Mike Birbiglia's Working It Out - 30. Nikki Glaser: The Taylor Swift of Comedy

Episode Date: February 8, 2021

Prolific, raw, and hilarious comic Nikki Glaser shares childhood memories of her mom in the Slow Round that she’s not yet willing to tell on stage but is willing to say on a podcast. Nikki and Mike both admit that their level of honesty with even their own diaries doesn’t hit 100%. Nikki declares herself the Taylor Swift of comedy and Mike declares himself the Springsteen. This episode is raw and honest and funny. https://www.strayrescue.org/

Hey everybody, it's Mike. We are back with another episode of Working It Out with the great Nikki Glaser. I want to plug one thing before we begin. Next weekend for Valentine's Day, I'm doing six live virtual shows, Nowhere Comedy Club tickets at berbigs.com. Thursday, Friday, to Saturday, to Sunday.

The Sunday Late Show has special guest Maria Bamford. And all of the proceeds, 100% of the proceeds, go to food banks. And so get tickets at berbigs.com. Today on the show, we have Nikki Glaser. Nikki is one of the funniest people on the planet. She's the star of countless comedy specials of her own, including her recent one, which is called Bangin', which is hilarious.

Her Instagram, at Nikki Glaser, says, on tour constantly when there's no pandemic, host of a new daily podcast soon to be announced she is an amazing uh radio and podcast host uh i should warn you sensitive topics she's raw if you don't know nikki's comedy she's in the roasts and she's she you know she really uh goes at topics hard and fearlessly. She talks about sex and abuse and suicide and things that you might not want to hear about today. And if not, maybe this is not the one for you. But I think ultimately,

really productive conversation and really funny. I think she's so good at turning things that are very dark into things that are very dark into things that are very funny and productive and beautiful. So enjoy my conversation with the great Nikki Glazer. You know, people always ask me, do you need to do any rituals before you go on stage and center yourself? And I can just easily transition between a conversation backstage and be like, hold that thought, walk right on. Because I don't need to go, okay, who am I going to be out there? I don't need to memorize anything.

I just go out and I talk. And of course the jokes are memorized, but they're only jokes that I memorize because I said them once in the way that I talk and then I go, oh, that works. I have a really good memory for how I've said things. Yeah, I really try to make it

conversational and I want to be who I am on stage, off stage, because, and I get that all the time of people being like, you're just the same. Like, I watched you on the History of Swear Words, and you're the same person. I was like, why aren't more people doing that? But it bugs me, man. Like, I have some friends.

Good friends who I'm hanging out with, and then they go on stage, and I go, what is this Larry the Cable Guy bullshit? You're like, this is a character character and you're acting like it's you and I just, I don't, I can't. It's hard for me to watch those people perform.

This is the subtweet of podcast episodes. I know. Because we're not going to say names. No. But it is annoying. They know who they are. They know who they are

and there's something about it. And I would chalk it up to partly that you're not only a great comedian, but you're a great touring road comedian. And you've performed in probably hundreds of cities. Yeah. And I think a lot of it, and you and I share that in common. We've spent a lot of time on the road. A lot of it is you're in a green room that's basically like a closet often right you know there's people there's waiters coming by you with like nachos and hot plates and then

they're like and now Nikki Glaser and you walk up and then that's the show and it's like there actually isn't much of a difference between being on and off stage yeah that's that's a good point you're literally just a doorway away from you know what zany's did you see that truck that hit zany's in nashville yeah a semi truck drove through the wall you know like when you've been to zany's you know when you walk from the green room to the stage that that path it just missed the green room unfortunately that thing needs to be redone. But it just plowed through that little short path that you have to get your character together. It's been demolished.

That is a crazy story I had not heard. Yeah. My God. I have a funny memory from that zany comedy club in Nashville, which is being on stage and performing and looking in the back of the room and seeing Robin Williams. And I was like, huh, it's Robin Williams. What's he doing here?

And then I do the show, and I go backstage, and Robin comes backstage in that little room that you're talking about, that guy right next to where they crash into. And he was like i you know i was in town i'm in town doing a movie and you know i saw your plan so i mean he has an irish accent for some reason in my impression that actually worked for me i thought that was a good i saw your plan i saw your plan and uh yeah just come by and and like he and then apparently like paid paid admission oh my they were, no, you don't have to pay.

He was like, no, no, no, I pay, I pay. He paid just because he thought he might have stolen a joke from you at one point. He used to do that to everyone. Oh, I know. He's famous for paying for jokes. But you know what he always used to say is, he'd be like, I paid 10 times for the same joke, different people. Yeah, yeah.

And he would pay people not even knowing if he did or not. Yeah. He was a sponge of a guy. Well, he was honest. I mean, that's honest. Yeah. Just this denial of being a sponge. People who sponge accidentally.

I've done it myself where I see something, don't realize that I've seen it. Then I say something on stage and it comes out and I go, that isn't me. But like, I don't know who it was, but I'm going to keep saying it because it was funny until I, I can't trace it. And I have this inkling, like, is that someone else's? So I call people and I ask around and then, you know, Allie Wong watches you one time and she goes, I have that exact joke. And I go, yes, that's it. I'm sorry. I saw you and that stuck in my head and I said it. And then you put it in your special before she can get to it again. No, I'm just kidding. Dave Attell is sort of famous for

calling comedians and just being like, hey, do you have a joke about this? And then he'll say the joke. But then someone recently said to me, I thought a very astute thing, which is, he's just making an excuse to run jokes by you. Yes, yes. Like it never, it's never a phone call where you go,

yeah, that is my joke. It's always just like, he's just running jokes. We do this thing on the show called the slow round. And it's basically like thoughts, smells you remember from childhood, things like that. Do you have a memory from childhood that you always think of? And this is the key thing. That isn't a story. But it's just like a thing where you go, oh, yeah.

