MMA Fighting - Between the Links: Poirier vs. McGregor 3 Aftermath, UFC 264 Fallout, Paul vs. Woodley Presser, More

Episode Date: July 16, 2021

Between the Links returns after a storyline-heavy #UFC264 event this past weekend. Host Mike Heck is joined by MMA Fighting’s Alexander K. Lee and journalist E. Spencer Kyte to discuss the biggest stories of the past week in mixed martial arts. This week, the panel discusses Dustin Poirier’s TKO win over Conor McGregor and the biggest takeaways from the third meeting between the rivals, McGregor’s claims that the #UFC, Dana White and the medical staff were aware of stress fractures he was dealing with, Gilbert Burns’ win over Stephen Thompson, the stoppage of the Sean O’Malley vs. Kris Moutinho fight, the press conference between Jake Paul and Tyron Woodley, and the upcoming UFC Vegas 31 and Bellator 262 events. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Follow Alexander K. Lee: @AlexanderKLee Follow E. Spencer Kyte: @spencerkyte Subscribe: http://goo.gl/dYpsgH Check out our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/u8VvLi Visit our playlists: http://goo.gl/eFhsvM Like MMAF on Facebook: http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z Follow on Twitter: http://goo.gl/nOATUI Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's wean the links. Bye. Thank you. And a big shout out to the iconic voice. of Esther Lynn as we welcome you to a brand new edition of Between the Links. Thank you for joining us. As you know, a lot to talk about. Seems to be the case every week in MMA,

but especially this week after UFC 264 has been wrapped and packed. A lot of MMA for us to consume this coming weekend as well. And yes, we will discuss the robot this week, the robot that made lots of headlines, but let us not waste any time. Let us introduce the combatants. No tag team match or going old school one-off. one. First off, joining the program for the first time, an old colleague, an old co-worker back in

the day where we were both over at Fanside at MMA. I was just cutting my teeth in this crazy sport of ours. He's now doing a lot of stuff on his own website, as well as UFC.com. A great talent in our space. Let us say hello to Mr. E. Spencer Kite. How are you, man? Good, man. Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure to be here. It's great to have you here and back on the show in this Canada versus Canada matchup. back-to-back wins for this man. One is a solo competitor. One is a member of a team, a championship team at that.

His team known as the King and I, alongside Kristen King, defeated Jedmishu and Fernando Pratchez last week. Let us say hello to the Prince of Positivity and the birthday boy. Mr. Alex Cayley, how are you, buddy? You know, Mike, when I'm talking to you guys, when I'm doing shows like this, every day is my birthday. This is true. Yeah, I love it.

But, yes, listen, I want to say last. week. I may have won. And Kristen, I may have one, I'd say. Really, you know, Ben Fernandah kind of defeated themselves, really more so Jay. But I'll take the win. Anyway, it is official. As you guys can see here, it is now five Ws, two in a row. But yes, today is, it will be a win, not just yourself, but for my tag team partner, I'm Chris and King. King and I, merchandise coming soon. Excellent. So let's get right into this thing. There's no time like the present to discuss the fallout of UFC 264, because no one has done. that yet. No one has done that at all this week. So we'll just go ahead and do it right now and

open Pandora's box, if you will. Most notably, let us discuss the main events between Dustin Portier and Connor McGregor. I don't need to go into the whole thing. You all know what happened by now, but there have been stories within the story, including an interesting piece of information provided by Connor McGregor a little earlier today, which we will get to in a moment. But, Spencer, let's begin with you. Let's just say five years from right now, somebody comes up to you, some MMA fan says, hey, Spencer, what comes to the top of your mind when you think of Dustin Porrier versus Connor McGregor 3? That whole fight, that whole night, what came out of it?

What's the first thing that you would tell them about? Probably Jolie Porier giving Dustin, giving Connor McGregor the finger in the middle of the octagon. An iconic image. Thank you to whoever captured it. If somebody wants to put it on a t-shirt, my DMs are open. I will purchase several. Really, it's Dustin rising above.

It's sort of the way that whole thing played out between Connor being old Connor and crossing some lines and saying some stuff that felt classless to me. And Dustin just remaining largely the classy individual that he is threw a couple words in there, you know, had a few shots in there. Did the Billy Strut himself a little bit. But for the most part made it about his performance. and the fight itself and being a competitor. And so for me, it's sort of that play between the two of them. And of course, as I said, Jolie getting her little message in there to Connor as well. A.K., your thoughts.

Like, how do you feel in the future you will remember that night, remember that fight and everything that has come from it? And I'll be telling everybody about the hero of heroes tied to Ivasa, who, goodness, the man could not have had a more inspiring evening. And I'm glad Spencer went outside the main, well, essentially went outside the two main event competitors and went with the main event competitor associate, the wonderful Chipply Poiré, because I'm also going,

yeah, I'm going with Tuivasa. It's not just, again, whatever however people feel about Greg Hardy, people know, I'm not a fan. So it's not just him putting away Greg Hardy, which was fantastic. The man comes out to, I think what we can all agree is an all-time class. classic wannabe by the Spice Girls. It's a, and just changes the whole mood of the card.

I mean, to that point, we'd seen some pretty spectacular stuff, but, you know, it still felt like, it felt like a solid UFC card. He took it to another level. He gave people something that clearly had never seen before, a grown man at the UFC level walking out to the Spice Girls. He had previously walked out to, My Heart Will Go On by Celine Dion, which I know Spencer and I, of course, can both appreciate us. She's a Canadian icon.

So that was a little shed us for us. And then afterwards, I hate shooys. But the man deserved it. Seeing the man just go shooey to shooey to shooey to shooey, the poor guy getting blasted with a hot sauce shooey. But, you know, he grinned and he bared through it all. So for me, I'll be telling people about the night that tied to Avasa just changed all of our lives. It was such an immaculate performance from entrance to exit.

All right. So let us get into a big story. story that that dropped today is from not really a story it's just a video that was released from one Connor McGregor because we we've heard all different things and different angles of things that were said but today people have gotten all sorts of inquisitive there's lots of questions being asked not towards Connor but now towards the UFC because Connor McGregor drops around the six or so minute video on his Instagram page and he talked about the latest in regards to his injury his broken tibia.

He's riding around in a motorized scooter, singing rap songs, and he seemed in pretty good spirits. But in the midst of all this, he said that he went into this fight with Dustin Porreier injured. And not only that, he said the UFC was aware of it.

So let me pull this up. Here's what he said. I was injured going into the fight. People are asking me, when was the leg broke, at what point of the leg break? Ask Dana White. Ask the UFC.

Ask Dr. Davidson, the head doctor of the UFC, they knew I had stress fractures in my leg going into the cage. There was debate about pulling the thing out because I was sparring without shin pads and I would kick the knee a few times. So I had multiple stress fractures in the shin bone above the ankle. And then I have trouble with the ankle anyway throughout the years of effing fighting all the time. And I also was wrapping the ankle every training session. So, AK, he also said that this injury in a bizarre way essentially was a blizzard.

blessing in disguise because it forced him to get treatment on this leg. What is your reaction to what Connor McGregor had to say today in his comments in that six-minute Instagram video? First off, let me address one of the comments on our YouTube asking, where is Jed? I'll answer that one real quick. Who cares? So talking about, so going to the second thing I want to do is, the second thing I want to do is, Mike, if I may, is directly attack Spencer because, yes, look, we're Canadian, we're all friends here. But I will say Spencer, It's wonderful profiles for UFC.com. If you guys, if you guys like, you know, anytime lead up to fight night, you know,

you want to know more about some of these fighters, Spencer's always writing stuff, you know, in case you're wondering what you guys been up to, maybe why would they were out of action? So compliments him for that. But I bet Spencer, he should lose this round automatically because I bet he knew all about, why don't you tell Spencer about your exclusive interview you had with Connor McGregor where he tells you all about his leg problems? This whole thing could have been avoided. Poor Connor McGregor goes in there.

