Mention It All - Is Erika Actually Being Sincere? (RHOBH Reunion, Winter House Premiere)

Episode Date: October 21, 2021

Dylan is joined again by Sami and Jordana for another busy Thursday. They start with their thoughts on the Winter House premiere, and how they’d approach being a newbie in a house of reality TV veterans. Dylan spills some tea on attending the premiere party, and who wasn’t in attendance. Then, they dive deep on part two of the RHOBH reunion, where Erika answered lots of questions about her marriage, and Kathy got emotional about her relationship with Kyle. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Your summer starts now with Memorial Day deals at the Home Depot. It's time to fire up summer cookouts with the next grill, four-burner gas grill, on special buy for only $199. And entertain all season with the Hampton Bay West Grove's seven-piece outdoor dining set for only $49. This Memorial Day get low prices guaranteed at the Home Depot. While supplies last, price invalid May 14th or May 27th, U.S. only exclusions apply. See Home Depot.com slash price match for details.

Betch's Media presents. Ha ha, laugh, funny. Mention It All. A Bravo by Betcha's podcast. We don't say that, but now we said it. With Dylan Hafer. Who don't check me, boo? And Barry Rosenfeld.

I need to start drinking alcohol. Now go to sleep week. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Mention at All podcast. I am Dylan Hafer. And once again, I am joined by Sammy Sage and Jordana Abraham because it's a Thursday. And we're going to talk about Beverly Hills. we are so thrilled to be here. What did you think of last night? Oh, it was, it was a busy night on Bravo. You know, they're, they're really working us to the bone with these like double Sundays, double Wednesdays. I'd like to speak to the schedulers because I feel stressed out, but it was, it was a great night of television. Right. Agreed. Yeah, and you were at the premiere party, right? I was at the premier party, yes, to celebrate Winter House,

which what so much to celebrate. Yeah, I mean, I had an issue where, like, I assumed it was like almost like a season, what, like five and a half of Summerhouse. Right. So I assumed my DVR was going to pick it up. But I guess it's like an entirely new show. Yeah, I think they're, I think they're trying to, you know, make some, they've never really done this before where it's like actually a crossover that's its own thing. But I think it works. I think people are excited for it.

I mean, like, in the last couple of years. I feel like Summerhouse has become like so much more legit as a Bravo show. And so I think people are like, people are into it. I was sad. Austin and Craig weren't there last night. And I'm like, could you not get a flight from Charleston? Like what's what's going on? That's weird.

Yeah, that's upsetting because I would have loved to hear your like take on the IRL page, Craig Dynamics. I know. I did. So in the in the episode when Craig is talking about how he's like with Natalie, I like saw a page in the corner like She's like texting with a smile on her face. And I'm like, oh, she's definitely texting Craig. Like, L.O.L. at you talking about your girlfriend right now.

Right. Yeah. I mean, I thought that they were like a thing going into the show. But then when he was talking about his girlfriend, I was a little confused. Right. And like, I don't know if you guys like are like watch all of Southern Charm. But like last season, it was very like, I'm with Natalie. Like I'm settling down.

Like I think she might, you know, they seemed like they were getting serious. And so it was weird to hear. hear him say like, well, we either get married or we break up. And it's like, you could just like stay, stay together. Right. You're not on deadline. Right. I read an article that said that Paige and Craig were totally platonic the whole winter house thing. Yeah. It seems they don't, I mean, Paige is making on the hot tub with Andrea. So. Right. Right. An interesting transition. I was confused by that. I was like, wait, when does she, when does the, the relationship happen? Yeah. Wait, Dilla.

question. Can you, what were Amanda and Kyle like in like their post-wedded bliss? What was that? Um, they seemed great. So I saw them on Tuesday night. I went to the release party for Dave Quinn's book, which I know you're reading right now. I am. And so I was talking to them. Amanda had definitely had some lover boys. Um, but she seemed, they both seemed great. Um, yeah, I was like chatting with her. She did not make it to the Winterhouse Premier Party. How could she not make it to like that? It seems like a lot of people were missing. Didn't make it.

