just kind of said, oh, those are false accusations. Like, you know, she's called it like the court situation. Like, she's called it like the court situation. I just don't feel like she's actually ever had to explain anything. And it's probably like a legal thing where she can't talk about it. But it's weird that we're talking about, okay, who informed them versus like, okay, did Jen actually do this or not? Yeah, there's been very little discussion of the kind of particulars of what's going on with Jen's situation.

Right. And it's all been sort of focused on like, you're either my friend or you're not. and it's like, okay, well, there's this whole, you know, like, most people, like, they don't indict people with whatever. And Jen, multiple times both on the show and on social media, has kind of thrown around this idea that she's being persecuted with no evidence, and they have no, you know, no standing to do this. And it's like, you can say that all you want, but that doesn't make it true.

Like, the fact of the matter is that there's evidence, like, we've seen. evidence. Right. And that that isn't even the full picture because just knowing how this court that she's being charged in works, they don't charge people unless they know you did it, basically, for the most part. I mean, obviously. They have to be really confident, exactly. Right. Obviously, like, Jen is innocent until proven guilty. That's how our legal system works. But like, to just kind of keep going with this idea that they're coming at you with bullshit charges with no evidence, it's like, I mean. Exactly. And that's why I just kind of am confused why the cast is just sort of taking

that and not pushing back on it that much. And I think, you know, like, for example, like Meredith and Jen had that hug on last night's episode. And that was very unexpected. And, you know, I do believe that Meredith has compassion for Jen. I don't think that Meredith's lying just to kind of get Jen off her back. I think that Meredith genuinely does feel for her when it comes to like the effect that this can all have on her family and all that. but I also think that Meredith just kind of like doesn't want to be associated with her. I think that's kind of because I think Meredith obviously believes the charges. So I don't know.

I just think it's, but it almost is like she doesn't even want to go there in terms of like, okay, let's pick apart what the allegations are. Yeah, I actually thought a couple episodes ago when Meredith told Jen, she's like, you need friends right now and I can't do that. I thought that was, I understand why it was upsetting to Jen, but I thought that Meredith actually was really mature for expressing that because it's like sometimes you have to know when you have to tap out and that like Meredith's presence isn't going to help Jen in the next few months, but she, you know, still, I don't know.

Has compassion for her in terms of her family, for sure. Yeah, it's just like kind of wild to watch this unfold knowing that Jen is like, potentially, maybe theoretically could be going to prison. for like kind of a long time and it's like but yeah I guess like enjoy your trip to Zion now I know it's really wild especially to hear that now they're like filming season three and you know she's been spotted filming it's sort of like okay so and the court date is really coming up so it's sort of like how can they not be talking about some of this stuff I know and on watch what happens live last night Lisa they did like a Jen or Meredith game and they asked who she left the reunion feeling closer to

and she just said neither. So I don't, yeah, I don't know. I mean, Jen is the kind of person where she doesn't really, the way she behaves isn't something that's going to make people like come back to your friendship. It's like I feel like she kind of is like, once she's exiled you, why would you want to go back? And somehow she still has Heather under this friendship juice spell.

But the rest of them I don't really understand. I don't know. I agree. Yeah, and it's every time you think Heather might like stray a little bit from that loyalty, she just doesn't. And I think I don't fully understand it myself, but I guess I understand why. I guess I understand her reasoning that as she has explained it. You know what I mean? But I don't, I can't fully wrap my mind around around that level of loyalty, I guess. such as just, yeah, I guess like I luckily have not been in a position where I'm forced to spend time with somebody who's like being. I hope we never do, Dylan. I know.

Girl, winter is so last season. And now Springs got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders. That perfect hang on the patio sundress. Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from. your couch. Done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear up on that envelope.

It's time for a little in-person spring treat. It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. So then the next morning, when Meredith storms down the stairs, that was... In her sunglasses. In her sunglasses and screams about them talking about her sister and her father. That was a moment where I truly was like, what is going on. And then when we found out what was going on, I still didn't feel like I knew what was going on. Because it was so, it was another thing of like there was this game of telephone and Meredith is saying what happened and Lisa's like, well, that's not what happened. And also I didn't bring it up for that reason.