You should have shared with the world what was wrong with poor Connor McGregor, who clearly has been dealing with these serious injuries for God knows how long, according to his video today. So yes, well, I would love to answer this question, Mike. I'm happy to push it on to Spencer first, because I want answers. Why, Spencer, did you not tell America that Conner McGregor's legs just essentially did not work going into Saturdays? What happened, Spencer?

I really do apologize for all of that inside information that I most certainly did not have. You know, my connections. I have, you know, back when Connor started, I have been over to Ireland and met him and John Kavanaugh and a bunch of the team at SBG when they were in the old warehouse days back just after his debut. That relationship really hasn't maintained very well since he became a global superstar and the wealthiest athlete in the world. He doesn't really care to talk to Canadian journalists from Abbottesford, British Columbia

anymore. There are bigger people in his world than I am. So I sadly didn't have any of that inside information. And, you know, I understand the tactic. I appreciate the tactic. I appreciate the kind words about my work. But yeah, I had no inside information on this one and have to have to bow out of holding responsibility for for not telling people about Conner's shins.

A.K., I mean, you're not the, I mean, stop trying to take the hosting duties and try to fear this conversation the way you're going to question. I want answers, A.K., I want answers from you. What was the question again? Are you kidding me? That was like two minutes ago. The reaction to the video and what he said about not only the injury, but the UFC knowing about it. that's a hell oh oh oh oh the reaction to the video okay uh Mike that's a hell of an allegation because he specifically says he he doesn't just go you know he didn't just do like a vague hand

wave like oh some people knew about this he says Dana White knew about it the UFC whatever that means officials matchmakers Dr. Davidson the you know the long time official physician of the UFC these are really serious and presumably of course this includes the Las Vegas Commission the Nevada Nevada Athletic Commission So this is a really serious thing to throw out there. Obviously, I can tell you, you know, we've reached out to the UFC unsurprisingly. They have not commented on this particular situation. I don't think they're in a hurry to address it.

But this is just classic excuse-making. I'm not saying he couldn't have issues, couldn't have had issues with his legs. But what could be different about him than so many other fighters that go into the UFC? And again, he's also not the first fighter to come up with excuses. So I'm not saying like, oh, this is such a McGregor thing to do. All fighters do it. All fighters do it.

It's becoming a chronic thing with him. It always seems to be something now when he loses. I was inefficient with my energy. Oh, the cat kicks caught me off guard. You know, I was focusing more on boxing than MMA in the second four-way fight. So it's becoming an issue. And if people want to buy these excuses, that's fine. I understand a lot of fans of his want to find a way to maintain their faith in him.

And that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. And that's, you know, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, He needs to maintain his own confidence, his own marketability. He's going to be on the shelf for a while. So there's no reason for him to go into this, I guess there's no reason to go into this stretch of inactivity with any sort of plan for introspection. The man doesn't change. The man doesn't change as part of his brand.

So while I, you know, I, these kind of claims of, again, having this injury and everyone knowing about it, I don't love it. I don't think it's great. But do I think he's like he's going to retract the same point? Does he think this is bad for his brand? Not at all. Not at all. This is classic excuse making. And he's not the first guy to do it.

He won't be the last. And it certainly won't be the last time that he does it. Spencer, what did you think of this thing? Because I had two different thoughts. One was kind of with AK, like, wow, you're throwing it all out there. Like you're throwing these guys under the bus.

But at the same token, I'm thinking to myself, and I haven't actually seen like any medical clearance paperwork in terms of the Nevada Commission. But if you have these, you know, if you have these injuries, I think you're supposed to declare that you have these injuries. So chances are he didn't even declare these injuries.

So is this Connor just saying, listen, if I'm going down, y'all going down with me? Yeah, it's going to be interesting to find out if this is Connor just saying stuff or if this is like real. And I mean, let's be clear. There have been lots of athletes as AK said that have not declared stuff in the past that have come out afterwards and said, well, hand was broken. I had a fractured skull. I had a broken back. All of those different things. And so this isn't a new tactic. But it is a big one because he does put specific names to it with Dana, with Dr. Davidson, with the UFC. And so that side of it will be interesting to figure out. My first takeaway from the video is that I want to see like the next six months just a Connor Instagram live series of him driving around on a rascal scooter in California. Yeah. Like I just cruise down the beach, people shouting at him, him cursing people out. Like, that's entertaining to me. Give me that. Give me that Connor McGregor show. Give me, give me that version of things as opposed to the guy we saw last week that was back to being a jackass and saying stuff that is off color and off putting.

Give me, give me playful fun, charming, Connor. And then let's just let the excuse making and all of that stuff subside because I think at the end of the day, it really just is trying to find a way to rationalize what happened and trying to find a way to justify what happened, which, as AK said, it happens every time. I mean, can't you all remember that Nathan Diaz was naturally a heavyweight in that fight? And poor little Connor went in there trying to, like, this is just how it goes, right?

And if he really did have fractured shins and chronically bad ankles, it's like a lot of smart people on Twitter said today, then the absolute best strategy sure was to go out there and just start spamming kicks right off the bat just to just to see how those fractured shins are going to hold up i love how scooter conner is now a thing oh yeah inside the mhm a it's great give me all of it like six months of him going to get yogurt him cruising down the beach like you know there's going to be like isn't there a connor mcgregor impersonator out that way that like they're going to connect step and do the like buddy cop movie like give it to me give me that let me see it the family's coming

out and it'd be great take the kids for a ride on the scooter i like it in light of all of this and we're not going to get into the ugliness of it all with some of the things that were said because listen it's been beaten to death everybody's talked about it paul felder cut a delightful promo about it and we're just going to kind of leave it at that so things did get ugly along the way but you could even make the argument that because of the ugliness, it seems that Dana White, Connor McGregor, and Dustin Porreier all want a fourth fight. They all want a fourth fight.

And things have gotten very personal between the two guys and rightfully so. And although there isn't full closure, there are a lot of people that have seen enough here, Spencer. So where are you at on this? I guess there's two questions. One, do we need to see a fourth fight to close this book for good? And the other question, will we see a fourth fight? Yeah, those.

are the two separate questions. I don't need to see a fourth fight. I came away from that one feeling like Dustin is the better fighter right now and has been in these two fights this year and will be 18 months from now when they do it for a fourth time because they will do it for a fourth time. I mean, Dustin's answer, I kind of expected Dustin to shoot it down at the press conference afterwards. And as soon as somebody asked, he was like, oh, we're not done. Like whether it's outside on the sidewalk or in the octagon, we're doing it again because you don't say the things that he said and not have to pay for them. And so when you take that animosity and combine it with Conner's marketability that's never going to wane, like you see in the aftermath of this that

no matter what happens, there are people that are going to loyally stand behind this dude and by every fight he's in. And so you get another opportunity to do a, do a fight that did 1.7 or 1.8 million pay per viewbys, it's going to happen again. I don't necessarily need to see it. I think we get a similar outcome to the first fight. I don't hope we get a similar outcome to this one, obviously. I want anybody to break their leg. But I think it ends up being the same result and doesn't really move us forward anywhere in this division that always kind of feels like it gets backed up a little bit because of stuff like this. A.K., for those who listen to On to the next one, we know that you have no desire to see a fourth

fight, but I have made this point, and people have kind of chastised me for it. Some people agreed, but a lot of people disagreed. I feel that even if Dustin Porier beats Charles Oliver and becomes the champion, the second Connor is ready to come back, even though he's gotten finished in two straight fights and three out of four, that they're going to throw him into a title fight with Dustin Pori and people are like, ah, there's no way. They can't force Dustin to take this fight. force him. You know how much money he's going to make to fight Connor a fourth time with a title on the line? This thing did 1.8 million pay-per-view buys for a card that kind of like didn't really get cooking until fight week.

