Mention It All - Reckoning With The Bravo Reckoning

Episode Date: October 30, 2023

It’s BravoCon week, but before Dylan can head to Vegas, he hits the studio to break down Vanity Fair’s supposed bombshell article about Bravo. What new information does it actually contain, and what does it reveal about Bethenny’s anti-Bravo crusade? He finishes with some final thoughts about the RHONY reunion, and salutes Frank Catania on his engagement. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Betches Media presents Ha ha laugh funny Mention It All A Bravo by Betches podcast We don't say that But now we said it With me, Dylan Hafer We're going to check me both

Hey everyone Welcome back to the Mentioned at All podcast It is a new week It's a new dawn It's a new day And it's a new Vanity Fair article That dropped this morning

That we are going to get into the reality reckoning tell-all or whatever that we've been waiting on dropped this morning. I have some thoughts. Whether or not you've read it, I'm excited to get into some of the details and some of the questions that I might still have. But first of all, I want to say congratulations to Frank Katania, Sr., who is now engaged to his beautiful girlfriend, fiancé, Brittany. She posted last night. It's a big old engagement ring. They look happy. I'm happy for them. And I am happy for the prospect of Dolores being able to live her life. We have really been on the roller coaster the last, I don't know, five, six years with Frank and Dolores. And it really feels like we're entering a new chapter. Last season, we finally saw Dolores in her love bubble of sorts with Polly, and that was causing some friction, because despite his happy relationship with Brittany, he couldn't quite give up on the idea that he and Dolores were this kind of dynamic duo.

And I do just wonder, will that change now? now that he has put the ring on a finger of someone who is not Dolores, will he once and for all move on? I was thinking about this last night after the news. New Jersey has a very unique setup. Of course, that being that the husbands really are their own unit within the cast. They film scenes. They have guys nights.

They're very active on the show. They usually come to the reunions. It's a different setup than the rest of the cities. But up until now, Frank has maintained his position in the cast, despite his somewhat shifting position in the life of Dolores. But now that Dolores and Polly, by all accounts, are happier than ever. more serious than ever, really moving toward a future together. And now that Frank is engaged to someone else who is not on the show more than as a

guest every so often, what does that mean for Frank Catania's position on the Real Housewives of New Jersey? Because I don't have an issue with him being invited to Guy's night or him, you know, attending a party, especially if it's a bigger event where all the cast are coming and bringing their significant others. You know, him and Brittany being in attendance at a party in New Jersey is not strange, but there doesn't really seem to be a good explanation for him staying on the show more than this guy who is invited to our parties sometimes. And I think that that is going to be a tough thing for him to accept. I don't know if that's what I want. I don't really feel

super strongly. I mean, I like Frank. He seems like a good guy, you know, aside from the fact that he's acknowledged that he's, uh, more or less a serial cheater. But overall, I just think that sometimes I prefer when housewives doesn't stretch the, you know, doesn't, I don't want to suspend my disbelief too much watching these shows. And so if we keep seeing Frank and Dolores filming all these scenes together, it's going to start to feel like, why would he be at her house right now? Their kids are grown. Both of their kids are in their 20s. They're both in their own relationships. That's, I think, why it feels like the end of an era, because if Dolores was still single, sure, who cares? If Frank was still single, yeah, they can, you know,

that's what it was for the first few years. as they were on the show. You know, Frank was closer to Dr. David than Dolores was there for a while. But yeah, I'm happy for them. I'm happy that they, I'm happy that they're engaged, but I'm just wondering. I'm wondering what it means for the future. I think Frank will be a BravoCon. So we'll see, we'll see if we get any clues there. I wonder if Brittany will be there. I don't know. Strange things are happening in New Jersey. So good, so good, so good. Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom Rack stores now and up to 60% off.

