Mike Birbiglia's Working It Out - 97. Bert Kreischer: Inside A Storytelling Machine

Episode Date: April 24, 2023

Mike and Bert Kresicher have known each other a little bit for a long time. Now they sit down for an in-depth chat about how to develop a story for standup, why Florida is so strange, and why Bert decided to change the course of his comedy career. Plus, they discuss their shared love for legendary comedic storyteller David Sedaris.Please consider donating to St. Jude Children's Research Hospital

my wife calls me like a soft narcissist in that I have a kind of like a periscope view of the way I see the world, and it's all about me. Yeah. And I leave a large wake. She's like, yeah, and at times you do not, you don't stop to make sure everyone's okay. Oh, interesting.

Like I had Leanne one time tell a very vulnerable story about me on a podcast. And I was like, yo, what was up with that? She was like, are you being serious? That is the voice of the great Bert Kreischer. For anyone who is wondering, yes, Bert wore his shirt during the interview. Literally, I interviewed Ray Romano yesterday, and that comes out next week. And I told him I had a Bert Kreischer, and he said, did he wear his shirt? And he did.

But we took a couple photos after, and he lifted up his shirt. This is one of those sort of long time in the making episodes Bert and I have known each other a little bit for a long time And of course we have this thing in common Which is we both are stand-up comedians who tell stories We really get into the nuts and bolts of that today It's really, really fun Speaking of which, I'm headed to Washington D.C.

To tell new stories and new jokes This week, Tuesday and Wednesday At the D.C. to tell new stories and new jokes this week, Tuesday and Wednesday, at the D.C. Improv. Those shows are sold out, but I think I'm doing a few other new material shows in Indianapolis and Philadelphia that aren't sold out. The Madison ones are sold out.

We're also adding more cities. I'm adding some cities through July and August. There's a big announcement about the old man in the pool overseas coming soon that I just heard, but I can't say it. But it's very exciting. If you don't live in America, you might live close to where the old man in the pool is going to be. That is a hint. That's a hint.

To be the first to know, sign up for the mailing list on burbiggs.com. You will be the first person to know about any of these tour dates. And if you're feeling generous, join the mailing list and go on Apple Podcasts and just say what your favorite episode is of the show. Write five stars. I like the Burt Kreischer. Maybe it's the Burt Kreischer episode. That's today's.

I think you're going to love it. We talk a lot about storytelling. We talk a lot about his story, The Machine, which is a very famous story in stand-up. Because it's very rare in stand-up that you have, like, a 10, 15-minute story that works. And not only that, he, like, does again and again and again. Like, I think a lot of times he, he like closes with it, encores with it. He made a movie about it that's coming out Memorial Day weekend with Mark Hamill. Who's that?

Mark Hamill. You can also check out Bert's Netflix special called Razzle Dazzle. We talk about long form storytelling. We talk about David Sedaris, who's an idol of both Bert's and mine one of the the great storytellers of this age and I think you're gonna love this one enjoy my chat with the great Bert Kreischer I was what is my wife called? I was living out of integrity in my standup

and she hated my standup. Your wife did? When I first met her, she was like, you're funny, you're smarter than that. And I was like, but it works. And she's like, no, it works, but it's you're smarter than that. Oh, wow.

And then she took me and showed me the blue collar comedy tour. Ron White tells Tater Salad. And I go, I'm going in the wrong direction. That's the direction I need to be in. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm writing fun, cute boy comedy. You know what's cool?

You know what's cool? When you go to the gym with your buddies. Yeah, yeah. And like I was doing this thing. Yeah, remember that time? Yeah. Remember the 80s? Remember Life Cereal?

Yeah. Do you guys remember Radio Shack? It's got Shack in the title, people. You know? And so when I want to do that, authentic stories about my life, and I had done a little bit of it. I had done hints of it at times, but I would do a hint and then do so much hacky stuff in between

that I don't think you really got the hint. And then obviously podcasting changed my value in what made me interesting. I wasn't a cute fun boy comic. Like I remember watching Daniel Tosh going like, I wish I had his act. Yeah. I wish I had his act.

Yeah. And then I did Rogan and I told the machine and that was a game changer. Oh, that's it. That's what did it. Yeah, the machine. Cause I had to learn how to tell the machine. I had to learn how to stand on stage

in the fucking pocket for 12, sometimes 15 minutes and tell a story that was not working. Oh, that's really interesting. Yeah. And once I learned... So it wasn't working at first. Oh, it was horrible. Because it didn't have enough jokes?

It didn't have any jokes. It didn't have any jokes. So it was just basically the fundamental, the bones of what happened. The bones of what happened, exactly. What are the bones of what happened. The bones of what happened, exactly. What are the bones of what happened? I signed up for a Russian class. I became friends with the teacher.

I took all her classes. She then said, we're taking a trip to Russia. My dad said I should go. I go to Russia. The mob's running Russia. They're living right next door to me. I end up becoming really good friends with one guy. And then in the theory of the story, what I, what I feel is

important in the story is that I, and I, and I look, I lower my guard thinking, oh, the mafia is fun and safe. And then we went on a train trip and we legit robbed a train with two other gangsters and they, and they weren't as user-friendly as my previous gangster. Yeah. And the whole key is, and I thought the end of the story was, you know, we go to the cops. I think I'm going to be in trouble. My class is sitting right there.

