MMA Fighting - BTL | Makhachev vs. Volkanovski 2, Chimaev vs. Usman, Dillon Danis vs. Logan Paul, UFC and USADA

Episode Date: October 12, 2023

UFC 294 looks a bit different at the top with Charles Oliveira being forced to exit his main event rematch for the lightweight title against Islam Makhachev. Featherweight champ Alexander Volkanovski now steps in for his shot at redemption on less than two weeks' notice.  On an all-new edition of Between the Links, the panel reacts to the new main event for next weekend's UFC pay-per-view event, if the fight is more intriguing than the original booking, if Volkanovski is in a win-win situation, and more. Additionally, topics include the new co-main event between Khamzat Chimaev and Kamaru Usman, the stakes involved in the middleweight bout, Bobby Green's big upset win at UFC Vegas 80, Saturday's UFC Vegas 81 event headlined by Sodiq Yusuff and Edson Barboza, Misfits Boxing's The PRIME Card featuring the combat return of Dillon Danis as he prepares to step in the ring with WWE star Logan Paul, USADA and UFC parting ways, Conor McGregor being a factor, and much more. Host Mike Heck moderates the matchup between MMA Fighting's Jed Meshew and Alexander K. Lee. Follow Mike Heck: @MikeHeck_JR Follow Jed Meshew: @JedKMeshew Follow Alexander K. Lee: @AlexanderKLee Subscribe to MMA Fighting Check out our full video catalog Like MMA Fighting on Facebook Follow on Twitter Read More: http://www.mmafighting.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Support for this show comes from the Audible Original, the downloaded two. Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudulian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever. Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster. The Downloaded, it's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking,

What are you willing to lose to save the ones you love? The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. Available now, only from Audible. Support for this show comes from the Audible original The Downloaded 2. Ghosts in the Machine. The Earth only has a few days left. Rosco Cudullian and the rest of the Phoenix colony have to re-upload their minds into the quantum computer, but a new threat has arisen that could destroy their stored consciousness forever.

Listen to Oscar winner Brendan Fraser reprised his role as Rosco Cudulian in this follow-up to the Audible Original Blockbuster, the downloaded. It's a thought-provoking sci-fi journey where identity, memory, and morality collide. Robert J. Sawyer does it again with this much-anticipated sequel that leaves you asking, what are you willing to lose to save the ones you love? The downloaded two, Ghosts in the Machine, available now only from Audible. We're listening to the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is Between the Links.

And now, your host, my... The iconic voice of Esther Lynn welcomes you to a brand, new edition of Between the Links and sometimes you get ready to host the show and you just hope there's things to talk about. And luckily, there's like too much to talk about this week. Like Bobby Green had an incredible knockout. There's a UFC event on Saturday. Interesting featherweight main event. It's not a bad card. And I don't even know if we're going to have time to talk about any of that stuff with everything going on in the wonderful world of mixed martial arts. But we will battle through. It should be a very fun.

show. So thank you for joining us. Let us introduce the panelists. Let us not waste any more time. First, he is Mr. No Gray Area. He is Mr. Hot to take. He's the co-host of No Bet Spire, which I was just blessed enough to be a part of this week filling in for the great G.C. who's in Manchester right now. He's the man behind Dan. They were good. He is ready to go. He told me yesterday. I wish BTL is right now because I'm ready. And now is the time for Mr. Jed Michoud. Hello, Jed. Happy Thursday. Well, you know, a lot of things happen in the 24 hours after we recorded between, or sorry, not between the lakes, no bets park. And I made some enemies yesterday.

It's great. I'm pumped. There's so many things. You saw it as dead. Hell yeah. I'm excited to get into it all. Yes. We will certainly talk about that as well.

And also joining us, the co-host of On to the next one, Mr. Otno Point, the Prince of Positivity and my best friend. He is Mr. Alexander Cayley. Sorry we had to pull you from the Misfits boxing press conference so soon, but thank you for being here nonetheless, AK. A pleasure, a pleasure, yes. Hopefully someone on our great site at mayfine.com will write up what is going on with that steel cage. Maybe we can get an interview with Chris Hansen.

He just showed up. But you're right, we've got to put that aside for now, and I'm sure we'll talk about it later in the show. And hopefully nothing crazy happens that we have to talk about live, but who knows? We'll see. Yeah, you guys are going to have to fill me in on what's going on because we had like a marathon, heck of a morning. Because there's so much going on,

let's just get right into it. Let's get into the news about UFC 294. It is a completely different top of the card than it was three days ago. We have a new main event. We have a new co-main event. We'll start with the main event. And we'll start with you, Jedmishu. Islam Machachev will not be fighting Charles Oliver

next Saturday, UFC 294. Instead, he will be fighting out. Alexander Volkadovsky for the second time this year. They're running back. Maybe the fight of the year at UFC 294, Volkadovsky stepping in 11 days notice. Gets a lot of praise and credit. He deserves this.

Islam Makachev also deserves credit and praise for staying on the card. And this is not the first time. Islam Makachev has been in this situation where it's just next man up, whoever you got. I'm going to stay on the card and fight them. And now we're getting this fight, Jed. So let me ask you this. As a man who felt incredibly constantly,

confident that Islamakachev was going to do to Charles Olivera what he did to him last year. And after seeing what is a Machachev and Alexander Volcanovsky did in February, are you more intrigued by this matchup than the original? That's a good way to phrase this. Yes, just because, I mean, we've seen both of the matchups before and this one was closer. But this is obviously very different because, you know, Volk's coming in on 12 days notice. And here, I just want to get this out at the top because I know that they're probably. probably already people being mad at me because of stuff I've said.

And I stand by every word. I ain't changed the damn one of them. You can't have it both ways because here's my issue with this fight. In a vacuum, this is a terrific matchup. This is my front runner for fight of the year, like the first one. And I don't think anything's going to surpass that. That fight was sublime in the ways that this sport rarely is. Running that back is absolutely a thing that should have.

happen. It shouldn't have happened immediately because no rematches should ever happen, but we should get that a year from now. What we shouldn't do is get it under these circumstances now, and I will die on that hill. I know people are more interested in this than they would be Matush Gamron. We can get into that. But I'm getting two very competing ideas to me. The first being like, hell yeah, this is so exciting. I can't wait for this. And the other one being like the balls of Alexander Volcanowski. And those are two ideas that don't fit for me because, well, one, I just don't think it's ever like a ballsy maneuver to get to accept a promotion. Oh, here's this great opportunity for you. I accept.

What a hero. What an absolute hero for taking this wonderful low risk opportunity. Like, that's just a nonsense thing. But it's really nonsense to me in the confines of this because this fight is way better not on 12 days notice. this fight is so much better when both men have full camps to prepare for one another specifically and not hey uh something happened we're we're going to shift the style up Islam you've been training for charles olivero who is about as fundamentally different fighter as could be for wolkenovsky and vulcanowski you're coming off surgery and maybe we're training for something like this isn't that

and so if you want to praise alexander volkenovsky for for the hutspa to take the this, you should also recognize that this sucks and it would be way better if this fight was happening next year because that's what was lined up. I thought we were all on the same page. Volk is going to go on and fight Iliate Dupuria and if he gets past Dupuria, he's going to get another lightweight title shot. And Islam comes here and he beats Charles and then he beats Justin Gaichi and then we run back the rematch with full pomp and circumstance and a world tour and we make this big grand spectacle that is awesome. And instead, we're bootstrapping it in 10 days

and everybody is tripping over themselves to praise Alexander Volcanovsky for something that anyone would do in his circumstances and forgetting that we are losing so much with this matchup. I felt like I was taking crazy pills that I'm the only person alive who like didn't like what happened yesterday in this regard. But that's where I'm at, man.

Like, yes, come fight night. It's going to be great. Their first fight was great. And if they can even have a fraction of that, this is going to be really, really great competitive fight. And hey, if vote comes in here and author's like an upset, it won't be the biggest upset ever, but it will, I mean, it will certainly get blown into the proportion of the biggest upset of all time. That will be a cool moment, et cetera.

But if instead what we get is Alexander Volcanovsky is probably too small realistically anyway, and he's coming in off surgery short camp in this fight. just doesn't live up to expectations, then what? Then we have burnt this bridge for nothing. I get it. Matush Gamrod is not the name Alexander Volcanovsky is, and there wouldn't be this hoopla. But like, what the purpose of a backup fighter?

If when the backup is needed, you pass him over. I don't know what the hell is going on. Yesterday was really weird. AK, your response to what Jed had to say, is this more intriguing? I think it kind of has to be in a lot of respects because of how the respective first fights played out against his Lamakachachep.

But hearing Jed Mishu here saying what he had to say, are you with him on this? No, not all. Not at all. Love you, Jed. We did a great reacts pod, primarily to the Kamar Usman announcement that happened because I think by then we already know

we were a few, at least 12 hours removed from the Volcanowski news. So we didn't get to talk about this or argue about this that much, I guess. But I'll start off by saying, you know, Alexander Volkonoski all the time talks about people not believing in him, counting him out. And I think I know who he's talking about now.

You're just talking about this guy. You are just talking about this guy. Jen Mishu. People like, people like, I didn't see a soul count this motherfucker out yesterday. All I saw yesterday was people tripping over themselves to be like, this the balliest thing I've ever seen. What a hero or legend.

He's going to do it. He's going to be the greatest. Right now. I'm looking at one. I'm looking right at him. I wasn't looking at him for. I'm looking at him right now. This guy, this guy does not believe in Alexander Wokonovsky.