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But really, we have to talk about this Vanity Fair article. So this was rumored to be happening for a little while. We didn't know exactly when it was going to drop. And that happened to be today at 8 a.m. The headline, Inside the Real Housewives Reckoning, that's Rocking Bravo. Amid disturbing allegations, Bethany Frankl's calls for a union and a whole lot of drinking, reality TV's most popular stars are facing their demons. So, you know, I see this article at 8.30 this morning. I tap into it. It's a lengthy chunk. It's a really

detailed, reported feature. It gets into a lot of different things. But I will say right off the bat, this article is not really what I was expecting. Because we've been hearing and listening to, hearing more than listening to, but Bethany has been making a lot of noise for a few months now. This reality reckoning thing that she has launched in the wake of her podcast with Jill over the summer and then her interview with Rachel that happened after that, she has really taken up this mantle and, you know, said a lot of things and made a lot of statements and,

you know, really stirred up this whole charge. And so when I heard that there was this sort of bombshell, tell all, what have you coming from Vanity Fair, which, I mean, Vanity Fair is a great, publication. I, you know, they do a lot of great stuff. I'm thinking, okay, this could be, this could be Armageddon for Bravo. You know, this could be really unspeakably bad, depending on what they have, who they've talked to, who has gone on the record. You know, I was just kind of bracing for the worst. And what I think this article does, it goes through a lot of

some specific details that are really upsetting, that are really unflattering to a variety of people. But in the sense of Bravo and Real Housewives as a whole, this article to me, it doesn't feel like it really changes anything. Like it really uncovers something that was lurking beneath the surface because the bulk of this article focuses on Real Housewives of New York. And specifically the last couple seasons prior to the reboot, season 12, season 13, because aside from Bethany, the two housewives that they have on the record that they really cover in this story are Ebony and Leah. And of course, they had very

different experiences on Real Housewives of New York. Leah's journey, especially as categorized in this article mostly focuses on her sobriety, her, you know, her relapse and non-sobriety during her first season on the show. And then in the second season when she was sober and there was the situation in where they went to the Hamptons and her grandmother was very ill. And there was kind of a question of whether she was allowed to leave the Hamptons, whether she was encouraged to stay. this has been sort of an open debate over the last couple of years. And then Ebony's experienced that season being the first black woman to join the cast of Real Housewives of New York. Most of what is covered in this article focuses on the numerous failings and, you know, racially insensitive and, you know, really problematic comments and things that happened, particularly coming from Ramona Singer.

And how, you know, there was the time at Luann's house when Ebony brought up white fragility. And then after she left, Ramona allegedly said, this is why we didn't need black people on the show. Because now look at, you know, and then she tells Ebony later in the season that she has to watch what she says. And there was a time when she said, made a comment about black chicks. And I mean, the worst of it is there's a black woman who was hired to be a producer on season 13 of Real Housewives of New York who, off-camera Ramona allegedly used the N-word in a conversation with. And all of these things are bad. None of these are, you know, to me, none of those moments are, you know, shrug it off.

Who cares? Why are we still talking about this? Housewives is supposed to be fun. This is something that's referenced in the article about, they view it as a comedy. But the thing is, with that being said, none of that information is new. None of that information really, I mean, as upsetting and as icky as it is, there's a difference between that and it being truly shocking or revelatory or new. And there were a few things in the article that really got me, mostly some quotes. But overall, it really focuses on that time period of Roney.

And then it ties in the Caroline and Brandy situation a little bit on Ultimate Girls Trip. And then it mentions the lawsuit that Marco, the Bart Butler or whatever, from Bluestone Manor, Girls Trip filed. And then it talks a little bit about Bethany and her, her, her. experience with Jill and Jill's statements about not knowing that cameras were going to be at Bobby's funeral. Those are sort of the events and the storylines that are on the table in this article. And quite frankly, I just thought there would be more. And I think with Bethany's whole reality reckoning, reality union, Bravo. union, whatever she claims to be fighting for, it's really, really interesting and I think telling in a

certain sense that this whole time she really has not gotten a single housewife or really a single current Bravo Leopardy to engage with the conversation, let alone to, you know, to, you know, proudly stand up and join her cause, but even really to acknowledge that it's happening. And I know the gut reaction to that is, oh, well, these people are still employed by Bravo, so they don't want to, they're scared to speak up and to lose their jobs in XYC. And of course, I think that's something that is at play in this scenario. I don't think you can, you know, pretend that that's not part of it. But when you think about the idea of a union and unionizing and, you know, organizing into a union,

the thing that you have to have is that the people who are employed within the system have to speak up and say that that's what they want. You know, I... Correct me if I'm wrong going back in a history textbook,