They've told on us. Here we are. We're getting arrested. And the cops said to me, so I understand you're the machine. Yeah. To make sure you party with us. Wow. And so I thought that was the whole story.

And the number one thing I didn't have was an ending. That was the number one thing. If I have any story that has an ending, if I can have an ending, a good ending, then I am, I can, if I have an ending before I have any of the other stuff, I can make the greatest story ever because I have so much confidence knowing

that if at any point I need this to end, I can get out of it. Pull the ripcord. Oh. If you have an ending in your storyteller, you're fine because the story can be two minutes long and it can be 15 minutes long. It could be an hour long.

Yeah. And if you can keep finding more, then you're like, oh, I got a one hour long story here. But yeah, no, that's a huge thing. Here's what I'm curious about. When it was bombing, because what's funny is you're telling me that story, even the bones, without jokes, I'm interested. What was the audience's reaction?

Anywhere from mildly amused to calling it a lie in the middle, this didn't happen, to outright losing them and then bailing on the story entirely. There's a number of times where I just bailed on the story in the middle. My sleepwalking through the second story window story is similar to the machine story in the sense that when it happened, and it happened in like 2005, the moment it happened, I went to the emergency room and wall-to-wall washing and all this stuff. I was like, no one's going to believe this. In the moment, I thought, no one's going to believe this.

I took out my Canon ELF. I photographed everything. I photographed the broken window. I photographed out the window to, you know, to the lawn, to the glass. I photo, I mean, I photographed everything because I mean, it is a weird thing where you realize that it's very hard to prove that something even happened. Well, you know, what happened for me was a girl in my class commented on the video. Oh. That's how, because I had told the story. Yeah.

I think most people just thought it was a lie, which I was cool with. Yeah. I was like, I don't care. First of all, I'm a comedian. My job is to entertain you. Yeah. Did you have a good time?

Awesome. Yeah, of course. Now, if you think it's a lie, I probably won't turn the corner of getting new fans. But when she commented on that video, the day I posted it, she wrote this story. I was in Burt's Russian class. I was on this trip. This story is 100% true.

He fucking robbed us. And then she tagged everyone in my class. And then they replied. Wow. Replied with pictures. And they're like, oh, here's a picture of B of Burton Igor arm wrestling, and here's a picture of this. And what's very interesting is I have since caught up with a lot of those class members. Yeah.

And her and another guy remember it almost exactly as I do. Yeah. My teacher does not remember it barely at all. Okay. My teacher kind of is like, like I even brought up the other head chaperone. It's like, yeah, I don't really, but what it is, is everyone's going through their own truth in that moment, their own life, their own story. They're telling their own story. They're not going to remember your story. Yeah. And so, and sometimes they just fall out of

people's lives and what they remember is the one thing they did in Russia. Yeah. And so, but yeah, I mean, it's fascinating because I've had it happen to me too. Like it happens all the time with my fucking dad. My dad, I'll tell a story at dinner and my dad will go, this didn't happen. Yes. And I go, hold on, dad. And he goes, no, I'm just saying

you got an active imagination, buddy. Yes. And my sister will be like, Dad, you're wrong. He's right. We have this fight going on and on about a van, about a goddamn van. Yeah. I know he had a van when I was a kid. I know he did.

My sister remembers it. We picked up my Aunt Judy at the airport in this van. I remember being at Tampa International Airport in this van. I remember my week of first grade, him taking me to school in this fucking van. And he, to this day, is like, I have never owned a van. I've never bought a van. Wow.

We never had a van. And me and my sister are like, we had a fucking van. I think it's worth pointing out that an idol of, a shared idol of both of ours, David Sedaris. Oh my God. When he's asked whether stories are true,

his answer is, I believe, the best storyteller answer. He says, true enough for you. He's, dude, he's a game changer for me. Me too. Life changing, life changing. I know it's going to be hard for people to hear what I'm about to say because they're never going to get it.

It's not going to be that hard. They're going to be like—because you can't really talk about anything in the past anymore with any immediacy and talking about how it was because people go, whoa, whoa, whoa. So, like, I didn't grow up with any gay dudes. I didn't know any gay dudes. I didn't know anyone gay. I'm sure I did. Yeah, yeah. Who hadn't come out, did. Yeah, yeah. Who hadn't come out probably.

Yeah, yeah. And so I would argue now knowing what – I would argue if you met me, you'd probably assume I was homophobic, but I wasn't. But I definitely had never been exposed to it. Sure. I moved to New York. A writer named – fuck. Steve – I wish I could remember his last name. He was the head of Us Magazine at the time.

He was a journalist. And so he was an editor. Okay. But he was a really smart dude. Okay. Really, really smart dude. He lived in the village. And the first night I was there, I went out with him and his ex-girlfriend.

And the first night I was there, I went out with him and his ex-girlfriend. Me and his ex-girlfriend ended up running into David Lee Roth and Harvey Cattell and Abel Farrar at a bar. I mean, the craziest night. What do you mean running into them? Mary Lou's on 13th. He happened to know them? David Lee Roth recognized me because I had been written up in Rolling Stone magazine. As the number one partier in the world?