I brought it up for this reason. And, you know, I think it is kind of like fucked up for these women to be like speculating all this stuff about her father's memorial service. But at the same time, you know, they're on this show to be messy. and I can't say I'm not like interested to know if Meredith lied to not go on the bus. Right. Yeah. And it's, it's, it's, again, it's like, okay, Lisa went to somebody's room after hours. The cameras were not there to capture it. They weren't miced. You know, they had been drinking a lot. And it's sort of, it's really hard to tell. Okay, did Lisa misrepresent what was said on the sprinter van? Did Meredith misinterpret that? Is it like kind of an alcohol fuel? misremembering of that conversation that they had at 3 a.m. the night before.

But clearly Meredith woke up and just snapped into like like holy shit threw on those sunglasses and just like all hell broke loose. And I have to tell you, what I mean, I think one of the things that I'm missing from Salt Lake is kind of like a breather moment, right? It's sort of like

they were kind of giving us these like scenes where Heather would be with her siblings and talk about sort of their past and their relationships together and that those sort of represent for me those served as like, okay, let me take a deep breath for this segment of the show in between big drama. But I guess the only kind of moment from last night when we got that was like watching Jen, Whitney and Heather hide in Heather's bed.

Heather had the sugar, had the sugar baby candy. Whitney had the pitcher of water. Jen had that Gucci fedora and sunglasses on. I mean, like that to me, it gave some levity to that moment where I could like laugh where I'm with you where I wasn't really sure what was going on.

But I was. I was laughing. Would Whitney's like it? I made eye contact with Meredith and then just kept walking. I can't do this right now. I do. There's some, this,

the idea of being like stuck in a house like this, when you have somebody who's just in like complete loose canon mode. And I mean, really they have two or three people like that in this house currently. You know, it's just a question of who's going off at what time. But it's, I mean,

that sounds unbelievably stressful. As somebody who doesn't like confrontation and who, you know, just wants to like chill in my bed and have my personal space, I, I mean, yikes. Especially when you're sort of the innocent bystander, but if you are in the right, wrong place at the wrong time, you could easily get caught in that crossfire, you know what I mean? Because like, you know, chances are you were on that sprinter van and you were just having snacks and watching it all go down. But, I know, I just, it's, I'm with you. And it's a difference, like, comparing this to the Miami trip that's happening right now. Like, at that dinner, they sat down and, you know, two minutes into the dinner, Marisol is like, so who does everyone trust the least?

And it's like, you know, that seems like a very calculated. Like, I am sure that a producer was involved in, like, hey, Marisol, like, maybe at dinner you could, like, play a game. Just fun icebreaker. But at Salt Lake, it just feels like everything is just like almost happening faster than production can keep up with. That it's like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Like, why are you two fighting now? Like, you were hugging last night and now it's like 9 a.m. and nobody's even in glam yet.

And you're all like storming around the house. That's a really good point. It's almost at a pace that I don't know if I've ever experienced on a Housewives show before in terms of, I mean, as a viewer. It's just, it's, I think you're right. But even, we saw a lot of cameras last night in the, in the dinner party scene. Like, they couldn't even get out of the way quick enough for all the back and force that were happening. Right. It's like, Meredith, are you staying at the table or are you running back inside? Because our shots really are not. We're doing laps. No, but I think you're right. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, I can't even imagine the job of

being a producer having to follow those threads in real time because it's, I can't even follow it now with the edited package. Right. And normally I feel like the producer, it's, it's, it's, it's, producers, like the field producers that are there with them kind of have time to like, you know, takes their cast member aside and kind of talk through how they're feeling and like, you know, maybe give them some suggestions for what they could do the next time they're all together. But it's like it really feels like all of this is just like tumbling out of, you know. And it's exciting. But at the same time, it's also a stressful viewing experience because, you know,

