Mention It All - Is Sandoval a Dangerous Man? Ft. Taylor Jackson (VPR Reunion)

Episode Date: May 25, 2023

It may be Dylan’s birthday, but that can’t stop him from sitting down with Taylor Jackson to discuss the real important event of the week: the Vanderpump Rules reunion. They talk through all the biggest developments, from Raquel’s sad little trailer to Sandoval’s individual interview. They also debate Schwartz’s handling of the situation, and whether Lisa’s strategy of not choosing sides is sustainable amid such a massive divide. Check out our latest promo codes here: https://betches.com/promo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Girl, winter is so last season. And now Springs got you looking at pictures of tank tops with hungry eyes. Your algorithm is feeding you cutoffs. You're thirsty for the sun on your shoulders. That perfect hang on the patio sundress. Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from your couch. Done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear up on that envelope.

It's time for a little in-person spring treat. It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. Betches Media presents. Ha ha, laugh, funny. Mention It All, a Bravo by Betches podcast. We don't say that, but now we said it. With me, Dylan Hafer.

We're going to check me, though. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Mention It All podcast. I'm Dylan Hafer, and it is Vanderpump Rules reunion time. We have finally made it, and who better to join me for this part one of the reunion than my girl, Taylor Jackson. Hey, Tay, how's it going? Oh, Dylan, I'm so excited.

Also, everyone, wish Dylan. and a happy birthday happy birthday Dylan thank you you are living the fucking dream because your birthday present is the first part of vpr reunion how does that feel um i feel you know like i would love to be asleep right now but like you know i've been rewatching season one of vanderpump rules and you know in the words of stasi troder it's my birthday um and you know just like stasi i'm getting to work on my birthday. I'm creating content. I'm giving the people what they need. And I mean, I could not, in good conscience, not record this episode on today. You know, like, it had to happen. Right. I mean, you're, you're really pulling through for the team. And also, I saw this,

I saw this tweet. It's very relevant to you yesterday. It was like, I got married yesterday and today feels like the most important day of my life. And it was a picture of the Vanderbump reunion. Look, I mean, this reunion is really what we've all been waiting for. Last week's finale obviously was a crazy, you know, once in a lifetime situation on the show. But the reunion where everybody's in the same place minus Raquel and Sheena, which we'll get to. I mean, this is really what we need. Like on, you know, on the episode last week, it was very like, okay, we're going to get one scene with these people. We're going to get one scene with this.

pair. We're going to get one scene with Lisa and now, you know, nobody can hide behind the filming schedule. No one is hiding and no one is trying to hide either, even though some people look like they want to be hidden behind a wall. They are not. Look, Tom Sandival is not doing great. No, not doing great. When they like show him, he's stiff as a board. His eyes are like, you know, when you're like you're trying to concentrate or like balance you're supposed to like look at one spot on the wall mm-hmm that's him on the floor just like this staring right he looks like when you when you're like getting seasick and they're like okay just you know like sit down focus on one point don't look at your phone screen like you know he looks like he just was on like a speedboat ride and then he like

stood up a little too quick and everything is kind of, everything is swirling around him. And also he needs a cigarette so bad. So bad. So bad. I think he might have taken his annex as well. He really should have done like a nicotine patch for the reunion or something. Because I feel like he needs like a constant stream. I don't know actually what his, what his nicotine habits are. But it's just the energy of needing a cigarette. He's, yeah, he is the definition of needs a cigarette immediately. So we start off the reunion with a new format for us, something we don't usually get for the first time. Andy sat down with, I like they say the principles of the scandal as if this is like, you know, they're casting characters. And it's like the leads are going first.

But so he sits down with Sandoval. He sits down with Ariana. He sits down with Raquel, these one-on-one interview formats. We don't get any of the Raquel footage this week. That is going to be saved, I guess. but Sandoval and Ariana getting a chance to one-on-one, you know, speak some of the things that they need to say, it is, Sandoval is in full damage control mode and we see him kind of doing the same thing that he's been doing, even for the last few weeks on the season where, you know, he's saying how things weren't great in their relationship.

He says he felt like he was Ariana's gay BFF, which like right then and there, I was like, sir, Sir. Take a step back. Listen to yourself. Reassess. Because saying that you felt like your girlfriend's gay BFF is not like the slam dunk explanation that you think it is. No.

No, not at all. It makes absolutely zero sense, to be honest. Right. Because number one, he was also complaining that Ariana and her gay BFF Logan were like, he felt like a third wheel. So clearly, you're not the gay BFF, okay? She has one of those already. Right.

