Mind the Game - Kevin Durant: Part 2 (What Happened in Brooklyn)

Episode Date: July 8, 2025

We are thrilled to share Part 2 of our conversation with Kevin Durant on Mind the Game with LeBron James and Steve Nash. First we open with how great the game of basketball is in the year 2025 and how the NBA Finals between the Oklahoma City Thunder and the Indiana Pacers was the perfect manifestation of the modern game. Then KD discusses falling in love with basketball as a young child and how that love grew into obsession. Finally, KD and Nash rehash what happened on their Brooklyn Nets team and how each of them look back on that time today.Part 1 of our conversation with Kevin Durant can be found on all platforms. Next week will be our Finale of season 2 so be sure to tap in. Thanks for listening to Mind the Game.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

When you think back to our time in Brooklyn, what do you think of? Man. It's just crazy how fast the game changed since I came into the lead. It usually is like a slow uptick, but it's like clearly different. different from what was your last year in league 14 and it's it was 14 and now right then is when I feel like that looked like the 90s compared to yeah we're done with the 90s the 14s the 10s through the 14s look like the old style of ball right because of the you know it's crazy right now it's just looked like we're playing 2k I love that we shoot so many

threes I love that we got big shooting threes now I love that that weekend, he got so much space to work. I even love that that you could throw zones in there. They're mixing up defense. That's an evolution, I think, in the last six months even. That's like when we play Houston, like he made you docker does a good job. He will go one possession, regular man, next possession zone, go back to man, the next three possessions zone, all in the first quarter. Throwing your up balance.

In the first quarter, and it's like, okay, how good you are as a team, How connected you are as a group, how well you pass, guys are unselfish. If a coach does that and you're not prepared for it. Yeah, you're all on balance. You're all on balance.

You got no rhythm. I'm going to go even more drastic who's even more crazier with it. Eric Sposter will go 48 straight minutes of zone. He would start the game with own zone. And he might want to press you back into a zone. Back into a zone and put bam at the top. Yeah, I mean, I see a lot of coaches

being creative defensively, players become better offensive because when I'm working out and I'm thinking like because now even a man on man defense starting to look like a zone a little bit with so many gaps yeah so many gaps guys you can shoot for sure they're going to be in the zone yeah yeah if you've got non-shooters on the floor they're going for sure be loaded up they might not be in zone but they're sitting in the way exactly and they're not moving exactly and they're not moving if the guy's in the corner and he can't shoot the three and he can't finish there's a lot of guys he the guy guarding the corner guy's going to be so far up the lane that you're

You're not going to go anywhere. They don't mind if you go back door. Unless you be under 6.9, too. So there's a lot of dudes who can't shoot that's six four, six five that's playing. And you can just put Yokich on them. And if you're not getting an officer rebound on him. You're not going to lay up over him. You just, he's not even looking at you, you know what I'm saying?

So if you can't shoot at the, like, if you just can't shoot at all. It's a premium. You're not even going to be in the league. I'm sorry. But that's why O.K.C.'s defense is great. They are individual defenders. They get in the gaps. They're willing to give up.

threes but they're gonna fly at you yeah protect their pain so it looks like a zone yeah but it's a man but then they'll go zone then they'll go zone nail catch man corner catch man yeah they're switching up in the possession during the possession right see that's yeah these coaches are getting creative man on the on the defense but like you said it's because of the offenses that's it's it for tat offense got so good oh we got to change yeah we got to figure it out yeah defense gets good now like you said it's pushing you to think about how do I find your spaces right yeah yeah and I see and when you look At OKC, though, do you, like, they play an ISO-based game.

They do. Offensively, they do. So they have Shea, which he's, I mean, historically elite, ISO player, right? Then they have Jalen, who's kind of an all-rounder, Chet brings versatility. The key to me is Hartnstein in a way, because, like, he, for 20 to 30 minutes a game, becomes like a folkroom, a hub, like the DHO's, the floater, the passing, to just take the right just the tie it's like the rug that brings the room to get big man that floater you get way more points than just chucking up threes man especially when playing with great players but yeah he he's been

a hub for him getting those other guys involved yeah it doesn't make shee have to do it in isolation the whole game doesn't make jalen feel like oh i got to do it all the time i mean especially in the postseason when the game ramps up physically to be able to have a big as a hub okay you pressure me pressure me okay you stop me boom now i'm playing chase game now you can't you can't grab me Right. Now I'm playing Chase's game. I can go back door, which Hartstein can, we know he makes that back door pass with the best of them.

