Mind the Game - Cooper Flagg, The NBA Draft and Prospective Rule Changes

Episode Date: June 24, 2025

The NBA Draft is this week and LeBron James and Steve Nash reflect on their own draft experiences. LeBron then talks about his mindset as a sure fire number one pick and shares his thoughts about this year’s prospective number one pick, Cooper Flagg. Finally, the guys talk through various rule changes such as the 4-point line and eliminating the charge. Thanks for watching Mind the Game and stay tuned for a VERY special episode next week!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

What if you could still stand in and take a charge? There's just no call. You could step in. Like, if you're coming down the lane, I'm not meeting here at the rim. But maybe I could slide in and take a charge. I don't get a charge. The rest are just like, no, there's already too much conflict between players and referees already. Could you imagine they take, you take a charge?

Anyways, no, charge stays. Charge got to stay, right? Got to stay. I think that makes the game too wild. Yeah, got to stay. Too wild. Like arch rivals. Yeah, remember that game on Nintendo?

ArchWildo was going crazy. Welcome back, Mind the Game. Another time round. Let's do it. Yeah. I got a call the other day from the great Grant Hill. Grant Hill, with my former teammate, a good friend, someone, I think the world of, who's now, what is Grant's title of USAB?

Is it president, CEO? Everything. Everything. Everything. But basically running USAB trying to keep that world supremacy. Yeah, for sure. Which is a tricky task. Have a job this past summer, too.

Yeah. Last summer. Yeah, great job. But he called me up and he said, you know, he's been listening to the pot. He's enjoyed it. Oh, really? Yeah. Which I was like, are you clearly not busy enough?

Gee? But, you know, one thing he said to me was that he was really impressed with your voice this summer, your leadership. He also said you were the first to meetings, first on the bus. I don't want to make you sound like a, you know what I mean, goody two shoes here, but I will say from a coaching perspective, when your best player, most famous player, most kind of accredited player, sets that standard every day.

There's a trickle down. There's a care factor. There's a priority place on what we're doing. Maybe just talk a little bit about where that comes from. Where does that desire to be there, be early? Yeah. I don't know. I think I was like, I think I was born into it for some of my reason.

know like I've always had a feeling of like um I didn't I don't like being late to anything it was always like it's always I feel like it's like a disrespectful thing you know my stomach starts to hurt a little bit anxiety my anxiety starts to ramp up if I'm if I'm late or even or tardity it happened when I was even like in like elementary school like you know if the bell rung and before I was in my chair like I I would, I guess my whole day will be messed up, you know. And when I started to play sports, you know, I always wanted to be at practice early. Did that come from your mom?

A part of that? Was that just something innate in you the way you were wired? I didn't pick it up from my mom. I don't think so. Like, I don't think I picked up from my mom. I literally, I think I was just born that way. I've always been like, in my anxiety, I can't function right when I'm late. And it's, and it's stuck with me throughout my, obviously, now I'm, you know, 40 years old.

But when I started playing organized sports, it was like the perfect match, like, for me. Because, like, it's like, if you're not on time to practice, you won't have to run. Like, I play football first, Little League football. Like, if you didn't run, you'd have to run sprints or you have to run dashers or 17s. And I know football people out there, they know exactly what those are. And that shit is punishment. You do not want to be late until football. practice and have to run, you know, gashers or 17s or hundreds. I never, I never, unless like,

you know, I didn't have the means like to, you know, my mom didn't have a car when we were growing up and, you know, so if I was late because of someone picking me up late or whatever the case may be, and I couldn't control that, even though I was still having anxiety about being late, some things I couldn't control. But like, you know, to hear Grant say those words, man, and it's just always been in me, man. And, you know, I feel like, you know, I feel like, you especially when you start playing sports and you're around other people and as you get older and older and older

and you go from little league to middle school ball to high school ball and if it's either college or the professionals, wherever you are, I think I always looked at it as like a disrespect to, you know, the people that you're working with you know, you're late you're like you disrespecting other people's time

you know and I never I never felt good about that And I, you know, I didn't, what other people do, that's what other people do, you know, but for me personally, like being on time has always been being late to me. Yeah. You know, so to be able to get the places early and like, you know, I didn't know what's setting the tone for the rest of the group, you know, whatever stage that was. But to be there on time, I feel like it was late and I wanted to be there extra early, you know, talk to the coaches you know this past you know past summer you know when we was in you know

for the olympic team being able to you know the coaches are going to be there a little bit early they talk about what they want to do tonight versus the opponents or practice i get there early and just kind of you know watch the film or talk to them and see what it was going on and then the guys started trickling in and coming in but it's just like just always kind of been me well it's said I mean when teammates start trickling in and they see you're there time and time again early it does set a standard it also shows them how much you care Right, I think that's really important, like, for everyone to recognize, like, oh, this means a lot to Braun. Yeah, for sure.