Like, the fact that you're not communicating means you're not the gay BFF because the gay BFF is the one who knows all the shit that you're doing wrong. Exactly. But so Tom also gets to, you know, state for the record, his version of events. He said that they, you know, they got close that guy's night at the Mondrian, which was right after the dog had died. And then the very next, see you next Tuesday, afterward, they went to the Abbey and then they had sex after that. So that was, you know, when Ali, I guess, had seen them getting close at the Abbey. But then he says that was a one-night stand. Then they took a break.

But then it picked back up his words in September before BravoCon. That's a long time. I mean, that's an extremely long time. And he's acting like it's like a bullet. guess it is a bad habit, but he's like, yeah, like, we stopped. And then, you know, a few months later, we picked the, we picked the back up. It's like someone with a workout routine. Like, someone who keeps going to spin and then stops. It's like, yeah, I picked it back up again. Like, give me a fucking break. Give me a goddamn motherfucking break. Tom is very focused on the difference

between the one night stand and then later when the like, quote unquote relationship started. because there are certain points throughout this episode where, you know, Lala will say something about, well, like, that wasn't your place to have an opinion about that because you were already, you know, you were doing it the whole time, the whole time, X, Y, Z. And he's like, well, it wasn't the whole time. It was once in July. And then in September. And it's like, right, but, but once you have crossed that threshold with Raquel, it no longer really matters the specifics of it. Like nobody is like, Lala and. and James and Katie and Sheena and all of them don't care if when something happened in August, it was just a one-time thing because now six months later, it's, it is what it is. One and done. That's the rule. One and done. Doesn't matter if it was once, like you said, it was sporadic. It happened and it continued to happen. Just because there's fucking like breaks in the cycle or whatever doesn't mean, doesn't make it any better at all. It makes it honestly worse. Right. Like I think he seems to have this idea that like he can discuss things that happened

during filming after they had hooked up once. And that's kind of like a separate time frame than later after filming when they started, you know, carrying on with each other. But it's like we're looking at the whole scope of everything that's happened in the last year and where we are right now, which is that you had a months long affair with our. one of Ariana's close friends who, you know, lied to her deliberately many times on camera, off camera, in real life. You know, it's like the magnitude, I still think he seems to have this kind of idea that he's going to like lessen the charges by explaining certain things. And it's like, that's just not the situation you're in. At all. And every time he opened his mouth and like, I get it. They're asking him in question he has to speak.

but it would have been more beneficial for him to stay fucking quiet silence like less is more in this situation because and regardless whatever is coming out of his mouth not a single person in that room or in the nation is believing it so i mean he's shooting himself in the foot every time he even opens his mouth but i think that there's just a better way for him to have gone about it it's like do the apology tour but just be like i fucked up i don't know what to say I'm sorry, you know? Like, we don't need the, it was this and then it was this. Like, it is what it is.

And like Lala said, like, we've all fucked up before. This is your turn. Live it. We're living this right now. Yeah. I think, like, it's not, I think it's fair to say that this reunion was pretty much a no-win situation. Right. Like a lose-lose for Sandoval.

But at the same time, I think he, there was a version of this reunion where he could have done the least additional damage possible. And it doesn't really seem like that's, you know, he's going in with this defensive energy. You know, Andy at the very beginning gives him this chance to kind of like, is there anything you'd like to say before we really dive into the whole season? And, you know, he's already, he's like blubbering trying to get his words out. James is immediately like, get yourself together, man. This isn't the Oscars, you know, fucking crocodile tears, pussy.

Ariana's not having it. I think if he had just, if he had kept it a little more simple with what he was trying to say, then it would have just been like, okay, I'm going to sit here, I'm going to take it. I know that there's nothing I could say

that would make this better. But I don't think he is the kind of person who I don't think his ego will let him kind of just take a step back. He like, there's something so, there's obviously something not connecting in his brain, but like he doesn't,

he doesn't think what he did. is all that bad. You know, he's still a good guy. Like, you can just tell in, like, the way he's trying to defend himself. And, like you said, he just sit there and take it. He should have looked Ariane in the eyes. First of all, the tears?

Okay, he must have went to acting school because he had actual tears coming down his face. James said, knock it off. Next cut of Tom? No tears. Nothing. Not nothing at all. It was like a fucking water duct in his eye.