You can play Chase with him now. He's one of the best screen setters we have in the league. And now Shea's coming off or J.Dub is coming off, you know. If the big helps up too much and the guard ain't get under Hardinstein, we got a lot of threat. Yep. Yeah. You know, so, you know, having that hub right there, having a five that can play from the three-point line all the way into the paint and not even like you said, you don't need to shoot threes.

He knows his game. You give it to me in the pinch post. You give it to me on delay action. Y'all trust me to make the right play. I mean, those bigs got to come into the league with that now, right? Nowadays, you got to be able to play DHO, pinch posts, like move, make decisions. Know which angle to set it on. Right.

When to keep, when to get rid of it. I think he, though, like, he is the fulcrum for their randomness. Shea is, he's just so elite at it. He's going to attack, but he's kind of the fulcrum to like, now we're going. They're two on Shea, now we're going to go play. He's going to play on the other side. He knows when the flash. tell his sometimes his flash is random right you know the play might break down a little bit we

ain't got nothing he just run up there you know he you know you know what I'm saying that organized chaos you know what I'm saying so they got a damn good team damn good team it's fun to watch I love that the league is trending towards that though that's just more hooping right structure is good don't get me wrong but like I think you maximize your players when you just let them play right I seen obit topping playing like some of his best ball that was way. I've seen Nick Neesmith playing some of his best ball where it's like, you're not restricted to like, all right, let me

set their screen and just wait for the jump shot. Like, they feel comfortable. Yeah, making somebody off the dribble. Teeny McConnell coming to the game, you feel like it's his team, you know what I'm saying? So I feel like that's just a... But I would give Rick Carlisle a lot.

I was about to say, yeah, I'm about to say. He's always been like that same... Yeah, he, I think he's very adaptable. What he's done in these three, four years has built an identity with his roster. Right? Yes. Like you said, Braun, it's not like, okay, mismatch. He's like, that's not us.

He's found identity. But it doesn't work if those guys don't have enough freedom to play Blender. Right, right, right, right. They have freedom to play Blender instead of like, I didn't get it, I got to throw a lob past the center to Hallie to get it back to try again. No, we just keep playing and moving. You don't see, you don't see Knee Smith or Nimel are coming off picking rolls trying to throw lobs. Right, right.

They just play their game. No, they don't, that's not what they're doing. Like, everyone, they know exactly what they do. doing they know their role and they are starring in their roles and they even going outside of their roles I mean we even talked about the game Nismith had the game one in New York when he went crazy

yeah that was game one they were down he hit up what five or six threes in the last two minutes or something like that like you know that's just but that's empowerment from from the coaching staff but it's also empowerment from you as individual you have to a coach staff can give you some some freedom right but a coach staff

can also pull that shit back if you ain't doing what the hell you're supposed to be doing if you ain't earning it now I can't just now you look making me look bad not you know what I'm saying like I can't do that so what I love about indie too and I think it's an underrated factor like Tyrese kicks the ball ahead he doesn't drivel across half court every time like some he even when they hand him the ball the center hand him the ball after he kicking in the head no matter who it is and I tell a lot of young team like coaches who want to talk ball I'm like if your point guard not kicking the ball in my opinion you got to in my opinion you

your team is not going to be as good as you. More pressure on your team. It's way more pressure when he's not kicking that ball ahead. So when you're seeing, you're kicking that head to Seaccom and he's coming down here on whoever. Yeah, yeah. No help. You're kicking at the OB Topper now here.

Now he dribble handoff to Aaron Neesmith out the corner. So that kick ahead for them is the reason. It's a big reason why I feel like they've been so connected. He's great of that. And I think what else, he's just in general, a brilliant, simple, early passer comes off picking room he doesn't do you know if he sees somebody and that guy's leaning the wrong way and now that guy's got to show him go or you know dh over the corner it gives them an advantage at all times instead of being like bogged down

so i'm impressed just an efficient like all his movements just seem efficient you don't turn the ball over he don't shoot bad shots like i think he could be more aggressive too to score the ball sometimes he might have to be he might have to be especially just next game but yeah just connectivity is based a lot on just moving the ball to simple plays like you said and they always say like it's funny because people say like well they don't turn the ball over that much but they play so fast i think now like it's almost easier to not turn the ball over you're just you're not thinking about i got to make a play he's open chuck it pinch pose give it back like you're not thinking me i got to make a play you're just thinking simple plays yeah so now it's

not like high risk all the time because that's how we play we just get rid of it so you end up and maybe i should give him more credit but end up almost the style allows them to not turn it over because they're just playing simple. Yeah, you're right. That's why it looked so weird in game one early on when they was turned the ball over so that much. That's a 25 turnoffice.

