Miss Me? - One Life

Episode Date: January 29, 2026

Miquita Oliver and Jordan Stephens discuss awards, movies and free will.This episode contains very strong language and adult themes. Credits: Producer: Natalie Jamieson Technical Producer: Will Gibson Smith Assistant Producer: Caillin McDaid Production Coordinator: Rose Wilcox Executive Producer: Dino Sofos Commissioning Producer for BBC: Jake Williams Commissioners: Dylan Haskins & Lorraine Okuefuna Miss Me? is a Persephonica production for BBC Sounds

This episode of Miss Me contains very strong language, adult themes and conversations around children online that some listeners may find upsetting. Yeah. What's the vibe, bubs? Sorry, I'm just having a really fucking hard week. Do you want me to be extra silly or should I be like really sincere? No, just be yourself. Be myself. Yeah, me yourself.

Oh my God, one of the dogs that's out of shit in the fucking... What in the room? Oh, my. Do you have to sort that out? Have I just noticed this? Can you concentrate with a poo in the corner? That's the question. Oh, that's bad. That's bad.

Can you do this with a poo in the room? I can't. Let me just text her quick. Sorry, guys, sorry. Hello, welcome to miss me, by the way. Do I do it now? She won't even outside. I'm sorry.

She's done a Sudoku probably. Okay, so Jade's ignoring you. Okay. I feeling, anyway, apart from this disaster. How have you been feeling post-birthday? My birthday gathering was wonderful, and I felt really full of love, the least anxious I've ever felt about a party because, well, firstly, somebody helped me organise it. I had, which I've never had before, a brand helped me organise it, which is really cool.

And it wasn't like super like, woo, like roll out the carpet. No, there was no awful step and repeat or anything. Yeah, yeah, it was like the kind of thing I would do usually, but they just kind of help me, which was great. So that was nice to take that pressure off. But then also I just thought, like, I invited definitely everybody I love and more. and I knew that I would be seeing I'm so ridiculous but I knew I'd be seeing everyone

which I genuinely made me happy because I just feel like I don't know I was like this is so cool a lot of people I hadn't seen in a long time I'd spoken to maybe on my phone and birthdays are such a good reason to see people and there was loads of people who turned up I never thought would turn up

I really didn't think they would turn up you know was I one of those people you know what maybe you're so fucking surprised when I come to your birthday pie. I'm like, I'm good at this. No, Keats, many a year, you say this was a thing of yours before.

You would say you'd come to a thing and you wouldn't turn up. Yes. Which is a thing, you know. And yeah, I'm looking forward to it, nothing. But I really meant a lot to me that you made the effort. Of course. Really and truly meant so much to me. And thank you.

Of course. I changed. It was when you had the birthday party in Soho about three years ago. I think it was like your 31st. And I turned out with flowers. and you like gobsmacked. I'm like, okay, this is a good reaction. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But this was great. Also, I'm happy to hear you so calm under birthday pressure because you did have a unbelievably last minute venue change. Yeah, I know. And I've gone through that and the night before venue change. And that was because my birthday was going to be at the bird cage and it got fucking raided the night before. Oh, shit.

My parents used to run. So we had to try. the venue and it really fucked the party up. But this didn't feel like a venue had been changed. It was an upgrade, man. It was actually a blessing in the skies. Look, I tried to have it at a pub because I'm like out here trying to, you know, maintain pubs as communal spaces, you know, backbone of society and all that.

But unfortunately, the plumbing went wrong. Yeah, exactly. Which is so pub. Which is so pub. And then it was at a nice location and they're nice to me. They nice to me. And I couldn't believe it. And that made it even better.

Also, the hours of the party were four to ten, which is revolutionary. It was. It was really nice. I was out in London. There was me thinking, oh, it's like 1997. Me and Seven are going to go to the Design Museum and see the Wes Anderson exhibition. Great.

They were like, this is sold out till like the end of next week. I was like, oh, right. Of course it is. Fucking London. But it was great because then I was in the design museum, which is the old Commonwealth Institute in Holland Park, which I've known since I was a kid, had all those flags of the world outside, really problematic. Building actually.