I would be so curious to see. Peacock were getting extended and uncensored reunion episodes, which are great. I watched, I watched like part of it this morning to get the full effect. And the cursing really is, it's so funny. Something else. But, you know, even with the extended episodes, I think it's like 10 more minutes of material, which is cool. But like some of these moments, I'm like, I would love to just see like the raw. This is what I said. I said to my family, I would happen. watch from when that camera went on no edits for the what six hours they were recording all three episodes or 10 hours who knows how long it was I would sit there and watch the entire thing that's love

island that's a season of love island right like if you've ever watched a season of big brother or love island like you're built for this like why can't we do that I wouldn't care the silence like is this just a production money thing or they could package this shit up and I would buy it imagine all of the people that would buy this. Yeah. It was funny. Lala pretty early in the episode also was getting, you know, turned up. And she was comparing Tom Sandoval to Randall Emmett saying, you know, in 10 years, he's going to be a Randall.

He says, you know, this type of man is dangerous. And Lisa took issue with the use of the word dangerous. To me, we'll get in more to Lisa later. I understand where Lala is coming from. because I don't think she means dangerous in the sense of like he's going to murder you and, you know, whatever. I think she means dangerous in the sense that you're going to feel safe and protected with somebody like this and you're going to build a life with them and buy a house together and

have a baby or freeze your embryos or whatever, you know, you're going to feel like this person is your future and you're going to put all of your, you know, financial, physical, whatever eggs in the basket, but also just. just your emotional and like, you know, like your whole life together. Right. And then they're going to pull the rug out from under you. And I think I, I mean, it's semantics a little bit like word choice, whatever. But like, I get what she's saying when she says that's dangerous because like art.

I mean, you could be financially imperiled by something like this. You could be your mental health could really be in a bad place when somebody does this to you. So I think Lisa, I get why she wants to, like, lower the temperature a little bit in the room. And, like, she says, like, we're going to be here for 10 hours. We have to, like, get through the questions. I think she's trying to, like, referee a little bit just in the sense of, like, James shut up and let Andy ask a question. But, like, I don't think that Lala is overstepping to say that these types of situations with these people can have real consequences. Exactly. And like it is, like he is Tom Sanval, we can all agree, is a narcissist, like full-blown

narcissist. And they are very, very dangerous people. And you can use, I think that's a great word to describe him. Again, she's not saying he's going to, you know, commit fucking like tax fraud or whatever or murder somebody. But the way he acts, it is dangerous to other people on an emotional level, honestly, on a physical level, just overall. Not like a narcissism is an actual dangerous issue. Well, and speaking of real consequences, there's a whole situation happening this episode where Raquel is watching from a little parking lot trailer 100 yards away from Sheena because she filed for a restraining order. And I mean, we know now that this was something where she filed and then pretty much immediately after the reunion it was dropped. And so it seems a little bit like she was doing it kind of.

kind of just to create this situation. But like that's a real legal consequence. I mean, Sheena had to have legal representation. She showed up in court. She had to treat this like the serious thing that it seemed like it was. And, you know, as much as the visuals of Raquel sitting in her little trailer are funny, it's like this, that's real. It's real. Like that is an actual court issued mandate.

They cannot be in the same room. I just want to mention to everybody that Dylan texted me before he made some sort of Bravo meme yesterday just to like test the waters. He says, I just get a text. Will people get mad if I call Raquel trailer trash? I said absolutely not. I said, you have pushed the boundaries way, way further than that. Look, that is not the kind, like, I don't, that's not like a term that I use on like a daily basis. But when you see the visual of Raquel's little Starwagon's trailer part.

parked in the parking lot and she's curled up on the couch watching sort of gleefully as as Schwartz talks about how kissing her was liberating she's like aw he loves he likes me still like it is so funny the visual of that so and like I love how you can hear the audio of the reunion in her trailer it makes it like it's very an immersive experience for the audience like I was loving it. The fact that they gave her access to that live stream is an interesting choice because I feel like they could have made the choice to basically have her like locked in a closet for four hours so she doesn't know what they've said about her.

But instead she's going to come out and be like, so I heard you said all these things about me, Katie. And I'm really not happy about it. Like also what did she expect? Like even if she was locked in a closet, she kind of gets the gist of what's half. Honestly, though, she probably doesn't because, again, not much going on up there either. She's not the brightest chick, as James said in his phone call last week. Your summer starts now with Memorial Day deals at the Home Depot.

It's time to fire up summer cookouts with the next grill, four-burner gas grill, on special buy for only $199. And entertain all season with the Hampton Bay West Grove seven-piece outdoor dining set for only $499. This Memorial Day, get low prices guaranteed at the Home Depot. While supplies last, price invalid May 14th or May 27th. U.S. only exclusions apply. See Home Depot.com slash price match for details. So good, so good, so good.

Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom Rack stores now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince, Sam Edelman, Frame and Free People. Join the Nordy Club to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first, and more. Plus buy online and pick up at your favorite rack store for free. Great brands, great prices. That's why you rack. I want to talk about also going back a little bit, Raquel's text that she sent to Ariana after this whole situation went down.

So the text thread that we see is on Wednesday night, Ariana texts Raquel, you are dead to me. And then two days later, Ariana, I don't know what to see. say right now besides I really fucked up and I am so so so sorry and then Ariana just says shut the fuck up you fucking rat and then blocks her number the thing is okay so last week we had to go through Schwartz's whole like long ass novel of a horrible text to Ariana about go take a vacation whatever this is bad in a totally different way in the sense that first of all Raquel I don't even know why she felt like texting Ariana in the first place.

Like what did she think was going to come of that? But to just send this like one sentence, I'm so, so, so sorry. I really fucked up. It's like, what makes you think that this is a text that's going to be like, oh, yeah, it really sucked. I was sad to hear, but like, we'll get through this girlie. No. Absolutely not. Don't even send the text at all.

It honestly made things worse. Or if you're going to send a text, make it a seven-paragraph thesis essay single-spaced. Right. Like I realized this about myself that I'm a deeply broken person who searches for validation in men left and right, just like Ariana said last week. And, you know, I need to figure out my own shit and I shouldn't have gotten you and your relationship involved. in it X, Y, Z. It's just like, I'm so, so, so sorry. Raquel, if you're listening, write down what Dylan just said and send that to Ariana. We'll do take two, okay?

She really thought, she really thought the third so and like, so, so, so sorry was going to be like, okay, now, now I feel bad. You know, when you're writing a work email and you, like, have one too many explanations and you're like, should I do it or should I delete it? That was with her with the so. She's like, one more so, or is that too much? I think three is appropriate but I won't do any exclamation points. Right. I know you this season have been

really into James's energy that he's been bringing and I think it's fair to say that he is the most activated at the reunion. He really is like he's on 11 out of 10 energy like he's like vibrating on the seat

cannot control himself. from the get-go as soon as he sat down. This man, it's like he drank three Celsius's before this recording, and he is on. And I'm telling you, like, he is delivering. He's delivering, look, he's doing what everyone expected him to do this reunion after watching this season. Be the comedy relief, obviously.

Even though the whole situation is pretty, it's so fucked up, it's funny. He is giving us the commentary that we expected, and he's nailing it. It is exactly, it's 11 out of 10 for me. The moment, I know you saw it when Tom makes his little statement at the beginning and he finishes talking after his like crying performance. And James turns to Lala and goes, yeah, that didn't really hit for me. And Lala just goes, I wasn't even listening.

The two of them. You know what they remind me of? Ursula's little eels and little mermaid. Yes. Like perfect, right? Are Flotsam and Jetsam in the new Little Mermaid? I don't know, but they should be, and it should be an adaptation of Lala and James. Can you imagine?

Can you imagine I'm going to see Little Mermaid tomorrow? What if, like, the little, like, CGI Flotsam opens his mouth and it's like, oh, yeah, Sebastian's little cocky-cock. I just peed a little. Oh, my God. I said, You want your legs Your poo-poo heads

Oh my god Wait you know what's crazy though Flotsam and Jetsam are kind of like worms with moustaches Oh my god Again Dylan Us with these ideas It's crazy It was so we got the worm with a mustache moment

In part one This was When Andy was asking about James And Sandoval's relationship And Sandoval has this instinct to downplay the fact that they were ever that close. James says that they were like brothers. And Thomas basically like,

you said we were like brothers. You said we were best friends. That was never a two-way street. That was just how you felt about me. And I mean, this kind of rings false all the way around just because the number one thing to point to Richella. Like,

you paid for this man's proposal allegedly because you loved him so much and wanted it to be special. Who knows if that was the real, you know, inclination. But to watch Sandoval just trash this friendship when last week on the episode we saw James crying

because he felt so betrayed by Sandoval. It's really tough. And when Tom says that James fucked Kristen to get on the show all those years ago, James is up out of his seat. He's, oh, he's going. over full force.

It's like almost physical altercation. Yeah. You know, James said, Tom says he's going to like fuck him up if he comes out of again. He's going to end up in the hospital. Like, I, I think James is one of those people where sometimes it's a little too much. And even this episode, there are times where it's like, James, shut up for like 15 seconds so we can move the conversation along.