He's defense. Yeah, it's like 21 turnovers a halftime or something. That's crazy. He was 26 for the game. Yeah, in the finals, it still won. Well, that goes back to your thing about Rick Trussing these guys. So where does he get that back? They never stopped playing.

No, they did not. They never stopped playing. And he, his face didn't never change either. I don't know what he said, a half time because I think they only have five or six in the second half but listen this we got here because this is how we play you know you know and as a coach though coming in a half and you got 21 turnovers in a final what are you what are you thinking as a coach then hand yourself no honestly though but what Rick does

great I know this 21 you know you know that's 21 that's right that's high for a whole game it's high but it's also credit okay see those guys man yeah unbelievably they're athletic and hansy and all that stuff but i think rick's been unbelievable i just ain't even keel like what am i going to get out of lamb basin you guys you guys have earned my trust let's keep trusting it keep playing it's four series you know you got a good team though yeah four seasons and more they've come back from like historic deficits yeah i love that mental four or two as a team like they they are mentally strong they discipline on what they want to do and they'll they're going to live and die with who they are they're not making no

changes they i respect that as a team Yeah, they don't get bogged down. No. Like, you know, sometimes in the playoffs, things get tight. You start to slow down, you start thinking too much. They just keep playing. You know, it's great. That's right.

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Terms apply. Learn more at Americanexpress.com slash with Amex. One thing that I want to ask you about is like how you found basketball and like how did it take hold of you? Like how old were you? What was going on? Where was it? That's a great question. I think about that all the time. I was about eight years old. My mom signed me up for a rec center. She just wanted me and my brother to get out the house. It wasn't to play ball. It wasn't to do anything specific.

It's just like y'all have been in the house for seven years. Under me and your grandma, y'all need to leave. So about eight years old. We went to a rec center about 10 minutes from our crib. We walked in there. There was nothing but kids playing and hooping and running up and down the court. And I was just like, I want to join in with them. And it was just so much fun that first day.

And I just wanted to come back. And I just kept coming back every day. And then when you see that ball go through the rim, it's just such a satisfying feeling. It's just like for the first time, I felt like I was doing something right in my life. You know what I'm saying? When the ball hit the rim, I'll go through the rim. So I just love that feeling. And I just kept coming back.

And then I had some great, great influence. at the rec center, older guys who taught me how to play, who put me on the team for the first time, just encouraged me all the time, just, you know, just big brothers figures to me early on. So that just built my love and the camaraderie that came with the game of basketball, just built from there.

So I want to say like eight or nine, I really fell in love with just the process of basketball. Getting in the car, going to the gym, put my stuff on, working out, talking to my teammates, you know, after practice, all of that stuff, just, just, you know, became a part of me. So from 8, 9, 10, you were, like, working on your game. You were just playing, you were already like,

I want to get better, I want to see that. Really, like, I want to play in the league. Yeah, like, I remember seeing, that's what, I mean, that's when we first got dial up internet. Like, when I was 9, 10 years old. So I'm on NBA.com a lot around that time when I'm 10. And, you know, I'm looking up. Vince Carter is my favorite, because he's dunking so much.

And he showed, you know, enthusiasm in the early, you know, his early in his career so i you know was attracted to what he was doing and so i just kept researching on nba.com trying to find anything inside stuff and i was just looking for stuff that was basketball that was basketball at the highest level and that's what the love built and then i just like i want to do that told my mom's dad at nine and just started training i was training before that you know fundamentally you know working on my left hand right hand jump shot stuff but my training just became uh you know the regiment became uh you know the regiment became uh You know.

Intentional. Yeah. Yeah. Just what I was, yeah, I could tell. Box jumps, running up hills, dug walks, you know, shooting 200 shots a day. My mom and my trainer, who was my godfather, who was my coat, like somebody I really hung out with before all of this, he started to get upset with me and work out. So I just started seeing everybody vibe change around me.

So mine's just changed and I just became more focused on wanting to be the best player I could be. That's interesting because you could go two ways at that age. Yeah. This is a lot. Too much, yeah. You kind of embraced it in a way. I enjoyed it. I felt like from like six to seven, eight years old,

I was outside running around, though. So I kind of understood my body. You know what I'm saying? I knew what I could do. Playing football, playing tag, whatever. Yeah, exactly. Jump and roll. I was riding my bike, you know,

just doing anything outside up until, you know. So I just think all that, it's just all hit at like one point. I was just having so much fun with my friends. I was using my body. and finding out of new things, I can run fast. I can jump. I can touch the backboard.

