Mention It All - Is Vicki The Next Jen Shah?

Episode Date: August 2, 2024

Stop the presses! Carl has responded to the speculation about his new bar’s name, and Dylan breaks down his weak attempt to dispel the discourse. From there, he settles into a juicy recap of RHOC, with an important detour to discuss the recent lawsuit filed against Vicki Gunvalson. What does it mean, and is her return to RHOC this season even necessary? Later, he digs into the drama between Heather Dubrow and Katie, and why the newbie needs to take her foot off the gas until she’s been around a bit longer. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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With me, Dylan Hafer. We're going to check me, both. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Mention at All podcast. It's Thursday, question mark as you're listening to this. Our schedule has been a little bit different lately if you've been noticing. O.C. coming back on Thursday nights has thrown a wrench into things because normally I record on Thursday mornings. but obviously I want to be able to discuss the OC episodes, the week that they come out.

So thankfully, I've been able to get the episodes a little bit early and watch them and then record at my normal time. And then they just come out a little bit later. But like it's quicker because you want the recap, whatever. This week I'm recording even a little bit earlier because I'm going to be out of town for a couple days. So it's Wednesday as I record right now, but I have seen this week's episode of OC and I cannot wait to talk about it. And also, I can't wait to talk about. we have still some more news. I literally recorded an episode earlier today and was like, I hope OC is good this week because I'm not going to have much time for anything else to happen.

Lo and behold, I was wrong. We've got an update in the Carl's softbar name saga. I feel like I have to have to read what he had to say about it just because I, you know, I had thoughts in the last episode. And then also there is a new lawsuit. You know, what would it, what would a week be without a new Bravo lawsuit against one Victoria Gunvelson, which I'm going to talk about kind of tucked into the episode recap for this week because Vicky, spoiler alert, makes an appearance. Yay. But yeah, so I'm recording this on Wednesday, and actually, as I sit down to record this, I have to get this done in a timely manner because after this, I am headed to the opening night of the

Bravo Diamonds and Rosei experience? It's some sort of interactive cocktail exhibit. I really, truly don't know, but they're doing this thing in New York and L.A. for the next couple weeks. I don't know. I'll come back to you with all the information after I attend the event. But I'm excited to check it out. They're not doing BravoCon this year, so they're trying to mix it up and do some kind of different, smaller, I don't know, interesting lines. events in lieu of that. They've had a couple of those watch parties already in New York and L.A. And they're doing this Diamonds and Rosee experience thing instead right now. I don't know that much about it. But I, next week, next week, I'll get you the full review. But anyway,

speaking of cocktail experiences, or rather non-cocktail experiences, I talked on a Wednesday's episode about Carl's soft bar and cafe. And of course, a lot of people seemed to, uh, construe that that name had something to do with this past season of Summerhouse when Carl was asking Lindsay to be soft. But no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Why would we think that? Carl talked to page six, and he clarified where the name comes from. Look, I'm going to read this quote, and I just want to ask before I read it, does he think we're dumb? I'm getting ahead of myself. This is what Carl had to say. So he claims that he was inspired. earlier this year, the summer by his travels in Europe, he went to a wedding in Portugal,

he went to Andrea's wedding in Italy, I believe, both of which Lindsay was also in attendance at, just a little fun note. And he says that in Europe, did you know that sometimes non-alcoholic drinks are called softs? Like a soft? Oh, do you have, is there a soft menu that I could look at? Yes. Here's a 12-year-old. Euro, elder flour, lavender juice, a soft, if you will. So he says, quote, while soft drinks is a term used in the U.S., it has a different connotation, typically representing soda. I wanted to define a new and much-needed category and space, having soft drinks or softs be seen as functional and high-quality non-alcoholic beverages for adults. I was sharing this thought during a conversation

with my co-founder, as we discussed raising the bar in the non-alcoholic space, ultimately leading us to the name soft bar. Like, does he think we just fell out of the coconut tree? I know that it's a reference to like soft drinks. I'm not, we're not stupid. I mean, statistically some of you are probably stupid because if there's like X amount of people listening, there's stupid people in the world. but like I don't think like the collective you are stupid. And I feel like Carl is kind of, he can't think you're stupid. This is just one of those things where it's like,