Has never believed in him. And thank goodness he hasn't because that disdain has fueled this Australian wonder to one of the greatest title runs we have ever seen. And people just keep doubting him. It's quite grotesque. So I love it. People know I am somewhat also, I love a good build. I love a good storyline.

It's very satisfying when it feels like two contenders or two, in this case, two champions, are meeting at the right time. There's no question about it. And most of our greatest moments, if we look back at our like in our 10 favorite moments, fights in MMA history, there's probably a handful that are like, oh, this person stepped in, I'm not sure I noticed this happened. But a lot of it is, oh, wow, like these two were meant to collide and it was got the proper build. But if you can't have that option and that sort of thing, frankly, is becoming more and more of a rarity in today's MAA, especially with the UFC, just with how many events they have, how convoluted, how big their roster is, how convoluted their title pictures are.

You kind of have to take these things when you can get them. And I just cannot complain about seeing this fight again. The fact that it could end up taking the number one and number two spots in the M.A. Fighting's year end, fight of the year ballot is amazing to me. is amazing and hilarious. Now, it's a tall order. There's definitely no guarantee that this fight can even come close to their fight in February. But I mean, the possibility is there.

And that's kind of what makes it so exciting. So I understand with everyone who wanted to see both guys defend their titles first and, you know, meet somewhere again, maybe in 2024. I am being hurt by this personally because I will very likely be at the rumored events in Toronto. It's supposed to be 297. Nothing official yet. but they do believe that's going to be in Toronto. And I was supposed to be getting Volcanowski-Tuporia, which is one of my most highly anticipated fights right now.

And I sincerely doubt that Volkanowski just sparks Makachev and escapes us without anywhere in tear and is healthy enough to just turn around in January. That's very likely not happening. So I'm losing that fight. And even knowing this, I am still in favor of what has been done here. It is a better fight. I like the Olivaara Makachev rematch,

but I wasn't like, I wasn't in love with it. I liked the idea of Gamera versus Makachev, but again, if I have to choose, if I have to choose right now, which fight do I want to see right now, I mean, Volcanovsky and Machicev is going to be at the top of the list. And, Jed, since you're chiming in, since you're chiming in, you said, you said,

who, who, what person wouldn't accept a title fight? And I am shocked that you would ask that question, given that you and I and others on them a fighting crew, We did a wonderful, damn, that was weird, I think the podcast was called, about UFC 151, the infamous Jones, Dan Henderson card that was canceled, one of the few UFC events that was actually canceled. We had a fighter who was offered a title fight and short notice and did not take it when Mr. Leota Machita was supposed to get a late. Yeah, that was really, really weird.

It has happened. It has happened. It has happened. Yes. I'm just saying it's happened. It's happened. We can give Volcanowski a little bit of credit, a little bit of credit for not just jump me on this opportunity, but being ready

for it. Manifesting it. He's been calling for this fight since the moment the decision was read against him. He's been calling for this fight. He has stayed ready for it. He deserves a lot of credit for that. Josie Aldo, I think once in a one time also said he wasn't quite ready to step into a title fight. I think it was one of the McGregor rematches. I remember being, and with good reason, I believe he was

banged up or something. But I was like, listen, we all wanted to see McGregor Aldo too. And there's like this one small window. And I didn't blame Aldo for not taking it, but I do remember there was, there was a slight, slight, slight, slight possibility of a short notice rematch once in a time. So I'll give Volcanovsky's flowers for that. Look, I'm not knocking Volk for taking the fight.

You should. They call take it. Absolutely do that. But like, I'm just not here. The first story of this being like the balls. Like, no, no, he's taking an opportunity that he is more or less begged for for the entire year and has no downside to him. Like very, very minimal downside to him.

The downside being, really the only downside to this is if he hasn't been preparing, which there are conflicting reports that he's kind of maybe been prepping for this, I can't speak to it, then that he is burning what is probably his one shot at a second shot against Islam on this when he sensibly could wait, but that is also risky because he still would have to go be Dillia Teperea. I'm not knocking him. I think this is absolutely career move, the great choice from him. I'm just saying like, why is this the narrative? You'll notice I'm not being like, we should respect Islam for taking this fight. I think Islam, I think this is a ballsyer move from Islam to change opponents on this short of notice.

But I'm not here big up in him in this regard because honestly, I actually agree with the quote that came from him. You're the champion, dude. It kind of doesn't matter. You just say yes and hold it down. Like you hold down your title. That's how this goes. but I think that it is peak lunacy to think that this was the right outcome

like outside of a business standpoint I get it from dollars and cents this is it like from a fight fan standpoint I just do not understand the appeal to this because I think everyone has rose colored glasses and they think that this fight's gonna be awesome

and it may be and if it is I'll be wrong in that regard but I think the process that I'm working behind is correct here because these two men should be prepared to fight each other for, you know, four months and have full camps and do the whole dance. And instead, to me, getting, potentially getting a hamstrung or not full bore Alexander Volcanovsky against Islamakov rematch is just not as good as letting him fight the dude who's there. Matush Gamrot is a viable, legitimate contender. And that's like, I would way rather get this

and get Volk down the line under ideal circumstances than just say, well, we got to do this now because if that's the case if you're striking while the iron is hot then just do that in the first place I would have given you shit for it but like who what do you care just do it if you're the UFC and you really want this fight to happen run it back both men would have said yes

we didn't have to do the rigmarole and the song and dance so like I think we've just got to the worst possible way to make this rematch happen and I I we should just have this should be next year's international fight card this like That's what this main event should be, and instead it's this. And we're going to lose Volk to Poria.

It's so dumb. It depends on who you talk to. Volk seems to think you might be able to do both. But we don't know. We don't know. First round, K-O for Volk, and they turns around. If he can do it, then that's great. My point is not being that there's not a world where this can go awesome and obviously can.

you are betting on some pretty unlikely roles to get that world. Like this is not the best process to get us the most good fights. Like I want to save Volg Tupuria and we're probably not going to get that now. Like very realistically, that fight just is no longer going to happen. Let me ask you this, Jed, because Islam Makachev, and we don't know, because honestly there's only a few people on planet Earth who know how this all worked and how this all played out. what if Justin Gaichi was in this fight?

What if Gaichi took the call? Because according to Islam Makachchev, they went to Gaichi first and he, and I don't blame Justin Gaichi at all for saying no. He couldn't make the wait. Apparently he couldn't make weight. And on top of that, this is probably, when he fights for the belt,

it's going to be his last chance. I think he would have said yes if he could have made the wait. I think Gaetian would have said yes, just because he, like, yes, what you were saying is right here, Mike, that his next chance is his last one. But like by saying no, he's, he is boned. He's out of the conversation now for like a minute.

And that just sucks. Just really shouldn't. And we'll get to that in a second. But how would you feel if Gaichi was in this fight? Even with Gamart as the backup, would you feel the same? Or would you be like, would you still be saying,

look, you have a backup here. Why is just, why are we not getting Gaichi on a full camp? Would you have the same feeling? I would still think it was very stupid that we're not just using the backup. that we could and should have, I would be at least a little more open to it

just because, like, I won't be losing another fight. If Okunovsky didn't have a fight lined up that we are going to lose as a result of this, I would also be a little bit more palatable to it. But, like, we've just straight up lost that fight and no one is acting like it because we all want to live in pretend fantasy land. But, like, that fight's not happening.

Barring the most incredible performance ever, and maybe that happens, I guess, whatever. Volk isn't going to turn around for January or February, whatever that card is to Tupuria. And basically the rumor or whatever already got out there that if Volk can't turn around, they're going to do Tuporia Max Holloway for the interim. Great.

Hopefully Tuporia wins. Probably won't because that's just not how the world works with Max Holloway, apparently. And so then what are we looking at? If Volt comes in here, everyone wants to think about the good side. Here's the downside. Let me pitch to you why you don't do. this because what could very likely happen equally as likely as all of these rose-colored glasses

scenarios this fight isn't as good because volkinovsky's coming off hand surgery he's too small and he didn't have a full camp to prep and so he's one of the best fighters we've ever seen he can make it at least competitive but he just kind of loses a fight because that's what happens when you're going in 80% against the best dude in the world loses that fight still gets beat up in that fight can't turn around and fight Ilya to Pira now Tupori has to fight Max Holloway Holloway beats Dupuria we are staring down the barrel of

Alexander Volcanovsky max four and Volk's gonna be like I don't want to fucking do that man I've beat that dude three times and now here I am but I can't go to lightweight because I've taken two shots and come up empty I have to defend against this guy I don't give a shit to fight against

why like the bad result here is so bad this is such a short-sight move to me. And everyone was so thrilled about it. And I felt like I was insane yesterday, a.k.a. Your response. It is short-sighted, but this is a short-sighted business. And you had to go down a pretty long road of, you know, bad outcomes there to sort of, I think, get to where you are. There's two bad outcomes. But as far as long as we're talking about, you know, Bulk loses and max wins, that's two outcomes.

And I would argue that those are the two most likely outcomes. I don't know if we can assume that. So the thing is, like I said, I'm going to make a bold claim here. And again, I probably had to explain it a bit better. If I had to choose between Makachev-volkov-Wolkanowski-2 never happening or Volcanowski-Tuporia never happening, and again, this is a hypothetical. There's a chance both can still happen. I would rather sacrifice Volkanowski of Toporia.

And again, I'm saying that someone who was super eager to see that fight, Topori is the rightful number one featherweight contender. Volkanowski has not cleared out featherweight. I see a few comments saying, like, well, they like this fight because Volcanowski cleared out featherweight. He has not cleared out featherweight. Featherweight is a fantastic division, and there's at least two names, including Topperia, that I would love to see a challenge for the title someday.

