Miss Me? - Listen Bitch! Colour Outside The Lines

Episode Date: June 15, 2026

Miquita Oliver and Jordan Stephens answer your questions about hobbies.Next week, we want to hear your questions about CONFIDENCE. Please send us a voice note on WhatsApp: [phone]. Or, if you like, send us an email: [e-mail] episode contains very strong language and adult themes. Credits: Producer: Natalie Jamieson Technical Producer: Oliver Geraghty Assistant Producer: Caillin McDaid Production Coordinator: Tom Jackson Executive Producer: Dino Sofos Commissioning Producer for BBC: Jake Williams Commissioners: Dylan Haskins & Lorraine Okuefuna Miss Me? is a Persephonica production for BBC Sounds

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contains very strong language, adult themes. But we will see you on the other side where we'll be effing and blind in all we want. I'm joking. We swear quite a lot on Missing. Even here. Welcome to the final listen bitch on the BBC. Yeah. The final LBBC.

I get it. I see where you're going. The final LBBC PC. No, that's not it at all. But it is the final listen bitch on the British Broadcasting Corporation channel. Yes. And the theme is hobbies. Hobbies.

I think that a lot of people think that maybe hobbies are frivolous. A bit silly, but actually they can be totally life-changing. Hobbies have completely changed my life. And I think I was always looking for what my hobbies are. And I would be so sad if someone never found out what their hobby is, because a hobby really isn't just a pastime. It's a way to kind of better the other things that you do in your life. And to also, like, look after your nervous system.

Yeah, hobby is game-changing. It really is. It's like discovering such a beautiful part of life. We'll go into all the hobbies that we love. Can we start, please, with a definition, Macquita. Before we get the first question, we need a Macita definition, please. Oh, I was going to wait, but listen to this. Yeah.

14th century, it was the name of a tiny horse, i.e. a pony. And it was called a hobby, H-O-B-I, or a hobbin. And then in the 16th century, it expanded into a hobby horse, referring to a child's toy made of a stick with an artificial horse's head. You know those ones that people would ride. Right. And then 17th century, because riding a toy stick horse is essentially riding a horse that's going nowhere, it became something that was ultimately frivolous or like, you know, a silly pursuit. And then that evolved into like around the Industrial Revolution when there was more leisure time, people were. then turned it into a kind of frivolous pursuit that you did in your leisure time.

So there is this like continuum of like silliness. But actually I think what we'll find out today is that they're deeply important. Love that. That's how the first question. Hi, Keith. Hi, Jordan. I just want to say, I fucking love this show. My name's Caprice.

I'm from Bristol. And this year I decided to embark on a journey of moving my body for joy. So I've been trying different hobbies. I've done surfing. I've done rollerblading. I've done a twerk fit dance class. I've been climbing. I've been playing tennis.

I feel like I'm doing it all. And I think something I've really enjoyed has been trying something that I'm not necessarily good at. I think we're often as adults in spaces where we are good at things or okay at things. Whereas when we were children, I feel like, you know, perhaps families might have pushed us to try new things

or you were assigned up to all these different classes. And you did it regardless of if you were good or not. So I want to know how do you feel about trying new hobbies and try new things, even if you suck at it. Massive love to you both. Big up my best friend, Leanne, because I know she'll be listening. Yes, Caprice. Yo, Caprice is on fire, but she has her own podcast.

The clarity, the movement. True, so. Are you friends with her? No, but I love that she called me Keats. You can definitely call me Keats, Caprice. I'm right. It's important this breadth that you've given yourself, this huge umbrella of just movement,

because that is it, right? That's a lot of hobbies are kind of physical. They can be, don't have to be, but a lot of them can be like sort of like sports-based, exercise-based. But although a hobby is something a bit different because it shouldn't feel like a chore a hobby. movement so much comes under it. Caprice is playing tennis,

but she's also doing an array of different shit. That's like just the best way to do it and to bring like this idea of a hobby into your life. And listen to her, she sounds energized, doesn't she? Can I just say quickly before we answer, I know I'm not supposed to be going on tangents all the time. Sorry, it's just some feedback on her.

