Mike Birbiglia's Working It Out - 112. Ramy Youssef Returns: You Already Love Him

Episode Date: October 23, 2023

Ramy Youssef was one of the first and most popular guests on Working It Out back in 2020, and now he’s back with updates to some of the same very material he worked out the first time around. Mike and Ramy discuss which Death Cab For Cutie songs make Ramy cry, unfriendly encounters in Jacksonville, the perils of public restroom keys, and Ramy’s not-so-secret “secret marriage.” All that and why Ramy wants Mike’s next special to be called “The Arab Dad.”Please consider donating to Karam Foundation

How old will you wait for your daughter to be to let her go on the subway? Oh, on her own? Yeah. I think I'll be 25. You're actually the most Arab dad I've ever met. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Ask Jenny. Jenny will be like 30.

Dude, that should be the name of your special. Mike Birbiglia, Arab dad. You're the Arab dad. You're the Arab dad. Yeah, yeah. You know how fast my career would end if I called my special The Arab Dad? Just tell people I said it was okay. That is the voice of the great Rami Youssef.

Rami is one of my favorite comics on this planet. He is obviously an extremely prolific writer, creator, now a director. We talk about that on the show today. Uh, amazing standup comedian. He's one of our original guests on the show way back in 2020. And he is back. If you're able to see him on tour, he is kind of everywhere right now. He's in Chicago. He's in Paris. He's in London. He's like, I would check on Instagram at Ramy, R-A-M-Y. He is going everywhere. And if you can see him live, absolutely take advantage of that opportunity because he is, he's absolutely one of the very best stand-up comedians.

I'm actually announcing a huge tour right now, this week. It's called the Please Stop the Ride Tour, which is a reference to a joke from my girlfriend's boyfriend about being on the scrambler. And it's all new material. It's a whole new hour that is different, completely different from the old man in the pool.

I'm so excited about it. I'll be in Boston, and then I'll be in Big Sky, Montana. I'll be in Vancouver, Seattle, Walla Walla, Washington, Portland, Oregon. I'll be in St. Petersburg, Florida, Jacksonville, Orlando, Miami, Aspen, Vail, Fort Collins, Denver, Dallas, Texas, Houston, San Antonio, Troy, New York, Rochester, New York, Toronto, Toronto, Atlanta, Charlotte, Richmond, and then back to Washington, D.C. at the Warner Theater. I'm going to be at the D.C. Improv also at the end of November, so I'm going to have two trips to Washington, D.C.

You might be asking, should I go to the D.C. Improv show and the Warner Theater show? I think so, and my inclination is one of them is in November, one of them's in June. The show is going to be a lot different. I mean, it's fundamentally going to be the Please Stop the Ride tour,

but I think it's going to be a lot different and it's going to be, you know, working it out. You'll see the whole process. All of this is on burbigs.com, tickets at burbigs.com

and if you join the mailing list, you'll be the first to know about the pre-sale, which is how you get the best seats to all of these shows. I love this episode with Rami today. One of my favorite episodes we've ever done. We talk about the stand-up

comics who influenced him, the family members who influenced him, his uncles, very funny uncles. We talk about the positive representation of his culture and prayer. He's such a smart person, such a big heart, and of course, one of the funniest people who I've ever known. Enjoy my conversation with the great Rami Youssef. So you're directing some episodes of Rami, an episode of The Bear.

Yeah. So like, do you think you're going to direct movies? I'd love to. Yeah. That's kind of... That's what I'm feeling. I'm excited to. It's kind of what has been... It just excites me. you know, in the, you

know, like you kind of do a bunch of pieces of it. And I think, you know, you know, this too, like you've started stuff and written stuff and directed stuff and done all that. And then it's like, you, you do so many pieces of it and then, yeah, I'm never going to say I wouldn't want to do all of them, but the more it starts to like whittle down to how do I want to spend my, like our precious time that we have while we're here. I'm like, all right. So like, if I'm actually making time a commodity, like what's the thing that I really want to spend it on? And I have so much fun directing. It's really, really fun. Yeah. What, what was the first thing you directed your own series? Yeah. Like first thing where there was money on the

line that wasn't mine. You know, I think growing up, uh, I loved, you know, I would direct little music videos and do this and that. And, you know, in high school, like me and my buddy, Steve way, who's, you know, on my show, uh, we just, we, there was a TV program at our high school that we like expanded it into a three year program. Like when we started, it was a year and a half program and we just kept being like, wait, we need more classes. We want to do more. And so they kind of stretched it out for us. And we kind of are the like known as the alumni who did that for that TV program, but it did a lot for us, you know, because it taught us how to make things and edit and do all of that. So it was something I always kind of really wanted to do. And then, yeah,

I was in a situation where I had a budget and we had all this stuff and I got to do it. Your show is semi-autobiographical. If you call it Rami, it's like, what are you going to do? It's kind of you, like even if you said it wasn't you, it's kind of you. Tough luck, bro. But it's like, what's the thing that you could do on your series that you're like I can't do

that as a stand-up bit because it's like literally me on stage saying the thing you know it's like I think things get to collide and build up in a way that they never could on stage it's there's not like a topic I don't think I couldn't do on stage or the seed of a thing I couldn't do on stage. I could talk about anything, you know, but, you know, the storylines and the way that the impact can be huge, yeah, I would never do on stage.

And then there's certain things that I find funny that just wouldn't even sound good coming out of my mouth and you get to give it to different characters. You know, like there's something like certain jokes or things that i feel that i'm like oh this would sound i find this funny because it's the kind of thought my dad would have yeah and then it's like oh cool i get to like give it to my dad you know we had this one scene it's one of my favorite scenes we've ever shot where um the dad is explaining to the mom, to his wife, that he has broken down the lyrics of one of President Obama's chosen songs

on his Spotify playlist. And it's this song by Bad Bunny. So he went online and he looked up the Spanish translation and then he turned all of the translation into like English that supports theories of the Quran. And then he's like telling her obama is trying to use coded spanish language to bring people to islam because of course he's muslim his name is

barack assane obama right it's i mean it's one of my favorite scenes we've ever shot it would kind of make sense if i said it on stage but to put these two people in a car who are on the brink of divorce and she's really frustrated with him and And then he's like, I've been breaking down the lyrics of Obama's Spotify playlist. Like that's the kind of shit where I'm like, oh, this is why it's so fun to make a show. Cause it's like, you can get in on these little granular things. And I, you know, it's like what we love doing in comedy, making small things so much bigger than they are and then kind of rooting them in relationship. And I think what the relationships you can see on a show, uh, there's so much more vivid I think what the relationships you can see on a show, there's