Sitting right next to me, he goes, dude, I just read an article about you. You've got to be kidding me. This is the craziest night. This is absurd. You're telling me, just to give context for the audience, Burt, in a strange twist, was named the number one college partier in America by Rolling Stone magazine. Yeah, it was a six-and-a-half back when like those were those were held for movie

stars oh my god i mean you just didn't have a big article like david lee roth would have articles like um yeah which is why he's probably reading that so david lee roth recognized you at a bar wow and then yelled down to harvey kytel and abel ferrara who were at the end of the bar i was over by i mean it's really in the weeds who's abel ferrara i think he did king of new york oh okay and so i don't know i didn't know who he was okay and i don't know who he is now okay so uh and so but at dinner and then we ended up going down to the meatpacking district for my first gay bar experience where like like i like dudes were like i mean it was like insane night but in that night, this guy Steve said to me, what are you reading right now? I was like, what are you, a nerd?

Like, I don't read. What do you mean read? And he was like, well, you should get a good book. You're in New York. You should go grab a book. Have something to read on the bus or on the subway or just go to the park and have coffee. You don't have a job. I said, well, what's good?

And he said, naked is fucking really good. Yeah. David Cedar is naked, yeah. And so I was walking down 3rd Avenue, and naked was being sold, probably bootleg, on a table. It was being sold on a table. This is an absurd story. And I bought naked. One of the greatest humor books of all time, in my opinion.

Yes. And the only thing I was comfortable with was my first week in New York. The only thing I was comfortable with was the bus, because I knew I could just get off at any time and know where I was comfortable it was my first like week in New York the only thing I was comfortable with was the bus because I knew I could just get off at any time and know where I was yeah

so there was the bus that went up and down 3rd Avenue and I was on that bus and I started reading naked and the Plague of Ticks is the story

and his mom has the teacher over at his house and she's smoking cigarettes and I'm crying laughing. Yeah. Crying, fucking laughing at this story. And this dude sat across the bus with me.

He goes, man, I got to ask, what the fuck are you reading? I go, this is the best book I've ever fucking read. This is the best book. And then it gets to the part where I find out he's gay. And I literally said, wait, is this my first gay friend? Like, I don't know anyone that's gay. And I already know I like this guy. Like, is this like,

so like, I didn't know you could have gay friends. I didn't know any of that. Florida was very, it still is. People, well, I actually, the law's going on there right now. Very simple minded times. But I didn't know you could just like be friends with a gay dude.

Yeah. And so I was like, I had a come to Jesus moment where I was like, what man am I? Am I a guy that goes, whoa, whoa, whoa, closes the books. This is a gay guy. I'm good. Or am I a guy who goes, I don't really give a shit. And then I worked at Barnes & Noble and I met my actual first gay friend. And then was like, and we got along so fucking well that i was like oh my god like

these are all things that never happened to a frat boy from florida yeah but that david sudaris i fucking that guy has a special place in my heart for the rest of my life i love that man i'm curious like because this is the this is a question I get asked the most often, and you probably get asked it a lot too, is like, if you're a young comedian and you want to be a storyteller, how do you start? Because you're only getting five-minute spots. That's an interesting, that's a really interesting,

because I remember getting, I remember getting, I remember getting like, you could get like, you know, five-minute spot at the Boston. Yeah. But I remember DC Benny and I did a storytelling show on Houston. Yeah. And you had to tell one story. And I was so much more proficient at that.

Yeah. And I remember going back to the Boston going, why can't I do what I did there up here? And I remember you got to save it as your superpower and just learn how to do stand-up. You have to learn how to do stand-up. Yeah. Right? You have to learn the fundamentals of hosting,

crowd work, jokes, how to write a joke. Writing a joke is fun as fucking shit. Yeah. It's one of the funnest things to do. And I think that'll all help you explore your personality. And then I think after you get competent at that, then you can start leaning into big, longer form stories.

I can't imagine being, I can't imagine doing what I do today and starting with this skill set and going, you know, like, I don't know. I also think jokes are so fucking important, especially when you do a special. Like, I really try to jack up my jokes per minute so that like, and people don't see it because I don't do traditional jokes, but like, I think I just

write short stories sometimes. Like I was taking a jog the other day and I saw a homeless woman scratching off a lottery ticket. And I thought, what a waste of time. And then I wondered if she saw me jogging and was like, what a fucking waste of time. Like those are, it's a story, but it's, you know, I don't know. Well, yeah, I always, and this is what I always say is like, you know, like this week at the cellar, for example,

I was, I told a story that I was on the subway home to Brooklyn from the comedy cellar from West Forth. And there was, it was late and it's the only, it's two women on the, on the subway and they start arguing with each other. I'm like,

I don't know. And it gets escalates where there's no one else around and one woman goes you bitch the other woman goes you bitch and i was like oh sort of a lateral move and then and then the first woman goes you white bitch and then i'm like i'm out and but but the white bitch looked at me and she just goes, what are you going to do? I'm like the white representative. And I'm just like, I'm not getting involved. And I say to the audience, if it was my own wife, of course,

I would go, excuse me, we're going to go. But that's an example of like, it's a joke, but it's a story. It's like something that happened that fits into, But that's an example of like, it's a joke, but it's a story. Yeah. Right? It's like something that happened that fits into, and it's not done. Like the joke will probably have 40 incarnations in the next three years. And then it'll be, maybe it'll end up on a special, maybe it won't. Yeah.

