MMA Fighting - BTL | Holloway vs. Oliveira 2, Tsarukyan's Brawl, Dana White Says UFC White House Card Done

Episode Date: March 5, 2026

The UFC's BMF title is on the line as fan-favorites Max Holloway and Charles Oliveira battle in a highly anticipated rematch this Saturday in the main event of UFC 326. With this weekend's card lacking depth, does it even matter with the main event being what it is? On an all-new edition of Between the Links, the panel talks UFC 326, the Holloway vs. Oliveira rematch, and some of the other big storylines to keep an eye on. Additionally, topics include Dana White saying the entire UFC White House card will be announced this week and what bouts could take place, Arman Tsarukyan punching Georgio Poullas after their match at RAF 6 and the weirdness of a grappling match between the two being announced, and abruptly cancelled, Aljamain Sterling's electric promo to MMA Fighting after his RAF win over Benson Henderson, and much more. Plus, Mike and Jed take part in their UFC 326 draft for Saturday's Watch Party. Join MMA Fighting's Mike Heck and Jed Meshew as they answer your questions all show long. Follow Mike Heck: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@m_heckjr⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow Jed Meshew: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠@JedKMeshew⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Subscribe:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ http://goo.gl/dYpsgH⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Check out our full video catalog: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/u8VvLi⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Visit our playlists:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ http://goo.gl/eFhsvM⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Like MMAF on Facebook: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/uhdg7Z⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Follow on Twitter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://goo.gl/nOATUI⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Read More: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. M.MA fighting studios. This is between the links. And now your host, my... The iconic voice of Esther Lynn welcomes you to a brand new edition of BTL. Once again, happy Thursday to us all. It's nice to be back on our normal day and time

on Thursday and noon Eastern. And boy, oh boy, do we have a lot to talk about. Of course, we got UFC 326 coming up on Saturday. the main event, a damn good one. Max Holloway versus Charles Oliver 2 for the BMF title, the rest of the card. I guess Miles may vary on that one, but at least the main event slaps. And really at the end of the day, it's all that matters. Of course, Armand Sarukin got into a big brawl at RF6.

Dana White says the White House card is done and we'll announce the fights this week. We'll see if that's actually true or not. But what is true is this man, Jed Mishu is here, Mr. Nogh. gray area the hot take kid himself and uh look his shirt is ironed very excited about this jed any any comments about uh about wrinkle gates on morning combat uh they didn't need to do me like that my i honest to god didn't even notice until like they tagged it or whatever and i was like oh yeah that that's bad um you know i rushed out of the house and i didn't fold neatly the shirt i was going to rock I just threw it at the bottom of the backpack I use when I travel.

And, you know, mistakes were made. Mistakes were made. Fortunately, you know what wasn't a mistake, Mike? Amoats! We got some emotes. More are coming, but I spent part of this week working on a few of these. So if you are a channel member, you have, I think, four or what's live right now. I'm trying to get a few more, working on some other ideas.

maybe we'll mix this up but also badges this is the one I'm excited about because currently we just have like normal YouTube badges which are kind of boring and we're going to do belts or belts are going to be our badges obviously you know a white blue brown purple black championship BMF belts depending on your membership and as I was looking at some of our membership numbers once we get those belts a few of you out there you'll be B MFs both in real life and in the MNVA fighting YouTube chat. Yes. Well, let's get into it. Let's talk to the peeps, by the way. How is LazyBet a new member? I mean, look, he's a busy man. He's always around.

Welcome to the party, pal. I thought he was with, I thought he was like an OG member. I thought he's a member before I got here. But, okay. Shout out to the Twitchers, obviously. Always shout out to the Twitchers. Always shout out to the Twitchsters.

I haven't got your emotes yet because I have to figure out how to do it. Okay. Took me a while to figure out how to do it on YouTube. And I got it. Now I got to figure out how to have to get access to our Twitch, which I don't have producer access to. So we're working on it, guys. But I promise we get some. We have some.

Hopefully I have a few more before our watch party. Because Mike, I forgot to remind you, we got to get drafted at the end of this thing. Oh, yeah. It's in all the teases. It's in all the descriptions. We are going to draft today. for the final six fights of this card because we're going live at 8. There is really no reason to go any earlier at this point.

But look, Jed, I mean, you are... There really is not a reason to go earlier at this point. Well, I mean, look, if I know one thing about you, Jed, is you'll deliver a fiery hot take, but you're also a big fan of the gimmicks, as Master of the Universe Classic points out. Three Codys on the prelims. We just need Cody Staven and Cody Gibson,

and it would be the Cody prelims. So do we have a Cody Parley, gimmick gimmicked up here for Saturday? We have an anti-Cody Parley. Gimmocked up for Saturday. Because the problem is, well, I actually and I talked about this on No Betts Barred, which is

not out yet because I'm having some technical issues. Mike, frankly, after this, might call you in to help and get that out this afternoon. But we talked about our No-Bets Bard this week. A.K. and I have talked about it privately this week as well.

the problem is Dante Johnson is going to kill Cody Brundage. So a Cody Parley doesn't really work. Even though I actually think Cody Durden and Cody Garbrandt they're very small underdogs but I can definitely see them winning their fights.

Zhao Long is like the worst dude Cody Garbrandt's ever fought. But Cody Garbrandt has also won three of his past 10 bouts and his career does not seem to be. in a great place, though he personally seems to be in a great place. If you listen to him speak at Media Day yesterday, this would be by far the worst loss he's ever had. I think he can win, but we'll see. Cody Durden, it's tougher, but Mike, I want to, because y'all aren't going to get

this experience until Novitzvard comes out, so I'm not rehashing things, Mike. I'd like to invite you back onto the screen, and I'll vamp a little while I'm going to send you and everybody at home right now to do just a little bit of homework. And that homework is to go to the Instagram page of Niam Yarlal to Mandimberl, the man who is fighting Cody Durden. If you don't know how to spell that, don't worry, no one does. You can either Google it or you can go to the Tapology, Tapology links to the Instagram page.

And I just, I'd really like to see your reaction to any of the photos. on his page because I don't know how you can look at this man's IG and not think, well, he might be the greatest person of all time. He is, you just, you go see what he's rocking with. And like the first couple are pinned you have C stuffs, but look at this man's outfit. Oh my gosh. He's winning. Look, look at like, how do you bet, like I shout out to Cody Durd.

And he's from Atlanta. I think he's from Covington, actually. I have shared maps with him before, never trained with him. But like, we used to run the same gym. He runs an ATT-Equinet now. But like, you see Yamjoggle, Tum and Dimbral in a straight-up classic Mongolian outfit riding a horse with a falcon on him. I'm sorry.

That guy's winning the fist fight. That guy is ready to take over and conquest China. He can beat a man named Cody Durden. He's unbelievable. So he's like, he looks like Yuri Pahashka. It's like Pahashka vibes, but like if he was a chess player. Because he's so calm, cool and collected and, but still is dressed like an absolute warrior. He's got to win.

Dude is absolutely got to win. Is that like, I just went down a rabbit hole of like every picture was just amazing. Like he's just in, uh, clearly like the Mongolian step covered. in snow with an eagle on top of his head. He's riding horses. He's riding a horses with a bow and arrow and a sword. Like, yeah,

this man can't, he can't lose to Cody Dirt. Up in the mountain, you could tell he started that fire with like two rocks. Yeah. Just an absolute. I've never seen a cool looking human being alive. Now,

when he takes off his shirt and has that, what I would call not a very good chest tattoo, game changed a little bit, but man, What a, what a banging thing. Huge supporter of Tumen Dipper this weekend, who has apparently did some training at least based on photos with Cody Garbrandt. So he knows how to fight another Cody as well. So Cody Durdin, I think, is cooked based on these photos.

Garbrandt's live, Brundage is, we all know why Brundage is here. Yes. Shout out to IATC Productions. New member. Shout out. Enjoy the emotes, my man. More coming. I have many more ideas, but I am not the most artistic person.

And so it'll be a bit of a slower product as we move forward here. I've been trying to find the right one. Been playing around really want a middleweighty middleweight emo. So whenever that's happening, we can just spam the chat with midwitty middleweights. Get a picture of Christop Jotko. That was the start of my journey down this was, in fact, Jocko with Mito. middle weighty middleweight in no room but it doesn't look good they're very small so you got to like kind of figure out how you're doing it uh and then as i was looking at the card it was like actually

the middleweight fights here aren't really middleweighty we hope so we don't need it for this card at least but that will be high on the list of i'm gonna loop hosean on some of my ideas because he's much more talented in this regard but he's kind of busy right now so he's a busy man waste his time our road warriors good good covering our RF6 with him last weekend. Speaking of RF6, Joseph asked, did the mess at RAF6 cost Armand a future lightweight title shot?

