Mention It All - If A Tre Falls… Ft. Jordana Abraham (RHONJ Reunion)

Episode Date: May 31, 2023

Dylan and Jordana are back to recap a hectic first part of the RHONJ reunion, with Teresa and Melissa each making their final push to secure their spots. Meanwhile, Danielle and Rachel work through their unnecessary feud, Margaret’s arsenal is laid bare, and we find ourselves right back in 2010. Check out our latest promo codes here: https://betches.com/promos Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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We're going to check me, though. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Mention It All podcast. I'm Dylan Hafer, and of course, it is a Real Housewives of New Jersey reunion, part one. So I am joined by none other than Jordana Abraham in the studio.

Hey, Jordana. Hey, Jordana. Hey, Dylan. So happy to be back for a reunion week, across the Bravo board. Across the Bravo board, we were just talking about the trip. Reunion is really, it's a strange time in the Bravo calendar. Right.

I feel like they usually stagger the shows so that they're not all ending at the same time. But I feel like they're trying to like close this block and start another one. Right. They're like, we really, really, really need you to watch Roney. So we're not going to give you. Nothing else. It's like you can have OC and I guess Atlanta will still be on. But like you're not, you're not going to have Vanderpump rules.

Right. So you're going to have to pay attention or else you're going to have nothing to talk about. It does feel like this reunion for New Jersey is kind of a crossroads in maybe the franchise history. Like right from the moment we get into it, it's very like, something's coming. That is definitely what they're leading. They're like, they seem to be insinuating on all fronts. I think that it was interesting to me the level to which Teresa is kind of playing into that narrative, which ultimately, assuming that there is a choice between them made after this season,

it could either be really triumphant for her or, frankly, really embarrassing. Right. I mean. She's like, bye, bye, you're leaving. You're leaving. And it's like, perhaps. I feel like in Teresa's head, she's like, if I say it enough, it will just be the case. Right.

Like, if I am like the dog that pisses all over the tree enough times, the other dogs won't want to even come near her. I wonder if they're going to, if Andy is. going to like king solomon the show like you know where like instead of he's going to cut the baby in half and get rid of both of them that's I mean it's stressful to think I'm like I don't know I mean if they were like two annoying kids who were like fighting over a toy you'd be like no one gets it it's not a bad point I do think like Teresa and Melissa are obviously both not in a good place with each other but their energy coming into the reunion does feel a little different like I don't

I think Teresa seems to be more in a place of just like, I'm done, I'm done, I'm done, I'm done. I don't want to look at you. I don't want to talk to you. I can't wait to never see your face again. It's over after today, whether I stay on the show or not. And Melissa feels like she's kind of choosing her moments a little bit more, has like maybe a little more strategy versus Teresa just kind of being like, I hate you. We're done. Right.

Yeah. I would say Melissa seems like she's willing to like engage about it. like the whole thing more and like still discuss it and still talk about like the points of her like arguments and Teresa almost seems like I'm not even going to do that like yeah I mean when when Teresa when Andy's like okay so you know after today like she's out of your life and she's like yeah thank God she's out of my life and Melissa just kind of let it sit there and then she's like sad and it's like I don't actually think Melissa feels that sad about it but I do think it's it is striking watching the show that it's like Melissa wasn't the one who said that.

Like she let Teresa say it. And then Teresa's on the record as basically being like, I hate these people. Well, she's drawing the line in the sand. She's basically saying like, I will not, I'm not filming with her. Which I didn't, which is a bold move. Right. And I mean, giving an ultimatum is not, whether in relationships or on reality TV shows, it's, uh, usually doesn't end well, but we will see.

I don't know. I really have no idea what. they're going to do. I don't, I don't really have, like, a firm feeling about. I kind of feel like they're not going to get rid of either of them and they're going to say, like, if you won't film, that's on you. Right. Like, you're going to have to figure this out. Right. You, you both are welcome to come back and film. Yeah. But, like, you know, if you're not showing up to half the scenes, maybe that means you're going to be friend of or demoted or not in every episode or something. I think Melissa will show up to filming. I don't think she's like over it enough that she's going to be like,

well, if you're not firing her, then I'm not coming back. Like, I don't get the sense that that's her stance. Whereas with Teresa, it kind of feels like that might be something that she would threaten. Yeah. And we've, we've talked about this over the course of the season, but Melissa is in a position where she just has more friends in the group that it's like if, you know, if Margaret's throwing an event and it's either Teresa or Melissa that gets to be there, obviously she's going to put Melissa on the list. I love how they're like still bringing up though. Like they're still bringing up Melissa getting on the show. Oh, God.