so much more vivid and alive than the relationships you could talk about on stage. You know, that's, that's what's really fun for me. Yeah, I think that's true. I think the reason why, like, I feel like I'm so obsessed with film is like, it feels often like a snapshot of time for that group of people. So like the scene you're talking about in the car, it's like, that's not just from your brain. It's from the actor's brains and their souls. And it's what the art department's bringing to it. It's what the camera department,

it's all kind of a snapshot in time. And like you're saying, like you can't quite express that in standup. You can get close. To the point you're making, it's almost like a written scene is like a prompt. So it's like stand-up you can get close to the point you're making it's almost like a written scene is like a prompt so it's like what's that going to bring out of the actor yeah what's that going to bring out of the art department yeah because they're going to put something in the room that you didn't tell them to put in oh absolutely you're going to

go and you're going to you know for better or for worse but when it's for better which a lot of the times my experience has been it's almost always for better where you're like oh whoa like it's kind of about that i didn't even realize it's about that oh absolutely you know but but the prompt like a good scene on paper will prompt the best out of everybody who's involved in making it and that's really fun there's this great the i listen to script notes podcasts it's craig mason and john august and craig mason says this thing i think is great which is like i love craig dude isn't it great dude yeah yeah he's so smart but he he says this thing which is like that that filmmaking is biology and television is chemistry in a certain sense where biology is just an experiment you put these things together it's like maybe it works

maybe it doesn't work. Chemistry is like, you got season two. You got season three. You got season four. Let's try this. Let's try this. What with your series do you feel like you're learning and it's better than season one?

Is there anything like that? Tone. Just digging in the tone more. In a way, something we've done on the show is kind of, we've not been beholden to preserving the season one tone. That's interesting, yeah. And then, you know, make season two, it has stuff from season one tone, but it's also its own year.

Season three, it's its own year. And in a way, season three for me was like the combination of season one and two tones you know yeah put into put into three right so yeah for it's it's it's because i think someone like larry david you know he kind of picked his like this is the tone this is the formula and those comedies are so good right because they never change so i i feel like there's like a real there's two types of comedy there's, right? Because they never change. So I feel like there's like a real, there's two types of comedy. There's the one where the characters never change.

So the comedy, like they'll do anything but change their problem, right? Like every character has a problem. So what's so funny about Seinfeld is like, no one in that show is interested in fixing themselves. They want to fix the world around them to fit how they are. That's right. And that's why it is powder keg repeatedly funny.

And then I think obviously there's a whole wave of comedies that I would consider my show being part of where the character is kind of like going through changes. Their scenario around them is shifting. And then that's kind of where the drama comes in. But then there's also the comedy because there's no fear in going into any topic, right? And there's no fear in needing to be taken too seriously,

even if the emotions are serious. So you kind of get the drama narrative elements of a character growing, shifting, dealing, but you also get the comedy of, yeah, we're not afraid to kind of try anything or do anything. Right. Yeah, and so the more we've made the show,

the more I'm aware of how the characters work but also what risks are worth taking and then you take certain risks and then you kind of new risks are born out of the old risks that worked or didn't work what are you like when what is the most uncomfortable you've ever felt shooting your series um we uh it's a good question i mean there's two things that really stick out to me one was honestly just the first time we filmed me my character uh praying right because that's something that i do and i grew up doing. And I had this weird feeling of, wow, now I'm doing it for a show. You know, it's such a kind of personal thing. And then you put it out there in a certain way.

But then it was so clear to me, you know, at a certain point when I was dealing with it, where I was like, man, the only time people have ever seen this on screen, it's usually followed with like, you know, finish the prayer and then like pick up a rifle, you know. And that's the imagery, you know, of what we do that Western media has seen. And I was like, you know, I have to kind of eat this discomfort for the reality that like doing this and then going to a diner and post gaming about a date

right and then going to work at a startup you know all these things that are in our show right to know that this act is part of the fabric of a life that you know in in some ways people are familiar with and in some ways is different but to just understanding that it would ground it in a human act, you know? And I think there's like a, uh, in general part of what, um, you know, is there for Arabs, Muslims in every landscape and, and, and whatever it is, there's a level of dehumanization. And so I had to kind of understand like, okay, if I'm, if there's any little contribution I'm making, which, uh, you would be genuinely shocked at how little of a contribution I actually think I'm making. I really don't think, I genuinely think it's like, we're making jokes. We're trying, like we're doing our thing. I'm not going to put any importance on it. I'm just going to say there's

a bit of a humanization hopefully that we're giving. So it was uncomfortable for me, but I was like, but it, you know, maybe it does like puts a more positive image for somebody, you know? No, I think that's exactly what it is. I mean, it's like when I see a great performance in anything and the actor just gives himself to it, you just go, well, that's a gift. And it doesn't matter if it's Meryl Streep and it's like their salaries, whatever.

Like it's still, they're giving themselves to the thing. And it's like, I don't know, when you pray on screen, it's like, it's exactly what you're saying. It's a gift to people to see that in that way and in an honest depiction. Yeah, and just like, this is what it is. This is what it looks like. These are all the things that surround it.

And it's not, you know, something, it's not what you might've thought it was, you know? So we're researching you the last couple of days now, and then it's like, you might have thought it was. So we're researching you the last couple days in the office. And then it's like you're married, but then it's like you're secretly married. And I know you're married, and we can cut this out if you want. But it's like, I know I met your wife. This is like, what is this charade? And then it's like he says in some interviews that he's married,

but then he doesn't say. I don't say it in any interview, of course. Yeah, very married. But you know what it is? It's really funny. I've seen those articles where it's like, Rami Youssef's secret marriage. It's a weird thing because it's like,

yeah, it's the best decision I've ever made in my life. And it's almost why I'm like, yeah, you know, it's the best decision I've ever made in my life. And it's almost why I'm like, yeah, you guys, you're not seeing her. You know, it's like, it's almost this thing of like, bring her to a red carpet, like bring her to a thing, like take a photo. And I'm like, she, she's not interested, honestly. She's just kind of like, she's like, that's your job. And then we have our life, you know? And it's like that kind of thing. Yeah. And, and I don't,'t you know i don't think it's really so funny that i saw that art i saw there's like a couple articles that are like and and the publications i read regularly all i know i know you're always on the sun

and um celebrity net worth dot net you know which is always very accurate underscore net yeah dot net you know that's where you go on and you're like they think I'm that poor yeah yeah yeah I have much more no it's not oh gosh but um yeah dude I am the best

I've known single Rami and I've known now I know married Rami yeah yeah and it's uh yeah it's exciting I'm thrilled

um you have a you and I have a thing in common which is we both appear to be calm on stage. Yeah. And Ira Glass was on this podcast for the 100th episode and he called me on it. He goes, you're not calm in real life.