Yeah, Sierra was the other one who wasn't there. So it was like, it was half the cast. I know. It was interesting because it was like the new people were all there. And they were kind of doing their own thing. And then Kyle and Lindsay and then Carl and Danielle were there too because they're supportive besties. You know, we love to see it. And so like,

They were kind of like a four-sum, you know, the like Summerhouse crew. And then I felt, I kind of felt bad for Paige because Sierra and Amanda weren't there. And then Craig wasn't there. So it's like, it felt like there was like one cohort missing. I'm just confused like why all these people didn't go to the premiere party of their own show. I know. But I met, I met Andrea. I met Andrea and he's just as handsome in person.

He gives me such vibes of like singing to me Paolo. Like that's who he is to me. Somebody said that he reminded them of Cedric Lisa Vanderpump's like house guest. Oh, I see that. Like there's something, the accent felt so familiar to me. And you're right. That is who it was. We'll see.

Yeah. It's like, it's interesting having the new people who are just like complete randos to us because like everybody else is so familiar. And it's like, oh, like, Paige's friend Julia just like invited three random friends who like happened to be models. And it's weird like on a show where it's like so established that it's like, oh, summer house, Southern charm. And then it's like, okay, like, are these people going to be like around?

Like do we like them? Do we care? I don't know. They're in the house. Right. What is the dynamic? Gabby's, you know, choosing the best room for herself. I was like, girl, we don't, we can't be doing that.

If you were a new person, let's say you were joining the winter house, right? and you weren't on Summerhouse or Southern Charm. What would your approach to like your room be? What do you think is the ideal approach? I feel like I would, I would know my place. Like I would be so, because I feel like I would be overthinking like, okay, like I don't want to, you know, like, I want everyone to think I'm like fun and like agreeable. And like obviously we can have drama like later.

But like I would be very concerned about like pissing people. off on day one. I think I would be like very deferential. Right. I would also know that like I did not arrange the house. Like I thought Kyle was right that because he arranged the house, he should get did he arrange that. Well, he said like he said, I mean, they're claiming in this house that he arranged the house. So like it's the very fourth wallie in way of being like, well, we're on this girl's trip for Doreen's birthday. So it's Doreen's trip. But in that, but, but, But when you're going to play that game, like the person who plan the house gets the first pick on the room.

Also, they're the only couple. You know, there, it is a couple. So like, maybe they get the- We need a bathroom. And what was the other thing? A closet. Like, where is Kyle going to poop? Like, that's a, you know, that's a valid question.

I agree with you, Dylan. You got to know your place if you're coming in. Like, maybe I wouldn't be like so deferential that I would like let the other newbies get ahead of me. but I would definitely let everyone who was like a previous cast member get ahead of me. Right. It's kind of like a little mini hazing situation. Right.

I would allow myself to be hazed or I would try to buddy up with someone who is a previous cast member and like get in on their room pick. If that were natural, if that were like a natural possibility. Well, yeah. It's kind of like if you were invited on like a bachelor or bachelor at party and you didn't really know. Let's say you're like the bride's cousin. who doesn't know anyone. Yeah. You're not, like, walking into the house and, like, picking the best room being like,

well, I don't know anyone. And, like, I didn't have anything to do with planning this. And I'm just going to, like, take the best room. Right. It's always the bride and the planner who got the best rooms. To, like, Gabby and Jason and Andrea's credit, it is a little awkward that Julia, who's the, like, connecting link, Mr. Flight and is a day late. So they're kind of walking to the house like, hey, like, I was told to show up at this.

time and I'm still here even though our like mutual friend is not. So, um, let's just, I guess, get drunk tonight. Right. It does seem like it's going to be fun. Last night I felt like a lot of setup, but. And Lindsay's not even there yet. Right, right, right. I think, I think it's going to be a pretty good season, but they definitely need that awkward like, we're integrating the castes and the newbies and we're like entering the house. So it wasn't like, I don't think it was the most exciting episode of the season. Yeah, I thought it was fun. I think the concept works and then we'll see

we'll see kind of whether the show itself is like excellent or just kind of like a fun thing to watch. Or will it be the Bachelor Winter Games of Bravo? I hope not. So good, so good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom rack stores now

and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince, Sam Edelman, Frame, and Free People. Join the Nordy Club. to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first, and more. Plus, buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free. Great brands, great prices.

That's why you rack. Girl, winter is so last season. And now Springs got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders. That perfect hang on the patio sundress. Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from your couch.

