MMA Fighting - BTL | Conor McGregor Found Liable, Yan Shines, Fighters Call Out PFL, Paul vs. Tyson Statement

Episode Date: November 27, 2024

On a special Thanksgiving week edition of Between the Links, MMA Fighting's Mike Heck and Jed Meshew take your questions about Conor McGregor and him being found liable in a sexual assault civil case on Friday, Petr Yan's incredible performance at UFC Macau, Jon Jones giving a return update, PFL fighters blasting the promotion ahead of their World Championship card on Friday, MVP's statement following Paul vs. Tyson, and more.  Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Follow Jed Meshew: @JedKMeshew Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Shop now at IKEA.ca.ca.com slash Black Friday. IKEA, bring home to life. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. From M.MA Fighting Studios, this is Between the Links. And now, your host, my... The iconic voice of Esther Lynn welcomes you to a brand new edition of BTL. No, it is not Thursday. It's Thanksgiving Eve, baby.

Happy Wednesday to us all. And because we are thankful to all of you, we want to do another live show. We wanted to make it your show. a special Thanksgiving Eve, Q&A edition of the program, and joining me to answer your questions, the hot take kid himself,

Mr. No Gray area, the Barrettaboop, the man who has scientifically tested that chickens cannot be goats. He is the one and only Jedbushu from MMMfighting.com. There he is. I want to clear up a misconception.

I did not do the scientific research. I am not a scientific research. I am not a science doctor. So I just spoke to the experts. I, you know, collected all of the data. And, but they're the ones who did the research. They looked at the chromosomes, not me, because I am not a science doctor. Fair enough.

I am also not a science doctor. Casey Leiden is a doctor in production, I would say. I would give him a PhD. He's joining us as well to take your questions. and chime in. There he is. Sleeves, optional but not needed

on this Thanksgiving Eve. How are you, Casey? Do you wonderful on this gloomy Wednesday morning in Southern California. But wherever you are in the world, I'm happy you are here with us on this Wednesday. Yes. So, as we already mentioned,

it's a Q&A. Bring on your questions. I'm out here sleeve list. I am in heavy sweatpants. is cold. It is cold on the East Coast, friggin living in California. It was misty yesterday. 70 degrees outside here. Yeah, there was a light mist yesterday.

It was like 30-4 when I woke up. Oh, yeah. Running in 30-degree weather sucks ass. That's my hot take for the day, kids. All right. Well, that's our show, everybody. Thanks for coming. joining us. Casey, bring up the first question because lots of stuff to talk about here. There we go. That's the first question. Oh, my God. There's a celebrity of the chat.

Oh. Phoenix. Dope. Tarnovali. The undisputed BTL champion who has, she's the dominant crews of BTL. She's been out for like three and a half years, but we just cannot take the belt away from her. We still have ranked. We still have a ranked despite her. Yeah. She's our John Jones. She's always going to be ranked. Good to hear for you, Phoenix. Happy Thanksgiving to you as well. Happy Thanksgiving.

Maybe the greatest ever appear on the show. Oh, yes. Catching up while forcing herself to do cardio. Yes, that's because nothing will make you want to push the pace more than watching us deliver takes on this here program. All right. Up that resistance. That resins it, it's a business, Phoenix.

Come on, get a sweat going. Inclined, like a 22 here. Incline, incline, yeah. I want to see 180 heart rate. Let's do it. Shout out to the VTL goat. Thank you, Phoenix. All right.

Question from longtime commenter, our favorite guy, Joseph Boza. Joseph Boza, what are your thoughts on the statement from MVP promotions that says Jake Paul versus Mike Tyson wasn't rigged? If they have to put out a statement, it tells me it was rigged. So I saw this. I'm trying to do more on my Instagram. So if you haven't followed me, like when things of this nature happens, I just jump on, hit record, and then I just post it after taking some like deep.

Got to get on that TikTok like Instagram. I got to do it. But I gave my thoughts on it. I'll deliver some more here. But Jed, what did you think of the statements from MVP? I thought it was silly, right? Like, it just because you will have people like Mr. Joseph Bosa. And I don't know if he is being serious here or not,

because I tend to think of all of our certainly viewers and listeners and commenters as educated fans unless your name is Cross and then you're a big dummy. But by speaking about this, you are giving it some level of credence. even if it is only to speak a total rejection of the thing. It just wasn't necessary because I think most people who are knowledgeable about fight sports know that it wasn't fixed, that it was just bad and stupid and silly.

And the people who aren't knowledgeable about fight sports, they're not going to hear the message that you gave them. like if they do they might view as as joseph has said here like oh if you're denying it that just makes it true but then most likely like the broader public they're not tuning into mfiting dot com for updates on on what mvp says about this and so it's one of those ones where it is just clearly better to me to say nothing uh what's the old saying better to uh better to be silent and have people think you're dumb than to open your mouth and remove all out. Like, they really just didn't need to say shit about this one. And so, yeah, I think that was probably not the best choice on their part. What did you think about it, Casey? Was it necessary?

I'm kind of on the fence. But I kind of also, I just don't know, I just don't know how this new promotion works with kind of more of a social media kind of, I don't know, a game plan. I don't work for MVP, but my wife, you know, worked for MVP last week. So I was kind of around the social media team around, you know, and the Kesa and kind of the top guys. And they just, because I was around Showtime too. And it's very different. Showtime, no, they were like, you know, for less, you know, the old school. And this is like new school, you know.

They're very social media oriented. So I'm just, actually, I just don't know if this is good or bad. Like is any publicity good publicity? Do they still want? Is this just good traffic, good engagement maybe to put that out there? But taking that away in general, I wouldn't put anything out, anything like that out there. It kind of just, I don't know, gives all the stupid TikTok videos a little bit more. What's the word I'm looking for?

Polidity. And I just think you just ignore it. It was not a fixed. It was not a rig match. It was just a bad fight. That's all. Yeah. Yeah.

Like it was, yeah, go ahead, Jed. It was just ridiculous, but please. Yeah, it is just like, honestly, so much of life can just be tracked back to like how you would handle a situation on a school yard. And like, if you get upset because somebody's calling you a name, I won't use the name that was in vogue during my youth because it's no longer an acceptable thing. like you were just making it worse by acknowledging it we're just like okay man whatever it takes any of the teeth out of anything about it and so like if you were going to send a statement like maybe Jake Paul doing it just on his social in the same way that he just tweets and TikToks about random shit maybe that's okay but to do it from like a a stance of the promotion

like that is just a huge huge failure on my part Yeah, this honestly, this was the dumbest thing MVP has done since they started this. This is honestly the worst decision they made, in my opinion. Because these rigged conversations have come up with every fight he's been involved in, every single one of them. And there have been social media videos made about each and every one of them that people believed. And you chose this fight to put out a statement. Not only that, whoever wrote this statement,

you know, terrific gumption in language. But you don't have an editor to proofread your work. Why would you ever put out there? We, by saying that these guys didn't fight to the best of their ability, you're not giving them the credit they deserve for the hard work and dedication they put into the gym. When Jake Paul literally said he didn't fight to the best of his ability, that he carried Mike and tried not to hurt him, you can't say things like that in a professional fight.

after a professional fight, you just cannot do that when hundreds of millions of dollars are being wagered on it. You just look so silly going back to this when in reality, knowing this combat sports landscape, you could have just let this slide in a week. No one would have thought about this fight. Nobody would have thought about it.