But in that moment, I really think that. specific conversation would really hurt him. To hear Tom say those things about him and downplay the relationship that they had together, like James, James is, he's like a sensitive person in a way. Oh, I mean, extremely. You see how he reacts, like even when he threw the beer on Schwartz. Like anything, the talks of Rochella obviously really, like, activate him for good reason, obviously. But yeah, like I feel that Tom, as we know, is trying to blame literally everybody else but himself.

And listen, he can't afford to be damaging any more relationships that he has in his life, which he single-handedly only has one, two relationships left on the show, Lisa and Schwartz. But the way that, like, he did James was just, again, trying to. blame or trying to deter the conversation or the attention away from him and on to somebody else. Yeah, I think he knows that this whole side of the reunion stage plus Sheena isn't ever going to give him an inch. So he feels like the only way that he can kind of claw back his position is by making them look bad. But the problem is with that strategy is that the audience has reacted so strongly to this whole situation and so negatively toward him that it's like no nobody is watching this reunion or very few people and thinking like okay I wonder who I'm going to agree with more at

the end of this three part reunion it's like it's not really a battle it's not a battle of like Tom versus Ariana it's like how are we going to watch this group respond to these events so I think He's almost treating it like, he's treating it like, this is a trial. And at the end, he wants to come out victorious. And like, I mean, it sucks for him, but he did it to himself. There is no way for him to leave this reunion victorious. And same with Raquel. And honestly, same with Tom Schwartz.

Like, Schwartz, whether or not you think he's like the ultimate villain or douchebag or whatever, he has just enough, like, things stacked up against. him that like he's not gonna be the like you know puppy dog fan favorite the way that maybe he has been sometimes in the past and I think I think that's tough for him but it's like it ain't good for y'all you know no it ain't looking good for that side of the room I'll tell you that much and like it honestly is like it feels so pathetic when they show Tom and Tom in the same shot and they're especially when they didn't get their timelines right and they're looking at each other like literally dim wits like absolutely

Baffoons. So this is where the one-on-one interviews really came into play again, where Tom Sandoval told Andy that he told Schwartz about Raquel in January. January. January. We already knew from last week's episode when when Schwartz and Katie were talking, he said, you know, he kind of flip-flopped back and forth about when he knew. First, he said a month ago.

and then he settled on September. But then at the reunion, when Andy asks him, he says late August, basically right after Sheena's wedding in Mexico, which obviously was still during filming. It squarely places the timeline in that Schwartz knew about this while the season was still being filmed, you know,

after Sheena's wedding, before the finale, before the original finale. And the fact that Sandoval is so taken aback by this, it really, it really just makes it so clear that there was supposed to be this plan. And whether or not Schwartz didn't hear about the plan or forgot the plan or chose not to go along with the plan, it makes Tom Sandoval look even worse because Ariana has been saying this whole time, you know, he's coaching Rachel. He's got, he's getting their stories on the same page.

You know, this is how he works. And the fact that Schwartz kind of, you know, flubbed in that moment. and said August, I mean, it's, that's the kind of thing where it's like, how do you come back from that? You don't really. You literally, there's no takebacks. It's, you say it, say it out loud. It's being recorded. Everyone's going to eat that up. And it's, it's a, it would be one thing if he said, oh, I said August. I think actually it was September. Like, you know, it was January. Yeah. Right. Like to say August when they were still filming versus January, months later, when he's, you know, on his snowboarding non-double date apparently with Raquel and Joe and Tom.

Jesus. That situation. That situation? Arianna goes, why wasn't I invited? If there were girls on the trip and it wasn't a double date and we were still together, why wasn't I invited? It wasn't a double date? What was it?

A fuck fest? And yes, it was. James goes, Raquel hates snowboarding. She went to fuck Tom. That is so funny. I think sometimes, even though James and Raquel have only been broken up for like a year on the show, we forget that James was with her for like five years. So long.

Like James knows everything about Raquel. And so for him to have like the receipts basically to say like, no, she doesn't like snowboarding. Yeah. That was so good. And we just get boo. Boo. This peanut. This peanut gallery is the best peanut.

gallery bravo has ever seen yeah the trolling energy the fact that everyone incredible everyone on that side of the stage just like doesn't give a fuck it really is it's so funny because there it feels like nobody has any pressure to like save these relationships or make up with them because it's like no you you you played yourself and you you got caught right exactly all new drinks are now at mcdonalds with refreshers like the strawberry water melon and the mango pineapple refresher with popping boba to crafted sodas like the Sprite berry blast with berry flavors and cold foam. Who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire? Try them all now at McDonald's. Refreshers contain caffeine. Copyright 2026, the Coca-Cola Company. Sprite is a registered trademark of

the Coca-Cola Company. Ready to soundtrack your summer? With Red Bull Summer all-day play, you choose a playlist that fits Summer vibe the best. Are you a festival fanatic? A deep end DJ, a road dog, or a trail mixer. Just add a song to your chosen playlist and put your summer on track. Red Bull Summer All Day Play. Red Bull gives you wings.