James Lynch did a video saying he thinks it might have. Can I give you my theory on this, Jed? Because on Saturday, weapons free. My initial thought was, yeah, he might be in some trouble here. But then he goes on Ariel's show,

and Ariel, like, straight up asks him about this. Like, do you feel like you're in trouble with the UFC? And then Armand said something that I didn't really think of. And I'm like, you know what? I think he's absolutely right about this.

Because what Armid is saying is essentially that he basically got into a fistfight with a influencer wrestler and won. So at the end of the day, and he was patient the entire time. He waited for the match to be over. So he beat the wrestler at his own game. So he got the win and then gotten a fist fight with the wrestler and won that as well. And to me, his response is like, the UFC would be happy about this. because if I had lost the wrestling match and then lost the fist fight, they probably would have cut me,

or they would have been pissed about that because the UFC fighter can't go and lose a wrestling match to an influencer wrestler. And I know Georgia O'Pulas has some wrestling experience, wrestled in college and such, didn't have a terrific record. And he's like better than, I guess, people give him credit for. But to me, like, Armand, I was like, you know what?

This makes total sense because back in the 80s when you had pro wrestlers, there were certain, like, mid-south wrestling and certain promotions, down south, they basically had a rule that if like a heel wrestler went to a bar and got into a fist fight with just a regular dude and lost, he was out of the company. Just like, no, you're done. You're done. All of that. There was just unacceptable.

So they were just like, look, we're not going to punish you for getting in fights. You just better win. Better win. So I don't think, I actually don't, I don't think he's in that much trouble. I don't think, or here's what I'll say. I'll say he's not in any more trouble than he was in heading. in. And in fact, I think this might have, I don't think it helped him, but I don't think it hurt him either because of the moment. And Armand's popularity just continues to rise. Everything,

everything we put out about Armand, even before this brawl happened, everybody watches it. Everybody watched. The numbers Armand put up for us, RAF-wise, were insane. Just insane. He is one of the most popular fighters on the roster right now. I saw some people are saying he's like the top three or top five. I don't think that's true. And even Armin. Harmon doesn't agree with that from what I saw. But he is definitely one of them. This guy is a social media darling right now. And that moment, even though R.F. was kind of pissed about it on Saturday.

Even R.F. has talking to Chad Bronstein is like, yeah, man, this is great for wrestling. More people are going to watch wrestling than ever before because of this moment, even though it was kind of unfortunate that there were kids there. But like the rematch, when they booked this rematch and it's going to happen. It's got to be so big. everyone's going to watch that friggin match. It's absolutely nuts. So I don't think this is a bad thing. I love James Lynch, but I don't think this cost him a title shot.

I don't think the UFC looked at this saying, ah, see, this guy sucks. This is why we're not giving him a title fight. I don't think it hurt him at all. What's a you? I think that it's silly to think this cost him anything. I just, like, why would you think this? would cost arm in something because if you and i think if if i just like was on with james lynch i could

tease this out and he would come to the exact same conclusion because like the next if you think that that cost arm in something the next question like that goes if you're just following the line of thought out is well why why did it cost something and then the only answer like if it does the answer why is well because the ufc you know wants to punish his actions and then he you're like they've literally never wanted to do that ever and certainly not in the last like five to ten years have they punished anyone's actions for almost anything other than inactivity or in the last couple of years now you can't hold the belt they're going to make you drop it if you're going to move weight classes sure Dana will say or has said it with arm and specifically

the headbut didn't help but they're like I don't think anyone real like honestly believes that the headbut is the reason arm is the reason arm Srucian did not get an interim title fight against either Justin Gage or Patty Pimbley. He didn't get it because they didn't want to do that business. They wanted to do the, they wanted to get Patty Pimbleau over. And Patty's not going to get over against Armin. Maybe he could have gotten over against Justin. Turns out he couldn't.

And so now they are left with, okay, well, Justin won. That's still a good fight for Lia Teporia, right? Like we're, we can live on this hill. Obviously it would have been better. but the reason Sarukian didn't get a title fight the reason Seru Kian didn't get to fight Ilya for the vacant lightweight

belt is a little more because he pulled out the day of that is something that they will hold a grudge about it's nothing to do with the stuff he says the headbutting Dan Hooker they're getting into a fistfighter R a FF I just refuse to believe that they care about that at all

they are looking at their business and what they want to do and this might be an excuse if they in in the near future decide to pass him over again, but it will not be the reason. It is because to believe that means you think that Mick Maynard and Dana White and Sean shall be sit in a room and say, I know we'd really like Armand Sruke in to fight for the belt, but he might just not be reliable. And you know, we have a history of telling John Jones that he can't fight.

Like, no, that's just not how this business works. So I don't think this cost him at all. It probably, frankly, continues to help him because it continues to raise his profile. And he, like, he has done a very good job of being very, very present in a way that guys like Shavkat Rakhmanov have not over the last year. And so it's fine. Armin, obviously people know how highly I regard Armin and have been for years. but one thing I really truly realized at the pre-match press conference on Friday is he might be the funniest guy in the UFC.

He was so funny. Like, I don't know how well it came off on camera, but like everything Armin said, the entire, and the press conference was packed. Like, there was not an empty seat at the press coverage.

There's so many people there. And everybody was roaring, laughing with everything that man had to say. He is, He's on one right now. And he just, he makes everything more interesting right now. Like him wrestling Lance Palmer? Like he made people care about a wrestling match with Lance Palmer in a way that I never could have expected.

So they got something with him. The UFC does too. And I think they're starting to realize that. Armand did say to Ariel that there are a lot of things sort of in the works for him. A lot of options on the table, including a title fight in September, Octoberish, somewhere around there. we'll see what happens but yeah I don't think this cost him anything honestly I think it might have helped

based on because I actually totally agree with everything Armourne had to say about that so yeah I do agree that if he had lost it would have looked bad but um and I think that this is again we should not this is stupid it was very dumb of him to do this I think that this is not how people

should comport themselves in a civilized society but I think you are a wee bit naive at this stage of like at this stage of the UFC ownership and and how things have been for years on end to think that anything somebody does has any real bearing on whether they will get a title fight or not is like I don't know maybe you just haven't been watching what I've been watching for the last several years yeah lazy man the GFL announcement that they are now being publicly traded has taken MMA by storm might we expect another town hall with Mike and

down in the near future. To answer the second question, in the works, I guess. I mean, I've reached out in order to do this. If it can happen, you bet your sweet took us that it's going to happen. But Jed, GFL, it seems like every few weeks they're putting out something. Last week, I think it was. They had their wellness board, which featured Hector Lombard, certainly a choice. Benson Henderson was part of that board as well. I talked to Benson about this and he thinks GFL's got something cooking. I even asked him true or false, will they have an event by the end of the year? He says, I think they're planning on doing it sooner than the end of the year, but if I had a guess, it'll be sometime before the end of the year. So Benson is confident,

and he's not fighting for them. Hell, he's fighting for PFL, which is kind of crazy to think about, too, especially after hearing those comments. But thoughts on the publicly traded GFL now and are you investing? Are you getting ready to expand that nest egg or are we getting ready to get some rental properties on the heels of gFL going public i need to know how i can invest uh i will for the lulls um under the assumption that i'm lighting my money on fire but sometimes it's okay to let your money on fire you know as long as you have fun while you're doing it what i will say though mike is everything about the gFL the first iteration was super fun and obviously doomed for

failure, but like I had a lot of time just dreaming, you know, to dream with me. That's what we want to dream. This, the redux is, um, seems somehow even more doomed for failure. While also like removing the opportunity to dream that much because it's not like, at least with the first iteration, they came out with a bunch of names you had heard of. I'm like, they're going to fight. And you're like, oh, and we're going to do a draft and teams. They're like, oh.

And now they're like, now they are not quite putting the cart before the horse, Mike. But it is like they're cooking Thanksgiving dinner, but they have forgotten to cook any of the food. And they've spent all their money and time and energy on like silverware and place settings and decorations. and people are going to show up and like, where's the friggin turkey, man? And they're like, we don't have it. But we do have an athlete board of responsibility or whatever. Like they, if you're making an MMA promotion,

the number one thing you do is you put on fights and broadcast them to people or give people a way to watch those fights. That's what a combat sports promotion is. And thus far, they have done none of those things. And don't seem close to doing it. any of them. They've got a lot of other bells and whistles, but there's no turkey, there's no mashed potatoes, no stuffing, no sides, just knives and napkins on the table. What a time. What a time to be alive.

Cosmo, if Paramount purchases Water Brothers, which there is a definitive agreement in place, it's not like done, done, but it's at like the three yard line now. What are your main concerns? Of course, Paramount is a juggernaut. They have the UFC. Obviously, with the UFC, you have a partnership with TKO, which owns WW. Warner Brothers owns AEW or is part ownership of AEW and AEW's on their network, which could create a little bit of an issue there. But do you have any concerns about this?