What about the voice? It's another part of leadership. He was really impressed with how you use your voice and how willing you were, whether it's film, shoot around, on the bench. He just was impressed, like, talk me through where that came from? Came from one, like, you know, you probably wasn't there for rookie year, right? No. You know, like maybe high school, yeah, it was, of course, natural. you're moving to a new league and then you have to find your voice as a player what's the

evolution there um i was i was a i was a class clown and um so so you weren't always a brown nose no no no that only started the last couple years uh i was a class clown and a jokester and um i mean i still am today like i'm all my people know i like i love laughing and joking and things of that nature. And so I think that's where the kind of the voice stemmed from. But when I started playing sports, like some of my little league coach just said, okay,

you need to use it to an advantage, you know, of playing the sport too, you know, and helping some of the other kids out with your voice that may not feel confident in their ability to talk or maybe don't want to talk. And,

you know, and then I got to high school and, you know, my high school coaches would tell me like the best thing about you besides your skill or whatever the case may be is your voice, you know, being able to, you know, call out plays before they happen, you know, you know, call out our sets when we were coming down, being the back line of the defense. We ran a lot of press, you know, in high school and I would be on the second line of the press so I could shoot the gaps and things like that, get steals of that nature.

And so I was the one kind of calling out the sets if it was like, you know, we used to We had 12 and 21, and 12 was half-court press. 21 was full-core press. So I was always calling out those sets. And even when I was like a freshman, you know, it was me and Maverick. Maverick was our senior captain. But, you know, I was the one like my voice was kind of the loudest, even as a 14-year-old freshman. And, you know, that went all the way into my senior year.

My voice was always, you know, commanding, and, you know, and just knowing what was going on the floor and they helped our team you know we was able to win three state championships in four years and i seen how it translated you know it kind of slowed down a little bit my rookie year in the NBA not because the voice wasn't there it's just because i felt like okay i need to sit back and soak in knowledge and learn and just see you know how can i when was my voice going to be needed you know i didn't want to go in there just like like when i was the number one player in the country my senior year but i knew when i got drafted i was number 4.50. That's how I looked at it. I was like, okay, so how can I get back to number one? Like I did

when I was a freshman to my senior year, how can I get back to number one? And I felt like it wasn't going to be me talking. I needed to soak in the knowledge. I needed to learn. I need to earn it, you know. And I think when Mike Brown... I just like everyone out there to hear that. LeBron James came in the NBA and thought, I need to earn it. Yeah. That, like, hold on. Yeah, yeah. We don't see enough of that anymore. Yeah, yeah.

I definitely came in with the, I'm 450. Let's start from 450. You know, the last player in the league, not saying that I was, but that was my mindset. How can I gain back to number one? And then when Mike Brown took over our team, you know, a couple years after, after, I think it was my third year, maybe my fourth year. He was a defensive-minded coach, big time. big time defensive mind the coach and he would hear me speak in practices or like like in the summer we'd come in and play and he would hear me you know hear my voice my voice was you know very commanding he was like in order for us to be you know one of the best defensive teams in the league up there was San Antonio and Detroit and you know some of the better teams I'm going to need your voice I'm going to need it and and from from there on I was able to do what I did best you know it wasn't something I needed to learn It was something I had, but now I was able to use that tool to our advantage.

And it's just from year three to year 22, it's been here. Growing. Yeah, it's been here. So in high school, your presses were 12 and 21? Yeah. I just like to apologize to my high school coach. Yeah. I don't remember shit we ran.

I'm really sorry. I don't remember one thing we ran high school. I know I had a great time. I know you were a hell of a coach. Yeah, we had diamond. We had diamond. How do you remember that? How do you remember that stuff?

We had diamond 12, 21. We had fifth, double fist. Double fist was when we turned you in the back court. And on the second turn, we jumped. We trapped. That's amazing. Yeah, yeah. We was, yeah, our defense schemes were great.

How many games ago was that? Oh, my God. So many. What is it? 22 years. My last high school game was in March of 2003. We in year 2025. Oh, my God.