but I don't think any union has ever been started by somebody from the outside coming in and saying, this looks bad, you all are now a union. union, there needs to be this kind of internal uprising in a way of people speaking out and really speaking truth to power and, you know, saying what they want and say what you will about Bethany, you know, I think she has her strengths and she has her weaknesses, but she has not gotten that to happen thus far. And also, nobody except for Leah and Ebony are really speaking on record

for this article. Now, there are a couple of off-the-record quotes that I want to get into. The first one, this is a housewife speaking on condition of anonymity because she doesn't want to lose her nightmare of a dream job. It says, quote, have I been put through the ringer? She says, 100%. Still better than my worst day, withering away at a life of quiet desperation. When this housewife went to last year's BravoCon, a three-day convention attended by 30,000 or so fans, she turned to two former fellow Bravo Leberties and said, quote, how do I ever be happy after this? I mean, fuck. This is what I think is really complicated because there are a lot of specific situations and a lot of, you know, people that have done

bad things and, you know, specific issues that have happened. But this quote to me speaks so strongly to the sort of overwhelming power of the Bravo environment, of reality TV as a whole, but I mean, specifically thinking about BravoCon as we're about to go into this year's event, these people are seeing an opportunity and seizing an opportunity, and a lot of them are coming from circumstances

where they're not famous. They might be wealthy. They oftentimes are not wealthy of their own accord. You know, maybe their husband has money or they come from a wealthy family. But some of these women aren't necessarily, you know, successful in certain metrics on their own. And these shows and this world really gives them something that I think is kind of addictive and hard to get away from. And I think, you know, when we talk about the concept of, of a reality reckoning and, you know, maybe mistreatment from the side of production and things

like that. It always comes up of people saying, oh, well, like, these women knew what they were signing up for. And, you know, this is, this is how it goes. And it's kind of something that you agree to because, you know, you're getting X, Y, Z out of it. And I think it's just so complicated. Because when you read a quote like that, that somebody who's still in the system is saying, if I were to ever leave, what the fuck would I do? What? I'm going to go back to sitting at home with no one, with no one watching me and just, you know, read a book for the rest of my life.

I think it's a really tough merry-go-round to get off of. And I think they make it that way in a sense. But also, I think that's just kind of the human psyche. and especially for certain kinds of people that having that love and attention and, of course, money is a part of it. But it's something that is intoxicating and thrilling and you sort of forget how to live without it. And especially for some of these people that are on these shows for, you know, five, six, seven, ten plus years. What is Vicki Gunwelson supposed to do without housewives? Who is Ramona Singer without Roney?

And I think Ramona is kind of the single person who comes out of this looking the worst. Because so much of that bad behavior from season 13 of Rony really comes down to things that she said and did, allegedly. You know, the reason that there wasn't a reunion in season 13 is because there was an HR investigation into Ramona's behavior. And I think that in terms of problems and questions, one of the biggest ones, which is crazy, it's like, why is Ramona still in the family? Ramona's on legacy girls trip coming out in a month or so. She's going to be at BravoCon. she's still in the family.

She's been on Watch What Happens Live. They talk about this in the article that Ramona was on Watch What Happens Live in September. And then, you know, popped up again last month. And, you know, she's still welcome on this territory. And it does just kind of beg the question of like, why can't we just let go of Ramona Singer? Another thing that, that cropped up for me in this article that just, kind of gave me pause was the conversation about mental health resources during filming for these shows. They had specifically been talking about one of Leah's experiences where she had been

connected with a mental health professional over the phone. But here's a quote that I want to read. Other housewives recall similar experiences with mental health care providers referred by Bravo. Quote, they have a 1-800 number for Dr. Barry. One housewife says of Barry Goldstein, an off-screen psychologist who goes by his first name with Bravo, His website, RealityShrink.net, notes he is also a, quote, board game designer and expert. Goldstein, quote, has called me on many occasions as a check-in, says a housewife, which in her estimation feels like, you're not doing what they want to do. Now, this is something where I feel like Bravo has pretty directly dropped the ball.