Who said that? But can I just say me, myself, I'm talking to my other personality. So twerking, you should, we should, find a way of doing a listen bitch that incorporates twerking. maybe it's dance or something. Dance could be one of the topics. Twirking is fascinating the history of it, genuinely,

because I think we allow ourselves, like many things in the Western world, to pervert or sexualize something like twerking, right? Because, of course, there are spaces in which it's used in that way. But that generation of life force in a person, whether it's a twerker or the twerkey, is spiritual, bro. It's spiritual keys. It's okay.

It's fine. I'm saying the action and the end. If you were to go to a twerking workshop or twerking class, it wouldn't matter whether or not you can twerking, in a vote of commerce. Oh, well, there you go. That would be my answer to question. It's like, yeah, like, everything else she said,

I was like, yeah, man, yeah, man. But then twirking, I was like, oh, no, because I'm not good at that. Right. But that's probably exactly why I should incorporate it on the way hobby schedule. And just to be clear, like, you know in Carnival, right? Shut, obviously, you're obviously at West London. I own Carnival, yes. Do you not, people have said this, people have said this about Rio.

in a hit, like the amount of people I've spoken to, not specifically Rio because there's big carnival on Salvador as well, but the energy, they say the energy, the energy, the energy, the energy, the energy in Notting Hill as well. You know, that is, I think a big part of that is to do with the dancers, the traditional dancers, if not all of it, that rush, you know, you feel like,

high. And I feel it more than ever when I'm sober. Totally, and you feel it as you walk in. Yes, because now I'm sober, I'm not, I'm not getting deterred or masked by other feelings. I'm going like, whoa, I actually feel like heady,

heady from the energy. Interesting. That's good to say because I want to do this carnival sober so that would be, that's quite a good introduction. Honestly, just to say at one point at Carnival sober,

I felt briefly like I was on the verge of possession by a spirit. That's not how you feel five rums in. I mean, you do, but in a different way. That is literally through a spirit. That's literally possession by spirit.

People forget. They're called spirits for a reason. Anyway, we should do alcohol as a listen, bitch. Anyway, let's say on track. Sorry, back on track, back on track. Is it, can you do a hobby if you're not good at it? 100%. Great for community.

Great for also, imagine if like one of your biggest wounds in life, which many of us would experience is rejection, right? So why wouldn't you go and do a hobby that you can't do? Because you're fair, what is it that we're fearing? Judgment? Are we fearing, like embarrassment? Yeah, it's very good to go through those barriers. Like I hadn't played tennis in a really long time this summer

because when I was back at my mum's last year, I just didn't really play it. And the first time I got on the court, I was shit. And I was like, oh, God, I can't play tennis. And I was like, no, you just need to stay in it again and have fun. Remember why you love it. And I suddenly remembered all the stuff that I'd learned from my coach the year previously.

And now I'm in a really good place with tennis. Imagine if I gone on the court and went, oh, I'm not good at it anymore and just stopped. Now this summer is just very tennis heavy. I've been playing with my little brother. which has been so nice. God, tennis is good. And Phoebe's son, he's just started his tennis club.

Yeah, see, community. The part of it that you need isn't like, can I compete at a let? No, it doesn't matter. Like, just enjoy. That's what's so great about hobbies. Hobbies are like purely about enjoyment. It's not like going to the gym.

That's not the same thing. Like, Jordan, your hobby, I suppose we could say your hobby is when you discovered painting. That would be the hobby you discovered. Oh, yes. My, okay, so with painting, yeah, but that's slightly different because, okay, wait, hold on, I need to answer this in two parts because I wanted to say something before about. Well, do you know what?

Actually, we should go to the next question because it will probably come up. Okay. Let's have another question. It's Kerry from Stroud. With hobbies, it just really confuses me and it's something that plays with my mind quite a lot. I had an ex-partner once that sort of said it in a bad way that I don't stick to anything like a hobby. I don't know why it bothered him. But I think it's because I dabbled in lots of things.

So one week I'll be camping, next week will be tennis and then lots of different things. So I suppose I do just try lots of things. But I don't see it as a bad, or I do now, I suppose, I see it as a bad thing that I don't commit to just one. So maybe my hobby isn't, say, tennis or camping or swimming or whatever. Maybe my hobby is dabbling. But is that a bad thing?