Done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear up on that envelope? It's time for a little in-person spring treat. It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. Okay, let's get into Beverly Hills. I don't want to waste any more time. Oh, no.

So the first, maybe the first half, I don't know, I wasn't timing it of this episode, is a lot of Erica and Tom, which we were promised by Andy last week, and I feel like they delivered. because there were a lot of, this whole Erica situation, there are so many different, like, layers and, like, elements to it.

And I think once all the, like, legal stuff started coming out, the divorce elements sort of, like, faded into the background. And I liked that they carved out time in the reunion to really, like, go back and pick apart some of the stuff that Erica said about her divorce. Because it was, like, that was the first big. shocking thing that happened in the season and I think it you know I had a lot of questions and I felt like some of them were answered I think he pushed he did a really good good job like pushing her beyond like her like surface answers to like really get at the question really get her to like fully answer the question not just give like a PRE answer so I thought he was very very good at like doubling down on the questions to make sure she answered them yeah the money stuff especially because very quickly, you know, we get to the point where she's like, well, where was I going to go? And Andy's like, I know what you make on this show.

And she says that she gave every paycheck to Tom. So. Right. I thought she did like really well from like a non-disterning standpoint. Like if you're just sort of the average viewer and you don't really have a lot of the details and maybe you don't remember, you know, you haven't like combed through previous seasons for inconsistencies. you probably think she did really well. I feel like she was media trained.

She felt very prepared. It almost felt like she knew what the questions were going to be. But that just, you know, seems like it was good preparation. But like, honestly, like the story would make more sense if she would just go all in on like, I was trapped. I would never do this again. I was captive. I had no access to money. And if she could explain like how she suddenly when all this litigation was about to come out,

got the ability to leave him. Like, where did that money come from? Like, like, and something else that I do sort of wish we could see more. Like, they kept cutting to Sutton looking like really pouty and like wishing to just be like, that's bullshit. So I would love to have been able to hear what like Sutton thought. And I also want to know why like Rina and Kyle and all of them were just like obsessed with like helping her. Yeah.

I thought she made some good points like to give that to her. Like she made some good points, but they were like, well, no one, you know, you, you always pretended you had a good marriage, blah, blah, blah. And then she was like, marriages are like long and complex and sometimes they are good and sometimes they're not good. And like, you know, it's not like it's like binary where it's like my marriage is good or my marriage is bad. Like sometimes you have a good year or a few months and things, then things turn around. So I thought that was all. But what I wish, really wish she would have done is taken some ownership over something. like that's really what was missing just like her she wasn't like yeah like obviously a big part of

the reason i was with tom was because of the money right or like right totally just admit it it would make it feel better or she could have been like yeah like i lied those years about it being good or or like explaining like why you were suddenly ready to leave him right before right in a real some sort of real way that gives a little bit, that takes a little bit of ownership over something. Yeah, I think the timing of her leaving is sort of like the missing puzzle piece to me, because I don't have any trouble believing that she gave all the paychecks to Tom. And I don't have any trouble believing that like she didn't have like free access to all of whatever money she had made and that the firm was kind of like, you know, controlling the

whatever. And so I understand when she says, I didn't necessarily stay because of Tom's money. I stayed because I didn't have access to the money that I had made. Like that, I don't know if it's like 100% true, but it at least makes sense to me. But she doesn't really have a good answer for why did you know that it was time to leave last year when all this shit was about to come out? And also, then the added piece of his. you know, dementia, memory issues.

And she's saying, you know, like, it's incorrect to say that he started losing, you know, he had Alzheimer's and that's why I left. But it was part of it. And it's like the timing still is, you know, it feels like she left at a very specific moment. And I don't think she really, like, you know, it could be a coincidence. I don't know. Like lightning can strike wherever.

but like I don't feel like she really has an answer that wouldn't incriminate her to why she left then. Well, she also, in her book, she said like, this is our money. My name's on the tax return. Like, what, like, I just think there are some, I do think that makes sense that some women do not know what is like going on with the money. Sutton's baseball team. Right, right. Like she knew that there were lawsuits. She had signed things about them.