But chances are, if it ends up in one of my shows, it'll be a subway trip on the way home. And then when I get home, something happens at home. Yeah. That's significant. That's the, that's the larger story. That's the key is that you get all these little, you get these, all these little tidbits that one day, I'm trying to think of a great example of that where you go, oh, like I had this story about my,

I have a story about my dog, us putting our dog down. It's a really great story. It makes me cry because I can't tell it. Yeah. It's hard, but it's a really great story. Yeah. It was slow and apart. And I took this story about shitting my pants and shoehorned it in there.

And was like, women, I was like, I hadn't cried, which was really important. Then I cried. And when men cry, it's like when women shit their pants. And then I go, I shit my pants at a Best Buy one time by a refrigerator. And I tell that story. And it made it so the story got so good, you were like, oh, that when I get to the emotional part, you allowed it for me. I love that. I love that when you have a story that's like,

you're like, it's short, it's good, it's not a great story. And then one day you find that if you cram it into another story, it makes that medium, two medium stories, a banger. What's your, tell me this, what's your strangest Florida story? Because you're such a creature of Florida.

I have so fucking many. And also this, because one of our producers, Peter, is from Florida. strangest florida story because you're such a creature of florida i have so fucking many and and also this because one of our producers peter is from florida why is florida so strange i have i want to try a bit out about this i mean i tried it the other night but it's not working but we have so many fucking predators in florida yes like alligators snakes yes fucking people spiders people yeah there's uh there's school shootings yes there's yes this is a good angle Like alligators, snakes. Yes. Fucking. People. Spiders. People. Yeah. There's school shootings.

Yes. There's. Yes. This is a good angle. But then you look at Germans. Yeah. They have zero predators. Oh, my God.

They don't even have wolves. They have zero fucking predators. That's a funny bit. Well, the funny part. This didn't do well? It didn't. No. You're telling me this didn't get anyone laughing?

I said lightning. We got lightning in Florida. This was a joke. I wanted to land and it didn't. I go, I't, no. You're telling me this didn't get anyone laughing? I said lightning. We got lightning in Florida. This was a joke. I wanted to land, and it didn't. I go, I mean, our lightning was so bad, we weren't allowed to have giraffes at our zoo. Oh, my gosh. That's funny.

And then everyone's like, for real? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's too thinky. It was all premised off of I was in Hawaii with Isla, both my daughters, and we were doing something authentically Hawaiian, and the guy was very casual as he walked through the woods. And he was very casual about everything.

Yeah. And Isla, or through the jungle or whatever, and Isla, Leanne said, like, this guy's got the aloha mentality, huh? And Isla goes, Mom, there are no snakes here, okay? That's all you need to know about these people. They don't have to do with snakes. And Eileen's like, how often are you thinking about snakes, Eileen? She goes, every time I walk in the grass, I look for snakes.

They don't ever have to do that. Now, that's Eileen's broken brain, but I applied that of like, oh, shit. When you go to places with no predators predators no predators yeah it's got to be fucking that's why and then you know germans get killed at a crazy clip in australia oh and and and there was a yeah every sign in australia says don't swim there are alligators then nine swimming in the alley crocodile right and so yeah every every sign in australia is in english and in german every sign we're gonna fact check that and then we're gonna decide whether or not to release that to the public that might be might be wrong might be wrong but

but i think the the but the joke is great like the idea of that florida has so many predators never once in my backyard did i go down to my lake to go fishing and not think a gator could come grab me and I'd disappear forever. Oh, my God. Is that real? That was a real fear? Oh, very real. Very real.

Did you know anybody who had been gated? Of course. Of course there's alligators everywhere in Florida. Everywhere in Florida. Wow. I mean, there was the dude across the lake from me got bit by a moccasin. Yeah. There was a gator.

What's a moccasin? Oh, it's a cottonmouth. It's a black snake with a big white mouth. Okay. Those would be in your yard all the time. They'd just be in your yard. Oh, gosh. Oh, yeah. in your yard all the time they'd be just be in your yard oh god oh yeah oh i definitively remember

finding a moccasin in our up against a flower bed and being like dad and he's like get a shovel and kill it oh my gosh it has to deal with why i have anxiety everyone talks about childhood trauma and i go i want to find out what mine was yeah i bet they're going to go, oh, it was from 7 to 15. Like it was daily. What I want to know, and maybe that's what you end up writing your next hour about or your hour after that. For someone who's so confessional, what's the thing in your mind where you're like,

I'll talk about that someday, but I'm not there yet? Well, right now it's my daughters. Like what they're going through in life and while they're growing into like young women it's been really interesting and really really bizarre and interesting but it's too I can't I can do I've done it here and there yeah but I can't do it on a special yet like I and which is kind of handcuffing a little bit because I don't know where I'm going from this point forward because I need them to get – I need them both to get out of college before I can start talking about this. I have almost the exact same dilemma. Really?

Which is, yeah, I don't talk that much about my wife and daughter. My daughter is eight. I'm like – I just feel like it's their own lives. I try to think about what my own lens is, but then also, I don't know, it's hard. It's hard when you're an autobiographical storyteller because it's ultimately, it's your side of the story. Oh, yeah.