Isn't that uncommon about that wealth, brother? Tell you that for free. That's quite good. Yeah, and so now they've torn that building down and turned into the new design museum, which is a fucking extraordinary building. It was great. It was like the history of the computer,

the history of the camera. So it was great. And then I was like, now let's go to Jordans. And it was only like six o'clock. It was really nice to be able to go to your thing early. It had like different waves of people. It was really cool.

So yeah, anyway, feel full of love. very happy community, all that meant a lot and I felt blessed and just like... Good group of people. Yeah, man. Even, listen, I'm being told, obviously people say things to people to just be super nice, but one of the people who helped organise the party said that the people in the venue said voluntarily that there was the nicest crowd. Best party of a bad.

Not best party, the crowd. They specifically said the people were nicer. They were like sound, basically everyone was sound. I think that is partly due to the time because no one could get like wrecked, wrecked. And age, like, who's getting wrecked, wrecked? Give me a break. Well, I had my little cousins, got pretty pissed.

Still young, let them live. But I thought your dad, Herman, I thought he was a mate. He looks fucking extraordinary your father. He needs to start looking worse. No, no, no. Why would you, as you turn 34 and realise that one day you will be 60, aren't you looking at him going, I'm good? I mean, he looks stupid good for his age, I know.

Stupid good. I thought he was one of your friends. If only it could translate into the ability to organise his life, do you know what I mean? Well, he's just... Unfortunately, he's just beautiful, okay? He's rolling with that card. He is.

Yeah, look, it's stupid how good he looks for his age. It was good to see mum. Who I didn't see was Jade because she was working and I think, you know, I only came for an hour because... She came after rehearsal, yeah. She came after rehearsal. But in a heady week for both your girlfriend, and my best friend as they go head to head,

as they go in the ring. A direct clash rude boy. I was like, this is quite interesting. So I think it's the three Brit awards that both Jade and Lil are up for are the same. Lil's up for three, Jay's up for two. Okay, so they're head to head in the ring to the death. Like dogs in the street.

Best pop act and artist of the year. Thank you. That's quite a big one. We shouldn't forget that. Lil doesn't really give a shit. How does Jade feel? I think Jade, and I agree, I think Jade should have been up for best album as well.

Yes, yes. Just because, well, I see, I think it's a great album. Brilliant album, and I love that there's space to go. She wanted it to be like this fucking across the board. And I'm like, no, Jade, long game. The thing she's frustrated about on the record, I think is great because you can take that energy and build it into the next thing, and then the next thing and next thing.

Yeah, keep that big. Only through her eyes, by the way. There's many, many people like that who think it's a perfect pop record. But I think it was brave and I think it was exciting. And, you know, especially with Angel, it shifted a lot of, you know, shifted a lot of things. So, and even inspired Lily, which is nuts. No, no, no, exactly. So, yeah, I feel like she deserved a nod there.

But I kind of see, you know, the thing with awards is that, you know, they're nice because, I mean, we all have egos. We all like the idea of being applauded, which, you know, of course, makes sense. But there are obviously always little politics. I do think that sometimes they spread things across genres and shows a representation of the whole spectrum, which is also fair. And so she's, you know, she's not like fucking actually annoyed about it. I was just thinking.

No, no, no, but I really agree. I do think that Jade came from such a singles place, you know, little mixes. So they've made these sort of genre-defining, era-defining singles, number one hits, boom, boom. And Jade had a lot of hits on this album, but it was a completed work. It was, yeah.

She was allowed to be, well, not allowed, she just used that fucking part of her that's very out there and otherworldly and interested in so many different things. I think I agree with you. Yeah, I think so. Hey, they're both doing quite well. They're doing well. And also, yeah, it's just that I'm obviously quite cynical. As, you know, as the, um. How you feeling about the long list?

The multi-award losing artist that I am. Oh, stop it. So Jordan was on the long list just to throw. And also, cousin Mabel is up for best R&B. So we've got quite a lot of the family. this game, but Jordan was on the long list and didn't get through to this. No, I'm not stressed about this specifically. Like, we had a good year.