What do you think is going to happen 18 months from now when the comeback is on? There's a title on the line and we have this fourth fight once and for all. Could it do better than 1.8 mil? We're going to see this fight, right? Am I nuts? I don't know if it does better than 1.8 mil, but the fact that it's like minimum 1.5. 5 mil is like insane is insane when you compare it to again that your average or your average UFC card these days.

Mike, you're right. I personally don't want to see it. I didn't want to see the third fight. I tweeted something out to the effect of like I want to see Davy Grant Cheevera three more than I want to see, you know, McGregor Porre three. And I wasn't even joking. Like I honestly didn't care. I'm human, of course.

Also, you know, it's our job. We covered the fight. Of course, I'll find it intriguing. It's kind of McGregor. He's the biggest name in the sport. But there's other matchups I want to see him in. That said, if I'm Dustin Porriere, I want to fight Cona McGregor forever. I want to get that title.

I want to fight Olivera. I want to win that title. And I really had to think about it today because there was just some discussion. Someone reminded me that, you know, Hafeld, the card wasn't going to fall apart if for whatever reason, let's say Conner McGregor couldn't compete. Let's say he had to pull out because of the, he had leg injuries. RDA, Hafeld Osangios was there. you know, he did weigh in his replacement.

So maybe that lends credence to the theory that UFC thought there was a chance, you know, something might happen with Connor. But putting that aside, if the card had gone down with the Dustin Porrier, Hafei al-Dosanos' main event, that does maybe 400,000 buys tops, and that's including people who maybe ordered the pay-per-view ahead of time, and they're just like, well, I'm not going to watch it anyway. Forget I've already ordered. I'm not pulling out.

So maybe I'm wrong. maybe 500,000. I don't know how much cashé Porriere has as a pay-per-view draw. RDA, I think, is certainly not as big of a star as Porier or McGregor, so it would really be more Porri-A. But 500,000 tops, I'm really thinking close to 400,000. And again, when you're pori and you're getting pay-per-view points, the difference between 400,000 and 1.8 million. I'm not a doctor, guys. It's a lot of money.

And it's more than he'll ever get to fight anybody. Even Oliver, I think it's 500,000 tops. So I'm against it. it, but if Dustin Forre said, look, I'm willing to fight this guy for eternity and do one point, even diminishing returns, 1.5 million. The next time it's 1.2 million. Then it's just 1 million for the sixth time they fight. That's still just so much more money. Like, we can't even figure out how much, calculate how much more money that is than he would normally get for anyone else. So I don't like it, but it's very, very likely going to happen.

It's true. We're all in agreement. This fight will happen at some point. It will not be Dustin's next fight. Probably won't be two fights from now, but as soon as Connor's ready, get ready for it because it's going to happen. But the story will continue on. We will see where it officially goes. But let's talk more about some of the other storylines coming out of UFC 264. But the point for Ra 1 goes to the man who put maybe the greatest reality show ever into the world for us. Spencer Kite gets the point because Connor on a scooter for the next 18 months is just must-see TV.

I can't get enough. Yeah. I just want to... Money. It's money. It's money. Different rap songs. Yeah, he's got to sing a different rap song every time

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Bringing all your most valuable resources onto one powerful platform so you can add value even faster. Workday, moving business forever forward. So UFC 24, I mean, obviously that was what was on the marquee, Poria McGregor 3, but there are some other fights, some intriguing fights, like the co-main event. Gilbert Burns, defeat Stephen Thompson v. unanimous decision.

There were a lot of people, the T-Mobile arena, Dana White being one of them, that didn't think the fight was very good. that it wasn't an entertaining showing, but Gilbert Burns goes in there and he gets it done. I thought, honestly, A.K., and I've talked about this on onto the next one, I thought he had a hell of a night. What did you think of Gilbert's performance?

And do you think that there's a part of these feelings from people, maybe Dana, I don't know if Dana specifically, but from like the fans, it stems from the fact that Wonder Boy's title aspirations seem to be a thing of the past now and they just like him so much, and it's just such a heartbreaking moment for him? Yeah, I think so for sure. I mean, Stephen Wonderboy Thompson is genuinely one of the nicest human beings walking the earth.

He's a dude you have to root for. You could argue that the case he made before that fight for challenging for the title, had some legitimacy. Maybe you don't hustle him in there off the two wins that he had. But, you know, it's not a rematch. And it looks like we, you know, we got the rematch with Mazvedal. It looks like we're going to get a rematch with Colby. So it would have been a fresh match up.

now that's gone by the wayside. I think some of it too is just what we kind of always see and always experience covering this sport is that when you get a exciting striker like Wonderboy Candy, people want to see him be an exciting striker. And if you're the guy that's going to come in here and shut that down and wrestle him to the ground and Stephen being good enough on the ground that you're not necessarily going to advance and get a bunch of submissions and, attack positions, it kind of makes for just a tactical fight. And there aren't a lot of people

necessarily that like tactical fights. Dana White often being one of them, a lot of the people in attendance at the T-Mobile arena who are back out into civilization for the first time, wanting to just have this raucous night coming off of Tai Tui Voss's knockout and Irina al-Dana's knockout that want to just see more chaos, get a very kind of slowed down, methodical fight. And so I think that's where the reactions come from. It's hard to see Wonderboy miss out on those opportunities, but it was a great performance by Gilbert Burns. AK, what did you think of the fight? And just Gilbert overall, man, like I thought his work on the stick afterwards was phenomenal. Like, I thought he played it to perfection. And I actually

spoke with Gilbert Burns earlier today. You'll hear that interview on what the heck. And he kind of explained his reasoning behind that promo after the fight. And it's pretty awesome. So looking forward to Tuesday morning when that drops. But what did you think of Gilbert's performance overall? Like not just the fight, but, you know, everything that happened after the final horn, the interview with Joe Rogan, all that. What would you grade him? What the hell is wrong with MMA fans that they're booing and criticizing Gilbert Burns?

He's a super nice guy. He did a great job with the post-fight promo. He reacted in the moment. He said the booze were coming. all right well so what i think whatever he was going to say after he probably he's probably switched up a little bit so he did a great job with that it wasn't like this canned uh promo i'm sure he knew he who you know whose names he was going to call out but you know he tweaked it he had a he had a basic idea of what he wanted to say and tweaked it based on on the scenario that was great

uh the fight was good like i'm not it wasn't a super exciting fight but he did his game plan was excellent i think he clearly won i don't know if there think there should be any controversy there don't blame him for stifling Wonderboy's title chances when, again, the UFC could have given Stephen Thompson a title shot, arguably, instead of giving Jorge Masvidal a title shot off of a loss. That's not Gilbert Burns' fault. Don't blame them for that. Don't blame them because they would rather see Colby Cummington and Usman fight again

than give him a fresh challenger and Wonderboy. That's the UFC's call. So if you're wondering, did Gilbert Burns stop him? Yes, but guess who else did? The UFC, okay? So don't be mad at Gilbert Burns. And there's this horrible, like, there's this horrible revisionist history that I saw, at least, again, looking at stupid comments online, saying like, oh, Burns is like a boring

fighter. I'm like, Gilbert Burns is a, this guy's been like smoking people at Welter Way. Like, even the fight with Usman was super exciting. And the one he lost. The Woodley fight was a bit methodical, but it was certainly amazing to see him dominate a former champion like that. It's like, Gilbert Burns is boring. What is going on here?