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It's NBA draft season. Oh, here we go. It's a draft. Incredible time. Incredible time, man. incredible time for the newcomers coming in first of all good luck to all you guys to the guys to get drafted to the guys that slide to the guys that don't get drafted does not mean that it's that your dream is not going to be accomplished man just no matter if you get picked one

don't matter if you don't get picked um no matter if you slide like the work is the work thank you and and and that's all that matters um but i wish the best of all the guys that draft and it should be a great one man i love that though uh you were the number one pick yeah we all knew that for two years three years coming in uh i was you know a senior at santa clara was hoping to get picked 15th in the first round i knew probably knew by the end i was going to be a first round pick but like took me four years of college there's guys that go undrafted uh-huh a r was a r undrafted yep yes yes you know who are incredible players in the league we all develop at different rates

we all develop at different rates so do not hang your hat on the draft in the draft alone can I read something yeah I'm gonna read something let's dig in the archives yeah I'm gonna dig an archive so I have a group chat with me

Bronny and Bryce okay and you know from time to time I'll send just you know things that just you know focus them back in so I sent this June 18th for 2024

I'll tell you who this guy is after I read this unranked in high school zero D1 scholarship offers played three years of Division II basketball at UCCS

I know who it is transferred to Colorado and now is the NBA champion the best teams in the NBA that guy is Derek White hell of a player

hell of a player and my message was to them everybody's role to success is different so stay locked in and patient that was my message to my boys last year your message yeah so I mean

there's a lot of stories like that's funny right like there's almost there's more stories like that than there is stories like yours right correct people I didn't recognize that I had one scholarship offer Stephen Curry did not get a scholarship to his dad's alma mater Virginia Tech his dad played in the league for a long time I don't remember Kauai Leonard being on a lot of radars even when he got to the league you go around there's a lot of guys that

develop I mean Janis coming from where he came Yokic second round pick second round you go through the league they're littered you know with people that got there in a circuit in a circuit in a sortuitous way let's say it's almost more common than the person that got there from high school all-American to college all-americans it's way more common than the LeBron James and the Cooper flags right right I'll tell you that yeah well that's great message I'm glad you could share that with us. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Speaking to Cooper, you know, he's in a position you can relate to. He's the consensus number one and terrific player. Terrific player. What do you remember about being in that position? Like, what advice would you give him? Like, you know you're the number one pick of the whole world of basketball is looking at you. It's got to come with a lot of expectations. Yeah, absolutely.

Well, I mean, one, obviously, you're super excited. It's like, you know, shit, it's what we all dreamed about as kids and sitting in your, laying in your bed, you know, with the basketball, just shooting up. up you know at the ceiling you know working on your form on that you know just doing that or you know if you if you were able to get a basketball hoop in your in your in your driveway then you're doing the whole countdown five four three two one wanting to hit a big buzzer shot you know in the NBA at some point and then you're wearing you're wearing other people's jerseys growing up you're wearing other guy's shoes just like all that's type of stuff playing video games well other people you're

inspired to be and want to be a part of and now the moment is here so you're just like it's a You're in awe, man. You're like, wow, I can't believe that this dream is finally coming true. You know, and at the same time, there's a little anxiety and pressure that comes with it, too. Because, you know, as the number one pick, the expectations are automatically put on you. It doesn't matter if they're right or wrong, you know, and we're around the same age. You know, I was 18 when I was drafted, I believe Cooper's 18, maybe turning 19 soon, but it's all same. but it takes time man it takes time and the expectation to wanting to put a 18 year old 19 kid

in a position where he's like he needs to be great right away I think it's unfair but it's also something that I think we can you know as kids like myself and Cooper can use as like motivation as well and I personally think that he wants to be great you know you know you know He had a hell of a year at Duke, a guy that can do so many different things on the floor, can play with the ball, can play without the ball. You know, his jump shot is going to continue to get better, super athletic, quick second jump. And also, he has the benefit, unlike myself, he gets to join a team that's established. With Hall of Fame guys, Clay Thompson, Anthony Davis, Kyrie Irvin, right off the bat,

Hall of Fame coach Jason Kidd, you know, these guys are like they're going to, they can give him the whole blueprint while he continues to learn what his blueprint will be. And I think that's going to be an incredible thing for him to have to have that type of presence, that type of leadership, that that type of, you know, just basketball IQ and knowledge around him every single day from those, those pieces. So I think he's going to be amazing. And in an environment, right, that's not like, one of the worst team in the league.

Right, right, right. You're learning bad habits, you know, that happens too, man. You get guys that you never know what their trajectory should have been based on if they were in a toxic environment or losing environment or an environment that had great habits.

You know, like we mentioned Kauai. Like, you know, we don't, We don't know if Kauai would have ended up somewhere without those type of built-in habits in San Antonio would he have been, you know, he would have probably been great, obviously. But he had time to hone those skills, be around Timmy, be around Manu,

be around Tony, be around Pop, to where he was able to get better on his own time and not the league's time. Right. So unique, I mean we forget, right? But the player, obviously now he's such a world-class player, but he's playing for championships right away. Yeah, absolutely. That's a totally different.

It's a very unique position for a rookie. Did you play with Cooper in the summer? Were you in those practices with USCB? Yeah, yeah. He was on the development team, on the select team, we call them. Yeah, and he played extremely well, man. I've been watching Cooper for a few years because my son played AAU basketball on the Nike EYBL circuit, Bronny.