Damn, I didn't know I could do that. So you just get more enlightened as a human being. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It inspired you. Yeah, it just inspired me to be out there. And I mean, I think that's just what's keeping me going today, to be honest. And who, like, I think you mentioned your godfather, but him, maybe others, like, who were, like, maybe Wanda? Who was your, like, key believers?

I think everyone needs someone that's like, you can do this. You're great. yeah, it's my mom's for sure I mean obviously it's always gonna be your mom's but it's like I tune her out at a certain point you know what I'm saying

so it was for sure you know when I look back on it I for sure appreciated my mom telling me that I was gonna be great but I always knew that of course she's gonna say that she was calling me handsome and I was going to school

and they was like uh nah you know what I'm saying so I'm like I understand I can relate to that one I get that You know, so I was looking for some validation from my coaches, my teammates, to just be like, yo, you're nice. So somebody would be like, yo, we want to pick Katie on my team, you know, outside.

So my friends started to knock on my door and Kincaid come play today. Like, that's how I started to feel confident in myself. And then my coaches was a team to work with me every day. So they didn't, it's easy. I've seen them say, this kid trash, don't bring him back tomorrow. But they kept inviting me back. So my comments. You knew something was there.

Yeah, I just knew something was up. Something was, you know, older kids, validating you. Exactly. So everybody around me kind of understood what this was before me, you know. So I started to become more enlightening, open my eyes to what this is as 10, 11, 12, 13. And I just hit the ground running. You walk in the gym, kids happy to see you. Yeah, happy to see all K-back.

Yeah, right. Let's play right now. So I love that camaraderie, man. I was just grateful to have a rec center in my neighborhood that, you know, provided us. space for the kids, you know what I'm saying? And I was grateful, you know, most of my friends come from Hooping. Most of the people I met come from Hooping. I travel this world because of that, you know what I'm saying? So everything just stemmed back to I just enjoy being in that gym, that community was perfect for me. We've spent a lot of time together.

Pre-Goldn State, Golden State, Brooklyn, like you have an obsessive work ethic around your routine and like staying sharp and trying to get better. The seeds of that was built then yeah that wasn't something like you know you should have saw it in this past summer last summer when he couldn't when you couldn't work out yeah because his cab wasn't right oh he was sitting on the sidelines shooting on the shooting in the chair literally one was he was so upset like he couldn't like the first couple weeks he couldn't do nothing besides like get up and just like as soon as we got in the gym we had pitcher day he didn't even get dressed didn't put his uniform on went straight out to just start like just pissed him like for sure you it's it's anything

Yeah, that's, yeah, man, it's, I don't know, it's that kid like Trey. I mean, we all had obsessive shit as a kid. You play with the same toy for a month sometimes, you know what I'm saying? You did the same stuff. I just think I keep that kid like energy in me, you know, and I'm upset. And that's what comes from, you know, enjoying what you do, wanting to be great at what you do. We all, us three, we understand what that's like being in the lead for so long, being at that level. having that standard that you hold yourself to,

you gotta be obsessed, I'm sorry. I mean, I know it's, it's something that it's like, it's trace that you gotta acquire as a human being in order for you to maintain what you got. And obsession is one of it. And we look at that, we frown upon that as human beings about stuff, but if you really, truly wanna be great at basketball,

I'm telling you now, somebody who's done it, I don't wanna speak for y'all, but I kinda understand y'all, but you have to be obsessed with wanting to get better every day. And it's like if you don't think that way, if you don't act that way, then it's just that simple. You're not going to be great at it. And so I understood that early.

And like I said, and also just love doing it and having fun doing it. And that's the reason why I am, why I am today. It's interesting where we all share that obsessiveness about it. But like for kids out there, I think it's important for them. It's not just doing it every day. We sat down, Bron Porz and wine, you're like, yeah, I got my work in. Like, it's on your, it's, it's on your mind. Like, you'd be anxious.