you are not going to be able to convince people that you didn't mean the thing that it seemed like you meant. So coming out here and being like, let me clear this up. It's like, no, that's not, that doesn't accomplish anything. And Carl is somebody who has been in this like reality TV social media hamster wheel long enough that he should realize that like going to page six and being like well actually it means this yeah like I said we know like it's it's it's a double ontantra it's a it's a play on words it's a reference and that's the thing with with these bravo lebrity business ventures

it makes sense for them to be referencing their own source material like Lindsay has an Airbnb in that's called the Hubhouse Nashville, and it has its own Instagram page, and it has a confessional booth in the house, and a neon sign, and all of that, it's like, yeah, people are going to want to stay there partially because of the connection to this person that they know from the show. And so it's fun to be like, how many sandwiches have you made for me? But with Carl, I just think that, like, he's, whether intentionally or not, I guess to give him the benefit of the doubt, he has referenced something that happened on this show. And it's not something that was received particularly well.

So I don't know exactly what the rollout for this soft bar and cafe is going to look like. And like I said, if I receive an invitation, I will be compelled to attend. So, you know, put me on that list. I just think it's like there seemed to be a couple of kinks to work out in sort of the PR strategy. And if only he was still on the good side of somebody with a background in PR, that could help him with some of this rollout stuff. It seems like that could be helpful at this juncture. But anyway, enough talking about a bar that doesn't exist yet and perhaps never will.

I don't mean to be that negative. But let's talk about Real Housewives of Orange County. And as we start, Terry and Heather are just, they're up on their penthouse rooftop in L.A., just looking down at all the little ants, spotting their Beverly Hills house in the distance right next to where Drake lives. Just, oh, they all. always hit the nail right on the head. They're nothing, if not coming out there with all of that. So they're renovating that Beverly Hills house that we saw in this season premiere, and they're like, taking it down to the studs, I think was the term that Heather used. So it's going to be a big

reno. It's going to take a while. So naturally, it makes sense that they would live in their other property in the city of Los Angeles. Oh, no, the penthouse is too small. Only 5,800 square feet, only two bedrooms. And so the two kids, Ace and Cat, who are still at home. They can't share a room. So it's basically a glorified closet. Heather doesn't go there to poop because she doesn't poop, but if she did, she would. So instead, their plan is to rent out the penthouse and then they're going to find somewhere else to live. Like they're going to rent a different mansion, a bigger penthouse. I know they've taken a place at the Balboa Bay Club, as I so love to remind you. But I don't think that that's like bigger square footage or more bedrooms. And also it seems like

the kids must be going to school in LA. I, the logistics of being rich sound so stressful to me. And I know that that is something where I'm like, you would think that being rich would make life easier. But I think once you get to a certain point of privilege, you kind of like, your problems exist in a different register that like normal people can't really wrap their minds around. Then I'm like, okay, yeah, like I would, I would, I would.

rather be living in a rental mansion because my penthouse isn't big enough to live in while my mansion that I own is being renovated. But I also wouldn't know the first thing of how to coordinate any of those logistics. Me, I just, I send off my little rent check every month. It gets cashed, and I have a place to live. And you know what? Sometimes life is nice when it's simple. And the fact that I'm calling New York real estate the simple version, it tells you a lot. I would not want to be Terry and Heather. I got to be honest. But anyway, it is continuously just funny that these are the problems that they're facing.

And then Gina and Jen are a little bit more down in our echelon. And even Shannon. I mean, Shannon is struggling. She seems to be going through it a little bit. Shannon and Vicky, Vicki's back. Vicki's back. I love that this season, they're like, oh, by the way, Vicki's back. Just Vicki's in Shannon's kitchen. Did you miss her? Probably not. Here she is. They have this scene. And they're, so they're, I guess, getting ready to go out on their Dosa Migos tour. They're Laverne and Shirley. They're Lucy and Ethel. They're Thelma and Louise. I don't know if Vicky ever made it to the end of that movie. I don't think that Vicky would approve of Thelma and Louise's. I don't think that Vickie would approve of Thelma and Louise's. choices. I just watched that movie a couple weeks ago. I don't think Vicky would get along with them. I don't think they would like Vicki. It's like, oh, Thelma, what are you doing? Louise, get in the car. Who's this? Who's this chick in the back? Who's like, woo-hoo! Vicky hanging out with Thelma and Louise,

