Mention It All - Rails Fails & Stassi’s Reality Comeback Ft. Kiki Monique

Episode Date: August 12, 2024

On today’s episode, Dylan is joined by Kiki Monique, host of the Pop Crime podcast, as she takes a morning off from attending Tom Girardi’s trial. She shares some updates on the trial, and what this all has to do with Erika Jayne. Then, they discuss the news that Stassi Schroeder will be returning to reality TV via a deal with Hulu. WTF is a docu-comedy series? And is she actually working at Vanderpump Villa? Later, they unpack the RHONJ’s not-a-reunion reunion, and why it wasn’t a satisfying culmination of a strange season. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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See Store Online for details. Betches Media presents. Ha ha, laugh, funny. Mention It All, a Bravo by Betches podcast. We don't say that, but now we said it. With me, Dylan Hafer. Who's going to check me, though? Hey, everyone.

Welcome back to the Mention at All podcast. It's Monday, and I'm excited to kick this week off with a returning guest, but it's been a minute since we got to catch up about Bravo, and she has been very busy at courtrooms, boots on the ground, doing her thing. You know her from the Betches podcast, Pop Crime. She has always got a lot to share, and I'm excited to catch up with her today. Kiki Monique, welcome back to the show. How are you?

Good. I've been singing forever. I know. We've been together at Bravo Cons. We've been together in the studio once or twice. Today we're remote, but you have been busy in L.A. with the trial of Tom Girardi. Just tell me, we're going to get into it more on an episode of your podcast, Pop Crime,

but I want to just get some, like, top-level update. what's going on, what are people missing, and also just like, what is the vibe? You know, it's going to court is, for me, it's exciting, but it's also court. So it's really boring. There is a lot of downtime. But what I love is the camaraderie because a lot of the people who go into court, and by the way, people ask like, well, isn't it televised? No, this is a federal hearing.

Federal court isn't televised. And in general, in L.A., I feel like they don't televise a lot of it, period. right? But especially if it's federal, that's never televised. So you see a lot of the same, you know, reporters, journalists, you know, in the court every day. And, you know, you're sharing information because sometimes, you know, you can hear information. So I like that camaraderie of it. But then you really do have to just listen to a lot of repetitive stuff. And you're just like, oh my guy, can I get a Red Bull? Right. It's like there's the, there is the interesting aspect of it. And obviously there's a reason that you're going. And there's a reason that people are interested to hear about it. But then also there's so much like procedural like gobbledygook

that it's just like, okay, she has to read this whole paragraph of like legalese to get to the actual interesting part. Exactly. It's like the judge has to like, you know, do the whole jury instructions. And again, all of these things are important. These are people who are deciding your fate. So you want them to have all the information. But sometimes you're just like, all right, can we get through this? I just want to hear, I want to see if Tom has another outburst and says, you know, fuck off to the prosecutor again. So Tom is like there the whole time for this, right? It's not something that he can just kind of like zoom into or whatever. No, he arrives every day.

I believe it's his caretaker because, you know, he is in an assisted facility situation. And I don't know if they've just assigned this particular nurse, but I see the same woman every day. She drives up and he gets out. And then two women come out, one which I believe is his daughter, come out to assist him out of the car. They all help him. You know, I'm over here taking pictures video. that sort of thing. He gets into the courtroom, probably about an hour before.

Not the courtroom, but he gets into the courthouse about an hour before. Then they bring him into the courtroom. You know, he's wearing, it seems like he has like two outfits. It's like he has these baggy, khaki pants. And then like the other day, I think he had on like, you know, baggy blue pants. He has always an ill-fitting jacket, tennis shoes. You know, he looks like an 85-year-old man. It is crazy because obviously, I mean, Tom Gerardy has been old since we've known him.

Like, it's not like we were ever seeing him as like this spry young man. But I went to his Wikipedia page. This man was born three months before the beginning of World War II. It's not very often that you're seeing a 1930s birthday these days when you're like checking in on somebody. He is really old. And the sentence, the maximum sentence for this is what, like 20 years in prison? It's intense. I think it's 20 years per count.

and he's charged with four counts of wire fraud. So, yeah, I mean, this is, look, from my perspective, he's absolutely going to be found guilty. Just from what I've heard in the first week of trial, I don't think there's any way he's getting out of this. But the question is, okay, you know, when does sentencing happen? He still has other trials that, you know, he's still linked to. They're civil. You know, he's not going to live through this. Let's be real.