If you hadn't gone to the gym yet, you'd be like, ugh. Like, so one, two, like, all of us, when we get down to business, when we're in our routine, we're doing our work, there's a standard. Like, we're not just there to, if coach said, make 200 shots, it's no, no. It's 200, game speed, pressure on the line day after day after day. just kids I think they have to understand like it's not just the volume it's not just the consistency it's the approach and also that they don't they'll they'll learn that as well over time it's not gonna happen day one to the kids out there I agree they'll learn how to train the right way they'll learn how they can get the most out of their training how they get the most out of their workouts and then like Kay said he started to feel his body change you know he started to feel oh I know you know that I can do this a little bit more now oh I can get to this spot a little bit more now I can get to this spot a little bit more now and now because I'm a little stronger now I'm a little faster now even at 10 11 12 years old you know and I look at it you know obviously I've had my two boys that play basketball whatever and you know my daughter's playing volleyball right now she's 10 and she's playing 12

you volleyball so you could just see the difference just in like two years it could be 18 months you see the difference shorter six months you know not as fast can't jump as high you know so like as those things continue to mold and get better and you you start seeing your body transition and you start the only thing that matters the most early on is that you want to do it and you get the love to do it love you got to love it you got to love it because that's going to keep you coming back right the body's going to do what it's going to do you're going to go to sleep one day and then you're going to wake up and your knee going to be hurting you're like what the hell's going on you're going to wake up one day and I'm going to

wait and you're going to say something to your mom and your voice going to be a little bit deeper you're like oh shit yeah yeah you know so like it happens it happens like that but you're right though it's the love like you you can't live without it right now right like I've had to move on

it's hard right it's hard you're not too far away you're not too far away like you guys now have a immediacy with that like you you know that you got to make the most out of this

you've seen there been there and done it like that all starts with love yeah for sure and it's gonna stay there with love You know, because we can easily get jaded by the business of basketball and the responsibility that comes with being a breadwinner and some of our families.

That's a lot that comes up being an NBA player that we don't discuss a lot. You know, it's like that unsaid thing, you know, but we deal with a lot as human beings and as basketball players, but when you get on that basketball court, that is like your sanctuary, man. Yeah, you can't let that get affected by all. of the that comes with life you know what I'm saying so once you keep that sacred and it takes some time some time yeah for people to understand how sacred that is like I'm not coming here to interview with y'all if I ain't work out today like I'm not going to change my workout right

I love you brine I love you but I'm not they definitely told me uh K can only do after 2 30 I'm like see I work out at 7 a.m I got to wait till 2 30 see this one fucking it was just like I would I just can't compromise that you know what I'm saying at this point 100% you know i mean and i think that's what we we all get to once we love something do you think uh another driving factor in our careers right now is um others who had the talent and others who had the same opportunity didn't make the most of it in their later career yeah see people that we grew up watching people that you know that you you felt like damn i wonder if they worked hard i wonder if they really

put the time into it to now like you look back you like you like sometimes I go back and look at certain players back in the dump like damn he only played 11 years or he only played eight years like I you know when you young you don't you don't really know

but it's like no you're right I mean you definitely look at I mean because you're not looking at the guys that come before you as examples and good or bad correct yeah you know good or bad then you're not going you know, it's hard for you to, you know, be ready for what's ahead.

Like, I've seen guys that, you know, you guys drove me every day. Going to watch your games, watch your box scores. I'm like, all right, if he on that level, I could, why can't I try to be at that same level too? So that drive, but then you look at guys who didn't necessarily pan out and you know their situation, and you want to avoid that too. You know what I'm saying? So, yeah, all of that stuff plays a factor,

but it's not just one or two or three things that make, you a good basketball player, things you have to do to be a great basketball player. There's so much you got to retain and understand in order for you to get the full potential out of yourself, you know what I'm saying? And the research is a big part, in my opinion, of becoming a very basketball player. Who you, who you listening to, talk the game, what you're watching, how are you watching it, how you watch your film, you know what I'm saying, are you researching old players and see what they did to understand the foundation they laid down for you.

Are you being real with yourself? Are you being real with yourself when you watch film? Or you hold yourself accountable after games, right after the game. You know what I'm saying? So there's a lot of stuff you got to ask yourself, you got to recommit to this game. Just like you sign a new contract, every time you get better as a player, I truly feel that you got to recommit and sign that contract with yourself every so often. I'm 10, 12 years in, I got four MVPs and four championships. Like, but do I still want to do this shit?

You know what I'm saying? You know how it is? Some people say I want to go play baseball. Right? Yeah. And then I want to come back. Well, some people say I'm going to go 22 straight. You know what I'm saying?

So as a contract, I feel like you got to have with yourself too in order for you to be a, you know, great ball player. No question. To have a long career. That's the goal to be in the league for 20 years. That's the goal. Have you want to get there, but you got to recommit to your goal. recommit to yourself before you commit to anything else. That's interesting, but like,

all that's, like that's a factor, like seeing what other people did, seeing maybe they didn't fulfill their potential, they didn't keep going as long as they could have, but it all starts again with that love, that passion for what you do every day. For sure. Because that ain't gonna last now.