And that's just too, like, I'm thinking of it off the top of my head. there's other great prospects coming up. So I understand why it hurts so much to lose that fight, which again, we haven't necessarily, but let's say we did. Let's say we did. If it's that or if it's Volcanowski, Makadchev, too, I really need to see these two fight again. Could it be happening under better circumstances?

Yeah. Could it be built up better? Of course. But again, this is the world of MMA. Often you kind of have to take these things when you can get them. And it is weird, and it does. does suck in a way that we actually lost that again, we lost another good fight for this to happen because I also want to see Makachev and Charles fight each other again.

But again, out of now, if I throw that fight in there, Makachov, Charles, Toporio Volkanowski, I would still, I would still favor the Volkanovsky Machetev rematch over that. So. Then why aren't we campaigning to that from Jump Street? Why was that not the whole focus? Because we're being realistic. Because I think we're being realistic. I think a lot of us, we all said we want to see the fight again.

We didn't campaign for it. But as soon as that first fight ended, everyone said, we need to see that fight again someday. That's one thing I think we're all unanimous not. We all want to see a fight again. And I think we all assumed it would, but this is where I go in the sense of,

there's so many bad things that could happen that could make that fight not happen. And that would suck. So if we want to go down these roads, we're like, oh, well, if this doesn't happen or if this outcome doesn't happen and this bad outcome happens, I think it's even easier to derail Makachev and Volkanowski's rematch because if either them lose the title,

then that's out the window. And they both fight in really tough divisions. They're both amazing fighters. But either of them loses it. That rematch is not happening and probably never happens. So I'm much more in favor of getting it no matter how we got it. And again, turning what was kind of an afterthought of a pay-per-view after the big fights of the end of 20203 were announced and making it intriguing. So now we have like three super intriguing pay-per-views to end 2023.

And I don't know. I can't see too much of a downside in that other than if all those negative scenarios, Like only if we assume all those negative scenarios that you presented play out. And I'm not ready to assume that. I mean, maybe there's a little course correcting. Maybe there's a little buyers remorse because of how the Adasania Strickland thing played out, that they were just like, rather than wait and hope the good thing happens, let's just try to get to this now. I don't know.

I have no idea. It's in Abu Dhabi. Islam Makach have had a fight on this card. I understand the argument of Gamrod, but then you kind of run into a situation where you're trying to check off all the boxes. What if for some reason, Gamrod can't make it? What if he has to pull out or something? Then you had no fight. So maybe this is just a way of, let's put a big name on the poster,

but yet we still have Gamrod here in case something does happen with Volk. We at least still have a fight here. And maybe that's the way they're looking at. I don't know. I'm fine with it. It is what it is. I wish, honestly, dude, I wish we had the full camps and all that. I want to see this a year from now.

And I want a December 2024. That's what I wanted it. But we're getting it now. It is what it is. Both guys deserve a lot of credit. We could talk about this for another hour, but we still have a million other things to talk about. So I want to end with one last question, Jed, because you said something very interesting. You said Justin Gaichi is boned here.

So let me ask you this. Cooked. Who's in a worst spot right now? Justin Gaichi or Charles Olivera? Oh, I mean, Gaichi's in a much worse spot. That's not the real question, Mike. And the real question will lead into a future topic because the question is who's in a worst spot, Justin Gaichie or Drickus 2 plus C?

It's a trick question because they're both screwed. Yeah, Gaiji just got cooked yesterday. That was very unfortunate for him. That's why I said I think he would have taken the fight if he could have made the weight. I mean, and that would have sucked for him. Both of his lightweight, like undisputed lightweight title shots would have come against Nirmagamatov's in Abu Dhabi. It's a tough ask.

But yeah, he has to fight again now. He will have to fight a human being before he gets a title fight. because ostensibly Charles Olivera, Charles didn't tear his shoulder, but it's a cut. Like that will heal up not that long ago and he will be, one would imagine or assume the next in line to fight for the lightweight title, which means Gaci is out. And that is assuming that this fight doesn't end weird, go to a draw. I mean, shit of Volk wins that probably run a trilogy right back, which again, I would say it's stupid if Volk wins this fight, but that's just how things operate. Gachi's going to have to fight somebody again. And maybe he fights Gamrod and that maybe that's just where this goes.

But yeah, he got screwed here in a way that's honestly not his fault and not really anybody's fault because it's it's not Alex Volcanovsky's fault that Justin Gage got screwed. It's just sort of how the ball broke for him and that's tough. But yeah, he's in a lot of trouble assuming that this fight. ends up going through, which we should also acknowledge still 10 days out. This sport's very stupid. Like, I remember a time when Max Holloway was going to step in to fight Habib and then something real dumb happened there. So we can't count these chickens yet. But yeah, Gaghi's in trouble. Do you agree with that, AK? I don't know if I'm bi. I don't know if I'm completely on that page

because I think they would love to have Gagchi in the spot. Like he's the rightful. guy after knocking out Dustin Porre, but it almost feels like everything worked out perfectly for Charles to get this fight because they had booked the BMF title fight to headline the Salt Lake City card. Volk had just fought Yair

and said he had to go to an hand surgery and basically kind of left it open-ended, could I be there or not? Oliver beats B'Neil Derriush, but nobody was like really hankering to see this rematch, although some people were more on board after he beat Derrush. So it wasn't like Oliver was like

the all-o-out. outright first choice here. He's just kind of the only choice at the time. Do you feel like Gachi isn't as bad of a position as Jed lays out? Or do you feel like it's worse, better? Like, is he in a better spot than Olivera right now? Like, what do you think for those two guys? I don't know.

I feel like it's almost the same because I feel like this is what happens. And I guess we'd have to, we'd have to go back like, I don't know, to BTL a year ago or two years. This is what happens when. the lightweight title picture gets so screwed up from squatting, from Conn McGregor's existence, from guys not getting title shots, somewhere at all this, you know,

Benile Dary, you should have got a teleth shot. He shouldn't have had, him and Charles shouldn't have had to fight each other. But the way the timing worked and with Benile's whole, I'll fight a hundred more times if I have to earn a tell shot, the U.S. is like, great.

You know, we need to add another fight to that card. Charles Alvara, Benile Darius, great. But that's how screwed up it is. And also, I guess in this case, to the benefit of guys like Gaetia, who, yeah, it feels like he had fought his way to a title shot with a huge BMF title fight win over Dustin Porre. Great highlight. Everything you could ask for it.

The people, the company loves him. His management has a good relationship with the promotion. Again, definitive finish. And then, you know, you had to put Charles in there because he beats Benile. And now they said, you know, Gachi wasn't ready and all that. So when the time comes, regardless of what happens with the dust settles here with Volk and Islam, nothing is guaranteed to anyone this division. So it's hard for me to say that Gates has been pushed back because I don't know what,

I don't know how close he was anyway. It's hard for me to say, well, oh, well, Charles getting screwed out of it now because, you know, as Judge suggested, if Volk wins, maybe they run a trilogy. Well, again, we were like, like, Mike you just said, we weren't like clamoring for Charles to get that rematch anyway. It kind of felt like he was still one fight away. It's just that there was really no one else and he'd earned it by, beating the guy who should have gotten the title shot, a title shot, excuse me, and bin El Darioch. So you have all these great names, all these fighters involved, but years of squatting, years

of question of matchmaking. Oh, we didn't, and I didn't even mention, I'm sorry, I meant to say this at the top. Connor McGregor and Michael Chandler were supposed to be in the mix somewhere, but that whole fight, of course, got delayed forever. And as far as we know, may never happen. And so they're kind of out of the title picture, but it's also Connor, and Connor's never out of the title picture. and also he's allowed to be gassed to the gills starting in January 2024.

So I don't, I will say Gates, he's probably in a slightly worse spot, but he's nowhere near out of the picture because no one at 155 is out of the picture. Whoever gets the next title fight, if it's not a Volkanovsky-Makachov trilogy following a Volkanowski win, will pretty much just be whoever schedule aligns best when, whoever is when Makachab is ready to fight. So that's kind of everyone's in neutral for me. And this lightweight title picture shows no signs of having any clarity, sadly. Can I just add one thing to what AK said? Because I agree with a big piece of what he said there,

which is how muddied the lightweight title picture is. But he did leave out one thing that really muddied it up. And it's not letting lightweight contenders fight for the belt because you're having a featherweight dude fight for it. Because Benile Dary Euse didn't lose a title fight because Charles Olivera. Lost title fight because we put Volcanovsky in there. And everybody was okay with it. I wasn't a huge fan, but I accepted it.

But now we're doing it again. And again, there are explicable circumstances, but that is by definition cocking things up at the top of this weight class when a dude who's not in it keeps getting to fight for the belt and delaying other guys who could be there. Matush Gamrot, you know, not saying he demands a title fight or whatever, but if we look back in his career in 10 years and like, it's weird he never got to fight for a belt. Why is that?

Hmm. Well, division kept being weird and we kept letting feather weights come up to take title shots. Das Samporea said he got the call and said yes as well. So, I mean, who knows how this all worked? That would have been really weird. I will freely acknowledge that Volk is a much better short notice choice than Porier. but for the part that I didn't think we could just do Volk Machethev 2 next year and be dope. Now, this show would be crazy enough if this is the main event topic.

But we got more changes to UFC 294. And we're going to touch on that in round two. The point for round one goes to give it to A.K., because everyone in the comments has to hate me right now. Because I'm the only one who sees reason. Okay, one to nothing. Hey, listen, when the opponent gives you the point, It makes my life way easier.