Yeah, I remember when the Jen Shaw stuff was happening, I think we talked about that. And with that, it was the thing of like, oh, is she going to be guilty or not? With the federal charges like this, it is pretty rare for people to, once they get to the level where they're willing to indict someone and to bring the charges to court, it's pretty rare for them to not have enough evidence to get it across the finish line. Like, they don't really throw out federal charges just kind of because they feel like it. Yeah. And a lot of times, these witnesses have been offered immunity to testify because, you know, what they know really outwe, you know, even if they maybe had a little bit of bad doing, it outweighs what the real

bad doing was. You know, I know that there was a motion to compel one of the witnesses to testify. So I'm interested to see if she gets up there. So, yeah, at this point, especially like with Jen, she was in the Southern District of New York, who I think has like a 99%, you know, prosecution rate. So, yeah, once you get there, it's, it's, you're not really getting out of it, most likely. Yeah, this isn't like. Judge Judy where it's going to be like, oh, like, we're all just sick of arguing, pay her $1,000,

and then this can be over. Yeah, and that's the thing because some people are like, well, I don't understand because if he's bankrupt, why are we going to court? You know, those were civil proceedings. And sadly, you know, many of the victims will never, ever see their money. But this is criminal proceedings, you know, because if they're like, I'm not going to get my money, I at least want you to go down, which also sets the scene for anyone who's involved, once he goes down, we can start, you know, then maybe capturing other people who were involved in the scheme.

Yeah, that's the thing with a scheme that is like, you know, allegedly of the size that his was. Like, that's not just like a one person putting money like under a mattress somewhere. Like that's, there's a whole like infrastructure around that level of a scam. Yeah. I mean, and right now the California bar really is under fire. And hearing a lot of what went down is just, mortifying to, I mean, it has to be mortifying to them because essentially Tom had 205 complaints made to the bar against him. Now, for people who don't understand, a lawyer could

get disbarred with one complaint to the bar, because that's how serious it is when people take a complaint to the bar. He had 205 and nothing was done. I mean, this is systemic. Yeah, it really is wild to think back to like Erica's early days on Real House House of Beverly Hills, when Tom was just presented to us as this, like, Titan of the LA legal system and, you know, the Aaron Brockovich guy and all of this stuff. And they're, you know, we're meeting these, like, random, he's like seeing cops at lunch and just being like,

oh, pat on the back. Kind of, like, looking back, it's like, yeah, like the vibe kind of was giving corruption. It just is kind of crazy that even so recently, I mean, that was, what, six or seven years ago that he was still this, like, you know, God of the legal system and then it came crashing down like so hard and then it's like wow a lot of people probably did know that he was doing this stuff and we just weren't aware yeah and that's the thing because he was the quote the good guy right he was you know fighting for the little guy he was donating to democrats it's really hard to not see him you know as not the good guy and people are

also rarely like what's erika's role in this like is she going to be brought up in this case look She's not a witness in this case. She's not charged in this case. But what will come up and what came up in opening statements is the prosecution says, you know, we can show that over $20 million of this money was funneled to help his wife's career. And so that will come up. And the fact that the judge is allowing that in, you know, that speaks volumes. Because at the end of the day, whether she was working for that firm or not, if you know you have a $40,000 glam team and that glam team and that glam

team is going on a credit card allegedly that is being paid for by Girardi and Kees. You have to say, why is my husband's law firm paying for $40?000? That has to feel wrong, right? And so I think that's where people get like, you know, you may not be charged, but like, you can't play dumb, you know? Yeah, it's always been a little bit like there's layers to how much you think Erica, like, did or didn't know or was or wasn't responsible. And it's like, I definitely don't think that it's like all her fault or even necessarily mostly her fault. But it's like there is like some, it's hard to imagine that you would really be at a point of like zero knowledge, zero culpability, like zero, you know, kind of involvement just because, yeah, like looking at the amount of money

she was spending. And that's why I'm interested to see on this current season of Beverly Hills that they're filming, that they've been filming, like, are we still talking about this at really at all? And also like, as Erica tries to kind of relaunch her music career, her kind of career outside of housewives as an entertainer. Like we saw her with the Vegas thing last year. And she's like, you know, it seems like she is still kind of interested in pursuing this lane, doing that without now this backing of her husband.