And comedy is based in conflict. Yep. If there's no conflict, there's actually no good scenes or comedy. Yeah. There's a joke I wanted to put in the special that I offered Isla $10,000 for. Oh my God.

She said, nope. Oh my God. She actually said, I'll get your money when you're dead so I don't need it now. Oh my God. Jesus Christ. I am. I remember one time she had something going on pu puberty-wise, and we were sharing it as a family, and it was so goddamn funny. And I had a spot at the Ice House that night,

and I'm literally like, oh, I'm taking this on stage tonight. Yeah. She just looks at me and she goes, this doesn't go on stage. Out of nowhere. And I was like, okay. Okay. I had a thing where, because you were very sweet, you posted a thing about my wife Jenny's poetry. Yeah.

I love poets. Yeah, yeah. I love poetry, and I love her poetry. She literally, because she was literally, when you did that, she was like, is he making fun of me? And I go, no, no, no, Bert's sincere. Like his whole thing, he actually is sincere. sincere like his whole thing he actually is sincere but like but but she and i had a thing that was tricky because she had written a poem about me and her and our daughter that was so

beautiful that it was imbued in my brain as what happened and at a certain point, I wrote, I said on stage, it adds my memory. And she was like, that's my poem. I'm like, that's not what happened? I was like, no. I was like, aha. But that's, it's challenging because it's like, we're all, as writers, we're all writing essentially our side of the story

or our version of events or our construction. And those things can butt into each other. Yeah. My wife calls me a soft narcissist in that I have a kind of like a periscope view of the way I see the world. And it's all about me. Yeah. And I leave a large wake. Yeah. And I leave a large wake. And she's like, yeah, and at times you don't stop to make sure everyone's okay.

Oh, interesting. And I'm like, what do you mean? And she's like, this one bit about Isla. She was like, definitely it's pretty aggressive. You should have run by her first before you started workshopping it. Like I had Leanne one time tell a very vulnerable story about me on a podcast and i was like i was like yo what was up with that she was like are you being serious because you told it everyone i farted during oral sex and she's like anything shy of that i can tell

my gosh that's great and then there's things that she won't like. Like I make this face. I guess I make this face like. Even bringing this up, I think she'll be upset because she goes, I want stuff for us that not everyone knows. But I don't know if it's good. I think everyone deserves to know it. What's the thing that you think is your flaw? No. That someday you'll reckon with

and talk about on stage? Well, my biggest flaw is I'm sensitive. That's not a flaw. I'm overly sensitive. I get my feelings hurt really quick. Really? What's an example? The littlest things hurt my feelings. Sigur is really good at identifying when my feelings get hurt.

He'll be like, hey man, there's no reason to think about that because that's not real and you're building it up. That's nice. I'll take the littlest thing and I'll build it up

something crazy in my head. Yeah. And so I have to learn how to, I don't know if I'll ever reckon with it on stage. I think, yeah, I think,

I wish I wasn't sensitive. I fucking hate it. I hate it so much it's interesting that you describe it as sensitivity because i think it is jen i think jenny and i you know jen's a poet and i'm a comedian and we always describe it as having very sensitive antenna where it's like when you're an artist you just you take in all the stimuli louder. Yeah. You smell it more.

You hear it more. I've got a good gut instinct radar. Yeah. I always could tell if I was getting cheated on before I was getting cheated on. Yeah. I could always tell. I can tell when someone's lying. I can tell.

I've always been really sensitive to everything. Yeah. But it's funny you put it in relation to being sensitive because I think like when I think about what my, the thing that I feel like I'll eventually unpack about myself on stage and I just don't know how to do it yet. I literally, there are certain times I go like, someday, is anger. I just get, I get really angry.

Like the kind of thing that you're saying about like, oh, this person got fucked over by this. It's like, my, somehow my brain goes to a 10 in anger. I have this, I have a mantra. And I don't get, and by the way, and my dad had anger stuff and he used to yell i so i definitively don't yell there's no physical violence so like the only person that hurts is like me there's like probably 10 tumors growing in different parts of my body i i have this thing

in my head that i always go you think i'm weak you think i'm weak because i've had a number of instances where people took liberties with me where I didn't stand up for myself and they knew I wouldn't stand up for myself. Oh yeah. And then they knew, they knew I didn't like conflict. You might as well be writing my life story. Yeah. What you're saying.

And so like, like, uh, and, and I got to a place where I almost got, so like, you know, this morning when this buddy of mine said, just giving you a heads up, this agency, I just heard this agency is trying to fuck you. I start going like, is this the day I stand up for myself? Yeah. Because I've never done it. Right. I've never.

Right. I've never. I have a hard time. I worked with a guy who slapped me in the face one time. And I was like, and I think that was the very beginning of me going. But like I also got bullied in high school. I did too, yeah. And there's something real crazy about getting bullied that where you go,

you go, okay, just let it happen. It's okay. If I fight back, it's going to be worse. So let's just, path leads to resistance, right? Let's get it over with. Let's get this out of the system. And there's no retaliation. One of the guys that, I always got bullied by very, very stupid dudes that were way bigger than me.