Yes. You know, and I've been revisiting a lot of this because I just switched therapists. So you know how you have to do like your one-man show essentially and like tell them from, you know, a very young age. Bring them up to speed. Yeah. Yeah. And so I just started dating this new therapist and we had our first get to know you. And the one story that I've never done anything with it, but,

and my mom hates the story, but it is true. I, one of my young, my youngest memories is being in a fight with my mom during the day. I was probably three or four and I was throwing a tantrum and I ran out into the front yard and I'm screaming, probably about to run away from home because she won't let me have some kind of tantrum. And I just turned to her and I go, Mom, I hate you. And she goes, well, you know what, Nick? I hate you too. And I remember thinking, you can't say that to me. That's not allowed.

Oh, that's great. You can't say that. She broke the matrix. Yeah. It blew. I remember everything froze. And I was like, and I think I believed it. And I think she might have in that moment, like, actually hated me.

And resented my existence. Wow. But it really stuck with me. And I was always like, my mom hates me. And she just said it in a moment of, like, anger. But I also, I was also like, you know, come up with your, you're kind of a hack.

She just threw it back at me. Like, come up with your own insult. But that really stands out to me of her saying that. And just parents aren't allowed to say that. There's certain things you're not allowed to say as a parent like um and they can actually they they can't say it back that is always one of the reasons why i never wanted to have a child was that i have almost an identical memory to yours which is i was probably 14 15 years old i got in a fight with my mom and i was just like i hate you and i i can't

let it go because i think like these you know my my mom and dad like worked so hard their whole lives to give me like everything that their life afforded and then when they're when you know when your kid grows up and is 15 he's like i mean i hate you it's like i'm like that's like a ponzi scheme i mean it's like a bad deal it's just a bad situation yeah it's guaranteed your kids hate you you give them everything i mean that's one of the reasons i was always reluctant to have a child but now now i'm at the i'm at the point where una's five which is like pure joy and i've i'm totally comfortable with the idea that maybe when she's 15 she might say i hate you right and and I'm fine with it knowing that right now it's blissful and I'll always have these memories.

Yes. And she'll come around again. And she'll come around. She will. She'll come around. By the way, the I hate you bit. Yeah. You should definitely try that on stage because it's so relatable.

There has to be something there. I mean, my mom used to drink a lot and she would get blackout, like she wouldn't remember things. Oh my gosh. And so she would call me and leave messages where she would like proclaim her love and be like, I love you so much. I'm so proud of you. And then the next day I would call her to return her call and she'd be like I I think I called you I didn't I didn't mean anything I said like she just like you know covering up whatever crazy things she could have said I go all you said was I love you and she's like yeah it's I it's too

soon for that like you know and it was you gotta talk about that yeah I mean that was I mean that's one of my first great area yeah but did you ever put it on a special? I don't think so, actually. And I'm reluctant to bring up any stuff about my parents like that because they are so great. And I just lived with them. And my mom does not drink as much anymore. And when she does drink, she definitely does not remember things, which as a kid, I really had some fun with. Because when you realize that your parent gets to a point where nothing will stick, you can say anything.

I would confess all the things I – mom, I'm smoking pot. I drink. Laura gave a blowjob last – I would tell her everything. Or I'd say like, I hate you. You're like, you know, I would tell her how I really felt. And I'd be like, you're not going to, none of this is going to stick. And then the next day, it's like, none of it happened. And you get all this stuff off your chest.

I mean, it's very dysfunctional. And I've worked through a lot of it. But there is, there was a lot of comedy in my house because of drinking. You got to talk about that. I feel like you should talk to your mom about, I want to talk about some of this stuff on stage and I love you, but I'm gonna talk about this stuff. Yes, I...

You should play her this. So we'll have this and then we'll, and then I'll, and maybe I'll write her an email and be like, you should talk to Nikki about this material because I think it's really cathartic for both of you. Oh, but then she would have to admit she has a problem with drinking too. Not necessarily. Oh, it's so fraught.

I don't know. No, but you're not wrong. I tend to just go about it and be like, okay, she's not going to hear this podcast because she doesn't know how to do podcasts. So I feel like I'm safe on here. And her friends probably don't listen to podcasts either. Right, sure. But I also go, okay, well, I had to grow up with a mom who drank a lot

and sometimes it was scary. So this is retribution. Sorry. This is what you get. You get a daughter who is going to make fun of you. I think you're okay because also I have to say like with all my shit, whether it's sleepwalking or having cancer or this and that or whatever, it's like you find that the things that you talk about that are the most embarrassing,

people are like, oh my God, I have something just like that. The difference is that was you telling your own thing and this is me choosing to air out something that my mom does wouldn't want. So that's the difference, but I try to lead by example and share really embarrassing things about me to get my parents a little bit

more comfortable with the fact that if I talk about this thing about you that's maybe a little embarrassing, so many people are getting wasted not remembering things. And you're funny. You're not a violent drunk. You're not mean. You tell me you love me.

It's funny. I don't think it's mean-spirited at all. Yeah. I mean, not anymore. You could make it about yourself. You say, I'm the daughter of an alcoholic. But if you can't say that. I'm just joking.

I'm joking. I was just trying to rephrase it through your lens. Right, right. And then it's, of course, more insulting. Yeah, exactly. I really have learned to be a little bit more gentler with other people's stories. And I also want to find a husband someday, so I do think about the fact that, like...