I think if you're a pro wrestling fan, if you're an AEW fan, I think it's pretty, I think you should be a little bit concerned right there because you could just kick them off air, make them find a new TV deal once this current TV deal wraps up and just be like, nah, we're good. And we're just going to put all our eggs in the WWE basket, leaving them looking for another partner. Now, to be fair, Tony Kahn has unlimited funds.

So they could, they'll be probably just fine, but could slow them down a little bit not having a TV deal because TV is everything right now, especially in these industries. So do you have any concerns about, paramount purchasing WBD? I have a number of concerns. I do want to preface this. I am not deeply versed on this.

Like I've not done like a ton of reading into it. But my big picture concerns are that are not really applicable to this show or what we do. But I basically any corporate merger I think is large scale bad. It usually results in less diversity, less not like diversity as far as people, but less diversity in product, less good things for consumers, people losing jobs, like this is a media deal,

so frankly, probably less movies will get made, and I love going to the movies. So, like, I do think that wholesale this will, consolidating power is almost always bad for everybody, but the people at the very top of that power org. So I broadly think that this is probably very, very bad in that regard. for tangibly for us, for the purposes of us,

I don't know how much of an effect it will have on our day-to-day MMA fandom. I do think that, I mean, I think the price of the bricks going up anyway. I think at the end of this year they're going to kick our sub fees up, and that's just sort of how business works. Maybe they kick it up a little extra bit because they've got a heavier carry now after the potential of this merger, the purchase, whatever you want to call it. So, you know, I don't think in the nuts and bolts you're going to feel it in a huge way as an everyday fan.

But I do think the downstream effects will probably be quite bad for all people who consume like modern American media. And, you know, I don't have any other comments that don't veer deeply into like a socioeconomic political policy discussion. about corporate entities and monopoly power. And I don't think any of us really want to do that. Fair. Yeah, the price to play is going up, especially if this all goes through where they merge Paramount Plus with HBO Max. Like, you're paying more.

Like, there's no doubt about it. You're going to be paying $4, $5, $6 a month more. And then probably by 2027, you'll be paying even more than that. You're probably paying $19.99 a month. for the foreseeable future come mid-20207 if i were to guess i have no insight to this so yeah like and the truth is from a like end user standpoint if i'm paying 1999 a month but i'm getting it all whole hog now i'm getting HBO and paramount plus and all of that that's a price point that would actually be quite good for me the end you agree as opposed to piecemealing it i will say i am

unlikely to believe that is going to happen because again it almost never does. Consolidation of power almost never benefits you and me and the, the end users. It always benefits others. Could we be going to pay-per-view? HBO Max pay-per-view? I doubt that.

I could see it being like $60 instead of $20. Wow. That would be a disaster for the UFC, if that happened. I mean, yeah. I don't think. Also, based on my limited reading, my understanding is that none of this is likely soon and that we're talking 2027, 2028 at the time that we start to like, because it has to clear through. So it is a bit of a future problem as well. Jemir, to be fair, isn't it a bit early for the June main event to be announced in March?

I think obviously he's talking about the White House. I think at this point, you just have to get everything out there. and they want this to be like the biggest most viewed event possible. So yeah. I mean, at this point, I think Dana's just ready to like unload the clip to whatever that means because this car may end up not being very good.

At least I don't think it's going to be good. I mean, if you get John Jones Alex Pereira on there, which people are rumoring could happen, that's humongous. And that alone will be like, okay, we're going to watch this. I don't know what the rest of it looks like.

But no, I don't think it's too early because this is, UFC 300 part two. Like I think data just wants to get this monkey office back and just be like, okay, we're done with this. Like now you know what the fights are. Stop asking me about it. Stop bugging me about it.

I think every piece of this question is incorrect. And that's not to pick on whoever it was asked. But I mean, we're three months away from June. We are in March, April, May, June. Like, we are three months away. That is a totally reasonable time. to announce pay-per-views. The UFC has shifted away from that in recent years

to where we're getting like eight-week lead times, but like 12, 14-week lead times are totally like pretty stock and fine things to do because why not? Like there's no harm to it. It simply gives you more time to promote and for people to get interested and excited so long as you don't have to completely, you know, restructure the whole thing because everybody falls out.

But like, that's always a risk with fight promotion anyway. So I think a 12-week lead time is, I mean, I guess we're like 13 or 14 based on we're in early March and it's mid-June. But I think in general, this is how they should be. We should know that like the pay-per-view schedule and the specific fights well ahead of time. It just gives us more opportunity to talk about them, to be excited, to be interested about them. And specifically with regard to this, they should have announced the. these six months ago. And I'm not even being hyperbolic.

Like, UFC White House has taken up all the oxygen in the room, basically since it was haphazardly announced by Donald Trump. Right. Like, it has been the guiding light of this sport for months at this point. And we saw this with 300. Everyone knew 300 was coming. It's on the track.

Here we go. And all of the conversation ahead of 300 was, why don't we have fights they're booking these other fights we've got 299 what's going to headline 300 there aren't any good fights left to put on 300 oh here they are or you know seven weeks out or whatever it was and i think the uc's learned a little bit of a lesson from that to not let this go too far but like if they come out and just announced you know the preset and just our wait then we're all stuck being like well it's probably going to be one of these three fights but we don't know and just give it to us.

You have it, give it to us. They should announce fights as soon as they have them. There's no reason not to. So, yeah, especially in an instance like this, where, like, it's the only thing people are going to talk about. Nobody cares. Nobody cared at all that Yuri Perhach was fighting Carlos Saldberg. Like, that was just like, okay, whatever.

I mean, this means Alex isn't the light heavyweight champ, when's he fighting for the heavyweight belt and against who is it at the White House? Solve the White House problem, and then we can backfill from that, but it's the only thing taking up energy right now. Yeah, pretty crazy stuff with all of this. And look, this is how they used to do it. Three months? This is,

three months is just not a big lead time. Yeah, this is what they used to do. We used to know three months ahead of time before stuff. And now we're sometimes, you'd wait like six weeks before things happen. And that's just like way too soon. So I imagine the White House card has shuffled up a lot of different things. And there are questions about that. We'll get there.

Joseph asks, what about Aljo's fiery promo after his win? at RAF 06. So he gave that to you, Mike. He gave that to you. He sure did. And I listened to his interview with Ariel. And Ariel asked him like why he got so fired up. It Alchabate Sterling said, because the reporter asked me something that triggered me.

And then I realized I was angry. And if you guys didn't see it, the question I asked him was, is there anything in the works for you? They are announcing a bunch of fights. We just found, we found it about Movisar and Lerone. And we found out yesterday that Aaron Pek, at the time, Aaron Pico's fighting, Trishio Pitbull. Is there anything being discussed for you? And then he started off with, yeah, I saw that.

The two Bellasores guys fighting each other. And then he just lost his mind for three minutes. And I have to tell you, he's outside of, shout out to Al Javier Stirling, by the way. What an absolute pro. He, when he wasn't looking dead into my eyes like he wanted to kill me, he was looking dead into the MMA fighting camera. Like just nailed it. Everything you want from a fighter that's just going off on an epic rant like.

that if you're actually taking the footage and you're a part of it. Aljo was this was one of the best promos I've seen from a fighter in a long-ass time. This is so good. This wasn't a bunch of jibber jabber. This wasn't a bunch of just nonsense being thrown around. This is a dude who just let it all out and did it in such a way where like you could understand everything he said and there's no real gray area. There's no like, maybe he's got a point. You're either think he's out of his mind or you wholeheartedly agree with him, which is what I loved about this. And I think Aljo stock has got up tremendously because of this moment, because of those three, three and a half minutes that Aljo just absolutely lost his mind. And I thought it was fantastic, Jed. I'm sure you saw the clip.

Your reaction to Aljo just, inscribed and wrote on the clip. Yeah. Yeah. Aljo just going off. And one comment in particular I would ask you about is the UFC wants me to lose was really like the big takeaway from a lot of people. I don't agree with that I do think that there probably was a period of time in his career where the UFC might have been a little happier for him to leave I don't think they care at this point he is broadly popular

there was definitely a period where they were making him work harder than probably needed to frankly to get to the belt etc and then after the whole debacle with Peeryon the first time around like they yeah I think that part of that was real. I don't think that's true at this point. I'll tell you, my biggest takeaway from that was like,

that is a perfect example of why enthusiasm and energy matters so much in conveying messaging. Because, like, the truth of the matter is a lot of what Al Jemate Serling said was a little silly. You know, like he is demanding a title shot that he has no real argument for over several other people. He has an argument for it over Diego Lopez, but so does everyone. But like it didn't matter.