She, like, she tries to play a little too stupid while she, the whole time she wanted to be seen as really smart. And it's like, okay, so you're giving your $600,000 Bravo paycheck and your husband. And he's putting $20 million into your account and there's not real revenue coming in. Like, where, and you know that there are a law. that alleged that his money is illegitimate. So like, maybe she, she probably can't say this legally, but even if she had been like, honestly, the lawsuits against him really made me see that he was doing funny things financially and that I should try to get out as soon as possible.

Right. Like, even she's always been, he's always been a little, you know, what she's, she almost like, it's like, she should have played more into the like, oh, right, none of the doctors would see him because they were afraid he would sue them. Like, play more into, like, yeah, it's time. Mom has always been like really like shady. And some of his stuff has been kind of shady. And so this to me was like I had a feeling.

She could have said like I had a feeling something. It was like there's just she just really can't play both sides. Well, she kept both sides because she kept saying like, because Andy was like, oh, is it because there was no more money. That's why you left. And she's like, no, I have the debts. It's like, but when did you find out? That's really like you said, what she wasn't answering. It's like, when did you know that you were going to be taking his death?

And then, right. She knew at least a year before because she had signed something that said that his creditors will be paid before she is paid, like in terms of marital assets. Like if there's something like that, she signed something that said that. So she knew that for before the pandemic. Like that was. And certainly she knew when she filed for divorce that she wasn't going to be getting half of some, you know, $50 million fortune.

Like she knew that that was not the situation. The only thing that can explain that to me is if there is offshore money that she is somehow like sticking with him to try to get access to. Even if it's only like $10 million, she wants to be able to get that. That's the only explanation for me that's like why she wouldn't just throw him under the bus. If he really did treat him so terribly, why wouldn't you just throw him and he cheated on you? Like everyone would understand if you threw him under the bus. but it's because you're trying to play like both sides. It just doesn't.

And she's so like contrarian and like just like bad on social media. It doesn't make any sense. What she should have said is like I never left Tom because or I don't know if she can legally say this. But she really, what's probably true, Tom has a, Tom and I have a pre-up where I don't really get anything. No, they have no pre-nup. They have no pre-up?

Yeah. Why would Tom a lawyer who's on his like third wife? I don't know. Because he knew that he didn't really have any money. That to me doesn't make any sense that he wouldn't have a pre-up. Maybe the whole time he was just spending everything that came in. And like he, I don't know. I mean, that's how a Ponzi scheme works.

That's how a Ponzi scheme works, you know. Doesn't it seem crazy to you that a lawyer who's like, well, not at the lawyer. Who's marrying, who's on a third wife, who's marrying one woman 20 years, young, 20 something years younger than him, wouldn't have a, that's like the weirdest thing of the, that I've heard this entire season. He has been illegitimate his whole career. He's been doing the shit his whole career. So it's like, why wouldn't he have a pre-dum?

Maybe because he knows he wants to stick his wife with his, maybe he knows he doesn't have any assets to split. So the, the part last night that really like rubbed me the wrong way. Like I was sort of, you know, I was taking in what Erica was saying. I was, you know, maybe buying some of it, buying other parts of it less. But then when Andy asked sort of how all the accusations against Tom were affecting her feelings toward him, and Erica's like, well, you know, like, I sincerely hope that it's not all true. And Andy's like, do you really think there's a chance this stuff isn't true?

And Erica's like, I think there's a chance. We don't know. we have to get to the bottom of it. And it's like, first of all, we don't have to get to the bottom of anything. You're not like investigating this yourself. But also it's like she makes her, like, she's saying all this stuff about Tom.

He took her money, like all this stuff. And she's, you know, now she's responsible for his debts. But she still won't, like you were saying, she won't throw him under the bus and say, yeah, it's really fucked up what he probably did. And, you know, say something about the victim. and all of this. It's like people are calling her out for using the word allegedly.

And it's like because she still hasn't fully accepted that this is true. Right. It doesn't make sense. Like why are you hedging your bets like that? Like what's the point? She just keeps saying like. Because she thinks maybe if they can't prove it, she won't have to be on the hook for any money. Like, and that's probably her.