All I'm saying is in two years, we're going to look back and be like, how come Islam Makachev's prime years were just him endlessly fighting Volcanovsky and Charles Olivera? Would have been way cooler if he fought any of the 30 other kick-ass lightweights out there? Hey, listen, I agree with you 100% when it comes to that because there are many lightweights to deserve title shots right now or at least deserve the opportunity to get to that point. but I will have to wait until probably 2024 at this point. So boarding for flight 246 to Toronto is delayed 50 minutes. Ugh, what?

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We were supposed to get Hamzaat Shimaev versus Paulo Costa. three weeks ago, Paula Costa has elbow surgery and now he's pulled from the fight. The elbow looked nasty from the photos, has the surgery. Paul Costa kept saying, I'm going to fight him no matter what.

Just didn't work. Dana White teased it Tuesday after the contender series. Fights in jeopardy. We'll have another answer. And then yesterday afternoon, we find out that Humzaa Chimayev has a new opponent is the former welterweight champion of the world,

Kamara Usman. So, AK, let me ask you, and I'm going to start this round with the same way I started round one. We had Hamzaa Tchamaya versus Paul Costa, a fight that has been building for a long-ass-time. It was on the books. Costa seemed in. It looks like we were going to get it. Now we get Kamar Usman. Is this fight more intriguing than the original?

Of course it is, my best friend. Of course it is. Paula Costa was a great choice for Hamza. Don't get me wrong. Costa fights one time a year. at Hamza, we've not seen him forever. It was a great chance for both guys to get back on track. We know Paul Ocas can sell a fight.

He's great, his social media account, great with the memes. Hamza can give as good as he gets. And there was enough doubt in the matchup where it's like, you know, I can't remember the odds. I'm sure they're out there, but I'm sure Hamzaa was at least a minus 200 favorite. But there's enough doubt there. You know, he hasn't, he hasn't beaten a top 15 guy at middleweight. Acosta, I think, is legit top 10 guy. I don't know if his, that estimation has dropped, you know, since he fights so infrequently.

Jed and I were talking on a React's pod yesterday that Costa has only fought once a year, I think, since 2018. And now this year with the injury, assuming he doesn't, he's not able to recover for one of the last two peer events the year, we'll go with no fights in 2023. So this was, this was a real treat of a co-main event, you know. it's unfortunate that again it didn't well I shouldn't say that it had and it seemed to have total implications I don't know if anything was guaranteed

because again we just talked about the sort of situation at the top of 155 and a 185 you have the possibility of a dissonure rematch you have I mean Drickus DuPcci should be fighting Sean Strickland but I just don't hear any talk about that right now and then this fight

and then Khamsat and Costa if someone of them had an impressive performance could easily have slotted into that you know, number of contenders spot. But now, now we have genuine intrigue for me in the matchup, and kind of like I said with the Volcanovsky-Makajab, I want it now, now, now, now mentality.

I've wanted Usman and Shemayev to fight for so long. When Usman had the belt, we were like, oh, Usman should get Shemayev, the Welterweight belt, I should get Shemayev before Shemayev has, like, improved, before we get to the best version of Shemayev, assuming we're not there. assuming he still has more of a ceiling to reach, Usman should fight him, you know,

should have fought him 18 months ago, two years ago, pick your date. For various reasons, this matchup didn't happen. Usman frankly never even seemed interested in it. And that's fine. Listen, that's his strategy. He was a great champion. I'm not going to call him out for it.

He certainly knows better than I do. But now we get it without the hassle of a weight cut. Again, strange circumstances, probably not the best version of Usman we could get. But at the same time, I never, you know, I would have loved to same fight for a title, but it doesn't really matter to me whether it's welterweight, middleweight, title fight, not title fight, three rounds, five rounds. I'm so intrigued by if Shemayev, you know, can really show that he is that dude because

he had a tough fight with Gilberr Burns, Kamar Usman. I probably going to give him a tough fight as well, but by some chance he, like, finishes Kamar Usman. That is what we're going to be talking about after UFC 294. Even if Volkanowski and Makachov's a banger, I think just above, just above that, we'll be saying, holy crap, like Makachov ran through Usman in the climate. Or, holy crap, Usman made Shemayev look like a fool, and Usman's now the no more contender in the middleweight division. So it's just a better fight than Kasa Shemayev.

Kasa Shemayev was not a bad fight at all, but how can you top one of the greatest welterweights of all time jumping up on short notes to 85, two-face? we don't know, maybe one of the top 10 best pound for pound fighters in the world. I'm not sure. I love it. I love it.

I'm all in. It's a better fight. Jed, AK, is all in here. Are you all in on this? Are you more intrigued with this fight than you were the Paul Acosta fight? I won't say I'm all in, but I have a lot more time of day for this fight

for a couple of reasons. One, I think AK kind of touched on it loosely. This fight, I thought this fight was going to happen like two years ago. Like this this was the matchup that I thought we should have just done back in the day and then didn't happen. And I get it. But I have a lot more time of day for us correcting a wrong, which in my opinion that's, hey, we didn't get this fight. Let's make sure we get it on the books. It's also just really weird.

It's like I just didn't see this one coming because Usman hadn't really talked about moving up to middleweight. But, you know, maybe with Sean Strickland taking the title instead of Izzy, that opened up some doors, created some opportunities for him to be like, okay, maybe I'll make this. And here's a fight that makes sense, even if it is on short notice. Again, some of the same concerns as I have with the main event. I think this fight rules. I would have preferred this fight to happen with both men are fully prepping for this exact matchup, but it's fine in that regard.

Like, we can survive it just because I don't think the stakes are high, so it's not as as unfortunate of an outcome. But yeah, it's more. interesting to me than the Costa one. I think the Costa one was just a fight that made all sorts of sense because of the backstory because Chimaev is moving to middleweight. You want to get him an immediate top 10 wins so you can put him to a title shot as quickly as you possibly can. Like that fight made a ton of sense, but it lacks the juice for me personally. I was never invested in their particular feud. This has a lot more juice than that. This style matchup is

way more intriguing to me. Again, not perfect circumstances, but we're working what we have. have, I guess, in this situation. My main issue, and I, like AK said, we did a reaction pod yesterday and I talked about it. And I sort of thought about this more overnight, particularly as forget who. So somebody either reported or broke a statement that the winner of this fight will be next in line for a middleweight title. AK and I talked about that being by far the most likely outcome because whoever wins this fight is just the biggest star not named Israel Dissina.

to fight for a belt in that weight class. And I kind of hate that a lot, the more I've thought about it. I get it. It is what it is. Business is business. But like I alluded to in the previous questions, Mike, Drickis 2 Plus E, the only man to have a worst day yesterday and Justin Gagy, in my opinion.

Drickis went from probably not getting a title shot, but at least like maybe sneaking in there some way. if Izzy didn't get in there or any of these other things happened to, yep, the winner of the Costa Chimae fight. Like if Costa wins, maybe, maybe Drix could have jumped him. He's not jumping the winner of this fight and Izzy's probably in front of him. Drickis is now just probably going to be fighting Izzy next year, you know, UFC 300 or something, whatever they do there. So I don't like the outcome, but the fight itself is fine. it's certainly weird and I like weird

I like weird too I kind of wish we got this fight two years ago as well Usman had I kind of feel like Usman had to take this fight I really do I feel like this is about as good as it can get for him right now like yeah he could have fought Bilah Muhammad and done that I thought that what does that do for him it puts him like in play especially if Colby wins the title because Colby wants to we'll probably want that one back

if Colby wins the title he's in play regardless Because Colby will just want to fight him and he's, he's in play. So I think fighting Belal would be the worst choice possible. No one should fight Belal. No human beings should fight Belal Baham. Right. It's very difficult and you get nothing for it. Yeah.

And look, Hamzat winning, it doesn't matter who Hamzat fights on this card. He wins. He's getting a title shot. Like that's just that. Let me ask you this, Jed. Because of the relationship that Kamar Usen and Israel Adasanya share, Do you have any concerns that if Kamar Usman somehow wins this fight, if he goes in there and beats Hamzaa Chamaif and has this incredible moment,

10 days notice, Knox slays the dragon? Do you have any concerns that he will say, look, me and Izzy are boys. If Izzy wants the shot, he gets it before I do. I don't think he'll say that there. I think that that might be something he'll say down the line. But I think if he wins it, he is going to play with the cards he has dealt. and we can all have friendships, but realistically, I know of two friendships in the history of this sport that have really been that rock solid. And it's Aljo and Marab who have like really been actually had each other down and DC moving away class to not fight Kane.

But other than that, you know, everybody gets a little selfish sometimes. And I think it would behoove him to have his title shot. It wouldn't happen until next year. He can at least sit on a middleweight title shot. see what Leon Colby does because like we talked about if Colby wins he's just right back there for the Colby fight and so then he can be like oh Colby won I'm going to go back and handle this and that's good you know I just did this thing at Middleweight to do it and then as he can step in but if Colby doesn't win and Leon's still holding it down at Welterweight what else is there for

Usman right like there's not another good avenue for him to pursue like things that at least in my opinion would be worthwhile for him. So I don't think it happens unless Colby beats Leon at the end of the year. Do you have any of those concerns, A.K.? I'm like, sorry, what was the question? Do you have any concern that- Wow, just give me the point now? It's not even paying attention. Before I give Jed the point, do you have any concerns about Usman saying, you know what, Izzy's my boy, he was the long-reaning champion all that. Like he's coming back and getting a title shot. I don't want to stand in his way.