It doesn't matter that he's, you know, simply ignoring the fact that he lost him off their half left. Like that doesn't matter because he was so passionate and so fiery. And like, you're just like, yeah, give that guy a title fight. Like that's how you convey, you know, the message you want. And that's how you get yourself into better positions. I do structurally think that like he's incorrect and that he doesn't get a title fight. but he did also sort of allow that he has to fight somebody.

And I don't know what's going on behind the scenes if he has been offered opponents, if opponents have turned him down. But he's not going to just get a title shot, I don't think. So he's going to have to fight somebody. And if the answer, as he posited, was fight John Silva, then, okay, fight John Silva, dude. And if you beat John Silva, like, sure, you'll get one.

But, like, it was just, it was good to see him, fired up in the right ways. I mean, someone will clip this and send it to him and somebody who's mad at me, like Faber's mad at me right now and that's fine. I find his YouTube stuff pretty tough of the fighters who do YouTube content. I think he is one of my least preferred to watch because he doesn't have like that energy. If he brought that energy to things, I think he would be much better at this. And so it was good to see him, like, actively engaged in an outcome he wants and not just sort of like,

there are different ways to complain about things. And on his YouTube channel, I think he complains about things in ways that do not appeal to me. This was a way that was good. This was a captivating way to complain about getting passed over. Even if I don't agree that he's, like, passed over or they want him to lose, he did it in a way that was better. So good on you. The biggest thing is, like, the dude just, the biggest takeaway for me is, and I've talked all a couple times, you know, since his fight with Brian Ortega,

the dude just wants to fight. Like, he's been ready to go for so long. He's just like, why am I not fighting? Like, give me a fight. I would like to make some money. So why can't I fight? Like, I want to. I'm ready to go.

A lot of fighters seem to have that issue these days. Yeah, what is going on here? I thought they were supposed to be offered, like, three fights a year. Like, Alja's not getting offered anything. So totally understand where we was coming from. I thought that was spectacular. I was, like, blown away by it. I was like, wow, this is awesome.

And I remember going on our Slack channel. I'm like Alja just lost his mind. And I don't think anybody really understood to the extent until the clip came out. And everyone was like, oh, okay. He truly did lose his mind, but in a really good way where people are talking about him. Plus, there are two other good things about it. One is he didn't lose his mind in like a corny way. Like he wasn't just like screaming.

He was passionate. And yeah, that's like a huge thing. Because if you're just like screaming, see you at the top, then you're a loser. which leads me to point two. He also took shots of Michael Chandler and God knows I love that. So shout out to you, Aljo. Keep it up.

I tried not to like just lose it during that point. I'm here for long time. It was my favorite thing. Oh, so funny. Like out of like a full blown just stray at him. Like clearly wasn't trying to make a point. Even immediately it was like my bad Michael Chandler. I realized I just caught you with one.

But like whatever, dude. Dude. You bum? Like he said it, he's like, he's like, like Michael Chair there. I'm not here for a long time. I'm here for a good time, except I actually win fights. I was like, oh my God. Wow.

It banged. It was very funny. Very funny. Masters, Josh Thompson did a video saying he doesn't think the White House card will happen. You'd have to watch the video to hear it's reasoning first. But I'd love to hear it takes on this Mike and Jen. I would say Josh Thompson does not have the best credibility right now. so I'm probably not going to watch it because that I mean I don't care what it's

I don't care what is there is I don't care what is reasoning is that card is happening that that that that card is absolutely happening so I'm not going to watch it because it's absolutely insane that's that's a bag and take dude like I I had that take is so stupid I have to believe that you're not conveying it correctly that the question was misinterpreted, like that whatever you have conveyed to us dear viewer and we love you for it

is incorrect because like that hair card's obviously happening there's I think that barring nuclear war or the alien invasion I think we're getting a card at the White House in three months

so there you have it but that's that's the sort of take that I aspire to have because it's so ludicrous. I just not going to do it. No. Okay. Oh, my gosh.

Um, Armand has a two parter. Or at least it's, it goes through two. Thoughts on the recent fighters being more outspoken about the UFC pay. Most recently, Aljo, which adds to the list of Strickland,

MVP, Sugar, Sean, and Gagie. Do you think this will pass over? Or does this situation have real momentum and the UFC should be worried about the optics of Zupa boxing pay versus the UFC pay, especially for the elite talents. on the roster. So I mean, for those who have it were not around in 2016, this is not a new thing. It happened then as well. And Jed, just, you know, you're a student of the game. How long did

that last when the fighters were like, no, this Reebok deal is ridiculous. We need to come together and do stuff. How long did those talks last? Because I don't remember them lasting very long. I mean, we had like three different fighting organizations try to happen and they fell apart within months. Then this time, like, there are a couple of points here. The biggest one being this time it's even less than it was then, right? Like, you know, and we love you, Harmon. Thanks for being a member and you're constantly here. We love that about you.

Like half the fighters you listed were not. critical of what has happened. You could see that they wanted to. You can see that off air, they probably are saying something else. You can't put words into fighters' mouths, right? But like,

you know, Sean O'Malley is like, man, Conor Ben, I don't even know who Connor Ben is. He's getting 15 million and I'm not getting 15 million. And then his next phrase after pausing is, well, it's business and blah. They're equivocating because they don't want

Dana and the UFC to hear this and be mad at them. Israel Addisonia last night was like, man, I think the U.C.'s checked. I think Dana White has checked out. He's focused on boxing. I want to get paid what Connor Ben is getting paid. And there's a literal moment where he is about to say something else and then just goes,

now let's talk about the fights this weekend because he does not want to be on air or vocally against the UFC because it does not pay. there is no opportunity to go elsewhere. That's how monopoly slash monopsony's work. And, you know, you bite the hand that feeds, even if they're not feeding you much,

they ain't going to feed you nothing. And so you're getting less pushback than you even got then because they have consolidated even more. We talk about fighter pay all the time, so we don't have to like reash every piece of it again. I will just say the same thing I say just about every time. If the fighters, when they had a little bit more leverage, a little bit more power, saw the UFC get sold for $4 billion in 2016,

realized what they're paying did just back of the napkin math and weren't like, we should maybe do something about this. They're never going to. They're simply never going to. There were plenty of fighters who did not want to take money. they were owed as a result of the legal settlement for whatever reasons they didn't want to take it never going to happen don't don't worry your pretty little heads thinking about something's going to change here because it is simply never going to happen yeah if they didn't do it in if they didn't do

it in 2016 it's never going to happen because like look at all how look at all how the dominoes fell there you know the sport was bigger it was humongous the company sold for over four billion dollars in 2016. They were on fire. The Connor McGregor surge was on all of it. Like they were just there. And then the Reebok deal happens on top of that. And everyone was pissed about the Reebok deal. And then I remember like Joe Lozahn was like one of those guys that was like, yeah, this is dumb. And then like every interview, every time I've talked to Joe Lozahn since then was like, yeah, man, it's never going to happen. Because this is no way that like there's no way you're going to get all these people to agree. And by the way, the UFC has given themselves.

such a cushion with this contender series stuff and boosting up this roster to like 600 fighters, you'd think there's a friggin' world where all those fighters are just going to agree to get a bigger piece of the pie, especially with who is guiding their careers in some aspects. Like, there's no frigging way this is ever going to change. So, no, the UFC is not worried. In fact, it would not surprise me if before these daily White House matchmaking meetings, they're not putting the social media clips on the big screen and not having a hearty laugh about it, because they know nothing's going to happen.

They know nothing's going to change. So there you go. I was like, how did that happen? I just needed support for me. I have so much power now. Drunk with power, Mike. Drunk with power. Mike off topic,

but who is the guy in the photo behind you with the hat? Is there a lovely story about that photo there? That's my dad. That's my father, who is a firefighter in Somerville, Massachusetts for 35 years. I thought I was just like a sick photo. So there's actually another one up there too. Let me see if you can see it.

There it is. There's old school Papa Heck. Oh, that's a, that one is even better. Look at that mustache. Old school Papa Heck. Yeah, my dad's the man. So yeah, he's done a lot.

Dudes love the life. Seeing some crazy shit. So there you go. Papa Heck makes it to the wall and well deserved. Mike, I think you overate how much stuff. Aljo might have gained. Aljo is one of the fighters

that people feel most apathetic about. You're just deeper in the M.A. world than everyone else. Yeah, but look, people are talking, people are talking about Aljo in a more positive way that I've seen in a long time. Does he still have,

does he still have, like, haters? Of course. Like, he's one of those guys that's always going to have him. But people were like, oh, sure it is. Yeah, but there are, some of those detractors were like,

oh, this was great. Good for Aljo. Like, speak your truth, buddy. even those who don't agree with them were like, this was badass. This is great. So I think his stock grows quite a bit. Maybe not in like the UFC brass. But like it doesn't change much.