Visit red bull.com slash bright summer ahead to learn more. See you this summer. I have a question for you. Okay, so I know, so listen, I think Schwartz is just totally out of touch, totally just stupid. I really just think he's stupid and like, duh, you know what I mean? Like, whatever. and I can only laugh at him, you know.

But there is a sense, so I was talking to my brother. First of all, this Vanderpump is for everybody. I think it has broken a wall for reality TV that it's not just for women, it's not just for housewives. It is, there is something for everyone here. Like both of my brothers are texting me, can't wait for the reunion tonight, whatever. I'm watching it with my older brother last night, whatever.

And he was saying the Schwartz thing. Like, obviously he's Team Ariana, of course. but he was like if my best friend my best best guy friend told me he cheated on his long-term girlfriend and not to tell anyone he's like obviously I would yell like I would be like dude you fucked up whatever but I my my trust is with him not to like say anything so and like it brings up a good point where it's like when your best best friend tells you a secret and not to tell anyone like are I think, okay, I think if this was a different friend scenario where Ariana and Tom Schwartz didn't really have a relationship with each other, I think I would understand that line of thinking a little bit more. Like if it would have been like out of character for Tom Schwartz to text Ariana or to call Ariana or to see her in a context that wasn't with Sandoval and they weren't all in a friend group together, I think that would be a little trickier.

But I think the way that they were that they're all intertwined talking about, you know, at BravoCon, the fact that Raquel and Ariana are there together. The fact that, you know, they're doing all of these events. and stuff and they're in business together and they're seeing each other and, you know, all of these things like, I think that just makes it messy to a degree where you would say, like, look, maybe I, maybe I'll give you a grace period where if you tell me this and I'll give you like a week or two to to figure it out and, and let her know or like, you know, deal with it. But I think the fact that it went on for so long and especially that's why knowing that Schwartz found out in. August or September and not January, that's that makes him look worse. And so the fact that he

reveals that, even though it makes him look worse, it's like you had what six months to figure out a situation. And that just means that all of that time, he was basically lying to Ariana's face. And to everyone in the group, I mean, to Sheena, to Lala, to Katie, to everyone, knowing that this is information that would be so seismic within the group, I think that kind of makes it inexcusable. I agree. I totally agree. Also, I just wanted to know your opinion, but also it's like, and he wasn't like, again, like, I would give my friend an ultimatum be like, listen, you have two weeks, this is fucked up or else I have to step in because my morals, like, morally I cannot stand to the side and not say anything. But he's also like, he was also,

like, not telling anyone, but he was giving those little, if you look back, those little hints, like when they went glamping, he knew about it. And he was like, that's the type of man, Raquel, like, someone who's taken. Like, and he's sitting at the table with Ariana. It's like at that point, act like a dumbass. Act like you don't even know anything happened.

Or be up front and be the quote-unquote hero and tell her what is going on. Because clearly, Tom Sandoval is too much of a pussy, too. Yeah. I mean, I think that's, we've always kind of known that Tom Schwartz is a little but spineless. And so I think, uh, seeing that kind of play out in this situation so clearly that it's like there were so many times over those six months when he could or should have found a way to, to handle it differently. And obviously that's not, you know, so should like Sandoval should have also. Like there's no, you know, it's not like it was Schwartz's fault that this situation was

happening. But given the position that he was in, I think he also handled it pretty poorly. I think he, but also Schwartz handled a lot of things poorly. I don't want to get lost, you know, that we talk about Katie and Schwartz's relationship in this episode, too, which obviously kind of, I think, has gotten drowned out by Scandival stuff a little bit. But, you know, that was a big thread, especially in the first, you know, chunk of this season. And to hear Katie basically talk about, like, I realized I was so unhappy in this relationship, largely because Tom was prioritizing everything ahead of me. And he's like, well, you know, I was so busy trying to get this bar open.

And she's like, it wasn't just the bar. I would understand if there was this period of time where you were really stressed about your work or really you had something important going on. But it was like you were prioritizing, you know, your guy friends in front of me. You were prioritizing your hobbies, fucking off. You know, like all of this stuff, basically that she was coming last in this. long list of things. And he just seems to have this full disconnect of like, oh, well, we've worked really hard on our relationship post-divorce.