Bravo and all of the production companies that are involved in the making of these shows, because for most of these, Bravo is not on the ground with the cast. Andy Cohen is not there. That's not how it works. But this has been something. They've said that mental health resources or professional or whatever are made available to all the women while they're filming. This is something that they have addressed a little bit in the recent round of kind of news

and updates where they're saying, that there's going to be more access and, you know, pre and post and during airing and all of that. So they're working on it, I guess. But this situation where they're calling this guy Dr. Barry and his website is reality shrink.com. And he's a board game designer. This guy, and I don't have any real knowledge of this, sounds like a, what's the word? a quack? Or, you know, maybe he's a very, uh, maybe he's a very legitimate, uh, professional. But the vibe just isn't quite that he's the kind of person that you want to be the person

overseeing this whole operation from a mental health standpoint. Like maybe there could be a little bit more infrastructure there. maybe a woman, that might be good. Maybe somebody who doesn't have an 800 number and a dot net web address. That might make me feel better. I think also just the idea that this is the guy that does all of this. He's the reality shrink. And this last part of the quote where he says, you know, he calls and checks in and it feels like you're not going to do what they want to do.

It feels like that is somebody who's in the pocket of production. And ideally, the idea that there is mental health care available for everybody on set should be something that is completely independent of production. And so, you know, is NBC paying this person a retainer to be available for their services? Okay, that's what it takes. but there really shouldn't be any coaching on behalf of production of this mental health guy talking to the women. Because what it really comes down to is that if there's a psychologist or a therapist or whoever available to them in a time of need, that should be the escape from production in your ear.

because I think that's one thing that's tempting, and I see this in this article and in others that I've read and just kind of in general, I think people sometimes conflate the basic mechanics of how producing a reality show works with something a little bit more nefarious and a little bit more sinister and calculated. and I think that there, I'm sure there are definitely instances where producers cross a line or where there are tactics employed that are really kind of gross. But I think that something like a producer talking to a cast member in between filming or in between scenes or whatever, and kind of coaching them a little bit through their issue with another. woman in the cast or sort of what they want to talk about in the next scene. That's just the job. That's how shows like this get made.

And I think suggesting that that is a problem kind of skates over the real issue, which is when people do abuse that power or when the medical, you know, the therapist that they can call is also doing the production narrative. And I think that if all the pieces were, you know, clean. up a little bit, then the process itself isn't necessarily what's broken. The Vanity Fair article, they talk a lot about these hot sheets, which essentially are daily production notes that are created by, you know, a field producer. You know, I know people who have done this for their job. And basically what that job is, is you sit there all day in, you know, while the women are filming, and you basically type up a log of everything that happens, of all the conversations,

that are broached of, you know, the dynamics of what went down on camera. Because then, you know, the network and Andy and whoever else are getting essentially this daily rundown of how things are going. And this really only applies to what did we get on camera? Because in the bubble of creating the show, the point of the hot pages or the hot sheets or whatever is that you're figuring out on a day-to-day basis, what content you're capturing, essentially. So then when it comes time to edit and to put things together, you know what you have,

you know what you might need, you know, kind of like how to narrativeize the footage. And what comes up in this article, you know, they kind of, some of the stuff in the hot sheets is portrayed as a little bit salacious. But I think they also point out that the hot sheets don't contain anything that's not on camera. So if they film a whole scene and then cameras are down and Ramona says something racist, that's not going to be in the hot sheets, not because somebody's trying to cover it up, but because that's not what the notes are for.

It's just a different thing that is also important and also should be happening, but is separate. That having somebody on set or having a person, producer or somebody whose job it is to make sure that people are being taken care of, that people are safe, that people are not being harassed or, you know, verbally assaulted or whatever off camera should be in place. But that doesn't mean that the system of production of the show itself needs to be wrapped up into that.

Like it's a separate issue that I think is important and should be addressed separately. And I think it deserves that. The other quote that I highlighted, this is getting toward the end of the piece. And it's about more of Bethany's role as an organizer, which I was already talking about. But Bethany says I was a part of it. I wanted to be Andy's favorite. I love that I was Andy's favorite. I love that I was able to make good television and produce it at the same time.

I loved that producers knew I was the best. I was in the machine. I was the machine. I created the machine. Okay, we got toot the horn just, just enough. But she says that now her mission to remake the medium that made her, she says, quote, it's my penance. And then this parenthetical is perhaps the best part of the whole article for me.