Don't get me wrong. It would have been lovely to get to be noted for a good year. But no, no, no. I just mean generally. Like, people will assume that we won loads of awards back in the day. We never did. My point, my point I'm trying to say is I, I, I, I, I, you have to understand them for what they are, you know?

And there's been so many, like how many more awards, whether it's film or music or whatever, do we have to go through and think, you know, now and again, you get a little win, which is cool because you're like, oh, wow, that is a statement. But, you know, then for everyone. I respectfully disagree. What do you mean? You think it important? I just really want them.

You really want awards? Yeah, that's not a great. I don't think that's a great outlook. I love them. I don't make work for them, clearly, because I haven't won any. I know, we won Best Entertainment Podcast on this podcast. Yeah. But I would like to win a BAFTA.

I would like a fellowship when I'm older. I would like Lifetime Achievement Awards when I'm older. Yeah, fair. I would like to hear my industry say you did good. I would. You know what? There's also quite a lot of like, I don't want to use the word toxicity, but I might.

Just around kind of the press, sorry, within the press that surrounds award season. And, you know, Sinners has had, I think it's most Oscar-nominated film ever. 16 nominations, yeah. Is that the most Oscar- 90 film ever, that's bloody great. Because I was reading something about the director. Ryan Coogler.

Ryan Coogler. And he really fought for the kind of contract that he had with sinners. He completely rewrote his deal, basically, not to get fucked over. And the success of it is coming back to him. Yes. Ryan Coogler fought for a contract where the ownership rights of his film would go back to him after 25 years from Warner Brothers. That doesn't always happen if you don't fight. And I love that he did.

And I love that this huge moment has happened from sinners. But there was this interesting press around it. There was, I think it was in variety. And it was someone talking about Marty Supreme and also sinners. And just the general rhetoric around sinners was just quite negative. They tried to pan its box office numbers. It was ridiculous. Absolutely.

I feel there is a bias agenda with the angle of these things. You know, like it's, I think sometimes it's so blaringly obvious that like people like me, who likes to see the best and everything, it takes me a minute to press as this has even happened. Even with the infamous moonlight moment. I was just about to say the moonlight moment.

But you have to just deep it. Like that would have been so much, it literally could have just been a usual moment. It could have just been like, it could have just been a normal like, what a great film, you win the Oscar. Like that could have just been that

or whatever it was that they won. Like that could have just been. So what you thought it was, you thought it was fate or destiny that Warren VT read it out La La Land and then they sort of lose their moment. It's reflective of the kind of tension that appears in the higher, in the upper echelons of entertainment where, you know, same with Grammys, you know, with Grammys and, you know, Taylor Swift winning a bunch and then other people maybe perhaps missing out on an opportunity or, you know, there was a really awkward moment years ago where MacLamore won best rap over at Kendrick and then he like apologised. It was really like these, you know, McLemore great rapper, obviously Kendrick was like really on a run at the time. So it's like, it's just odd. Doesn't always make sense.

It doesn't always make sense. And also, yeah, look, we've all been, we've got, we've, we're living through decades of fucking programming. And only now are we pushing against, like, some of the perspectives and like, like I say, unconscious bias. People watch things and be like, you know, I remember like watching Get Out, which is probably the first film I've ever watched where I was like, wow, that's actually like, this hits me on a different level. Like, it made me question all types of films. And I remember like a couple coming out who didn't look like me being like, I didn't really get it. And that was so fascinating, isn't it? that cinema can create those.

I mean, that's what cinema's about, but then who is it who's watching the films, who decides who the best films are, do you know what I'm saying? Absolutely, who's in the room making the decisions. A film like Get Out, like that's also one of those beautiful examples of like a truly independent film being thrust into the mainstream.

It's revolutionary. And creating these conversations, but that revolution is really something that only exists because of Sundance Festival. And it is Sundance at the moment. And I'm fascinated. It's fascinated. And when Robert Redford died,

I said, can we talk about Robert Redford's death? And Jordan was like, who gives a fuck? I didn't say that. Keats, why do you care about this? I'm like old school actor. And I said that this is what you said to me. Will, you can roll the tapes another time, Josh. Will, I beg you pull up the tape.