So funny. And I'm going to similarly call you on you. My response to him was, I actually am calm on stage yeah but i'm not calm in life and that's that that can exist but what's your take on yourself because you're very relaxed like what like on stage and then in person like i move around a lot is that what it is you move around and you're like i would say off stage you're hyper focused oh interesting i think of you yeah yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And on stage, it's more just like,

what are we doing? What are we talking about? Yeah, I think it's why I like, well, it's funny, this hyper-focus thing is something that comes up. I'm never going to get tested for ADHD. Me neither. I'm never going to get tested for ADHD me neither I'm never going to do it I'm the same

I'm not it's like I'm not going to join am I I'm not going to join am I that's so offensive that's so offensive

how dare you I'm positive I am but I'm not speaking on behalf of the ADHD community I am not joining of which I'm not officially a part no I love you guys and I of which I'm not officially a part. No, I love you guys. And I'm probably one of you.

I'm not joining is so offensive. Is it? It might be. No, no, I'm just kidding. All love. What you're describing is exactly how I felt for so long, but I felt afraid to express it. I just refuse to be diagnosed. You know, like I don't want, I don't diagnosed. I'm sure it's freeing. I'm sure

a diagnosis would be freeing. I'm sure we all are to some degree. But the thing about being on stage is it's actually what we were talking about earlier with this gratitude for the audience and this respect for the audience. I get up there and I'm like, oh, all I have to think about is the thing that I'm... Stand-up for me is like, okay, I'm going to come on stage with something that I'm battling with. That's what's interesting to me. I'm battling with something. And I've figured out a way to make it funny before I have found the answer that I'm looking for. And I'm going to share essentially what is like a mid process with you.

And so I have respect for presenting that battle and then I have respect for you guys all put your shoes on you put your shoes on you came out to see me I don't give a fuck when someone's like I watched your show I hate it I'm like you didn't even put your shoes on you don't even like you don't even you're just sitting there you watch

you watch like 7 minutes and you're like you didn't put your shoes on. These people put their shoes on. They're here. They respect what I might do, you know? So I'm loose by that nature because I'm like, you already love me. You know what I mean? Like you're here.

Even if it's not my audience. I'm like, you want to love me. You showed up because you want to love me. This is great. You know what I mean? So it's like, I'm chill. Listen to this all day. Do I even have to talk? So I'm chill. I could listen to this all day. Do I even have to talk?

So I'm chill. I just want to listen to this. I was here. No, it's like, I'm chilling. Like, you already love me. You came, you're invested in loving me. I'm going to show you this thing I'm working on, but I'm chill. Yeah.

Off the stage, I don't know. Like, I'm like, this guy's trying to sell me something. I got a family member calling me. That's right. I'm talking about some random shit. Right. I'm like, listen,

I don't, I got to fill out a form for the city because I broke my fence. If I give you my like relaxed thing, I have this fear that you, you know, I'll never even, I'll never even leave the house.

You know what I mean? So it's like, I just got to like focus and do it. But you know, I'm working on being more present even when I'm not on stage. You know, but you are, I don't think focus and do it. But I'm working on being more present even when I'm not on stage. But I don't think you're not present. I think you're present.

I am, but I don't know. There's something, you know what I did do? A lot of people are doing this and I just jumped on it. But I went to upgrade my phone, my iPhone. And then while I was there, I bought a flip phone. So now- I'm doing the same thing? Yeah, it's the best.

Because I'm writing a movie right now. And I'm like, I can't have iPhone. iPhones and writing a movie do not coexist. You can't do it. So I just have flip, like, because it was this thing where I was like, wait, am I going to transition to flip phone? And then I was like, no, just I have flip phone days and then I have iPhone days. Yeah.

So much easier. So it's like, because I had this paranoia. I was leaving the house without my phone. And you know how it is. We'll find any excuse to not write. So I'd leave the house to write and then I'd be out. And then my mom was sick for a bit. And so I'd have this paranoia.

Because this one morning I woke up where I had 17 missed calls. And then anytime your phone is 17 missed calls from family, like something really bad happened. So I had this paranoia now to not have the phone because I'm like, well, what if family calls? So I have this phone, only five people have the number. Yeah. And that's it.

Yeah. So it's like, I don't have to worry about that. If someone was in trouble, they'd call the phone. Those are the five people I love and I don't love to worry about that. If someone was in trouble, they'd call the phone. Those are the five people I love, and I don't love those other 12 people. Well, the thing about the five people is they are attached to the other. They're attached to the other people. Finally, I cornered you.

You got me. That's what this podcast is all about. Corner me. It's all about who- You're not on the flip phone, bro. Who are the 12? Yeah, exactly. Who's on the flip? Who's on the flip?'re not on the flip phone Who were on the podcast about like, what your brain notices is what your comedy is, basically.

And it's like, what are you noticing now? Like, what is like burning in you? I'm noticing a lot of stuff in my relationship obviously you know it's like it's a new thing being in being married being in something like really being in a secret marriage you're not allowed to talk about being a secret marriage that um you know is he married.net is unaware of they don't have a photo um but i am going to talk about it in in in my next hour. So it will be very public.

Feelings part two. More feelings. That's I guess the name of the tour. I haven't really named the hour yet. But maybe it'll be the name of the hour. I like it. I like the continuity of it. I like the continuity of it.

And I think it expresses actually what stand-up comedy is in a certain way i appreciate that because you know what it is i always liked the title feelings because i i was actually battling with um i was battling with how much i like to do i like to talk about politics in my comedy but i don't want to have to speak about politics in any sort of eloquent, factual way. Factual way. I don't want to be held to any of that. And so what I realized was it's really all just my feelings.