they're getting ready to have their club Zion night, and it's like, how is this going to go off the rails? You know, and it doesn't really. It seems like everybody actually manages to have a good time. I was going to say that I really enjoyed that we ended the episode with like 10 minutes of just pure drunken fun, till 4 in the morning. I appreciate an ending on that note. I love seeing like hungover housewives. It really is just... There's nothing better. It's everything. And seeing those four. women wake up in the same room and none of them knew what was going on. It's, I mean, you just,

it's perfect. I mean, I love how Mary, they're in the kitchen and Mary's like, oh, I remember everything. Actually, I just remember you guys in swimsuits for some reason. It's like, nobody fully remembers. Right, exactly. All I saw was three bikinis. It's like, Mary. But I saw watching them in that kitchen, you know, we see like the cut up, the dried up, cut up limes on the counter. The Lisa's coming down with, like, her big gulp, but also like a glass of wine from the night before that was probably by her bed and like another drink. It reminds me of like sharehouses that I've done before where it's like, you know, everyone just convened in the kitchen. What do you remember? Let's piece it together. But it's all, it's all in good fun at least at that point. I really liked the

continuity of we see Lisa coming off the bus back from the slot canyon with the giant Coke in hand and then the next morning bringing it downstairs. It's like, I like that we can follow the trajectory of Lisa's diet Coke. An extra large soda from a fast food chain is absolutely, you know, to Lisa Barlow is the same thing as a red solar cup as to Kim Zolziak. That is, that's where, it's a thing that just always, always needs to be there. It's in the Lisa Barlow starter pack, for sure. Absolutely.

The slot canyon was also fun. I feel like housewife trip activities, it's kind of like, okay, whatever, like you have to plan something. But I do like, in, on Salt Lake City. it's like everything is very scenic. I like that we get a little bit of a little bit of nature. And one of my favorite details of the episode was that Mary Cosby was wearing the Brooks Marks matching set the whole time.

Such a supportive friend. Oh my God, it's so good. It's funny because I'm like, Mary and Meredith's friendship is something that I feel like has sort of confounded everyone this season, that it's like, Meredith just seems to have this, like, a weird, weird soft spot for Mary that nobody can really explain. And somehow seeing her in the, the jumpsuit was like, damn, like, yeah, I guess they, yeah, I guess it makes sense, but I still don't fully understand it, but I agree. And there's like, there's hints of like, oh, it's maybe not just surface level. You know, there is some, like, you know, he's wearing the

sweats, wearing the tracks. There's other moments. But, and I think that, honestly, Mary this episode had a really, Mary had a pretty good episode this time when I think she did, she apologized to Jenny when she didn't need, but I don't think she really needed to, but I think that made her the bigger person in that situation. But then also kind of in a more on a lighter note, she was doing kind of a lot of really good periphery work this episode. Like I think that I loved, I loved watching her come down from from that canyon, but also like whenever Meredith was storming in and out, she was kind of sort of following her, making side comments. She was like watching Jen and Meredith's hug from the bed, but not. really participating in the conversation. She brought up the Huobos Rancheros from Meredith and then, like, stood there, kind of, like, for a little bit too long, but then, like, eventually exited. She was doing some good side work in this episode, which I appreciated.

It does feel like on this trip, once she actually got there, I guess, it kind of kicked in at the White Party dinner. She actually feels like she is an active participant in this trip, whereas I feel like a lot of the time that she's been on the show, she's either not shown up, like she didn't go on the Vegas trip last season. or she's kind of been, it feels like she is like just waiting for her ride to show up so she can leave. And this trip, it actually seems like she kind of is, you know, getting her head in the game a little bit. Obviously, we know she's not going to be on the show for very much longer.