I, the thing is, look, have we ever gotten a hundred percent clarity and closure on that situation? Perhaps not. I mean, Andy kind of said like, you were, he kind of said what the, why he made that decision. Yeah. But yeah, Teresa goes back to kind of her talking points a couple times throughout the episode.

You see it when when there's the, I got. I got married on the, I got divorced on the show. I had a baby on the show. I went to jail on the show. She basically gave that exact same monologue on her podcast. Yes. I was like, where have I heard this before?

I feel like I've heard you. Yeah, it was like toward the beginning of this season when she was like basically saying that Melissa's only storyline was her, which is, you know, something that people talk about a lot. But then she also goes back to the talking point of and then you went behind my back to get on the show all those years ago, which I looked at the calendar. Melissa started filming for Jersey in 2010. Oh my God.

So that's 13 years ago. 13 years ago. Let's say that was how she got on the show. Let's say we give Teresa that argument. She gets on the show because she's the feuding sister-in-law of Teresa. It's not like that's the only reason she's been like staying on the, like she's earned at this point. I think she's earned her place. Right.

And I think there's a lot of talk about storylines and kind of like what, you know, your housewives resume or whatever. But like, casting happens every season. Like contracts go out every season. And to stay on any show, anybody to stay on a show for this long in any context, there's a reason. That's like an active choice being made by production every year to bring you back. So it. I mean, Kathy didn't make it. Like that's how she got on the show. She's not still here. Right. And I mean, across every franchise, there are countless people who at one point maybe were the star of the show. And then, you know, Lisa Rina's not on Beverly Hills this season. And so I think kind of to be like dogging Melissa for not having like enough bullet points on her resume. It's like

that's not Melissa's problem. Like take it up with who was ever sending out the contracts. Right. But also Andy basically does kind of make the point that you just made that it's like, I mean, first of all, he doesn't recall Melissa like reaching out to, you know, begging to get on the show. But also it's like, we're casting a reality show. There's like the young hot sister-in-law and the brother. Right. And, you know, there's some tension there. And she seems she has young kids.

She is the whole package of what Housewives looks for. Right. Why wouldn't they cast her? It's so funny that like I do feel like there's this moment in an OG. And Teresa is one of the only remaining OGs. There's like Beverly Hills ones, whatever. But I do think it's almost like there's a moment where they fly a little too close to the sun. And you saw this with like Jacks.

Yeah. Where he was like, it's my show. And Lisa Vanderpump was like, actually, it's my show. And I think that sometimes when you get a little too sure, that's sort of like the kiss of death. I think maybe Vicky had that a little bit too. Like you can't, no one's ever a sure thing. I think is sort of like the lesson here. Yeah, for sure.

And I mean, that goes back to, you know, they. Everybody gets cast every season. You know, whether or not you're returning or you're new or you're coming back or you've been on the show forever, they have to choose you next time. You know, like you're only as good as your last time. As your worst season, yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, we're nowhere near done with the, uh, the Teresa and Melissa of it all. But this episode, there's more going on.

First of all the portraits that they put up of all these women on the set where they're like, like, like, who do they get commissioned this from? like photoshopped into like Renaissance paintings. It was so funny. They're in an Irish castle, I guess. I have to say, seeing Melissa's outfit up close, I don't fully get it. There's a hood. The hood is a little, I think the blue sparkles I'm into.

Yes. The hood, I don't quite. I like the, like color and the sparkles, but I feel like the design is like very bizarre, even just like the front. And the hood is like adds just an extra layer of like what is going on. on here. Also, the blue and gold color scheme feels so cohesive. And then Danielle, lovely Danielle, is sitting there in that lilac dress and it just is off putting to the eye. It was so funny when Andy was like, Jennifer, I see you're in Ramona Blue. And she's like, I call it Royal Blue.