So it's like there's nothing to be taken other than the fact that it is my feelings. And so I loved the title, and then I was just like, well, this is just more of that. I think that's really interesting because that's like my biggest gripe with comedy criticism currently is when people get upset about comedy. I'm always just like, yeah, it's just that person's feeling about the thing. I know.

It doesn't really matter. Yeah. It doesn't really matter. Yeah. Unless, I mean, without getting into the weeds on specific people, unless that person sways an entire generation to feel a certain way, but my inclination is that they were heading there. Yeah.

And it wasn't someone's joke about it. Yeah, I think, you I think my issue with, I would say most artistic criticism is the responsibility that's being put on the art to be, we've kind of done this thing where we're asking artists and art to do what leadership in government doesn't do. And so there's this kind of weird thing that's just like, we won't even write a press article about a lying politician anymore, but we'll write it more

about someone we perceive to be like a lying comedian. You know, it's like the things are like flipped. It's like, wait, wait, you know,'re used to politicians doing this, this, and this, but you're a comedian. You're supposed to be a voice for truth. Dude, we don't finish college. Dude, we don't finish college. We don't finish college. I had someone be like, dude, you miss...

Look, I'm also learning a lesson, though, from critiques I've gotten. Like, again, I'll talk about politics in a funny way in my standup. I'm not going to talk about anything that political on interviews anymore because I'm like, you know what? Like someone would be like, you said this thing and it wasn't right. And I'm like, you're right. It wasn't right. Yeah.

I was wrong. And maybe I either should say less or be really clear about like, I actually don't know what the fuck I'm talking about. So I'm very, you know, open to that. So I like criticism in a sense because it'll either teach me or it'll guide me to a certain way to be like closer to myself or closer to what I'm actually trying to say. The only type of criticism I don't like is just that it has this extra tinge of like, you have failed society by doing such, which is like, that's not true

because you know what? There's so much fucking content. Like we're all fighting to get anyone to watch what we're making anyway. So it's not like we're not in the era anymore where it was like Cosby and more black kids went to college because they watched the Cosby show.

That's over. That was like, there were nine channels or however many there were, even if there were 20 or 30 channels, you were going to watch something that was on TV. It doesn't work that way anymore. Like my show doesn't speak to people who don't know anything about Islam or who hated Islam and then watch it. No, it speaks to people who are open-minded. Maybe they don't know, but for the the most part like we're all like kind of preaching to our choir because there's so much content like they're just gonna go where they feel like they want to be right so my job always feels like what nuance could I provide to my own choir so it's like here's my audience but I'm gonna challenge them but I don't think I'm like pulling over

that many people who who hate the idea of what I do. Right, right, right. The thing that I find interesting about your show and your act in relationship to Islam and like, you know, because is that most comedians are either agnostic or atheist or some variation on lapsed Catholic. In my case, kind of lapsed Catholic. Yeah. And so it's like you pray, you practice,

and you're open about kind of talking about it. Do you ever feel like there's a line you can't cross? Because I feel like so much of what we do as comedians is just cross lines, cross lines, cross lines, or go really close to the line. Yeah, I mean, it's kind of an easy one it's like i don't make fun of religion i kind of make fun of myself within it yeah uh for two reasons one is like the critiques of of like religious culture are all very valid yeah

um and they're out there yeah uh and the other thing is it's kind of hacky like it's like actually to make fun of religion actually Like it's like actually like... To make fun of religion. Yeah, it's like actually like just from a pure comedy perspective, to make fun of religion is very like, it's like, okay, that's like what everybody does. You believe in a magical person in the sky or whatever. We've heard that a hundred times.

We've heard it a hundred times. You know what I mean? It's like it's actually a hacky joke. But it is a line for me in the sense that I'm like, yeah, I'm not, that's not, it's just not interesting to me. And I think my biggest comedic line became at some point, I don't even remember the joke because it was so inconsequential. I just remember the show I once had at this bar show in Brooklyn

where all day I had this idea for a joke. I wish I could remember it, but I remember being like, oh man, I think this is going to be funny. And then I went up and it so didn't hit and then on the ride home and this was the time when I used to ride home to Jersey you know I was using my mom's car so I'd be in the car

driving back to Jersey those drives were the best cause I'd think so much you know cause there's something about like paying to go through the Lincoln Tunnel where like you really feel like this set better be worth it you know like I went through the Lincoln tunnel and I'm driving back and I'm like man I don't even care about what I said I just said it because I thought it would be funny yeah so the biggest line for me is like

if I don't care at on some level about what I'm and it could be silly yeah it has to hit something that I feel about the human condition in some level. And if it doesn't, and I just said it because I thought it would be funnier, I thought it would be clever. That's my line. Like, I can't do that. Because I need to feel like if I don't get a laugh, I still have like my dignity. When you, like you have such, your style is like laid back. Is that from people you know growing up or comedians you watched

it's interesting because i actually like now that i'm getting into my making my second special i i couldn't watch the whole thing i don't know how you feel i can't really watch my old stuff but i watch it's hard yeah it's hard hard. I watched some stuff from my first special. And the way I'm doing it now is totally, like, it's obviously totally still me, but it's like, I think I'm way more comfortable. So for me, sometimes stillness, you know, and this actually goes back to your earlier question. Sometimes it's like, when I'm nervous, I actually seem really calm. And so when I was younger, I would always get this where people would be like, dude,

you're so chill. And I'd be like, really? Like, I was actually pretty nervous. Like, I can't believe like you thought I was that chill. When I'm really comfortable, I'm calm, but I move more, you know? And so what I've noticed is, cause I filmed myself, um, a bit, you know, as I've been on the road, I was like, Oh, I'm moving more. Like, I feel like I actually look more like myself, you know? So in my first special, my first special is totally me. Like, it's like, it's not, you know, but, but I do think, um, and I think I was in the round and I was kind of like focusing on moving in a different way. But, uh, yeah, I'm like really excited to shoot my second one

because it's a bit, it feels a bit more like myself, I guess. Who did you, like who's the first standup you ever saw live? Oh, that's a good question. So I used to go, I'm trying to, I remember the first standup I obsessed over watching, which was Carlin. That was like my, that was like everything me and my uncle obsessively way before I should have you know that like like 10 years old or something

literally 10 years old I'm watching Carlin yeah with my uncle and and that was where and my uncle kind of talks like Carlin like he's really my uncle talks in premises yeah he's really funny like he hit me with this with this like like he'll say stuff that I'm just dying like he goes like Carlin. Like he's really, my uncle talks in premises. He's really funny. Like he hit me with this, with this like, like he'll say stuff that I'm just dying. Like he goes, what's up with Donald Trump's son?