But her interactions with Jenny are really interesting because obviously they haven't been getting along super well, but Jenny still seems to be kind of in the point where she's like, I don't know, like maybe Mary and I can figure our stuff. like I don't know what you know I don't really have a problem with Mary whereas Mary doesn't even want to hear Jenny's voice she's like right with her I can't with her no uh-uh uh-uh and like you know as much as Mary is like a bad person I'm like yeah like I guess you know call like you see it with Jenny I mean I can't say too much about her either I don't blame her for not wanting to speak with Jenny like that's completely her braggative and makes sense especially given everything we know now so um you know I'm actually

I'm glad she walked away in that moment, to be honest. And then when she finally does apologize to her, it's really an apology with an excuse versus like, you know, she's basically saying, I don't want to be friends with you because I don't want to be friends with anyone new versus like, she's like, it's not you, it's me, but like we're still not going to be friends. Which, you know, I appreciate the honesty. And also, in terms of Jenny, when going back to the stuff about Meredith's dad's memorial, the flashback to the sprinter van really makes it seem like Jenny is the one who kind of was planting that seed of doubt because, you know, Heather brings up, you know, makes some comment about that Meredith was at the memorial and Jenny's the one that's like, or was she? And it's like, wait, what? Do you know? Like, where did that come from? Exactly. Yeah. Jenny. I mean, I've had kind of up and down feelings about Jenny throughout this season. And so like if she ends up not returning next season or whatever, even without those Facebook posts, I wasn't going to have really that big of feelings about it. But I don't know. She can be like a little sneaky, messy sometimes.

Yeah, I agree. I really, I mean, look back. It's like the first half of the season for her was just her and her husband having those like repetitive, wild sister-wife conversations that just like were really dark. And like, I wasn't even sure if they were really like super true. or like just for the show kind of thing. And I just don't think she's ever really made a huge impact on the show. And at this point, her impact has made an impact, but in a really, really negative way.

And with her literal racist Facebook post. So I just don't see any redeeming reason to bring her back and put her and kind of give her a platform like that. And even last night when she's talking about how she had to go to anger management because she like broke her husband's ribs by throwing stuff at him or something like that. Like, that was a total really dark aside comment that we spent zero seconds on. But, like, there's a lot of tidbits there that I'm just like, I don't know if I need this. And then it just, I don't know.

Yeah, that was an extremely, extremely strange thing to just kind of throw in. And she said that in her confessional, too. It's not even like it was a scene that happened on the show. So she had to talk about it. It was like, she brought it up. So why are you volunteering this information about yourself? It's one thing to say like, oh, like, I had some anger issues, so I like went, I saw someone. Like, I figured it out.

But being like, I used to get so angry. Like, one time I threw my husband into the wall. It's like, no, that's not like, that's not like a little. That's not like a little. Yeah, exactly. There's some darkness there. And I agree the sister wife conversations early in the season were giving me a little bit of like, uh, Melissa and Joe Gorga storyline vibes where it's like every season.

there's something happening in their family that's like, uh, right? And she wasn't even filming with the group really that much. It was just like, it's been a really weird season for me for Jenny and I wasn't sold and now I'm completely not not buying what she's selling. And it's, I don't know. I think that they can find a better, in multiple ways, a better person to fill her spot on the show. There have got to be some women somewhere in Utah that are like messy and third. thirsty in the way that we love without being...

100% without being racist or problematic or bigoted, exactly. Or like at the insurrection. I forget, was there anything bad that came out about Angie? Because I'm kind of confused about where she... I feel like there is a story out there that I haven't, that I don't remember, but I kind of wish she showed so much promise. I think Angie is like Trumpy, but not necessarily problematic in the same way that Sarah or Jenny have turned out to be.

Got it. Got it, got it. I mean, whatever. It puts all bad taste in your mouth, really, the whole thing. I know. It's like, I am never going to be the person who expects every housewife to, like, agree with me politically, because to be honest, you would cancel out half of Bravo and we wouldn't have anything to talk about. But it's like, we can draw a line at like posting memes about, running down protest. It's like a human. And it's a humanity thing. All new drinks are now at McDonald's,

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and put your summer on track. Red Bull Summer All Day Play. Red Bull gives you wings. Visit redbull.com slash bright summer ahead to learn more. See you this summer. Before we wrap up, I want to ask you about Miami because I didn't get to talk about Miami last week, and I certainly have thoughts.

How are you feeling about this season? Is it exceeding your expectations when they announced that they were doing this reboot? So I'm loving this season. I think it's really, really fun and refreshing. I think it's kind of gives me a mix of like current day housewives, but also there's some elements of some of kind of retro elements of house lives in there that I really appreciate.