Well, also I can, I can understand where unless she was like ready to fully, fully like, she was married to this person. for 20 years. So anything, but anything she says about him on this show will be used against him. If she says he probably did it, they're going to use that in court. They're going to use whatever she says. So I can understand why she might, unless she's fully, fully turning on him, she really can't say, and I think he did something bad. Which again is like, why isn't she fully turning on him? Right. She's not, like, she's not like in the car with him, but she also isn't like fully detaching. She's like,

she, her wagon is still hitched to him, you know, like, she's not he's only, which I think can only be explained by the possibility of getting some offshore money. And like, she's only turning on him. 10 million dollars in a case account. Our watch what happens live drinking game word

today is offshore money. No, like, why would he not put 10 million dollars in an offshore account just in case? Like, and why would she continue to hitch her wagon to him if all the money is truly gone? Right. Well, she's only turning on him. She's ready.

She's extremely happy to turn on him in any sort of like personal way. Like, yeah, he's been cheating. Yeah, he's an asshole. He was like kind of like not supportive and didn't hug me and was verbally abusive. But like that she's fully able to like throw him under the bus, but not this, which is interesting. Can we talk about the ankle and the and the coma and the surgery? like that still makes no sense to me. I feel like I'll get to that.

Okay, I saw someone on Reddit suggest that she knew that if he died, she would then be on the hook for his deaths. So that's why she didn't want to like let them put him under. I just. Interesting theory. I feel like the whole car accident story, like obviously a lot has been made of the fact that it sounds unbelievable or they're, you know, the details don't always. always match up the way she tells it.

But I just feel like with this story, it's like I almost don't care to hear her talk anymore about it because I don't feel like the more she talks about it, I'm not getting any more clarity on what actually happened. And I don't feel like she's ever going to tell a version of the story that I feel 100% like, okay, yeah, like now we know what happened. So it almost feels like a moot point to like. Like a distraction from like the real issue. Right.

And I think with some of with some of the Erica stuff. and I think this is one of those topics, the other women aren't really going to have anything to say about it. Like, a lot of this Erica stuff feels very one-on-one between Erica and Andy. And, like, while I think that is, like, important to get through, I almost want to get to some, like, juicier stuff that, like, the other women can weigh in on.

Like, Sutton barely said a word on last night's episode. And, like, I'd like there to be a little more back and forth, I guess. And also, like, how come Andy? can ask her all these questions, but Sutton can. She's not threatening to sue Andy on the show. So, Eddie, you better watch your, watch your mouth. Yeah, like, seriously. I mean, like, there is, obviously, like, one is a clear interview almost.

Yeah. Well, also, like, Erica didn't do one single piece of press this entire season. Like, she was fully benched during the season. And so the reunion, like, literally is the only time that she's had any kind of platform been asked any questions outside of the filming context. And so like it is, it almost feels like it's like this is the interview that you're going to do. And it's going to be Andy on the reunion couch, which is weird. But right. I mean, if I were her and I were her publicist, I would stop, I would tell her to stop saying, I have to look out for me.

I just feel like she kept repeating that. Like I, the victims like totally feel bad if that's what happened, but I need to look out for me. But I need to look at it. It's like, just don't say that. Like we get, it's sort of implied. Just don't do it. All new drinks are now at McDonald's, with refreshers like the strawberry watermelon refresher and the mango pineapple refresher with popping boba to crafted sodas like the Spriteberry berry blast with berry flavors and cold foam. Who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire? Try them all now at McDonald's. Refreshers contain caffeine.

Copyright 2026, the Coca-Cola Company. Sprite is a registered trademark of the Coca-Cola Company. Ready to soundtrack your summer? With Red Bull Summer All-Day Play, you choose a playlist that fits your summer vibe the best. Are you a festival fanatic, a deep-end DJ, a road dog, or a trail mixer? Just add a song to your chosen playlist

and put your summer on track. Red Bull Summer All-Day Play. Red Bull gives you wings. Visit redbull.com slash Bright Summer ahead to learn more. See you this summer. You know, one part that I did kind of like believe and felt rang true to me was her when she said that Tom was on a loop. Like, I thought that actually, like, I do believe that Tom deteriorated.

But I think she's using his deterioration in a way that it doesn't actually justify what he did. Like, I think he was doing those things. And he also happened to start to deteriorate. Right. I'm on board with the dementia Alzheimer's, whatever. Like that stuff makes sense to me. Like I've had family members who have gone through that.