We would have thought about Thanksgiving and the holidays and then we would have been on to UFC 310 and boxing would have had another big fight. Ryan Garcia is doing weird. Ryan Garcia things. We would have moved so quickly past all of this, unless a lawsuit or something happened. But in terms of how people viewed the fight and the perception of it,

people were almost past it anyways. Like people were already had turned the page. This fight sucked. It was ridiculous. We talked about it on Thursday and kind of like let everything out that we had left to say. Then the Kesa goes on Ariel's show and just says a bunch of ridiculous nonsense. And that could have been everything right there. You could have just left.

it there and then you put out this statement i just i'm stunned by the stupidity if we're being honest i could not believe what i saw and i cannot believe they did this and to jed's point now people really think it's rigged because they put out the statement so i don't i don't get that i don't get quite get that part but is but it's good is any publicity is this bad publicity is this bad overall for them but why but why because i don't get people are people We're not going to tune in for the next one more or less? No. I think that is yes, almost definitionally, I think.

Like, I do not ascribe to the idea that all publicity is good publicity. I think that there are limited windows where that is true. But it's just like blatantly not true when you're actively trying to sell a product. And so I think that this ain't helping. This is not going to make one more person tune in. and I suspect that it will in fact turn more people off to tuning in in the future insofar as they would have for the next freak show that he does. Because like nobody's tuning in for Jake Paul to do the thing. Like we already know this.

We talked about this inaudsium and Jake Paul goes back to fighting the Ryan Borland's of the world. Some people will tune in because they are Jake Paul people who will tune in for everything and everybody else will ignore it. the next time Jake Paul fights somebody that is of renown, I'm trying to think of who it would be that would like fits in the Mike Tyson mode. Like if he fights a Vayner-Holyfield or whatever, people won't tune in. It's just like, now I'm good. Yeah. It's just a bad idea.

You took all the focus off of a man that's around on Katie Taylor. Like all the credit they got, them being at the top of the news cycle when it came to that card, gone now. You took all the attention off of them, put it back on this shitty fight. If you want to do a statement, here's the statement I would have written. Hey, guys, we did it in Texas. That's all I needed to hear. Oh, yeah, Texas sanctioned this bullshit. And Texas is one of the worst commissions in the country.

I mean, it's been proven. Just go to MMA fighting. Look at some of the write-ups we've had about the TDLR. Look at what they've done with MMA. Look at how they disciplined referees. Like, they are terrible. They sanctioned this bullshit. That should have been the statement.

It was Texas signed to MVP. And people. They sanctioned the ref in the Katie Taylor fight, you know, which they've been highly critical of. Yep. So. 100%. Mike, you also brought up,

you brought up a thing that I didn't mention that is like, I just already moved past it. It was real preachy. Like their statement was real preachy in a way that is just off putting and was lame. Just be like admonishing people for it. Like if you feel the need to respond, you don't have to do it on, such a high horse. Like particularly when you're like definitionally the high ground you stand upon

is in putting a 60 year old dude out there to fight a 27 year old kid who admittedly tried not to hurt him. Like you don't have a moral imperative here. So maybe just maybe take that holier than now language and stuff it up your ass. Yeah. There's been a lot of that since this fight ended and it's driving me insane. So I like that. I like that. I like that. A logical and inane. You know what else? Buddy, you know what else was illogical and inane? The whole goddamn thing. Yeah. 70,000 people 110 million watched. We love illogical. We love inane. That's what sells. And I'm not being. That's what sells. I love illogical and inane shit. too. I've seen every Fast and the Furious movie in theaters.

Like I get it. I'm just saying when I'm at the fucking Fast and the Furious movies, I'm not looking down my nose of people because I understand the world I'm inhabiting. Yeah. Just like you're an idiot for not doing this as an exhibition. Like that killed you. No one, not what you would have made lost like a thousand total viewers in the whole thing. No one had been like, oh, no, it's an exhibition about going. Because no one wouldn't even known, really.

Just like we would have known and we would have told people, but no one, like the casual audience who was watching this fight just saw on Netflix that Mike Tice was fighting Jake Paul. They didn't care if it was a pro fight or not. They just were like, wow, these two guys are fighting each other. And none of these questions would matter. We wouldn't have anything to say about. We'd say the fight was terrible as we expected. Mike didn't get hurt.

We would probably celebrate Mike. like not getting hurt in all of this. But now it's come to this and it's crazy. Is there an actual, is there an actual real, what is the argument? I've only seen a couple of stupid slow-mo videos of bad angles and like, look, they're whispering into each other's ears right now to, you know, like, it's not rig. The fight was not rig. Oh, I know it's not.

I'm not, what are they even basing anything on? Because, or is this just really stupid casual? They're trying to make money. Engagement. You're making money. 100%. You're trying to make money. Okay.

Just double check. I saw off like 10 seconds like this is stupid. I was there. This is. Yeah. You know. I was just kind of curious what people were actually. People who never watched fights and have no idea how fights were.

Okay. Because this doesn't just happen for Jake Paul. I mean, this just happens for every big boxing match. It is always rare. In MMA. Dude, I, I worked at Lidexe during the Kimbo Slice era. I've been through all this again. You know, me and the James Thompson fight, though, the first fight in CBS, that was called fixed forever, you know.

And Petrazzelli knocked Kimbo out. That was, I guess that was called. I don't know, everything it was called. Anything Kimbo's Lysol-Relier was always called fixed. Yeah. People don't, people want to believe in conspiracies. Yes. That is why there are grown adults who believe the earth is flat, which is truly the dumbest thing.

Like, not even hyperbolic. I think it's the dumbest thing in the world. If you believe the earth is flat and you're watching this, I, Jed Mishu personally believe you to be among the stupidest people in existence. And that's just, there's a not insignificant portion of the consuming public who, you know, maybe doesn't go quite that far, but they do want to believe in a conspiracy. All right. We good?

Oh, we're so good. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Boza. question from our good friend Lazybed. Important. It's just important discussion right here. Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap. You're almost at the finish line.

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Instacard, groceries that over deliver. Service fees exclusions in terms apply. Ladies have a macaroni and cheese, a crucial side dish or overrated slop? Jed? We don't have mac and cheese at our Thanksgiving. It was never part of it. So I would certainly say it is not a crucial side dish.

I love me of mac and cheese, though. I'm not morally opposed to mac and cheese. I don't think it is at all necessary. I mean, the Thanksgiving table has so much else going on. But particularly you get like a good pan made, not like, and I like a craft mac and cheese straight out of the box too. again, I am not levitating above the rest of humanity here. But you get like a good pan made like real mac and cheese.

I'm also into that. But I definitely don't think it's necessary because I'm cooking Thanksgiving dinner tomorrow and I am not making mac and cheese. Never had mac and cheese at Thanksgiving ever. Casey? Freaking crucial. And this question is an overrated slop. Thank you, Lacey, Beth.

Oh, all right. I like it. I am a Southerner and we like our mac and cheese. Casey, I am as a southerner human being as a kids. Oh, whoa, whoa, no, yeah. You live in California. I live in California now. I was raised in Mississippi.

My name is Janet, and I was born in South Georgia. I am flying to Mississippi tomorrow to do. Yeah, we're flying on Thanksgiving. Oh. Yeah. Leaving five, leaving streets in the morning. Yeah.

That's the best way to fly. That's the best time to fly. Ooh, land in Memphis, 30 minute drive, Mississippi. We're good. Yeah. Today sucks. Tomorrow will be bad. And then flying back on Sunday is terrible.

So you leave Thursday and you fly back Monday. That's the way you do it. I've never flown. Mike Heck. That's exactly what me and Esther did. I know Thursday morning. You probably stay. Yep.

It's going to be so nice. for you guys travel-wise and you probably saved a whole bunch of money doing that way. And get this, get this. We spent a little bit more. We got upgraded. We have layback seats. Oh. In style.