I love it. Like, Andy forgets that not all of these women know like every Bravo reference. Right. So it's like, Ramona Blue. And she's like, that's, you know, I don't know if that's what they say at Benjamin Moore. Right. And she's like, Roblin, he's like, yeah,

I mean, most people call up that. Fair. I, yeah, no, and Teresa immediately is like, please God,

be with me, Namaste. She's grabbing Andy's hand. She's like, give me, give me the hand. Feel my heart. It's real.

That's real. That was a little stunty to me. Yeah. No, I agree. So, yeah, Andy asks Melissa and

Teresa's goals for the day. Teresa wants to close a chapter and move forward in peace. Melissa says there's a lot of truth that needs to come out, but she also wants to close a chapter in peace. And it's like, okay, we'll. We'll see. We'll see. Yeah, the peace thing we've talked about this over the course of the season, that it's like, what does peace mean in a situation where two people fucking hate each other? Right. I mean, it's still, it's weird, because it's still not fully clear to me why they hate each other so much. Like, there wasn't some,

like ultimate betrayal. It just doesn't feel like. I guess it's just years of pent up resentment. Well, you know, when Teresa was single, they never even invited her out to dinner. Oh, my God, that was so funny when they were showing the group picks at like these restaurants. They went to, uh, I invited myself. We went to Charlie's in Bayhead. Like, the, it is funny. Like, obviously there's a lot of layers to this relationship over the years and her, whatever. But the fact that for Teresa, this. period of her life boils down to like, you didn't ask me out to dinner? Right, but it doesn't even seem like that's true. Right.

And yeah, there seems to be a little bit of kind of just like speaking off the top of your head where it's like, oh, I mean like you, you know, you could have invited me to dinner more. You could have like introduced me to the hot neighbor or whatever. And it's like, that's not really what this is about. Right. We're looking for things to like demonize the other person. Right.

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Obviously, the husbands are going to come out later in the reunion. but there's this thing where basically, Teresa says Joe basically dragged Louis onto the cameras. And then Melissa says that back when Teresa and her were filming Ultimate Girls Trip, that Louis hadn't been on the show yet and he was begging Joe saying the whole week that they should get on a flight and go down and basically crash the filming. Get on camera. Yeah. get on camera and that he did know who she was when when they met, which Teresa has said he

didn't. And that the craziest part of this is that he, I guess, wanted to date Alexia from Real House of Miami before he met Teresa. Like all of these things, Teresa says they're all lies. I'm not inclined to believe that those are just being pulled out of thin air. I mean, I kind like, again, I don't know for sure. I have no personal knowledge of the situation, but all those things seem likely. just because like if you look at Louis Instagram

like he seems like he's trying to make a name for himself on Instagram like most if he really wanted to be low key and off camera he wouldn't be like posting every day like he posts he's a man in his 50s and he posts constantly I don't know any other any other men in their 50s who are doing that so clearly he's like leaning in right there are bravo husbands who have like no online presence like Bill Aiden is Bill Aiden on Instagram? I mean he's doing his plastic surgery testimonials. Okay, he's using it for work. He's doing Joe Judice's

uncle's eyes or whatever. Oh my God. That was so funny. But he's not like using it as like speaking to the camera, giving motivational like interviews. Right. Like it almost, Louis has a little bit of like want to be influencer vibes going on, which is, I mean, it's funny. Maybe he wants endorsements. You know, Andy loves his endorsements. Here's the thing. Dating someone like to even if you didn't know immediately, I would say when you found out that you were going on a date with someone from the real housewives of New Jersey, that would be something that would be a huge consideration, I think, when you were deciding to date someone or not. So the idea that he would have no idea, didn't care at all. Like, I'm not saying he like planted himself to run into her on the walk, but like I think that he was had very much knew what he was doing. Yeah, this was a conversation last season when he was newer to the show and they weren't married yet about did he sign up for this?

Is it fair to kind of pull him into stuff that's happening on the show? And, you know, Teresa was very adamant. Like, leave him out of it. He didn't sign up for this. This isn't, this is my, like, talk to me, not him. Right. And it's like, like, even then that was a little bit of a tough argument. And then now it's like he's fully on the show.