I love that you say that, like, there's a store. I'm looking for one right now. I don't want to go online. I want to go to, like, a mom-and-pop shop. I just want to get a pea coat. You know when you start looking for something online and it's just, like, everywhere? Yeah, I'm looking.

I would like to... I just want'm looking. I would like to. I just want a hat. I want to wear a hat. I want to get a hat that I can wear in the winter and the spring. Do you know about anything? I'm looking for. I am. I'm looking for like someone to want to date me.

And I feel that I have a reputation of like talking about men on stage and being kind of a Taylor Swift of comedy. That's a thing I gave myself. And you can pass along and everyone can use it. Why not? Please. Yes. Oh, I mean, you're talking to Bruce Springsteen in comedy. Yeah, I mean.

Look, we're all doing good work out here. That's so true. That's all. I just want to be a pop star more than anything in the whole world. But it's like no guys want to be talked about on stage. You know, like they just don't want to be. I know what you mean. I know what you mean.

And so I just recently learned that. I was like, oh, no, that's maybe it. Like it's not that I'm unlovable. It's like guys are scared that I'm going to talk about the size of their penis on stage someday. And that's just not – I just won't do – that's not the type of comic I am unless you hurt me. Right, right. And then if you hurt me, I feel the need to like hurt you back sometimes with my material. But it's been a really long time since I've been that immature with, and I

don't, you know, also, you could get sued, so I'm careful about it. I mean, we could unpack you not being unlovable all day, but I think we'll get to that. Right, yeah. Because you're very lovable. You're like America's sweetheart of comedy. I mean, I do think I'm lovable. I think I'm a goddamn catch. You're the's sweetheart of comedy I mean I do think I'm lovable I think I'm a goddamn catch you're the Taylor Swift of comedy

you're not unlovable I just I don't even know where I heard that but it's sticky well a lot of people are saying it and writing about it and it's out there it's in the zeitgeist for sure.

Stepping away from my conversation with the great Nikki Glaser to send a shout-out to Magic Spoon. Magic Spoon, big announcement. Brand-new variety pack now featuring peanut butter. I had the peanut butter flavor this morning. I loved it. It filled me up, which is what it's supposed to do. And it was delicious and tasty. It's got zero sugar, 13 or 14 grams of protein,

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So this is another slow round question. What do you think people, your friends, your family, what do you think people like most and like least about you? Oh, my God. What a good question. Can you go first? Yeah, yeah. So like people like most about me is I think that I'm sort of

always attempting to be positive. And I think that it's interrelated to the negative, which is I think it's annoying. Like, I think it's overbearing sometimes. And I think that it's also like, I don't realize that it's also like self-serving sometimes. And it's selfish. And it's like, I don't, that it's also like self-serving sometimes and it's selfish and it's like – you know what I mean by that? I would agree with you on that in terms of what people like about you, the positivity, the curiosity about other people's lives, just the joy and the kind of – you're an easy laugh. Like you're just like – you're fun to talk with but you're also really sad that is so true you're also there's like i mean you're happy like you present happy yeah yeah but there is definitely a lot of sad which i mean makes sense you're brilliant so you

there's got to be a lot of sadness under that so there's like a lot of sad, which, I mean, makes sense. You're brilliant. So there's got to be a lot of sadness under that. So there's like a lot of stress about like the world, but always a positive take on it. I just think, do you think that's a coping mechanism? You mean the optimism? Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, those are completely interrelated.

And I think this, yeah, the sadness, yeah, the sadness runs through a lot. I get depressed. It was funny, I listened to Conan O'Brien on Fresh Air, on NPR, and he was talking about how, and I totally related to this, is how for years he didn't think he was depressed because he was able to get so much done. And then he went to a new physician at one point who said, you can be depressed and get a lot done. It's just like a type of depression. And it sort of broke open the way he thought about himself. And when I heard him say that, I was like, I completely relate to that. Yes. I think that's you for sure.

You get so much done and yeah, you must feel like I'm not entitled to say I'm depressed or feel depressed because depression is so connotated with, or, uh, you know, being in bed all day and not being able to shower and things like that, which you sometimes don't do that, but, um, you've got that one going for you, but you're still writing as you know. But yeah, you seem too productive. And people have said that to me too. You're not depressed. You're not, you don't have ADD. You get so much done.

And for me, getting stuff done is the only way I can stay out of the dark thoughts and not want to kill myself, I mean, or go to those places. So it's – yeah, it's because of it. But it doesn't mean that when you get undepressed that you stop working hard. I think that motivation and i have talked during the pandemic on the phone and both have had i feel like pretty low moments really low i yeah i was listening to your conversation with maria bamford about you know suicidal thoughts and all that and i've been really open about mine i was plagued by them and have been several times in my life but especially over this the summer i hit some real lows where i was like i think i need to like go away somewhere to

just get medicated and like get out of this state of constantly wanting to end things but not but not doing anything like i'm not gonna end it so I'm just in this horrible, like it reminded me of like when I was, uh, I w I had an eating disorder for a while. I was anorexic and like on death's door. And it was in that same place of like, I don't know how to get better. I just wanted to die because I couldn't eat. And it's torture. Cause you're like starving all the time.