That would make me physically ill if I heard that. I hate that. My best friend, I hate that you even suggested it. Listen, our friendship is a beautiful thing. I will never deny that. But in otherwise, in the world of M.A., friendship is for Roobes. All right?

Friendship is for Roob. I fully, I, look, I fully support, you know, Aljo and the whole Al Jemarab situation. the AKA back of the day, Josh Koschek, Mike Swick, and John Fitch, Vashad Evans and John Jones before they fell up, fully support that stuff. At the same time, I also support consequences. So I am also okay with the UFC matchmakers and Dana White saying, well, we are going to, you know, listen, we're passing you guys over for opportunities

if you guys aren't going to be serious about working towards a title shot, just because your buddy is holding the title. So if Usman were to put on a sterling performance against Khamsa Shemaya, and then get in the mic and say, I'm going to wait. I'm going to wait to see if they give Izzy that rematch versus Strickland. I would just be so furious. So I'm not worried about it. I'm not worried about because I don't think it's going to happen.

I think Izzy right now is doing the right thing and hopefully taking some time off to recover physically, mentally, everything, because he's been a pretty busy fighter. This is the idealist in me speaking again. There's the idealist, the optimist saying, Izzy will, you know, chill until summer of next year and then wait to see what's going on in middleweight, wait to see what's going on in light heavyweight. You know, maybe Alex Padetta has the belt.

He just goes up to 205. And in that scenario, it would be really stupid, if that's even a possibility for Usman to say, well, I'm going to wait to see what happens with Izzy first. Because it could be a while to the UFC decides what's going on with Izzy. And if Usman says, I'm going to wait, they'll just say, well, fine, we're going to slot in DDP instead. We have other options at 185.

So I wasn't concerned about it until now. I don't think it's going to happen. And I really, really, really, really hope Usma is not even considering saying something like that. All right. So last thing on this, AKL, bounce back to you. You are one half of the matchmaking squad. We got DDP, who is probably going to get iced out of this whole entire conversation. I think the thing he needs to hope for the most is that Hamzaa wins, but has a lengthy layoff.

Then maybe he could sneak in. I think that's probably his best case scenario. that's not really fair because, again, he took a fight with Robert Whitaker, went all in on it. It's the UFC's fault for matchmaking Malfeasins for actually booking this fight two months before Izzy is supposed to headline in freaking Australia, but we don't need to go down that road. What happens to DDP? And then we mentioned Bilal Mohammed because there were a lot of conversations, maybe tying those two guys together because Dana had said, like, we got something for Balal.

And with the way this, was this a good day for? to Bilal Muhammad and how bad of a day was this for Jerk his duplice? It's never a good day for Balala Muhammad because he always has to fight. He's guaranteed nothing. He's never, it's I hate to say it because I think he's a good fighter and he deserves a title shot, but

does that deserves, we said deserves in this episode so many times after saying like, we've always said that war should matter. But I mean, Balal is as worthy of his title shot as anybody and it's just, it's never going to be a good day until you see that Dana White tweet out of nowhere saying, guess what? Val Muhammad is getting that shot.

Until you see that, it's not a good day to be Bilal Muhammad. It's always tough time to be Bilal Mohammed. I'm more concerned about DDP. But kind of what I said about lightweight, whatever happens next 25 is going to be dependent on schedule. I don't want to just go to this answer for every question going forward. So I'll try, next time I pop up in BTL, I'll try not to phrase it this way.

But we are in this stage of UFC title shots, where it is based, I think I will honestly say schedule is first, takes priority over everything else. That's just how it has to go. So as you mentioned, in the possibility, even if Hamzaa wins, let's say there's some sort of minor injury that keeps them on the show, that prevents him from getting back in the training camp, prevents him from being ready for a 185 title shot whenever Sean Strickland is ready for it or more so whenever the UFC wants to book Sean Strickland's first towel defense, then yeah, DDP is certainly an option. So I'm not super conservative DDP. This is not the best situation for him because if it's up to the UFC and everyone is healthy and Hamzat wins, it is going to be Hamzot 1A and everyone else a distant second. But we'll have to see how things play out at UFC 294.

Again, we don't even know if Hamzat wins. But I could see a world where DDP is ahead of Uzman. I know that sounds crazy. I know that sounds crazy. But I do feel like they've done a good job of promoting DDP. He certainly is doing a good job for him himself. It's not the Izzy fight. It's not the easy fight.

I understand. But I think there's enough intrigue of him as a, as the number one guy at middleweight that they could give him the tell shot over Usman. And it's not going to be this big like, oh, fans like, oh, Usman, you know, beat Hamza. Why didn't they go with the former welterweight champion? I think DDP can still lay claim to that spot without much objection. Again, maybe I'm, I'm just being too positive here for the DDP side. But I think he's still in a good spot if Usman wins.

Jed, your thoughts on DDP and Balaal after this news? I think DDP needs to stay ready and really hope that this fight is a hammer and tongs war. If Hamzan and Usman really get after it in a way that's going to require, you know, prolonged time off, seems like Izzy's planning to take time off. We know Strickland likes to be active. There were rumors he tried to step into fight on this. card so just be available and you might get January or February just on a timing basis like AK said that's that's your best hope otherwise you're fighting Izzy next international fight week

and that's just the world you're living in for below I initially wanted to react like AK and just be like no it's never good to be below Mohammed um yeah actually I think this probably helped him very slightly not in like a major major way but I do think that this has made him kind of number one with a bullet right now as the next in line behind Colby, just because Usman's not really going to be there now. And there had been rumors that maybe Usman fights Wonderboy or something like that. And if taking him out of the Welterweight division means nobody can fight Usman and beat him and then supplant Bilal. So he's still there and maybe he just gets lucky. You know, maybe he gets the Leon Edwards title shot where he hung around enough and he did enough and things break right for him.

So, again, I wouldn't want to be him. I think Shavkat is in a substantially better spot than him right now, assuming he can do what I think he's going to do to Stephen Thompson. But it probably helped him a little bit yesterday at least. All right. Well, that's UFC 294. We'll talk more about those fights more in depth on the show next week. but we're getting them now. This has been a big news week.

And now we'll move on to some other weirdness and chaos. I can't believe we're going to talk about this, but we're going to do it. The point for round number two goes to Jed Mishu, because he's trying to. Yeah. I got, listen, this is old school, old school pride. I got the yellow card for Passivity.

I apologize. And I like the question. I remember I like the question when you asked it too. I did tune out for a second there. I apologize to Jed. I apologize to Jed. I knew I was listening and I had an answer. I just completely blanked out.

I got, I'm so sorry. I take that yellow card. I take the yellow. I take the yellow. Don't apologize. I got 20% of your purse. Let's go, baby. Yeah, yeah, I do all you the first as well.

Yep. Well played. Guys, as this is all going down, the beginning of the show, we got the tail end of the misfits boxing prime card press conference. Apparently John Fury was going banana. is. Dylan Danes is Logan

Ball. Yeah. We had the dude from to catch a predator, Chris Hanson coming on

up and doing a bunch things. And apparently things got a little physical during their little face off. Prime bottles,

it was like a Star Wars you have the lightsaber battle. This is a prime bottle battle which is apparently

won by Dylan Dennis because he whacked, according to people who were there, whacked a Logan

Paul in the head and Logan reportedly it was bleeding from his head as he's being escorted off stage. Not my plus 140. Oh, what an A plus move. Not my plus 140 bet of is this fight actually going to happen? Maybe he actually happening now, but I want to focus more. Did he blade my best friend? Did he blade pro wrestling style, Dylan?

I think he's played. God, I hope so. Jen, let me ask you this. As a man who enjoys chaos, is a man who put fight circus on the map before. any media member on this planet. Are you into this? Are you excited for Saturday? We got KSI, Tommy Fury,

but I think all eyes, especially in the MMA space, whether you're like it or not, the cancassore fight of 2023, Logan Paul versus Dylan Dennis. Are you, where would you gauge your interest levels and excitement levels for this chaos?

Exceedingly low. I, I don't, I feel like I've been very negative on this show. And that's my brand. so it's fine. If you're into this, I hope you enjoy this weekend. This has nothing for me. And I have come around on a lot of the influencer boxing. Some of it is funny to me. Partly, I don't care for the personalities involved here. I actively dislike Dylan Dennis, but not in a way that I want to pay money to him to watch him lose because I don't think I've ever

spent. I've never understood why people would spend money to watch someone get knocked out. That seems real dumb. I just don't care about him and the less he's involved in my life, I think overall, the happier I'd be. And I just have no thoughts on Logan Paul, except for he's doing great with the vitamins he's got. He is looking like he might join the UFC in January of 2024 if you pick it up what I'm putting down. Yeah, I just don't. And the main event, I don't care about it. Tommy Fury doesn't mean anything to me.

The Jake Paul stuff, I was at least somewhat invested in that for the sheer breadth of it. But KSI is a terrible boxer. Tommy Fury isn't a good boxer, but he is a boxer. And so that means nothing. Like, legitimately, this is no bullshit. I am far more interested in the next two fights on this influencer boxing thing than the top two fights. One, I was an early adopter of salt poppy in the influencer boxing scene because I had to cover all these. early ones and I was like oh this guy actually has hands and the same with Dean the Great

who's rematching wilded sharks like those two dudes actually like can kind of box a little bit and thus I am more interested in them and then the cartoon you know whatever's going out at the top of this card. A.K. I have a feeling you're on a whole different side of things when it comes to this event, are you? Aren't you? I don't know. I don't know my best friend. As I was watching some of the press conferences of the day before we started between the links. I was lamenting that, and it's not just this event,

it's how influencer boxing sort of the direction it's gone. And I was lamenting that like, I feel like we're already out of the wild. Oh, my God. Guys, I'm looking at a face off between Dylan Dennis and Mike Perry. I'm looking at a face off right now between Dylan Dennis and Mike Perry. Oh, my God. What? Oh, my God.