I would like to see it. But they're having this, they're having this scene at Shannon's house. First of all, Vicky has a staff infection, and she's like, I left the hospital because I'm just so busy. Yeah, I love being busy and I love to work and I have enough money to retire if I want to, but what would I do? I'm just a type A girl. And they're talking about the, the John Jansen situation. And Shannon has been told now that she owes John Jansen $75,000. I think this is originating from the facelift that he claims he paid for. And Vicki's like, oh, well, you were always the one that was paying for the flight upgrades and the dinners and the this, that, and the other thing. So who's he to say that you? And then they're having this moment. Shannon is like seemingly

about to be vulnerable. She certainly seems vulnerable in her confessionals. And then all of a sudden, Vicki's just like, why is one boob bigger than the other boob? It looks like you have two lopsided oranges in your shirt. And I just, this is the thing that frustrates me, that this scene could have been really interesting. They have multiple things to talk about that I would like to hear more about. I would like to hear more about the actual particulars of Tamara dipping out on their Trace Amigos tour. If they feel like she did them wrong and they're owed something, I think that's sounds like a good housewife storyline. And I feel like we're getting the like cliff notes, Thelma and Louise, more like Lucy and Ethel, but like, you know, without the talent. Like,

we're getting kind of like the goofy retelling of it where they're like, on FaceTime with this guy who's like, I don't know how those tickets are selling, but you girls better get to promoting it. And it's just like, I'm my own. What are we going to do? And then when Shannon's talking about this thing with John,

I want to hear about the real fallout of her real relationship with this guy who is now still in the picture via Alexis Bellino, but it feels like we're getting like two seconds of vulnerability. And then it's immediately back to the Vicki Gunvilsen Comedy Hour. And the thing with Vicki is that it's like she's so desperate to perform. Like she wants this so bad. Even though I don't think the train is ever coming back around for her. I don't think that orange is ever coming back into her grasp. But it feels like every time she's on

screen, it's just like there's so much effort being put in to like create something. And I'm like, you know what would make me want to see more of Vicky on this show is her. creating like real emotional stakes, not just being like, well, fuck Tamara. And also, why your boobs lopsided? So good, so good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom rack stores now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince, Sam Edelman, frame, and free people. Join the Nordi Club to unlock exclusive discounts, shop new arrivals first, and more.

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Those sandals you can wear all day and all night. And you've had enough of shopping from your couch. Done hoping it looks anything like the picture when you tear open that envelope? It's time for a little in-person spring treat. It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. I don't know how much more we're going to see Vicky this season. But while we have her here, let's talk about some news that broke this week.

And this is via In Touch. And so all of this is alleged, you know, there's a lawsuit. There's a lawsuit. A 74-year-old woman named Diane. Diane. Diane is alleging Diane Field. Diane is alleging that she, back in the 2000s, she and her husband saved a lot of money.

Her husband got sick. They at one point had like $6 million saved. In 2019, she was introduced to Vicky through a friend. Vicky, obviously, in her like insurance finance lane is giving people a lot advice, has a lot of clients, selling people on a lot of stuff. She's work, work, work, work, work. She doesn't want to retire. She doesn't want to get old. So in the lawsuit, Diane Field claims that Vicky and her partner, Allie, were really selling her on this specific alliance annuity. Again, I remind you every week that I'm not a legal expert. And surprise, surprise, I am neither a legal

expert, nor a financial expert. So if I do a poor job of explaining the, like, actual finance stuff of this, let me know gently in a five-star review or send me a DM, but like, it's not that deep. I'm not going to get into like the DD details. I'm going to give you kind of like the three-bullet version. So in 2019, Vicky and her partner convinced this woman, Diane, to invest in a certain type of annuity and to also buy a life insurance policy with a $300,000 premium. Now, $300,000, it sounds like a lot of money. I don't know that much about life insurance policies, but that's what she paid. So then Diane Field leaves with, leaves Vicki with her money for this annuity thing and also with the $300,000 that she paid for the life insurance. And she thinks that this is a one-time life insurance premium