Just, has he been 13 the whole time? He's like, it's so funny. Like he literally goes, the kid has never aged. Isn't that the funniest premise? Isn't that the funniest premise? He literally goes, the kid has never aged. Isn't that the funniest premise? Isn't that the funniest premise?

He literally goes, the kid has never aged, and I died. And I was like, yeah, I don't think I've ever heard a different age on him. Like, I know he's gotten older. Like, it's like, you know what I'm saying? So it's like. We're talking about Baron, right? Dude, yes. Yeah, yeah.

Yes. That's so funny. His young son, like, he like he's like right he's not right because he's probably in college he's probably 18 but he's like as far as we know that's so funny no no it's got nothing to do with the kids intelligence it's like about insulting the joke is is about reporting. He's literally like, the kid's just been 13 the whole term. And it just,

it made me laugh so much. Are you doing this on stage? No, I never have. Oh, you should do this. You should do this. I think potentially you should just, and I don't even know

where you go with it because it's so funny on its own. It's so funny. But it is one of those things where like, sometimes in life we are out, as comedians, we're outdone by people who are non comedians in our lives. They're just, that's so funny. No, no. But like when my, when I walk into a room with my

uncles, they're like, I'm a fraud. Cause they're like, we're funnier than you. Like they know it. They're like, whatever you're doing out there, like you're just, it's our energy. You know? That's so funny. You know what I mean? Like they're just like, so, so they,

I mean, they're so funny, dude. Like, I love that. My uncles and my mom in a room. I have a lot of, I have a bunch of uncles,

but the uncles I grew up with are two, you know, who were, lived in New York. Everyone else lives overseas. Yeah. Between Egypt and Switzerland. We have like our family there. But they're so funny.

So he talks like Carlin. And like, you know, so his style is really ripped from Carlin. You know, my style is obviously nothing like Carlin or my uncle's. But live, so I lived in Jersey until I moved to LA when I was 20 so when I was like 17 I used to take my mom's car I'd go to UCB back when it was back under Aristides

and I'd go see Whiplash on 26th street yeah so in my mind I feel like the first comic I ever saw live that I was like holy shit stand up comic was Sean Patton I remember going to see Patton hosting Whiplash at some point and I was just like

this guy is so fucking funny and to this day he's one of my favorite comics he just made everything funny in this way that kind of blew my mind I got to do it right before UCB shut down UCB Chelsea yeah which I don't know what year that was might have been 17 or something or 18 I just

remember doing whiplash there and was one of the last like two three shows oh wow and it it like filled something in my heart where I was like oh my god like when I used to go at 17 or 18 I didn't even think I would do standup. Yeah. Because at that point I was writing things and shooting sketches and doing that kind of thing. I kind of thought, you know, so standup looked like a pure magic trick to me.

Yeah. I was like, I don't know how anyone does that. Do you still have the, are you doing the bit that we talked about on the podcast a few years ago about your dad and therapy? It's so interesting. I've lately been wondering if it's going to stay in the special. I think it's so funny.

I know. It really makes me laugh. Yeah. It makes me laugh, but I'm having this hard time. I was like, I think I need to clarify what I'm trying to say about my dad. Say it again in case people didn't hear it. So I had this bit about just like my dad. It's kind of, it's such a long bit now, but the essence of the bit is, you know, he's basically like, you know, why are you seeing a therapist?

You know, like you you seeing a therapist? You're paying a guy to talk. Pay me, talk to me. And I'm like, well, that doesn't work. I'm talking to him because of you. That exchange doesn't work. And then he started crying. It was the first time I ever seen him crying in my life.

Not because of anything he did, but because he created an expense. He couldn't believe they did that. But the funny thing about it is I know the money part rubs him, but the thing is, is like, he actually is really emotionally open. So I started to have this thing where I was like, I know my dad thinks it's weird. I pay for therapy, but ultimately it doesn't really bother him. But it's funny on stage, but there was this part of me that was like, I needed to lead to something else i'm saying oh interesting so you think okay so you think it needs to lead to a larger point yeah or something like more i guess more sincere about him because i want him to see it and like love it oh interesting you know like i want him to i don't want to i feel that's a question by the way i get from young comedians all the time, which is basically like, what do I do when I want to talk about my family

and this person and my wife and my husband or whatever? And I want to be honest, but also respectful. I always say it's just like, you have to navigate that. That's the good luck. That's our whole lives. No, I heard Mike answer this question in person. He said, fuck them. That's true. Once. No, I heard Mike answer this question in person and he said, fuck them. Like I remember I was at the cellar.

Once, once. Man, fuck those people. No, no, it was an isolated incident. I was sued. It was a civil suit I lost. I heard you say, fuck them. I'm being forced to sell my car. Dude, it happens. It happens.

It happens. No, no, we all know it happens um no so yeah we're constantly working like my first stand-up hour and my first season of my show yeah my parents had never seen me do stand-up other than five minutes on cold bear oh my god i kept everything from them wow because i was i respect what they think so much yeah i didn't want to hurt their feelings and I knew if they were uncomfortable with anything that I was saying I would probably change it so I was like let me just do this without showing them

it was one of those things like it's better to just ask for forgiveness later than I mean I always say the analogy for me is it's stripping it's being a stripper being a comedian and. Being a comedian. You don't want to invite your friends

to your first 10 times being a stripper. But you want them there the 12th time you strip. 12th or 13th time you're ready. Once you've picked your song. You've got your song. You've got to have a song that really works for you. You've got the right song, the right thong,

everything, you're ready. You've got the right nice outfit. There's some kind of energy that happens. You got the right song, the right thong, the right everything. You're ready. You got the right nice outfit and there's some kind of energy that happens. You got to flow with the DJ. Very important. You know, yeah. Oh, are you doing

the Jacksonville story on stage these days? Where the woman said about Islam, we don't do that here? No, you're like reminding me of a lot of my bits. No. We talked about it

on the podcast last time. Because I said to you, so last time I was on the podcast, we were talking about Jacksonville because actually... This was like COVID, huh? Yeah. I remember I was in my parents' basement. You were, yeah. You're like, oh yeah, we have the footage.