And so I've seen that process. And like the whole like telling a story from 20 years ago and like knowing that story doesn't mean that you're like 100% with it. And I think the way she kind of explained that last night feels it rings true of like having a loved one with dementia. And so like, but I think you're right that it's like, I don't feel like that is, I feel like that's a totally separate issue than like any of his career dealings. Well, I think it probably plays into it in a sense, right? Because let's say you're Erica, you know your husband's been doing some kind of shady things, but like he seems to have been getting away with it for quite a while.

All of a sudden, he's starting to get a little sloppy about it, probably because he is mentally getting a little bit like less capacitated right and then she's probably realizing like okay he's not doing this as well as he used to because he doesn't have like he's not fully functioning he's going to go be going down because people are starting to realize this and like who's next to him it's like me and who's going to have to deal with all of it it's me and maybe that's when she decided to leave it's like right because she's going to have to almost do more she's going to have to deal with it more than because he's like, has dementia. Right. But she can't say that because then it's like, oh, actually, I kind of knew

the whole time, but I didn't do anything because it didn't seem like it's going to fall on me. But it's like, okay, you have like his crimes. And then you have her putting like all these like clouds in front of it. Like, ooh, the dementia, the car accident. Like the, you know, the, these, all the affairs. Like she puts, it's like, okay, all those things can be true, but you still have the crimes and everything else you're saying is just obfuscating that. I, wait, this just occurred to me with what you were saying, Jordana. If she hadn't filed for divorce, do you think there was a chance that they would have made her his conservator?

Probably. And I bet she did not want that responsibility. Like, she did not want to be the one who was like put in charge of handling whatever. Like she's obviously she still is like liable for stuff. She's named in lawsuits. She's on the hook. But like she doesn't have to like go to all these court dates and like speak on behalf of Tom. And like I bet that was something that she really didn't want to be like around for.

She could have said she didn't want to be it. They could have made it just like an attorney could have been her his conservator. Like I don't think she she would have been like. Okay. Maybe. I don't know. I mean like it might have looked weird if she wasn't. No, no, no.

can, it is very common to just, if someone has dementia that the spouse does not want to be the conservator, I don't think that's like that fishy. Like, a lawyer would be better at it because they can like navigate. That's true. You know, I actually don't think, I mean, she could have been, but I don't think she would have been. Okay. I want to move on a little bit. I want to ask what you thought about Derreet saying that she has taken a lot of shit for a long time because she is an easy target. Because I thought that was... Is she an easy target?

I think she's kind of an easy target. I feel like Doreet is an easy target because she makes herself an easy target. Like she speaks a lot. She says a lot of things that I think are easy to like... That are told you up and be like... Right.

And I think it's like, if you put yourself in the position of being an easy target, then yeah, you might get shit. coming back at you and I feel like she was trying to like play the victim a little bit and it's like, Doreet. Doreet shoots from the hip and that's why like sometimes you can agree with her and like 50% of the time you can agree with her and 50% of the time it's like what the fuck are you talking about like and I think that that's good for a reality show.

But like now she's trying to like turn it into a story of like everyone picks on me. And it's like no. Right. It's like you say dumb shit and people are going to respond. respond to it. That's not the same as people like antagonizing you for no reason. Correct. Like Arcel, I think people kind of antagonized her for no reason. No one really knows that. What did you think there was a rumor? I can't remember like who where originated that Doreet is like on the chopping block for season 12. I heard that and I wish it wasn't Doreet. I wish it was Rina. Rina. Yeah. I think they'll keep her around. I think they'll keep her around. I think Doret is good for the show. in the sense that whether you like her or not,

she can kind of, she'll play with anyone. And I think she's less, you know, Rina is somebody who takes such a strong stance and then it just like, I feel like it can develop in a way that's like not enjoyable to watch,

not entertaining, whatever. Like, yeah, like it's happened a couple times whereas to read, I feel like she maybe is less like strong in her convictions,

but that almost helps because then it's like, oh, like, you can still, like, go to lunch with anyone. You're not getting in these, like, massive rifts that then you can't be in the same room with someone. Do you think it also came down to, like, oh, we'd rather have Harry Hamlin than P.K. Oh, God. Do they have Harry Hamlin? Harry Hamlin's not that interesting. I agree.

I actually think P.K. is more interesting. He at least, like, says shit. He seems like a nice, normal guy. Why is that good TV? No, like, I don't care about your sauce. Like, I'll buy it in a store. I don't need to watch it on TV. Harry like begrudgingly does one episode of season.