But along the fan base and all that, like these fighters are like creators at this point too. Yeah. Got some stuff. Got a lot of press out of it. Ladiesy bad, breaking Ignacio Baja Mondays versus Tovique Messiah of March 28th in Seattle per Nolan King.

So we're signing Tafikna. Okay. Oh, he's already fought. Has he? Yeah. He lost his first fight, did he not? In the UFC? Oh, he lost the Oroby.

Yes, he lost a Bictibeck oral by. He got finished in the first round. Man, that totally, totally whiffed on that one. Yeah. So, yeah, that'll be a scrap. That'll be a fun one. So why? Because lightweight's rule.

Oh, I'm throwing one up, Mike. I'm taking over the power. Late to the party, No Betz Bard, Climb Update. I'm ready to ride again, Jed. LFG. No Betz Bard is in the can. I have requested Mike's assistance after this show because my production capabilities have been neutered for the time being.

And I won't say any more about that. That'll just be it. So that should be up this afternoon. But, Mike, I will just let us know right now, the climb. We're back first. version 12 only one bet this week and it is uh down to john maxwell jerome holloway straight up million i don't know what max is i'm sorry it's jer i didn't realize jerome was his first name yes it's jerome max uh holloway in my head it was max well uh maximilian holloway straight up

i think he's going to just dump up charles olivero so y'all can ask questions we can talk about it Or you can watch the previews show tomorrow where we will, of course, speak a lot about that fight. Yes. What else we go? What else we got? Let's see. Josh's take was very surprising. His co-host said it took him back as he never thought about that, but he had a good point.

What was the point? I don't want to watch it. Tell me what his point was in layman's terms. Because I'm not going to watch this. I can assure you that. We bombed or ran and might start a world war. I don't know. Like, I truly don't know what it would think.

You think that's going to stop Donald Trump for putting a UFC card on his life? on truly just don't know what would stop the white house card from happening like i said immediately and i still am open to this idea of everyone's going to have these grand ideas about it being cool and it's actually going to be lame like fight island was and that could still be true but there's going to be an event uh extra ad what if all the champions and sean o'malley all strike would that change anything yeah it oh it would change a lot mike it would change every champion Yes, we would have vacant title fights galore. Derek Lewis might get his title shot if they do this.

Literally the only way to like get, you can't get fighters all bought in. Like I mean, Leslie Smith tried. Like there's just, that's never going to happen. The only way you could maybe do something. And I say this purely as hypothetical because it very obviously would never happen. And if you got like the five biggest managers to all sit in a room and be like, we are going to unionize our fighters under this umbrella, I mean, like five dudes basically manage like 70% of the UFC roster or something.

So you could do it that way, but they ain't never going to do that. So you're never going to happen. So you don't have to think about it. Oh, yeah, 100%. Joseph asked a question earlier. I'm not seeing it now. and I'm not going to scroll all the way back up, but the question was essentially,

what are our thoughts or guesses for the UFC 328 main event now that UFC 327 has been announced? What do you think it might be, Jed, if you had to take a guess? Hold on a moment. That will be in the wonderful city of Newark, New Jersey. So keep that in mind.

I don't know if that changes much. So, So we had a bit of news today, Michael. I don't know if you saw this. And by news, I mean rumor. A bit of rumor in innuendo. And that rumor in that innuendo is that heavyweight champion, Tom Aspinall, may be returning in action. He posted a teaser to his social last night saying back to business, which suggests that perhaps he is ready to return.

And if he is ready to return, feels like that might be the time to do it. you run things back with Cyril Gahn. This is operating under the assumption that John Jones versus Alex Pereira will headline UFC White House, which I do think is very likely. And based on other reporting, it seems that if Conne McGregor is returning, it will be International Fight Week. So based on that, you need something with some juice or at least apparent juice to it for your 328 for your go-home show. A lot of other champs are busy. I don't see a reason, and I frankly don't think, do you. UFC would want to put Tom Aspinall versus Cyril Gahn on the White House card.

So if I'm having to pick, I will say Tom Aspinall, Cyril Gahn is our UFC 328 main event, the rematch. To be fair, also clear, I would not have said this three days ago because I would have just assumed that Tom Aspinall is out indefinitely, but I don't know how else to interpret his social post. So let's say he's coming back And that fight feels like it fits a need I just don't see a world

Where Tom's fighting in May I just don't see it I think this back to business thing It's just like he's gonna announce Some sort of sponsorship Like it's gonna be nothing of the Oh we're coming back If he does that I'm going to turn aggressively

On Tom Aspinall I want Tom This is for you buddy I have been an ardent supporter Of you throughout this whole thing Because I think it is I maybe don't agree entirely with how you've handled everything.

But I have from the night of the fight been like it's ludicrous to come at him over this. I have continually been like, that everybody seems stupid now that he's getting all these eye surgeries. If that back to business is you just signed a brand deal with, you know, I don't know, a watch company or something, I'm going to be very upset with you. What if after the sponsor announcement he calls out Stebe? um does that does that balance the scales? I will burn you to the ground.

Oh come on. That was like your greatest take ever. I mean, it would be really funny. Yeah. But I don't think you can do it anymore. Okay. It's over.

The moment has passed. Yes. I think it would have been quite funny at the time. And maybe you could still do it in a way that's funny. But like it has to be clear that you don't mean it and that you're mocking John. The problem is I think John's fighting Alex. And so kind of tough. It's tough to.

mock John when he got the thing he wanted and you have, you know, had your eyes stabbed a bunch. So I think if it's not Alex and John at the White House, it's going to be Alex and gone headlining that card. I don't know if it's going to be for the real belt or some sort of interim belt and that's fine. I agree. I think that's why they've been a holding it. I think that's why we didn't get the Alex announcement because it's either John or gone. And they're crossing the T's and dotting the eyes.

But I think it's going to be John. And so I think gone and Tom makes sense now. Yeah, and then we can do that later in the year. It's fine. And if you do Tom versus Gone at 328, then the winner, potentially Tom Aspinall, can go to the White House card a few weeks later and try and set up a fight either with Alex Pereira, should he beat John, or try and go John one more time. Like you can do some things there. So I think it fits a lot of boxes. The only problem is can Tom Aspinall see?

And I'm taking his cryptic posts as proof positive. I think this means he's going to fly to Vegas and talk to the UFC. That's what I think. They're going to settle their differences. They're going to figure this all out and do that. My other option for this main event, and I actually think this is kind of likely, especially if they do John and Alex. I kind of feel like they have no choice but to make that fight happen for the White House.

And I wasn't sure about this at first. And then I saw him on Ariel's show, Jan Marab three headlining in May. Also, that's totally reasonable. Marab is very familiarized with the area. He's fought in Newark a whole bunch. Just fought in Newark last year. That was the main event with Sean O'Malley in a fight nobody cared about. I think more people will care about this fight.

So that feels like that'd be a really good co-main event and kind of a ma-main main, but maybe you just got to do it. Yeah, maybe. You got out of international fight week. You have the White House. I don't know. We shall see. Which brings us to this. White House card predictions, Jed.

John Jones was Alex Pereira. I think that's happening. Feels like we're, that's just how things have shifted, which is good. think that that is the probably the best possible option I still maintain Connor actually would make the most sense but you know whatever

I think John John Pereira is a massive massive fight Pereira won't be fighting for his third belt but he will be kind of fighting for his third belt because John is you know the lineal have you not

actually the lineal but the kind of lineal whatever you see every champion it's a big mega fight. I think that's totally fine. Apparently, Kobe Covington will not be fighting Boe Nickel, which I think anyone... It's crazy.

I think most people would have assumed that that fight wasn't going to happen because why would Colby Covington go up and wait to fight a dude who's going to beat him? That would be a bad choice in his decision. But Booneckle will fight somebody. I think unfortunately Gable Steven's going to be too injured from fighting at the Ronda Rousey

uh, Netflix card. So he won't be fighting at the White House. It's a real shame for you, Mike. Oh, he's fighting at the White House. So Bo Nicol will probably be on that card. I, I, they should do Jorge Bosnual versus Leon Edwards.

They're not going to. A trillion percent. They're not going to, but 100 percent that fight should be happening at the White House card. Um, I don't know why they're not going to. Like, it feels like it just makes sense. but less.

I think we're going to get John Alex kind of seems like we might be getting Ilya Gaichi as sort of a double as sort of a double header there. And then I think they're going to put a third title fight on it. But it doesn't, I haven't heard anything from Kayla so I just can't imagine she's back to be ready for the way. Yeah, I just don't think she can be back to being able to do it.

So maybe that's Dern Jang. Like maybe that's the third title fight. You throw that on there because I don't think you put Chevy versus any, like, you know, or Silva, I don't think you do that there. So maybe it's Dern Jang because otherwise like Hamzat probably is not going on there. You know what, Mike? Let's let's, let's, I'll hate a lot of this, but let's actually change. Let's go.