You live in fancy. Yeah. Well done. Thank you, ladies of bed. All right. This is good. What are Mike and Jed's thoughts on PFL ator being a mess? I thought it was a good thing when they had the town hall.

with Don Davis, but now I'm thinking Don doesn't know what he's doing. You're just thinking that now? I mean, come on. Look, Don came on to the town hall. We discussed the things that were said and not said on that particular program. But for those who have no idea what this question means or where it's coming from, PFL is about to do their annual million dollar championship show on Friday. It's going to be in Saudi Arabia.

and it's going to be 17 hours long because there's 10 scheduled five round fights between the prelims and the actual main card. These are the most brutal cards to watch and cover. But that has nothing to do with the story. This is going to be the worst one by far. Oh, yeah. It's not even close.

This one is going to be a nightmare Friday. Yeah. I bet most people have no idea who Dakota Dichiva is even fighting because we haven't seen a thing about Tylosanto, so I just gave you the answer. But anyways, we have seen a whole,

bunch of Bellator fighters come out expressing their frustrations as to why they are not fighting patchy mix patriciao pit bull cori anderson johnny eblins thrown in a few things here and there uh we've seen lorenz larkin become a free agent we've seen other big names become free agents or get released and all these other things uh this is not going well uh and once again jed as i throw this to you ahead of a big event one they call their tent pole events every year it all comes down this is why you do the season and the whole build is to get to the show. Nobody is talking about the show at all. They're talking about the drama surrounding PFL ator.

Your thoughts on the messy situation they now find themselves in once again. So I wrote about this this week in the mailbag because a lot of people had the same question for the mailbag. And I covered a lot of ground because this has been a bad year for PFL, just straight up. And at the end of 2023, when the acquisition of Beltaur was going through, we talked about, and I certainly put it out there that this would, maybe not be a make or break year, but that this is, this was a big opportunity year for PFL. Which is with the confluence of things happening now with getting this influx of talent from Bellator, because that was always the issue. That was always what they lacked was having a number of good fighters. They had one or two and the idea and the theory that the tournament system would create more names. That has not proven to be true, frankly.

Though I guess maybe to some extent it did give us in on Faheda. But, all right, you're going to get all this bell to town in. Now you can start to put together real, like legitimately good cards multiple times a year on top of your bread and butter, which is the tournaments or the season long series, however the hell they call it, whatever. And then all of that has just failed pretty much pillar to post. This has thus far been the least interesting tournament or season long thing that they have done, in my opinion. It is pretty much Dakota DeCeva's show.

Like, they're putting a lot of eggs in that basket to be something that's interesting and new. The rest of the tournament finals are frankly not all that interesting for any number of reasons. And then on top of this, and I do want to address specifically the championship this weekend, but we can talk about that later because to get to the point of the question, the bellator shit is awful. It is so unbelievably bad for them because you can have criticisms of Bellator and God knows we did. We had any number of criticisms on this program, on other programs repeatedly because we wanted them to do better. But one thing that I was always very clear on and that I think Bellator was very, very good about, And not just Bellator, historically Scott Coker has been exceptional about through his history,

which is probably why he has been as successful as he has been, is he was always clear in communication with the fighters on his roster. And while there is naturally an animosity in the relationship between promoter and fighter, he, for the most part, was fighter friendly. Not all the time, and certainly that no promoter is. but, you know, hey, Michael Chandler wants to leave and go to the USC, go do it with our blessing. Hey, you guys went out of your contract. You want to, they worked around those things and basically just carried themselves with an air of respect that resonated with fighters.

Because if you talk to any freaking fighter who fought under Scott Coker's banner, be it strike force or bellator, they are all pretty much unanimous in saying, it's great to fight for Scott. I was treated with respect. I got paid better. etc, etc. Like I knew where things stood and there are outliers but mostly that has happened and PFL has simply not done that

and whether we aren't in the behind the scenes meetings maybe there's a reason for this but openly and honestly almost every major fighter from Bellator has come out and complained about the lack of transparency the lack of fights

the lack of communication that is being proffered to them saying, hey, man, I would like to fight X, Y, and Z. Chris Cyborg, not the most reliable narrator, apparently wanted to fight Larissa Pacheco for a while. They finally made it happen and she did fight her and now was already like, let me fight somebody else. I do not know what PFL is doing with respect to Bellator fighters. I think I know what they're doing with Belator and I've put that out here before. But what I know that is happening with Belator fighters is they are, are burning any goodwill they had. And so when patchy makes a contract comes up and whenever it is due, they're going to play hell resigning it. Because why the fuck would you go

sign somebody who was this bad at communicating with you? Even if you give them, okay, well, we were trying to figure things out. It was new. Like, no, I will just go, I will go to a promotion that I know I am going to fight twice a year. I know the UFC will give me two fights a year. And so I will go do that because I value consistency because at the end of the day, everybody in their job values consistency and just straight up the PFL has not been consistent with Bellator fighters and it is a disaster for them as a result. Yeah, it's insane. They've just dropped the ball.

At this point, you just kind of kind of do the humane thing here and just make a decision. You either book these guys to fight and you do it quickly or you let them go. like let them go at this point you need to send an email to all their managers and be like yo this is what we're doing we're releasing these people or we're doing this we want to keep you but we're not going to force you to stay we will give you this if they stay but if they want to leave we're giving you the option to leave they need to do that right now they're just doing too much and we knew they would when don davis came on the mMA hour and was like everybody has a job everybody is a contract.

Bellator's going to stay. It's going to be better than ever. We knew it was just terrible business in terms of like MMA and creating buzz. What Bellator is worse now. It's so bad. They have so little buzz and it's the same thing except they put a sprinkle of PFL on top of it,

which is just disgusting. It's like having mac and cheese and vanilla ice cream and squash and cranberry sauce all mixed together in one pie. You like the things possibly individually, but you put them all together, it tastes like ass. You don't want that.

And that is what this has become. It's ridiculous. It is ridiculous. At this point, you just got to let these fighters who are in the prime of their careers make a decision one way or the other. They can make more money and stay with you

and get less interesting fights, or you can let them go and see what they can get on the open market. Because right now you're wasting these fighters' careers because you try to do too much. you tried to do something that everybody told you was a bad idea. And even now, look at what they themed the new champion series product. There's no Bellator attached to it.

We're still doing Bellator titles, which I don't understand either. But there's even, they just call it the champion series, the PFL champion series, starring Bellator lightweight champion Usman Nirmagamedov. What the fuck is that? I, I said this when it happened, like when they said, signed it and announced the plans. And I am really convinced. Like, until somebody gives me, like, Don Davis explains a better reason, I am just flat

out certain that they are contractually obligated, either through a fiduciary duty or a literal contractual, you know, broadcast rights deal to perpetuate Bellator for some period of time. And because it is the only thing that makes sense at all with how they have done. that they have, that Bellator had existing rights deals that they had to adhere to or promotional deals or whatever, that there is a financial obligation somewhere in there that this has to perpetuate for a year or two, whatever it may be, before they can fold this thing up. Because otherwise, I do not, I believe that the people managing PFL are smart people. I don't think that they are smart fight promoters.

and I think as Don Davis pretty clearly outlined, they are really fight fans. But I do believe that they are smart at business because that is what they see this as. And you have to be a very dim bulb to think that bifurcating your brand to this extent is worthwhile when you're at this stage of what you are. And so I remain absolutely convinced that the only reason Bellator exists in so far as it does is because they have some obligations. of being said, I do not understand at all why the fighters can't fight. Because, like, I think that the championship card this weekend is the dumbest idea of all time. I have been on the record for years saying that I think it is an awesome idea to do it Thanksgiving weekend. I think it's such a good idea to do your championships, to tie it to an established American holiday, and you're going on Friday.

but you can't ever host a pay-per-view that has six championship fights on it because that's silly. And it's not even six. It's actually like 10 this year because they're doing all the regional ones too. What you can do is you can do a two-day event. You can do Friday and you can do Saturday and you can split that up and then make it the big extravaganza card for you of the year. And if you have that, then you can fill in more Bellator fighters. And frankly, you know what a lot of your fighters probably would enjoy outside of Georgia. just the champions fighting for a million bucks.