Well, like on stage? Yeah, if Logan Paul got cut. Like if you got cut, he got cut, he. you might not be able to fight. Oswald just posted a video of Mike Perry and Dylan Dennis facing off shirtless. That's just for pictures. I don't know if this is real.

I'm just saying they're on the, they're on the stage facing off and now they're taking photos. I'm not on the ground. I'm just saying what I'm seeing on the Twitter. Mike, what was your bet that the fight happens or that Dylan Dennis shows up?

What was the plus one? I don't remember the actual wording. I think it said the fight. Because it was Dennis. Oh, no, because it was, as I was the same, it's just. Dennis, you're all good then.

But if this is a tough beat, it's going to be a tough beat. It's going to be a tough cut. I'm probably nothing on that. Logan Paul or he's or he's mildly concussed. Except for, Dylan Danes shouldn't fight Mike Perry. He's going to get can slaughtered if he fights Mike Perry. So he's so he should.

He might actually have a, he's probably going to get slaughtered by Logan Paul. But at least he is a better shot, I think, of beating Logan Paul. Yeah. Oh, God. I was just about to say. Mike, I'd like to, I'd like to rescind my previous. answer if my first thought

I'm in I'm super in because he's all in stupid and funny I was lamenting that these press conferences and things have become so much

have already become so organized you know what I mean have already become so like it feels like oh it was only like two years ago or maybe less where we're like

there's still the element of chaos that outlaw element to it even though we are talking about like spoiled like rich influencer people and not but I hope you're still

sort of in our early you know our early UFC days of influencer boxing. You know, you look at the early UFC convert to now. It's like a different world. But you look at, I mean, influencer boxing has already become so professional, so many major deals. I mean, you know, they're on the zone.

It has so much credibility now. I feel like we didn't get a chance to enjoy influencer boxing for being, like, I wish it was lower budget and like poor production qualities and even dumber. Now it's still dumb, but it's just dumb with like HD cameras and really well put together stages and and and and incidents like this where I don't know I want to say they're rehearsed but again if Logan is actually out uh that would be uh not ideal I would think for misfits boxing because they were saying a lot of things at the beginning of the press conference about how oh this event is trending so well it's going to break all these records expecting all these buys I don't think

Mike Perry Dylan Dennis uh sells as much as Logan Paul and Dylan Dennis so um but yeah that's personally I'm sorry putting aside all that stuff about like my my sort of sadness over, you know, where the product is going. This particular card is intriguing to me. I may not be watching live, I will say. Sadly, I had taken the Saturday evening off, so I won't be covering it professionally, but that does not mean I might not have a chance to watch it.

Because they are touting this as what is supposed to be, you know, they want to have like a prime event every year, right? I guess it would be the prime misfits boxing could be like their WrestleMania. Now, this clearly depends on how long KSI is going to do something like this, how long Logan Paul do something like this. I guess ideally they sign other influencers and other sort of quasi fighters under, you know, two prime sponsorship deals and those people can go on to carry future prime cards. But I think they're being a little overly optimistic about how much gas this brand can have,

especially like and serve as a tent pole event every year. But again, this is a concern for them. This is a concern for the future. Right now they're just concerned about selling Saturday's card. And I like just a lot of the names that are involved. So I'll be checking the results. I'll be watching the clips. And depending where I am, I'm definitely going to try and have a laptop on me so I can check out the main event, Co-Main.

I hate so many of these people on this card. These are not, I'm sorry. I won't begrudge anyone making a buck. But I mean, and maybe I'm old. But I just do not. I could not see myself enjoying interacting with these people or following them regularly. If influencer boxing brought fans from that social media and YouTube world over to combat sports, fantastic. I would be very surprised if it went the other way.

If someone like myself who is a combat sports fan said like, oh, well, now I want to follow Salt Poppy on TikTok. Now I want to follow Winderson Nunes on YouTube. I want to talk to Guy Cruz, translate some Winterson Nunes videos from me, explain to some of these Winterson Nunes gags gags to me. It has not gone that way for me. And I can't imagine it's gone that way from many people. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Astrid Wett has found a whole new audience of fans via her influencer boxing career. And if she has more power to her.

But I just don't think that's possible. So I'm intrigued as long as they're fighting. But outside of that, man, I just don't know how much I care about these people. But Saturday's card is a fine one. And it's going to get a lot of eyeballs from the non-traditional combats, sports world, that's for sure. Damn, so I'm looking at a photo that Wade Clem just put on Twitter. Dylan Dennis didn't hit him with a prime ball.

He hit him with a frigging microphone. He hit Logan Paul the microphone. So, yeah, might be getting Mike Perry versus Dylan Dennis after all of this. I want to move on from this unless anybody else has something to say, but I'll say my piece. I'm weirdly intrigued by it, but for something. that we have to talk about, I have never in my life been more excited for an event to be over in my life. I cannot wait till this event is over. I can't wait. Move us on and get us ready for 294. Can I mean, I, at least we could at least talk about Francigano Tysifuri and I'm not all

that interested in that. It's oddly weird. And I love the most. You're not interested in the greatest upset in the history of sports. Yes. I mean, look, if that happens then you're the man, Jed, but I never wanted an event to be done so so badly in my life just get us to sunday i wish i could just sleep for the next three days wake up sunday read the results and then move on with my life but i will probably be paying attention to watching it because i'm a weirdo like a lot of other people are and that's that um the relationship between logan paul and dylan dallas has not been a good one there's another relationship that is also not good hasn't been good for a little while and is about to come to an end in a matter of months we'll talk about that

Next, point for round three goes to Jedmishu. It's two to one. AK doesn't like it, but it's okay. It's okay. Unwrap holiday magic at Holt Renfrew with gifts that say I know you. From festive and cozy fashion to Lux beauty and fragrance sets,

our special selection has something for every style and price point. Visit our Holtz holiday shop and store or online at Holtrenfrew.com. It's hockey season, and you can get anything you need delivered with Uber Eats. Well, almost, almost anything. So no, you can't get a nice rank on Uber Eats. But iced tea, ice cream, or just plain old ice, yes, we deliver those.

Goaltenders, no, but chicken tenders, yes, because those are groceries, and we deliver those too, along with your favorite restaurant food, alcohol, and other everyday essentials. Order Uber Eats now. For alcohol, you must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details. AK, we'll begin with you because, as our own Damon Martin put out on M.A.

fighting.com yesterday, a wonderful website. The relationship between the UFC and Usada is coming to an end. December 31st will be the last day of the partnership. Jed, I'm very excited to get your reaction to this. But AK, your thoughts on this breakup, Usada and the UFC felt like they're going to defy the odds and be married for years and years to come. Now they divorce. It's all over and done with. Your thoughts, your reaction. What do you have to say about it? I want to find my exact reaction. Oh, yes. Okay. Here's what I said on Twitter when the news came out. I said, open the floodgates. Let the games begin. Jet and I have been, we agree on many things. We disagree on many things. One thing we have both never wavered on is that cheating is

great. Cheating in M.A. is great. It's, you know, there's different kinds of different levels. It's It's very funny when it happens in the cage, you know, when there's an accidental eye poke, when there's a reactive grabbing of the fence, when there's the incidental foot to the groin. It's funny. It's productive. It almost always benefits to cheater. And we're all for it. We're all for it as not as nobody's getting like seriously hurt.

You know, you don't want to see someone taking an eyeball home or something. But otherwise, if you do it and you get away with it in the win the fight, nothing but applause after. Nothing but applause. Al Jermaine Sterling's quote-unquote acting job that he did. amazing. Though I guess that says cheating went wrong because it's really a Peodoriano cheated. Anyway, a whole other discussion. Now, when it comes to outside the cage cheating, I still applauded. I mean, some of our, we've, I talked about the damn show we've done for it. If you want to talk about fighters from pride, fighters who fought in pride, fighters who fought in early UFC,

there were some physiques out there, man, and those physiques are involved in some of the best, most brutal fights, most brutal moments you've ever seen. And those physiques were all natty. Sorry to break this to anyone. There was a lot of PDs in combat sports in its nascent stages. Frankly, they're probably still as today. And Usada can't catch everyone. But now that Usada is out of the picture and the UFC has not announced their plan necessarily for what they're going to do to replace it, everyone is sort of assuming they're just going to be doing in-house testing, which again, not confirmed.

They could announce a new partner within the next month or so. no, they could announce another third party. But under the assumption that that is not the case, it's going to be a real free-for-all, I think. There's just so much money invested in these fights that the UFC promotes that it's not in their best interest to pull people out of them. And if they control the testing, they control the narrative, they control the dissemination of information. There's a lot of things that are getting it swept under the rug here. And I think, think your average fan probably is not too bothered by it. That's the funny thing.

Your average fan, even media members like me who are like, sometimes we don't always want to know how the sausage is made. If this means, look, we got, we got, if this extends John Jones's career another three years and we get to see this guy fight more, great, you know, if there's other fighters whose careers

are extended, whether it's because, again, they're able to perform at a high level for longer, or they're able to recover from injuries, easier. As a fan, how can you hate that? The dark side of it is, of course, that these substances are not great for long-term health, as far as we know. Now, don't get wrong, you can have athletes who, you know, are suspected of or have proven to be under PDs who will go on to live long, happy lives. But in my history, as a professional wrestling fan, there's a lot of folks who were popping steroid pills like candy back in the 80s.