And very stupid dudes. Like the stupidest dudes. And it was the actual dumbest human beings that were massive. And it was like, I don't know. I had a fucking – I had a flag on my head. They would find me every goddamn time. Yeah. And it was always physical bullying like slap you on the back or throw you up against a wall or like just tackle you like a full-blown, full like walk into class as a ninth grader.

And dude just comes from out of nowhere and just knocks me to clean the fuck out. Yeah. And I – And you were in an all-boys Catholic high school. Catholic school, yeah. And so was I when I got bullied. Yeah. And for whatever reason, it didn't happen to everyone.

Yeah. And it didn't happen long. It was freshman year. Yeah. As soon as you start getting older that goes away yeah but it did happen and that shit still happens and i and i start wondering like when will be the day i stand up it happened it happened to me with what it's i mean it continually happens yeah where someone tries to fuck me over and and what stinks is i was so happy some people that are above us were happy for their success and so i've been like with everyone and i watched everyone succeed before i did my age and then when i started succeeding some dudes got real fucking shitty and i was like oh wow so you were cool when I was below you and you could talk

to me and tell me what to do. But now that we could be considered peers because we're playing same venues, I'm sometimes bigger than you. And now you have problems with me. So you never were the guy I thought you were. And then that fucking bums me out. No, I feel like that's been one of the most running themes in my whole life is being the mentor and being the mentee. So you're under people and they teach you things. And then sometimes you're over people and you teach them things. And when those roles shift, sometimes it's chaos. I'll tell you one author.

I'll tell you one author that will blow your fucking mind. I'll tell you a couple authors. Oh, my God. And then you get someone like Rogan in your life who really wants you. I mean, look, I'll never be bigger than Rogan. I don't think anyone in our business ever will. But he wants you to blow up as hard as you can. He gets excited.

I don't know him well, but he seems genuinely happy for the people. I think the only thing that makes him happier, I don't even know if he registers his success at all. I think he watches other people blow up and that brings him joy. Yeah, that's really interesting. And this is actually a suggestion for any writers listening too.

Some of the stuff, as you can hear from me and Bert being like, we'll talk about this off air. Some of it, you just write into a fictional movie. And you don't use the names and you call it a day. And that's what it is. Oh, that's fucking good. Here's a joke. This is a new joke that I'm working on. These are all half-baked ideas that I throw on the podcast

just as a starting point, but true story, when I was starting out, I was opening for this guy in Cleveland, and I'm backstage, and I'm writing jokes on my laptop. He goes, how much do you pay for that laptop? I go, I don't know, maybe $500. He goes, I get you that laptop for $200. I go, how?

And he goes, it's hot. And I was so naive. I didn't even know what hot meant. I was like, what do you mean? He goes, it's stolen. And I was like, no thanks. You know, like good little boy. He's like, I thanks. Good little boy. He's like,

I get it for $150. Now I'm thinking, hot seems pretty good. That's sort of my price range. And then I started thinking, oh no, is he going to steal my laptop from me and sell it back to me? Yeah, yeah. It's got your files on it. It's got photos of your family.

I set you up already. I set it all up for you. You'll love this one. Yeah. That one's called Hot Laptops in Cleveland. Hot Laptops in Cleveland. I have so many stories. I'm just starting to unpack all the stories I have of starting out opening for people.

Because even someone you probably know, a guy in Florida who owned a club down there, he was opening for me one time in, I want to say Rochester or something like that when I was starting out. At the end of the weekend, he goes, I didn't know he was a club owner. I didn't know anything. He goes, I run a club in Florida. He goes, and I've decided you're not ready for it.

I'm just like, I didn't know I was auditioning. I'd like to withdraw my nomination. That's fucking hilarious. That's just a random thing I wrote down. And then the other one I wrote down is when I was starting out, I was opening for this guy in West Virginia, one-nighter, middle of nowhere. And this guy goes, you live in New York City? I went to New York City once. All I saw was the inside of an abortion clinic. And I was like, whoa. I was

like, wow, you really have to spend a week there to get a feel for the town. I'd see the Empire State Building, go see the tree at Rock Center around holidays. The abortion clinics are nice. Yeah, that was one of your things. Oh, that's great. I've been digging into that. Do you have any stories, or either half jokes or whatever, but like, do you have any stories from starting out

where you're just like, this is absurd? I mean, the early road for me was so, it was so emotional because I was so like, I wasn't the kind of guy that could hustle and get a chance. Yeah. Like I didn't know. Like I remember my first headlining gig came from, I was at Laughs Unlimited, and there was this guy, his name, I forgot his name.

They owned the Amarillo Comedy Club. They were three brothers, and they each had escalating drug habits. Oh, wow. But one of them was a piano player. He's passed. I think they all overdosed. He passed. He was a piano player for the comedy store.

And I was opening for him, and he was having a hard time following me. Yeah. And he went over to the club manager and said, hey, you need to get him headlining. He shouldn't be featuring. And she goes, we don't headline features. And he goes, how do you think they become headliners? And she goes, we only headline headliners. Features remain features.

And he goes, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. And he looked at me and he goes, I have a club in Amarillo, Texas. Would you like to headline next week? And I said, yeah. And he goes, he's a headliner now. Why don't you headline? And then I went to Amarillo next weekend, and his brother picked me up. His brother's name was Kevin.