If you have two cards and you can fill it out with other guys in your roster, they'd probably like the chance to fight right before the holidays to make money that they can then spend on their family at Christmas time. I do not understand why literally the lowest hanging fruit of all time has just been spurned by them. And instead, we get 16 fucking fights on Friday,

which is insane. 10 championship fights, which is more insane. And then the other six fights, which clearly should not happen. Under no circumstances should there be more fights outside of championship fights. But if you're going to do it, why in shit's name is there an O&O fighter competing? Why is Asel Aduge taking on Jose Perez?

Why are the rest of these fights not people we give a shit about who want to compete for you? What in the name of God is this promotion doing? It is so not hard. Don Davis, when you were never. watch this. Give me a call. Mike will give you my phone number and I will consult for free

not because like I I just want you guys to stop shooting yourself in the goddamn dick because it's not that hard. 16 fights is insane. I don't even like that UFC 310 is 14 fights and there's one championship fight and one other five rounder

and I still think 14's too many fights. I would be so mad if I went to like a, you know, a local card and there was like 16 fights on the card. And like, I would like, oh, God, no. This is no. Dude, for and thoughts and prayers to all the PFL staff. Oh my God. All the cameramen. The, the play by play announcers, Sean O'Connell doing that many fights.

That is just, that is, you just don't do that to people. And thoughts and prayers. That's just. It is. So, I didn't even think of the. Sean O'Connell of it, like, because we've talked about how it is hard to do a broadcast for 10 fights for seven hours. This thing is going, like, even I'm assuming, and this might be a bold assumption, I am,

maybe it's just hope. I'm hoping that this will not have PFL pacing attached to it and they will be firing people in because 10 championship fights. You guys understand. They need multiple fights at the same time. I don't think it will happen, right? Like, I assume there will be some finishes. You know, there is a world where four hours of continuous fighting is the minimum.

Like four full hours, 250 friggin minutes. That is four hours. I'm at there. It's actually four in change of championship fighting and then six undercard fights. Like, that is an insane task to give to Sean O'Connell and whoever. Randy Cotor, Kenny Floyd, whoever it is. Like, it is why is this thing

not Friday and Saturday? They do it for WrestleMania. Why is PFL mania not like, and as you just call it, BFL mania and it's Friday and Saturday and you do three tournament championships and two of the regional championships and three tournament championships and two of the regionals

and then that's five fights on each card and then you fill it out with a couple of other specialty interest fights or whatever. And this is just the softest of softballs that could exist. And they're just like, no, I don't get it. Casey, I love your idea so much. You ever go to like a rock festival?

And it's like the big bands play the main stage in the stadium. And then there's the side bands that play out like just in the entrance way of the parking lot. Like PFL metafite should happen outside in the parking lot. And then all. And then some of the, some of the PFL title fights, the ones that aren't Dakota to Chava and that are not Brennan Locknade and some of the interesting ones. Like an actual timebook running. You have ESPN Plus at your disposal. You can do multiple channels.

What's ESPN Plus going to say? No. They're like, cool. You want the meta fights? Awesome. You want the hip. Yeah. You can split them.

You stagger them. You know, you have your championship fight, you know, at one. And then you have your, I don't know, who's this? you're slim to blessy fight you know he fights at 115 so you know I'm gonna watch the first round if I like it I'll stick around if it's so you know I get it

I'm gonna go to the other fight it's right there follow the music festival circuit oh there yeah they're just they're just running the shit into the ground wait but I want to ask you to gentlemen a question I'm the BTL host

right now this is this is the fifth round you're Don Davis why sell me why you are not giving your best fighters on your roster of fights right now. What would he be saying to kind of sell this? If I'm Don Davis, I'm lying. Oh, yeah.

This is exactly what he says. This is exactly what he says. Well, the Bellator brand, it's not working. It's just not working. Sure, we had some fights book for these fighters, but I can assure you, because we are fan and fighter-friendly first, these fighters are all aware that they have fights booked on a champion series card in 2025, Mike.

It's going to happen, Casey. These guys are all going to get rebooked. All the fights that the fans have wanted to see in 2024, you just have to wait a little bit longer. And isn't waiting for something great? Isn't the anticipation almost as valuable as the actual moment it arrives? And I think that's what fight fans are going to get in 2025.

The UFC is going to put on the, these cards of the apex that nobody's going to watch. But with these Bellator champion series fights, you're going to get at least one championship fight, probably two, because we have to make up for the 2024 reshuffling of the deck, if you will.

So, yeah, these guys are all getting fights. All of their managers have been told they have fights. They will be fighting at a couple of blinks of an eye in a shake of something. I don't know. I ran out of Don Davis. I think it did pretty good for the first 45 seconds. Okay.

Yeah, I think Don just has to lie. Maybe give a kernel of truth and a half apology of, you know, we wanted it. We had some plans and some of those fell through and we're really sorry. We've kind of talked to the fighters. It is tough, though, to manage, you know, this was not part of the plan. Last year, we weren't trying to acquire Bellator. The opportunity happened and we're sort of having to kind of find our way as we go here. And so we know we've made mistakes.

We're going to get everybody into action very early in 2025, maybe with another PFL versus Bellator Supercard, something like that, with the new PFL champions who will be crowned on Friday evening, all 10 of them, whatever. But yeah, like we've made some mistakes. hasn't gone great. But rest assured, 2025 is going to be a much better year for them. And we hope to get them in soon.

Like I think that that, because there's, there is not a logical, explanation, or certainly not one that fighters would suffer. So you just have to lie and maybe give the kernel of truth of like, yeah, we screwed up a little bit. We're going to make it better. I don't know if they're going to make it better, but I hope they do. Because again, Don, love you, buddy. I have given you a ton of respect for doing the town hall.

I think that is very admirable thing of you to do. I would very much like PFL to succeed. This year, I am the least confident I have ever been. and your chances of success. It has been a categorical disaster for you. The last thing he would have said is, oh, sorry, I wasn't really paying attention. I was watching Robbie Lollah versus Carlos Condit for the 12th time because I love that fight. I heard the fight was good, so I decided to keep into it.

Oh, by the way, I, Jed, 100% agree with you of the Bellator, some weird contractual thing. But why don't they just, okay, the Bellator brand, the name, I get why they're probably contractually obligated to it. Why not just release the fighters or? Dude, they're not even using it anymore. Look at the champion series. They don't even attach the bellator name to it anymore. I'm so confused.

I mean, my belief, Casey, and this is pure speculation. Nobody say that I have, my belief is that there is a one, a year long, roughly about a year long timeline that they are held to some sort of financial obligation. for whatever reason that is. And that as soon as that that is up, probably at the end of this year, they are going to immediately get rid of Bellator and make an announcement like the UFC did with pride

when they were like, oh, we're giving up on pride. We're just going to put it all together. It's like, yeah, everybody's going to fold under the PFL. We are still going to have our PFL Africa, et cetera, et cetera. But we're all coming in. But they, the only reason it would make some sense to me that Bellator fighters haven't gotten too, compete as much as they want is because that is tied to the obligation and that they don't want to

put on Bellator shows because those are lost leaders for them. And so they are simply trying to wait out the time limit that they need to to then keep those fighters with them because they want the talent, but they want to be putting that talent under their banner in service of the PFL brand and that there is simply a timeline that they are forced to adhere to in that report. It's the only thing that honestly makes sense at all to me other than blanket incompetence. It's one of those two, in my opinion. It's probably a little column A and a little column.