It's like, have we moved, have we progressed past the point of like needing Erica Jane, the icon, like the pop star, quote unquote? You know, I definitely think that the storyline involving Tom Girardi is dead. You know, like, you know, it's not lost on me that we just saw these pictures the other day of, you know, all the Beverly Hills Housewives jumping off of a yacht in St. Lucia, right?

They're having a great time. And I was kind of like, why am I sitting in a courtroom all these pictures? No, I mean, but that's my choice, obviously. And I don't think it'll be a big storyline. But what I do will think, I will find interesting is, you know, the first day of court or the first day of testimony, Chris Pesila, who was the co-owner. of Marco Marco showed up, which I thought was really great. He was really there to support the victims. And that case, his case, Marco, Marco, is really pointed at Erica. And that's around the time that you have to say, like, you have to wonder if she's questioning, because if your husband

comes to you and says, what are all these charges on these credit cards? I want an $800,000 credit on this. And you've been living your whole life like, I've never had a budget. I've told no, I was told I had no budget. And now I have to go back and say, you know, all of these fraudulent charges were happening and this guy gets arrested for it. I have to imagine she knew something was not feeling right at that moment. Totally. Okay, we will leave the Girardi stuff there. I'm excited to get into more of the nitty gritty on pop crime. So definitely check out when that episode is live. So good, so good, so good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom rack stores now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love.

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It's time for a trip to Ross. Work your magic. I want to talk about an interesting update that we got a few days ago that another maybe disgraced reality star is coming back to reality TV. Stasi Schroeder is going to be. be on Hulu in the new year. She has signed a deal with Hulu, and so she's getting her own 30-minute docu-comedy series called Stasi says, which we'll get into. But another interesting piece of this is that she is going to be on the upcoming second season of Vandervaunt Villa. And this was announced,

you know, it was in all the trades. It basically is like, this is the renewal announcement for Vanderpump Villa. Officially, it's coming back for a second season. And also Stasi Schroeder will be on the show. I haven't seen any kind of detail about what that actually means in the context of Vanderpump Villa because it's like, okay, so is she a guest at the villa? Is she like Lisa Vanderpump's second in command? Is she expected to be a bartender? Like, it is just so strange that she's, I was expecting her to come back in some way at some point, but coming back on Lisa of Vanderpump's show is a really interesting sort of twist in the Stasi story. It is an interesting twist, but when I sat there and thought about it, because I really did

sit on this all weekend. I didn't even post about it because I was like, I really want to think about this. And I said, you know what? It makes sense because one, look, I watched every episode of Vanderpump Villa. But I will say it was not, the cast itself wasn't bringing what it needed to bring. There was no real connection. It didn't feel as authentic as we tend to like that show, right? And so I knew coming, like for another season, she was going to have to give us something.

Now, maybe there was a conversation about just bringing Stacian as a guest. Maybe once they got those viewer numbers, though, they were like, we're going to need, like, her as like something, you know, maybe bringing this group together, right? And, you know, she probably worked out this deal like, look, I'm willing to come back. But if so, then I want this option for my own show. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I feel like it would make sense for her to be maybe like Lisa's second in command, but like a little bit more in on the drama maybe than Lisa is where it's like Lisa will show up like once an episode and be like, everybody stop fighting. But like Stasi maybe is a little bit more like stoking the flames kind of. You know, she's like a friend but also a boss, but also who knows what she's actually there to do. Exactly, because the dynamic wasn't working where, you know, Lisa was trying to catch them doing bad things. And then they were like, oh, no, my boss caught me doing bad things. Whereas, like, Stasi could kind of pretend to be their friend and then catch them doing things or she can also be just as bitchy.

And it doesn't feel like a boss is berating their staff versus like just another cast member kind of in the same age range. Yeah. So I think the thing about the docu comedy series, which is just like at this point, We're just like stringing words together and pretending that they mean something. But so I'm going to, the, the description of this that came out is endlessly relatable, utterly hysterical, and questionably sane. Stasi is the anchor of a fresh ensemble of comedic and chaotic characters who are dealing with identity crises and major life crossroads of their own.