I don't know. No, no, no, no. Maybe you dabble. Who gives a shit? Be a dabbler. Try things, fail, find out what you're really good at. But, God, isn't it interesting we always find a way to, like, see the negative in what we're, a choice we make for ourselves?

Well, like, hold some sort of shame in it. No, babe, no. I would go as far as to say that I think in life, for some reason we are programmed to be ashamed of movement in a metaphysical sense. What people are scared of if they ever say, like, recently people are like, can you teach me to skip? I don't need to teach you. You don't need to learn.

it's not even like that. We all know how to jump up and down, right? And it's something that people are so fearful of because I think it's that jump. I agree with you. And I'm so glad you spoke about skipping because that's a fantastic hobby that you are very much part of.

I didn't actually mean literal movement. I meant as in moving house, moving like friends, moving partner, moving country, like moving hobby, moving career. It might be right.

This is what I'm going to say. It might be founded on something. But I wonder if when people say like, oh, I'm changing my job or I'm moving to this country or I gave up this hobby to do that one like the person said, right? Yeah. I think if I'm to believe my own instincts, which might not be a reflection of everybody, there's immediately like a preconditioned part of me that thinks it's sad. But I don't know.

I don't actually think that. Once I think my real, once I think my actual self kicks in, I think I'll go like, this is great. Like I love change. I love people who are brave enough to just fucking. move. I love it. I really do. I genuinely love that. I've obviously as a nomad myself. But I think that we

think that we aspire to like solidity and grounding. So like if say for example if someone said to you, I've been in the same job for 40 years you'd think wow that's amazing, right? No, I think that's quite sad. You'd think the other way. Interesting. Because I get bored

really easily in my work. I need to be stimulated. This show keeps me on my toes. So I'm saying, okay, so somewhere in between and isn't it? Because the idea is that there's a shame in not paying attention to one thing for too long. Yeah, but you know what? If I had another life, just one other one, then I really would.

This is good start of a song. But if I had another life, it could be, like. If I could have another try. Just give me a try, please, another try. Children, I love when you close your eyes when you say. It's so deep. If I had another life, I would have one job and live in a small town and have loads of babies and a husband. Keep it all of it smaller, calmer and simpler.

A simple life. A simple life. I just want to say that the lady's question, the lady who had the question, it wasn't actually her that was being down on her displacement of which hobby. It was like her partner. So just say to him, excuse me, I'm expressing myself and trying to discover more about myself. The reason I say that is like there are just some people in life that are just wired in that way and I think that's beautiful. Like when I hear stories of stability, I don't think, oh no, are you, you're just unadventurous. I just think, oh, wow, if that actually makes you happy, that makes me happy.

If it makes you happy, that's amazing. Again, I won't go off on a tangent, but for you, for example, you talk about enjoying London. I don't hear you and go, that's wrong. I'm like, wow, I would love to have that same kind of feeling of like busy. Oh yeah, I like the business and the movement, you know. So, but then similarly, if I hear someone say, I lived here and then I lived here and then I lived here and then I'm, you know, like moved my whole life into this country. I'm like sick too. Like, but you know, all these things exist.

So someone says like, I'd like doing one hobby a week indefinitely. Like, and it changes every week. I'll be like, fuck yeah. Yeah, definitely. And actually with a hobby, I just don't want to live a life where I don't discover that I might be excellent at chess. Some people need to test every, some people need to go on the menu and eat every goddamn meal, bro. and then you know which one's your favourite. That's quite me.

I'm going to try and learn poker this summer. Poker's great. What a hobby would that be? Where's key? She's got her poker night. No, poker's actually a really... Honestly, I think you'd get obsessed of that, though. Me too.

Got to take this crazy brain somewhere. Might as well take it to the poker table. Make some money. Brilliant. Next question. Hi, this is Andrea from Northampton. A long time listener to Listen Bitch from day one, I think. Hobbies. It's a hobby slash obsession booking holidays, going on holidays, thinking about holidays, planning holidays. So yeah, it's not my full-time job. But because I am obsessed with going

away and planning trips, I did start to sign it with a travel agency and I booked them for the people now and I get my little kick from booking trips for people. I get paid a very small amount for doing it through the suppliers. But yeah, it's brilliant. Endorphines through the roof. Holidays for me. Holidays for the people. Literally the only reason I work is to book a trip.