It's like truly like the worst feeling you're just so hungry, but you can't eat because whatever it's not letting your mind is not letting you. And I just was like, I don't know what to, I wanted someone to like, take me away and put me away and do something with me because I'm out of options. I can't do this anymore. So, um, luckily though, I got the summer when it got so bad, I, um, I got diagnosed with ADD and then that really helped me tackle my depression. But the suicidal thoughts, I mean, there's so much comedy with suicide and I've talked about it for so long in different ways on stage and, uh, similar to you of, of, I don't,

I can never do it. Um, because I have to clean my room first. I can't. The mess I would leave behind. My mom would already be mad that I killed myself, but then she has to clean up after me. And the EMTs might be, like, hot. And so, like, I wonder they're going to, like, break in my hotel room and, like, see all the trash. And so the fact that I'm so messy has actually protected me from ever doing anything

because I would have to get things in order beforehand. And, yeah, the mere fact that I don't have a Swiffer is going to keep me alive. I also have that with like, wait, people are going to read my journals? Yes. Yeah. I don't want people to read my journals. I don't know. So your journals, like, are you organized about your journaling? I've

always wondered this. No, it's a mess. Your morning pages, I know you do. Yeah. That's just like scribbling stream of consciousness. Yeah. I literally just type into my laptop. It's part, right now it's part of a single document that might end up being a book or part of the next show. And then do you actually write with a pen at any point journaling and then i write my journal like at night with a pen notebook journaling's really important i really did not know how great it was until recently and like picking up old journals just ones that i wrote like three pages in at like in 2014, and just read those rambling thoughts. And I'm like, I was really figuring some – I was on to something here emotionally that I just abandoned.

But, you know, thankfully got through it. But there's just so much to uncover. When did you get into journaling? I got into journaling, I don't know, like sometime in my 20s. journaling, I don't know, like sometime in my 20s. And in some ways, as therapy, it's great because it's essentially inadvertent cognitive therapy because you're writing down how you feel and then you're reading it later and going like, do I still feel that way? Why did I feel that way? And you sort of put things in perspective. You're like, I shouldn't have been so mad about that. It's a little out of proportion with what actually happened.

That's what it helps me with. And then as a writer, it's good because like my last show and book, the new one, is like essentially my journal ended up being the first draft of what became this super long document and then super short thing. So it's like in a lot of ways, my journals are like the setups for what become my jokes. And when you do write, is there any thought in the back of your head? Someone's going to pick this up someday. Someone's going to see this.

Always, always. Really? Always. Yeah, I don't think I'm ever 100% honest with the page. I think I get up to 90-95, but I think there's always a little hint of, like, hold back. Yeah, yeah, me too. Unless, you know, I am scribbling in such a way

that it's completely illegible. But then what's the point? Because I can't go back. But, yeah, it's interesting. Intentionally illegible. Is there anywhere we can be completely honest? I think the comedy store, I think. It's interesting. Is there anywhere we can be completely honest? I think the comedy store, I think.

You're so right. That's what I've heard. I don't know. I followed him on Instagram. That's what that documentary was about. That's the only real place where you feel like you can be yourself. You can't say anything anymore. You can't talk about anything anymore.

That whole sentiment drives me nuts. It's like you're on your Netflix special for 200 million people and you're going, let me just start by, nobody can say anything anymore. It's like, what do you mean? You're talking to 200 million. No one has that platform. That's so funny. It's like, give that platform to a fireman, for God's sakes. Give it to an EMT, someone who does something productive.

I'm going to step away from my conversation with Nikki to send a shout out to Helix Mattresses. Helix Mattresses 2021. The greatest mattress of 2021. As dictated by comedian Mike Birbiglia. You heard it here. I have one.

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I can't believe you do this every week and have to have new material. So let's go. It's because, Nikki, of course, it's because I'm sad. Yes, exactly. It's your depression. It's all I have. And the people seem to enjoy it. This is our favorite depression symptom.

Yeah, yeah. So I don't have a swimmer's body. I have a drowner's body where it seems like I'm drowning at all times, even when I'm not in water. Even when I'm shirtless and dry, people are like, are you okay? And I told this, the reason

I brought this up to you is I told this joke to a friend and he goes, Mike, don't body shame yourself. And I thought, if I didn't body shame myself, I'm not sure I would even know how to perform comedy. Body shaming is my bread and butter.

By the way, I love bread and butter by the way i love bread and butter i feel like i could eat bread and butter for every meal and i wouldn't get tired of it i mean i'd get tired in just in general because i'm always a little tired but i tried to but i tried to understand i'm sure you you feel this way is like relating to this like i try to understand where my friend's criticism came from about body shaming right yeah and what i think he's getting at is that i'm criticizing my own weight and build and by proxy i'm criticizing anyone of a similar weight or build unintentionally but the truth is i'm not thinking about them i'm thinking about myself because we're all just thinking about ourselves because that's the thing about human beings.

Narcissism is our bread and butter. And that's the end of the bit. Narcissism is our bread and butter. And I think like that's what it's sort of about. It's so good. Let's start at the top. Okay, you don't have a swimmer's body. You have a drowner's about. It's so good. Let's start at the top. Okay. You don't have a swimmer's body.

You have a drowner's body. It's so goddamn funny. I actually have another tag for it, which is I have a river corpse body. Like a body that you'd see in a documentary about murder. And, like, when I see those documentaries, I'm like,'s relatable that's in the like second stage of decay yeah it's horrible um i just picture like people like i i want to see a scene in which you're being rescued like in line getting coffee by a lifeguard just someone's got you and you're like i'm okay or like throwing someone throwing a raft to you like the idea that you're drowning all the time yeah i mean i want to see that like

act out act it out in some way people are giving you cpr okay i love um and i love the bread and butter i mean i feel like it's dying for bread and butter is my bread and butter. Oh, that's funny. Bread and butter is my bread and butter. I don't know if it's been done. I wonder. Yeah. Bread and butter.

We'll have to ask Dave Attell. Yeah, check with him. Now, do you have a joke about getting gonorrhea on a carousel? No. Sounds very specific. In 1972. I wasn't alive then, Dave. So, yeah, I think the bread

and butter is my bread and butter. I love the what did you say about the tired? Oh, about even when I'm shirtless and dry, people are like, are you okay? And then you're eating and you say, until I get tired of it.