And Stossi's the one who has to keep them all afloat. This sounds like, like, like I, none of them. if that means anything. I'm like, okay, so are these her friends? Are these like people that are being cast? Like, is this like she's Moripovich and they all have problems she needs to solve? Like, it's very like, it sounds like it was supposed to be the valley, but I'm not sure Stasi actually has a group of friends at this point.

So like, I just, this does not sound promising to me. So I think, I think it is very much like the valley. And I think it's with Stasi and her set of. of friends. And, you know, I followed Taylor Strecker. I've known her from back in, like, serious days. And I know that she's really close with Stasi. And I remember at one point, there was a rumor going around that they thought that Taylor was auditioning for Real Housewives of Jersey. And now I'm starting to think, like, if someone saw Taylor filming, it was probably in relation to this in some way, shape, or four. I definitely think Taylor will be a part of this as well as her wife, Taylor,

just because they've been together a lot. I know they've been on some trips recently. So that wouldn't surprise me. I don't know who else is in that crew, but I think it's people very far removed from the Vanderpump world. Yeah, Stasi has been in an interesting place because obviously, you know, we all were around in 2020 for her, you know, firing from Vanderpump rules under some pretty, you know, bad circumstances. You know, she was part of this racist thing against Faith who was in the cast. And so there's like a lot of, I think people have a lot of complicated feelings

about Stasi as a person. Stasi's return to the reality TV spotlight. Obviously, it seems like she's being given a pretty nice deal from Hulu with these two projects that she's working on. But it is kind of like, a lot has changed in the reality landscape since Stasi was on Vanderpump Rules.

And, you know, even when she was on that show, she was always just a cast member on a Bravo show. And even though she was, you know, an important piece of that cast, she's never been the Lisa Vanderpump of a show. And so, like, I think the idea that this show is called, it's what Stasi says or, you know, it's like, the Valley, to me, part of what worked so well about the first season was that there were like 12 people who were all messes.

And even though we knew Brittany and Jackson Kristen before, it didn't feel like Britney and Jackson Kristen's show. And so I think with this Stasi thing, the idea that it's being billed as a 30-minute, you know, docu-comedy series and Stossi's in the name and she's the executive producer. I'm like, I feel like it's going to be, I could see it being really like cringe and try-hard in a way if it's too much like Stasi spouting Stasi-isisms and talking about, white wine and true crime and, you know, how she loves mac and cheese and pizza and, you know, posting filtered photos on Instagram. Like the, the Stasi aesthetic that translated so well, you know, maybe six or seven years ago and then got her those books and everything like that. I'm like, the culture has moved on a lot from that. And I know she still has a lot of fans. It's not that I think nobody's going to watch this show, but I'm just kind of like,

is this something that like we, the collective we need to care about? Or is it just kind of going to be like for her fans? Yeah, I mean, I definitely think this is a show for her fans because I will say that like obviously, you know, even I had complicated feelings around this, right? It's like, I want to watch the show, especially if Taylor is part of it. I love her. I want to see her. Yeah, Taylor is great. Yeah. I do, you know, sit there and go only because there was a moment where I felt like, so I remember this specifically and I'll tell this really quickly.

When that whole thing went down in 2020, I remember Jackie Schimmel because it was happened on. the bitch Bible podcast, right? I remember Jackie posted on her stories, kind of like, I'm trying to understand what's going on, why this was such a bad thing. Can some black creators, black women creators help me understand? And I remember I tagged Jackie and I was like,

I'm perfectly willing to like come and talk to you about this. And I remember it's just so to scene, but she never talked to me about it. And I was kind of like, well, did you really want to know or did you just want to like say that you wanted to know? And I sort of felt that way about Stasi too where I felt like, you know, I wanted to talk to her. I actually like reach, I was like, I want you to come on my show. I want to talk to you about this to how you feel. And it almost

felt like she was like, I'd rather wait this out because I have enough fans and followers that I don't really actually have to care or be apologetic about it. I just have to wait it out and my turn, time will come around. So when this thing came around, it was kind of like, well, I guess she's right. She just had to wait it out. It came around. And now she has a show and she'll have enough people. So I'm curious. I'm curious if people, you know, will be responsive. Like you said, we've kind of moved on from that sort of like, look, I love Stasi. I love Stasi in that particular time and her role in Vanderpenterpard Rules.