And they did not live past the age of 45, 50. I'm not a doctor, but the human body pretty much is not meant to be pushed past a certain level. And that's what a lot of these substances do. So that's just me. That's just me covering my bases and just clutch my pearls a little bit. But, man, I think we could be in for some bizarre fun with DeSada out of the picture. And fingers crossed not too much out of the cage tragedy or in the cage tragedy for that matter. So I don't know.

This is me being the Prince of Positivity, but maybe not in a way that a lot of people want to hear, Mike. Jed, I know you wanted to wax poetically on this subject, and there's one specific part of the statement involving the biggest star in the sport that I want to get to in a moment. But just your overall reaction to the divorce, Jed, it's finally, I think we kind of saw it coming. Dana has been kind of dumping on you Sada like all year

anytime he's asked about stuff. So now that this, we have an end date here, what is your reaction? My reaction is, this is a great and happy day and a good thing has happened here. Because AK, I'm not a medical doctor. I'm willing to stipulate that, you know, steroids probably aren't the best thing for you. You know what else really bad for your long-term health?

Fist-fighting. Fist-fighting professionally. And in fact, we have a lot more evidence to suggest that, like, repeated head trauma is really, really bad for you. Yeah, this is great. I've made no secret about thinking Usada was all. in just about every aspect of its inception from the fact that the fighters had no say in it. It was unilaterally imposed on them.

The expense attached to it is enormous. It is outrageously invasive and all for no gain to me because I might be misattributing this. I don't think so. A while back, Luke Thomas put this in like a really condensed form that has been my go-to. It's just what is the evidence that USADA has made the sport safer? Because there is none. There is no empirical evidence that USADA has done anything other than occasionally catch people with banned substances in their systems.

But there's no data point saying that the sport has been made safer by its presence. Instead, it has foisted a enormous onus on fighters and has frequently, by its own admission, frankly, just screwfighters over. Like, Filthy Tom Lawler, one of the biggest examples of Usada, like just taking years away

from people's careers and then later being like, oopsies, our science was bad or whatever. Like, I have railed against Usada for a long time. I am thrilled that it is gone. I do not think it brings anything

tangibly beneficial to the sport. And to what AK was saying previously, Like, the only people who are really going to be upset about this are there will be an immediate backlash of people clutching their pearls because this has become a moral test in our current society. And then periodically fighters who can't deal with the fact that they got beaten will look to blame it on something else. Because the answer can't be, I got wheel kicked in the face and I probably shouldn't have done that. It's that guy's on gear and thus I was fighting a cyborg and could not defeat him. And that's it. Like, this is it.

But I'm really glad that it's gone. I do not think that I think that there are two major non-coincidences I'd like to note here. The first being pretty obvious to me, the timing of this and how much it correlates along with the completion of the lawsuit by Mark Hunt. I think that that is very much a reason here. And the other thing I'd just like to note for everyone, because I'm sure there are people out there, being like, Usada's great, and safety first. I don't have reason.

I do not believe that it is a coincidence that Usada has not caught a high value target or fighter in like six years. It's just you either believe that everybody at the top of the sport, every one of them are all on the up and up, that everybody's doing clean, nobody's doing anything untoward. And maybe the one time one person is, they were actually, they just, they took a fake Seattleist that had the gas station pill or whatever

had it. Or you recognize the truth of the matter, which people like Cheeto-Verov said, if you have any means whatsoever, it's extremely easy to beat these things. There's no, you could just not show up to your drug tests and then they'll flag you for it, but they're not going to ban you because you didn't give them your location once, because that would also be ridiculous. If you have any money, any means about you, USADA is a tax that you are paying outside of it,

not an indication of a clean sport. It never has been, this is all a fabrication told to make people feel better. And I'm glad that it's gone. I think that there is a whole separate discussion about the USC doing it in-house and that is like way worse in a lot of ways. But the end result here is going to be that they stopped testing, and I think that or they minimize their testing substantially. And I think that that's just a way better outcome for everyone.

Yeah, and Tom Lawler lost like a whole bunch of the prime of his career because of this stuff. Like other fighters are getting like four to six months suspensions. And he got two years for the same infraction that these guys got. And specifically said that it made him hate fighting. It's like this was one of the things I loved in my life and they took it away from me with bullshit bureaucracy. that meant nothing. It didn't make the sport safer because that's the thing

that always have to come back to. There is not a piece of evidence that Usada made the sport tangibly safer in any way. If any of you have a data point that can say, X happened less, you don't because it does not exist.

It simply doesn't. It is an anecdotal. I feel that it's safer because this guy's not on testosterone, so he can't punch his hard. But like, no, that's just not. There is not a concrete data point that this did a goddamn thing other than cost the UFC a ton of money and be needlessly invasive to fighters. And in several instances, screw up their professional careers.

Like, this is good. I'm so glad they're gone. Maybe the fighters will have a seat at the table when they discuss the next third party. Yeah, we know that's not going to happen. Before we move on, I want to read a specific piece of the statement that was on NBA fighting. And I'll start with you, Jed, because I think this is pretty, it's pretty funny. This is what was said. This is what was said.

Let me just pull it up real quick. I want to make sure I have everything ready to go. Usada CEO Travis Tigardt put up this statement, basically confirming that the relationship's going to end December 301. And this is what he said, and I quote, the relationship between Usada and UFC became untenable, given the statements made by UFC, leaders and others questioning U-Sada's principled stance that Connemar Greger not be allowed to fight without being in the testing pool for at least six months. One UFC commentator echoed this recently declaring that U.S.ada should not oversee the UFC program since we held firm to the six-month rule involving McGregor and since we do not allow

fighters without an approved medical basis to use performance-enhancing drugs like experimental unapproved peptides or testosterone for healing or injuries simply to get back in the octagon. So basically, Jen Bishu, the CEO of Usada pinpoints Connor McGregor and essentially outs him in this statement with the divorce with the UFC. What did you think of this when you read this? One, this is one of the best things that's happened this year. Like that paragraph is so funny to me on seven different levels. The first being like, just straight up,

Connor McGregor can sue for defamation. Like, they just functionally outed him. I'm assuming based off of conversations from him talking with them being like, hey, I did X, Y, or Z to get back, what's the policy here? And they just like, because they got broken up with by the UFC and they're losing a bunch of money, their own fault. Their own fault. They chose a moral high ground that was.

of falsehood anyway and came to the UFC. We're like, no, no, we're holding fast here. Like, what are you doing? It's the biggest bag fumbling since Gina Carrano just wanted to be racist and gave up Disney cash. I don't know what the hell they're doing. Then they get mad about that and out Connor McGregor almost explicitly. But the part of it that makes, that really just gets me is that they, they peel back the

the curtain on their own bullshit right here. Like straight up here, because here, I'm going to paraphrase. But what they are functionally saying is, we did not believe in relaxing the six-month policy, and I quote, to use performance-enhancing drugs like X, Y, or Z for healing or injuries simply to get back. They're not saying we're not doing it because it's going to make him a superhuman who is going to jeopardize the safety of others. They are explicitly stating, we do not care if you are using these things to recover from a

catastrophic injury. Your safety and health do not mean shit to us. It is the appearance of equity here that matters to us. It is all a sham. It is all nonsense. This is terrific. You saw to call it like seven Ls yesterday and it's the best. A.K., your reaction to this of all things out of this statement.

Anderson Silva never should have been suspended. Never should have been suspended. Shouldn't have had to call it with any excuses. all Anderson should have said at that time when he got the submission was, yeah, I broke my freaking, I broke my, I broke my, I broke my friggin' leg, I juiced up so I'd get back as quickly as possible. I think he was like 35 or 36 at the time. It's like, I don't have a lot of years left. I can't, I cannot like heal normally. I may never heal as good as it can without these, this extra sauce that I'm on. And we'd be in a much better world. So yes, the transparency of that. statement, it may come back to bite them. I think there also was some emotion in there. We also had, you know, Mr. Taggart speak to MAFighting. Spoke in the Fighting.

Stephen wrote that up. That story went out this morning so you can read more about some of the hurt feelings, some of the business dealings that I think Yusada maybe wasn't super happy about it. It's fantastic. It's fantastic. It's amazing. It's amazing. Great website.

The only way I would like to see Yusada bounce back from this. because Jedd is white, right, they caught some else. Mike Bonn earlier today tweeted, commenting on the same thing, that there's some damning words from the Usada about Connor McGregor. Now that he's in the pool, what is stopping the Usada from testing McGregor every day

until December 31st? I am all for this. I would love... Absolutely. I am all in on... We don't have this enough. I don't know if we've ever had this in combat sports. But I think it's time for spite testing.

And again, our window is very short. It's only until December 31st. Usada, you camp out, you follow, Connor Gerger's not hard to find. This is a good thing about him being such a big star. He's not hard to find. He's a big celebrity. He's not hard to find.

You have your, you go TMZ style full court press in this guy, and you are testing him as much as you legally can within the confines of the current agreement, which again, only lasts until the end of the year. So test them every day. Nothing in the USATIS rules, as far as we know, says like, They say they can test any time. I've never seen anything that says,

oh, we can only test this amount of times within a two-week period. The whole point is it's supposed to be random. And they can just say, well, Connor, your name came up again. 42 days in a row. You're having some unbelievable luck here. So you said they're not going to come out in this on top. But can they go out guns blazing, middle fingers up in the air?