That ain't enough. That ain't enough to keep you going, seeing what other people did. It didn't do. You can't just chase other people. You gotta love your own race. You gotta be deeply inside it and engineer that thing. Drive your own bus.

I was going to say, how does that, at this stage, you're like, what is success, I asked you the first episode, what does success look like for you, like, the rest of your career? How do you approach it? For me, is you, you're coming into 19? 19, yeah. 19. It's just about, for me, it's just about being in it every day.

Like, and what I mean, in it, it's just, like, every detail, I got to be, like, if my coaches need to ask me about anything, no matter, you know, I got to be ready, if I got to jump in the drill first, you know what I'm saying, to demonstrate the drill, if I got to be, you know, play a whole scrimmage and practice even on, you know, 35, 36, I don't want to, I got to set that example of, like, no matter how old I am, that I'm still trying to be great every day. That is a standard. You know what I'm saying? That's really what I'm in for, is just continue to live up to that every day, rather than shoot around, practice, or a game. And I think, I love living up to that standard. Similar. He was process over, you know, the process, the process, trying to be great every day and like leaving an example for other players.

And if you do that, then when lose or draw, shit. I mean, we get frustrated with losses. We've been to the mountaintop before. We want to get back there. But you sleep better than the contrary if you wasn't doing the other shit. For sure. And you lose. You're like, oh, I just, I just cheated.

season. I just cheated a week away. I just cheated a day away. For what? Because at the end of the day this game that we're playing, the basketball game, the life game, whatever the case, me, the game in general, it's not a dress rehearsal. It is right now.

We lie. We lie, baby. We got to get to it. We got to make the most of when you're that person. When you have the it factor, it's not a dress rehearsal for it. You're not allowed to have a dress rehearsal. person the others do got to be on everything and that's the beauty of being given that much responsibility that you got to be on every day it's easy when you get two days a week where you

got to be that guy you know what I'm saying but you challenge yourself you reach different heights as a human being I think this game of course you want to be great at playing basketball there's so many life lessons within a game that enlighten you just on everything you know what I'm saying so if you're not open-minded to that part of it too not just being highly touted great player everybody love you and you got the most points and you got the accolades but do you actually truly care about coming in every day and being the best that you can be right as an individual and it may not be just shooting the ball putting in the basket it may be your influence what you say to your teammates how you're encouraging your coaching staff you know how you're

how you, how you, how coachable you are as an individual. You know what I'm saying? All of that stuff I try to stay conscious of because I know the heavy influence that I have as being a veteran in the league, accomplished so much into the league, just walking into any gym. It can, it can, people attest just, you know,

you got to make sure they're comfortable too. So I try to come into the gym and make sure I'm locked in on being a team player, you know, true and true. You guys are approaching the right way Because there's someone who's already gone over the other side, right? Like, there's a lot of reward in life. Like, there's a lot of things to enjoy, to challenge yourself with. But, like, this is special.

Like, it's hard to replicate this once it's done. Yeah, you have family or you have new interests, endeavors. But to be the best in the world or thereabouts at something and to fight for it every day and have that passion to want to get up and do it and think about it going to bed. It's not like it. There's nothing like it. And when it's gone, it's, like, you guys will both do great things when you're done playing.

You're both already, shit, you know, incredible at business, at life. Once you're done playing, you're done playing. That never comes back. So getting every drop out of it. One, I think, is the right approach. Two, it makes it okay when it's over. Yeah. Yeah.

It makes it okay. For sure. I can't wait to hold up the sign with my grandkids that I scored 101 points in the game before. It's coming. Yeah, for sure. Matter of fact, we should take it right now, so I can just, I can hold it up and then I, and now... What, they're not gonna believe you?

Right. Right, that's what I'm saying. Just a hundred? Right, I'll be, I'll pass Kobe. Right. Yeah. Something else I want to ask you about is, here you are of this, still this incredible passion, incredible efficiency still.

You're touring Achilles, like later in your career. Oh, yeah, I forgot about that. Yeah, forgot about it. Like, that's crazy. Right, right. In your 30s, you torn Achilles, recovered, still incredible player. We right now, Dame and JT. Yeah, JT, yeah, yeah.