Will it translate now? I don't know. Yeah. I mean, famously, she got paid a lot of money to write a book about being canceled. So certainly she's on an interesting trajectory. And we'll see. We're not going to see that show for a while, I think. So we'll circle back when it comes out.

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And then I was like, oh, once they made the announcement that there was no reunion, I was like, oh, I'm not watching. This is terrible. Then once they made that announcement, I felt like the episodes got really good, which was really weird, because I was like, maybe you should have made that announcement. Maybe you lost some viewership. I don't know. I was really into it. And when we got to that finale, I was like, I was mad because I was like, no, we need absolutely a reunion. It's not fair. I felt like we're left with a lot of questions. Then I watched the off the rail special and I said, you know what? I take that all back. I don't want a reunion. I want nothing to do this because what I feel like has now happened is Teresa is set in her ways. She does not like Margaret

Joseph's. She is never going to like Margaret Joseph. She is never going to like Melissa. And it does not matter what actual facts can be laid in front of her. She is not going to hear it. And she's just stubborn. And it's so frustrating to talk to someone like that because you're like, we're not asking you to like completely bend over backwards. We're just saying look at this piece of information you've been handed and look at it objectively and say like, you're right. I was pointing the fingers at the wrong person, you know. She subpoenaed the wrong bitch. You know, And look, do I believe that, you know, Jackie and Margaret and Melissa were all talking about this? Of course.

Why wouldn't they? Jackie had just gotten dragged. Like, they were, they hated each other. They were friends. It makes perfect sense. This is what friends would do. But for Jackie to act like I had nothing to do with that video and I didn't know about that video. Please, Jackie, please.

Yeah. It was a strange ending to the season. And obviously, like, Teresa's lack of reaction to the Jackie revelation was really just kind of it was so frustrating as a viewer because I'm like, come on, like look alive. Like you just got a big piece of information. There's just like zero.

But then watching the off the rail special, it almost was like, I had like settled, I had like moved past the like confusion at her lack of reaction. And just I'm like, well, I guess this is just, this is how it is.

And watching them after they watched, after they finished watching the finale episode, when in their room where it's Jennifer and Teresa and Dolores and Jackie, for Jennifer to sit there and be like, yeah, the problem with the other side of this group is that they don't own anything, they don't take accountability for anything. We can't move on because they won't blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, okay, sure, maybe. Maybe the other side of the group struggles with that.

But like, look in the mirror. The call is coming from inside the house. No, like everything, like Jennifer, like, and I liked Jennifer, but like everything this season, I was like, I understood every moment of Danielle smacking that cup against the side of her head because like I couldn't take it. First of all, why are you like money shaming people? Like, first of all, plumbers make a shit ton of money. I would marry a plumber in a second.

They got unions. They got all kinds of money. I don't know why we're shaming plumbers, Teresa. I don't know why you're acting like Danielle is jealous of your house and all your bathrooms. Jennifer. Like it was so infreed. And like, I think it was, you know, a lot of Coltranez last night were just like, this is, there's low, like there's some lobe missing. There's like a missing element here. Yeah. I think with the group being so divided, it's one thing when you have like a big conflict and it's like some people are on this team, some people are on this team. But a lot of the stuff like you were just

talking about this season, it was just like petty bullshit. And it's, like, It's like the fact that we are at such a heightened level of the dislike and the, you know, disconnect in this group where even when there's not even anything really worth fighting about, they just hate each other so much. It's like, that's the kind of thing that makes it really hard to imagine this group being able to move forward and being able to kind of, you know, put the pieces together to have a productive season because it's like if you can't literally, you know, if you can't. have a piece of real information and then talk about how that changes the situation. It's like, how can you talk about anything? How can you, how can we do anything? And I think with the, this off the rail special, I mean, I respect production and the network and everything trying to do something.

You know, they had this situation that was kind of untenable and they were like, okay, how do we end this season in a way that feels final in a way that feels like appropriate and not just like it's going to go out with, you know, a wimper. But it also was like then they're showing up to rails. They have them set up in these two rooms. And like the tables are just regular restaurant tables with the white tablecloths on them and like water glasses and one charcutory board in the middle. They're sitting on the regular restaurant chairs. There's no kind of set decoration or centerpieces or, you know, it doesn't even feel like they put

special lighting in there. Like, it doesn't feel like, when they do the reunions, there's so much effort put into kind of the, like, overall setting and vibe and theme and kind of the experience of it. And for this, it's like, you see the cameramen the whole time. There's no kind of, like, it doesn't feel like they really imbued it with any kind of, like, specialness or any kind of character. It just is like, we're showing up at Rails with the camera crew. You guys are going to sit your asses in the chairs for an hour.