So the lady turned it into her job. That's really cool. Just as a side hustle. I think that's actually like the way forward. That's what I've done. I've turned my hobby into my business. And it's really good place to start. I think it's really cool because then you're loving.

what you do in that essence. I think that's the dream for everybody maybe to make their transition from hobby to career. Wow. I'm just thinking like if you became a painter in like your 40s. Oh, I can so see that. I can see that.

Yes, I feel like you would have come deeply. What a full circle thing to do. And that's why it's so important that we discover our hobbies as in any way we can and as soon as we can because they could become something that's much deeper in your life later.

This is the interesting thing about painting is that I think, and I don't know how to say this about sounding like a bit of a, a dick, but I'm just like going at this from my life and looking back at my life, like, I'm quite good at most things, like quite good. I'm definitely not, and I really mean this, like, in a most balanced way, I definitely don't think I'm except. Writing is the first thing I've done where I'm like, I think I'm actually a good writer. Like I can read other writing

and I feel I can at least match that and I have my own voice. So I'm not comparing. I'm not, and it's a really bizarre feeling I've not had before where I can return to that craft and it gives me Yeah, man, fantastic. Like, of course there's the ego part of it, like, you know, will people buy my writing, am I losing it? Like, all that kind of stuff happens for sure. But there's like another part that maybe would have happened to music when I was a kid, but I lost it for sure where I can think to myself,

even if everyone's pissing me off, I can go to the page and write. Like, I feel that in my soul, which is beautiful, right? With painting, I painted as a favour for a friend, like someone close to me to do a show, like celebrity. landscape artist of the year. I did it as a favour, right? I didn't know much about painting other than than this girl showed me how to paint a little bit in this random warehouse in LA. I know that sounds nuts. Sorry. Anyway. That you said. And I kind of had the, she was like, oh my God, you know, you're really good.

And I was like, yeah, sure, whatever. I don't know if that was the case, but she gave me a love encouragement. And then I did it on the show. And then I literally got commissioned on the show to do a painting for like, so-house, because the woman, I just took too long to do the painting. But she was like, you're really good. You should do more painting, right? That blonde lady from portrait artist of the year who works for Soho House. Yeah, I know her. Kate? Kate, yeah. But what I felt in that immediacy was this fear immediately, right?

Because what I was feeling while painting, which I don't even think I feel with writing, is because I'm so slow. I'm so slow at painting. And it's because I'm very particular about like the type of colours that are going there. And also I don't use any of the actual painting technique. So I don't like paint the canvas black first

and then lighter and lighter and lighter. I just do it like almost childlike. sketch out the outlines of where I want to paint and then I just put the paint in and I just change it. There's no rhyme or reason. There's no method. So it takes me a long, long time.

But in those moments, I am actually zoned in. Like there's nothing else. Even writing, even writing, there's nothing that can take me away from my phone, from whatever. I just put on music

and I'm actually only focused on making colors and putting the color on the canvas. Oh my God. I don't want that to be infected with the concept of that painting being worthy of purchase or worthy of exhibition. I just want that feeling. And I almost feel protective.

So actually, that's beautiful. But it probably means that it shouldn't become your work. Yes. Because I was just, right? Because that will steal it. It does steal that. It will steal it. It will steal it.

Like I really truly want to cultivate that space. I want to like ring fence it. I remember Stormsie talking about on that Louis Thruid to you that I love. And he asked him about the second album, which was a third album, which was that album that did very well, that was sort of beautiful and sort of a little bit more melodic and a bit more African.

The Maya one, the one really like, talking about Maya. Yeah, trying to get Maya back. I'm actually talking about the third one then. Sorry, that's what's coming out.

Yeah, but he went to a little island off Essex or something and he like recorded the whole thing with like a group of people, including my friend Owen Cart's, but boop, shout out. Okay.