A little combo. Also it could be that. They don't want to let the fighters go because then why in God's name did they acquire Bellator at all? I mean, despite they didn't spend any money. No, you heard them, they paid Monopoly dollars for, but you don't want to let these guys walk, but I don't think they can give them the fights they want right now. Yeah.

So does it. It's my guess. I hope in 2025 we will actually be saying some positive things about PFL. I really do. Yeah. Dude, open up a freaking band. Let these fighters walk and we'll say positive things about them right now. Yeah.

Yep. come out and do a press conference say patchy mix say patchy mix Johnny all all Bellator champions are now free agents then that will say positive things I would not if you guys did that I would not say that they can say it and I would respect you being good people I would rake you over the coals for being horrible businessman harbler I mean there's no real difference honestly for their brand right now Yeah, I mean, so what, Fight Matrix isn't on their side, but they're not pushing them anyways. It's all, it's all about Dakota and Lachnaghan. Like, that's all, as long as they win a million bucks, it's a successful year for them.

I'm, I'm excited for Johnny Ebblin to be in the middleweight tournament next year. Oh, my God. Patchy makes to be in a Bellator tournament or an abandoned weight tournament. Unbelievable. All right. Thank you, Mr. Boza. super chat from lazy bed lazy bed

lazy I was watching old BTLs yesterday shouts to Phoenix baby face ched and buzz cut A K Lee thankful for the content through the years getting keep pushing

thank you lazy bed awesome thank you much maybe I'll bring back to baby face I'll just start shaving once you start shaving you have to shave though like you gotta keep doing it it's so exhausting

all right another super chat from George Simon What's up, George? Should UFC introduce a cruiserweight division? Is cruiserweight? Is that 220? You're on 225?

I guess 225 is what it would be in, yeah, MMA. Should they? No. Why? Because it's, there's a better argument that they should do away with the heavyweight division. that they should introduce a cruiser weight to fish. I don't know what to tell you guys, man. Like, it is.

Heavyweight is a garbage weight class. Light heavyweight so much better if we're being honest. That's the thing. Light heavyweight is also a garbage weight class. And so is heavyweight. And then like if you go to boxing, boxing is 200 pounds as heavyweight. Like light heavyweight and body weight. oxen's like 170 or whatever like the the the further up we get that that changes an enormous

mount because it's just like yeah once you're over 200 pounds you're all the same it's all it's all the fine and so like i think that there there's been a pretty decent argument that the heavy weight should just be 205 like it like that's that's the maximum weight class or whatever and that you draw the dividing line there so you definitely don't need to differentiate you between heavyweights because like who cares there are not 15 good heavy weights will we get like six decent cruiser weights no yeah i agree uh honestly i think the 205 should should go away heavy weight is just 186 and up uh i mean maybe we just bump 185 up like you do just a little notch up but just like yeah 200 and up

That's that's the number. Was that how the original UFCs were? Where was it? It was just, was it 205? I believe the dividing line was 200 pounds in the usual. When they introduced weight class, I believe that lightweight was sub 200 and heavyweight was over 200. I can look that up though, Casey. Yeah, I know it was around there.

I can't remember exactly. I think in like 2050, I think if you didn't do it back in like 2014, 2015, then it makes absolutely no sense to do it. because that was like the time I thought it was actually a pretty decent idea when you had a lot of heavyweights that were like fighting at 2.30. Like, oh, that would be kind of interesting to see like, you know, a lot of people were saying back then, like imagine where Brendan Schaub could be. You know, I know it's like a different thing to think about now in 2024 with where Brendan is and just having all the success he's doing doing the broadcasting stuff.

But like he could have been a much different fighter fighting dudes that were like 225. that were his size and not going up and fighting 265-pound guys. So back at like 2015, I thought it wasn't a bad idea to introduce that division. But now at this point, like, makes absolutely no sense to it. Casey, I did in fact confirm it. It was 200 pounds and over and under 200 pounds was lightweight. That was first implemented at UFC 12, which took place in good old Dothan, Alabama. Oh, yeah.

And Joe Rogan debuted, was it not? And Dothan. Beautiful Dothan. Dothan. Actually sounds like that is correct as well. I'd have to look that up. Jerry Bolander won the lightweight tournament finals, stepping in as a replacement fighter over Nick Sanzo with a neck crank.

Was that the card they just moved like the day before? I believe that that was. And I know this because it was Mark Coleman, Dan Severn. Yep. So, yeah. New York was like, no, you can't do it here. and they'd move the entire event. Yeah, John McCain was being a butt.

So they bumped it down to Dothin. They moved a whole card for, what was his name? Whoever won? Tom McCain. Yeah. It's been, it has been set. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, in, and I've, I've been extremely clear that I am not pro adding a 165 found. I think that that's silly. if you're going to add cruiserweight you don't add cruiser weight you just restructure all the weight classes to do 125 35 35 55 55 55 65 75 75 85 and then heavyweight so you don't add a 165 get rid of light heavyweight and merge it functionally yeah uh yeah i don't care about cruiserate i do want i do like 65 get rid of 70 make 70 75 yeah i i that's personally what i like um but uh I'm not opposed to doing that.

I'm opposed to adding 165 and keeping 170. No, no, that never made sense to me. I never, I always assumed when you do 165. It is the argument that is always made. And I'm like, that's dumb. Well, no, 165 is right. If you move 170 to 175. I'm fine with that.

I have no issues with that. Okay, yeah. All right. Thank you, George. Appreciate you. All right, what else we got here? Welcome aboard Air Canada. Rocky's vacation, here we come.

Whoa, is this economy? Free beer, wine, and snacks. Sweet. Fast-free Wi-Fi means I can make dinner reservations before we land. And with live TV, I'm not missing the game. It's kind of like I'm already on vacation. Nice. Air Canada.

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You don't hear it? Oh, I don't even notice it. I usually drown it out with the radio. How's this? Oh, yeah. Way better. Save on insurance by switching to Bel Air Direct and use the money to fix your car.

Bel Air Direct, insurance, simplified. Conditions apply. Rakeed. Rakeed, what's your thoughts about a lot of fighters who don't want to fight in Australia because of the tax? A huge difference for one week between Saudi and Australia. Yeah, this is pretty interesting.

Boy, just kind of like peering around at what UFC 312 is looking like right now and what's available. Not much. Not much going on in good old Sydney, Jed. So, yeah, what are your, it's not something we talk about all that often, but it is an important thing, especially when we're thinking about the fighters. People not wanting to go to Australia because of the big taxes. It is, like you said, we don't really talk about it. I think, and there's not really a ton of reason.

It is fascinating to me this part of the game, though, because pretty clearly there are places that you would rather fight, like, that just based on tax law. And, like, even in the United States, like, it is better to fight in some states over other states, and we see that all the time. And it is, you know, like, I'm just going to shock you guys, pretty pro taxes, I believe in, you know,

what taxes do. But it would be foolish to suggest that if I myself were a fighter, I would not want to, you know, with one of the three paychecks I get in a year, collect as much of that money as I possibly can. And so, like, almost definitionally, if you are a fighter who's going to compete in a specific area, you are getting paid less than you normally would. You are taking a pay cut in some of these places to go compete there versus some of somewhere else. And so like, I just think it's sort of the nature of the beast. There's nothing to do about it. But it is, I totally get why some people would be like, I don't want to do that. Like,

I would rather not fight in New York or California or whatever because I'm only getting 10 and 10. I really don't want that to be taxed to, I'd like that to be taxed as little as possible. So, yeah, it's just sort of the nature of the beast. And we, these overseas ones, it's like you do get taxed. You're getting double taxed. And, of course, you receive no benefit from it because it goes to that country. Yeah. To my understanding that there's some recourse for the American tax on that, if you're already taxed. But I am certainly not an expert in tax law or anything like that.