PK like shows up to film. Pekke will start drama. Pekay is arguably more funny and interesting than Doreet, which I guess people have said. Do you think Doreet had a nose job? I, I... Maybe she had like a filler nose job. I was just going to say I could see her, I could see her dying on the hill of I haven't had a nose job, but she did the like non-surgical. Agreed.

You know. I think she probably did. like, why wouldn't she? She doesn't say that then. Everyone would just like forget it. No, she probably is like, that's not the same as like a rhinoplasty. Honestly, she looks great. I don't give a shit.

I don't care either. It's just like funny that like, if she had it, I don't, I just think she should say it. I've had filler put in my nose, but that's not the same. Like they did not break the bone. She's like, Andy, when you go to the doctor and you say I want a nose job, that means you're going under your. anesthesia. They're going to be breaking the bone. Skin is broken.

Andy, I never did. It was a needle. Yeah. A three-meat recovery. She's like, I never had to wear the bandage. She does look great. So whatever she's doing. And she made a birthday video for Harry Stiles, which was out of nowhere. First of all, Harry Stiles watches housewives. Okay, random.

Very random. The clip of Doreet being like, Harry, I found out you were watching our show in quarantine. And I love to hear it. What is happening? Right. That was so weird. What about how Kyle was clearly, like, still upset that Drake didn't follow her? She was like, she definitely felt like a little bitter about it.

I want to know, I want to, I want to know what Florence Pugh was saying in Rina's DMs. Oh, same. But Florence Pugh just did a movie with Harry Stiles. So maybe they were like chatting Beverly Hills on. set. Interesting. Or maybe Renno was trying to get Florence Pugh to set up Harry Styles with

Amelia. That could be too. But Olivia Wilde was the director of that movie. True. So that could have been awkward. I think Kathy Hilton, I'm a little annoyed that they won't get into the

the Hilton mom like thing. They will not touch that. The more they don't touch it, the more they don't touch it, the more curious people become and the more shocked they will be when they read about her. I almost feel like with Kathy, like she's obviously in a different position than anyone else in this cast because

she's not full time. She's not like angling to get a diamond or anything. So I feel like she probably has more strict boundaries of like what she will and won't discuss. And I think probably the producers and the editors and the network and everyone, they've seen how much everybody has enjoyed Kathy this season. And so I feel like they probably would rather tiptoe around upsetting her and like bring her back next season than like push her to a place she doesn't want to go. And then she's like, fuck this.

I don't need to do this. Yeah. Right. Kathy, their mother was a horrible person. Like, like really. I mean, she's sitting there crying hysterically on the show about her. I think it's like when you've read about her, it seems very weird. I actually think that there's like a bit of a stockholm.

syndrome between like these three women and their mother and Kyle's the only one who's like even remotely like been willing to like in any way explore like their mother and how she behaved like not even but not even like in a real way. And she's really doing an idealized way too. She, I mean, they're all doing an idealized way. But I think Kathy is like on another level meaning like she won't, she wouldn't even talk about how she like couldn't cook and like Kyle was like yeah, like she couldn't cook. But that doesn't even go to like the real essence of Kathy Avanzino.

When Kathy said that she still had never actually watched American woman, like that was telling to me because that caused, I don't really watch a lot of TV. She watched the trailer. But like that was such a big source of strife between the sisters. And so it's like, you know, even if they disagreed about what was offensive. or what was crossing the line. It's like, Kathy doesn't even technically really know what she's talking about when it comes to the show itself.

And so I think I have to imagine that, you know, even if Kyle has decided to put it aside, she must still be frustrated by that. That it's like, Kathy is still like saying how this show was disrespectful, but she never actually watched it. Well, Kathy probably knows, the more people are curious. Kathy probably knows it's like a slippery slope. Like, once you open one,

one thing, like it could, like, it could become like a publicly, like, acknowledged thing about just how crazy their mom was or just how, like, she's right about that. She is totally right about that. That it's like, if you're starting a TV show, you're opening the door to people like digging. Right. Like, even if your TV show is like a loving tribute, you know, with some, you know, maybe unflattering moments peppered in there. If people are like, Google. Googling like what was big, big Kathy actually like, you know, like there might be some info there.