So when they announced it, I binged Miami this fall, gearing up for the reboot for the first time. So it was so fresh in my mind. I was obsessed with the show. So I was just like so ready for it. And I think they brought back the right people. I think, you know, there's been a lot of talk about like, why are Majorana Marisol friends of?

But I think the people that they've made full-time cast members for the most part have proven why they are full cast members. So it's, everyone's pulling their weight, I think, for the most part. I mean, Alexia is pulling like, triple the weight of it. I mean, she's really like, her storyline is so amazing and so wild, but I'm loving it. I love that it feels like there's real money in Miami. And like, I think that that's something we've been missing from some housewives. I think that's, like, the aspirational aspect of this. And then I think in Montauk, it's like, they hit the ground running on this

trip. I mean, let's see, that episode was less than 24 hours and we got some of the most fighting we've had over rooms on a trip in a long time that led to other arguments that led to an amazing dinner party. Yeah, I feel like the first day of that trip really unfolded in a pretty exciting way. And like, you know, like we were talking about on Salt Lake City, kind of how fast everything is happening. When they got to the Montauk House, it was like, okay, they had this argument with the rooms and Lisa, you know, stating her case that she doesn't share rooms, all of this. and then everybody kind of went their separate ways and then reconvened for dinner

and like of course, you know, that's a logistical thing of like getting ready for dinner but it also gives the producers time to get in there and be like, okay, so what's happening next? And I thought the dinner was really amazing. I think Marisol is like the perfect messy friend role. Like I think that's great for her because she's been kind of a sounding board for Alexia.

She can kind of stir the pot, but she doesn't need to have that much storyline of her own Yeah, I interviewed Marisol on my podcast that's coming out like next week, I think. But I just asked her, I was like, when you signed up to come back, did you always know you're going to be a friend of? And she was like, yeah, I'm really happy with my role. I'm literally there to, like you said, be that sounding board for Alexia because there is so much going on in her life and they are such trusted but like good friends. And I agree. I think she's serving her purpose really well on this show.

And, you know, she serves the pot immediately at that dinner. And then I think that, like, Larsa and Nicole, like, they both really came alive for me in that dinner in ways that we hadn't really seen yet on this season. Like, to me, I was always sort of curious if Larsa was going to be more than just sort of like the intrigue around her association with the Kardashians. And sort of that's what I think was what we thought about coming in. But she was really like letting it fly at that dinner. And Nicole was really defending herself. in a way that impressed me. I'm loving Nicole, and I agree.

I have been pleasantly surprised with Larsa on this season because I think for obviously when people think of Real Housewives of Miami, it's like, okay, Larsa, yeah, Larsa's an OG. Like, I know she was on that show. But when you go back and watch, she was only on one season that was like six episodes long. And so she was really only a housewife for such a brief period of time. And then since then, she wasn't even living in Miami. So there's, it felt when they announced that she was coming back, I was kind of like, I feel like they're just doing it because she has this clout associated with her. Yeah, it felt like stunt casting.

Yeah. Yeah. And like I personally, you know, that can work sometimes, but I feel usually better about casting when it feels a little more organic. But I have to say, I feel like Larsa has kind of understood the assignment coming back. And, you know, she is very, she's like not ashamed of free. who she is at all. I feel like she really is like hitting all the right notes talking about her divorce. You know, we haven't gotten, she hasn't talked much about the Kardashians, but honestly, like, I don't particularly care. But I do feel like she is, I was worried that she wouldn't

kind of play along with the group and that she would kind of be like on her pedestal a little bit. And I really, I really feel like she has done a good job of kind of getting in there and kind of, you know, feeling out her place in this new group. And I, I'm enjoying her. I don't know if I would say she's like one of my favorites as a person in the cast, but like I think she's doing a good job on this season. I think so. I completely echo that sentiment. I think it's been a pleasant surprise with her in terms of how engaged she's becoming. I don't think she was engaged from the beginning. And again, I don't think there's enough going on on this show that we don't need, you know, why her and Cam aren't super close anymore to be like a plot line on this show.