And Dana, again, just to go after Dana White, as we in the so-called MMA media love to do, I can't stand him, like, saying it was a bad performance. Like, this is, he's so influential. And all it takes is him saying something like that for a lot of fans to go like to kind of confirm, you know, what fans thought they saw. Because like, it's true.

Again, it was a methodical performance. It wasn't a barn-burning fight. So if any fans are kind of like, yeah, I'm not sure if I liked that. Then something Dana White says, you know, he kind of sits down on it and it's like, oh, yeah, oh, we'll do it with Gilbert Burns just sucks. It's like, Dinawa has the power to kind of turn things around like that and kind of shift, you know, help shift people's opinions, which he should do as a promoter. And for him to criticize Gilbert Burns and for anyone to criticize Gilbert Burns is just so frustrating to me, Mike.

I thought Gilbert Burns did a great job and was one of the standout fighters of USC 264. I think that's the only way to look at it. Shout out to Al. They weren't booing Gilbert Burns. They were saying boo-werns. I'm angry with myself for not recognizing that honor. I can't believe you didn't say that, AK. You see that I'm like, that is such an AK thing to say.

So Tai Tui Vasa gets the big win. Irini Aldana, great win, a little bit of an asteriskana because she missed weight. But one of the big storylines coming out of this event was the first fight of the main card between Sean O'Malley and New England's Chris Putino. This was a clinic from Sean O'Malley offensively. He looks sensational, about the heart of Chris Patino, his ability to take punishment. It stole a big chunk of the narrative. And the other big piece of this puzzle, Spencer, and I'll go back to you on this one, was the stoppage.

Like, did Herb Dean make the right call not stopping the fight? Because I think we can all agree the stoppage could have and should have happened at some point in this fight. But he waited until the final 27 seconds of the third round to stop it. So do you agree with the stoppage or at that point, that deep in the fight, should have Herb Dean have let Chris get to the final horn? I agree with the stoppage because I'm always going to side on the side of fighter safety and protecting these athletes. Watching it back and even watching it live, it felt to me like Herb was kind of in that

I'm getting ready to stop this fight stance that he gets into for about two minutes and kind of just was waiting for an opportunity. and waiting to see sort of not necessarily it sounds bad if I say waiting to see the punishment pile up but just kind of waiting to see how Chris Matino reacted to it and if there were moments where he was slowing down or or got stopped do I understand all the people you know saying let the kid go the next 27 minutes what's the 27 seconds what's the big deal absolutely I get it he put on a hell of a performance in terms of showing how gritty and tough and, you know,

competitive he can be in there and make you want to see his next fight, but he got lit up. Let's be clear. Sean O'Malley, as you said, put on a clinic, more than 70% landed in terms of significant strikes, up over 200 significant strikes.

So it's not like this was a competitive fight where Chris Matino got robbed of sort of that last second opportunity. And if we're If we're clinging to the, well, you never know what's going to happen in the last 27 seconds. Yeah, we do. He's going to get punched in the head a bunch more and he's going to keep walking forward. And it's going to be an even wider margin of victory.

So I have no quarrel with it. I think he could have stopped it earlier. But I also kind of understand that people say and let him just get to the buzzer. AK, now that you've had some days to digest this, and we've talked about this before. And, you know, and I even said this on Sunday, had. Herdean stopped it before the second round, I'd have no issue. Had he stopped it midway through the second round, I'd have no issue. Had he stopped it before the third round? I don't think anybody would have any issue with any of these scenarios. But it was the fact that he waited until there's 27 seconds left. And I've said this before and I'll say it again. I don't have an issue with the stoppage at all. I just kind of at that point, like if you're going to let it go that deep and let him take 230 strikes, like what's 10 more? You know what I mean? It can me a lot. I get that from like a medical perspective. We want to see these guys be as healthy as possible. But you got to watch the interview with Chris Boutinho that I did for what the heck. You got his side of it.

Has your stance changed at all? Like, should her, what was your thought on the stoppage now that you've heard pretty much all sides to this? I'll say, let me say say it first that this is the definition of a controversial stoppage. Not necessarily a bad stop. I know if I'm going to say bad stoppage or, but I thought, I think controversial is perfect for it. Because I think there's so many legitimate arguments to make around it. Was it too late in the fight? Was it early in the moment with 30 seconds remaining?

Could Moutino's corner have considered, you know, stopping the fight at an earlier time? How close was O'Malley to really landing like a bomb that would have put him down? And again, taking the decision almost out of the hands of Herb Dean and just made it a straight KO. Forget TKL. You know, he could have been one or two shots away from actually knocking Moutino straight out. hard to believe, considering how much punishment Mutino had taken up to that point. But I'm just saying these are all the kinds of things

we can discuss about this, again, controversial stoppage. And that's okay. Because we've had some heart of deep shortages that are just objectively bad. Like when we say controversial sometimes, that's our nice way of saying like, oh, this guy effed up. So in this case, I don't think he effed up. I really don't.

I personally don't think he effed up. And I've seen strong arguments for both sides. Yeah. So, Moutino, look, I, yes, having heard his side of the story, certainly he would have wanted to continue. Certainly he feels, he knows he wasn't going to win the fight. But for a fighter, there is a big difference between seeing, well, okay, well, I made it to all the distance, or this is another stoppage on my, on my resume. Because I think he came in with like four stoppage losses, and now this is number five. And in his mind, he's just kind of like, well, you know, there shouldn't be lumped in with those.

This wasn't a stoppage. That is not how he lost his time. this should have been a decision loss. And I understand that. And the other thing is, I do respect his mentality of thinking, even though he was not going to win the fight. But I like his mentality of if there was two more rounds,

who knows what could have happened. He felt he was coming on strong. He said he was, I think for lack of a better phrase in his interview with you, Mike, he said that he felt O'Malley was getting scared near the end of the fight. Concern, I think is more really what he means, not like scared, like frightened, more concerned.

And just to put a cap on it, look, if anyone saw the medical suspensions, the official medical suspensions that came out, Chris Mutino, I think minimum suspension, he could compete again as early as like, you know, first week of September. Sean O'Malley, injuries to both his hands, I think his like, one of his feet and then one of his like ankles or something. And so he's potentially out for six months. We might not see Don O'Malley until January. So I don't know. Who knows how close to you. Who knows how Preck Martino really was that the tide was hurting. But it took its toll on both men, apparently more so on, on Shunel Malley. So pretty wild stuff.

We'll move on for the interest of time. But I will say one of my favorite things to come out of the weekend was I don't know who did it. And if anybody knows who did it, give them a shout out. Let me know, tag him on Twitter or whatever. Someone created a meme of Randy Marsh himself. Park with green hair and it said, hey O'Malley, I didn't hear no bell. That was amazing. So kudos to whoever did that. But we'll go from one crazy event to another crazy event that happened earlier this week. And it's going to be with us for another five to six weeks at least. But the point

for round two goes to the birthday boy, Alexander K. Lee, is one to one. Good stuff, gentlemen. And now let's go to the reason that everybody is watching this program right now. We're going to shift the boxing world because it is now official August 29th, Cleveland, Ohio, Jake Paul versus Tyron Woodley is happening. The former UFC welterweight champion is heading to the YouTubers hometown of Cleveland and this fight is actually happening. Of course, we had the press conference on Tuesday featuring Jake Paul, Tyron Woodley, and a giant robot. So, AK, we're going to start with you this time. Did you watch the press conference? And if so, what did you think of it did it do its job?