Going through that, two great players. You know, obviously, Dames in his 30s, JT's in his 20s. Like, maybe talk a little bit, like, talk to camera. JT. You know what I mean? Talk a little bit about, like, what? that took and what these guys have in front because 25 years ago maybe 15 20 years ago that you i don't know that you could i mean even when i had it i felt like damn that's it because it

was always like for us i mentioned like for basketball players that injury that's the worst thing you you know for football players a concussion you don't want to get like you like oh man a concussion like you know if you get too many of those it's over you know they're trying to keep you out and for us like you know and Achilles is like the you know something that's man man it was a it was a grind and of course you know JT and Dane you know hit me off I feel like I'm the Achilles guy you are yeah like everybody hit me up when they had their Achilles and best yeah I mean I mean a lot of guys I feel like a lot of guys have bounced back and became themselves again mine I'm just I mean mine's is the most you know popular but I feel like a lot of guys

that bounced back that I took inspiration from when I was going through my journey. But those guys are cut from a cloth that, you know, how they got here. Yeah, it's rare. They're rare individuals anyway. So this is just a little stoppage in their journey that they just going to have to sit down and lock in on. And it's easy. I think it'll be easy for them to lock in on once they truly grasp that, like, I'm going to be out for a year.

And I think that takes Initially that takes a few weeks for you to truly understand This is probably their first time And they hold lives They got to sit down and not play sports They can't physically can't play Yeah That's part of the first time that they had to go through that

And that's just a You can either elevate or drown in my opinion And I think both of those dudes have shown you Time and time again That they're going to continue to elevate As individuals and as players But it's a grind man You see me every day

You've seen me. It was grumpy day. Even when you were back, the amount of work you have to do to make sure it does today. You still have to rehab when I'm playing. I'm still doing some of that stuff that I was doing in that rehab. So it's going to be a, your game and your body is going for sure change. And I'm telling people with Dame, he shoot a lot of those deep threes. When you tell your Achilles, your cab muscle goes to nothing.

You sit around for three months and you can't move your calf. If you look at mine's now, I wish I could show people. My right is smaller than my left. But that's just from not using it for those four or five months. It's completely shut down. It's completely shut down. So that's most of the work. Right, right, right.

It's getting that cab back to that. You got to get it bigger and stronger, you know what I'm saying? So I think that's going to be the adjustment for them. And those deep threes that both of those guys shoot, they shoot a lot of tough step-back three. I think that's, and I was shooting those before, you know, I got injured and I fine-tune my game to take some of that stuff out, the sidestep. Just not because it's a bash.

It's because I didn't truly have enough power in my right leg yet in order for me to do those moves. So it's going to be that type of adjustment for guys coming back from an Achilles is just building that power up. Once you get confidence, because I just threw myself out there too. I'm hooping. As soon as I can hoop, I was playing. So once they just throw themselves out there, man, those dudes will be all right. I can't wait to see him bounce back. The overcoming is great, right?

Like to, like, because you're, the whole time you're like, am I coming back? There's anxiety, there's doubt. You're fighting, everybody had overcome it. You come back, you succeeded. I get it. Amazing. Almost, we take it for granted, really.

Like, even when I coached, I took it for granted. Like, sometimes because you were playing so well, moving well, like what you'd been through. But what did that time, did that time off change you at all? Like, open your mind to stuff. It did. Open my mind to just the anatomy of, you know, body you know just learning my body understanding you know power transfer or you know

movement patterns and you know different ways to work on muscles in the weight room that allowed me to be at my best what would uh exercises is tailored to my game specifically i started learning more about that stuff um which you know you know made my my workout regimen just even more detailed and routine and you know so before that I was you know in a weight room a lot and working on my body but it was no real intention of purpose when I went in there now it's just like I know exactly what the super specific yeah way more specific on what I'm doing in the weight room and I think that's the reason majority of the reason why I was able to bounce back the way I did when you think back to our time in Brooklyn what do you think

him stepping on that damn three-point line we had this conversation that's one of them that's tough on that damn i can't get away from it too because they're gonna they're gonna repost that it tag me and that but we had this conversation in portland i think um right before a game and i'm like who am i spending my next five years with i has just signed that deal you had just signed the deal but I feel like we were secure but everything else around us was going to shit not in a bad way we got we got GMs going to other teams we got coaches going to other teams we got players forcing trades we got bringing Ben Simmons he's back like it was just so much stuff going on bullshit around us I feel like we were locked in on the same page

and understand, like, we're trying to do something special here. But, and I felt like your hands were tied a lot because you had to, as a coach, you got to deal with so much. You know what I'm saying? You know what I was. I didn't think we didn't get the full Steve Nass,

like I want it, like you probably want it. I just felt like it was just too much, too many distractions in a way, and you know, you can't win that way. But I felt like we had great intentions, though. I felt like we cared enough. I felt like every day we were trying to, to push towards winning the champion.