and that, you know, whatever's going to happen with the annuity. So then the next year in 2020, 2021, she gets charged $300,000, again, for the insurance premium. It turns out the $300K is an annual payment, not a one-time deal. That's a big difference. If I think $300,000 is a lot of money to pay once, I certainly think it's a lot of money to pay twice. But she's like, okay, I guess allegedly she feels like she's like she's, she doesn't have any other option. I don't know the details of this, why she didn't feel like she had another option. It is what it is. She paid the $300,000. The $300,000, I believe, was taken out

of the amount that Vicky was managing for her. The next year, it comes around again, another $300,000 payment. It happens that year after paying $900,000 on this life insurance policy, she pulls her money out of the account that Vicky's managing. So she's like, thanks so much for whatever. I'm going to take my money back. I don't like the way that this is happening. And then earlier this year, she claims in this lawsuit, Vicky and Ali come a knock in and they're like, hey girl, just so you know, on this life insurance policy, you owe $100,000. You got to re-up. Should we basically like, give us your credit card info or alleged, I don't know. So she's like, hmm, I don't really want to pay this $100,000. So she calls the company that the life insurance policy is with, Alliance. And she's like,

hey, just wondering, I heard that I have another $100,000 that I owe. And the company, according to the lawsuit, is like, oh, no, babe, you're fine. You don't owe us anything. You've paid $600,000 on this policy. That's all you got to, that's all. You're good. So then naturally, Ms. Diane Field is like, huh, if the people who are actually administering the life insurance policy don't think I owe them money, then why does Vicki Middleman Gunwelson think I owe her money? And if I were to pay her that money, where's that money going? Is that money going into Vicky's pockets? Is that money going into Vicky's pockets? Is that money going into some mysterious account?

I don't know. I don't have any more information. What I do know is that Diane Field was not happy about this discovery. And now she has sued Vicky, along with Cotto insurance, and along with a couple of these other companies that are involved, for elder abuse and fraud. Now, I think it's important to note this, at current juncture is a lawsuit. It's a civil claim. So she is, you know, suing presumably for

damages, claiming that she has been, you know, a victim of this stuff. This is much different than, say, the people versus Jen Shah, where she was charged with federal crimes for, you know, charges of fraud and, you know, whatever else. Similar to Teresa, criminal case, charges were filed, arrested, arraigned, indicted, all that stuff. So, Vicky at this point, it's not a fair comparison to Jen Shaw, except for the fact that it involves old people. But I will be just super curious to see sort of like if this goes anywhere and if so, what that looks like. Is this something that we're going to see, I mean, imagine Tamara getting her hands on this? We're never going to hear the end of it.

It's going to be, it's going to be Diane Field. Get your ass down to two T's. She's going to be, there's going to be a two T's exclusive of this woman telling her side of the story. I don't know. I mean, it's, it's not good. It's, any time there's even like an allegation like this, it just makes you feel kind of icky. And obviously, I don't know. All of this is alleged.

I don't know kind of where this is going to land. And I certainly don't know if Vicki's business practices are, in fact, predatory or anything. But, I mean, Vicki drives a hard bargain. I've heard stranger things. Whatever your thing. It could be anything. Canva helps you make that thing a thing. Canva is a simple online tool thing.

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Katie, just four episodes into her housewives tenure. I gotta be honest. This week, I've really liked Katie the last couple weeks. I thought she's shown a lot of promise. I liked seeing Sutton last week via her. This week I started to bump. on just a little bit on Katie, because the thing that first kind of like flicked up my antenna was when she name dropped Cynthia Bailey. And I was a little bit like, hmm, you're four

episodes into this show. Last week you brought a Sutton. And this week you're planting a seed that your friend Cynthia, who now has met Heather, is being like probed for information about you and that Heather's trying to run in this LA circle with Cynthia. And I'm not saying that any of this is not true, or even that it's not interesting. Because I love Cynthia Bailey. I think having her in the mix on these West Coast shows is kind of fun. It just feels like if you are coming onto this show for the first time,

and we're meeting you, we're getting to know you, I just for the first time this week remembered her husband's name. It is Matt. Ding, ding, ding, ding points for me. sometimes the husband's, it takes me a minute. But if you're just kind of introducing us to you and your world and giving us a glimpse into who you are, it feels a little bit calculated to me that the first two people, aside from your husband and kids, that we are being exposed to in your world, are other housewives