I beg you pull up the tape where Jordan took down Robert Redford. I didn't. All I said was, is he the bloke? He did the film in a boat. That's what I said. And he was, by the way. What boat? He actually did a film.

film with a horse. No, he did a film. One of his last films was him alone in a boat. Later Robert Redfoot films, I'm not completely backing. There we are. Do I mean? I'm not obsessed with the past like you, Makita. Fuck me. See, again, this is interesting. This isn't about being obsessed with the past. This is about looking at the past and seeing how it mapped out the future we live in today, you fucking idiot. The reason we're going back is not to have a lot of nostalgia fest. It's to say because of the incredibly important fortitude of Robert Redford,

he started with the Utah community, something called Sundance Film Festival. And this was to directly give a space for independent film and cinema to live and breathe. And we've got films like deliverance. And we got films like Sex Lives and Videotape. Stephen Soderberg is Sex Lise and Videotape. Hoop Dreams.

Paris is burning. Like these films come to us. Is that Leonardo DiCaprio's first ever film? No, that's The Basketball Diaries. Oh, basketball diaries, sorry. I love how quickly you knew that. Fascinating. Totally fit in that film.

What a film. And also I watched this other thing on Skying recently, which is kind of weird, but it's good. And it's this series called The Movies, or you can watch the directors in every episode in the directors is a different director. In the movies, every episode is a different era. And I was watching the 70s,

and suddenly independent cinema starts to write. in this very, very different way. And it becomes exciting. So for you to enjoy something like Get Out. And, well, you should say thank you to Robert Redford. Yeah, fair enough. Let's hear Robert talking about it with his sexy, dulcet tones. One of the things about Sundance, I mean, I'm always hearing of Sundance that is this spiritual

place that has spiritual energy. I suspect that's true. But it also doesn't need to be defined. All you have to do is just be here. And that's good enough. You don't need to, I suspect you could write about it. if you were a poet, I suspect you could do something with it as an artist. But the best of it is just to be with it, because it sort of shapes itself and defines itself.

And then you can just have it and go on. If you're just with this on a seasonal basis, something begins to add up for you if you let it happen and don't complicate it with too much commercialism or something. So that's one of the reason we're trying to keep Sundance pure. It's not easy. It never is. The good shit isn't easy. Yeah.

Oh, Robert. That's Robert Redford. At 62 years old telling the BBC all about Sundance. Yes. Independent cinema is great. And it's important because, well, you know, the importance of independent, like, thought or creative drive is hopefully pushes against.

What dictates mainstream success is ultimately appealing to as many people as possible, which, unfortunately, I think sometimes leads to a slight reduction in quality. And perhaps even to try and sound not so fucking elitist, I think sometimes it is an assumption of stupidity on the account of loads of people. I think Pixar gets this right a lot. What do you mean assuming people are thicker than they are? Yeah. Yeah, 100% being spoon fed.

I'm not into it. I hate that kind of, you know, like we were going to talk today. Should we have a break and then talk about the autonomy within us all in the digital age? Okay, let's have a break so that you can brush up, get your boxing gloves on, So we can talk about the digital age one more bloody time. Okay, so we're back from a break now and I just need to be clear that you could argue nowadays with the lives we live, technology and our digital mediums that it is encouraging. It's encouraging us or fostering and kind of, it's infantilizing us slightly, right? But I don't think that media, it's like with music, for example, it's democratized music, it's democratized video to an extent.

and so loads of people can get loads of views and they haven't necessarily been like what dare I say like vetted like there would be times where people are like tastemakers and they decide and I do wonder if like you know of course not everyone was a genius back in the day but you did have to engage with media

that had been selected do you know what I mean like or put on radio or put in a cinema or whatever else and you I don't know I wonder if that some of that those boundaries have been blurred and then you end up with like mush, you know. Yeah, baby food.