And so, like, yeah, it's just on its face, would you like to make 30% less money? No, thank you. I would not like to do that. Okay. You want to fly across the world an economy, share a hotel room of three dudes, then lose, if you lose, and basically walk home, maybe banking five grand for a three-month camp. So the way to sell it to me would be like, oh, they're flying me out and I can use this. I can think of this as that being the cost of a free trip to Australia or whatever. But yeah, man, it's tough.

It is a tough thing. and it's the exact sort of thing, guys, and I feel like, I haven't hit this particular note in a while. The exact sort of thing. And by exact sort of thing, I mean exactly the thing that, oh, I don't know, a union might stand to represent in favor of fighters. If you are collectively fighters and had somebody to collectively bargain around such things, such as if we are going, to go to a higher tax rate location, the UFC foots that bill, and thus we get a commiserate pay bump to compete in such things. But in the absence of a union, the UFC ain't never going to do shit. And that's really not just the UFC. Your employers will never do anything that they are not

forced to do. So get yourself a union fighters. Then you can have say in this sort of thing. Yep. It'll never, ever, ever, ever happen. It's too bad. It's just never going to happen. And to Dave's point, if you ask the UFC about this, because going through the John Jones steepe timeline, Casey, that you wonderfully put together, Dana was asked a question about the UFC card for the Gus ofson rematch being moved to California. And they said, and I believe it was Aunt Walker who actually asked this question, our good friend Aunt BTL alumnus. said, are you going to help the fighters out with a little more money to cover the taxes? And Dana's response was, who's going to pay my taxes? We have to pay extra taxes too. And that will be their answer every single time. And it's not even wrong. Like, because no one, as Jed said, it's morally wrong.

It's not. Right. But if no one's pushing back against it, if the fighters aren't coming together to do something about it, then why? change a thing. You're making so much money. You cannot lose. You literally cannot lose right now. You can't.

You get the fighters over a barrel. They can't do anything about it. I mean, they could. They're just not going to. The only thing they can do about it is be like, I don't want to fight in Australia. That's it. Because consistently at every, it's not at every possible opportunity, the fighters as a whole have not just rejected a union.

they have done it like with with vicious anger like the concept of a union just infuriates them because they're dumb and I can't put that in any more kind of way I don't know guys like I got to tell you if I was a professional fighter I would look at other professional athletes and be like I don't think a single person in the NFL is upset that they have a players association I got to tell you I think the NBA and the MLB I think they're all like man it's pretty sick

that we have this thing that helps us leverage against the unfettered power of the corporate structure and their own fighters like nah man I'm good

4.6 billion sale price man that would be cool if we had some way to get some of that guess we just will never do anything about it. No, I mean, you just got to give all the UFC. They'll trickle it down to the fighters. That's how it works.

We all know it works that way. I'm sure show I'm sure show Aotani is like, damn it, why did I join this union? With my 10-year, $700 million contract, I just signed. Like, come on. That's the part that is always driven me insane. It's like legitimately,

Connor should have been the fighter most driving reunion thing. He would have benefited the most. It's like, no. Sure would have. But this is it. It's just not hard.

There's so much literature and studies that like unions are a good thing for workers. Yeah. But I mean, it's, but the UFC is the UFC has done actually like a really good job of like making sure this could never even happen because that's why they have the contender series and all these other shows because they could just lock in 60 new dudes at 10 and 10 who will gladly accept anything that the UFC offers them for the chance to fight in the UFC. And there's a lot of managers out there who will just want to keep the UFC happy more than keep their fighters happy.

And it sucks for fighters because you go, even if a fighter goes, you know what? Yeah, you're right. We should unionize. I'm not going to go to the UFC because of their, you know, contracts. So what's my option? Oh, crap. PFL. BFL.

Not even one anymore. One doesn't do MMA anymore, realistically. Yeah. Well, now you got BKFC. Like brave? Well, yeah, MM. Yeah, you have to jump out in other sports. You have to like, all right, well.

All that grappling kicking, yeah, just. Dirty boxing. The video is some dirty boxing. It looked kind of cool. That was fun as hell to watch those clips. I was like, shit, that would have been real fun to go. I could legitimately be on to something there. Yeah.

Do you see what they did, though? Do you see what they did? And Jorge Mazadol could learn a lot from this. Yes. They didn't do it in an arena. And I know it was like a private event and all. But I'm telling you, and I hope Mike Perry and all those guys are listening to the words that come out of my mouth, do not do a single thing different moving forward.

Your events should look like that every time. There should be that. many people in there every time. Maybe a little more. Maybe a little more. But you do not need to do an arena. You do not need to do a 5,000 seat building. There should be no more than 1,000 people at those fights.

And that's a full capacity type situation where the fire marshals to come in and say, these 10 people have to leave. You have way too many people. That's it. No more than a thousand people. What's the name of that like, it's like a ball it's called like a ballroom or something where that that pro wrestling organization that wasn't the WWF or

SWW sure that one where there's like stacks of people because there's like a thing and it's like a really small venue Hammerstein yeah whatever that shit is like I see stuff on TikTok and like it feels so crowded it looks like there's a billion people and they're just like throwing beer everywhere. There's like the most lively like event space I've ever seen. You should be doing that.

Like that should be the place that you should do you in. That's her all the Mazdaal's card. That's what all the game bread MMA cards should be in building is just like that. Little theaters with high bet with the which is one balcony overlooking everything else. Yeah, you gotta have a belt like the balcony shit kicks ass.

Yeah. You need that. That's perfect because like the acoustics in Hammerstein because I've been to an ECW show at Hammerstein. And it is free, it was free and electric in there. Where is that place? Yeah. Did the place still exist?

Yeah. Oh, no, I absolutely agree. Like, the greatest times I've had at combat sports events have been actually at pro wrestling events in extremely small venues where like essentially you are part of the show. And I think for dirty boxing, if you're a fan and one of those 500 fans that are there, you kind of your, you're almost job as a spectators to be part of the. experience, not just be the, not just witness experience. You are part of the experience. And that's why ECW was so awesome because it wasn't just the wrestlers. It was the crowd and everything. That was all part of it. And I hope that that's why game bread, MMA, whatever kind of sucks right now because it's just the fights. You need kind of an experience. And dirty boxing seems to

kind of get that. And I hope they kind of lean into that more. Yeah. It's the same with concerts. It's like if you go to a big stadium show and it's somebody who can do that, you know, I've never been to Taylor Swift. I imagine Taylor Swift puts on a great live performance. But like all the best concerts I ever went to were in some bar where they were tucked in the corner. And there were a hundred of us just moshing. Like it's just like, yeah, get small venues with lively experience is way better. Yep.

Yes, sir. Do the thing. Do the thing. All right. Thank you much. stuffing or dressing? It's a great question. It's stuffing maybe.

Stuffing for here. Both are, I mean, so we're clear, this is asking us which we would prefer, not which is the correct term, because those are two different things. So we're on the same page here. Stuffing and dressing are not the same thing. Stuffing is dressing that is actually stuffed and cooked in the turkey, and dressing is just that. that shit that's not cooked in the turkey. They are different and they're both awesome. So stovetop is dressing.

Yeah, but stove top that you then shove up the bird's ass and cook it is stuffing. You don't actually shove it up the bird's ass. But if you don't stuff it, yeah. But if you don't stuff it, it's not stuffing, then it's just dressing. And dressing is awesome. Dressing and gravy rocks. But also stuffing is also awesome. yeah it's we will we we we call it stuffing whether it goes up the turkey or not we were very clear

there's because there is the stuffing by definition i'm wrong but i'm like to say great grace said you want some dressing he'll be like what the hell you're talking about yeah stuffing yeah oh the thing is it yes this is semantics but it is also a different product because they taste different because one got cooked for six hours in a turkey. And so they are different. So if you're like, would you like this and they're not the same? I think they are both awesome, but they're different. Stuffing.