from other cities that have been on the franchise longer than you, that other people are going to recognize and it just sort of rings a little bit false to me. Like she knows that this is going to be seen as iconic that this new housewife is friends with these other housewives. And that's the kind of thing that I want to appreciate in an Instagram post or like at an event where it's like, oh, they're like, they're friends. I don't necessarily need her bringing her Rolodex onto the show. This isn't the celebrity apprentice. You don't need to be like calling in a celebrity favor. I don't know if we're going to see Cynthia. It could be in the trailer and I forgot, but I just feel like Katie needs to like cool it on the on the, hey guys, remember I have like friends that you already know from other

places. Because I want to get to know her. I want to get to know her and her, her, her vibe and her her real friends. Not that, not that Sutton and Cynthia can't be her real friends. I just feel, I feel like we're seeing a very specific, she's showing us something very deliberate. But the real thing we have to talk about this week is the paparazzi photos. The Disneyland paparazzi photos, which we have already talked about on this show, because last season, Teddy Mellencamp, former Real House of Beverly Hills and now podcast co-host with one Tamara Judge, she had claimed that Heather DeBrow had called the paparazzi on herself when she was at Disneyland

and that these paparazzi photos of her at Disneyland were in fact staged. Now, Tamara had brought this up last season. Heather was offended at the mere notion that she would call the paparazzi. She was offended that Tamara would even possibly believe it or, you know, give it any credence. And it was sort of put to bed. This was not like a main storyline last season. And to be honest, I don't know that it really needed to be. It's one of those things where, like, Heather obviously is, she's going to be very put off by any.

sort of accusation that she feels like sullies her like above it allness. And I think calling the paparazzi feels like a very like I do give a fuck thing to do. And Heather doesn't want to seem like she gives the fuck. She wants to seem aloof. But at the end of the day, the idea of someone calling the paparazzi on themselves is just like kind of silly. It's kind of funny. It's like, yeah, she calls the paparazzi on herself. But Katie has brought this bone back into the dog house. And she's saying, I'm good friends with this guy who, like, manages or owns or runs all of these photo agencies. And so when I heard it being discussed before, aka when she saw it on the show,

she called up her friend and was like, hey, is this true? And she says that now she has a screenshot and some proof that Heather did, in fact, call the paparazzi on herself at Disneyland. And so Katie is first talking about this at some kind of lunch that I don't think we really saw much of with Emily and Gina. And then when Tamara plans a girl's night without Shannon, without Heather, to sort of lift Gina's spirits, they're at some coyote ugly bar. The scene is not that interesting otherwise.

Emily brings this up in front of the group and was like, hey guys, Katie brought up this thing. Remember when we talked about this last year? well, it's back. And Katie is like, she's insistent that this is proof, that this is a fact, that this is something that she knows.

But then she says, this guy who allegedly Heather called, she says he's on speed dial for Kim Kardashian. And Tamara's like, and Heather Dubrow. And Katie goes, she has his information. And this is where,

first of all, I think she like, I don't know if this was her being like, cute and coy, or if this was her kind of, of like acknowledging maybe the limitations of the like quote unquote proof that she has because when she says she has his information that Heather has this guy's number saved in her phone. Okay. Heather having the guy's information in and of itself is not the same as having

concrete proof that she called him to Disneyland on that day. Now she may have and I am, you know, fully I don't know the truth here. We haven't seen this receipt yet. We haven't seen this receipt yet. We haven't seen the screenshot. Katie, notably, I think in this episode, does not produce the proof. She doesn't show it at the girls' night, where they cut it off at the golf course. She has not shown it to Heather. She hasn't shown it to anybody else. Until we see the receipt, the receipt is, you know, might as well be fictitious or doctored or whatever. But anyway, so they're talking about this. Oh, so before we get into the golf, day. I love the little inclusion. They're talking about this other weird situation where Heather had

tagged Katie in an Instagram photo that she wasn't in. And it was before Heather followed her on Instagram. So she was like, what is going on? Heather's explanation of this is that she has, she's paying somebody else to run her social media. And so while this social media girl is uploading Heather's like outfit photo, she says, I was wearing a Jivanchi dress. Jivanchi famously starts with the letters G.I. And so while social media girl was putting in the outfit tags, she must have accidentally hit Janella, Katie's last name, which also starts with the letters G.I. Do we buy this? I, look, I, I could believe it. You know, it's like a, it's like a 12 angry men. Like, is it a crazy coincidence?