But also with, you know, obviously Kathy is in a position of power on the show. But in her relationship with Kyle, you know, Kyle's never going to like really push back because she doesn't want to damage what she's been able to rebuild with Kathy. And I think, you know, Kathy is the alpha in that relationship because Kyle of the sisters. Yeah, because Kyle, you know, she's. She likes being on good terms with Kathy because that makes her look good. Kathy's the alpha of the relationship because she most successfully lived out her mother's command, which was to get married to someone extremely wealthy and have a lot of children with them.

You know, Kyle didn't do too bad on that either. No, Kyle did great. Like, honestly, I think Kyle's probably like upset that Big Kathy didn't get to see like Maricio at his most wealthy. I think, but yeah, but I mean, Kathy has like almost the more public recognition of like the Hilton brand, which is obviously a little stronger. Yeah, totally. And had Nicky married a Rothschild. Right. And Faris Hilton is like, obviously like the most famous of all of the people that we're talking about.

I highly recommend anyone who's really interested in like the dates about Big Kathy. Readhouse of Hilton. Like there are so many. I need to get into that. I read a summary last night. It was some very shocking stuff. It's incredibly fucked up. Like, I understand why Kathy doesn't want, like, her mother to go mentioned at all because

there was a really bad adagos about her out there's, like, about her mom, like, pimping out young girls to, like, rich men. There's also a whole thing about her mom pimping out. Kathy. Well, not, okay. Kathy and other, she was, like, almost like a fucked up matchmaker, but like in a more, like, sexual way. Allegedly.

Allegedly. Madam matchmaker. Basically for like young girls and like rich men. That one I think in the book was like a little bit less certain. Like the specifics were less. Allegedly. The specifics were less concrete on that. But like she fed her mother-in-law.

Oh no. She fed her daughter, her stepdaughter, a cheeseburger with a screw inside it. Because she had very nice teeth and she wanted to fuck them up. Maybe that's why Kathy is so interesting. in dental work. Yeah. Which we're going to talk about on part three. In the preview and they're like, who would like Kathy Hilton cut their hair?

I'm like, what are we doing here? How is this? How is this what we're talking about? But I'm excited to see Erica. I feel like next episode, the Erica stuff we're getting into is going to get a little more like intense. We need to be more combative, I think, with the other house lives. Exactly.

And that's what I'm really excited. for. I do want them to get into her fight with Sutton because like regardless of what happened with Tom, the fight with Sutton was like its own piece. I'm sure it'll have a whole section. Right. And like we, you know, we see Andy kind of pressing her about like, what is this like threat? Like what are you what are you saying it's going to happen? I need to know like when she says it's not a threat. It's a promise. It's like, okay, but like what are you promising to do? Please explain. Please elaborate. You can almost see what she learned from Tom. in the way she, like, responded to these, to these accusations.

Like, you can kind of see how he was able to keep, like, the accusers at bay for so many years because he clearly, like, use these, like, bulldozing tactics. Yeah. And, you know, clearly doctors were worried that he was going to sue them, which is, like, such a strange, like... It's telling. Yeah, it is. People were scared of him. I mean, like, it's a whole thing.

And, like, Erica, whether or not it's real. in actual in actuality. She still is tied to the thing of Tom Girardi and yeah I don't know. Allegedly It's pretty crazy. It's been a good season. It has been a great season. We deserve this.

I've still got two episodes. Two more parts. Two more parts. But thank you guys. I'm so glad you were able to join me today. Hopefully everyone enjoyed this episode if you did make sure to leave a five star review and subscribe, follow whatever so you don't miss any of our episodes. You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches.

And just be cool. Don't be all like uncool. Mention It All is produced by Sean Kilby and Jorge Morales Pico. Editing by Sean Kilby. Social media by Dylan Hafer. Guest booking by Nicole Pellegrino. Be sure to follow at Bravo by Betches on Instagram and Twitter. San Manuel is California's number one entertainment destination for today's superstars.

Catch the Jonas Brothers return to the Yamava Theater stage on April 30th. The powerful vocals of Demi Lovato on May 17th and the signature Southern Country Rock of Eric Church on July 19th. Tickets on sale now at Yamavat Theater.com. Only at Yamava Resort and Casino, celebrating its 40th anniversary. You in? Must be 21 to enter.