Let's go different. Let's be, let's be, some people will call this optimistic. I won't. I'll throw my official prediction down as this, though. John Alex, yes. And, uh, Ilya versus Islam. Oh.

And those two and then plus, plus some random stuff patched in. I don't, I don't think they should do that. And I'm not even entirely sure it will happen, but. That would be, I mean, I think Islam's going to If they're trying to make the biggest splash That's about as big as you can splash.

Yeah. I agree with Jones Pereira And then we're going to get a bunch Not fluff, but stuff that people aren't like super into Or maybe like someone into. I think Colby is going to fight Wonderboy. That's my prediction for Colby.

I think he's going to find that card. That fight makes perfect sense at their points in their careers. Gable Steven versus I'll say I'll say Max Jimenez because he will just truck him. Cable's going to be medically unable to compete because Andre just beat his ass at MVP Netflix. I will go.

I'll go Derek Lewis versus. Derek's going to fight on the card. I'll say Derek Lewis versus Ryan Span. on that card just a random ass fight but derrick's going to be on that card so that's what three fights four fights that's four fights Derek lewis probably is going to be in there somewhere i mean shit it might be cable versus derrick i think there's got to be a women's fight on the card where is it i don't know i i truly don't know i'm going to say those four fights um i think sean o'malley fights cori san haggen on that card too oh yeah sean's going to fight

somebody on that card if it's Corey sure yeah Sean versus Corey so this five fights I'm gonna say there'll be one more after that they're gonna do like six or seven fights Michael Chandler versus God who would be a good one

I mean it is lightweight um BSD no I don't think that happens it'd be fun yeah it would definitely be fun it would be fun and silly Chandler versus Moikano.

Mouikano's headlining against Chris Duncan. Oh, I forgot that that's happening. I love the, I'm crediting Damon Martin for all this, but I completely agree, like Michael Chandler versus Terrence McKinney would be friggin awesome. It would be really, you know, it wouldn't last for a long,

sure. I'm just trying to look at like my lightweight rank. You could do Michael Chandler versus Bobby Green. I don't hate, I like that callout. I think that fight makes a ton of sense. Yeah, that'd be fine. I'll go with that. King Green versus Michael.

Chandler. There's your UFC Whitehouse card. Not going to knock the socks off you overall, but you get the main event you want. And we'll go with that. Yeah, so. If you give that main event, it really won't matter much what's underneath it. Super chat. Playground, CHP,

more through a super chat in there as well, which I appreciate. We'll get there in a moment. Is this the most exciting era of the 125 pound division in the UFC? no but it is very exciting one what time frame is better than this peak DJ

like basically right when they brought it in and you had that the whole tournament structure because you've got DJ before we knew what DJ was going to go on to become you still have a good fighting challenge for the band and white belt in the WBC um Joseph Benavides who everybody assumed was going to

sort of just walk into that title, which they kept assuming forever and then Joseph Benavides has a case to be the greatest UFC fighter to never win a title, right? Like he is, he's certainly on that short list,

in my opinion, for the greatest to never win the belt. So Hudo came along a little bit after that, so not quite there. But like Ian McCall was, Ian McCall was the number one, flyweight in the world at that time. None of you all were to remember.

But Ian McCall had done some good things at Tachi. He had, did he beat UCA Formiga at the time? I think he beat UCA Formiga at Tachi. Usayframiga was like the number one flyweight in the world. Like right when they brought flyweight in, there were a bunch of people who casual fans had no clue of. But if you were on the Sherdog forums or the underground,

I'm like, you're like, oh, the freaking bangs. And it did. And they did a tournament that had some walkiness to it, but still kind of banged. Like, I'd say that was the flat out the most exciting time at Flyway. And then, and early on, DJ getting to consolidate, you know, against John Dotson and stuff like that. Like, that was a really fun time. You look back on it and think, wow, DJ just ran the show forever. But, like, in the middle of it, he wasn't running the show.

I was like, oh, he's got to be this guy and this guy. And then you got to the Chris Carrioso's and the Wilson Hayes and stuff like that. But that's the case with everybody who's a long-rangee champion. It's the case with, you know, freaking Anderson Silva. At the height of it, it was awesome. I do think this is probably the most exciting time since then. Because you've still got pants coming off the injury, new champion in van, a whole bunch of super young guys coming up,

while the old guard is still like, in transition I think Brandon Reval and Brandon the Brandon's are probably on their way out of the top 10 sooner rather than later but Manel cop still hanging around Kioji's hanging around like a lot of fun things happen at 125 which

long time listeners of our program will know I said this two years ago I was like watch out in a couple of years 125 is going to be the new Bannamway there's a whole bunch of hot shit young dudes rolling in and that is proving to be pretty accurate yep it's a good time right now at 125

More, any interest in Power Slap tomorrow? Crazy Hawaiian versus Wolverine Heavyweight Championship. Oh, I started that because I just want to say, no. My longstanding belief is if you like Power Slap, I am not here to dunk on it or you or whatever. I have met one person in real life who does watch PowerSlapp. It was at Mark Raimondi's book release party for his NWO book. and we were talking and a random person there was like watched power slap and I was I sat and talked to him for like 10 minutes because I was fascinated by someone who watches that

because it truly just has no appeal to me but if you like it good on you yeah yeah I'm the same way I'm I think I've actually like sat through just for work purposes I think I sat through like half of one because page van's aunt was competing on it um I watched the page Van Zant thing. I did not like sit through the event. And I was like, yeah, not for me. Yeah. And it's not for me either. Nor will I like voluntarily watch it. But again, I'm like you. Like if that's what you like, that's what you like. I found it so incredibly boring. Because if you don't get, if you don't get like an obliteration or like a highly real knockout that's going to get six billion views on social media, that is a slog city man. It's just,

the same thing. Like there's no mixing of the martial arts. There's no, oh, but this happened in this fight. Like, there's none of it. It's just slap, slap, slap, slap, slap, slap, slap, fight over. There's no action. Over and over again. If you don't get knockouts, yeah, if you don't get knockouts, that is brutal. It's a brutal time. And I've talked to people who've, like, attended those events. And they say the same thing is like, man, if there, if you don't get like a card full of knockouts, it's a disaster. So that for me is just doesn't seem like a great time. Yeah. I genuinely don't understand the appeal because like even the knockouts aren't interesting to me

because it's like okay yeah that dude got one you anticipate it coming like part of the thing that's fun with knockouts in combat sports or like YouTube videos like oh I didn't see that coming like it's out of nowhere because you don't know that he's going to throw a spinning head kick or whatever

like it's like okay one of two things is about to happen either that dude's going to fall over or he's not going to fall over but I know when and how he is going to get slapped so there's no mystery there's no interest to it there's no defense there's no offense there's no strategy it is

it is slapping each other and it's like a game that I would frankly have more fun playing than watching but I also don't like I wouldn't want to play with them and be like you know that's a sort of thing you do when you're dumb kids you're like let's play Rochambe or whatever

you know it's just yeah I don't not grab the appeal, but I don't like to yuck people's yums unless I see specific reasons, and I do not in this instance. Yeah. I mean, my read on PowerSlaff from Jump Street was 100% accurate. Like, this has no viable sort of like television appeal. They try to do TV. They got a time slot.

I don't think TBS is like, oh, we have to have this. I think they probably paid to get that time slot after AEW. Like they were getting, I mean, big time lead-ins. They were like, this is when AEW was doing like a, a million plus every Wednesday leading into power slap and like yeah power slap could sit there and be like yeah but like the first quarter hour we did like 800 000 because that was everybody catching the last part of the overrun of a ewe because a w didn't end 10 and end like 10 08 so like those numbers would climb into power slap numbers but then you'd see like it started 800 000

then we'd go to like 300 000 100 000 like it's just plummeting it's got no viable staying power outside of YouTube or Rumble or wherever they want to put it. This will never be a televised product. Like it just there's no room for it. There's just nothing there. However, as a business, if you're Dana White, like trying to run a business, this is brilliant. Because it's making, when he says like, we're in the green, we're making so much money with Power Slap, I don't disagree with him. Because of the social media numbers that this thing does.

Like people just scroll through and you just watch a slap and then you're like, oh, let's watch more Slap. laps and that staying power goes away pretty quickly, but then you get the next person, the next person. Like they're doing sick numbers on social media. So from that aspect, for the short term viewers who only have a minute to watch a clip or less, it's perfect. This is a perfect, viable business. But as somebody you want, if your business is, oh, we want a million people to watch

our cards, it's never going to happen, ever, ever, ever. Yeah. I mean, at least on social, like, it can be surprising because you're just scrolling through TikTok and, oh, shit, dude just got slapped in the head. I'll tell you what, I don't think you can do this for a lot of ethical, moral, and legal reasons. I'd be more interested in it if they brought a wheel into the game, and we're like, okay, everybody gets to slap,

but this isn't a slapping contest in the outright sense. Before your turn, you get to slap in, are you slapping backhanded? Are you slapping forehanded? Blindfold. slapping blindfolded, offhanded. Do you get to slap with rings on? Oh, now we're talking.