Oh, stuffing. Stuffing. Stuffing. Stuffing is obviously a word, by the way. Stuffing is a much better word. Yeah. We know what stuffing is. Dressing can be multiple things.

Yeah. Dressing. Dressing is a bad. word for what it is to 100%. It doesn't really, you look at it and you're like, that's not dressing. It doesn't, it's not the same. All right.

This one's for you, Jed. You're cool. Jed, what to watch, PFL championship or UGA versus GT on Friday? Boy, my God. I had a trillion dollars to bet on this one. Hold on. When is the game time for

the Georgia Tech game? Oh, fortunately, PFL will probably just be wrapping up. 10 p.m. 7.m. It is 7.30 kick for Georgia versus tech. So I will probably get to be watching all of it, frankly. If PFL is still going on by the time,

if BFL is still going on by the goddamn time attack and EGA kickoff, it will be a nightmare. So I'll probably watch both. I mean, I will certainly watch both. I have two TVs. I'll set one up. But the knock on wood that the tech game shouldn't be a problem for us. I'm now like, college football is so silly this year.

And I don't know to what extent either of y'all pay attention to this or not. But the 12-team playoff is so weird because like Georgia is now going to play in that. We are now locked into the SEC championship game. And we will play the winner of Texas versus Texas A&M that happens this weekend. we have two losses already if we go to the SEC championship game and win we get a buy in the playoff if we go and lose

we might not make the playoff whereas if we just weren't playing in the SEC championship game we would be pretty much locked into a playoff spot so it's very very stupid and I don't know how to feel about things right now in college football I thought they fixed all this

no that's made it way worse The 12 team playoff is so dumb. It's been dumb since the idea of it. Four teams was better. The very obvious correct answer is you do an eight-team playoff, five conference champions and three at-large bids. It's very not hard.

They have decided not to do that. And the SEC has also been a nightmare this year because everybody has just beaten everybody, so we all have a bunch of losses. And so, yeah, it's just, it's weird. Like, I wish we weren't playing for the SEC champion. championship because even though I think we will beat Texas or A&M depending we already want to Texas but I would rather just be a guaranteed spot in the playoffs it'd be

I'm assuming it's 12 teams now over eight it used to be eight or no it's four they went right from four to 12 oh four okay we went four to 12 okay once they did a play okay I'm assuming it's because they want to make more money have more games right okay correct because if it doesn't make sense I always go uh money money is always always is the answer and yes it is it doesn't make sense that's why the whole the belligerth thing well it doesn't make sense ah money there's probably a money reason for for something that doesn't make sense you are you nailed it yeah yeah thank you uh thank you he's carpenter um all right well we're going to get to this it's uh it's yeah just talk about it uh jama i have a new

take on this okay shall we talk connor what impact will this have on his brand slash finances, I do not mean in the fight games since MMA fans are quite forgiving. So a lot going on with the Connor McGregor situation. I know Jed, you and AK reacted to it shortly afterwards on the UFC Macau preview show because it happened this past Friday, five days ago as right now to go live. They're like, we're going to have to delay this. Jesus. I couldn't like when I tried to do that, I couldn't figure it out, and now it just happens. But anyways, Connor McGregor found liable in a civil case stemming from a sexual assault in 2018 or an alleged sexual assault. Connor found liable over $250,000 paid to the victim.

And since then, it has been kind of wild Connor has come out and just continued to declare innocence. even Connor's fiance has come out and basically said, just rip this woman, Nikita Hand, a new one on social media, standing by her man. And Connor is no longer part of the hitman game. He is no longer the face of proper number 12. And stores have taken proper number 12 Irish whiskey off the shelves in Ireland. Like all sorts of craziness has happened.

So obviously some effect to his finances there potentially and some effect to his. his brand already, Jed, but what more could this all mean for Connor McGregor? And what is this new take you have? So I came to this take when I was talking about this with some friends. My friends and I usually talk about fighting stuff. Connor is obviously breaks through that kind of normal rule and they were just asking about it. And I talked a lot of the stuff that we talked in the reaction and that I think we all would agree with. And that even John Moss says here, right, like MMA fans are quite forgiving.

This isn't largely going to hurt his stock with the UFC. I don't think. I wrote about this little bit this week as well. I think that the UFC is going to hand-wave this. It's tough to know. At some point, Dana will get asked about it and we will see his reaction. I would guess that his reaction will not be to outright defend Connor, but to kind of dismiss it with the same way he is,

hand-waved a lot of other issues of. I've got 700 lunatics. It's not a criminal conviction. People make mistakes. You know, I wasn't there. I don't know the details, but, you know, maybe he will then defer to a,

look, Connor, I was saying Connor's going to fight next year. He's got to get his own house in order and he's got other issues to deal with before we even really concern ourselves with Connor competing again. What I was very confident of at the time and I has borne out to be true,

is that however this affects his standing with the UFC, which I don't think is much, this is absolutely going to nerve all the rest of his business dealings. Because while the UFC and MMA and this space of the world has a grand tolerance for awful shit, in the mailbag column I wrote this week, I cataloged not a comprehensive list, just a whole bunch of instances of the sport turning a blind eye to awful heinous crimes that have act. This is the same in promotion that willingly employed Greg Hardy. Like the sport can bear a lot of this. But other things can't.

Like the stench of this is enough to make people disassociate with him. And so very broadly we are already seeing that. And more specifically, we will continue to see that. If y'all were waiting on Connor to be in Roadhouse too, that wait may be forever because it ain't happening. And so, as I was talking this through with my friends, what I came to is this, and this is unbelievably cynical, and I am very sorry if anyone is offended by the cynicism of it, but I truly believe it is real. Because this happened, because he was rendered civilly, or a verdict against him was rendered for this, and because of what it will mean to his personal finances, his business dealings, etc., this has made it dramatically more likely that Connor McGregor will fight next year. I have been very firmly on the corner that Connor's not coming back.

I was pretty firmly on that corner even when he was booked at 303 and then after he exit, he's never fighting. Y'all have heard me say it a million times. This is the sort of thing that will make him fight again, both because now a lot of the impediments to it will be removed. He still has plenty of money, but he doesn't have. other things to occupy his time because no, there ain't no movies coming for him now. There aren't other business dealings going to do.

Everyone is going to say, please stay away from us. And also because fighting is how he gets back to what he was now. He did not need fighting before in any regard. He could make money doing other stuff, people he was beloved for who he was. And I was fine. now that there is something very, very, a very dark cloud hanging over his head. Fighting is the path back to not salvation, but to broader appeal. Because, lest we forget, Mike Tyson is a convicted rapist.

Not a civilly liable, convicted, went to prison rapist, and to the best of my knowledge, has never once apologized or done anything towards that. And yet, because he came back, he returned to fighting, he got back to doing the things that people loved him for, he became an elder statesman and then got rehabilitated despite doing none of the things we expect for rehabilitation, not, you know, admitting his fault and working to be a better man, just saying whatever and letting time and his activity move us beyond it. And so Connor is now, the court of public opinion will render unto him what it feels. And broadly speaking, it seems most people think that Connor is a bad person. That will only change with time. And if Connor gives us reasons to remember certainly the people who want to forgive him, reasons to remember why they liked him.

And they didn't like him because he was in Roadhouse or because he made a whiskey or had to close. They liked him because he fistfought people and was fun and engaging on the mic. And so I think that because this has happened, I would say it is extremely likely now that we do see Conne McGregor back in the cage next year. Yeah, that's, yeah, it's, yeah, I think the UFC is going to kind of handle it the way you said. We'll see what happens. What we heard Dana say about Luis Pena after that whole situation, we're not going to get that here. We didn't get it with John Jones. We're not going to get it here.