They certainly can. And I would love to see this spite testing. Incredible. That's a great point, AK. Get petty with it. Because why? I just, I love how this is the stupidest thing I've ever seen from them. Travis Tigger's comments are incredible to me.

They didn't ask for an exemption in part because they knew what our position was because we made it crystal clear with them in writing and conversation and publicly when we made the statements we did. But they didn't like the statements. Yeah, homie. And they're the ones paying the fucking bills. What are you doing? No.

We're not going to do this. We don't accept it. Okay. I will take my business elsewhere. Shit. Somebody's getting fired in Usada and they should. People will be fired over this and they should. It is, I genuinely, since Gina Carrano, I have not seen someone in this space

fumble a bag in a more hefty way. They're making like seven million a year from this. Plus whatever cash they get for saying that they are the official testers, the UFC and that's out the window because they didn't want to allow Connor McGregor who we all knew was going to get to do it anyway. Hey, come back from breaking his leg into. Just it's incredible, incredible. Yeah, read this article.

It's on MA fighting. Steve Morocco's filled it with Travis Tigard. It's good stuff. One comment, just to just to wet the whistle. Tiger had said the UFC's lofty valuation, quote, doesn't happen in large part without a USADA run program. How about that? If that doesn't get you to me fighting to read the west of this,

I don't know what will. But we move on. Tiger also brag that at least one fighter, like, quote unquote, had a bounty on my head. And I'm not sure that that's a thing to brag about. Like at least one fighter just straight up hates my guts. Why do you think that would be? Do you think it's for good reasons?

Come on, man. So let's move on. The point for round four goes to, you know, it's crazy because I was ready to give a straight up win for the first time in the history of the show. But then AK comes out with the spite testing and steals the round. It's two to two. Shout out to my fellow Tarantoneon. Shout out to my fellow Tarantoneon.

Spite testing is such a good idea, AK. Incredible. Well laid out, well played. That means we're going to go to the knock around. This might be the most uninteresting round of the entire show after everything we just talked about. But we will give each of these wonderful competitors one minute on the clock to answer whatever question there is. I wasn't sure where I was going to go. So I'm going to do something a little different here.

And AK, since you were the victor the last time you guys met, you get to choose. Do you want to go first or do you want to go second? Let me think, Mike, do I want to? Of course I want to go first. I always go first. All right. So we talked about UFC 294. We'll talk more about that next week.

We talked about Misfits Boxing. We talked about UFC Usada's upcoming divorce. There is a UFC event on Saturday. It's UFC Vegas 81. The main event is Sadiq Yusuf versus Edson Barbosa. And look, we are not the promotion. we are just a wonderful website that covers all these promotions and covers all these events. So, AK, I want you to take your journalist's hat off for a moment and put on your promoter hat.

I want you in the next 60 seconds to sell the viewers, the listeners, why they should watch UFC Vegas 81 on Saturday. You're going to cut a 60 second on the spot commercial for UFC Vegas 81. One minute on the clock, go. How can you not tune in to UFC Vegas 81, which features Daniel Lacerda and Ashley Oder, two of the worst fighters in UFC history. And I say this with the greatest respects, Daniel Lacerda getting a second chance at life after he wasn't choked out, but I'm pretty sure he was about to lose by submission to Edgar Chires in the first fight. Now he can go 0 and 6, I think, with one no contest in the UFC if he loses to Edgar Chires again and is finished.

She'll be the first player to do that in making history. Ashley Yoder, tough as hell, talented woman. My goodness, I do not know how the UFC keeps bringing her back. She's three and seven in the promotion, I believe. Eight and eight overall is a pro. I'm sure she's a lovely person. I'm sure she does her work, but at the same time, man, I don't know why she's around. But they're both fighting on Saturday.

So, Dique Yusuf, Edson, Barbosa, great men event. Michelle Pineda at middleweight. He's a maniac. And there's a women's baton weight fight between Dinara, Lisboa, and Rivetta. there. What else do you need to know, guys? Two women's band-to-way fights. Irene Alexeva, Melissa Dixon. This might be the card of the year. Man, you must, like, it's like you were ready for this.

And you had no idea this is the question that was going to be asked. In fact, until about 30 seconds ago, I had no idea. This is the question that's going to be asked, though. Well done, AK Jed, now it's your turn, buddy. I know how highly you regard this card after doing no best part with you. So go ahead. Why should people watch? One minute on the clock.

Go. I mean, people should watch because you've already watched or listened to No Betts Bard. You've read my gambling thing. You've listened to Connor Berks on DMA hour talk about his bets. And you're going to have some bets down. So you want to make some money. That's my case for my remaining 45 seconds. I'm going to go back to the top of the batting order, Mike, because I'm not going to win this week because I already talk shit about Volk.

And people are going to be upset about it. And you know what? I'm okay with that. I'm okay with that. And I want to bring it. all back to the top and I want to say that I hope the next week is great but God I can't wait for next week to be over you were talking about you want this fight week to be over I want next fight week to be over because at this point in time every Alexander Volkinovsky

fight week is the worst fight week of my life because my DMs they stay popping so all of you out there I hope it goes great I hope we all have fun and I stand by every single thing I said And that's where I'm at. That's all I got. It's been a jury. Now, if this was an audition or a trial, perhaps, for you to join the UFC 294 watch party next week before the main event. I can't, I can't take it. Color me intrigued and color me.

We'll get back to you later with an answer, Jedmishu, after that response. Kill me. I'm so excited. I just need it to be over. I need it to be over. and I need us to live in a world where champions defend their titles against the best dudes available in their own weight classes, which seems like it's not a big fucking ask, but God damn, it has been impossible to convince people that that's correct. Thanks, Connor McGregor.

Champ, champ, baby, champ, champ. Make it forever. I'll never forget to break in the sport forever. So cash your votes. While you're voting, I will just carry the load for a moment. tomorrow we'll have heck of a morning 10 a.m. Eastern still met very much to talk about. So join me on that. People were very spicy today. We had like an extra long show. We had an emergency show yesterday after this Mokachev Volkovsky news broke. We'll have another show tomorrow. Be a free for all Friday. We'll have a preview show. I assume for both misfits boxing. God. And UFC Vegas 81. We'll have your coverage on Saturday for all that. We'll have a post-fight show, all that fun stuff. AK and I will be back for on to the next one on Sunday. And let me just say this. I tweeted something out, I think it was last week,

and people have been hitting me up about it. When are you going to reveal it? When are you going to reveal it? I'm still not going to reveal it. But I will say that this tweet said, it was something to the effect of man, oh man, do I have something fun in the works? And I do.

And Monday, I'm not going to reveal Monday, but Monday will be step one of this new thing. Taking a little journey. I'm going to take a little bit of a drive. going to speak to a fighter in a different kind of a way. It's going to be wonderful. And this will be the first of many new things we're going to do with this content. And shout out to Jed Mishu.

I'm not going to reveal the name either, but Jed Mishu came up with the name for this. And it is tremendous. And it is tremendous. So I hope you guys will enjoy it. Probably won't drop next week. It'll probably drop after UFC 294. But it's going to be a lot of fun. So, Casey, do we have a winner?

Have I taken up enough time? in order for the boats to come in. I think we're good. I think we do have a winner. We are going on. I lost this round one, and I knew that was, I knew what I was doing coming in here. But like you, Sada, I am a man of principle. And I stand on those principles, even in the face of overwhelming logic and reason.

Oh, man. Casey, who won? Your winner with. 53% of the votes. Ooh. And also, maybe the biggest Cajonas in the sport. It can't pay. No way.

Jed Bishu. Oh my God, he did it. He did it. He did it. He did it. He pulled a New York Rick in the beginning. Give the point to AK. Give the point to AK.

I lost. I lost. It's okay. I stand by everything I said. It's fine. It's fine. And then you win. incredible.

I did get all the USADA stuff to help fall back into it. That was great. No, let's be honest. Let's be honest. Again, I say this as respected as possible. Who cares about this diet as EOC card. Was the best possible answer you could have given?

I think Jed did deserve the point of this time. That was the best answer. That was the right way to go. Jed, the people stood by you. I support them. I love y'all. Honest to God, that answer came because looking at the clock, I actually thought for sure Mike was just going to give me the win through three rounds, like through four rounds.

And then when he added, I was like, I have nothing to say about this. This is a fight card. It's all right. You did, you did very well. A.K. you performed admirably. This is going to be one of the more memorable shows of 23. And next week should be fun too, because we will officially be on the clock for you. UFC 294 will recap the chaos in Manchester.

We'll recap an apexe apex card. And I'm sure there'll be other crazy things to talk about as well. So Casey, go ahead and hit the music. Thank you all very much for watching. It's my parting words. All my parting words to be here. I hope I'm wrong. But if at the end of next week, that fight doesn't deliver,

and everyone is left being like, Aw, that's a shame. I told you first. I told you first. All right. Well, for Jen Michoud, who told you first, A.K. Lee, Casey on the ones a Tuesday, a conic voice special,

and takes you home. I am Mike Hack back next week. I'm between the lakes. Good night, everybody. Love y'all. This has been Between the Lanes. An MMA fighting production on the Vox Media Network. Getting ready for a game means being ready for anything,

like packing a game. spare stick. I like to be prepared. That's why I remember 988, Canada's suicide crisis helpline. It's good to know, just in case. Anyone can call or text for free confidential support from a train responder anytime. 988 suicide crisis helpline is funded by the government in Canada.