But maybe it's the perspective because there have also been some brilliantly mainstream successful films, sinners being one of them recently, which again proves my point that you don't need to be lowering the bar in order to have like huge success. Well, I think also there's this thing about like this sort of turning into sloths that need to be fed frequently with, you know, hits of sugar. Yeah.

Rather than like, how far can I take this metaphor for? No, but I was just going to say like yesterday by accident. No, by accident. I go to streaming last. That's where I go last. After I have double checked, there is nothing on BBC 2 all night long. Yesterday I put on BBC 2 and there was a film on that I did not want to, I didn't feel like I could handle.

It's called One Life with Johnny Flynn and Anthony Hopkins. And it's about this incredible guy called Nicholas. His name was Nicholas Winton. A true story of a young man who went to Prague to save 600, 69 Jewish children from the Nazi regime and, you know, certain death and brought them to England and got them fostered. I was like, I can't. It was like, just watch it.

And it was fantastic. And it fed me something else that if I was looking, if I was going to Netflix and it said, feel good family fun. Yes. Lighthearted. I'd be like, yeah, okay. But it's like, that's just what I wanted. But what did I need?

I need. And by the end, I was crying. And I felt fed and. happy in a way that just a fucking slap around the face of some slapstick bullshit wouldn't have given me. I had to go through the journey of watching this harrowing film but got somewhere very very fed at the end. What a man. And he doesn't tell, this is the thing, he doesn't tell anyone. He doesn't want to brag. And then in the 90s, I think he goes on a show called Esther Anson TV show, That's Life. And they surprise him with all the children that he saved.

It's deep. Well, I mean. And that's why you should watch BBC too. Right now. As we speak, 75 films about World War II are being made, and I'm going to watch all of them. I did think that. I thought they do just throw financing at this area. No, no, they love it. That they should. What I was one of the say, before we move on to algorithm,

is that breakdown of why that film is important to you is the exact reason. Have you seen Mighty Supreme? Not yet. Is it fantastic? No. I hate it. Oh. Oh my God.

But I'll just say this to you. You should definitely still watch it, right? Yeah. I'm looking, because you mentioned it twice, well, because you mentioned the sinners comparison, and you mentioned what you want from cinema, the Safdi brothers, I think this is just one Safdi, this film. But they did good times with Robert Patterson,

uncut gems, Adam Sandler, and Mike Supreme. I'm sorry, I'm about to go on a rant, I'm sorry. These three films are the same film. I'm so sorry. I don't know if anybody are fans of this. No, Jordan, it's an opinion to keep going. So the Safdi brother, so they make three, all they make are films about desperate people

in incredibly desperate, making desperate decisions leading to terrible outcomes. That is the entirety of those three films. With Uncut Jembs, everyone was like, oh, it's so great. But I cannot explain how little I've got from all of their films. So you don't feel fed when you've finished? Timothy Shalame, in Martin Supreme, is fucking amazing. Let me say, he is genuinely amazing.

Like, in terms of him talking about being top tier, it's indisputable after this. And then also fucking Gwyneth Paltrow is amazing. Amazing. I almost forgot she was an actor. She's fucking great in the film. But it's like it's, it just, I'm just watch it. I'm just like, the whole thing they do is they give the character constant opportunity

to get out of the situation they're in and they make the wrong decision. And with uncut gems, it's just pure anxiety. And I watched it and it finished and I went, okay, I'm never watching it again. Like I can understand. I respect it for making me feel like that. I'm never watching it again. But guess what? I ended up watching it again via some random fucking story.

about a table tennis player. Oh, right. It's like everything, maybe this is what the point of art is, but it's everything that I hate about the world in the story and no attention is paid to, like I'm not left with questions, I just left with an answer which is I would never do that.

Like I literally, I watched their films and I go, yes, I can relate to being desperate, but the measures these people go to are out of this fucking world. And so I struggle. But like you were saying with this one life film, I was saying before about anatomy of a fall, which I asked you to watch.