Made this like entire like, very musically adventurous. Like, you know, he was doing basically the opposite of what people expected him to do in that moment, which was cool. Exactly. And in turn, with that, Louis says to him, do you ever worry about how well it's going to do? Yeah. An album that you put out. And he said, and I really believe him, he said, literally 100%, that's the thing I'm least fearful about.

That's what I'm thinking about the least. And I thought, what fucking freedom? Because that isn't your hobby. Exactly. That's your livelihood. That's your reputation. That's your everything and you are still putting out something and you don't give a fuck what people want. It's what you want to give, what you need to say.

It was a brave decision at the time and it's one of the hardest things to navigate as an artist. It just is. And I got respect for him for doing that. And ironically, I think it was actually other decisions in his career that have ended up kind of impacting him more than like doing an experimental album. I mean, yeah, I mean, obviously I've got my own compressions in terms of being. a pop star trying to do what they want. But it's almost impossible to take away the two things, to be honest, especially if you're in an industry that focuses on profit.

You can say that, but then the reality hits. Yeah. So we take that back. Think carefully before you make your hobby. No, no, no, but that's, okay, yeah. Two truths. I think it can be a beautiful thing and it can also be quite a difficult thing. It can take away.

I think you just kind of have to split the psyche in that respect. Yeah. I remember back in the day, just as a funny thing, I went back in the day they used to do just as a side note. I remember rappers in the UK would do a thing where they would release a commercial song and a street song. And that was fascinating. That doesn't happen. Oh my God.

Well, like endubs. Pre-endubs, but around endubs. No, pre-endubs. End-dubs would have been the moment where those things came together. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. But there would be like an artist would put out like a song for radio. They'd literally say it. It would be like a song for radio.

Yes. And then there'd be a song for the... Do you remember? Yes, absolutely. So it'd be like, oh, that's not even for... for me and they'll be like yeah yeah listen let me get my money but here's me and then split the two they don't really do it anymore yeah no you'd be more open about the fact that wants to make money and wants to be creative yeah you'd be straight up like this is this is three and a half minutes long

I'm not swearing I'm just doing this so I get some money trying to make the other shit this is to sell out hall arena and this is to feel good yeah literally got it literally literally in the range rover sport performance is more than a promise it's something you feel on every drive. With the choice of powerful mild hybrid and plug-in hybrid engines, Range River Sport responds instantly, bringing unbridled power and precise handling into perfect balance. Explore more atrangerover.com. What do Beatles member Sir Paul McCartney? YouTube megastar, Mr. Beast.

And former Facebook executive Cheryl Sandberg all have in common. They're all being discussed in the new season of Good Bad Billionaire, the podcast which explores the lives and fortunes of the world's super rich. That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service. Listen now. Search for Good Bad Billion. wherever you get your BBC podcasts. Welcome back to the final foray on this particular ship. All right, next question, please.

My name is Alice and I'm from Sydney. I love the podcast and never miss an episode. So thank you both so much because you make every morning the best morning for me. I'm 34 and I have a question for you because I've turned my hobby into a business of five years now. I make chocolate with my partner, which was a hobby from loving eating chocolate. And now it's turned into a business where we import hundreds of kilos of cacao beans from around

the world to make single origin chocolate for chefs and cafes. But being around the smell and the process does make me think of chocolate slightly differently, and I enjoy eating it less now. So my question is, do you think some hobbies should stay as hobbies? And do you think you're risking the love of your hobby by turning it into a job? Oh, Alice, I love your life. I love your life. You and your sexy boyfriend in Australia making chocolate.

Single origin ethical, bloody chocolate. What a life. And I'm so happy I'm part of that life in a weird way, without even knowing it. It's so fun. Yeah, that's mad. So I think this is a version of it going right. One turns their hobby into their work. But there is also another double-edged sword,

which is like, don't they say something about a butcher's like, what about the butcher or something? And it's like this idea of like if you are surrounded by something all day long, it takes the joy out of whatever it was in your life before. It's actually very, very tricky, this balance of how you want to implement something in your life. I suppose for me turning skipping into my business is different because if I was just skipping for my business in a kind of like charitable community way, that would sort of, they would just mirror each other.