Yeah. Could it be true? Yeah? Is it true? I don't know. It could be. It's just one of those things where it's like, we're not really going to get anywhere with this.

Like, we're not going to get any more clarity into what happened with social media girl allegedly accidentally tagging Katie Janella instead of Jivanchi in this Instagram post. So it's a little bit neither here nor there to like keep going with it. But the explanation is pretty funny. We get one scene at home with Jim and with Jen. Jim.

Oh my God. If you heard my rant about housewives gyms the other day, you know that that's jarring for me to make that mistake. Jen and Ryan, they're going to Vegas. And Jen's like nervous about posting that they're going to Vegas because everybody knows she's broke and they're going to be like, why are you in Vegas? And then she goes to Vegas and she posts that she's in Vegas. And everybody's like, why is Jen in Vegas? Isn't she broke? Girl, just don't post the fucking phone.

photo. It's like touching the hot pan that you already knew was hot. Like, girl, just, just don't. I mean, first of all, like, I'm not not on the same page of, like, why are you in Vegas? Teach you outdoor yoga class, as Gina would say. But it is a little bit like, okay, I don't know. The situation, though, I'm more interested in is with her yoga studio that she's like a co-owner of. And she says that the yoga studio, which we know is not doing well, The problem facing it is that they opened it in COVID. First, first problem. Why'd you do that?

But because they opened it in COVID, they got a rent deal on the space, as so many did. The problem, though, the rent deal, it wasn't in writing. It was like a handshake deal for them to just pay less rent than was like on the lease or whatever. Fast forward, however many years since they started this. deal. There's a new landlord. The new landlord is like, hey, it seems like you haven't been paying your whole rent this whole time. Now I'm, I would like, $133,000 in back rent. So Jen says that they are now working on making payments on the back rent. And I'm like, girl, what is it with you and rent? Rent in the grand scheme of things. And I know this because I don't have Heather DeBrow problems,

as I established earlier. I understand paying a monthly rent. It's pretty simple. in the grand scheme of things, you agree to an amount of money to pay. Usually there's a lease or something in writing that you probably have to sign. Sometimes you have to sign actually like a bunch of pages. It's kind of annoying. You're like initialing the like lead paint agreement and the like window whatever. But then after that, whatever it says in the lease, you just do it. If it's 12 months of rent at X amount, you just pay that 12 months in a row. and then you get the space for the whole time and then you either sign another lease or you go somewhere else. It's kind of wild. It's not a perfect system. It's a system that we use a lot.

And it seems like Jen just has a little bit of an issue with knowing how the fuck to be an adult. And she's acknowledged that. She said she never had a credit card in her name. She doesn't know how to do dittly squat as an adult. But it's like, girl, get... the lease terms in writing. And I thought it was bad. She owed like 24,000 back rent, I think, on the house she got evicted from. 133 grand. She's never going to be able to pay that.

She's going to be making those, she said it's $50 a class she makes. She's going to be making those dinky little rent payments until she's 95 years old. She stresses me out, but also then she just like makes me mad. I'm like, girl, get it together. Don't go to Vegas. Teach an outdoor yoga class. I sound like Gina. I'd like to think a little more empathy, but also, I don't know the girl. I wish her well, but like, pay your rent. Pay your rent. It is nice to see Katie and Matt. God, I already almost forgot her husband's name. They're having this golf event. She wants to call it drinking and driving, dear God,

Heather's like, they're literally at this, like, spa day, and Shannon's right there, and Heather's like, I don't, let's, call it something else.

She's like, ah, yeah, and Shannon's just like, white knuckling it through this season, Shannon is. So Katie's like,

okay, we'll call it sipping and chipping. Cute. Okay. Is it just me, I don't think drinking and driving is like that cute

of a name for your golf event, even if there's not somebody in your immediate friend group who was recently arrested for a DUI. Like, let's just leave the like drinking and driving puns in the bin. Like, we're not going to use those, right? Like, people die. But we're at this event, you know, it's nice enough. It's like a five-hole golf tournament.