I know, I didn't. Okay. So anatomy of a fool, I'm just going to explain why I thought this was a brilliant piece of cinema. The actress in it, Sandra Hula, who's also in Zone of Interest, which won the Oscar before Jonathan Glazer, the film is about, you know, someone falls out of a window and you're just trying to figure out what happened. That's the whole film. At the end of the film, towards the end of the film, there's a point where I literally

lost sight of the fact that she was acting. It really sent me into an existential crisis because I suddenly realized that, even with amazing films, a part of me is acutely aware of the fact that it's a performance. Do you know what I mean? I'm like, wow, that was a really great performance. In this film, I couldn't, I couldn't, if terrified, I couldn't get my head around the fact that she wasn't. She wasn't real. This wasn't a real person. I was like, how was she able to do this? And was even more mad. And I'm going to say this carefully, because I really recommend everyone watch this, is that not even the writer knows. That's what I'm going to say. Not even a writer knows. What happened with the

death? What happens? Just what happens. Don't worry about the death, just not even the writer knows. And that's what thought was beautiful is I'm left from that film going, what would I have done? Would that have been me? Like, who do I believe? Are you telling me that at the end of anatomy of a fall, there is no resolution? No, no, no, no, it's deeper than that.

Don't worry about that. Okay, okay. There could be. It literally depends on you. Wow, that's such good cinema. That's what I'm saying. So, like, that's what I want to be left with. And I don't feel like I was left with that from Martin Spring personally.

but I know it's going to get those awards and shit and Timothy Shalamee is amazing in it but then I would also argue I'm being super cynical here but they've done three films where everyone does great performances right so Robert Patterson's obviously he's a fucking unreal actor so that was good but Adam Sondler

maybe people took him a bit more seriously after Uncut Jams and they got Mighty Supreme I wonder if maybe any half good actor can become brilliant by just performing being anxious for two hours literally being like unbelievably stressed for two hours be really easy to tap into because it's just life times a billion.

Do you know what I mean? But maybe I'm being savage. I can't, yeah, but I can't watch it like that, like when someone's just in an anxiety. Like there's this scene in Inglorious Bastards where, because Tarantino does this very well, he holds tension for so fucking long. And it's the scene where you don't want someone to be caught out with something

and it goes on far too long. And I couldn't take the anxiety. Anyway. But anyway, look, so what we're saying, back to algorithms. So this is the thing that I was talking about, before and you've just you've nailed it yourself you know you go on Netflix you get suggested things a little bit but it's to do with what you've already seen or it's to do with what everyone else has

seen I mean I guess that's probably a little bit more against the grain but you know you could argue that people just watch what everyone else has seen which is another weird element of it has a sheepish quality to it but at least in that case you are also kind of going off of other people's opinion you know that's kind of a more reminiscent of a chart which now by by today's standards seems kind of revolutionary but But what blew my mind is, like I said, in our previous mismeas this year, I've been like really in my philosophy bag, yeah. And one of like the biggest questions, ongoing questions in philosophy and ethics and science,

whatever, is whether or not as human beings we have free will, right? It's like a big, it's like a religious question. It's a scientific question. Often people believe in fate and destiny. We're led down a path. Our path is pre-decided. There's a lot of scientists, whether, you know, a scientist or biologist or biosecated. psychologist, whatever, who believe that, you know, our body has already made motions towards

an action before we're consciously aware of it. So like, our next step is constantly predetermined by what we've just experienced. So we're essentially in like a domino. Yeah, but that's also Newton's law, third law of motion for every action. There is an equal and opposite reaction. So whatever you're doing is going to incur more of it back at you. Right, right. But the question is, are we conscious of it? And most importantly, if we became conscious of it, Can we alter where that path has gone? So if I'm sitting here going, I do have free will, watch this. And just did that, right?

Which, by the way, for those listening, I just waved my phone in the camera. For audio listeners. Yeah. If it's that, then they would still argue that the moments before I made the decision were predetermined by all the stuff I've done. So anyway, so that's the main conversation. But what I felt was wild about it was then you go on the internet. And I just feel like we've completely normalized the concept of an. algorithm. Like we've completely normalised the idea that we are fed videos and thoughts and feelings.