He's very much on the show. Like, he's not trying to hide. anymore. Right. He's on the show just as much as any of the other men are on this cast, which is quite a bit. And yeah, I mean, there are certain things that just come along with that. But like you said about, you know, if you were going to date someone from the housewives, whatever you would look it up. I thought it was really interesting to hear Danielle say that her brother's favorite show is Real Housewives of New Jersey. I don't understand. I still don't at what's going on there, that they would send back the gift? Yeah. It's, it is weird. And like,

she's so adamant that there's not, like, a missing piece that we're not hearing. It just doesn't make any sense to me. No. And I noticed they definitely cut in the trailer to make it look like they were having some big sit down the next day. Really, it's her grandmother's funeral that they were just going to both be at. So, like, you know, that's not going to be some big filmed, like, confrontation between her and her brother. But it does feel like this is one of those things where it's like this isn't going to feel like it's rewarding as a storyline until we get more context. Both sides.

Yeah. The full context. I don't understand why she won't just give more. Unless her brother's like a lunatic, that wouldn't be a reason that you would never speak to someone again and send back a gift just because they blocked you on Instagram. Yeah. I mean, she seems like she would do anything to have a relationship with this person. again. Like she seems very actively sad about the fact that they don't have a relationship.

But it is, it's strange to me. Not that she won't like admit that there's more to the story, but that she doesn't seem to understand why it seems weird. Why that doesn't make sense to most people. Yeah. Right. Because it's kind of, to me, in my mind, I'm kind of like, if you had the kind of brother that would never speak to you again because you blocked him on Instagram because he was making fun of you, you would think about that before you blocked him on Instagram. Yeah. Or you wouldn't think about it. You wouldn't care if he stopped speaking to you because he would be like kind of crazy.

My brother's a piece of shit anyway. Yeah. I don't need that in my space. Exactly. Something is just like not checking out. I just don't. It doesn't make sense. And the back that she doesn't, that she thinks the storyline makes sense is weird.

And then she kind of tries to play it off by being like, oh, like I, I hope Margaret has something in her arsenal because I would love to know. It's like, no, that's not. That's what we're doing here. Yeah, I don't think that's what's going. Like, she has no idea why her brother would be this man. And her parents also, like, are kind of, like, can't get through to him either. Like, that doesn't make sense.

It's just, there's something there's something they're not telling us. I wish, if anyone is an insider onto the Cabral family drama and knows the real story, I would like an arsenal personally. Please DM me. I want to know. I feel like there's, like, a non-zero chance that Danielle's brother is listening to this right now. So if it's you, send in an anonymous tip.

Or not or not. I mean, come on. Come on. You're welcome. Can he, are we formally welcoming her brother onto the show? Brother Cabral. Yeah. I guess his name wouldn't be Cabral because that's nice.

Oh, yeah. Mr. Daniel's brother, sure. Open invitation. Tell your side of the story. I don't know what I'm opening myself up to there. They also don't say his name, right? I don't think so.

I guess he probably didn't sign off for that or it's like, would be like slander or libel or something. I mean, but it's his favorite show. I know. Maybe that's her ultimate payback is ruining his favorite show by getting on it. You want to watch it? You got to watch me. And if it's his favorite show, why would he be so upset that she was like this thirsty person supposedly like posting all this stuff on Instagram?

Like it just doesn't make sense. Yeah. I mean, if I were a betting man, I would say if Danielle is back next season, we're going to see the brother. I feel like they're going to almost say like if you want to come. back. You have to tell the story. Right. Like there's like a clause in your contract that it's like you must, we will handle the logistics. We'll get him in the room, but like you have to agree to do this. Yeah. I would, I would watch for that. I hope so. And honestly, like, so Margaret got asked about what she said in

Ireland about, you know, if she doesn't forgive and forget, she's never going to have, she's always going to have problems in a family. And she stands by it. She says it was harsh, but she kind of stands by it, which I don't disagree with. Teresa then says that she's great at forgiving and forgetting. which it reminded me a few weeks ago she was saying that the only time she and Joe Judas ever fought in their marriage was because of her brother and issues he was causing.