I'm telling you, the wheel is always best. Again, like, well, because it would, it would literally add both variety and mystery, where, again, the primary problem is I know that somebody is going to get slapped, and there are only two outcomes. And so nothing is interesting about that. Like, if you told me, all right, we're going to have the dunk contest, but everybody, is just dunking windmills. Like, okay, I'm not that interested.

The fun is to see what is unexpected happening. So if you add a wheel of chaos into the equation, maybe I get more interested. But I also think that that probably can't be done for all the aforementioned reasons. I still say to this day, if PFL just listened to our Kayla Harrison wheel idea, they'd be in a much different place right now. buddy if pfl would i am i am reasonably priced i'm so reasonably priced you can't imagine it to just like give them 10 ideas a week to be like do this it will be more fun do this it'll be more fun do this it'll be more fun and people might like you because you are fun i don't know who this is thompson we'll go to thompson uh is it all possible that now after his performance against

gone maybe john is willing to fight tom at the white house no no that fight has zero appeal is John. The prayer fight is a hundred times bigger and it is 75 times more winnable. Not saying, John could beat Tom. Like there is absolutely, and I think we both have said that from the beginning. Like, John could win that fight. It's why I want to see the fight because I don't know who would win.

Yeah. But the prayer fight is like, it's just way bigger. It's just way bigger. And he wants a bag. Are you kidding me? What? What? Chuck Flock.

Oh. Oh. Oh. God, this is... All right, hold on. Hold on a second. Hold on. They look like everything I said earlier,

except you don't want to hate him. Tom Aspenhall has signed with matchroom, talent agency, and won Edward Hearn for representation. That is the big news.

That is back to business. That's where the flight was. I thought it seemed like Eddie was going to announce this news tomorrow. I think this is the tease. Perhaps this is just the start of many teases. But Tom Aspinall has signed with Eddie Hearn for for management. This is wild and I got to say Tom is going to be out of the UFC and like this.

This is a spectacular move. I love everything about this. This is great. Kudos to both guys. I think it's good for Tom Aspinall. I think Day now it's not Dana but like now Mick's going to have to deal with

with Eddie oh my gosh and they're already this is a deeply funny move from any this is so great oh my gosh what a sick move that is

I I got there's a non-zero chance that the UFC is just going to strip him of the belt and fire him and be like dude you can't

return Alex Pereira versus zero gone for the heavyweight belt or F it John like John versus Alex for the heavyweight belt Tom's gone like that's I wouldn't say that's a high likelihood but it's not a zero percent chance

good freaking Lord this is such a great move I think this is spectacular it's it's deeply troll and pretty funny and I do honestly think it's a good business decision for Tom Aspinall. Because I say this, I say this a lot and I feel like

nobody cares and y'all don't listen to it. That's fine. This is advice for you, all of you at home personally. Like for you as well, and for any fighters who are watching, money is very nice. I understand that. I don't make, I'm not a rich person so I understand the appeal of making a lot of money.

I, one of the very few things I'm deeply, deeply confident of in my life is money is not everything and that it is tough to put a price on working with people who respect you and who you respect and who add to your life as opposed to add stress to your life. And I think it is fair to say that Tom Aspinall has not had his life tangibly benefited by the UFC over the past six months. that that has probably added stress to him and been unhelpful to have a promoter at odds with you. And so I encourage everyone to choose joy, choose happiness, choose good people around you, or people that are good for and with you. And so if the UFC ultimately did fire him, that would be funny as hell. And frankly, probably long term better for Tom Asperall, maybe not total dollars and cents wise.

but as like just lifetime happiness, it'd be nice to work with the promoter who you aren't afraid is going to call you a pussy because you got poked in the eyes. Wow. Sorry, I'm multitasking. I mean, it's wild. This is freaking crazy.

I love this move so much. I think this is spectacular. I knew this move would not be would not be fight related or UFC return related. And I think there is a little bit of sponsor. sponsorship attached to this because there is a a Monaco private jet ad sort of being attached to this So there is kind of that but a golly man this is so good

Shout out to to both guys like if if you're not announcing fight news this is literally the best thing that could have happened It's so catty we're just oh god Oh my it's like high school gracious And, you know, Tom Aspinol and go box people. Rico's about to go box somebody. Why can't Tom Aspinall box some people? Well, now he may be able to do it. I mean, we'll see.

That's love to hear Dana's take on this, which he'll have to give at some point. Maybe today at the presser. Oh, man. I forgot there's a presser, yeah. Yeah. Loved here. Wow, we have just created a whole new can of worms here. Enigma Master, what do you guys think of that new football sport

where they just run into each other at full speed? I think that is actively stupid in a way that I'm much more critical of than PowerSlapp and should not exist, but I'm just not going to get on a soapbox about it. Over under 40%, the UFC strips Tom Aspinall. Under 40%, but I mean, again, it's not zero. I think it went from like six to 20.

There's no way to view this as anything other than like appointed F you to them, right? And maybe like you can try and be charitable. But when does Dana White ever try to view something charitably from another's perspective when he could view it as a slight towards him, go listen and talk about Eddie Hearn? you know, he was like, I don't have any problem with Eddie, but Eddie said, I can't wait to compete with him. And I took that personally and he's a pussy or whatever. Like it's, there's no way they're going to view this as like, oh, Tom's trying to be on good terms with us. And a defining feature of the UFC leadership and operational sort of modus operandi basically since 2001 has.

been, if you are not with us, you are against us. And this is not a move that can be seen as with them. So I think that opens up the possibility for them to say, Tom Asperon has been a headache. He cannot fight for a while. We're going to strip the belt from him. And, you know, good luck, Godspeed. Maybe they hold on to him for as long as their contract will allow.

There are some limitations on what that can be. and ultimately they'll probably just be like, if they strip the belt from him, I think the likelihood that he leaves is pretty high, frankly. And so it's just a question of whether they stripped the belt from him. Again, less than 40%. It's not 0%. Jeez, wheeze, man.

This is pretty wild. I love this move. I really, really love this move. I think it's so great. I mean, it is catty. Like, I get where you're coming from. Uh, golly. I mean, this is interesting.

Duke Baddick Chandler versus Matush Rubetsky at the White House. I don't think they'll do Robechki. Yeah, that's just not going to happen. That fight would be a fun fight. That would be a fun fight. I love the match. I love the match. It's so great.

Golly. Um, from old Greg. I mean, he can't leave immediately unless they cut him, which they could. I don't know the terms of the contract, but basically the contracts can't live forever anymore, which is why Francis ultimately got to leave as a, like, one of the biggest impediments to leaving the promotion is being a champion, because they have like a lot of retaining rights as champion. If they strip the belt, that gets removed, which really opens up the door. And ultimately, like, I just don't know what the timeline is.

At this point, I haven't looked at a UFC contract in ages and ages. But my guess is that they can't keep him indefinitely. So they'll have to let him go at some point. And they may just ultimately choose not to because they just don't need to deal with the headache. It will not affect their bottom line in any respect. I'm going to keep you on because I have to get this graphic out. Jed, do you think Max can submit Charles? No.

I mean, like, yes, because he could. hurt him and then finish club and sub is always an option. I know he has talked about it right like he he had that quote at pre-media day interview with somebody I think it was was like and a media as well then they asked him about it media day was like well like a real BMF thing to do would be to sub the guy

with the most subs in the UFC that would be cool but like if they're grappling Charles is winning unless it is Max dropped him and Max just takes the back but actually let me look this up right now. Because if that happens,

it would be only the third submission win of Max Holloway's long tenured career, which would be pretty impressive. And the odds against it are, hold on.

Hold on method of victory. Max Holloway by submission plus 1,500. So deeply unlikely is my answer to this. It'd be really wild if it happened, though. Really, really wild if it happened. Do you still need to still need me to run so low? Yeah, for like 30 more seconds.

Okay, I got you. We're going to throw up Lazy's comment from his membership for 12 months. Way to go, Lazy. Look at you. You are a brown belt on our thing as soon as I get belts up. Today is a 10-year anniversary since Diaz subbed Connor. Memories, I remember being completely flabbergasted that that happened. I just did not see that coming whatsoever.

It was, yeah, man. Because he stepped in on nine days' notice. And you're like, okay, he's getting his payday. And we were all happy that Nate was getting his payday. Because that was the thing. It's like Nate had been toiling for years, finally going to get his payday. and Connor could go right on to be in Connor. And then he shook up the world and became, you know,

one of the biggest stars in the history of the sport and set up one of the biggest rivalries, arguably the biggest rivalry in the history of the sport. Like, that was an event that we all thought was going to be big. We didn't know it would be as like historically significant to the trajectory of MMA as it ended up being. Super chat from Indignant Master. What does the signing say about Tom's eye situation?