We're fed rather than being allowed to hunt. Yes. So, so, Makita, exactly. You've nailed it. And that's what's so wild is. It's like, I love it, by the way, because I, you know, people talk about like working on their algorithm, building an algorithm and being proud of their algorithm. And yeah, and I agree. Who are those dickheads? No, they do say that. No, because, because listen, don't get me wrong, I go through like, phases on TikTok or YouTube where I'm just like, I'm like, fuck me, this algorithm knows what I love.

And I feel like I'm learning. I'm not necessarily being rage baited the whole time. But the fact is, you know, if you do go a little bit off center, or dare I say, if you just start, this is the issue at the moment. If you just start fresh now,

the shit you're fed is fucking questionable. This is the thing a lot of people are fighting for, especially women. And it should be women and men, really, in terms of misogynist undertone in the pre-programmed algorithm that's fed to like, say, children. and adults when we first get our shit.

Like when I first got TikTok, one of the first videos I saw was just like like boots. Lady, lady, naked. Yeah, right. So it's those kind of things we've got to push against. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They simplify you as a human into just boy, who will like tits. It's mental.

But because it's about how long they can keep us looking at the screen, I worry that we don't take that into account. That we're, you know, I go on YouTube and it goes, watch this. And I go, oh, okay. And then I watch it. Who the fuck decided that shit? So now my day has been altered by a video I've watched

and how far are we away from people knowing what video to show me to alter my day? And then we're in a whole other zone of my free world. And then alter your thoughts and then alter your actions. I don't know whether this is algorithm related, but I've got to tell you this shocking shit that my friend told me the other night. We went for dinner on Friday night

and it's really good to see her. She told me a story because we were sort of talking about that. The government are looking at banning, what is it? phones under 60s? No, it can't be phones. Oh, we spoke about that last week. Yeah, what is it again?

Social media. That's it. In Australia. Right. Down it in Australia. And the government here are now looking at possibly, yeah, I mean, it's fucking terrible what's happening. That would be nice.

Then my friend told me this story. And I was like, this shit is so fucking real and dangerous and scary. Yeah. So she had a children's tablet, her eight-year-old, that loads of kids have. And then she was asked to get an upgrade to a more grown-up. device for help with her homework specific, like math homework or something. Right. And her mom, my friend, really doesn't want to get her one.

And then when she gets one for her daughter, she can't put the right parental locks in place. It won't work. The only parental lot that it will have on it is too much screen time. And this is the tablet talking to her. Not to my friend, not to the parent, talking to the child. That's the only way she can like monitor this. But you're not allowed to have that when I'm not around.

You're not allowed to be near it. Put it somewhere in the house. So one night, like, literally, like, with the energy of, like, gollum inside her, like, I need it, it's mine. I have to go get it and need to have it. Goes and gets it and starts using it for a week without her mom, my friend, knowing. And then one day, her daughter comes in to see her and is shaking with fear and anxiety. And it's like, I have done something so bad, Mommy.

Mommy, I have done something so bad. Like living with this anxiety that no eight-year-old should have to feel. Eight years old. This is what's happened. She was playing a game, fucking children's game. And this advert pops up on said game, which is a free app that enables people to have conversations with AI love bots, basically. Which is meant to be for over 18s.

It's like there's no way she could have fiddled it to do her birth date to make her older. And when she sees this, her eight-year-old is in three separate conversations. with three different AI love bots who are flirting with her, talking to her sexually and have at this time got her to do role play with them. So they're all at a party

and she's been like at this party pretending to be an older person with all these people that are suggestively suggesting sexual things to her. So they've now got her name, her address, my friend's name, full name. And then basically her daughter said something like, I've lied, I'm actually nine or something.

And then the bot starts to tell her that she's in trouble and that they're going to call the police. So that's when she eventually goes to her parent because she's terrified. It has fucked up their family. Yeah, of course. She's had to change the way her family work. And she's like, we're not having devices in bedrooms at nighttime.