I remember it really well. We have the footage. No, because I'm doing Jacksonville in the winter. Oh, yeah. And the thing I always remember about Jacksonville is that it's religious. Like, it's the only place I've ever gotten complaints. Yeah. Like, legitimate complaints.

Like, people going on Ticketmaster being like, I really wish that he hadn't said this about Jesus. You know what I mean? Like, all right. I'm sorry. But it's like me. Right. It's you.

Yeah, I wish you hadn't said that. But then you said that your Jacksonville story was that a woman came up to you and basically said about it, of Islam, we don't do that here. Yeah, honey, we don't do that here. But she said it like, yeah, the air wasn't conducive for Muslim life forms. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We just wish we could. We can't grow it.

I think put that in too. That was the same show. I don't know if I told you this part part but I was wearing this shirt that kind of had like an abstract looking rainbow on it did I tell you this part? this other woman comes up to me after the show and she's so

she loved the show and she grabs me by the arm and she goes thank you for wearing that shirt we're taking the rainbow back like that I She goes, thank you for wearing that shirt. We're taking the rainbow back. Like that I, you know, said I like women. And she was just like, you are bringing, like there's a fight for the rainbow.

From pride? Yeah. And it was, yeah. Who is taking it back? Me and her. In her mind. You and her are taking the rainbow back because you're wearing a rainbow on your shirt from Pride. In her mind, we had formed this alliance to take the rainbow back.

And the shirt was like kind of an abstract rainbow. It took me a really long time to understand what was happening. Taking that back. Yeah. Jacksonville. There's a reason Cat Williams opens with 25 minutes on Jacksonville in a special. It's a wild place.

I want to do a slow round question, which is what's a song that makes you cry? This is going to be embarrassing, but no, it's not embarrassing. I own it. Any of Death Cab for Cuties albums get me into it, dude. Like pop on pretty much any of them. I'm back in my 13-year-old emo New Jersey fall jacket.

Leaves are falling. Girl didn't talk to me. Pop on death cab, get home early, otherwise I'll get yelled at. I get that. I'm in. Like, it transports me. Yeah. Yeah. That whole Zach Braff, Garden State soundtrack has that kind of energy to it.

Yeah. Yeah. That vibe, it's New Jersey. You know what I mean? It's just New Jersey stuff. And that's something, yeah, that as an adult,

I've been told many times, turn off your New Jersey music. I'm trying to think of a specific Death Cab song. I mean, where do you want it? Well, the Transatlanticism album is amazing. And there's the track,

Transatlanticism. I'm about to listen to it right now when I leave here. Oh, wow. Just because it's now in my mind. I haven't listened to it probably for a couple years because I don't want to cry. But after this podcast, I'm going to want to cry. Okay. Should I just run out now just so I can have an experience for the story? Just like now.

Do you remember an inauthentic version of yourself? What was like the least Rami Rami there ever was? Like what age? I would say 20 to 26. There was like this six year period where it was like I moved to LA. You know, when you're inauthentic, you're not inauthentic all the time. It's like you're just like, I think I was just so afraid and kind of like ill-equipped to deal with life.

Because, you know, I was living at home, and then all of a sudden I moved to LA for a job. I had never lived on my own. Like I literally, it sounds so stupid, but you know, when you're like 19, 20, if you've lived at home, you didn't go away to college and do anything. Like I had never really done like my own supermarket shopping by myself, you know? And so I was really, yeah, I really was like, not myself. Like, I think I was, I was scared and I was, you know, it's funny, even when you're being inauthentic, you are being who you are when you are,

you're being your lower self. Yeah. So there's actually something authentic about your, you know, you're just being your lower self. And so it's like, I was my lower self for more than I'd like for that early 20s, you know? And then I think towards the end of my 20s, I started to be like, oh wait, I could balance this out. That part of me is not all who I am. I could actually maybe be

better. We were literally talking about this in the studio today about how if you have a sense of humor about yourself, in some ways, it's a huge strength because you're admitting that sometimes you're a zero. Yes. And sometimes you're a 10. Exactly. And sometimes you're any number in between. Yeah. But like all those things can be true.

Yeah. And it's like, yeah, you're inauthentic version of yourself. I think for me, it's like 16 through 25 kind of thing. Like I was just like intermittently a zero. Yeah, yeah. Like I look just like intermittently a zero. Yeah, yeah. Like I look back and like, so it's so embarrassing. But, and that guy shows up sometimes if you're like really hungry or you're in traffic

or like you're under slept or like whatever. That guy shows up and he's late. He shows up. But like, I've learned to like love that part of myself genuinely because I'm like, oh, I'm so glad to know you exist because you definitely allow me to appreciate when I'm not being you. It's like to not have to be in that mood all the time makes the other parts feel like a really sunny day. It's really sweet.

You don't know a sunny day if it didn't rain. So it's just... You literally, you and I had a text exchange when I was in London because you were like, how's London? And I was like, I'm depressed. I'm away from my family. It's really hard.

And you were like, it's good for you because the contrast and the experience of going through it will make you savor it when you come back. Contrast has just been my favorite thing to think about lately. It's like some really, you know, things happening in the world really mess, and you're like, all right, like that means something at some point

is going to feel really sweet, hopefully. Yeah. You know, like it's, there has to be contrast. The equal and opposite will exist also I'm going to get to some material these are just things I wrote in the notebook. And if you have stuff that you wrote down in your notebook, feel free to throw it out. I wrote this down this week.

This, I think, has a shot, which is I was at a cafe and I had to use their bathroom. And my problem with using the bathroom key at a cafe is that there's a 99% chance it was just touched by someone who just used the bathroom. at a cafe is that there's a 99% chance it was just touched by someone who just used the bathroom. If someone said

to me, like, here, hold this big hunk of wood that moments ago was held by someone who went to the bathroom and then wiped their ass, I would say, no thank you this proposition. That's really funny. And somehow we're like, give me the key.

Give me the key. Because you've got gotta go so bad that's really funny I thought that was worth it it also reminds me of I realized that I sometimes you go to the bathroom you gotta poop in public

which is obviously a very difficult position to ever be in but I check if there's four stalls I'm looking at each one and essentially like what I'm trying to gauge is like, which one will allow me to most successfully pretend I'm the first person to use it today. Like, that's what I'm looking for. Like I'm looking for one that's so pristine that I can be like, they just cleaned this, you know, like it didn't, it did nothing's happened here yet. You know, like it didn't, nothing's happened here yet. You know, like that's what I'm looking for.