I certainly did watch it, and I actually think it did do its job. If you're asking, did it do its job of maybe, you know, getting people who are on the fence or maybe even catching the attention of people who are kind of, like you said, they now have the official date. I think it did help. I didn't think things got out of hand in, like, an annoying way. We've seen that with press conferences where there's a lot of like back and forth. There was some of that for sure.

but I don't think either guy came off in like that's such that abrasive way they were like well I don't want to see either of these guys fight like I just never want to see anything from either these guys again I thought they properly sold the fight there was a few dumb personal insults in there as was to be expected but overall there's there is like I think Woodley is such a more intriguing opponent athletically speaking than Ben Ashtrian can he sell a fight like Ben Ascran does he have kind of like that that it factor that the Ben Ascran has or had going into that Jake Paul flight? Maybe not.

Maybe not. You know, Ben Ascran's a character. I would not describe Tyrone Woodley that way. But again, this has the feel of, and I can't believe I'm using this word, legitimacy. Like, it's, that was kind of the strangest thing while I was watching it is that there was a certain, it was almost mundane, but like in a good way. Like we're getting used to it. We're getting used to these Jake Paul's celebrity boxing things happening. And, and with that.

comes with sort of this like acceptance, this almost like broader acceptance that these bites are not going away, that they are for the most part worthy of your attention. Again, especially if you enjoyed Logan Paul versus Flaymate Weather. If you enjoy Jake Paul versus Ben Asker, if you enjoyed the first trailer event with Jake Paul and Nate Robinson and Mike Tyson and Roy Jones Jr. And all that stuff that happened. If you enjoyed that, it's almost becoming not a guilty pleasure. And always becomes a thing, again, where we've accepted this is now part of the combat sports

field. This is its own genre. There's kickboxing, bare-knuckle boxing, you know, competitive combat jiu-jitsu, and now celebrity boxing. It's its own brand of combat sports. And I thought the press conference was really good. I thought the robot, whoever's in the robot suit needs to get a raise,

reveal yourself who you are, hero, because he didn't stop working. He was like punctuating all of Jake Paul's statements in the background. Really, the camera should have been focused on him all the whole time. I think we did, I think our main fighting footage did a great job of zooming in on him when we could. But he really needed his separate cam. Way to go. Way to go.

Pat ourselves on the back. Because, yeah, I thought it was a good press conference. Not the most controversial, super exciting press conference. But I don't think that's what this fight needs. I think this fight needs is, again, what I said before, some sense of legitimacy. And I think heaven help us. I think we got it. Spencer, what did you think of the press conference?

Did you watch it? Did you watch highlights? Like, what were your thoughts on the whole thing and on the build to August 29th? I didn't watch it. And the fact that A.K. is using the word legitimacy and then running down the opponents that that Jake Paul has fought being Nate Robinson and Ben Ascran as markers for this is becoming a legitimate thing and there's a robot involved.

And like, it's just like if we're qualifying that is legitimate. And I get it. Like people are into this. And people absolutely want to see it. And I don't knock showtime for getting involved. And shout out to the Paul brothers for getting their money. Shout out to Tyron Woodley for getting his in this. And Ban Askin for getting his from earlier this year.

But like just because people are interested and just because it has a platform doesn't necessarily mean that we have to treat this like some kind of legitimate sporting event and put it on the same level as some of this. other combat sports, some of the other combat sports that we get, or even just like legitimate entertainment. This is carnival, carnival barker stuff. I'm cool with it. Do it. Have at it. But like to use the word legitimacy about this kind of feels a little bit weird because you said there was a robot that was doing the most work at the press conference and was the breakout star of the press conference. And I can't think of any other sporting event

where that's the big takeaway and that's the thing that makes it legitimate. And so for me, look, I'm interested because I do think it is a, obviously a much more competitive fight than the Ben Askeran fight was. I think, you know, Jake Paul, you got to give him credit.

He really is putting in as much work as he can to become a legitimate boxer. And I think Tyron Woodley, even though he's up into his late 30s and, you know, kind of left the UFC on a low. He is the most accomplished in terms of athleticism and an athletic talent guy that's been in the ring with Jake Paul. And so it should, I hope, be a much more competitive fight.

And I think people are going to be interested. And I think the group that was going to be interested and into this fight already didn't need any more convincing. And so did the press conference and everything that came out of it, sway a few more people over to be interested in it. Probably that's what a press conference is for. But in terms of, you know, is this a legitimate sporting endeavor and this stuff's getting real? Like, I don't know, man.

And until I see him fight an actual boxer, I'm going to have some problems calling Jake Paul legitimate. So, AK, we did a reaction podcast to this press conference. It was shot all shoddy, myself, and Damon Martin. and we're trying to find the right words to express how we feel heading into this fight. And one of the words I threw out that seemed to be the word of most debate was excited. And everyone wrestled with that word.

And I'm curious, A.K., are you excited for this fight? Like, not the circus and not the build and the silliness, but the actual fight itself. Like, are you excited to see Jake Paul boxed Tyron Woodley? I am legitimate excited. There's that, there's that, there's that word again. Capital L, capital E. I am legitimately excited, guys.

It's, I thought the, I thought the Ascran Jake Paul, I am on record on so many of our shows saying this. I was super intrigued by the Jake Paul Ben Ascran fight. And I'm even more intrigued by this one because, yeah, I think we view Tyrone Woodley as a little more of a striker for sure. He has highlight real knockouts on his record in MMA. Completely different sport, I understand. But the thought of Ben Ascran landing like a K-O blow on Jake Paul, excuse me, I totally

got a half a Jake Paul. It was like a pipe dream. It's like, that's probably not going to happen. The thought of Taran Willie doing it, it doesn't seem completely unbelievable. Again, we don't know how Taran's going to look in a straight up boxing match, but we know he has power. We know he's not the kind of guy. You know, there's a lot of cracks about Askers like Dad, Bodfazique before that fight.

That's not going to happen to Taran Woodley. The guy is in immaculate shape. Say what you want about his performances. Again, maybe the body and the minor aren't quite as willing to pull the trigger anymore in a high-level UFC fight. But he's certainly still in great athletic shape. And that's a big, big sell for this fight. So

it's just, on a basic primal level of Jake Paul leveling up competition-wise. And now is he facing a more, again, now I'm tired of using this word myself, a more legitimate opponent in Woodley. It certainly feels that way.

And the only way to find out if it's real or not is to watch the actual fight. And that is the appeal of it. That is what makes it so exciting. Will it be a good fight? I don't know. Again, how do we define good in this scenario? I think it's going to vary from person to person.

But I think as soon as, as soon as fight night rolls around, I know I'm going to be super into it. And I think a lot of people who tuned in are not going to regret that they invested their time in it. Spencer, something tells me that excited is not one of the words that's on top of mind when it comes to this fight. So if you could put a word to it in terms of how you're feeling heading into August 29th, what war would you use and why? I'm certainly intrigued because, like I said, I give Jake Paul credit for the steps he's taken and the effort he's committed to building himself as a boxer and trying to develop this. he's certainly much more refined at it and seems like he's put a lot more energy into it than his

brother who looked like he was just out there swinging swinging for the fences and you know throwing ugly punches against Floyd Mayweather and I'm intrigued to see what he does against the guy that you know is a former UFC champion and is still in great shape and and should as we've said be a level up in terms of competition because this is sort of the way you see if there is legitimacy here. And if there is something beyond just being spectacle here. So I'll certainly pay attention in terms of getting some results, getting some replays and highlights through Twitter.