There's just no way that happens. I'm kind of surprised we have not heard from David Feldman at all, BKFC, and that they've not said a word. David Feldman is a smart man. Yeah, I am kind of surprised. Shut the fuck up. If no one's going to hold you to task on it, shut the fuck up. Yep. Yeah, I kind of hate what you said, Jed, but you're correct.

I hate everything that I said but I really can be fun. No, no, I kind of thought that initially too as soon as the verdict came. I was like, oh, bad for Connor, but this is good business for the UFC. UFC would not, they are going to make money, extra money, more money because of this, because Connor, I agree with you, is more likely to come back to fighting sooner than later. And that's what the UFC wants. So, I just hope there is a victim in this. I hope Nikita Han.

I hope, I just want, I think we need to talk about the victim because we never mentioned the victim in this. I just hope that I think it took a lot of bravery, what she did to come out this case. Because once this case goes civil and everything, like everything's public and everything now. And so I just hope her life is better now. that's all because it takes a lot of brave breed to do what she did to put her name out there and yeah it's a it's a lot of yeah i can't i can't actually i just can't even i can't even imagine what she must be going through at this time so yeah yeah and connor's got to appeal and you know if you're actually like really dig through some of this stuff like i don't know it's it's it's

just unfortunate the whole thing so we'll see what happens yeah But Mike, do you kind of agree with Jed too that this is more, this brings Connor more likely back to MMA soon and the later? Or is this? Yeah, probably. Yeah, more I would say so. There's just nothing. Nobody else is going to touch him.

Nobody else can touch him outside the combat sports world. He actually needs fight. He needs to fight. Like, I think for him, for himself personally, he needs to fight. Like, he needs to have something to strive towards because. without being in the gym and being disciplined and doing the two a days and all the things that fighters would do

in his position, staying healthy both physically, which will also help him mentally and keep him on track. Like there are just fighters out there that just have to fight. It's just the best thing for them. And Connor will,

you know, was making a ton of money not having to do that. He could go be in movies or he could go make personal appearances. He can walk the red carpets. He could do. do all this and that and still make a shitload of money. But the focus isn't all there.

But now he can shift that focus into a fight camp and maybe it'll improve him. But again, then the fight will end. And then what is he going to do with this time? So, yeah, it's these stories suck. Yes, sir. All right. We might not have a lot. We might not be forced to watch Roadhouse 2.

It's the worst movies. It's overlining. Okay. Before we get out of here, it's a couple more Thanksgiving kind of questions. What is better? The initial Thanksgiving meal or the sandwiches made with the leftovers the day after? It's the meal.

The meal fucking rocks. The other stuff's great too, but the meal just, I mean, I've been preparing for a month for tomorrow. I've been preparing for a month for tomorrow specifically. Are you like a turkey truck guy? You go do like a 5K in the morning before you go home and start cooking the plan, you know? I could see. There will be a work guy.

I'm not turkey truck guy because I hate running. Absolutely hate it. I will do it if I have to. But there is a workout that it's going to be abscary. It's going to be it's going to be effing brutal. I hate everything about the workout tomorrow. There's lunges and all sorts of shit that I hate. Lots of bikes, lots of echo biking, which is never fun.

But yes, that workout will be done before the turkey is eaten. But yeah, it's the Thanksgiving meal, but the sandwiches just rule the day after as well. And the night. The fourth meal is always a good time as well. You're leaving that out. Lunges are the second worst. workout behind Bulgarian split squats, which should be banished into the eternal fire. Yes.

Those are all- Oh, burpees. Burpees can go. Burpees, I mean, burpees suck. They're not fun, but I would rather do 10 burpees than 10 munches any day of the week or 100, you know. I hate guys. Yeah. I'm a big leftovers guy, so, yeah, leftovers.

I love both, but yes, I'm with my original. original meal. All right. One more Thanksgiving question. I was waiting for because I thought about this for a while. What UFC fighter would you want to eat Thanksgiving dinner at? Like, oh, whose house or just who would you want to eat with? Yeah, just who I guess. I mostly think I'm just like. Mine is Dustin. Yeah, mine is Dustin or any other Southern fighters. So if you could have Thanksgiving, if a UFC fighter were to come to Thanksgiving, who would it be if you could choose? So I saw this early in the show

and I've been thinking about it pretty consistently. And I've settled on. I had an initial answer and I went around and I've come back to it and I think it's the answer I'm the happiest with. Because I'm not thinking just like me and Dustin Poirier at a dinner table, like just the two of us because I frankly would not want to do that

with any fighter that sounds horrible. But like integrating a fighter in with like a group family dynamic. So you want somebody who is outgoing and gregarious and like good at sort of the kind of social aspect to it and kind of cover range of topics. And like, Dustin's not a terrible answer, but I'm actually going with his Louisiana brother and give me Daniel Cormier. I feel like Daniel Cormier probably thrives around the Thanksgiving table, like just a big

party sort of atmosphere hanging out. You know the man can put in that. at work on on the plates as well so like i feel like dc is is as close to a perfect answer as i have for this that that is a great answer i have been at not a thanksgiving dinner but kind of big meals with dc when he was an active fighter and that man just that man just takes up the room in a good way not a bad way in a good way yeah some people would take a bit take a room a bad way but dc's like no no dc take over it's fun yeah you you could just i here Take it and run.

Here's the ball. Take the rock. And like, I think Porre, like Max Holloway, these would be like cool dudes to just hang around with. But if you're looking like in a big atmosphere, somebody to have a big personality to fill space and not like step on toes or be, you know,

I'd feel like DC is just kind of like perfect for that role. It's a good pick. I'm going. It's my go to for like everything. I'm going Brandon Moreno. This is just such a delight. There's no way. the meal is bad.

He might even like make funny faces with like peas stuck in his mouth at people. Just like and as soon as you look at him, he closes his mouth. He would just be like the, he would be like the peewey Herman of the table. It'd be incredibly fun. And he'd probably have like a mystery word that if you said, he would yell out loud. It's just, it's him. He's just a delightful human being. I would pick because I have two fighters.

I would pick because I know her and I've had meals of her and the bar have always been great meals. So I love hanging up, Angela Hill. But for a fighter, I've never, yeah, for a fighter, I've never been around with, but I would just want to experience Yeri Paraska, just because I just want to see Yerri Peraska, all around my Chinese relatives and just like this giant man. Oh, he'd make you go out like hunt all of the food. It would be incredible. He's a pretty great answer.

He truly worked for him, yeah. That's excellent. Because I was going to say Tom Asper. all because like he's English so he doesn't do Thanksgiving or at least I don't think they do Thanksgiving and so like he can get that oh and he's various but Yeri is that only instead of it being like normal and fun it would just be real weird in a way yeah fun hilarious just a weirdness to be just yeah unbelievable now we pray to the fight gods before the yiri would you say the prayer to the Bishito gods

Just turn the lights off. We all sit in silence for about six hours before we... We honor this turkey. David's life. This noble turkey. I think with that, yeah, I think that's a great way to end the program, right, guys? I think we're good. That's terrific exit point.

A terrific exit point. Hit the music. We're done. For those who celebrate, happy Thanksgiving. We are thankful to all of. of you who tune into this show and all of our other shows each and every week. And we'll be back next Thursday to get you ready for UFC 310, the final pay-per-view of the year. We'll recap just hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours of PFL fights tomorrow.

But until then, everybody, have a happy Thanksgiving. A great long weekend for Casey, for Jed. I am Mike Kack. We love you. Good night, everybody. Love y'all. This has been between the links and MMA Fighting Production on the Vox Media Network. Unwrap holiday magic at Holt Renfrew with gifts that say I know you.

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