Wait, so talk me through the logic again. Yeah. So when you walk in, you see four stalls, you open each? I open each one and I'm looking for the one that just looks so fresh that I could convince myself. It's a lie. I'm the first one to use it. Yeah, we're all lying to ourselves about these bathrooms. You're always lying.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. But I mean, it's just, I need that lie. It's like this fairy tale about the public restrooms that no one has used it today. No, like I've created the dude who just left. Like I heard a sound of some wheels. I'm like, oh, that was probably just his cart he just left.

And like, he just mopped it. You know, like I'll do it every day. And then I still go in and I like wipe it down a little bit. Oh my gosh, yes. Yeah, I've definitely cleaned public toilets. Like for myself, but also to pay it forward a little bit. I think that it's like an undiscussed truism of society that we're all kind of wiping down public toilets all the time.

Like it's part of our day somehow. Of course, of course. And it's not fair and it feels but there's a relationship to bacteria that i think as a new yorker you have so uniquely like and i think it's why egyptians are so comfortable in in in new york because you have the same agreement in cairo like there are these really densely populated city places where the way you deal with bacteria and just keep rolling with it

is so much different than other places. I was in Houston for a little bit and I'm just like, I actually don't have to touch anything. I don't have to touch. I don't, I just get in the car. The traffic's never really that bad. I could just like, if I need to poop, I could probably go poop at where I'm staying and like not deal with any like like really like but being in new

york it's just like you make a deal because you know you're gonna be on the subway you're gonna move around you're just gonna do whatever you're gonna come home you don't always take your pants off before you go to bed you don't know like or sit on the bed or it's just everywhere right you know it really is so we're absolutely right We're just coping with, you know. So why do we do it? I don't, I think just from like movies in the 70s. Like all these movies just like, I think it was just like New York streets like shot on like beautiful film. Right.

Like I think that's why we're here. We're here because of Scorsese and Cassavetes. Yeah. Yeah. And Nora Ephron somehow. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, no, it's crazy.

No, it's truly crazy. It doesn't make sense. Yeah. It's like... It makes no sense. It makes no sense. You have like a street with like nine trees on it and you're like, oh my God, I'm in the jungle. You know, like this is... Gorgeous. Beautiful know literally yeah is this a rainforest you're like bro this is fucking nine trees like what the hell

just go like just go to jersey um do you have anything you're working on oh this is like a hat this is like only for this is a joke for you okay it's actually i like it because we live two blocks away from each other. I guess there's just this thing about being like living in Brooklyn and the energy that is here and you go to coffee shops that like when I go to the Home Depot that's over here, I'm shocked at like the men being men. Like it's so like, like I walk into that Home Depot and all of a sudden I'm like do I need a gun like do I need to own a gun

and I can't believe it's this close because everyone at the coffee shop I go to is trans so I'm just like they don't how do these people how is everyone 15 minutes within each other it's a small place yeah and I go to Home Depot and I'm like is this allowed can you be like this

New York City is a wild landscape of a lot of different types of people living in an extraordinarily tight space. Yeah. It's why I love it. I think it's why, you know, this goes back to our New York conversation earlier. Yeah, it's the reason why people are here. It is why people are here. People like the fact that it's an absurdly

diverse population. It's why you bring up the amount of people who I deal with in the neighborhood who are different race, who are trans, who are different language, who do all these things. You have people who will be saying

hateful things, this and that. I'm like, well, you've never met them. I live in New York and I've met everybody like I've actually met everybody because I live in New York and it makes it so much harder to have a non-human opinion of anybody you're like no

I have real connections with anyone who you think is just like a political point I guess that's why I like being here outside of the 70s. I think that's why people raise children here too. You want your kid to see everything and do everything. Yeah, because otherwise you end up like you were saying earlier, you end up seeing depictions of things in film and TV.

That's it. Not actually what it's like. How old will you wait for your daughter to be to let her go on the subway? Oh, on her own? Yeah. Yeah, like 25. I'm just being honest with you, Rami. These are my feelings.

25 years old. This is my special. It's called feelings. 25 years old. It's like feelings. You're 25 years old. It's like, yeah, I grew up in New York. I have a very, you know, like you're the most, you're actually the most Arab dad I've ever met. Ask Jenny.

Jenny will be like 30. Dude, that should be the name of your special. Mike Birbiglia, Arab dad. You're the Arab dad. You're the Arab dad. You know how fast my career would end if I called my special The Arab Dad?

Just tell people I said it was okay. I'm like trying to tank you. Produced by Rami Youssef and it's like over the title in 40 font. It's much bigger

than my name. You're like, dude, you know, you said I could call it Arab Dad. You want to produce it so people know? I'd be like, nah, dude, it's okay. Just tell people I said you could. You're like, dude, you're like dude you know you said uh i could call it air dad you want to produce it so people know i'll be like no dude just it's okay just tell people i said you could like dude you're

trying to you're trying to tank me you know no all right what do we got i don't know what else i got man oh i was like this is like a um i was trying to figure out what i was afraid of with ai um and it's not like it's like i, I know I can write, you know, like, so I'm not even, like, I just have this fear that conservatives will get, like, really good at making movies. Oh, my God. That's so funny. Because it's, like, up until now, like, for whatever,

you know, like, for whatever you know like for whatever reason like like right for up until now only liberals only liberals could finish the script seem to be able they just seem to be able to finish scripts yeah like lmb go work but then so because it's like um yeah like this country you know broke back mountain changed this country's view uh of you know, gay people in a really meaningful way, right? Where people were like, thought they were seeing a Western. And then they were like, oh, wait, like I just saw this relationship. So I was just like, you know, that's like, that's because Jake Gyllenhaal loved that script. And so I could be like, what if Gyllenhaal like, just, what if you can get him to love a script that you wouldn't want him to love?

And then he's just playing this like ice agent, you know, and you're just like, and he's so good that you wouldn't want him to love. And then he's just playing this like ice agent, you know, and you're just like, and he's so good that you're like, yeah, maybe everyone should stay where they were born. Oh my God. That's a great concept. Well, I think that's the unspoken about the like liberals and Hollywood is like, no, no, those are the people who've done well.