And it seems like Teresa does have this kind of thread of misremembering things or being a little charitable maybe to herself. Well, if you talk about storylines not making sense, that to me doesn't, she says two things at the same time. One, Joe and I never fought. unless it was about my brother. Two, I never loved Joe. Never. We had a horrible, you know what I mean.

I was, I was rethinking my wedding on my wedding day and I, you know, I made a huge mistake by marrying him. Like to me, if you had a, I don't know what, like 10, 13 year marriage, maybe more with someone that you only fought about one thing with. I'd be like, that seems like that was a pretty healthy marriage. Batting average could be worse. Right. It just doesn't make sense. There are two conflicting storylines. Right. And I mean, similarly, she's saying she's great at forgiving and forgetting. And then later in the episode, like we said, is bringing up something that happened in 2010. Yeah. It's not configuring.

Right. And like I don't think you don't have to be great at forgiving and forgetting. Everybody has their things that are tough for them. But it's like then. Well, that's the annoying part about Teresa. Again, like I think she has redeeming qualities. But there's never a moment where she's like, yeah, I'm pretty vindictive. Or like, I hold a grudge.

Or here's something kind of negative about me that I'm. I'm working on. Yeah. Which to be, you know, to be fair, I don't think Melissa is great at that either. Like, I think there is. Most housewives, I guess, are not because that's sort of they would have less drama if they were more self-aware. Yeah.

And I mean, both of these women have been on the show for a long time. There is a lot of substance to work with. Right. And like, you know, for Melissa to say, like, we've never said anything negative about whatever. Like, that's a broad statement that is probably not true. But like, I think both of them kind of. Yeah, no one is giving anything.

I agree. That's true. Melissa doesn't really either. And I guess Teresa did say the beginning of the season that she does is quick to anger. When she went to therapy. Sure. Right, right, wait. Oh, I forgot about therapy.

Yeah. It is, oh my God. Like the therapy threw lines on these shows. It's just like, sure. Insane, yeah. We should have the therapists come to the reunion sometimes. Or come on the show. Give us the back.

I'm sure that would be like extremely illegal. Yeah. How does Dr. Patient Confidentiality work? when you have reality TV cameras in the room during your session. I've always wondered that. Like how it seems like a breach of like all moral codes. Wave it. Yeah, I mean, clearly they wave it.

But if I were someone's therapist, I would advise them against doing that. Right. Like, look. So we've met once. Right. This is our second meeting. I would say it seems like you still have a lot of stuff to work through. And I would say maybe doing that on camera isn't going to be the best route.

I would say, yeah. If I were a therapist, I think I would say for a session, like maybe reality. TV isn't the best for your mental health. So you've been doing this 13 years? Right. Let's get a camera in here. No. Yeah.

I think maybe if you were a therapist, you would have higher morals than some of the ones we've seen on Bravo. I would hope. It's good exposure, I guess, but it seems like... At what cost. Crazy. Yeah. Do people really see, like, you know, Dr. Barbara or whoever on Bravo and be like,

I want her to be my therapist? No. Because I wouldn't see a therapist that would tell that would televise their sessions. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, it's so weird. I love, uh, Margaret calls Teresa's fans her tree stumps, which is like, they, it's usually like tree hoggers.

And Teresa, that goes over Teresa's head and she thinks it's a comment on her appearance. And her like, yeah. And she's like, yeah. Look at you. Look at you. Yeah. Right. That was so funny.

Just because like, because she was like so me. She replied. with like such a mean comment. She's like, that's not what I meant. Yeah, Margaret's like, okay, catching strays left or right. Going over your head, yeah. Danielle, had a fun comeback that I just want to give her like one little like brownie point for.

She said, you call me a wannabe. That's the truth. I want to be nothing like you. Danielle is like a like a, I don't know, she's like a caricature of like a real housewife's character. She gets really activated. And her stuff with Rachel, it's interesting because that was obviously, you know, it happened in the season. It was a storyline.

But they both came with a lot of heat for each other at this reunion that I maybe was not really. I feel like neither of them wanted to get on the sides to like take on any of the real. I sensed a hesitancy with both of them with getting on anyone's bad side who's like the OGs or the people who have like been here for a while. So I feel like they thought it was easier to go at each other. I think that probably makes sense. And they, you know, Andy kind of negotiates a peace treaty between them that I think will last, you know, six to eight hours. Yeah. But, you know, Danielle says that Rachel twisted her words about Margaret.