So, you know, we would be in tournaments either in like, you know, Peace Jam in Georgia or Kansas City or Dallas or Indianapolis. And, you know, Cooper, unlike a lot of kids, he played for his team out of Maine. A lot of these kids are going to like. Recrued in it. Yeah, recruited whatever, him and his brother. And a bunch of those guys they grew up with played on the, I think they were called, I forgot it was Maine Select or something like that. But he made them competitive, like versus teams that were stacking teams, you know, him and his brother.

You know, I thought that was just super cool because I was how I remember me, that's how I was. You know, I played for the Northeast Ohio shooting stars. Like me and my guys grew up playing together and having to play all the best teams in the country. I just thought that was super cool. But, you know, he's a big time talent. Yeah, said something about his mentality. What did you notice, practicing with him?

What did you notice about his mentality? Oh, he just, it's all, he just made winning, he's a winner. It just seemed like he made winning plays. Even at his first year at Duke, you know, just made winning plays. You know, and obviously, you know, the fact that he was the freshman and I think it's player to year this year as well, ACC player to year, you know, and I just thought he just played the game the right way,

how you will hope that, you know, a player of his caliber just comes to work every day that's trying to get better, and I just think he's been getting better and better. That's a great indicator, right, of his success, willing to make small plays that mean a lot to winning. So I would say, like, the one thing for such a prodigious talent that we want to wait and see what happens with

is how good is he with the ball? Right? Like he obviously is capable with the ball. We've seen him do a lot of things with the ball. But is he that primary guy, will he be? But I love to hear that like, while I think he's going to get there, love to hear that his mentality is I'm happy to do whatever the team needs. Yeah, yeah. And a lot of people, he has the ability to do it at this, you know, especially at this point, you know, when you have, you know, the guys that they have, he doesn't have to put pressure too much more pressure on himself. You know, he can put the pressure on himself to get better every single day. But as far as, you know, his rookie ear or his second year, he doesn't have to put the pressure of making every play. He has guys out there that can help him with that. So, you know, he, I think he could possibly be in a position where he could, you know, be. You know, into who he's going to be at his pace and not with the league expect the number one player picked. Where's my 25 a night? Right, exactly. What you should be doing is your number one player.

You're number one player out of high school, but like, you know, maybe that's not my timeline. I hope he doesn't get pressured by what the narrative timeline is because you're the number one player. Yeah. So what do you think it looks like? I mean, that's a huge thing for him to go to a winning team where the pressure is not on him to score 25 a night from the start. That's awesome.

great for his development. But there must be, like you've been in this business, there must be a little bit of a sense of relief on draft night just to get it behind you. Yeah, for sure. You feel that way? Yeah, yeah. And then what does it look like?

What was your mentality after the draft? Because now it's like you've built up to this thing, like you said, in the driveway, in bed at night. Now you're drafting. You are going to an NBA team here, moving to a city. What was your mindset like? I mean, obviously you knew you were going to Cleveland early. He knows he's going to Dallas.

What was your mindset like of like, this is what this summer looks like? Yeah, yeah. It was, you know, I have. Young young guys. Yeah, yeah. Super young. Yep. You know, I have been building up for the NBA for a couple of years.

You know, like, you know, my junior and senior year of high school, I have been, you know, I wouldn't say building up to like, you know, to play against those guys. But I kind of knew that, you know, after my junior year that I had an opportunity to go straight out high school. So I was kind of building up, you know, my reps, building up my strength, building up my stamina, things of that nature. And then right after the draft, I was like, okay, you know, just get to work. You know, I knew Summer League was coming up, you know, and I didn't get an opportunity to be a part of Vegas long, long, many, many years ago. Where was it? We was in Boston to start and then Orlando. Yeah.

Yeah, that was a more regional in Utah out here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Way back there at Long Beach. Yeah, they had long. I remember that. Yeah, I remember that. So I was just getting ready for, you know, for Summer League. And it was just a lot, though.

Like, I couldn't really, like, you know, really, really. locking in on like you know you had so much to do you got the media stuff to do the espies was going on and you know they want you at the espies and you know once you're summer league here but I just wanted to have fun with the process you know and you know I enjoyed it it was a lot of pressure you know the games were like sold out for summer league games and it was a lot of pressure in that sense but I just want to try to have a lot of fun with it and make the most out of this summer going into my rookie year so how did you like how did you manage like everyone's personality is different like I could see you

enjoying going to the SB's and being like the center of attention in a way because you have a fun gregarious personality that my Cooper may not be that way what was your approach to that stuff like yeah the SBs obviously I got all this Nike stuff media stuff other brands like how did you as an 18 year old kind of manage that yeah I mean I mean it was fun for me you know it was super fun for me you know um you know I always kept the main thing the main thing you know like I understood that um at the end of the day I had to I had to work like if I wanted to enjoy that I needed to work and even when I came out to L.A. and you know did the SPs I literally left Summer League in Boston flew here for the SPs I believe and then right after that I had to fly to her back to Orlando you know but I didn't