And his brother was addicted to pills, and he had fallen and had very little use of one of his hands. So he'd use this arm to hold the steering wheel. With this arm, he'd smoke a 100 Marlboro and feather his hair with a brush because he was high. And he was just perfectly high on pills. So you see a comb and a cigarette. Kelly Moran, Kevin Moran. The Moran brothers.

I was really good friends with Kenny. He was their youngest brother. And Kenny and I were roughly the same age. And we used to party. I heard Kenny passed away. And then I heard, I know Kelly passed away. I'm sure, I hope Kevin's still alive. I hope he's.

And then that first weekend I did it, guy said to me the first night, he goes, you can say whatever the fuck you want to say. You want to say the N-word? Say the N-word. I don't give a fuck. I hear one GD, I'm pulling your ass off. I go, and he walked out, and I go, what the fuck's a GD? Like, what's GD? And they go, god damn,

you can't say god damn. I go, I can say the N-word, but I can't say god damn. I go, what kind of fucking rules are these? No, GD is so serious. GD, because I grew up on GD. My dad used to say it all the time. So when I went out into the universe, I was just like, yeah, goddamn,

this fucking goddamn car doesn't run. People were like, you go to the South. I started out touring South. People were like shocked. Yeah. Shocked. And then, yeah, so I would do gigs where they would go, I started out touring people were like like shocked yeah shocked and then yeah so I would do gigs

where they they would go you can say whatever you want no GD I remember that a lot and the rule was you had to be on stage one hour

I gotta sell beers one hour you need to be on stage for one fucking hour if I'm if you five minutes short I'm I'm

doxing your pay. I just knew it about my wife where I go. My wife loves me. The other day she made me pancake. I go, you heard that correctly. It was just the one pancake. She made my daughter pancakes. She made about four.

She made me pancake. And I think she loves me because she's aware of my health profile. My health profile should have about pancake. She's like, pancake. And so I wanted to do something sweet for her because in marriage, we're all keeping score, which I'm trying to blow out this idea of we're all keeping score even though we say we're not keeping score. We're keeping score.

I'm going too fast. I'm writing, keep going. Yeah, yeah, so so then I go to like her favorite cafe and I get her coffee and like the and like coffee these days like literally the price changes in real time like you go and I'm like they're like it's six dollars I'm like what they're like it's nine dollars I'm like what they're like it's seventeen dollars I'm like what they're like we're closed and then the guy on the and I'm still holding like $45 worth of coffee. And the guy goes, do you want pastries with this? I go, my wife made me a pancake.

And he goes, what? I go, make me a pancake. He goes, what? I go, we're closed. So anyway, that's a little segment of a thing I've been working on. I thought you were going to say, my wife made me a pancake. And I really appreciated how she is aware of my health health profile and she knew this is what I needed. So that night I gave her a sec.

That's funny. Or something. There's something to that. I always go, I always like. The singles and the plurals, the various singles, singulars and plurals.

Singulars I gave her. That's funny. But I'm trying to write a few. My daughters, I'm trying to write a bit about my daughters today, their personalities today. Yeah. Because they've just changed. And I have a little bit in this special.

Yeah. They're bullies, and I have a little bit in this special. But I would love to. I'm excited. We'll take a trip this summer. We'll all take a trip, and then I'll get a bit out of that. That's interesting. Yeah.

That's such a comic thing to say. I'm going on a trip. I'll get a bit out of that. We went snorkeling in Bali and I realized I only like my daughters when they're scared. Yeah. So their only real capacity to love me is when they're terrified. That's so funny. I hate a confident child.

Oh, that's so funny. I have a thing where I'm like, my daughter's eight, so it's like joyous. She loves me. Eight's the best. She's so great. She's so great. I can't live in the present, and so my mind goes to her 16-year-old self. That's like, my dad's garbage.

You know what I mean? I was there. I was there. And of course, when I was there, I was there. And, and, and of course, you know, now, you know, when I was younger, we used to disregard kids, like, well, no one listened to us, but now I'm going to have to be like, she's so brave. I am garbage. She's so right. You know what my daughter did to me. So she began the pandemic. She's like 15, 15 maybe. And she will ask if she can go on bike rides with her friends i go hey guys i'm weird about breaking rules i don't want you breaking the rules she's like dad it's

just a bike ride i said nothing bad's happening right she's like no i said no one's like getting close together and i was like no no one's getting close together and uh and and then i found out that they were going out and they were smoking weed and drinking white and so i was like and and what i did was i decided i'm gonna take my energy here yeah and let her know how fucking angry she i am and how much trouble she is yeah and what i did is i created a paradigm within which she knew she knew as how hard the dog could bark and how hard his bite felt. So she's like, well, there's no reason to ever tell him the fucking truth because if I get caught lying, it's going there anyway. Right.

He's not going to get twice as mad if he catches me lying. Yeah. I might as well just fucking live in the lie. Yeah. Because he's going to yell. Yelling is what happened. And it wasn't until I didn't yell and I didn't punish her for her. She was sneaking with friends in her car and driving around town.

I didn't yell and I didn't punish her that she started listening and being like, you're not mad? I go, no, I'm furious. But I'm not going to yell at you because that doesn't do anything. Right. And so I learned with her and me and Georgia are doing great now, but we had like a fucking, like if we were dating, we would have broken up. Yeah. Yeah.