Lowest score wins, the prize of pair of Prada sunglasses, Emily ends up winning, yada, yada, yada. This flag football was more exciting. It's more interesting after the game of golf. when Tammy Sue Judge, she gets to talk into Heather. And she just lets her know that Katie's been talking about this paparazzi thing, as she's want to do. And then, you know, Shannon catches wind from Katie that she's been talking about it.

And Shannon's like, oh, oh, oh, ooh, I, I, I don't think that was, why, why, why, why, why have you been doing that? That's not a good thing to do. Heather, Heather's going to know. I mean, if you've ever listened to Shannon. about something. It's like, she knows not to fuck with Heather. Heather's not real thrilled about this. Katie goes

up to her and she's like, you know, there's just been this weird weird thing between us. And Heather's like, I don't think there was a weird thing between us until you started talking shit about me, apparently, about this paparazzi thing. And Katie has this whole list of events that have happened where she's been wronged by Heather.

She says that she heard that Heather and Terry were going through her Instagram and then after that they saw her at Sutton's Christmas party and just like didn't give her the time of day. And Heather's basically like, I saw your Instagram once and then I didn't recognize you at like a crowded social event. Okay. And then there's like another, another thing that happened where she feels like she was slighted. Like she was asking Cynthia for information, which again, I feel like we need a lot more context for.

Heather's like, I barely know this girl. She's not even a blip on my radar. But then she says on her children's lives, she's never called the paparazzi. And everybody, like, everybody around the group is kind of like, ooh, I don't know about that one. The children's lives, it's always a little bit like, even if you're telling the truth, it's like, don't, not the kids. Because also, everyone in the group, like, either low-key or high-key believes that Heather called the paparazzi. So I think how staunch she's being in her defense of herself with this, it's a little bit like, okay, I guess. Go off if you feel like you have to.

But the thing with this is that my bigger question, other than did Heather call the paparazzi? Because like I've said, it's not that serious if she did. It's more funny than anything. I wish she would admit it if she did. I just need to know like, why does Katie care so deeply? Because the way that Katie told the story, her friend is this guy who owns the paparazzi, whatever. So she saw it on TV and she was like, oh, I better call my friend and be like, did Heather do that? I do kind of get Heather's vibe of her being like, it seems like this girl is a little bit obsessed with me.

there might be more beneath the surface. We might not have the full context yet, but I do think that for somebody coming into the group, again, four episodes into this season, that is not very much time to establish yourself. It feels like Katie is trying to come in hot, which I don't have an issue with, but she's doing it in such a targeted way

where it feels like from day one, she's coming for Heather, and she's like got her ducks in a row and she won't be deterred. And I'm like, it's a little much. It's just, it's a little, it's a little pointed right away. And Heather tells her, she's like, if you want to come into this group, why don't you come into this group and try to make friends and then you'll have a place in this group versus coming in.

It seems like with such an agenda. And I like Katie. I want to like her. but I do need her to just like take her foot off the gas a little bit and just let let things develop because it feels like she's kind of trying to go from zero to 100 and like I don't actually think a first season housewife who's been on the show for four episodes is ready to be going 100. You're on a show with people who have been doing this a long time. Let it, you know, let yourself get used to the water temperature before you're, you know, turning it up to a boil.

But anyway, I mean, another good episode of O.C. I am really excited to see where the Heather and Katie dynamic goes this season. Because, again, it feels like right now they're in a very bad place. And I don't know if they will continue in that bad place. But we've got a lot of season left to go. But that is all for this week. Thank you so much for listening. Don't forget to rate review and follow the show wherever you listen.

You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches. We'll be back next week on Tuesday, just a little late. because I am traveling, but there will still be lots of great content next week. So make sure you're subscribed. And until next time, be cool. Don't be all like uncool. Mention It All podcast is produced by Dylan Hafer and Bell Roman. Editing by Bell Roman, social media by Dylan Hafer and Candice Maniga, guest booking by

Ali Friedlander. VP of Podcast is Chris Allen. And be sure to follow Bravo by Betches. Own it all. Pay off your home. Travel for life. Drive a Ferrari. In celebration of the world premiere of the Monopoly, Big Benches.

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