But it's not a like appointment viewing for me where I'm planning this out to sit down on my couch that night and take it all in. if he goes out and beats tyron woodley though like even i will come back on this show and offer a maya culpa to to a k lee to jake paul to literally everybody for me calling it illegitimate or thinking questioning the legitimacy of this because if he goes out there and beats tyron woodley then it's something we need to talk about more and pay more attention to because then it's you know it's it's not beaten as you said it's not beating ben askeran who really stood not a lot of chance of going out there

and land in a big shot to win that fight. But Tyron has that potential, and he should have that, or he should have that potential, and we'll find out if he does. First of all, there's nothing more legitimate than a robot being involved in fight promotion. Ask the UFC, they know this during their days with Fox. And also, there's nothing makes a fight more legitimate than a tattoo bet,

and that's what we have here. The stakes are high, gentlemen. The stakes are high, heading in the office. August 29th. And the good news is good. We have Spencer's bet now. Now Spencer is saying he will he will retract what he is, he will call, he will look back on this retroactively

as a legitimate athletic contest should, should Jake Paul win. So that's really what to be, the tattoo thing is super cool. This is what I'm really waiting for. I cannot wait to see this man's world turned upside down. I don't want to see those goalposts moved again, Spencer. All right? Those goal posts are set.

He goes out and beats Tyron Woodley. I will be the first one all up in your mentions saying, you were right, I was wrong, I bow down. If I win today and Jake Paul wins, I hereby solemnly do promise that I will accept the no contest in this contest. I think even more so what we should do, and you can hopefully find a way to do this. If this happens, you have to issue an apology,

via video, but riding around in a motorized cart, a la Kana McGregor. I will find a scooter. There are certainly scooters at several big box stores around here. I will commandeer one, grab a selfie stick, and just bomb around wrapping and apologizing to AK League. I have never, wow, I might be rooting for Jake Carl now. Just cruising through the aisles of Costco.

I'll have to do something as well over, So we'll figure that up. But yeah, obviously, if you're going to put all that in the line, I got to do something. So, bet within a bet, this is a beautiful thing. The good news is we have five or so full weeks to build upon this in August 29. So get your robot costumes ready and buckle up. And just like we should buckle up for the final route of regulation. The point for round three goes to AK, two to one, good stuff.

This is a tough one. proverbial flip of the old coin as we uh we head to the weekend to come for our wonderful sport of mixed martial arts there is no jake paul fight we have two events on the calendar there's there's more but two are at sort of the forefront we got bellator 262 which comes up tomorrow night on showtime flyway title on the line the main event juliana velasquez versus denise keelholz we got tyrol fortune versus matt mitrione cody law is back johnny ebblin is back some good prospects some interesting fights for sure The UFC is back on Saturday. This was supposed to be Max Holloway versus Yair Rodriguez. Injury to Holloway, scratches that fight. Now the new main event is Islam Makachev versus Tiago Moises. We got the return of Misha Tate against the soon-to-be-retired, Marion Reneau, Jeremy Stevens versus Batush Gamrod.

He's had some wonderful comments this week, which are not going to get into and more. So Spencer, we go back to you, my friend. Who's bringing the better card to the table on this weekend? The UFC or Bellator and why? For me, it's the UFC, but it's not by a wide margin. Shout out to some of the people competing on Bellator. Juliana Velasquez is a terrific fighter, very much interested in seeing that fight.

I think it's a good matchup. I want to see what she does in her first title defense. Shout out to Matt Mitrione for his I throw hand son comment today that made the waves, made the rounds on the internet. As somebody like started out the questions, it's like, hey, Matt, you just keep losing. he was like, cool, that's how we're doing this? All right, sure, let's go. And then he asked him how he's going to win. And he said in pure meat fashion, I throw hands on. That's what I do. There are some good prospects, as you mentioned, very curious to see what they do. But it also feels like kind of

the standard Bellator play with some of their prospects where they're in highly winnable fights, as opposed to competitive fights that are necessarily going to give us a lot of instruction about what they can do in the future. And I just like a bunch of the prospects and a bunch of the matchups on the UFC card a little bit more. Gabriel Benitez and Billy Quarantio is violence guaranteed.

Certainly looking forward to that one. I think Amanda Le Mois and Montserrat Ruiz is a really interesting fight in a division where Amanda Limos has looked really great in her last three fights. You mentioned Matois Gammrot. I spoke to him earlier this week. Super interested to see what he does

against Jeremy Stevens, who, even though he doesn't have a win in his last five fights, look at who he's been facing, look at who it is that has beaten him. He's still a tough out. I think that's a really good litmus test for gamer. We get the return to Misha Tate. We get a really competitive main event that to me, I know it's not the fight that people necessarily wanted for Islam Mahashev,

and that's because nobody wants to fight this dude. and if Tiago Moises who is also a kind of unheralded unsung dude on a three-fight winning street goes out there and beats him then we suddenly have a brand new contender in the division and that's kind of what I'm always looking for. And so

shout out to Bellator for a good card, an interesting card, but I give it to the UFC on Saturday. A.K., what do you think? Because like we've talked about many times on this show and other shows, the pay-per-view hangovers are real. UFC 264, storyline written kind of makes these upcoming cards fly under the radar.

Like, there should be a lot more fanfare around the fact that Islam Makachev is fighting, that Misha Tate is coming back. It's just not really there. And it's not their fault. It's just what happened with 264 and everything that's come from it. And then Bellator is coming back. This is the card, sort of the go-home show to the one everyone's got their eyes on at the end of the month. That's headlined by Patricia Pitbull versus A.J. McKee.

So two fight cards that are interesting in their own ways, but they're not really in the most interesting times, if you will, with everything else going on. So with that being said, which card sticks out to you top to bottom more? Do you like the Bellator card better or do you like the UFC card better? Well, the good news is people don't have to choose. You know, on the Prince of positivity, I would tell people, if you guys are looking for fights this weekend, remember,

Belator's on Friday, UFC's on Saturday. You can watch both. You don't have to choose. So that's awesome. I'll make the case for Bellator. So I'm certainly, for all the reasons that Spencer mentioned, I'm very excited for the UFC card. I love, I'm very excited to see Hadolfo Valletta come back.

I thought that last fight was obviously exciting as hell and completely unexpected what happened to him. But I, you know, I think he's a, he's a truly an original type fighter and I want to see that. So the thing, before I get into the belt, so the thing with the UFC card is, it feels like, I got to, I was saying phrases correctly. For a lot of these fighters, it's not their one fight away from what's going to really be, their big fight, if that makes sense. Machachev versus Moises is not the matchup that a lot of people want to see for Macachov. I think it's a cool fight on paper, but I think obviously people have been, Mike,

you know, in our matchmaking machetechab with people in like the top five. Like they just want to see Makachov make a big, big jump up. So there's a good fight. I don't know if it's this must see fight that if you're a Makachov fan, that you're like, oh, I'm going to have to see this one. I think that's the next one. It will be his big opponent. Same with Misha Tate.