Of course, that's going back to the Arsenal comment. And there are like split opinions on what happened because Margaret even says that the footage was more mild than she expected. Delores says that Rachel's, you know, interpretation was fair. Jennifer is very much like, she misrepresented it. False. But like, overall, it's like, who does care about this? No one. I think this is like a very, I think this is sort of like a storyline for both of them to be in on some drama.

And like, I don't find this, this story to be compelling. I think we should, I think, I think they should drop it. Yeah. And even Margaret is like, Margaret is joking about the Arsenal thing. Like, she's fine. Right. I also don't think that's that insulting. No, it's really not. But Rachel says, if I was an asshole and a bitch, I would own it. Danielle yelling, I'm not insecure. My balls drag out the door. Oh my God. And Rachel's like, yeah, the door where you leave. It's like, Danielle's good one liners. Good one liners. I mean, that is, I feel like that's the kind of thing where like she has studied for this. Yes. She has, I think those, those were pre-prepared. She's like, I'm going to ace the test and I will show my work. She might not write like the most interesting. essay, but it'll be like...

I think Danielle, like, I think she's extremely invested in getting back on the next season. And I think also probably at this reunion, there is an inkling for her of like, Andy's asking me why like my thing this season was leaving when I got upset. And that's not a great thing to have as a housewife that you're like running away from conflict. Yeah. So I do feel like in the reunion, she probably was like, okay, let me really like... Bring it.

Yeah. Like ground myself and then like... go for it because, I mean, obviously, you need to participate if you're going to stay on the show. I think she'll be back. What do you say? I think she'll be back. I don't see an upside, really, of getting rid of her or Rachel. Yeah, I think they were both, like, solid. I don't think either of them needs to go, especially if we're getting rid of Teresa or, um, or Melissa. Well, you know, food a tile did, uh, Joe and Melissa's new floors. Oh, yeah. I felt bad about all the hate that Melissa was getting about her house. I saw that on TikTok. I mean, uh, you know,

mean, is the house, you know, is it a specific taste? Of course. Yes. Is it everyone's taste? No, but it's like, I, yeah, I, I always think it's a little, like, unnecessary when people really pile on the houses. Yeah, she's like, you know, this is like, it's my house. I like it. Right. Like, Teresa's hair. Yeah. Yeah. And she's like, the girls loved it. Everybody loved it. And it's like, okay. Did you watch the reaction shots? I don't know if she watched the wedding special. I think she probably watched. How would she not watch her own wedding special? She probably. watched the parts that I feel like she had it on. Maybe she didn't pay attention the whole time. Right. Yeah, I don't really see. Speaking of preparing or not preparing, I don't see Teresa's a big preparer. Study and play. Come together on a Windows 11 PC.

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Try them all now at McDonald's. Refreshers contain caffeine. Copyright 2026, the Coca-Cola Company. Sprite is a registered trademark of the Coca-Cola Company. What do you think about the conversation about the Antonia Sweet 16 thing that came out in Ireland? Do you think that was a setup question? It sounded like a set-up question. Yeah.

I don't know if like, I'm sure Rachel was instructed to ask that question. Yeah. I don't know if she knew that it was going to, that she was going to answer it in that way. Yeah. I felt like that was, that was one where I was more on Teresa's side where I'm like, the, the time and place and way that it was asked was felt pretty specific. She took the bait though. Yeah.

But yeah. And I think like, I think probably the, you're right that the producers knew what they were doing more than Rachel did in that moment. That they're like, hey, like, if somebody is like, hey, Rachel, like, if you have time on the bus. Right. Maybe ask about this. Ask a question that might start something. Right.

It's like, Rachel's the new girl. She's like, oh, yeah, they said I should do this show. I probably should. She's not like, oh, I heard there was this thing with the Sweet 16. And if I asked Teresa, I bet she'll say something that'll make Melissa Matt. Like, yeah. It's a little bit more shady on the side of production. I agree.