Not of it, but just tired. Yeah, and I go, by the way, I love bread and butter. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not of it, but just tired. Yeah, and I go, by the way, I love bread and butter. I feel like I could eat bread and butter for every meal and I wouldn't get tired of it. I mean, I'd get tired, but just in general, because I'm always a little tired.

Yeah, I think not even, not always a little, like you're always a little tired. It's good, but I feel like for you, like you getting always a little tired it's good but i think i feel like for you like watch getting you getting tired from eating so much might be fun like because i would just get tired from it's like lifting the bread to my face i don't know oh that's nice that's nice yeah just get specific it's like yeah lifting all that bread always makes me sluggish. My jaw chewing and the swallowing and the wiping the crumbs off my, you know, the bed.

And then you closed with narcissism being, oh, the looking at other people. Body shaming. Body shaming. Okay. I love that too because that is exactly it. People don't, when you put down yourself, you think that they're thinking about you and you're so right.

Well, I've had to pull back a little bit because actually like my friend, I say, my friend mentioned this and it's a comic. Yeah. It's not even like someone who doesn't do comedy. It's like a comic was like, hey, don't body shame yourself. And I'm like, I mean, if I don't have,

if I can't body shame myself, I don't really know what I'm going to talk about. Right. And that's okay. So I have the same thing when I say that I'm scared of being called ugly. People go, Nikki, come on. I get it. I'm not like ugly.

But that doesn't mean that I don't feel it sometimes. And just because someone might be uglier than me doesn't mean that I'm saying that they're ugly by saying that I am. You know, like it's to be told that you're not allowed to have your feelings about yourself. Yes. Strange. Very strange. Yeah, yeah. And that's why I'm always met with you're so hard on yourself.

It's like, well, I can't. Well, now you're just making me feel. Now I'm feeling bad about being hard on myself. Now I'm like, now I'm mean to myself about being too mean to myself. I can't win. So, yeah, that's really interesting, the fact that a comic told you that. It's like ease up on that. Yeah.

I'm trying to think of what it was recently where I was like – oh, I was writing a bit about how sometimes when I show up at my shows, it's like I've been dreading doing the show all day and it's my favorite thing to do. And it's like, I'm realizing like, oh my God, I dread just doing anything at all. And then some people say to me like, Mike, well, you're lucky. You at least get to be a comedian. I'm like, I know.

How do you think I feel? I'm just telling you how I feel. I don't think I'm right. I just think it's how I feel. I am so glad that you also dread doing comedy all day long all day all day and i promise you to the listener who's like i don't want to go see a comic who dreads the second we take the microphone it the dread goes away it's gone it's gone this it never fails to work and sometimes i think it won't work and i'm gonna be up there dreading it there's only been a couple times where i've

really been miserable and been like i i can't wait to get off stage. But generally, that dread goes away the second you start talking on mic. But you can't anticipate that. It's just there's dread. I have been told by, like, boyfriends, my dad, saying, I've never heard someone dread doing something they love more than you. Like, you complain all the time about how much you don't want to go on stage, how much you don't want to go do the set. Then why do you do it? And I don't have an answer for that. It's like...

Because you love doing the thing, but you don't love the thing before the thing. I hate the preparation. I hate, I just want to do it. I am not someone who is good at reviewing or preparing. I just want to go and do it and then not have to look at it again. And that's why I love standup is because there's no, usually no tape to look over. And I do record

every single set, but I've never listened to a single set of mine, like ever. And it's really, I'd be a much better comic if I did. I just, it's too painful. I just like one and done and then leave it and not have to look at it and review it and second guess things and hear my voice. And I know that's not original and I just have to fight through that uncomfortability, but I can't seem to. Yeah, the dreading bit, and I don't know if it'll make it into the next show

because in some ways it's like, to talk about dreading being on stage while you're on stage in some ways is the kiss of death. Yes. With the audience. Well, that's why you have to reassure them. I'm happy right now. I promise you.

So my joke is always like, you know, I'm like, oh, I got to do this show tonight. I got to take the F train from Bergen to West Forth. And then I get on the train. I'm like, I like the train you know what I mean and then I'm like oh then I get a walk from West Forth to McDougal then I'm walking I'm like I like walking I get some steps in on my Fitbit

and then I get on stage and then I show up at the show and I see the audience and I'm like oh these fucking people and then I get on stage and I'm like I love you guys you know like and then I just have this fear I'm like, I love you guys. Oh. You know, like, and then I just have this fear like, oh, I guess I just dread doing anything at all.

Yeah, it's, and I mean, it's just a, it's about being in the present, you know, like that's just a testament to like being in the present is the best place to be. But also I do, I do not dread eating and sleeping.

I totally feel you. Those are the only things in my life or like um you know seeing a friend that i met like but even just friendship i dread a lot of that too but i i dread podcasts i'm having such a good time i am so glad i did this but like leading up to actually today i wasn't dreading this i i'm gonna be honest i can't lie and say i was dreading it I wasn't dreading this. I'm going to be honest. I can't lie and say I was dreading it. I wasn't. But most of the time, even really fun things, especially, you know, like, thank God I have a rapport with you where I'm not as nervous as I probably should be for this. But like, you know, you did Conan's podcast and like the nerves leading up to something you really want to do and have dreamed of doing. I was like buckled over in anxiety before Conan's podcast.

And then when you get in it, were you able to relax and be present? I had a great time and I was present. Yeah. I mean, but you hear those stories about Letterman. He was always miserable, except when he was filming his show. And so part of you is like, fuck that guy.