Like it's not, there's not some thing where it's like, if a conservative moved to Hollywood and wrote Good Will Hunting, people wouldn't be like, I don't know, he is a Republican. No, exactly. No way. Exactly.

It's just not how it is. Hollywood is very capitalistic. Of course. People want- No, if it makes the money, we'll do it. People want to make a lot of money in that town. It's part of the reason why I don't live there. No, it's like, you feel it when you're there.

And that's why I've always felt, yeah, it's like, that's why I guess what was, you know, the empathy you need to understand human beings to write a script that pops usually will then lead you to probably disassemble whatever political view you think is like so strong. And then I think it kind of ends up having someone be like, well, yeah, let's just let everyone do what they want.

And they end up being liberal, like for the most part. But then AI comes in and now it's just like, hey, write me. Well, then it's like, well, write a movie in the spirit of James Cameron, except the people. The people are people they are getting rid of the abortion clinic

that's right and then the script is good and people are like it's good you're on board you get these great actors and all of a sudden you're like who's to say when a life starts who's to say please don't excerpt this out of context.

Hold on. Let me see if I have anything else that is... Oh, I have something in the hardware thing, which is Jenny and I have increasingly realized as adults that we just don't know anything. Like, we don't know about plumbing.

We don't know anything. Like, we don't know about plumbing. We don't know about, you know. And we're, like, we don't understand heat. We don't understand plumbing. We don't understand electric. And I feel like at this point, we're currently looking for a throuple. Yeah. We're going to technical colleges.

We're sitting, like, is there anybody who could complete? We're looking to technical colleges is there anybody who could complete we're looking to fill some holes in the lineup or it's like we both realized we need a husband we do we both realized we recently realized that we need a husband

we need a husband that's very funny I like that a lot that's a really good tag we need a husband. That's what it is. Yeah. Oh my gosh.

Do you ever have a realization? Do you ever see yourself from your wife's eyes and go like, ooh, she got a doozy? Yeah. Oh my God. Yeah, especially when it comes to certain things like that where it's like you know stuff would happen when i was a kid and my dad just like pulls out the toolbox oh that was good yeah there was

one time something was going on i didn't even know what could be done but i was like all right maybe if there's a toolbox in front of me i'm gonna improvise something right because i have that kind of belief in myself like i don't know what's going on i just put the tools in front of me yeah maybe i'll make something happen. But then I, and then, but then I had to like, ask my wife where the toolbox was.

Yeah. Yeah. Cause I don't know. She knows she uses it. I don't. She's like really handy. Her dad is an engineer. Oh wow.

So it's like, she, yeah, I was really embarrassed. I was like, where's the tools? And then she was like, what do you,

I could see it in her eyes. She was like, what are you even going to do with them? It was like, why are you tools? And then she was like, what do you... I could see it in her eyes. She was like, what are you even going to do with them? It was like, why are you asking to just learn about the house and where things are? Because you're not going to use them. Our wives both need a

husband. They need a husband. Yeah. We should get a guy for both of us. We live close enough to each other. Oh, yeah. That's a great idea. Let's see. I'm literally thinking, oh, that's really smart.

Just have a dude. The final thing we do is working it out for a cause. And if there's a nonprofit that you think is doing a good job, I'll contribute to them. We'll link to them in the show notes. Oh, amazing. I did a charity show with the, they're called the Karim Foundation, and they are giving like the best on the ground aid for everyone in Turkey and in Syria that were affected by the floods and the earthquakes.

That's great. Which to me is just like, it's like a climate charity in the sense that it's, you know, they're so affected by what's been going on there. Okay. So yeah, they're doing some shows with them. Karamfoundation.org. K-A-R-A-Mfoundation.org.

We'll contribute to them. We'll link to them in the show notes. We'll encourage others to contribute as well. Rami, thanks for coming on the show. You're the best. So fun doing it in person, man. It's the best. This is my first handshake across the table.

Really? Yeah, I think so. Because it felt like you were going for it at first. That's how I felt compelled to touch you. But I've never had that. This is nice. This isn't even really a handshake. Your hand is so much bigger than mine actually

it's really weird no it's okay what I'll say is this you are when I think of you when I think of you it makes me feel warm because I think that you're funny

in your bones and you're funny in a way that it just makes me feel warm because I think that you're funny in your bones and you're funny in a way that is like, it just makes me happy. Now we're bone to bone right here. Now we're bone to bone. I'm touching your knuckle right here. Yeah, I like that. Come on. Come on.

Working it out because it's not done. Working it out because there's no hope. That's going to do it for another episode of Working It Out. I always love talking to Rami Youssef. He is on tour doing stand-up. Pittsburgh, Vancouver, Calgary, Philly, Stanford, D.C. Again, you can follow him on Instagram, at Rami, R-A-M-Y.

And you can get the full video of this interview on my YouTube page, which is at Mike Birbiglia. Check that out and subscribe because we're going to be posting more and more videos of these episodes. Don't miss that. Join my mailing list at birbiglia.com. Our producers of Working It Out are myself,

along with Peter Salamone and Joseph Birbiglia, associate producer Mabel Lewis, consulting producer Seth Barish, assistant producer Gary Simons, sound mix by Ben Cruz, supervising engineer Kate Balinski. Special thanks to Marissa Hurwitz and Josh Upfall, as well as David Raphael and Nina Quick.

As always, my consigliere, Mike Berkowitz, and Jack Antonoff and Bleachers for their music. Special thanks to my wife, the poet J-Hope Stein. Special thanks, as always, to my daughter, the poet J-Hope Stein. Special thanks as always to my daughter Una who built the original radio fort made of pillows. Thanks most of all to you

who are listening. If you enjoy the show, please rate it and review it on Apple Podcasts. It helps us so much. It helps us reach other people who don't know about the show. We have so many people

who say, I didn't even know you had a podcast. I've watched all your specials. I've many people who say, I didn't even know you had a podcast. I've listened, I've watched all your specials. I've listened to your albums and even though you had a podcast. So here it is. Tell your friends, tell your enemies, maybe you run into your enemy at a Home Depot. Maybe you're picking up some tools for your significant other to fix something around the house and you run into your enemy and you say, hey, while you're looking at those wrenches, maybe consider this podcast that I enjoy called Working It Out. And then they'll like it. And then maybe you'll both enjoy one of those hot dogs they have outside the Home Depot where they sell the hot dogs. Anyway, thanks for being here. I'll see you next time.