And she's like, I don't agree with that. And he's like, well, you know, I would be fine if she fell for someone within the group. And she's like, that's not what we're talking about. Like, I think he just, he is kind of incapable of, like, actually understanding on an emotional level, like, why Katie has made the choices she's made. And, I mean, the fact that he still can. can't wrap his mind around Katie setting the one boundary of don't hook up with anyone in this direct friend group. And he's like, but you know, you were sleeping with other people when we were still in

the house together. And she's like, right. And you could have been doing that too. That wasn't the boundary I set. And if that was his boundary, he should have made it clear because, you know, it's just the kind of thing where he feels like he's still entitled to some kind of friendship or relationship with her. And it's like, no, like you guys are divorced. You're not living together anymore. If she knows, ever wants to talk to you again. So be it. That's her call. You don't have kids together.

You don't have a house together anymore. You're not in business together. Like, that's it. Divorced people usually aren't hanging out all the time. Exactly. And I think he's having a hard time understanding that and realizing that. Yeah. Yeah.

It's, I mean, it's tough. It's like the kind of thing with Schwartz, it's like, I don't, I don't wish ill on him. Like, I hope that he comes to a point where he's like feels okay about. the situation, but it's like, yeah, in this, in this specific situation, you played yourself. If you, if the kiss with Raquel was liberating, good for you. I'm glad you found your spark of joy or whatever. But then Katie has every right to be like, well, I asked you not to do that and you did it. So I am going to be upset. Right. And if a drunk hookup in Mexico is liberating for you, you need to get yourself out there, Schwartz. Okay. Like, seriously.

I have a question about Tom Tom. This kind will tie us into the Lisa conversation. But like, do they get rid of one of the Tom's names? But both of the Tom's are kind of, you know, villainized, right? Villains. Like, could it just be Tom's? Or could they change the name? Will they still have steak in the place?

Because, like, to be honest with you, I, when I go out to L.A., I, my favorite restaurant of the pump at the time was Tom Toms. I think it's like the atmosphere, the food, the drinks. but I mean, I don't know. It just, it feels a little icky. You're like, I don't, I don't, you're like, I don't, you're like, I don't know if my, I don't know if my money is supporting this, but I don't really want to feel like it might be. Exactly. Exactly.

Okay. To get into the Lisa question, I think that she is in a delicate place on this show. And I think that it's worth kind of remembering that, that not only is she. a cast member on this show, but she's an executive producer. She is obviously plays this role in the cast of this mentor, mother figure sometimes, boss sometimes, you know, just kind of like sounding bored for all of these younger people's issues. And I understand for her why this puts her in a really tough position because from a show

perspective, Sandoval is still on the show. And if he's going to stay on the show, whether or not he stays on the show right now, it has never been her role on the show to like disavow someone, really. And so I think she feels like she kind of has to tread carefully where it's like, obviously I don't condone this. Obviously, I'm going to, I'm going to make him feel really bad about this. But at the same time, she doesn't feel like she can be like, fuck you, Tom, get out of here. Yeah. But I think she is miscalculating just a little, or at least a little bit, kind of how her,

how her attitude is going to come across. Because I think it just, it comes across a little more wishy-washy than maybe she's intending it to. I agree. And like, I think she should just let the kids fight. Let them fight. Again, silence, Lisa. Sit back.

because what you say, like, it does come across, like, she's Team Tom or, like, you know, not really being as hard as she should be on Tom or understand the situation. But again, like, she is a business owner and yada, yada, yada. But maybe just don't say anything at all unless someone is actually attacking her and, like, her livelihood, you know, her as a person or as a boss or whatever. Yeah, I think there's this idea on Bravo shows or on, I guess any show of, like, somebody being the voice of reason. And I think Lisa a lot of the time plays that role. But I think in a situation like this, being the voice of reason doesn't mean being the neutral party right in the middle of

everyone. Sometimes the reasonable thing to do is to choose the correct side. And so I think somebody like Lala at this reunion feels like more of a voice of reason than Lisa because Lala is, you know, yes, she's like funny and popping off sometimes but she also is like standing back evaluating the situation and being like Tom is a scumbag and I recognize a lot of the traits of Randall in him

and that is a rational reasonable thing to say and I think Lisa feels like she is trying to be the voice of reason but really she's just not taking a strong stance at all yep exactly

which doesn't come across great Right. I think it's worth keeping in mind, you know, if you're on a reality show and you want to be the voice of reason, that doesn't mean never getting your hands dirty. That just means, you know, evaluating every situation and kind of choosing the most reasonable answer. And right now, the most reasonable answer is like, Tom and Raquel fucking suck. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. I was shocked to hear, maybe I'm not shocked. They made $200,000 on something about her. merch. I, my jaw dropped. I'm like, well, I keep saying this is honest, as hard as this is for Ariana and whatever. Like, obviously it's terrible. One of the best things that could have ever happened to her. Yeah. I mean, she's obviously had all these opportunities. She's on Call Her Daddy this week. You know, she's, I really hope she does dancing with the stars because I want that for us.