We would have broken up, and our roommate would have been like, you guys aren't good together. Yeah. This is actually one last thing about marriage, which is about I feel very lucky. Like when I think about what I feel luckiest about in the world, I'm lucky for my daughter. I'm lucky that I found the person in the world, my wife, who understands me the most. And you're so lucky if you find that person. Yeah.

That said. I love the most. And you're so lucky if you find that person. Yeah. That said, I love the turn. About once a week, she will stare at me while I'm doing an activity. And she'll just say, what are you doing? And I'll explain what I'm doing. And then she'll just start laughing. Not with me, just at me with no one. Yeah. I'll say, why are you laughing? She'll say, no reason. And then that's the end of the conversation. That's the person who understands me the most,

which is why sometimes I'm lonely, but for the most part, I'm all right. That's great. It's just sort of the beginning. It's a jumping off point for like talking about stuff. I'll tell you the weird thing I the weird thing I had thought about marriage. I was having sex with Leanne and I was looking in her eyes

and I realized these are the eyes I'll see when I die. Powerful. And I thought, I thought they'll be older then. Yeah. Will I still see the beauty that I do? And I realized I would rather be looking at old eyes that I've been with forever than young eyes that are impatient and want to start their second chapter in their life. Because if I get a second wife and she's like, let's say I marry a second wife, 33 is probably

the perfect age that I go for right now. That's like my litmus. So then I die at 70, she's going to be like, in her 50s, she's going to be like, I'm still young. That's like my litmus. So then I die at 70. She's going to be like in her 50s. She's going to be like, I'm still young. I still got a second chapter. She's like, I'm ready to open a yoga studio. Like, let's go. Let's die, buddy. I need this inheritance.

Let's go. Let's die, buddy. And I go, but Leanne, she'll look at me. She'll be like, you were my one. You were my one. I think about death a lot. I think about death a lot. You were my one. You think about death a lot. I think about death a lot. You were my one.

You were my boy, boo. That's great. Yeah. I love that. Is that in the new special? No, no, no. Have you done it? No, I just.

Oh, that's great. Sometimes I'll have deeper thoughts that I think. Oh, forget about it. That thing's done. Throw that on stage. The last thing is working out for a cause, nonprofit that you like. I don't even know what a nonprofit is. Charity.

Oh, like is it a charity? They go, do you have a nonprofit? And I go, what the fuck's a nonprofit? I go, Michael Birpiglia should know me well enough to know I don't have a nonprofit. I go, Big Girls Little Boys is a good one. And they go, what the fuck's a nonprofit? I go, Michael Bropigli should know me well enough to know I don't have enough. I go, Big Girls Little Boys is a good one. And they go, what's that? And I go, it's for small guys that marry taller women.

It just helps them assimilate into society. This is ridiculous. What's the charity you like? I'm a St. Jude guy. St. Jude's, yeah. Great. We've given to them before. They do a great job. We'll give to them again. We'll link to them in the show notes so that people can donate as well. Bert, such a joy to talk to you.

I could talk to you forever, dude. Forever. I could talk to you forever. I can't wait to start texting on the text premises to you and go, I know. Is there something here? Working it out because it's not done. Working it out because cause it's not done Working it out, cause there's no hope That's going to do it for another episode of Working It Out.

I love that Bert Kreischer. You can follow him on Instagram at atbertkreischer. His special is out right now on Netflix. His movie's coming out in May. Follow all things Bert Kreischer, our producers of Working It Out Are Myself along with Peter Salamone and Joseph Birbiglia, associate producer Mabel Lewis, consulting producer

Seth Barish, assistant producer Gary Simons, Lucy Jones and Nick Dimitrilakis sound mix by Ben Cruz supervising engineer Kate Balinski special thanks to Marissa Hurwitz, Josh Upfall David Raphael and and Nina Quick. I can say Gliari's with Mike Berkowitz.

Special thanks to Jack Antonoff and Bleachers for their music. Jack produced just another great album, that Lana Del Rey album that's out right now. So good. Special thanks to J-Hope Stein, my wife, the poet. Little Astronaut is in bookstores right now. And if you follow her on Instagram, at J- Hope Stein, my wife, the poet, little astronaut, is in bookstores right now. And if you follow her on Instagram, at J. Hope Stein,

she just put out these beautiful, beautiful broadsides that are signed, like of little astronaut, the poem. You can just hang them up in your office or your house. They're just really, really pretty. And some other poems that she wrote. Those are, you can follow her on at J. Hope Stein on Instagram. Special thanks thanks as always to our daughter Una

who built the original radio fort made of pillows. Thanks most of all to you who are listening. Rate and review us on Apple Podcasts if you have three minutes.

Tell us what your favorite episode is. We'd love to hear from you in the comments and the reviews. Tell your friends. Tell your enemies. You know that

Burt Kreischer is a great example. He just wanted to read a book. The David Sedaris story. He just wanted to read a book. Someone goes, and then he goes, what book would you read if you were going to read a book? And the person said David Sedaris.

And then he picked it up and it changed his life. It changed his darn life. You could be changing lives by recommending this podcast. I'll see you next time, everybody.