And we're going to watch this. We're going to do like one little confessional with each of you so Jen Fessler can play her little song. And then it's just over. Like it feels like they kind of, they were like stuck somewhere in the middle of like, should we do anything or should we not? And it's like I almost think that the lack of kind of production they put into this special almost made it be like, I kind of would have rather they just didn't do it.

I know. And I was trying to figure that out too because at first I was just like, what is this? like, what is this? Like, we're seeing behind the scenes when they're doing the confessions at the end. We're seeing the boxes that they have their feet on and that sort of thing. And then I thought about it. And I said, I don't know if this was because it was all last minute or if this was actually a creative decision made because there was an element where I was looking at them sitting

on their boxes with their confessional. And then they would kind of go to the, you know, the glam portion and kind of, and it was like, we're kind of trying to show that behind all this like fake facade that all of these women are having like it's just a pile of garbage that we're dealing with right now. That's what it felt like. Yeah. And that even even from the finale to the, I'm just going to call it the reunion special, like they, they were in the same room and it felt so much less cinematic, so much less, you know, there wasn't like the same, you know, intensity to the music. And it didn't feel like there was kind of this, you know, breaking the fourth wall so much more readily with the camera

crew and stuff. Like it almost, yeah, it did kind of like strip it of some of that like, drama, which in a way, I guess, yeah, it's like a creative choice, but then also it's like, we need the drama too. Like, it's housewives. And I think that was the problem, you know, the concept of watching the finale is fine. But the fact that the two groups were separate the entire time, there was clearly, they had no intention to like engineer a run-in with any of these people that aren't getting along. Like, it was very like, there are two rooms. They will not interact other than Dolores. Like, this is what we're doing.

It needs to be as, like, simple as possible. And so it really does just end up being an hour of, like, Teresa muttering under her breath whenever Margaret's on screen. And, you know, Danielle being like, oh, Jennifer looks terrible. And, like, there were a few moments that were like, oh, like, that's, she said something funny or, oh, I forgot about that moment or, like, the, you know, Dolores saying that she didn't watch the season. And it's funny to see her, like, actually kind of have some information.

But, like, it just, it fell so flat to me. The actual, like, watching them watch the episode just wasn't that interesting. No, like, even when Bravo does their after shows, there's more production value in those after shows because it's like we're seeing the scene play out and then we're actually getting reactions. Yeah, like you said, right now we're just listening to them, talk over each other, calling each other Satan or saying they look, you know, like shit. And it's like, I don't.

Like that's not what I signed up for. It's like production. They let the crazies run the asylum and they didn't know what to do with them. The one thing I think that they did right, and which is why if there had been a reunion, it would have been good, was not having the men there. Because I do, like, I don't know how many times it has to be pointed out. Like, we are rooting for Teresa. We've been rooting for Teresa since the very beginning. everyone, I think even people who are fans of Teresa

look at Louis as poison, right? And it's like removing that element, I don't know if she'll be able to see it, but I feel like having a conversation where he is not involved or by her side is more helpful. Yeah, that is a good point. Like, I think that was a key difference between a Jersey reunion and whatever this was.

And that like with the Louie piece of it, it's like, yeah, like, it's not necessarily, like the vibes were amazing at this reunion finale watch special but like there wasn't that kind of darkness that has been around a lot of the moments where Louis has been present and I think

when they were talking at the end about kind of how they felt about the season overall and Rachel said that one thing she kind of regrets is not kind of exposing Louis more and kind of digging deeper into everything that we've sort of hinted at around him I agree with her

like I wish we would have kind of it didn't feel like we got to the bottom of anything with Louis this season. But at the same time, I understand for these women in the cast that like it maybe doesn't even feel worth it. Like the way that he is speaking about, you know, I hope Margaret's son suffers and, you know, having dirt on people and investigations and the bow dodle of it all. It's like if I were in that situation,

like I would probably want to talk about that person as little as possible. Because like what really is to be gained? Yeah. Because even when we, you know, when Teresa heard for the first time, Melissa say, you know, everyone was coming out and talking to us about Louis. You know, I was down the shore and his niece came up. And the first thing Teresa says is, oh, I'm going to tell little Louis that his cousin was talking about her father. And it's like, what? The way they use their kids to just like, like, oh, it's going to be this generational problem.