miss I didn't miss a day in the gym you know I stayed in the gym I wanted to work I wanted to get better and I and I also wanted to have fun and enjoy it but at the same time understanding what the main goal was and the main goal for me is the only reason I'm able to I'm invited to the SPs is because I played a game of basketball and that is you make sure you keep that the main thing that's the focus right you know and I think for Cooper as long as he understands you keep the main thing the main thing man you know Pat Rowley has made that you know a famous quote I kind of knew that I knew that even as an 18 year old kid as long as I keep the main thing the main thing then nothing will sway me

away from what I want my career to look like. That's a good message. At the end of the day is the work, right? Stacking days, being consistent. There's no substitution for our work. There's no substitution for work. It's the main separator, right, is how we work. What do you think, why do you think some players

thrive more in the NBA than in college? I mean, that's a great question. Obviously, when I watch, Some college games, and I'm going to be honest, it's hard to watch college games a lot because of the space. The spacing, it feels like everyone. Yeah, it feels like everyone is in the paint. Everyone is in the paint.

And some programs do a great job of now trying to open it up. And, you know, I watched Florida, you know, this past year. They kind of play a version of like the NBA style, you know, a couple years ago, the Connecticut. a team, you know, their, their version of, you know, passing in and cutting and keeping his space and keeping everybody out of the paint. But ultimately, you could still just, if you want to, you could just stand in the paint defensively and not move. You know, so I think, you know, you bring certain guys into the league that maybe didn't thrive as much in college,

but the space. Also, you know, one thing that, you know, it's funny what Ronnie told me, He was like, the best thing about the NBA compared to college is that I can literally just focus straight on basketball. Yeah. You know, like in college I had to go to class. You know, you have to meet, you have to do your work and stuff like that. You have to, you know, go to, you know, all these things that's going on on campus and meet with the academic advisors here and then meet with these people here.

He's like, you know, as much as you think basketball is like the main thing, in college sometimes it's not right you know he said once you know once i got drafted and realized listen oh all i got i could just go to the gym early get my work in practice go home take a nap and i could come back to the gym again like and then go home and go to sleep play my game like he was like this is the best so i think you're able to hone your skills and just play more basketball too which helps a lot of guys too yeah we also had luke on with us talking about how it's almost easier sometimes in the NBA because of the space, even though he also said the players are way better than maybe the early or college, but the spacing does make the game and the pace

makes the game, you have more opportunities. The only problem is to be successful in the NBA, like to be efficient as an NBA player, like we're talking about there's not that many people on the planet that are really efficient NBA players. So yeah, okay, you've got more space in time now you've got to make something happen with it, right, like day after day after day after day and be consistent. You know, it's interesting we talk about, you know, the top pick, Cooper, We talk about some players going undrafted. It's an interesting time too with NIL.

Because if you're not a guaranteed first round pick and you're making really good money now to stay in college, that's a big consideration. One, financially, and two, you can develop in a safe space. The NBA, it's a risk. You could come out, go in the second round, or not get drafted and not make the team. Right?

It's interesting. I think it's going somewhere positive. It's just a bit lawless, right? Yeah, yeah, it's a little lawless right now. Yeah, it's a little bit lawless right now. You gotta figure it out. But I think, like you said, as far as, yeah, you have the, you're not as stressed out about

declaring for the draft and then having to stay in, you know, if I hired an agent or whatever the case may be, and not get drafted, you know, if you feel like you're not ready and you're developing, you know, the NIL is there. Right. you're still able to make good money, stay on campus still, play great ball. Facilities are on a real college. Facilities are great, you know, or, you know, hit the transfer portal.

Maybe, you know, you go somewhere else, you know, and you're able to, you know, cash in on the NIL as well and continue to develop until you believe that you're ready or now the scouts are even, you know, talking more. Your name is out there a little bit more saying that you are ready. So it's definitely a thing, like you says, the NIA is a little lawless right now, But maybe kids are making money, man. It was, you know, shit. Yeah, it's great.

But it feels like, is there a plan coming together? It's a little disorganized. The other thing about the draft that's interesting to me is like the way the game's becoming so positionless, I feel like there's a premium on that positionless player with potential. And it seems like it's evolving. I'd love to get your take on this, but like it started like three and D guys because they could guard multiple positions. They could stretch the floor. You watch these two teams in the finals.