You know, this is their comeback fight. they're giving another solid veteran and Marion Renaud who is I believe is going to retire after this fight and you feel like Misha Tate's should she win her next fight is really going to be the can't miss one

I'll say the same thing about Matush Gamrott Dan Rodriguez again he lost his original opponent so he's now he's not facing a newcomer his next fight I think is going to be the one to watch Khalit Taha Sergei Morazov both great prospects I think again their next fight will be the great one so it's kind of obviously if you're a hardcore fan like I said you don't want to miss either card

but this this UFC card is like for a lot of people it's it's the one before the one their fight that's really going to make an impact Bell Tor somewhat the same way but some of the fights are so like I like that as prospect building I like that we're going to see hopefully highlights for like a Johnny Eblen for Diana Avesa Avesse Ragova that I like cars that are built this way I think you have an Arlene Blancone there she's always an exciting fight so I like her a lot and then you have the potential for a big knockout in Taral Fortune of Fortune and Matt Mitchell. But I'm really jazzed up. I'm probably overselling the card a bit because of how jazzed up I am for the main event. I actually really like the Giuliano Velasquez,

Denise Keelholz matchup. I haven't taken a good look at the odds. It's my understanding that Denise Keelholtz is a pretty sizable underdog, which is reasonable, I suppose, given that Velasquez is undefeated and has looked great in Beltoor. But I think Keelhoz is actually a very, very, very dangerous challenger.

I like her story, how she got to this title shot. obviously she's the former Belator kickboxing champion. So this to me is a really high-level flyweight fight. And I think fly-wit, of course, is one of the most underrated divisions across MMA, both in the UFC and in Belator and elsewhere that has flyweight divisions. So the main event, I actually like, I think I like the Belator main event more. Again, not take away from Makachev because he's a future star for sure. But I like the Belator main event more.

So just on the strength of that, plus some of the other reasons I kind of mentioned, I'm given Belator the slight edge. let me just uh back to the bet back to the mitrione thing kevin or wherever the media member was immediately comes out and says mitrione you're o and five by the way he's not o and five

he's two three and one in his last six fights there's no contest he's lost three in a row he hasn't lost he's not oh in five so yeah mitreone was on fire kudos to him for that and by the way a k a k a kre just so you know uh vr friends at dk nation juliana velasca's a minus three 35 favorite the comeback on denise keelhoz is plus two four which let me compare it to the UFC one, which I'm sure is just outrageous. Islam Makachev is probably one of the bigger main event.

Minus 670. Come back on Tiago Boys is plus 450. I can't remember the last time of the main event was lined that spread. Spencer, let me go back to you because you write a lot of stories, you talk to a lot of these fighters, and you give us reasons to care

and reasons that fights get built and you shine a spotlight upon them. them. So listen, I think Misha Tate is obviously the biggest storyline of the weekend in your eyes, but outside of that and maybe even outside of Islam Makachev, what stands out to you when you think of storylines for this weekend in MMA? Like what's something that has caught your attention that maybe not a lot of people are thinking about? I think for me, it's Amanda LaMoishe. I mean, she comes back off off a two-year suspension, pop top for something after a fight with Leslie Smith. She moves down two divisions.

to 1-15 and comes out and as two finishes and three straight victories, she absolutely torched Livia Hanata-Suzza last time out of former Invicta champ. And that to me was an eye-opening performance. She's at number 14, I think, in the UFC rankings right now and goes into this fight against Montserrat Ruiz, who had a tremendous performance, in my opinion, in her debut, just kind of bulldog choking Cheyenne Bays for 15 minutes. Cheyenne gets up and curses at her afterwards and wants the meter out back to continue fighting,

which is always entertaining. And so that to me, in a division that we kind of recognize as maybe the most competitive of the UFC women's weight class is 115, is a really entertaining fight, a really interesting fight to me where the winner isn't necessarily in title contention, but they move into that group with the really established names and really familiar fighters like Angela, Hill, like Claudia Goodella, like Michelle Waterson, where you're one or two away. And so to what AK is saying about this card

being full of fights where guys are maybe one or two fights away, I agree, and that's far more compelling and far more interesting to me to see that build between contenders and competitive fights than seeing a Johnny Ebelin go out and get

another dominant victory where I'm not learning as much about him or seeing Cody Law look great for another fight where I'm not necessarily seeing him in there getting tested. I'm more focused on seeing people get tested and move up than really get that showcase spotlight opportunity. Yes, but what if Johnny Ebblin came out with a robot, Spencer? Would that change your...

If he comes out with a robot and the robot is doing a lot of work, then yeah, absolutely. I mean, you get the MMA fighting camera people out there. to film it and focus in on the robot again and we're gold. And I will certainly again, apologize for not giving the robot enough love. But I mean, to me, I want to see these. And look, it's, again, nothing against Bellator. I like the way they build their cards.

I do like that they give some of these athletes, these opportunities to have these spotlight fights where you start building their name. But at a certain point, they got to get in there with somebody. And they got to get in there with somebody. that's going to test them. And I think right now this card is built more with showcase opportunities than fights where people are going to get tested.

And so I still kind of stick with the UFC on Saturday as being the top to bottom better card for me. What storyline sticks out to you, AK, that maybe people aren't talking about it. Well, okay, I did say the main event, but I do think there's the Bell Tour main event, excuse me. But I do think that there is some, I do think that there is some intrigue there, at least as much as again as there can be for sort of a Beltor flyway title flight that no longer involves, you know, Al-Lay McFarland, who they had done a great job building up. So this is the first title fight in a few years now that doesn't feature her. And she had a lot of good storyline hooks.

So I think, well, I'll go to the UFC for this one. What I think the storyline is, again, I'm so intrigued by seeing how Hadolfa of Avera, is bouncing back from that loss because we have seen many, like, outstanding jujitsu fighters who, when they kind of hit that first road bump in MMA, they don't always respond in the best way. Some of them just disappear for being out. Some of them just don't compete. Where's Kron Gracey? You know what I mean? I should say Kronom Grasie. Where's Kroen Gracey? I know he's going to fight again. I think we all, I assume he's going to fight again. But it did feel like when he lost to Cub Swanson that it was just like, okay, well, I'm going to take a step back from MMA now.

I didn't enjoy that experience. And Bayetta had one of the most miserable experiences that I think a jiu-sus specialist can have. He was submitted. This guy's an ADCC grappling champion. He was submitted in a wild fight that he looked like he was going to win in the first round. It's such a humbling thing. And, of course, our Giam A crew has had a great interview with Hidalpho, which I, sorry, I don't

I don't think it's out yet. It'll be out, of course, this week before fight night. And that story to me, hopefully when that story comes out, more people will look at this because there's a lot of mockery that comes to a loss like that, too, when you're known for being such a great grappler. So it's to me, it's very intriguing. I think they've given him a good matchup in Dustin Stolzvus,

but he has to go out and perform, and we'll see how serious he is about actually becoming a UFC contender, because I think he can, but when you have these other options as a star grappler, you know, sometimes it all takes as one loss to derail you. So that's a fight. I think people really need to pay attention to. Well, the good news is we're going to have you covered for both of these events over at MAAfighting.com. So get excited.

But regulation is now over. The all important point for round four goes to Spencer Kite. It is two to two. Well done. And that means to nobody surprise through 59 episodes of this program, we are going to the knockout round. And one question will decide at all. Neither competitor knows what this question is. I just thought of this question 30 seconds ago as I was just looking at our website.

But they're each going to have one minute to respond to said question. Once that is done, we will turn it out over to the judge, the jury, the executive producer on the ones and twos. E. Casey Leiden, he will render the final decision, crown the winner with the help of the live studio audience. So, A.K. Lee, back-to-back victories under your belt. You have the champion's prerogative, if you will. So do you want this question first, what you normally like to do? Or do you want to pass the first option over to Spencer? Mike, you know, it's unprecedented that I'm on a winning streak.