Like, then that just feels like it's, I don't need that, you know, there's enough else going on and enough other things to pick apart for us. And I mean, like, her and Adriana to me is like an amazing, they pop together on screen. Like, they do not like each other clearly. And it's starting as sort of this playful, kind of shady thing that I think creates for some fun scenes, but it's clearly going to kind of level up to something a little bit more intense. And that's one thing. I think the one kind of takeaway positively from Larsa's first time on the show was her back and forth with Adriana.

Right. And that was kind of the biggest drama of that season. There wasn't like a ton happening in Miami season one. And so I love that they've kind of preserved that dynamic a decade later. considering that I don't think they really have spent much time together since then. Definitely not. Yeah, and I think that Larsa and Lisa are clearly, like, relatively good friends. Like, I believe that friendship in, like, a true way beyond the show.

So I think that also adds to, like, okay, there is sort of a connection here that makes sense for Larsa to come back. So I'm excited to see if she continues to sort of sink her teeth into the drama because she was, again, like, even Lisa wasn't safe at that dinner. Like she was like kind of throwing some digs at Lisa. Yeah, it really, they really were kind of mixing it up and it didn't just feel like it was like one side versus the other side. It's like, oh, wait, wait, you said this about me? What did what did that mean when you said that?

Oh, I didn't know you were talking shit about her. Like, it's very, you know, there's a lot going on and I'm enjoying it. And they just did their reunion in New York. So I'm really excited to see kind of how the rest of the season plays out. And I really hope that they bring it back. You know, it seems like people have been loving it. I feel like there's so much potential there. I think, you know, obviously it's on Peacock.

So I think there's probably less like actual, there are probably less viewers. There's probably less online chatter about it than maybe Bravo is used to with that with their housewise franchises. But I think I did see that. Aren't they going to air Ultimate Girls trip on Bravo? I think I saw that somewhere. And so I'm like maybe maybe eventually. They're premiering it. Yeah.

Yeah. Maybe Miami will air its fourth season on a peacock. And maybe while they're filming the fifth season, they'll put it on Bravo, like, at, you know, alternative time slots and, like, get more viewers plugged into it for a fifth. Because I think there's so, I mean, again, we have like eight, I think it's like eight or nine total women in this group that are like, I mean, there's just so much there.

So I think doing a one season return would just be really disappointing. And I don't think, I think they've earned their keep here for sure. Totally. Yeah. Well, Gibson, this has been so far. fun. Thank you for coming on. It's been, it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much. Yeah, this is, again, there's, there's a lot going on. And this has been a big week. And I think, again, I think we're, I think if one thing sort of unites all, all of us right now, it's like,

it's like, what we saw from Jenny's post is so deplorable and so, like, just not acceptable. And I just, I think we're rating on the response. But until that, until then, it's sort of like, clearly the show is going to keep on trucking. And there's like there's so much happening on the show outside of that. And it just, there's layers to this, Dylan. I think we're all working through it. Yeah. Well, you will have to come back next time when some, when some more layers have been unveiled. But until then, tell everyone where they can find you and listen to your podcast and everything. Of course. So you can follow me at Gibsonoma on Twitter and Instagram. Twitter's where I do all my live tweeting, which I'm sure you've seen. And then you can

listen to my podcast, which we have one interview per week. It's like 75% Bravo, the other 25% are other reality stars and celebrities. It's available wherever you get your podcast. It's called We Should Talk and would love if you tuned in. You should definitely check it out. Gibson is one of the best Bravo live tweeters and also one of the best interviewers out there. So, wow, thank you. I appreciate that. Don't forget to rate, review and follow our show wherever you listen so you don't ever miss an episode. You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betts. And until next time, be cool. Don't be all like Uncool. Mention It All is produced by Sean Kilby and Jorge Morales Pico.

Editing by Sean Kilby. Social media by Dylan Hafer. Guest booking by Nicole Pellegrino. Be sure to follow at Bravo by Betches on Instagram and Twitter. All. Pay off your home. Travel for life. Drive a Ferrari.

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