They're asking their quote-unquote three-and-d guys now to be able to play Blender. So, like, it's not just stand in the corner, make a three-in-guard. It's now you've got to be able to guard different positions. You've got to be able to make a perimeter shot. You also have to, when given a close-out, drive the ball, make the next play. Do you feel like that's where this game's evolved to? Yeah, absolutely. You know, being able to put five guys on the floor that can do multiple things,

and if not everything, not saying everything great. Right. You only need one guy, two guys that can do, you have your staple guys that can do everything great. Like you said, make the simple play. But being able to at least attract the eyes of another defender so when if that defender helps, you can just get off of it. And now it starts to blend your action, you know. And, you know, these players are being sought after more and more and more as the years are going. And it's you're seeing, you're seeing, you know, you saw obviously what Boston been able to do with those guys.

Those guys are all positionless, you know, being able to. you know, catch, shoot, drive, pass. That's it. You know, and then you have the great ones, obviously, you have the Brown and the Tatum's that they can do, they give it a little bit more freedom to do that, you know, and now you see, you see, you see, okay, see you, they put all guys on their floor that can make plays, you know,

even Hardinstein, you know, they give him the ball, boom, pinch post. Uphill, DHO, okay, you jump out too fast, okay, uphill, DHO, you know, floater. Or, okay, my guy, you overplay, you overplay, I can make a back door cut after the split action. I can make those passes. You know, so you don't look at him as a guy that could, but he actually can't.

You know, you know what I'm saying? Miles Turner is the same way. We was talking about it like on the last show when Miles Turner has, I'm a short roll. You're going to think I'm rolling all the way. And then when my guy drives, you're going to be in the paint. Now I'm going to pop all the way back to the three.

And if you close out, I can put the ball on the floor and either get myself a shot or get it or get it sprayed. You know, those are, OB Topping, same. Those guys are just positionless players where, okay, if we switch, I can guard to one, I can guard the five, I can guard the four. You know, those are players that's very key to teams being able to, like you said, be positionless in our league. Yeah, it's always interesting this time here to see in the draft how many guys in that kind of like six four to six nine range can take it and where they're at and their development. How many teams are like they know what this guy can do or this is a project we got to develop, but he fits a profile that our team. and our league needs, that's always fascinating. Yeah, for sure, for sure. Well, shifting gears, I wanted to talk a little bit about some of these rule changes or concepts

that I've been hearing out there recently. Now, some of these are to make the game better, but some of them are to make the game better for the fans. And I think that's kind of the prism. We got to look at these. So the one that's been talked about a lot with all the three-point shooting, the evolution of the three, is to eliminate the corner three.

So to be clear, you know, the three-point line curves, and then it goes straight down to the corner. I believe the concept would be that that curve just goes until it touches the sideline. And then that's it. And that's it.

Yeah. So anything in the corners is a two, a long two. A long two. Where does that take our game? Like, I like our game. I like our game. I like our game.

I do too. Let's envision, let's envision, you know, guys standing in the corner, trying to space the floor, but he's not spacing for a three. Yeah, I mean, it would be an adjustment. Right. I think, listen, one thing about us as NBA players, we are adaptable.

And if we have to, no matter if we like it or not, we're able to adapt. I mean, I like our game where it is. I think the corner three is a, you know, it's a great, it's a great shot. Obviously, it's the best shot. Outside of the, yeah, besides a done. or a layup or a free throw but um but i mean it will be something that could be um could be

looked at i mean if if the fans and our committee board are saying okay maybe let's take a look at i think it should be something that could possibly be explored like you said like a summer league or the g league showcase or something like that you don't just throw it to us right away the players are not you the NBA guys don't want to just just throw it on to us right away like this is a big change yeah it's a huge change you can't just throw it on us like that you can't just throw it on us like that I'm like, oh, well, here we go, guys. You showed the practice the first day of training camp, and there's no corner three.

Yeah, like, what am I doing? What am I doing? Yeah, I, that one seems like too big a leap for me. Yeah, I agree. You know, too big a leap from me. Now, I think our game would have to get, because like I said, I love our game. So what are we talking about?

That's not one that I would tweak, you know. I agree. What about eliminating three seconds in the lane? That basically gets us to FIFA. Yeah, yeah, in college. In college, right? We just talked about how college can get a little bog down. no spacing you know we want to encourage speed of play skill athleticism fast pace

right so for the fans to you know it's a give-and-take obviously but I like the way our games play it open and fast it's getting to more of a it's more jazz now I read and react play out of principles seeing the players think and adapt on the flies I think this is an incredible error for that I agree here's one talking about defensive player of the year we need a big and a small because a lot traditionally the bigs have dominated right you know you got that rim protector back in my day you go you got the odd guard but usually it was like the bigs it felt like do you feel like there should be a big like a big and a perimeter no i don't know

if it should be a big and a perimeter but i do think the landscape of how we the voting and how we clarified the defensive player at a year is determined. You know, you know, because you know, right now, like, if you can't, if you can't guard, if you can't guard on the perimeter, you know, you can't play.