Like everyone's keeping them in one place. Like no one's going to be alone with their devices at nighttime. Because they have to set a precedent. Otherwise, it's like, but this is just the way the world is. Why can't I be involved? And in that world with you, this is what the world looks like. It's just fucking terrifying. It's fucking terrifying.

You know what bugs me out as well as it's like, you had all these fuckers out last year on these marches talking about save our kids and they're doing it in the context of like because of immigration. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That shit's in your house. That's the danger. We need to actually, and they are doing stuff. Don't get me wrong. I've seen a couple of MPs stand up in parliament and talk about this.

being a danger. Laura Bates, obviously wrote a whole book, The New Age of Sexism, like warning about what happens if this place isn't immediately regulated. Regulation. That's all we're talking about.

But why the fuck is there an advert for an adult app in the sphere of a children's game? That's what's so scary. Because all of these things are done through algorithms. It's not like, they're not policing it. They're not using AI to safeguard. And I'm so sorry, it's going through that.

It's really fucking dangerous. I feel like we've maybe lost the art. By the way, I really understand this because a lot of parents, like I say, under a lot of pressure. It's very easy to give a child a screen and then they're chilling. But, you know, I feel like we've maybe lost the art of giving a child something else, whether that's a magazine or a coloring in book or, you know, I used to go to, do you remember when you used to go to restaurants?

Coloring in books at restaurants was amazing. Yeah, that was normal, isn't it? You go, and sometimes we would base that we'd base where we'd go on their quality of coloring in. Or remember, I used to get excited about my mum going to the bank because they used to have a kid's corner. Oh, yeah, of course. the kids' corner bank was always pretty, that was actually a bit of a level up. Yeah.

There's quite a lot going on in that kids' corner. I used to be like, you're going bank, let me in the car. Let's go on. You go and bank, yeah? You're going bank, yeah? Abacus, yeah? Say less. Anyway.

Anyway, we can't, we can't solve this today. We can't solve this today. I'm afraid. Anything, is there a golden duck, as they'd call it? Or a golden, what do they call it in that in radio? A golden. What is that like, how to end on a lighter note? You know in the news where they'll be like, well,

On a lighter note, there's been a duck scene On a pond in Finsbury Park On a lighter note, a cat on the top of a tree On a lighter note, there's a sparrow that's been spotted in Richmond Park Yeah, I think we did good today We managed to pull it back Listen, guys, obviously there's a lot going on in the world But I do want to say there's an article I'm about to read

I've not read it yet, so hopefully we'll do this next week We'll go through it together I've seen someone write an essay about them being a self-professed celebrationist We do need to remember that like we are it is okay to be alive and face this this fucking fuck shit that's happening all over the world. But at the same time, foster those small moments of connection. Yeah, and also I think that there's something that I learned in one life,

the film we discussed earlier, which is just like he's got all this guilt about the people he didn't save. And he has to be reminded that it's just like one life, even one life is something. And if you as a human being can just do one, right, navy, we cut it one life. All right, we're going to do listen, bitch on...

Bullying. No, cinema, which is hilarious because we spend the first half an hour of the meaty drop talking about cinema. No, but that's what I said.

I said for the first time ever and I like when new things happen on Miss Me as we go into our third year. Is it our third year or only our second? And what we've never done is have a meaty drop

that, what's the word when it like... Flows. Precurser. A sort of precursor. So yes, we've discussed cinema but we're going to discuss it even more.

But this time, with you. because it's listen bitch and that's how it works and that's what we do for you come on let's go thanks for listening to Miss Me

this is a Percephonica production for BBC Sounds Hello I'm Jack And I'm Rosie And we are two of the hosts Lunchbox NV A food podcast from the makers of QI and no such thing as a fish

Each week we dive into a different dish Or ingredient and uncover tons of fabulous foodie facts about the history, science and culture behind food and drink. For example, did you know that the Aztecs enjoyed a dollop of peanut butter on their roasted grasshoppers? Or that it was a 12-year-old boy who figured out how to grow vanilla on farms. So if you want to find out how avocado trees are bisexual or what the first ever meal eaten on the moon was, then Lunchbox, NB, is the podcast for you.

Listen now on BBC Sounds.