So I think it's logically, it would be time for me to exhibit unprecedented behavior. But I'm not going to do that. I'm going to do exactly what people expect of me. I'm super predictable. Of course, I'm going first. Wow. All right. Spencer, this is a big moment.

Spencer's going to log some notes and get ready. But here's the question, AK. So I've had some pretty interesting conversations this week, one of which was with former UFC middleweight champion Luke Rockhold, who is looking to get back inside the Octagon. And we had a nice conversation. We laughed. We smiled.

But then we talked about his fighting career. And this man is frustrated because he hasn't been able to not only book a fight, but book a fight with somebody that even interests him. He's looking for a top 10 guy. or he's looking for something exciting and he basically said like, give me something that's going to get me out of bed or just let me go.

I'm not just taking any fight. So, A.K., if you're the UFC, if you are the middleweight matchmaker right now, what is your plan of action to get Luke Rockhold in there with the right opponent that makes everybody happy? We'll attempt to do some problem solving on the show this week with the knockout round.

Try to help everybody. So one minute on the clock, what do we do with Luke Rockold? That makes everybody happy. Your time starts now. Well, my, I don't think there's anything that's going to make. everybody happy and it really two things really suck uh i would have loved to see another fight with jacques

suza he's no longer with the promotion i would have loved to see another fight with chris wyman chris wyman is obviously recovering from an injury so i think the way to go is i i still think what i would like to see him go up to 205 and i would hope it's still possible for him to fight anthony smith i don't maybe the heat from this is gone but but i haven't given up in that matchup i don't think i ever gave up on it they talk so much crap about each other there's There's just something about their personalities that I feel like are oil and water. I don't know if it's where they come from. I don't know if it's how they were brought up.

I just really believe those are two guys. If you put them in a room, they're just going to hate each other. They're going to be professional up to Fight Night, but I think they would legit hate each other. I also think it's an exciting style matchup. I think it's a, I mean, I would favor Anthony Smith pretty heavily. But I think if you ask, I think casual betting side, I think you get a lot of people who believe Luke Rockhold could win that matchup. So I'm not giving up Anthony Smith, Luke Rockhold.

I think that's the way to go. All right, Spencer, over to you, my friend. Same question. How do we get Luke Rockhold, the right fight? What is the right fight? How do we do it in a way where Luke's happy, the opponent's happy, fans are happy, the UFC, et cetera. Everybody is happy.

One minute on the clock. Your time starts now. Two words, Darren Till. We always talk about this guy as still being a title contender. He is absolutely going to talk a bunch of junk. He's got a bunch of people that are interested in him. He's going to come out there and throw shots. He's going to stand in the pocket.

And trade with Luke Rockhold. And that's, I think, what Luke Rockhold wants, is a guy that's going to put him right back in the mix. That's what he said. Darren Till's kind of in limbo right now. He fell out of another fight. We're not sure where he's at, what he's doing. I've been seeing some pictures of, you know,

super puffy face Darren Till on Ariel Hawani's Twitter timeline lately. Give me that fight. Give me these two dudes just talking junk at each other for a couple of weeks building up to a co-main event spot or even a main event spot on a fight night card where they get potentially five rounds. Winner gets into that middleweight title conversation, which is where both want to be. And it's something that doesn't take away from guys that are actually competing lately and on their way up. And lastly, I always have to shout out Casey's mustache. It's just phenomenal. Wow. Smart play.

Smart play. He's watched this show, Casey. He knows that you got to plant the seeds, got to talk about the baddestash in MMA. So as we await for the fine people watching our program right now to chime in with how they feel this knock around went, just a reminder, we will be covering both of these shows for you, Bellator 262 tomorrow.

UFC Vegas 31 on Saturday. We will have a live preview show tomorrow for the UFC card at 3 p.m. Eastern, noon Pacific time. So join us for that. Bring your thoughts, your comments, your questions in regards to that event. And then we get a very busy week next week in the world of MMA. More on that coming up at the beginning of next week. But at this moment, it is time to turn it over to the man without sleeves,

the man with a mustache, E. Casey Liding, and the man who captured the robot better than anybody, anybody for that press conference in L.A. Casey, who wins? Thank you, gentlemen. It was a great competition Unfortunately, I can't pick the robot to win Because clearly he is the winner But for you two gentlemen

Oh, is it what are the people in line saying? Yeah, yeah, oh yeah I can't say that out loud. Oh boy. Okay Your winner The Canadian Senator Guy, congratulations. Congratulations. against the win. The winning streak is over.

No winning streak is over. Wow. I actually, for, I thought for, I thought Spencer might have shot himself in the foot, honestly, with that question, because Darren Till is supposed to fight Derek Brunson, although that fight is not official at this moment because there's dates and there's locations

and geographical crap going on right now, but man, there you go. Congratulations, Spencer. brought the noise. You brought the noise, my friend. Even though you insulted the robot, you still walk away with the victory. And with that, you don't get any money or a championship belt. You get 30 seconds to talk about whatever it is you want to talk about, good, bad, and different, plug your own stuff, whatever you want in regards to MMA. I want to thank you guys, first and foremost, for having me. I want to thank Casey for siding with another E period

competitor. We all got to stick together. Shout out to people that said you picked Darren Till and you automatically win. Thank you for having me. I do stand by on my promise. Jake Paul goes out and looks good. I'm coming back to it for my closing. Jake Paul comes out and looks good. I will be back here.

I will jump on a rascal scooter and drive around the Costco. Singing rap songs and praising A.K. Lee. I have a man of my word. You can hold me to it. I look forward to coming back and defending my title. Whatever you guys can find me a suitable book. Well, Spencer.

The thing about this program is you win and you move on. So hopefully we can book you next week and you can defend your victory. I will say there is no actual champion right now. So I think we're going to, I think this, this got really interesting. So more on that coming up next week because I have an idea that's going to shake the foundation of BTL. But AK, the look in your eyes says it all. Let's see. Oh, man.

You're like the Miami Dolphins from the early 2010s right now. I didn't respect them, Mike. I didn't respect them. You told me I was having a fellow Canadian on here, and you said who it was, and I'm not going to lie. I said, my reaction, my reaction was him? I don't need to train for this. I'm sorry, Spencer.

I'm just being real with people here. Hey. I said, I don't need to train for this. I don't need to prepare it. I feel like a, I only blame myself. I feel like a fool. I am happy. to be the Dustin Poirier to your Connor McGregor.

We can do this as many times over. Don't say that. The result is going to be the same every single time. Wow. I'm so salty right now. My sodium levels. My sodium levels are at a very bad level. Through the roof.

Well, you guys are excellent competitors. I appreciate you both coming on here and spending a little over an hour with fine folks watching and listening. to this program right now, but we are getting out of here. Thank you so much for checking out the program. We will be back next week. However, there will be a little bit of a caveat mixed in. I'm going to be on the road.

So when the show will happen, hopefully we'll still make it happen on Thursday. It will probably be at a different time slot. So just throwing that out there. But that's it for AK, for Spencer, for the judge, the jury, the executive producer, E. Casey Liden. I am Mike Heck. We'll see you next week once again between the links to the iconic voice of Estherlyn. Takes you home.

Good night, everybody. This has been between the links. I'm Mr. Len. You can tell because it's my beautiful voice. Oh, yeah. Happy birthday, AK, you suck. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.