And I know, I don't, nobody wants to see that. Yeah, that kind of thing where it's like, okay, so then what is Louie going to do? like send her a, you know, a horsehead in the bed? Like what's the actual, like, what's the end goal there? Like, it doesn't feel like, and I'm not saying that the other side of the cast is like totally innocent in this because all of these people are messy and have helped get us to the place where we are. But specifically with the Louis and Teresa piece of it, it doesn't feel like there's any kind

of motive of resolution or motive of moving forward with people. Even though Teresa does say at the end, she's like, oh, I got resolution. I feel vindicated. And it's like, the biggest development in the finale was that you were sort of proven wrong. Yeah. Like the fact that she's so,

so solid in her version of things that even being presented with like opposite information makes her feel like she was proven right. It's like, I almost have to applaud it. Yeah. I mean, you know, and that was exactly the moment where I said,

you know what? I'm glad there was in reunion because if I had to do three parts of that, I might throw my TV out the window because I couldn't take it anymore. Yeah, I was in a group chat where people were trying to figure out if this was going to be one part or two. And I was like, I think it's one. Like on the schedule, it doesn't say part one. Like they're not they're not teasing that it's a two part whatever. And watching it, I'm like, how on earth could this have been made into more than one part? Like we don't even see they like, we don't even watch them watch the whole episode.

Like they kind of chop it up a little bit, thankfully. But like even 48 minutes, it was like, okay, I'm good. Well, the only thing we would have gotten, which is I feel like the element that is missing, is Andy would have not have been afraid to call out Teresa in those moments. Like, you're telling me, Teresa, that you're totally fine with the fact that you find out Jackie had been talking, had both of his exes at your house, and you're totally fine with that. And he would make her explain it because I feel like they do. feel like they owe Andy an explanation, especially when they feel like their jobs are on the line.

I just feel like in that moment they didn't feel like their jobs were on the line and they could just get away with whatever. Right. I think the vibe was kind of like this might be the end of it. Hopefully it's not. But like we kind of, it didn't feel like anybody felt like this specific event was like a make or break moment for them on the show. Yeah, I don't know. Do you think like if Andy had come to Rail Steakhouse and like visited each of the rooms for a few minutes, Like, do you think that would have improved it? Or do you think it was just kind of like, don't pretend this is a reunion when it's not?

I don't know. I mean, I don't know what he could have done in that moment. But I think I would have wanted more individual moments where we were getting responses to what was happening versus just reactions to what was happening. Yeah, I think even having, like, when you brought up the after show, which was a good comparison. And like on the after show, it's like how in confessionals they have a producer asking them questions. that they're responding to. I think that that maybe feels like it's what was missing from this is like there wasn't anybody kind of facilitating the conversation.

And with a group of women such as this, I think especially when they're taken out of the situation of being in a room with their like enemy, you need somebody to kind of like prompt them to talk about stuff. Otherwise, you do just get to like, stupid bitch. stuff. She lives so, that's not, that's not like answering a question.

Yeah. And it's like, you know, you could, obviously there were parts of this. You could tell we're thrown together. I mean, the fact that Jen Fessler was showing up late.

Like, normally production, it's like we have the cars ready for you to pick up. Also, you're getting glammed on site. Everyone had to show up already in glam. Yes. You know,

and it was like, it was like, okay, we're just rolling up to the steakhouse. Okay. Right. I'm like, how late was she that they had to press play before she got there.

Like, like, who's, Did they have to clear out of rails before 4 p.m. for dinner service? That's what I'm saying. It looked light outside. I assumed you rented it for the entire day. But like, what?

What is the Rails day rate for a TV production? Those people at Rails are probably so fucking sick of this group of women. Well, I mean, the two women who were on Watch What Happens Live last night. I mean, they say they enjoy when the women come in. So, you know. Oh, they have the people from Rails on Watch What Happens Live. They had two of the women from Rails, the two of the servers on, yeah, that's nice.