But then it's like, that's his experience. I don't know. What are you going to say? Yep. I'm so glad because I always looked at you as someone who just loves stand-up, can't wait to perform, wants to do it every night. Not as much compelled to do it, but wants to. But I'm glad to hear that it's just a similar compulsion and a constant chronic dread.

And I think what I love about it, and I don't think I've even ever talked about this, and this is why even like I enjoy doing virtual shows, which is a lot of comics are like, I'm never doing virtual shows. Right. I like seeing people laugh. I love sharing an idea and them laughing and me laughing at them laughing. Yes. Like I love the interplay of it.

Yeah. I forget that we make people laugh sometimes. Like, I really forget that, like, it brings joy to people. I think it just becomes such a way for me to be validated or to, like, you know, speak up for maybe girls who might not feel spoken for. But I sometimes forget laughing makes you happy. Oh, I know. It's like a good thing that you're doing. Oh, here's the other thing.

This is wild. I don't know why I do this. I do not ever look at the audience. And I never, it appears that I am, but I blur my eyes subconsciously. I don't choose to do it. I can never, I never make eye contact. I don't know what the audience looks like.

I don't see them laugh. I can see them moving. And that's when I know they're laughing and I can obviously hear it. But I will never actually look at them. I have a fear of, I guess, looking people in the eyes and having them feel like they have to laugh because I've made eye contact with them.

So I just choose not to. And I'm scared to see that they won't be laughing. I feel like you should try it. I think I might have to. It's like I don't do crowd work. I'm so scared of them. And that's why I talk so fast. I don't want anyone to ever be able to get in a heckle.

I don't like silence. I have a weird fear of the audience that I haven't addressed yet. I feel like you have the opportunity just because you work the cellar and the store and all these places that have like great crowds and like you could lose them for five minutes and win them back. And a lot of comics don't have that luxury. And I feel like you could experiment with like, I'm going to just tonight, I'm just going to look at the crowd.

I think I'm going to take those chances when, when it opens back up because it's the way i was doing stand-up before isn't as fulfilling as i wanted it to be so i have to re-approach it um and and breathe some life back into it for me and scare myself again a little bit and bring some edge to it because it was just becoming so easy even when i was doing new material, I just wasn't feeling nervous. And I don't, I want to feel nervous again. I want to be scared. And so I'm going to challenge myself to, uh, do more crowd work. Cause that's the scariest thing for me. And to, um, what else? I like, I have a lot of goals. Yeah. I think the fun thing with crowd work is like, when I was doing,

thank God for jokes, I would, I would I would tell a story about how I got arrested in New Jersey once and I said, has anyone ever been arrested? And you can't believe how good the stories are. People would tell stories about you know, one time Rachel Maddow was in the crowd and I was like, what'd you get arrested for? And she was like

civil disobedience and I was like, that makes sense. You know, it's like, you just get like you get like really good stories, like endless amounts time a guy said like i climbed on top of the hollywood sign once you're just like what i mean you're right i think it's the specificity of the crowd work that will make it more fun and i am interested in people and i do like i have a way of i don't know why i'm so scared of it. It's really a weird thing for me. And, um, I think cause one time I did venture out there, I had like a joke about tattoos or something, how I, um, I just have a joke where I got,

I got wasted the other night and I got a tattoo removed and I like, don't remember doing it. And now I have a blank space on my hip that I have to live with the rest of my life just like going walking like stumbling into a laser clinic and just getting a tattoo removed so it was just some dumb joke like that but to get into it I was like anyone got tattoos and this woman was like I do

and I go oh what do you got and she's like I have like my baby's like footprints and I was like oh my gosh how old is he and she was like, I have like my baby's like footprints. And I was like, oh my gosh, how old is he? And she was like, he's dead. Oh my God. And I didn't know what to, I don't even remember what I did. I think I died.

And I think like I can't even remember. I like, that's a moment where like my, I could, my body a moment where my soul left my body and I could see above bird's eye view. And I think that scared me for the rest of time. I feel like I can't think of a specific thing, but I've had stuff like that over the years where you hit a brick wall with crowd work and it's scary,

but also it reminds you of what the art form is. The art form is just one person talking to a group of people and whatever happens, happens. That's the show. Yeah. And now I realize with that woman, I would have asked about it and had a real moment. Like who cares if we go to a sad place?

Yeah, yeah. Even better because first of all, she was comfortable enough to raise her hand and say she had a tattoo and then offer that up she's in a place where she can actually talk about this how how actually interesting that we could have someone who's willing to talk about this and for me to ask a little bit and then anything i say after that and obviously not about that is going to be met with so many laughs because people are going to want to get out of it. Absolutely.

This is huge. Nikki, I think this is huge. Yeah, I think so too. Because the reason why I say that is whenever I come on your podcast or radio show, I'm always amazed at how good of a listener and talker you are. And I feel like, and you're a great joke writer, obviously. That's what you're known for. And so if you merge those two things into your live show i

think it could be explosive i think you're right mike i really uh because i i i love it too i love um i love when i see people go into the crowd and where you just trust them to be okay what i you know and that's what comedy is is obviously just the audience just wants to feel like you're in control. And I think that I am so in control of my own jokes that going out in the crowd is going to give them that sense that I'm not because I'm not as confident with it. But the only way to combat that is to just do it and then to prove myself wrong. And like you said, I can always get out of it. You're going to be great at it. And you have 40 jokes lined up.

And I don't care about bombing. I truly don't. It's okay to bomb. I've been there so many times. I will be there again. It's not comfortable, but it's not going to destroy me like it used to. So it's just like, okay, I'll just have to shake it off and get another set in pretty quickly after.