Right. But if you're a big and you can, you can't guard bigs, you can actually still play because there's not much, it's not the 90s anymore where guys are posting up a lot. That's right. You know, the game is more on the perimeter. So, you know, I think that just the clarity of what the defensive player award actually means. So like some sort of criteria.

Some type of criteria. I did think about how like the NFL does offensive player to year and MVP. I thought that could possibly be something in our league where you give an offensive player to year. you know and a MVP you know not saying we should do it but it was something that was like pretty cool like in the NFL how they do that they do the offensive player of the year defensive player of the year that's a great point MVP we have defense yeah we don't have offense we have defense and MVP right we have yeah so maybe something because also because there's no real criteria about MVP it's a statement most valuable player what's what is the criteria because you know we we

I think we usually associate it in some capacity with team success, which is a good thing. But is it said it's like, you know, and is it good that it's sort of this nebulous kind of thing we don't exactly know, but there's a narrative sometimes that forms or there's a popular opinion or a populist that develops, like maybe that's just the way it should be. Right. Yeah, because it's no, it's, it's changes. It's like, okay, so is it the best player, you know, is it the, is it the player that had the best season with his team, you know, maybe that's offensive player of the year, you know, or is it

the, just simply the best player in the league, like statistically was the best player of the year league, you know, no matter, you know, obviously you're not going to have a guy in there that's like doesn't, the team didn't come close to making the playoffs. Well, well, obviously, because if that's the case, then he's not the best player, you know, but it's just, it's not most valuable then, but if it's, I don't know. It just changes, it changes too much. Your offensive player of the year is interesting. I think that one's interesting.

I haven't really thought about it a lot, but that is interesting because maybe that helps direct this thing. Because you could be on a poor team, have an unbelievable offensive year. You can still win offensive player of the year. And vice versa, you could maybe not have the best year in the league, but you were the most valuable in taking your team to a new height. So there's all sorts of, like,

a prism here to kind of decide. So that would maybe take some of that down with an offensive player. Yeah. All right. What about the four point shot? I'm talking about taking away the corner, but what about just adding?

How would that work? Would that go to the sideline from above the three? Do they move behind? I'm sure you sit at home thinking about this all the time, right? No, we can't do that. No. No, we can't do that.

I mean, we can. we want but I don't like the when you start talking about the four-point shot yes you have guys that shoot from the show from the logo in our league and shoot from way behind the three-point line but we also got to think about like the the younger generation that's looking up to us as the pros and they watch everything that we do everything and what I wouldn't want to happen is kids developing trying to shoot a four-point shot at eight, nine, ten years old when their bodies and their muscles are not even...

I don't even... My best friend, Drew Joyce, his dad did not let him take a three-point shot until I believe we was like in the seventh grade. Someone in the league was just saying that the other day. I believe... Was it book? It might have been book.

He was talking about his form. And his dad was like, you're not allowed to shoot three. And I want to get this correct. I can ask my best friend after, but I believe, I know for sure, like when we play Little League, for his dad would not let him shoot. He's like, you're not strong enough. And you're not about to mess up. You're a shot because you're literally just pushing it up there, like chugging it like a full-course shot.

So he didn't let him shoot threes till we was like in a seventh, eighth grade. Yeah, so were you add a four-point shot to our league? What it's going to do to our kids and our younger generation, it's going to, I don't like it. Yeah, I wouldn't like it. You got kids prioritizing things in our room. Don't really matter yet. Remind me like MTV Rockin' John.

You remember that? Yeah, like the 30-point shot back shot back. It's all up in there. Is there a trampol? No, there wasn't a trampoline. That was, what was the one with the trampolines? Oh, my goodness. Slam ball.

Yeah, slam ball. Yeah. I had a college teammate that played slam ball. Oh, yeah. That was funny. Made it to the league. What do we got here? What about eliminating the charge?

Hmm. So I also wonder about this one. What if you could still stand in and take a charge? There's just no call. But if you were set, it's not a foul. It's not a foul at all. You just take the, you just take. Like, I don't know, you know what I mean?

Like, what are we talking about here? You can't do it at all? Or can you go in and if it's a charge, it's just no call? you just keep playing. But if your feet aren't set, it's a foul. Oh, and if you're not said, it's a foul. That's what I'm saying. There's no charge.

But if you're still set, you could step in. Like, if you're coming down the lane, I'm not, I'm not meeting you at the rim. But maybe I could slide in and take a charge. I don't get a charge. The rest are just like. No, there's already too much conflict between players and referees already. Could you imagine you take a charge on like Janus? Or like Embed, and you're there, you're there.