But actually what I've loved is that the hobby led me to the world of design, which is such a new workspace for me. And not to mention the world of business and raising capital and the rest. and so the hobby became the portal to the new work life. And that really is cool. I think this is something to do with the separation between being self-serving and being of service. I think that's where I think the confusion lies and maybe where it would be like, I think if there was clarity for the individual on what they're doing,

then it maybe wouldn't be conflicting. Like, for example, like, I think the reason why craft or like, you know, that idea of having a hobby or a craft that you lean into is that you're on an adventure with your own experience of the thing, right? With writing, it's like, can I write a sentence that brings me clarity? That's what's so trippy about writing. Sometimes you write what you feel before you realize it, right? That's the space you're trying to get to. Flow state where you're like, whoa, I didn't even know I felt like that, right? and then like if it was something like chocolate

you're obviously making chocolate that you want to eat right so you're like you're like tasting and the da da da da da da and oh my god this is fucking amazing I love this chocolate I want to make this chocolate to eat but then where it becomes where it becomes different is what you would call audience capture right where it's like then you put

out the chocolate but maybe you have a more nuanced taste than like most people so then you would get feedback going I wish it was a tiny bit sweeter but maybe you don't wish it was sweeter right so then you have to ask yourself, do I make the chocolate sweeter for other people because it'll make them happy at the expense to myself? Or do I maintain the love for my own chocolate at the

expense of most people? Which is the same across things, same with music, same with writing. I know what sentences I like to read, but I have a particular brain. If someone says, do you want to sell three million books? Yeah, I'd probably have to write more simplified. Yes, but haven't the greatest artists of all time always, no matter what medium, are within, haven't they always followed their own instinct and their own guts? Otherwise, you are just a sheep following. This is like leader chat. It's leader chat.

And also, if you had a list of the amount of artists historically that died poor and unappreciated, it is insane. No, no, no, honestly, it's insane. The woman who wrote Black Beauty, right, was about, I mean, at that time, there was probably horrible words for it, but she was childless, unmarried, a lone woman. What would they call her spinster? The kind of shit you would say it, you know? Yeah.

And she died before it became an international bestseller of Black Beauty. She had gone. I think she, I think it would. No, she did just, five months, just. She definitely saw it doing well. Yeah, she saw it like picking up. Oh, man, what a story that is. She was called Anna Sewell, Anna Sewell, and she died five months after it came out.

Thank God. Thank God. And it's like, that happens a lot. Like, no, but like the closeness. It's like, and then three weeks before it was. was released. It's like, oh, come on. Yeah, I think Van Gogh died poor. Totally poor and unknown, yeah. There's a photographer called Vivian Meyer, who was like, who lived in a room with a family

that she put a lock on the doors. She walked around the town, taking pictures on her, like this huge, beautiful, like pentax or one, you know, these big things like you're you know, like old school, all black and white pictures. She died alone, no money. All her photographs went into storage, some random guy bought the storage box at an auction. I've read this. Put on an exhibition and she's become like one of the most famous

photographers at all time. Oh my God. Wasn't she a nanny? Yeah, she was an opair. She was a living opair. Yeah. But her pictures are phenomenal. Right.

So it's a tough one. What's the lesson, Jordan? It's a toughie. I'm just saying it's a toughie. It's weird because it was like the question that you ask and I will not provide an answer. The question you ask is, would there are,

have changed if they were appreciated while they were there. Very good. Ah, very good. Yeah, what would they have made if people were looking? Exactly. So that's why it's hard to, sorry, we still talk about hobbies, but anyway, I've got to say this. That's why it's hard to stay listening to your gut when success comes.

Exactly. Because you're like, we'll just keep doing what you do because people start getting different with success and then greedy and worried and and it's like, ah, I. I've seen that happen over 25 years of working in television so many times. A hundred percent. So I think as an answer to this question, as a potential answer,

sorry Alice. I would assume that you would have to separate the two at a certain point. Like we were talking about, were we talking about names? Yeah, because of Monti Dund, yeah. So like we were talking about names, you go, all right, there's a point now where this is a business. So I have to actually say, that's the business.

Language. Yes. And that's a different name. It's me and my partner. and we're doing chocolate and we're being of service. Meanwhile, I will have my own practice,

my own space. Yes, totally. The other day I realized I hadn't skipped in a month because all I do is talk about skipping. Exactly.