But it's survivable. It's not the worst thing that could happen. Stepping away from my conversation with Nikki Glaser to send a shout out to MeUndies. MeUndies. Let me tell you something. I never really cared about what underwear I was wearing before I met me undies. You know what it was? I would listen to podcasts like this

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Do you have any material that you're working on that you want to float? Yes. Okay, so I'll go through some. And these are just very loose things. Okay, so my nephew, like, doesn't care for me. Like, he's not into me. We haven't been able to like make that bond. And I have several examples, but, uh, and this isn't even a joke.

This is just real thing that happened. I got a cardboard cutout of myself made by the St. Louis Cardinals to be at Bush stadium during COVID. Um, and it was placed next to John Hamm's. There's rumors. I was like, could you put it in his lap?

It was nice. They made a cardboard cut out of me. And then after the season was over, they gave it to me. It was at my parents' house. And then my nephew, who's three and a half, came over. And I was like, Arlo, I have a gift for you. And I thought he would just think it was funny and weird.

He was so horrified by this beautiful picture of me, like, waving and being, like, happy in a Cardinal shirt. And he was so scared of it and cried. And I go—and my sister Lauren was like like we're going to take this home this is fun this is funny and he was like no and just threw a huge tantrum how old is he three and a half and okay they put it in the car to take him home and they're like just and they were really

defensive of it like Nikki he's just this this doesn't have anything to do with you and I'm like I didn't think it did until you said that but all right so then they're in the car on their way home, and he is so upset by this cardboard cutout of me smiling at him in the backseat. They have to pull over on the side of the road

and get rid of it. They have to move it out of the car, and that's how much he was uncomfortable with me. But we got it back, and it's in their house, and it's now prominently displayed, and I think he's become used to it and i like try to it it's it's now um prominently displayed and i think he's like become used to it but he really hated it for a while so that beside that he doesn't we never really bonded and i'm i'm always trying to work it but i'm also like not trying too hard i don't want to be like that but one day this summer he was over i have one job

one tag for that if you want it which is like like my nephew doesn't care for me, which I think is really funny. And then it's just a great setup. And then I feel like you could be something in the universe of like the St. Louis Cardinals did this thing where they had cardboard cutouts of like different St. Louis locals, you know, Jon Hamm and me and blah, blah, blah. And I gave it to my nephew. Well, I didn't give it to him. I had my road manager deliver it to his house. You know what I mean? Like, you could distance yourself from the delivery of the cardboard cutout.

That's so funny. And then he freaked out. And, like, I asked them to console him. I don't know why he doesn't feel close to me. I had my assistant tell him that someday I'm going to take him to the baseball. Yeah, that's really. And I told him I would send a car. Yes.

I told him if he was upset, I would send a car, and the car would take him to Applebee's. He could have whatever he wanted from the right half of the menu. It would all be paid for. Then the car would bring him home. I don't know. He doesn't like. He doesn't care for then the car would bring him home and i don't know he doesn't like he doesn't care for me he's three years old i don't know it's so funny that yeah just uh really leaning into like i'm a celebrity and like he should care about like that should mean something to him but it just really doesn't because he doesn't care i mean they always are like nicky's on tv and and he just doesn't. Right, we show him the specials. Yeah, I mean. We show him the specials. Does Una respond to seeing you on TV talking to Seth Meyers?

Is she like, what daddy's up there? We show her stuff every now and then. We don't show her a lot. Right. And she's five and a half. It's a little confusing. There's this great book we read her called Bear Has a Story to Tell. And I read the audio book.

And so I could either read it to her or I can press play. Oh my God. That's awesome. And like even that is sort of confusing. Like why is dad's sonic quality so high on this recording? Well, she's just going to think that all dads, every child's dad does what you do. Like that's what they grow up thinking. Is a voiceover artist.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes. That's so cute. We're all just a bunch of soccer coaches and voiceover artists. She, that's. But what's the rest of the bit? But I love that bit bit i think it's hilarious this is a little bit uh okay so over the summer i'm like kind of giving up on him and

my sister would force him to like hug me and i go please don't do that just let him have his own like choice in the matter she's like no he loves you you love nicky don't you and he's just like mute you know and so just it's so awkward because i'm like you don't have? And he's just like, mute, you know? And so, just, it's so awkward, because I'm like, you don't have to do this. I know that he does, it's fine. Like, later on, he's going to love me, because I'm going to like, I'll probably get him laid when he's like 20,

because I'm going to be famous and like take him backstage with him and his friends. Like, it's, I'm going to, he's going to, it's all going to pay off someday. Oh my God. At one point, I was, we had just gotten done with a run, his dad and I. And I was like, I'm going to go take a shower.

And he's like, I want to take a shower. And I was like, okay, no, no. You know? And I'm like, I'm going to go. And he's like, I want to take a shower. And my sister goes, he can go. And I go, no, he can't. And she was like, but it's fine.

He doesn't care. And I go, I do. I was like, I'm going to be naked. And she was like, yeah, he doesn't and she was like oh my gosh it's fine he doesn't care and i go i do i was like i'm gonna be i'm gonna be naked and she was like yeah he doesn't care and i go but like what if like what if i like molest him or something and she was like are you going to i don't know i've never been in a situation i've never taken a shower with a young child i don't want to be put in don't put me in that and it's like you know you don't know what you're gonna do it's the same it's the same reason i don't have a be put in, don't put me in that. And it's like, you know, you don't know what you're going to do. It's the same,

it's the same reason I don't have a gun, you know, because I might use that gun to make, you know, my nephew have sex with me. That bit is so funny. I have no tags. It's so bad.

I have nothing to offer. I mean, the only reason I can make it, obviously, is because I'm not a molester, but, and I'm like, I don't know.