Presented with the idea that she might participate in Frankel's organizing, Williams, that's Ebony Kay, said, quote, fuck Bethany Frankl. You think I'm going to let someone. white girl, speak for me with my experience with a multi-billion dollar corporation. Say what you want about Evony K. Williams as a housewife, but the fact that she's on the record in Vanity Fair saying, fuck Bethany Frankel, she doesn't speak for me. That is gold. And I think that intentional or not, I think intentional because, you know, the people working on this

piece are very smart. Therein lies the issue. issue of Bethany Frankel, St. Bethany of, of reckoning, that there are lots of problems here. There are lots of things happening on the surface, below the surface, at all levels that could be, should be addressed. There's a lot of stuff in the article about drinking, both kind of how that happens, how it's portrayed. I have complicated feelings about that. You know, there's, There are a lot of pieces to this puzzle, and I've been talking about it for 20 minutes, and I'm not even going to get to everything that's in the article. It's a long article.

It's worth reading. But I think this is an important thing to spotlight that even within the three main people that are featured in this article, they don't agree on Bethany as kind of the champion of this cause. And so how are 100 people going to agree on Bethany as the champion of this cause? So at the end of the day, I think it's a really interesting read. I think if you are not so steeped in what has happened in the Bravo world the last couple of years, I think it might be super eye-opening and, I mean, quite upsetting. The stuff with Roney, I think, is a saga unto itself.

But I was just expecting a little more from this article in terms of getting people from other franchises and shows on the record, getting into more examples of stuff, even if they didn't have people on the record. Really, the other, aside from Girls Trip and Roney, the other housewives franchises are not really even mentioned or alluded to in this article. there's no talk of below deck where there have been multiple instances just in the last year or so of really unsavory things happening on below deck shows. That's not kind of touched here. You know, they get into Vanderpumperals a little bit with the Rachel situation and kind of Andy not coming to her defense when she was being really, you know, raked over the coals by her fellow cast members. I think that is kind of a whole other can of worms. I think the Andy piece in general is really interesting. And there's, you know, there's a lot of stuff in there about how, you know, at one point they say that Andy seemed disappointed.

Or Leah says that Andy seemed disappointed that they hadn't captured essentially her moment of relapse with drinking on camera when she told him that she had actually started drinking before filming began. That he was, you know, annoyed because that would have been such a great moment to. get the first glimpse of her tasting alcohol after a decade. You know, that's a big, that's a big thing to throw around. And I don't necessarily, I'm not saying that Leah's lying about that, but I think that's her perception. And I think that there are a few cases, you know, with the Hampton situation, you could go back and forth all day long about, you know, could she have left earlier, should she have left earlier, should she have come in the first place? Did production really say anything? Or did she just read into it.

Like, it's, it's a complicated thing. And I think that this article, if anything, what it does is kind of paints the picture of how big and messy and difficult this is to wrap your head around rather than tying it up in a bow and being like, bravo's fucked. And so I don't know if anything is going to come of this. I think that's almost, it feels like the needle hasn't necessarily been moved from where it was 24 hours ago. Bethany is still going to do her dance. I think Ebony and Leah have their own kind of issues. I think there's, you know, some lawsuits, some stuff happening there. I think that a lot of these issues still need to be figured out.

And Bravo has been, you know, making strong. or saying that they're going to make strides or promising to make strides. You know, Francis Berwick wrote that whole note about, you know, alcohol training and, you know, all the stuff that's going to happen on set. And so I think in a broader sense, we'll see. But in the immediate, I think this article is, as it kind of just adds to the conversation. I don't know that it really tips the scales one way or the other. Study

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Refreshers contain caffeine. Copyright 2026. the Coca-Cola company. Sprite is a registered trademark of the Coca-Cola company. I was going to talk about the Roney Reunion. I have all these notes. The Roney Reunion Part 2, it kind of felt like we were there. Like, we're here because we were told we had to be, not because there's really anything that we need to get to. And these Peacock extended versions, I'm sorry. I didn't need 58 minutes of this reunion, part two.

And I think part one was that long, too. It just was losing a little bit of steam. You know, we talk a little bit more about Jessel and Pavit's sex life. We've been talking about that for three months. We talk more about Jessel talking about her past and, you know, comparing her, you know, trauma of having an internship to other people's, you know, absentee parents. We sort of come to an understanding there. We get a classic.