And skipping ropes. And I went down to have a skip and I was like, oh yeah, this led to that. I love this. That's why I'm doing this. And I know I can give it to other people that it was like return to the source.

Yeah, which I have to do too, by the way. hands up. Like I am responsible. I, I, too, get, I've been doing so many conversations

about, like, what my next book is, I've forgotten that I just like writing, regardless. Yeah. It doesn't have to be good.

Yeah. You know, doesn't have to be good. Nah. Let's have our final question. This has been wonderful. God, this is our last,

last question for the last episode of Listen Bitch. On the BBC. On the BBC. Hi, Macita and Jordan. My name's Becky, and I'm from West Yorkshire. And I'm so excited to hear

that this week's listen bitch theme is Hobby. because hobbies is my word for 2026 because I decided that I want to take more time to myself, be mindful, get off screens, try new things. So this year I started doing Lego and jigsaw puzzles and I know I mentioned screens but I have been playing video games as well which I find really good for just getting into my imagination. So my question is what do you do to be more mindful and just kind of get out of your own head and be more present in your body

and stay off screens and do you have any hobby recommendations for me? Thanks, love you both, love the pod. Thanks, babe. That's who video killed the radio star. I just realized that's what might have killed the hobby, the phone. A bloody phone!

Because I suppose people playing games on their phones which I've never been into. I suppose that is people's... It's probably the same part of the brain. 100%. That would be kind of usually focused on a sort of activity or game, which of course will come under hobbies. So I didn't even realize hobbies are like the antidote to screen time.

So that's actually a huge thing to remember. And I think it is actually really good to hear that people are like thinking about them as an antidote to screen time. I think this is like the second person that was like, I've decided to focus on like doing things like this out in the world more. I know she said she's playing video games as well but hey we're all human whatever keeps you happy

but I mean I've said it so many times I would just say racket sports like it's not just tennis like lots of people don't know that they can go and play badminton down like five minutes from their house and there are so many free tennis courts not so much anymore but there are so many tennis courts

just in London I can't imagine how many are around the country but we've been very lucky in that way when they built this country they really supplied kind of courts for sports everywhere. Think about basketball courts, football pitches. It's all over this country and I love that about this country. But also like badminton and squash seem a little bit like more left field sports, but they're really not. And when you go and play these games, you really, like, for as a hobby,

changes my day, which in turn changes my week, which in turn changes my life. That's how, that's how much a hobby can mean. But new to add to the lifts, chess, poker, drafts. There's a few other card games I want to learn. The thing about poker, which I love and also stresses me out, is that unfortunately, it's not the most practical hobby because it takes...

Six people. Six people and a long time. You need to have like four to five hours free. Of an evening. Yeah. That's why people have poker night. Yeah, literally. And it can go till, from experience,

it can go late. But that's what I'm thinking of doing is like a new pastime, like having people around for poker night. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's very communal, it's a vibe. Poker night in the penthouse, yes, please. That sounds like a dream. Jade does puzzles.

Right. And coloring in and shit. And I can see that being really calming. I mean, coloring in as like just a thing to do. It's so similar to what I was saying about painting. It's like there's something really deeply spiritual about that. I think even when I was on an emotional trauma retreat, one of the things we were doing our break time was mandalayas,

like just colouring mandalayas. You don't have to be good at coloring in. You just got to enjoy it. You just got to enjoy it. Trying to figure out if that's enough of a metaphor to finish our last ever list of it. Columnity. You don't have, no, you don't have to be good at colouring in. You just have to enjoy it.

Enjoy it. That's it. Thank you, Nat. What a team we are. Exactly. Don't be afraid to go outside the lines. And this is really a story of independence and enjoyment, which is where me and Jordan are headed. As I said, like Dick Whittington before us, we are headed out into the big world to see what the hell there is to find.