I've been on this like molestation kick race, like of just like wanting to talk about it because I listened to this podcast called hunting warhead, which just every parent needs to listen to it, even though it's horrifying. It's like, there's so much more, many more molesters out there than anyone thinks. And I just feel like we need to talk about it more. And like, and, and so many people have been molested and like, I feel like so ashamed about it. And I feel like it's my duty as a comedian to like talk about a about it more. And so many people have been molested and I feel so ashamed about it. And I feel like it's my duty as a comedian to talk about it a little bit more.

And obviously the jokes are uncomfortable, but I really want to talk about it more. That's great. I think that's good. Now, by the way, I think that that's a good reference point also for your special banging, which is like, it's tons of sex stuff but it's very

candid and honest and it's true to you and like i feel like a lot of times there's a sensitivity with comedy where people go like like i don't like when comics discuss xyz topic and i'm always like and you know and they ask you you know in interviews or they ask me are there any topics off limit in comedy i was gonna know like it's all a matter of how you do it it's all a matter of like you can do any topic well comedically because theoretically we're doing exactly what you're saying about the molesting thing which is you're shining a light on a huge problem and i don't know that i haven't been molested i I mean, this is another bit that I was like, I'm going to therapy to like,

I plopped down on the couch and I was like, dig it out of me, Donna. Let's see if we can find him. Because I don't know if he's in there somewhere, you know? So we're going through all my uncles. I have like 10 uncles, a Catholic family. So we're going through and doing a deep dive on each of them. But like, I actually did,

I actually had a therapist one time looking at her notes for me and she goes remind me again when you were molested and i go i wasn't she was like oh my god are you are you sure like i don't know find it so um have you done that as a bit i i've i've i've messed with all of these things that's really good it's true and and That's really good. But it's true. That's a very funny, like, it's also funny if you listen to him off, like, what about Uncle Brian? Nope. What about Uncle Matt? Nope.

What about Uncle, you know, whatever. I do that. And then you get to one, it's like, what about Uncle Brendan? Well, there was one Thanksgiving that was odd. You know what I mean? Yes. And you could even go through like a nebulous story. You know what I mean?

I like the idea of the fact that – because I think the relatable thing, the listing of the uncles is really good. But I think the thing that a lot of people do when they do like repress those memories is you don't even remember that uncle. You erase that uncle. He doesn't even enter your list because every single person, whether they've been molested or not, and especially those that have not, have gone through your roster of your childhood and been like, was there something that I'm blocking out? And you kind of go back and you go through each one. And I have a feeling that if I was really repressing something,

I would just completely miss, like i wouldn't even so it might be funny to go through the uncles and then to have one come up and go like some kind of reveal where like oh i don't have an uncle or like just something where it's like i've revealed an uncle but then i did like uh insist oh like for instance this one thing that i do i go go, so I go, I'm not molested. I never like was molested. I don't know what's going on. And then later on my act, I go, you know, I don't know what fucked me up sexually, but there's something that happened, but I don't know.

I think it's the talk my mom gave me, the sex talk my mom gave me where I was really young. She sat me down and molested me and she told me that. And then I just like shove it out. I go, oh, there it is. Oh my God. That's it. That's it. Yeah. Like something go, oh, there it is. Oh my God, that's it. That's it.

Yeah, like something like that where it just kind of. Oh my God, thanks for being part of my breakthrough. Yes. So the last thing we do is called Working Out for a Cause. And if there's a specific nonprofit that you like to give to, I will donate to them and we'll link to them in the show notes. That's amazing. I would love to give to the St. Louis Stray Rescue because I'm an animal lover,

who isn't, you know, but you just see what these people see and they go in and they see animals in just like the worst situations. And I'm someone who just like kind of throws money at things, but they really get in there and see some awful stuff and they do great work and they've really, I've done a lot of, uh, charity work for them and they've helped me out a lot with, uh, my own dogs just being, giving advice. So they're just good people. And, um, yeah, St. Louis stray rescue. That's great. Um, thank you. Uh, thanks for doing this. And, and I can't wait to see you next hour. And I feel like there's so much stuff in there that I feel like could end up in the show. I feel like the stuff about your nephew is a riot.

Yeah, I got to put that down because I just want him to know how difficult he is and how we're going to come so far. But I need him to know what a little brat he is. Well, thanks, Nikki. I'll see you soon. See you soon, Mike. Working it out,

cause it's not done. Working it out, cause there's no... That's going to do it for another episode of Working It Out. Nikki Glaser, man, so smart, so funny. If you want

to listen to her on another podcast, I'm going to recommend another comedy podcast for comedy nerds. It's called Good One. It's a weekly podcast from Vulture hosted by Jesse David Fox. Every Tuesday, I was on in 2018.

Good One has also had Roy Wood Jr. and Sarah Cooper who were on Working It Out. You can subscribe to Good One on you know, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Working It Out is produced by myself along

with Peter Salamone and Joseph Rubiglia, consulting producer Seth Barish, sound mix by Kate Belinsky, assistant editor Mabel Lewis. Thanks to my consigliere Mike Berkowitz as well as Marissa Hurwitz and Josh Upfall. Special thanks to Jack Antonoff for his music. There's some new little stings today. As always, a very special thanks to my wife, J. Hope Stein.

Our new book is called The New One, and it is at your local bookstore, which we should all be supporting our local bookstores. As always, a special thanks to my daughter, Una, who created a radio fort made of pillows. Thanks most of all to you who have listened. Tell your friends. Tell your enemies. What's it like telling your enemies about a podcast? I want to hear those stories. We're working it out.

I'll see you next time, everybody.