Sye apologizes, quote, if that's how she felt. and that it felt like, you know, she was doing a little bit too much watching it back. Jessel acknowledges that her uncle was not the same as size mom, though he was like a father to her. I love that. It's like, it's like I acknowledge that my uncle, though he was like a father to me, is not the same as your mom. It's like, okay, I agree to disagree there. You know, we're talking about Jessel's privilege. Aaron asks Jessel if she grew up poor And Jessel's response is that it was comfortable But not lavish

Look, I'm sorry She's not going to say she grew up poor But she's also not going to say she grew up rich Because in her mind she didn't grow up rich And I don't know I don't have the bank You know the tax returns I don't know

But she says to Aaron Well you were at the ballet with Brad Pitt and Gwyneth I was delivering newspapers with my mom. I'm like, where did that come from? What is going on? Also, it's funny because Jessel was at the ballet last week with Brandon Uba and Uba's man. They all looked good. Sutton was there too.

I was sad Sutton didn't take a picture with them. Sutton and Crystal, I think. You know, Sai gets the full defense of being an influencer as a real job, you know, yada, yada. And then we have to talk about the Anguilla phone incident for like 20 minutes. I just, at the time when it was happening, I was weirded out by it.

I still sort of am. I get, okay, so Uba explains that her family, because she's always traveling for work and she doesn't always have time or signal or whatever to keep up with them, her family asks her to write in the group chat every morning so they know she's safe. And that this was the root cause

of why her reaction was so strong to not having her phone. Sure. Okay. But then Aaron's like, well, why did you freak out at me? And Uba's like, well, I gave you the grace of not talking to you all morning. And then when I like happened to mention your name, you blew up and we're like, don't say my name. And then that's when I blew up.

And then there's the whole thing about Aaron says she texted Jessel that she had the phone. And Jessel's like, you didn't tell me that you had the phone. And Aaron's like, well, I'm like, well, I'm. I sent you an emoji that made it clear that I had the phone. And it's like this whole thing is just when it comes down to it, not that interesting. And I get that they have to talk about it at the reunion because objectively, it was one of the most heated, tense, dramatic feuds of the season. but it's like weeks later taking a step back it's just a little bit who cares and honestly that's how I feel about the brin and sifing about when she said that the Connecticut thing in the finale

and then they were like oh I'll never talk to each other again everybody seems to be able to acknowledge with most of the conflicts in this cast that something was blown out of proportion or there was a misunderstanding or, you know, they didn't react the right way. And I mean, I'm glad that there's, you know, movement forward and personal growth and all of that. And maybe it's a little hypocritical because I remember with the Orange County reunion a month or so ago that we were like, it was so productive. They were able to talk through all their issues. Yay. But there just was kind of a spark that this reunion was missing that I think I think with OC it felt like they had big issues that they were able to make progress on in a way that was kind of admirable.

Whereas with this reunion, I think it felt more like there just weren't really that many issues to begin with and that the issues that we did have this season were a little bit surface level and a little bit played up for needing 14 episodes worth of content. And I think, you know, I still came out of this season really liking some of these women. I think overall it was a strong first effort with this reboot, with this cast. None of these women had been on Housewives before. But I also think that it's fine to, like, we can exist in the duality of this season was not that bad. And also this reunion, there kind of wasn't anything that we really needed to get into.

And so I'm very curious to see what happens between this reunion and next season with Roney. I think all of them, but Jenna are going to be at BravoCon, which seems like it could be telling, but also, you know, Jenna has an event or something, I'm sure. But yeah, there's a part of me that's like, let them do another season. They'll figure it out, you know, tinker with the casting a little bit. but for the most part they're fine. But then also it's like, I don't know. I don't feel like this season is ending with a lot of forward momentum. And I think it'll be interesting to find out kind of like what the direction is going into

season 15, season two. But I'm sure there will be a season 15. So we will find out. We're all on this journey together. And don't forget to rate review and follow the show wherever you listen. You can follow us on Instagram at Bravo by Betches. You can follow me at Dylan Hafer. I'm going to be headed to BravoCon later this week.

And there's going to be lots of exciting stuff happening over the weekend. So make sure that you're following if you don't want to miss anything. And I think I might do like a I might do like a little BravoCon, a little mini guide or something. If you have questions or you want to hear more about BravoCon, feel free to send a DM or let me know a five-star review and I'll get something cooking for later this week. But anyway, thank you guys so much for listening. And until next time, be cool. Don't be all like uncool. Mentioned at all is produced by Dylan Hafer, Sean Kilby, Jorge Morales Pico, and Rebecca Sousmacat. Editing by Horace

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