And we're taking you all with us. And also, can I just say, as a general, this is another like kind of, I guess parallel. But something my mum installed in me, and I've said this before on the podcast, I think, but I want to say it again, because I do think it's really cool, is that just because everyone is doing something one way doesn't mean there isn't another way of doing it. Now, that can be really beneficial and it's also also not good. So like it's not good as in, I've taken that advice and it's really benefited me. It's also because I sometimes slip into a world of like, oh, well, that means I don't have to learn the basis of this before I start being experimental. But I definitely do because I'll fuck up. But I think, you know, sometimes people will go naively into a situation, whether that's a hobby or like, you know, something else like a career or whatever.

And they're actually going to approach it in a way because they haven't been told. Like, for example, if you take music, yeah. there are people who are incredible musicians like as in they know everything there is to know about the theory of music but they lack the ingenuity to actually create something new they end up often in bands

that are just playing songs that already existed but playing them really really well because they almost can't theorise of something whereas you get a song there's one particularly famous song where the story is that the guy was in the studio and he was tuning a piano so it's going ding ding ding

ding, ding, dung. And then someone went, yeah, that should be the riff. Like a musician would think that was insulting. A pianist would think it was insulting for them tuning a piano to be the riff. But then it became iconic. So I'm just saying, my point is... Play, make accidents, yes. Yes.

Our perception of good is informed by like an set idea of how to do something. You might end up doing it in a much more interesting way. Yeah, I've got another way of saying it. Just be more like, Prince about it. Yeah, Prince is what he wants. What would Prince do? Didn't Jimmy Hendrish play the guitar, like, left-handed?

Like, he didn't, he did. He turned it upside down. Yeah, yeah, he did. He did all the time. Oh, sorry, he didn't play the guitar left-handed. He played the right-handed guitar upside down. Because he was left-handed. He was making it work for him. Yeah. That's actually it.

What we're doing is very Prince of us. This is very when he goes into like the symbol time, where he didn't want to be called Prince anymore. and he just became a symbol. Yeah, it was a bit fucking nuts, but he was very much following his path and being guided by his own instinct and curiosity. And that's what I'm most excited about Jordan Stevens.

Stay curious. Stay curious. Be brave. Jump off the ledge. Do what you've got to do. BBC, thank you for the most wonderful, life-changing two years of my life and for all the support and the beautiful campaigns.

And it was truly an honour to start this show in a place that I have so much pride about working for. I hope we work together again soon. But for now, take my hand, Jordan. This is our Exodus. We should probably sing Exodus. Do you know Exodus? Do you even know Bob Marley?

Do I know him personally? No. What's the lyrics for Exodus? Exodus. My favorite bit of Bob Marley is when the guy asks him how much money he's got. And he says, Possession make you rich. You think money make you rich?

Yes. Yes. That is good. That is how we end this. Exodus movement of job people. Possession make you rich? Question mark. We'll see you on the other side.

Come with us, world, as we go out into this big, brave foray together. BBC? Mw-a. Thank you for everything. Oh-voir. We'll see you on the other side. Oro-a-voir. Thanks for listening to Miss Me.

This is a Perciphonica production for BBC Sounds. Hi there, I'm Dillie Carter, and this is everything you need to know about my new podcast. Sort Your Life Out, Unpacked. I interview a different celebrity every episode. They bring me in three items from their home that reveal the most about them, and we unpack the stories behind those items.

And I give you a few tips and tricks along the way. Some of the guests that I'm going to be interviewing are TV presenters like Lorraine Kelly, reality stars like Kerry Catona, podcast royalty like Elizabeth Day, and of course, our very own Stacey Solomon. Oh, and let's not forget some incredibly funny comedians like Phil Wang and Eddie Caddy. I think, as with everything, sort your life out based, you are going to get so much motivation, inspiration and ideas for your own home.

Sort Your Life Out unpacked presented by me, Diddy Carter. You can watch us on IPlayer and listen on BBC Sounds. Step inside the Range Rover sport and experience refinement in every detail. With features like cabin air purification and active noise cancellation, every drive feels composed and considered. Explore more atrangerover.ca. What do Beatles member Sir Paul McCartney, YouTube megastar, Mr. Beast,

and former Facebook executive Cheryl Sandberg all have in common. They're all being discussed in the new season of Good Bad Billionaire, the podcast which explores the lives and fortunes of the world's super rich. That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service. Listen now, search for Good Bad Billionaire, wherever you get your BBC podcasts.