But I'm trying to think about what does this mean like because if you take away the charge a guy barrels down the lane Your only only option is try to meet it's the vertical verticality. That's it. That's the only that's the only thing you can do then or file Yeah, but even verticality sometimes can be a charge Okay, right? Yeah, so it's kind of like a gray area. Yeah, right like you guys with his elbow with his leg Yeah, anyways I no charge's stay charge got to stay right got to stay I think that's kind of I think that make the game too wild. Yeah, it got to stay. Too wild.

Like arch rivals then. Right? I remember that game on Nintendo? Arch rivals, they go crazy, fucking people up. Catch a cross on that. Crazy. Transition? Yeah.

What about just cleaning up some of our rules? Where are you at with like illegal screens? I feel like there's a, it's creeping. Yeah, I think we should, we gotta get it back in order. get it back in order a little bit a little bit it's not like i don't mind the odd one it feels like so many screens now or like a hip or the hip or or the leg is a little bit too far out or or the you know it's a difference between the touch and go and the actual shove and go yeah you know now you know there's right you're like you're displacing you're displacing i'm on the ball and i'm on

the ball and i just come up and shove you underneath your hip and i roll out because we know it's It's a switching league, so if you're not going to enforce that, I'm going to push you up a little bit and you're never going to get behind. You're never going to get behind to get the switch. So I think, you know, yeah, we just, we got to look at it a little bit more, you know. I think the committee, the referee committee, and the players, we just look at it a little bit more, just get a little bit more fundamental with it. You know, we've talked about it before how you've got to give a guy space when you said it.

Sometimes, you know, how these, yeah, yeah, we hear, but, you know, first two, three weeks. Yeah, we got to, and then it kind of just trickles back to what it was. Same with the travel. You know, we've had different times. I think for sure during your career, definitely during mine multiple times. We're trying to clean it up sometimes. I'm not like a crazy person on travel. Like, I like it to be a lot of freedom of movement.

I don't want people just being crazy with it. You know, we have the gather now. You know, guys obviously put their hand under the ball a little bit. It's the catch and go. There was times, you know, you know it's like an international. Oh, international is different, too. Some ruffs are like everything. And we practice it.

Like, you know, when we were gearing up for the Olympics, like, we are first, the first thing we do when we say everybody on the baseline, they throw us the ball and you put the ball down right away. Bob Coosie. Yep. So as you, are you catching the transition? Put it down.

You can't want, if you do this, travel. International, travel every single time. No, no jab and go. Right. Right. Everything is put it down first. See, I'm glad we're not like that in the line. Right, right, right, right.

That's the language. That's how we all grew up, like, you know, playing in the playground or the open gym, whatever. Yeah, you know, just looking at, I guess, you know, just, because I, sometimes since I'm here, I get away with traveling sometimes, too. I can't see here and say I don't because, you know, but I think we just, just, I don't want to be, like, nitpicky about our players. I don't want to stop us from being creative or whatever case may be, but just, you know, we can, We can probably, that's one of the things, like we're saying with the Office of the Files.

We can clean it up a little bit. Yeah. What's the most egregious travel you ever got away with? Me? The most egregious travel I ever got away with. And you know what? The basketball guys was not on my side. The one that comes in my mind right now, I was my second stint with Cleveland playing in Washington.

And we were down one. I got the ball in transition about the half court. And I was driving the lane. It's late in the game. I was driving the lane and I got into the lane and I traveled like a mother and I got all the way to the lane and missed the layup. They didn't call the travel. They did not call the travel.

I blew the, I blew the layup. It's because you felt guilty. I don't know if I felt guilty. It felt weird. You're just thinking like, what are you doing? Like I had a wide open layup and missed it. It's the same game when I end up tying it hitting the three point off the glass. So they made a bucket?

They made two free throws. And then I hit the... So what do you mean the basketball gods weren't on your side? Well, I mean... They came back around. Yeah, it came back around because I'm true to the game. I missed it.

If I would have made it, then, you know, we finally lost the game. You found a way to beat. Yeah, they'd have found a way. Basketball guys stayed with me a little bit. Beautiful. I love that. We're going to pour that clips.

So, God, you know how people would be like, LeBron's lying. He doesn't remember that. What is he talking about? Exactly. That was terrible. I had won this past season, too, in Orlando.

That was so bad. Switched my pivot feet. Missed a shot, too. No call? No call. Just straight up pivoting on one, change the other. Changed it.

At the elbow. Yeah. Terrible. Drove down the lane. Oh, drove? Yeah. I was at the elbow. Pivot foot.

Oh, I didn't like that one. Switched it. Drove. Shot of a floater. Hit the side of the backboard. I said, yep, that's one. That's got him. I think that's good.

Yeah. Yeah? That's 45. Love it. You love it. Knock him out, boy. Knocking him out. Knocking him out.

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