Maybe the outlook looking good. I don't know that says anything about his eye situation. I think Eddie would sign him just to needle Dana. And because it's like this is objectively good business on Eddie to manage one of the very best MMA fighters in the world. So I think he would sign him anyway, whether he was injured or not. My assumption is that Tom Aspinall will fight this year, but I don't know. that and I now

retract my previous statements about Tom fighting at 328 because that doesn't seem to be the case. Nope, no takebacks. No take back. Taking it back. RS 40, super chat. Who is the better resume? Charles or Max? Max, I don't think it's close. Charles is a very good resume.

Charles is one of the five best lightweights of all time and a sure ballot, sure first fire first bout Hall of Famer. Max Hall of is one of the 10 best fighters who have ever lived. I think Charles Olivera's resume, pound for pound is the most underrated maybe in the history.

It's a great resume. Yeah, it's a great resume. It's not better than Maxes, but there's a reason because people, I remember people kept saying, like, how was Charles Olivera still in everybody's pound, and everybody's pound and everybody's pound for pound list? And I was like, because look at the dudes he's fought. Look at the wins he has. He's got a great resume.

Like, what he did a lightweight during that title round was incredible. absolutely insane what he has put together. His strength of schedule is as good as anybody's, and he's got some incredible wins. But it's Maxis is better. Max is one of the 10 greatest fighters who have ever lived. Championship, multiple title defenses, you know, some of the greatest performance.

BNF champion, arguably that's probably the single greatest highlight in the history of the sport, records out the ass you know like Charles got him too but this is just great I mean I mean just looks It's a great fight

Resumey versus resume like promotional wins versus promotional wins This is about as crazy as it gets Mr. Senior Pepe I'll never let you forget Zell Huber well same here I don't know who that is

Neither do I I mean I must have ruined it for Bay Ruin it it Dell Huber I mean actually do remember him because I remember telling you that was a bad fantasy break. I was like he's fighting king green and like we you know what how do you not know what you're getting like you truly know what you're getting every single time completely flabbergasted by a man talking shit to him

during a fight 45 seconds into it because I was like kind of watching it out of my left eye I was immediately I was like oh he's not going to win because he's scared to fight because Bobby green's talking a bunch of shit to him. It was instantaneously I was like like, well, Climbs dead, got it. God. I did actually cook like hot fire last week, though.

You got a good week. My fantasy is going quite well this season. I thought I was going to go undefeated this season. I was feeling real good about things. My only bad fantasy pick is Shafcott. Holloway Oliver 326

is the winningest matchup in UFC history. It combines single fight record 47 UFC victories between the two men. Will this high mark ever be surpassed? Probably not. I don't think so. I mean, like, they're both top 10 all time in victories. Like, that is, let me pull up the UFC records real fast.

Oh, this is a good quote. This is a good shout from Enigma. I wonder if Dana goes after Katie Taylor next. She's super should. He's super should. He should go after AJ. That would be the one that would hurt. I don't think there's a chance.

I don't think you could pay. AJ seems like a pretty loyal cat. and he's got lots of money. I agree. But if you were trying to, if you were trying to do it, that would be one. That would be one of the most shocking things I've ever, like I could, that might be the most shocking signing of all. Like I know there's bigger names than AJ, but that would be, that would be a stutter.

Yeah. An absolute stutter. I mean, Turkey's got the money. I mean, I was still surprised that Connor Ben did it. And I still maintain those bad choice on him. But yeah. Not my pig, not my form. All right.

of picks, not pigs, but picks. Let's knock this out because we've got to get out of here. We have a very busy day ahead. We have things to happen. So it is time for our watch party draft

for UFC 326. As we are accustomed to doing, we will select the final six fights. Do you remember how we picked who went first last time? Did we just did random draw? Maybe we did random draw. Random draw.

Okay, it's fair. Want me to do the wheel of fun? No, I want to use lazy bed. No, we can't because he might, we can't, we can't trust him. Let's do a wheel. Sure, let's do a wheel. Let me get the wheels real quick. Okay.

Oh, I mean, can we put a quick, next time we'll put a quick pole up and let the pole happen. Oh, look at that wheel. That's a great wheel. Okay, where it lands on. first pick. This is for who gets the first pick. Oh, no. Get there.

Stay. Stay. Suspect. Mike gets the first pick. For the record, eight and seven, because I had a rebound week. You sure did.

You sure did. We're four and two in a big way. Well, now you're going to have to mentally rebound because my first pick of the UFC 326 draft is going to be Max Holloway. Well, that's, That's just rude.

You heard that he was my climb bet, and you decided to steal that from me. But I also gave you an emotional hedge, too. Are we going down to Cody Garberich? How long? Are we doing that one as well? We're doing the Cody Garbran fight. Okay. So that's the, because I was, I was, I was about to take Dante Johnson so.

Oh, no. We know. We're just doing the final six fights. The ones are watching. The ones are watching. I was going to do Dante Johnson. so hard. We will take with our first pick, you took Max, because I hate you.

We will take, let's go Raoul Roses Jr. Ooh. Okay, I'm actually okay with this. I'm okay with this. And then, I mean, that's the thing. I actually think every dog is live other than Charles realistically. Yeah. We will follow that up.

with Robocop Gregory Rodriguez. That's a good pick. That's where I would have gone. I knew I got the wheel and I was like, I'm probably just going to take those too because Robocop could lose, but if he just tackles him, you should win.

So we'll see. This is a real dart throw today, man. Wow. It is. A real dart throw today. I have the same strategy as you. I am avoiding the Cody Garbrand fight at all costs at this point. I'll take whatever I get there.

Yeah. Well, you're going to have to pick because I'm going with the, I'm going with the closest line fight of all. I'm going with Michael Johnson to defeat your Dover. I agree, but it's a risky. Would anyone be surprised if Dober won that fight? No, I just think, I think Dover's a bit more on the well done side of things. Yeah, I agree. That's the side I'd pick if I were picking it. I was like, for all. I don't know, dude. And now, but I might give you, I might just be giving you a gift here, Jed, because this is where I'm at. I know you're going to give me my man and I won't have to work for him.

Yeah, I'm going to give you, I'm going to give you your guy. I'm going to give you Kyle Baha'i. And I'm just kidding. I'm giving you RDR. I'm taking Kyle Bajalio. Although, what, why, why believe if weight cutting wasn't a thing, that RDR, like, has a much better chance than the lines. indicate, I just have no confidence that he will make 185. I think he'll make 185. I just don't have

any confidence that he is like fully past all of this medical stuff that he had to deal with. Like there's just so much that happened and just only like six months have gone by. Not even. Not even six months. He should have gone up to 205. And I think Kyle Bajalio is going to do us all favor and give us the stream matchup between RDR and Dominic Reyes later on this year. Well, that leaves me with the Cody long fight. What's he going to do? I'm so fascinated by this. I didn't realize this until looking at it.

Like, you could convince me that you can go six and oh or I can go five and one. I have no belief in Charles. Everything else will be remotely surprised by any outcome, which I think is the first time I felt that way since we started doing this. I'm going to take Cody Garbrand. I think Jow Long is very, very bad. And Cody's on a terrible losing streak, but he should be able to win a striking matchup, and I think he gets one.

Yeah. I really wish I could have taken Dante Johnson. Yeah, this fight seems pretty cut and dry to me. If Jow Long gets Cody to the ground, he's going to win. If he gets a takedown on the first round, he will win the fight. Because that's just going to keep happening. And now we know, like, Cody won't be able to stop it. But if Cody can keep it standing, he's got a very good chance.

So this is a, yeah, this is about as, this is about as tight as he can be here. Like, Mike, I don't have a lot of confidence really anywhere here. I have, like, some confidence in all the way. Confidence in Max. And that would be all I'd have confidence. But even then, like, Charles could just get him. Like, Charles is Charles. So, yeah, this is going to be quite the battle.

Find out how it all goes down on Saturday right here. Jed's first time in the new command. center uh that's right yeah i gotta give you the new address you come to the to the new crib by the way when are when are you making your way to the low country uh saturday saturday okay i don't know if you're coming friday we're gonna have to do preview show stuff i'm just not it'd be too hard to do everything remote tomorrow so fair all right well uh the producers in the air that's it we're done yay thank you very much long show thank you to eddie herne and tom aspenall the show.

Spectacular stuff. Tune into the preview show tomorrow, old Greg. Yeah. You will find out. We can't give you all of this stuff on this show as much as we would love to. So thank you very much. You guys are the best.

You guys rock. We'll see you next week. Recapping it all right here in between the legs. Good night, everybody. Love y'all. You're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network.