It was a great vibe in there. It was some of the best times. That first year, that's why I signed that deal. That first year, man, most fun ball I had. Some of the most fun ball I had playing my whole life, I enjoyed it. I enjoyed Brooklyn a lot. I love playing for Brooklyn,

but it's just so much. Stuff happened. Around the guys that were committed to the situation. I felt like we were committed, but everybody else wasn't. It just was weird. I felt sometimes I feel like I let you, led you guys down in a way, and then I think about everything that happened. Come on, man, that shit was...

You know, we had a three-star roster. You know, the cap, his team of three stars, played 16 games together. We bawled out every game we played together. You know, that's one. You could go down the list and out all these things, and for me, I end up feeling like I'm making excuses. Reality is, from my perspective, I feel a little bit like I let everyone down, but then I realized there was so much to know me.

And I just wish I had more of a chance to develop as a coach. I think so, too. I just think your hands were tired too many times. You had to be a principal more so than anything. You know what I'm saying? Like, you just couldn't, like, inject your basketball, you know what I'm saying? Just everything that you have basketball. I didn't feel like you could inject that into everybody in the way that you.

we all envisioned, you know what I'm saying, just because of the distractions, COVID, injuries. More than anything, I think it's injuries. I feel like we had a good chance to win that first year. But we were injured. James shouldn't have been playing. He was on one leg. Kai was out. Jeff Green was in and out.

So I think more than anything, I think we had a great chance to win that year or step on the line. But yeah, it's just... Some shit happens that way, man. But I don't think that should be an indictment on anybody. It's just like, people don't understand context, though, and what truly happens and how you need to really be, you know,

be connected as a group. Like, it just looked at the names and thought it was going, it's supposed to be perfect. And people always, like, think, like you say without context, but also they want to come in over the top and say, ah, they didn't do it, they didn't do this, they didn't do that. I think for guys, like, that go every day, like, our, even our approach to our routines, it's war.

Every day. We're not afraid to lose. Yeah, exactly. So when we lose, it doesn't work out. We're not at home, and everyone's like, oh, they're killing. We don't think about that, right? We think about, like, tick it on the chin. Let's get ready for whatever the next war is, right?

We're putting our boots back on the next year. Like, that's always been a mentality. But, you know, the dialogue around the league, the discourse around the league, they don't truly appreciate the journey sometimes when it goes on. Even the ones that don't work out, you can still see some beauty in the Sacramento Kings that didn't win the chip. Right. Or your Phoenix Suns that didn't win the championship.

Like, if you really love the game of basketball, you can pull great things from all of that stuff. And that's why I tend to do with that Brooklyn situation. We have some fun times. We have some terrible times, but that's life. That's what makes you a better human being. but for the most, I mean, if I'm being honest, we had more good times than not.

Even the times when it was me and four, two-way, like, it was fun to me. We were successful. Like, because we locked in as a family, just us for that little 48 minutes. And, like, a lot of those games were, like, you know, high-pressure games, late games, I'm sure those, you know, even me I learned from, but those young guys took a lot from there, too. So I look at the season like that a lot. Of course, we want to win.

and go to the chip. But it's a little small moments that I can appreciate throughout a year, even though we don't add up to winning. And a lot of people don't understand that. But we, that shit is in our DNA and our blood. Like, we look at the game of ball like that. Yeah, I mean, it ended up not being a success,

quote unquote, but it's great experience. Man, come on, right. That's all it's about. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I got to come back part two. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I think you have to be coming back for part three.

Yeah, right. I think we got two of them, yeah. We got to watch some film next time, breaking down some real. Come on, God. Hey, and I want this on the record. The only, you forgot to mention, the only member of the 55, 40, 90. Oh, yeah, 55. I cleared that close.

That's I'm saying. 55. We know, we know that. Yeah, we know that. Yeah. Yeah. You just looked it up. One year, you was 39.

39.1 from 3. Okay, see it in 12. 12. 39.1. And I was 50 from the... Oh, my. Can we get one photo of you guys a little tighter? Like sitting or standing?

Not, just standing's fine. Is that, or what do you prefer? Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, you're in the middle. You're the guest. You're the guests.

No, no, no, no, no. You're the guests. Y'all are still fighting. You're still fighting. Thanks for watching Mind the Game. If you enjoyed the show, please subscribe for more content. Thank you. Thank you.