Wait, now I need to watch that. I'm like, watch what happens live for me these days is like a little bit. Sometimes I catch it. Sometimes I don't. But like, Railstakehouse, shout out for your cultural contributions. Okay, Kiki, I feel like it's been the question with everyone. So with Jersey now in the bag this season, where do you see this franchise going? It could be a prediction or like a wish list of, of what?

you want to happen. At the end of the finale, surprisingly, I said, I want them all to come back because I felt so unresolved. However, then I watched off the rails and I absolutely do not want to see that at all. I, you know, from hearing from people who were from Jersey, I realize Jersey is so much more than like, you know, Italian women who look like mob wives. And like, I realize even I had that sort of assumption. I was like, no, it's so much more.

You know, and we saw with Roney what a success it can be when you revamp. Now, would I be sad if some of the women who I really liked didn't come back and they completely cleared house? For sure. But I also know those women, we will see them in other versions of Bravo. What we know about Bravo is they don't really fire people. At this point, everyone just kind of goes on pause and some longer than others. So even if they came back with a whole new cast, I know that we'll still see Margaret, we'll still see Fessler, see Dolores, you know, in some incarnation. And obviously, you know, there's rumors of, you know,

Gia filming this kids show with the kids of Bravo. Making it in Manhattan. Yeah. So we know that we will see them in other ways. So at this point, look, I'm down for a reboot, you know. I thought it was fun with Roney and like, let's see, you know, what other, you know, what Jersey has to offer. Wow. The full reboot. That's bold. I feel like most people, you know, I, most people myself included are scared of, of the full reboot because I just feel like, yeah, there's a lot of possibility, but there's also so much risk. So much risk. But I feel like the risk comes if you keep like Melissa and get rid of Teresa or you keep

Teresa, get rid of Melissa, because it's so toxic. So at this point, it's like, if you all want to go away, we have a whole new fan base come in, fine. Yeah. I mean, as somebody who is definitely a bigger fan of Melissa than Teresa, as you all tell me in a one-star iTunes review. I know. Like, I think that at this point, if they're getting rid of one of them, they need to get rid of them both. Just for like a pure like sage the house, clear the air, like we have to move on from this. So I think that even if they end up keeping like half

of this cast, I think it would just, it would make the most sense for everybody to just like be done with the family Gorga at this point on Real Houseways of New Jersey. Because how, how are you ever going to move forward? And I say that with like, even if you think that Teresa is the best housewife ever and she is the show, it's like, I think everybody after this season should be able to agree that we need to start fresh in some form, you know? No. And I think, again, Matt Rogers, I think he said it best when he was like, Teresa is dating someone who has a very dark background. And so her entire storyline will always be very dark as long as she's connected to this person. And so it's just, I think it's impossible to kind of move forward in like a non-toxic way with that element.

Well, we will see. And I will be sure to have you back on whenever we do have a new season of Real House of New Jersey, whatever that might look like. In the meantime, Kiki, tell everyone about pop crime and what you've got going on over there. Yeah, pop crime. We're doing all of the pop culture, true crime, you know, story scandals, legal dramas that you want to follow right now. I'm going into the Tom Girardi trial every day here in Los Angeles. So we'll be recapping that this week.

And so many, I mean, there's just so many stories, I think, that are in the world of celebrity and dramas. And I even do something like I did the Karen Reed trial just because it became so popular, even though that's not a celebrity. But it's like she became a celebrity by how popular that trial game. I know the Tupac trial is coming up. So obviously I'm going to follow that very closely. And so, yeah, there's lots of stuff. There's always something going on. And I feel like when I see your episode topics, I'm like, I get curious.

about things that I didn't even really realize were happening. I'm like, wait, what's the tea there? But thank you so much, Kiki. Always a pleasure. And I can't wait to talk more about Tom Girardi on your show. But until next time, you can rate review, follow the show wherever you listen. You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches. And until next time, be cool.

Don't be all like uncool. Mention It All Podcast is produced by Dylan Hafer and Bell Roman. Editing by Bell Roman, social media by Dylan Hafer and Candice Maniga, guest booking by Ali Friedlander. VP of Podcast is Chris Allen, and be sure to follow Bravo by Betches. Yamava Resort and Casino at San Manuel is California's number one entertainment destination

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