Planted, but she could have not taken the bait. Yeah. And also I get like, it's a little tough because on the reunion, like, they're not going to say, well, like, the producer texted me from the back of the bus to say this. Right. I think it is interesting the idea of like the way that the kids talk about the relationship. I mean, Melissa has a point she doesn't say. It almost seems like Antonia doesn't care that much. Yeah.

It's not like she's like, she seems like neutral towards the situation. I think she just like is not that invested. Yeah. And I think in in the show terms also, there is a feeling that it's like, oh, well, Teresa's kids have said more negative stuff than Melissa's kids. But also Teresa's kids are just a lot more present in. the show, which you can say that's a bad thing or a good thing or whatever. But just in general, it's like, we don't hear Gino and Joey's thoughts on anything. I don't think they've ever been

miced. If you think about Teresa, it's not so much that people prefer Teresa over Melissa or that she's like a better housewife, but I do think people are invested in her daughters and her children in a way that they aren't with the Gorga kids. For sure. Like, I think they're, there, people really want to see them almost like if teresa didn't have them i think her place would be more at risk yeah i i agree and i think obviously her relationship with louis has given her more of like an active personal storyline but also people are just kind of forever interested in how things are going with her kids and you know the the dynamic with joe not being in the country and how co-parenting you know how do you do that and all that stuff like there's been a lot of

really interesting stuff that's happened with them over the years and them going to prison obviously is the whole thing. Whereas like, you know, Melissa's life on the show, her, you know, nuclear family life has been a lot more chill. Chill boring. You could say that that's a bad thing in terms of storyline, but it's like, it's probably a good thing for her kids that there just hasn't been that much stuff going on at home. Right. It's the kind of thing with like bad for reality TV, great for like their mental health. Great for her just like being at a cheerleading competition.

Yeah. Like she's doing her. It seems like she's got like a happy healthy childhood. Yeah. And I mean not that not that the Jude ice girls are unhappy or whatever, but I do think that there's like there's just something a little bit more intriguing about seeing what's going on with them. Yeah.

And I think the wedding special kind of illustrated that that, you know, to see like all four of them in a confessional together. It's like that's not something really any other housewife would have. have on any show that I can think of. And just not many people have like four like daughters who are kind of just like this little crew of people. Yeah. Yeah.

Like I, I mean, in a way, I feel like Kyle Richards has like the four daughters a little bit, but they're like so far apart in age and they haven't always been on the show. So I feel like that is something where when you talk about, you know, what do we do with the cast? Does Teresa leave? Does Melissa leave? It's like there is a lot that kind of goes along with. And so, I don't know, I mean, maybe that would lend itself to a spin-off. I can't say that I love any, like, individual housewife spin-off, really.

Like, that's not something that is super appealing to me just as a concept in general, leaving Teresa out of it as a personality. But, like, I mean, that could be a show. You know, Kim Zolziak had, like, eight seasons of Don't Be Tarty. Yeah. Very few people are able to carry their own spinoff. Right. And when you think of something like Vanderpump Rules, it's like,

that was Lisa's spin-off, but it's a completely separate thing. It's really not about her. She's in it, like, minimally. Yeah. So, so, so I don't know. I mean, I, it is interesting, though, to come back to the, the idea of Melissa saying that Teresa's kids have hate for her. And Teresa says her kids don't hate Melissa. I do think. She was crying at the mention of her name. So I was surprised they didn't dig in a little more to some of the specific scenes that we've seen this season because I feel like this season was kind of a turning point in terms of in the Teresa and Louie household how it seemed like Melissa and Joe were being spoken about openly. Yeah.

And it was like the kind of party line now is like, wow, my my piece of shit uncle and his and his and his bitch wife. Yeah. Like, and that's not, and that's not saying like, oh, Melania is such a evil little kid. Like, she hates her uncle. But it's like, that's the storyline in that house. As a family, it seems like the kids are pretty much on board with like Uncle Joe sucks. Yeah.

They seem to really not like him. I would say, I don't mean, maybe they wouldn't use the word hate, but it definitely seems like they have strong dislike at the very least for her and him. And like, maybe there's a reason behind that. I don't know. Like, we weren't there every day when Teresa was in prison, but they seemed like they got along after she came back. So I don't fully understand, like, why is it about that? What is it?