That'd be fun. But like, in terms of, I guess, in the like vander pump bubble a little bit more. The fact that this sandwich shop is now kind of like such a hotly anticipated thing. Meanwhile, Schwartz and Sandys is finally open and they have foot traffic, but nobody's spending money and somebody's writing in lipstick on the bathroom mirror team Ariana. It was me. It was me. Watching the Tom's faces while Andy is like listing off these accomplishments of Katie and

Ariana. It is so delicious. I know. They're like this. Literally like sad little school boys sitting there. Yeah. And even Lisa is like, well, you know, I, I offered you guys this help and like you kind, you kind of seemed like you were trying to do your own thing. So like fuck me, I guess. And now they're like, it's, yeah. Yikes. Yeah. It's not going well. No, no, no. Thanks, Tom Sainimal. Great PR move, Tom Sanymo. You really helped us out. I argue how do you feel about Raquel's impending arrival at this reunion? Because obviously this week we didn't hear from her at all. We just saw her in the trailer. But in the preview for next week, she is going to show up and Sheena is going to have to dip out.

Which is so insane to me. So insane to me. But like are you, do you feel like you want like information from Raquel or do you just want to see her get yelled at for 45? minutes like well where are you at with that I don't think there's any information that any of us are going to hear from her that is one going to make sense to change any of our minds um honestly I am looking forward to her getting what she deserves and that is to be reprimanded to her face in front of the people that she backstabbed so obviously for the past year you know like she hasn't had to deal with any of that. It's all been a hidden little joke. She, she hid behind the text, trying to text

Ariana. Then she just goes off the grid. And like, you can not run into people all you want, but this is kind of her being like, this is you facing the fucking consequences, which she very much deserves. Yeah, I think that's more than anything. I just am curious to see the, kind of the vibe in the room between her and everyone else. Because on the finale, you know, unfortunately, I guess we didn't get to see a scene with her and anyone except for Sandoval. So I, we don't know how Lala is going to react to her being in the room. We don't know how Ariana is going to react to her being in the room. James, I can't even imagine.

But so, so that's the thing. It's not like I, I don't feel like I need anything from her. I'm just, I'm glad that she's there because we haven't, we haven't seen what that will be like. and I think it's going to be pretty, pretty interesting. It's going to be extreme. I cannot wait for next week. It's literally the only thing I'm looking forward to in my life right now, which is kind of sad, huh?

You know, it happens. It is what it is. Everyone is motivated by something different for me, reality TV. But thank God she showed up. She could have been a no-show. And I think the hype for this reunion would have been a lot different. Yeah. Yeah, I think we are, we're in exactly the right place.

We're getting exactly what we need to get. And I'm so glad that I got you here today to talk about it with me. Me too. Oh my God. Well, thank you so much, Taylor. And thank you everyone for listening. Don't forget to rate, review, and follow the show wherever you listen. We will be back tomorrow with the second installment of our Pump Rules Rewind series.

Watching season one has been a lot of fun. So I'm excited to go on that journey together. but in the meantime, you can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches. And until next time, be cool. Don't be all like Uncool. Mentioned It All is produced by Dylan Hafer, Sean Kilby, Jorge Morales Pico,

and Rebecca Sousa McCat. Editing by Horacee by Paulus Pico, social media by Dylan Hafer, guest booking by Dylan Hafer and Ali Friedlander. Be sure to follow at Bravo by Betches on Instagram and Twitter. Aw. Pay off your home. Travel for life. Drive a Ferrari.

In celebration of the world premiere of the Monopoly Big Board Bucks slot machine by aristocrat gaming, Yamava Resort and Casino at San Manuel is giving one person a $1.6 million dream package. The biggest prize in Yamava's history. Club's Serrano members can earn daily instant prizes and secure a spot in the finale May 29th. Don't pass go and own it all. Only at Yamava, celebrating its 40th anniversary. U.N. Details at yamava.com must be 21-20. Please gamble responsibly. Monopoly is a trademark of Hasbro. Hasbro is not a sponsor of this promotion.