Why do the kids dislike them so much? I think the comments, it's a big sticking point seems to be that comment that Joe made on Melissa's podcast a while back about putting food on the table and doing all this stuff, you know, when Teresa was away. And then after she came back and Joe was gone. and that like there seems to be some resentment from Teresa and from her daughters of like him sort of like claiming responsibility I guess for them being like okay. And I think Joe Judeyice probably is also very upset about that claim.

Yeah. And I mean, I think obviously it's a really shitty situation for, you know, those girls especially and for Teresa and for, you know, Joe Judey also went to prison. but like, again, it's one of those things where now all of this is stuff that happened five, six years ago at this point when you're talking about, you only came to visit me once in prison and he's saying he wasn't on the list until she started filming her special, which, you know, that's another thing where it's like, at this point, it's neither here nor there. Yeah, I think Teresa is a little bit like all or nothing. And I think some, it was probably somewhere in between that, were they like the most intensely devoted. whatever people to the kids. Probably not. Were they abandoning them as soon as she left? Probably not.

I think it was somewhere in between. But Teresa is not really like, she doesn't really live in the gray. So I think that, sure, maybe they could have done more. And in their minds, maybe they did more than they had to. But I think that's sort of, I don't really feel like there's a clear answer there.

Yeah. And I think at this reunion in particular, but over the last few years generally, the temperature is a little too high to actually, have a real conversation about like, okay, I'm getting now where you're coming from. And I'm realizing that maybe we're just thinking of things differently or, you know, kind of, you know, have a different mindset about this. Let's try to get on the same page. It's like when you're when you're so angry and you feel like somebody has said such awful things about you or, you know, lied so egregiously on your name or whatever, it's hard to actually take a step back and be like, okay, where are.

Where are we not seeing? Right. Where could we meet in the middle? I would love to see them in family therapy. I would watch that. Yeah. I know you would. Shocking.

Yeah. I think, you know, for better or for worse, we're just kind of past the point of no return at this reunion. And we don't know where it's going. Well, we got two parts left and I have a feeling that neither of them is going to be trying to meet in the middle. No, I mean, we got to talk about Bo Dietel. We got to talk about. Wow. I think there's a security guard, right?

Yeah. We got a little taste of the Jacqueline Larita Convo at the end of this episode. Oh my God. It's going to be a doozy. Jackler and Lauren. The thing about, that's the, I mean, that's sort of the beauty of having them both stay on is that they both have these like longstanding older. Oh, what did you think of the Dina thing? Do you believe that?

That Dina didn't come to the wedding, Teresa says, because she didn't want to be on camera. And Andy is like. She could have just not signed the release. We've blurred out people's faces. At China's wedding, I feel like there were so many. cast members there that they didn't show, right? I caught up on Family Karma a few weeks ago. And at one of the weddings, the Nicholas's parents didn't want to be on camera.

So they literally just like weren't. Like it's like there's a work around that. Right. They work around that. Like and I don't know. I mean, I believe, I don't know anything about the like alleged business dealing between Dina's husband and Louie. I don't know if that's real.

I don't know what happened there. But it does seem like. There is some, it wouldn't be coming up in this way if there really was nothing to it. Yeah. So, I don't know. Now I really want to know because it's not just that she didn't go. It's that they used to be all over each other's Instagrams. And now there's not much there.

They were, when they got engaged, they were in Mekanos together. Yeah. There's got to be more to this story. Yeah. It's very, it's very interesting. But we will, we'll get into the next two parts. I heard on today's U-Up episode, you tried to explain Scandival to our friend Jared free. That was a doozy. Well, if you want more complicated Bravo musings, then go listen to you up,

I guess. Check it out. You know, we get into the, you know, the real, the dating, emotional part of the scandal of all. Check it out. It's out today. Amazing. Well, thank you, Jordana. And thank you everyone for listening. Don't forget to rate review and follow the show wherever you listen. You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches. And until next time, be cool. Don't be all like uncool. Mention It All is produced by Dylan Hafer, Sean Kilby, Jorge Morales Pico, and Rebecca Sousmakat. Editing by Horace Pico, Social Media by Dylan Hafer, guest booking by Dylan Hafer, and Ali Friedlander. Be sure to follow at Bravo by Betches on Instagram and Twitter.

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